Speaker 1: I Am all in again.
Speaker 2: Oh, let's do.
Speaker 3: Luke Steiner with Scott Patterson an iHeartRadio podcast. Hey everybody,
Speaker 3: Scott Patterson, I Am all in podcast, one of them
Speaker 3: productions iHeartRadio, iHeart Media, iHeart Podcasts, Season one, episode six
Speaker 3: of Borri's Birthday Parties, and we are joined find none
Speaker 3: other than Dacon Matthews, who portrayed Headmaster.
Speaker 4: Charles I Heeart Podcasts. Listen on the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3: Dacon, Welcome to the show. I'm joined by Tyra sud
Speaker 3: My in Trepid Crew and we're just going to get.
Speaker 1: Into it here. Tara go ahead and uh synopsizes.
Speaker 4: All right. So this is season one, episode six, Rory's
Speaker 4: Birthday Parties, which aired November ninth, two thousand. Emily insists
Speaker 4: that Rory's birthday party take place at their home and
Speaker 4: then asked Laura I for help in finding a special
Speaker 4: gift for her granddaughter, but Rory is horrified to discover
Speaker 4: her grandmother sent party invitations to her classmates. Then, at
Speaker 4: laurelized party for Rory, Emily realizes she doesn't know either
Speaker 4: of them.
Speaker 3: Jake and I'm just going to start off with a
Speaker 3: question right away. What did you think of this episode.
Speaker 2: I was fun watching rewatching it. It was fun rewatching
Speaker 2: the first first season. I did, I think the second
Speaker 2: show in the first season I had had auditioned for
Speaker 2: Ed Herman's part originally Oh show, yeah, which is kind
Speaker 2: of fun, but of course was primo and it was
Speaker 2: fun watching it. It was It was a little unsettling
Speaker 2: also because I had gotten used more to the later
Speaker 2: rep episodes and of course year in the life when
Speaker 2: everyone was sort of settled in and easy with it,
Speaker 2: and everybody was kind of much edgier than I remembered,
Speaker 2: you know why, that we were still creating characters, not
Speaker 2: living in them, and right that it was. It was
Speaker 2: a strange. It was a stranger feeling for me in
Speaker 2: many ways.
Speaker 3: It is interesting watching these first bunch of episodes because
Speaker 3: it is that exactly as you described it is. It
Speaker 3: is people sort of feeling their way through the dialogue
Speaker 3: and feeling their way to find the rhythm of the show.
Speaker 1: And I think the writers were.
Speaker 3: Doing the same thing too, write Amy and Dan were
Speaker 3: doing the same thing on this one.
Speaker 2: Though.
Speaker 3: I think it started coming together pretty well on all levels,
Speaker 3: because it seemed like a very polished, very complete and
Speaker 3: deeply felt episode, especially the writing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I thought especially Kelly and Lauren. Really, I mean,
Speaker 2: Alex just really sort of came into their rown on
Speaker 2: this episode. They were so identifiable as their character at
Speaker 2: the same time, they weren't two dimensional. There was something
Speaker 2: sort of richer than the earlier I went back and
Speaker 2: watched a couple of other episodes earlier than that, and
Speaker 2: it was to see even the different the growth and
Speaker 2: the characters. Oh yeah, five or six weeks.
Speaker 3: No, we start out with the Friday night dinner Lorealize
Speaker 3: mazed Emily serving putting in Friday night dinner, and sometimes
Speaker 3: Emily's niceness is completely self serving, and the pudding is
Speaker 3: used in a metaphor and a lot of this episode,
Speaker 3: Emily tells Rory look around the house and pick out
Speaker 3: items for the will.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's it's the.
Speaker 3: Comedy here is is just so ironic and thick that
Speaker 3: they're talking about this in dulcet tones and discussing the
Speaker 3: most morbid subject you could possibly want to enter into
Speaker 3: it at a dinner table to try.
Speaker 2: It's not even faster aggressive. I mean it's.
Speaker 3: With a posts right exactly, and so we're you know,
Speaker 3: they're making plans for Rory's extravaganza birthday party that is
Speaker 3: so out of touch with who Rory is.
Speaker 1: And what she needs. Tara, why don't you take the
Speaker 1: next one?
Speaker 4: The gift shopping, all right, Well, only wants to buy
Speaker 4: Rory something. And that's when they are picking out the
Speaker 4: bracelet and she says it looks cheap, but you know, Laura,
Speaker 4: I says it doesn't matter because it's I mean that
Speaker 4: Rory would like.
Speaker 3: And here we see writ large that Grandma doesn't know
Speaker 3: her granddaughter at all all. She's just sort of purchasing
Speaker 3: items that she would like h and wants to sort
Speaker 3: of dictate that to her granddaughter.
