WEBVTT - Take Back the Customer: Social Commerce in 2019 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:03.760 I'm off my game today. No, you're not. People are 0:00:03.800 --> 0:00:05.640 going to have to start making better content. I think 0:00:05.640 --> 0:00:07.160 we're gonna be talking about this for a long time. 0:00:07.240 --> 0:00:10.200 When you program for everyone, you program for no one. 0:00:10.240 --> 0:00:12.319 I think it's that we're purpose driven platform, like we're 0:00:12.320 --> 0:00:15.680 trying to get to substance. How is that? Are you 0:00:15.680 --> 0:00:19.200 happy with that? This is marketing therapy right now? It 0:00:19.480 --> 0:00:28.920 really is. What's up on? Laura Currency and I'm Alexa Kristen. 0:00:29.040 --> 0:00:33.080 Welcome back at Landia twenty nineteen. Happy New year. So 0:00:33.159 --> 0:00:36.600 today we are starting off our year kicking it with 0:00:36.680 --> 0:00:39.199 one of the smartest people in the industry, Rachel Typograph. 0:00:39.280 --> 0:00:41.239 She's back on the show. She is the founder and 0:00:41.320 --> 0:00:44.839 CEO of Micmac. Really excited to hear about what she 0:00:44.920 --> 0:00:47.559 sees happening in the social commerce space. And I think 0:00:47.560 --> 0:00:50.400 everybody's been asking question, is everything that's been happening with 0:00:50.440 --> 0:00:53.320 Facebook going to affect my business? Is it gonna actually 0:00:53.360 --> 0:00:55.920 make an impact? It has in the media space. We 0:00:56.000 --> 0:00:58.920 know that on the publisher side, but is it really 0:00:58.960 --> 0:01:01.680 going to impact brand? Are they willing to think about 0:01:02.000 --> 0:01:04.759 potentially moving spend off the platform as a result? Will 0:01:04.760 --> 0:01:06.920 be interesting to see as somebody who's built her business 0:01:07.319 --> 0:01:10.080 around that model, Like has the bottom line been affected 0:01:10.240 --> 0:01:11.640 or will it be? Or will it be? And I 0:01:11.680 --> 0:01:14.040 think one thing that you and I have talked about, Laura, 0:01:14.200 --> 0:01:18.080 that we're super interested in is is there another platform? 0:01:18.120 --> 0:01:20.000 Is there another platform? Maybe that's not going to take 0:01:20.040 --> 0:01:22.600 the place of Facebook, but do we enter into maybe 0:01:22.640 --> 0:01:26.760 a more disintermediated world of social media. Is that happening 0:01:26.959 --> 0:01:29.000 or is it the fact that we have big companies 0:01:29.040 --> 0:01:34.360 now merging and acquiring other platforms to create massive entities 0:01:34.400 --> 0:01:36.320 that may be able to compete with the Facebooks and 0:01:36.360 --> 0:01:40.560 the Googles of the world. And you're implying with legacy companies, 0:01:40.680 --> 0:01:44.440 which act is very interesting. So we will be right 0:01:44.440 --> 0:01:59.520 back with Rachel Typograph and we're back in the studio 0:01:59.720 --> 0:02:05.200 with our first episode of with Rachel Typograph, founder and 0:02:05.280 --> 0:02:10.840 CEO of mic Mac. Rachel, welcome back to the show. Hi, Rachel, Hey, 0:02:10.880 --> 0:02:14.320 excited to be back. So, Rachel, we couldn't think of 0:02:14.400 --> 0:02:18.839 anyone else to kind of kick off for us. One 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:21.600 start with who is mic mac? What have you done 0:02:21.680 --> 0:02:26.119 and where have you kind of gone from? So mic 0:02:26.200 --> 0:02:31.240 mac is the e commerce platform for social video and beyond. 0:02:32.080 --> 0:02:35.640 Our business is broken into two parts. We call our 0:02:35.639 --> 0:02:40.760 software micmac Attached in its simplest form, it's a vertical 0:02:40.880 --> 0:02:44.040 video product details page that can connect to any e 0:02:44.120 --> 0:02:47.040 commerce card, so it could be d t C or 0:02:47.200 --> 0:02:51.080 third party retailer like an Amazon, Target or Walmart. And 0:02:51.120 --> 0:02:53.040 then we have a second part of the business, which 0:02:53.120 --> 0:02:57.079 is called micmac Studios. It's our creative service arm. We're 0:02:57.160 --> 0:03:00.720 literally all day long. We only do two things. We 0:03:00.760 --> 0:03:04.280 either optimize existing assets to get people to hit add 0:03:04.320 --> 0:03:07.240 to cart, or we create original content from the ground 0:03:07.360 --> 0:03:10.200 up that gets people to hit add to cart. Obviously, 0:03:10.200 --> 0:03:14.320 so much has happened since, both within the social space, 0:03:14.480 --> 0:03:19.959 obviously advances in technology, more around trust and transparency. How 0:03:20.000 --> 0:03:24.120 has the business evolved to be honest? Um, we're on fire. 0:03:24.639 --> 0:03:28.480 Last year was the craziest year of my life. Professionally. 