Speaker 1: You're listening to Comedy Central. Hey, what's up, everybody. I'm
Speaker 1: Roy Wood Jr. And this is Beyond the Scenes the
Speaker 1: Show where we go deeper into the topics that you
Speaker 1: see on the Daily Show. You know how they have
Speaker 1: the Talking Dead for the Walking Dead, and you know
Speaker 1: Talking Bad for breaking Bad. Well, this is the Talking
Speaker 1: Show for the Daily Show. You know it. Never mind,
Speaker 1: we'll come up with a better name for it later. Basically,
Speaker 1: what we're going to be talking about today is our
Speaker 1: segment Dulce And featuring TDS correspondent Dulce Sloan. Basically, these
Speaker 1: are explainer videos that go a little bit deeper into
Speaker 1: topics that you know, people need to know a little
Speaker 1: bit more about, like the history of the strong black
Speaker 1: woman or the Nineteenth Amendment. This week, we are talking
Speaker 1: about how female MC's shaped hip.
Speaker 2: Hop hip hop.
Speaker 3: It's how we know what bottles to pop and what
Speaker 3: luxury items we can't afford.
Speaker 2: And we've been living in a.
Speaker 3: Golden era of female rappers with legends like Missy Elliott,
Speaker 3: Lil Kim, and Lauren Hill, not to mention Megan thee
Speaker 3: Stallion and Cardi B dancing with a certain African who
Speaker 3: misplaced my ticket to the Grammys. But did you know
Speaker 3: that female rappers have been viewed in every era, every era,
Speaker 3: every every era that didn't work.
Speaker 2: It's true.
Speaker 3: Rap's history is full of women who have largely been forgotten,
Speaker 3: like Sylvia Robinson, the woman who helped create hip hop.
Speaker 3: Sylvia was a singer, record producer, label executive, and the
Speaker 3: first person to rock the Pharrell hat. She took rap
Speaker 3: from little known basement parties in the Bronx to worldwide
Speaker 3: commercial success in nineteen seventy nine by conceiving and producing
Speaker 3: raps first hit record, Rappers Delight. Not only was it
Speaker 3: the first rap single to conquer the charts, it also
Speaker 3: sold over a million copies. That's right, it went platinum,
Speaker 3: and back then we didn't even know what that was.
Speaker 2: They had to whip out a periodic table.
Speaker 1: To help us walk us through this segment of Dull saying,
Speaker 1: Please welcome, Dull say sloan, how you doing my love?
Speaker 2: Hello?
Speaker 3: What for those that don't know, I call it uncle Wold,
Speaker 3: your uncle Roy, even though he might be.
Speaker 1: I don't know when I ascend it to uncle status
Speaker 1: in the world of comedy in New York. But you're
Speaker 1: not the only one. We'll discuss that off air. Also
Speaker 1: helping us walk through this segment today is Deep Dive
Speaker 1: producer Chelsea Williamson. Chelsea, please also don't call me uncle.
Speaker 1: Welcome aboard, Hi ROI. I thought she was gonna still
Speaker 1: say uncle too.
Speaker 2: She respected her request.
Speaker 1: Now, before we get into how Chelsea does the research
Speaker 1: on these stories over in Deep Dive, d'll say, breakdown
Speaker 1: the actual segment, Dull saying for me, like, first, what
Speaker 1: is the purpose of the segment and just kind of
Speaker 1: where the origins of it the origins it.
Speaker 3: So, the one of producers of the show, Jen Flant,
Speaker 3: she approached me, She's like, well, we have an interesting
Speaker 3: idea of kind of like an explainer piece, like basically
Speaker 3: wanting to get like deeper information on the subject. And
Speaker 3: they were like playing around with a name, and she
Speaker 3: was like, what do you think adults saying? I was like,
Speaker 3: that's hilarious, and so like you know, like you were
Speaker 3: saying of them like the nineteenth Amendment and you know,
Speaker 3: the trope of the strong black woman.
Speaker 2: I believe we did one on hair.
Speaker 3: Care products too, write like black hair care product, black care. Yeah,
Speaker 3: so they are I see them as topics that only
Speaker 3: I can really explain.
Speaker 2: As a way to.
Speaker 3: Give our audience like deeper insight. So with this piece,
Speaker 3: it was to show the influence that women have had
Speaker 3: in hip hop and female MC's and the influence that
Speaker 3: they've had in music.
Speaker 1: The thing that I enjoy about dulceing is that it's
Speaker 1: just you delivering facts and jokes because like traditionally in
Speaker 1: the field department for the people who don't know, the
Speaker 1: creative process over in the field wing is you have
Speaker 1: to you pitch the topic and then the next question is, okay,
Speaker 1: well who are we going to talk to about this topic? Well,
Speaker 1: who can we get what expert? And then it's booking
Speaker 1: and the next thing, you know, two months of past
Speaker 1: because you got the perfect person, but they scheduled, don't
Speaker 1: and it's too much and you all can just go
Speaker 1: a right, We're just gonna talk about this now, Chelsea,
Speaker 1: because there is no person attached to this. That means
Speaker 1: that all of the facts have to come from Dulce,
Speaker 1: which means we get to have the facts right, which
Speaker 1: means you're the one deep diving on this. What did
Speaker 1: you do? I guess we could talk broader about Dulceain,
Speaker 1: but specifically about female MC's and hip hop. Where did
Speaker 1: you start that journey in assembling the pieces and looking
Speaker 1: at the history of it so that then the writers
Speaker 1: can come into that document and there's the joke. There's
Speaker 1: a joke. Then Dulce comes in and goes, that's a
Speaker 1: good point. That's the point I want to make. I
Speaker 1: want to make that point.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I feel like a lot of it.
Speaker 5: Well, this one specifically began through what happened with Megan
Speaker 5: the Stallion and Tory Lanes last year's shooting.
Speaker 4: Yes, the shooting last July.
Speaker 3: Preparatory Lanes has been charged in connection with the shooting
Speaker 3: a fellow hip hop star Meghan the Stallion.
Speaker 4: Lanes is accused of shooting Megan.
