1 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:16,960 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace Crime Con twenty twenty two, Vegas. 2 00:00:17,720 --> 00:00:21,119 Speaker 1: For those of you that couldn't be with us, we 3 00:00:21,360 --> 00:00:23,720 Speaker 1: chose a topic near and dear to our hearts, a 4 00:00:23,840 --> 00:00:28,240 Speaker 1: topic that to this very day is a warning from 5 00:00:28,280 --> 00:00:32,800 Speaker 1: parents all over the country. Natalie Holloway goes missing on 6 00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:36,839 Speaker 1: a school trip. I me, Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories. 7 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:39,160 Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation 8 00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:43,000 Speaker 1: and series X one eleven. Right now, let's go straight 9 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:47,000 Speaker 1: to Crime Con and our all star panel on what 10 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:54,280 Speaker 1: really happened on our investigation in Aruba and what an 11 00:00:54,440 --> 00:00:59,200 Speaker 1: awesome panel of guests we have today. Wait. Now, you 12 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:05,839 Speaker 1: are Cheryl McCollum with me, Founder and Director the Cold 13 00:01:05,880 --> 00:01:08,800 Speaker 1: Case Research Institute. We go all the way back to 14 00:01:08,840 --> 00:01:12,039 Speaker 1: when I was a prosecutor and miss thing showed up, 15 00:01:12,160 --> 00:01:14,440 Speaker 1: she claims, at three am on a crime scene. I 16 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:19,080 Speaker 1: don't know about that. You know. The beautiful and brilliant 17 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:24,480 Speaker 1: doctor Bethany Marshall who was with me, wasn't our first 18 00:01:24,600 --> 00:01:29,399 Speaker 1: hl IN program where we had a young girl, Stacy, 19 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:34,280 Speaker 1: who was behind bars for murder and as we uncovered 20 00:01:34,520 --> 00:01:41,200 Speaker 1: her stepfather or father had been molesting her. I remember, 21 00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:43,959 Speaker 1: Didny call is seeming tiger juice or something like that. 22 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:47,320 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, right, and sticks with you. You just never 23 00:01:47,360 --> 00:01:51,560 Speaker 1: get that out of your head. And she ultimately was released. 24 00:01:51,560 --> 00:01:55,880 Speaker 1: By the way, and of course, right here Kelly Skihn, 25 00:01:56,320 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 1: who was my executive producer on Fox Station, and I'm 26 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:03,760 Speaker 1: so grateful to have Kelly and to have Fox Nation. 27 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:06,440 Speaker 1: And here on the end, who knows who this lady 28 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:13,119 Speaker 1: is as Susan Constantine. Guys, you probably only see her 29 00:02:13,120 --> 00:02:17,800 Speaker 1: on television. Don't move, I mean it, because this woman 30 00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:25,200 Speaker 1: analyzes nonverbal cues, So don't move, okay when I'm on 31 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 1: with her and they put us in the two bicyc 32 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:34,880 Speaker 1: She's brilliant and has done so many high profile cases. 33 00:02:34,880 --> 00:02:37,400 Speaker 1: Now wait, you have a book, right The Complete Idiot's 34 00:02:37,400 --> 00:02:42,000 Speaker 1: Guide to Reading Body Language. Brilliant, and she's online. I'm 35 00:02:42,040 --> 00:02:45,280 Speaker 1: so happy y'all are here, and thank you for being 36 00:02:45,560 --> 00:02:52,200 Speaker 1: at Crime Con and joy asked, and remember, come up 37 00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:55,120 Speaker 1: with questions, please, no difficult legal questions. Don't do that 38 00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:59,520 Speaker 1: to me, okay, because we're coming to you for questions 39 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:03,239 Speaker 1: during this Okay. What we're talking about today is something 40 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 1: that several of us lived through. We were doing a 41 00:03:07,680 --> 00:03:14,160 Speaker 1: special for Fox Nation on Spring Break dangers for spring Breakers, 42 00:03:15,160 --> 00:03:18,400 Speaker 1: Dangers for spring Breakers, because over and over and over 43 00:03:19,360 --> 00:03:22,959 Speaker 1: every year, this one was killed, this one was raped, 44 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:26,800 Speaker 1: this one went missing. And I'm thinking, there's gotta be 45 00:03:26,880 --> 00:03:31,120 Speaker 1: a way for us to at least curtail what happens 46 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:35,560 Speaker 1: to spring Breakers and what class trip sticks out in 47 00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 1: my memory. American Beauty Straight A student Natalie Holloway, so Beth, 48 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:51,920 Speaker 1: her bestie Ginger, a makeup person, media Cheryl, myself and 49 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:56,800 Speaker 1: Kelly and a crew go to Aruba to retrace the 50 00:03:56,880 --> 00:03:59,080 Speaker 1: steps and see what we can find out. And I 51 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:02,760 Speaker 1: gotta tell you, I found out a lot. I don't 52 00:04:02,800 --> 00:04:06,400 Speaker 1: want to be harsh, but you know, you pull up 53 00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 1: to Aruba and you get off that cruise ship and 54 00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:14,640 Speaker 1: everything looks beautiful. Right right behind that first thing, you 55 00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 1: see our crack houses, houses, a prostitution where people sit 56 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:27,719 Speaker 1: out and shoot drugs, very high crime. And we walked, 57 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:30,840 Speaker 1: didn't we, Kelly, didn't we Charyl walked from one tip 58 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:33,760 Speaker 1: of the island to the next. And I'm like, it's 59 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:39,760 Speaker 1: not that big. Why couldn't they find Natalie? And the 60 00:04:39,800 --> 00:04:42,360 Speaker 1: things we learn? But I'm gonna let them kick it off, 61 00:04:42,360 --> 00:04:44,560 Speaker 1: because you guys, hear me all the time, and remember, 62 00:04:44,600 --> 00:04:47,039 Speaker 1: get your questions ready. Just raise your hand in the middle. 63 00:04:47,440 --> 00:04:49,800 Speaker 1: I'll come out to you first of all, Cheryl, let's 64 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:53,719 Speaker 1: hear your story. Nancy. I think you know, and I 65 00:04:53,760 --> 00:04:57,840 Speaker 1: think this audience knows. I would follow Nancy Grace anywhere, 66 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:06,000 Speaker 1: no question about Yes, tiny she has been my prosecutor 67 00:05:06,520 --> 00:05:08,800 Speaker 1: back in the day. And we did meet on an 68 00:05:08,800 --> 00:05:11,600 Speaker 1: active crime scene. That's where we met. It was two 69 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:14,599 Speaker 1: forty five in the morning and this little sports car 70 00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 1: comes flying up to a screech in the hall. This 71 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:19,839 Speaker 1: little bitty woman pops out, what do y'all got? What 72 00:05:19,880 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 1: do you need? What do we have? And I'm like, 73 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:26,000 Speaker 1: what is that? And Jim Birds from the g v 74 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:29,240 Speaker 1: I says, that's Nancy Grace. You don't know Nancy. And 75 00:05:29,360 --> 00:05:32,360 Speaker 1: I'm like, I know two things in this moment. I'm 76 00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:36,000 Speaker 1: gonna nowhere and we're gonna be friends. So back in 77 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:38,080 Speaker 1: the day, we did. We worked in the trenches. So 78 00:05:38,160 --> 00:05:40,720 Speaker 1: when she called me and said, will you go to 79 00:05:40,880 --> 00:05:43,880 Speaker 1: Aruba with me and let's do some you know, security 80 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:47,719 Speaker 1: points for parents that are sending kids to Aruba or 81 00:05:47,800 --> 00:05:51,920 Speaker 1: anywhere on spring break, I didn't hesitate, but y'all, I 82 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 1: wasn't not ready. She did hesitate. That is total be 83 00:05:56,040 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 1: as she I am a passport, I'm like, we'll get 84 00:05:59,520 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 1: one now, Jackie. Jackie is an EP on Crime Stories. 85 00:06:04,720 --> 00:06:10,160 Speaker 1: Did that happen? Oh yeah, oh yeah, that's a story, 86 00:06:10,240 --> 00:06:12,720 Speaker 1: I think, if I remember correctly, Cheryl needed to get 87 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:15,359 Speaker 1: a passport within twenty four hours and flew down to 88 00:06:15,440 --> 00:06:18,440 Speaker 1: Houston to be able to go to Aruba. But I 89 00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:21,760 Speaker 1: will say this was an incredibly surreal trip. I'm not 90 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:24,680 Speaker 1: sure how many people here watched the Fox Nation documentary, 91 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:27,719 Speaker 1: but as Nancy said, we went down there to film 92 00:06:27,720 --> 00:06:29,840 Speaker 1: a warning piece for spring Breakers, and I don't think 93 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:33,360 Speaker 1: we were expecting what we found down there at all. 94 00:06:34,400 --> 00:06:38,000 Speaker 1: That whole thing about saying yes I left immediately, we 95 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:41,160 Speaker 1: had to jump through hoops to get that one a passport. Anyway, 96 00:06:41,160 --> 00:06:45,560 Speaker 1: that's said. Then there was the whole COVID thing. The 97 00:06:45,640 --> 00:06:48,560 Speaker 1: whole COVID thing. We had to be tested and retested 98 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:51,239 Speaker 1: and tested within twelve hours and get to the said, Cheryl, 99 00:06:51,320 --> 00:06:53,400 Speaker 1: get in line, it's time for your COVID test. Bend 100 00:06:53,440 --> 00:07:00,360 Speaker 1: over and I said, Nancy, you got it. I tell you. 101 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:04,200 Speaker 1: Whatever she tells me to do, we're doing. But here's 102 00:07:04,240 --> 00:07:07,080 Speaker 1: the thing that I think shocked me the most. I 103 00:07:07,200 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 1: was prepared for the beautiful water and the flowers, and 104 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:15,000 Speaker 1: the touristy type buildings and things to do. I was 105 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:19,680 Speaker 1: not prepared for the poverty and the desert and the cactus. 