0:03:29.040 --> 0:03:33.959 Our business grew and the reason being is that all 0:03:34.000 --> 0:03:36.920 trends point to mcmac. The reason I say that is 0:03:36.960 --> 0:03:41.240 because we live in a world now. We're fundamentally everything 0:03:41.240 --> 0:03:45.400 that I've been preaching people finally understand, which is if 0:03:45.440 --> 0:03:48.680 you give up your first party data, you give up 0:03:48.680 --> 0:03:51.880 your brand. And the way that you capture your first 0:03:51.960 --> 0:03:56.760 party today to today is via direct response, Performance Marketing, 0:03:56.920 --> 0:03:59.600 and e com and we literally sit at the nexus 0:03:59.640 --> 0:04:02.520 of that. You know, the business has grown three and 0:04:02.560 --> 0:04:07.160 we're working with partners like Bows, Campbell's Essay, lauder Craft, 0:04:07.800 --> 0:04:13.120 Glauria Levi's Mattel, PNG, under Armour, Unilever. I could literally 0:04:13.160 --> 0:04:15.680 go on and on um And the reason why we're 0:04:15.680 --> 0:04:18.640 signing all of these brands is that a major evolution 0:04:18.640 --> 0:04:22.600 in our products since we spoke last is our integrations 0:04:22.680 --> 0:04:26.839 with third party retailer cards. So when we spoke in 0:04:26.880 --> 0:04:30.719 November two tho seventeen, my business was primarily focused on 0:04:30.760 --> 0:04:35.640 working with direct consumer brands, and I began to take 0:04:35.680 --> 0:04:39.280 this very contrarian point of view in the market, which 0:04:39.320 --> 0:04:42.359 is personally, I don't believe we're going to live in 0:04:42.360 --> 0:04:46.120 a world where you go to paper towels dot Com 0:04:46.200 --> 0:04:49.320 to buy your paper towels and deodorant dot Com to 0:04:49.360 --> 0:04:53.960 buy your deodorant. And as I saw the entire media 0:04:54.040 --> 0:04:58.640 landscape and overall retail landscape applaud every single director consumer 0:04:58.680 --> 0:05:01.720 brand that came to market, I go, there's gonna be 0:05:01.760 --> 0:05:04.880 a point of saturation where there's too many of these 0:05:04.920 --> 0:05:07.760 brands in market. Cost for customer acquisition is going to 0:05:07.839 --> 0:05:10.200 get too high, and the pendulum is going to swing 0:05:10.240 --> 0:05:13.880 the other way. And I felt like the company that 0:05:14.000 --> 0:05:16.760 was going to win in the landscape would be the 0:05:16.800 --> 0:05:21.440 one that could take all the principles of direct to 0:05:21.480 --> 0:05:26.560 consumer brands and apply it to third party retailer environments. 0:05:27.480 --> 0:05:34.679 And that's when I began to integrate with Amazon, Target, Walmart, Alta, Sephora, 0:05:35.240 --> 0:05:40.920 best Buy, Exporting Goods, pet Co, and my business changed 0:05:41.000 --> 0:05:46.240 overnight because the majority of the COM sales today actually 0:05:46.320 --> 0:05:49.359 still come from those major third party retailers that I 0:05:49.480 --> 0:05:53.680 just went through. And when you're a brand and you 0:05:53.760 --> 0:05:57.560 are driving traffic to those environments, you literally only know 0:05:57.800 --> 0:06:01.760 three things impressions, click, curate in your overall sales. You 0:06:01.800 --> 0:06:04.560 don't know anything that happens after that click or after 0:06:04.600 --> 0:06:09.800 that swipe up with us. You now know everything. So 0:06:09.880 --> 0:06:13.640 we get these brands that more often than not have 0:06:13.720 --> 0:06:16.920 been these legacy brands that are heavily reliant on third 0:06:16.960 --> 0:06:20.120 party retailers to drive the line share of their eCOM sales, 0:06:20.839 --> 0:06:23.360 and we get them to act more likely to see brands, 0:06:23.480 --> 0:06:27.000 meaning they now know the entire customer journey, they understand 0:06:27.000 --> 0:06:30.880 the media channel effectiveness, they can measure influencer effectiveness, they 0:06:30.880 --> 0:06:34.159 can measure creative effectiveness, they can capture all of that 0:06:34.320 --> 0:06:38.600 data in their d MP or their CRM, and that 0:06:38.640 --> 0:06:42.760 has been a huge, huge turning point for our business. 