Speaker 3: The Stallion's feet back in July after she exited his
Speaker 3: suv during the flight in the Hollywood Hills. Got shot
Speaker 3: in both feet, yes, both feet, for feet after they
Speaker 3: went the party together, bastard.
Speaker 5: So we had been trying to figure out how are
Speaker 5: we going to put this into some sort of piece,
Speaker 5: like we need to do something because she is also
Speaker 5: not the first like female rapper that's something like that
Speaker 5: has happened to in this industry. So it just felt like,
Speaker 5: I don't know, it just felt like there was like
Speaker 5: not a trend, but like there. Yeah, it's like the
Speaker 5: sexism in the industry and how it affects like black
Speaker 5: women that specifically occupy the rap space, which is so
Speaker 5: misogynistic I think.
Speaker 4: Anybody would admit.
Speaker 5: So we wanted to tackle that in some way, shape
Speaker 5: or form, and it kind of ended up getting to
Speaker 5: the space of, well, let's talk about how women have
Speaker 5: influenced hip hop in general, because it's very much thought
Speaker 5: of as only men have done everything, and that it's
Speaker 5: it is still very male dominated. But as we showed
Speaker 5: and as Duels said, like black women literally founded and
Speaker 5: helped put together the first rap record, so it's like
Speaker 5: we've been there since the beginning, and you know, we
Speaker 5: deserve our flowers, and all the female rappers especially deserve
Speaker 5: their flowers because they never get them enough.
Speaker 1: Now I saw the piece and I was disappointed to
Speaker 1: see that Charlie Baltimore had been Ah, you passed over. Now,
Speaker 1: there's only so much time. That's not disrespect to matam.
Speaker 1: Charlie Baltimore, one of my things favorite rappers from the nineties,
Speaker 1: Thank you very much. But Chelsea, Chelsea Thend'll say, what
Speaker 1: were some what were some pieces of the historical timeline?
Speaker 1: Like what did you have to cut? Who were the
Speaker 1: rappers that you didn't get a chance to get in
Speaker 1: that because you know, I'm a Southern guy, so I'm
Speaker 1: already biased to like the mia X and the gangster
Speaker 1: booze of the w.
Speaker 5: X.
Speaker 4: Yes, No, we were so much for say X.
Speaker 5: We wanted to include Salt Pep and Spinderella. I mean,
Speaker 5: like they were some of the first ones. Like we
Speaker 5: had so many female rappers you have right right, It
Speaker 5: was it was like it was literally like Sophie's choice.
Speaker 5: It was like who are we going to mention because
Speaker 5: we know we're going to offend somebody, and we actually
Speaker 5: weren't even able to. Ideally, we had wanted to end
Speaker 5: like on where we are now and like Highlight, you know,
Speaker 5: the Megan, the Stallions, the Cardi B's, Nicki Minaj you
Speaker 5: kind of ushered in this entire new era and we
Speaker 5: weren't really able to so we didn't. We weren't able
Speaker 5: to get them in. We weren't able to get Trina
Speaker 5: the bit. You know, there were just a few that,
Speaker 5: unfortunately we couldn't, you know, put in but they mean
Speaker 5: so much to hip hop and like that's not at all,
Speaker 5: So you had.
Speaker 1: To focus on the foundation of the genre, of the
Speaker 1: gender in this genre. They'll say, well you okay with
Speaker 1: that Once you all came to that decision, like, hey,
Speaker 1: we ain't got enough time to talk about present day
Speaker 1: hip hop. Were talking from you know, back in the day.
Speaker 1: We're talking from Cross Color Karl Kanai right right up
Speaker 1: to TLC, and that's gonna be the cutoff, right.
Speaker 3: Well, I think it's like I think us not being
Speaker 3: able to include more present day artists, uh was a
Speaker 3: bit of a disservice, but one.
Speaker 2: You got to cut stuff for tom sometimes.
Speaker 3: But also I think when it comes to the music
Speaker 3: industry and it comes to hip hop, everything is very
Speaker 3: much what's happening now, who's hot now, what's going on now?
Speaker 3: Whose album just dropped, whose single just dropped? So I
Speaker 3: think we're very much aware of who is popping currently.
Speaker 3: So I think it being a bit of a history
Speaker 3: lesson was beneficial to people because there's a whole generation
Speaker 3: of folks that don't know what Queen Latifa was a rapper.
Speaker 2: As only reason we don't know ice.
Speaker 1: Cube was argue me down about Will Smith, the youngest
Speaker 1: he has, he won the first rap griff.
Speaker 2: What are you talking to?
Speaker 1: Do they even know about the fashion influence like the
Speaker 1: young man? So I do sound like an uncle. You're right, young.
Speaker 2: Kids don't know nothing about this.
Speaker 3: I'm worried about that I'm gonna hit auntie status before
Speaker 3: I become a mother, and don't I can't handle that situation.
Speaker 3: Queen Latifa burst onto the rap scene with the pro
Speaker 3: and message. Her song Ladies First showed off not only
Speaker 3: her lyrical prowess, but also uplifted women and name checked
Speaker 3: other female mcs. She was shouting out more women than
Speaker 3: Mambo Number five than in nineteen ninety three. Her song
Speaker 3: called You and I t Y called out men in
Speaker 3: hip hop for referring to women as bitches and hoes.
Speaker 1: Bitches and holes. That's my bad. I got caught up.
Speaker 1: I can see why I shouldn't have said that. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna just leave it. That's where I think dul Sin
Speaker 1: is such a rewarding segment because in a lot of ways,
Speaker 1: when you're doing segments that are about black issues, Chelsea,
Speaker 1: how are you all making sure that you're honoring, like
Speaker 1: because a black person or white person will watch your
Speaker 1: segment different if we just gonna be blind. A black
Speaker 1: person is looking to see confirmation of things that they
Speaker 1: already knew, and it's great to see it being presented
Speaker 1: to another audience, whereas non black viewers it's kind of
Speaker 1: a well, damn, I didn't know.