Speaker 4: And the analogy of a pudding comes up again right
Speaker 4: in this scene.
Speaker 3: And I think, I think the thing that really stuck
Speaker 3: out right away in this episode for me, Dacon is
Speaker 3: it's just how deft a comedic actress Lauren Graham is,
Speaker 3: and even at the early stages of this show, because
Speaker 3: she's throwing out zingers and one liners and quippy, funny
Speaker 3: little words and statements just like you know, by the dozen,
Speaker 3: and they just keep coming and coming and coming.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think this this is Amy, you know,
Speaker 2: and Amy sort of broke onto the scene there with
Speaker 2: a style that we hadn't seen I don't think since
Speaker 2: the Screwball comedies of the you know, pre war almost.
Speaker 2: So it's not like anybody was already had those skills
Speaker 2: of that sort of snappy stuff. You had to learn
Speaker 2: how to do that. Unless you were a huge fan
Speaker 2: of Screwball comedies and watched a lot of Jeene Arthur Girl,
Speaker 2: you had to learn how to do Amy's stuff because
Speaker 2: it was not It was not easy.
Speaker 3: It's not easy that that was amazing to watch her,
Speaker 3: just isn't it really? Just it just it seems so
Speaker 3: easy for her, and it's so flowing.
Speaker 2: An interesting audition process to find to find. I don't
Speaker 2: know if she was always what Amy had in mind,
Speaker 2: or if they auditioned for this role. I don't know
Speaker 2: the backstory on how Laura ended up with the role,
Speaker 2: but I mean, Amy was a demanding, demanding writer, and
Speaker 2: they find the right person for this and.
Speaker 4: They can't imagine anyone else doing it, to be honest, Yeah,
Speaker 4: really yeah, I can't imagine anyone else.
Speaker 1: You know, I've often wondered, you know, Jenna Jennifer Aniston is.
Speaker 3: Very, very very good. She probably could have done something
Speaker 3: with this role too.
Speaker 1: I think, you.
Speaker 3: Know, she's a dynamo.
Speaker 1: She's a real dynamo as an actress. So anyway, all right, so.
Speaker 3: We're back at Luke's diner and lucas Laura Lai sarcastically
Speaker 3: with the intent of keeping her, making her shut up
Speaker 3: if she will marry him. But it was sarcasting but
Speaker 3: not really right, So the big moment, Emily hints that
Speaker 3: Luke and Larela I that Luke the iceman. Emily can
Speaker 3: tell that by the way Luke looks at her, and
Speaker 3: what does she say? Looks like he wants you to
Speaker 3: give him a lap dance.
Speaker 1: Yeah, b for something.
Speaker 3: Look, he looks at you like you're a Porterhouse steak.
Speaker 2: Right, the first time in episode six that that issue
Speaker 2: was raised.
Speaker 1: Yes, I believe it is.
Speaker 2: I mean, obviously, I mean it might be bercolating underneath
Speaker 2: earlier episodes, but right, but Yeah, says will you bury me?
Speaker 2: Even though it's to shut her up. That's the first
Speaker 2: time that really just sort of bursts onto.
Speaker 1: The right I think, I think so.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Between that and when Emily calls out that he likes Laura, I.
Speaker 3: Yeah, interesting, subtle, not so subtle.
Speaker 2: But yeah, exactly. I mean, that's it.
Speaker 3: It's the how to plant that, when to plant that,
Speaker 3: and how they do that. But I mean, really, I thought,
Speaker 3: you know, I felt the chemistry from the first scene
Speaker 3: that I shot with her up in Toronto when she
Speaker 3: gets for coffee, coffee, coffee and I tell her she's
Speaker 3: an addict. So it was, it was, it was apparent,
Speaker 3: all right, So morning snuggles and coffee cake at Luke's.
Speaker 3: Lorela's going into Rory's room at four three am to
Speaker 3: say happy birthday. And this is a very, very, very
Speaker 3: significant moment I thought in the growth of this show,
Speaker 3: because all I thought about during that really sweet little
Speaker 3: scene with mother and daughter is I bet everybody watching
Speaker 3: this wishes they had a mother like this, and every
Speaker 3: mother watching this wish is they had a daughter like this,
Speaker 3: and if they do, they probably feel pretty good about it.
Speaker 3: And I just thought, man, no wonder America fell in
Speaker 3: love with this show so fast, head over heels because
Speaker 3: of scenes like this. I thought it was a big
Speaker 3: moment in the episode, and I think a big moment
Speaker 3: for the fan base bonding with these two characters as
Speaker 3: deeply as they remain bonded to these characters. So Rory
Speaker 3: finishes Laurelized birth story, okay, because she was.
Speaker 2: Laurel has heard a number of times. So that's what
Speaker 2: I find interesting about the scene is they bond over
Speaker 2: something that obviously would be tedious in any of this,
Speaker 2: because it always tells her this every year, every year,
Speaker 2: to get decided by heart.