106 00:07:20,040 --> 00:07:23,720 Speaker 1: I was really shocked at just how desolate parts of 107 00:07:23,760 --> 00:07:25,600 Speaker 1: it were. Okay, I want to I don't remind you 108 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:28,720 Speaker 1: all something. Do you remember? Do you remember in Naalie 109 00:07:28,800 --> 00:07:32,200 Speaker 1: Holloway one point of interest where her body might have 110 00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:35,840 Speaker 1: been was the lighthouse at the end of the island. 111 00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:40,000 Speaker 1: Speaking about poverty. Now, I know there are things worse 112 00:07:40,040 --> 00:07:42,480 Speaker 1: than this, but this sticks in my mind and I 113 00:07:42,520 --> 00:07:46,360 Speaker 1: can't get wait for it, this one little dog out 114 00:07:46,360 --> 00:07:49,640 Speaker 1: of my mind. Okay, because we went to the end 115 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:52,360 Speaker 1: of the island to look at the lighthouse to see 116 00:07:52,400 --> 00:07:57,080 Speaker 1: it's that even possible. And there was a pike of dog, 117 00:07:57,160 --> 00:08:01,640 Speaker 1: a lot of dogs there that were starving. Now, in America, 118 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:04,960 Speaker 1: if there were dogs, for instance, a national monument that 119 00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 1: were starving, you know, everybody would be trying to save 120 00:08:09,040 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 1: them and rescue the dogs. They were out there, their 121 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 1: ribs were showing. One of them had a hurt leg 122 00:08:17,080 --> 00:08:20,040 Speaker 1: and he was trying to run along with the others 123 00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:22,200 Speaker 1: and I got out of the car and I said, 124 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:25,520 Speaker 1: do we have anything to give them to eat? Because 125 00:08:25,560 --> 00:08:29,679 Speaker 1: all their ribs were painfully sticking out. And I thought, 126 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:33,439 Speaker 1: what kind of place is this? That this is where 127 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:41,000 Speaker 1: people go tourists and that's happening just and I still 128 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:43,560 Speaker 1: think about it because when I got out, it was 129 00:08:43,640 --> 00:08:48,080 Speaker 1: so wind swept and desolate. Remember Kelly, I tried to 130 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 1: do a stand up saying, here we are at the 131 00:08:50,880 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 1: lighthouse where some people thought Natalie's body was. The wind 132 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:59,440 Speaker 1: was so fierce we couldn't even stand up and talk. No, 133 00:08:59,520 --> 00:09:01,400 Speaker 1: I would say, it was so windy we couldn't We 134 00:09:01,400 --> 00:09:04,280 Speaker 1: couldn't film a lot of stuff. But the Aruba you 135 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 1: see in the tourist videos is definitely a trap. That 136 00:09:07,800 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 1: is not the Aruba that we experienced at all. We 137 00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 1: had received a very less than warm welcome. Who wants 138 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:20,920 Speaker 1: to tell about what Beth told us? She flies down immediately, 139 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:23,480 Speaker 1: she bought didn't she get somebody to give her a 140 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:26,080 Speaker 1: let her borrow a jet or something. She was out 141 00:09:26,080 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 1: of her mind, and she knew somebody that knew somebody 142 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:31,240 Speaker 1: that knew somebody that they gave her a ride down there. 143 00:09:32,160 --> 00:09:35,320 Speaker 1: She could not get police to listen to her. Remember 144 00:09:35,360 --> 00:09:39,080 Speaker 1: that story she told about waiting. They went go wait 145 00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:42,280 Speaker 1: and she waited for like seven hours in the police station. 146 00:09:42,320 --> 00:09:46,479 Speaker 1: Oh you tell it, y'all. She was so desperate for information. 147 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:51,400 Speaker 1: She could not get anyone to respond to her. She 148 00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:56,360 Speaker 1: sat alone in a police department not speak in the language. 149 00:09:56,720 --> 00:09:59,480 Speaker 1: They all spoke English. That's one of the four languages 150 00:09:59,520 --> 00:10:02,480 Speaker 1: they know. They would not speak to her, and she 151 00:10:02,640 --> 00:10:07,000 Speaker 1: was waiting just she was gutted because she knew when 152 00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:10,480 Speaker 1: Natalie did not get on that plane, that something horrible 153 00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:13,520 Speaker 1: had happened to her. And when she wanted help, the 154 00:10:13,600 --> 00:10:17,200 Speaker 1: guy said he want he needed to finish his frosted. 155 00:10:18,040 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 1: He came out of his office. He had been in 156 00:10:20,360 --> 00:10:23,360 Speaker 1: his office this whole time, while she's sitting there for 157 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:26,520 Speaker 1: like five hours. And she said he came out and 158 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:30,199 Speaker 1: he was like rubbing his shobu and he went in. 159 00:10:30,320 --> 00:10:32,640 Speaker 1: I had to go to the barbershop. And I was back. 160 00:10:32,679 --> 00:10:36,480 Speaker 1: I was just eating lunch, and I'm like, my daughter 161 00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:41,960 Speaker 1: is missing in your eating wings, hiding in your office 162 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:44,400 Speaker 1: from me. I mean, I would have ripped his throat 163 00:10:44,400 --> 00:11:00,680 Speaker 1: out with my teeth right there. Time story with Nancy 164 00:11:00,720 --> 00:11:07,160 Speaker 1: Grace keeping that mother sitting there like that. I mean, 165 00:11:07,280 --> 00:11:10,320 Speaker 1: do any of you have children? You know I have 166 00:11:10,400 --> 00:11:14,360 Speaker 1: the twins, And I said, David, my husband, I love you, 167 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:18,480 Speaker 1: but nothing can compare to the twins. When you have children, 168 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:21,400 Speaker 1: all bets are off. And he sat there and ate 169 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:24,960 Speaker 1: his wings while she was waiting to find out about 170 00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:27,960 Speaker 1: her daughter. And they still didn't help. Right, No, I 171 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:31,760 Speaker 1: believe it was frosted flakes too. It was. He was 172 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:33,960 Speaker 1: rubbing his fat belly and said he had to finish 173 00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:36,520 Speaker 1: his frosted flakes before he could quote deal with her. 174 00:11:37,080 --> 00:11:40,360 Speaker 1: She's in the worst deal with her of her entire life. Now, 175 00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:43,640 Speaker 1: hold on, we happen to have two brilliant ladies that 176 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:47,839 Speaker 1: are going to weigh in on that. Yet at bethany Well, 177 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:50,600 Speaker 1: I was thinking about this story this morning. I go 178 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 1: back with Nancy Grace to h l N Days where 179 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:56,840 Speaker 1: she had the Nancy Grace Show, and I remember covering 180 00:11:56,880 --> 00:12:01,280 Speaker 1: the story from the Very Big And you have Beth 181 00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:07,000 Speaker 1: who sends her beloved daughter on her graduation trip. And 182 00:12:07,120 --> 00:12:10,680 Speaker 1: imagine the hopes and dreams when you send your girl 183 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:14,880 Speaker 1: away on a graduation trip and you entrust the people 184 00:12:14,920 --> 00:12:17,320 Speaker 1: that are taking were there, you intrust the place she's 185 00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:19,600 Speaker 1: going so many pep. Do you know the twins are 186 00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:24,400 Speaker 1: going on a class trip on Monday, right? I know 187 00:12:24,480 --> 00:12:26,920 Speaker 1: this one is going to follow them because I happened 188 00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:29,840 Speaker 1: to remember when the twins were born, she was spying 189 00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:33,200 Speaker 1: on her own nanny. Didn't you go around the side 190 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:35,480 Speaker 1: of the house. I made no secret that I spied 191 00:12:35,559 --> 00:12:38,720 Speaker 1: on every babysitner and nanny, and they knew it. I 192 00:12:38,800 --> 00:12:41,360 Speaker 1: brought my foot spying one time. That's right, I was 193 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:45,280 Speaker 1: just going to drust my foot. She left the house, 194 00:12:45,360 --> 00:12:48,079 Speaker 1: went around the side, looked in the window to make 195 00:12:48,120 --> 00:12:50,319 Speaker 1: sure nothing bad was happening with the nanny. I think 196 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:54,280 Speaker 1: you were standing on something that fell off broke her foot, 197 00:12:55,840 --> 00:12:59,720 Speaker 1: but not exactly like that, but generally speaking, that's what happened. 198 00:13:00,040 --> 00:13:02,560 Speaker 1: So here's the mom and this guy's by their having 199 00:13:02,559 --> 00:13:05,720 Speaker 1: his frosted flights. But what I think, what I remember 200 00:13:05,760 --> 00:13:11,000 Speaker 1: the most about this story is a whole community conspiring 201 00:13:11,360 --> 00:13:14,480 Speaker 1: to pray on young women. I think that's what's underlying 202 00:13:14,640 --> 00:13:20,559 Speaker 1: the laxadaisical attitude of the constable is that Joran Vanderslou's 203 00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:25,800 Speaker 1: father was a judge there, and everybody knew that Joran. 