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Speaker 1: Talking to Death is released weekly every Wednesday and brought

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Speaker 1: to you absolutely free. But if you want at free

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Speaker 1: listening and exclusive bonuses, subscribe to Tenderfoot Plus at tenderfootplus

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Speaker 1: dot com or on Apple Podcasts.

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Speaker 2: Talking to Death is a production of tenderfoot TV and

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Speaker 2: iHeart Podcasts. Listener discretion is advised.

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Speaker 1: Talking to Death. We're back. I'm actually in New York

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Speaker 1: City right now, and so is Michael Beca Michael. I

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Speaker 1: usually call Mike Michael. Michael's what I say when I'm

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Speaker 1: in business mode. We're here in strangely, the same exact

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Speaker 1: hotel room I stayed in last time, and we were

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Speaker 1: here about a month or two ago doing some interviews

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Speaker 1: for Talking to Death, some that you've seen, some of

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Speaker 1: some you haven't seen yet. But I guess there's just

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Speaker 1: a I mean, there's probably nine hundred rooms in this hotel,

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Speaker 1: and I swear to god, I just reserved a standard room.

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Speaker 1: And here we are, back in the same precise place

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Speaker 1: that we were recording this first round of interviews. And

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Speaker 1: so it's going to look like, optically down the road

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Speaker 1: that this is just our New York studio. So I'm

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Speaker 1: just gonna roll with it. Yeah, it is at this

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Speaker 1: point Tenderfoot, New York, Tenderfoot Studios in New York City.

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Speaker 1: We're also out here getting some really fun interviews of

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Speaker 1: some people that I'm I've looked up to forever. I

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Speaker 1: don't want to spoil it too much, but just some fun,

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Speaker 1: exciting people that I got a chance to sit down

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Speaker 1: with and pick their brains and learn how they tick

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Speaker 1: and kind of see our similarities and differences. And I

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Speaker 1: think that all you guys will get not only just

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Speaker 1: a kick out of it, but maybe learn something too

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Speaker 1: in the process. Today's guest is one of my very

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Speaker 1: good friends. I have known this person for over a decade,

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Speaker 1: and I met him back in and this was probably

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Speaker 1: two thousand and eight. I was a young, little sprout

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Speaker 1: and I wanted to be a musical artist. I wanted

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Speaker 1: to be a rapper singer, and clearly that that did

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Speaker 1: not work out entirely. That's why I'm here making podcasts.

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Speaker 1: But I had a fun time doing it, and I

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Speaker 1: met this producer named Maddie. Matthew Pearson also rip one

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Speaker 1: of my best friends, but he passed away sadly a

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Speaker 1: couple of years ago, but he lives on forever and

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Speaker 1: impacted so many people, not only just in my life,

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Speaker 1: but the music industry in Atlanta, the rap scene, style culture.

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Speaker 1: But I met I met this person through my good

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Speaker 1: friend Mattie, who was a producer, and the first time

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Speaker 1: I ever actually set eyes on this guy, I walked

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Speaker 1: in the room and he was at a point in

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Speaker 1: his life where he was also rapping and singing. His

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Speaker 1: name is Greg Mike. This guy makes some of the

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Speaker 1: coolest art out there. Big, huge murals, fun, vibrant colors.

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Speaker 1: He has this mascot called Larry Loudmouth. The guy is

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Speaker 1: just a brilliant human who has mastered his art as

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Speaker 1: a craft. Greg Mike's art is bold, it's playful, it's colorful.

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Speaker 1: It just makes you feel good when you look at it.

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Speaker 1: And he has this very popular character mascot, whatever you

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Speaker 1: want to call it, called Larry Loudmouth, and it's really

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Speaker 1: kind of an iconic figure. And if you're in Atlanta,

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Speaker 1: if you live in Atlanta, there's no way you've not

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Speaker 1: come across this, either in a mural somewhere in East Atlanta,

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Speaker 1: or on a billboard, or somewhere inside a Falcons game,

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Speaker 1: a Braves game, whatever, a Hawks game, you name it.

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Speaker 1: This guy is on the pulse of the city. And

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Speaker 1: he's also, over the years in his career, built this big,

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Speaker 1: huge community of other artists and features them in his gallery.

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Speaker 1: He's just an amazing human who is way better at

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Speaker 1: something that I'm trash at. Mike, how good are you

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Speaker 1: at drawing?

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Speaker 3: I'm absolutely terrible. Like I can kind of doodle, but

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Speaker 3: like I'm bad at straight lines and like anything perfect.

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Speaker 1: So you'd be a bad surgeon, Yeah, probably, but the

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Speaker 1: surgery hands, you know, like.

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Speaker 3: My handshake real bad. It's like a genetic thing in

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Speaker 3: my family.

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Speaker 1: You just haven't had a drink yet or what exactly.

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Speaker 1: It's weird. So I have to just drink this sean

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Speaker 1: of whiskey in the morning then it goes away.

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Speaker 2: Uh No.

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Speaker 3: But Greg, Mike is the guy who does those perfect

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Speaker 3: surgical lines. Like his stuff is just known for being

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Speaker 3: like it's printed, it's amazing.

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Speaker 1: It's just fun to look at. And I actually have

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Speaker 1: one of his pieces in my house. The infamous Larry

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Speaker 1: Loudmouth just an icon staple of Atlanta. But I wanted

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Speaker 1: to catch up with Greg because one it's been a

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Speaker 1: minute since we've just sat down and talked to his friends.

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Speaker 1: But he's become so successful in the artist world, the

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Speaker 1: graffiti world, and I've always just been so curious what

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Speaker 1: that is. Like, I'm talking about the og guys who

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Speaker 1: in the middle of the night with hoodies on, dodging

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Speaker 1: the cops out there tagging up places. You wake up

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Speaker 1: and you're driving down I twenty and you see some

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Speaker 1: tag on on the road sign like, how did that

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Speaker 1: get there?

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Speaker 3: These people are like rock climbing to get out. You

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Speaker 3: see it right out this window. There's graffiti at the

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Speaker 3: top of this brick building, and I'm like, who is

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Speaker 3: hanging off the side of this building doing this right now?

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Speaker 1: It's It's seriously, it's mind blowing. But it just sounds

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Speaker 1: like a fun life, just running from the cops all

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Speaker 1: to just leave your mark somewhere and tag up a town.

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Speaker 1: It's kind of badass. But this guy is a genius,

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Speaker 1: has so much stuff going on. I think we have

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Speaker 1: a very hilarious conversation, and I learned a lot about

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Speaker 1: his journey to get to where he is today that

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Speaker 1: I honestly didn't even know. And I think a lot

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Speaker 1: of this stuff is relatable and applicable to everyone, no

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Speaker 1: matter what you're doing in life or what you want

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Speaker 1: to do. I learned a lot. But either way, I'm

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Speaker 1: super excited for everyone to meet Mike. Good friend Greg, Mike.

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Speaker 1: And so, without further ado, the next episode of Talking

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Speaker 1: to Death Greg, Mike, hope you enjoy it. Well, it's

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Speaker 1: good to see you again, man, it's been a minute.

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Speaker 2: Good to see you as well.

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Speaker 1: Long time, long time. I've actually known you for a

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Speaker 1: long time. Yeah, what uh, I.

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Speaker 2: Mean, I'm trying to think what year do you think

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Speaker 2: that was that we first met?

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Speaker 1: Two thousand and eleven? Twelve sounds about or earlier maybe

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Speaker 1: actually sounds about whenever I met you, you were doing music,

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Speaker 1: or that's what I or at least that's what it

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Speaker 1: looked like you were doing.

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Speaker 2: Well. Yeah, I mean I've always been a huge fan

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Speaker 2: of music. I've always said that, you know, music is

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Speaker 2: my speed. You know, whether you can take that as

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Speaker 2: like a drug reference or a reference for how I

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Speaker 2: operate on the day to day. You know, it's like

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Speaker 2: I feel like from the minute I get up, it's

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Speaker 2: always like putting on music and whether that's a fast

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Speaker 2: DM song that kind of dictates the mood and energy

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Speaker 2: that I work at right and like same thing if

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Speaker 2: it's like on some chill mellow, you know, reggae vibes,

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Speaker 2: Like that's just the vibe that I'm going with at

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Speaker 2: the time. I feel like music always dictates that. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 2: especially with art. I mean it's feel like it's almost

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Speaker 2: I find like it's almost impossible to like create without

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Speaker 2: music playing.

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Speaker 1: So it feels so when you're painting and stuff, you

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Speaker 1: just always have the music.

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Speaker 2: Oh I have to. Yeah, it just feels like so stale.

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Speaker 2: Like if I go in the studio and I don't

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Speaker 2: put on a track, I'm like, it's like dead silence,

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Speaker 2: you know, says like rhythmatic, you know. But yeah, I

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Speaker 2: mean we used to. But I mean you were you

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Speaker 2: were crushing it back then. I was just messing around

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Speaker 2: with some buddies. I feel like at the time it

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Speaker 2: was like go to the studio and paint and then

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Speaker 2: go to the music studio and you know, rip some bars.

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Speaker 1: I remember this. It was like a song that you

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Speaker 1: were doing that's still in my head.

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Speaker 2: Something that the Diamonds song. She shines like Diamonds. I

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Speaker 2: think we're gonna have to find that. But yeah, I

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Speaker 2: actually looked years ago and it was I couldn't find it.

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Speaker 2: I mean because it was on like MySpace or something.

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Speaker 2: Oh man, and that all those files must have just

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Speaker 2: been deleted.

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Speaker 1: I said, bringing back my space. We don't need more

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Speaker 1: social media. I know that they've talked about it, but yeah,

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Speaker 1: I kind of want the top eight friends again.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that was fresh and the song you know you

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Speaker 2: had that song I remember I had right now. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: day and night. That was like mine for like, you know,

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Speaker 2: at least six months about.

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Speaker 1: Other people.

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Speaker 2: But timber justin Timberlake tried to bring it back. I

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Speaker 2: think at one point he was an investor.

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Speaker 1: That was a while ago.

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Speaker 2: I could be wrong. I mean I just heard that.

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Speaker 1: But where's Tom.

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Speaker 2: You know, Tom's on an island somewhere. I saw something

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Speaker 2: recent care. Yeah, he's just chilling. He seems like he

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Speaker 2: made out better than everyone. He said, peace, you have

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Speaker 2: fun with that social media Hawaii.

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Speaker 1: Just chilling. I feel like, you know, if you're you're

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Speaker 1: a professional artist, you make artwork and it's it's I mean,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of it here in my office. Huge

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Speaker 1: fan of yours. I feel like that's one of the

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Speaker 1: harder things to do, is be self sustainable doing your job.

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Speaker 1: How long did it take you to get to a

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Speaker 1: point where you can do this for a living, because

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Speaker 1: I mean you could be a talented artist. You probably

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Speaker 1: know tons of them, but do they you know, make

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Speaker 1: a living off of this.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I think for me it was really

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Speaker 2: I mean I've been doing art since I was a

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Speaker 2: little kid. Like I've always picked up you know, krans

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Speaker 2: when I was a child, and my parents would put

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Speaker 2: out a giant sheet and let me just draw on

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Speaker 2: papers all over the ground. So I mean I was

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Speaker 2: always attracted to it. So but I don't think from

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Speaker 2: a professional standpoint, like you're saying, where I was able

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Speaker 2: to sustain my myself on It was probably till two

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Speaker 2: thousand and nine, So I mean there was, you know,

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Speaker 2: and I was born in eighty two and probably did art,

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Speaker 2: you know, got serious about my art when I was

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Speaker 2: about maybe ten or twelve years old, So I think

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Speaker 2: from like ten till when I was twenty six, maybe

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Speaker 2: fifteen fifteen or so years of like actually like painting daily,

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Speaker 2: you know, going to art school. Like I mean, I

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Speaker 2: was a starving artist at that point. I never, I

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Speaker 2: never you know, could imagine like being where it's at

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Speaker 2: now and being able to be a full time professional artist,

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Speaker 2: like if you would have asked me back then, you know,

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Speaker 2: because there were so many times of like people telling

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Speaker 2: me you can't do this. You know, you're not gonna

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Speaker 2: make it. You need to get a real job, right,

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Speaker 2: like even family friends.

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Speaker 1: Your parents.

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Speaker 2: No, my parents never said that, but it was always like,

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Speaker 2: you know, it was always like the brother's girlfriend or

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Speaker 2: like the people that were like you know one, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: yeah exactly, so things like that where it was like

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Speaker 2: I think that that type of stuff too, just like

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Speaker 2: lit that like Underdog fire and fuel for my tank,

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Speaker 2: Like hey, well wait though, just all the people telling

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Speaker 2: you you can't do something. Yeah, yeah, I mean I

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Speaker 2: still feel like I used that like kind of aggression. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I mean when I was younger, all my art was

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Speaker 2: like super dark and kind of disturbing because I was like,

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Speaker 2: you know, pissed off young graffiti, vandal and rock yeah,

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Speaker 2: and just like skateboarding punk, you know, vandalism just you know,

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Speaker 2: all about just you know, anarchy and whatnot. But then

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Speaker 2: I switched it to being more positive, and I feel like,

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Speaker 2: because I feel like that, it just made my mood better.

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Speaker 2: But I mean just yeah, never never thought ever like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: you can make money off art. I think it was

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Speaker 2: just one of those things. And I'm sure even with you,

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Speaker 2: it's like, you know, it just happens, and then it's

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Speaker 2: like a snowball effect and it keeps going and you're like, yeah, okay,

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Speaker 2: you start to see it grow and you're like, wait, okay,

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Speaker 2: there might be something here, and it's like if you

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Speaker 2: don't chase that, you never know, or if you don't

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Speaker 2: try out a million things. I mean, you know, you're

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Speaker 2: never gonna know. It's one thing I tell my kids,

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Speaker 2: I'm like, try every single sport. You know, you might

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Speaker 2: be the world's best badminton player, right, but if you

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Speaker 2: ever if you never picked that up and try it

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Speaker 2: like you nevern might not. Yeah, it could be yeah,

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Speaker 2: you know what I mean. It's like, no, that's what's

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Speaker 2: crazy about life.

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Speaker 1: And it's like, you know, just like taking shots, you mean, yeah,

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Speaker 1: because you don't know what your talent is until you

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Speaker 1: do it, right, I mean, there's certain things that you're

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Speaker 1: drawn to naturally.

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Speaker 2: But it's like, so.

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Speaker 1: From ten to twenty six, I mean, you're saying that

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Speaker 1: you're like you were a starving artist. Had you decided

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Speaker 1: at that point that even if you can't make get

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Speaker 1: rich off this or whatever it is that you were

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Speaker 1: just gonna do it anyways that you.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I was doing it like I was working, you know,

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Speaker 2: normal nine to five jobs. I mean, I used to

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Speaker 2: be a bag boy at publics. I've worked at every

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Speaker 2: single restaurant, like yeah, in South Florida growing up there.

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Speaker 2: But I was always the one thing I was always

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Speaker 2: doing was doing art on the side. It's like I'd

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Speaker 2: get off of work and then I go and do

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Speaker 2: graffiti till you know, three four in the morning. Even

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Speaker 2: when I moved to Atlanta, the same thing. Like I

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Speaker 2: was working like you know, just like consulting and design,

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Speaker 2: graphic design jobs. But like I come home at you know,

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Speaker 2: six o'clock and I start painting, and I paint till

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Speaker 2: three in the morning, and then I get up again

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Speaker 2: at seven o'clock and I repeat it. So I think,

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Speaker 2: if it's in you, it's in you. It's like, I mean,

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Speaker 2: it's one of those things you can't force, right, It's

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Speaker 2: like you got to let it out. As an artist,

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Speaker 2: you have to release that otherwise it's not healthy to

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Speaker 2: just keep all that energy like bottled up. And I

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Speaker 2: think with anything, if you stick with it long enough,

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Speaker 2: you're going to see success and you know you're going

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Speaker 2: to see growth. And I think that's at the end

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Speaker 2: of the day, that's what it's all about. Whether it's

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Speaker 2: from I mean, if it's satisfying you creatively, whether it

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Speaker 2: makes money or not, then that means it's the right

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Speaker 2: thing for you to do.

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Speaker 1: I think all the people who you know would say

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Speaker 1: that you should get a real job, that kind of thing.