Speaker 3: And it's great that such a tender, sweet moment between
Speaker 3: a mother and the daughter. And Rory's reaction is, eh, boy,
Speaker 3: here we go.
Speaker 2: So's it's real and its ritual at the same time,
Speaker 2: which is right and interesting.
Speaker 1: That's great. So she goes into Luke's.
Speaker 3: Uh, Rory and Lanner and Lukes and uh, you know,
Speaker 3: grumpy Luke says, uh, you know, I blew up balloons
Speaker 3: off the table there.
Speaker 1: And get the back over there.
Speaker 3: I'll pull it all down. And he doesn't want the love,
Speaker 3: I guess.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 3: Roy thinks she is getting old, and Dean comes in
Speaker 3: picks something up in Mouth's happy birthday to Rory as
Speaker 3: he leaves the diner.
Speaker 1: Uh, go ahead and take this twer. This is now
Speaker 1: Emily's party. This was a big.
Speaker 4: Deal, yeah, big yeah. So this is when we find
Speaker 4: out that Emily sent the invitation to everyone in Roy's
Speaker 4: class and basically how controlling she is this party, and
Speaker 4: Tristan is one is the one who showed Rory the
Speaker 4: invitation and that's how she found out everyone was invited,
Speaker 4: and everyone making decisions on what they want for Rory's
Speaker 4: birthday besides Rory, which obviously frustrates Rory when she is
Speaker 4: asked to make a speech in front of people that
Speaker 4: she does not know. And then we kind of hear
Speaker 4: about uh Christopher for a moment for the first time
Speaker 4: I think in the series that he lives in California
Speaker 4: and he visits.
Speaker 3: Rory that obnoxious well woman being so inappropriately.
Speaker 4: Mitzi, yeah, funny.
Speaker 3: And Laurai gets out of adverse things. I'm like, well,
Speaker 3: I see someone else someone else, so tell you later.
Speaker 4: And then we have obviously the sweet moment with Richard
Speaker 4: who gives Rory a card for fez.
Speaker 2: Mm hmm, what is that? What that is?
Speaker 1: What is fez as is a location? Right?
Speaker 4: It's yeah, she wanted to visit, so he would give
Speaker 4: her money for the trip, and then we see it
Speaker 4: again at her house and he's given it to her
Speaker 4: in the past. And then there's that moment with Tristan,
Speaker 4: that Richard approved of Tristan and Rory wants nothing to
Speaker 4: do with him.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I thought what was the most interesting about just
Speaker 2: that transition from the cafe to the party is that
Speaker 2: she's got this invitation and she sees it and it
Speaker 2: couldn't be more humiliating a teenager girl like that. What
Speaker 2: we find out later in the episode, she does not
Speaker 2: tell her mother about it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, doesn't.
Speaker 2: She senses a thawing of the relationship the pudding basically,
Speaker 2: which is the metaphor of the thawing of the relationship
Speaker 2: between the mother and daughter, and she doesn't want to
Speaker 2: do anything that stops that. And I thought that was
Speaker 2: a very subtle character thing to to lay on to
Speaker 2: Rory at that particular moment, that her concern learn for
Speaker 2: her mother's relationship with her grandmother, which was I thought,
Speaker 2: you know, as much as the as much as the
Speaker 2: mother and daughter are fighting over over that, the grandmother
Speaker 2: and the mother are fighting over that relationship, the daughter,
Speaker 2: the granddaughter is trying to trying to heal.
Speaker 3: It rightly, writing right, it's like who's raising who here?
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3: It really there almost seems to be no boundaries.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And I don't really blame Rory for having her
Speaker 4: breaking point wanting when she doesn't want to make a speech,
Speaker 4: because she'd been holding that in she didn't want to
Speaker 4: be at the party, But in that moment she kind
Speaker 4: of snapped on Emily because she doesn't know anyone in
Speaker 4: that room, and the people who she knows she doesn't like.
Speaker 1: So, yeah, you got to give Emily the benefit of down. Yeah,
Speaker 1: she's a tough one though, but I was sort.
Speaker 2: Of astonished at how clueless she is. But that's the
Speaker 2: point of the episode at the right, because I really
Speaker 2: do not know. Right you think the episode is about
Speaker 2: she doesn't know her granddaughter very well, that's what the
Speaker 2: shopping is about. But the episode is about she doesn't
Speaker 2: know her.
Speaker 1: Daughter right right?
Speaker 3: There are there are tragic elements, you know, sprinkled in
Speaker 3: that make you very moving stuff.
Speaker 1: Okay, so Emily. Uh So, now we're at the college fair.