0:06:42.920 --> 0:06:46.840 And the other part of that, which is directly related 0:06:47.680 --> 0:06:52.200 is the evolution of our audience product. So we call 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:56.279 it the micmac Engager audience, and what we have found 0:06:56.360 --> 0:07:00.000 with nearly all of our clients is that it's actually 0:07:00.080 --> 0:07:04.200 become either the top performing or within the top three 0:07:04.640 --> 0:07:08.560 most effective audience within their ad managers. Going back to 0:07:08.680 --> 0:07:11.280 like this example of like a c retailers, you drive 0:07:11.280 --> 0:07:15.080 traffic to an environment like Amazon. The moment someone arrives 0:07:15.080 --> 0:07:18.800 at Amazon product detail page, you've completely lost that audience. 0:07:19.560 --> 0:07:23.480 Because our software replaces that product detail page, we now 0:07:23.680 --> 0:07:27.120 can collect that audience. We collect that audience on behalf 0:07:27.160 --> 0:07:30.200 the brand, and we pass it directly back to them 0:07:30.280 --> 0:07:34.320 to live within their preferred ad manager, meaning for literally 0:07:34.360 --> 0:07:38.400 the first time ever, they can go retarget that audience 0:07:38.440 --> 0:07:41.840 to close the sale. They can use that audience within 0:07:41.920 --> 0:07:45.960 their future prospecting media. So that's one of the major 0:07:46.160 --> 0:07:51.280 differences between brands that are heavily reliant on third party 0:07:51.320 --> 0:07:54.000 retailers and DD C brands right, because the moment a 0:07:54.080 --> 0:07:58.160 D two C brand acquires a customer, they now own 0:07:58.200 --> 0:08:01.600 that customer. And the high pothesis is the next time 0:08:01.600 --> 0:08:04.160 that they go remarket to them, their overall cost for 0:08:04.240 --> 0:08:10.200 customer acquisition should be lower and their effectiveness therefore effectiveness 0:08:10.280 --> 0:08:15.320 is much higher. Correct some of the portfolio companies, they've 0:08:15.360 --> 0:08:18.560 gone all in. It's literally the end all be all. 0:08:19.080 --> 0:08:23.880 If you talk to the CMO any brand marketer, it's 0:08:23.080 --> 0:08:26.320 a part of their daily lexicon. And then there are 0:08:26.360 --> 0:08:30.280 other portfolio companies where you're just overall concerned for their 0:08:30.320 --> 0:08:34.319 future because they're not talking that way. What are they 0:08:34.320 --> 0:08:36.559 talking about? If they're not talking about this, what are 0:08:36.559 --> 0:08:38.920 they talking about? I would say it's all over the map, 0:08:39.280 --> 0:08:42.840 But there are certain categories that I absolutely feel are 0:08:42.880 --> 0:08:46.840 more standout than others. So, I mean, the beauty brands 0:08:46.880 --> 0:08:49.480 are all over it. I would say they're the most 0:08:49.520 --> 0:08:54.000 progressive of you know, the overall legacy brands UM, and 0:08:54.040 --> 0:08:58.760 then after beauty, uh, you know, consumer electronics, apparel and footwear. 0:08:59.160 --> 0:09:02.800 They're definitely ahead of the races, and I'd say we're 0:09:03.720 --> 0:09:05.480 it's more of a lad But this is one of 0:09:05.520 --> 0:09:08.760 my big best for two thousand nineteen are people who 0:09:08.840 --> 0:09:14.400 are within the food in BEV overall grocery category. I 0:09:14.440 --> 0:09:17.280 think you're gonna you're gonna see people make leaps this year. 0:09:17.360 --> 0:09:22.640 I'm very very bullish on grocery, but it's very new 0:09:22.679 --> 0:09:27.560 to them from a customer standpoint. Within grocery, especially with 0:09:27.640 --> 0:09:32.240 like perishables, we're all becoming a lot more comfortable never 0:09:32.360 --> 0:09:36.560 touching our food before we buy it. So