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Speaker 1: Hi guys, welcome to another episode of Legally Brunette. I'll

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Speaker 1: be your host Emily Simpson and oh oh you need

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Speaker 1: to set up and Shane and Shane. First of all,

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Speaker 1: we are going to go into the Menindez Brothers because

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Speaker 1: obviously they've had a big week this week. They were

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Speaker 1: both went up before the Pearl Boards, and I think

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Speaker 1: maybe we should just do a little little background just

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Speaker 1: to see, you know, just to cover how we got

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Speaker 1: to this point. We've covered Meninda's many many times. Are

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Speaker 1: actually our very first episode for Legally Brunette was on

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Speaker 1: the Menindez Brothers, and so if you haven't listened to it,

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Speaker 1: go back and find it. I think it was a

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Speaker 1: really good episode because I had done so much research

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Speaker 1: and read the book written by Robert Rand and studied

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Speaker 1: as much as possible, so.

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Speaker 2: Every video, watched, every possible house.

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Speaker 1: I went to their house, I stalked them. I've done

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Speaker 1: everything possible that I could to know as much as

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Speaker 1: I could. Anyway, so they are on they went before

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Speaker 1: the parole board this week, and that the parole board

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Speaker 1: came about because they were on a two track system.

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Speaker 1: If you guys remember we've talked about this before. They

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Speaker 1: had a habeas petition that was basically based on new

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Speaker 1: evidence that came out later, which was a letter from

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Speaker 1: a cousin of Eric's corroborating that there was sexual abuse

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Speaker 1: in the relationship with Jose. And then there was also

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Speaker 1: the boy, the guy from the Menudo band, that came

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Speaker 1: forward that said that he had been sexually abused by

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Speaker 1: Jose as well. So those two pieces of new evidence

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Speaker 1: put them on track for a possible new hearing, new trial,

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Speaker 1: and that was the habeas route that is still ongoing.

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Speaker 1: This other route that led to them being in front

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Speaker 1: of the parole board was the resentencing, and that was

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Speaker 1: in front of Judge Ryan, and I don't remember the

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Speaker 1: exact date, but it was I don't know, maybe a

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Speaker 1: month or so ago or a couple of months. I

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Speaker 1: don't have time flies, I can't even keep track. But

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Speaker 1: Judge Ryan re sentenced the Menendez brothers to instead of

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Speaker 1: life without parole, to life with the eligibility for paroles.

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Speaker 1: So that's how they've ended up. From fifty years to life,

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Speaker 1: it was fifty years to life with the eligibility for parole,

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Speaker 1: which has now put them in front of the parole board.

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Speaker 2: So Eric and separately, not together.

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Speaker 1: Not together. They have separate parole hearings. Lyles was yesterday,

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Speaker 1: Eric's was the day before, and I'm sure, as we

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Speaker 1: all know, just based upon the headlines and the news,

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Speaker 1: both of them were denied parole. Let's talk about first

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Speaker 1: of all, which is an interesting thought, is because they

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Speaker 1: had separate parole hearings, one could have been paroled and

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Speaker 1: one could have not, which would have been a really

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Speaker 1: probably i mean devastating scenario for them, as well as

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Speaker 1: an interesting scenario that one could have been paroled and

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Speaker 1: one could have stayed in prison. We know now that

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Speaker 1: didn't happen. They were both denied parole, So let's talk

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Speaker 1: about why they were denied.

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Speaker 2: And they both had different not just different dates, but

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Speaker 2: they had different boards that they were in front of them.

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Speaker 1: They did. They were both in different in front of

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Speaker 1: different parle boards, and each brother had a different commissioner

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Speaker 1: that was that was heading up the parle board. So

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Speaker 1: a lot of the issues with the denial was this

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Speaker 1: contraband that had to do with cell phones. So official

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Speaker 1: stress that such devices posed serious security risks in prisons,

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Speaker 1: often tied to gang's drugs or violence. This is when

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Speaker 1: it had to do with Eric. Eric acknowledged that using

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Speaker 1: a phone to stay connected with his wife and for entertainment,

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Speaker 1: which he likes to watch YouTube, listen to music, et cetera,

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Speaker 1: and apparently also watch pornography. Lyle turned to phones when

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Speaker 1: he realized his communications with his wife and family. Even

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Speaker 1: though Lyle isn't married any longer. I believe he's now divorced.

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Speaker 1: And then there was like a young girlfriend and we

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Speaker 1: got married.

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Speaker 2: I think he's married. Toy did married and divorce in prison?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? I think maybe he was married twice. And then

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Speaker 1: there was like a young girlfriend that came and visited him.

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Speaker 1: That was like from the UK. Anyway, that's a whole

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Speaker 1: nother podcast to the parole hearings. But he realized that

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Speaker 1: his communications with his wife and family were being monitored

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Speaker 1: and sold to tabloids. So he saw cell phones as

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Speaker 1: a privacy major in a way to stay in touch

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Speaker 1: with his wife during a stressful time in their marriage.

