1
00:00:00,640 --> 00:00:03,559
Speaker 1: Since the initial release of our coverage of Troy Coleman's case,

2
00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:06,480
Speaker 1: attorney Joseph Moron has joined Troy's team and was able

3
00:00:06,519 --> 00:00:09,000
Speaker 1: to gain access to the original homicide File or h

4
00:00:09,080 --> 00:00:12,160
Speaker 1: file and the Brady material. It's so significant that we

5
00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:15,520
Speaker 1: had to rearrange this episode to accommodate the new evidence,

6
00:00:15,760 --> 00:00:19,640
Speaker 1: which is inserted throughout. Troy has always maintained his innocence,

7
00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:22,360
Speaker 1: but has never said a word about Darren Johnson and

8
00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:26,360
Speaker 1: Byron Johnson's involvement in this case until they themselves came

9
00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:30,760
Speaker 1: forward supporting his claims at the time of our first release. Now,

10
00:00:31,120 --> 00:00:34,320
Speaker 1: with their admissions, as well as previously discovered Brady material

11
00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:38,080
Speaker 1: and this new homicide file evidence, we can finally see

12
00:00:38,120 --> 00:00:40,920
Speaker 1: a clearer picture of what really happened to Kevin Jones,

13
00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:44,960
Speaker 1: as well as subsequently what happened to mister Troy Coleman.

14
00:00:47,640 --> 00:00:50,800
Speaker 1: Troy Coleman split his formative years between California and the

15
00:00:50,840 --> 00:00:54,840
Speaker 1: middle class Philadelphia neighborhood of Mount Airy, but while in Philly,

16
00:00:55,120 --> 00:00:57,480
Speaker 1: he attended a poor high school in Germantown, where he

17
00:00:57,560 --> 00:01:02,760
Speaker 1: met Byron Johnson, Kareem Nobles, and Darren Keith Johnson. After

18
00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:06,000
Speaker 1: Troy graduated Byron and Kareem with a muscle behind a

19
00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:10,400
Speaker 1: cocaine operation that they all ran out of Troy's apartment. However,

20
00:01:10,800 --> 00:01:13,240
Speaker 1: a drug drought in the summer of nineteen eighty nine

21
00:01:13,319 --> 00:01:17,360
Speaker 1: gave way to desperate behavior all over Philly. While Troy

22
00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:20,280
Speaker 1: was away in Atlantic City, on a September twenty sixth,

23
00:01:20,319 --> 00:01:23,480
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty nine, Kareem set up a deal with two men,

24
00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:28,000
Speaker 1: Kevin Jones and Arthur Sanders. Sanders claimed to have waited

25
00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:30,760
Speaker 1: down the block while Kevin Jones drove to Troy's apartment

26
00:01:30,760 --> 00:01:34,720
Speaker 1: and his Gray Dodge with forty thousand dollars to buy cocaine. Then,

27
00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:38,360
Speaker 1: after about ninety minutes, two other men allegedly drove past

28
00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:41,800
Speaker 1: Sanders in Jones's gray Dodge, a light skin driver and

29
00:01:41,840 --> 00:01:44,400
Speaker 1: a dark skinned passenger wearing a hat with the brim

30
00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:47,720
Speaker 1: pole down low. There's new evidence that indicates that the

31
00:01:47,800 --> 00:01:51,120
Speaker 1: victim was alive at this time. Nearly two months later,

32
00:01:51,400 --> 00:01:54,920
Speaker 1: Jones's body was discovered in the gray Dodge, beaten bound

33
00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:58,880
Speaker 1: and shot. Arthur Sanders agreed that Troy Coleman's photo looked

34
00:01:59,040 --> 00:02:02,160
Speaker 1: like the passenger who allegedly drove by him. Two months earlier.

35
00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:06,440
Speaker 1: This shaky id, along with Darren Keith Johnson's coerced and

36
00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:12,000
Speaker 1: incentivized false testimony, sent Troy away for life. Despite Darren's recantation,

37
00:02:12,280 --> 00:02:15,320
Speaker 1: Byron Johnson's confession to being the actual passenger that day,

38
00:02:15,520 --> 00:02:19,320
Speaker 1: and some explosive New Brady material, Troy continues to serve

39
00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:21,600
Speaker 1: life for a crime which he was not even in

40
00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:42,520
Speaker 1: Philadelphia to commit. This is wrongful conviction. Welcome back to

41
00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:45,800
Speaker 1: wrongful conviction with Jason Flomm. That's me. And today we

42
00:02:45,880 --> 00:02:49,160
Speaker 1: have a story that I think is going to rock

43
00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:52,640
Speaker 1: your world in a different kind of way right because

44
00:02:53,160 --> 00:02:56,720
Speaker 1: the person that we're interviewing today, Troy Coleman, has been

45
00:02:56,720 --> 00:02:59,440
Speaker 1: incarcerated for thirty one years in Pennsylvania for a crime

46
00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:02,760
Speaker 1: he didn't commit. That being said, he wasn't a choir boy.

47
00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:04,399
Speaker 1: Some of the people we have on the show where

48
00:03:04,600 --> 00:03:08,360
Speaker 1: literal acchoir people before they were arrested. But he is

49
00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:10,720
Speaker 1: innocent of this crime. He wasn't even the same city

50
00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:15,040
Speaker 1: when it happened, or state for that matter. So Troy's

51
00:03:15,080 --> 00:03:19,000
Speaker 1: on the phone from prison, Troy, I'm glad you're here,

52
00:03:19,000 --> 00:03:21,240
Speaker 1: but I'm sorry you have to be here under these circumstances.

53
00:03:21,639 --> 00:03:22,720
Speaker 2: Good afternoon, how are you.

54
00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:23,560
Speaker 1: I'm good?

55
00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:23,960
Speaker 3: Thank you.

56
00:03:24,040 --> 00:03:27,840
Speaker 1: And with Troy is Jerry Brown, not the former governor

57
00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:32,240
Speaker 1: of California, but an esteemed attorney from Philadelphia. Thank you

58
00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:35,480
Speaker 1: for joining us on the show today, Jason Pleas, let's

59
00:03:35,560 --> 00:03:40,160
Speaker 1: go back Troy. You grew up in a middle class environment, right.

60
00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:43,840
Speaker 2: I grew up in Mount Are, Philadelphia, which is a

61
00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:48,040
Speaker 2: middle class neighborhood, and I was blessed to live with

62
00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:52,120
Speaker 2: my grandmother, who was well all. We had a beautiful home,

63
00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:55,560
Speaker 2: bedroom home, and you know, everyone who came from that

64
00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:59,440
Speaker 2: home came to be very successful, although went to private school,

65
00:03:59,520 --> 00:04:03,480
Speaker 2: even my father. And my father moved to California. And

66
00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:06,360
Speaker 2: when he moved to California, I was going back and

67
00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:09,720
Speaker 2: forth from California to Philadelphia from my grandmother house, which

68
00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:13,560
Speaker 2: California school curriculum, our junior high curriculum was equal to

69
00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:16,840
Speaker 2: a high school curriculum here in Philadelphia. But you know,

70
00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:19,800
Speaker 2: when I came back to high school here in Phillyppia

71
00:04:19,839 --> 00:04:22,479
Speaker 2: Germantown High School, I was looked at it as kind

72
00:04:22,480 --> 00:04:25,960
Speaker 2: of dirty. I guess, you know, because the academic type

73
00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:28,080
Speaker 2: guess that we came with versus where was over here

74
00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:31,080
Speaker 2: in Philadelphia, and you know, you try your best to

75
00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:34,640
Speaker 2: fit in and you want to be accepted. That's where

76
00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:37,560
Speaker 2: a lot of my de minds came from when I

77
00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:41,640
Speaker 2: got involved with drugs, not needing to, didn't have to,

78
00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:44,640
Speaker 2: you know. Again, my family was well to do, however,

79
00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:46,560
Speaker 2: you know, just to sit in and be a part

80
00:04:46,600 --> 00:04:49,680
Speaker 2: of this particular neighborhood that was in Germantown, which is

81
00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:53,040
Speaker 2: a little bit once of a good lifestyle. I didn't

82
00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:54,840
Speaker 2: live down here. It was a little more lower class

83
00:04:55,360 --> 00:04:58,200
Speaker 2: again from Mount Area. So when I started boxing the day,

84
00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:01,440
Speaker 2: just being down there in the how a couple of

85
00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:05,480
Speaker 2: them guys from brand the neighborhood. After that, subsequently I

86
00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:08,320
Speaker 2: got invoved with him with the about the age of

87
00:05:08,800 --> 00:05:12,640
Speaker 2: seventeen sixteen. We started out young, one the corners till

88
00:05:13,120 --> 00:05:13,880
Speaker 2: that's when it began.

89
00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:17,680
Speaker 1: So this must have put you on the radar of

90
00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:20,400
Speaker 1: the local police. And we know that in that time

91
00:05:20,520 --> 00:05:23,960
Speaker 1: and place, this was a culture that it started with

92
00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:27,520
Speaker 1: Frank Rizzo, who as the police chief in Philadelphia from

93
00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:30,479
Speaker 1: sixty eight to seventy one. The legacy of brutality and

94
00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:33,480
Speaker 1: corruption is widely known, and it thrived in the police

95
00:05:33,520 --> 00:05:36,919
Speaker 1: department after he became mayor. It's really crazy that that

96
00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:39,240
Speaker 1: guy became mayor. But seventy two to eighty, and they

97
00:05:39,240 --> 00:05:41,480
Speaker 1: were just beating the shit out of everybody back then,

98
00:05:41,560 --> 00:05:44,360
Speaker 1: and it's really it's crazy that this was a major

99
00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:47,960
Speaker 1: American city. So, Jerry, you were a college student at

100
00:05:47,960 --> 00:05:51,840
Speaker 1: the University of Pennsylvania at that time and you experienced

101
00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:54,080
Speaker 1: or were at least aware of this. Right, This is

102
00:05:54,120 --> 00:05:55,400
Speaker 1: not hyperbole, right.

