WEBVTT - KJ Live - Dorian Lee 0:00:01.280 --> 0:00:10.360 This is kJ Live with Chris Johnson. Allen and Chris 0:00:10.440 --> 0:00:13.680 is having conversations with influencers in the sports world and 0:00:13.920 --> 0:00:21.560 entertainment industrain. Now here's Chris Johnson. You're now tuned in 0:00:21.600 --> 0:00:27.160 to kJ Lott today's guests on the show. Has been 0:00:27.200 --> 0:00:31.040 considered one of the foremost authorities in basketball player development. 0:00:31.080 --> 0:00:35.879 He's worked with over four thousand, five hundred clients around 0:00:35.920 --> 0:00:39.959 the globe, including international Olympic, w n B, A college, 0:00:40.040 --> 0:00:47.720 high school, and some MBA athletes. Dorian Lee and his 0:00:47.840 --> 0:00:51.560 training is rooted in an explosive movement, functional movement, quick release, shooting, 0:00:51.600 --> 0:00:55.600 seamless trasitional ball handled, exposed to play and exposed to finishing. Man, 0:00:55.640 --> 0:00:58.480 that sounds like a lot. Let's welcome in my man. 0:00:59.520 --> 0:01:01.920 Dorian Lee is in the building. What's up? Deeply, have 0:01:02.080 --> 0:01:04.400 been a long time bro. So it's good. Like I said, 0:01:04.400 --> 0:01:08.360 it's good seeing you and excited about just having that conversation. 0:01:08.440 --> 0:01:11.160 Man there like you. We've talked off line about the 0:01:11.319 --> 0:01:15.920 vibe even years ago. Uh, forward thinkers have this this 0:01:16.000 --> 0:01:19.560 way of connecting, and I knew you were a forward thinker. 0:01:19.640 --> 0:01:23.119 I knew you had some, uh some big things in store. Man. 0:01:23.240 --> 0:01:25.600 So I'm honored, man, I would have to do the 0:01:25.720 --> 0:01:28.520 do the bow down. I'm honored to be on the podcast, 0:01:28.600 --> 0:01:31.039 my bro. No, Man, I appreciate you for jumping on 0:01:31.160 --> 0:01:34.640 man and blessings you know have been bountiful for me 0:01:34.800 --> 0:01:37.120 and for you as well. Man. But I wanted to 0:01:37.120 --> 0:01:40.200 get you on the pod specifically because just to give 0:01:40.360 --> 0:01:41.840 all this a little bit of background, I met d 0:01:42.000 --> 0:01:45.240 Lee down in Atlanta around two thousand and five. I 0:01:45.240 --> 0:01:47.960 think we was at Running Shoot. So we was at 0:01:48.040 --> 0:01:50.440 Running Shooting and all my my who pends out there 0:01:50.520 --> 0:01:53.000 know exactly what Running Shoot is. It's over there, what 0:01:53.160 --> 0:01:57.559 East Point, Yeah, yeah it was. It was on Metropolitan Parkway, yeah, 0:01:58.080 --> 0:02:04.400 the Avenue. Yeah. What revitalized actually spearheaded the revitalization of 0:02:04.440 --> 0:02:06.640 that part of town because that town, part of the 0:02:06.680 --> 0:02:09.040 town was known for the strip clubs, for you know, 0:02:09.080 --> 0:02:11.280 the drug dealing and things of that nature. And it 0:02:11.400 --> 0:02:15.000 was amazed at how a basketball facility kind of changed 0:02:15.240 --> 0:02:18.000 all of that. Man. It was beautiful. Man. Running Shoot 0:02:18.040 --> 0:02:21.280 had about what six eight eight twelve courts, had a barbershop, 0:02:21.400 --> 0:02:23.720 you could eat, you can lift weights, and so during 0:02:23.760 --> 0:02:25.760 the course of during the course of my workouts, I 0:02:25.760 --> 0:02:27.680 think I was down there doing trying to try out 0:02:27.720 --> 0:02:30.520 for the Hawks or something. But I had met Dorian 0:02:30.680 --> 0:02:32.880 Lee in the gym and we start chopping it up 0:02:32.880 --> 0:02:34.840 and we'd be rebounding for each other. We'd be working 0:02:34.840 --> 0:02:36.799 out a little bit, but it would be a daily thing. Man. 0:02:36.919 --> 0:02:39.799 We kind of had this bond and camaraderie. Man, did 0:02:39.800 --> 0:02:42.720 I didn't see you again for nothing? Yeah, for another 0:02:42.760 --> 0:02:46.120 fifteen years. Man, we finally reconnected. But I wanted to 0:02:46.160 --> 0:02:48.200 get you on the show because man, I I love 0:02:48.240 --> 0:02:50.480 your story, I love your journey, and I love how 0:02:50.480 --> 0:02:53.440 you express your journey. Brother, I wanted to know how 0:02:53.520 --> 0:02:56.280 you got your start. Where are you from and how 0:02:56.320 --> 0:02:59.080 did you get your starting this basketball? So I'm deep South. 