1
00:00:01,880 --> 00:00:04,960
Speaker 1: Hey everyone, It's Jay Shaddy and I'm thrilled to announce

2
00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:07,840
Speaker 1: my podcast tour. For the first time ever, you can

3
00:00:07,880 --> 00:00:12,120
Speaker 1: experience on purpose in person. Join me in a city

4
00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:17,200
Speaker 1: near you for meaningful, insightful conversations with surprise guests. It

5
00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:20,439
Speaker 1: could be a celebrity, top wellness expert, or a CEO

6
00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:25,079
Speaker 1: or business leader. We'll dive into experiences designed to experience growth,

7
00:00:25,360 --> 00:00:29,159
Speaker 1: spark learning, and build real connections. I can't wait to

8
00:00:29,200 --> 00:00:32,400
Speaker 1: meet you. There are a limited number of VIP experiences

9
00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:36,000
Speaker 1: for a private Q and a intimate meditation and a

10
00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:39,320
Speaker 1: meet and greet with photos. Tickets are on sale now.

11
00:00:39,720 --> 00:00:43,520
Speaker 1: Head to Jaysheddy, dop Me Forward Slash Tour and get

12
00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:44,200
Speaker 1: yours today.

13
00:00:45,440 --> 00:00:48,320
Speaker 2: To whom much is given, much is expected. The guilt

14
00:00:48,400 --> 00:00:50,120
Speaker 2: comes from am I doing enough?

15
00:00:50,280 --> 00:00:50,360
Speaker 1: Me?

16
00:00:50,680 --> 00:00:54,080
Speaker 2: Michelle Obama to say that to a therapist. So let's

17
00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:57,520
Speaker 2: impat that former First Lady Michelle Obama and someone who

18
00:00:57,640 --> 00:01:01,080
Speaker 2: knows her best, her big brother. We'll be hosting a

19
00:01:01,120 --> 00:01:02,600
Speaker 2: podcast called I Am O.

20
00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:05,880
Speaker 1: What have been your personal journeys with therapy?

21
00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:08,520
Speaker 2: We need to be coached throughout our lives.

22
00:01:08,600 --> 00:01:12,600
Speaker 3: And my mom wanted us to be independent children and

23
00:01:13,600 --> 00:01:17,600
Speaker 3: she would always tell me stop worrying about your sister.

24
00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:21,319
Speaker 2: Having been the first lady of the entire country and

25
00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:24,640
Speaker 2: representing the country in the world, I couldn't afford to

26
00:01:24,680 --> 00:01:26,160
Speaker 2: have that kind of disdain.

27
00:01:26,480 --> 00:01:28,840
Speaker 1: What would you say has been the most hardest, g

28
00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:30,800
Speaker 1: recent test of fear.

29
00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:33,959
Speaker 2: I'm gonna make him start so that I don't start crying.

30
00:01:38,280 --> 00:01:41,120
Speaker 4: The number one health and well in the podcast.

31
00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:42,800
Speaker 2: Jay Sheety Jay Shetty Jon.

32
00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:49,840
Speaker 1: Hey, everyone, welcome back to on Purpose, the place you

33
00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:54,120
Speaker 1: come to become the happier, healthier and more healed. Today's

34
00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:58,160
Speaker 1: guests are two of my favorite people. I'm so grateful

35
00:01:58,200 --> 00:02:01,040
Speaker 1: and excited to welcome one of the back, and one

36
00:02:01,080 --> 00:02:03,760
Speaker 1: of them for the first time ever. I'm speaking about

37
00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:11,000
Speaker 1: none other than Michelle Obama and Craig Robinson. Welcome Purpose Dynamic.

38
00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:15,240
Speaker 2: I always say, it's like your my most favorite interview

39
00:02:15,760 --> 00:02:16,720
Speaker 2: ever period.

40
00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:19,239
Speaker 4: Oh my gosh, that's saying a lot.

41
00:02:19,440 --> 00:02:23,000
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. Wow, you're gonna make me cry. That's

42
00:02:23,040 --> 00:02:23,720
Speaker 1: so sweet.

43
00:02:24,320 --> 00:02:26,200
Speaker 4: She's the one who turned me on to you, so

44
00:02:26,720 --> 00:02:27,880
Speaker 4: this like old Home Week.

45
00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:31,280
Speaker 1: Thank you both, But honestly, I'm so grateful. I was

46
00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:33,240
Speaker 1: just thinking when I was preparing for this, I was like,

47
00:02:33,520 --> 00:02:36,440
Speaker 1: I wish my sister was in town because then we

48
00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:38,160
Speaker 1: could have double interviewed.

49
00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:41,079
Speaker 2: All right, we're gonna we have to do that.

50
00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:43,160
Speaker 1: She would have killed me if I did that to her,

51
00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:49,399
Speaker 1: because she's not She's an optometrist in London, the best. Yeah,

52
00:02:50,040 --> 00:02:53,000
Speaker 1: we're going to check your eyes for you. She's four

53
00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:55,560
Speaker 1: and a half years younger than me, and I still

54
00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:58,240
Speaker 1: remember the moment. Well, I don't remember the moment. It's interesting.

55
00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:02,000
Speaker 1: I've seen a picture of me holding her when she

56
00:03:02,200 --> 00:03:04,360
Speaker 1: was born, and I was four and five years old,

57
00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:06,600
Speaker 1: and so I have this memory that I held her

58
00:03:06,600 --> 00:03:09,800
Speaker 1: when she was born. Yeah, and we've been inseparable ever since.

59
00:03:10,160 --> 00:03:13,240
Speaker 3: Jay, you're gonna have to when she comes to town,

60
00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:16,280
Speaker 3: just don't tell her. Just tell us and we'll come

61
00:03:16,320 --> 00:03:19,120
Speaker 3: back and we can just ambush her.

62
00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:23,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, she will, but we have one of those pictures

63
00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:29,160
Speaker 2: to my favorite family picture. I was a newborn. I

64
00:03:29,240 --> 00:03:32,040
Speaker 2: was maybe ten months, but I was one of these big, fat, round,

65
00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:36,000
Speaker 2: puffy babies and a bonnet and a white dress, and

66
00:03:36,560 --> 00:03:38,480
Speaker 2: my dad was in a suit and a bow tie

67
00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:43,200
Speaker 2: and mom our Mom had the most beautiful tunic dress

68
00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:45,640
Speaker 2: on and Craig sat on her lap. I was on

69
00:03:45,680 --> 00:03:50,000
Speaker 2: my dad's lap and I have this little fat arm

70
00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:53,320
Speaker 2: and he's in a little bow tie and he's holding

71
00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:56,839
Speaker 2: onto my arm and looking at the camera like you

72
00:03:56,920 --> 00:04:02,080
Speaker 2: better not. You know, he seems so so concerned. You know,

73
00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:03,440
Speaker 2: he was about two years old.

74
00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:04,480
Speaker 1: Can we get the look?

75
00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:08,560
Speaker 4: I was worried. I had this. It's just like, what

76
00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:11,800
Speaker 4: is going on? And I hold on because I was worried.

77
00:04:11,840 --> 00:04:13,840
Speaker 2: I don't know what they're gonna do to my sister.

78
00:04:13,960 --> 00:04:19,679
Speaker 2: But that that picture epitomizes our relationship. He has always

79
00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:23,960
Speaker 2: been my quiet protector, just and that sweet little face.

80
00:04:25,279 --> 00:04:28,440
Speaker 2: You know, he is the ultimate big brother. And he's

81
00:04:28,480 --> 00:04:31,640
Speaker 2: been by my side holding my arm like that for

82
00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:32,880
Speaker 2: my entire life.

83
00:04:33,120 --> 00:04:35,479
Speaker 1: Wow, I love that. And do you actually remember do

84
00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:37,120
Speaker 1: you remember the moment or it's the picture that you

85
00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:38,160
Speaker 1: remember that's.

86
00:04:38,080 --> 00:04:38,680
Speaker 4: Just like yours.

87
00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:41,320
Speaker 3: It's the picture I don't know, and I remember back

88
00:04:41,400 --> 00:04:44,120
Speaker 3: to when I was three and four some things, but

89
00:04:44,279 --> 00:04:46,760
Speaker 3: that when I don't. But when I see the picture,

90
00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:49,360
Speaker 3: it just warms my heart every time I see it.

91
00:04:49,640 --> 00:04:51,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that. I mean sibling relationships. As I

92
00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:54,120
Speaker 1: said in mine as well, My sister and I are

93
00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:56,680
Speaker 1: so close. Yeah, and we haven't lived in the same

94
00:04:56,720 --> 00:05:00,719
Speaker 1: country for nine years now, but we talk and stay

95
00:05:00,760 --> 00:05:03,120
Speaker 1: in touch and we're constantly connected, and I wanted to

96
00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:05,400
Speaker 1: stop asking you this question for both of you. That

97
00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:08,080
Speaker 1: I feel like the first time and my sister got

98
00:05:08,080 --> 00:05:11,080
Speaker 1: close is when I shared a secret with her, and

99
00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:14,279
Speaker 1: I was wondering, what was the first secret that you

100
00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:18,200
Speaker 1: ever told each other, as early as it was, as

101
00:05:18,200 --> 00:05:21,360
Speaker 1: silly as it was, that you remember sharing something in

102
00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:24,600
Speaker 1: confidence in the beginning, early days of your relationship.

103
00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:27,360
Speaker 3: Okay, now you did this to me when you came

104
00:05:27,440 --> 00:05:30,880
Speaker 3: on our show. That is a question I've never been asked.

105
00:05:31,440 --> 00:05:34,760
Speaker 4: I love it. I love it. You got me back,

106
00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:38,160
Speaker 4: you got me back? Okay. A secret, A secret?

107
00:05:38,279 --> 00:05:41,760
Speaker 2: I don't know if it was a secret, but it

108
00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:45,560
Speaker 2: was a what felt like a secret practice of ours.

109
00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:51,279
Speaker 2: We shared a room for most of our lives, and

110
00:05:51,720 --> 00:05:54,280
Speaker 2: there came a point in time when our parents, because

111
00:05:54,279 --> 00:05:56,279
Speaker 2: we didn't have a lot of money, thought it's time

112
00:05:56,320 --> 00:05:58,280
Speaker 2: for them to have their own rooms. So they took

113
00:05:58,320 --> 00:06:02,640
Speaker 2: this one big room our grandfather's south Side, who was

114
00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:08,120
Speaker 2: a Jackla carpenter, built plywood a plywood tea wall that

115
00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:12,080
Speaker 2: went down the middle of this one bedroom and broke

116
00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:15,159
Speaker 2: the room into two little units that were big enough

117
00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:18,440
Speaker 2: for a twin bed and a desk and one of

118
00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:22,080
Speaker 2: those accordion doors, right, that was those were our rooms.

119
00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:25,159
Speaker 3: And it was that that old paneling look, so it

120
00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:27,160
Speaker 3: was it was that fake wood that.

121
00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:29,640
Speaker 2: Was, and the and the ceiling didn't go all the

122
00:06:29,640 --> 00:06:31,080
Speaker 2: way to the top of the roof, and there was

123
00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:34,640
Speaker 2: a little crack in between the rooms by the window sill.

124
00:06:35,120 --> 00:06:37,800
Speaker 2: And when we were supposed to be in bed, we

125
00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:41,880
Speaker 2: would spend that whole night just talking in between the walls. Right,

126
00:06:42,200 --> 00:06:46,159
Speaker 2: we were supposed to be asleep, but go, Mesh, Mesh,

127
00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:51,080
Speaker 2: are you awake. I'd be like, no, And then we'd

128
00:06:51,160 --> 00:06:54,920
Speaker 2: have some deep conversation about life. And you know, every

129
00:06:54,920 --> 00:06:58,960
Speaker 2: now my mom mom would yell, go to bed, you're

130
00:06:58,960 --> 00:07:01,560
Speaker 2: supposed to be asleep, and we giggle and we just

131
00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:05,240
Speaker 2: keep talking. So I think we shared the secret of

132
00:07:05,279 --> 00:07:09,040
Speaker 2: not going to bed but having our own little breakdown

133
00:07:09,080 --> 00:07:11,600
Speaker 2: of the day. I don't even remember what we talked about,

134
00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:14,280
Speaker 2: but we were always supposed to be talking, but we

135
00:07:14,280 --> 00:07:17,000
Speaker 2: were constantly talking. So I can't think of a secret.

136
00:07:17,120 --> 00:07:18,400
Speaker 4: So I can think of a secret.

137
00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:23,040
Speaker 3: Okay, So this is the discovery of Santa Claus.

138
00:07:23,360 --> 00:07:25,800
Speaker 2: Oh, yes, that's a good one.

139
00:07:26,040 --> 00:07:28,960
Speaker 3: So we Jay. As you know, we lived in a

140
00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:32,480
Speaker 3: two family home. We lived on the top floor, very

141
00:07:32,520 --> 00:07:38,040
Speaker 3: small apartment. Our great aunt Robbie and uncle of Terry

142
00:07:38,280 --> 00:07:39,400
Speaker 3: lived downstairs.

143
00:07:40,240 --> 00:07:42,600
Speaker 4: And in our basement, which wasn't finished.

