Speaker 1: This is the most dramatic podcast ever and iHeartRadio podcast.
Speaker 1: Chris Harrison and Lauren z Ema coming to you from
Speaker 1: the smoking hot home office in Austin, Texas.
Speaker 2: I mean, maybe Chris is talking about how good looking
Speaker 2: he is, but it's also we're in excessive heat warnings
Speaker 2: in Austin. You step outside, it's like stepping into a
Speaker 2: bath that we did escape. This weekend, we went to
Speaker 2: Colorado visited the town of Aspen for the very first
Speaker 2: time neither of us had ever been. And I absolutely
Speaker 2: love going to brand new places together because I feel
Speaker 2: like it's always a nice little reinvigoration of the relationship,
Speaker 2: like exploring new places and new restaurants and kind of
Speaker 2: feeling like you're learning and growing together.
Speaker 1: Just to get out of town and we do.
Speaker 2: We like to away. I said it was very cool
Speaker 2: and like deep, and you said, just to get out
Speaker 2: of town.
Speaker 1: It was nice to get out of it.
Speaker 2: Also, does everyone hear me? Did you I've seriously did
Speaker 2: you ever do vocal training in our profession? Because we
Speaker 2: go away for a weekend with friends and I come
Speaker 2: back sounding like this and Chris is ready to host
Speaker 2: a lot of.
Speaker 1: Fun I did. Finally, I didn't my entire career, had
Speaker 1: never done it. But I always had the same issue
Speaker 1: where if I got a little sick, Like I worked
Speaker 1: in Vegas quite a bit, whether it was Miss America
Speaker 1: or Millionaire, and it's very dry and it's smoky. They
Speaker 1: call it Vegas throat.
Speaker 2: The only place people are still owed to smoke. Cecrests.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and they really do have a name for it.
Speaker 1: They called Vegas throat. And so I kept losing my voice,
Speaker 1: long story short, and so I went to this vocal
Speaker 1: coach and she was amazing. The only embarrassing thing is
Speaker 1: a She taught me how to speak and what part
Speaker 1: of my body to use to save my voice, that
Speaker 1: which most singers do. But she had me sing. I
Speaker 1: had to sing to her in our sessions.
Speaker 2: What song did you sing? Did you get to choose?
Speaker 1: Well, we did range stuff, so it wasn't even songs
Speaker 1: per se.
Speaker 2: It was more like, well, can you tell everybody the truth,
Speaker 2: which is that you were in weren't you in an
Speaker 2: a cappella group at one point?
Speaker 1: Well, I did do choir back in the day, that's
Speaker 1: but that's when I was a tenor. I think it's
Speaker 1: before my boys had dropped really so my voice was
Speaker 1: a little bit higher, got it. I think i'd probably
Speaker 1: be more in the bass section now.
Speaker 2: So can you give it?
Speaker 1: But I did?
Speaker 2: I loved choir, you.
Speaker 1: Did, and I was a part of this thing called madrigals.
Speaker 1: You're going to be so excited to marry me after this.
Speaker 2: I was just where three.
Speaker 1: Of us would would sing together, like kind of like
Speaker 1: barber shop quartets.
Speaker 2: By this is making me like you more? Do you
Speaker 2: even know me? I mean, I'm a theater kid. I
Speaker 2: in my mind the choir story was that you were
Speaker 2: in an a cappella group, So I guess I'll have
Speaker 2: to settle for question.
Speaker 1: I also, back in the day, we had this I
Speaker 1: forget the name of it, like maybe it was a
Speaker 1: Spree or Spirit or something. It was like a pop
Speaker 1: group that was at our high school, and I auditioned
Speaker 1: for it. But I went into it with no idea
Speaker 1: what to do or how to audition for something like that.
Speaker 1: So I remember I played it was a Billy Joel song,
Speaker 1: I forget which one it was. It was from his
Speaker 1: Glasshouses album, and I just played the song over and
Speaker 1: over and I would sing to it in my bedroom.
Speaker 1: And then I went to audition now that day, and
Speaker 1: I didn't realize how many people were going to be watching.
Speaker 1: There were so many people packed into this choir room
Speaker 1: to watch, and they said, okay, well, where's your music?
Speaker 1: Who's performing your music for you? Like, who's playing it
Speaker 1: on piano or whatever?
Speaker 2: And I I had no idea, Okay, that's on them.
Speaker 2: At a standard audition, you just have someone there on
Speaker 2: the piano playing everybody's.
Speaker 1: I was probably fourteen or thirteen.
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. So you did not make it into
Speaker 2: the battle group. No, your whole life could have been different. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And so.
Speaker 1: All this to say, yeah, I finally in my life,
Speaker 1: I took some vocal lessons just so I would quit
Speaker 1: losing my voice, because you know, oftentimes you'll go, like say,
Speaker 1: Miss America, You'll rehearse for three days for the big show,
Speaker 1: and by the time you get to the big show
Speaker 1: on Saturday night, your voices totally.
Speaker 2: So can you give me without us practicing my singing? Here,
Speaker 2: what's like one thing I should be doing differently when
Speaker 2: we go away for the weekend with friends. That leaves
Speaker 2: me sounding like this.
Speaker 1: Most of the time, when people get lazy, you start
Speaker 1: you start talking. No, it's just we all do this right.
Speaker 1: It's like lifting weights. We start talking up in our throat,
Speaker 1: in our neck. Think of your voice coming from your neck.
Speaker 2: It's really right now it's high.
Speaker 1: And so you're just you're exacerbating the muscle and that's
Speaker 1: all it is. You got to drop it down into
Speaker 1: your chest and your your diaphragm and your lung speaking
Speaker 1: from her. So if you want to go back in
Speaker 1: history and find something really embarrassing, and I'm going to
Speaker 1: out myself Miss America. It was the year that Kuric
Speaker 1: is Ansive, who you know, a good friend of ours
Speaker 1: now on Golf Channel having a great career. She was
Speaker 1: missed New York and my voice broke announcing Miss America.
Speaker 1: That is the moment when you're hosting Miss America.
Speaker 2: I mean, like a crack like America is.
Speaker 1: And I go no, because you always say to State
Speaker 1: and I go miss New York and Kierk is answif
Speaker 1: and so. But you will hear my voice break and
Speaker 1: I was. It was like a teenager going through puberty
Speaker 1: and right at that moment, I just rolled over and died.