103
00:05:55,279 --> 00:05:58,520
Speaker 4: Oh no, if you had a little bit of long

104
00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:01,200
Speaker 4: hair like I did, every time you walk down the

105
00:06:01,279 --> 00:06:03,600
Speaker 4: street at night, you were afraid that you were going

106
00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:05,679
Speaker 4: to stop and hassled by the police.

107
00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:08,360
Speaker 5: And I'm sure for people of color it was much worse.

108
00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:11,479
Speaker 1: In my research, I mean, these were in the thirty

109
00:06:11,560 --> 00:06:14,840
Speaker 1: ninth District, right, a section of North Philadelphia, which was

110
00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:19,120
Speaker 1: a working class, poor black neighborhood. Police routinely made false arrests,

111
00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:22,560
Speaker 1: planted drugs, robbed victims, and filed bogus reports to cover

112
00:06:22,680 --> 00:06:25,839
Speaker 1: up their actions. So all of this is known now,

113
00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:29,560
Speaker 1: it's been documented. This is not us just having ah

114
00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:32,680
Speaker 1: there's a trip down a very ugly memory lane right here.

115
00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:36,520
Speaker 5: In fact, there were fourteen hundred convictions that were overturned

116
00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:38,960
Speaker 5: due to the thirty ninth district. But they're not the

117
00:06:39,000 --> 00:06:42,479
Speaker 5: only ones. There was the one squad cases, the five

118
00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:46,720
Speaker 5: squad cases. I mean, there's been a history in Philadelphia,

119
00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:49,520
Speaker 5: you know, and then in the nineties you have one

120
00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:52,479
Speaker 5: of the cops that was involved in this case, Martin Devlin.

121
00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:55,159
Speaker 5: The number of cases have been overturned because of him.

122
00:06:55,360 --> 00:06:58,360
Speaker 5: It's a very sordid history, right.

123
00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:01,479
Speaker 1: So this of course brings me back to another person

124
00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:03,240
Speaker 1: who was wrong for the convictor who's been on our show,

125
00:07:03,279 --> 00:07:07,000
Speaker 1: Tony Wright, which was ironically the same cop that was

126
00:07:07,040 --> 00:07:10,560
Speaker 1: involved in Troy's case, Martin Devlin. And in the article

127
00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:13,160
Speaker 1: of Rolling Stone magazine about Tony's case, there was a

128
00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:16,800
Speaker 1: pull quote that said that in the nineteen eighties or nineties,

129
00:07:16,920 --> 00:07:18,840
Speaker 1: a black man had a better chance of getting justice

130
00:07:18,960 --> 00:07:22,680
Speaker 1: in Philadelphia, Mississippi than in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. So let's go

131
00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:25,920
Speaker 1: to that and of course, Troy, this of course, what

132
00:07:26,080 --> 00:07:29,240
Speaker 1: led up to this, I think indirectly is the fact

133
00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:31,920
Speaker 1: that you were involved, as you've been very honest about,

134
00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:34,800
Speaker 1: in the cocaine business. Can you tell us about that

135
00:07:35,080 --> 00:07:38,400
Speaker 1: and the people that were working under you at the time,

136
00:07:38,520 --> 00:07:41,720
Speaker 1: because they come to play a role in your wrongful conviction.

137
00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:44,240
Speaker 2: Well, when we got involved, it was a couple of

138
00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:47,800
Speaker 2: guys from that neighborhood, particularly down cross the street. And

139
00:07:47,840 --> 00:07:50,840
Speaker 2: this is actual. He's called the Jungle. Some of the

140
00:07:50,880 --> 00:07:55,000
Speaker 2: guys that's involved, Barmi Johnson, Gary Keith Johnson, Raymond Noble's

141
00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:58,640
Speaker 2: in his street meet was dream. My street meeting at

142
00:07:58,680 --> 00:08:03,080
Speaker 2: the time was caussing his with his Kareem So he

143
00:08:03,160 --> 00:08:04,960
Speaker 2: was an older guy, he just got out of jail

144
00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:07,440
Speaker 2: and all this time everybody looked up to him as

145
00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:08,960
Speaker 2: the tough, gut height and so on and so forth.

146
00:08:09,400 --> 00:08:11,840
Speaker 2: To me, it was like comparative that I get them involved.

147
00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:14,360
Speaker 2: It's somewhat for the muscle as well as Byron.

148
00:08:14,560 --> 00:08:20,640
Speaker 5: So you had Byron Johnson, Darren Johnson and Kareem Nobles

149
00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:23,000
Speaker 5: were your underlings. They worked for you.

150
00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:26,560
Speaker 2: Yes, I guess my little intellect being involved in that

151
00:08:26,800 --> 00:08:30,920
Speaker 2: allowed me to shoot up fast. So I had a

152
00:08:30,920 --> 00:08:34,040
Speaker 2: little apartment down in Mars Street. Plaski Town is what

153
00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:36,240
Speaker 2: they called Aeron. But we had an apartment in Pulaski

154
00:08:36,320 --> 00:08:38,880
Speaker 2: Town and it was just for you know, fun, dealing

155
00:08:38,880 --> 00:08:41,120
Speaker 2: with the drug stuff, girls and all that. The Rayman

156
00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:44,560
Speaker 2: Nobles Koree was actually staying in my apartment live in

157
00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:47,120
Speaker 2: Mount Area. I still had that place in Byron. The

158
00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:49,840
Speaker 2: keys to the apartment kareem at keys to the apartment,

159
00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:53,240
Speaker 2: so people had access to it. At that time when

160
00:08:53,240 --> 00:08:55,920
Speaker 2: I was driving BMW's had a nice amount of money

161
00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:59,040
Speaker 2: and I was okay. However, these guys that were working

162
00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:03,560
Speaker 2: for me, okay until a drought came in nineteen eighty nine.

163
00:09:04,040 --> 00:09:07,440
Speaker 2: Rout is when there's thot drugs, particularly cocaine of elbow

164
00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:09,520
Speaker 2: at that time. And this was a well known time

165
00:09:09,600 --> 00:09:13,680
Speaker 2: because homicideal rose significantly at that time. So when this

166
00:09:13,760 --> 00:09:16,920
Speaker 2: drought came about, I was okay these guys, I didn't

167
00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:20,000
Speaker 2: have anything for him. So they actually ran them up

168
00:09:20,080 --> 00:09:21,800
Speaker 2: for lack of running fleet. They just ran them up.

169
00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:24,080
Speaker 2: They was just doing all kinds of puny stuff. And

170
00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:27,520
Speaker 2: this day in particularly in which this crime happened, myself

171
00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:30,439
Speaker 2: and another gentleman by the name of Richard Crawford. That

172
00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:33,760
Speaker 2: morning of September twenty sixth we went to Atlantic City.

173
00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:35,800
Speaker 2: And when I was in Atlantic City, I think I

174
00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:39,240
Speaker 2: had no more than nine ounces of cocaine left, and

175
00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:42,640
Speaker 2: I actually, you know, trusted claim to deal with that

176
00:09:42,720 --> 00:09:45,960
Speaker 2: while I was gone. And when I left on the

177
00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:50,240
Speaker 2: twenty six We get to Atlantic City. That morning, was gambling,

178
00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:54,200
Speaker 2: taking insights, you know, shopping, talking to all that other stuff,

179
00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:58,040
Speaker 2: to girls whatever. So I was very intoxicated. I wasn't

180
00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:00,319
Speaker 2: willing to drive back to the city, so that night

181
00:10:00,559 --> 00:10:02,240
Speaker 2: we checked the two hotel.

182
00:10:02,520 --> 00:10:05,920
Speaker 1: Okay, So you were in Atlantic City having fun, intoxicated,

183
00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:07,880
Speaker 1: so drunk in fact, that you had a hard time

184
00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:11,040
Speaker 1: even remembering where you had checked in and under what name.

185
00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:14,719
Speaker 1: And then eventually the prosecution presented evidence that you had

186
00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:17,840
Speaker 1: stayed at Bally's under your own name, using your shaky

187
00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:21,240
Speaker 1: memory to impeach your alibi, which makes no sense. They

188
00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:24,240
Speaker 1: impeach your memory of your alibi with evidence of your alibi,

189
00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:27,480
Speaker 1: But why let evidence of your innocence stop them from

190
00:10:27,480 --> 00:10:28,200
Speaker 1: prosecuting you?

191
00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:28,480
Speaker 2: Right?