144
00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:47,160
Speaker 3: It was a concrete basement, pillars, washing machine, furnace of

145
00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:50,280
Speaker 3: storage room. But then there was a table that was

146
00:07:50,320 --> 00:07:53,680
Speaker 3: like a workbench, and a refrigerator that didn't work or

147
00:07:53,720 --> 00:07:54,760
Speaker 3: it wasn't plugged in.

148
00:07:54,800 --> 00:07:58,520
Speaker 2: It was a refrigerator, old time refrigerator. And we used

149
00:07:58,560 --> 00:08:00,200
Speaker 2: to go down there and play.

150
00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:02,760
Speaker 3: We played hockey, we'd ride our bikes, we'd do all

151
00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:06,800
Speaker 3: kinds of stuff. And Mesh was down there once by

152
00:08:06,880 --> 00:08:09,920
Speaker 3: herself and came running upstairs.

153
00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:13,120
Speaker 4: Great Greg, come here, come here, come here, and she

154
00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:14,480
Speaker 4: took me downstairs.

155
00:08:15,040 --> 00:08:21,120
Speaker 3: She opens up the refrigerator and there are two empty

156
00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:23,520
Speaker 3: boxes for boxing gloves.

157
00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:26,000
Speaker 4: Now this is June or July.

158
00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:28,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, little kids boxing gloves.

159
00:08:28,320 --> 00:08:32,959
Speaker 3: We got boxing gloves for Christmas the year before. Oh okay, so,

160
00:08:33,160 --> 00:08:35,200
Speaker 3: and she deduced.

161
00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:39,839
Speaker 2: The gloves are here. Santa wouldn't leave gloves.

162
00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:44,720
Speaker 3: Gloveboxes gloveboxes because our mom didn't wrap the presence. She

163
00:08:44,760 --> 00:08:47,400
Speaker 3: set them under the tree as if Santa had just

164
00:08:47,520 --> 00:08:50,839
Speaker 3: brought toys and didn't wrap them, and I remember me.

165
00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:54,559
Speaker 4: Saying, Mom and Dad are Santa Claus.

166
00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:58,920
Speaker 2: But then the secret was we weren't gonna tell them

167
00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:01,319
Speaker 2: that we knew, because first of all, we didn't want

168
00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:05,560
Speaker 2: to deploy disappointment. Yeah, because it's like what a blunder, right,

169
00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:09,480
Speaker 2: So we sort of kept it to ourselves that for

170
00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:11,440
Speaker 2: a good year or two we knew there wasn't a

171
00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:12,120
Speaker 2: Santa Claus.

172
00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:18,640
Speaker 4: Along, we played along. That's so funny. It's like living

173
00:09:18,679 --> 00:09:21,800
Speaker 4: a love. That's really And do your parents know that

174
00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:25,520
Speaker 4: the story? Yeah?

175
00:09:25,120 --> 00:09:29,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, they were mad at our aunt Robbie. My mom

176
00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:31,920
Speaker 2: was particular because she was, like, I told her not

177
00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:35,200
Speaker 2: to keep those glove boxes. She was supposed to throw those.

178
00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:39,800
Speaker 2: My mom was furious because my mom was Christmas very seriously.

179
00:09:39,800 --> 00:09:42,959
Speaker 2: I mean, she decorated the house, She created a chimney

180
00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:46,400
Speaker 2: where there wasn't one. She was very crafty. She she

181
00:09:46,679 --> 00:09:50,320
Speaker 2: really took great joy in keeping this Santa Claus myth alive.

182
00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:54,360
Speaker 2: And the fact that our aunt Robbie spoiled it for

183
00:09:54,480 --> 00:10:00,880
Speaker 2: us sooner than she was ready to, she was not happy. Yeah,

184
00:10:01,080 --> 00:10:03,520
Speaker 2: they didn't have kids and didn't really appreciate it. And

185
00:10:03,600 --> 00:10:06,040
Speaker 2: she cared more about saving a couple of boxes than

186
00:10:06,559 --> 00:10:08,880
Speaker 2: you know, keeping the magic of Christmas alive.

187
00:10:09,040 --> 00:10:09,960
Speaker 1: Oh that's amazing.

188
00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:13,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was a good one. That's why it's good

189
00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:14,720
Speaker 2: to have him here, because I wouldn't have remembered that.

190
00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:17,560
Speaker 1: Well, that's what's so beautiful about this, this relationship. And

191
00:10:17,559 --> 00:10:19,640
Speaker 1: it's interesting you both said, because we did the same thing.

192
00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:21,559
Speaker 1: So me and my sister shared a room as well,

193
00:10:21,960 --> 00:10:24,480
Speaker 1: and it's so interesting to hear about. I talked to

194
00:10:24,520 --> 00:10:26,440
Speaker 1: a lot of siblings and some are not close to

195
00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:28,640
Speaker 1: each other and some are very close to each other.

196
00:10:28,679 --> 00:10:31,280
Speaker 1: And you see that pattern in people who shared a room,

197
00:10:31,520 --> 00:10:35,520
Speaker 1: who talked about something every night connected. And that's how

198
00:10:35,520 --> 00:10:37,079
Speaker 1: I think me and my sister got used to talking

199
00:10:37,080 --> 00:10:40,400
Speaker 1: to each other, because that's who you dissected the day

200
00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:43,880
Speaker 1: with exactly. Even if it wasn't very deep and profound.

201
00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:46,200
Speaker 2: At the time, we were stuck with each other, for

202
00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:47,320
Speaker 2: better for worse.

203
00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:50,640
Speaker 1: I love that what was what would you say, was

204
00:10:50,679 --> 00:10:54,760
Speaker 1: something that you felt, a value that you learned at

205
00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:57,960
Speaker 1: that early stage in your life that you both feel

206
00:10:58,120 --> 00:11:01,120
Speaker 1: you've kept till today, like something that continue to be

207
00:11:01,160 --> 00:11:02,880
Speaker 1: a part of who you are today.

208
00:11:03,400 --> 00:11:08,240
Speaker 3: My mom wanted us to be independent children. And she

209
00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:13,640
Speaker 3: would always tell me, stop worrying about your sister, because

210
00:11:13,679 --> 00:11:17,920
Speaker 3: whenever I did something, I wanted to include her. If

211
00:11:17,960 --> 00:11:20,559
Speaker 3: I was going outside and she was outside, I felt

212
00:11:20,559 --> 00:11:22,720
Speaker 3: like I had to keep an eye on her. I

213
00:11:22,800 --> 00:11:26,240
Speaker 3: felt like I had to protect her, and my mom

214
00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:30,240
Speaker 3: always said to not do that.

215
00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:31,600
Speaker 1: Interesting.

216
00:11:32,080 --> 00:11:34,560
Speaker 3: First of all, she didn't want Mesh to have to

217
00:11:34,600 --> 00:11:38,720
Speaker 3: feel like she was being looked after by her brother.

218
00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:41,199
Speaker 3: That's what her parents were for, and she didn't want

219
00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:44,120
Speaker 3: me to have to worry about her. But I will

220
00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:49,160
Speaker 3: say that I couldn't stop worrying about her. So I

221
00:11:49,280 --> 00:11:53,160
Speaker 3: have been looking after her from the time she was

222
00:11:53,200 --> 00:11:55,600
Speaker 3: a little kid and I was holding her arm. We

223
00:11:55,920 --> 00:11:59,360
Speaker 3: ended up in college together at Princeton. And remember when

224
00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:01,240
Speaker 3: we drove move to South Carolina.

225
00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:04,199
Speaker 2: Uh yeah, We rented a car for spring break.

226
00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:07,040
Speaker 4: For spring break and drove to South Carolina.

227
00:12:06,559 --> 00:12:07,880
Speaker 2: And visit our grandparents.

228
00:12:08,920 --> 00:12:12,200
Speaker 3: They had moved down there from Chicago, and we thought

229
00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:15,200
Speaker 3: we'd surprise them and the two of us were going

230
00:12:15,280 --> 00:12:18,440
Speaker 3: to drive, but I was so worried about her driving

231
00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:23,040
Speaker 3: that I tried to drive the entire way by myself.

232
00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:25,200
Speaker 4: And you know, six hours later.

233
00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:28,000
Speaker 2: He's starting to blink like I'm like, are you okay?

234
00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:29,880
Speaker 2: I got it? I got it, And I was like,

235
00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:30,800
Speaker 2: you know, I can drive.

236
00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:34,200
Speaker 3: She's very capable and a very good driver. But I was,

237
00:12:34,280 --> 00:12:36,520
Speaker 3: you know, me and mister worry war. So finally I

238
00:12:36,840 --> 00:12:37,600
Speaker 3: had to just take care.

239
00:12:38,080 --> 00:12:40,000
Speaker 2: I just have to go to sleep. I was like,

240
00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:43,040
Speaker 2: we'll pull over. I can do this. I drove us

241
00:12:43,160 --> 00:12:43,719
Speaker 2: the rest of.

242
00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:47,160
Speaker 4: The way the way, but at every fifteen minutes after

243
00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:51,040
Speaker 4: I fall asleep, I'd be like, oh yeah, yeah, it's like,

244
00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:51,760
Speaker 4: are you okay?

245
00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:56,880
Speaker 2: It's fine. Well for me, the value, it's the value

246
00:12:56,880 --> 00:13:00,600
Speaker 2: of family. It's the value of the no one you

247
00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:04,119
Speaker 2: can count on more than you know, your your siblings

248
00:13:04,160 --> 00:13:06,840
Speaker 2: and your mom and your dad. And I feel for

249
00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:12,440
Speaker 2: people who were raised with sibling turmoil, you know, or

250
00:13:12,520 --> 00:13:16,439
Speaker 2: turmoil in their household where they didn't feel safe at home.

251
00:13:17,160 --> 00:13:20,360
Speaker 2: And that was never the case. We felt poor, you know,

252
00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:23,800
Speaker 2: we felt like we didn't always get the stuff that

253
00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:28,080
Speaker 2: we wanted. But we always felt and it wasn't just

254
00:13:28,200 --> 00:13:32,520
Speaker 2: our nuclear family. We grew up in a big community

255
00:13:32,920 --> 00:13:36,559
Speaker 2: of family, were fortunate enough to be raised with all

256
00:13:36,640 --> 00:13:41,720
Speaker 2: four of our grandparents. They all lived within a couple

257
00:13:41,720 --> 00:13:46,040
Speaker 2: of mile radius of us. Even though our maternal grandparents

258
00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:49,600
Speaker 2: were separated, they lived in separate households around the corner

259
00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:52,560
Speaker 2: from each other, Wow, which was around the corner from

260
00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:58,079
Speaker 2: us cousins and uncles and aunts, and when times were down,

261
00:13:58,280 --> 00:14:00,920
Speaker 2: people would share homes. I remember when we were little

262
00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:05,560
Speaker 2: in Southside, our mother's father, who lived with a couple

263
00:14:05,640 --> 00:14:09,560
Speaker 2: of her sisters, their house burned down, their apartment did,

264
00:14:09,760 --> 00:14:13,559
Speaker 2: and I remember being really little, and there was a discussion,

265
00:14:13,640 --> 00:14:15,880
Speaker 2: or how are we going to help people out until

266
00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:19,040
Speaker 2: they found a new place to live. And so two

267
00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:23,160
Speaker 2: of our aunts, Carolyn, and there was someone else, stayed

268
00:14:23,200 --> 00:14:27,040
Speaker 2: in our little apartment and she worked nights, but she

269
00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:29,640
Speaker 2: slept in my bed and I didn't even really know

270
00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:31,600
Speaker 2: it because she would come in and just push me

271
00:14:31,680 --> 00:14:34,440
Speaker 2: over and sleep in bed with me, which was next

272
00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:39,840
Speaker 2: to Craig's bed. It was just this, when family's in trouble,

273
00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:44,080
Speaker 2: you step up. And I think to this day, throughout

274
00:14:44,760 --> 00:14:49,520
Speaker 2: all our travels travails being in the White House, we

275
00:14:49,640 --> 00:14:53,720
Speaker 2: retained that no matter what was going on in his

276
00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:57,400
Speaker 2: life or mine, we had some rituals, you know. We

277
00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:01,080
Speaker 2: did Thanksgiving together. His family came to the Easter egg role.

278
00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:05,040
Speaker 2: My niece and nephew, his oldest kids. Whenever we had

279
00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:08,840
Speaker 2: an interesting trip in the summer, Avery and Leslie always

280
00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:11,320
Speaker 2: came with us, so it wasn't just me, Malia and

281
00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:15,800
Speaker 2: Sasha on Bright Star the first Lady's plane, seeing Nelson Mandela,

282
00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:21,120
Speaker 2: or going on Safari or going to see going to Rome,

283
00:15:21,560 --> 00:15:25,960
Speaker 2: but averyan Leslie came with us, So it just made

284
00:15:26,040 --> 00:15:29,040
Speaker 2: the whole experience feel like we weren't on some island

285
00:15:29,200 --> 00:15:32,280
Speaker 2: just doing this really hard thing, but we were still

286
00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:36,960
Speaker 2: doing it as a family. So family values, I think,

287
00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:39,880
Speaker 2: is probably one of the strongest things we took away

288
00:15:39,920 --> 00:15:42,400
Speaker 2: and we made it happen in that little house on

289
00:15:42,520 --> 00:15:46,800
Speaker 2: seventy fourth in Euclid. It was just brimming with love

290
00:15:47,120 --> 00:15:50,080
Speaker 2: and conversation and trust.