Speaker 2: Is that when you decided to get the vocal coach?
Speaker 1: Because it was because After that moment, you know she's
Speaker 1: gonna go on talk shows for the next year. And
Speaker 1: the one thing they always play leading up to every
Speaker 1: interview with Kira or Miss America I did it for
Speaker 1: ten years, is my announcement. It's Miss America is Miss
Speaker 1: New York.
Speaker 2: If that happened today, it would have been like everywhere,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. You probably got away with
Speaker 2: it being a few years ago and it.
Speaker 1: Was kind of subtle, but I noticed it. It really
Speaker 1: did break, and it was just because it's so loud.
Speaker 1: It was. We're doing it in Atlantic City. There's thirteen
Speaker 1: thousand people there, so it was But I was mortified
Speaker 1: because you want you think about that moment the whole night,
Speaker 1: the whole week. You're thinking, as the host, this is
Speaker 1: my moment to announce Miss America. I wanted to be perfect.
Speaker 2: Well, maybe screwed that up.
Speaker 1: I did, thanks, But from that day on I learned
Speaker 1: to speak deep.
Speaker 2: I've got it. I'm gonna try it right now. I've
Speaker 2: got it.
Speaker 1: No, that's what I sounded like.
Speaker 2: So I mean, I should be better because obviously I'm
Speaker 2: on et. I've been in news for forever, but I
Speaker 2: just never I know, go lower. But I never worked
Speaker 2: on it. I think this is like a muscle you
Speaker 2: have to practice. By the way, it's interesting to hear
Speaker 2: I never knew that you auditioned for this pop group,
Speaker 2: and I all, I guess I'm listening to that story, thinking,
Speaker 2: you know, you grew up in Texas, and this is
Speaker 2: no knock on your parents, obviously, it's just your boy
Speaker 2: growing up in Texas. They're going to put you in sports,
Speaker 2: and you played all the sports, and you loved sports.
Speaker 2: You loved baseball and soccer and all that. But it's
Speaker 2: just always interesting to me as someone who did theater.
Speaker 2: Every kid is typically put in sports by their parents,
Speaker 2: and that's a good thing. Sports teaches you teamwork and
Speaker 2: it's good to be healthy and fit and all these things.
Speaker 2: But it is not standard that kids try the arts typically.
Speaker 2: I don't think, like maybe through school, but you know,
Speaker 2: I obviously never did well in sports, but my parents
Speaker 2: still had me try volleyball and tennis and all these things,
Speaker 2: and luckily they then realized how horrible I was and
Speaker 2: let me brand into theater. But I just I would
Speaker 2: encourage all parents to have their kids try theater, because
Speaker 2: I'm in here thinking what if you'd tried plays and
Speaker 2: stuff as a kid.
Speaker 1: Well, you know what, I didn't love the theater. I
Speaker 1: was never drawn to the theater. I was never drawn
Speaker 1: to acting. I always wanted to host, which is I
Speaker 1: know it fits now, but no, like even the talent show,
Speaker 1: the school talent show, when everybody was auditioning for stuff,
Speaker 1: I wanted to MC. I wanted to run the show.
Speaker 2: Someone has a control.
Speaker 1: I do for sure, But I always and you know,
Speaker 1: I did speech and I was a part of the
Speaker 1: speech club and stuff like that. But you're right. I
Speaker 1: think typically you have to find theater as opposed to
Speaker 1: your put into sports.
Speaker 2: Right, it's not so automatically.
Speaker 1: And you know, not to get on a soapbox. But
Speaker 1: unfortunately the first thing that's cut in schools is.
Speaker 2: The article let's get on a soapbox.
Speaker 1: Oh, and that is a bummer because you know, choir, music, band,
Speaker 1: all those things, just that outlet. You should be well rounded,
Speaker 1: and you should play sports. You should try it. You
Speaker 1: should try all these things.
Speaker 2: And just so, I think doing that teaches you how
Speaker 2: to speak in meetings, teaches you how to you know,
Speaker 2: like that's people's number one fear. Right, Even you said
Speaker 2: you were nervous auditioning in front of everybody. It's such
Speaker 2: a good way to kind of get away fears of
Speaker 2: stage fright and even social interaction.
Speaker 1: And we have a lot of parenting things we're going
Speaker 1: to discuss today that are in the headlines. And it's
Speaker 1: funny because you know, as far as as my kids go,
Speaker 1: I probably definitely helped my daughter because she went into theater,
Speaker 1: found that she was a great athlete as well, so
Speaker 1: she was more well rounded than probably Joshua, who never
Speaker 1: found that voice and experimented with theater and all that,
Speaker 1: and so he's probably a little lacking, a little behind
Speaker 1: in the public speaking forum.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so let's run the drills, you know, dad, give
Speaker 2: him the mic and just do some tittering.
Speaker 1: If I had Joshua on this podcast, it would be
Speaker 1: a very short podcast, a lot of one word answers.
Speaker 1: Someday I'll have the kids on.
Speaker 2: Oh you know what, we talked about doing that for
Speaker 2: father's sake, and we just straight up for your.
Speaker 1: We were all traveling and going kind of different directions.
Speaker 1: But someday we'll have them on. And because it's fascinating,
Speaker 1: there at a kind of a perfect age to do it,
Speaker 1: being nineteen and twenty one, and they're both in college,
Speaker 1: and that kind of takes us to some of these
Speaker 1: things that struck us this week. One is this Gavin
Speaker 1: Rossdale and Gwen Stefani co parenting story where Gavin Rossdale
Speaker 1: went on they share three kids, Kingston, Zuma, and Apollo.
Speaker 1: Their ages seventeen, fourteen, and nine, so very impressionable ages,
Speaker 1: and they just talked about their co parenting and how
Speaker 1: they really don't co parent.
Speaker 2: Well, Gavin spoke about it's only Gavin on this podcast.
Speaker 1: A podcast, and he said they don't co.
Speaker 2: Parents, and they don't co parents, and they don't do podcasts.
Speaker 1: They just parent. And I know you're like, well, yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll read the exact quote he said on the
Speaker 2: Not So Hollywood Podcast.
Speaker 1: Quote shout out to Adreana Costa Body, former co host
Speaker 1: of mine. We worked together for years.
Speaker 2: Oh really, I didn't know that. I know her from
Speaker 2: seeing her on Red Carpet.