204 00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:31,080 Speaker 1: That help whole brothers, DJ Diablo, All these young men 205 00:13:31,160 --> 00:13:34,080 Speaker 1: and men were just waiting for these young women to 206 00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:39,520 Speaker 1: come in go to what Charlie Harlos and Charlolos and Charlie's. 207 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:41,760 Speaker 1: It was their first time. Hey guys, what is that 208 00:13:41,800 --> 00:13:50,680 Speaker 1: funny sound? I hear it? Anyway, Okay, sorry, these young 209 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:53,360 Speaker 1: women would go to Carlos and Charlie's. It was their 210 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:58,080 Speaker 1: first time experimenting being away from their parents. Right, So 211 00:13:58,160 --> 00:14:01,199 Speaker 1: maybe their brains weren't fully developed, maybe they were a 212 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:05,439 Speaker 1: little disinhibited, maybe they never had alcohol before. And these 213 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:10,480 Speaker 1: young men, like a pack of dogs, were waiting for them. 214 00:14:10,600 --> 00:14:13,199 Speaker 1: And you can't tell me that the whole community didn't 215 00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:15,960 Speaker 1: know this. You can't tell me that this wasn't the 216 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 1: culture of a Ruba, just like what you what you 217 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:22,080 Speaker 1: found when you visited there for this special And that's 218 00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:25,920 Speaker 1: why I think Beth had such problems investigating this on 219 00:14:25,920 --> 00:14:28,520 Speaker 1: our own, and problems that you had is that this 220 00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:32,320 Speaker 1: whole community is in on it. They're colluding, they're conspiring. 221 00:14:32,800 --> 00:14:36,240 Speaker 1: They know they want the tourists. They don't want those 222 00:14:36,280 --> 00:14:39,560 Speaker 1: cruise ships to stop, they don't want the class trips 223 00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 1: to stop. Susan Constantine is a world renowned nonverbal specialist. 224 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:51,160 Speaker 1: You also look at what people say too and the 225 00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:53,200 Speaker 1: way they say it. But I want to get your 226 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:56,360 Speaker 1: take on this chief of police coming out and saying 227 00:14:56,680 --> 00:15:01,160 Speaker 1: I had my food before I could deal with you. Well, 228 00:15:01,280 --> 00:15:05,000 Speaker 1: someone that liked that is detached, right. They don't realize 229 00:15:05,040 --> 00:15:08,240 Speaker 1: the severity of the situation, and they didn't rank it 230 00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:11,480 Speaker 1: up as being a high profile case at this point. 231 00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:14,440 Speaker 1: It was just a bothersome. This is another kid that 232 00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:17,760 Speaker 1: probably got drunk on a trip and they didn't really care. 233 00:15:18,160 --> 00:15:20,840 Speaker 1: But that's not what this case was all about. This 234 00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:26,640 Speaker 1: wasn't about predatorial people that are out there looking at children, 235 00:15:26,880 --> 00:15:31,280 Speaker 1: vulnerable young girls, especially blonde haired, blue eyed girls. And 236 00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:35,640 Speaker 1: that was a predator that was out there seeking to 237 00:15:35,680 --> 00:15:40,800 Speaker 1: whom he was going to find and take back. But yeah, 238 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:44,520 Speaker 1: that police officer total disregard and he thought he could 239 00:15:44,560 --> 00:15:46,960 Speaker 1: get away with it, and he did get away with it, 240 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:50,200 Speaker 1: coming out and going oh yeah, I had to eat 241 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:54,760 Speaker 1: before I deal with you. Really, And what we learned, Cheryl, 242 00:15:54,840 --> 00:15:57,880 Speaker 1: remember was that this was what jrn Vandersliet would do. 243 00:15:58,080 --> 00:16:01,520 Speaker 1: I didn't know this that he did this week after 244 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:05,440 Speaker 1: week after week, when new groups would come in, he 245 00:16:05,480 --> 00:16:13,280 Speaker 1: would find young ladies, didn't matter. Caller race age somebody 246 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:15,120 Speaker 1: for him to pray on, but it had to be 247 00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:19,440 Speaker 1: a woman. And I found out that night that his father, 248 00:16:20,560 --> 00:16:25,560 Speaker 1: the judge Paulas Vanderslut, was at the casino at the 249 00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:30,440 Speaker 1: table with Yourn Vanderslout and Natalie, and it's in the video. 250 00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:33,600 Speaker 1: But when asked he went, I don't know anything about it. 251 00:16:33,680 --> 00:16:36,600 Speaker 1: He was just there with her. But wait, what about 252 00:16:36,680 --> 00:16:40,240 Speaker 1: that little moment when we all were threatened with arrest? 253 00:16:40,520 --> 00:16:48,040 Speaker 1: Cheryl at times? Okay, I had a severely twisted ankle 254 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:51,280 Speaker 1: at the time. Oh blah blah. I could hardly move, 255 00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:56,960 Speaker 1: and she was fine. Because I'm taking pictures. You go 256 00:16:57,080 --> 00:17:03,400 Speaker 1: in front Nancy. My ankle's hurting of the holiday Inn. Well, 257 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:06,199 Speaker 1: I notice Kelly and Nancy. All of a sudden, this 258 00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:10,160 Speaker 1: security guard starts harassing them a little bit. Well, I'm 259 00:17:10,160 --> 00:17:12,280 Speaker 1: over to the side, and I'm like, what in the 260 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 1: world The security guard will not let them in the 261 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:19,439 Speaker 1: holiday Inn. So Beth and Nancy and Kelly are standing 262 00:17:19,480 --> 00:17:22,480 Speaker 1: there again, I'm in the front yard taking a picture 263 00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:26,880 Speaker 1: from it. Just hurt and cross. So I decide, all 264 00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:31,280 Speaker 1: of a sudden, a police car drives up three d well, 265 00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:34,240 Speaker 1: I'm in law enforcement. I know what that means. So 266 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:38,439 Speaker 1: I start walking back toward the car, Thanks, Cheryl, because 267 00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:41,440 Speaker 1: I know I'm the slowest one, so if there's something 268 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:43,480 Speaker 1: about to go down, they can catch me. I think 269 00:17:43,480 --> 00:17:47,200 Speaker 1: I heard her say I don't know them. And Nancy 270 00:17:47,359 --> 00:17:51,119 Speaker 1: is pleading their case. Why it's not pleading anything? Why 271 00:17:51,160 --> 00:17:54,000 Speaker 1: can we not go into the holiday inn? And they 272 00:17:54,040 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 1: said we won't allow anybody in that's not a guest here. 273 00:17:57,280 --> 00:18:00,320 Speaker 1: And Nancy said, I got a credit card, will rent 274 00:18:00,359 --> 00:18:02,760 Speaker 1: a room right now. They still wouldn't let her in. 275 00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:05,840 Speaker 1: So I start walking back toward the cars because I'm like, 276 00:18:05,880 --> 00:18:08,320 Speaker 1: I'm out of here, y'all. And all of a sudden, 277 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:11,360 Speaker 1: Nancy and them start walking back toward the cars. They 278 00:18:11,560 --> 00:18:16,480 Speaker 1: passed me. Nancy doesn't even miss a clip going past me, 279 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:19,080 Speaker 1: and then the police are now behind me, and I 280 00:18:19,160 --> 00:18:24,679 Speaker 1: hear them say stop stop right now, ma'am. Well I stop, Nancy, 281 00:18:24,760 --> 00:18:28,600 Speaker 1: don't stop, y'all. And I thought, Lord, I'm gonna go 282 00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:32,040 Speaker 1: to jail and a ruba alone. Well they started, I 283 00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:34,199 Speaker 1: gonna do what they told me, did you? Well? I 284 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:37,200 Speaker 1: took a picture, a selfie of me and two of 285 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:39,800 Speaker 1: the polices Nancy Grace getting arrested. That's what she was 286 00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:43,679 Speaker 1: trying to get a picture. It was. Then he says, ma'am, 287 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:46,639 Speaker 1: you're gonna go to jail if you take a picture 288 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:49,840 Speaker 1: of me. And I was like, do tell well about 289 00:18:49,840 --> 00:18:52,320 Speaker 1: that time they're hollered Nancy and them Nancy in bed 290 00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:55,760 Speaker 1: still won't stop. All of a sudden, I'm thinking, okay, 291 00:18:55,800 --> 00:19:00,119 Speaker 1: I may go to jail alone. Nancy stops, y'all, She 292 00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:03,600 Speaker 1: turns on her heels, she comes walking straight back to 293 00:19:03,680 --> 00:19:07,240 Speaker 1: that policeman. And then I thought, oh lord, I know 294 00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:11,800 Speaker 1: I'm going to jail now. And I thought, I love 295 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:15,600 Speaker 1: this woman, and I will be her, you know what, 296 00:19:16,240 --> 00:19:18,439 Speaker 1: in Georgia. But I ain't gonna be here, you know what, 297 00:19:18,520 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 1: in prison in a Ruba. We're gonna have to work 298 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:24,359 Speaker 1: something out. I mean, I love her, but you know 299 00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:26,720 Speaker 1: that's too much because I did find out there's no 300 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:29,920 Speaker 1: air conditioning in the jails in a Ruba, and that's 301 00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:33,280 Speaker 1: just too much. Nacy Gray spots right back to that 302 00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:37,000 Speaker 1: man and she says, are you telling me that we 303 00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:41,879 Speaker 1: cannot film on the public grassway here? We're not on 304 00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:44,160 Speaker 1: their property, and they would if she were. You were 305 00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:46,439 Speaker 1: filming on that property, and that's when Kelly jumped in. 306 00:19:46,640 --> 00:19:49,399 Speaker 1: Kelly's recording the whole time. My mic is hot the 307 00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:52,399 Speaker 1: whole time. Yeah, Kelly was in the background. Hey, this 308 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:55,000 Speaker 1: will be great. Arrest her. No no, no, no no, 309 00:19:56,359 --> 00:19:59,479 Speaker 1: but do it slowly so I can get a good picture. No. So, 310 00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:02,080 Speaker 1: they were falsely accusing us of filming. And there's a 311 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:06,679 Speaker 1: reason that only I the journalists always talk about false accusations. 