291
00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:53,240
Speaker 1: I couldn't be more excited to share something truly special

292
00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:55,680
Speaker 1: with all you TA lovers out there. And even if

293
00:15:55,680 --> 00:15:59,760
Speaker 1: you don't love tea, if you love refreshing, rejuvenating, refueling

294
00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:03,440
Speaker 1: odors that are good for you, listen to this RADI

295
00:16:03,480 --> 00:16:07,400
Speaker 1: and I poured our hearts into creating juny sparkling tea

296
00:16:07,720 --> 00:16:11,480
Speaker 1: with adaptogens for you because we believe in nurturing your body,

297
00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:15,080
Speaker 1: and with every sip you'll experience calmness of mind, a

298
00:16:15,160 --> 00:16:18,720
Speaker 1: refreshing vitality, and a burst of brightness to your day.

299
00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:23,760
Speaker 1: Juni is infused with adaptogens that are amazing natural substances

300
00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:27,200
Speaker 1: that act like superheroes for your body to help you

301
00:16:27,280 --> 00:16:30,240
Speaker 1: adapt to stress and find balance in your busy life.

302
00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:35,280
Speaker 1: Our super five blend of these powerful ingredients include green tea, ushwaganda,

303
00:16:35,640 --> 00:16:39,600
Speaker 1: Acirolla cherry, and Lion's Made mushroom and these may help

304
00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:43,160
Speaker 1: boost your metabolism, give you a natural kick of caffeine,

305
00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:47,840
Speaker 1: combat stress, pack your body with antioxidants and stimulate brain

306
00:16:47,880 --> 00:16:52,720
Speaker 1: function even better. Juni has zero sugar and only five

307
00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:56,600
Speaker 1: calories per can. We believe in nurturing and energizing your

308
00:16:56,600 --> 00:17:00,520
Speaker 1: body while enjoying a truly delicious and refreshing drink. So

309
00:17:00,640 --> 00:17:05,040
Speaker 1: visit drink Juni dot com today to elevate your wellness

310
00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:08,879
Speaker 1: journey and use code on Purpose to receive fifteen percent

311
00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:13,959
Speaker 1: of your first order. That's drink jay Ni dot com

312
00:17:14,240 --> 00:17:17,640
Speaker 1: and make sure you use the code on purpose. Yeah,

313
00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:19,440
Speaker 1: I love that. I remember last time we were together,

314
00:17:19,480 --> 00:17:22,280
Speaker 1: you were talking about just the kitchen table and just

315
00:17:22,560 --> 00:17:25,760
Speaker 1: the gathering of minds and family and how important that

316
00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:27,760
Speaker 1: is in Craig, I know your birthday is coming up too,

317
00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:28,359
Speaker 1: like it.

318
00:17:28,240 --> 00:17:31,760
Speaker 4: Is thank you day, thanks for remembering twenty first.

319
00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:35,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, twenty first birthday. But were birthday is a

320
00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:38,480
Speaker 1: big part of connecting over the years as well or

321
00:17:38,480 --> 00:17:40,800
Speaker 1: as not not been, because that for my sister is

322
00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:44,760
Speaker 1: like the biggest day. She's like, my birthday is really important.

323
00:17:45,040 --> 00:17:46,880
Speaker 1: Do not miss my birthday, like I know.

324
00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:52,000
Speaker 3: Well, we never missed birthdays, and we always celebrated birthdays,

325
00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:55,080
Speaker 3: but they weren't a big deal like where we had

326
00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:58,639
Speaker 3: a party, Like I think you had one or two

327
00:17:58,760 --> 00:17:59,600
Speaker 3: birthday parties.

328
00:17:59,640 --> 00:18:02,240
Speaker 2: And this is the tripped out thing about this generation,

329
00:18:02,560 --> 00:18:06,480
Speaker 2: Like kids have parties every year and multiple parties. They're blowout.

330
00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:10,520
Speaker 2: You know, it's a birthday month and you're renting something

331
00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:14,320
Speaker 2: and you're catering, and you know, I've been like our generation,

332
00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:18,640
Speaker 2: you had maybe thirteen maybe five years old, you had

333
00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:21,000
Speaker 2: two parties and they were at your house in the

334
00:18:21,080 --> 00:18:23,400
Speaker 2: kitchen table, right, you know, with your cousins and.

335
00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:25,040
Speaker 3: You played pin the tail on the donkey in the

336
00:18:25,119 --> 00:18:28,840
Speaker 3: yard or somewhere like that. But but as a family,

337
00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:31,880
Speaker 3: we celebrated everybody's birthday and it was a big deal.

338
00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:35,880
Speaker 3: Every now and then that community of relatives that were

339
00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:38,040
Speaker 3: around us would come over and it didn't matter what

340
00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:41,159
Speaker 3: the day. If it was Thursday and everybody had to

341
00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:43,480
Speaker 3: go to work on Friday, they would come over and

342
00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:47,760
Speaker 3: sing Happy Birthday, gift cards out. Birthdays were always celebrated

343
00:18:47,840 --> 00:18:48,640
Speaker 3: in our family.

344
00:18:48,680 --> 00:18:52,560
Speaker 2: They weren't like big like see me, bring me gifts,

345
00:18:52,760 --> 00:18:56,560
Speaker 2: but it was a time to gather. And we're talking

346
00:18:56,560 --> 00:19:01,520
Speaker 2: about the extended family. So my mother had said brothers

347
00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:05,720
Speaker 2: and sisters, and then the cousins and then our grandfather.

348
00:19:05,960 --> 00:19:08,920
Speaker 2: We were always at Southsides house for these birthdays because

349
00:19:08,960 --> 00:19:11,879
Speaker 2: that's the side of the family that did it. Every

350
00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:16,240
Speaker 2: There was a dinner and cards for every birthday for

351
00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:20,400
Speaker 2: all those people, you know, so it's almost like every

352
00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:24,480
Speaker 2: weekend we were celebrating somebody's birthday.

353
00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:27,680
Speaker 1: That's what's been something that you've an idea that you've

354
00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:30,800
Speaker 1: had to unlearn since you were younger, something that you've

355
00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:33,080
Speaker 1: kind of had to let go of as time has

356
00:19:33,119 --> 00:19:38,119
Speaker 1: gone on. Something that was important before, but you're like, no,

357
00:19:38,280 --> 00:19:39,320
Speaker 1: it's not so important.

358
00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:47,000
Speaker 3: Talked about our grandfather's apartment being on fire. Fire back

359
00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:52,000
Speaker 3: then in the seventies was a real thing, like houses

360
00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:52,760
Speaker 3: caught on fire.

361
00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:57,040
Speaker 2: People didn't have smoke, especially in working class, poor communities,

362
00:19:57,080 --> 00:19:57,640
Speaker 2: you didn't.

363
00:19:57,400 --> 00:19:59,080
Speaker 4: Have smoke detective detectors.

364
00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:01,840
Speaker 2: So I think we knew several kids who's homes caught

365
00:20:03,040 --> 00:20:03,520
Speaker 2: on fire.

366
00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:09,440
Speaker 3: And I had to unlearn worrying about our house being

367
00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:14,480
Speaker 3: on fire. I mean, I grew up completely obsessed with

368
00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:18,639
Speaker 3: being able to recognize if the house was going to

369
00:20:18,680 --> 00:20:21,480
Speaker 3: be on fire number one and then having the ability

370
00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:24,920
Speaker 3: to get everyone out. And you know, our dad had MS,

371
00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:28,960
Speaker 3: and so he walked with a limp from the time

372
00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:32,439
Speaker 3: I could remember. He then had a cane, and then

373
00:20:32,480 --> 00:20:35,200
Speaker 3: he had the crutches that went around his arm, and

374
00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:40,159
Speaker 3: I would practice dragging him with his shoulder, with my

375
00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:44,479
Speaker 3: arms under his shoulders around the house and he would

376
00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:47,159
Speaker 3: I know it was humiliating, but he'd let me do it.

377
00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:52,200
Speaker 3: And my mom would be like, Craig, put Fraser down,

378
00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:54,439
Speaker 3: just stop doing that. And I went in to make

379
00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:57,320
Speaker 3: sure I could drag him through the house. And we

380
00:20:57,440 --> 00:21:00,520
Speaker 3: had like fourteen stairs down to get out. I didn't

381
00:21:00,600 --> 00:21:02,719
Speaker 3: drag him down there, but I knew I could if

382
00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:05,760
Speaker 3: I had to. That's something I had to unlearn because

383
00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:08,720
Speaker 3: that was a real fear of mine. Was a fear

384
00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:10,119
Speaker 3: of dying in a fire.

385
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:12,320
Speaker 4: Wow, Yeah, what did it take?

386
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:15,080
Speaker 3: Like, what was the Well, what it took was I

387
00:21:15,119 --> 00:21:18,640
Speaker 3: realized it was irrational as I got older, because there were.

388
00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:19,640
Speaker 4: Less house fires.

389
00:21:20,160 --> 00:21:23,680
Speaker 3: And I guess it wasn't irrational because there were actually

390
00:21:23,720 --> 00:21:28,320
Speaker 3: house fires. But the advent of smoke detectors and the

391
00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:33,120
Speaker 3: advent of sort of inflam non inflammable.

392
00:21:32,480 --> 00:21:35,080
Speaker 4: Or what is it, non and non flammable.

393
00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:37,920
Speaker 3: Items around the house, I was always worried about a

394
00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:40,720
Speaker 3: fire starting. And we had a fire start in our kitchen.

395
00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:44,040
Speaker 3: You remember, we were cooking pop tarts, which were like.

396
00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:47,919
Speaker 2: Saturday mornings, we kind of had the run of the

397
00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:51,399
Speaker 2: kitchen because that was the day Mom would sleep in.

398
00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:54,520
Speaker 2: And we had this old toaster and we were making

399
00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:56,840
Speaker 2: fad tarts and it caught.

400
00:21:56,640 --> 00:22:00,639
Speaker 3: Fire and came out, and the flame came up and

401
00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:01,919
Speaker 3: then sure enough.

402
00:22:03,800 --> 00:22:04,720
Speaker 2: Mom to the rescue.

403
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:06,200
Speaker 4: Mom came in and put it under the same.

404
00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:13,440
Speaker 2: Yeah. But as you talk about fear, when I think

405
00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:20,240
Speaker 2: about things that I think we had to subconsciously unlearn,

406
00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:23,719
Speaker 2: was fear because you know, we grew up at a

407
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:26,879
Speaker 2: time and you know, just coming out of the deep

408
00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:32,160
Speaker 2: segregation of Chicago. But our parents and grandpa parents grew

409
00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:35,200
Speaker 2: up in it. You know, in a time when being

410
00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:39,440
Speaker 2: black in the city, you know, you were isolated. There

411
00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:42,680
Speaker 2: were areas of the city that you couldn't go into

412
00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:48,160
Speaker 2: because you could be literally harmed killed as a black person.

413
00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:52,760
Speaker 2: That was that was the truth of Chicago. As I

414
00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:56,879
Speaker 2: noticed in my family, fear, the fear of what could

415
00:22:56,920 --> 00:23:01,440
Speaker 2: happen to a black man, to a black person, kind

416
00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:05,560
Speaker 2: of consumed some of our elders and stunted their growth.

417
00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:09,400
Speaker 2: I mean Southside the grandparent that I talked about, he

418
00:23:09,600 --> 00:23:12,680
Speaker 2: was kind of a mama's boy. You know, his mom

419
00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:18,280
Speaker 2: our great grandmother, Mamma overprotected him and as a result,

420
00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:21,640
Speaker 2: he never really got his own footing because he had

421
00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:24,040
Speaker 2: a mom that was going to make sure you live

422
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:27,600
Speaker 2: at home. I'll take care of you. He also had

423
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:30,320
Speaker 2: limits as a black man because he was a carpenter

424
00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:34,040
Speaker 2: who wasn't allowed to join the unions, couldn't afford to

425
00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:37,920
Speaker 2: go to college. They were of the generation where even

426
00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:41,520
Speaker 2: if you were smart and talented, the ceiling was real

427
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:45,119
Speaker 2: and the dangers were real. A lot of the reason

428
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:48,720
Speaker 2: our family was so close right was because the elders

429
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:53,639
Speaker 2: were keeping everybody close and they were slowly passing those

430
00:23:53,680 --> 00:23:57,080
Speaker 2: fears on don't go down this street, don't go on

431
00:23:57,119 --> 00:24:00,600
Speaker 2: this bus, maybe not take that job, don't try something

432
00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:05,200
Speaker 2: new because it could kill you. I think our parents

433
00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:11,240
Speaker 2: tried to actively unhook those those things from us by

434
00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:14,600
Speaker 2: pushing us out. I think they knew that they had

435
00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:18,920
Speaker 2: the tendency to suffocate their dreams because of these fears,

436
00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:22,720
Speaker 2: to not try new things, to not draw outside of

437
00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:27,399
Speaker 2: the lines. And I think they deliberately pushed us. So

438
00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:31,640
Speaker 2: there were a lot of yes is in terms of experiences, exposures,

439
00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:38,399
Speaker 2: Craig traveling on his AAU basketball league to other parts

440
00:24:38,440 --> 00:24:40,720
Speaker 2: of the city, even you know, because in a city

441
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:43,520
Speaker 2: like Chicago, because of those fears, we had cousins that

442
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:45,960
Speaker 2: lived on the west side of the city. We lived

443
00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:48,240
Speaker 2: on the south side of the city, in a neighborhood

444
00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:52,480
Speaker 2: that was right along the lake near downtown Chicago. If

445
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:54,920
Speaker 2: you're a black kid growing up on the West side

446
00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:58,800
Speaker 2: of Chicago, we met kids that had never been downtown.