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Speaker 1: You know that probably, like you were saying, motivated you

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Speaker 1: back in the day, what motivates you today? How do

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Speaker 1: you stay hungry like that at this point there, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: kind of flipped out.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I I think that's the toughest part about

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Speaker 2: kind of the stage that I'm at now, because you know,

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Speaker 2: a lot of things that I've dreamed of have came

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Speaker 2: to fruition, right, And it's like, you know, when you're younger,

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Speaker 2: you have all these dreams X, I want to be

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Speaker 2: you want to be here, I want to do this, X,

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Speaker 2: Y Z, and then as those things come to happen,

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Speaker 2: you know, kind of happen, you kind of have to

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Speaker 2: reset those goals and you know, yeah, it's like what

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Speaker 2: are those things and how do you reset those and

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Speaker 2: how do you stay creative and how do you stay motivated.

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Speaker 2: I mean, for me, a lot of it is like

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Speaker 2: I have to get out of my own space. I

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Speaker 2: got to get out of my own city. I gotta

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Speaker 2: get out of my own like like work environment, whether

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Speaker 2: that's like taking a flight and going to a place

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Speaker 2: I've never been to, because I always say that, like

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Speaker 2: when you look at things in another city or outside

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Speaker 2: of your normal nine to five day to day, you

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Speaker 2: kind of look at things from a different lens, right,

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Speaker 2: Like have you ever notice, like when you go to

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Speaker 2: when you're traveling, how much more alert you are because

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Speaker 2: you've never been in that space, So you're looking and

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Speaker 2: you're analyzing things from a different viewpoint vantage point You're like,

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Speaker 2: I mean, I know when I drive around these streets here,

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Speaker 2: I kind of go into autopilot mode in my head

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Speaker 2: because you know where you're going, right Yeah. And it's

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Speaker 2: like I feel like that happens the same way with

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Speaker 2: your like everyday work. I know, for me, from like

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Speaker 2: a creative standpoint, it's like I'm doing the same monotonous

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Speaker 2: thing every day. My brain isn't going to look at

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Speaker 2: things differently and think of things differently. So it's like

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Speaker 2: when I take myself and I go to another city.

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Speaker 2: It kind of makes me look at things completely differently.

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Speaker 2: And that's where like I'm seeing inspiration. So yeah, I

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Speaker 2: mean it's like doing a lot of that travel, getting

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Speaker 2: in nature and then finding out like really like what

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Speaker 2: matters in life. Like it's not if you figure that

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Speaker 2: out yet. Yeah, I mean as now that I have

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Speaker 2: a kid, you know, two kids, a wife, and you

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Speaker 2: know a lot of things I dreamed of as a kid.

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Speaker 2: Just through success, it's like, you know, you kind of

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Speaker 2: just have to like really think about what matters in life.

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Speaker 2: You know. It's like, so that's kind of where I'm

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Speaker 2: at now and trying to figure out, you know, like

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Speaker 2: what are the next moves and how I'm gonna get there.

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Speaker 2: And you know, I have some exciting things of building

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Speaker 2: like this new creative hub and.

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Speaker 1: Tell me about that. What's the plan?

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Speaker 2: So this has been kind of like a ten year

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Speaker 2: decade dream for me is to build like kind of

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Speaker 2: like a just a creative hub that encompasses all things

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Speaker 2: that we do, because you know, what I have currently

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Speaker 2: is you know, there's the Greg Mike Art which is

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Speaker 2: my personal art brand. There's ABV, which is my gallery

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Speaker 2: which we work with close to five hundred artists globally.

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Speaker 2: And then we have my ABV agency, which is all

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Speaker 2: corporate commercial, you know, collaboration projects. So with that, there's

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Speaker 2: just like so many crazy things that go on during

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Speaker 2: the normal, normal every day, whether it's me painting the

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Speaker 2: studio or creative directing projects or curating art shows. But

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Speaker 2: I always wanted to have like one place where we

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Speaker 2: could do this all in one space, right where I

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Speaker 2: could kind of hop from room to room, work with

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Speaker 2: my team, you know, create shows, paint in my studio,

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Speaker 2: all under one roof. So about four years ago, I

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Speaker 2: found a space in East Atlanta. Village is a church

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Speaker 2: that was built in nineteen fifties, and I was able

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Speaker 2: to purchase the building and we're renovating the whole space.

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Speaker 2: But it's going to be really just like a creative

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Speaker 2: fantasy factory hub where we'll be able to do all

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Speaker 2: this stuff.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: It's four thousand square feet of gallery space, design studio,

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Speaker 2: conference rooms, art storage, my personal painting studio, just rooms

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Speaker 2: for anything imaginal. You walk in the building and just

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Speaker 2: like anything you can think of you can do in

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Speaker 2: that space, whether it's giant twenty foot tall sculptures or

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Speaker 2: massive murals on the outside of the building. Just taking

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Speaker 2: everything and putting it in one place. So I'm just excited,

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Speaker 2: Like it's things like that, like excited to see kind

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Speaker 2: of what comes out of that. You know, like if

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Speaker 2: you have a space where you can do everything in

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Speaker 2: one place, you know what kind of work is going

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Speaker 2: to be developed.

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Speaker 1: So who owns pieces of your artwork that you're the

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Speaker 1: most humbled by that You're like, man, it's pretty cool

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Speaker 1: that they are a fan of my stuff.

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Speaker 2: I don't know, man, that's a tough question.

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Speaker 1: Or what which one flattered you the most or something? Right?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean there's been there's been a few along

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Speaker 2: the way, and it's cool when it just shows up,

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Speaker 2: you know, whether it's like an artist like Diplo and

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Speaker 2: he's doing a live stream and he's got you know,

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Speaker 2: my vinyl figure in the background and you know, things

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Speaker 2: like that, or like you know, the random DM from

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Speaker 2: like Justin Bieber that's like, hey, I want you to

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Speaker 2: do my charity art auction or something like that, And

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Speaker 2: that's what's cool. It's like, you know, the power of

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Speaker 2: the internet now, right, It's like it's like you never know,

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Speaker 2: you know, like, what's gonna happen tomorrow? Right, you might

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Speaker 2: open your phone there's a DM from you know, one

384
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Speaker 2: of your biggest you know, superstars you looked up to

385
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Speaker 2: as a kid, right, asking to collaborate on a project.

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Speaker 2: And those things are cool when they happen, and it's like,

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Speaker 2: you know, it's been a lot of that over the

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Speaker 2: years where it's you know, I think stars aligned for

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Speaker 2: a reason, and it's like you got to put in

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Speaker 2: that work and you know, work on your your art

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Speaker 2: over time, and good things will kind of come to life. Right.

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Speaker 1: I feel like when you're a starving artist, you're largely

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Speaker 1: uncomfortable for a majority of the time. And as you

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Speaker 1: you know, gain success with with that oftentimes comes more comfortability.

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Speaker 1: And so once you get to that level, do you

396
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Speaker 1: feel like you ever try to make yourself uncomfortable again?

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Speaker 2: I actually kind of feel like it's the opposite of that.

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Speaker 2: The more success you have, the more money and financial

399
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Speaker 2: you know, success you have, the more responsibility you have,

400
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Speaker 2: the more employees you have. I mean, you know, now

401
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Speaker 2: I have close to you know, eight or nine employees

402
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Speaker 2: full time. They're just you know, working on projects that

403
00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:51,800
Speaker 2: we're working on, and it's like you have more responsibility

404
00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:53,600
Speaker 2: and more fear. I feel like, to make sure that

405
00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:56,960
Speaker 2: you're going to continue to you know always, you know,

406
00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:01,480
Speaker 2: create work that's going to be sucessful and collected and whatnot.

407
00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:04,440
Speaker 2: When you're young and you don't have any of that,

408
00:20:04,520 --> 00:20:07,440
Speaker 2: you know, stress or burden or worry, you can create

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Speaker 2: whatever you want, right.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: Also, when you create, you know, a body of work

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Speaker 2: over fifteen years, you develop a style as as an artist,

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Speaker 2: as a new artist, you can do whatever you want.

414
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Speaker 2: You could jump fifteen styles you know every week, right, Yeah,

415
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Speaker 2: because you don't have a collector base.

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Speaker 1: There's a standard of the set, right.

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Speaker 2: So I think that's the most challenging thing for artists

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Speaker 2: and creatives or probably entrepreneurs or business people you know,

419
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Speaker 2: in general. It's like, you know, how do you make

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Speaker 2: sure that you grow properly and you don't lose your

421
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Speaker 2: your you know, initial fans. Right. It's like what if

422
00:20:42,840 --> 00:20:45,480
Speaker 2: you man, if you're known to manufacture whatever type of

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Speaker 2: product and you're like, oh, that's our you know, bread

424
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Speaker 2: and butter. We have to do that. But times change

425
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Speaker 2: and styles change and people want something else. I mean,

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Speaker 2: I feel like you see it all the time with

427
00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:57,720
Speaker 2: even in tech or you know these companies that are

428
00:20:57,760 --> 00:21:00,280
Speaker 2: known for one thing and then they keep doing that

429
00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:04,360
Speaker 2: and then somebody else comes along and progresses. So it's

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Speaker 2: like one part right there, like we have to do

431
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Speaker 2: what we got to do to make sure we bring

432
00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:11,000
Speaker 2: in the money to feed all the employees and you know,

433
00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:13,840
Speaker 2: pay all the bills. Right, But then if you're not

434
00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:16,800
Speaker 2: growing and changing, then people are gonna get you know,

435
00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:20,320
Speaker 2: they're gonna get the I guess just complacent with you

436
00:21:20,520 --> 00:21:21,680
Speaker 2: and move on to something else.

437
00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:24,600
Speaker 1: So you think just building on what you've done is

438
00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:27,920
Speaker 1: arguably harder than I guess even if you were dead

439
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:30,119
Speaker 1: broke back in the day, you had more freedom to

440
00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:32,920
Speaker 1: kind of just do whatever and take risks that didn't

441
00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:35,359
Speaker 1: have as much of an impact if you failed. But

442
00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:38,239
Speaker 1: maybe the further you get down the line, the more

443
00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:42,440
Speaker 1: successful you are, the more those risks matter to your

444
00:21:42,480 --> 00:21:45,960
Speaker 1: well being in the moment or what you've built, right, I.

445
00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:47,919
Speaker 2: Mean, think about like how many musicians, how hard it

446
00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:51,920
Speaker 2: is for musicians to stay relevant and like after number

447
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:54,000
Speaker 2: one hit or something, right, Yeah, you know, like I

448
00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:56,080
Speaker 2: feel like that's like the toughest thing for a musician

449
00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:59,400
Speaker 2: is like you drop that you know, that first album

450
00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:02,280
Speaker 2: and then your follow up album. There's so much stress

451
00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:04,520
Speaker 2: where people are like, oh, you gotta have the hits,

452
00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:08,680
Speaker 2: you gotta have the number one more slump. Yeah yeah, yeah,

453
00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:10,480
Speaker 2: that's a scary feeling.

454
00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:13,520
Speaker 1: But you don't ever consider those things when you're you know,

455
00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:16,200
Speaker 1: the starving artist mentality, because they don't matter to you.

456
00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:18,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, you don't know, you're not thinking about it. I

457
00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:21,159
Speaker 2: think that's all just like right, comes comes along with

458
00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:24,400
Speaker 2: the just years of doing it.

459
00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:29,240
Speaker 1: Do you have any regrets in your life that stand

460
00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:29,679
Speaker 1: out to you?

461
00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:40,560
Speaker 2: Any regrets? Not not a ton of regrets. I mean,

462
00:22:40,680 --> 00:22:43,040
Speaker 2: I think there's things that like, I think it's more

463
00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:45,120
Speaker 2: just like time. I wish I would would have done

464
00:22:45,119 --> 00:22:49,000
Speaker 2: things sooner and be more What do you mean just time,

465
00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:51,560
Speaker 2: like when I got when I actually got serious about,

466
00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:54,639
Speaker 2: you know, about art, even though I started early, like

467
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:58,280
Speaker 2: I could have probably gotten you know, more serious early,

468
00:22:58,320 --> 00:22:59,199
Speaker 2: which could have sped up.

469
00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:02,119
Speaker 1: The entire part is getting serious about art. So there

470
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:04,760
Speaker 1: was a time that you're picturing were Okay, now I'm

471
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:05,840
Speaker 1: getting more serious or what.

472
00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:09,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's just being more active, right, and

473
00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:11,800
Speaker 2: being more like in the scene and being don't like,

474
00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:14,119
Speaker 2: don't be scared to knock down doors and don't be

475
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:16,800
Speaker 2: scared to make those calls or send those emails or

476
00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:19,800
Speaker 2: show up and you know, show face. It's like I

477
00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:23,880
Speaker 2: spent a lot of my I guess young younger years

478
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:26,320
Speaker 2: just like with that fear of being told no.

479
00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:27,080
Speaker 1: Right.

480
00:23:27,840 --> 00:23:29,480
Speaker 2: So it's like and I think as you get older,

481
00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:32,000
Speaker 2: obviously you get more confident, and as you have more wins,

482
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:34,600
Speaker 2: you're gonna be you know, more confident. But I think

483
00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:38,040
Speaker 2: everybody starting off is scared of that feeling of you know,

484
00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:40,720
Speaker 2: just talking to people or like you know, going up

485
00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:42,879
Speaker 2: in a room where you don't know anybody and pitching

486
00:23:42,920 --> 00:23:44,160
Speaker 2: your own work or uh huh.

487
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:45,920
Speaker 1: You know, so you didn't want you didn't want the rejection,

488
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:49,720
Speaker 1: so you kind of maybe, yeah, it's just held yourself back,

489
00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:51,400
Speaker 1: like in hindsight sometimes.

490
00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:53,400
Speaker 2: Not even like I think just as a young kid.

491
00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:55,639
Speaker 2: I think that's just things that kids go through in general,

492
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:57,480
Speaker 2: not even talking about my art, but like I remember,

493
00:23:57,600 --> 00:23:59,360
Speaker 2: like you'd be scared to like pick up the phone

494
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:01,520
Speaker 2: and call somebody, like your parents would be like call

495
00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:03,639
Speaker 2: Johnny's parents and ask him if you can go spend

496
00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:07,680
Speaker 2: the night, and you're like, hell no, you know, I

497
00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:09,679
Speaker 2: don't know, it's just like that type of stuff. And

498
00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:12,119
Speaker 2: like I see now looking back at where I'm at,

499
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:14,480
Speaker 2: and I see some kids that are young that are like,

500
00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:17,720
Speaker 2: you know, very timid and shy, and it's like, what's

501
00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:19,439
Speaker 2: the worst thing that can happen to you if you

502
00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:21,879
Speaker 2: go into a gallery and talk to the curator and

503
00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:25,440
Speaker 2: ask them like, hey, take a look at my work, right,

504
00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:30,000
Speaker 2: because you learn from all those experiences. It was just like, yeah,

505
00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:32,560
Speaker 2: I think there's just years of that, like just kind

506
00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:33,840
Speaker 2: of fear.

507
00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:37,400
Speaker 1: So what'd you learn through that if you somehow overcame

508
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,800
Speaker 1: the fear of you know, making that cold call or email.

509
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:46,159
Speaker 2: I mean, what I'm doing right now is just like

510
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:49,119
Speaker 2: like time on this planet. There's not a lot of

511
00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:51,320
Speaker 2: it like for us, and I'm sure like I mean

512
00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 2: I don't know. When I hit forty, that's when shit

513
00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:56,960
Speaker 2: got real and I was like, holy shit, like you know.

514
00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:59,360
Speaker 1: Like like what did it feel like.

515
00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:01,800
Speaker 2: I'm getting old?

516
00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:03,840
Speaker 1: I'm trying to thirty six next week?

517
00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:05,760
Speaker 2: Yeah? Well, I mean when you're in your thirties, you're like, oh,

518
00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:07,919
Speaker 2: I'm a thirty year old, you know, I still my thirties, right,

519
00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:10,680
Speaker 2: Like I'm not fifty. I'm not sixty. You know, I

520
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 2: don't know. When I hit forty, it was just like

521
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:14,520
Speaker 2: an eye opener. I was like, Okay, holy shit, Like

522
00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:17,520
Speaker 2: what if you know what I would give to be thirty?

523
00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:20,520
Speaker 2: You know again? You know, so it's like mm hmm.