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Speaker 1: So that was the reasoning that both of them gave

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Speaker 1: for using cell phones in prison. First of all, my

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Speaker 1: question is who how do they get the cell phone?

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Speaker 1: And who pays the bill?

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Speaker 2: Well, someone on the outside pays the bill. I imagine, well,

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Speaker 2: why not his wife? Yeah, so you think or maybe

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Speaker 2: maybe in the divorce proceedings he gets some type of

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Speaker 2: alimony and he uses it to pay the phone.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but he can't be paying his cell phone bill

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Speaker 1: from was he log on and pay a cell phone bill?

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Speaker 2: Sure he has a cell phone, is a smartphone. He

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Speaker 2: probably has email and everything.

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Speaker 1: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I mean, you can Venmo and Jaelic probably Vene won

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Speaker 2: each other. You know.

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Speaker 1: It just seems odd to me. But I mean, obviously

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Speaker 1: I've never been in prison, but it seems odd to me.

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Speaker 1: I guess there's just I picture like someone's in prison

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Speaker 1: and that they're just being watched twenty four to seven.

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Speaker 1: But I guess there are a lot of opportunities where

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Speaker 1: you can pull off a cell phone. Here's a cell

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Speaker 1: phone and do it on the download and people don't

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Speaker 1: know and all right. Also another reason that they were

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Speaker 1: denied bail was that there were many moments where they

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Speaker 1: were not considered model prisoners. Eric faced questions about associating

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Speaker 1: himself with a prison gang called the quote two fivers.

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Speaker 2: I don't know what that means, but the number two

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Speaker 2: and the number five.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the two fivers and helping them with a tax scheme.

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Speaker 1: In twenty thirteen, he claimed that he only did so

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Speaker 1: to survive the violent gang. He also used drugs and

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Speaker 1: alcohol in his very early years in prison, but noted

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Speaker 1: that he had been sober for more than a decade.

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Speaker 1: I did read this in an article after his parole

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Speaker 1: was denied, because Eric was first, and I thought, how, now,

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Speaker 1: how do you get involved in a tax fraud? Do

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Speaker 1: you pay taxes when you're in prison?

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Speaker 2: Well, if you're married, I guess file married, but living separately, I.

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Speaker 1: Don't know.

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Speaker 2: Separately. Yeah, so I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I guess Eric was involved in some type of tax scheme.

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Speaker 1: But again, I need a prison insider to come on

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Speaker 1: the podcast and answer these questions because I want to

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Speaker 1: know what it's like like for real, not just from

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Speaker 1: the outside reading articles, but I want to know. I

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Speaker 1: want to know the cell phone usage. I want to

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Speaker 1: know how a tax fraud scheme goes on in prison.

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Speaker 1: I want to know if he's filing taxes. I want

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Speaker 1: to know all the things that does he have income.

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Speaker 1: I did think it was good though that I mean,

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Speaker 1: he's been sober for ten years. That's commendable.

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Speaker 2: Well, shouldn't he have been sober for thirty five years

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Speaker 2: or however long he's been.

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Speaker 1: No He claims that he did use drugs and alcohol

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Speaker 1: in his early years in prison, but that he's been

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Speaker 1: sober for the past ten. Lyle's record was less severe,

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Speaker 1: but still drew criticism from the commissioners, who said he

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Speaker 1: demonstrated quote anti social personality traits like deception, minimization, and

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Speaker 1: rule breaking that lie beneath that positive surface. You know,

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Speaker 1: here's another question I have, and this is what I

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Speaker 1: thought when I read this, when they say he has

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Speaker 1: anti social personality. Whatever, he's been in prison for thirty

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Speaker 1: five years. He went into prison when he was like,

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Speaker 1: you know, twenty one or something. I mean, wouldn't you

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Speaker 1: expect that someone that spent the last thirty five years

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Speaker 1: in their life maybe does suffer some type of anti.

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Speaker 2: So he's very grumpy. He's grumpy, and he doesn't appreciate what.

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Speaker 1: He doesn't show a lot of gratitude. I mean, it's

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Speaker 1: like I sometimes when I read these decisions and what

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Speaker 1: they're saying, you know, as far as his personality, I think, well,

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Speaker 1: what kind of personality do you expect someone to have

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Speaker 1: after thirty five years of being locked up in prison.

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Speaker 2: I would love to see, like a result of someone

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Speaker 2: that did get off after thirty years, and what was

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Speaker 2: it that they did, you mean.

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Speaker 1: What was their personality like after they spent the day perfect?

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Speaker 2: They have a flawless record.