447
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:02,240
Speaker 2: They had ever seen the lake. And if you've been

448
00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:05,840
Speaker 2: to Chicago, to be from Chicago and never see the

449
00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:10,960
Speaker 2: lake is a herculean effort. But you understand it when

450
00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:13,440
Speaker 2: you're a black kid from the West Side and you

451
00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:16,919
Speaker 2: viewed with suspicion. When you come downtown, you don't feel

452
00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:21,000
Speaker 2: welcome outside of your neighborhood, so your world gets smaller

453
00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:24,199
Speaker 2: and smaller. I think our parents did not want that

454
00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:28,480
Speaker 2: smallness for us, and we saw how that smallness kept

455
00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:33,480
Speaker 2: some really intelligent people in our lives in one spot.

456
00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:36,000
Speaker 2: You know. They didn't move, they didn't grow, they didn't

457
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:39,639
Speaker 2: try new things. I had an aunt, my mother's youngest sister,

458
00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:42,840
Speaker 2: who recently passed this year, who never came to the

459
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:45,840
Speaker 2: White House, and all the years that we were there,

460
00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:50,680
Speaker 2: she never came. Why because she was afraid of flying,

461
00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:54,280
Speaker 2: she was afraid of driving too long, She was afraid

462
00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:57,199
Speaker 2: of doing anything but leaving her house and going to

463
00:25:57,240 --> 00:26:01,360
Speaker 2: work and coming home. We saw that here, right, We

464
00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:06,840
Speaker 2: saw that, and you have to actively tell yourself a

465
00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:09,840
Speaker 2: different set of messages about what you can expect from

466
00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:14,000
Speaker 2: the world. And we also could have been limited by

467
00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:19,240
Speaker 2: that because while it physically limited some of our relatives,

468
00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:23,400
Speaker 2: some of our grandparents' perspectives, like many people in this country,

469
00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:27,439
Speaker 2: they were backwards thinking, you know, their views of white

470
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:30,440
Speaker 2: people and who they could trust. You know, the same

471
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:32,919
Speaker 2: south Side never went to the doctor because he didn't

472
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,800
Speaker 2: trust doctors, so he you know, he never went to

473
00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:38,520
Speaker 2: the dentist. That's probably why he died in his seventies.

474
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:40,600
Speaker 2: He didn't have a tooth in his head, but he

475
00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:43,240
Speaker 2: would never go to the dentist, you know. And we

476
00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:46,639
Speaker 2: would talk about these things around our immediate kitchen table

477
00:26:46,720 --> 00:26:50,119
Speaker 2: because our parents wanted us to learn from the mistakes

478
00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:52,199
Speaker 2: that they had made and others. And that was the

479
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:56,200
Speaker 2: power of that householders. Our parents talk to us very

480
00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:59,480
Speaker 2: openly and honestly about some of the weird things you'd

481
00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:02,840
Speaker 2: see at Christmas dinner or some of the conversations, and

482
00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:06,520
Speaker 2: you'd come back and go, well, why did Dandy, our

483
00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:09,200
Speaker 2: other grandfather say that, Why did he yell about that?

484
00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:12,280
Speaker 2: What was he talking about? We were always allowed to

485
00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:17,560
Speaker 2: question and that fear element and the limitations on people's

486
00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:21,600
Speaker 2: views of the world we would see and discuss and

487
00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:24,560
Speaker 2: we were told, you have to do better than that.

488
00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:27,639
Speaker 2: You have to live beyond that fear. You have to

489
00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:31,200
Speaker 2: push yourself outside of your comfort zone. And I continue

490
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:33,560
Speaker 2: to try to do that, instill that in my kids

491
00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:35,119
Speaker 2: and other kids to this day.

492
00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:39,199
Speaker 1: I mean, that's such a profound thing to reflect on

493
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:42,200
Speaker 1: when thinking about what on Leine, because it's so as

494
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:45,119
Speaker 1: you said, it wasn't both of you us, but especially

495
00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:48,480
Speaker 1: this is something that isn't going to change based on

496
00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:51,880
Speaker 1: a mindset because it exists. Yeah, in reality, did either

497
00:27:51,920 --> 00:27:54,880
Speaker 1: of you ever have any close calls or run ins that,

498
00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:57,040
Speaker 1: oh yeah, that you would like to share?

499
00:27:57,119 --> 00:27:57,320
Speaker 4: For all.

500
00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:00,320
Speaker 2: You were got tenure, I was.

501
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:03,040
Speaker 3: I was probably more like twelve because I could ride

502
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:05,520
Speaker 3: to Rainbow Beach, so figure out.

503
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:10,520
Speaker 4: Seventh grade ish a department store near.

504
00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:14,639
Speaker 3: Our house called Goldblatz had a sail on ten speed

505
00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:18,200
Speaker 3: bikes to kind with the handlebars that go under that

506
00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:22,360
Speaker 3: was brand new back then. They were yellow and they

507
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:26,040
Speaker 3: sold a ton of them, and you got one.

508
00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:28,960
Speaker 2: I got one to give your first ten speed bikes.

509
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:30,520
Speaker 3: And it had to I must have gotten it for

510
00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:32,520
Speaker 3: my birthday, so it was probably around this time of

511
00:28:32,560 --> 00:28:35,520
Speaker 3: the year. But it didn't come with the clamps to

512
00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:40,200
Speaker 3: hold the cables along the yoke. So my mom used

513
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 3: these twist ties that she got from the baggies that

514
00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,560
Speaker 3: you would put stuff in before you had the zip lock.

515
00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:50,800
Speaker 3: You had these bags and then you put these green

516
00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:53,680
Speaker 3: and white twist twisty ties on it. So she put

517
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:56,480
Speaker 3: them on my bike. And there is a point to this,

518
00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:01,800
Speaker 3: I'm wondering what it is. So so I'm riding my

519
00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:06,120
Speaker 3: bike by myself down seventy fifth Street, which if you

520
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,640
Speaker 3: head east you run right into Lake Michigan. And I'm

521
00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:14,640
Speaker 3: almost there and a policeman comes up to me while

522
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:16,680
Speaker 3: I'm riding and I'm on the sidewalk and he's in

523
00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:19,080
Speaker 3: the street, turns his lights on, tells me to pull over,

524
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:21,840
Speaker 3: and I stop, and I was like, officer, how can

525
00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:24,720
Speaker 3: I help because I'm always happy to see a policeman.

526
00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:29,440
Speaker 3: My uncle's a policeman, and you know, officer friendly in school.

527
00:29:29,960 --> 00:29:33,560
Speaker 3: And he said, where'd you get that bike? And I said, oh,

528
00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:35,840
Speaker 3: I got it for my birthday. I just got it.

529
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:37,960
Speaker 3: I mean, take a look at I was proud of it.

530
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:41,200
Speaker 3: I was like, this is my new ten speed bike.

531
00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:44,800
Speaker 3: He said, you stole that bike. Now, this was a

532
00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:49,840
Speaker 3: black police officer, and I was like, no, no, and

533
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 3: it was it was so out of the realm of

534
00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:56,280
Speaker 3: my mind to be accused of stealing a bike. I

535
00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:59,680
Speaker 3: wasn't even worried at first. I just said, no, no, listen,

536
00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 3: you got it all wrong. This is a brand new

537
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 3: bike that I got. And he was like, I know,

538
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 3: you stole that bike. And he was basing it on

539
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:12,160
Speaker 3: the fact that someone who had bought a similar bike

540
00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:16,800
Speaker 3: had it stolen and their mom used twist ties to

541
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:18,960
Speaker 3: put them on the cables.

542
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:22,600
Speaker 4: So he wouldn't believe me. And so now I'm getting worried.

543
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:24,640
Speaker 3: And he picks up my bike and puts it in

544
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:26,440
Speaker 3: the trunk of the car, puts me in the back

545
00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:29,240
Speaker 3: of the car and says, where do you live?

546
00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:31,680
Speaker 4: And I said, I told him where I lived, and

547
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:35,720
Speaker 4: he drove. I said, you'll realize this is my bike.

548
00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:38,120
Speaker 3: We can go right to my mom's, right to my house.

549
00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:42,000
Speaker 3: So we pull up to my house and by this

550
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:45,600
Speaker 3: time I'm in tears. I'm just beside myself. I ring

551
00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:48,640
Speaker 3: the doorbell, and my mom was worried because she knew

552
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:51,600
Speaker 3: I was gone for her long bike ride. She comes

553
00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:56,640
Speaker 3: out and I said, the policeman has accused me of

554
00:30:56,680 --> 00:31:00,760
Speaker 3: stealing this bike, and I'm in tears. He comes out

555
00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:04,640
Speaker 3: and she said, wait inside. And I'm on our front

556
00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:08,640
Speaker 3: porch looking out, or actually I'm upstairs looking down because

557
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:13,120
Speaker 3: we lived upstairs. I'm looking down and I see her

558
00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:17,959
Speaker 3: and I can tell she is pissed, and she is

559
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:20,800
Speaker 3: talking to him like she would talk to us if

560
00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:24,360
Speaker 3: we were in trouble, and all I can see is

561
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:30,720
Speaker 3: the policeman trying to defend himself. So after about twenty minutes,

562
00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:33,720
Speaker 3: she yells up to the window, Craig, come down here,

563
00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:38,640
Speaker 3: and she said, this policeman has something to say to you.

564
00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:40,600
Speaker 4: And this dude took.

565
00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:45,200
Speaker 3: Off his hat and apologized for accusing me of stealing

566
00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:45,640
Speaker 3: his bike.

567
00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:49,240
Speaker 4: And as it turned out, they ended up finding the guy.

568
00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 3: But it was you know, that's kind of the collateral

569
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:58,200
Speaker 3: damage of being a young black kid.

570
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,880
Speaker 2: I just think about all, you know, what would have

571
00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:03,960
Speaker 2: happened if my mom wasn't a stay at home mom.

572
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:06,160
Speaker 2: What if she had been in work when that happened.

573
00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:09,840
Speaker 2: What if, you know, he didn't have a mom that

574
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:13,200
Speaker 2: you know would stand up for him, What what if?

575
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 2: What are all the what ifs that that could have happened,

576
00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:21,240
Speaker 2: And that, you know is you imagine you're just having

577
00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:24,320
Speaker 2: a regular day and your son is pulled up to

578
00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:27,400
Speaker 2: your house in the back of a police car at

579
00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:29,640
Speaker 2: ten years old, at ten twelve years old.

580
00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:31,080
Speaker 4: It was it was frightening.

581
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:33,120
Speaker 2: It was fright you know, And I think what she

582
00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 2: was incredulous was about was that he wasn't even inclined

583
00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:40,160
Speaker 2: to believe this little boy, who was obviously articulate, didn't

584
00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:42,080
Speaker 2: look you know, you don't even want to say didn't

585
00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:45,560
Speaker 2: look like some little hood rat, because what does that matter? Right,

586
00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:49,400
Speaker 2: But that was you know that that was unusual for

587
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:52,040
Speaker 2: us because we were good kids, I mean, and we

588
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:54,720
Speaker 2: lived in a neighborhood where their kids were getting into

589
00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:56,760
Speaker 2: trouble all the time. And he knew all the kids

590
00:32:56,800 --> 00:32:59,960
Speaker 2: because he was a basketball player. He knew the game

591
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:03,440
Speaker 2: kids and the drug dealers and the but everybody also

592
00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:06,360
Speaker 2: knew him, you know. And you know, when you grow

593
00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 2: up in a neighborhood, people know the kids that are

594
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:12,560
Speaker 2: heading in the wrong direction and the kids who have promised.

595
00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:16,320
Speaker 2: Everybody knew that Craig was a good student, he was

596
00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:18,760
Speaker 2: a good guy, and the notion and I felt the

597
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:22,280
Speaker 2: anger too, It's like, how dare you do that to

598
00:33:22,360 --> 00:33:26,959
Speaker 2: my brother? But he you know, he had a support system.

599
00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:30,160
Speaker 2: He could have wound up in jail for stealing not

600
00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 2: stealing a bike. So yeah, that kind of stuff happened

601
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:39,200
Speaker 2: all the time, you know, walking into a department store

602
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 2: as a young kid and having the the you know,

603
00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:46,680
Speaker 2: salespeople wonder why you're there, and you're coming, you're an

604
00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:49,960
Speaker 2: honor student coming from high school, you know, having lunch

605
00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:52,400
Speaker 2: with your friends. I mean, they don't they didn't see

606
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:54,800
Speaker 2: that part. There were times when that part of us

607
00:33:55,160 --> 00:33:59,440
Speaker 2: couldn't be We couldn't walk around saying valedictorian straight. A student,

608
00:34:00,440 --> 00:34:04,720
Speaker 2: you know, speaks excellent, has excellent diction if you give

609
00:34:04,760 --> 00:34:07,480
Speaker 2: them a chance. You know, we knew very early on

610
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:10,880
Speaker 2: that that no one was going to see beyond the

611
00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:15,520
Speaker 2: color of our skin at an early age, and that

612
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:16,720
Speaker 2: could get you in trouble.