312 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:10,640 Speaker 1: It was all false. So I whipped out my phone 313 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:13,240 Speaker 1: and started recording it because it was just unbelievable that 314 00:20:13,280 --> 00:20:15,680 Speaker 1: we were being falsely accused of filming when we had 315 00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:18,240 Speaker 1: no crew in sight. There's a reason it's not on video, 316 00:20:18,600 --> 00:20:21,159 Speaker 1: and we were doing absolutely nothing illegal. But I do 317 00:20:21,200 --> 00:20:23,320 Speaker 1: want to add something to the Carlos and Charlie's point 318 00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:26,639 Speaker 1: for a second, because Natalie's dad found out that you 319 00:20:26,680 --> 00:20:30,360 Speaker 1: could pay a bartender there twenty dollars to spike someone's strength, 320 00:20:30,600 --> 00:20:32,880 Speaker 1: and that is what you're on vander Salute did over 321 00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:35,280 Speaker 1: and over and over again. And what we learned when 322 00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:37,720 Speaker 1: we were down there is that that is still happening 323 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:40,840 Speaker 1: to this day, not only to tourists but to local rubens, 324 00:20:40,920 --> 00:20:44,239 Speaker 1: and absolutely nothing has been done to stop that. And 325 00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:47,560 Speaker 1: that is why they did not want us right where 326 00:20:47,560 --> 00:20:50,200 Speaker 1: we were. We were at the Holiday Anne and beside 327 00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:55,160 Speaker 1: it was the casino at that time, and that's where 328 00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:59,199 Speaker 1: spiking was going on, also at Carlos and Charlie's, and 329 00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:02,800 Speaker 1: it's still opening today. So the last thing they want 330 00:21:03,240 --> 00:21:08,920 Speaker 1: is Kelly, myself Cheryl busting up in there and messing 331 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:12,360 Speaker 1: up their deal. They don't want the truth coming out. 332 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:16,080 Speaker 1: And let me tell y'all something. I have seen Nancy 333 00:21:16,119 --> 00:21:19,399 Speaker 1: in a courtroom, and y'all, there ain't nobody better. She 334 00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:22,480 Speaker 1: will advocate for you, she will fight for you. But 335 00:21:22,680 --> 00:21:25,880 Speaker 1: let me tell you something right now, quick, in a hurry. 336 00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:29,000 Speaker 1: You ain't seeing nothing till you've seen that woman on 337 00:21:29,200 --> 00:21:34,040 Speaker 1: Foreign Soul advocating for Bev Holloway. She was flat ready 338 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:41,399 Speaker 1: to go to jail. It was awesome. I think the 339 00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:45,760 Speaker 1: only reason that we were not booked is because that 340 00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:50,880 Speaker 1: would have been even a worse pr nightmare for them, 341 00:21:51,040 --> 00:21:54,720 Speaker 1: with me screaming to the top of my lungs, things 342 00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:59,440 Speaker 1: like you killed Natalie, stuff like that. And but wait, 343 00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:05,160 Speaker 1: did they offer for you a cocktail? But I gotta 344 00:22:05,200 --> 00:22:10,880 Speaker 1: tell you something, Aruba is nothing like what I thought 345 00:22:10,960 --> 00:22:14,360 Speaker 1: it would be. And in that moment when they were 346 00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 1: threatening to arrest us, I didn't even think about the 347 00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:19,879 Speaker 1: jail or the air condition. All I was thinking about 348 00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:25,280 Speaker 1: was you are the same cops that let Natalie holloway 349 00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:32,600 Speaker 1: body be hidden forever because you did nothing when you 350 00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:36,080 Speaker 1: could have helped her mother. You did nothing, and you're 351 00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:39,359 Speaker 1: doing it again. Instead of helping us find the truth, 352 00:22:39,600 --> 00:22:42,639 Speaker 1: you're correcting to put us in jail. And that's all 353 00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:44,600 Speaker 1: I could think when I looked at them when they 354 00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:48,160 Speaker 1: were huge, Remember them, they looked like they spent half 355 00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:50,200 Speaker 1: a day at work and half a day in the gym. 356 00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:52,360 Speaker 1: I think they were pumped up on steroids. They had 357 00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:54,320 Speaker 1: to be. They were so big and ripped in their 358 00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:59,240 Speaker 1: black slot outfits, so predictable. And there were we, and 359 00:22:59,320 --> 00:23:02,520 Speaker 1: we also had a local with us from Aruba. Her 360 00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:05,720 Speaker 1: mom worked at the Holiday Inn, and they threatened her. 361 00:23:05,800 --> 00:23:08,160 Speaker 1: They said, you will be the first one to go 362 00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:10,919 Speaker 1: down for this group when we were doing nothing wrong, 363 00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:13,879 Speaker 1: and she relies on them giving her permission to film 364 00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:16,520 Speaker 1: for her own company. So they were threatening the local 365 00:23:16,560 --> 00:23:19,120 Speaker 1: who was helping Nancy Grace. And even before we got 366 00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:22,639 Speaker 1: down there, Beth said, Kelly, we have seven to twelve 367 00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:25,479 Speaker 1: minutes at every single location before the police arrived. So 368 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:27,440 Speaker 1: they are all over her, but they were not all 369 00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:30,600 Speaker 1: over solving Natalie's give you that point on. We would 370 00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:34,240 Speaker 1: walk up to a restaurant or a bar where we 371 00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:37,760 Speaker 1: thought Natalie had been. They would come to the door 372 00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:40,840 Speaker 1: and lock it. I could see him doing it through 373 00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:45,600 Speaker 1: the glass and put closed. I'm like, what, We're going 374 00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:47,800 Speaker 1: to come in there and shoot the place up. It 375 00:23:47,920 --> 00:24:10,960 Speaker 1: was insane time stories with Nancy Grace. I'm not hearing 376 00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:14,040 Speaker 1: from beth Any Marsha, which is really odd, and Susy 377 00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:17,560 Speaker 1: Constita a very odd. I have a thought bubble forming 378 00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:20,840 Speaker 1: above my head. Where are the women in this community? 379 00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:24,320 Speaker 1: All these men are predators, And if they're not directly 380 00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:28,320 Speaker 1: a predator themselves, they're aiding and abetting a predator. They're 381 00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:33,680 Speaker 1: overlooking predatory behaviors. It's like a culture of predation. Just 382 00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:38,600 Speaker 1: like you have child molesters forming communities online where they 383 00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:41,040 Speaker 1: all share pictures and they all know where to find 384 00:24:41,119 --> 00:24:44,240 Speaker 1: children and where one will kidnap a child, then they'll 385 00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:46,840 Speaker 1: send a picture to another one. You have a same 386 00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:50,000 Speaker 1: sort of community on the island of Aruba, where they're 387 00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:56,000 Speaker 1: all conspiring together in some way, either actively participating or overlooking. 388 00:24:56,040 --> 00:25:01,120 Speaker 1: So the question is where are the women where Jordan 389 00:25:01,200 --> 00:25:08,639 Speaker 1: Vandress Flute's mother, the constable's mother, waitress home and the 390 00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:12,960 Speaker 1: mother still lives right there and they've got fancies around it. 391 00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:17,639 Speaker 1: And remember we went to Fine. Okay, yep, what about it, Susan, 392 00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:20,639 Speaker 1: I'm sorry I didn't hear the question. It wasn't a question. 