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Speaker 1: I can't imagine. That was an good question and a

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Speaker 1: point I would like to make is anyone spending thirty

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Speaker 1: five years in prison, I can't imagine anyone would have

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Speaker 1: a flawless record and a pristine personality analysis the amount

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Speaker 1: of violence that you're dealing with, you probably have to

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Speaker 1: make a lot of decisions to stay alive. Possibly maybe

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Speaker 1: you have to make decisions or do things that you

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Speaker 1: wouldn't necessarily do, but you have to survive. I think

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Speaker 1: you wake up and think, how am I gonna You might.

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Speaker 2: Get a fight, but you started it. But you started

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Speaker 2: as a proactive measure because they were going they're going

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Speaker 2: to attack you or something, or I got to set

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Speaker 2: the stand.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I can't imagine that you can go through

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Speaker 1: thirty five years of prison without some type of mark

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Speaker 1: on your record, because I'm sure that you are put

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Speaker 1: into situations where you are forced to make decisions and

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Speaker 1: to act in ways where you're just surviving as opposed

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Speaker 1: to following rules. So I don't know how you know

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Speaker 1: feasible that is that someone just has a clean record

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Speaker 1: after all that time.

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Speaker 2: Even on the outside, one has a clean record.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean you have antisocial personality too. Jan's like everybody,

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Speaker 1: everybody's out of the house by nine pm.

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Speaker 2: I'd probably be happier. The JEL set no responsibilities right.

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Speaker 1: There were also concerns about the death of Kitty Menindaz

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Speaker 1: and this was something else I thought about before the

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Speaker 1: decisions came out. When we were when they had separate

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Speaker 1: parole hearings. I remember thinking, when it comes to separate

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Speaker 1: parole hearings, Lyle definitely acted differently the night of the

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Speaker 1: murders as opposed to Eric, because Lyle was the one

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Speaker 1: who well, they both went into the den and they

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Speaker 1: shot both of them. They both had shotguns. Lyle was

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Speaker 1: the one that left and went and reloaded and went

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Speaker 1: back and then shot his mom. So really, if you

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Speaker 1: want to look at the facts of the case and

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Speaker 1: maybe who was more culpable, you could have put that

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Speaker 1: on Lyle and then that would have maybe made a

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Speaker 1: difference in whether he was paroled or not, or whether

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Speaker 1: Eric was or not. But anyway, it ended up being

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Speaker 1: that the panel pointed out that the way their mother,

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Speaker 1: Kitty Menendez, was killed, and how the brothers attempted to

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Speaker 1: cover up the murders afterward, describing those actions as callous

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Speaker 1: and troubling, and if you do know the case, and

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Speaker 1: also I said, we did a very in depth episode

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Speaker 1: on this, which was our first episode. You know, they

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Speaker 1: did immediately afterwards pretend like, you know, it's not like

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Speaker 1: they can't clean They did say it with someone else.

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Speaker 1: They did try to point police in the direction of

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Speaker 1: a gang related or no, a mob related hit, you know,

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Speaker 1: saying their dad was involved in like shady business practices.

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Speaker 1: They did spend a lot of money, their parents' money afterwards.

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Speaker 1: So but again, it was thirty five years ago, and

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Speaker 1: at some point, when do you not focus so much

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Speaker 1: on the actual crime that was committed, because we all

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Speaker 1: know it was heinous, and do you focus on the

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Speaker 1: rehabilitation and where they're at now and that they've spent

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Speaker 1: thirty five years in prison. So it says it says

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Speaker 1: basically that they have to wait three years. However, I

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Speaker 1: believe that there's a way that they can apply earlier

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Speaker 1: for parole.

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Speaker 2: Well, what I have here is written Eric and Lowle

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Speaker 2: must wait at least three years before the next eligible

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Speaker 2: parole hearing. Some indications suggest they may reapply via an

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Speaker 2: administrative review for after one year and get scheduled for

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Speaker 2: hearing in eighteen months. So I guess, you know they might.

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Speaker 2: I don't know what administrative review means. Maybe that just

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Speaker 2: means they can apply. And if there's they're on track

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Speaker 2: to do whatever they're set out to do as far

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Speaker 2: as good behavior and getting rid of their cell phones

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Speaker 2: and I don't know, paying as taxes or whatever, then

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Speaker 2: you might pay it early as eighteen months.

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Speaker 1: Right, And you know they can't appeal this decision, and

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Speaker 1: so I'm sure their attorneys are working on the appeal.

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Speaker 1: And I thought this was interesting. The appeal for this

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Speaker 1: parole decision. We'll go before Judge Ryan, who is the

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Speaker 1: judge that resentence them.

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Speaker 2: Oh, oh, it's the same judge that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it would be Judge Ryan that they would be

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Speaker 1: in front of in regards to an appeal to the

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Speaker 1: par board hearing, which I don't know. Maybe that is

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Speaker 1: just a glimmer of hope because obviously he did resentence them,

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Speaker 1: so maybe he's more amenable to that that's.