192
00:10:28,600 --> 00:10:31,560
Speaker 1: In fact, what we now know is that the state

193
00:10:31,760 --> 00:10:36,000
Speaker 1: was in possession of even more exculpatory evidence, but we'll

194
00:10:36,040 --> 00:10:38,800
Speaker 1: get to that in just a bit. So anyway, the

195
00:10:38,840 --> 00:10:40,880
Speaker 1: crime itself while you were in Atlantic City. Back at

196
00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:43,800
Speaker 1: the apartment in Philadelphia on September twenty sixth, nineteen eighty nine,

197
00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:45,920
Speaker 1: Kareem had set up a deal with Kevin Jones and

198
00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:48,800
Speaker 1: Arthur Sanders. Now, according to Sanders, he and Jones. Kevin

199
00:10:48,880 --> 00:10:50,920
Speaker 1: Jones arrived in the area of the apartment of separate

200
00:10:50,920 --> 00:10:53,800
Speaker 1: cars around one thirty pm with forty thousand dollars to

201
00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:57,440
Speaker 1: buy cocaine. According to Sanders, while he waged down the block,

202
00:10:57,920 --> 00:11:01,000
Speaker 1: Jones continued alone to the apartment in Gray Dodge. Then,

203
00:11:01,400 --> 00:11:04,000
Speaker 1: about an hour and a half later, Sanders allegedly saw

204
00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:06,560
Speaker 1: two men driving the Gray Dodge past him, a light

205
00:11:06,600 --> 00:11:08,760
Speaker 1: skinned man driving and a darker skinned man with the

206
00:11:08,760 --> 00:11:11,079
Speaker 1: brim of his hat pulled down low at the passenger seat.

207
00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:16,880
Speaker 1: This is who Sanders misidentified as being Troy. However, in

208
00:11:17,040 --> 00:11:21,240
Speaker 1: twenty nineteen, Byron Johnson admitted to being that passenger, right

209
00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:24,400
Speaker 1: that Kareem had hired him to move a body back.

210
00:11:24,440 --> 00:11:27,760
Speaker 1: At this point in nineteen eighty nine, it is unclear

211
00:11:27,800 --> 00:11:30,800
Speaker 1: whether Kareem or Byron even knew that Kevin Jones was

212
00:11:30,840 --> 00:11:33,319
Speaker 1: still alive in the trunk. And we'll get to how

213
00:11:33,320 --> 00:11:35,280
Speaker 1: we know that in just a bit. It's dramatic, so

214
00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:39,400
Speaker 1: stay tuned. That night, though, the Jones family came to

215
00:11:39,440 --> 00:11:42,880
Speaker 1: Troy's apartment armed looking for Kevin Jones. They threatened Troy's

216
00:11:42,880 --> 00:11:46,520
Speaker 1: girlfriend searched the apartment, but no sign of Kevin at

217
00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:48,960
Speaker 1: this point, Troy, Well, you had no way of knowing

218
00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:50,640
Speaker 1: it yet, but you were in a lot of trouble.

219
00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:53,240
Speaker 1: And I'm not talking about with the cops. The cops

220
00:11:53,440 --> 00:11:56,520
Speaker 1: actually kind of ironically inadvertently saved you.

221
00:11:57,040 --> 00:11:59,480
Speaker 2: I got that to put off. The next day, I

222
00:11:59,559 --> 00:12:01,600
Speaker 2: was stop by the police. You know, had my license

223
00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:04,719
Speaker 2: and registration, everything was legit, but they found a bag

224
00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:06,760
Speaker 2: of marijuana in the car, and that might have been

225
00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:09,480
Speaker 2: a good thing, because I got arrested that evening. I

226
00:12:09,480 --> 00:12:11,880
Speaker 2: want I call it home, and that's when I heard everything,

227
00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:14,880
Speaker 2: everybody saying, these guys are looking for you if you

228
00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:17,440
Speaker 2: stated and want to kiked. So when I was built out,

229
00:12:17,520 --> 00:12:20,160
Speaker 2: my girlfriend at the time as well as my mother

230
00:12:20,720 --> 00:12:23,280
Speaker 2: had bags in the car and the ticket to me.

231
00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:27,960
Speaker 2: And that's that very next day, I was in California.

232
00:12:28,040 --> 00:12:30,440
Speaker 1: Even though you had nothing to do with this, You've

233
00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:32,520
Speaker 1: got to leave town for California just to be safe

234
00:12:32,559 --> 00:12:34,560
Speaker 1: from the Joneses. So you bailed out and hopped on

235
00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:37,000
Speaker 1: a flight on September twenty ninth. Now, between the time

236
00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:39,280
Speaker 1: of the abduction and when the body was discovered, Kareem

237
00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:43,559
Speaker 1: aka Raymond Nobles died. Call me crazy but it might

238
00:12:43,559 --> 00:12:47,040
Speaker 1: have had something to do with the Joneses anyway. So now,

239
00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:50,280
Speaker 1: November twenty first, nineteen nine, the police discovered Kevin Jones's

240
00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:51,800
Speaker 1: body in the trunk of the Gray Dodge and the

241
00:12:51,880 --> 00:12:55,320
Speaker 1: john want to make her parking lot at Abington Township. Now,

242
00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:59,080
Speaker 1: by that time the body was badly decomposing, but it

243
00:12:59,120 --> 00:13:01,560
Speaker 1: was clear that his was struck with a blunt object

244
00:13:01,640 --> 00:13:05,640
Speaker 1: several times and then one, and this is important, one

245
00:13:06,400 --> 00:13:10,200
Speaker 1: hard contact, high velocity gun shot wound was the cause

246
00:13:10,240 --> 00:13:13,320
Speaker 1: of death. And we'll get to why that's important in

247
00:13:13,360 --> 00:13:17,880
Speaker 1: a little bit. The body was bound with electrical cord, blankets, sheets,

248
00:13:17,880 --> 00:13:22,119
Speaker 1: and some insulation. The police chemist Lewis Joka, later testified

249
00:13:22,280 --> 00:13:26,400
Speaker 1: matched items from Troy's apartment. So the investigation began, and

250
00:13:26,480 --> 00:13:29,840
Speaker 1: initially while under pressure from both the Jones family and

251
00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:36,480
Speaker 1: the notoriously like unbelievably like hopelessly terrifyingly corrupt Detective Martin Devlin,

252
00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:39,679
Speaker 1: Arthur Sanders was the first to implicate Troy.

253
00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:43,680
Speaker 5: According to him, never seen Troy before, and he's sitting

254
00:13:43,679 --> 00:13:46,439
Speaker 5: there waiting for now, and he suddenly a car comes by. Now,

255
00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:49,320
Speaker 5: when you I mean, just logically, when you think about it,

256
00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:51,360
Speaker 5: if suddenly you see a car. First of all, you go,

257
00:13:51,600 --> 00:13:54,520
Speaker 5: you know, that car looks familiar, and then in your

258
00:13:54,559 --> 00:13:58,080
Speaker 5: mind you go, oh, yeah, that looks like it's Kevin's car.

259
00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:01,640
Speaker 5: And then he looks at the driver and says, that's

260
00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:04,200
Speaker 5: not Kevin. It's a light skin guy. Then he looks

261
00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:06,920
Speaker 5: at the passenger who has his hat over his head,

262
00:14:07,800 --> 00:14:10,520
Speaker 5: and he's able to identify him. Now, all this is

263
00:14:10,559 --> 00:14:15,320
Speaker 5: happening in two or three seconds. According to Sanders's testimony.

264
00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:18,040
Speaker 2: Office said just said that the passenger, he said he

265
00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:21,440
Speaker 2: had a baseball cap on, pulled down over his foreheads,

266
00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:24,760
Speaker 2: slouched in the seat, and in a photo where he said,

267
00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:27,880
Speaker 2: I look like the passenger putting me in the city

268
00:14:27,880 --> 00:14:30,160
Speaker 2: at the time. However, I'm in the Atlantic City. It's

269
00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:31,840
Speaker 2: a possible identification to me.

270
00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:35,960
Speaker 5: Devlin certainly was willing to do something like this to

271
00:14:36,040 --> 00:14:39,480
Speaker 5: create false evidence, because he's done it on multiple occasions,

272
00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:42,480
Speaker 5: as you all know, And so he probably said, isn't

273
00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:45,360
Speaker 5: this the guy. He's being pressured by the police to

274
00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:47,960
Speaker 5: give up somebody on the one hand, he's being pressured

275
00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:51,400
Speaker 5: by the family on the other, and you know, he says, yeah,

276
00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:54,960
Speaker 5: that looks like the guy, and you know, Sanders is

277
00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:58,360
Speaker 5: pretty scared to death anyway, because the family is really

278
00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:02,200
Speaker 5: upset with him. This is an element that's not unwilling

279
00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:06,600
Speaker 5: to use gunplay if necessary. That's kind of the background

280
00:15:06,640 --> 00:15:09,840
Speaker 5: of all this and part of the reason why Arthur Sanders'

281
00:15:09,880 --> 00:15:12,800
Speaker 5: statement is so flaky, if you will.

282
00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:16,080
Speaker 1: And from what I understand, Sanders had Kevin Jones' pager

283
00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:18,120
Speaker 1: and keys in his possession when Kevin went missing, so

284
00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:21,160
Speaker 1: he probably wanted to direct attention away from himself. Now

285
00:15:21,520 --> 00:15:24,360
Speaker 1: I've been saying allegedly every time I mentioned this passing

286
00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:27,320
Speaker 1: great dodge slightly because it may never have actually happened.

287
00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:30,800
Speaker 1: But even if it did, there's an explanation for the misidentification.