Speaker 1: We worked a TV guy together, We did Red Carpets
Speaker 1: together for the award shows and lived near me out
Speaker 1: in in Westlake Village area.
Speaker 2: It's lovely.
Speaker 1: Her podcast.
Speaker 2: Yes, so Gavin said to her quote of co parenting
Speaker 2: and being divorced with kids. I think you can go
Speaker 2: one of two ways. You can either do everything together
Speaker 2: and really co parent and see how that goes, or
Speaker 2: you can just parent. And I think we just parent.
Speaker 2: We're really different people. I don't think there's much similarity
Speaker 2: in the way we bring them up, but I think
Speaker 2: it gives them an incredible perspective for them to choose
Speaker 2: which pieces of those two lives they'd like to inherit
Speaker 2: and move on with, and which part of themselves comes
Speaker 2: out of the whole process.
Speaker 1: You can clearly see number one, how Gavin and Gwen
Speaker 1: Stefani did not stay together well right, because you very
Speaker 1: different people.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it makes me honestly, hearing that quote
Speaker 2: alone makes me think, well, gosh, it sounds like their
Speaker 2: marriage was rough. We're very different people. I think that's
Speaker 2: the biggest mistake people make typically marrying young. Myself included ourselves. Well,
Speaker 2: you grow up hearing like opposites attract and he needs
Speaker 2: someone to balance you out and he needs your counterpart.
Speaker 2: And that's true if that helps you work as a team,
Speaker 2: but it's not true if you're such different people. Like
Speaker 2: I think, honestly, relationships work better when people are pretty similar,
Speaker 2: and they want to do life the same way, and
Speaker 2: he's saying, we don't do parenting the same way.
Speaker 1: Well, and that's the big one, right, I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: when it comes to economics and how we spend our
Speaker 1: money and save our money, our politics, typically things like that,
Speaker 1: But when kids come into the picture, that's when it's
Speaker 1: really noticeable.
Speaker 2: Because you're doing the hardest job.
Speaker 1: That's when it gets exacerbated because you are dispensing advice
Speaker 1: and making decisions every single day, so you're put on
Speaker 1: display for each other as partners, husband and wife, whatever,
Speaker 1: mother and father. So it just gets exacerbated because it's
Speaker 1: magnified so many times a day, and these are pretty
Speaker 1: big decisions. And if you don't align all the time,
Speaker 1: I mean, you're never going to always align, Like you
Speaker 1: and I had a disagreement recently, but you're not always
Speaker 1: going to agree. But for the most part, big picture,
Speaker 1: you should and clearly they didn't.
Speaker 2: We disagreed on a parenting thing recently and it was
Speaker 2: sort of shocking to me, and I guess this is
Speaker 2: a good problem to have, but it was the first
Speaker 2: time in the five years we've been together that I
Speaker 2: did not agree with you. On a parenting thing. Now,
Speaker 2: granted we sort of separate, how like, I never have
Speaker 2: disciplined the kids I leave. You know that in my mind,
Speaker 2: I'm a mentor to them, I'm not their parent. But
Speaker 2: you and I talk about this stuff, and I don't know.
Speaker 2: I was really shaken by it. I even spoke to
Speaker 2: some friends and said, I don't agree with Chris. I
Speaker 2: don't agree with Chris, and I don't know what to do.
Speaker 2: And my friends were like, Lauren, parents disagree on things
Speaker 2: all all the time, And I felt very naive about it.
Speaker 2: But I really don't know the answer. When you disagree
Speaker 2: on a especially a pretty big parenting decision, what do
Speaker 2: you do?
Speaker 1: Well. It's funny because I blew right past that with
Speaker 1: you and just continued on because you mean, because I
Speaker 1: know that that happens all the time, because I've had that.
Speaker 2: Oh it didn't hit you as hard until.
Speaker 1: I saw how it affected you, and I realized, oh,
Speaker 1: this is the first time you and I have had
Speaker 1: this situation, And so I stopped. And I don't know
Speaker 1: if you noticed, but I went back and I had
Speaker 1: a lot of discussions with you about parenting and how
Speaker 1: I and just our philosophies are.
Speaker 2: I don't know if I noticed, Babe, we stopped and
Speaker 2: had those discussions because I kept telling you, I don't
Speaker 2: feel good about this.
Speaker 1: We need to have these discussions, and so I just
Speaker 1: realized I was going, you know, one hundred miles an hour,
Speaker 1: which you just typically do, and you just kind of
Speaker 1: move on because yeah, you do these these broad brush things,
Speaker 1: and I always say, you can't really parent with a
Speaker 1: scalpel and be so specific. It's more broad brush strokes
Speaker 1: and the best you can in that moment, and then
Speaker 1: you just accept it and move on. That that was
Speaker 1: the decision that we made, and so I realized that
Speaker 1: we had never disagreed before, and so that was kind
Speaker 1: of the first time that we had to actually stop
Speaker 1: and discuss it.
Speaker 2: So let me ask you then, and you know, take
Speaker 2: you and I out of it, just being as someone
Speaker 2: who's a parent period. If you do disagree, what do
Speaker 2: you do?
Speaker 1: I mean, you just got to find that eventually, you
Speaker 1: find that common ground and you're just not always going
Speaker 1: to agree and someone at the end of the day,
Speaker 1: someone's going to win. And I guess you could say
Speaker 1: that one I won. But I think for the most part,
Speaker 1: what you do. And this is why I really related
Speaker 1: to the Gavin Rossdale Gwen Stefani thing is because I
Speaker 1: have two schools going on like you and I, and
Speaker 1: I know you don't consider yourself in this realm, but
Speaker 1: we do. We copair it, we discuss things. Typically we
Speaker 1: arrive at a decision that is best suited for all
Speaker 1: of us. And I very much value your opinion because
Speaker 1: I know you love the kids as much as I do,
Speaker 1: and I think you have a great perspective, and you
Speaker 1: are unbelievably smart. And I think I've been doing this
Speaker 1: for a while and I think I'm a good dad
Speaker 1: and I have good perspective, and so it's that's typically
Speaker 1: what you have when you're married or when you're raising
Speaker 1: kids together. What scared me, and this is what drove
Speaker 1: me on this Gavin Rossdale Gwen Stefani's story is that
Speaker 1: scared the heck out of me when I got divorced again.
Speaker 1: My ex I get along with, she's a good mother,
Speaker 1: none of those issues that Gwen and Gavin seem to have.