524
00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:22,960
Speaker 2: I think it's a lot of like reflection like that,

525
00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:24,800
Speaker 2: and you know, it's like, all right, now, how did

526
00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:28,080
Speaker 2: the next thirty years look? Right? Thirty, forty, fifty years

527
00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:31,919
Speaker 2: hopefully God willing right? So I mean, and that just

528
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:33,800
Speaker 2: goes back to that comment, like, yeah, what if I

529
00:25:33,800 --> 00:25:37,600
Speaker 2: would have gotten you know, started sooner and more serious

530
00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:40,680
Speaker 2: sooner where I where would would I be right now?

531
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:41,639
Speaker 1: You know?

532
00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:45,640
Speaker 2: Like would I be where I am now? Like ten

533
00:25:45,720 --> 00:25:47,080
Speaker 2: years ago? I guess right?

534
00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:49,919
Speaker 1: Yeah, So if you're afraid to go talk to that

535
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:53,240
Speaker 1: guy in the gallery, you know what you learn by

536
00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:55,560
Speaker 1: just saying fuck it, I'm gonna go do it? Anyways?

537
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:58,560
Speaker 1: Is it that nothing bad usually happened? Yeah?

538
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:00,440
Speaker 2: I feel like you're always building it up so much

539
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:03,640
Speaker 2: worse in your head. Like I would drive myself crazy

540
00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:06,080
Speaker 2: in my head being like, oh my god, I can't

541
00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:08,520
Speaker 2: call this person right, And then it's like you get

542
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:11,520
Speaker 2: off the phone and you're like, I'm such an idiot?

543
00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:14,560
Speaker 2: Why was I that? Like I thought about that for

544
00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:16,919
Speaker 2: six days and like freaked out and couldn't sleep, and

545
00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:18,840
Speaker 2: then I got off the phone and that was the

546
00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:19,960
Speaker 2: easiest thing that ever happened.

547
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:22,160
Speaker 1: It's done, Yeah, yeah, but I feel like a lot.

548
00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:24,080
Speaker 2: Of people like deal with that. You know, it's like

549
00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:26,760
Speaker 2: mental anxiety and stress of just like you build things

550
00:26:26,800 --> 00:26:28,920
Speaker 2: up in your head. Yeah, and then when it's done,

551
00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:30,320
Speaker 2: you're like, wow, that wasn't that bad.

552
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:32,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, and like you realize that you're the only person

553
00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:35,520
Speaker 1: who's really thinking about it like that. Yeah, it feels real.

554
00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:37,520
Speaker 2: I think about that all the time, Like half the

555
00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 2: things that you stress about or you think other people

556
00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:42,159
Speaker 2: are thinking about, Like, no one's thinking about that. Everyone's

557
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:45,440
Speaker 2: thinking about themselves most most of the time. Right, It's

558
00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:47,560
Speaker 2: usually yeah, like what if I do this? What are

559
00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:49,720
Speaker 2: people going to think? But it's like people don't even

560
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:51,959
Speaker 2: care what you think actually, or if they do, it's

561
00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:54,399
Speaker 2: gonna be one second and they're like, oh, okay, my

562
00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:57,760
Speaker 2: dog up, Like that was weird.

563
00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:02,000
Speaker 1: But yeah, no, but that anxiety feels like it's just

564
00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:05,400
Speaker 1: the the absolute truth, right.

565
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:08,679
Speaker 2: I mean it could be polarizing and crushing to people.

566
00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:11,119
Speaker 2: I mean a lot of artists aren't people that like

567
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:12,080
Speaker 2: to talk to people.

568
00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:13,520
Speaker 1: They're very like, are you one of those?

569
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:16,800
Speaker 2: I mean I kind of walk like a like a

570
00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:18,760
Speaker 2: middle ground I feel like, you know, because a lot

571
00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:22,119
Speaker 2: of artists are not entrepreneurs. You know, they're not you know,

572
00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:23,919
Speaker 2: they're not into business. They don't want to deal with

573
00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:27,439
Speaker 2: invoicing and talking to you know, lawyers and legal folks

574
00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 2: and right. They want to be in the studio and

575
00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:32,280
Speaker 2: they want to create. You know, I kind of feel

576
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:34,560
Speaker 2: like I walk like the middle ground where you know,

577
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:37,359
Speaker 2: I have that entrepreneurial spirit and kind of get that drive,

578
00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 2: but I love art and I've always done art. But dude,

579
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:42,800
Speaker 2: there's so many artists and you know that's why agencies

580
00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:44,440
Speaker 2: are great, like because they can handle all that stuff.

581
00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:47,119
Speaker 2: But there's so many artists where they either get frustrated,

582
00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:49,520
Speaker 2: starts messing with their art the art looks different, or

583
00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:52,760
Speaker 2: they just like can't emotionally or mentally like handle that stuff.

584
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:55,280
Speaker 2: It's just like they were built to create art and

585
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:57,000
Speaker 2: that's it. You know. It's like they go to the

586
00:27:57,000 --> 00:27:58,199
Speaker 2: studio and they paint. That's it.

587
00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:02,240
Speaker 1: And yeah, you know, do you still get do you

588
00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:06,919
Speaker 1: still get scared when you unveil a new series for sure,

589
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:08,560
Speaker 1: what's it feel like?

590
00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:11,560
Speaker 2: I mean, with art, it's always you know, the thing

591
00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:13,240
Speaker 2: about art is you're putting it out for people to

592
00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:16,240
Speaker 2: critique it, right, you know how you look at create,

593
00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:19,199
Speaker 2: you create something, you say, you look at the reaction,

594
00:28:19,359 --> 00:28:21,800
Speaker 2: You're like, you know, I mean, obviously you create for yourself,

595
00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:24,680
Speaker 2: and you're and you're you're you're getting your emotions out

596
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:26,040
Speaker 2: through the art. But at the end of the day,

597
00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:27,920
Speaker 2: if you put your art in a gallery invite people

598
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 2: to come look at it, you know, that is a

599
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:32,960
Speaker 2: pretty terrifying thing. If you think about it, You're like,

600
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:33,960
Speaker 2: all right, what do you think?

601
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:36,840
Speaker 1: You know? That's all right?

602
00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:37,760
Speaker 2: Yeah?

603
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 1: So you know, so I mean, do you feel like

604
00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:45,000
Speaker 1: it's that your art is an extension of yourself? Yeah?

605
00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 2: I mean for me, my art's always just been like

606
00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:49,640
Speaker 2: like a way for me to kind of release emotion.

607
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:52,480
Speaker 2: And you know that's why, like I said, like when

608
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:56,160
Speaker 2: I switch my art to kind of being more like happy, colorful, positive,

609
00:28:56,280 --> 00:28:59,440
Speaker 2: you know, versus I was painting a lot of like depressed,

610
00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 2: weird ship when I was a young kid, you know,

611
00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:05,320
Speaker 2: as an outlet or what yeah, as an outlet, you know,

612
00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:07,320
Speaker 2: Originally it was an outlet, but then I started realizing

613
00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:10,000
Speaker 2: that I was painting all this like negative, dark, depressing

614
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,920
Speaker 2: stuff that it wasn't helping me. It was like I

615
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:15,200
Speaker 2: was just staring at all the all the bad things

616
00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:17,400
Speaker 2: and was like, okay, like what if I start what

617
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:20,000
Speaker 2: if I try all the positive thoughts. I try to

618
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:22,080
Speaker 2: convey all the positive thoughts through my art, whether it's

619
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:25,440
Speaker 2: smiling characters or positive statements or you know. And then

620
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:27,640
Speaker 2: that's when I noticed, like it started making me feel

621
00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:30,600
Speaker 2: better versus making me feel like depressed.

622
00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:33,840
Speaker 1: Right, So it felt good to get it out, But

623
00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:36,960
Speaker 1: then you're just living in this darker world all the time.

624
00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:40,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, versus living in like a positive, like you know,

625
00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:43,720
Speaker 2: a positive happy place. You're living in this like deep dark,

626
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:46,880
Speaker 2: depressing all the depressive thoughts. Where I always thought it

627
00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:48,840
Speaker 2: was like, oh, you got to let your like dark

628
00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 2: thoughts out on canvas and right, But it's actually, like

629
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:53,320
Speaker 2: I learned over time, it was like the opposite. Like

630
00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:55,200
Speaker 2: what if you take all the positive things you're thinking,

631
00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 2: and all the positive things that people tell you or

632
00:29:57,600 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 2: you know, or positive things people say, and incorp that

633
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:01,640
Speaker 2: in corporate that in your work. What's that going to

634
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:04,560
Speaker 2: do to your overall you know, well being right, and

635
00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:05,960
Speaker 2: what is that going to do for other people? Like

636
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:08,120
Speaker 2: there's people that tell me all the time, like they'll

637
00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:10,680
Speaker 2: see murals and they're like, you know, send dms. They're like, Yo,

638
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:13,640
Speaker 2: this brightens my day. I mean I feel like that's like,

639
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:15,920
Speaker 2: you know, that's what you want. You want your art

640
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:20,280
Speaker 2: to kind of affect people to positive positively, right, And

641
00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:22,280
Speaker 2: that could just be like the colors that I use

642
00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:25,240
Speaker 2: or like you know, my character Larry Loudmouth, like the

643
00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:28,200
Speaker 2: way that those characters are always smiling and giant grins

644
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:34,280
Speaker 2: and whatnot. You know, but it's just like like anything

645
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:36,960
Speaker 2: you learn over time, right, and you know, hopefully that

646
00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:39,120
Speaker 2: continues to make people feel that way.

647
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:44,240
Speaker 1: When's the first time you consciously remember trying to make

648
00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:45,800
Speaker 1: something happier looking?

649
00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:50,280
Speaker 2: I think it was right around like two thousand and

650
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:53,320
Speaker 2: nine ish. You know, I was going through like a

651
00:30:53,320 --> 00:30:55,920
Speaker 2: weird period of my life and had a lot, like

652
00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:57,360
Speaker 2: I was saying, like a lot of like just kind

653
00:30:57,400 --> 00:30:59,960
Speaker 2: of deeper, darker thoughts and why why do you have

654
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:00,480
Speaker 2: those thoughts?

655
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:02,320
Speaker 1: What was going on just like.

656
00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 2: Back then was like relationship things. Yeah, you know, was

657
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:07,160
Speaker 2: going through like a big major change in my life

658
00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:09,719
Speaker 2: with the relationship, a long term relationship that I was in,

659
00:31:09,800 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 2: and I kind of saw I lent like was leaning

660
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:15,360
Speaker 2: on my art as kind of like the more positive

661
00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:18,560
Speaker 2: art outlet, Like, Hey, if I really go hard on this,

662
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:20,440
Speaker 2: maybe this is going to be like the way out.

663
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 2: And it was, you know, but again it was like

664
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:26,760
Speaker 2: I felt at that time mentally, I was like in

665
00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:29,880
Speaker 2: a deep dark space and started creating these happy things

666
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:33,400
Speaker 2: and started you know, leaning more into like that that happy,

667
00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:37,120
Speaker 2: you know, positive world. And it was just like me

668
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:39,120
Speaker 2: looking at the art would make me feel a certain way,

669
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:42,440
Speaker 2: and vice versa, and you know, the way that people reacting,

670
00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 2: and it kind of, you know, just helped push in

671
00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:46,360
Speaker 2: a positive direction.

672
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:50,480
Speaker 1: If you're always kind of living in this art space

673
00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:52,640
Speaker 1: that you've created for yourself, which is also an outlet,

674
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:56,960
Speaker 1: which is also your career, and you have employees who

675
00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:59,720
Speaker 1: work with you, and it's just you know, bigger than

676
00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 1: it ever could have you know, maybe even imagine it being. Yeah,

677
00:32:02,920 --> 00:32:07,840
Speaker 1: is it hard to juggle your personal life with how

678
00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:10,160
Speaker 1: much you put into your art.

679
00:32:11,680 --> 00:32:15,479
Speaker 2: Yeah. Luckily, like I've gotten it to a point now

680
00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:18,040
Speaker 2: where it's I'm like I treat it like a you know,

681
00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:20,360
Speaker 2: nine to five job, which I have to do because

682
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:22,120
Speaker 2: I have a wife and two kids. And it's well,

683
00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:24,640
Speaker 2: it's been helpful because you know, my wife works, and

684
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:27,880
Speaker 2: you know she's is you know, on the nine to

685
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:31,120
Speaker 2: five schedule usually, I mean she she works more than that.

686
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:35,160
Speaker 2: But yeah, as I've been able to kind of like

687
00:32:35,240 --> 00:32:37,320
Speaker 2: look at that lifestyle because I think when you're growing

688
00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:39,680
Speaker 2: up as an entrepreneurial artist, your mind is like I

689
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:42,000
Speaker 2: have to work, work, working non stop. You know, there

690
00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:45,960
Speaker 2: is no like no off days. You know, take some

691
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:48,520
Speaker 2: days off, but that like that's not it's so bad

692
00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:51,000
Speaker 2: for your mental health. So like, yeah, the more I've

693
00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:54,000
Speaker 2: gotten like on that, like okay, like follow a holiday

694
00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:57,800
Speaker 2: schedule that maybe you know her company does, or you know,

695
00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:00,160
Speaker 2: get up at nine to five. Like every morning I

696
00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:02,400
Speaker 2: I wake up, you know, I take the kids to school,

697
00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:05,360
Speaker 2: whether that's I I walk them to school or drive

698
00:33:05,400 --> 00:33:08,959
Speaker 2: and drop them off. And every day I pick them

699
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:10,840
Speaker 2: up from school and I work from you know, nine

700
00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:14,280
Speaker 2: to five every day, uh, in the studio. And I

701
00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:16,640
Speaker 2: feel like having that structure has allowed me to like

702
00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 2: when I get home at the end of the day,

703
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:20,960
Speaker 2: to be like, Okay, I can focus you know, a

704
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:22,880
Speaker 2: little bit more than I used to not saying I can,

705
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 2: because I do have a hard time.

706
00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:26,000
Speaker 1: Like course, it's always a juggle, right, you.

707
00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:27,560
Speaker 2: Know, you get home and it's easier to hop on

708
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:30,520
Speaker 2: your iPhone and you know, but it used to be

709
00:33:30,560 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 2: really bad where it would be like I'd be at

710
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:34,920
Speaker 2: the studio till two three in the morning every single

711
00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:37,960
Speaker 2: night and then up at you know, nine, nine o'clock

712
00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:41,280
Speaker 2: back at the studio. So it's gotten a little healthier

713
00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:44,080
Speaker 2: along the way, just kind of like having them like

714
00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:46,760
Speaker 2: somewhat of a structure in a format like I'm I

715
00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:49,000
Speaker 2: think about it all the time. I'm terrified, like if

716
00:33:49,040 --> 00:33:51,120
Speaker 2: my wife was not in the picture and my kids,

717
00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:54,760
Speaker 2: like I couldn't imagine like just having like that free

718
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:56,880
Speaker 2: spirit of just being like I'm gonna hop on a

719
00:33:56,880 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 2: plane go to New York for five days, or you know,

720
00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:01,560
Speaker 2: if I didn't have the company, you know, with employees

721
00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 2: and things like that, because there's a lot of artists

722
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:05,480
Speaker 2: that do that and get caught in that cycle where

723
00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:08,239
Speaker 2: it's like, all right, I'm going to la for three

724
00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:10,759
Speaker 2: weeks and then I'm hopping on a plane and we'll

725
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:12,960
Speaker 2: go to New York and party with some friends up there,

726
00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:15,319
Speaker 2: and it's like, you know, it's nice being able to

727
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:17,240
Speaker 2: kind of like pop in and out for special events.

728
00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:19,719
Speaker 2: But like having that structure and that family base and

729
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:22,600
Speaker 2: that core back home I think really kind of keeps

730
00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:25,240
Speaker 2: you level headed and you know, a sense of structure

731
00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:26,640
Speaker 2: in place is there life?

732
00:34:26,760 --> 00:34:29,239
Speaker 1: Is there ever a point where you feel in a

733
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:33,560
Speaker 1: moment stagnant with the structure where you have to go say, ah,

734
00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:37,279
Speaker 1: like let me go do something random just to kind

735
00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:39,200
Speaker 1: of like get it going.