288
00:15:31,400 --> 00:15:35,240
Speaker 1: Troy and Byron look somewhat similar. Now let me be clear,

289
00:15:35,280 --> 00:15:37,760
Speaker 1: I'm not just some white dude over here giving cross

290
00:15:37,880 --> 00:15:42,720
Speaker 1: racial misidentification. Troy, you could back me up here, right, yes, John,

291
00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:46,840
Speaker 1: Now you two don't look exactly alike and not twins,

292
00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:50,120
Speaker 1: but enough to say they look like one another. And

293
00:15:50,120 --> 00:15:53,360
Speaker 1: that's what Arthur Sanders ended up saying. And that's when

294
00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:55,880
Speaker 1: he's trying to identify someone with his hat pulled down

295
00:15:55,920 --> 00:15:58,240
Speaker 1: low for less than three seconds behind glass in a

296
00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:01,080
Speaker 1: car that's passing by over twenty miles an hour. That's

297
00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:04,520
Speaker 1: if we even accept that this passing grade Dodge identification

298
00:16:04,680 --> 00:16:08,160
Speaker 1: even ever happened. It's also entirely possible that this was

299
00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:11,680
Speaker 1: just a complete fabrication from either Devlon Sanders or both

300
00:16:11,840 --> 00:16:14,600
Speaker 1: to direct the attention Steer the attention Toy Troy, who

301
00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:17,480
Speaker 1: was a known entity to police and whose apartment was involved.

302
00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:20,240
Speaker 1: But they knew he was in Atlantic City, and then

303
00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:23,160
Speaker 1: they knew he went to California as well. Now, according

304
00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:26,480
Speaker 1: to police, Byron Johnson was a prime suspect from day one,

305
00:16:26,600 --> 00:16:29,160
Speaker 1: and they maybe, I don't know, maybe they thought they

306
00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:32,160
Speaker 1: could get Troy to flip on him. We're not sure

307
00:16:32,200 --> 00:16:34,400
Speaker 1: and we'll probably never know, but that would never happen.

308
00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:36,720
Speaker 1: Troy was not flipping on anybody. And anyway, Troy was

309
00:16:36,760 --> 00:16:39,640
Speaker 1: in California, so he wasn't even available to be pressured

310
00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:42,640
Speaker 1: to give up his friends. But that didn't change when

311
00:16:42,680 --> 00:16:46,800
Speaker 1: he came back either or for the following thirty long years.

312
00:16:47,560 --> 00:16:50,360
Speaker 1: But back in nineteen eighty nine, with only Arthur Sanders's

313
00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:53,680
Speaker 1: shaky I D, the police needed something more for probable

314
00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:55,120
Speaker 1: cause to arrest Troy.

315
00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:59,880
Speaker 5: Now that they are focusing on Troy Coleman, they start

316
00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:05,040
Speaker 5: focusing on his associates, one of whom is Darren Keith Johnson,

317
00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:09,800
Speaker 5: who was a eighteen year old five foot three, one

318
00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:15,359
Speaker 5: hundred and twenty five pounds, soaking wet youth, essentially who's

319
00:17:15,359 --> 00:17:18,719
Speaker 5: brought into homicide and who first says, I don't know

320
00:17:18,800 --> 00:17:23,199
Speaker 5: anything about anything, and then they proceed to scare the

321
00:17:23,240 --> 00:17:25,720
Speaker 5: hell out of him by saying, we know you do,

322
00:17:27,040 --> 00:17:30,040
Speaker 5: and the homicide cops pressured him to give a statement.

323
00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:33,400
Speaker 5: They told him that if he didn't give a statement

324
00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:36,159
Speaker 5: that he was going to go to jail. He wouldn't

325
00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:38,960
Speaker 5: see his mother again. I'm sure they told him that

326
00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:42,119
Speaker 5: if he went to prison that he would be molested

327
00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:44,600
Speaker 5: there because he was so small. He told him that

328
00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:48,480
Speaker 5: they didn't want the dead guy, Kareem Nobles. Detective Cohen said,

329
00:17:48,560 --> 00:17:51,359
Speaker 5: we think that he was involved, but we want Troy

330
00:17:51,720 --> 00:17:56,280
Speaker 5: because this apartment was rented by Troy. So he's scared

331
00:17:56,320 --> 00:18:00,480
Speaker 5: to death and he finally gives up Troy. Darren Johnson says, yeah,

332
00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:02,800
Speaker 5: Troy admitted to me he had to lay somebody down.

333
00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:06,880
Speaker 5: Those two pieces of evidence Arthur Sanders sort of ID

334
00:18:07,320 --> 00:18:10,280
Speaker 5: and Darren Johnson now they have enough to get an

335
00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:11,080
Speaker 5: arrest warrant.

336
00:18:11,359 --> 00:18:14,560
Speaker 1: And this is from Darren Johnson's statement about what Troy

337
00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:18,080
Speaker 1: allegedly told him. And now I'm gonna quote, okay ready,

338
00:18:19,240 --> 00:18:23,040
Speaker 1: quote I had to lay somebody down over some drugs.

339
00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:24,800
Speaker 1: Let me tell you how.

340
00:18:24,640 --> 00:18:25,080
Speaker 2: I did it.

341
00:18:25,119 --> 00:18:27,120
Speaker 1: I put my gun up to him and told him

342
00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:29,760
Speaker 1: to give it up. I shot him two to the

343
00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:33,560
Speaker 1: head end quote. Now, not only is this statement not

344
00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:36,399
Speaker 1: specific to the victim, Kevin Jones, but it also has

345
00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:41,119
Speaker 1: a very important hallmark of false statements, which is factually

346
00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:45,120
Speaker 1: inaccurate information. As I mentioned earlier, Kevin Jones was shot

347
00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:47,919
Speaker 1: once according to the medical examiner a trial, not twice.

348
00:18:47,960 --> 00:18:50,879
Speaker 1: And from what I understand, they used both the carrot

349
00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:55,600
Speaker 1: and the stick to get this statement from Darren. Subsequently,

350
00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:58,720
Speaker 1: and this will surprise exactly no one in our audience,

351
00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:01,919
Speaker 1: he received leaning and see for multiple drug charges and

352
00:19:02,080 --> 00:19:04,280
Speaker 1: this quid pro quote and the fact that it was

353
00:19:04,359 --> 00:19:07,480
Speaker 1: hidden from the defense. It's something that Troy litigated through

354
00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:11,320
Speaker 1: pro say post conviction motions but unfortunated no avail. But

355
00:19:11,920 --> 00:19:14,359
Speaker 1: the point ends up being moved here as Darren Keith

356
00:19:14,440 --> 00:19:18,640
Speaker 1: Johnson has signed multiple affidavits starting in nineteen ninety eight

357
00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:22,280
Speaker 1: to recant his testimony, for which the prosecutor not only

358
00:19:22,280 --> 00:19:24,479
Speaker 1: threatened him with perjury, but we find out later that

359
00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:29,080
Speaker 1: Darren and his mother received ominous threats from the police

360
00:19:30,160 --> 00:19:33,119
Speaker 1: to stick to the original statement. However, back in nineteen ninety,

361
00:19:33,119 --> 00:19:36,919
Speaker 1: with Arthur Sanders and Darren Johnson, they moved forward with

362
00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:40,480
Speaker 1: your arrest Troy, and on to what ends up being

363
00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:42,560
Speaker 1: really interesting preliminary hearing.

364
00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:47,000
Speaker 2: Yes it was. It was murder, robbery, conspiracy and possessional

365
00:19:47,080 --> 00:19:50,879
Speaker 2: baseman of Crown. The preliminary here was April twelfth, nineteen

366
00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:56,320
Speaker 2: ninety and at this preliminary here at altus Sanders rightfully,

367
00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:59,280
Speaker 2: I guess he slipped up because he said that we

368
00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:02,480
Speaker 2: were going to see Kareem, and this is throughout the

369
00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:04,680
Speaker 2: preliminary here, and that we were going to see Kareem,

370
00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:08,480
Speaker 2: Kareem in his Raymond Nobles My name was not mitching right.

371
00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:11,320
Speaker 1: He was going to see Kareem, not Troy or your

372
00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:14,880
Speaker 1: street name, Cassim, but Kareem.

373
00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:17,919
Speaker 5: Which is probably why Judge Merriweather, it was a decent

374
00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:21,160
Speaker 5: judge decided to dismiss the case because if you're going

375
00:20:21,200 --> 00:20:23,960
Speaker 5: to see Kareem, that's not him.

376
00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:27,800
Speaker 1: Right, Sanders accidentally told the truth even though he had

377
00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:31,239
Speaker 1: been pressured to lie. But they're not nearly done with

378
00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:31,800
Speaker 1: you yet.

379
00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:35,280
Speaker 2: So after Judge Maryweathers dismissed the case, then it was

380
00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:37,959
Speaker 2: about a week or two and they rearrested me again

381
00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:42,199
Speaker 2: with the same as that inflammation, and they switched to judges,

382
00:20:42,240 --> 00:20:44,159
Speaker 2: and he put it before another man I think they

383
00:20:44,280 --> 00:20:46,480
Speaker 2: was Judge Eigens, and he held.