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Speaker 2: More familiar with them, so maybe he's come across things

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Speaker 2: that will work in their favor.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so we'll keep following that. Also, here's just some

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Speaker 1: other things that came out of Lyle's hearing yesterday. First

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Speaker 1: of all, I do know that there was some audio

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Speaker 1: from Eric's hearing that was leaked while Lyle was having

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Speaker 1: his hearing.

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Speaker 2: Oh wow.

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Speaker 1: And when the audio was leaked and a news station

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Speaker 1: started running it, Lyle became upset and actually left the hearing.

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Speaker 1: And I think he was upset that, Like, I think

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Speaker 1: he felt like that was supposed to stay private, but

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Speaker 1: it was leaked and then everybody was commenting on Eric. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: Lyle comes back in his commissioner. The commissioner for Lyle

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Speaker 1: was named Commissioner Garland, and she goes into some details

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Speaker 1: about why he was denied parole, and she says that

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Speaker 1: the crime lacks self control, was impulsive and made very

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Speaker 1: poor and that Lyle made poor decisions during the commission

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Speaker 1: of the crime. She says he has poor threat perception

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Speaker 1: with regard to the risk Jose pose and she specifically

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Speaker 1: cited shooting Kitty one final time as extremely callous, which

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Speaker 1: you know we've spoken about before. The commissioner also highlighted

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Speaker 1: Lyle's role in the cover up, which was lying to

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Speaker 1: police and working to avoid prosecution. Commissioner Garland also says

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Speaker 1: Lyle has a strong support network and good plans for

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Speaker 1: his post release life and is set up for success

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Speaker 1: when he walks out the door, which is all positive.

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Speaker 1: She also commends Lyle's lack of violence and his prison record,

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Speaker 1: his work on programs inside, and his positive relationships with

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Speaker 1: other inmates and staff. This is a quote from the commissioner.

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Speaker 1: We find your remorse is genuine. In many ways, you

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Speaker 1: look like you've been a model and mate. You have

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Speaker 1: been a model inmate in many ways who has demonstrated

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Speaker 1: the potential for change. But despite all those outward positives,

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Speaker 1: we see you still struggle with antisocial personality traits like deception, minimization,

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Speaker 1: and rule breaking that lie beneath that positive surface. She

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Speaker 1: also goes on to say incarcerated people who break rules

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Speaker 1: are more likely to break rules in society, and that

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Speaker 1: we do understand that you had very little hope of

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Speaker 1: ever being released for many, many years. Citizens are expected

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Speaker 1: to follow the rules, whether or not there is some

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Speaker 1: incentive to do so. I don't know what. I don't

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Speaker 1: know if I necessarily agree. Obviously, they have the statistics

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Speaker 1: and you know, all that to back up what she's saying.

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Speaker 1: But to me, when you're in.

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Speaker 2: It's like they just described a politician. Yeah right, you

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Speaker 2: don't follow your rules, you lie, you're deceptive.

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Speaker 1: Right real? Yeah. I just don't know if I believe

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Speaker 1: that you would make the same choices or you the

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Speaker 1: same level of deception in prison as you would outside

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Speaker 1: of prison. I feel like when you're in prison again,

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Speaker 1: you're put into a situation where it's a survival type

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Speaker 1: of situation. I don't And also another thing they look at,

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Speaker 1: obviously is what the risk is that these two would

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Speaker 1: commit a crime again. And we talked about this earlier.

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Speaker 1: To me, I don't think there are risks to society

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Speaker 1: in any way, shape or form. I think what happened

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Speaker 1: was thirty five years ago. It was an isolated event.

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Speaker 1: It had to do with traumatic circumstances that they were

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Speaker 1: dealing with within their home at a very young age.

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Speaker 1: They made a poor decision. It was a heinous crime.

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Speaker 1: I think they've felt remorse for thirty five years. I

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Speaker 1: feel like they've done their time, and I don't think

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Speaker 1: that they're a threat to society.

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Speaker 2: No, do you agree?

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Speaker 1: No?

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Speaker 2: Based on what I've seen, though, I don't think so.

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Speaker 2: I mean, if you wanted to say they should be

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Speaker 2: in there longer because of the crime itself, like deserves

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Speaker 2: a longer sentence, that's that's a different story. But if

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Speaker 2: you're saying that they're a threat to society, therefore they

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Speaker 2: should be in prison, I agree with that.

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Speaker 1: Also, Commissioner Garland said that I think she was taken

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Speaker 1: aback by this question that she asked Lyle, which was

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Speaker 1: are you a good liar? And he said no. Ultimately,

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Speaker 1: she said Lyle needs to be the person that he shows,

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Speaker 1: who is the person who is running programs for other inmates.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if someone asked you on a parole

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Speaker 1: board hearing are you a good liar?

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Speaker 2: I mean that's a what. Yeah, that's not How are

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Speaker 2: you going to answer that? You can't It's a load

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Speaker 2: of question. You can't answer it the right right, there's

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Speaker 2: no good answer.

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Speaker 1: Right, are you a good liar? Well? If I say yes, yeah.