Speaker 1: But at the same time, you lose control. And I
Speaker 1: actually just said this to my nineteen year old daughter
Speaker 1: Taylor the other day. We were having a deep discussion.
Speaker 1: I said, you know, the scariest thing for me as
Speaker 1: a dad was when we got divorced, you would go
Speaker 1: to your mom's. We were fifty to fifty and I
Speaker 1: didn't think you were you know, anything was wrong, but
Speaker 1: it just it scared me because I lost control again,
Speaker 1: going back to a control thing. But I didn't know
Speaker 1: what was being done, what was being said. I didn't
Speaker 1: know the things you were going through on the day
Speaker 1: to day anymore.
Speaker 2: If you weren't seeing half for life in person in
Speaker 2: real time.
Speaker 1: Usually every single day you see it and you're dealing
Speaker 1: with it. And again, even if you agree or disagree,
Speaker 1: as you're co parenting, you're in it and you lose
Speaker 1: that and that that scared the hell out of me
Speaker 1: as a dad because then they come back to you
Speaker 1: a week later or however you're doing your your custody
Speaker 1: and you're not going to get the full report, and
Speaker 1: you don't want to dive in and be like, oh
Speaker 1: what did mom say? You know, it's you're trying not
Speaker 1: to pit anybody against each other, but at the same
Speaker 1: time you're trying to get some information as to what's
Speaker 1: going on in your life. It was a very It's
Speaker 1: a very difficult thing to navigate. And I have all
Speaker 1: the love and the respect in the world for even
Speaker 1: for Gavin and Gwenn trying to figure this out and
Speaker 1: navigate these waters.
Speaker 2: Well, I you know, I think what I've learned in
Speaker 2: this these past couple weeks with us is that I've
Speaker 2: maybe learned, for the first time in my adult life,
Speaker 2: the true meaning of agree to disagree. And I know
Speaker 2: sometimes you're like, you think that I keep tally of
Speaker 2: things in my head. By the way, babe, this is
Speaker 2: just a female thing. Like women, I'm stereotyping here, But
Speaker 2: when you are about to have an argument with me,
Speaker 2: I've played that scenario out five different ways in my head.
Speaker 1: I know the chays you're going to get scoreboard.
Speaker 2: I do a little bit, but not in a way
Speaker 2: of like like to me, I'm like a lawyer gathering evidence.
Speaker 2: I am the child of two lawyers, and I'm just
Speaker 2: trying to show you how I feel, and so I
Speaker 2: provide examples. I did think to myself with this, Okay,
Speaker 2: we've agreed to disagree here, he has won here. But
Speaker 2: I thought, well, in future, you know, if this same
Speaker 2: situation comes up, I am going to bring this up
Speaker 2: and say I felt differently here, then this is why,
Speaker 2: And now we're kind of in the same situation again,
Speaker 2: and I thought that is that a toxic thing? Yes?
Speaker 1: Now I guess my advice to parents and I think
Speaker 1: to going back to your original question, what do you
Speaker 1: do if you quote unquote lose in the decision making.
Speaker 1: It's not that you lose and you lose power, it's
Speaker 1: you need to find other ways to reach that child
Speaker 1: with your wisdom. And so obviously there's only one way
Speaker 1: certain certain decisions can go, but that doesn't mean you
Speaker 1: can't offer some reflection and some important lessons on what
Speaker 1: just went down. Maybe it's not going to be as
Speaker 1: extreme as you would have decided to do, but you
Speaker 1: can still like and you did this, And this is
Speaker 1: why I love it is you had talks with Taylor
Speaker 1: explaining your position and how you felt about things, and
Speaker 1: I think you can still in part wisdom even if
Speaker 1: you don't fully get your way. Well, of course, and
Speaker 1: that's but but that's co parenting. At the end of
Speaker 1: the day, you're you're reaching that medium, that center point
Speaker 1: and both being able to give that wisdom in your
Speaker 1: side of things.
Speaker 2: True, but I'm going to tell you why I don't
Speaker 2: think what I did was toxic. As we have an
Speaker 2: argument here on the podcast. Say that a kid gets
Speaker 2: a speeding ticket and you disagree on the punishment or
Speaker 2: the response, and then they get another speeding ticket. Wouldn't you,
Speaker 2: as the parent who lost out on the way to
Speaker 2: handle it that first time, be like, Okay, can we
Speaker 2: try my method now because something did you do?
Speaker 1: No, I would say we go back and say, let's
Speaker 1: say someone got a speeding ticket and I and you'd
Speaker 1: say I think they need to lose their car for
Speaker 1: a month, and I'd be like, hm, let's just take
Speaker 1: away their phone for a night. I don't know, I'm
Speaker 1: just making this up. And they do it again two
Speaker 1: weeks later. I would go back and be like, you
Speaker 1: know what, you were right? This needs to be is exactly.
Speaker 2: What I'm saying. I'm saying, I'm just banking it to
Speaker 2: be like, Okay, you did not agree with my approach.
Speaker 2: If a similar situation happens in the future, maybe we
Speaker 2: go the Elsie way.
Speaker 1: But I also think that you have to everyone needs
Speaker 1: to understand as parents. I think everyone who is a
Speaker 1: parent understands this. There is no perfect. There is no right,
Speaker 1: there is no winning or losing. You do the best
Speaker 1: you can with the information you have at the time,
Speaker 1: and you're hopefully doing the best for your child. Sometimes
Speaker 1: it's tough love. Sometimes it's being harsh. Sometimes it's putting
Speaker 1: an arm around him telling him you still support him
Speaker 1: and love him. It's a very and that actually believes
Speaker 1: us in kind of this next story.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know, one more thing I do want
Speaker 2: to say about the Gavin and Gwen thing, though I
Speaker 2: wish I could remember which friends said this to me,
Speaker 2: but I think it's a good note to leave this
Speaker 2: one on. I was talking to a friend about the
Speaker 2: situation of ours, and she was saying that, like, you know,
Speaker 2: like she's a working mom, that her partner works. They're
Speaker 2: so busy all the time. And she said, one of
Speaker 2: the biggest things that helped us, I think, avoid disagreements
Speaker 2: in the now is that before we ever became parents,
Speaker 2: we had a ton of conversations about how we wanted
Speaker 2: to parent, and so then when we're in the midst
Speaker 2: of everybody's working and we're exhausted and the kids are crazy,
Speaker 2: we kind of in our minds we were already on
Speaker 2: the same page and we go back to what we
Speaker 2: that foundation we'd laid, and I thought, God, that's so simple,
Speaker 2: but how many people do it? You know, you're excited,
Speaker 2: you're caught up been getting pregnant, but are you really
Speaker 2: having discussions about how we want a parent beforehand? So
Speaker 2: I loved that good.