384
00:20:46,280 --> 00:20:49,000
Speaker 1: It over for trial, and it may have ended in

385
00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:51,680
Speaker 1: a not guilty verdict if you hadn't been screwed over

386
00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:55,840
Speaker 1: by ed Geiger, a private investigator who your family had hired. Now,

387
00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:58,000
Speaker 1: this guy was supposed to have gone down to Atlantic

388
00:20:58,040 --> 00:21:00,800
Speaker 1: City and gathered up your alibi de which would have

389
00:21:00,840 --> 00:21:03,960
Speaker 1: literally been the easiest job ever for a private investigator,

390
00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:06,600
Speaker 1: just asked the hotel. But instead we now believe that

391
00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:08,600
Speaker 1: he never even went to Aletic City or bothered to

392
00:21:08,600 --> 00:21:11,400
Speaker 1: speak with Richard Crawford, your aliby witness. Otherwise he would

393
00:21:11,400 --> 00:21:13,239
Speaker 1: have found out what the state had already discovered, that

394
00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:15,600
Speaker 1: you had stayed at Bally's under your own name, and

395
00:21:15,680 --> 00:21:18,639
Speaker 1: another item that was hidden from the defense that Crawford

396
00:21:18,640 --> 00:21:23,000
Speaker 1: had called home several times from the room Geiger failed

397
00:21:23,040 --> 00:21:26,480
Speaker 1: to gather this critical alibi evidence and further told you

398
00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:29,720
Speaker 1: that Crawford wasn't willing to testify at your behalf, which

399
00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:33,560
Speaker 1: was another lie. Richard Crawford was more than willing, but

400
00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:36,600
Speaker 1: you didn't find that out until two thousand and nine,

401
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:40,080
Speaker 1: almost two decades later. Instead, with your fuzzy, drunken memory

402
00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:43,040
Speaker 1: of AC, you thought that you had stayed at the

403
00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:46,439
Speaker 1: Ridgemont Inn under the name Robert Irving. So when the

404
00:21:46,480 --> 00:21:50,359
Speaker 1: state presented Marlene Smith, a Bally's clerk, who testified to

405
00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:53,920
Speaker 1: you staying at Bally's under your own name, it really

406
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:57,360
Speaker 1: hurt the credibility of your memory. But it still doesn't

407
00:21:57,560 --> 00:22:01,040
Speaker 1: place you in Philadelphia, Not to mention europe Apartment, you

408
00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:03,119
Speaker 1: were in a different city, in a different state, and

409
00:22:03,160 --> 00:22:06,040
Speaker 1: they knew it. Anyway, What's much worse than this private

410
00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:10,320
Speaker 1: investigator doing essentially nothing is what was hidden by the

411
00:22:10,400 --> 00:22:13,879
Speaker 1: state in order to ensure your wrongful conviction. And now,

412
00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:16,760
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty two, in light of this new evidence

413
00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:19,600
Speaker 1: from the homicide file, you are being an AC only

414
00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:22,359
Speaker 1: makes you unavailable for Kevin Jones's abduction.

415
00:22:23,320 --> 00:22:26,680
Speaker 6: My name is Joseph Moron. I represent Troy Coleman in

416
00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:30,520
Speaker 6: his ongoing PCRA matters. I'm lead counsel on the case.

417
00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:33,680
Speaker 6: I continue to consult with the Jerome Brown. Recently, we

418
00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:37,680
Speaker 6: were able to access Troy Coleman's homicide file with the

419
00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:41,600
Speaker 6: assistance of the courts, which has information or evidence in

420
00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:45,440
Speaker 6: there that the prosecutor possessed during the course of his case.

421
00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:48,560
Speaker 6: We went through this entire file and we found critical

422
00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:53,919
Speaker 6: pieces of evidence that further substantiate Troy Coleman's innocence. We

423
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:57,959
Speaker 6: found a search warrant, an affidavit of probable cause where

424
00:22:58,119 --> 00:23:01,200
Speaker 6: the police were trying to get phone records because the

425
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:05,879
Speaker 6: mother of the victim, Kevin Jones, contacted the police and

426
00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:10,320
Speaker 6: gave him some pretty astonishing information that she spoke to

427
00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:13,360
Speaker 6: her son on September nineteenth of eighty nine, that.

428
00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:16,879
Speaker 5: He told her that he was in fear of the.

429
00:23:16,920 --> 00:23:20,160
Speaker 6: Junior Black Mafia the JBM, that he suspected some type

430
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:23,919
Speaker 6: of foul play. She did not see him since September nineteenth.

431
00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:28,440
Speaker 6: Subsequent to that, on October nineteenth, a little over three

432
00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:31,119
Speaker 6: weeks after the alleged date of death in this case,

433
00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:33,520
Speaker 6: she told the police that she got a phone call.

434
00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:36,120
Speaker 6: She got a collect call from an individual who indicated

435
00:23:36,440 --> 00:23:38,400
Speaker 6: he was a member of the JBM and that they

436
00:23:38,760 --> 00:23:41,359
Speaker 6: had her son, Kevin Jones, in their custody, that he

437
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:45,200
Speaker 6: was basically kidnapped and they were holding him ransom, presumably

438
00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:49,199
Speaker 6: about ten thousand dollars. She was initially skeptical. An individual

439
00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:51,920
Speaker 6: got on the phone. She indicates it sounded like her son,

440
00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:54,399
Speaker 6: and then the son referred to a pet name of

441
00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,439
Speaker 6: the mother, which further in her mind, solidified that it

442
00:23:57,520 --> 00:23:59,800
Speaker 6: was him. They said that they would call back. They called,

443
00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:03,160
Speaker 6: She asked for more information. She wanted a piece of clothing.

444
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:05,879
Speaker 6: They thought that was fair, but they were basically working

445
00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:08,359
Speaker 6: out a deal the hold to get money because they

446
00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:11,120
Speaker 6: were holding a ransom. The bottom line is this evidence,

447
00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:14,560
Speaker 6: this information was indicating that Kevin Jones was still alive,

448
00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:20,520
Speaker 6: which completely contradicts the entire prosecution theory. This information was

449
00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:24,080
Speaker 6: known to the police was a critical and crucial piece

450
00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:28,280
Speaker 6: of exculpatory evidence that the prosecution and the detectives and

451
00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:29,320
Speaker 6: police with help.

452
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:33,119
Speaker 1: You should have also been able to show the jury

453
00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:35,960
Speaker 1: that not only were you not at your apartment on

454
00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:38,560
Speaker 1: September twenty sixth, but also that you weren't even on

455
00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:41,840
Speaker 1: the freaking East Coast from September twenty ninth, nineteen eighty nine,

456
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:45,399
Speaker 1: passed this phone call on October nineteenth, and passed the

457
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:48,240
Speaker 1: discovery of the body on November twenty first, all the

458
00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:50,480
Speaker 1: way to the following year. I'm talking about all the

459
00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:54,480
Speaker 1: way to January fourth, nineteen ninety Kevin Jones was still alive,

460
00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:58,879
Speaker 1: that he was killed, that he was found, all while

461
00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:03,280
Speaker 1: you were proved in California, which proves that the prosecution

462
00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:06,840
Speaker 1: presented a case that they knew was horseshit, but a

463
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:09,840
Speaker 1: trial in nineteen ninety they'd attacked your alibi with this

464
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:13,840
Speaker 1: differing alibi evidence, which seems like a crazy misdirection plan.

465
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:16,000
Speaker 1: It's pretty weak. But so tell us what else they

466
00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:18,600
Speaker 1: presented to trick the jury into believing you were guilty.

467
00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:21,800
Speaker 2: Well, I believe that it was the testimony of Derek

468
00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:25,120
Speaker 2: and June and coupled with the testimony of Office Sanders. However,

469
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:28,439
Speaker 2: one of the things that were said in closing was

470
00:25:28,520 --> 00:25:32,560
Speaker 2: that testimony page seven fifty one by the prosecutor. He said,

471
00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:35,679
Speaker 2: if in fact, Troy was in Atlantic City and you

472
00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:38,360
Speaker 2: believe that he was still involved, or he put these

473
00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:40,200
Speaker 2: guys up to it, and this isn't. This is something

474
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:42,359
Speaker 2: that was said to the jury, you could find them

475
00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:45,760
Speaker 2: guilty of conspiracy and you know, second degree murder, so

476
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:49,240
Speaker 2: and so forth, and an undefeldy murder is actually saying

477
00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:52,760
Speaker 2: that as a result of that robbery of death occurred,

478
00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:55,760
Speaker 2: we don't believe that he had the intent to kill, right,

479
00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:58,480
Speaker 2: And that's what second we murdered is Here in.

480
00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 5: Tasmania, well, there's certain enumerated felonies, one of which is robbery,

481
00:26:03,080 --> 00:26:06,480
Speaker 5: and if you during a robbery, if a murder occurs,

482
00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:11,440
Speaker 5: that becomes felony murder, which is unfortunately in Pennsylvania, even

483
00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:14,320
Speaker 5: if you're convicted of second degree murder, it's life.

484
00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:17,840
Speaker 1: Troy, can you describe for us that awful and probably,

485
00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:19,640
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm guessing must have been the worst moment

486
00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 1: of your life when the jury came back in. I

487
00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:24,879
Speaker 1: found you guilty, he said guilty.

488
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:28,159
Speaker 2: It was like I was just like shocked. I was.