that's more 0:09:36.600 --> 0:09:43.000 of like a societal evolution and combined with more plays 0:09:43.080 --> 0:09:47.200 within the on demand commerce space. Meeting Yah, I buy 0:09:47.320 --> 0:09:49.319 melons in the morning and by the time I get 0:09:49.320 --> 0:09:52.920 home from works at my door. Is why I'm getting 0:09:53.120 --> 0:09:56.240 very very excited about grocery and two thousand nineteen for 0:09:56.559 --> 0:10:02.280 brands to have a different relationship in grocery, that category 0:10:02.440 --> 0:10:04.880 is where things start getting really interesting. And also to 0:10:04.920 --> 0:10:08.240 me is the opportunity where brands can start working with 0:10:08.320 --> 0:10:10.880 when you talk about bundling, thinking about bundling in a 0:10:10.920 --> 0:10:14.600 different way, right um, where brands can work together, where 0:10:14.600 --> 0:10:18.880 there can be new products actually created with shared kind 0:10:18.880 --> 0:10:23.800 of I P or shared data. And you're starting to 0:10:23.840 --> 0:10:26.400 see a lot of the portfolio companies think that way, 0:10:26.559 --> 0:10:29.439 like the brands of these organizations have been mostly siloed, 0:10:29.440 --> 0:10:33.480 and they're absolutely coming together for bigger portfolio plays right now. 0:10:33.600 --> 0:10:37.280 You started really focusing on DTC brands. You spent a 0:10:37.320 --> 0:10:41.560 ton of time last year with big legacy brands. Who 0:10:41.559 --> 0:10:44.079 are you going to put your money on in terms 0:10:44.120 --> 0:10:47.360 of really being competitive and being able to push this 0:10:47.400 --> 0:10:52.240 new mindset but also new practices kind of into the industry, 0:10:52.400 --> 0:10:55.440 they're all becoming one of the same. Meaning, if you 0:10:55.480 --> 0:10:59.320 walk into Target today, you are beginning to see all 0:10:59.360 --> 0:11:02.120 of the Darling direct to consumer brands available on the 0:11:02.160 --> 0:11:07.120 shelves of targets. And the reason being is that one 0:11:07.120 --> 0:11:09.959 of the tradeoffs with D two C is that you 0:11:10.000 --> 0:11:14.520 begin to experience limited reach and growing costs per customer acquisition, 0:11:15.120 --> 0:11:18.520 and if you want to be able to increase your reach, 0:11:19.360 --> 0:11:22.160 you end up on the shelves of Target, and the 0:11:22.240 --> 0:11:25.640 moment you do that, you are no different than the 0:11:25.720 --> 0:11:28.760 legacy brands that you were trying to cut out from 0:11:28.800 --> 0:11:32.320 their market share. So we're starting to get a lot 0:11:32.360 --> 0:11:36.240 of inquiries from all of those brands because they're like, 0:11:36.280 --> 0:11:38.400 wait a second, we've now given up all of our 0:11:38.440 --> 0:11:42.199 first party data. How can we begin to reown that 0:11:42.800 --> 0:11:46.559 and that's been really interesting, and I would say I've 0:11:46.640 --> 0:11:50.240 experienced more and more that over the last six months. 0:11:50.840 --> 0:11:55.040 So there's definitely a big undercurrent happening. And with the 0:11:55.120 --> 0:11:59.920 legacy brands, so they had that massive distribution. But three 0:12:00.000 --> 0:12:04.800 reality is, you know, performance marketing and producing creative that converts. 0:12:05.640 --> 0:12:09.520 It's totally new to them. So the amount of education 0:12:10.320 --> 0:12:13.440 that we need to invest, both on the brand side 0:12:13.559 --> 0:12:16.319 as well as the agency side that services these brands 0:12:17.200 --> 0:12:20.680 is enormous. What you're not saying is that brand is 0:12:20.760 --> 0:12:25.560 less important. You're actually saying brand is actually more important 0:12:25.559 --> 0:12:30.360 as a function to pull through to sale. Oh I 0:12:30.400 --> 0:12:35.360 am the biggest, biggest, biggest pertonent of brand. UM. Brand 0:12:35.720 --> 0:12:41.200 will lower your cost for customer acquisition. Brand will increase 0:12:41.240 --> 0:12:45.679 your recall. UM it is the end all be all 0:12:46.360 --> 0:12:50.680 at and in both situations, you're going to need to 0:12:50.720 --> 0:12:54.320 do both. Like there's there's literally no director consumer brand 0:12:54.440 --> 0:12:59.160 that will not have a wholesale play at some point 0:13:00.320 --> 0:13:02.920 in their company's tractorate. One of the things that I 0:13:02.960 --> 0:13:05.240 love about you is that you don't just talk to talk, 0:13:05.280 --> 0:13:08.520 you walk the walk and inen you developed mic mac 0:13:09.240 --> 0:13:13.480 Academy is that the name and the purpose of that 0:13:13.720 --> 0:13:18.439 was to actually go out and educate brands about the 0:13:18.559 --> 0:13:23.360 use of an implications of working in the social commerce space. 