Speaker 3: And this is a scene where we see Rory walking
Speaker 3: up to the Harvard table because it's college day and
Speaker 3: getting a pamphlet, and Paris happens to be there at
Speaker 3: the same time, and they realize, oh god, you're going
Speaker 3: you want to go to Harvard too?
Speaker 1: But then it turns into a discussion about uh, Tristan
Speaker 1: and do you like him? And Rory's answer is not
Speaker 1: even a little bit.
Speaker 3: And that's the first time we see, you know, the
Speaker 3: iceberg that is Paris melting a little bit and becoming
Speaker 3: a little bit vulnerable with Rory. Yeah, so we see
Speaker 3: that maybe perhaps there is some hope.
Speaker 1: Here for a budding friendship. Not a lot right now,
Speaker 1: but she's been pretty cool.
Speaker 4: Was the first time they said me, there's room for
Speaker 4: both of them at Harvard.
Speaker 3: Right, right, right, So the beginning of something, you know,
Speaker 3: your antagonist turns into your protagonists. But it's going to
Speaker 3: be a while, all right, Tara take this party for Rory,
Speaker 3: which was just an incredibly satisfying scene.
Speaker 4: Yeah, this was a fun one. So obviously at the
Speaker 4: end of the party at Emily's house, Rory invites her
Speaker 4: grandparents to her party at lore Lies and you really
Speaker 4: see all of stars hollow in this, all the characters,
Speaker 4: the people who've been around Rory since she was a
Speaker 4: little kid. I thought it was funny when they reading
Speaker 4: the doorbell and Laura is like, just get in here.
Speaker 4: Whatever she said about you, yeah, get.
Speaker 3: Your asses in here, And then she saw too, and
Speaker 3: then asses.
Speaker 4: There we go, and that's when we find out that
Speaker 4: Emily and Richard have never been to Laura I's house,
Speaker 4: which I thought was interesting. And we see, you know,
Speaker 4: Emily loves Suki's cooking, and then we Emily is listening
Speaker 4: to the stories about Rory that Miss Patty's talking about
Speaker 4: Richard's outside reading magazine that Rory gives him, and then
Speaker 4: that this is the moment Cosmo yes, which I'm not
Speaker 4: sure if you know, but the famous line from this episode,
Speaker 4: uh is I am an autumn from Richard and uh yeah.
Speaker 4: Then this is where we see Luke bring the ice
Speaker 4: and and then Emily wanders into Lorelei's room and I
Speaker 4: think that's when she really realizes she doesn't know her
Speaker 4: daughter in the town she lives in.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm.
Speaker 2: You know, we know the relationship from from with with
Speaker 2: with God is warming up and he walks into two
Speaker 2: bags of ice, So this sort of counter imagery to
Speaker 2: what we know what's actually going on.
Speaker 3: Which so it's so hot between them and the ice
Speaker 3: to cool it off. Yeah, first time Emily sees Luke,
Speaker 3: first time they meet.
Speaker 1: Uh, first time we see Laurel eye.
Speaker 3: Be physical with Luke right, give she gave him a
Speaker 3: big hugs the first time we've seen that.
Speaker 2: So every up to now, everything between them has been
Speaker 2: hot coffee.
Speaker 4: Right, Maybe it don't.
Speaker 3: And you know that that's one of those things that
Speaker 3: a man can misinterpret that that happiness as oh game
Speaker 3: on here and so teasing the audience a little bit
Speaker 3: here about what.
Speaker 1: Is to come.
Speaker 3: But I just look, I just thought that that Roy's
Speaker 3: birthday party was everything you need to know about the show,
Speaker 3: what it's about at its core, community, all of these
Speaker 3: you know, great people, eccentric characters. Miss Patty hitting on
Speaker 3: Richard was hysterical. She's so bold, but just a love
Speaker 3: surrounding that.
Speaker 2: Particularly, I really liked the fact that Emily loved Suki's cooking.
Speaker 2: Yeah some reason. That sort of was like a window
Speaker 2: opening saying there may be some relationship possible between the
Speaker 2: two worlds.
Speaker 3: And that Emily's Emily's not a complete monster. There's a
Speaker 3: human being there that appreciates fine cooking.
Speaker 2: She doesn't.
Speaker 1: It comes from you're very talented.
Speaker 3: But then of course she steps in and has to
Speaker 3: take over and says, I'll make you very rich.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and I discovered you exactly.
Speaker 3: She owns her now, yes, but I really enjoyed that scene,
Speaker 3: very very pleasant scene.
Speaker 4: And the scene at the scene when the Emily and
Speaker 4: Richard leaving, that was a little heartbreaking to see Emily
Speaker 4: in the car.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I imagine feeling that way. You know, your whole
Speaker 3: life flashing before you and you you haven't you know,
Speaker 3: for the past sixteen years, you haven't really had a
Speaker 3: relationship with your daughter. That's powerful. I mean that sense
Speaker 3: of loss and oh boy, And she did it with
Speaker 3: a couple of lo you.