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Speaker 2: It's like when we're kids, you'd run I remember, we'd say,

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Speaker 2: like does your mom know you're ugly? Like no, it's like, well, oh,

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Speaker 2: your mom doesn't know, you know, but it's like, you

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Speaker 2: can't answer that correctly. No, that's your favor.

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Speaker 1: That's a lose lose. So I didn't. I felt like

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Speaker 1: that was a I don't know what you called a

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Speaker 1: trick question, a loaded question, whatever, But it's a question

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Speaker 1: where there's no good answer, there's no exactly. It puts

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Speaker 1: him in a position where you're right, there's no good choice.

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Speaker 1: If he says yes, I'm a good liar, then it's like, oh,

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Speaker 1: you're being honest, but now nothing we you know, nothing

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Speaker 1: you have said has any weight because you just admitted

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Speaker 1: that you're a good liar. And if you say no,

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Speaker 1: you're not a good liar, then it's like, oh, you're lying.

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Speaker 2: Unless they're trying to say like, not a good liar

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Speaker 2: means you don't do it. You get called out if

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Speaker 2: you do lie, like people know, you don't get away

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Speaker 2: with things. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: Well, then at the end of this hearing with Lyle,

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Speaker 1: I think she goes on to give him a little

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Speaker 1: bit of hope, But don't ever not have hope. This

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Speaker 1: denial is not the end. It's a way for you

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Speaker 1: to spend some time to demonstrate to practice what you

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Speaker 1: preach about, who you are, who you want to be,

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Speaker 1: don't be somebody different behind closed doors. So she says

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Speaker 1: he'll be considered for an administrative review within one year,

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Speaker 1: and Lyle could be moved up to a hearing as

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Speaker 1: soon as eighteen months. And then the hearing adjourned.

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Speaker 2: Here's we see they have sorry, they have thirty five

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Speaker 2: years or however long, and then in one year, magically

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Speaker 2: it's like, oh, okay, you know, thirty five years, you

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Speaker 2: weren't eligible, you weren't very good, you're not a rule faller, accepted,

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Speaker 2: but you know, in the last twelve months, but if

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Speaker 2: you get your app together in the next year, we

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Speaker 2: might let you out.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I bet. Basically, yeah, that's that's a really

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Speaker 1: good point to make that they've been in prison for

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Speaker 1: thirty five years. But they're saying, don't lose hope. If

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Speaker 1: you can just you know, get your act together in

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Speaker 1: the next year, we might, you know, free you. But

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Speaker 1: is there Here's what I was thinking. Are there consultants

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Speaker 1: that help you? Do you know what I mean?

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Speaker 2: Like everything has consultants, Yes, like that probably.

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Speaker 1: I mean, if you if you go into pageant there's

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Speaker 1: pageant consultants.

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Speaker 2: That teach you, like if child custody, there's child custody

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Speaker 2: hearing consultants. So you go teach you how to you know,

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Speaker 2: how to deliver, not not to change the truth, but

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Speaker 2: how to deliver, to express, what to kind of refrain from,

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Speaker 2: you know what, what looks? What's bad? A bad look?

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Speaker 2: You know?

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Speaker 1: Right? And I know maybe to you listening, maybe that

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Speaker 1: sounded like a dumb question, but it's really not a

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Speaker 1: dumb question. It really is like are there attorneys?

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Speaker 2: That's why you needed a cell phone? He had a

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Speaker 2: close pro board consultant.

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Speaker 1: Right, I mean, I feel like at this point it's like, okay,

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Speaker 1: well we went through one round of parole hearings, we

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Speaker 1: didn't do well. We have a year. What do we

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Speaker 1: need to do to get ourselves, you know, prepared for

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Speaker 1: this next parole hearing. Anyway, if anyone has an any

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Speaker 1: insight on that as well, I'd like to know. All right,

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Speaker 1: So let's move on to I just wanted to touch

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Speaker 1: briefly on the Gillian Michaels of pop culture because I

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Speaker 1: see her everywhere, and I will tell you I am

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Speaker 1: the biggest fan of Biggest Loser. You know that I

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Speaker 1: watched it all the time and because I realized I'm

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Speaker 1: one of those people that I like shows where there's transformations.

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Speaker 1: That's why you make fun of me all the time.

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Speaker 1: But I love my six hundred pound life because I

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Speaker 1: get to know them. I root for them. I want

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Speaker 1: to see them, you know, get healthy. Oh I love intervention.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, the success rate and intervention is like

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Speaker 1: is it It's so low tough. But I become so

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Speaker 1: engrossed in their life and I and I'm rooting for them.

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Speaker 1: And I think that's what the appeal was with Biggest Loser.

