1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:14,120 Speaker 1: All the media. 2 00:00:11,360 --> 00:00:14,960 Speaker 2: Welcomes it could happen here. I'm Andrew of Future Channel Anturism, 3 00:00:15,640 --> 00:00:18,880 Speaker 2: and last time I was on here discussing political cults generally. 4 00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:22,440 Speaker 2: Today I'm here once again with. 5 00:00:22,960 --> 00:00:26,279 Speaker 3: Oh Garrison, Yes Hello. I am also here to talk 6 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:29,440 Speaker 3: about cults because Andrew told me. 7 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:34,120 Speaker 2: To Yes yes, and I'm the I'm the leader in 8 00:00:34,159 --> 00:00:34,919 Speaker 2: this dynamic. 9 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:39,279 Speaker 3: In many ways, this zoom call is kind of a 10 00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:41,040 Speaker 3: mini cult where you are the leader. 11 00:00:42,800 --> 00:00:45,920 Speaker 2: Indeed, in need, there is nothing except this call. There's 12 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:48,200 Speaker 2: no outside world, there is no cat on your desk. 13 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:53,040 Speaker 2: It is just this the cult. The cat is a revisionist. 14 00:00:54,080 --> 00:00:59,560 Speaker 2: So last episode, we discussed how cults operate, essentially the 15 00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:04,240 Speaker 2: rule coaster emotional ride that individual's experience during cult recruitments, 16 00:01:04,400 --> 00:01:07,400 Speaker 2: where their feelings and ideas are manipulated and they're drawn 17 00:01:07,440 --> 00:01:11,240 Speaker 2: into an exclusive and isolating group. We explore the rigid 18 00:01:11,240 --> 00:01:15,360 Speaker 2: belief system that's created, the immunity to falsification, the authoritarianism, 19 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:20,080 Speaker 2: arbitrary leadership, deification of leaders, intense activism, and the use 20 00:01:20,120 --> 00:01:23,440 Speaker 2: of loaded language. We spoke about the contradictions within political 21 00:01:23,520 --> 00:01:31,480 Speaker 2: cults and the conditions of ideological totalism, and today, as promised, 22 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:34,000 Speaker 2: we're going to look at one political cult leader in 23 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:40,720 Speaker 2: particular whose influence spanned left to right, self described Platonist, 24 00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:47,800 Speaker 2: a presdential conspiracy theorist. The alleged targets of an assassination 25 00:01:47,960 --> 00:01:52,760 Speaker 2: from Queen Elizabeth are once Trotskyist, the one and only, 26 00:01:53,320 --> 00:01:58,040 Speaker 2: the infamous, the loathsome London LaRouche. 27 00:01:58,640 --> 00:02:01,280 Speaker 3: As soon as you said platon is, I knew we 28 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 3: were in for just a horrible time, just just the worst. 29 00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:11,080 Speaker 3: The only people who self described as Platonists are the worst. Actually, 30 00:02:11,680 --> 00:02:14,240 Speaker 3: the last person I knew who self described as a 31 00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:19,280 Speaker 3: Platonist was the target of an assassination because it was 32 00:02:18,880 --> 00:02:25,399 Speaker 3: the daughter of Alexander Dugan was at. 33 00:02:26,880 --> 00:02:29,520 Speaker 2: Anyway, what an interesting cast of characters. 34 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:32,200 Speaker 3: Indeed, indeed, and speaking of. 35 00:02:32,200 --> 00:02:34,360 Speaker 2: Cast of characters, by the way, I should note that 36 00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:38,200 Speaker 2: Tim wall Fourth, one of the cool authors of the book, 37 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:41,040 Speaker 2: that this research was based on the book being on 38 00:02:41,080 --> 00:02:44,240 Speaker 2: the edge particular cults left and right. Tim wall Fourth, 39 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:49,200 Speaker 2: the other author's tenant is Dennis Torrish was a Trotskyist 40 00:02:49,480 --> 00:02:56,840 Speaker 2: called leader at one point, oh like cult underling or whatever. 41 00:02:57,720 --> 00:02:59,800 Speaker 2: But he was kicked out and then he needs a 42 00:02:59,800 --> 00:03:02,359 Speaker 2: cool authored this book to call out some of their 43 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:05,480 Speaker 2: cultish tendencies. If you need that sort of backstory to 44 00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:08,440 Speaker 2: take some of this with the grain of salt, so 45 00:03:08,600 --> 00:03:10,800 Speaker 2: be it. Because, as far as I can tell, Tim 46 00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 2: Warforth and Lynn and laruche actually crossed paths at one point. 47 00:03:17,160 --> 00:03:17,680 Speaker 3: Interesting. 48 00:03:18,600 --> 00:03:21,240 Speaker 2: So, as always, let's start from the beginning and get 49 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:25,360 Speaker 2: an early portrait of this guy. Laroche was born in Rochester, 50 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:30,240 Speaker 2: New Hampshire, in nineteen twenty two, then moved to Lynn, Massachusetts. 51 00:03:30,840 --> 00:03:33,760 Speaker 2: He was the oldest of three children in a Quaker home, 52 00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:36,320 Speaker 2: where eventually his father would be expelled from the local 53 00:03:36,400 --> 00:03:40,280 Speaker 2: Quaker community for his alleged misuse of funds. He then 54 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 2: briefly attended Northeastern University in Boston and left in nineteen 55 00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 2: forty two, at least partly because he believed his teachers 56 00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:51,360 Speaker 2: quote lacked the competence to teach him on conditions he 57 00:03:51,480 --> 00:03:52,520 Speaker 2: was willing to tolerate. 58 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:56,760 Speaker 3: Sure, sure, I'll take a first word on that one. Yeah. 59 00:03:56,840 --> 00:03:58,880 Speaker 4: Yeah. 60 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:02,320 Speaker 2: At first, he was a conscientious objector to enlistment in 61 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:05,560 Speaker 2: World War Two, because you know, Quaker I Instead he 62 00:04:05,680 --> 00:04:09,480 Speaker 2: joined a civilian public service camp in what is what 63 00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 2: you know, which is what conscientious objectors did at the time. 64 00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:16,039 Speaker 2: But Eventually he would enlist with the US Army and 65 00:04:16,160 --> 00:04:19,080 Speaker 2: serve with the Medical Corps in India and boomer which 66 00:04:19,120 --> 00:04:22,560 Speaker 2: is now Myanmar Ye. In nineteen forty six, aboard the 67 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:26,760 Speaker 2: s S, General Bradley Don Morrill met the young soldier 68 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 2: in Laruche and got into it with him about politics 69 00:04:30,200 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 2: and particularly the political optimism of the post World War 70 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:36,600 Speaker 2: Two era what a time, the revolutionary spirit of the 71 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:41,480 Speaker 2: Indian subcontinent, and socialist ideas more broadly. Now, Laruche was 72 00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:45,479 Speaker 2: already sympathetic towards Marx and Trotsky at this point. In fact, 73 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 2: even in his preteens, he was a voracious reader philosophy, 74 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:56,920 Speaker 2: particularly of the German polymath Godfred Wilhelm von leibnizbut leibnizbut 75 00:04:57,279 --> 00:05:01,400 Speaker 2: or however that is pronounced. But ultimately, by the time 76 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:06,839 Speaker 2: they returned to America, LaRouche was a Trotskyist. In brief, 77 00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:09,520 Speaker 2: For those unaware, a Trotskyist is someone who hears the 78 00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 2: principles and politics of Leon Trotsky, who was a prominent 79 00:05:13,200 --> 00:05:16,160 Speaker 2: figure in the early Soviet Union and a key figure 80 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:20,000 Speaker 2: in what I would call co optation of the Russian 81 00:05:20,000 --> 00:05:25,919 Speaker 2: Revolution of nineteen seventy. Trotskyism is distinct from mainstream Leninist 82 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:29,840 Speaker 2: and particularly Stalinist thought, most famously for their rejection of 83 00:05:29,880 --> 00:05:33,600 Speaker 2: socialism in one country and their advocacy of permanent revolution. 