613
00:34:17,160 --> 00:34:20,359
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, when you talk about that fear, I'm

614
00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:24,600
Speaker 1: sure that fear has been tested across your life in

615
00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:28,120
Speaker 1: so many different places, and I wonder what would you

616
00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:32,560
Speaker 1: say has been the most hardest recent test of that fear,

617
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:34,400
Speaker 1: Because it's not one of those fears that you kind

618
00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:37,080
Speaker 1: of get over in it just goes away. It kind

619
00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:39,759
Speaker 1: of shows its head in many different ways. I imagine.

620
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:43,560
Speaker 2: Well, in this current climate, for me, it's you know,

621
00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 2: what's happening to immigrants, you know, So it's it's not

622
00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:50,840
Speaker 2: the fear for myself anymore. I drive around in a

623
00:34:50,960 --> 00:34:55,080
Speaker 2: four car motorcade with a police escort. I'm Michelle Obama.

624
00:34:55,520 --> 00:34:58,280
Speaker 2: I do still worry about my daughters in the world,

625
00:34:58,320 --> 00:35:01,560
Speaker 2: even though they are somewhat recognized. So my fears are

626
00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:05,080
Speaker 2: for what I know is happening out there in streets

627
00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:08,560
Speaker 2: all over the city. And now that we have leadership

628
00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:13,200
Speaker 2: that is sort of indiscriminately determining who belongs and who doesn't,

629
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:17,000
Speaker 2: and we know that those decisions aren't being made with

630
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:20,879
Speaker 2: courts and with due process, and you know that it's

631
00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:24,839
Speaker 2: being made like this cop that pulled my brother over

632
00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:30,160
Speaker 2: when he was twelve. You don't look like somebody that belongs.

633
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:33,520
Speaker 2: You know, I can determine just by looking at you

634
00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:36,960
Speaker 2: that you're you know, you're a good person, or you're

635
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:40,040
Speaker 2: not a good person. And knowing that there's so much

636
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:43,200
Speaker 2: bias and so much racism and so much ignorance that

637
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:48,120
Speaker 2: fuels those kind of choices, I worry for people of

638
00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:51,839
Speaker 2: color all over this country, and I don't know that

639
00:35:51,920 --> 00:35:55,480
Speaker 2: we will have the advocates to protect everybody. And that

640
00:35:55,880 --> 00:36:00,680
Speaker 2: makes me, that frightens me. It keeps me up at night,

641
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:03,480
Speaker 2: and I know that there are and I see that

642
00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:06,239
Speaker 2: when I'm driving around LA I'm just looking in the

643
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:09,320
Speaker 2: faces of folks who could be victim, and I'm wondering

644
00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:12,279
Speaker 2: how are you feeling? How do you feel standing on

645
00:36:12,320 --> 00:36:14,480
Speaker 2: the bus stop? Do you how do you feel comfortable

646
00:36:14,840 --> 00:36:18,160
Speaker 2: going to work, going to school when you know that

647
00:36:18,200 --> 00:36:21,560
Speaker 2: there could be people out here judging you and who

648
00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:26,920
Speaker 2: could up end your life in a second. You know

649
00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:30,480
Speaker 2: that that's who I worry for right now?

650
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:33,560
Speaker 1: What do you both do with that fear? Because I

651
00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:35,440
Speaker 1: think that's very real and a lot of people listening

652
00:36:35,480 --> 00:36:38,560
Speaker 1: probably feel very similarly to both of you as well.

653
00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:42,279
Speaker 1: What do you do with it? Because it almost feels overwhelming,

654
00:36:43,080 --> 00:36:45,440
Speaker 1: and especially for someone going through it as you're talking

655
00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:50,480
Speaker 1: about with your daughters too, it's not something that you rationalize,

656
00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:52,359
Speaker 1: and you know it's not the same as so many

657
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:53,960
Speaker 1: other fears, So what do you do with it?

658
00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:56,719
Speaker 3: See, I still have a couple of young kids at home,

659
00:36:56,840 --> 00:37:00,560
Speaker 3: so I've got a fifteen year old and a thirty old,

660
00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:06,200
Speaker 3: So I'm still in the education process for those guys.

661
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:09,000
Speaker 3: Because we you know, we live in a suburb and

662
00:37:10,560 --> 00:37:15,040
Speaker 3: we have a relatively safe environment, so our kids aren't

663
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:17,400
Speaker 3: growing up with that kind.

664
00:37:17,120 --> 00:37:18,760
Speaker 4: Of fear that we had.

665
00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:21,960
Speaker 3: But I have to make them aware of it because

666
00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:23,880
Speaker 3: at some point they're going to be away from us

667
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:26,040
Speaker 3: and they're going to be in a place where they're

668
00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:30,839
Speaker 3: going to encounter that. I'm trying to be as empathetic

669
00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:34,000
Speaker 3: as I can, because that's how we were taught to

670
00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:37,920
Speaker 3: deal with this kind of behavior. Our mom always said,

671
00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:41,080
Speaker 3: just put yourself in the other guy's shoes. He's probably

672
00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:45,760
Speaker 3: had a bad upbringing, an ignorant upbringing. His folks didn't

673
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 3: know anything, and that's how I always view people who

674
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:53,920
Speaker 3: treated me with disdain because of my race, or because

675
00:37:53,960 --> 00:37:54,560
Speaker 3: of where.

676
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:57,680
Speaker 4: I'm from or anything.

677
00:37:58,040 --> 00:38:01,759
Speaker 3: And I'm trying to help my even my older kids

678
00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:04,600
Speaker 3: who are thirty three and twenty nine, they're pretty much

679
00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:07,680
Speaker 3: formed and are handling things on their own. But it's

680
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:11,560
Speaker 3: a good reminder to talk about this and put some

681
00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:18,200
Speaker 3: coping strategies together for especially our teenagers, because they're going

682
00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:22,160
Speaker 3: to they're going to encounter this at some point.

683
00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:28,160
Speaker 2: I have to practice reverse messaging in my own head

684
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:31,960
Speaker 2: about this stuff, because you can get locked in the

685
00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:37,520
Speaker 2: disappointments of what is happening right now, and you can

686
00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:40,480
Speaker 2: sit in it and let that eat you up, and

687
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:45,960
Speaker 2: it can taint your view of so much. Having been

688
00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:49,799
Speaker 2: the first lady of the entire country and representing the

689
00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:53,560
Speaker 2: country in the world, I couldn't afford to have that

690
00:38:53,680 --> 00:38:58,279
Speaker 2: kind of disdain. You know, I had to remind myself

691
00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:02,799
Speaker 2: and put myself in situation that reminded me the ideals

692
00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:07,160
Speaker 2: and beliefs that I disagree with are not pervasive that

693
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:10,040
Speaker 2: you know, there are a lot of good people out there.

694
00:39:10,360 --> 00:39:15,240
Speaker 2: Again employing empathy, but also reminding myself of the truth

695
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:19,080
Speaker 2: of what I've seen and I've experienced that We're in

696
00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:23,319
Speaker 2: a confusing time, but it doesn't help me and it

697
00:39:23,360 --> 00:39:26,799
Speaker 2: doesn't help the country for me to grow cynical in

698
00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:30,040
Speaker 2: that space. So I kind of view it as it's

699
00:39:30,080 --> 00:39:32,879
Speaker 2: a duty as a citizen to not do the same

700
00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:36,640
Speaker 2: thing that they're doing and start making assumptions about people

701
00:39:36,760 --> 00:39:39,759
Speaker 2: based on my anger and fear. You know that I

702
00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:42,400
Speaker 2: have to assume that most people are trying to do

703
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:46,960
Speaker 2: the right thing, that deep down inside, the vast majority

704
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:49,520
Speaker 2: of us do not want to see our neighbors and

705
00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:52,759
Speaker 2: our friends and relatives live in fear. They just don't

706
00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:55,880
Speaker 2: understand what it feels like to be the target. But

707
00:39:55,960 --> 00:40:00,640
Speaker 2: if they knew, they would understand, which is why communication

708
00:40:00,760 --> 00:40:03,960
Speaker 2: and conversation is so important, because maybe if I can

709
00:40:04,040 --> 00:40:07,080
Speaker 2: tell a story, you know, if I can if I

710
00:40:07,120 --> 00:40:10,640
Speaker 2: can help them be in the shoes of someone and

711
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:14,960
Speaker 2: that it can have that same empathizing effect that I'd

712
00:40:15,080 --> 00:40:19,560
Speaker 2: rather use that rather than become to become discouraged and

713
00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:24,200
Speaker 2: then suspicious and just be the you know, just do

714
00:40:24,320 --> 00:40:27,960
Speaker 2: what they're doing. I don't want to become that. So

715
00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:31,600
Speaker 2: it's a constant reminder, do not slip in to that

716
00:40:31,719 --> 00:40:32,840
Speaker 2: behavior yourself.

717
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:40,880
Speaker 1: I love that. I think that's such optimistic, hopeful, powerful mindset.

718
00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:44,320
Speaker 1: And you're so right, because if we all become cynical

719
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:48,080
Speaker 1: and skeptical and negative, it only makes it worse for

720
00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:50,440
Speaker 1: us and worse for everyone around us.

721
00:40:50,560 --> 00:40:54,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, let me tell you I can. I can, and

722
00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:58,040
Speaker 2: I can be cynical, and I can be all of that.

723
00:40:58,120 --> 00:41:00,160
Speaker 2: And I don't want to set myself because in these

724
00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:03,320
Speaker 2: times it's hard. No one is perfect. But I try

725
00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:07,200
Speaker 2: to keep that to my kitchen table, you know. I mean,

726
00:41:07,560 --> 00:41:10,880
Speaker 2: I feel like when you have a platform and you

727
00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 2: have a voice, there is a responsibility to use that wisely.

728
00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:20,080
Speaker 2: So yes, I yes, even I in going high, there

729
00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:22,759
Speaker 2: are times I want to go low and I need

730
00:41:22,760 --> 00:41:25,239
Speaker 2: to let that out. But I'm never going to let

731
00:41:25,280 --> 00:41:28,920
Speaker 2: that out in public because that's not even fully truly,

732
00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:33,920
Speaker 2: how I feel, you know, so just for our listeners

733
00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 2: and viewers, it's like, yes, of course we all feel it.

734
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:39,120
Speaker 2: It's just a question of how do we act on it.

735
00:41:39,640 --> 00:41:43,080
Speaker 3: And you hear this, This is why we're doing imo, yes, right,

736
00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:46,919
Speaker 3: It's just to be able to take the lessons we've

737
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:52,240
Speaker 3: learned and the experiences that we've gone through, and hers

738
00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:54,680
Speaker 3: being at the level of the White House and mine

739
00:41:54,760 --> 00:41:57,880
Speaker 3: being what they are sort of I'm still the regular

740
00:41:57,920 --> 00:42:03,160
Speaker 3: guy in the family. We're hoping that we can share

741
00:42:03,200 --> 00:42:06,080
Speaker 3: some of these with folks and learn some things from

742
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:08,960
Speaker 3: the people that we have on Like you, just listening

743
00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:13,080
Speaker 3: to her do that, this is the most fun I

744
00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:16,960
Speaker 3: am having, other than hanging with my kids and my family.

745
00:42:17,360 --> 00:42:22,719
Speaker 3: I just get goosebumps when when you hear some good wisdom.

746
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:25,480
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean that totally, like you know it

747
00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:30,160
Speaker 1: just it was just such a refreshing take on what

748
00:42:30,200 --> 00:42:34,359
Speaker 1: I was saying, was is a valid concern, is a

749
00:42:34,600 --> 00:42:38,680
Speaker 1: natural feeling that people are having. But to flip the

750
00:42:38,719 --> 00:42:41,080
Speaker 1: script in our own minds as to how we deal

751
00:42:41,120 --> 00:42:43,799
Speaker 1: with it and that constant battle that we have to

752
00:42:43,840 --> 00:42:45,920
Speaker 1: have with the thoughts in our head. And I love

753
00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:47,400
Speaker 1: what you're doing with im I mean, I was so

754
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:50,680
Speaker 1: grateful to be a guest on the show and to

755
00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:54,359
Speaker 1: visit you both in Martha's Vineyard, which was last year.

756
00:42:54,440 --> 00:42:55,120
Speaker 4: I think it was.