Speaker 1: Advice, and that honestly makes me admire what you have
Speaker 1: done and what all people who enter into a parenting
Speaker 1: situation and a step parenting situation where you haven't had
Speaker 1: those conversations. You and I didn't grow up together talk
Speaker 1: about having babies. You had to enter into this situation
Speaker 1: and that's why you have done a brilliant job. And
Speaker 1: it is and again my hat goes off to everybody,
Speaker 1: men and women who step into these roles and love
Speaker 1: kids and care for them and haven't had the opportunity
Speaker 1: to have those conversations. And thanks Ben that grace came
Speaker 1: up in this situation with Charlie Sheen and Denise Richards's daughter,
Speaker 1: Yes she is, And this struck me again because she
Speaker 1: is nineteen years old, the exact same age as by
Speaker 1: daughter Tayloran.
Speaker 2: We were laughing the other day about how you can
Speaker 2: get for lack of a better word, triggered by just
Speaker 2: what's you know, things did you like when you were
Speaker 2: I don't know, when you're going through a divorce, celebrity
Speaker 2: news divorce celebrity divorce news hits you where I lost
Speaker 2: my dad and you're like watching the show Shrinking and
Speaker 2: there's a loss in the beginning, and Chris is getting
Speaker 2: very into it, and I'm like, I don't know that,
Speaker 2: like that show hits me differently or you know. So
Speaker 2: it's we're very much on this note with this next headline.
Speaker 1: Because so this nineteen year old daughter of Denise and
Speaker 1: Charlie Sheen, she's been on Only Fans. She just celebrated
Speaker 1: her one year anniversary she turned eighteen. She joined Only
Speaker 1: Fans and at first Charlie was actually outspoken about not
Speaker 1: loving it and didn't condone this. He since changed course
Speaker 1: as a parent.
Speaker 2: He said he had a conversation with Denise Richards, his
Speaker 2: ex Sammy's mom, his co parent, and he said that
Speaker 2: Denise brought some points to light for him and made
Speaker 2: him see the situation differently. And I really by the
Speaker 2: way Charlie Sheen, I mean, the man said his headlines
Speaker 2: over the years, but I admire that in an interview.
Speaker 2: He said, no, I spoke to my ex wife and
Speaker 2: she helped me see it differently, and I feel differently
Speaker 2: about it. That's a pretty mature thing to reve Now.
Speaker 1: I put my arm around her, and I give her
Speaker 1: the support that she deserves and needs and the and
Speaker 1: I don't know what she does on OnlyFans. I have
Speaker 1: no idea.
Speaker 2: It's very interesting because Sammy's made a lot of headlines
Speaker 2: for referring to herself yes as a sex worker, and
Speaker 2: then she clarified and said, well, listen, I'm not like
Speaker 2: having sex on camera. I'm not doing what you would
Speaker 2: call porn, but I call myself a sex worker because
Speaker 2: of the other things I'm doing. And she said, and
Speaker 2: I think there's no shame in being a sex worker.
Speaker 2: And to be honest, I admire her at a young
Speaker 2: age for classifying herself in that way and saying that
Speaker 2: she doesn't think there's shame in the profession. I mean,
Speaker 2: it's a really interesting case with her and her mom
Speaker 2: because Denise Richards has said, look, I did the movie
Speaker 2: Wild Things, I posed for Playboy, so who am I
Speaker 2: to judge here? And also I was just really thinking,
Speaker 2: I don't know, is that the equivalent is only fans,
Speaker 2: like very similar to that today And.
Speaker 1: By the way, we don't have them. We didn't have
Speaker 1: only fans back in the day, so you had to
Speaker 1: be in what was called a magazine and maybe that's
Speaker 1: more lasting than only fans.
Speaker 2: Way out there. He didn't get paid, well.
Speaker 1: You definitely didn't get paid, Hugh Hefner did and he
Speaker 1: had a big mansion.
Speaker 2: Right, so why not profit from it?
Speaker 1: At least you own it. Look, whether it's Taylor Swift
Speaker 1: and her music, whether it's only fans. I know that
Speaker 1: Denise who joined only fans later as well in kind
Speaker 1: of you know, solidarity with her daughter Sammy. It's like, look,
Speaker 1: she's catching a lot of grief. I'm going to join
Speaker 1: this as well. They're both And again I'm no judgment
Speaker 1: whether this is good or bad. They are making a
Speaker 1: crap ton of money, hundreds of thousands of dollars a month,
Speaker 1: so say what you will. Again, I'm not condoning it.
Speaker 1: I'm not shaming it. I'm just saying they are making banks.
Speaker 2: Babe, let's get you on OnlyFans, I would do.
Speaker 1: I think feet stuff a really good feet for a man.
Speaker 1: Is there is there a market for that?
Speaker 2: By the way, Yes, I'm sure there is there's a
Speaker 2: market for everything. I'm gonna ask you the tough question, but.
Speaker 1: Here's my thing, and I know you go because this
Speaker 1: isn't my point.
Speaker 2: Well, you know what I'm gonna ask. Yes, if either
Speaker 2: of the kids, Yeah, came to you and said, I'm
Speaker 2: gonna be on only fans because Sammy is saying, this
Speaker 2: is my job. That's what I'm doing professionally. If they
Speaker 2: said that, she says she loves her job, what would
Speaker 2: you say to them?
Speaker 1: This is and this goes back to kind of our
Speaker 1: disagreement with what happened this summer. Sammy is a nineteen
Speaker 1: year old woman. She is technically an adult. Now is
Speaker 1: she a grown woman? No, she's not. I would say
Speaker 1: that she does not have the life experience that her
Speaker 1: mom and dad do. She does not have the life
Speaker 1: experience that she will when she is twenty five, which
Speaker 1: is still very young, thirty five, forty five, fifty five.
Speaker 1: Now will she look back? I can regret this, I
Speaker 1: don't know. And I think what Charlie said is the
Speaker 1: dad is kind of probably apropost it was. I can't
Speaker 1: believe I'm saying I agree with Charlie Sheen and parenting.