0:02:59.200 --> 0:03:03.760 I'm from Mobile, Alabama, football country. Viger High School where 0:03:03.760 --> 0:03:07.840 I attended was actual ESPN National champs in football. So 0:03:07.880 --> 0:03:11.359 it wasn't a basketball It's not a basketball part of 0:03:11.400 --> 0:03:13.680 the country, right. You know, we're Alabama and Auburn. No 0:03:13.800 --> 0:03:18.200 pro sports teams, uh, you know, major pro sports team. 0:03:18.280 --> 0:03:21.680 So you know we were kind of afterthoughts, you know, 0:03:21.720 --> 0:03:23.600 and then you talk about just a little bit to 0:03:23.680 --> 0:03:27.600 the left in Mississippi. You know, you got your literial greens, 0:03:27.720 --> 0:03:31.240 your mark mood abdu Raos and they were allowed to 0:03:31.320 --> 0:03:35.320 really play. We were more defensive oriented. You know, people 0:03:35.360 --> 0:03:38.560 like me were actually shun who let that ball fly? 0:03:39.200 --> 0:03:41.720 You know, we were shunned in a sense. So, uh, 0:03:41.720 --> 0:03:45.120 it was it was a funny uh placed the start 0:03:45.160 --> 0:03:48.280 in terms of your basketball journey, but um, you know 0:03:48.320 --> 0:03:52.200 that's where it started from me. I ended up you know, 0:03:52.720 --> 0:03:54.920 lant the city and scoring a second in the city 0:03:54.920 --> 0:03:57.280 and scoring behind Antonio Lange my senior year, and uh 0:03:57.320 --> 0:03:59.800 in high school. He went on to play at Duke 0:04:00.040 --> 0:04:02.560 to obviously grand Hill's roommate, you know during that time. 0:04:02.600 --> 0:04:06.240 So Tony has had an incredible college and professional career 0:04:06.240 --> 0:04:08.640 in terms of coaching, playing overseas, the whole now has 0:04:08.680 --> 0:04:11.760 done a phenomenal job. But I ended up going to Juko. 0:04:11.800 --> 0:04:14.960 I didn't have any offers coming out of high school, 0:04:15.400 --> 0:04:18.120 you know, not because of the game. I believe, even 0:04:18.120 --> 0:04:20.800 though I wasn't in my opinion when I looked back 0:04:20.800 --> 0:04:23.240 at I wasn't that good. I was athletic, I was 0:04:23.640 --> 0:04:25.760 you know, explosive, I could score, but I really just 0:04:25.800 --> 0:04:29.120 didn't have the true understanding of the game. But I 0:04:29.160 --> 0:04:32.160 had knee surgery to knee surgeries before I left high school. 0:04:32.640 --> 0:04:35.800 So people wanted me on crutches to the wait and 0:04:35.839 --> 0:04:38.880 then we'll try out and whatever. And I was like, no, man, 0:04:38.920 --> 0:04:41.880 I wanna, I wanna. I want to ink something and 0:04:41.960 --> 0:04:45.600 lo and behold. Uh. This was the funny stories of it. 0:04:45.720 --> 0:04:49.040 But the laughing stock junior college where we used to 0:04:49.120 --> 0:04:51.080 jone people that hey, man, you're gonna end up going 0:04:51.120 --> 0:04:53.599 to Bishop State, that's where you go. You ain't even 0:04:53.600 --> 0:04:59.200 good enough. Guess where your boy ended up. So we 0:04:59.200 --> 0:05:01.680 were jonah and man, it was one of the best 0:05:01.720 --> 0:05:03.600 things that ever happened. Led him in score. My first 0:05:03.680 --> 0:05:06.160 year fourteen and a half, second year nineteen and a 0:05:06.240 --> 0:05:10.760 half was an all star selection, had uh multiple Division 0:05:10.760 --> 0:05:13.800 one offers. Uh, it ended up coming down to a 0:05:13.800 --> 0:05:16.840 Division one, Division two, so I had Southeast Louisiana, had 0:05:17.160 --> 0:05:20.480 McNeese State, Western Carolina, but it came down to Western 0:05:20.520 --> 0:05:23.919 Carolina and North Florida, which is now Division one but 0:05:24.040 --> 