Speaker 2: Know, yeah, and it was one of them because it
Speaker 2: was just a moment right then she remember right back,
Speaker 2: but she had that that moment and then gathers up.
Speaker 3: And watching two masters filling moments and not overdoing it
Speaker 3: and Richard acknowledging and then Okay, let's just drive away
Speaker 3: and that's all it needs.
Speaker 1: It's just mm hmm uh. And then.
Speaker 3: We have another one of these moments where Lorelei realizes
Speaker 3: that her little girl's growing up and she's going to
Speaker 3: leave home, and that's a tough one. Dean giving Rory
Speaker 3: a handmaid was a necklace or atlet, bracelet, bracelet?
Speaker 2: What was the dangle on the bracelet? What was that?
Speaker 2: Was it a coin.
Speaker 4: I think it was a coin, yeah, something that he said,
Speaker 4: he he he made the leather string, but he took
Speaker 4: the coin.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I think that again. And I mean, Amy's
Speaker 2: so clever in his way. But here's Emily throwing vast
Speaker 2: amounts of money at Glorie, money will buy her and
Speaker 2: then she gets just a coin from which is kind.
Speaker 4: Of I never thought of it that way.
Speaker 2: You know, she's a clever, clever writer.
Speaker 1: It is clever, isn't it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Emily saving up all her energy and love for
Speaker 3: her granddaughter that she didn't get to shower her own
Speaker 3: daughter with.
Speaker 1: H And you know, you still have.
Speaker 3: To feel for her a little bit, yep, still have
Speaker 3: to feel these are these are human beings going through
Speaker 3: life and having real issues, you know, and.
Speaker 1: Uh, it's just so dark entertaining to watch.
Speaker 3: I mean, there's a really powerful drama underneath all of this,
Speaker 3: all this great dialogue and pop culture references and all
Speaker 3: this humor, you know, and it's.
Speaker 2: Just you look at it from the other side of you.
Speaker 2: If you're if you're a parent and you have an
Speaker 2: extremely rebellious child, that's a heartbreak you just you can't do,
Speaker 2: not reach across the gulf at all, you know, and
Speaker 2: it becomes mutually recriminatory between the two of them.
Speaker 3: Can tell us what it was like working those scenes
Speaker 3: with Scott Cohen and Lauren and uh, you did some
Speaker 3: marvelous work on this show, extremely popular character with the fans.
Speaker 3: Tell us, tell us about how it all started.
Speaker 2: As I look back, you know, I didn't realize it
Speaker 2: at the time, but as I look back, I think
Speaker 2: I never got the stars Hollow. I was never part
Speaker 2: of the never part of the part of the fun people.
Speaker 2: You know, it's always I was always an outsider. And
Speaker 2: there was a kind of a uh, you know, a
Speaker 2: charm about Star's Hollow and nobody. Nobody actually thinks, Oh,
Speaker 2: I really wish I could be a chiltern everybody. I
Speaker 2: remember I was. I was living in Long Island doing
Speaker 2: a play, I think, and I was at I lived
Speaker 2: close to the train stage, and so I said, I
Speaker 2: used to take the train in and out. And I
Speaker 2: was standing at the at the L I R R
Speaker 2: ticket dispenser machine, and this woman and her daughter started
Speaker 2: coming over to me, and she said, excuse me, can
Speaker 2: I can I bother you for a moment, and I
Speaker 2: thought she wanted to figure out how to use the
Speaker 2: machine and I said, yeah, sure, of course you head
Speaker 2: Master Charleston, and I said, well, I was, yes, I was.
Speaker 2: He says, oh god, you live here in Malverne and
Speaker 2: I said what I do? Yes, Now, they said, it's
Speaker 2: our own little stars hollow, isn't it. This mother and
Speaker 2: daughter were trying to emulate the relationship that was existing
Speaker 2: between the two characters, but also the whole feeling of
Speaker 2: the small town environment. And I thought that that town
Speaker 2: really became iconic for a lot of people, whereas Chiltern
Speaker 2: became iconic for something else, something a little colder, a
Speaker 2: little bit more, you know, harder, and stuff like that.
Speaker 2: But it was fun because I remember when I first
Speaker 2: started again, as I said, you had to learn how
Speaker 2: to how to talk amy, And I think the very
Speaker 2: first thing the director said to me, I mean my
Speaker 2: first episode was Dacon, don't take any pauses in your
Speaker 2: speech because if you take a pause, we're going to
Speaker 2: cut it away from you.
Speaker 4: Let's keep going, keep going, and.