757
00:42:55,360 --> 00:42:58,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, And first of all, I'm just so grateful when

758
00:42:58,640 --> 00:43:02,600
Speaker 1: I see doing it with families just special because already

759
00:43:02,640 --> 00:43:06,160
Speaker 1: you're seeing sides of each other that you never see elsewhere,

760
00:43:06,239 --> 00:43:08,600
Speaker 1: so you can tell how authentic and real it is

761
00:43:08,640 --> 00:43:11,640
Speaker 1: and true it is, which is so beautiful. And on

762
00:43:11,719 --> 00:43:14,400
Speaker 1: top of that, what I love about it the most

763
00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:18,680
Speaker 1: is that I feel the fact that you're doing a podcast,

764
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:22,319
Speaker 1: which is the most accessible platform where you're giving I mean,

765
00:43:22,360 --> 00:43:24,480
Speaker 1: you know, when we were on like questions coming in

766
00:43:24,520 --> 00:43:27,799
Speaker 1: from the audience that we were tackling together trying to

767
00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 1: hear from both of your experiences. And by the way, Craig,

768
00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:33,680
Speaker 1: you're saying that you you know, the normal, regular person

769
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:38,399
Speaker 1: and the family, I mean, like you know, everyone has

770
00:43:38,600 --> 00:43:41,400
Speaker 1: a regular life. You know, it's amazing to hear it

771
00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:43,759
Speaker 1: from both of your sides. And the fact that you're

772
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:46,000
Speaker 1: opening up, even just the way you did now about

773
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:49,279
Speaker 1: these real life experiences that you've both had, I think

774
00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:52,040
Speaker 1: it's so needed because I think the challenge is that

775
00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:54,319
Speaker 1: when people do have success as both of you have had,

776
00:43:54,719 --> 00:43:58,200
Speaker 1: and the incredible heights of success that you've had, you

777
00:43:58,400 --> 00:44:01,799
Speaker 1: forget that. So someone was once scared that they were

778
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:05,759
Speaker 1: told they were stealing a bike, or you know, that

779
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:08,360
Speaker 1: they were scared about going down this particular street in

780
00:44:08,400 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 1: their neighborhood. And that's where so many people start out.

781
00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:14,640
Speaker 1: And it's not saying that everyone has to go and

782
00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:18,440
Speaker 1: achieve things externally in the world to get out of that,

783
00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:21,440
Speaker 1: but these are real emotions. And I think what you

784
00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:24,239
Speaker 1: were saying to me that resonated just now, Michelle, was

785
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:28,360
Speaker 1: this idea that you've had to push yourself out of

786
00:44:28,400 --> 00:44:31,279
Speaker 1: that comfort zone and your parents wanted you to not

787
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:35,279
Speaker 1: have that. What amazing parenting? Yeah, I mean, what phenomenal

788
00:44:35,360 --> 00:44:38,320
Speaker 1: parenting when you have every reason to scare your kids

789
00:44:38,719 --> 00:44:42,520
Speaker 1: into a corner, but you actually use it to expand

790
00:44:42,560 --> 00:44:44,120
Speaker 1: their vision up to the whole world.

791
00:44:44,200 --> 00:44:47,440
Speaker 2: I mean, that's we were blessed, Jay, and the older

792
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:50,920
Speaker 2: we get, the further down life's path we go as

793
00:44:50,960 --> 00:44:54,840
Speaker 2: we parent and parent young kids and adult kids, we've

794
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:59,840
Speaker 2: come to appreciate how rare our parents' perspectives were for

795
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:03,759
Speaker 2: or anyone, let alone for people in their circumstances. Which

796
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:06,640
Speaker 2: is another thing reason why it's like, well, let's create

797
00:45:06,680 --> 00:45:09,960
Speaker 2: a bigger kitchen table. I mean, with the loss of

798
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:13,880
Speaker 2: our mom this year, that was also a big impetus

799
00:45:13,640 --> 00:45:18,560
Speaker 2: to do this podcast, because the wisdom that she gave us,

800
00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:22,360
Speaker 2: it lives in us and as people who were raised

801
00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 2: to be givers and to be mentors and to gain

802
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:29,080
Speaker 2: joy from that mentorship. Truly, that's sort of a shared

803
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:33,080
Speaker 2: attribute in both of us being able to take that

804
00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:36,720
Speaker 2: wisdom and I don't want to spread it to the world,

805
00:45:36,880 --> 00:45:40,200
Speaker 2: but to just let other people benefit from the little

806
00:45:40,320 --> 00:45:44,200
Speaker 2: nuggets of wisdom that our parents laid out in that

807
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:47,680
Speaker 2: kitchen table, It's like, why not share it? You know,

808
00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:53,799
Speaker 2: the power of good parenting is too often underestimated, and

809
00:45:53,840 --> 00:45:58,440
Speaker 2: I think our parents came into parenting with a philosophy

810
00:45:58,960 --> 00:46:02,440
Speaker 2: like philosophy, and when you think of how most people

811
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:04,560
Speaker 2: think of parenting, they just think, I want to have

812
00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:06,920
Speaker 2: a baby, And that's where it begins. It ends, I

813
00:46:07,160 --> 00:46:11,399
Speaker 2: want to have a baby. But then the question is, well,

814
00:46:11,520 --> 00:46:15,200
Speaker 2: why why do you want to have a baby. Do

815
00:46:15,239 --> 00:46:19,320
Speaker 2: you want to have a baby because you're lonely, that's

816
00:46:19,400 --> 00:46:21,680
Speaker 2: not gonna work out. Well, do you want to have

817
00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:24,319
Speaker 2: a baby to create a mini me to continue on

818
00:46:24,640 --> 00:46:29,919
Speaker 2: some aspect of yourself that you didn't achieve. Oof, that's

819
00:46:29,960 --> 00:46:33,719
Speaker 2: going to be a messy kind of situation. Are you

820
00:46:33,840 --> 00:46:37,240
Speaker 2: lonely and you want a companion? Do you want a friend?

821
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:41,759
Speaker 2: I mean, if we actually sit down and piece that

822
00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:45,880
Speaker 2: stuff apart before we have kids, because parenting is a

823
00:46:45,920 --> 00:46:49,000
Speaker 2: hard thing. I think our parents, or at least our

824
00:46:49,040 --> 00:46:54,719
Speaker 2: mother for sure, she wanted parents because she felt the

825
00:46:54,760 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 2: importance of raising independent, kind, compassionate people adults, Like she

826
00:47:01,080 --> 00:47:05,200
Speaker 2: always said, I'm not raising babies, I'm raising adults. And

827
00:47:05,239 --> 00:47:09,480
Speaker 2: that completely shifts your approach as to how you parent

828
00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:12,200
Speaker 2: if you're not like just trying to raise a friend.

829
00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:14,440
Speaker 2: Because let me tell you, if you want a friend,

830
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:16,959
Speaker 2: you never want your friend to be mad at you, right.

831
00:47:17,040 --> 00:47:19,279
Speaker 2: You want your friend to like you. And if you're

832
00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:22,080
Speaker 2: a parent and you're worried about whether your kid likes you,

833
00:47:22,640 --> 00:47:26,600
Speaker 2: I guarantee you you are screwing them up, right, because

834
00:47:26,600 --> 00:47:29,560
Speaker 2: so much of parenting means that you have to suffer

835
00:47:29,600 --> 00:47:34,360
Speaker 2: through them gritting under their teeth of ooh oh, mommy,

836
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:37,080
Speaker 2: make me so mad? Why don't you ever? You know?

837
00:47:37,160 --> 00:47:39,359
Speaker 2: And it's like you can have those feelings you know.

838
00:47:40,040 --> 00:47:42,960
Speaker 2: But as my girls say that, their favorite phrase of

839
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:48,000
Speaker 2: mind is I'm not one of your little friends. It's like,

840
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:51,760
Speaker 2: you don't have to like me. I've got my own friends.

841
00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:55,239
Speaker 2: So you can don't slam your door. You can go

842
00:47:55,320 --> 00:47:57,480
Speaker 2: in your room, you can say whatever you want, but

843
00:47:57,560 --> 00:48:00,480
Speaker 2: you better not let me hear it. And when you

844
00:48:00,520 --> 00:48:03,560
Speaker 2: come out, you still have to do it because I

845
00:48:03,640 --> 00:48:06,240
Speaker 2: am not raising you to be my friend. I'm raising

846
00:48:06,239 --> 00:48:09,760
Speaker 2: you to be a human, responsible adult in the world.

847
00:48:09,760 --> 00:48:14,359
Speaker 2: And that's how our mother raised us. And I always say,

848
00:48:14,360 --> 00:48:18,600
Speaker 2: if everybody took that to heart before they had kids,

849
00:48:19,040 --> 00:48:22,880
Speaker 2: and they treat it parenting in that way, that would

850
00:48:22,920 --> 00:48:25,839
Speaker 2: solve a lot of the mess we're trying to deal

851
00:48:25,880 --> 00:48:31,160
Speaker 2: with right now. If parents just approached the job like

852
00:48:31,480 --> 00:48:34,720
Speaker 2: this is the biggest, most important thing that I'm doing,

853
00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:37,879
Speaker 2: and it isn't about me. It is about who this

854
00:48:37,960 --> 00:48:40,360
Speaker 2: little human is going to be and how they're going

855
00:48:40,440 --> 00:48:43,480
Speaker 2: to enter the world and are they going to be empathetic?

856
00:48:43,600 --> 00:48:45,920
Speaker 2: Are they going to be responsible? Are they going to

857
00:48:45,920 --> 00:48:49,319
Speaker 2: be an asshole out here? And you start doing that

858
00:48:49,400 --> 00:48:52,080
Speaker 2: when they're two and three and for all of that work,

859
00:48:53,080 --> 00:48:56,560
Speaker 2: is it starts that early? That's you know, if I

860
00:48:56,600 --> 00:49:00,799
Speaker 2: think of a mission for myself right now. Today, it's

861
00:49:00,880 --> 00:49:06,799
Speaker 2: really like having us all rethink the way we are

862
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:10,560
Speaker 2: building the next generation and what our duties and our

863
00:49:10,600 --> 00:49:13,520
Speaker 2: responsibilities are, what we're getting right and what we haven't

864
00:49:13,560 --> 00:49:17,640
Speaker 2: been getting right, and how do we self correct. I'm

865
00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:23,200
Speaker 2: really like on one for just that thing, because we're

866
00:49:23,239 --> 00:49:24,800
Speaker 2: not going to be able to count on the government,

867
00:49:25,600 --> 00:49:27,680
Speaker 2: you know, I mean we're not right now. We're not

868
00:49:27,719 --> 00:49:30,840
Speaker 2: investing in education, so we can't you know, we're not

869
00:49:31,040 --> 00:49:34,640
Speaker 2: paying teachers enough. We're leaving this all on us. We're

870
00:49:34,680 --> 00:49:37,200
Speaker 2: saying we don't want to pay taxes for any of

871
00:49:37,239 --> 00:49:41,400
Speaker 2: this stuff, right, so we sure as hell better be

872
00:49:41,520 --> 00:49:45,920
Speaker 2: good at taking care of our kids because now we're saying, well,

873
00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:48,520
Speaker 2: then it's all on us and we can't afford to

874
00:49:48,520 --> 00:49:49,200
Speaker 2: get it wrong.

875
00:49:49,719 --> 00:49:54,600
Speaker 1: Mic Drop, that was like, that really hits hard. I mean,

876
00:49:54,640 --> 00:49:57,759
Speaker 1: that resonates so strongly, and I feel, as I was

877
00:49:57,800 --> 00:50:00,759
Speaker 1: listening to you, it's in one sense, and I want

878
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:02,239
Speaker 1: to ask you this about this parents. I'm not a

879
00:50:02,280 --> 00:50:04,719
Speaker 1: parent yet, and partly it's because me and my wife

880
00:50:04,800 --> 00:50:07,239
Speaker 1: have these discussions. We talk a lot about what our

881
00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:10,000
Speaker 1: parenting philosophy is, and we've talked about it over the

882
00:50:10,120 --> 00:50:12,640
Speaker 1: years that we've been together. We've been together now for

883
00:50:13,000 --> 00:50:15,719
Speaker 1: twelve years and married for nine, and it's been a

884
00:50:15,760 --> 00:50:18,520
Speaker 1: topic of conversation and there's been things we haven't agreed on.

885
00:50:18,600 --> 00:50:20,680
Speaker 1: There's things we agree on, and we want to make

886
00:50:20,719 --> 00:50:23,799
Speaker 1: sure that we have an aligned viewpoint, even if we

887
00:50:23,880 --> 00:50:28,480
Speaker 1: have slight differences. We want to have an aligned viewpoint

888
00:50:28,480 --> 00:50:30,360
Speaker 1: of because we want the kids to get a clear message.

889
00:50:30,360 --> 00:50:32,960
Speaker 1: We don't want them to get Mom and dad have

890
00:50:33,040 --> 00:50:35,600
Speaker 1: different viewpoints and they're you know, they're arguing about trying

891
00:50:35,600 --> 00:50:37,799
Speaker 1: to figure it out, and it's hard. And I wanted

892
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:39,360
Speaker 1: to ask you about this parents to think, you know,

893
00:50:39,400 --> 00:50:42,799
Speaker 1: you've both lived incredibly successful life. You went to the

894
00:50:42,840 --> 00:50:45,359
Speaker 1: best schools in the country. You know, you went on

895
00:50:45,400 --> 00:50:48,360
Speaker 1: to pivot and have an amazing career in your passion

896
00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:50,759
Speaker 1: of basketball. Like to even be able to do that

897
00:50:51,040 --> 00:50:53,919
Speaker 1: as a coach is incredible. Great right to be able

898
00:50:53,960 --> 00:50:56,560
Speaker 1: to pivot, which I'm sure took sacrifice and stress, And

899
00:50:56,600 --> 00:50:58,799
Speaker 1: I want to link it to parenting and of course

900
00:50:58,840 --> 00:51:01,480
Speaker 1: Michelle going to the White House raising kids while you're

901
00:51:01,520 --> 00:51:05,239
Speaker 1: at the White House, leaving them continuing, how did you

902
00:51:05,880 --> 00:51:11,799
Speaker 1: put parenting as a priority despite prioritizing your passion, prioritizing

903
00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:16,239
Speaker 1: the country and service, prioritizing your own marriages. Like I

904
00:51:16,239 --> 00:51:18,919
Speaker 1: feel like there's so much pressure on parents. We just said,

905
00:51:18,920 --> 00:51:21,160
Speaker 1: we can't rely on school, we can't rely on the government,

906
00:51:21,320 --> 00:51:23,600
Speaker 1: can't realize So that means it's all in this person.