84 00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:37,679 Speaker 2: By the time Laruche had returned home in nineteen forty seven, 85 00:05:38,040 --> 00:05:42,320 Speaker 2: he joined his hometown Lynn, Massachusetts, chapter of the Socialist Workers' 86 00:05:42,320 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 2: Party s WP, which was the main American Trotskyist group. Interestingly, 87 00:05:48,800 --> 00:05:52,279 Speaker 2: he took on a party name which really reminds me 88 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:56,159 Speaker 2: of how religious missionaries would give those they converted Christian 89 00:05:56,240 --> 00:06:02,120 Speaker 2: names baptism. So his party name was Lynn Marcus. You 90 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 2: could just see it as a pseudonym for political work. 91 00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:06,680 Speaker 2: Of course, I mean, the CIA and the FBI were 92 00:06:06,760 --> 00:06:10,840 Speaker 2: very active in infiltrating these sorts of groups, so I 93 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:14,360 Speaker 2: understand having like a pseudonym, But I mean, considering we're 94 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:17,520 Speaker 2: talking about cul tendencies and political movements, I couldn't pass 95 00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:21,279 Speaker 2: up on that observation. You know, Don Morrill, who was 96 00:06:21,320 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 2: also from Lynn, Massachusetts, was also part of the SWP 97 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:28,920 Speaker 2: and very active in their union organized and activities. LaRouche 98 00:06:28,920 --> 00:06:34,120 Speaker 2: Tho not so much. He was very intellectually oriented. He 99 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:37,120 Speaker 2: wasn't very into the union scene, and he eventually left 100 00:06:37,120 --> 00:06:39,839 Speaker 2: Massachusetts in nineteen fifty two and settled down in New 101 00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:43,640 Speaker 2: York City. He got married, he had a son, and 102 00:06:43,720 --> 00:06:47,000 Speaker 2: he was focused in his career as an economic consultant 103 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:50,200 Speaker 2: in the shoe industry, with a nice, nice apartment in 104 00:06:50,279 --> 00:06:53,080 Speaker 2: Central Park West. He didn't really have any ties to 105 00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:58,120 Speaker 2: the working class efforts of the s WP, So what now. Well, 106 00:06:58,720 --> 00:07:02,200 Speaker 2: eventually he and his wife separated and he moved in 107 00:07:02,240 --> 00:07:06,360 Speaker 2: with a fellow s WP member known sometimes as Carol White, 108 00:07:06,760 --> 00:07:12,680 Speaker 2: sometimes as Carol Schnitzer, and sometimes as Carol Larabie. And 109 00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:17,160 Speaker 2: then he decided that the WP leadership had the wrong idea. 110 00:07:17,960 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 2: Why they so obsessed with union organizing, Perhaps he should 111 00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 2: be the one calling the shots. You have to understand 112 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:28,480 Speaker 2: something about Laruche. You see, with little involvement or connection 113 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:32,360 Speaker 2: to actual working class struggle and disconnection. You see, with 114 00:07:32,480 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 2: little involvement or connection to actual working class struggle and 115 00:07:36,320 --> 00:07:39,920 Speaker 2: disconnection from the party's activity, he had already begun making 116 00:07:39,960 --> 00:07:42,760 Speaker 2: a right word shift, even while still bearing the banner 117 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:48,000 Speaker 2: of leftism. As an intellectual, he loved his books, including 118 00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:53,600 Speaker 2: Marxist Capital, Rota Luxembourg's The Accumulation of Capital and Hegeld's 119 00:07:53,680 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 2: Logic and his intellectualism naturally fed into his elitism, Drawing 120 00:07:59,880 --> 00:08:03,160 Speaker 2: for Lenin's what is to be Done larushe believes that 121 00:08:03,200 --> 00:08:06,480 Speaker 2: a select intellectual group, which I mean he was clearly 122 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:11,920 Speaker 2: a part of. These professional revolutionaries held a pivotal role 123 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:15,640 Speaker 2: in transforming society, would their task being to gain dominance 124 00:08:15,720 --> 00:08:21,160 Speaker 2: over the less intellectually developed masses. He also borrowed from 125 00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:26,080 Speaker 2: Gramacy's idea of hergemony. He saw himself in competition with 126 00:08:26,160 --> 00:08:29,600 Speaker 2: other intellectuals on the left for leadership over the hearts 127 00:08:29,600 --> 00:08:33,640 Speaker 2: and minds of the dommy masses to undermine the capitalists 128 00:08:33,640 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 2: hold on the working class. But unlike Gramcy, he didn't 129 00:08:37,280 --> 00:08:40,240 Speaker 2: believe the working class was capable of developing its own leaders. 130 00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:44,680 Speaker 2: He was that leader, and he also borrowed from George 131 00:08:44,720 --> 00:08:50,559 Speaker 2: Lucas's concept of class consciousness and the importance of thinkers. 132 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:56,080 Speaker 2: Larush wasn't just a thinker. He saw himself as the thinker, 133 00:08:56,720 --> 00:08:59,520 Speaker 2: the one who would take power and lead the masses 134 00:08:59,800 --> 00:09:03,720 Speaker 2: to freedom. So he was fed up with the SWP 135 00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:08,319 Speaker 2: limiting his clearly elite intellect and ability, and so in 136 00:09:08,400 --> 00:09:12,160 Speaker 2: nineteen sixty five he left and joined a small Trotskise 137 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 2: group called the American Committee for the Fourth International. Yes, 138 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:20,679 Speaker 2: associated with George Healy, who was another left wing cult leader. 139 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:25,760 Speaker 3: A lot of a lot of left wing cults came 140 00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:29,280 Speaker 3: out of the Fourth International, some of which are very cool, 141 00:09:29,559 --> 00:09:30,760 Speaker 3: some of which are not. 142 00:09:30,920 --> 00:09:36,280 Speaker 2: Very cool indeed indeed, but guess what, he didn't like 143 00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:38,520 Speaker 2: the Fourth International. He only stayed there for six months. 144 00:09:38,520 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 2: And apparently Healey did not even like him. I mean, 145 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:45,160 Speaker 2: I wonder why, right, I know, I mean. 146 00:09:45,080 --> 00:09:47,560 Speaker 3: He seems like a very agreeable fellow. 147 00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:50,600 Speaker 2: And not only that, I mean, when have you ever 148 00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:53,400 Speaker 2: heard of cult leaders getting along? You know, call leaders 149 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:55,640 Speaker 2: sent to view other cult leaders as threats to their 150 00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:56,400 Speaker 2: total control. 151 00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:58,760 Speaker 3: You know, it would be funny if there was just 152 00:09:58,800 --> 00:10:02,839 Speaker 3: like a conference for leaders to like share like tactics 153 00:10:02,880 --> 00:10:04,280 Speaker 3: and they all have their dinner together. 154 00:10:06,520 --> 00:10:06,760 Speaker 4: Yeah. 155 00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:09,560 Speaker 2: So laruche pus out of that party. And then he 156 00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:13,080 Speaker 2: joined the Spartassist League, which was another trot party, and 157 00:10:13,160 --> 00:10:16,120 Speaker 2: again he didn't stay for too long. He decided he 158 00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:19,160 Speaker 2: was going to put all those factions and leaders behind 159 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:27,360 Speaker 2: him and declared himself the pioneer of the Fifth INTERNATIONALE. So, 160 00:10:27,400 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 2: for those unaware, the First Workers International from eighteen sixty 161 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:33,880 Speaker 2: four to eighteen seventy six was a coalition of labor 162 00:10:33,920 --> 00:10:37,560 Speaker 2: and socialist groups seeking to promote workers' rights and international solidarity. 