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Speaker 1: It was huge. It was you know everyone, you know,

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Speaker 1: there was so I think there were like twenty somethings seasons. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: So the other day when I was I put Netflix

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Speaker 1: on and I saw that there was a documentary on

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Speaker 1: the Biggest Loser. I clicked on it immediately. I was

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Speaker 1: so excited to watch it. So now we have Jillian

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Speaker 1: Michaels's pushing back against the claims made on her and

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Speaker 1: the new Biggest Loser documentary.

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Speaker 2: It's called well, let's be clear on the documentary. Is

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Speaker 2: she does not appear in it? Others do? She does not?

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Speaker 1: Right? And I read that they reached out to her

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Speaker 1: and asked her to appear in the documentary and she declined,

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Speaker 1: which now she's.

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Speaker 2: Probably glad she didn't, or she did well no, because well, yeah,

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Speaker 2: you're right, if she she would be glad she didn't

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Speaker 2: because she's like that. They say a bunch of crap

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Speaker 2: and they edit it in a way where they paint

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Speaker 2: it in a bad light and I don't want to

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Speaker 2: be a part of that, and now I can sue

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Speaker 2: them and hopefully I'll make some money.

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Speaker 1: Or she's regretting saying no because she doesn't get to

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Speaker 1: voice her own opinion and give her own viewpoint of things.

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Speaker 1: It's just everyone else talking.

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Speaker 2: And then so yeah, fair point.

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Speaker 1: Anyway. The documentary is on Netflix. It's called Fit for TV,

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Speaker 1: The Reality of the Biggest Loser. I thought it was great.

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Speaker 1: I watched I think it's like three episodes. I watched

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Speaker 1: all of them in one night. The series goes back

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Speaker 1: and re examines The Biggest Loser, which aired from two

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Speaker 1: thousand and four until twenty sixteen and briefly returned in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty, through a very critical lens highlighting the extremes

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Speaker 1: the contestants endured for dramatic weight loss, and you know,

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00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:49,679
Speaker 1: now watching it as a fifty year old woman as

435
00:21:49,720 --> 00:21:53,320
Speaker 1: opposed to you know, a twenty something or thirty. How

436
00:21:53,320 --> 00:21:54,680
Speaker 1: old would I be in two thousand and four. I

437
00:21:54,720 --> 00:22:00,000
Speaker 1: can't do math thirty. Yeah, so there's a big difference

438
00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:01,919
Speaker 1: between watching it as a thirty year old watching it

439
00:22:01,960 --> 00:22:04,040
Speaker 1: as a fifty year old. Because when they were showing

440
00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:07,080
Speaker 1: some of those flashback scenes of the challenges they made

441
00:22:07,080 --> 00:22:10,800
Speaker 1: them go through where they had to stack donuts and

442
00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:13,160
Speaker 1: you know, put donuts in their mouth and run from

443
00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:16,240
Speaker 1: place to place, and I was like, that's humiliating, it is,

444
00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:19,160
Speaker 1: that's really that is sad.

445
00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:21,639
Speaker 2: The ones I didn't like are that when they tempt

446
00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:24,439
Speaker 2: them with like junk food, yeah, you know, not not

447
00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:28,760
Speaker 2: reward them with something, you know, like like a lot

448
00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:31,439
Speaker 2: of these shows do they reward them with prizes or

449
00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:34,960
Speaker 2: things to inspire them, But they want to tempt them

450
00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:38,040
Speaker 2: with crap food, right.

451
00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:42,000
Speaker 1: And then show like you know, chocolate fountains and donuts,

452
00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:45,400
Speaker 1: and I mean it's just it's just making fun of them.

453
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:47,160
Speaker 2: And I don't think I actually the reason I thought

454
00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:48,240
Speaker 2: that's why you liked watching it.

455
00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:51,119
Speaker 1: No, I liked to watch the table well, I mean,

456
00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:53,320
Speaker 1: I do love a good dessert table, but I know

457
00:22:53,359 --> 00:22:56,800
Speaker 1: I really love the whole transformation part of it. So

458
00:22:56,920 --> 00:23:00,200
Speaker 1: Jillian Michaels has been very public. Every time I pull

459
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,159
Speaker 1: up my new sword source, which we all know is Instagram,

460
00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:07,120
Speaker 1: there's lots She's been doing lots of interviews, and Michaels

461
00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:10,240
Speaker 1: has addressed the documentary's claims on social media. I know

462
00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:11,800
Speaker 1: she was posting a lot of things, and she was

463
00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:17,280
Speaker 1: posting receipts, she was posting screenshots and things. She disputed

464
00:23:17,320 --> 00:23:21,000
Speaker 1: accusations that she and other trainers gave contestants caffeine pills

465
00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:24,760
Speaker 1: without approval, sharing what she said were old emails showing

466
00:23:24,760 --> 00:23:27,479
Speaker 1: that the show's doctor had cleared their use and that

467
00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:32,080
Speaker 1: fellow trainer Bob Harper had even suggested certain supplements. I

468
00:23:32,119 --> 00:23:35,440
Speaker 1: did read an article where she said, I know she's