393 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,000 Speaker 1: Just wanted to hear your thoughts. Well. One of the 394 00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:24,640 Speaker 1: things that I wanted to kind of hitch hike off 395 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:27,680 Speaker 1: from was what you were talking about, the predatorial type 396 00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:29,680 Speaker 1: of people. The one thing I want you to all 397 00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:32,359 Speaker 1: be aware of is that they already know what they're 398 00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:34,800 Speaker 1: looking for when they walk in the door, and so 399 00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:39,679 Speaker 1: they placed themselves as a spotter, so they spot around, 400 00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:42,199 Speaker 1: they go back several times. The fact that that you 401 00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:44,600 Speaker 1: see them over and over again should give you a clue. 402 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:48,960 Speaker 1: And also they have a very fixated response. They look 403 00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:52,359 Speaker 1: at someone and they're very fixated. It's like a dog 404 00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:54,919 Speaker 1: that's looking at someone ready to go for a prey 405 00:25:55,119 --> 00:25:58,760 Speaker 1: because they're thinking and contemplating at what they're doing. So 406 00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:02,040 Speaker 1: you need to watch al for that nonverbal behavior because 407 00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:08,040 Speaker 1: predatorial nature is prevalent there's nowhere that it's safe. It 408 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,679 Speaker 1: could be your brother, I mean a brother's friend. It 409 00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:13,080 Speaker 1: could be a doctor, it could be a coach, it 410 00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:16,120 Speaker 1: could be a priest, it could be anybody. They're out 411 00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:19,119 Speaker 1: there and they're looking for vulnerable women. I mean, you know, 412 00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:21,720 Speaker 1: I would think a judge would go along with his 413 00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:24,080 Speaker 1: son's activity. You say something, well, you know when this 414 00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:26,960 Speaker 1: story first broke and I remember being on so many 415 00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:29,159 Speaker 1: shows with you, Nancy, there was an article in the 416 00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:31,399 Speaker 1: New York Times called can a nine year old b 417 00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:35,760 Speaker 1: a sociopath? And that's when the we as a community 418 00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:39,480 Speaker 1: first began to think about how young sociopathy develops, and 419 00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:42,560 Speaker 1: we think of Joran Vanderslout was really the poster child 420 00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:48,760 Speaker 1: for sociopathy, aggressive predatory, lack of a conscience. I mean, 421 00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:54,160 Speaker 1: his whole life was organized around praying on young women. 422 00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:57,320 Speaker 1: And we know with organized crime, usually it takes only 423 00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 1: one sociopath to recruit who similarly have a lack of Conscio. 424 00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:06,080 Speaker 1: When you're making me think of and I said it, 425 00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:08,879 Speaker 1: and I taken Joey and having been right that one time, 426 00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:11,760 Speaker 1: I said, he's going to do this again now, and 427 00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:15,480 Speaker 1: then current me if I'm wrong guys five years to 428 00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:21,240 Speaker 1: the day, the day Stephanie Flores, Stephanie Tassiana Flores. He 429 00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:26,280 Speaker 1: met her in a casino, talked her up. They went 430 00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:30,720 Speaker 1: back to his room and she opened up her iPad 431 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:34,240 Speaker 1: or her phone and was googling him, and she asked 432 00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:38,800 Speaker 1: him about Natalie Holloway. He bludgeoned her dead. Then he 433 00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:41,960 Speaker 1: went out and got a croissant and coffee, came back 434 00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:45,840 Speaker 1: in with her dead body right there, and ate breakfast. 435 00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:49,880 Speaker 1: You know, there was blood all over that hotel room. 436 00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:54,199 Speaker 1: He didn't just kill her. He belugend her out and 437 00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:58,520 Speaker 1: outrage that she knew who he was, that she was 438 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:01,879 Speaker 1: going to id him, And probably not so much that 439 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:05,159 Speaker 1: he was afraid of exposure getting caught, but that he 440 00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:07,440 Speaker 1: didn't want to be prevented from going right back out 441 00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:11,880 Speaker 1: into the casino and praying on your thing. Thing. Now 442 00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:14,040 Speaker 1: wait a minute, where were all those hands we were 443 00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:17,920 Speaker 1: talking about with questions. I'll take anything, of course, I'll 444 00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:22,120 Speaker 1: throw it to them, but we don't stand up see 445 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:24,120 Speaker 1: that camera. Don't you want to be a Fox nation? 446 00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:29,479 Speaker 1: Because I do? Okay, So how does this continue when 447 00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:33,560 Speaker 1: we know what's happening and we just is there anything 448 00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:37,520 Speaker 1: we can do you know what was your name? Lynette 449 00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:43,280 Speaker 1: from Salt Lake. You know that's why we went to 450 00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:46,320 Speaker 1: find out what, if anything, we could do. I was 451 00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:50,120 Speaker 1: really not mentally and emotionally prepared to find out the 452 00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:53,560 Speaker 1: scale on which it was happening. Still to this day, 453 00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:56,360 Speaker 1: after Natalie was killed, and you want to tell me, 454 00:28:56,480 --> 00:29:01,840 Speaker 1: Cheryl McCollum that he ripped apart Stephanie tossing on a floridask, 455 00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:05,840 Speaker 1: but he didn't touch Natalie, right. This is also a 456 00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:09,480 Speaker 1: man that has confessed how many times and he's also 457 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:13,240 Speaker 1: told thirty two different versions of what happened to her 458 00:29:13,320 --> 00:29:17,880 Speaker 1: that night. Over a hundred people saw her get in 459 00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:21,600 Speaker 1: his car because the bar had closed. They were all outside. 460 00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:25,720 Speaker 1: All of her classmates saw him. He has continued to 461 00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:29,560 Speaker 1: con and harass Beth. He's offered to tell her thanks 462 00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:33,800 Speaker 1: for money. He is the epitome of a socio yet 463 00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:38,360 Speaker 1: no conviction and now murder her Lynnette from Salt Lake Cities. 464 00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:41,320 Speaker 1: Question Wise, of what can we do, well, we went 465 00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:45,040 Speaker 1: to try to do something and find something, but sadly, 466 00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:47,440 Speaker 1: I don't think we made a dent in it. But 467 00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:52,479 Speaker 1: what you can do is school your children and follow 468 00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:55,320 Speaker 1: the rules. Yourself. You know what I did before I 469 00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:59,480 Speaker 1: came here. I started to spank myself. I got to 470 00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 1: the airp and the flight was delayed, so I sat 471 00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:07,600 Speaker 1: in a dark parking lot answering emails and texts for 472 00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:11,840 Speaker 1: like thirty forty minutes. I'm like, WHOA, what am I doing? 473 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,240 Speaker 1: This is crazy? So I get out go in. But 474 00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:19,520 Speaker 1: even having literally written a book about how to stay safe, 475 00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:24,160 Speaker 1: we still, you know, our defenses slip because you don't 476 00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:27,240 Speaker 1: expect everybody to be a killer or a rapist, and 477 00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:31,360 Speaker 1: that is when they strike when you're on your senior trip. Well, 478 00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:33,840 Speaker 1: and then here's what Beth said what we can do 479 00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:36,160 Speaker 1: to protect ourselves. First of all, don't go to Aruba. 480 00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:38,960 Speaker 1: Don't give them your two urism dollars. Second of all, 481 00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:41,560 Speaker 1: if you're sending your child overseas, do you have a 482 00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:44,240 Speaker 1: passport in case something goes wrong? Can you get to them? 483 00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:46,520 Speaker 1: Do you have enough money on your credit card to 484 00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:49,600 Speaker 1: book a last minute flight? Do you have enough high 485 00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:52,040 Speaker 1: enough limit on your credit card to stay at a 486 00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,280 Speaker 1: hotel for months on end? All of that needs to 487 00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:56,880 Speaker 1: be put in place before your children goes off. God forbid, 488 00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:01,800 Speaker 1: something goes wrong another thing, for instance, jrn Vandersliet was 489 00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:05,880 Speaker 1: drugging women at the bar in their drinks. We know that, 490 00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:09,080 Speaker 1: and he routinely did it and was still doing it 491 00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:13,680 Speaker 1: after Natalie was murdered. Don't leave your drink because a 492 00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:15,920 Speaker 1: lot of people go, well, why did she leave with 493 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:19,280 Speaker 1: three guys? She didn't know. She was so out of 494 00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:21,560 Speaker 1: her mind. I think part of his story was true, 495 00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:24,280 Speaker 1: that they went to the beach. He said they didn't 496 00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:28,560 Speaker 1: have sex, but then he could describe her underwear and 497 00:31:28,760 --> 00:31:32,280 Speaker 1: she may have started vomiting and choking up from the 498 00:31:32,360 --> 00:31:36,840 Speaker 1: roofie he gave her. That may be true. But when 499 00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:40,120 Speaker 1: people blame her for leaving, I hate that because they're 500 00:31:40,160 --> 00:31:45,200 Speaker 1: shaming the victim. But don't let anybody leave on their own, 501 00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:50,400 Speaker 1: And don't you leave on your own and watch your drink. 