Speaker 1: But he said, look, keep it classy, just try not
Speaker 1: to do anything that you will regret. But at nineteen,
Speaker 1: do you have the mechanism to do things you won't regret?
Speaker 1: I think of myself at nineteen, I think of my kids.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you are equipped. You just don't
Speaker 1: have that computer chip in you yet, you're not upgraded
Speaker 1: to that model.
Speaker 2: Well, and let's you know, look, people are first of all,
Speaker 2: we're all making mistakes of that age. But then I
Speaker 2: think any celebrity of any level is making mistakes on
Speaker 2: a public scale totally. So Sammy is doing stuff on
Speaker 2: OnlyFans and that's public and known. But like you could be,
Speaker 2: you know, justin Bieber or any star at that age
Speaker 2: is probably going to do some things in the limelight
Speaker 2: that they'll later look back and wish they hadn't done,
Speaker 2: which is really hard because it's in the public eye.
Speaker 1: And what you want to do is you want to
Speaker 1: give your kids that room to make mistakes. That's how
Speaker 1: you learn. You want them to grow and push the
Speaker 1: envelope and make mistakes. But for someone of this ilk,
Speaker 1: it's so public. That's the thing for these celebrity kids.
Speaker 2: But you know, Denise, like she said, she posed in magazines,
Speaker 2: she did all that stuff. And I I saw this interview.
Speaker 2: I don't know which OnlyFans model it was, but somebody
Speaker 2: who's big on OnlyFans did an interview with Piers Morgan
Speaker 2: that weren't kind of viral because he said, well, don't
Speaker 2: you wonder what your children will look back and think
Speaker 2: on with this content? And she's British and she goes, well,
Speaker 2: they'll be looking back from a Ferrari. Well, it's not
Speaker 2: a bad point. You're making money for your family, and
Speaker 2: I is.
Speaker 1: That The bottom line is the bottom line, the bottom line,
Speaker 1: you know? Is it just Hey, you're making bank. Don't
Speaker 1: worry to me. I guess as you asked my opinion
Speaker 1: of what I would do with my kids. Life gets tricky.
Speaker 1: Parenting gets tricky when your kids are adults. Now they're
Speaker 1: still living under my roof. Technically I'm still paying for college,
Speaker 1: so I feel like I have a little bit more say.
Speaker 1: But at the end of the day, if my son
Speaker 1: or daughter want to emancipate and like fully break away
Speaker 1: and just leave, they can. There's nothing I can do
Speaker 1: about it. They are grown adults technically in this world
Speaker 1: nineteen and twenty one years old. But I try to
Speaker 1: just guide them and help them, knowing that at the
Speaker 1: end of the day they are at this point making
Speaker 1: the final decision. Sammy Richards is making the final decision.
Speaker 1: I would just try to guide her as her dad
Speaker 1: and mom seem to be doing of Let's try not
Speaker 1: to make that fatal layer. Let's try to keep it
Speaker 1: between the navigational beacons in some way to where at
Speaker 1: nineteen you can be proud of this later.
Speaker 2: Love. That one thing I've learned from you a lot
Speaker 2: is all my love and shout out to Donna Zima,
Speaker 2: who's been on the podcast before. But my mom was
Speaker 2: a much more harsh parent than you are. It was
Speaker 2: like about punishments and groundings and yelling. And I have
Speaker 2: seen you be such an effective parent through patients, through
Speaker 2: calm responses, through Hey, I love you no matter what.
Speaker 2: But what do you think about? What do you think
Speaker 2: you'll think about this decision X amount of years? You
Speaker 2: know it's and like that gentle challenging you make it
Speaker 2: very effective.
Speaker 1: So thank you. One thing I will throw out at
Speaker 1: the end of this there's a great book that I
Speaker 1: read many years ago called Bounce by Michael Sayed, and
Speaker 1: it's kind of in the same vein of Malcolm Gladwell.
Speaker 1: He took that Gladwell idea of the Tipping Point. If
Speaker 1: you've ever read The Tipping Point, that ten thousand hour rule,
Speaker 1: and Bounce kind of if you coach kids, work with kids,
Speaker 1: deal with kids, read this book. It changed my life
Speaker 1: and my perspective on my kids, the way I spoke
Speaker 1: to my kids, the way it kind of comes from
Speaker 1: an athletic perspective, mostly because this guy was a world
Speaker 1: class table tennis player. I know that sounds wild, but.
Speaker 2: His table tennis ping pong, ping pong, yes.
Speaker 1: Essentially, but he was like Olympic level, crazy, world class,
Speaker 1: and so it's an amazing that he then took into
Speaker 1: the way to teach, coach and all that, and I
Speaker 1: have learned. I learned so much many many years ago
Speaker 1: from that. And then again just the perspective of now
Speaker 1: I'm fifty one years old and have lived a life
Speaker 1: and I've seen these kids grow up.
Speaker 2: One more quick parenting headline. So we did that podcast.
Speaker 2: If everybody listened, thank you, and if not, please go
Speaker 2: back and listen to the podcast. We did with doctor
Speaker 2: Sterling about being older parents, literally having kids at an
Speaker 2: older age, from both a male and female perspective of
Speaker 2: biology and emotion and everything in between. Now, this was
Speaker 2: before the news dropped that Courtney Kardashian is pregnant at
Speaker 2: forty four. But this we were doing it because of
Speaker 2: Alpacino and Robert de Niro becoming Dad's much older two
Speaker 2: x with Gyes. Yeah huh So now this time is
Speaker 2: in the headlines again. I mean, I'm looking at a
Speaker 2: headline right now from Glamour. Why are women being shamed
Speaker 2: for the age they have children, or why are women
Speaker 2: like Courtney Kardashian being shamed for the age they choose
Speaker 2: to have children? Because people are coming for Courtney in
Speaker 2: the comments, saying she's being irresponsible for being pregnant at
Speaker 2: forty four because.
Speaker 1: Breeding with these old eggs.
Speaker 2: I know, horrible things and I love it. Because also
Speaker 2: our friend doctor Sterling, when on her Instagram, defended her.
Speaker 2: Go follow doctor Sterling if you don't.
Speaker 1: But and we talked a little bit about this. We
Speaker 1: obviously were focusing on Pacino and de Niro, but she
Speaker 1: went into women.