469
00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:39,040
Speaker 1: mad because she's being blamed and accused of like for

470
00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:41,280
Speaker 1: her team to win or whatever, that she was giving

471
00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:44,800
Speaker 1: them caffeine pills to have an edge. And her dispute

472
00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:47,439
Speaker 1: is that was It's not like I was doing it

473
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:50,880
Speaker 1: on the down load, it was approved. She also rejected

474
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:53,320
Speaker 1: Harper's statement in the series that she failed to reach

475
00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:56,240
Speaker 1: out after his twenty seventeen heart attack, posting what she

476
00:23:56,320 --> 00:23:58,600
Speaker 1: described as a screenshot of one of her last text

477
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:01,400
Speaker 1: messages to him that claims he's the one who never

478
00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:04,399
Speaker 1: responds back to her. She did post a text message

479
00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:06,560
Speaker 1: that said something to the effect of, you know, you

480
00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:09,280
Speaker 1: never respond to any of my texts. You know, I

481
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:14,720
Speaker 1: do find that interesting when people ghost you. Like let's say,

482
00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:17,280
Speaker 1: for example, she shows a text that shows that he's

483
00:24:17,320 --> 00:24:20,080
Speaker 1: not responding to her. So he allegedly, according to her

484
00:24:20,080 --> 00:24:22,800
Speaker 1: and her screenshots, ghosted her and wasn't responding. Then he

485
00:24:22,800 --> 00:24:26,199
Speaker 1: has a heart attack in twenty seventeen, and then he says, oh,

486
00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:29,199
Speaker 1: she didn't, you know, reach out to me. But it's like,

487
00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:32,080
Speaker 1: where does the blame lie. If you ghosted her and

488
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:34,159
Speaker 1: weren't responding to her and you weren't friends, is she

489
00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:37,280
Speaker 1: obligated to reach out? I don't know.

490
00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:38,159
Speaker 2: I don't think so.

491
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:41,640
Speaker 1: Michael's further did I claims that she made an inappropriate

492
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:44,560
Speaker 1: comment to a contestant contestant saying you're going to make

493
00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:47,560
Speaker 1: me a millionaire, or that she encouraged unsafe dieting.

494
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:50,960
Speaker 2: Why would wait as if Jillian said you're going to

495
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:51,800
Speaker 2: make me amazing Yeah.

496
00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:54,879
Speaker 1: In one of the interviews, I don't remember which contestant was,

497
00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:59,480
Speaker 1: but he claimed that she was just you know, pushing

498
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:02,879
Speaker 1: and pushing, pushing and pushing, and said something like, you know,

499
00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:04,800
Speaker 1: don't give up, keep pushing because you're gonna make me

500
00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:06,920
Speaker 1: a millionaire. You know when we watched I don't remember

501
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:09,080
Speaker 1: the one woman's name, but it was the very first.

502
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:11,840
Speaker 1: It's like they flew them in and they ran on

503
00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:14,119
Speaker 1: the beach, remember, and this is like this is before.

504
00:25:14,359 --> 00:25:15,720
Speaker 2: Wasn't it like make it to the finish line and

505
00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:17,440
Speaker 2: then you'll you'll make the cut or something like that.

506
00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:20,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, And she nearly died and they had to helicopter

507
00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:23,879
Speaker 1: her away. And I'm thinking, like literally, like I I

508
00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:25,400
Speaker 1: work out every day and I wouldn't have been able

509
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:29,399
Speaker 1: to run that far and sand and heat on the beach.

510
00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:31,680
Speaker 1: And then and you're talking about people that.

511
00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:35,159
Speaker 2: Are stretch and warm up the least, right.

512
00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:38,400
Speaker 1: I mean, then these are people that clearly are extremely

513
00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:41,480
Speaker 1: overweight and have a sedentary that's when you don't move

514
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:45,000
Speaker 1: like they don't they don't work out, they don't move

515
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:49,560
Speaker 1: a lot. You that's whatever that is, Yes, But and

516
00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:51,000
Speaker 1: then you put them on a beach and you're like,

517
00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:54,400
Speaker 1: run for as long as you can and as hard

518
00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:56,240
Speaker 1: as you can.

519
00:25:57,040 --> 00:25:59,480
Speaker 2: And these are people that never tried to work out,

520
00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:02,840
Speaker 2: knew they were overweight, we're okay with it for or

521
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:04,240
Speaker 2: we're not okay with it, but they let it be

522
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:06,080
Speaker 2: for twenty years. And also he expected them to be

523
00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 2: like superstars and just run right like they could have

524
00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 2: done that on their own. They knew that they don't

525
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:10,960
Speaker 2: want to do it.