0:05:27.080 was was D two at the time. And it was 0:05:27.920 --> 0:05:30.479 you know, when you talked about making those decisions, I was. 0:05:30.720 --> 0:05:32.960 I was in love at that time, so I wanted 0:05:33.000 --> 0:05:36.240 to be closer uh to my girlfriend. So I made 0:05:36.240 --> 0:05:40.600 a decision, a permanent decision on a temporary relationship. Uh. 0:05:40.600 --> 0:05:43.560 And I ended up going to North Florida over Western Carolina, 0:05:43.720 --> 0:05:46.440 and uh so that's that's kind of where I started, man. 0:05:46.480 --> 0:05:48.640 And you know, I played six d points in college, 0:05:48.680 --> 0:05:51.960 had had a decent career, got into my coach my 0:05:52.000 --> 0:05:54.240 senior year, went back to spring Hill College in a 0:05:54.360 --> 0:05:56.480 i A ranked number four in the country that year. 0:05:56.520 --> 0:06:00.400 We were loaded, had had a good college experience. Uh 0:06:00.600 --> 0:06:03.160 and then I was like, you know what, man, I 0:06:03.440 --> 0:06:06.440 I want to make my money doing something else. Man. 0:06:06.600 --> 0:06:09.280 And you know, it's it's weird because I already had 0:06:09.279 --> 0:06:11.320 a child. My oldest daughter is thirty one now, and 0:06:11.360 --> 0:06:14.640 she was she was small then, and I was like 0:06:14.800 --> 0:06:20.360 kind of almost like uh uh disenchanted with with basketball 0:06:20.440 --> 0:06:23.240 at that at that moment, you know, went over to 0:06:23.279 --> 0:06:28.239 Mexico for a tour, played well, but my heart really 0:06:28.360 --> 0:06:31.400 wasn't totally in it at that point. Man. So you know, 0:06:31.520 --> 0:06:34.360 I got back worked in Corporate America for some years, 0:06:35.000 --> 0:06:37.520 and I finally, man, just got to a point I 0:06:37.560 --> 0:06:40.719 was a pharmaceutical wrapped my last stint in corporate America, 0:06:41.200 --> 0:06:43.000 and that was supposed to be the cure all, end 0:06:43.040 --> 0:06:45.440 all job. And when I got it, I realized, Man, 0:06:45.480 --> 0:06:48.600 I don't want to work with anybody. Yeah, and it 0:06:48.880 --> 0:06:51.760 was it was different. So, man, I tell you I left. 0:06:51.760 --> 0:06:54.080 I have some real estate, already had seven properties I 0:06:54.120 --> 0:06:57.200 bought by the time I was twenty five, I got 0:06:57.240 --> 0:07:00.000 in with some business partners in the Network marketing company 0:07:00.520 --> 0:07:02.880 and I'm telling you that. I was like, dude, I'm 0:07:02.880 --> 0:07:05.680 getting out of court for America. And I literally left, 0:07:06.240 --> 0:07:08.599 and you know, the bottom fell out with the real estate. 0:07:09.240 --> 0:07:11.480 And so I was on a trip to New York 0:07:11.640 --> 0:07:14.080 and this this guy was sitting at my wedding. It 0:07:14.200 --> 0:07:17.040 was a wedding event we were at and sitting at 0:07:17.040 --> 0:07:20.160 my table was Jay Hernandez that played at Hofstra. He's 0:07:20.200 --> 0:07:24.680 an assistant coach now with Charlotte Horner and uh we 0:07:24.680 --> 0:07:27.640 were sitting talking man, and Jay was talking about Look man, 0:07:28.160 --> 0:07:30.160 you know, uh I hear I was talking about going 0:07:30.200 --> 0:07:33.160 back to play. This is around the time that I 0:07:33.240 --> 0:07:35.480 met you. A little bit before I met you two 0:07:35.480 --> 0:07:38.000 thousand and three, I went on another tour to Ostria 0:07:38.080 --> 0:07:41.720 professional tour and I was heading that. When I was 0:07:41.720 --> 0:07:43.240 talking to him about he was saying, like, why don't 0:07:43.280 --> 0:07:45.560 you come up and work out with me? And so 0:07:45.920 --> 0:07:48.160 I'm from Alabama work out. To me, I'm like, man, 0:07:48.360 --> 0:07:50.640 I live weights with you talk. You know. He was like, no, 0:07:50.800 --> 0:07:53.840 like player development, man, Listen, I had never even heard 0:07:54.320 --> 0:07:58.760 the term player development. Right. We we just didn't have 0:07:58.840 --> 0:08:01.480 either you had a dad who could do it, or 0:08:01.560 --> 0:08:04.760 you founded in the streets and you just made the 0:08:04.800 --> 0:08:07.520 best of it. And we just didn't have people who 0:08:07.560 --> 0:08:11.880 were putting people through drills and explaining the game. And 0:08:12.000 --> 0:08:15.600 I went up that week, uh took a long train 0:08:15.800 --> 0:08:19.600 ride countryside New York uh to get the Long Island. 