907
00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:26,600
Speaker 1: How does a parent take that pressure in a way

908
00:51:26,680 --> 00:51:31,560
Speaker 1: that uplifts them and allows them to pursue their greatness too,

909
00:51:31,760 --> 00:51:34,839
Speaker 1: rather than feel completely paralyzed by it.

910
00:51:34,920 --> 00:51:39,200
Speaker 3: The first thing that comes to my mind is that,

911
00:51:40,160 --> 00:51:43,520
Speaker 3: as Meche said, we were so blessed to have such

912
00:51:43,560 --> 00:51:49,320
Speaker 3: good parents. I feel obligated to be a great parent

913
00:51:50,120 --> 00:51:52,360
Speaker 3: as a tribute to my own parents.

914
00:51:52,440 --> 00:51:54,640
Speaker 2: Well, you also know what a great parent looks like.

915
00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:56,839
Speaker 3: I do know what a great parent looks like. But

916
00:51:56,880 --> 00:52:02,439
Speaker 3: I also am so thankful for the sacrifices that they

917
00:52:02,560 --> 00:52:05,720
Speaker 3: made so that we could thrive.

918
00:52:06,320 --> 00:52:08,480
Speaker 4: And it makes sense.

919
00:52:09,640 --> 00:52:17,000
Speaker 3: And irrespective of whatever my passion is, which is basketball

920
00:52:17,360 --> 00:52:25,399
Speaker 3: or coaching or mentoring, the first responsibility I have are

921
00:52:25,440 --> 00:52:28,400
Speaker 3: to the four kids that I brought into this world.

922
00:52:28,760 --> 00:52:31,799
Speaker 3: And that's an easy one jay for me to do.

923
00:52:31,920 --> 00:52:36,080
Speaker 3: So if I had to sacrifice my passion for my kids,

924
00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:42,080
Speaker 3: I would have Fortunately, coaching is a terrific environment to

925
00:52:42,200 --> 00:52:47,319
Speaker 3: raise kids because you're around other young people, and it

926
00:52:47,520 --> 00:52:51,400
Speaker 3: really is like having fifteen kids instead of just four.

927
00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:56,439
Speaker 3: I would say there is a discipline that comes with it,

928
00:52:57,560 --> 00:53:01,279
Speaker 3: and you talked about this being aligned. We call it

929
00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:06,640
Speaker 3: united front in our house. No matter what we're thinking,

930
00:53:07,080 --> 00:53:09,360
Speaker 3: we are going to come to an agreement when it

931
00:53:09,400 --> 00:53:11,840
Speaker 3: comes to all right, let's give some advice to this kids.

932
00:53:12,200 --> 00:53:13,240
Speaker 4: This is the advice.

933
00:53:13,600 --> 00:53:17,799
Speaker 3: Sometimes it's what Kelly wants and sometimes it's what I.

934
00:53:17,920 --> 00:53:19,400
Speaker 4: Want my wife Kelly.

935
00:53:19,960 --> 00:53:25,840
Speaker 3: So there's a coordinated communication, there's discipline, and then most

936
00:53:25,880 --> 00:53:29,960
Speaker 3: of all, and I think I hear the word me

937
00:53:30,160 --> 00:53:33,480
Speaker 3: time and parents of these young parents. You know, my

938
00:53:33,600 --> 00:53:36,759
Speaker 3: parents never talked about me time. Their me time was

939
00:53:36,840 --> 00:53:41,200
Speaker 3: our time. And I know from a mental health standpoint,

940
00:53:41,480 --> 00:53:44,400
Speaker 3: we all need to get away and be on our own.

941
00:53:44,880 --> 00:53:47,239
Speaker 3: But I would do that after I made sure my

942
00:53:47,360 --> 00:53:51,920
Speaker 3: kids were solidly on good footing, before I was worried

943
00:53:51,960 --> 00:53:54,640
Speaker 3: about I need a vacation with my boys to go

944
00:53:54,680 --> 00:53:59,560
Speaker 3: to Vegas. And I just saw my dad and you

945
00:53:59,600 --> 00:54:02,640
Speaker 3: talked to about it. He was a shift worker for

946
00:54:02,719 --> 00:54:06,280
Speaker 3: the City of Chicago, but he made time no matter

947
00:54:06,760 --> 00:54:10,799
Speaker 3: what shift he was on to attend our events, to

948
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:14,959
Speaker 3: play with us when he got home, no matter how tired.

949
00:54:14,640 --> 00:54:17,880
Speaker 4: He was, he made us the priority.

950
00:54:18,040 --> 00:54:21,160
Speaker 3: So it's not hard work for It doesn't feel like

951
00:54:21,239 --> 00:54:24,799
Speaker 3: it's hard work for me and for us. We just

952
00:54:25,239 --> 00:54:30,040
Speaker 3: had really good role models and we were well coached

953
00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:30,719
Speaker 3: in parenting.

954
00:54:31,120 --> 00:54:33,440
Speaker 2: Well, when you think of talk about the pressure, I

955
00:54:33,560 --> 00:54:37,920
Speaker 2: do think that these days parents feel a lot of pressure.

956
00:54:37,960 --> 00:54:42,640
Speaker 2: But we're like taking on the wrong pressure. Like we

957
00:54:42,840 --> 00:54:48,120
Speaker 2: feel responsible for our kids' happiness and success, right, so

958
00:54:48,440 --> 00:54:53,280
Speaker 2: we put a lot of pressure on making sure they achieve,

959
00:54:54,040 --> 00:54:57,719
Speaker 2: like making sure they don't fail, making sure they don't

960
00:54:57,760 --> 00:55:01,360
Speaker 2: feel bad or they don't experience disc appointments. So a

961
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:04,960
Speaker 2: lot of that emotional energy we're taking on is in

962
00:55:05,000 --> 00:55:09,400
Speaker 2: my view, it's misdirected and it takes a lot of energy.

963
00:55:09,520 --> 00:55:13,360
Speaker 2: If you think that you're responsible for your kids to

964
00:55:13,640 --> 00:55:18,440
Speaker 2: happiness right, and it's it's a whole lot of energy

965
00:55:18,520 --> 00:55:21,600
Speaker 2: if you think your kids should always be happy. I

966
00:55:21,600 --> 00:55:28,399
Speaker 2: mean that's a current parenting generational angst. Like no generations

967
00:55:28,480 --> 00:55:33,400
Speaker 2: before us, you know, cared about whether their kids were happy,

968
00:55:34,280 --> 00:55:37,560
Speaker 2: let alone being responsible for your happiness or that you

969
00:55:37,600 --> 00:55:41,640
Speaker 2: should be happy all the time. It feels like that's

970
00:55:41,680 --> 00:55:45,400
Speaker 2: a new phenomenon, right, you know. I mean we just

971
00:55:45,480 --> 00:55:47,919
Speaker 2: think of all the work that we do to keep

972
00:55:47,960 --> 00:55:50,959
Speaker 2: our kids busy and you know, engage, and we sign

973
00:55:50,960 --> 00:55:52,560
Speaker 2: them up for this and sign them up for that,

974
00:55:52,840 --> 00:55:55,000
Speaker 2: and you know, we're taking them here and we're taking

975
00:55:55,000 --> 00:55:57,640
Speaker 2: them there instead of just going go. Maybe you're going

976
00:55:57,719 --> 00:56:01,399
Speaker 2: to be bored today. You know, what are we doing

977
00:56:01,440 --> 00:56:04,240
Speaker 2: on Saturday? Mom? When I was growing up, the answer

978
00:56:04,360 --> 00:56:07,880
Speaker 2: was nothing, you know, and my mother went on with

979
00:56:08,000 --> 00:56:11,600
Speaker 2: her day. You know, we're kind of taking on a

980
00:56:11,680 --> 00:56:14,920
Speaker 2: lot of that. My mom always said that I am

981
00:56:15,160 --> 00:56:21,200
Speaker 2: going to help you own your life as early as possible,

982
00:56:21,960 --> 00:56:26,359
Speaker 2: so you know, so that it's not my life. It's

983
00:56:26,400 --> 00:56:29,520
Speaker 2: not my failure, it's not my homework, it's not my

984
00:56:30,000 --> 00:56:33,880
Speaker 2: going to school, it's yours. And when you start giving

985
00:56:33,920 --> 00:56:36,279
Speaker 2: your kids their lives early, which means you got to

986
00:56:36,360 --> 00:56:39,719
Speaker 2: let go, there's a worry in that. But if you

987
00:56:39,800 --> 00:56:42,319
Speaker 2: start letting go, it's like you got to wake yourself up.

988
00:56:42,320 --> 00:56:44,440
Speaker 2: You gotta make your bed, you gotta wash your plate,

989
00:56:44,600 --> 00:56:46,680
Speaker 2: you can get to school, you can figure it out.

990
00:56:46,880 --> 00:56:49,480
Speaker 2: You got to figure it out. And I think these

991
00:56:49,560 --> 00:56:53,160
Speaker 2: days parents don't want to. They don't want that process

992
00:56:53,280 --> 00:56:56,560
Speaker 2: of watching their kids figure it out. And I get it.

993
00:56:56,560 --> 00:56:59,719
Speaker 2: It is hard to watch the person that you love

994
00:57:00,560 --> 00:57:05,160
Speaker 2: literally walk into a wall that you see, you know,

995
00:57:05,920 --> 00:57:09,080
Speaker 2: because our instinct as parents go besweety, no, no, no,

996
00:57:09,640 --> 00:57:13,320
Speaker 2: you were walking right into a wall. Let me stop

997
00:57:13,360 --> 00:57:15,880
Speaker 2: you and sit you here and be safe with me.

998
00:57:16,320 --> 00:57:19,600
Speaker 2: Now I feel better, right, And the truth is is

999
00:57:19,680 --> 00:57:24,240
Speaker 2: that sometimes, at least I've learned with my kids, they

1000
00:57:24,240 --> 00:57:27,479
Speaker 2: have to walk into that wall, they have to bump

1001
00:57:27,560 --> 00:57:30,960
Speaker 2: their head hard, and it hurts me to see it.

1002
00:57:31,480 --> 00:57:34,360
Speaker 2: But I found that they learn faster that way than

1003
00:57:34,440 --> 00:57:38,920
Speaker 2: me keeping them from bumping their heads, and there's a

1004
00:57:38,960 --> 00:57:42,040
Speaker 2: release with that. It's like it's a different kind of

1005
00:57:42,080 --> 00:57:45,800
Speaker 2: difficult thing that you're dealing with, right, You're dealing with

1006
00:57:45,840 --> 00:57:49,720
Speaker 2: your own emotions and watching somebody that you care about

1007
00:57:49,800 --> 00:57:53,560
Speaker 2: go through tough stuff. But there's no other way to

1008
00:57:53,640 --> 00:57:58,560
Speaker 2: get them to be independent other than dealing with that pain. Right.

1009
00:57:59,160 --> 00:58:01,520
Speaker 2: And I always say, as I told Barack, I was like,

1010
00:58:01,720 --> 00:58:05,840
Speaker 2: you know, we either do this stuff early and deal

1011
00:58:05,840 --> 00:58:08,840
Speaker 2: with it, have these hard kind of conversations, deal with

1012
00:58:08,880 --> 00:58:13,000
Speaker 2: these mistakes and failures when they're ten and five and thirteen.

1013
00:58:13,920 --> 00:58:17,480
Speaker 2: Then rather than having them live in our basement at

1014
00:58:17,520 --> 00:58:21,240
Speaker 2: thirty five for the rest of their lives. It's like,

1015
00:58:21,280 --> 00:58:24,160
Speaker 2: I don't want a kid in my basement. So I've

1016
00:58:24,200 --> 00:58:28,280
Speaker 2: been Our parents parented us not to be in their basement.

1017
00:58:28,960 --> 00:58:32,120
Speaker 2: You pay your bills, you handle your business. That's our model.

1018
00:58:32,240 --> 00:58:36,160
Speaker 2: Are you handling your business? That's a certain kind of parenting.

1019
00:58:36,160 --> 00:58:39,240
Speaker 2: But if you make that investment early, you know, if

1020
00:58:39,240 --> 00:58:41,320
Speaker 2: you do the hard things, if you make your kids

1021
00:58:41,320 --> 00:58:43,640
Speaker 2: sleep in their bed, if you tell them no when

1022
00:58:43,640 --> 00:58:47,040
Speaker 2: they're five, if you teach them boundaries and don't let

1023
00:58:47,120 --> 00:58:51,520
Speaker 2: them talk back and help them be socialized beings by

1024
00:58:52,040 --> 00:58:55,919
Speaker 2: setting forth some real hard to manage boundaries at three

1025
00:58:56,120 --> 00:58:59,200
Speaker 2: and four and five, you're not even dealing with a

1026
00:58:59,200 --> 00:59:04,000
Speaker 2: lot of these issues at sixteen because they've practiced something

1027
00:59:04,000 --> 00:59:09,240
Speaker 2: else in your presence. And so now sixteen twenty, our

1028
00:59:09,280 --> 00:59:11,960
Speaker 2: girls are All of our kids are joys to be with.