489
00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:31,119
Speaker 2: It was so shocking to me that the first couple

490
00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:34,359
Speaker 2: of years they believe wait only Middlin and you know,

491
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:36,480
Speaker 2: we lost a lot of family. My mother died, my

492
00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:41,520
Speaker 2: grandmother and my grandmother and died. Is a domino offender

493
00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:44,720
Speaker 2: pain and what happened another but I just couldn't believe

494
00:26:44,760 --> 00:27:05,199
Speaker 2: in believing when we are there more years later. First

495
00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:07,439
Speaker 2: got to give all praise to our creator getting me

496
00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:11,119
Speaker 2: through this and constantly having that hope that you know

497
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:14,000
Speaker 2: and it will come to it. However, it was a

498
00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:15,879
Speaker 2: time and it actually, to be honest with you, it

499
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:19,359
Speaker 2: just recently when I h they said I was negative,

500
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:21,240
Speaker 2: but I know I was positive. I was in the

501
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:25,760
Speaker 2: Germany with COVID and I was, Oh, I was deadly sick.

502
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:27,959
Speaker 2: I never ever felt no thing like that. And at

503
00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:31,000
Speaker 2: that time, and this is once ago, I prayed and

504
00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:33,880
Speaker 2: I asked the Lord. I said, if this is I'd

505
00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:36,680
Speaker 2: rather go now. And don't even thought this no more

506
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:39,399
Speaker 2: than just if you feel I wasn't, you know, suicidal.

507
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:41,399
Speaker 2: But I was like, I was okay with I was

508
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,240
Speaker 2: okay with Dyan. I just praised and this is the time,

509
00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:45,639
Speaker 2: and I'm not going to If I'm not going to

510
00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 2: go home, I'm breddying. And that was my prayer. In subsequently,

511
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:54,720
Speaker 2: you know, all of this sudden it was stored a

512
00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:55,480
Speaker 2: little hope for me.

513
00:27:55,720 --> 00:28:01,080
Speaker 1: But yeah, you know, you're hiring other people not to

514
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:03,520
Speaker 1: give up hope. So I'm glad you're here to talk

515
00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 1: about this, and I'm glad you're fighting. And I think

516
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:10,719
Speaker 1: now in Pennsylvania there's you know, the progress, and that

517
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:13,960
Speaker 1: should give hope, hopefully to you and many many other

518
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:18,200
Speaker 1: people who need relief in the Pennsylvania criminal system. Talk

519
00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:21,879
Speaker 1: a little about the post conviction litigation, because this is

520
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:24,800
Speaker 1: a crazy I mean, like a lot of these cases

521
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:26,480
Speaker 1: are when they go on this long. I mean, it

522
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:29,000
Speaker 1: should have been reversed. It should have been freed back

523
00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:29,800
Speaker 1: in ninety three.

524
00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 2: That conspiracy conviction in nineteen ninety three has since been reversed.

525
00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:37,360
Speaker 2: The Superior Court of pensive that in it of itself

526
00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:40,800
Speaker 2: was a reason to overturn this case and retry me

527
00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:43,240
Speaker 2: or to let me, you know, let me go. However

528
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 2: that hasn't been the.

529
00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:47,200
Speaker 1: Case, which is just insane to me. I mean, without

530
00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 1: the conspiracy and being in Atlantic City for the abduction,

531
00:28:50,280 --> 00:28:52,640
Speaker 1: in California for the murder and the body dump, how

532
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:56,560
Speaker 1: are you involved in the murder in any way? Well,

533
00:28:57,040 --> 00:28:59,320
Speaker 1: they continue to try to square that circle with the

534
00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:01,840
Speaker 1: two boga This witnesses Arthur Sanders saying you were in

535
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:04,000
Speaker 1: the car and Darren Johnson saying that you confess to

536
00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:08,400
Speaker 1: having to quote lay somebody down over some drugs and quote.

537
00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:10,840
Speaker 1: So in nineteen ninety eight, Darren Johnson wanted to come

538
00:29:10,840 --> 00:29:14,080
Speaker 1: clean and finally recanted and did so in an appid David.

539
00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:16,320
Speaker 1: But as we find out later, he and his mother

540
00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:19,880
Speaker 1: were threatened by the police and the prosecutor openly threatened

541
00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:24,040
Speaker 1: him with perjury. So when he here, we hear this

542
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:26,960
Speaker 1: too much. It makes me sick. So when he came

543
00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:29,520
Speaker 1: to court in nineteen ninety nine to a firmness recantation,

544
00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:32,120
Speaker 1: he was appointed counsel who told him to plead the

545
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:35,680
Speaker 1: fifth in order to avoid perjury charges, and he did.

546
00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 1: But obviously he would not need to plead the fifth

547
00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 1: if he was just coming to repeat the lies he

548
00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:44,160
Speaker 1: had told at Troy's trial, right, he wouldn't have been

549
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:47,960
Speaker 1: there at all. So, Troy, you did most of your

550
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:51,600
Speaker 1: post conviction litigation pro say meaning by yourself from prison,

551
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:54,480
Speaker 1: trying to undermine Darren Johnson's trial testimony by proving that

552
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:56,880
Speaker 1: he was incentivized by a deal for leniency in his

553
00:29:56,920 --> 00:29:59,479
Speaker 1: own drug charges, and that the defense was never notified

554
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:02,920
Speaker 1: about any such deals, and the prosecution got around this

555
00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:08,120
Speaker 1: by promising Darren a deal unofficially Okay, and suspending the

556
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:11,600
Speaker 1: charges until after Troy's trial, So they weren't technically hiding

557
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:13,680
Speaker 1: a deal in exchange for Darren's testimony. They were just

558
00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,600
Speaker 1: dangling one and Darren later supported that in your post

559
00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:17,640
Speaker 1: conviction motions.

560
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:21,520
Speaker 2: When Darren he was asked by the prosecutor David Deza Dario,

561
00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:24,480
Speaker 2: do you have any open cases at this time? Darren

562
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:27,960
Speaker 2: Keith Johnson said yes, one, five years pulbition. That's a

563
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:32,400
Speaker 2: direct quote. It was a testimony basically thirty seven. However,

564
00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:35,840
Speaker 2: unbeknownst to us, that was a lie made all his

565
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:38,680
Speaker 2: criminal history of where he never spent all five years polation.

566
00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:41,800
Speaker 2: But jury is listening to this. Did jury say, oh, okay,

567
00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 2: he has five years folcation? Okay, so he don't have

568
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:47,280
Speaker 2: any incentive to testify falsely against this guy because he's

569
00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:50,800
Speaker 2: already been sentenced. Again, unberknownst to us, that was a lie.

570
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:53,480
Speaker 2: Darren actually had an open case at that time, which

571
00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:56,480
Speaker 2: was resolved sixty nine days after I got convicted.

572
00:30:56,640 --> 00:31:00,360
Speaker 1: But unfortunately, so far post conviction litigation on this matter

573
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:03,560
Speaker 1: has been ignored. The court sided with the DA finding

574
00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:06,400
Speaker 1: him more credible than Darren Johnson. However, that's not the

575
00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:09,520
Speaker 1: last we're going to hear from Darren Johnson. But first

576
00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:13,000
Speaker 1: two thousand and nine, you find out what I had

577
00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 1: mentioned earlier, that you're investigated at the time of trial

578
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:16,760
Speaker 1: lied to you about not being able to find any

579
00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:20,840
Speaker 1: alibi evidence in ac and your alibi witness, Richard Crawford

580
00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:23,640
Speaker 1: being unwilling to testify. He lied about both of those

581
00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:26,760
Speaker 1: two things. But you hired another private investigator later on,

582
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:29,200
Speaker 1: guy named Walter P. Lee, and in two thousand and

583
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 1: nine he caught up with Richard Crawford.

584
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:34,360
Speaker 2: Well, my private investigator, Walter Lee went to school interview.

585
00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:36,920
Speaker 2: Rich Crawtey said that's something that he never said to

586
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:39,360
Speaker 2: Edgeier said, no, one never came to see me and

587
00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:41,240
Speaker 2: told me nothing about Rory. I was whit him in

588
00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:43,160
Speaker 2: Atlantic City, and I would have said that I was

589
00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:45,680
Speaker 2: whitting in Atlantic City and we had his statement nail,

590
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:47,960
Speaker 2: but he said that never happened. So that ind of

591
00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:49,240
Speaker 2: himself was probablyad for me.

592
00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:49,720
Speaker 5: With Daniell.

593
00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:53,480
Speaker 2: Richard is will sistefied. And this is something this awso significant.

594
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:57,560
Speaker 2: Michard Crawford called from the hotel. He called home to

595
00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:01,400
Speaker 2: his good wife Shrill the Pross to have those phone

596
00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:04,480
Speaker 2: numbers and those phone calls, and well a couple of

597
00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:07,840
Speaker 2: the phone calls was to Richard Crawford's address on McNay

598
00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:10,520
Speaker 2: Street in Philadelphia. They never took this before.