0:08:19.640 --> 0:08:21.680 I mean it was about four inches of snow during 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:23.960 this time, and you know, we got an island garden. 0:08:24.400 --> 0:08:26.200 You know, we got some work in and I learned 0:08:26.280 --> 0:08:30.080 more from an individual standpoint, how to frame stuff in 0:08:30.120 --> 0:08:34.319 one week that I had my entire basketball career, right. 0:08:34.800 --> 0:08:38.600 And so I went over to Austria. Killed it. I mean, 0:08:38.679 --> 0:08:41.320 average probably twenty nine for the tour. I mean, just 0:08:41.360 --> 0:08:45.679 had a phenomenal tour. Had offers from Lithuanian teams, from 0:08:45.679 --> 0:08:49.640 German teams, a couple of Austrian teams, um, but they 0:08:49.679 --> 0:08:52.560 fell through, and I just took it as a signment, 0:08:52.640 --> 0:08:55.640 you know what I need to bro I just need 0:08:55.640 --> 0:08:59.360 to do something else and and and I it was 0:08:59.400 --> 0:09:02.280 a weird kind of feeling because I had a big 0:09:02.360 --> 0:09:05.480 gap between corporate America when I went to Mexico to 0:09:05.640 --> 0:09:08.640 gap in corporate America and then back to Austria. Man, 0:09:08.640 --> 0:09:11.839 that was about a ten year eight nine year journey. 0:09:11.880 --> 0:09:13.600 So I was thirty one when I went to Austria. 0:09:14.080 --> 0:09:17.080 And so one of the issues was, you know his age, 0:09:17.240 --> 0:09:20.480 you know, yeah, he's he's he's really really good. But 0:09:20.520 --> 0:09:24.400 can we get a younger player for you know, less money? 0:09:25.040 --> 0:09:27.080 That that that thing. So I came back and I said, 0:09:27.120 --> 0:09:29.040 you know, I'm gonna set up shop and run and shoot. 0:09:29.559 --> 0:09:32.520 And you remember, I don't know that all the times 0:09:32.559 --> 0:09:35.400 you came. But it was such a jungle like meaning 0:09:35.520 --> 0:09:39.480 like a real jungle. So I started in that man, 0:09:39.559 --> 0:09:41.719 and I'm I'm telling you, bro, it was people will 0:09:41.800 --> 0:09:44.040 walk on the court while you're training. And yo, bro, 0:09:44.120 --> 0:09:47.200 you didn't give it. You didn't get permission to set 0:09:47.280 --> 0:09:50.520 up shop in our town. What's up with that? And that? 0:09:50.360 --> 0:09:52.800 And so so I had to deal with that and 0:09:53.200 --> 0:09:56.640 maintain professionalism. You know, I had the college shirts, I 0:09:56.679 --> 0:09:58.520 had the logo. I was the first to really kind 0:09:58.520 --> 0:10:03.640 of bring a level of of of professionalism to that 0:10:03.720 --> 0:10:06.480 inside a running shoot and from there, man, it really 0:10:07.480 --> 0:10:10.040 it grew. I I mean, and I was as super 0:10:10.080 --> 0:10:13.360 athletic then I was still three six tins. So I 0:10:13.400 --> 0:10:19.280 had a a flare for the presentation. And so it 0:10:19.400 --> 0:10:21.800 really drew a lot at that time, and then the 0:10:21.880 --> 0:10:25.280 rest became reputation. And I've grown throughout the years a lot. 0:10:25.320 --> 0:10:27.960 When I look back then, you you know, you realize 0:10:28.000 --> 0:10:30.640 how much you didn't know. And then as you move forward, 0:10:30.679 --> 0:10:32.640 she was like, man, you know what I've I've come 0:10:32.679 --> 0:10:34.920 a long way in the game. Man, I'll tell you what. Man, 0:10:34.960 --> 0:10:38.440 that's a You really really brought back a lot of 0:10:38.440 --> 0:10:41.160 memories when you mentioned running shoot in the jungle, because 0:10:41.200 --> 0:10:43.400 I remember, Man, I'm coming. I was at running Shoot. 