163 00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:42,800 Speaker 2: It split because of the irreconcilable differences and divisions between 164 00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:47,800 Speaker 2: the statists and the anarchists. Then in eighteen eighty nine 165 00:10:48,120 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 2: and from then unto nineteen sixteen, the Second Internationale was born. 166 00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:55,840 Speaker 2: That was an organization of socialists and labor parties, this 167 00:10:56,000 --> 00:10:59,319 Speaker 2: time no anarchists allowed, and it was aimed at fostering 168 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:02,880 Speaker 2: cooperation among socialist globally, until it dissolved due to the 169 00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:06,680 Speaker 2: divisions related to World War One. And then in nineteen nineteen, 170 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:11,360 Speaker 2: the Soviet Union founded the Third Internationale or the Common 171 00:11:11,440 --> 00:11:16,160 Speaker 2: Turn to promote worldwide communist revolution and aid communist parties, 172 00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:18,760 Speaker 2: but then it dissolved during World War Two due to 173 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 2: the Soviet German tensions, among other things. And then in 174 00:11:23,120 --> 00:11:27,880 Speaker 2: nineteen thirty eight, Trotsky, who was marginalized and persecuted by Stalin, 175 00:11:28,360 --> 00:11:32,280 Speaker 2: founded the Fourth International as an oppositional alternative to the 176 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:36,880 Speaker 2: Stalin dominated comment tern. Technically, the Fourth International is still 177 00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:41,640 Speaker 2: active today, but it's always been fairly irrelevant beyond small 178 00:11:41,679 --> 00:11:45,439 Speaker 2: bi current sects and ever splinter in splinter groups and 179 00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:48,800 Speaker 2: more than one political cult. So for a Trotskyist like 180 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:52,360 Speaker 2: Laruge to declare a Fifth International is like, you know, 181 00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:54,560 Speaker 2: here we go again. How is it going to match? 182 00:11:54,679 --> 00:11:59,559 Speaker 2: Do this? Nineteen sixty eight picture this a room with 183 00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:03,640 Speaker 2: about fility students sitting on the floor, all eyes fixed 184 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:07,040 Speaker 2: on Lindon LaRouche. After playing a major role in the 185 00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:11,480 Speaker 2: students strike at Columbia University, these students were totally invested 186 00:12:11,559 --> 00:12:15,160 Speaker 2: in this man's every word. They were part of the 187 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:21,200 Speaker 2: National Caucus of Labor Committees lc NCLC, which was affiliated 188 00:12:21,200 --> 00:12:25,839 Speaker 2: with the Students for Democratic Society SDS. Laruche held this 189 00:12:25,920 --> 00:12:29,280 Speaker 2: meet in for a whole seven hours, that's longer than 190 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:34,760 Speaker 2: a church service, and he blended discussions of tactics with 191 00:12:34,960 --> 00:12:39,880 Speaker 2: educational presentations. The SDS had a lot of spirit and action, 192 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 2: but Larush believed that they were a bit short on theory, 193 00:12:43,120 --> 00:12:45,600 Speaker 2: so he was there to fill that void and a 194 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:49,360 Speaker 2: bit more. The gathering marked the early stages of Wild 195 00:12:49,400 --> 00:12:52,880 Speaker 2: lad become a political cult center around Laruge, where he 196 00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:56,920 Speaker 2: served as an intellectual and political gurup, training his followers 197 00:12:56,960 --> 00:13:02,040 Speaker 2: as devoted disciples nach for me, making his disciples feel 198 00:13:02,040 --> 00:13:04,559 Speaker 2: like they were part of an elite club. They believe 199 00:13:04,600 --> 00:13:07,040 Speaker 2: they were the only ones who truly understood the era 200 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:09,720 Speaker 2: they were in and had all the answers to fix 201 00:13:09,800 --> 00:13:14,000 Speaker 2: society's problems. In nineteen seventy, Larush wrote that you should 202 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:19,600 Speaker 2: start with recruiting and educating our revolutionary intelligenzia, mainly young 203 00:13:19,640 --> 00:13:23,040 Speaker 2: intellectuals like these student radicals, rather than the working class, 204 00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:27,360 Speaker 2: because again laruthe thought the working class was stipid. He 205 00:13:27,440 --> 00:13:31,520 Speaker 2: wanted these elite recruits to commit to intensive study and activism, 206 00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:36,800 Speaker 2: particularly of his interpretation of ideas, so they'd lead the charge. 207 00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:39,120 Speaker 2: And I remember at this point Larush was pushing a 208 00:13:39,320 --> 00:13:43,400 Speaker 2: right wing form of Trotskyism. Like Marx, he believed that 209 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:46,199 Speaker 2: capitalism had to keep growing to stay alive. Once it 210 00:13:46,280 --> 00:13:48,280 Speaker 2: hits his limits, it would go into crisis mode and 211 00:13:48,360 --> 00:13:52,480 Speaker 2: eventually collapse. He also shared Marx's idea that human activity 212 00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:55,800 Speaker 2: should be all about progress, particularly the growth of the 213 00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:57,280 Speaker 2: world's productive forces. 214 00:13:57,760 --> 00:14:01,640 Speaker 3: Do you know who's organizing the next International? Actually right now, 215 00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:04,040 Speaker 3: right now, it is in fact that the products and 216 00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:08,120 Speaker 3: service services that sponsor this podcast, So they're making the 217 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:11,680 Speaker 3: great shift the same way anarchism was expunged from the 218 00:14:11,679 --> 00:14:15,160 Speaker 3: Second International. Now communism is going to be expunged from 219 00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:18,360 Speaker 3: this this next upcoming international, and it's just going to 220 00:14:18,360 --> 00:14:22,000 Speaker 3: be capitalists. So here, here, here are the sponsors organizing 221 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:24,320 Speaker 3: the next, the next international. 222 00:14:36,280 --> 00:14:40,200 Speaker 2: Marx thought copalism was just a phase in human society, 223 00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:43,400 Speaker 2: as crises would paved the way for a working class revolution, 224 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:48,160 Speaker 2: which would lead to socialism. Under socialism, the productive forces 225 00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:53,200 Speaker 2: would flourish. Thought those pesky copleist constraints. Laruche came up 226 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:57,200 Speaker 2: with something he called the theory of re industrialization. He 227 00:14:57,320 --> 00:15:01,360 Speaker 2: claimed that copulism, in its third stage of realism, needed 228 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:05,240 Speaker 2: fresh opportunities for capital investment. They even predicted that if 229 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:08,320 Speaker 2: world leaders did not follow his advice, the system was 230 00:15:08,360 --> 00:15:12,760 Speaker 2: on the brink of collapse. Only he and his trained 231 00:15:12,800 --> 00:15:17,280 Speaker 2: followers under his lead, could prevent this catastrophe. By the 232 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:20,400 Speaker 2: late sixties and early seventies, members were giving up their 233 00:15:20,520 --> 00:15:23,320 Speaker 2: jobs and devoting themselves wholly to the cause and the 234 00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:27,640 Speaker 2: leadership of Laruche. They were convinced that the world had 235 00:15:27,680 --> 00:15:32,080 Speaker 2: all the resources needed for an incredible economic transformation. But 236 00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:35,440 Speaker 2: they saw a big problem. They thought the nation's leaders 237 00:15:35,480 --> 00:15:39,360 Speaker 2: were clueless, and of course they didn't think too highly 238 00:15:39,440 --> 00:15:43,920 Speaker 2: the masses, so their solution was getting Linden and Laruxe 239 00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:47,640 Speaker 2: Junior into power or whether he's a junior, ah, but 240 00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:52,440 Speaker 2: their solution was getting Linden Laruz Junior into power as 241 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:56,320 Speaker 2: soon as possible, and then he would lead the trade 242 00:15:56,400 --> 00:16:01,280 Speaker 2: unions that take over America. He expected their support and 243 00:16:01,360 --> 00:16:03,720 Speaker 2: if they were slacking in their activism, he would call 244 00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:07,440 Speaker 2: them out. Borrowing from the confrontational therapy with the new 245 00:16:07,440 --> 00:16:12,160 Speaker 2: age for psychology cults, Lrush began holding ego stripping sessions. 