736
00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:42,239
Speaker 2: Or yeah, I mean, luckily, like I travel enough with

737
00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:44,680
Speaker 2: like a lot of these projects because these mural projects

738
00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:47,040
Speaker 2: happen in like various cities, and you know that's like

739
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:50,560
Speaker 2: you know, usually seven days minimum to like complete a

740
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:53,799
Speaker 2: project like off site. So those are nice breaks where

741
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:55,960
Speaker 2: I can kind of like get away, you know, and

742
00:34:56,040 --> 00:34:58,840
Speaker 2: just kind of like get fully immerged into the art,

743
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:02,239
Speaker 2: you know. And then usually by the third or fourth day,

744
00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:04,799
Speaker 2: I missed my my family terribly and I'm like, all right,

745
00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:06,719
Speaker 2: I want to get back. First day, I'm like get

746
00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:07,319
Speaker 2: me out of here.

747
00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:09,400
Speaker 1: You know, You're like God, finally, then you're like I

748
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:11,960
Speaker 1: miss you. I'm sad.

749
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:14,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, It's funny. I mean, my wife, you know, she

750
00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:16,600
Speaker 2: travels for work too, and she's just gone. It's the

751
00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 2: same thing. Like first day she's like, all right, see

752
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:20,839
Speaker 2: you later, have fun, peace. Yeah, and then like by

753
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:22,520
Speaker 2: day she's like, I'm so tired.

754
00:35:22,560 --> 00:35:23,279
Speaker 1: I just want to be home.

755
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:26,600
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, oh yeah, so nah, it's good. I mean,

756
00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:29,319
Speaker 2: I'm big, big on family. I always have, you know,

757
00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:32,200
Speaker 2: I think it's important. You know, it just keeps you

758
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:33,719
Speaker 2: mentally sane as well.

759
00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:36,560
Speaker 1: Do you think you're the kind of person who learns

760
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:39,360
Speaker 1: the hard way it has to learn it for yourself,

761
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:42,279
Speaker 1: or were you able to take advice from anybody and

762
00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:44,719
Speaker 1: apply it or did you I feel like I'm the

763
00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:47,759
Speaker 1: kind of person where when I was younger, especially, I

764
00:35:47,840 --> 00:35:50,960
Speaker 1: was more stubborn and I had to figure it out

765
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:53,560
Speaker 1: myself and then lose and fail to know that I

766
00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:54,200
Speaker 1: shouldn't do that.

767
00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:57,000
Speaker 2: I'm a taurust man. So if that tells you anything,

768
00:35:57,000 --> 00:35:58,759
Speaker 2: I'm as stuborn. What does that mean for you, then

769
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:02,279
Speaker 2: I'm as stubborn as a bull. Yeah, I mean the

770
00:36:02,280 --> 00:36:08,120
Speaker 2: same thing. I've everything's been learning the hard way. I

771
00:36:08,120 --> 00:36:11,279
Speaker 2: think you know artist's personalities, I think a lot is

772
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:13,719
Speaker 2: like you know, well, especially with me, as like I

773
00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:15,560
Speaker 2: got to go through it to remember it for for

774
00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:16,640
Speaker 2: really to kind of like.

775
00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:21,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, give me the yeah, yeah exactly, Yeah, make sure

776
00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:21,880
Speaker 1: you don't forget it.

777
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:23,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I'll read things and I'll be like, oh,

778
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:25,680
Speaker 2: yeah that's cool, and then like yeah, it goes out

779
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:26,120
Speaker 2: the window.

780
00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:26,359
Speaker 1: Right.

781
00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:29,920
Speaker 2: But I think everything I've learned has just been like

782
00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:32,759
Speaker 2: a trial and error underdog mentality.

783
00:36:33,040 --> 00:36:33,359
Speaker 1: M hm.

784
00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:36,920
Speaker 2: You know, see what works, see what didn't work, Tweak it,

785
00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:39,560
Speaker 2: you know, and just kind of like fine tune it

786
00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:41,960
Speaker 2: as you go along, Gonna fall off the tracks here

787
00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:44,240
Speaker 2: and there. Make sure you stay in that yellow line,

788
00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:46,480
Speaker 2: you know, right down the middle hopefully.

789
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:49,080
Speaker 1: So what kind of advice would you give to somebody

790
00:36:49,160 --> 00:36:52,600
Speaker 1: who is maybe following in your footsteps, who is just

791
00:36:52,640 --> 00:36:55,480
Speaker 1: as stubborn as you are. You could sit here and say, hey,

792
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:58,040
Speaker 1: I would do this and you know, remember this, But

793
00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:01,000
Speaker 1: think about yourself back in the day. Would you have

794
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:03,680
Speaker 1: even taken that? You know, in like that.

795
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:08,640
Speaker 2: It's like, how would you give hate to be cliche,

796
00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:10,400
Speaker 2: but like, you know, Nike, like just do it. You

797
00:37:10,400 --> 00:37:11,840
Speaker 2: got to just get the fuck out there and like

798
00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:12,520
Speaker 2: make it happen.

799
00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:14,520
Speaker 1: And what does that mean though people say that kind

800
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:16,880
Speaker 1: of no, I mean it's the truth is men example

801
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:18,319
Speaker 1: of what just just doing it is.

802
00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:21,960
Speaker 2: I mean, even if I don't have the knowledge, I

803
00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:25,160
Speaker 2: feel like if you I've okay, here's here's an example.

804
00:37:25,560 --> 00:37:27,799
Speaker 2: I've always been a firm believer that like, if you

805
00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:29,640
Speaker 2: say you're gonna do something and you put it out

806
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:32,040
Speaker 2: in public, it's you're gonna have to do it because

807
00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:35,160
Speaker 2: humans have big egos. And the minute you say, hey,

808
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:37,600
Speaker 2: if you were like I'm gonna do this crazy art

809
00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:39,520
Speaker 2: show and this and that and blah blah blah, you

810
00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:42,400
Speaker 2: put it on social media, are you gonna let yourself

811
00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:44,680
Speaker 2: not make that happen if you went public with it

812
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:46,719
Speaker 2: at the stage in your career you're at right now, So.

813
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:48,839
Speaker 1: You're setting yourself up for accountability here.

814
00:37:49,080 --> 00:37:52,799
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I mean I've done it multiple times over

815
00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:54,799
Speaker 2: my career where it's like, you know, some people are like, hey,

816
00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:57,200
Speaker 2: don't don't talk about things until they're actual happen. But

817
00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:00,239
Speaker 2: I've realized like, if I say something, you know, if

818
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:01,360
Speaker 2: I have a thought in my head and I know

819
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,080
Speaker 2: that I can make it happen, whether that I don't,

820
00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:06,320
Speaker 2: even if I don't know how I'm gonna do something,

821
00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:10,120
Speaker 2: I will start talking about it because I know in the

822
00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:11,480
Speaker 2: middle when I talk about it and I tell you

823
00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:13,520
Speaker 2: about it and you're like, man, that's cool, then I'm like,

824
00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:15,680
Speaker 2: holy shit, I actually have to make this this happen.

825
00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:18,120
Speaker 2: And it's happened time and time again, where it's like,

826
00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:20,120
Speaker 2: you know, like the minute you start talking about things,

827
00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:23,000
Speaker 2: that's when they become a reality. And it's like, you know,

828
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:25,359
Speaker 2: it's easy to sit there and be like, I'm gonna

829
00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:27,600
Speaker 2: wait till the timing right, timing's right, or I'm gonna

830
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:29,600
Speaker 2: wait to get this investment, or I'm gonna wait till

831
00:38:30,120 --> 00:38:32,480
Speaker 2: to do this. It's like if you talk with that

832
00:38:32,600 --> 00:38:35,359
Speaker 2: idea that like this is happening and and in your

833
00:38:35,360 --> 00:38:37,719
Speaker 2: head it's already happened, you're gonna find a way to

834
00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:40,640
Speaker 2: make it happen. Like you know, if you want to

835
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:42,719
Speaker 2: purchase a piece of property, and I mean, you have

836
00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:45,720
Speaker 2: no idea how to do that, right, but you're gonna

837
00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:48,200
Speaker 2: learn from each person you talk to. You're gonna start

838
00:38:48,200 --> 00:38:51,080
Speaker 2: talking to lawyers, You're gonna start talking to real estate agents.

839
00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:54,200
Speaker 2: You're gonna start looking at properties. You're gonna go to

840
00:38:54,239 --> 00:38:55,759
Speaker 2: a property even if you don't have the money, you

841
00:38:55,760 --> 00:38:57,120
Speaker 2: don't have the funding, You're gonna go out there and

842
00:38:57,120 --> 00:38:59,560
Speaker 2: you're gonna look at it, and then what's gonna happen next?

843
00:38:59,600 --> 00:39:01,279
Speaker 2: They're gonna be like, what bank are you talking to?

844
00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:01,960
Speaker 1: For your fuck?

845
00:39:02,040 --> 00:39:03,800
Speaker 2: They want to have a bank, yeah, and what's not

846
00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:05,520
Speaker 2: gonna make you? Oh, well, my buddy as a bank,

847
00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:07,719
Speaker 2: you should talk to him, right right. But it's like

848
00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:10,920
Speaker 2: if you sit there scared for years and you're terrified

849
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:13,800
Speaker 2: of just like taking that first step or that jump,

850
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:16,920
Speaker 2: like I don't think like it's ever gonna happen, right, like.

851
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:19,200
Speaker 1: Because no one's gonna come connect all the dots for

852
00:39:19,239 --> 00:39:19,719
Speaker 1: you either.

853
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:21,239
Speaker 2: Yeah right, Yeah, you.

854
00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:22,320
Speaker 1: Have to kind of do that yourself.

855
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:24,480
Speaker 2: And the minute you start talking to people, like people

856
00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:26,400
Speaker 2: want to help people naturally. I feel like that's the

857
00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:26,839
Speaker 2: thing like.

858
00:39:27,000 --> 00:39:29,719
Speaker 1: When you think maybe if if you're not giving a shot.

859
00:39:29,680 --> 00:39:31,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that's all the time. Like people will

860
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:33,400
Speaker 2: ask me things like hey, do you know a good accountant?

861
00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:35,600
Speaker 2: I'm like, yeah, this is my account here? Cool? You know,

862
00:39:35,760 --> 00:39:38,640
Speaker 2: like right, things like that are like who's your lawyer?

863
00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:41,319
Speaker 2: Like you know, Like, but it's like if you don't

864
00:39:41,320 --> 00:39:44,040
Speaker 2: start talking about those things, even if they haven't happened yet,

865
00:39:44,080 --> 00:39:45,920
Speaker 2: you're not going to get those leads, right if you're

866
00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:48,719
Speaker 2: just sitting there, you know, with your mouth shut like, oh,

867
00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:50,719
Speaker 2: I can't wait for somebody to come to me and say, hey,

868
00:39:50,719 --> 00:39:51,200
Speaker 2: do you want to.

869
00:39:51,640 --> 00:39:54,200
Speaker 1: Or that never happens, yeah, and he usually doesn't. I've

870
00:39:54,239 --> 00:39:57,400
Speaker 1: found that it really hasn't for me. Yeah, you know, like,

871
00:39:57,560 --> 00:39:59,759
Speaker 1: do you consider yourself a perfectionist when it comes.

872
00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:02,479
Speaker 2: To your work? For sure? With my artwork, I mean, what.

873
00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:04,399
Speaker 1: Is what is being a perfectionist mean to you?

874
00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:07,960
Speaker 2: I mean it's like I mean, when it comes to

875
00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:10,560
Speaker 2: my art, it's mostly just like obviously like the clean

876
00:40:10,880 --> 00:40:13,200
Speaker 2: the cleanliness of the work and like the very like

877
00:40:13,239 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 2: from a design aesthetic, like you know, clean lines, bright colors.

878
00:40:16,160 --> 00:40:18,560
Speaker 2: Like my motto is kind of like you know painted,

879
00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 2: like it's printed where like you look at it and

880
00:40:21,280 --> 00:40:23,279
Speaker 2: you can't tell if it was you know, a piece

881
00:40:23,280 --> 00:40:25,560
Speaker 2: of graphic design or you know those printed on an

882
00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:28,840
Speaker 2: apps in printer or a screen print or whatnot.

883
00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:31,320
Speaker 1: So it's really just your style, right, Yeah, that's my style.

884
00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:34,160
Speaker 2: But I guess that comes from just like my personality

885
00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:36,520
Speaker 2: a little bit, which is weird because like you would

886
00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:38,080
Speaker 2: think that like you'd walk in my house and it'd

887
00:40:38,120 --> 00:40:40,600
Speaker 2: be like everything would be like in perfect place. But

888
00:40:41,480 --> 00:40:43,920
Speaker 2: maybe that's like where I find my I don't know,

889
00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:49,080
Speaker 2: place of like relaxation. Is like when I when I

890
00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:51,719
Speaker 2: know my art is so like you know, clean and structured,

891
00:40:51,920 --> 00:40:53,520
Speaker 2: because the rest of my life I feel like it's

892
00:40:53,520 --> 00:40:56,080
Speaker 2: like an add mentality where I'm like running around sometimes

893
00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:58,439
Speaker 2: like uh huh, like a chicken with my head cut off,

894
00:40:58,520 --> 00:40:59,000
Speaker 2: just like, but.

895
00:40:58,920 --> 00:41:01,759
Speaker 1: This is a place where all those things can come

896
00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:05,759
Speaker 1: together for something that's really put together. Yeah, do you

897
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:08,400
Speaker 1: feel like any of the work you've ever made is perfect?

898
00:41:09,160 --> 00:41:09,399
Speaker 1: I don't.

899
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:11,440
Speaker 2: I mean I think you can ask any artists and

900
00:41:11,440 --> 00:41:14,120
Speaker 2: they always feel like every piece could be pushed harder,

901
00:41:14,160 --> 00:41:16,440
Speaker 2: it could be better, it could be cleaner. Yeah, you

902
00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:19,160
Speaker 2: know they're always struggling with that, like is this done?

903
00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:21,440
Speaker 2: Like I don't, like, you know, luckily I don't do

904
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:23,799
Speaker 2: like a ton of abstract work, but like that's one

905
00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:26,160
Speaker 2: thing like that's always baffled my mind and like been

906
00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:29,279
Speaker 2: a place of interest. Is like these abstract painters that

907
00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:32,840
Speaker 2: are just like brushstrokes and splattering canvas and doing sprays.

908
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:35,640
Speaker 2: It's like, how do you know when that's done right?

909
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:37,640
Speaker 2: It's a feeling or like do you ever have times

910
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:39,120
Speaker 2: when you push it too far and you're.

911
00:41:38,960 --> 00:41:41,120
Speaker 1: Like, I overdid it a little bit, right, Yeah.

912
00:41:41,160 --> 00:41:43,279
Speaker 2: I mean with my stuff, it's always started as like,

913
00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:45,920
Speaker 2: you know, there's a sketch, there's a digital drawing. You know,

914
00:41:45,960 --> 00:41:48,160
Speaker 2: I pretty much know when I'm painting a giant wall

915
00:41:48,239 --> 00:41:51,600
Speaker 2: or a canvas what it's going to look like, just

916
00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:54,120
Speaker 2: because that's not like my process. But like there's a

917
00:41:54,120 --> 00:41:55,560
Speaker 2: lot of artists that just go to a wall and

918
00:41:55,600 --> 00:41:59,040
Speaker 2: start throwing paint and you know, seeing reacting to those

919
00:41:59,080 --> 00:42:01,520
Speaker 2: marks and you know, seeing what comes out of that

920
00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:02,440
Speaker 2: entire process.

921
00:42:02,840 --> 00:42:06,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, I decided years ago that I am not a perfectionist,

922
00:42:07,320 --> 00:42:09,719
Speaker 1: only really because not that I don't want my work

923
00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:12,439
Speaker 1: to be perfect, but also that I realized every time

924
00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:15,719
Speaker 1: I release a new podcast, you know, I'll listen to

925
00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:18,080
Speaker 1: it one time and then I'll not want to listen

926
00:42:18,120 --> 00:42:19,719
Speaker 1: to it again because I'll immediately think about all the

927
00:42:19,719 --> 00:42:22,000
Speaker 1: things I would have done differently, and you know, I

928
00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:25,040
Speaker 1: just apply that to my next thing. But I've met

929
00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:30,320
Speaker 1: so many people over the years who say I'm a perfectionist, right, Yeah,

930
00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:32,239
Speaker 1: A lot of those people, not all of them, but

931
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:35,280
Speaker 1: a lot of them. Majority of them never put out anything.