Speaker 2: She gave me a lot of hope, and I actually
Speaker 2: have several friends tell me they loved listening to it
Speaker 2: because again, I'm thirty five. My friends are thirty six mostly,
Speaker 2: and some of them don't have kids yet are and
Speaker 2: really felt the stress of this essential sort of vibe
Speaker 2: that we have in our culture that the science says,
Speaker 2: if you have kids over thirty five, you're screwed and
Speaker 2: horrible and you shouldn't have done it, and your kids
Speaker 2: are like. So I I am here in defense of
Speaker 2: Courtney Kardashian as well, and I know some people are saying, well,
Speaker 2: she's coming from this place of privilege and she has
Speaker 2: the money to do these fertility treatments. I mean, look,
Speaker 2: on the one hand, yes, but on the other hand, well,
Speaker 2: if you have the money, like, I'm not going to
Speaker 2: deny someone the ability to have a baby if.
Speaker 1: Wells Doctor Sterling, who is again the medical side of this,
Speaker 1: very appropriately said technically, yes, as you get older, things
Speaker 1: can change, but she says you can also mitigate those risks.
Speaker 1: There are many things you can do, and she said
Speaker 1: also as we get older, there are positives.
Speaker 2: That was fascinating telling.
Speaker 1: Babies and getting pregnant at an older age. So it's yes,
Speaker 1: there are some risks but if that's all you look at,
Speaker 1: you're not looking at the full picture.
Speaker 2: I just think we have a lot of people in
Speaker 2: this world, honestly, who are bad parents or who are
Speaker 2: really mediocre parents. You see headlines all the time. I
Speaker 2: see them on people dot com of I saw a
Speaker 2: headline yesterday I have a woman who went on vacation
Speaker 2: and left her infant baby at home and the baby died.
Speaker 2: So I don't mean to be morbid. I'm just saying,
Speaker 2: if there are people in this world who want to
Speaker 2: go be good parents, who are craving to have a child,
Speaker 2: and who can do it in a healthy way, and
Speaker 2: obviously the Kardashians, the Kardashian Barker legacy has plenty of
Speaker 2: money to give a kid a beautiful life, like then
Speaker 2: have a baby.
Speaker 1: And by the way, the way Courtney announced this, that's
Speaker 1: so cute. You did it at a Blink one eighty
Speaker 1: two concert with obviously Travis Parker's and Blink one eighty two.
Speaker 1: She held up a sign at the concert and some
Speaker 1: people were giving her grief about, you know, it being
Speaker 1: so public and the way she did it and that
Speaker 1: it was staged. You think you think a Kardashian state,
Speaker 1: like knew that they would get pressed with this, of course,
Speaker 1: but like who cares?
Speaker 2: Well, she was doing a nod to a Blink one
Speaker 2: eighty two music.
Speaker 1: Areas part of the video.
Speaker 2: Yes, it was. She was a callback to the video,
Speaker 2: and I ever.
Speaker 1: Came up with that idea jails by the way, I
Speaker 1: don't know if it was Courtney or pr or whoever,
Speaker 1: but basically to play out the video and to kind
Speaker 1: of roll it back on Travis Parker was awesome, But like,
Speaker 1: what do we care that it was how she announced
Speaker 1: it and that it was stage coming.
Speaker 2: Well, look, the Kardashians are excellent at making careers out
Speaker 2: of being commended and being criticized. So congrats to court
Speaker 2: me And if you guys haven't listened to that podcast
Speaker 2: with Doctor Sterling, please go check it out and let
Speaker 2: us know what you think. And if you'd like more Podor.
Speaker 1: We're going to have her on again because just we
Speaker 1: had I've had so many women come up to me
Speaker 1: and you've the same direct message et cetera saying, man,
Speaker 1: that was a great, honest talk to hear her. I
Speaker 1: think it's just kind of taboo to have these conversations
Speaker 1: and really speak out honestly about some of this stuff.
Speaker 1: So we're going to do more of that and maybe
Speaker 1: take some of your questions and take them to doctor Sterling.
Speaker 1: Speaking of criticism. Oh, before we go, my girl, Taylor Swift,
Speaker 1: proud Swift, Swifty, I'm a Swifty, so just know that
Speaker 1: you know what side I'm coming on. So Taylor Swift
Speaker 1: has released her albums, re released her albums because she
Speaker 1: lost her catalog in twenty nineteen. It was kind of
Speaker 1: taken out from under her and sold, and so she
Speaker 1: has brilliantly and the effort and money and time it
Speaker 1: takes to re record your entire catalog with Taylor's version
Speaker 1: is insane to me while you're trying to tour and
Speaker 1: all that. So kudos to her. But she's going to
Speaker 1: re release this latest.
Speaker 2: Album, speak Now, Ingenuous one Speak.
Speaker 1: And so she went was it a video at her concert?
Speaker 2: So no, She's on her airas tour right now, and
Speaker 2: during a moment of one of the stops, she kind
Speaker 2: of spoke out to the fans and said, look, speak
Speaker 2: Now is coming out and I would love here you
Speaker 2: know what I'll read the basically ask you for some grace, right, Well,
Speaker 2: not for herself for other people, she said, because on
Speaker 2: Speak now are the songs rumored to be about, for example,
Speaker 2: John Mayor, and people have really come for John Mayer
Speaker 2: over the years because of the songs the lyrics that
Speaker 2: they think are about him. They probably are. And their
Speaker 2: big thing was there was a big age gap between
Speaker 2: the two of them, and Taylor was quite young when
Speaker 2: they dated. I think like only nineteen, so I.
Speaker 1: Think, seriously it wasn't even the age gap as much
Speaker 1: as the ages the ages.
Speaker 2: You're right, she was nineteen, as we were just saying,
Speaker 2: at nineteen, you don't really know who you are yet,
Speaker 2: and John was a good amount older. So Taylor said
Speaker 2: to the crowd quote, I was hoping to ask you
Speaker 2: that as we lead up to this album coming out,
Speaker 2: I would love for kindness and gentleness to extend onto
Speaker 2: our internet activities. I'm thirty three years old. I don't
Speaker 2: care about anything that happened to me when I was nineteen,
Speaker 2: except the songs I wrote. She told her the audience,
Speaker 2: you should not feel the need to defend me on
Speaker 2: the internet against someone you think. I might have written
Speaker 2: a song about fourteen billion years ago. Now it stuck
Speaker 2: out to me about This quote specifically was I'm thirty
Speaker 2: three years old. I don't care about anything that happened
Speaker 2: to me when I was nineteen except the songs I wrote.