599
00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:14,440
Speaker 1: What weren't they hiding? The only things David Desiderio was

600
00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:17,760
Speaker 1: presenting was the evidence that he and Martin Devon had fabricated,

601
00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:21,920
Speaker 1: and even that was falling apart. Darren Johnson recant, they

602
00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:24,960
Speaker 1: don't want to hear it. Your investigator, Walter Lee Onearth's

603
00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 1: your alibi witness shedding more light on the state's misdeeds,

604
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:32,360
Speaker 1: hiding that exculpatory evidence and ambushing you with it to

605
00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:36,400
Speaker 1: undermine the truth which they already knew, which was that

606
00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 1: you were in Atlantic City on September twenty six, and

607
00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:42,680
Speaker 1: they also knew that Kevin Jones was still alive while

608
00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:44,959
Speaker 1: you were in California through until the end of the year,

609
00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:47,480
Speaker 1: until the beginning of next year. However, if that alibi

610
00:32:47,560 --> 00:32:49,640
Speaker 1: wasn't enough for them to stop pursuing you in nineteen ninety,

611
00:32:49,640 --> 00:32:51,440
Speaker 1: why would it stop them in nineteen ninety eight or

612
00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:55,520
Speaker 1: two thousand and nine or ever. Right, so another ten

613
00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:59,040
Speaker 1: years go past, and Byron Johnson, who everyone is scared

614
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:02,120
Speaker 1: of and wouldn't even think of snitching on In twenty nineteen,

615
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:04,800
Speaker 1: had suffered a non fatal gunshot wound, and I guess

616
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:06,760
Speaker 1: he didn't want to die without having told the truth.

617
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:10,480
Speaker 1: He didn't die, and he came forward to confess to

618
00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:12,240
Speaker 1: the part that he played with Kareem.

619
00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:16,120
Speaker 5: And there was a sella named Herb Hartisan who was

620
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:20,400
Speaker 5: with Byron Johnson who had just been shot. And he said,

621
00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:22,760
Speaker 5: get me to somebody, because I want to be able

622
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:25,480
Speaker 5: to tell the truth about this. And he came and

623
00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:28,080
Speaker 5: he gave a statement. Walter Lee took the statement from

624
00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:32,440
Speaker 5: Byron Johnson. Byron did that. Kareem Nobles called him. He

625
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 5: said something about moving some furniture or something like that,

626
00:33:36,440 --> 00:33:39,160
Speaker 5: and he went over and he saw the body and

627
00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:41,320
Speaker 5: Kareem said, look, you help me get rid of this body.

628
00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:43,040
Speaker 5: He'll give you five thousand dollars.

629
00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:45,400
Speaker 1: So the two men in the Great Dodge that Sanders

630
00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:48,680
Speaker 1: allegedly saw, where Kareem Nobles and Byron Johnson, the cops

631
00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:51,120
Speaker 1: knew that Kareem was involved, and it's believed that the

632
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:53,400
Speaker 1: Joneses did too, since he wound up dead before the

633
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:56,240
Speaker 1: police had a chance to nab him. Byron's confession and

634
00:33:56,360 --> 00:33:59,760
Speaker 1: Darren's recantation impeach Sanders a shaky idea of Troy and

635
00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:05,400
Speaker 1: directly at Byron. This murder happened in Troy's apartment while

636
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:08,480
Speaker 1: he was partying in ac So other than letting his

637
00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:10,399
Speaker 1: friends use his apartment while he was out of town,

638
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:12,960
Speaker 1: there's nothing else that connected Troy to the abduction on

639
00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:17,040
Speaker 1: September twenty sixth, and certainly not the murder sometime after

640
00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:21,680
Speaker 1: October nineteenth, while he was in a Mercede, again, California,

641
00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:26,120
Speaker 1: three thousand miles away. But the conflict between Byron's confession

642
00:34:26,120 --> 00:34:28,880
Speaker 1: when he talks about moving a body and Miss Jones's

643
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:32,600
Speaker 1: statement about the phone call that she received. We just

644
00:34:32,680 --> 00:34:36,279
Speaker 1: assumed that Byron and perhaps Kareem didn't know Kevin was

645
00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:36,960
Speaker 1: still alive.

646
00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:42,200
Speaker 6: When you look at Byron Johnson's confession indicating that he

647
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:44,920
Speaker 6: was contacted by Kareem Nobles to come to the house

648
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:48,360
Speaker 6: to move a body, specifically the body being Kevin Jones,

649
00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:51,560
Speaker 6: nobody really gets into the fact of whether Kevin Jones

650
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:53,520
Speaker 6: is still alive or not. In neither this he what

651
00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:56,160
Speaker 6: could have potentially happened. I mean, Byron Johnson was arrested

652
00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:58,440
Speaker 6: at the end of September September twenty ninth for an

653
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:02,080
Speaker 6: unrelated robbery was technically out of the loops or to speak.

654
00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:05,520
Speaker 6: So the fact that Kevin Jones could have been still alive,

655
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:09,040
Speaker 6: he may not have known that. And when he ultimately

656
00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:12,080
Speaker 6: confessed back in nineteen, he is just trying to be

657
00:35:12,160 --> 00:35:14,200
Speaker 6: truthful and telling what he knows. That he was called

658
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:16,560
Speaker 6: by Kareem to move the body and he did so,

659
00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:18,320
Speaker 6: and he was the one in the car with Kareem.

660
00:35:18,520 --> 00:35:21,160
Speaker 6: It further substantiates that Troy had nothing to do with it.

661
00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:25,680
Speaker 1: When Byron Johnson confessed, Darren Keith Johnson could finally speak

662
00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:28,760
Speaker 1: freely and he gave a sworn AFFI David to Walter

663
00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:33,600
Speaker 1: Peeley and Jerry Brown, which was very powerful but has

664
00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:36,240
Speaker 1: never been heard to this very day in open court.

665
00:35:37,320 --> 00:35:39,040
Speaker 1: So we reached out to Darren to give him a

666
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:40,560
Speaker 1: chance to finally speak publicly.

667
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:45,560
Speaker 3: When they first came and got me, they laid out

668
00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:50,160
Speaker 3: some pictures and I picked out Karine and they said no,

669
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:54,200
Speaker 3: but dead man can tall you know.

670
00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:55,080
Speaker 5: Who did it?

671
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:59,279
Speaker 3: And they kept pointing at Troy saying he did it.

672
00:35:59,360 --> 00:36:02,960
Speaker 3: He did it. So they kept saying, I said no,

673
00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 3: this man right here then he had kicked the chair,

674
00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 3: and you know, they was getting mad, and they kept

675
00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:16,120
Speaker 3: taking my hand and putting my finger at his picture

676
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:18,680
Speaker 3: and that. Then when they let me go, I was like, no,

677
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:23,360
Speaker 3: it's this guy. And then you know, one was behind

678
00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:26,960
Speaker 3: me and the other one was at the desk type

679
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:29,560
Speaker 3: and they said, we know who did it.

680
00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:31,840
Speaker 5: And they start typing stuff up.

681
00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:36,880
Speaker 3: And they made me sign it, and so they bade

682
00:36:36,920 --> 00:36:41,280
Speaker 3: me say that he confessed to me. And then after

683
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:45,080
Speaker 3: that I wasn't going to court. And then they kept

684
00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:48,680
Speaker 3: arresting My mother. She said, well, they said that they

685
00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:52,800
Speaker 3: going to arrest you if you don't come in the court.

686
00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:57,520
Speaker 3: And the fat da I know he's a fat white guy.

687
00:36:57,600 --> 00:37:00,480
Speaker 3: I don't remember his name. He said, well, well we

688
00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:05,440
Speaker 3: could get you a probation if you testify what the

689
00:37:05,480 --> 00:37:10,840
Speaker 3: detectives told you. And they all was alive. See Troy

690
00:37:11,080 --> 00:37:15,319
Speaker 3: was in Atlantic City because I remember because I said, YO,

691
00:37:15,480 --> 00:37:18,600
Speaker 3: bring me a pair of Gucci sneaks back and he

692
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:22,759
Speaker 3: started laughing and he was like, I got you. I

693
00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:23,279
Speaker 3: see y'all.

694
00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:24,600
Speaker 5: When I get back, I.

695
00:37:24,560 --> 00:37:28,280
Speaker 3: Said, all right, you got an innocent man in jail

696
00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:32,000
Speaker 3: for something he didn't do. You know, I've been carrying

697
00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:34,360
Speaker 3: that guilt for for a long time.

698
00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:52,759
Speaker 5: Other than the testimony of these two people, there's not

699
00:37:53,360 --> 00:37:59,719
Speaker 5: one shred of physical evidence that ties Troy Coleman to

700
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:00,400
Speaker 5: this crime.

701
00:38:00,640 --> 00:38:03,680
Speaker 1: Nothing. And to hear the words of Darren Keith Johnson,

702
00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:07,040
Speaker 1: along with Byron Johnson's confession in which he completely nullified

703
00:38:07,160 --> 00:38:10,840
Speaker 1: Arthur Sanders as shaky id that should end the dates

704
00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:15,280
Speaker 1: case right there, full stop. Then there's this newly discovered

705
00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:17,680
Speaker 1: evidence from the homicide file or h file that indicates

706
00:38:17,680 --> 00:38:20,880
Speaker 1: that Kevin Jones died sometime after October nineteenth, while Troy

707
00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:23,960
Speaker 1: was most certainly on the West coast, coupled with all

708
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:27,200
Speaker 1: of the exculpatory material that this prosecutor would help and

709
00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:29,160
Speaker 1: the fact that Byron may not have been clear on

710
00:38:29,160 --> 00:38:32,399
Speaker 1: whether Kevin Jones was actually dead when he moved him. Well,

711
00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:35,000
Speaker 1: he was arrested on September twenty ninth, nineteen eighty nine,

712
00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:37,600
Speaker 1: It didn't see the outside until well after Kareem had

713
00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:39,760
Speaker 1: died and couldn't tell him the rest of the story.

714
00:38:40,560 --> 00:38:42,480
Speaker 1: So with that said, we're going to go to Joe

715
00:38:42,560 --> 00:38:44,720
Speaker 1: Moron for the current status of Troy's case.