932
00:42:35,920 --> 00:42:39,400
Speaker 1: They're always trying to make it perfect, and so therefore

933
00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:41,960
Speaker 1: they don't ever put anything out into the world. And

934
00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:46,080
Speaker 1: me personally, I've learned that putting out stuff that maybe

935
00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:48,200
Speaker 1: had a couple flaws in it that I didn't even

936
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:51,640
Speaker 1: realize were flaws until I got better later and just

937
00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:55,120
Speaker 1: got better at my craft. But sitting back there and

938
00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:57,680
Speaker 1: saying I wanted to be perfect and it holding me

939
00:42:57,719 --> 00:43:00,480
Speaker 1: back from putting anything out at all, it wouldn't be

940
00:43:00,520 --> 00:43:01,520
Speaker 1: where I am at today.

941
00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:03,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I see it. I see that a lot

942
00:43:03,480 --> 00:43:05,960
Speaker 2: in the art world and the music world too. It's

943
00:43:06,080 --> 00:43:08,520
Speaker 2: just like I've seen like these producers where you know,

944
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:11,239
Speaker 2: they're like, you know, super talented and the same. Yeah,

945
00:43:11,360 --> 00:43:13,279
Speaker 2: it's like they're just sitting on files and they're like,

946
00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:15,560
Speaker 2: I'm gonna release these one day, and then you're like, okay,

947
00:43:15,600 --> 00:43:18,359
Speaker 2: it's been ten years you've been saying that, like these

948
00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:22,359
Speaker 2: are fire, like drop them, you know. But and yeah,

949
00:43:22,480 --> 00:43:24,359
Speaker 2: artists too, Like you'll walk an artists studio and they'll

950
00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:26,000
Speaker 2: have hundreds of paintings. You're like, why don't you show

951
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 2: these anyway? And they're just like, eh, right, But that's

952
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:32,799
Speaker 2: funny that you say that about uh, kind of like

953
00:43:32,840 --> 00:43:34,680
Speaker 2: moving on from a body of work when it's like

954
00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:36,600
Speaker 2: after you complete it, because I feel like I feel

955
00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:39,000
Speaker 2: a very similar way when it's like when it's done,

956
00:43:39,040 --> 00:43:39,479
Speaker 2: it's done.

957
00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:40,080
Speaker 1: Yeah.

958
00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:42,120
Speaker 2: I mean there's like some cases where I'll go back,

959
00:43:42,200 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 2: like five years later, yeah, and it is cool to

960
00:43:44,600 --> 00:43:46,680
Speaker 2: kind of revisit those things or watch those videos and

961
00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:49,120
Speaker 2: be like, Okay, there's been some growth, you know.

962
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:52,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a reality check, the assessment of where we were,

963
00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:54,239
Speaker 1: where we got. Yeah.

964
00:43:54,920 --> 00:43:57,279
Speaker 2: It's always cool to kind of yeah, see that, you

965
00:43:57,320 --> 00:44:01,600
Speaker 2: know that timeline because back then it's it's funny because

966
00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:04,160
Speaker 2: like you always think you're at your like you know,

967
00:44:04,440 --> 00:44:06,319
Speaker 2: best point right in a certain year, and then you

968
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:10,800
Speaker 2: go back and you're like, wow, I improved a lot, right, Yeah,

969
00:44:11,200 --> 00:44:14,359
Speaker 2: But I guess that's how it goes. Yeah, if you're

970
00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:17,399
Speaker 2: not changing and growing and getting better, or at least

971
00:44:17,520 --> 00:44:19,080
Speaker 2: thinking you're getting better, I think.

972
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:21,520
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm equally as stubborn I think when it

973
00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:23,920
Speaker 1: comes to the kind of stuff. So I think the

974
00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:27,480
Speaker 1: most viable lessons I've learned that have improved my work

975
00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:30,799
Speaker 1: have been putting it out in dealing with what that

976
00:44:30,840 --> 00:44:34,680
Speaker 1: feels like. Yeah, and you know, it never felt perfect

977
00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:37,640
Speaker 1: to me. I did my best at the time, but

978
00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:41,879
Speaker 1: sometimes you even have constraints that are out of your control. Yeah, right,

979
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:43,799
Speaker 1: it's I mean I had to get this done by

980
00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:46,040
Speaker 1: this time. It's like, yeah, you could could always do

981
00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:49,799
Speaker 1: it differently, but you learn from that when you put

982
00:44:49,800 --> 00:44:50,040
Speaker 1: it out.

983
00:44:50,080 --> 00:44:52,360
Speaker 2: I feel like, yeah, I mean, speaking of deadlines, what

984
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:54,799
Speaker 2: do you think about deadlines in the creative space? And like,

985
00:44:55,200 --> 00:44:58,640
Speaker 2: you know, right, like you said, like does do DEADLINEAE

986
00:44:58,719 --> 00:45:01,840
Speaker 2: sometimes dictate like the quality of work and or I

987
00:45:01,880 --> 00:45:03,719
Speaker 2: know for me, sometimes I don't get shit done if

988
00:45:03,760 --> 00:45:05,799
Speaker 2: I don't have a deadline. So sounds like, hey, I

989
00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:06,840
Speaker 2: hate probably admit it.

990
00:45:06,719 --> 00:45:08,840
Speaker 1: But I kind of need that kick in the ass

991
00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:11,560
Speaker 1: sometimes where you know, it's like I was always the

992
00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:15,080
Speaker 1: kid even in school where oh the project's due tomorrow,

993
00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:19,120
Speaker 1: let's start now here exactly, and then also get an

994
00:45:19,160 --> 00:45:23,239
Speaker 1: a maybe right and just bust it out. Yeah, I

995
00:45:23,280 --> 00:45:26,280
Speaker 1: think I do need that sort of kicking the ass

996
00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:30,560
Speaker 1: deadline where hey, man, don't ruin your reputation on this shit,

997
00:45:31,040 --> 00:45:33,480
Speaker 1: get it done, and you kind of learn how to

998
00:45:33,520 --> 00:45:37,399
Speaker 1: juggle that a little bit as you grow into your

999
00:45:37,440 --> 00:45:40,480
Speaker 1: craft more. I think where it's not you don't put

1000
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:44,080
Speaker 1: yourself in you know, too risky of a situation. But

1001
00:45:44,080 --> 00:45:48,239
Speaker 1: at the same time, you make accountability or I set

1002
00:45:48,320 --> 00:45:54,239
Speaker 1: like accountability measures for myself in order to finish the product, right,

1003
00:45:54,560 --> 00:45:58,040
Speaker 1: Like that business mind on top of the creative mind,

1004
00:45:58,080 --> 00:46:00,600
Speaker 1: because creatively, I could go on forever with all the

1005
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:03,680
Speaker 1: different ideas and ways to do this because it's infinite.

1006
00:46:03,719 --> 00:46:07,960
Speaker 1: Sometimes yeah, but if I force that structure onto this,

1007
00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:11,280
Speaker 1: it makes me think about the things that matter first,

1008
00:46:11,480 --> 00:46:16,120
Speaker 1: and you know, when those become autonomous, I can work

1009
00:46:16,160 --> 00:46:19,200
Speaker 1: within that space and still make something great even if

1010
00:46:19,200 --> 00:46:23,480
Speaker 1: it feels restrictive. What are you looking forward to the most,

1011
00:46:23,480 --> 00:46:26,480
Speaker 1: you think? I mean all the work you've done, you know,

1012
00:46:26,719 --> 00:46:29,160
Speaker 1: you're past forty. Now you have this really cool, exciting

1013
00:46:29,719 --> 00:46:32,760
Speaker 1: new creative hub you're making. What's the future of Greg

1014
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:33,520
Speaker 1: Mike's work.

1015
00:46:33,920 --> 00:46:37,960
Speaker 2: I mean obviously that, but it's yeah, these like bigger projects,

1016
00:46:38,520 --> 00:46:41,280
Speaker 2: like whether it is building a hub, is it building

1017
00:46:41,360 --> 00:46:44,240
Speaker 2: like loud Land, which is like you know, my version

1018
00:46:44,239 --> 00:46:46,759
Speaker 2: of Disneyland. You know, like those are the type of

1019
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:48,680
Speaker 2: things I'm thinking about, Like what's Loudland?

1020
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:49,480
Speaker 1: What's the vision here?

1021
00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:51,680
Speaker 2: Some of the ideas are, you know, like build a

1022
00:46:52,080 --> 00:46:54,920
Speaker 2: build a small community where all the houses look like characters,

1023
00:46:54,960 --> 00:46:57,799
Speaker 2: build a giant skyscraper that looks like a character. I

1024
00:46:57,840 --> 00:46:59,920
Speaker 2: haven't seen that done. You know, like, what if in

1025
00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:02,440
Speaker 2: the middle of New York City Skyline there was a giant,

1026
00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:06,719
Speaker 2: you know, giant building that looked like one of my characters.

1027
00:47:06,360 --> 00:47:07,080
Speaker 1: May be awesome.

1028
00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:09,160
Speaker 2: I mean, it'd be crazy. So it's like, those are

1029
00:47:09,160 --> 00:47:10,840
Speaker 2: the type of things where it's like, those are the

1030
00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:13,319
Speaker 2: dream projects that I'm looking for now.

1031
00:47:13,360 --> 00:47:13,520
Speaker 1: You know.

1032
00:47:13,560 --> 00:47:16,080
Speaker 2: I had the loud house you remember over here, I

1033
00:47:16,080 --> 00:47:18,040
Speaker 2: mean right down the street here. You know, what if

1034
00:47:18,040 --> 00:47:19,320
Speaker 2: there was a whole community.

1035
00:47:18,920 --> 00:47:21,200
Speaker 1: Of those, what's the loudhouse?

1036
00:47:22,239 --> 00:47:24,520
Speaker 2: The Loudhouse was a house that I've painted right here

1037
00:47:24,680 --> 00:47:28,520
Speaker 2: next to pont City Market on North Ave, which was random.

1038
00:47:28,560 --> 00:47:29,640
Speaker 2: It was like I got it. It was one of those

1039
00:47:29,680 --> 00:47:31,520
Speaker 2: days where I got like a random, you know, DM

1040
00:47:31,560 --> 00:47:34,000
Speaker 2: from a developer and he's like, Hey, I have this

1041
00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:37,279
Speaker 2: house that's that's zoned in a commercial district, so there's

1042
00:47:37,320 --> 00:47:39,440
Speaker 2: no hoa, I can you know, we can paint it

1043
00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:41,719
Speaker 2: whatever colors we want. Do you want to do it?

1044
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:43,360
Speaker 2: And I was like, you know, he didn't have a

1045
00:47:43,360 --> 00:47:44,800
Speaker 2: budget for it, and it was just like one of

1046
00:47:44,840 --> 00:47:46,799
Speaker 2: those things. I'm like, you know, I've always had a

1047
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:49,520
Speaker 2: dream painting a house, painting a commercial jet, commit a

1048
00:47:49,520 --> 00:47:54,040
Speaker 2: commercial airline, a commercial ship, you know, whether it's like

1049
00:47:54,040 --> 00:47:56,960
Speaker 2: a cargo ship or like a cruise ship. So house

1050
00:47:57,040 --> 00:47:58,600
Speaker 2: was definitely one of those things on the list where

1051
00:47:58,640 --> 00:48:00,759
Speaker 2: it's like, you know, this is gonna take time, not

1052
00:48:00,760 --> 00:48:02,400
Speaker 2: getting paid for it, but I think it's gonna be

1053
00:48:02,440 --> 00:48:05,319
Speaker 2: really cool and I'm inspired by it. So I think

1054
00:48:05,360 --> 00:48:07,600
Speaker 2: it took like a week, but I painted, you know,

1055
00:48:07,719 --> 00:48:10,640
Speaker 2: three sixty this entire house and you made the front

1056
00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:12,839
Speaker 2: doorstep turn into a giant loudmouth that you can kind

1057
00:48:12,880 --> 00:48:16,480
Speaker 2: of sit in, became this whole like photo op. I mean,

1058
00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:20,120
Speaker 2: like three days later, it's all over the news.

1059
00:48:20,880 --> 00:48:21,600
Speaker 1: What are they saying?

1060
00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:25,160
Speaker 2: They're just like house painted in an old fourth ward?

1061
00:48:25,239 --> 00:48:29,080
Speaker 2: Does this a a site for sore eyes or a

1062
00:48:29,120 --> 00:48:30,040
Speaker 2: piece of art work?

1063
00:48:30,560 --> 00:48:31,759
Speaker 1: Right? Because we don't know.

1064
00:48:31,960 --> 00:48:34,839
Speaker 2: And it was funny because like you know, that was

1065
00:48:34,880 --> 00:48:37,200
Speaker 2: like the title, it was like site for sore eyes

1066
00:48:37,320 --> 00:48:38,160
Speaker 2: or art and.

1067
00:48:38,040 --> 00:48:40,200
Speaker 1: Like is that funny to you? Or how'd you feel about?

1068
00:48:40,200 --> 00:48:42,000
Speaker 2: No? I was like, I mean, were you like this

1069
00:48:42,120 --> 00:48:43,880
Speaker 2: was like ten years ago? And I was I was

1070
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:46,480
Speaker 2: definitely like I feel like now my personality is kind

1071
00:48:46,480 --> 00:48:48,880
Speaker 2: of like the more shit that you go through like

1072
00:48:49,239 --> 00:48:51,080
Speaker 2: you can kind of like take shit and it bounces

1073
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:53,799
Speaker 2: off of you left and right, Whereas like back then,

1074
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:55,360
Speaker 2: like anything that would happen to me, I would like

1075
00:48:55,400 --> 00:48:57,000
Speaker 2: get fired up. I was like, I'm going down there

1076
00:48:57,040 --> 00:48:59,000
Speaker 2: right now. I'm gonna talk to the news people protests,

1077
00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:01,000
Speaker 2: which I did because they like hit me up. They're like, hey,

1078
00:49:01,040 --> 00:49:03,000
Speaker 2: do you want to like come down here. We're outside

1079
00:49:03,000 --> 00:49:04,880
Speaker 2: filming this, like we're doing a piece on the building,

1080
00:49:04,920 --> 00:49:06,880
Speaker 2: Like will you come talk to us? My team's like,

1081
00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:07,600
Speaker 2: don't go down there.

1082
00:49:07,600 --> 00:49:09,759
Speaker 1: Ignore the email who said it was a nice raise

1083
00:49:09,760 --> 00:49:10,320
Speaker 1: your hand.

1084
00:49:11,640 --> 00:49:13,840
Speaker 2: Now. And there's a video clip on my social media

1085
00:49:13,880 --> 00:49:15,960
Speaker 2: where like it's funny because like you could tell just

1086
00:49:16,000 --> 00:49:18,920
Speaker 2: like younger and just more of a knucklehead. And I

1087
00:49:18,920 --> 00:49:21,080
Speaker 2: don't know, I guess Larry Loudmouth was coming out, but

1088
00:49:21,120 --> 00:49:23,600
Speaker 2: like yeah, I'm like, I'm like, this is better than

1089
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:26,640
Speaker 2: some condo you're gonna you know, build here, like you know,

1090
00:49:26,800 --> 00:49:28,920
Speaker 2: it's like you're gonna knock this down and build a high.

1091
00:49:28,840 --> 00:49:31,200
Speaker 1: Rode for more than that, yeah, you know.

1092
00:49:31,239 --> 00:49:33,200
Speaker 2: And I mean at the time, I was just kind

1093
00:49:33,200 --> 00:49:35,640
Speaker 2: of like a little pissed about it because you know,

1094
00:49:35,680 --> 00:49:38,040
Speaker 2: they I mean, I guess that's what the news dude does, right,

1095
00:49:38,120 --> 00:49:40,359
Speaker 2: They like they painted in a positive and negative like

1096
00:49:41,160 --> 00:49:43,880
Speaker 2: vantage point, Like they interviewed someone that was like, you know,

1097
00:49:44,000 --> 00:49:46,400
Speaker 2: really upset about it, and then they interviewed somebody that

1098
00:49:46,520 --> 00:49:48,560
Speaker 2: was like, I love art, I love Greg's work. This

1099
00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:50,600
Speaker 2: is the greatest thing ever, Like we need more houses

1100
00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:56,080
Speaker 2: like this. So you know, it was cool, but yeah,

1101
00:49:56,280 --> 00:49:59,640
Speaker 2: I mean what ended up happening with that was they uh,

1102
00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:02,359
Speaker 2: because it was it was vacant when I painted it,

1103
00:50:02,480 --> 00:50:04,320
Speaker 2: like it was like it was an office building. I

1104
00:50:04,360 --> 00:50:07,839
Speaker 2: think there was like a yeah, because there was no

1105
00:50:08,280 --> 00:50:10,560
Speaker 2: like I guess by city code, you can paint your

1106
00:50:10,600 --> 00:50:12,520
Speaker 2: commercial building however you want, as long as it's on price.