246 00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:15,720 Speaker 2: Anyone who failed in a political task was subjected to 247 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:19,840 Speaker 2: pure psychological terror as everyone attacked them and tore apart 248 00:16:19,880 --> 00:16:23,200 Speaker 2: their past and personal life in front of the whole group. 249 00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:28,640 Speaker 2: And because cults, and because cults and sex and inevitable 250 00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:32,800 Speaker 2: combination like madness and badness, Larush also launched a campaign 251 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:39,480 Speaker 2: against the sexual impotence of his membership. Apparently Carol left 252 00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:43,480 Speaker 2: him for a disciple of the movement. Interesting his name 253 00:16:43,520 --> 00:16:46,760 Speaker 2: was Christopher White, and they went to England to set 254 00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:51,400 Speaker 2: up a chapter of the NCLC. So that's probably why 255 00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:55,120 Speaker 2: he got a little bit unhinged. But that's not the 256 00:16:55,120 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 2: worst of it. I can't not mention Operation mop Up 257 00:17:00,720 --> 00:17:04,639 Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy three, Laruge fully shifted the group's political 258 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:08,960 Speaker 2: stands from being far left to far right. Armed with bats, 259 00:17:09,080 --> 00:17:13,160 Speaker 2: chains and martial arts, Gale his supporters physically attacked members 260 00:17:13,160 --> 00:17:16,359 Speaker 2: of the Socialist Workers' Party and the Communist Party for 261 00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:18,880 Speaker 2: He declared that he intended to wipe these rival parties 262 00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:21,400 Speaker 2: off the map, going as far as to threaten their 263 00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:26,520 Speaker 2: families as well. But it didn't stop there. He extended 264 00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:29,520 Speaker 2: his attacks to groups like the Revolutionary Communist Party, the 265 00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:34,320 Speaker 2: October League, and the Progressive Labor Party. Essentially, Laruche want 266 00:17:34,359 --> 00:17:39,359 Speaker 2: to establish dominance through these physical confrontations. There were at 267 00:17:39,480 --> 00:17:43,280 Speaker 2: least six day reported assaults during this time, and the 268 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:46,439 Speaker 2: whole operation only ended when the police stepped in and 269 00:17:46,560 --> 00:17:52,360 Speaker 2: arrested some of Larushe's followers. Interestingly, though, there weren't any convictions, 270 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:56,359 Speaker 2: and Laruche insisted that his people were only acted in 271 00:17:56,359 --> 00:17:59,480 Speaker 2: self defense. But here's where get a little bit mokier. 272 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:05,440 Speaker 2: Journalist and Laruse biographer Dennis King suggested that the FBI 273 00:18:06,119 --> 00:18:08,320 Speaker 2: may have played a role in stirring up trouble among 274 00:18:08,359 --> 00:18:12,240 Speaker 2: these groups. Do we have used tactics like sending anonymous 275 00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:15,359 Speaker 2: mailings to keep these groups in each other's throats, so 276 00:18:15,760 --> 00:18:17,200 Speaker 2: you know, plot thickens. 277 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:20,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that way, that was very typical kind 278 00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:24,080 Speaker 3: of conel Pro stuff that was happening around this time period. 279 00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:29,280 Speaker 2: That would not surprise me. Yeah, it's safe to say though, 280 00:18:29,359 --> 00:18:32,560 Speaker 2: in this period of Larush's life, all the folks on 281 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:34,520 Speaker 2: the left were wondering if he was really still one 282 00:18:34,520 --> 00:18:43,760 Speaker 2: of their own. Back to nineteen seventy three, Carol and Christopher, 283 00:18:45,720 --> 00:18:48,600 Speaker 2: like I said, they were going to the UK to 284 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:53,639 Speaker 2: set up their own version of the NCLC, but then 285 00:18:53,680 --> 00:18:55,280 Speaker 2: the Rush called them back to the US for a 286 00:18:55,359 --> 00:19:03,119 Speaker 2: national conference, and during the flight, Stepher lost it. He 287 00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:06,240 Speaker 2: started yelling that the CIA had plans to off Lwerby 288 00:19:07,480 --> 00:19:13,320 Speaker 2: and the Rouche, Carol, Larbie and the Rush. The plane 289 00:19:13,359 --> 00:19:16,639 Speaker 2: was an utter chaos. So Carol reached out to the 290 00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:21,200 Speaker 2: Rouge and they decided to work together to deprogram Christopher. 291 00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:29,400 Speaker 2: What we mean deprogrammed Christopher? I'm glad you asked. 292 00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:35,359 Speaker 3: I think we have mentioned called deprogramming before, kind of 293 00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:38,439 Speaker 3: been passing, but never never too much on it. 294 00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:42,240 Speaker 2: I think yes. What I mean in this instance, though, 295 00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:46,040 Speaker 2: is not that they were trying to inculcate him into 296 00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:51,359 Speaker 2: the cult or deprogram him from mainstream ideology. You see 297 00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:55,880 Speaker 2: in his Rantins and Ravens on the plane, Christopher claimed 298 00:19:55,920 --> 00:19:59,639 Speaker 2: he was a Manchurian candidate who had been tortured by 299 00:19:59,640 --> 00:20:03,560 Speaker 2: the CI and British intelligence in a London basement. He 300 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:06,439 Speaker 2: then said he was programmed to do some stuff like 301 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:10,440 Speaker 2: often his wife and setting up Laruge for a watery 302 00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:16,840 Speaker 2: demise by Cuba and exile frogmen. So that's the kind 303 00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:22,880 Speaker 2: of deep program and they intended to carry out Hmmm. 304 00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:27,439 Speaker 3: I have some notes, but I suppose I'll just let 305 00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:28,320 Speaker 3: them do their thing. 306 00:20:29,359 --> 00:20:32,040 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, So Christopher was saying that he was a 307 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:35,440 Speaker 2: Manchurian candidate, and so then the whole group was in 308 00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:41,639 Speaker 2: a frenzy. LaRouche and his disciples were releasing statements left 309 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:44,880 Speaker 2: and right, training their members and how to spot other 310 00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:50,960 Speaker 2: Manchurian candidates and how to handle CIA torture. And here's 311 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:55,520 Speaker 2: what I guess, really crazy. One of the members, Alice Weitzman, 312 00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:03,040 Speaker 2: she made a critical mistake in a political cult. She doubted. 