0:13:23.840 --> 0:13:27.440 What led you to create that? I decided to productize 0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:31.160 the educational arm of what we do for a few reasons. 0:13:31.920 --> 0:13:36.640 One is I love it um. It's honestly what energizes me. 0:13:36.800 --> 0:13:39.280 It's one of the favorite parts of what I do 0:13:39.320 --> 0:13:44.720 at Mick mac Um. Two is there's a major skill gap. 0:13:45.679 --> 0:13:52.360 And it's interesting because I personally do not feel any 0:13:52.400 --> 0:13:57.080 of this is rocket science. It's more about access. And 0:13:57.120 --> 0:14:00.840 if you've been put in a job where you never 0:14:00.880 --> 0:14:04.079 were encouraged to go inside of Facebook ad manager and 0:14:04.120 --> 0:14:07.040 start buying ads and experimenting and see how it works, 0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:11.600 then you live in the darkness. And what we try 0:14:11.600 --> 0:14:13.840 to do here at mic mac is explained to everyone. 0:14:14.000 --> 0:14:17.720 This isn't rocket science. We're going to teach you the 0:14:17.800 --> 0:14:21.560 core principles. We're going to sit with you while you 0:14:22.640 --> 0:14:27.640 navigate this new world and allow you to begin to understand, 0:14:28.360 --> 0:14:31.000 uh the effectiveness of the partners that you're working with, 0:14:31.120 --> 0:14:35.560 including me. Right. So, the more I educate the client, 0:14:35.680 --> 0:14:38.760 we're just raising the standards for everyone who's involved. And 0:14:38.800 --> 0:14:41.040 what is the skill gap? Because Alex and I talked 0:14:41.080 --> 0:14:44.040 quite a bit about the talent and the need to 0:14:44.040 --> 0:14:49.120 integrate skill sets that weren't previously needed, let alone train 0:14:49.240 --> 0:14:51.320 for right. So, what are the things that you're seeing 0:14:52.160 --> 0:14:56.720 that the industry needs to be aware of and begin 0:14:56.800 --> 0:15:02.360 to implement? Probably yesterday, I think so over simplify it, uh, 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:05.840 just within like you know, the world that I primarily touch. 0:15:07.440 --> 0:15:11.840 Most of these brands, these legacy brands that are readily 0:15:11.880 --> 0:15:16.920 available at third party retailers, they've been producing creative and 0:15:16.960 --> 0:15:21.120 buying media the same way since you know, the dawn 0:15:21.200 --> 0:15:24.400 of television, which is that the majority of their focus 0:15:24.480 --> 0:15:28.640 has been on awareness. So spray and pray. Let's make 0:15:28.640 --> 0:15:33.400 sure every person under the sun understand what our product is. Secondly, 0:15:33.840 --> 0:15:38.520 let's produce creative that can communicate this mass message more 0:15:38.560 --> 0:15:43.400 often than not through the lens of television. It doesn't 0:15:43.400 --> 0:15:48.440 work online. And what I constantly explain to our partners 0:15:48.480 --> 0:15:51.400 is that there's really just three things that I want 0:15:51.440 --> 0:15:57.880 you to think about. Campaign objectives, niche, audience targeting, and 0:15:58.080 --> 0:16:03.880 creative formats. And so when we sit down with legacy brands, 0:16:04.280 --> 0:16:06.040 one of the first things that we have to do 0:16:06.840 --> 0:16:11.440 is convince them that a portion of their media cannot 0:16:11.480 --> 0:16:15.560 be bought against awareness, It actually has to be bought 0:16:15.800 --> 0:16:21.400 against more bottom of the funnel conversion metrics. The second 0:16:21.440 --> 0:16:27.920 thing is helping them leverage perhaps internal audience data that 0:16:27.960 --> 0:16:31.560 they already have within