1107
00:50:13,640 --> 00:50:14,439
Speaker 1: It was by the book.

1108
00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:16,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, but literally it's the house next door was like

1109
00:50:16,640 --> 00:50:17,560
Speaker 2: a residential house.

1110
00:50:17,600 --> 00:50:19,120
Speaker 1: And right, you know there how they feel about it.

1111
00:50:19,120 --> 00:50:20,879
Speaker 2: I mean there's people on like you know, all these

1112
00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:23,279
Speaker 2: you know, reddits and Zillows and all these things common

1113
00:50:23,480 --> 00:50:25,440
Speaker 2: like this is bringing down the value in the neighborhood, which

1114
00:50:25,480 --> 00:50:27,600
Speaker 2: like you sure I understand, is it though a little

1115
00:50:27,600 --> 00:50:30,440
Speaker 2: bit is it? But it's also like you go, you know,

1116
00:50:30,640 --> 00:50:33,399
Speaker 2: you go ten feet one direction, it's the resident residential house.

1117
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:36,080
Speaker 2: You go ten feet the other direction. It's a massive

1118
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:40,839
Speaker 2: you know, they're building you know, retail spaces and condos

1119
00:50:40,880 --> 00:50:42,719
Speaker 2: and you know, all these things that you know a

1120
00:50:42,719 --> 00:50:45,200
Speaker 2: lot of times they don't have control over. Yeah, so

1121
00:50:45,719 --> 00:50:47,040
Speaker 2: you know, I was like, at the end of the day,

1122
00:50:47,040 --> 00:50:48,640
Speaker 2: it's art. Don't look at it if you don't like it.

1123
00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:51,400
Speaker 2: It's not infending anything. If if anything, it's paint, and

1124
00:50:51,440 --> 00:50:54,000
Speaker 2: paint protects bricks, so it's you know, it's really helping

1125
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:58,080
Speaker 2: the building. Yeah. You used to always say that about

1126
00:50:58,080 --> 00:51:00,799
Speaker 2: graffiti when people complain about graffiti, were like, actually, we're

1127
00:51:00,800 --> 00:51:04,080
Speaker 2: actually protecting. We're putting a protective coating on your building.

1128
00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:07,160
Speaker 2: You know, so I'm actually helping the longevity and historical

1129
00:51:07,239 --> 00:51:08,080
Speaker 2: nature of you're building.

1130
00:51:08,680 --> 00:51:11,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean ten years ago they were. I feel

1131
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:16,000
Speaker 1: like today people care a little less about graffiti. You know,

1132
00:51:16,320 --> 00:51:18,839
Speaker 1: they're kind of like, oh wow, how cool. Yeah, but

1133
00:51:18,920 --> 00:51:21,960
Speaker 1: there was a time where you know, every Karen was

1134
00:51:22,000 --> 00:51:24,680
Speaker 1: probably like this is the devil here.

1135
00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:25,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure an IFO.

1136
00:51:26,000 --> 00:51:27,480
Speaker 1: I grew up with that. Did you ever have any

1137
00:51:27,520 --> 00:51:29,440
Speaker 1: weird run ins when you were doing graffiti with I

1138
00:51:29,480 --> 00:51:32,280
Speaker 1: don't know, the cops or some hoa guy.

1139
00:51:32,280 --> 00:51:36,160
Speaker 2: Or I don't know of course. I mean, dude, even

1140
00:51:36,280 --> 00:51:39,400
Speaker 2: up to what I mean how many years ago was

1141
00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:41,120
Speaker 2: now seven or ten years ago. I mean I got

1142
00:51:41,520 --> 00:51:45,040
Speaker 2: slapped with like a million dollar lawsuit on real like

1143
00:51:45,320 --> 00:51:47,400
Speaker 2: you know where they what happened where they said that

1144
00:51:47,440 --> 00:51:48,799
Speaker 2: I did some work.

1145
00:51:49,160 --> 00:51:51,880
Speaker 1: Or they said you don't but you weren't there. I

1146
00:51:51,960 --> 00:51:55,240
Speaker 1: was not there at the time. You really aren't there.

1147
00:51:55,280 --> 00:51:56,920
Speaker 2: Like growing up as a kid, it was you know,

1148
00:51:57,000 --> 00:52:00,640
Speaker 2: like it was a lot of that you're like running

1149
00:52:00,640 --> 00:52:03,440
Speaker 2: from the police, hiding, ducking, you know, but that was

1150
00:52:03,520 --> 00:52:06,440
Speaker 2: like what made graffiti fun was that adrenaline rush. It's

1151
00:52:06,440 --> 00:52:09,120
Speaker 2: like skydiving, you know. I feel like people get addicted

1152
00:52:09,160 --> 00:52:13,560
Speaker 2: to that natural high and chasing that, you know, that feeling. Yeah,

1153
00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:15,200
Speaker 2: you don't have to do drugs, but you can go

1154
00:52:15,239 --> 00:52:17,239
Speaker 2: out and you know, paint a massive piece on the

1155
00:52:17,239 --> 00:52:19,200
Speaker 2: side of the road and catch flicks of it the

1156
00:52:19,200 --> 00:52:21,200
Speaker 2: next day and you know, hide in the bushes for

1157
00:52:21,200 --> 00:52:23,680
Speaker 2: thirty minutes at a time because you saw some headlights

1158
00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:26,560
Speaker 2: from a car like driving down a you know, deserted

1159
00:52:26,640 --> 00:52:29,960
Speaker 2: road like that like feeling of like your chest pumping

1160
00:52:30,000 --> 00:52:33,479
Speaker 2: and like adrenaline was like that's what is the reason

1161
00:52:33,480 --> 00:52:35,400
Speaker 2: people do graffiti, Like if you've never done that, you

1162
00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:37,040
Speaker 2: don't understand what that is. Yeah, you're gonna look at

1163
00:52:37,040 --> 00:52:38,560
Speaker 2: graffiti and be like, I don't get it. I mean,

1164
00:52:38,600 --> 00:52:40,160
Speaker 2: obviously there's a lot of things that go into it.

1165
00:52:40,160 --> 00:52:42,640
Speaker 2: It's fame, notoriety, but I think for a lot of people,

1166
00:52:42,680 --> 00:52:45,120
Speaker 2: it's the addiction to same reason. Like why do people

1167
00:52:45,200 --> 00:52:45,960
Speaker 2: go skydiving?

1168
00:52:46,680 --> 00:52:47,920
Speaker 1: Clearly they think about it.

1169
00:52:48,280 --> 00:52:51,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's that thrill. It's crazy. I see a lot

1170
00:52:51,000 --> 00:52:53,239
Speaker 2: of these people now too, like that get to a

1171
00:52:53,280 --> 00:52:56,080
Speaker 2: certain level in their career and they've made you know,

1172
00:52:56,440 --> 00:52:58,920
Speaker 2: X amount of money, and you're starting to see like

1173
00:52:58,960 --> 00:53:01,879
Speaker 2: these like big CEOs of these corporations that like they

1174
00:53:02,040 --> 00:53:04,200
Speaker 2: are only like doing things like that to kind of

1175
00:53:04,239 --> 00:53:07,360
Speaker 2: get that natural high, because like if they're buying another Lambeau,

1176
00:53:07,480 --> 00:53:10,040
Speaker 2: like that doesn't give them the thrill, right. It's like,

1177
00:53:10,160 --> 00:53:12,600
Speaker 2: so it's been interesting. I've seen some people that have

1178
00:53:12,640 --> 00:53:14,880
Speaker 2: been really successful, just like friends along the way. Then

1179
00:53:14,920 --> 00:53:18,400
Speaker 2: I'm like, I'd never thought you'd be skydiving, bro, Like,

1180
00:53:18,400 --> 00:53:21,120
Speaker 2: what what what are you okay? Are we good? Is

1181
00:53:21,160 --> 00:53:21,799
Speaker 2: everything good?

1182
00:53:22,000 --> 00:53:22,440
Speaker 1: Yeah?

1183
00:53:22,440 --> 00:53:24,400
Speaker 2: But like I think about it, I'm like, if you

1184
00:53:24,440 --> 00:53:26,200
Speaker 2: have everything you can want and dream in your life,

1185
00:53:26,239 --> 00:53:27,360
Speaker 2: like what gives those.

1186
00:53:27,239 --> 00:53:30,960
Speaker 1: Type of little excitement. It sounds like, right, I see

1187
00:53:31,040 --> 00:53:33,839
Speaker 1: I see some crazy graffiti sometimes when I'm like, how

1188
00:53:33,840 --> 00:53:36,080
Speaker 1: the hell they actually pull this off? Right? Have you

1189
00:53:36,120 --> 00:53:36,839
Speaker 1: done some of those?

1190
00:53:36,880 --> 00:53:39,680
Speaker 2: Before? I did a I painted a few billboards like back,

1191
00:53:39,719 --> 00:53:41,640
Speaker 2: but that was like I was like probably sixteen seventeen

1192
00:53:41,719 --> 00:53:44,960
Speaker 2: years old, uh, in South Florida. But and that shit

1193
00:53:45,080 --> 00:53:46,839
Speaker 2: was scary as shit, and you you know, you got

1194
00:53:46,840 --> 00:53:48,360
Speaker 2: to like cover up the lights with a T shirt

1195
00:53:48,400 --> 00:53:50,040
Speaker 2: or a rag or something so that you can't see,

1196
00:53:50,120 --> 00:53:51,480
Speaker 2: you know, when you're climbing up on.

1197
00:53:51,600 --> 00:53:53,520
Speaker 1: Paint a picture for me, like what, what's the crazy

1198
00:53:53,520 --> 00:53:55,840
Speaker 1: one you did? And like just location wise, I.

1199
00:53:55,840 --> 00:53:57,560
Speaker 2: Mean mostly in West Palm Beach when I was doing

1200
00:53:57,600 --> 00:53:59,960
Speaker 2: like more bombing, that's like what you call like graffiti

1201
00:54:00,160 --> 00:54:01,759
Speaker 2: where it's you know, you're just going out to pain

1202
00:54:01,840 --> 00:54:04,239
Speaker 2: as much as possible, and you're doing one night you're

1203
00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:05,279
Speaker 2: doing I mean, yeah, just.

1204
00:54:05,160 --> 00:54:06,000
Speaker 1: Tagging, just stuff.

1205
00:54:06,040 --> 00:54:08,800
Speaker 2: But if you're there's like in graffiti, there's like tagging,

1206
00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:10,920
Speaker 2: which is like a tag and usually that's just like

1207
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:14,719
Speaker 2: a one liner of your name. There's bombing, which is

1208
00:54:14,719 --> 00:54:16,600
Speaker 2: like more just like go out and kill as much

1209
00:54:16,640 --> 00:54:19,520
Speaker 2: stuff as you can and that's like, you know, you're

1210
00:54:19,600 --> 00:54:22,719
Speaker 2: less focused on, you know, how pretty it looks, and

1211
00:54:22,760 --> 00:54:24,880
Speaker 2: you're more just like doing fill ins, which is like

1212
00:54:24,920 --> 00:54:28,040
Speaker 2: you're just doing like you know, hollow fills and outlines,

1213
00:54:28,520 --> 00:54:30,919
Speaker 2: and that's just like how many like bubble letter throw

1214
00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:33,320
Speaker 2: ups is what they're called, Like can you place around

1215
00:54:33,360 --> 00:54:35,719
Speaker 2: a city or an area at the time, you know,

1216
00:54:35,840 --> 00:54:37,200
Speaker 2: so like you have your tag, which is your most

1217
00:54:37,200 --> 00:54:38,880
Speaker 2: basic thing. You have your fillings, and you're in your

1218
00:54:38,880 --> 00:54:40,799
Speaker 2: bubble letters and your bombing, which is more just like

1219
00:54:40,840 --> 00:54:42,440
Speaker 2: your quick stuff that you probably see a lot of.

1220
00:54:42,840 --> 00:54:44,680
Speaker 2: And then you have your piecing, which is like short

1221
00:54:44,680 --> 00:54:47,600
Speaker 2: for like a masterpiece. That's where it came from, and

1222
00:54:47,640 --> 00:54:49,840
Speaker 2: that's where you see like the more like fill in

1223
00:54:50,040 --> 00:54:52,680
Speaker 2: fine tune colors, you know, like and it's like if

1224
00:54:52,719 --> 00:54:54,359
Speaker 2: you can get to that level where you're doing like

1225
00:54:54,640 --> 00:54:57,520
Speaker 2: pieces as like other folks are just like going out

1226
00:54:57,560 --> 00:55:00,040
Speaker 2: and bombing, Like you're going out and you're spending you know,

1227
00:55:00,200 --> 00:55:02,799
Speaker 2: eight nine hours like painting on the back of a

1228
00:55:02,880 --> 00:55:05,240
Speaker 2: highway freeway sign, which is called like a heaven spot

1229
00:55:05,960 --> 00:55:08,840
Speaker 2: like because basically like you feel like you're in heaven

1230
00:55:08,920 --> 00:55:11,120
Speaker 2: up there because like there's nothing else around. You're looking

1231
00:55:11,160 --> 00:55:14,600
Speaker 2: around there's just car zooming under you, which is absolutely insane.

1232
00:55:14,680 --> 00:55:17,359
Speaker 2: That's insane, you know, especially kids that are like going

1233
00:55:17,440 --> 00:55:19,719
Speaker 2: up there like you know after a few bruise at

1234
00:55:19,760 --> 00:55:24,319
Speaker 2: the end of the night. Right, Yeah, but yeah, I

1235
00:55:24,320 --> 00:55:27,920
Speaker 2: mean if you can, you know, master and crush masterpieces.

1236
00:55:27,960 --> 00:55:30,760
Speaker 2: But like I guess, like when you the term going,

1237
00:55:30,840 --> 00:55:33,440
Speaker 2: like being a king in graffiti is like being all city,

1238
00:55:33,760 --> 00:55:35,560
Speaker 2: which is like you're the best at your craft. You know,

1239
00:55:35,600 --> 00:55:38,719
Speaker 2: like there's you know, there's only a few folks get

1240
00:55:38,719 --> 00:55:41,560
Speaker 2: to the like king level. But yeah, you're able to

1241
00:55:41,600 --> 00:55:43,399
Speaker 2: like you're able to piece, You're able to bomb, you're

1242
00:55:43,400 --> 00:55:46,000
Speaker 2: able to tag. You know, you have all the things mastered.

1243
00:55:46,280 --> 00:55:48,280
Speaker 1: Have you ever had run from the cops? Of course,

1244
00:55:48,560 --> 00:55:48,840
Speaker 1: give me.

1245
00:55:48,920 --> 00:55:51,080
Speaker 2: I still run from the cops. Ran from the cops

1246
00:55:51,120 --> 00:55:53,160
Speaker 2: this morning. No, did you just kidding? Like I ran

1247
00:55:53,200 --> 00:55:53,680
Speaker 2: from the cops.

1248
00:55:53,680 --> 00:55:56,759
Speaker 1: In my head there wasntairs. You might might you want

1249
00:55:56,760 --> 00:55:57,359
Speaker 1: to regret them?

1250
00:55:57,400 --> 00:56:01,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, it was funny this morning. It was random.