Speaker 3: That it's information, Like that's it's interesting you said it
Speaker 3: that way, because like that's how I view like just
Speaker 3: my stand up just as a stand up comic. Like
Speaker 3: when I'm trying out a new bit, I'm looking for
Speaker 3: information does this work? Once the bit is established and
Speaker 3: I know it works, then it's confirmation. I already know
Speaker 3: this is funny. I'm just waiting for you to catch up.
Speaker 3: So when it comes to these segments, it's I know
Speaker 3: one group of people, Like when we are looking through
Speaker 3: scripts and we're fact checking, it's I gotta make sure
Speaker 3: that black people won't go, hey man, that's not no.
Speaker 2: You should have you should you should have said something
Speaker 2: that's not.
Speaker 3: Right because like when we first got like the first
Speaker 3: job of the script, when we were talking about Queen
Speaker 3: Latifa and they were referencing her being a character on
Speaker 3: like her playing a character on Living Single, her name
Speaker 3: was wrong in the script, and I just was like,
Speaker 3: her name is Kadija, not whatever they put in, and
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, we gotta fact check that. I'm like,
Speaker 3: what the hell are you fact checking? I just told
Speaker 3: you a whole the black person just told you. I
Speaker 3: not only did I see all the Living Single the
Speaker 3: first time, also watched it again in lockdown.
Speaker 2: Her name is.
Speaker 1: To be fair to some of our writers in the building,
Speaker 1: they'll say Living Single was up against Seinfeld in the
Speaker 1: same time Sladter on Thursdays and Mad About You. Don't
Speaker 1: ask me how I know I listen.
Speaker 3: Honestly, I think Mad About You might be one of
Speaker 3: the reasons I have to think for these you know,
Speaker 3: God shows some people.
Speaker 2: Honestly, I've been trying to figure it.
Speaker 1: Out and I was like, oh, that's a separate podcast.
Speaker 2: That's not it. That's a separate lifestyle.
Speaker 3: But I do like the fact that we're making That's
Speaker 3: where when I look at pieces like this, like when
Speaker 3: we're talking about you know, the black hair products and
Speaker 3: things like that, there are certain that when we do
Speaker 3: these pieces, I'm always like, Okay, we have to make
Speaker 3: sure we have a black writer on this, because sometimes
Speaker 3: of a black person if I don't like being questioned
Speaker 3: because I told you what the shit is? What are
Speaker 3: you asking me? Well, we gotta we're gonna do Google?
Speaker 3: Is Google your reference? Because I just told you. So
Speaker 3: that's when you're saying, like black people are looking for confirmation.
Speaker 3: Anyone who is not aware is looking for information. So
Speaker 3: you want to make sure. And that's the thing with
Speaker 3: all of these pieces, you have to make sure that
Speaker 3: you're doing both things. You don't want to misinform, but
Speaker 3: you also don't want to say the wrong stuff because
Speaker 3: black people be like y'all could.
Speaker 2: Have just bruh.
Speaker 4: Y' know, they'll call you out there, Chelsea.
Speaker 1: Before we go to a break real quick, I have
Speaker 1: to ask you a question since I know you were
Speaker 1: in on the writing part of this. There was a
Speaker 1: particular correspondent that was written into this piece whose job
Speaker 1: it was to just come on and look like stupid
Speaker 1: man who interrupts woman and.
Speaker 3: Rapping in a group is great for a female MC
Speaker 3: because when the man repeats what you just said but
Speaker 3: slightly louder, he's not being sexist.
Speaker 2: He's being a good hype.
Speaker 1: Man, being a good man.
Speaker 3: See, women weren't just part of raps birth they also
Speaker 3: invented the rap beat.
Speaker 1: The rap beat.
Speaker 2: Okay, that's enough.
Speaker 1: Whose decision was it to put this brother on the
Speaker 1: chopping block in front of all the black women's on
Speaker 1: the internet. How does that happen? Like when you start
Speaker 1: having all these extra cameos and stuff.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I feel like sometimes it's it'll come out of
Speaker 5: the Deep Dive team, like we'll be like, oh, you know,
Speaker 5: what would be a funny addition here is like the
Speaker 5: idea of like a hype man, and especially like ironic
Speaker 5: because we're talking about you know, women MC's and I
Speaker 5: don't know, just like the cultural meaning of a hype
Speaker 5: man in hip hop is just so important. It was
Speaker 5: just funny, Like it was like you can you know,
Speaker 5: and nobody else would have made sense, honestly, Roy, Like
Speaker 5: it's like.
Speaker 2: Who was it supposed to be?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 2: White man?
Speaker 1: All right? Well, after the break, we're gonna get into
Speaker 1: a little bit about our own personal relationships with hip hop.
Speaker 1: Since I am the eldest uncle, I'm sure I remember
Speaker 1: some people that maybe you two don't, and we'll we'll
Speaker 1: compare notes on which female limces influenced us the most.
Speaker 1: This is beyond the scenes. We'll be right back on. Now,
Speaker 1: let's talk for a second about your personal relationship with
Speaker 1: female limces and hip hop, like as women, as Black women's,
Speaker 1: as women's. Yeah, the representation, how I'm joking but no,
Speaker 1: but seriously, how empowering was it to see that, you
Speaker 1: know on television or did you all always see that
Speaker 1: and feel like it was not enough? Chelsea, I'll start
Speaker 1: with you.
Speaker 5: I mean, I feel like the most impactful one for
Speaker 5: me actually was probably Nicki Minaj because of when she
Speaker 5: came out, which was like the latter half of my
Speaker 5: high school years, and I want to say that was
Speaker 5: like the first rap album i'd bought for myself with
Speaker 5: Pink Friday. I don't know if I really got like
Speaker 5: the magnitude of the moment when I bought it, but
Speaker 5: like I knew that, like, Okay, this is this is
Speaker 5: going to be great.
Speaker 4: I love this girl.
Speaker 5: It was also because she was featured Mariah song and
Speaker 5: I'm a huge Mariah Carey fan. But other than that,
Speaker 5: I would say yeah, and then side note for that,
Speaker 5: Mariah always featured a lot of female mcs on her
Speaker 5: remixes in the nineties and I loved those, so.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah she did. Mariah had a nice little relationship
Speaker 1: with hip hop in the nineties, and then she would go.