an existing CRM, or start to 0:16:31.680 --> 0:16:35.720 develop niche audiences that they can use in their ad 0:16:35.720 --> 0:16:41.680 Tiger day. And then the third is producing creative that 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:45.280 is literally designed to get people to add to cart, 0:16:45.840 --> 0:16:50.320 which is a totally different creative muscle. So to boil 0:16:50.400 --> 0:16:55.800 down what's missing is honestly just an understanding of what 0:16:56.920 --> 0:17:01.600 works within performance marketing. I know that MAC advises and 0:17:01.640 --> 0:17:04.440 works on production as well. Are there agencies that you've 0:17:04.480 --> 0:17:10.639 been particularly impressed with in the performance space, that is 0:17:11.000 --> 0:17:15.280 that are actually creating great creative that pulls through to sale. 0:17:15.440 --> 0:17:18.280 I mean, there are great agencies that we work within performance, 0:17:18.320 --> 0:17:25.879 but they're mostly focused on media. Um, what we have 0:17:26.000 --> 0:17:29.080 found to be the most effective creative teams are the 0:17:29.119 --> 0:17:32.880 internal creative teams. They run with the creative best practices, 0:17:33.600 --> 0:17:40.679 there's less ego involved, and they personally are accountable for sales. 0:17:41.080 --> 0:17:44.000 This is a huge white space for an agency. You've 0:17:44.080 --> 0:17:47.320 and I actually think a really great, really great b 0:17:47.440 --> 0:17:52.040 Two B talent needs to come over into this space, 0:17:52.119 --> 0:17:53.760 and I don't know if it's come over. It's like 0:17:53.800 --> 0:17:56.960 they're there, but people aren't thinking about them like this 0:17:57.280 --> 0:17:58.920 because they're in the the you know, the B two 0:17:58.920 --> 0:18:01.960 B world is kind of gone. It's like over on 0:18:02.000 --> 0:18:05.120 the side. So that's what we do right at MCMAC Studios, 0:18:05.359 --> 0:18:09.080 but in complete transparency, Like I don't make money from 0:18:09.160 --> 0:18:14.080 mcmac studios. MICMAC Studios is an enabler for my software 0:18:14.680 --> 0:18:19.880 and the reason why is that the content space is 0:18:20.240 --> 0:18:26.720 so competitive that content has become commoditized and it is very, 0:18:26.920 --> 0:18:31.200 very very hard to make big margins on content. I mean, 0:18:31.200 --> 0:18:33.720 we saw it in the media landscape this year. Digital 0:18:33.720 --> 0:18:38.919 publishers like so uh, it's it's a hard game. And 0:18:38.960 --> 0:18:43.080 that's why, you know, we are in service of training everyone. 0:18:43.200 --> 0:18:47.879 I'll train agencies, We train internal creative teams to be 0:18:48.000 --> 0:18:51.719 able to produce content that converts because wherever the content 0:18:51.760 --> 0:18:54.919 comes from, as long as it follows the key creative 0:18:54.960 --> 0:18:56.920 best practices that we see day in and day out, 0:18:57.119 --> 0:18:59.000 I don't care if I didn't touch the content. We 0:18:59.080 --> 0:19:01.400 are just in service of educating the market on how 0:19:01.440 --> 0:19:03.320 to do this and how to do it at scale. 0:19:04.080 --> 0:19:06.480 But are there things that still surprise you, like questions 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:09.320 that you get asked that you're like moving into, Like 0:19:09.359 --> 0:19:12.480 we can't possibly still be asking that question. Yes, I 0:19:12.480 --> 0:19:16.520 mean like there's obvious things like well, literally receive creative 0:19:16.560 --> 0:19:20.600 where you don't see the product. I mean like you 0:19:20.640 --> 0:19:24.600 know this, this isn't an aspirational perfume commercial where the 0:19:24.600 --> 0:19:27.320 girl's hair is blowing in the winds in a convertible. Like, 0:19:28.040 --> 0:19:30.040 you've got to show the product. Number one, and you 0:19:30.080 --> 0:19:33.199 need to show it right away. Number two is a 0:19:33.240 --> 0:19:36.000 lot of people are still so hesitant to put calls 0:19:36.040 --> 0:19:40.560 to action on their creative. If you want someone to shop, 0:19:40.880 --> 0:19:44.720 you've got to tell them to shop. Um, so you 0:19:44.800 --> 0:19:49.040 know it's it's all