Speaker 2: Be word perfect. So you were always slightly on edge
Speaker 2: and panicky that you had to get through your speeches
Speaker 2: so fast. But you know, it was not a difficult
Speaker 2: role for me to play. I have actually was an educator.
Speaker 2: I was a college professor for twenty five years, right,
Speaker 2: and I still teach somewhat. So it was not very difficult,
Speaker 2: but it was. It was fun interacting being the other
Speaker 2: world from stars Hollow, being the world that that Rory
Speaker 2: had to navigate where where it wasn't easy when the
Speaker 2: navigation wasn't easy. And it was also fun because I
Speaker 2: had some a very good friend who was also part
Speaker 2: of the part of the Chielton I think, which was
Speaker 2: Emily Bergel. It was a very good friend of mine
Speaker 2: and we worked together in theater for for many years together.
Speaker 2: So it was fun. That was not nice.
Speaker 3: Do you remember episodes? Uh directed by Amy? Were you
Speaker 3: directed by Amy?
Speaker 2: I think at least one, I think, yeah, I don't remember, right.
Speaker 1: Was it did?
Speaker 3: Was that a different experience from the other directors?
Speaker 2: Pretty much pretty much doing what anyone. I'm working with
Speaker 2: them again right now as a matter of fact, on
Speaker 2: their new.
Speaker 1: Series, Oh the Palladinos. Yeah yeah, oh.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the ballet series.
Speaker 1: Oh that's fantastic.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just got.
Speaker 1: What's your character? Where were were you in Paris?
Speaker 2: I was in Paris for one day, I mean, and
Speaker 2: I shot a day in Manhattan as well. It's it's
Speaker 2: a story of two ballet companies, one in Paris and
Speaker 2: one in Manhattan that exchanged personnel because they're having problems attracting,
Speaker 2: you know, audiences and stuff. And I play And it's
Speaker 2: actually a bilingual series, tolf of it is in French.
Speaker 2: It's quite that right, And I play the chairman of
Speaker 2: the board of a major New York performing arts company.
Speaker 2: I'm the chairman of the board of the ballet company,
Speaker 2: not an no. And and it's and it's and Luke
Speaker 2: who played you know who was in the in the
Speaker 2: is playing the lead. He's the artistic director of the ballet. Okay,
Speaker 2: the manager, district manager.
Speaker 1: So it's great, yeah, really anticipating that serious.
Speaker 2: And Daniel was directing both of the episodes that I
Speaker 2: was in.
Speaker 4: Oh okay, Well, I have a question. You've had some
Speaker 4: pretty fun scenes over the series. Is there anyone that
Speaker 4: stands out to you as one of your favorite moments
Speaker 4: as head Master Charleston.
Speaker 2: You know, I really enjoyed my last one in Year
Speaker 2: in the Life. I really enjoyed that because, you know,
Speaker 2: I got to work again with with with Lisa and Alexis.
Speaker 2: But it was a completely different feeling. He was a
Speaker 2: different kind of you know, now that they were graduates
Speaker 2: and more or less successful or still you know, not
Speaker 2: quite successful as they wanted to be, he was able
Speaker 2: to show a sort of a difference. I mean he
Speaker 2: actually offered Rory a job. Yeah, he actually sympathized with her,
Speaker 2: you know, as opposed to being the other thing. So
Speaker 2: I loved that. I love that seat, you know, a
Speaker 2: lot with the with the two of them in that room.
Speaker 2: That was probably the favorite thing that I've done in
Speaker 2: the whole in the whole one. The other one, I
Speaker 2: guess is when confronting them, when what do they do?
Speaker 2: They they raided my office and did something I forget. Well, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: there was a was a.
Speaker 4: In the middle of the night, right, Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that that idea of a school administrator having to
Speaker 2: punish kids, But every school administrator knows that the kids
Speaker 2: are going to do this all the time. It's like
Speaker 2: it's almost like a ritual you go through. Rather than
Speaker 2: being really angry, you have to pre not you don't
Speaker 2: pretend to be you are angry, but you realize this
Speaker 2: is what kids do. You can't stop. That was That
Speaker 2: was a fun scene as well.
Speaker 1: Well, what subject were you teaching for elst year?
Speaker 2: Uh? English was an English professor and then drama.
Speaker 1: Oh boy, where where where were you teaching?
Speaker 2: I taught at cal State at cal State University, it
Speaker 2: used to be called Hayward Hayward Calson East by now
Speaker 2: and then I taught at Juilliard for three years. Oh
Speaker 2: did you really Yeah, very early years at Juilliard.
Speaker 1: Did you Did you have any students that went on
Speaker 1: too greatness? Oh?