502 00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:55,040 Speaker 1: She had no idea what had happened, okay. I Also, 503 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:56,960 Speaker 1: in terms of what can you do, we have to 504 00:31:57,000 --> 00:32:00,480 Speaker 1: be aware of society that there are certain vulnerable populars 505 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:04,960 Speaker 1: and those populations are vulnerable at certain times. Children who 506 00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:08,720 Speaker 1: are getting on and off school buses, are seniors in 507 00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:12,239 Speaker 1: society who are left alone with caregivers where we may 508 00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:18,400 Speaker 1: not be overlooking what's happening. Young women on senior trips 509 00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:22,960 Speaker 1: whose supervisors leave them unattended. These are all vulnerable populations, 510 00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:26,920 Speaker 1: so they should be watched at all time. Because young 511 00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:30,760 Speaker 1: people have a right to go and experiment with being 512 00:32:30,800 --> 00:32:34,040 Speaker 1: away from their parents, but they should experiment in a 513 00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:38,800 Speaker 1: safe environment. So we have to think about safer environments 514 00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:41,600 Speaker 1: for them. I believe somebody has are hand up out 515 00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:44,440 Speaker 1: in the crowd. Come on up. What's the question? I 516 00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:47,000 Speaker 1: was just wondering the friends she was with, why didn't 517 00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:50,520 Speaker 1: they stay with her? I don't know. I never got 518 00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:53,040 Speaker 1: the answer to that, Dona kill I don't. Well. Yes, 519 00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:56,920 Speaker 1: so the cabs in Aruba don't look like regular caves. 520 00:32:56,960 --> 00:33:00,239 Speaker 1: They look like cars. So her friends thought she was 521 00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:03,000 Speaker 1: getting into a cab. They didn't think she was getting 522 00:33:03,040 --> 00:33:06,040 Speaker 1: into a stranger's car. And I know her friends struggle 523 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:09,240 Speaker 1: still to this day with what happened, and that the 524 00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:11,640 Speaker 1: fact that they weren't able to, you know, get her 525 00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:15,080 Speaker 1: to stay with them. I know they've struggled severely with 526 00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:18,040 Speaker 1: what happened. I do know that her friends went in 527 00:33:18,080 --> 00:33:20,680 Speaker 1: and out of the hotel room multiple times that night, 528 00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:25,640 Speaker 1: because Natalie's key cards showed multiple entrances and exits from 529 00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:28,200 Speaker 1: the hotel room between two and four in the morning. 530 00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:32,040 Speaker 1: So if she switched keys with them, that does imply 531 00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:34,840 Speaker 1: that they were up, that they that they were sober, 532 00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:37,000 Speaker 1: that they were aware of what's going on, and that 533 00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:40,520 Speaker 1: they were searching for her. Question that my name is Kathy. 534 00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:47,600 Speaker 1: Is there any evidence that he perpetrated before Natalie's Okay, 535 00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:51,959 Speaker 1: this is what I know. I've never had a defendant 536 00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:57,920 Speaker 1: or suspect go from sixty to one twenty mph like that. 537 00:33:59,640 --> 00:34:05,160 Speaker 1: We do know for sure that he would routinely drug women, 538 00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:08,360 Speaker 1: rape them when they were unconscious, and take their money 539 00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:11,360 Speaker 1: because he would wait for the next cruise ship or 540 00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:14,400 Speaker 1: the next school trip to come in. So we know 541 00:34:14,760 --> 00:34:19,280 Speaker 1: Natalie was not his first victim. Whether he killed anybody before, 542 00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:23,440 Speaker 1: I don't know, but two dead bodies is enough for me. 543 00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:27,600 Speaker 1: And just hold this thought. He is in a prison 544 00:34:28,360 --> 00:34:34,319 Speaker 1: in Lima near Lima, where he can have drugs, alcohol, 545 00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:38,680 Speaker 1: and conjugal visits. He has gotten married and got a 546 00:34:38,920 --> 00:34:43,360 Speaker 1: woman pregnant and has a child, and so he's like 547 00:34:43,520 --> 00:34:48,640 Speaker 1: king of the penitentiary. Sex offenders offend on average for 548 00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:53,560 Speaker 1: sixteen years before they come to the attention of law enforcement, 549 00:34:54,120 --> 00:34:56,200 Speaker 1: So that tells you a little bit about what Sean 550 00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:58,600 Speaker 1: Vandersloot might have been up to. Sorry, Hi, I'm Katie 551 00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:00,719 Speaker 1: from you the City, California. I wanted to know if 552 00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:03,920 Speaker 1: any of the bartenders or the clubs that were surrounding, 553 00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:06,680 Speaker 1: did anybody get in any kind of trouble or you 554 00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:08,600 Speaker 1: know anyone who helped him. You said that they were 555 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:11,759 Speaker 1: getting paid twenty dollars to spike a drink. Nobody got 556 00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:16,719 Speaker 1: in trouble and the two brothers, Dpak and who was 557 00:35:16,760 --> 00:35:22,399 Speaker 1: the other brother, Cheryl Satish were question arrested. Thank you 558 00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:25,840 Speaker 1: and let go. But Nancy, I think it's imperative that 559 00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:32,120 Speaker 1: people understand this entire island is protecting their tourism, the 560 00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:37,120 Speaker 1: entire place, the hotels, the restaurants, the cabs, everybody. We 561 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:40,960 Speaker 1: did track down a former bartender at Carlos and Charlie's, 562 00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:43,760 Speaker 1: and I was astounded to learn he wouldn't talk because 563 00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:47,480 Speaker 1: he signed a non disclosure agreement. What restaurant or bar 564 00:35:47,640 --> 00:35:49,480 Speaker 1: do you work at where you need to sign an 565 00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:52,799 Speaker 1: NDA when you leave? That tells me everything I need 566 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:56,560 Speaker 1: to know about what was going on there. Hi, I'm Jill, 567 00:35:56,680 --> 00:35:59,040 Speaker 1: and I just wanted to know what your personal theory 568 00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:03,040 Speaker 1: is on what may have happened to her. You're talking 569 00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:06,879 Speaker 1: about Natalie. Natalie went with her friends to go out 570 00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,520 Speaker 1: and have fun that night. She was at a bar. 571 00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:12,799 Speaker 1: Jorn van der Sleet was at the bar. She was 572 00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:17,319 Speaker 1: just It's like a wolf waiting for the sheep to 573 00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:23,719 Speaker 1: go by. It's like a hyena out on the Serengetti 574 00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:31,040 Speaker 1: hiding at the water place, waiting for the gazelle, and 575 00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:34,520 Speaker 1: then all they have to do is catch one gazelle. 576 00:36:34,840 --> 00:36:38,520 Speaker 1: The weak link. I think that he spotted Natalie. He 577 00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:42,160 Speaker 1: started talking her up. As she talked back, it was nice. 578 00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:46,600 Speaker 1: Then he slipped her the drug and it was all over. 579 00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:50,440 Speaker 1: I think he led her to the car they went away. 580 00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:53,600 Speaker 1: I think that he raped her because she was unconscious. 