313 00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:08,840 Speaker 2: She didn't believe the whole CIA story that Christopher was pushing, 314 00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:13,480 Speaker 2: and Larush didn't like that she didn't believe, and so 315 00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:17,199 Speaker 2: Larush was like, oh, you don't believe that the CIA 316 00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:20,560 Speaker 2: is infiltrating us right now, then you must be a 317 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:25,720 Speaker 2: CIA agent. So he sends a squad of six members 318 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:29,560 Speaker 2: of his cult to Wisman's apartment and they held her 319 00:21:29,560 --> 00:21:35,399 Speaker 2: a hostage and cranked up Beethoven music to deafening levels. 320 00:21:36,560 --> 00:21:42,800 Speaker 2: Why because Laruche believed that Beethoven's tunes could somehow deprogram 321 00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:49,639 Speaker 2: Manchurian candidates. Whitesman managed to toss out a note through the 322 00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:52,119 Speaker 2: window and a passerby picked it up and alerted the police, 323 00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:55,639 Speaker 2: so she was rescued, but then she chose not to 324 00:21:55,680 --> 00:22:02,640 Speaker 2: press charges against her captives. Larusha turned this party at 325 00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:06,840 Speaker 2: this point, with one thousand members in three seven offices 326 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:09,680 Speaker 2: in North America and twenty six in Europe and Latin America, 327 00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:15,320 Speaker 2: into an extreme right, anti Semitic organization, despite the presence 328 00:22:15,320 --> 00:22:21,560 Speaker 2: of Jewish members. In fact, Carol herself was Jewish and 329 00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:25,119 Speaker 2: she stuck around Dennis King. The biographer's book called Earlier 330 00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:30,920 Speaker 2: found a deep connection between LaRouche and fascist and United groups. 331 00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:36,080 Speaker 2: Nearly eighties. Laruche used a Strategic Defense Initiative or star 332 00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:40,000 Speaker 2: Wars to bring together far right forces from Europe and America. 333 00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:46,520 Speaker 2: He was even promoting like Revanism and defending Nazi war criminals. 334 00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:51,160 Speaker 2: And he was known for blending his usual conspiracy theories 335 00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:55,840 Speaker 2: with anti Semitism, particularly towards the British. He blamed the 336 00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:59,959 Speaker 2: Rothschild for running Great Britain, and he was a typical 337 00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:04,919 Speaker 2: Holocaust denial. Yeah, I really, I generally wonder why Carol 338 00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:08,520 Speaker 2: left him, but I also wonder why she stuck around 339 00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:13,680 Speaker 2: in the group. Anyway. The Anti Defamation League labeled the 340 00:23:13,720 --> 00:23:17,520 Speaker 2: Rushes NCLC as the closest thing to an American fascist party, 341 00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:22,399 Speaker 2: and well, it begs the question what was life like 342 00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:23,120 Speaker 2: in that party? 343 00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:23,800 Speaker 3: Yeah? 344 00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:28,000 Speaker 2: I mean I remember you Garrison describing a good party 345 00:23:28,840 --> 00:23:30,399 Speaker 2: as a color and. 346 00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:34,680 Speaker 3: See, I think part of part of the problem is 347 00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:37,720 Speaker 3: when you know, a house party turns into a political 348 00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:39,000 Speaker 3: party and then. 349 00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:40,359 Speaker 2: Turns into a fascist party. 350 00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:43,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, that never ends. 351 00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:42,320 Speaker 4: Yea. 352 00:23:44,280 --> 00:23:47,120 Speaker 2: So Larush was using these really sneaky tactics to drive 353 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:51,600 Speaker 2: a wedge between Laruge members and their families, partners, and spouses. 354 00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:57,040 Speaker 2: There were members of Laruciu's elite who convinced one person 355 00:23:57,240 --> 00:24:00,280 Speaker 2: that their own dad was laundering money secret leave for 356 00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:04,960 Speaker 2: the drug trade. This organization was telling their members where 357 00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:08,400 Speaker 2: they could live, what carter buy, went to quit their jobs, 358 00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:11,240 Speaker 2: what they should read, what they should watch, how to 359 00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 2: scam their parents out of money, how and when to 360 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:16,960 Speaker 2: break up with their partners. 361 00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:18,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a. 362 00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:20,320 Speaker 4: Yeah. 363 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:23,320 Speaker 2: And then while all this is going on, lari movement 364 00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:26,760 Speaker 2: is also swapping out the red flags of Trotskyism for 365 00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 2: good old or red, white and blue. Members were soon 366 00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:34,560 Speaker 2: educated with the ideas of Alexander Hamilton. 367 00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:36,520 Speaker 3: Right, oh god. 368 00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:40,280 Speaker 2: Hamilton's economic policies were basically the American version of what 369 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:44,720 Speaker 2: Marx represented in Europe, according to Laruge, And forget about Marx. 370 00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:48,520 Speaker 2: They're not reading Marx anymore. Now, they're reading Plato and Dante. 371 00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:52,520 Speaker 2: In nineteen eighty they even told the members to vote 372 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:53,040 Speaker 2: for Reagan. 373 00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:57,879 Speaker 3: Yeah, cool stuff, cool stuff, cool stuff. They dropped their 374 00:24:57,920 --> 00:25:02,280 Speaker 3: left platonist philosopher Ronald Reges. 375 00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:05,760 Speaker 2: Yeah. They basically dropped any ven air of left lean 376 00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:08,480 Speaker 2: in in their recruitment tactics. And then they started doing 377 00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:14,040 Speaker 2: things like soliciting people at airports and bus terminals. And 378 00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:16,720 Speaker 2: these members they were caught in this whirlwind. They didn't 379 00:25:16,720 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 2: have time to read, to think, to get a decent 380 00:25:18,920 --> 00:25:21,879 Speaker 2: night's sleep. They were working twelve hour shifts and getting 381 00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:24,720 Speaker 2: paid peanuts, like one hundred dollars one hundred and twenty 382 00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:27,120 Speaker 2: five dollars a week, and sometimes they'd even get paid 383 00:25:27,119 --> 00:25:30,600 Speaker 2: at all. They were in a constant state of mobilization, 384 00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:35,480 Speaker 2: living an adrenaline ready for anything, And finally, in nineteen 385 00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:38,399 Speaker 2: eighty one, around three hundred and six hundred people decided 386 00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:42,159 Speaker 2: they had had enough and left the organization. Some of 387 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:45,359 Speaker 2: them were formal leftists, but not all those who stuck 388 00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:50,840 Speaker 2: around with the die hard cult members completely under Larusia's control. 389 00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:06,640 Speaker 2: Would it surprise you gun to learn that the Rush 390 00:26:06,760 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 2: was a scammer? 