obvious things. Uh, you know, developing 0:19:49.200 --> 0:19:52.040 niche creative. So you know we do an enormous amount 0:19:52.040 --> 0:19:55.320 of working beauty. Uh, we do a lot of work 0:19:55.359 --> 0:19:58.359 these days in hair care. I am curly hair. If 0:19:58.359 --> 0:20:00.360 you show me a piece of creative with straight at hair, 0:20:00.480 --> 0:20:04.560 I'm a wasted impression. And meanwhile, we get creative all 0:20:04.600 --> 0:20:09.720 day long. That that doesn't speak to that sedimentation. Um, 0:20:09.760 --> 0:20:11.719 so you know there are obvious things that happened day 0:20:11.760 --> 0:20:15.320 in and day out, but there's internal bureaucracies that often 0:20:15.520 --> 0:20:18.359 handcuffed my clients from being able to change. Let's talk 0:20:18.400 --> 0:20:21.880 about Facebook and talk about you know, your business. I think, 0:20:22.359 --> 0:20:28.800 like many businesses, media publishers, technology companies, creators, creators, in 0:20:28.840 --> 0:20:32.120 the beginning, we're really dependent on Facebook. I don't think 0:20:32.160 --> 0:20:35.560 your business was dependent on Facebook, but Facebook was an 0:20:35.560 --> 0:20:38.280 important platform to your business. How has that changed in 0:20:38.320 --> 0:20:42.040 the last two years and what's the future uh for 0:20:42.080 --> 0:20:44.959 Facebook with your business? But also what are you seeing 0:20:45.400 --> 0:20:47.879 and hearing from brands that you work with in terms 0:20:47.920 --> 0:20:50.960 of are they going to continue to be on that platform, 0:20:51.000 --> 0:20:53.160 are they going to abandon that platform, are they looking 0:20:53.160 --> 0:20:56.400 to replace that platform maybe with the platform of their 0:20:56.440 --> 0:21:01.000 own or otherwise. So when we opened up and I 0:21:01.200 --> 0:21:04.640 introduced mic Mac, you know what I said was were 0:21:04.640 --> 0:21:08.919 the e commerce platform for social video and beyond the end. 0:21:09.240 --> 0:21:15.480 Beyond part is what's very new to the Atlantia audience. So, uh, 0:21:15.640 --> 0:21:17.760 what I began to notice the beginning of two thousand 0:21:17.840 --> 0:21:24.080 eighteen was media budgets were getting consolidated. The essentially were 0:21:24.160 --> 0:21:28.520 centered around Facebook, Google and Amazon, and CPMs were getting 0:21:28.560 --> 0:21:34.080 really expensive and by the end of March of two eighteen, 0:21:34.960 --> 0:21:38.719 I began to feel that media budgets were starting to shift, 0:21:39.440 --> 0:21:45.080 that partners were looking for other alternative places to place 0:21:45.160 --> 0:21:50.480 their dollars to lower that CPM, and partners were coming 0:21:50.480 --> 0:21:53.639 to me and saying, hey, we want to use you 0:21:53.720 --> 0:21:56.560 in programmatic, we want to use you in paid search, 0:21:56.880 --> 0:21:59.159 we want to use you in YouTube, Pinterest, et cetera. 0:22:00.000 --> 0:22:06.480 So this summer, uh Mic Math essentially released a feature 0:22:06.880 --> 0:22:10.960 that allows our partners to traffic us everywhere. And that's 0:22:10.960 --> 0:22:14.280 how my partners use me now. So they put us 0:22:14.320 --> 0:22:16.680 in programmatic, they put us in paid search, they put 0:22:16.760 --> 0:22:20.120 us in YouTube, they put us in interest, and so 0:22:20.320 --> 0:22:23.760 we become the default destination you are l in our 0:22:23.800 --> 0:22:27.960 partners digital and social media period. That is what success 0:22:28.000 --> 0:22:32.960 looks like for us. And in terms of the Facebook ecosystem, 0:22:34.040 --> 0:22:39.760 uh it still has a very strong footing, and the 0:22:39.840 --> 0:22:45.080 reason being is that pretty much the only entities that 0:22:45.119 --> 0:22:49.119 can rival Facebook in the amount of data that is 0:22:49.160 --> 0:22:57.000 available for deep segmentation is Google and Amazon. So that's 0:22:57.040 --> 0:23:02.439 the real realities of the dr landscape. And what we 0:23:02.520 --> 0:23:08.720 have seen though, is with missteps that happen, I have 0:23:08.960 --> 0:23:14.200 seen clients react and typically what happens in those um 0:23:14.440 --> 0:23:18.840 reactionary moments is that they will pause