581 00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:56,879 Speaker 1: I don't know if the Calpo brothers joined in, and 582 00:36:56,920 --> 00:36:59,799 Speaker 1: I think that he killed her. Where do you think 583 00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:03,200 Speaker 1: her to remain? Oh gosh, I think they're either buried 584 00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:06,520 Speaker 1: somewhere on that island, if you're the father Paulace had 585 00:37:06,560 --> 00:37:09,200 Speaker 1: anything to do with it, or there's a very strong 586 00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:13,440 Speaker 1: possibility they went out in the water and dropped her 587 00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:15,560 Speaker 1: remains out there. And if you get past a certain 588 00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:19,279 Speaker 1: point your past, for instance, a reef and it goes 589 00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:23,000 Speaker 1: straight out to the ocean. There's no harbor past a 590 00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:25,040 Speaker 1: certain boat. They have a friend who was a DJ 591 00:37:25,560 --> 00:37:28,920 Speaker 1: was a DJ dia the Tattoo party boat, Yes, the 592 00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:32,920 Speaker 1: tattoo party boat that actually presented to law enforcement telling 593 00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:35,960 Speaker 1: multiple lies about where he had been that night, which 594 00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:38,120 Speaker 1: tells me that he could have been the one who 595 00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:41,319 Speaker 1: captained a boat that took her out and dumped her 596 00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:43,919 Speaker 1: in the waters. But you know, to me, I find 597 00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:46,880 Speaker 1: it hard to believe that somebody else was involved because 598 00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:50,600 Speaker 1: people can never keep their yap shut, Like people say, 599 00:37:50,800 --> 00:37:56,560 Speaker 1: do you think OJ did it? Yes, because if you 600 00:37:56,680 --> 00:37:59,040 Speaker 1: buy into the theory that the police had a big 601 00:37:59,080 --> 00:38:02,360 Speaker 1: conspiracy and they were trying to frame him their idol, 602 00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:06,719 Speaker 1: one of them would have broken ranks by by now 603 00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:11,280 Speaker 1: and done a two three million dollars deal with Saint 604 00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:14,359 Speaker 1: Martin's breath or whoever, and written a book and made 605 00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:18,319 Speaker 1: a movie about what really happened. So I think that 606 00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:22,840 Speaker 1: if you're in vandersliep and the Calpo brothers had had help, 607 00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:28,040 Speaker 1: somebody would have cracked by now. Hi, I'm Renee from La. 608 00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:31,720 Speaker 1: What about his father? Nothing happened to him. His father died, 609 00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:34,640 Speaker 1: His father had a heart attack, or a stroke on 610 00:38:34,640 --> 00:38:39,160 Speaker 1: a tennis court. I blame yourn vandersliep because all the 611 00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:41,840 Speaker 1: pressure and all the stress, all the covering of the 612 00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:44,799 Speaker 1: murder come. Well, do you remember Paula's running from the 613 00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:48,279 Speaker 1: Remember when we would ask Paul's the question he had, 614 00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:51,279 Speaker 1: Literally the judge would take off running. All you could 615 00:38:51,280 --> 00:38:56,080 Speaker 1: see was elbows and tailhole running away. Hi. So my 616 00:38:56,200 --> 00:38:59,480 Speaker 1: question is, do you think the culture of menace predators 617 00:38:59,600 --> 00:39:04,759 Speaker 1: is changed at all? Do I think the culture of 618 00:39:04,880 --> 00:39:10,880 Speaker 1: men as predators is changing? No? I do not. Because 619 00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:15,400 Speaker 1: the rape statistics, the attack statistics, the murder statistics, statistics 620 00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:19,239 Speaker 1: are high rising in many areas. Why, I don't know. 621 00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:23,680 Speaker 1: And all this awareness, I mean, we're aware, but it's 622 00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:29,479 Speaker 1: still happening that people are still covering for them. All 623 00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:32,120 Speaker 1: I can think is to keep teaching our children, to 624 00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:35,160 Speaker 1: teach their children, to teach their children. And all I 625 00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:38,440 Speaker 1: can do is try to put their sorry ass in jail. 626 00:39:39,160 --> 00:39:44,279 Speaker 1: That's all I can think. You question, I'd like to 627 00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:46,600 Speaker 1: make a note about that is that one thing when 628 00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:49,640 Speaker 1: they're a face to face with a predator, they are 629 00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:54,239 Speaker 1: very likable, very approachable, They're charming. There are people that 630 00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:57,400 Speaker 1: will that know how to build report with you within seconds. 631 00:39:57,800 --> 00:40:00,560 Speaker 1: They're the types of people that get into your life 632 00:40:00,640 --> 00:40:04,360 Speaker 1: so rapidly you don't even realize it's happening. When you 633 00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:08,520 Speaker 1: see this happening, you need to be aware that's not 634 00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:12,840 Speaker 1: normal because what they're trying to do is to create 635 00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:16,520 Speaker 1: trust with you. And what happens is that these young 636 00:40:16,640 --> 00:40:20,239 Speaker 1: girls a boy pays attention to them, they get all 637 00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:23,279 Speaker 1: excited about it and they let their guard down. I 638 00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:31,760 Speaker 1: teach my children never let your guard down ever. Also, 639 00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:36,239 Speaker 1: rapists are a heterogeneous group. They're not homogenized. They're not 640 00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:40,440 Speaker 1: just one subtype. The rape, the sex crime is a 641 00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:44,440 Speaker 1: way to express so many different disorders. It's a perversion, 642 00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:46,480 Speaker 1: it's a way to show hatred. It's a way to 643 00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:49,839 Speaker 1: have power. It's a way to kill. It's a way 644 00:40:49,880 --> 00:40:53,160 Speaker 1: to raise one's excitement level if you're a sociopath. So, 645 00:40:53,840 --> 00:40:58,640 Speaker 1: because rape is an expression of so many types of psychopathologies, 646 00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:03,960 Speaker 1: it wouldn't make sense that public awareness would decrease sex crimes. 647 00:41:04,320 --> 00:41:06,360 Speaker 1: It's just not going to work that way. We have 648 00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:09,359 Speaker 1: to work on ourselves and our children to keep them safe. Right, 649 00:41:09,400 --> 00:41:11,600 Speaker 1: And don't you think, Bethany, that starts a lot of 650 00:41:11,680 --> 00:41:15,560 Speaker 1: times with porn addiction, the porn addiction that their flavor 651 00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:19,040 Speaker 1: gets stronger and stronger and stronger, and they kind of 652 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:22,239 Speaker 1: keep upping their game to get the endorphins going. Porn 653 00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:26,960 Speaker 1: addiction and sex addiction is on the rise. Yes, it is. Question. Yes, 654 00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:29,759 Speaker 1: so I love you guys, That's why I'm here and 655 00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:34,239 Speaker 1: you Where was the chaperones? And if you're I'm paranoid 656 00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:37,160 Speaker 1: about going in certain places, I live here. But why 657 00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:40,440 Speaker 1: is the parents not more straighten? Whether kids do like 658 00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:43,120 Speaker 1: to get their phones or passwords and all of the 659 00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:47,760 Speaker 1: chaperones for Natalie, Okay, when all this happened, I really 660 00:41:48,600 --> 00:41:54,520 Speaker 1: roasted the chaperones big time because I felt the same 661 00:41:54,600 --> 00:41:59,080 Speaker 1: way that you do right now. Then after I started 662 00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:03,719 Speaker 1: with Fox Nay and Kelly found one of the chaperones 663 00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:06,759 Speaker 1: that would agree to speak to me, Bob Plummer. Yes, 664 00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:12,920 Speaker 1: and he said, I'm so sorry. We were just facilitating 665 00:42:13,440 --> 00:42:17,320 Speaker 1: the travel and the hotels. I mean, they're eighteen and 666 00:42:17,719 --> 00:42:20,200 Speaker 1: there were how many four of us or how many 667 00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:24,000 Speaker 1: And when they would go somewhere in a group together, 668 00:42:25,400 --> 00:42:29,200 Speaker 1: we couldn't watch every single one of them. And I 669 00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:32,200 Speaker 1: had to tell you, I felt really bad. But yet 670 00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:36,120 Speaker 1: I still wonder when you send your children away with chaperones, 671 00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:40,440 Speaker 1: you think they're watching them. I think that there was 672 00:42:40,560 --> 00:42:45,239 Speaker 1: a misunderstanding. There were not enough chaperones. And the ones 673 00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:51,399 Speaker 1: that went were very ethical and devoted and they did 674 00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:55,879 Speaker 1: their best. They just could not watch all those students. Well, 675 00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:57,759 Speaker 1: and Nancy, I don't know if you remember that, Bob 676 00:42:57,800 --> 00:43:00,840 Speaker 1: Plummer said he warned all of the students after he 677 00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:03,360 Speaker 1: saw somebody that was like you were on vander Salute 678 00:43:03,400 --> 00:43:06,200 Speaker 1: at the pool who pulled a knife out. So the 679 00:43:06,400 --> 00:43:09,200 Speaker 1: chaperone did warn all of the students. But there were 680 00:43:09,239 --> 00:43:12,160 Speaker 1: seven chaperones and one hundred and twenty five students. There's 681 00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:15,919 Speaker 1: just not enough. There's not enough eyes. And remember, these 682 00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:20,000 Speaker 1: girls are nice girls from good families, and when somebody 683 00:43:20,080 --> 00:43:22,520 Speaker 1: offers them, oh, do you want a glass of water? 