391 00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:13,919 Speaker 3: Oh, you're saying that the person involved in in running 392 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:18,320 Speaker 3: the cult was also a prolific grifter, as someone who 393 00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:21,560 Speaker 3: tried to scam other people are really really. 394 00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:23,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, A lot of people don't know this, but cult 395 00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 2: leaders and scammers actually go hand in hand. 396 00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:28,560 Speaker 3: Ah yeah. Yeah. 397 00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:31,720 Speaker 2: The Rush was a master of operating through a network 398 00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:37,000 Speaker 2: of front organizations. He created the Fusion Energy Foundation, getting 399 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:40,800 Speaker 2: support from nuclear and aerospace industries to run a private 400 00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:45,080 Speaker 2: intelligence to this focusing on terrorists and drug cartels. Get this. 401 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:48,800 Speaker 2: He even met with top officials from the National Security 402 00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:52,240 Speaker 2: Council and the CIA in the eighties. Despite his parannoy 403 00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:55,960 Speaker 2: about the CIA, and he somehow managed to get White 404 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:57,199 Speaker 2: House access. 405 00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:03,080 Speaker 3: What yeah, yeah, why how. 406 00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:09,000 Speaker 2: Yeah. He eventually infiltrated the Democratic Party and ran for 407 00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:13,120 Speaker 2: president several times, and he launched the Proposition sixty four 408 00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:17,040 Speaker 2: initiative in California in the eighties, aimant to impose strict 409 00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:21,280 Speaker 2: public health policies for AIDS, which public health officials rejected. 410 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:24,840 Speaker 2: But basically he was instrumental and spreading a lot of 411 00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:28,399 Speaker 2: unnecessary fear about AIDS. In fact, he was advocating for 412 00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:31,080 Speaker 2: lynch mobs to deal with the AIDE crisis. 413 00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:34,360 Speaker 3: Oh so he wasn't like spreading good health information when 414 00:27:34,359 --> 00:27:37,560 Speaker 3: everyone was ignoring the problem. He was being like, we should, 415 00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:38,680 Speaker 3: we should just killed everybody. 416 00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:40,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, pretty much? 417 00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:43,360 Speaker 3: Okay, I got h But you know. 418 00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:47,359 Speaker 2: Every scammer has their day, and one of his scams 419 00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:50,840 Speaker 2: got him in the pen. You see, laruche had a 420 00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:53,959 Speaker 2: knack for recruit in the offspring of the wealthy and 421 00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:58,920 Speaker 2: separating them from their money. To put it euphemistically, One 422 00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:04,840 Speaker 2: of his most famous fruits was Lewis DuPont Smith A 423 00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:09,760 Speaker 2: DuPont here that DuPont who gave a whop in two 424 00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:13,639 Speaker 2: hundred and twelve thousand dollars to Laruge. He even moved 425 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:18,479 Speaker 2: close to Laruge, but eventually the DuPont family intervened, had 426 00:28:18,520 --> 00:28:21,480 Speaker 2: him declared mentally ill and put him on a monthly stipend. 427 00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:26,679 Speaker 2: Still Laruche was making a royal bank. His empire was growing. 428 00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:29,320 Speaker 2: He had one hundred and seventy two acre as state 429 00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:32,879 Speaker 2: in Virginia serving as his center of operations, which had 430 00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:36,920 Speaker 2: phone banks, offices, a printing plant guarded twenty four to 431 00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:42,560 Speaker 2: seven by armed individuals. But the Empire of LaRouche eventually 432 00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:46,080 Speaker 2: went into a decline. This lost for publicity caught the 433 00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:49,760 Speaker 2: attention of the public and federal officials, and his phone 434 00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:53,320 Speaker 2: bank operator started making an unauthorized credit card withdrawals. 435 00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:56,959 Speaker 3: I mean he he was like going to the White House. 436 00:28:57,720 --> 00:29:00,920 Speaker 3: How did he how did he? He like trying to 437 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:05,720 Speaker 3: stay under the federal radar. He was literally in the 438 00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:08,360 Speaker 3: in the one spot, the one. 439 00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:15,479 Speaker 2: Place exactly exactly. It's it's baffling, But Dennis Kidding has 440 00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:17,600 Speaker 2: a book all about it, so you could check it out. 441 00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:22,760 Speaker 2: In nineteen eighty seven, he faced a trial on credit 442 00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:27,160 Speaker 2: card fraud and conspiracy to obstruct justice, which ended in 443 00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:30,560 Speaker 2: a mistrial. Then a subsequent trial convicted him out in 444 00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:33,240 Speaker 2: various charges, and he ended up in a federal penitentiary 445 00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:37,720 Speaker 2: in nineteen eighty nine. And what do all great cult leaders, 446 00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:39,560 Speaker 2: or what do many great cult leaders do when they 447 00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:43,680 Speaker 2: in jail? Some of them write book books. 448 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:48,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, all right, all right, I'm back on now. Okay. 449 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:52,960 Speaker 2: So Lurci decided to write a book called In Defense 450 00:29:53,000 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 2: of Common Sense. It's a mix of obscure geometric illustrations, 451 00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:05,840 Speaker 2: defense of Platonism, attributes to the seventeenth century astronomer Johannes Kepler, 452 00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:11,160 Speaker 2: and some heavy denunciations of philosophers like Kan't and most 453 00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:14,320 Speaker 2: philosophers post Plato. In fact, as far as Larus was concerned, 454 00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:17,080 Speaker 2: every philosopher after Plato sucked. 455 00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:21,040 Speaker 3: That's so funny, that's really funny. 