Speaker 3: Remix one of her songs, you a song with Bone
Speaker 3: Thugs in harmony, Like Maria, she got an album under
Speaker 3: Tony Matolan was like, I'm with all the black people now,
Speaker 3: Negro old dirty basket.
Speaker 1: Tell him to shimmy all over this track Logical Platinum.
Speaker 1: They'll say you're a little different, in my opinion, than Chelsea,
Speaker 1: and that you came up in a city two cities actually,
Speaker 1: Miami in Atlanta that acoustically are so unique that it
Speaker 1: is possible to be a fan of someone who is
Speaker 1: Gangbusters regionally, but nationally people don't necessarily connect at the
Speaker 1: gangster booze or I guess for your era crime Mob.
Speaker 3: Right, because like, hey, yo, we nucking, we bucking. People
Speaker 3: only think when you talk about who was in Crime Mob?
Speaker 3: Who did they talk about Princess and Diamond. I don't
Speaker 3: know what them dudes names are. Clu, no fucking clue.
Speaker 4: It's true, it's true.
Speaker 1: So who were some more of the mainstreams that you
Speaker 1: that you kind of fell in love with coming up?
Speaker 3: I remember as a kid, uh seeing Queen Latifa perform
Speaker 3: Ladies First on TV. I don't know if it was
Speaker 3: like in Living Color or it was like on a
Speaker 3: late night show, but I remember seeing Queen Latifa perform
Speaker 3: on TV.
Speaker 2: I like Tool Free Staff, the cloud.
Speaker 3: Stick Mob, But it only seemed like there were mainly
Speaker 3: like female rappers from like the North, because like you like,
Speaker 3: you know, Queen Latifa MC light in Salt and Pepper,
Speaker 3: And then like when Dubrat came out, it was like,
Speaker 3: and the Brat's not from the South either, but she
Speaker 3: was with Demaine Japrix, so by.
Speaker 1: Default she's she's Chicago.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what I thought. She's from Chicago.
Speaker 3: So I think the only the first time I really
Speaker 3: heard a female rapper that was from a sound that
Speaker 3: I was accustomed to was when Dibrat came out to
Speaker 3: would be on songs with Jermaine Duprix.
Speaker 1: The thing that I thought was very interesting, it seemed
Speaker 1: like there was and you all correct me if I'm wrong,
Speaker 1: but it seems like when female EMC's first came in
Speaker 1: the game, there had to be kind of a rough gruff,
Speaker 1: you know, EMC like stuff if.
Speaker 3: Your afro puffs, yeah, Lady of Rage, yeah, because I
Speaker 3: remember his daughters.
Speaker 1: That was another regional one out West.
Speaker 3: My mom did my hair like her one time, like
Speaker 3: Lady of Rage, but like I had a relaxer, so
Speaker 3: I couldn't have afro puffs, so my mother bought Burgundy.
Speaker 3: Leave well may This is like in like the mid
Speaker 3: nineties in Miami, so every little girl had.
Speaker 2: Grown woman ass hair.
Speaker 1: No.
Speaker 3: Like I remember being in like elementary school and being like,
Speaker 3: we're playing touch football to day and it was like
Speaker 3: me and like seven of the black girls being like
Speaker 3: these are fresh fingerwaves, coach. Nope, I ain't running around
Speaker 3: in Miami heat with fresh fingerwaves. Nah, dude, just gotta
Speaker 3: last a Sunday. So my mom gave me gelled on
Speaker 3: my hair down and I had legit Burgundy afro puffs
Speaker 3: because apparently my mother really was a fan of the lad.
Speaker 1: Are there pictures we need pictures of that?
Speaker 2: NaHg I did even come from a picture to take
Speaker 2: a family.
Speaker 1: Go to the Daily Show Twitter account if you want
Speaker 1: to see Dulce is.
Speaker 3: Maybe one day baby, But yeah, I re so like
Speaker 3: I think because I grew up in the nineties, I
Speaker 3: remember seeing a lot of female rappers and then there
Speaker 3: weren't any because like mc light on, where she went
Speaker 3: and then like you know, Trina and Gangster.
Speaker 2: Boot popped up.
Speaker 3: But it's kind of like when people talk about like, Okay,
Speaker 3: there can only be like one big black comic at
Speaker 3: a time, right, So it's like it was prior and
Speaker 3: there was Eddie Murphy and then you know, now it's
Speaker 3: you know, the Chappelle and Kevin Hart. So that's like
Speaker 3: and then they're just going, you can only have one
Speaker 3: big female rapper at a time when there's a bunch
Speaker 3: of dudes talking nonsense all day and everyone's on board
Speaker 3: with it.
Speaker 1: I always felt like there was a feeling where there
Speaker 1: was proud to be a woman. There was like a
Speaker 1: proud to be a woman era of lyricism within female
Speaker 1: hip hop. And then it was I'm as bad as
Speaker 1: these dudes and I'll beat your ass era lyricism, which
Speaker 1: is kind of the brat and it was just kind
Speaker 1: of gangsta boob, which is a little bit Trina and
Speaker 1: Trina was kind of that transition and little Kim.
Speaker 2: Get paid, so you walk to your girl, like the
Speaker 2: name just flid on my.
Speaker 3: Eyes, like that ask to pay and then to get
Speaker 3: to yah yeah, with the mom and.
Speaker 1: Lay kind of overlap of I'll beat your ass. But
Speaker 1: also we can have sex if you would like to
Speaker 1: have sex, which one would you prefer? And now I
Speaker 1: feel like female rappers have given so much space now
Speaker 1: finally to be all of the different things that a
Speaker 1: woman could be. Like I love And I'm not saying
Speaker 1: this because she's from Montgomery, Alabama. I really enjoyed Chica.
Speaker 4: I really enjoy MILLI too is from Alabama.
Speaker 2: Yeah, from Alabama.
Speaker 1: And there's this expressiveness of no, I'm going to talk
Speaker 1: about my inner thoughts and my wants and I don't
Speaker 1: have to if I choose to, I don't have to
Speaker 1: sexualize my lyrics. You have the freedom and the right to.