716
00:38:45,760 --> 00:38:50,640
Speaker 6: So we now have submitted an amended PCRA outlining this

717
00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:54,560
Speaker 6: critical information that we found in the homicide file. We

718
00:38:54,680 --> 00:38:58,600
Speaker 6: have served a copy of this petition to the District Attorney.

719
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:01,920
Speaker 6: We are waiting for the District Attorney to tell us

720
00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:04,239
Speaker 6: when they will respond, but there is a hearing date

721
00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:07,960
Speaker 6: on July seventh, and based on this information that we

722
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:11,359
Speaker 6: have now found and the previous information, we are going

723
00:39:11,400 --> 00:39:14,160
Speaker 6: to ask for some form of intervention from the court,

724
00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:17,719
Speaker 6: from the judge to force the District Attorney's hands to

725
00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:22,920
Speaker 6: either have a evidentiary hearing immediately on these issues or

726
00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:27,240
Speaker 6: to respond to our amended petition so that the judge

727
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:31,560
Speaker 6: can make a ruling regarding mister Colemans. And our concern

728
00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:35,480
Speaker 6: is we're caught into the system of procedure in the courts,

729
00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:39,160
Speaker 6: and that being said, it's not unlikely that the DA's

730
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:42,319
Speaker 6: office will ask for a sixty and ninety day extension

731
00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:46,360
Speaker 6: to answer or respond to our amended petition, and that

732
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:48,480
Speaker 6: I believe is unfair. So what we're trying to do

733
00:39:48,560 --> 00:39:52,000
Speaker 6: is push the process through the judge by the judge

734
00:39:52,040 --> 00:39:53,760
Speaker 6: really forcing them to kind of respond.

735
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:57,200
Speaker 1: Now, well, we've previously been seeing some really great things

736
00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:01,040
Speaker 1: out of the Philadelphia CiU, and we hear at wrongful conviction,

737
00:40:01,120 --> 00:40:04,279
Speaker 1: and I personally want to encourage them to end this

738
00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:08,200
Speaker 1: particular injustice as swiftly as it possibly can. We understand

739
00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:11,640
Speaker 1: that the task of researching and re litigating the last

740
00:40:12,040 --> 00:40:15,360
Speaker 1: thirty forty fifty years worth of corrupt cases in a

741
00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 1: place like Philadelphia, you know, trying to write any percentage

742
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:24,160
Speaker 1: of those wrongs is a tall, tall order. So I

743
00:40:24,239 --> 00:40:25,799
Speaker 1: just want to say that every one of the hard

744
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:28,440
Speaker 1: working people at Philadelphia CiU, your hard work is not

745
00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:33,000
Speaker 1: going unappreciated here. But also, we originally released this story

746
00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:36,000
Speaker 1: a year ago. It's pastime to end this nightmare, and

747
00:40:36,040 --> 00:40:40,160
Speaker 1: we hope they will join our call for freedom and justice.

748
00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:42,560
Speaker 1: And with that, we're not going to go to my

749
00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:44,600
Speaker 1: favorite part of the show, which of course, is where

750
00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:46,840
Speaker 1: I first thank all three of you for joining me

751
00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:51,400
Speaker 1: here today and sharing your incredible, harrowing story. And now

752
00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:53,080
Speaker 1: I'm going to kick back in my chair, turn off

753
00:40:53,080 --> 00:40:56,400
Speaker 1: my mic, and just listen to whatever else you guys

754
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:59,040
Speaker 1: would like to say. Jerry and then Joe, why don't

755
00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:02,080
Speaker 1: you guys lead off and then hand the mic off

756
00:41:02,080 --> 00:41:05,520
Speaker 1: to Troy and he'll take us out into the sunset.

757
00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:10,239
Speaker 5: Well, thank you, Jason for giving me this opportunity to

758
00:41:10,320 --> 00:41:14,560
Speaker 5: address Troy's case. Obviously, there is a lot of facts

759
00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:18,080
Speaker 5: and circumstances here that are extremely troubling. One of the

760
00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:24,600
Speaker 5: problems is back when Troy was arrested, Philadelphia was in

761
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:28,840
Speaker 5: the midst of one of its worst homicide waves and

762
00:41:28,880 --> 00:41:33,759
Speaker 5: its history. Homicide police wanted to clear cases and do

763
00:41:33,840 --> 00:41:36,520
Speaker 5: it in the most convenient way because they were being

764
00:41:36,600 --> 00:41:41,080
Speaker 5: pressured to do so, and therefore they used some of

765
00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:44,400
Speaker 5: the cases I've seen some shortcuts in order to achieve

766
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:47,520
Speaker 5: that goal, and one of the shortcuts is that they

767
00:41:47,520 --> 00:41:52,520
Speaker 5: would pressure witnesses, and in this case, they had two

768
00:41:53,120 --> 00:41:57,120
Speaker 5: very good subjects that they could pressurize. So these are

769
00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:01,200
Speaker 5: the only two pieces of evidence that were the heart

770
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 5: and soul of the Comonwell's case. Once they've been debunked,

771
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:07,880
Speaker 5: which I believe they have been, it is pretty clear

772
00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:09,440
Speaker 5: that Troy Coleman is not.

773
00:42:09,440 --> 00:42:13,480
Speaker 6: Guilty based on Troy's case and its entirety. And if

774
00:42:13,560 --> 00:42:16,320
Speaker 6: you look back from the day that he was initially

775
00:42:16,440 --> 00:42:20,000
Speaker 6: arrested and you start to take apart all the evidence

776
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:22,959
Speaker 6: in the case, and you start to realize how the

777
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:25,759
Speaker 6: prosecutor the DA in this case handled the case, and

778
00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:29,200
Speaker 6: you look at all the evidence that was withheld throughout

779
00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:34,440
Speaker 6: the process, key witnesses, criminal history, phone records, It goes

780
00:42:34,520 --> 00:42:36,560
Speaker 6: on and on and on, and I think at some

781
00:42:36,680 --> 00:42:40,640
Speaker 6: point now that we found this additional information, we're hoping

782
00:42:41,200 --> 00:42:44,760
Speaker 6: that the courts will see through this and some immediate

783
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:49,239
Speaker 6: intervention will happen to help expedite the process of exonerating

784
00:42:49,239 --> 00:42:51,799
Speaker 6: an innocent man who's been sitting in prison for well

785
00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:52,880
Speaker 6: over thirty years.

786
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:55,680
Speaker 2: At this time, I would like to say I'm to

787
00:42:55,760 --> 00:42:58,560
Speaker 2: be there with guying to being all precidents to oursord.

788
00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:01,240
Speaker 2: I don't think any thinkers want to come to fruition

789
00:43:01,400 --> 00:43:04,040
Speaker 2: in regards to this case, except by the will of

790
00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:07,040
Speaker 2: our creative God Most High. I would like to thank

791
00:43:07,280 --> 00:43:12,600
Speaker 2: Jason and my attorney and Connor and all that was

792
00:43:12,760 --> 00:43:16,200
Speaker 2: involved in this, my family who has been supported me

793
00:43:16,280 --> 00:43:19,200
Speaker 2: through this, and my message you know at this time

794
00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:21,919
Speaker 2: what got me through these years. I want to push

795
00:43:22,080 --> 00:43:26,000
Speaker 2: education and vocational skills that's needed. I'm a founder and

796
00:43:26,120 --> 00:43:30,239
Speaker 2: facilitator of a group entitled Youth Mister Ackronam and Young

797
00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:35,160
Speaker 2: Offenders Understanding their Habitual Shackles, which is facilitated by myself,

798
00:43:35,360 --> 00:43:38,840
Speaker 2: Kevin Bowman and Dracy Box and we push forward to

799
00:43:38,920 --> 00:43:41,160
Speaker 2: try to help the youth put between eight and eighteen

800
00:43:41,200 --> 00:43:44,240
Speaker 2: and thirty of this enhancing and all holding their education

801
00:43:44,480 --> 00:43:48,360
Speaker 2: and vocational skills. But I'm very grateful for everyone, and

802
00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:52,600
Speaker 2: God willing I can be speaking further about this on

803
00:43:52,640 --> 00:43:55,520
Speaker 2: the street as opposed to from the penitentiary. God will.

804
00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:05,000
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Wrongful Conviction. I'd like to

805
00:44:05,040 --> 00:44:08,760
Speaker 1: thank our production team Connor Hall, Jeff Cliburn, and Kevin Wardis,

806
00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:12,000
Speaker 1: with research by Lyla Robinson. The music in this production

807
00:44:12,160 --> 00:44:15,360
Speaker 1: was supplied by three time OSCAR nominated composer Jay Ralph.

808
00:44:15,640 --> 00:44:19,120
Speaker 1: Be sure to follow us on Instagram at Wrongful Conviction,

809
00:44:19,360 --> 00:44:23,120
Speaker 1: on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction podcast, and on Twitter at

810
00:44:23,160 --> 00:44:26,279
Speaker 1: wrong Conviction, as well as at Lava for Good. On

811
00:44:26,400 --> 00:44:29,359
Speaker 1: all three platforms, you can also follow me on both

812
00:44:29,400 --> 00:44:33,600
Speaker 1: TikTok and Instagram at It's Jason Flam. Wrongful Conviction is

813
00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:36,360
Speaker 1: the production of Lava for Good Podcasts and association with

814
00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:37,640
Speaker 1: Signal Company Number one