0:10:43.440 --> 0:10:45.720 I come in the gym. You know, I'm nobody, and 0:10:45.720 --> 0:10:48.080 I won a national championship. I had done some stuff 0:10:48.120 --> 0:10:50.080 in U c L A pack ten, you know whatever. 0:10:50.640 --> 0:10:52.440 But I walked in the building. It's like they look 0:10:52.440 --> 0:10:54.800 at me up and you like, you know, who's this 0:10:54.880 --> 0:10:57.560 light scaring curly here, you know, with all that type 0:10:57.600 --> 0:11:00.400 of stuff. So then, but the thing I love of 0:11:00.679 --> 0:11:03.920 about Basketball D League is if you got a game, 0:11:04.880 --> 0:11:09.400 it automatically endears this respect no matter where you at 0:11:09.440 --> 0:11:11.800 in the world. So it dope better. So it felt 0:11:11.800 --> 0:11:13.640 like a jugger first, But after a couple of weeks, 0:11:13.880 --> 0:11:16.800 you know, on first name basis with everybody, it's all good. 0:11:16.880 --> 0:11:18.760 You're walking. We got, we got, we got, we got 0:11:18.880 --> 0:11:21.600 light skin, Yeah, we got, we got. Let's go, let's 0:11:21.600 --> 0:11:24.160 get it. Let's get it. And there's no greater feeling 0:11:24.360 --> 0:11:25.839 than that. The other thing I want to touch you 0:11:25.840 --> 0:11:27.600 on something you said at the outside, just talking about 0:11:27.600 --> 0:11:31.440 where you're from, where your roots are from that area Alabama, Mississippi. 0:11:31.440 --> 0:11:34.960 I remember when I was growing up. You mentioned Chris Jackson, 0:11:35.160 --> 0:11:37.600 the guys that it was a bunch of Mississippi dues. 0:11:37.720 --> 0:11:43.000 Also m Chris Jackson, a guy named Ford. You know, 0:11:43.120 --> 0:11:47.400 you know who Ronnie Henderson is, Okay, Jess Jesse Pate, Okay, 0:11:47.520 --> 0:11:54.040 Othella that whole so that whole crew. So I played 0:11:54.040 --> 0:11:57.600 with Ronnie Henderson. We flew Ronnie Henderson out from Mississippi, 0:11:57.679 --> 0:11:59.840 came out to l a bro and he played on 0:11:59.840 --> 0:12:01.360 our team. So I kind of got And I was 0:12:01.400 --> 0:12:07.360 sixteen years old, dumb bounce and one of the coolest 0:12:07.400 --> 0:12:10.200 cats of all time. I'll tell you what the brothers 0:12:10.240 --> 0:12:13.400 down from Alabama, Mississippi. Man, when you just a different 0:12:13.400 --> 0:12:16.959 type of person down there, saw a real cool, solid individuals, 0:12:17.040 --> 0:12:20.319 unbelievable sense of humor. But that I thought about that too, 0:12:20.360 --> 0:12:22.079 And the other thing I thought I wanted to ask 0:12:22.120 --> 0:12:26.160 you about all this. How serious in your mind was 0:12:26.240 --> 0:12:29.000 the NBA? Because because you kept it going? Man? And 0:12:29.240 --> 0:12:31.960 I know as for me, I always had the NBA. 0:12:32.080 --> 0:12:33.960 So I go to Tim Buck to to who, I 0:12:34.080 --> 0:12:36.199 go to Madagascar to who, because I say, hey, that's 0:12:36.200 --> 0:12:38.920 the job. Let's give me an opportunity. I put on 0:12:38.960 --> 0:12:41.120 my resume and say I played somewhere last year. I 0:12:41.160 --> 0:12:43.440 didn't you know, because it's you know? So so for you? 0:12:43.880 --> 0:12:46.920 How serious was the NBA in your mind? As as 0:12:46.920 --> 0:12:48.760 a goal? My brother? It was? It was No. I 0:12:49.360 --> 0:12:52.080 really didn't have a plan. B. And for for many people, 0:12:52.120 --> 0:12:54.720 if you go to my hometown, and I think most 0:12:54.760 --> 0:12:59.120 will a test. They everybody just felt because the way 0:12:59.160 --> 0:13:02.240 I loved it, that I would fill the gaps from 0:13:02.240 --> 0:13:04.800 a talent and an i Q standpoint, and it would 0:13:04.840 --> 0:13:07.360 just happen. And when I look back on that has 0:13:07.440 --> 0:13:10.880 so many opportunities. Man. But when you have such poor 0:13:11.000 --> 0:13:14.640 counsel and when I mean by poor counsel, that means 0:13:15.040 --> 0:13:19.079 bad counsel, means