Speaker 1: But I can also be something else in the industry
Speaker 1: goes ah, Yes, you come, come get a record deal too.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I feel like there's a lot more choice nowadays than
Speaker 5: there used to be. I do feel like, you know,
Speaker 5: that gap that we were just talking about, that kind
Speaker 5: of happened after like Kim, Foxy and all of them
Speaker 5: came up and they changed the entire game. Like, if
Speaker 5: we're being one honest, you know, Kim and Fox made
Speaker 5: women owning their sexuality a thing it wasn't really talked
Speaker 5: about often from the women's perspective in rap and hip
Speaker 5: hop the way that they were talking about it before them,
Speaker 5: but kind of in consequence to that, that was then
Speaker 5: expected of all female rappers for at least a decade,
Speaker 5: which it's just you need to be the next Kim Foxy,
Speaker 5: which means you need to be dripped in Gabana, like
Speaker 5: they said, you need to be talking about sex. Is
Speaker 5: like all the time you'd be selling sex like it
Speaker 5: was a very specific archetype that they wanted for so long,
Speaker 5: and record labels even have said it now that they
Speaker 5: said women rappers were just too expensive, and that's one
Speaker 5: of the reasons there was such a long gap is
Speaker 5: they were like, we don't want to get a rub
Speaker 5: and rapper because then we got to pay for hair,
Speaker 5: we got to pay for nails, we got to pay
Speaker 5: for your you know looks, we got to pay for
Speaker 5: all this stuff. You've made it now so expensive to
Speaker 5: be a woman rapper, and then you're acting like that's
Speaker 5: the reason to gatekeep.
Speaker 3: Also, it's like with I mean with little kids, like
Speaker 3: the thing I remember specifically about being like when I
Speaker 3: was like middle school going into high school.
Speaker 2: One look.
Speaker 3: Kim has a line in her song where she says
Speaker 3: I could make a sprite can disappear in my mouth,
Speaker 3: and there.
Speaker 2: Was way too many people attempting.
Speaker 1: This, just a lot.
Speaker 3: Joe just destroyed, just just just and then feeling an
Speaker 3: out of I'd never tried it because I was like,
Speaker 3: this makes no sense. And then I remember a rumor
Speaker 3: about little Kim having to go to the hospital to
Speaker 3: get her stomach pumped because she'd had a wild night
Speaker 3: with a couple of men. And let's just say there
Speaker 3: was Uh, I don't know how to way to say
Speaker 3: this and keep a Christian.
Speaker 1: Ejaculator.
Speaker 2: I guess it's the best way to say it.
Speaker 1: It's I think I think people get the gist.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well I mean she did too, so it's like
Speaker 3: this is so sexual, but it seemed like it was
Speaker 3: we're being open about our sexuality, but it was still
Speaker 3: through a male gaze. Yeah, Like it was like I'm
Speaker 3: gonna talk about sex as a woman how men talk
Speaker 3: about sex. And I still felt like it didn't feel
Speaker 3: like it was from a woman's perspective, like I think
Speaker 3: the I think it took like Nikki or now especially
Speaker 3: Megan Thee Stallion and Cardi B, but especially Megan Thee Stallion.
Speaker 3: I was like, this is what it sounds like when
Speaker 3: a woman talks about sex, because Megan's always talking about
Speaker 3: a man pleasuring her, you know what I mean as
Speaker 3: opposed to because it seemed like a lot of times,
Speaker 3: like a Little Kim and Foxy Brown, it was still
Speaker 3: them talking about like they were open with their sexuality,
Speaker 3: but it was still talking about pleasuring a man. You
Speaker 3: see what I'm saying, like them receiving pleasure from pleasuring
Speaker 3: a man, as opposed to you know, Megan the Stallion
Speaker 3: being like, yeah, you're gonna go down to me while
Speaker 3: I play a video game, Like you're like, yeah, that
Speaker 3: is about her. They call me patty Cake because the
Speaker 3: wet that ass says, I'm gona make them feed me up.
Speaker 1: While I'm watching We Gotta Go to Break. But I'll
Speaker 1: tell you my female rapper that energized and awakened me.
Speaker 1: And it's in that same Little Kim, Foxy Brown, Trina
Speaker 1: sexualized Bravado era, but you had real flow as well.
Speaker 1: That's the other thing, like this wasn't gimmick grap These
Speaker 1: women had bars, But for me, it was mia X
Speaker 1: because mia X was so counterculture to what everybody was
Speaker 1: doing and when master p dropped umbout It in nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety five and they shot that video in the Calio
Speaker 1: Projects and mia X she's wearing a black baseball jersey
Speaker 1: and she's got a baseball bat. She's wearing a do
Speaker 1: rag and I'm like, this woman will beat the shit
Speaker 1: out of me my undivided attention now.
Speaker 5: But it's home.
Speaker 2: Just hooked his yead. I'm plowing coming from the press.
Speaker 3: And tacking us and riding the buck.
Speaker 4: Some go to bat.
Speaker 3: So your pet be backing, lope, see you have hope coming, Like, tell.
Speaker 6: Me you don't bring rama.
Speaker 1: That was the woman that just like, oh yeah, but
Speaker 1: that was the one, Like to this day. I met
Speaker 1: her at Essence Fest and I basically told her that story.
Speaker 1: I was like, just you with the back and she said, yes, baby,
Speaker 1: I will beat the ship out of you. I said,
Speaker 1: thank you.
Speaker 2: Look at her. Yes, I remember seeing her.
Speaker 3: And the thing is because like Queen Latifa has never
Speaker 3: been like a small woman, right. I don't know how
Speaker 3: this makes sense, Like you know how like Ashley Graham
Speaker 3: is a plus size model mm hmm, but she just
Speaker 3: looks like a She's not a fashion regular.
Speaker 4: Yeah, she's the type of curvy that they want.
Speaker 3: Right, yes, So that's how Queen Latifa looked to me.
Speaker 3: But when I saw me an X and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 3: I don't I know a million women that look like
Speaker 3: this woman. I am I currently like I look like
Speaker 3: like she. She looked familiar and she felt familiar, and
Speaker 3: so and little Basch's in my neighborhood started calling me
Speaker 3: me X and I was like, I don't hate it,
Speaker 3: so actually thank you.