456 00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:25,960 Speaker 2: Incredibly, But at its core his book In Defense of 457 00:30:25,960 --> 00:30:31,280 Speaker 2: Common Sense was laruse re stating his modernist, somehow marks 458 00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:36,640 Speaker 2: inspired worldview. We argue that scientific and technological progress set 459 00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:40,200 Speaker 2: humanity apart from all other creatures, and it naturally leads 460 00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:43,960 Speaker 2: to increased population density. In Larucie's eyes, there's no room 461 00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:47,120 Speaker 2: for any entropic view that suggests a limit to human 462 00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:52,120 Speaker 2: technology and population growth. Even coined the term neganthropic to 463 00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:56,480 Speaker 2: advocate for ongoing industrial and population expansion no matter what. 464 00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:01,520 Speaker 2: All right, So then if you didn't, okay, maybe you 465 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:03,480 Speaker 2: listen to this and you're like, none of this is 466 00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:06,960 Speaker 2: all dramatic and wild or whatever. Here's where it gets 467 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:09,680 Speaker 2: even wilder. This is where we get to the intersection 468 00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:17,000 Speaker 2: of Lynn Laruche and Elon Musk that we colonize Mars. 469 00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:22,360 Speaker 3: Well, I mean, honestly the whole his other what was 470 00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:28,040 Speaker 3: the term he just said, like ner Trup, Yeah, that 471 00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:31,680 Speaker 3: that is pretty similar to Musk's ideology as well, though 472 00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:33,160 Speaker 3: pretty much. 473 00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:39,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, And so LaRue says, let's go, let's colonize Mars, 474 00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:42,080 Speaker 2: and what's that's done? In about forty years according to 475 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:46,920 Speaker 2: his estimation, then his philosophical standpoint will clearly rule all 476 00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:51,360 Speaker 2: of humanity for all of time. But while the Rush 477 00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:55,520 Speaker 2: is deep in thought, behind bars his followers, they're not 478 00:31:55,560 --> 00:31:58,920 Speaker 2: twiddling their thumbs. They joined forces with other anti war 479 00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:04,680 Speaker 2: demonstrators pose the Gulf War in nineteen ninety nineteen ninety one. 480 00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:06,680 Speaker 2: And you know, it's interesting to note that the NCLC 481 00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:08,880 Speaker 2: was not the only voice from the right among those 482 00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:14,520 Speaker 2: left wing demonstrators. Pat Buchanan the Populist Party, the Liberty Lobby, 483 00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:17,280 Speaker 2: and other ultra right and other ultra right and neo 484 00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:21,360 Speaker 2: isolationist groups formed a sort of united front with elements 485 00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:24,040 Speaker 2: of the left in terms of that opposition to the 486 00:32:24,040 --> 00:32:30,120 Speaker 2: Gulf War and Laruche was eventually released on parole in 487 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,400 Speaker 2: nineteen ninety four, and by nineteen ninety eight, during the 488 00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:39,560 Speaker 2: economic crisis, the Rush was demanding that Bill Clinton appoint 489 00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:43,400 Speaker 2: him immediately as an economic advisor. 490 00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:46,240 Speaker 3: Sounds like a good idea. Yeah, now he seems, he 491 00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:47,880 Speaker 3: seems well qualified. 492 00:32:48,200 --> 00:32:51,880 Speaker 2: And I coulte it was now time to abandon crisis 493 00:32:51,920 --> 00:32:57,160 Speaker 2: management and Chile Shaian in other words, democracy. Laruge believed 494 00:32:57,160 --> 00:33:01,400 Speaker 2: in the inherent tendency of popular opinion towards me mediocrity. 495 00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:05,120 Speaker 2: The very tendency to rely upon collective decisions rather than 496 00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:09,280 Speaker 2: decisions based upon foundation of principle is itself a wellspring 497 00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:13,480 Speaker 2: of mediocrity, he fully explained to proposed as symbol of 498 00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:18,000 Speaker 2: virtual rabel decision makers, usually featuring those parties who are 499 00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:20,640 Speaker 2: still advocates of the policies which have caused and advocated 500 00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:24,040 Speaker 2: the crisis, is scarcely a noble enterprise, nor a fruitful one. 501 00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:28,440 Speaker 2: Some relatively few in the position to influence directives must 502 00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:31,360 Speaker 2: preempt the situation, just in case there should be any 503 00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:35,160 Speaker 2: question as to Laruci's concept of governance. He declared China 504 00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:37,520 Speaker 2: to be probably one of the best governments in the 505 00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:40,640 Speaker 2: world to be in terms of quality of leadership, the 506 00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:45,360 Speaker 2: kind of leadership required to get through crisis. Laruche, like 507 00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:49,960 Speaker 2: Mussolini and Hitler before him, borrowed from Marx and then 508 00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:51,719 Speaker 2: changed his theories completely. 509 00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:52,760 Speaker 3: Yeah. 510 00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:57,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, Marx's internationalist outcolook was abandoned in favor of the 511 00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:00,760 Speaker 2: nation state. Marx's goal of abolish and capitalism replaced by 512 00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:05,880 Speaker 2: a model of a tutalitarian state that is still primarily 513 00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:09,759 Speaker 2: in the hands of private corporations and their owners, who, 514 00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:13,680 Speaker 2: by the way, would have to take orders from the rouge. Now. 515 00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:23,160 Speaker 2: Hitler called his national so his schema national socialist socialism interesting, curious. 516 00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:26,799 Speaker 2: Larusha was a fan, but he was like, you know, 517 00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:30,160 Speaker 2: let's add a little spice, let's give it some American branded. 518 00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:35,480 Speaker 2: So Larush called his system and ideology the American system. 519 00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:36,960 Speaker 3: It's a little bit less catchy. 520 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:41,240 Speaker 2: I gotta say, yeah, I mean, that's that's the story. 521 00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:42,560 Speaker 2: Other than the rush. 522 00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:48,440 Speaker 3: He died obviously, most people do. There's there's only a 523 00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:52,520 Speaker 3: few that have not died Enoch and I think I 524 00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:55,640 Speaker 3: think like one or two others, but most people, most 525 00:34:55,640 --> 00:34:57,360 Speaker 3: people do do in fact die. 526 00:34:57,840 --> 00:35:02,399 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, he was quite the guy. He died into 527 00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:03,800 Speaker 2: onto nineteen by. 528 00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:06,240 Speaker 3: The way, Oh no, that that recent. 529 00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:08,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, he lived a really long time. He had 530 00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:10,719 Speaker 2: He lived for a hundred years for Cornald. 531 00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:15,200 Speaker 3: Load did not realize he was still kicking around so 532 00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:15,840 Speaker 3: so recently. 533 00:35:16,400 --> 00:35:22,239 Speaker 4: Yeah, gone too soon him a right, yeah, yeah, absolutely, 534 00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:25,879 Speaker 4: at least at least now he's in heaven with Ruth 535 00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:26,640 Speaker 4: Bader Ginsburg. 536 00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:28,440 Speaker 3: That's that's yeah, that's why. 537 00:35:28,760 --> 00:35:30,239 Speaker 2: Why do the good die young? You know? 538 00:35:32,520 --> 00:35:33,960 Speaker 3: Oh, he was just a kid. 539 00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:40,640 Speaker 2: So as we conclude our journey and the enigmatic will 540 00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:43,319 Speaker 2: live in the rouge, I think we left with more 541 00:35:43,400 --> 00:35:48,040 Speaker 2: questions and answers. How did a man on the fringe 542 00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:52,640 Speaker 2: of radical politics end up in the White House? 