that they just people don't know right, 0:13:19.480 --> 0:13:22.120 Like like what I'm able to do now, Chris, when 0:13:22.120 --> 0:13:25.320 I can literally get on the phone and get you 0:13:25.400 --> 0:13:28.840 a job, whether it's an agent involved or not, or 0:13:28.880 --> 0:13:32.480 I can get you the right agent for your tear 0:13:32.600 --> 0:13:36.320 of player, I had no idea of that. I can't 0:13:36.360 --> 0:13:39.760 and worked out for an agent Atlanta ninety six loved me, 0:13:39.920 --> 0:13:44.080 told me, look, you signed with me. Now I'm gonna 0:13:44.080 --> 0:13:47.040 take you on these tours. Right, I'm gonna pay you 0:13:47.080 --> 0:13:50.520 about three hundred dollars a week, blah blah blah. And 0:13:50.559 --> 0:13:54.079 I'm sitting here like a dummy listeners to somebody who 0:13:54.120 --> 0:13:57.000 doesn't play, saying, oh you can make that at McDonald's. 0:13:57.160 --> 0:14:00.320 Why are you did? But it's it's it's it's not 0:14:00.400 --> 0:14:03.160 saying it's not the same. It's not the same. It's 0:14:03.160 --> 0:14:05.199 not the same. And I said, now I gotta pay 0:14:05.240 --> 0:14:08.520 this Cardinal, I got the baby, and nobody would say, 0:14:08.640 --> 0:14:13.000 d you trust me? You got this talent. You got 0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:16.960 the talent to play a long time right every time 0:14:16.960 --> 0:14:19.800 I walked and running, shoot right. And if anybody says 0:14:20.040 --> 0:14:24.000 it says it's not true. It's lyne. People always ask me, man, 0:14:24.040 --> 0:14:25.920 so so so where did you play last year? Where 0:14:25.960 --> 0:14:30.040 where are you coming from? What? Right? Because that's the 0:14:30.040 --> 0:14:32.160 type of work I used to put in, And so 0:14:32.800 --> 0:14:36.200 it's it's the talent was there, but the advice, man, 0:14:36.320 --> 0:14:41.200 it is that counsel is so utterly important man for 0:14:41.280 --> 0:14:46.000 young folks to really be able to to seek expert 0:14:46.080 --> 0:14:50.800 counsel versus you know, and I'm gonna say this, I'm 0:14:50.800 --> 0:14:52.680 gonna say this, think about this from a from a 0:14:53.360 --> 0:14:56.920 you know, because of the leagues you've played in that 0:14:57.000 --> 0:15:00.760 this is not the same as all other businesses. Right, 0:15:01.040 --> 0:15:06.640 So people will tell you, oh, they offered you four thousand, Uh, Chris, see, 0:15:06.640 --> 0:15:09.280 you're worth more than that. See, that's something you do 0:15:09.480 --> 0:15:13.880 as a as an I T. Consultant. You can't do 0:15:13.960 --> 0:15:17.080 that in basketball because you gotta know maybe that's the 0:15:17.160 --> 0:15:21.440 market that year that year, not your value, but the 0:15:21.480 --> 0:15:27.000 market that year that year, right, And so four this 0:15:27.080 --> 0:15:29.600 year might really have been nine last year, and then 0:15:29.640 --> 0:15:32.600 next year that four might be twelve based on the 0:15:32.680 --> 0:15:36.280 economy and certain markets that the global economy a lot 0:15:36.320 --> 0:15:40.160 of things. But again, without that expert council, bro, it's 0:15:40.200 --> 0:15:43.280 just you that's not gonna get it. And but you 0:15:43.400 --> 0:15:45.960 made a really great point about being able to direct 0:15:46.000 --> 0:15:49.800 a player to the right agent for his level, because 0:15:49.800 --> 0:15:52.360 a lot of times cast get with agents that are 0:15:52.400 --> 0:15:54.680 too big for him and then they become an afterthought. 