Speaker 2: But I remember hearing her and going.
Speaker 3: Absolutely like yes, like I was always happy to hear
Speaker 3: her and to see her, and it was it was like,
Speaker 3: it's felt like master p really fucked with her, because
Speaker 3: it seemed like sometimes like it's right, like sometimes when
Speaker 3: these girls and these like the women in some rock
Speaker 3: groups are just like, oh yeah, we got a girl.
Speaker 3: She uh come on, he comes out some words, come on,
Speaker 3: we got a girl, which is where I was great.
Speaker 3: The Crime Mob had two girls who have the two
Speaker 3: like the one you know I love knuck if you buck.
Speaker 3: We've all decided at work that it would be the
Speaker 3: new Negro Spiritual. But it it was the same kind
Speaker 3: of feeling because when you would be out in Atlanta,
Speaker 3: that was the lines like there versus you would just
Speaker 3: see just hood ass dudes in Atlanta at everybody's thinking,
Speaker 3: like because sometimes you know with dudes, they'll like stop
Speaker 3: on the female verse m cause they're like, I ain't
Speaker 3: gonna say this now. When Diamond Princess came on, everybody
Speaker 3: was they were like, we don't care today women because
Speaker 3: he's bitch just going in. So I like, I was
Speaker 3: so glad when there got to be more female Southern
Speaker 3: rappers because this was a style that I liked, and
Speaker 3: I was like, I know, there's got to be women
Speaker 3: out here rapping that from the South, Like it doesn't
Speaker 3: make any sense it's only New York chicks doing.
Speaker 4: This, even in regards to mea X.
Speaker 5: Like that's also getting into the fact that so many
Speaker 5: of these labels really got famous off of the female
Speaker 5: rappers that they signed.
Speaker 4: The one mia X is one of no limit.
Speaker 5: I want to say hers was like the first album
Speaker 5: that like started charting. If I'm remembering the BT and
Speaker 5: documentary they did on them last year. Ruthless Records with
Speaker 5: Easy e jj Fad, which was an all women rap group,
Speaker 5: was the first record that started charting for them and
Speaker 5: put them on the map, like and those aren't the
Speaker 5: only two examples.
Speaker 4: It happens so much.
Speaker 5: But again, like nobody gives the women their credit that
Speaker 5: they rightfully deserve.
Speaker 1: This mia X bar and then we're gonna go to
Speaker 1: a break. This is mia X. I'm about it Soca
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety five poetry. I keep your ear holes lace
Speaker 1: with my pimpterous funk punk's player hate because they shit
Speaker 1: be bunk, it's trash. But I duck somebody's head into
Speaker 1: a toilet full of piss because in this drama feel fool.
Speaker 1: We eate take it no shit man.
Speaker 2: Come on, bars, bars.
Speaker 1: We go beyond the bars and beyond the scenes. After
Speaker 1: the break, I want to talk to you all about
Speaker 1: the challenges that female rappers are facing now in the
Speaker 1: industry and kind of things are headed. I'm Roy jingor
Speaker 1: this is beyond the scenes. We'll be right back. We've
Speaker 1: been talking about all of these amazing mcs and the
Speaker 1: ways they influenced us. Before the break, we forgot to
Speaker 1: talk about Lauren Hill.
Speaker 2: Funny, how money change a situation, and.
Speaker 1: Just what Lauren Hill meant to that brain. Because we
Speaker 1: talked about the transition of lyricism out of sexualization into whatever,
Speaker 1: which way you wanted to go. I think it's fair
Speaker 1: to say that Lauren Hill was able to kind of
Speaker 1: expand minds in the sense that, oh, if you don't
Speaker 1: want a pop yakoucie, you can also talk about this.
Speaker 5: Yeah, definitely, I would definitely say that I don't think
Speaker 5: we would have a Drake without Lauren Hill. If I'm
Speaker 5: being honest, just in terms of like the ing, like
Speaker 5: I mean, if we want to trace the lineage here,
Speaker 5: I'm just saying it exists.
Speaker 1: But you know, in terms of the Lauren Hill two
Speaker 1: point zero.
Speaker 5: Well, I don't know if I go that far with him,
Speaker 5: but like you know, he's he's a good attempt.
Speaker 4: But you know, I don't think we'd have him.
Speaker 5: We wouldn't have an Azalea Banks, we wouldn't have like
Speaker 5: so many now rappers incorporation.
Speaker 2: I mean, do well, where is she?
Speaker 5: I will also very much say the Azalea Banks before
Speaker 5: everything recently.
Speaker 2: But man, she need help, I know, like we don't.
Speaker 2: We don't. I don't know why we don't want to
Speaker 2: help her. We put up with Kanye's foolishness.
Speaker 3: We have, we have, But I guess if she was
Speaker 3: considered a genius then yeah, we would.
Speaker 1: Okay, So then to that point, then don't say what
Speaker 1: are some of the biggest hurdles that are faced by
Speaker 1: female mcs, Because Azalea is a woman who's been very
Speaker 1: vocal about the industry and the shadiness of it. What
Speaker 1: are some of the things that you think women em
Speaker 1: sees are dealing with today that they weren't saying nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety three.
Speaker 3: Now you can meet too these niggs. Before you just
Speaker 3: had to take it like before you couldn't say anything
Speaker 3: in all. Also, would anybody have cared in the first place.
Speaker 3: But if you're because if you're coming out rapping about
Speaker 3: you know, suck Nick's pop and pussy b da da
Speaker 3: da da da da da dah, are people gonna have
Speaker 3: any sympathy for you When you go, hey, this man
Speaker 3: was being inappropriate, You're like, ma'am, we got two albums
Speaker 3: if you being inappropriate. So I think now you're able
Speaker 3: to you're able to have some agency over what happens
Speaker 3: to you more because now you can hold people accountable
Speaker 3: in some form of fashion.
Speaker 1: So the abuse that happens to women rappers within the industry,
Speaker 1: they can call that out faster, to weed that out
Speaker 1: and have a better chance of having a career that's
Speaker 1: not the teared by that type of drama.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because I'm sure like a lot of female rappers
Speaker 3: because you see, like because I've always wondered, like you
Speaker 3: have these female rappers and I'm like, where'd she go?