their Facebook media, 0:23:20.200 --> 0:23:24.280 but then they eventually restarted, so they're not and reallocating 0:23:24.280 --> 0:23:30.760 it elsewhere. They're just holding they they hold UM. Sometimes 0:23:30.760 --> 0:23:34.159 will reallocate and they'll give some money to Snap or 0:23:34.200 --> 0:23:38.720 pinterest UM. But it's a temporary thing. And the reason 0:23:38.760 --> 0:23:43.400 why it's temporary is that Facebook is just effective when 0:23:43.440 --> 0:23:47.840 it comes to d R again, Like it's really hard 0:23:47.920 --> 0:23:51.679 to rival the effectiveness of that platform. And the reason being, 0:23:52.280 --> 0:23:54.399 and I think I talked about this in two thousand 0:23:54.480 --> 0:23:58.240 seventeen and I remained to be bullish on it, is 0:23:58.240 --> 0:24:01.880 that Facebook has had their pixel and market for nearly 0:24:02.400 --> 0:24:06.280 seven years now. The amount of audience data that they 0:24:06.320 --> 0:24:10.840 have collected compared to the other social platforms that literally 0:24:10.880 --> 0:24:14.760 only released a pixel last year, like you just can't compare. 0:24:14.800 --> 0:24:17.680 Are there indicators that you've seen in that as we 0:24:17.760 --> 0:24:21.639 moved to we ought to be thinking about in terms 0:24:21.640 --> 0:24:25.400 of channels or platforms that brands are going to need 0:24:25.440 --> 0:24:28.600 to put on their radar quickly, I e. Audio going 0:24:28.640 --> 0:24:31.680 into chatting with you guys, I was thinking about, you know, 0:24:31.920 --> 0:24:35.320 what are my major predictions for two nine? That's where 0:24:35.320 --> 0:24:42.160 we're going and one of them is around alternative distribution. Um. 0:24:42.200 --> 0:24:45.359 So we're seeing this across the board. Uh, you know, 0:24:45.480 --> 0:24:48.199 cost per customer acquisition is getting really high, and a 0:24:48.200 --> 0:24:52.160 lot of the mains popular consumer categories and so now 0:24:52.200 --> 0:24:56.119 you need to diversify. And so I think social is 0:24:56.119 --> 0:25:00.240 going to remain to be a really strong play. Um, 0:25:00.320 --> 0:25:04.439 but in it's not just going to be Facebook. I 0:25:04.520 --> 0:25:07.320 do think that Snap has made an enormous amount of 0:25:07.320 --> 0:25:10.440 investments in their d R ecosystem last year that is 0:25:10.440 --> 0:25:13.199 going to begin to pay off this year. I have 0:25:13.400 --> 0:25:19.400 to say, we continue to see amazing results within YouTube, 0:25:19.960 --> 0:25:23.639 So I'm super bullish on YouTube, and I think that 0:25:23.680 --> 0:25:26.119 they've done a lot in terms of investing in brand 0:25:26.160 --> 0:25:28.320 safety that a lot of people are going to start 0:25:28.320 --> 0:25:32.720 shifting dollars back there. Um. I think that we're going 0:25:32.760 --> 0:25:36.679 to begin to see that messenger is actually going to 0:25:36.720 --> 0:25:40.680 replace our email inbox. So in terms of customer attention, 0:25:40.960 --> 0:25:43.960 loyalty and all the traditional ways you used to convert 0:25:44.000 --> 0:25:46.360 someone via email, I do think it's going to move 0:25:46.400 --> 0:25:49.280 to messenger. To finally, because we've been talking about this 0:25:49.320 --> 0:25:52.240 for four years, do you think finally do you think 0:25:52.680 --> 0:25:56.000 nineteen is the year This happens. Yeah, you're going to 0:25:56.080 --> 0:25:59.360 see it in a really big way within the SMB market. 0:25:59.720 --> 0:26:02.720 And and once we all start to experience that more 0:26:02.800 --> 0:26:04.960 and it becomes a more part of our daily life, 0:26:05.400 --> 0:26:11.560 it will then infiltrate the large brands audio. I see 0:26:11.720 --> 0:26:16.920 you know, continued d our investments in audio. Everyone that 0:26:17.040 --> 0:26:21.359 I speak to in terms of advertising on podcasts continually 0:26:21.400 --> 0:26:25.679 says how strong it is for their business, and so 0:26:26.600 --> 0:26:30.720 I do think that people will start to begin to 0:26:30.880 --> 0:26:35.240 invest more in that uh space, especially from a programmatic lens. 0:26:36.080 --> 0:26:39.679 And then in terms of voice, um, you know, voice 0:26:39.720 --> 0:26:42.720