0:15:54.720 --> 0:15:57.360 But then if you get an agent that specializes in 0:15:57.400 --> 0:16:00.880 getting guys like yourself, your particular, whatever your skill set is, 0:16:00.920 --> 0:16:03.560 whatever you get it. Maybe you undersize an undersized four. 0:16:03.880 --> 0:16:05.880 And my guy has been able to get Cats jobs 0:16:05.880 --> 0:16:08.720 in Australia, Australia or whatever because the team likes these 0:16:08.720 --> 0:16:11.280 type of guys because that coach is on that type 0:16:11.280 --> 0:16:14.480 of system. You feel me and so and so. That 0:16:14.680 --> 0:16:16.840 to me is one of the most important parts about 0:16:17.040 --> 0:16:22.000 just today's basketball culture, Dorian, is having surrounding yourself with 0:16:22.040 --> 0:16:25.040 the right people. You know. I bring folks on uh 0:16:25.160 --> 0:16:27.880 NBA guy x NBA guys, and that's what they tended 0:16:27.920 --> 0:16:29.600 to to kind of lean and talk about because I 0:16:29.600 --> 0:16:31.000 asked them the question of you if you can tell 0:16:31.040 --> 0:16:33.880 yourself you can talk to a sixteen year old say, 0:16:34.000 --> 0:16:35.760 I had de Reil right on and he was like, 0:16:36.040 --> 0:16:38.240 you know, I'll tell you know, he tell hisself just 0:16:38.280 --> 0:16:40.680 to listen to the right people. And just to stay 0:16:41.640 --> 0:16:44.960 locked into the right stuff. And I feel like I 0:16:44.960 --> 0:16:48.560 feel like a voice like yours, d Lee and the 0:16:48.600 --> 0:16:51.840 way you lead by example as well. You're somebody, uh 0:16:51.880 --> 0:16:53.760 that I feel like it's it's easy to follow, it 0:16:53.800 --> 0:16:55.680 is easy, it's easy to listen to a brother like you, 0:16:55.800 --> 0:16:58.520 is easy to trust someone like yourself. Now you can't 0:16:58.520 --> 0:17:01.760 trust everybody, okay, but you can't, you know. I feel 0:17:01.760 --> 0:17:03.960 like you're somebody that you know, folks can kind of 0:17:04.000 --> 0:17:07.600 listen to. But man, I want to talk about some 0:17:07.680 --> 0:17:10.239 high level basketball stuff because that's that's one of the 0:17:10.240 --> 0:17:12.280 major reasons I got you on this show, bro, because 0:17:12.320 --> 0:17:14.560 I love the way that your perspective and the way 0:17:14.600 --> 0:17:16.879 you think about things. So my first question for you 0:17:16.920 --> 0:17:19.720 on that level is the old school versus new school thing. 0:17:19.840 --> 0:17:22.959 So my thing has always been about the old school 0:17:23.280 --> 0:17:25.760 was the style of play in the context, so the 0:17:25.840 --> 0:17:28.440 rules of the game, and whether or not an old 0:17:28.440 --> 0:17:31.680 school guy could would have a hard time playing today. 0:17:32.760 --> 0:17:35.200 It kind of started with Charles Oakley saying that stuff 0:17:35.200 --> 0:17:38.920 about Janice and Joannice being a role player. You're taking 0:17:38.960 --> 0:17:41.080 your honest today and putting them in the eighties. He'd 0:17:41.080 --> 0:17:45.320 be a role player. What is your opinion on comments 0:17:45.400 --> 0:17:48.080 like that? And what is just your overwhelming thought about 0:17:48.119 --> 0:17:52.160 taking new school guys who have grown up playing without physicality, 0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:55.000 without our level of physicality, and putting them back into 0:17:55.000 --> 0:17:57.320 old school. How would they do? So? So I'm I'm 0:17:57.320 --> 0:17:59.959 gonna say this. I'm gonna say that we got two 0:18:00.119 --> 0:18:02.680 things that we have to do to frame this correctly. 0:18:03.280 --> 0:18:07.600 Uh Number One, we always talk about when a game 0:18:07.640 --> 0:18:11.800 would be played right. So if we're talking about bringing 0:18:11.880 --> 0:18:16.600 someone back to the eighties and nineties seventies, we also 0:18:16.720 --> 0:18:23.840 have to erase YouTube, television contracts, specialized training, blah blah blah. 0:18:24.200 --> 0:18:27.400 Now let's see where they are. If we talk about 0:18:27.480 --> 0:18:30.480 moving Oscar Robinson up, now, we got to talk about 0:18:30.520 --> 0:18:35.119 specialized training, YouTube, synergy, being able to watch all of 0:18:35.119 --> 0:18:38.439 this stuff. The number of AU games now we're moving 0:18:38.480 --> 0:18:40.679 them forward. So what I know for a fact is 0:18:40.720 --> 0:18:49.600 that true greatness is transcendent. Some greatness is situational, it's timing. 