Speaker 3: And I can't always believe it's like, oh, her record
Speaker 3: stop selling. Also, there's more, there's more ways to release
Speaker 3: your music. You don't have to be beholding to something
Speaker 3: like if you could produce your own album. There's comics
Speaker 3: that produce their own albums and put them on Apple
Speaker 3: and put them on Spotify and all this other stuff.
Speaker 3: So you yeah, soundclouds and we got plenty of SoundCloud rappers.
Speaker 3: So you know, if you get enough following on YouTube
Speaker 3: or Instagram or any social media, you can kind of
Speaker 3: skirt around a lot of the nonsense that rappers, you know,
Speaker 3: female rappers in ninety three or two thousand and three
Speaker 3: we're dealing with because you don't have to be beholding
Speaker 3: to some man having a choke hold on your future.
Speaker 3: It's like, well, you know, if you do this, then
Speaker 3: you know, we might not put your album and like,
Speaker 3: I'm fair, I don't need you are out of the
Speaker 3: whole internet, or put this album all over that.
Speaker 1: That's Cardi B all day.
Speaker 2: Right, So I have space. I'm not.
Speaker 3: The system is going like the system broke, the system broke.
Speaker 3: You can release songs for free if you want to,
Speaker 3: just to get your name out and so you don't
Speaker 3: have to wait to be the one female rapper that
Speaker 3: they let pop every five years.
Speaker 1: Why is that, Chelsea? Is that? Are the women rappers
Speaker 1: held to a different standard, because from what I can hear,
Speaker 1: the songs are just as hot, the flow is just
Speaker 1: as good.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: No, I definitely think that women rappers are held to
Speaker 5: different standards. I think this is actually something Dull Say
Speaker 5: and I were talking about. Is just it's kind of
Speaker 5: no matter what industry you're in, women are constantly underestimated
Speaker 5: and thought of as lower, and especially in rap, which
Speaker 5: is so male dominated and misogynistic. Like these women are
Speaker 5: still getting asked whether they write their lyrics. I'm like,
Speaker 5: men don't even write their lyrics anymore, Like why is
Speaker 5: that even still a question? Like people are still like, oh,
Speaker 5: did Cardi B write X y z da da da
Speaker 5: da da, And it's like does it matter? Like you know,
Speaker 5: like who cares? But then on top of that, like
Speaker 5: they have drinked out.
Speaker 4: Okay.
Speaker 5: I mean, I'm like, that's why we have the whole
Speaker 5: feud between him and Meek Mill. But you know, like
Speaker 5: even with all of that, these women are also supposed
Speaker 5: to be super fashionable all the time. They have to
Speaker 5: have all the hell of choreography. Like they're dancing, they
Speaker 5: are giving you they're rapping, they're trying to dance like
Speaker 5: they're Janet Jackson and at the same time like still
Speaker 5: trying to like keep a bomb flow and like have
Speaker 5: great lyrics like and the men just aren't listen. Migos
Speaker 5: can walk around three times and they'll be out of breath.
Speaker 5: There's also just the fact that there's so many mediocre
Speaker 5: rapping men out here, like but we can't have a
Speaker 5: female equivalent of that. Or whenever somebody is like not
Speaker 5: to whatever x y Z standard is, it's suddenly like
Speaker 5: the whole hip hop world is gonna, you know, go
Speaker 5: and burst into flames because this girl can't rap on
Speaker 5: beat or whatever.
Speaker 4: And it's like, you know how many men can't most
Speaker 4: of them?
Speaker 3: I mean, I think for me, the true measure of
Speaker 3: equality is allowing mediocrity truly, because when I think of
Speaker 3: because like only twenty percent of comics are women, right,
Speaker 3: So out of one hundred comics, twenty of them are women.
Speaker 3: And I I had a conversation with uh Oh. I
Speaker 3: held the shade back in. I held the shade back in.
Speaker 3: I'm so proud of her. I'm trying to be blessed
Speaker 3: this year. And but he was like, I don't know
Speaker 3: a lot of like women killers, like a lot of
Speaker 3: women killers. And I'm just like, are you looking for
Speaker 3: male killers? Because he's like, well, you know, I'll see
Speaker 3: a lineup and I'm like, out of ten comics.
Speaker 2: Only one of them is a woman.
Speaker 3: Out of a lineup on a show, out of ten comics,
Speaker 3: there's usually one of them as a woman. Out of
Speaker 3: these other nine comics that are all men, four of
Speaker 3: them probably are okay, but all every female comic is
Speaker 3: represented in this one girl.
Speaker 1: Right, she has to destroy.
Speaker 2: She has to fucking destroy.
Speaker 3: And so, because when women succeed in a male dominated industry,
Speaker 3: it's just like when you're you know, any marginalized group
Speaker 3: that is trying to be successful in an industry that's
Speaker 3: either predominantly white or predominantly male, you're going to have
Speaker 3: a problem. And you're going to be held at a
Speaker 3: different standard because it's like, well, you need to show
Speaker 3: us that you're as good as us, And I'm like,
Speaker 3: half of your motherfuckers are trash, so I only need
Speaker 3: to be as good as half of y'all.
Speaker 1: Technically, yeah, but the industry wants you to be undeniable
Speaker 1: across the board, better than any man we've ever seen.
Speaker 3: I'm really waiting for the day where female artists because
Speaker 3: it seems like as I've gotten older, the less and
Speaker 3: less closed female artists have on just in any like
Speaker 3: the only girls that are still really seeing like fully
Speaker 3: dressed or like country singers girls still got closed. Everybody
Speaker 3: else about half naked. And I was like, okay, when
Speaker 3: we can get to the point where you can listen
Speaker 3: to a woman perform a song.
Speaker 2: And she and.
Speaker 3: Something in her titties aren't out her asses and not
Speaker 3: just literally fully dressed, then it's just like okay, because
Speaker 3: if it was because also, there's a lot of ugly
Speaker 3: male rappers, a lot of them. Yeah, facts, there are no,
Speaker 3: there are no ugly female rappers.