Speaker 2: I love that, and I think it's such an important
Speaker 2: message for everybody, Like, honestly, take out the part about
Speaker 2: like don't come for John Mayer. It's such a good
Speaker 2: reminder for kids now to be like, this too shall pass.
Speaker 2: The breakups that are bothering you now are not going
Speaker 2: to stick with you at thirty three. They will help
Speaker 2: shape who you become. You will take away the important lessons,
Speaker 2: but don't let it be like like you're not going
Speaker 2: to be upset about the same guy or girl or
Speaker 2: whoever in fifteen years. And I love that she told
Speaker 2: the audience that she's like, I'm not holding onto this bitterness.
Speaker 1: I'm hopay I've moved on right.
Speaker 2: I mean, again, those experiences to shape you. But by
Speaker 2: the way, I also even though she said that, I
Speaker 2: don't think it's going to work well, the thing is,
Speaker 2: people are still going to come for Jean Mahor in.
Speaker 1: Their defense the Swifties. You know, if you were going
Speaker 1: to use some of this as cannon fodder and your
Speaker 1: songs in any art there, you're hoping to elicit a reaction.
Speaker 1: So these these songs elicit emotion reaction. So it's hard
Speaker 1: to put this out in the world as that is
Speaker 1: the intent. And then when you get that emotion.
Speaker 2: Well, what's different and scary and hard now is when
Speaker 2: she first wrote these songs, we didn't have social media
Speaker 2: on the level it is now. I mean, think about it,
Speaker 2: not that long ago in time. If you artists have
Speaker 2: always used their own lives as inspiration, and if somebody
Speaker 2: wrote a breakup song about someone, even if as a
Speaker 2: fan you knew who it was, you couldn't immediately go
Speaker 2: on their Instagram and type something horrible to them or
Speaker 2: send them a horrible DM. But now you can.
Speaker 1: I found that that happened on the show quite a
Speaker 1: bit too. You know, people would be over a breakup
Speaker 1: and the person that got broken up with or cheated on,
Speaker 1: whatever it was, would come back and say, guys, I'm okay,
Speaker 1: I'm fine, you don't need to hate this person, but
Speaker 1: there is something out there, and I guess you're right.
Speaker 1: The times have changed so much that between Twitter and Instagram,
Speaker 1: TikTok and all that that they just get.
Speaker 2: Hammered and well, you've also probably got a lot of
Speaker 2: young fans listening to Taylor Swift who still you know,
Speaker 2: when you're young, those emotions are so strong, you crush
Speaker 2: so hard, you feel sung so much, and they don't
Speaker 2: have that perspective of time. So I liked that she
Speaker 2: said that. Again, I don't know if it'll really hit home.
Speaker 1: And John Mayer's just out there rocking with the Grateful Dead,
Speaker 1: I think these days.
Speaker 2: I mean, here's a question. Is there any ex now
Speaker 2: who you would feel weird running into? Like I don't
Speaker 2: need you to name names, but I'm just like, yes,
Speaker 2: there is Yeah, like you what would you? You wouldn't even
Speaker 2: say hi? Or you would say hi? Or what?
Speaker 1: There's there's two one I would actually like to see
Speaker 1: just to reconnect. Uh and then not like in that way,
Speaker 1: don't look at.
Speaker 2: The question was when you feel weird? Al let's headline
Speaker 2: this podcast Lauren and Chris break up?
Speaker 1: But no, and then there's there are exes I would
Speaker 1: just rather not run into. I mean, who wants to.
Speaker 2: I'm I'm just saying, okay, baby, here's a better question.
Speaker 2: Is there any X if you ran into them right now?
Speaker 2: You wouldn't say hello? No, I don't think so, which
Speaker 2: is a great place to be.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, would you. I mean, like if I.
Speaker 2: Don't feel wirried about anybody.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it's like again, I don't look forward
Speaker 1: to running into them at the pizza parlor, but like
Speaker 1: I wouldn't if I saw them, I'd be like very cordial,
Speaker 1: and I hope they would too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm just a big like it's water under the bridge.
Speaker 2: We all make mistakes.
Speaker 1: Move on. Life's too. Life is too short and equally
Speaker 1: too long to carry that pain that hurt like grudge.
Speaker 1: And I know, look, I know there are those of
Speaker 1: you out there that have been through much worse and
Speaker 1: you're like, dude, you don't get it. I understand. I
Speaker 1: empathize with you, but at some point, for your health,
Speaker 1: you got to move forward.
Speaker 2: Well, I felt differently. Look years ago again, maybe more
Speaker 2: fresh off breakups or years ago I had more toxic
Speaker 2: relationships that made me angrier at the exes. But gosh,
Speaker 2: if it isn't true that like time heals all wounds,
Speaker 2: it really I go back to that sometimes I'm like,
Speaker 2: anything that you go through it will be better, and
Speaker 2: a certain amount of time it just will. And so
Speaker 2: you have to kind of you know what, I gotta
Speaker 2: shout out our friends. We'll do it, Stacy, see.
Speaker 1: That's where you're going, because you almost said the same thing.
Speaker 1: We'll leave you with this bit.
Speaker 2: Of hilariously simple wisdom. Verbal stage, verbal stage. Our friend
Speaker 2: Stacy is a pilate's instructor, and she recently had someone
Speaker 2: reach out to her and say, Hey, I just wanted
Speaker 2: to tell you. It really stuck with me when years
Speaker 2: ago you told me, look, next month things will be better,
Speaker 2: and the month after that they'll be better, and the
Speaker 2: month after that too.
Speaker 1: Dot dot dot. So I think, as our friend was
Speaker 1: trying to say, this too shall pass as this show has.
Speaker 1: Thank you guys so much for being with us today.
Speaker 1: I love sitting down with you. It's been too long
Speaker 1: since we have sat down and had a chat. Appreciate
Speaker 1: you listening always, and we will talk to you next
Speaker 1: time because we have a lot more to talk about.
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening. Follow us on Instagram at the most
Speaker 1: dramatic pod ever and make sure to write us a
Speaker 1: review and leave us five stars. I'll talk to you
Speaker 1: next time.