1251
00:56:01,640 --> 00:56:03,040
Speaker 2: I dropped my kid off at school. There's like a

1252
00:56:03,080 --> 00:56:05,279
Speaker 2: little park by the school, and I mean, I'm not

1253
00:56:05,400 --> 00:56:07,359
Speaker 2: dressed for it, but I decided to just run full

1254
00:56:07,400 --> 00:56:12,239
Speaker 2: speed through the woods and I on my Instagram. No,

1255
00:56:12,360 --> 00:56:14,839
Speaker 2: but everyone's like everyone's like dming me. They're like, bro,

1256
00:56:14,920 --> 00:56:17,040
Speaker 2: are you running from the cops? Like what is going

1257
00:56:17,080 --> 00:56:18,719
Speaker 2: on right now? And I was like, I was like,

1258
00:56:18,760 --> 00:56:20,919
Speaker 2: maybe I'm just running from the bear in my head

1259
00:56:20,960 --> 00:56:23,239
Speaker 2: that's telling me, yeah, just let it out and go

1260
00:56:23,320 --> 00:56:27,600
Speaker 2: and fucking go full speed. So maybe that's yeah, who knows,

1261
00:56:27,640 --> 00:56:30,560
Speaker 2: Maybe that's tied back to I see a trail in

1262
00:56:30,600 --> 00:56:33,440
Speaker 2: my head and think I need to run full speed

1263
00:56:33,480 --> 00:56:33,839
Speaker 2: down it.

1264
00:56:34,520 --> 00:56:36,759
Speaker 1: How do you feel about AI and art?

1265
00:56:37,840 --> 00:56:39,640
Speaker 2: It's such a mixed bag, dude, Like.

1266
00:56:40,160 --> 00:56:41,760
Speaker 1: I mean, what's your knee jerk reaction?

1267
00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:45,200
Speaker 2: I mean, initially I was obviously pissed off, and I'm like,

1268
00:56:45,200 --> 00:56:48,640
Speaker 2: I can't believe this is you know, this could ruin everything.

1269
00:56:48,719 --> 00:56:50,520
Speaker 2: But I think, like anything, it's like you got to

1270
00:56:50,600 --> 00:56:52,880
Speaker 2: use it as a tool, right, use it to your advantage.

1271
00:56:53,280 --> 00:56:56,279
Speaker 2: I mean, don't copy it, but use it as a

1272
00:56:56,280 --> 00:56:58,279
Speaker 2: mood board, use it as a thought starter. I mean

1273
00:56:58,280 --> 00:56:59,880
Speaker 2: we've seen like even at her, you know, at a

1274
00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:03,240
Speaker 2: like if we're curating something, you know, with the brand,

1275
00:57:03,239 --> 00:57:05,440
Speaker 2: and we hit a roadblock and we're like, we know

1276
00:57:05,560 --> 00:57:10,120
Speaker 2: this needs to look psychedelic and old newspapers you know

1277
00:57:10,200 --> 00:57:14,720
Speaker 2: have vintage newspapers and things like that, Like what happens

1278
00:57:14,719 --> 00:57:17,800
Speaker 2: when we put that into you know, into mid journey

1279
00:57:17,800 --> 00:57:20,040
Speaker 2: and what is what does a computer think that looks like?

1280
00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:22,840
Speaker 2: And we've done that, and it's cool because it's like

1281
00:57:23,360 --> 00:57:25,480
Speaker 2: we didn't take that stuff and then we flip it

1282
00:57:25,720 --> 00:57:27,960
Speaker 2: and maybe we incorporate one little element into it in

1283
00:57:27,960 --> 00:57:31,240
Speaker 2: our bigger project. I mean that's more like on like

1284
00:57:31,720 --> 00:57:34,440
Speaker 2: the agency side of things in the design business. Like

1285
00:57:34,600 --> 00:57:36,120
Speaker 2: I haven't really messed around with it a lot with

1286
00:57:36,160 --> 00:57:38,480
Speaker 2: my art, but I know a lot of artists that

1287
00:57:38,520 --> 00:57:41,000
Speaker 2: are like an artist, you know, a good friend of mine,

1288
00:57:41,320 --> 00:57:44,200
Speaker 2: you know, he's will be like, I want to see

1289
00:57:44,480 --> 00:57:46,880
Speaker 2: a bear that's made out of leaves, that's you know,

1290
00:57:48,160 --> 00:57:51,120
Speaker 2: has smoke coming out of its ears, and it is

1291
00:57:51,160 --> 00:57:53,040
Speaker 2: in the middle of a desert, right, And then he'll

1292
00:57:53,080 --> 00:57:55,200
Speaker 2: take that and do that six different times and come

1293
00:57:55,280 --> 00:57:57,320
Speaker 2: up with these images and then collage all those images

1294
00:57:57,360 --> 00:58:00,640
Speaker 2: together and create a new piece of work. It's not

1295
00:58:00,680 --> 00:58:03,040
Speaker 2: any different than like an artist that goes on Google

1296
00:58:03,880 --> 00:58:06,560
Speaker 2: pre AI that says, I need a picture of a candle,

1297
00:58:06,920 --> 00:58:10,280
Speaker 2: I need a picture of a lighter, I needed a

1298
00:58:10,320 --> 00:58:12,920
Speaker 2: picture of a hand held in this direction, and then

1299
00:58:12,960 --> 00:58:15,120
Speaker 2: they go and photoshop and assemble all those things and

1300
00:58:15,160 --> 00:58:17,959
Speaker 2: then they paint that because that's what artists are doing.

1301
00:58:18,040 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 1: Like whether yeah, whether.

1302
00:58:19,320 --> 00:58:21,040
Speaker 2: An artist is going and saying, I'm gonna take a

1303
00:58:21,040 --> 00:58:22,760
Speaker 2: picture of this plant, I'm gonna paint this plant like

1304
00:58:23,560 --> 00:58:26,040
Speaker 2: it's very rare unless you're like a truly like surrealistic

1305
00:58:26,120 --> 00:58:28,120
Speaker 2: artist that you're painting just like straight out of your head.

1306
00:58:28,280 --> 00:58:30,720
Speaker 1: And that's what you're doing intentionally. If you're doing that right,

1307
00:58:30,760 --> 00:58:32,120
Speaker 1: and that's that's your style of work.

1308
00:58:32,240 --> 00:58:35,680
Speaker 2: AI is just doing that for you faster, right.

1309
00:58:35,760 --> 00:58:38,040
Speaker 1: What's your fear with AI and art?

1310
00:58:39,080 --> 00:58:42,520
Speaker 2: I mean, just like stylistically, like I've been thinking thinking

1311
00:58:42,560 --> 00:58:45,160
Speaker 2: more like as an artist with AI being in the picture,

1312
00:58:45,200 --> 00:58:47,240
Speaker 2: like you have to be more of a brand, You

1313
00:58:47,320 --> 00:58:49,320
Speaker 2: have to be more of you have to be able

1314
00:58:49,320 --> 00:58:51,760
Speaker 2: to manufacture more products, because that's one thing AI at

1315
00:58:51,760 --> 00:58:53,520
Speaker 2: this point hasn't been able to do as man. I mean,

1316
00:58:53,560 --> 00:58:55,600
Speaker 2: it could design all day, but it's like if you

1317
00:58:55,680 --> 00:58:59,040
Speaker 2: have an image, you can't say, okay, AI go all

1318
00:58:59,120 --> 00:59:02,520
Speaker 2: right now producing a event based around this image that

1319
00:59:02,640 --> 00:59:06,360
Speaker 2: has you know, three D elements, that's you know, something

1320
00:59:06,400 --> 00:59:09,280
Speaker 2: that people can experience, whether it's like a music festival, right,

1321
00:59:09,360 --> 00:59:11,560
Speaker 2: Like you could say, design me a music festival the

1322
00:59:11,600 --> 00:59:14,360
Speaker 2: desert and it looks like this, but like you can't say, okay,

1323
00:59:14,920 --> 00:59:16,600
Speaker 2: it doesn't have the power to go and produce that

1324
00:59:16,640 --> 00:59:18,920
Speaker 2: and put all the artists and run all the talent

1325
00:59:19,080 --> 00:59:21,280
Speaker 2: and you know, the stuff on the ground, boots on

1326
00:59:21,280 --> 00:59:24,120
Speaker 2: the ground, hire all the folks, and so like, I

1327
00:59:24,160 --> 00:59:26,480
Speaker 2: think that's where people are going to continue to win.

1328
00:59:26,760 --> 00:59:30,160
Speaker 2: It's like, you know, if you can design sculptures all

1329
00:59:30,240 --> 00:59:33,880
Speaker 2: day long through mid journey, but it's like, how do

1330
00:59:33,920 --> 00:59:35,640
Speaker 2: you actually produce that? How do you put an event

1331
00:59:35,640 --> 00:59:37,080
Speaker 2: toge where people are going to go look at that?

1332
00:59:37,640 --> 00:59:39,560
Speaker 2: You know? How do you make it more than just

1333
00:59:40,720 --> 00:59:41,280
Speaker 2: a painting?

1334
00:59:41,520 --> 00:59:42,040
Speaker 1: Right? Right?

1335
00:59:42,400 --> 00:59:44,760
Speaker 2: How is it something that could be experienced by people?

1336
00:59:44,760 --> 00:59:46,120
Speaker 2: Those are the things where I think it's going to

1337
00:59:46,200 --> 00:59:48,880
Speaker 2: like set people apart. You know, you're going to see

1338
00:59:48,920 --> 00:59:50,520
Speaker 2: like a lot of people that are painting the same things.

1339
00:59:50,520 --> 00:59:54,200
Speaker 2: We're just like AI generated images. But like the people

1340
00:59:54,240 --> 00:59:56,520
Speaker 2: that are creating experiences for people, I think are the

1341
00:59:56,520 --> 00:59:57,960
Speaker 2: people that are going to be able to stand out.

1342
00:59:58,200 --> 01:00:00,800
Speaker 1: Do you know, do you feel like the it advancements

1343
01:00:01,040 --> 01:00:05,640
Speaker 1: of AI art and the accessibility of the programs could

1344
01:00:05,680 --> 01:00:09,560
Speaker 1: potentially devalue human made art like you like yours.

1345
01:00:09,840 --> 01:00:13,960
Speaker 2: Uh. The thing that like kind of makes me feel

1346
01:00:13,960 --> 01:00:17,680
Speaker 2: okay with it is how long art's been able to

1347
01:00:17,720 --> 01:00:21,040
Speaker 2: stay around, like to this day. Right, think about like

1348
01:00:21,120 --> 01:00:23,480
Speaker 2: you know, back in the early times, Like I'm sure

1349
01:00:23,480 --> 01:00:26,520
Speaker 2: when the camera came out, people were like, art's gonna die.

1350
01:00:26,800 --> 01:00:28,880
Speaker 2: Why can't I just take a picture of that landscape?

1351
01:00:29,280 --> 01:00:32,000
Speaker 1: Right, we could say the same thing maybe on an iPhone, right, yeah,

1352
01:00:32,120 --> 01:00:34,400
Speaker 1: everyone's a good photographer now. Yeah.

1353
01:00:34,440 --> 01:00:37,280
Speaker 2: But it's like I always I think humans want something,

1354
01:00:37,360 --> 01:00:39,360
Speaker 2: want something that's created by human touch.

1355
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:41,800
Speaker 1: Do you see there being a time where, maybe you know,

1356
01:00:41,960 --> 01:00:45,960
Speaker 1: as AI art just keeps advancing and becomes more prevalent,

1357
01:00:46,440 --> 01:00:50,560
Speaker 1: that people will value human made art more.

1358
01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:54,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I think that's why people value paintings

1359
01:00:54,840 --> 01:00:57,440
Speaker 2: like they do now, Like you could easily buy a

1360
01:00:57,480 --> 01:01:03,080
Speaker 2: replica photograph or digital print or print on canvas, but like, right, yeah,

1361
01:01:03,160 --> 01:01:05,840
Speaker 2: I think that's just like humans being humans and humans

1362
01:01:06,120 --> 01:01:08,280
Speaker 2: the same reason, like the human touch and the human

1363
01:01:08,400 --> 01:01:10,880
Speaker 2: like the act of creation and all that. It's like

1364
01:01:10,920 --> 01:01:14,800
Speaker 2: I feel like people will always want that. I mean,

1365
01:01:14,880 --> 01:01:16,600
Speaker 2: what do you think about like for like acting and

1366
01:01:16,640 --> 01:01:18,720
Speaker 2: actors and like, yeah, I mean I guess there's a

1367
01:01:18,760 --> 01:01:20,520
Speaker 2: market for I mean, I see my kids that are

1368
01:01:20,520 --> 01:01:23,360
Speaker 2: addicted to watching all like Pixar films and you know,

1369
01:01:23,960 --> 01:01:26,680
Speaker 2: Cocoa Melon and thing like these YouTube shorts that are

1370
01:01:26,720 --> 01:01:29,760
Speaker 2: just like, yeah, you know, it's that's all. There's not

1371
01:01:29,800 --> 01:01:32,080
Speaker 2: one act I mean, maybe there's voice actors involved in that.

1372
01:01:32,120 --> 01:01:33,720
Speaker 2: But I'm sure in the future you're gonna be able

1373
01:01:33,720 --> 01:01:35,800
Speaker 2: to say, Hey, write me a cartoon that's based on

1374
01:01:35,880 --> 01:01:38,160
Speaker 2: Larry Loudmouth and here's the script because I threw that

1375
01:01:38,200 --> 01:01:41,320
Speaker 2: in chat GPT and you know, here's a thirty minute

1376
01:01:41,360 --> 01:01:44,880
Speaker 2: you know short, you know, plot, and do the animation

1377
01:01:44,960 --> 01:01:46,360
Speaker 2: for it same way you put in a mid Journey.

1378
01:01:46,400 --> 01:01:49,760
Speaker 2: It's gonna kick out me a like it's gonna kick

1379
01:01:49,760 --> 01:01:51,600
Speaker 2: out me a full animated series.

1380
01:01:51,760 --> 01:01:51,960
Speaker 1: Right.

1381
01:01:52,880 --> 01:01:55,160
Speaker 2: But it's like, yeah, are people gonna still yearn for

1382
01:01:56,160 --> 01:01:59,600
Speaker 2: like voices like you know, Chris Rock, like you know, yeah,

1383
01:02:00,040 --> 01:02:01,400
Speaker 2: as a cartoon character voice.

1384
01:02:01,560 --> 01:02:04,080
Speaker 1: It's tough because I mean, I I think I will

1385
01:02:04,520 --> 01:02:06,880
Speaker 1: I would yearn for that. Yeah, I do think that

1386
01:02:06,880 --> 01:02:08,920
Speaker 1: there are some people who just simply don't care. I

1387
01:02:08,960 --> 01:02:12,800
Speaker 1: don't care, right, if it's like the same thing, like

1388
01:02:12,840 --> 01:02:14,680
Speaker 1: I mean, if it sounds the same looks the same,

1389
01:02:15,120 --> 01:02:18,840
Speaker 1: feels the same. It not being the same doesn't really matter.

1390
01:02:18,840 --> 01:02:20,240
Speaker 1: It's like living in the matrix. It's like, oh, if

1391
01:02:20,240 --> 01:02:22,040
Speaker 1: it feels real, it is real.

1392
01:02:22,400 --> 01:02:24,120
Speaker 2: That's like I mean, if you've seen those like you know,

1393
01:02:24,160 --> 01:02:27,320
Speaker 2: those like Drake AI Audio like they're insane, like where

1394
01:02:27,360 --> 01:02:31,360
Speaker 2: they're making tracks that are like you're like like like

1395
01:02:31,720 --> 01:02:35,880
Speaker 2: kind of yeah, you know, I mean I don't know. Yeah,

1396
01:02:35,920 --> 01:02:39,760
Speaker 2: it's it's scary. I mean, times are crazy, but I

1397
01:02:39,760 --> 01:02:41,800
Speaker 2: guess we always figure out a way to make it

1398
01:02:41,840 --> 01:02:45,560
Speaker 2: work right and make you know, hopefully humans will continue

1399
01:02:45,600 --> 01:02:49,000
Speaker 2: to evolve and be able to how you know, keep

1400
01:02:49,040 --> 01:02:51,720
Speaker 2: a living for themselves. Uh yeah, you know, make money

1401
01:02:51,720 --> 01:02:53,400
Speaker 2: and succeed and be happy.

1402
01:02:53,560 --> 01:02:55,600
Speaker 1: I mean, do you feel like they're you Like at

1403
01:02:55,600 --> 01:03:00,600
Speaker 1: this point, there's just so many content creator I think

1404
01:03:00,640 --> 01:03:02,200
Speaker 1: everyone is a content creator now.