Speaker 2: None.
Speaker 1: Hang on, let me think, hang on, let me think,
Speaker 1: let me see. Yeah, they all yeah, all eights eights
Speaker 1: are better. It's a lot of fours with the male rappers.
Speaker 2: Negative sixes is out here in the.
Speaker 1: World, but they'll say, you don't think that. Wat being
Speaker 1: performed at the Grammys was like this major moment for
Speaker 1: sex positivity.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, it was absolute, and it was interesting to see
Speaker 3: the Watts uh freak out to the point that they
Speaker 3: were having like medical professionals interviewing them like well, is
Speaker 3: this the thing? Like, well, no, actually, if if this
Speaker 3: is happening to you, then intident disorder.
Speaker 2: Bitch.
Speaker 3: You're not gonna sit up on a white man's Internet
Speaker 3: and tell me that a wet pussy is a disorder.
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna do this. I'm not gonna listen to
Speaker 3: this nonsense. We're not gonna No, I'm a Christian, I'm
Speaker 3: not gonna listen to this. So it was crazy to
Speaker 3: see people just short circuit over this song because like
Speaker 3: I remember the first time I heard it and I
Speaker 3: just was like, I don't think I'm old enough to
Speaker 3: listen to this song.
Speaker 2: Truly, I need adult supervision. This song needs to come.
Speaker 3: I was like, oh, this is why parental advisory stickers
Speaker 3: were invented, because they were like, well, our children, I'm
Speaker 3: just like, listen, it is not TV's responsibility to raise
Speaker 3: your child, period, and like, well, we'll look up to
Speaker 3: them as role models. And I was like, if your
Speaker 3: children aren't being provided with better role models than Cardi B,
Speaker 3: there's something going on. There's nothing wrong in your house.
Speaker 1: So Chelsea, as we wrap up here, who should we
Speaker 1: be listening to? Now? Who's the furture of the women's
Speaker 1: Who's the furture of black women's female hip hop?
Speaker 5: I love Flamilli, I love pre Runway. I am Dochi.
Speaker 4: Sweetie.
Speaker 5: I feel like is like gonna have like she she's
Speaker 5: about to hit that atmospheric stage.
Speaker 4: I feel like that we were talking about.
Speaker 1: She's coming around the corner too. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5: She's dropped that dead weight and yeah, I feel like
Speaker 5: those ones. Those are the ones that I listened to mostly.
Speaker 5: And then of course like Megan, I feel like she
Speaker 5: hasn't really hit like that big, big, you know stage yet,
Speaker 5: but I feel like.
Speaker 1: It's like at the Grammys. I think that's the next thing.
Speaker 1: You know. It'll be interesting though, because I feel like
Speaker 1: last year was kind of a mulligan because of COVID.
Speaker 1: That is no touring, and touring is just as important
Speaker 1: to female artists, to musicians in general, but to really
Speaker 1: tour a single, that's a very very important part of
Speaker 1: being able to become atmospheric and go to that next level. Well,
Speaker 1: this was a fun conversation. We didn't even get a
Speaker 1: chance to talk about. Then white women rappers out in Oakland?
Speaker 2: Are you talking about be Nasty?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah. V Nasty got canceled? And then what's the
Speaker 3: girl that did the Gucci Gucci song?
Speaker 2: And then I think she had.
Speaker 4: Like a remix with Australia.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well we we and we never got to talk
Speaker 3: about Iggy Azelia.
Speaker 2: That might be Australia. Australia listen, listen.
Speaker 1: The shades coming out at the end was just that was.
Speaker 4: An Azalia Bank special. She came up with that.
Speaker 2: That is one hundred percent praise God, you think her
Speaker 2: for it?
Speaker 3: Murder business, d murder business was great. And then she
Speaker 3: started going on like the press tour and then she
Speaker 3: started talking and everybody.
Speaker 2: Went, oh, you fwhere.
Speaker 3: Like Keith Urban is Australian And that's still confusing to
Speaker 3: me as well, right, but we let it ride. But
Speaker 3: Iggy Azalea, listen, when we found out she was Australian
Speaker 3: and everybody dropped her like a hot rock and t
Speaker 3: I just had to go, I'm sorry, friend, and just
Speaker 3: let her go. If she'd have been from Atlanta, she'd
Speaker 3: have been fine. She'd have been fine. If she was
Speaker 3: from any She could have been from Wisconsin and we
Speaker 3: would allow to Montana, North Dakota. We don't care. We
Speaker 3: might have gave her Canada, Australia now.
Speaker 1: Next time, the next duels saying will do white femalecs.
Speaker 3: Ha listen, I love the Nasty And then she kept
Speaker 3: getting trouble for saying the inn word and she was
Speaker 3: just like, but my friend said, we're like when I
Speaker 3: playing no, and she's like, but we're like no, and
Speaker 3: she just would not stop saying it and she got canceled.
Speaker 2: But cray Sean was fun.
Speaker 3: I'm just like, yeah, this girl's got about two years
Speaker 3: and it's going to be back at that office depot.
Speaker 1: Well, v Nasty lived up to her name. I can't
Speaker 1: thank you all enough for joining me and leading me
Speaker 1: and the listeners through this wonderful, wonderful journey. Female MC's
Speaker 1: and hip hop Chelsea Williamson Daily Show, Deep Dive, thank you,
Speaker 1: Dulce Sloan as always. You can see Dulce on The
Speaker 1: Daily Show and you can see Chelsea's great work on
Speaker 1: The Daily Show every single night. I'm Roy Virginir. This
Speaker 1: has been beyond the Scenes. We just went beyond the scenes.
Speaker 1: We did it. Now we're back in the present. Gucci
Speaker 1: Gucci Gucci Gucci fifty fifty product. Listen to The Daily
Speaker 1: Show Beyond the Scenes on Apple Podcasts, the iHeartRadio app,
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts. I wanna go even
Speaker 1: further beyond the Scenes. Check out the video version of
Speaker 1: Beyond the Scenes on The Daily Show's YouTube page.
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Speaker 1: This has been a Comedy Central podcast