684 00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:25,480 Speaker 1: Do you want to drink? They're socialized to be polite 685 00:43:25,520 --> 00:43:28,359 Speaker 1: and to say yes. So they were sitting ducks. From 686 00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:30,839 Speaker 1: that standpoint, if they were spiky, you should just say 687 00:43:31,239 --> 00:43:39,480 Speaker 1: hell no, go away. Good question. Yes, I have a question. 688 00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:42,320 Speaker 1: So I know crime can happen anywhere, but should we 689 00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:44,719 Speaker 1: even been more cautious and worried traveling outside of the 690 00:43:44,800 --> 00:43:48,520 Speaker 1: country Because the officers who could be corrupt and protect 691 00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:53,000 Speaker 1: their own Will you please shade my book because it's 692 00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:57,560 Speaker 1: fighting back and don't be victim, fighting back against America's 693 00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:01,640 Speaker 1: crimeway because US started riding about out crimes when you travel, 694 00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:04,760 Speaker 1: and I really just started writing it about Aaron Andrews. 695 00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:08,080 Speaker 1: That's what goes going to be a little segment about 696 00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:10,400 Speaker 1: when you're in your hotel room, know that people can 697 00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:12,480 Speaker 1: look through the peopole and do this and don't do that. 698 00:44:13,160 --> 00:44:17,320 Speaker 1: The more I investigated it turned into a huge chapter 699 00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:22,719 Speaker 1: in the book about people getting raped and killed while 700 00:44:22,719 --> 00:44:27,720 Speaker 1: they're on vacation at these five star all inclusive resorts. Honey, 701 00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:29,759 Speaker 1: I have not put my foot back in Mexico since 702 00:44:29,800 --> 00:44:34,160 Speaker 1: I wrote that book, and because the crime there is insane. 703 00:44:36,719 --> 00:44:41,600 Speaker 1: Another thing, ladies jump in. Another thing is that they 704 00:44:41,680 --> 00:44:44,840 Speaker 1: don't have police like we have police. I learned in 705 00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:46,719 Speaker 1: a room, but they didn't even have nine one one. 706 00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:49,359 Speaker 1: You get raped and thrown on the side of the road, 707 00:44:49,920 --> 00:44:53,480 Speaker 1: there's no nine one one to call, But do you 708 00:44:53,520 --> 00:44:56,680 Speaker 1: want number The story we covered about the two high 709 00:44:56,719 --> 00:44:59,879 Speaker 1: school age kids who went with their parents to Mexico City. 710 00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:02,839 Speaker 1: They had one drink of alcohol. Maybe there were twenty 711 00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:07,840 Speaker 1: one twenty two Abbey Abbey Connor sloging in the pool, 712 00:45:08,280 --> 00:45:13,600 Speaker 1: face down dead. So not only can you not rely 713 00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:16,680 Speaker 1: on the police or law enforcement, but you can't rely 714 00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:20,919 Speaker 1: on the things you ingest either. The alcohol regulation there, 715 00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:24,960 Speaker 1: like here, alcohol is a big business. I mean, we're 716 00:45:25,000 --> 00:45:29,080 Speaker 1: in Vegas, for Pete's sake, and it's highly regulated by 717 00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:30,920 Speaker 1: the government. You're not going to belly up to the 718 00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:34,360 Speaker 1: bar and get some moonshine here. That's not going to 719 00:45:34,440 --> 00:45:38,920 Speaker 1: happen because it would it would ruin the reputation of 720 00:45:39,040 --> 00:45:43,759 Speaker 1: this facility. That happened to Abby Connor. She and her 721 00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:47,080 Speaker 1: brother were there with their mom or their family. They 722 00:45:47,120 --> 00:45:52,000 Speaker 1: were going to have dinner that night, but Abby didn't 723 00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:55,279 Speaker 1: show up. So the mom, Jenny, was trying to find 724 00:45:55,360 --> 00:45:58,320 Speaker 1: her and they came rushing up, said there's been an accident. 725 00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:01,680 Speaker 1: She and her mother had one drink at the bar 726 00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:07,080 Speaker 1: and the next thing, there was no lifeguards, no security cams. 727 00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:10,240 Speaker 1: She was faced down in the bar and the pool 728 00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:16,200 Speaker 1: waist deep and she could swim, and the brother was 729 00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:19,799 Speaker 1: also faced down. He lived, but he had a broken collarbone. 730 00:46:20,560 --> 00:46:26,280 Speaker 1: They airlifted Abbey. She died was tainted alcohol in Mexico, 731 00:46:26,840 --> 00:46:31,959 Speaker 1: where say the hotel buys two million dollars alcohol every 732 00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:35,879 Speaker 1: other month. Think how much the provider can make if 733 00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:41,480 Speaker 1: they use moonshine made somebody's garage and half of that 734 00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:45,600 Speaker 1: money all goes in their pocket. So it is rampant. 735 00:46:46,200 --> 00:46:51,200 Speaker 1: And the Milwaukee Journal did an expose on tainted alcohol. 736 00:46:51,719 --> 00:46:56,360 Speaker 1: And it is rampant in other countries. So when you go, 737 00:46:56,680 --> 00:47:01,240 Speaker 1: and I mean just like Mexico or any of the islands, 738 00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:06,719 Speaker 1: it's a ninety minute trip. They don't have regulations, they 739 00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:10,600 Speaker 1: don't have cops like we have, and you're really at 740 00:47:10,640 --> 00:47:13,920 Speaker 1: a disadvantage, especially if you don't speak the language. En 741 00:47:13,960 --> 00:47:18,200 Speaker 1: Firements are a perfect storm for crime and for being 742 00:47:18,200 --> 00:47:20,719 Speaker 1: a victim. And that's what we're talking about today. I 743 00:47:20,840 --> 00:47:23,000 Speaker 1: think bottom line as you leave your rights at home 744 00:47:23,080 --> 00:47:26,760 Speaker 1: when you travel abroad. And from Beth's experience, she didn't 745 00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:28,640 Speaker 1: get help right away. What they told her is she 746 00:47:28,760 --> 00:47:30,920 Speaker 1: was in a crack house and she would show up 747 00:47:31,000 --> 00:47:32,919 Speaker 1: just like all of the other tourists. So they lost 748 00:47:32,960 --> 00:47:35,279 Speaker 1: a valuable time in searching for her because police just 749 00:47:35,400 --> 00:47:38,640 Speaker 1: wrote it off. Oh and remember guys, when we went 750 00:47:38,880 --> 00:47:42,800 Speaker 1: to the crack house, we were in a car and 751 00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:47,920 Speaker 1: Beth went stop. She said, that's the crack house that 752 00:47:48,080 --> 00:47:52,200 Speaker 1: I went in looking for Natalie, who had never so 753 00:47:52,400 --> 00:47:56,319 Speaker 1: much come home drunk and straight a student pre med 754 00:47:58,120 --> 00:47:59,920 Speaker 1: Do you all remember or we were in the car 755 00:48:00,040 --> 00:48:05,160 Speaker 1: are and Beth pointed to a cross just stuck on 756 00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:08,200 Speaker 1: the side of the road, and she said, let me 757 00:48:08,239 --> 00:48:10,000 Speaker 1: get out, and we all got out went with her. 758 00:48:10,120 --> 00:48:13,960 Speaker 1: She said, I was out of my mind. I just 759 00:48:14,080 --> 00:48:17,239 Speaker 1: felt Natalie was still alive. I couldn't find her, and 760 00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:20,560 Speaker 1: I was looking blindly in a ruba Natalie, you know, 761 00:48:20,760 --> 00:48:24,520 Speaker 1: basically calling for her. And I saw this cross, and 762 00:48:24,640 --> 00:48:27,160 Speaker 1: I got out of the cab and I fell on 763 00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:29,680 Speaker 1: the dirt and I had the dirt my hand. I'm 764 00:48:29,719 --> 00:48:34,160 Speaker 1: liking God in heaven, where is Natalie? And I looked, 765 00:48:34,400 --> 00:48:37,520 Speaker 1: I saw another cross. I walked to it. I went 766 00:48:37,600 --> 00:48:40,400 Speaker 1: on my knees. I saw another cross. She went up 767 00:48:40,480 --> 00:48:46,319 Speaker 1: eighteen crosses, up a hill, stations of the cross, she said. 768 00:48:46,360 --> 00:48:47,719 Speaker 1: When she got to the top of the hill and 769 00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:50,799 Speaker 1: we went there, there was a little chapel I think 770 00:48:50,840 --> 00:48:54,719 Speaker 1: it was called Buena Vista, beautiful vista, and you look 771 00:48:54,760 --> 00:48:58,080 Speaker 1: at and you can see mountains and ocean. She said, 772 00:48:58,120 --> 00:49:00,280 Speaker 1: I came to this chapel. It was as big because 773 00:49:00,280 --> 00:49:05,239 Speaker 1: your kitchen table. And she said, suddenly I knew that 774 00:49:05,440 --> 00:49:10,080 Speaker 1: Natalie was dead. She said, I felt like all of 775 00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:13,520 Speaker 1: a rub. It was just like writhing under me, just evil. 776 00:49:13,880 --> 00:49:17,720 Speaker 1: But when I got to this chapel, everything became still, 777 00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:23,000 Speaker 1: and I knew Natalie was dead. I will never forget 778 00:49:23,080 --> 00:49:25,880 Speaker 1: it as long as I live. You remember that, Cheryl, 779 00:49:25,960 --> 00:49:30,239 Speaker 1: I do. And Nancy, y'all. Nancy and I worked in 780 00:49:30,280 --> 00:49:33,839 Speaker 1: these cases as a prosecutor and as a crime scene investigator, 781 00:49:34,280 --> 00:49:38,600 Speaker 1: but sometimes in those moments we're standing there just as 782 00:49:38,640 --> 00:49:42,640 Speaker 1: two mamas, and our heart was breaking for Beth all 783 00:49:42,719 --> 00:49:46,399 Speaker 1: over again, and we were standing there with her at 784 00:49:46,480 --> 00:49:50,479 Speaker 1: that chapel. And since two thousand and five, Beth knows 785 00:49:50,560 --> 00:49:54,399 Speaker 1: the truth. She knows Natalie was murdered. She knows she's 786 00:49:54,480 --> 00:49:58,040 Speaker 1: not coming home. But she looked at Nancy and I 787 00:49:58,760 --> 00:50:02,560 Speaker 1: and she said, can I tell y'all, I still carry 788 00:50:02,680 --> 00:50:07,320 Speaker 1: her passport just in case, just in case they find 789 00:50:07,400 --> 00:50:10,960 Speaker 1: her and I can bring her home. And that's the 790 00:50:11,120 --> 00:50:13,560 Speaker 1: reason we go back, that's the reason we do it. 791 00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:17,280 Speaker 1: Signing off, goodbye friends,