Speaker 2: Well yes, uh, Patty lepone n. I was very close
Speaker 2: with Group one. In fact, I was. I got my
Speaker 2: job at Judiard because my wife was one of the
Speaker 2: students in Group one. And I went back and I
Speaker 2: knew John and bade him for a job because I
Speaker 2: was going to go back to graduate school as well
Speaker 2: at NYU. So he hired me to do some part
Speaker 2: time work there. And then about in the third year,
Speaker 2: their third year, they added Kevin Klein and David Steyers
Speaker 2: to the class, and by John Negro and Housman decided
Speaker 2: I want to form a company of these people, but
Speaker 2: they were one character man short. So for my third
Speaker 2: year at Juilliard teaching, he sort of said, we're going
Speaker 2: to cut back on your teaching, keep doing the administering,
Speaker 2: and I want you to join that group and form
Speaker 2: the company with them. So that that first year class,
Speaker 2: which was quite phenomenal, and I the Ringer, the sixteen
Speaker 2: of them and me the seventeenth. The Ringer formed the
Speaker 2: acting company in the early years.
Speaker 3: And that Housman's baby from day one.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: And so he he gleaned this idea borrowing from what
Speaker 3: the group theater, from from what well he had.
Speaker 2: The Murky had the Mercury Theater, and he knew the
Speaker 2: Group theater people, and he tried to He actually was
Speaker 2: one of the people behind the finding of the Center
Speaker 2: Theater group in Los Angeles as well, when he was
Speaker 2: in when he was in when he was in at USC.
Speaker 2: But I think what happened was and this happened in dramas.
Speaker 2: I don't know if you went to drama school or not, Scott,
Speaker 2: did you.
Speaker 1: I was in New York. Yeah, I studied with Bobby Lewis.
Speaker 1: I was the interest too well.
Speaker 2: In conservatories. What happened is classes developed personalities. You know,
Speaker 2: they used to call them groups. I still call them groups,
Speaker 2: said Julia Lip, like group fifty two or fifty three,
Speaker 2: I think now but you have group one, Group two,
Speaker 2: Group three, Group four, and we in the fact that
Speaker 2: he always always noticed that each group had its own personality,
Speaker 2: its own thing, and some of them would be really
Speaker 2: good and some of them would just never meld well.
Speaker 2: Group one had a particularly good group of artists and
Speaker 2: young artists in it, but also a certain dynamic, and
Speaker 2: Houseman looked at it and said, I don't want to
Speaker 2: break these people up, and he kept much of that
Speaker 2: group together for four or five years. I didn't my
Speaker 2: wife and I didn't stay with it past the first
Speaker 2: year because we were coming back to California to start
Speaker 2: a family. Was just and also he believed, and it
Speaker 2: turns out not to be true, that the conservatories were
Speaker 2: going to be feeding the regional repertory theaters across the country.
Speaker 2: His idea and everybody's thought at the time, was that
Speaker 2: there would be these hundreds of regional repertory theaters doing
Speaker 2: classical plays all over the country, and they would need
Speaker 2: a steady stream of very talented young people to fill them.
Speaker 2: So they would be so and he'd give them a
Speaker 2: repertory company experience so they could go out and populate
Speaker 2: the theaters across the country. Turns out that wasn't what
Speaker 2: happened in American theater. There are only a couple of
Speaker 2: regional repertory companies left. But he wanted to have He
Speaker 2: wanted the kids to have that great company repertory experience,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 3: And did Juilliards start out with an eye on the classics? Yes,
Speaker 3: Steepton Shakespeare and very much.
Speaker 2: So, and in the European tradition really because John was
Speaker 2: a co founder with Michelle san Deni, who was one
Speaker 2: of the great classical theater trainers from from Frands and Canada. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that was the other thought that the regional theaters would
Speaker 2: be doing a mix of classics and contemporary plays, but
Speaker 2: always a lot of classics. And that turns out to
Speaker 2: be true.
Speaker 1: Right, And it is still thriving today.
Speaker 2: And the Acting Company I'm now on the board of
Speaker 2: the Acting Company as as a board member. It's fifty
Speaker 2: two years old. And yes, they're sending out a national
Speaker 2: tour of a Shakespeare play and and two trends running
Speaker 2: you know, wow, And they're going to play about maybe
Speaker 2: twenty venues across the country. So the Acting Company is
Speaker 2: still so it's always on the edge, I mean, as
Speaker 2: all theater companies these are nowadays, they're on the edge
Speaker 2: of financial disaster all the time.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 5: I always thought that, you know, at the beginning of COVID,
Speaker 5: and once COVID, COVID combined with what's happening in the
Speaker 5: film and TV business, Yeah, you know, the shrinking of
Speaker 5: this business.