526
00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:13,359
Speaker 1: So he claims that she says, you're going to make

527
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:16,359
Speaker 1: me a millionaire, or that she encouraged unsafe dieting. She

528
00:26:16,440 --> 00:26:19,800
Speaker 1: said that written records, including emails and messages with former

529
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:23,199
Speaker 1: participants and producers, supported her account that she promoted a

530
00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:27,600
Speaker 1: calorie intake of sixteen hundred calories per day. The documentary

531
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:31,160
Speaker 1: also alleges that she was forcing contestants to consume less

532
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:35,840
Speaker 1: than a thousand calories and addressing Rachel Frederickson's dramatic weight

533
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:38,399
Speaker 1: loss during season fifteen, Oh my gosh, that was crazy.

534
00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:42,040
Speaker 1: Did you see that? That was in the very last

535
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:45,800
Speaker 1: episode of this they show this girl named Rachel Frederickson

536
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:48,520
Speaker 1: comes out, you know when they show the dramatic weight loss,

537
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:52,040
Speaker 1: and you can see everybody's face and they all look

538
00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:53,960
Speaker 1: shocked because.

539
00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:57,880
Speaker 2: She is so thin, like not like unhealthy.

540
00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:00,480
Speaker 1: Thin like unhealthy than not like she hes been working

541
00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:03,080
Speaker 1: out and she lost the weight and she looks she

542
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:07,679
Speaker 1: like gaunt, and you can look at the camera pans

543
00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:10,639
Speaker 1: to the trainers and they were just like in shock.

544
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:14,359
Speaker 1: So in addressing this is her name was Rachel Frederickson's

545
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:17,760
Speaker 1: dramatic weight loss during season fifteen. Michael's claim that NBC

546
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:22,040
Speaker 1: told her if she did not publicly condone Fredericson's appearance,

547
00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 1: NBC would pursue legal action against her. Michael's also added,

548
00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:29,800
Speaker 1: I resigned from the Biggest Losers shortly thereafter. At this time,

549
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:33,280
Speaker 1: she's considering suing Netflix for the claims made against her,

550
00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:37,440
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously without her own input in this documentary,

551
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:39,720
Speaker 1: since she chose not to be a part of it.

552
00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:43,879
Speaker 1: I know she's thinking this is defamatory. They're accusing her

553
00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:47,480
Speaker 1: of giving, you know, caffeine pills to contestants when they're

554
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:49,720
Speaker 1: claiming that you weren't supposed to do that, and she's saying,

555
00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:52,200
Speaker 1: but we were allowed to do that. She even claims

556
00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:54,680
Speaker 1: that Bob Harper was saying, why don't we give them

557
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:57,639
Speaker 1: some other brand stackers or something, but she said the

558
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:01,000
Speaker 1: conversation revolved around her saying, no, let's use the caffeine pills.

559
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:04,520
Speaker 1: I like because they're cleaner, and that the ban on

560
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:09,200
Speaker 1: caffeine was never a rule. Also, when they interviewed doctor Hazanga,

561
00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:11,400
Speaker 1: he's the doctor that's on staff.

562
00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:12,920
Speaker 2: He disapproved of the caffeine pills, right.

563
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:14,919
Speaker 1: Well, I think he disapproved of a lot of things.

564
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:18,359
Speaker 1: But I think I felt. To me, my takeaway about

565
00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:21,679
Speaker 1: doctor Hazanga was that I felt like he was genuinely

566
00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:22,520
Speaker 1: a good guy.

567
00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:24,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think his health was a concern.

568
00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:28,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was really looking out for the best interest

569
00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:31,960
Speaker 1: of the contestants and their health. But the problem is

570
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:35,680
Speaker 1: is that you're doing that versus good TV, and you've

571
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:37,920
Speaker 1: got production on one side saying, but we have to

572
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:39,600
Speaker 1: make good TV. So they got to work out hard,

573
00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:41,640
Speaker 1: and they got to lose weight. We gotta have transformations.

574
00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:43,920
Speaker 2: And ye, you know you're right, because if they didn't

575
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:46,200
Speaker 2: have any, if people weren't losing weight every week, no

576
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:48,160
Speaker 2: one was going to tune in. Yeah you think, Okay,

577
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:49,800
Speaker 2: this show is not working right.

578
00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:53,360
Speaker 1: So in order to make good TV, you have to

579
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:57,960
Speaker 1: have a significant transformation and you have to have people

580
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 1: dropping weight, and so that's where the line was.

581
00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:05,080
Speaker 2: Blowing and just breaking down, you know, because they break

582
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:07,600
Speaker 2: him down all the time, right, They're crying, they're falling

583
00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:08,760
Speaker 2: over remind.

584
00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:11,840
Speaker 1: Tactics, you know, when you go to boot camp and

585
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 1: the whole point is to break you down so then

586
00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 1: they can build you up. We will continue to follow

587
00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:22,960
Speaker 1: Jillian Michaels. We'll see if she actually does sue Netflix

588
00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:25,440
Speaker 1: and we will follow that story. But anyway, thank you

589
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:27,680
Speaker 1: guys so much for listening today. We appreciate it.

590
00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 2: Thank you