0:18:50.760 --> 0:18:54.919 But true greatness Pete Pistol, Pete would have had everything 0:18:55.000 --> 0:18:59.400 that Nash had ten years later because the style would 0:18:59.400 --> 0:19:03.159 have adapted. See when we talk about pre uh and 0:19:03.359 --> 0:19:06.760 one pre and one post and one, you can see 0:19:06.760 --> 0:19:11.800 the shift in the style of handling. Right, it was 0:19:11.840 --> 0:19:14.120 more outside of the frame of the body, where back 0:19:14.160 --> 0:19:16.120 in the day it was taught to be tight, keep 0:19:16.119 --> 0:19:20.040 it tight, you know everything, Like you watch kJ Kevin Johnson. Man, 0:19:20.640 --> 0:19:22.840 Kevin Johnson used to be on top of it. His 0:19:23.040 --> 0:19:27.320 back was art because leaned over the ball so much. 0:19:27.359 --> 0:19:30.879 But it was like quick kids. But Kevin Johnson in 0:19:31.040 --> 0:19:36.679 space now with the style of play bro, that's a 0:19:36.880 --> 0:19:39.320 that's an all star guard with his with his with 0:19:39.400 --> 0:19:45.080 his athleticism, all start in you see what I'm saying. 0:19:45.600 --> 0:19:48.760 So that for for me, we have to talk about that. 0:19:48.840 --> 0:19:52.359 So how would they have fair? It is players that 0:19:52.440 --> 0:19:56.280 would have transcended all levels, and it is some players 0:19:56.280 --> 0:19:59.399 today that would have figured it out based on what 0:19:59.560 --> 0:20:02.720 they're built like. So for me, Lebron is a it's 0:20:02.760 --> 0:20:06.119 a big hot topic, right. I think Lebron when we 0:20:06.119 --> 0:20:09.800 started talking goat, we we enter another way of we 0:20:09.960 --> 0:20:14.760 enter another level of critique. Right, So we can't critique 0:20:14.840 --> 0:20:18.840 him like an average player. He's in the goat conversation, 0:20:19.320 --> 0:20:23.120 So how does he stack up against other goats? Right? 0:20:23.240 --> 0:20:27.080 So when you look at Lebron from a mental toughness standpoint, right, 0:20:27.320 --> 0:20:31.240 I don't know, would he have been much different than 0:20:31.359 --> 0:20:38.160 Karl Malone in same career, in same statistics numbers out 0:20:38.200 --> 0:20:41.680 the roof, it was was arguably one of the best 0:20:41.680 --> 0:20:44.560 of his positions, but when it got down to the 0:20:44.720 --> 0:20:49.440 to the to the nuts and bolts, he struggled in situation. 0:20:49.600 --> 0:20:54.640 So worst case scenario, Lebron is Carl Malone? Right, that 0:20:54.640 --> 0:21:00.200 that that in my opinion, right, move move MJ to 0:21:00.280 --> 0:21:03.720 this era, right, because I'm gonna keep going back and forth. 0:21:03.720 --> 0:21:05.879 So now we we got Lebron back to there, and 0:21:05.960 --> 0:21:09.520 let's move m J up. But MJ with the same 0:21:10.200 --> 0:21:15.920 pedigree upbringing brothers whooping on him. Uh, you know all 0:21:15.920 --> 0:21:20.640 of those situations and joined in space with six four 0:21:20.720 --> 0:21:23.440 at the RAM, six six at the RAM, six eight 0:21:23.480 --> 0:21:27.240 at the RAM. I just I just think it's it's 0:21:27.440 --> 0:21:31.720 ungodly the type of numbers with the level of competitiveness 0:21:32.480 --> 0:21:36.480 right with his with if he kept the same unset, now, 0:21:36.600 --> 0:21:41.160 no one convinced him to take games off. You know, uh, 0:21:41.200 --> 0:21:44.680 what do you call it? Not time management but management? 0:21:44.880 --> 0:21:48.280 Old management, all of those terms that you know, the 0:21:48.320 --> 0:21:51.240 man played eighty two games nine times. You know, Stockton 0:21:51.280 --> 0:21:56.680 played eighty two games like twelve times, ten like crazy. 0:21:57.000 --> 0:22:01.159 So those are those are factors to right and just 0:22:01.280 --> 0:22:03.120 the basic science. So at the end of the day, 0:22:04.080 --> 0:22:06.320 I believe what I said the other day on the 0:22:06.359 --> 0:22:08.320 post that got me lamb based in him. And it 0:22:08.359 --> 0:22:10.879