543 00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:56,080 Speaker 3: Yeah? That is that is That is one question I 544 00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:59,319 Speaker 3: actually still have thinking about his What what were the 545 00:35:59,360 --> 00:36:02,799 Speaker 3: conditions to his White House visits and. 546 00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:06,000 Speaker 2: What led to his transformation from a committed leftist to 547 00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:07,960 Speaker 2: a fascist. I mean I think we could see the 548 00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:09,000 Speaker 2: science of that right early. 549 00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:10,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, yeah, in. 550 00:36:10,640 --> 00:36:14,560 Speaker 2: The sixties, the Rouge displayed egotism and hints of instability, 551 00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:19,400 Speaker 2: but he was also an intelligent individual who attracted serious intellectuals. 552 00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:26,719 Speaker 2: His ideas, well sometimes peculiar, were generally rational because the 553 00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:30,280 Speaker 2: adulation of students allowed him to gather a following around 554 00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:35,239 Speaker 2: his ideas and personality. The collapse of student radicalism the 555 00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:37,640 Speaker 2: seventies that the stage from his shift from left to 556 00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:41,120 Speaker 2: right and the unwavering loyalty of his followers likely reinforced 557 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:44,799 Speaker 2: his increasingly psychotic worldview and perception of his role in it. 558 00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:49,840 Speaker 2: The Rush was convinced that he deserved worship, that he 559 00:36:49,920 --> 00:36:55,120 Speaker 2: was an intellect. He was fueled by his ideology of catastrophism, 560 00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:58,799 Speaker 2: that he, as the elite, would play a significant role 561 00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:05,040 Speaker 2: as savior of mnity. The practices of his organization resembled 562 00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:09,440 Speaker 2: many of the extreme religious thought control groups UH. The 563 00:37:09,640 --> 00:37:13,200 Speaker 2: practice of ideological totalism is very clear, The authoritarian structure 564 00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,239 Speaker 2: is very clear. The paranoia foster to create a clear 565 00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:19,480 Speaker 2: boundaries in the group and the outside world don't be likely. 566 00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:23,799 Speaker 3: The l aruche please please. 567 00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:28,319 Speaker 2: And watch out for his I want to be is 568 00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:33,280 Speaker 2: I feel like Mopin is the Laroche of this generation. 569 00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:37,120 Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, I mean, I hope. I don't see 570 00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:43,320 Speaker 3: Mappin getting invited to the White House anytime soon, nor 571 00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:48,440 Speaker 3: other characters like like Chairman Bob. Yeah, I don't know. 572 00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:51,080 Speaker 3: We live in a different time. I think because of 573 00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:54,200 Speaker 3: how the Internet works, there's a lot there's there's much 574 00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:57,720 Speaker 3: more cult leaders just dispersed everywhere all the time. 575 00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:02,440 Speaker 2: But it's almost it's almost the democratization of cult leadership. 576 00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:05,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, but it's also made them more or less isolated 577 00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:10,200 Speaker 3: to the Internet with occasional flare ups in the real world, 578 00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:14,080 Speaker 3: which kind of which kind of limits their engagement with 579 00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:18,399 Speaker 3: you know, normal people, so to speak. It's kind of. 580 00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:22,080 Speaker 2: Help cults, right, they can't even communicate with people outside 581 00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:22,800 Speaker 2: of them anymore. 582 00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:25,400 Speaker 3: Yeah, And I think part of part of that is 583 00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:28,520 Speaker 3: definitely happening here on on on on the Internet, where 584 00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:32,640 Speaker 3: there's just so many of them that they they're all 585 00:38:32,760 --> 00:38:36,200 Speaker 3: very small, they're all very isolated, and they don't ever 586 00:38:36,239 --> 00:38:38,160 Speaker 3: really break out of their bubble, which which you know 587 00:38:38,280 --> 00:38:40,880 Speaker 3: is common with with with a lot of a lot 588 00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:41,360 Speaker 3: of cults. 589 00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:41,560 Speaker 4: Right. 590 00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:44,680 Speaker 3: The ones that we only really know about or hear 591 00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:47,359 Speaker 3: about are the ones that you know, ended up doing 592 00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:50,880 Speaker 3: some big, big horrific thing at some point you know, 593 00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:54,440 Speaker 3: in that that generated you know a lot of eyeballs 594 00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:57,680 Speaker 3: on them. But for every for every Heaven's Gate, there's like, 595 00:38:58,280 --> 00:39:00,799 Speaker 3: you know, a dozen New Age holds that just fly 596 00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:04,600 Speaker 3: right under the radar that are still like horribly horribly abusive. 597 00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:06,399 Speaker 2: They just still going on to this day. 598 00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:09,360 Speaker 3: Yeah, they just they just might not be tied to 599 00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:13,719 Speaker 3: like a horrific act of like mass murder and mass suicide. 600 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:16,720 Speaker 2: And that's a scary thoughts. You know how many cults 601 00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:19,839 Speaker 2: have not yet break broken containment as it will. 602 00:39:21,080 --> 00:39:25,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, it's uh, it's a fun time to to 603 00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:26,160 Speaker 3: be alive. 604 00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:30,879 Speaker 2: Surely indeed, So yeah, I mean, I hope, I hope 605 00:39:30,880 --> 00:39:36,200 Speaker 2: that the audience has enjoyed this cautionary tale, a reminder 606 00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:41,239 Speaker 2: of the profound and sometimes dangerous paths the ideology can 607 00:39:41,280 --> 00:39:47,200 Speaker 2: take individuals and groups down. Once again, I'm Andrew, and Andrew. 608 00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:54,840 Speaker 2: This is Garrison of Garrison of of myself. Yes, and 609 00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:55,920 Speaker 2: this has been it can happening. 610 00:39:56,640 --> 00:40:03,960 Speaker 1: Peace, It could happen here as a production of cool 611 00:40:04,040 --> 00:40:06,960 Speaker 1: Zone Media. For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit 612 00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:09,680 Speaker 1: our website coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on 613 00:40:09,719 --> 00:40:13,279 Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio, app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts, 614 00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:15,960 Speaker 1: you can find sources for It could happen here, Updated 615 00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:20,080 Speaker 1: monthly at coolzonemedia dot com, slash sources. Thanks for listening.