1405
01:03:02,240 --> 01:03:02,520
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1406
01:03:02,560 --> 01:03:05,400
Speaker 1: And so while these tools are super helpful and can

1407
01:03:05,880 --> 01:03:08,800
Speaker 1: you know, get you eyes on your work or ears

1408
01:03:08,840 --> 01:03:10,600
Speaker 1: on your work that you would never be able to

1409
01:03:10,600 --> 01:03:13,280
Speaker 1: get in like a you know, smaller setting at some

1410
01:03:13,360 --> 01:03:17,360
Speaker 1: gallery or live event. Is it too saturated at this point?

1411
01:03:17,440 --> 01:03:20,320
Speaker 1: Is everyone trying to do that to the point where

1412
01:03:20,360 --> 01:03:25,560
Speaker 1: maybe this person over here who has objectively better work

1413
01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:30,560
Speaker 1: is being overshadowed by just how saturated it all is.

1414
01:03:30,680 --> 01:03:33,040
Speaker 2: Or yeah, and it's only gonna get worse with this

1415
01:03:33,120 --> 01:03:36,800
Speaker 2: AI stuff, right, I mean it's like AI projectors, all

1416
01:03:36,800 --> 01:03:38,919
Speaker 2: these like tools that have like, yeah, you know, coming

1417
01:03:38,960 --> 01:03:41,440
Speaker 2: to the forefront like the last few years. It's like

1418
01:03:42,000 --> 01:03:44,200
Speaker 2: anyone really can be an artist if you go on

1419
01:03:44,280 --> 01:03:46,640
Speaker 2: mid journey, you type in an image, you project that

1420
01:03:46,680 --> 01:03:48,840
Speaker 2: image on a canvas, and you do a paint by numbers.

1421
01:03:49,320 --> 01:03:51,040
Speaker 2: You know, it's like boom, But it's like how do

1422
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:53,160
Speaker 2: you stand out from that? Right? So yeah, I think

1423
01:03:53,200 --> 01:03:55,040
Speaker 2: it's gonna be like, yeah, the bar's gonna be raised,

1424
01:03:55,040 --> 01:03:56,880
Speaker 2: and it's like, yeah, it's like who's thinking of the

1425
01:03:56,920 --> 01:04:00,560
Speaker 2: crazier ideas? Who's doing insane and still late? You know,

1426
01:04:00,680 --> 01:04:03,160
Speaker 2: like just being an artist that paints on a canvas

1427
01:04:03,160 --> 01:04:04,560
Speaker 2: isn't gonna cut it anymore. I don't think.

1428
01:04:04,800 --> 01:04:07,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, but we do some AI stuff.

1429
01:04:07,600 --> 01:04:10,560
Speaker 2: Maybe this podcast is or this interview, whatever you want

1430
01:04:10,560 --> 01:04:11,480
Speaker 2: to call it, is that we.

1431
01:04:11,520 --> 01:04:13,360
Speaker 1: Paid a lot of money for this deep fake here. Yeah,

1432
01:04:13,720 --> 01:04:15,600
Speaker 1: how do you rig Mike's busy? He couldn't come down?

1433
01:04:15,680 --> 01:04:17,800
Speaker 2: Does it look real? Do you guys believe it?

1434
01:04:17,800 --> 01:04:19,439
Speaker 1: It looks I mean it feels real.

1435
01:04:20,120 --> 01:04:21,920
Speaker 2: This is actually a deep fake.

1436
01:04:22,280 --> 01:04:25,640
Speaker 1: What's the like the beta test for if you're AI,

1437
01:04:26,000 --> 01:04:31,840
Speaker 1: you gotta show blood right now? Yeah?

1438
01:04:31,920 --> 01:04:34,120
Speaker 2: The prick test? Yeah, give me your finger. Do you

1439
01:04:34,160 --> 01:04:35,640
Speaker 2: guys have the little test kit.

1440
01:04:36,120 --> 01:04:39,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like a COVID test. It's like you just.

1441
01:04:39,040 --> 01:04:40,720
Speaker 2: Put it into this, you put it into the computer

1442
01:04:40,760 --> 01:04:43,360
Speaker 2: and it's like, yep, that's actually him, Like, yeah.

1443
01:04:43,240 --> 01:04:46,040
Speaker 1: He's come back. I'm I'm worried him. I gotta come

1444
01:04:46,080 --> 01:04:50,160
Speaker 1: back as am. Do you care about your legacy?

1445
01:04:50,680 --> 01:04:52,560
Speaker 2: Of course? I mean that's a big thing I always

1446
01:04:52,560 --> 01:04:55,600
Speaker 2: think about, especially after I have kids. After now that

1447
01:04:55,640 --> 01:04:56,760
Speaker 2: I've had kids.

1448
01:04:56,480 --> 01:04:57,560
Speaker 1: What do you care about?

1449
01:04:58,640 --> 01:05:01,920
Speaker 2: I mean, for me, it's like I'm always you know,

1450
01:05:02,520 --> 01:05:04,120
Speaker 2: I think what kind of differs me a little bit

1451
01:05:04,120 --> 01:05:06,000
Speaker 2: with like a lot of artists is like I've found

1452
01:05:06,080 --> 01:05:08,440
Speaker 2: like a strong passion for you know what we've done

1453
01:05:08,440 --> 01:05:12,040
Speaker 2: with ABV as an artist agency and gallery where it's

1454
01:05:12,080 --> 01:05:15,480
Speaker 2: like utilizing my platform to you know, put other artists

1455
01:05:15,680 --> 01:05:19,120
Speaker 2: uh artwork on show. You know, We've we've worked with

1456
01:05:19,160 --> 01:05:21,560
Speaker 2: close to five on our artists globally and we're constantly

1457
01:05:21,560 --> 01:05:23,640
Speaker 2: pushing out shows in our gallery for that reason, to

1458
01:05:23,720 --> 01:05:26,240
Speaker 2: kind of like, you know, make it bigger than just

1459
01:05:26,400 --> 01:05:28,960
Speaker 2: my art, you know, like utilizing as I grow to

1460
01:05:29,160 --> 01:05:32,120
Speaker 2: kind of use that as as a showcase for other

1461
01:05:32,120 --> 01:05:34,760
Speaker 2: folks and you know, artists that I meet, and I

1462
01:05:34,840 --> 01:05:37,360
Speaker 2: think hopefully that carries on. Like you know, a lot

1463
01:05:37,400 --> 01:05:38,720
Speaker 2: of people are like, oh, do you want your kids

1464
01:05:38,800 --> 01:05:40,280
Speaker 2: to do art? Like, yeah, of course you want your

1465
01:05:40,320 --> 01:05:42,320
Speaker 2: kids to do art. But for me, I mean, I

1466
01:05:42,360 --> 01:05:44,480
Speaker 2: hope it's bigger than just me. I don't want it

1467
01:05:44,520 --> 01:05:47,560
Speaker 2: to just be more family, but like really, yeah, I

1468
01:05:47,600 --> 01:05:49,400
Speaker 2: want it to be. Like so when you're dead, you're

1469
01:05:49,560 --> 01:05:51,800
Speaker 2: how do you influence? How do you influence a community,

1470
01:05:51,800 --> 01:05:55,560
Speaker 2: a culture, an art scene in a city. Yeah, you know,

1471
01:05:55,760 --> 01:05:57,760
Speaker 2: those are the things that I'm thinking about and hopefully,

1472
01:05:57,800 --> 01:06:00,920
Speaker 2: like with building this new creative hub that you know,

1473
01:06:01,200 --> 01:06:04,480
Speaker 2: inspires people to be artists. Like I've noticed and had

1474
01:06:04,520 --> 01:06:06,840
Speaker 2: conversations with people that used to be like working dead

1475
01:06:06,920 --> 01:06:08,760
Speaker 2: end jobs as bartenders and came to me and they

1476
01:06:08,800 --> 01:06:10,360
Speaker 2: were like, Greg, what do I do? And I'm like

1477
01:06:10,520 --> 01:06:13,160
Speaker 2: jump jump, Like they were amazing artists and now they're

1478
01:06:13,160 --> 01:06:15,200
Speaker 2: getting paid, you know, sixty seventy thousand dollars to pay

1479
01:06:15,240 --> 01:06:18,120
Speaker 2: one wall overseas, you know, and it's like and they're

1480
01:06:18,120 --> 01:06:20,120
Speaker 2: doing those every month, and it's like, those are the

1481
01:06:20,120 --> 01:06:22,440
Speaker 2: same people that were scared to take the risk that

1482
01:06:22,560 --> 01:06:25,760
Speaker 2: were bartending and you know that type of stuff that

1483
01:06:25,800 --> 01:06:27,720
Speaker 2: makes me feel good. And it's like, hopefully, like if

1484
01:06:27,760 --> 01:06:29,480
Speaker 2: our agency and our gallery and all these things that

1485
01:06:29,480 --> 01:06:32,160
Speaker 2: we're building can continue to do that, like after I'm gone,

1486
01:06:32,160 --> 01:06:35,360
Speaker 2: whether it's through foundations or running the company still, through

1487
01:06:35,400 --> 01:06:38,840
Speaker 2: other employees or partners or whatever, it's like, and you're

1488
01:06:38,880 --> 01:06:41,680
Speaker 2: able to positively impact other artists so that they can

1489
01:06:41,760 --> 01:06:43,760
Speaker 2: like live their lives freely, then that's a win.

1490
01:06:44,440 --> 01:06:47,320
Speaker 1: You know how much more popular your work would become

1491
01:06:47,360 --> 01:06:47,959
Speaker 1: if you died.

1492
01:06:49,640 --> 01:06:52,280
Speaker 2: Don't say that, I know, come on, man, And then

1493
01:06:52,320 --> 01:06:55,160
Speaker 2: I just realized that this guy's on like it does

1494
01:06:55,280 --> 01:06:57,800
Speaker 2: like true crime. Shit, I'm sure you've got some interesting

1495
01:06:57,880 --> 01:07:00,920
Speaker 2: listeners and uh, just stay away if you put.

1496
01:07:01,280 --> 01:07:04,160
Speaker 1: My listeners an when it's too into that. The thing is,

1497
01:07:04,280 --> 01:07:07,000
Speaker 1: I think your wife's one of them. Though, yeah, she's true,

1498
01:07:07,040 --> 01:07:08,040
Speaker 1: normal is true.

1499
01:07:08,280 --> 01:07:10,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, until she said she couldn't sleep at night. She's

1500
01:07:11,000 --> 01:07:15,200
Speaker 2: like until yeah, No, I'm like, like, why are you

1501
01:07:15,200 --> 01:07:17,720
Speaker 2: guys listening to these like things that are terrifying you.

1502
01:07:17,720 --> 01:07:20,960
Speaker 2: We're like, you're like, I'm gonna go and and you're

1503
01:07:21,000 --> 01:07:23,160
Speaker 2: out of town and I'm gonna listen to something really

1504
01:07:23,240 --> 01:07:26,680
Speaker 2: scary and just be not able to sleep for four days.

1505
01:07:26,760 --> 01:07:28,840
Speaker 2: So I think she's into romance novels now.

1506
01:07:28,840 --> 01:07:32,600
Speaker 1: So that's okay. That's helped out a lot. That's until

1507
01:07:32,640 --> 01:07:33,880
Speaker 1: you read it here. What is this?

1508
01:07:34,960 --> 01:07:38,240
Speaker 2: Yeah exactly. I'll hop on GPT sometimes and just throw

1509
01:07:38,280 --> 01:07:39,600
Speaker 2: in the titles and be like, can you give me

1510
01:07:39,640 --> 01:07:42,560
Speaker 2: the like the three sentence summary on this book, just

1511
01:07:42,560 --> 01:07:45,720
Speaker 2: to make sure she's not getting anything that's gonna harm

1512
01:07:45,720 --> 01:07:46,480
Speaker 2: the relationship.

1513
01:07:47,520 --> 01:07:50,160
Speaker 1: Oh god, that's good, but it's always a little bit worse.

1514
01:07:50,160 --> 01:07:52,560
Speaker 1: I think I'm joking, but it's always like, wow, he

1515
01:07:52,640 --> 01:07:57,640
Speaker 1: does what it was? How big? Yeah? Yeah, exactly, that

1516
01:07:57,800 --> 01:07:58,280
Speaker 1: is amazing.

1517
01:07:58,320 --> 01:07:59,960
Speaker 2: You gotta be careful when the plumber comes around.

1518
01:08:00,680 --> 01:08:07,360
Speaker 1: Right. This has been a blast, man. I'm looking forward

1519
01:08:07,360 --> 01:08:10,160
Speaker 1: to when you get your your new creative hub up

1520
01:08:10,160 --> 01:08:12,040
Speaker 1: and running. We'd love to check it out at some point.

1521
01:08:12,200 --> 01:08:13,880
Speaker 2: Of course, I'd love to give you a sneak peek

1522
01:08:13,920 --> 01:08:16,800
Speaker 2: and yeah, man, early a little early view on it all.

1523
01:08:16,840 --> 01:08:19,040
Speaker 2: But yeah, what a fun conversation. I mean, we definitely,

1524
01:08:19,200 --> 01:08:21,000
Speaker 2: I think we jumped around. I think the topic. We

1525
01:08:21,000 --> 01:08:24,240
Speaker 2: were most interested in his ai and how our jobs

1526
01:08:24,240 --> 01:08:25,280
Speaker 2: are probably gonna get.

1527
01:08:25,360 --> 01:08:29,519
Speaker 1: And how threatened we feel by it. Get that, guys. Yeah,

1528
01:08:29,640 --> 01:08:33,240
Speaker 1: there should be a verification process. We need the government

1529
01:08:33,240 --> 01:08:35,479
Speaker 1: to step in at some point. Not the government, but

1530
01:08:35,640 --> 01:08:40,000
Speaker 1: the government, but you know, an entity of of sorts. Yeah. No,

1531
01:08:40,080 --> 01:08:41,880
Speaker 1: it's been fun, man, and I've always been a fan

1532
01:08:41,920 --> 01:08:42,640
Speaker 1: of yours.

1533
01:08:42,600 --> 01:08:46,639
Speaker 2: Likewise, mean, ye, long history. Maybe one day we'll get

1534
01:08:46,640 --> 01:08:48,280
Speaker 2: back in the booth and U, you know, lay some

1535
01:08:48,320 --> 01:08:48,800
Speaker 2: bars down.

1536
01:08:48,960 --> 01:08:51,680
Speaker 1: Hey man, like to hit me up anytime. Let's go

1537
01:08:52,439 --> 01:08:54,080
Speaker 1: all Hey man, cheers. Brother.

1538
01:08:58,800 --> 01:09:01,559
Speaker 3: Talking to Death is a prettyduction of Tenorfoot TV and

1539
01:09:01,680 --> 01:09:06,479
Speaker 3: iHeart podcast created and hosted by Payne Lindsay. For Tenderfoot TV,

1540
01:09:06,720 --> 01:09:10,920
Speaker 3: executive producers are Payne Lindsay and Donald Albright. Co executive

1541
01:09:10,960 --> 01:09:15,280
Speaker 3: producer is Mike Rooney. For iHeart Podcasts, executive producers are

1542
01:09:15,320 --> 01:09:19,160
Speaker 3: Matt Frederick and Alex Williams. With original music by Makeup

1543
01:09:19,200 --> 01:09:23,320
Speaker 3: and Vanity Set, Additional production by Mike Rooney, Dylan Harrington,

1544
01:09:23,520 --> 01:09:28,120
Speaker 3: Sean Nerney, Dayton Cole, and Gustav Wild for Cohedo. Production

1545
01:09:28,240 --> 01:09:32,519
Speaker 3: support by Tracy Kaplan, Mara Davis and Trevor Young. Mixing

1546
01:09:32,560 --> 01:09:36,240
Speaker 3: and mastering by Cooper Skinner and Dayton Cole. Our cover

1547
01:09:36,360 --> 01:09:40,000
Speaker 3: art was created by Rob Sheridan. Check out our website

1548
01:09:40,200 --> 01:09:45,800
Speaker 3: Talking to deeathpodcast dot com.

1549
01:09:45,880 --> 01:09:48,120
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to this episode of Talking to Death.

1550
01:09:48,600 --> 01:09:52,000
Speaker 1: This series is released weekly absolutely free, but if you

1551
01:09:52,040 --> 01:09:55,519
Speaker 1: want ad free listening and exclusive bonuses, you can subscribe

1552
01:09:55,560 --> 01:09:59,400
Speaker 1: to tenderfoot Plus on Apple Podcasts or go to tenderfoot

1553
01:09:59,439 --> 01:10:00,400
Speaker 1: plus I Come