Speaker 3: The money seems to be disappearing for everybody. As streaming
Speaker 3: kind of snuffs out the fires, uh the economic fires
Speaker 3: as it as it was that live theater would thrive
Speaker 3: again because people were seeking you know, live entertainment that
Speaker 3: they were they were not getting the choices coming out
Speaker 3: out of Hollywood because of all the tent poles that
Speaker 3: were being made, because there was no money available to
Speaker 3: make anything really uh nuanced, and you know these these
Speaker 3: sort of independent stories or or even mainstream stories. They
Speaker 3: weren't doing anything but superhero stuff because it's the only
Speaker 3: thing they could pay the bills with. And I thought
Speaker 3: it would affect live theater and I hope it still does.
Speaker 1: I hope. I I imagine that live theater.
Speaker 3: Becomes so popular that I have to start building new
Speaker 3: venues to house all the demand.
Speaker 2: We would think that, but a pandemic put up an
Speaker 2: I mean so many theaters had to close. My own theater,
Speaker 2: you know that, I ran for a number of years,
Speaker 2: the Shakespeare Festival in California one and now it's closing
Speaker 2: today after fifty years. Last week and I was so
Speaker 2: many theaters closed that you just can't build them back
Speaker 2: up from bootstrap, you know, you can't very hard to
Speaker 2: start them again. I think what may help is AI.
Speaker 2: Interestingly enough, at a certain point, people will realize the
Speaker 2: only place you'll be sure it isn't AI is on
Speaker 2: the stage, correct that you know, that's the only place
Speaker 2: you could be pretty sure you're actually watching real people.
Speaker 2: Because they can now make avatars of us. We have
Speaker 2: to actually legally get into the court rooms and stop
Speaker 2: them right our faces and voices.
Speaker 3: Hey, it's a copyright issue for everybody. Yeah, especially in
Speaker 3: entertainment fields. God, I hope so, because really, there is
Speaker 3: nothing more vital than lives eater when it's done well,
Speaker 3: there just isn't.
Speaker 2: You can't about twenty years of a lot of work
Speaker 2: on stage and scream I'm pretty much back in live
Speaker 2: theater full time.
Speaker 1: Now, Oh what are you doing right now?
Speaker 2: You finished a really ten year, really good period of
Speaker 2: time about nine Broadway shows in a row. Wow, which
Speaker 2: was exhilarating and great and fun.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: And now I'm kind of relatively unemployed because I'm a
Speaker 2: little too old for nobody writes plays for eighty four
Speaker 2: year old men and white man anymore. We're a napa.
Speaker 3: Oh boy, Well, listen, it's been a pleasure catching up
Speaker 3: with you, and your insights are are much appreciated.
Speaker 2: Is this great?
Speaker 1: Any any closing thoughts?
Speaker 2: It's a takin Well, I'm gonna I'm gonna have to
Speaker 2: do a little commercial. I have a I have a
Speaker 2: script that I've prepared, a Shakespeare script that I've paired,
Speaker 2: combining the parts of Henry four, Part one and two
Speaker 2: into a single play, which has been done about twenty
Speaker 2: times across the country, including a big Broadway production. But
Speaker 2: it's going to be mounted again in New York at
Speaker 2: Theater for a new audience this coming January and February. Okay,
Speaker 2: it's really good, it's a great it's a big it's
Speaker 2: actually what life there is a big fun project with
Speaker 2: fifteen or sixteen actors on stage doing a monumental work
Speaker 2: that really means something also for our time. So it's
Speaker 2: that's my commercial.
Speaker 1: Is that Is that a Juilliard Project.
Speaker 2: No, that's a theater for a new audience.
Speaker 1: Okay, so that's the Companys.
Speaker 2: Theater over in Brooklyn.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, great.
Speaker 2: So that play did actually have its premiere at Juilliard
Speaker 2: among a student body without my knowing it. I had
Speaker 2: shared the script with the director at Juilliard, and then
Speaker 2: I went back to California and he just go ahead
Speaker 2: and directed it with his students.
Speaker 3: Have you have you ever played any roles in Hamlet
Speaker 3: on stage?
Speaker 2: I've done Polonius two or three times, okay, and the
Speaker 2: Ghost and the grave Digger. Oh my first player.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Polonius, juicy role.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I did, did opposite Hamish oh, okay one and
Speaker 2: then Yeah.
Speaker 1: It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 3: Keep up the good work, and thank you for your
Speaker 3: contributions to live theater. It's it's so important too for
Speaker 3: people to have access to quality theater, to keep the
Speaker 3: arts alive. And if I'm in New York, I'm gonna
Speaker 3: I'm gonna come see that play. It should be so
Speaker 3: thank you so much, Dake and Matthews, everybody, and hopefully
Speaker 3: we'll talk soon.
Speaker 1: Okay, all right, take care, everybody, don't
Speaker 3: Again follow us on Instagram at I am all In
Speaker 3: podcast and email us at Gilmore at iHeartRadio dot com.