1029
00:59:12,520 --> 00:59:14,920
Speaker 2: They all live on their own. Our kids have an

1030
00:59:14,920 --> 00:59:17,600
Speaker 2: Obama tax that we will continue to pay just to

1031
00:59:18,040 --> 00:59:20,520
Speaker 2: cost on their life that is not their own. So

1032
00:59:20,560 --> 00:59:23,160
Speaker 2: there's certain places that they cannot live, where they can

1033
00:59:23,200 --> 00:59:26,320
Speaker 2: afford to live. There's certain things like that. But all

1034
00:59:26,360 --> 00:59:30,400
Speaker 2: of our kids, they don't want our help because they

1035
00:59:30,560 --> 00:59:34,919
Speaker 2: get gratification in saying they did this, and that comes

1036
00:59:34,960 --> 00:59:37,400
Speaker 2: down to choosing the college that they're going to go to.

1037
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:40,880
Speaker 2: I may not agree with you, it happened. It's like,

1038
00:59:40,920 --> 00:59:43,880
Speaker 2: I don't think you're gonna like that school, but it's

1039
00:59:44,000 --> 00:59:47,080
Speaker 2: got to be your choice. You know, I don't think

1040
00:59:47,080 --> 00:59:50,600
Speaker 2: you're going to like that girlfriend, it's got to be

1041
00:59:50,720 --> 00:59:53,440
Speaker 2: your choice. I gotta look the other way. I gotta

1042
00:59:53,520 --> 00:59:55,880
Speaker 2: and then I've got to be there with you after

1043
00:59:55,920 --> 00:59:59,600
Speaker 2: you make that mistake, going it's okay, let's talk about it,

1044
01:00:00,120 --> 01:00:03,960
Speaker 2: you learn, let's you know. But I my mother was

1045
01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:07,400
Speaker 2: staying out of our lives very early in our lives,

1046
01:00:08,440 --> 01:00:11,440
Speaker 2: and I think that's something that makes parenting easy in

1047
01:00:11,480 --> 01:00:14,600
Speaker 2: one way but emotionally difficult in another way.

1048
01:00:14,840 --> 01:00:19,479
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, and I really really appreciate the clarification of

1049
01:00:20,160 --> 01:00:24,520
Speaker 1: reprioritizing that pressure, because the pressure we're placing, as you said,

1050
01:00:24,520 --> 01:00:29,240
Speaker 1: on the winning, the succeeding, the it's almost misplaced. There's

1051
01:00:29,280 --> 01:00:33,040
Speaker 1: a distinction that I'm hearing from both of you in

1052
01:00:33,880 --> 01:00:39,840
Speaker 1: coddling an individual and cultivating independence. And when we think

1053
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:44,280
Speaker 1: of more love or more support, we think fix solve

1054
01:00:44,800 --> 01:00:48,640
Speaker 1: control is done right. That's what we think love is.

1055
01:00:48,720 --> 01:00:51,720
Speaker 1: We think love means you have no problems. We took

1056
01:00:51,760 --> 01:00:55,640
Speaker 1: care of everything, and we're here for everything that you need.

1057
01:00:56,360 --> 01:00:59,920
Speaker 1: And actually, what we've realized is love is setting someone

1058
01:01:00,520 --> 01:01:06,120
Speaker 1: up to carry themselves exactly and fix themselves instead of themselves.

1059
01:01:05,760 --> 01:01:09,120
Speaker 2: And feeling the confidence in being able to do that.

1060
01:01:09,200 --> 01:01:15,000
Speaker 2: They competence is love too. And you know, I always

1061
01:01:15,040 --> 01:01:19,440
Speaker 2: want my kids to know that I do trust that

1062
01:01:19,560 --> 01:01:22,240
Speaker 2: you have good sense. I do you can do this,

1063
01:01:22,800 --> 01:01:25,400
Speaker 2: Watch you do it, and just see how kids light

1064
01:01:25,520 --> 01:01:28,800
Speaker 2: up when they accomplish something on their own. And when

1065
01:01:28,840 --> 01:01:32,680
Speaker 2: you're if you're the fixer, you're robbing your kids of

1066
01:01:32,680 --> 01:01:37,360
Speaker 2: that sense of self satisfaction. I fail, It hurt, but

1067
01:01:37,520 --> 01:01:40,720
Speaker 2: it was me. But when I succeed, it's also me

1068
01:01:41,520 --> 01:01:44,600
Speaker 2: and sometimes you know it's parents. We want that victory.

1069
01:01:45,160 --> 01:01:46,840
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's what I was going to say.

1070
01:01:47,400 --> 01:01:50,880
Speaker 3: Mish does a good job talking about how people don't

1071
01:01:51,000 --> 01:01:55,960
Speaker 3: like friction, and sometimes you need friction as a parent,

1072
01:01:56,800 --> 01:02:01,439
Speaker 3: especially those who are doing the coddle. They're doing that

1073
01:02:01,560 --> 01:02:05,360
Speaker 3: for themselves. You are not helping your kid by doing it,

1074
01:02:05,520 --> 01:02:11,680
Speaker 3: because parenting this way is hard and it causes friction

1075
01:02:11,880 --> 01:02:14,760
Speaker 3: in your inside. When we say okay, you can take

1076
01:02:14,800 --> 01:02:17,960
Speaker 3: your scooter to the store and go pick up some

1077
01:02:18,000 --> 01:02:19,040
Speaker 3: stuff and bring it back.

1078
01:02:19,360 --> 01:02:20,000
Speaker 4: That's hard.

1079
01:02:20,120 --> 01:02:22,320
Speaker 3: It would have been easy for me to take you

1080
01:02:22,400 --> 01:02:25,200
Speaker 3: to the store and make sure you got back in

1081
01:02:25,280 --> 01:02:30,920
Speaker 3: the car. And nothing made me feel better about doing

1082
01:02:30,960 --> 01:02:33,280
Speaker 3: this kind of stuff was when I found out that

1083
01:02:33,360 --> 01:02:37,840
Speaker 3: our parents were deathly afraid of us traveling on our own.

1084
01:02:38,440 --> 01:02:41,720
Speaker 3: Mish had an opportunity to go to France. I played

1085
01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:44,360
Speaker 3: bitty basketball, and there was a trip to Kansas City

1086
01:02:44,440 --> 01:02:47,320
Speaker 3: and to New Orleans, and we came to find out

1087
01:02:47,400 --> 01:02:51,880
Speaker 3: later that our parents were fearful of us going on

1088
01:02:51,920 --> 01:02:54,920
Speaker 3: these but they we talked about the same reasons we

1089
01:02:54,960 --> 01:02:57,600
Speaker 3: talked about, but they did it anyway because they knew

1090
01:02:57,800 --> 01:03:01,520
Speaker 3: it was important for our development. And I just thinking

1091
01:03:01,560 --> 01:03:06,480
Speaker 3: about the adjita in their stomachs, ex when they're letting

1092
01:03:06,600 --> 01:03:07,640
Speaker 3: go of you.

1093
01:03:07,560 --> 01:03:10,480
Speaker 4: Know, your kids are leaving town and doing things they

1094
01:03:10,520 --> 01:03:11,000
Speaker 4: never did.

1095
01:03:11,320 --> 01:03:13,400
Speaker 2: They never did, They never got to travel when they

1096
01:03:13,400 --> 01:03:15,640
Speaker 2: were young. They didn't have the resources, they didn't go

1097
01:03:15,640 --> 01:03:18,640
Speaker 2: to college, they didn't go off their block, out of

1098
01:03:18,680 --> 01:03:23,120
Speaker 2: their neighborhoods. You know, So imagine the fear of sending

1099
01:03:23,120 --> 01:03:26,800
Speaker 2: your kids to do something going out Princeton, you know,

1100
01:03:27,000 --> 01:03:28,840
Speaker 2: the day they let him leave to go to some

1101
01:03:29,120 --> 01:03:33,080
Speaker 2: school in some place where they knew nothing about the rituals,

1102
01:03:33,240 --> 01:03:38,439
Speaker 2: the prestige, you know, the kind of confidence in your

1103
01:03:38,760 --> 01:03:42,600
Speaker 2: parenting philosophy that it would take to execute that. When

1104
01:03:42,600 --> 01:03:45,640
Speaker 2: we were growing up in a community where people's parents

1105
01:03:45,680 --> 01:03:49,520
Speaker 2: wouldn't even fill out their fasciforms because they were afraid

1106
01:03:49,520 --> 01:03:52,240
Speaker 2: of their kids going to college. So they held on

1107
01:03:52,360 --> 01:03:55,360
Speaker 2: to their kids. They said, go to the state school

1108
01:03:55,400 --> 01:03:57,840
Speaker 2: down the street because it will make me, deep down,

1109
01:03:57,840 --> 01:04:00,200
Speaker 2: it will make me feel better because I don't don't

1110
01:04:00,200 --> 01:04:03,000
Speaker 2: want to let you go. Don't go out of state,

1111
01:04:03,160 --> 01:04:06,280
Speaker 2: don't leave the home, don't go out of the neighborhood.

1112
01:04:06,680 --> 01:04:10,240
Speaker 2: A lot of parents parent out of fear, and it's

1113
01:04:10,240 --> 01:04:13,600
Speaker 2: fear for themselves. It's real fear, for sure, you know.

1114
01:04:13,800 --> 01:04:16,360
Speaker 2: Do not get me wrong. It is the hardest thing

1115
01:04:16,440 --> 01:04:19,960
Speaker 2: to do, which is what makes parenting so hard, which

1116
01:04:20,000 --> 01:04:23,240
Speaker 2: is why people really have to think before they bring

1117
01:04:23,320 --> 01:04:27,360
Speaker 2: kids into the world, because it's hard. It's hard in

1118
01:04:27,800 --> 01:04:31,080
Speaker 2: some really obvious reasons, and it's hard in some ways

1119
01:04:31,120 --> 01:04:35,200
Speaker 2: that you will never understand until that that little person

1120
01:04:35,960 --> 01:04:39,240
Speaker 2: is breathing in this world. How they will make you feel.

1121
01:04:39,400 --> 01:04:43,760
Speaker 2: You will love nothing more. So I understand it, but

1122
01:04:43,840 --> 01:04:45,760
Speaker 2: that's why we get a lot of it wrong because

1123
01:04:45,800 --> 01:04:47,960
Speaker 2: we're operating out of fear. Sometimes.

1124
01:04:48,240 --> 01:04:50,480
Speaker 1: We've talked a lot about the differences in how you

1125
01:04:50,520 --> 01:04:53,280
Speaker 1: were parented, how things have changed, and I feel like

1126
01:04:53,920 --> 01:04:56,440
Speaker 1: one of the biggest talking points of today for parents

1127
01:04:56,480 --> 01:05:00,240
Speaker 1: and children is therapy. Like therapy seems to be a

1128
01:05:00,280 --> 01:05:03,360
Speaker 1: conversation that's opened up that a previous generation either didn't

1129
01:05:03,360 --> 01:05:07,480
Speaker 1: have access to, didn't believe in, couldn't afford, didn't value,

1130
01:05:07,520 --> 01:05:10,840
Speaker 1: which some of those challenges still exist today with affordability

1131
01:05:10,840 --> 01:05:14,360
Speaker 1: and accessibility. But what have been your personal journeys with

1132
01:05:15,080 --> 01:05:19,080
Speaker 1: therapy as a form of working on your own self

1133
01:05:19,120 --> 01:05:20,640
Speaker 1: and then of course your children as well.

1134
01:05:21,160 --> 01:05:25,560
Speaker 3: I would say I was your typical guy when it

1135
01:05:25,600 --> 01:05:30,920
Speaker 3: came to therapy, and typical guy of color, because I

1136
01:05:31,080 --> 01:05:36,160
Speaker 3: wasn't exposed to therapy until I got to college and

1137
01:05:36,200 --> 01:05:39,440
Speaker 3: I found out that kids my age were going to

1138
01:05:39,560 --> 01:05:43,920
Speaker 3: therapy and I was like, well, what is going on

1139
01:05:44,040 --> 01:05:45,000
Speaker 3: in that head?

1140
01:05:45,160 --> 01:05:49,480
Speaker 4: Because I didn't understand it. Now you jump ahead.

1141
01:05:50,040 --> 01:05:53,240
Speaker 3: In my first marriage, that was when it hit, when

1142
01:05:53,280 --> 01:05:56,280
Speaker 3: it started to have trouble. We would go to couple's

1143
01:05:56,320 --> 01:05:58,360
Speaker 3: therapy and then I would go to therapy.

1144
01:05:58,040 --> 01:05:58,720
Speaker 4: On my own.

1145
01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:03,280
Speaker 3: And I really that my last statement about not knowing

1146
01:06:03,320 --> 01:06:06,840
Speaker 3: what therapy was and not doing it, I just did

1147
01:06:06,880 --> 01:06:11,320
Speaker 3: it in a different way. My therapy was the barbershop.

1148
01:06:11,720 --> 01:06:14,200
Speaker 3: It wasn't church for me because I wasn't a church goer.

1149
01:06:14,240 --> 01:06:17,600
Speaker 3: But for some people it's church. But for me, it

1150
01:06:17,760 --> 01:06:22,800
Speaker 3: is fellowship with my good friends that I can tell

1151
01:06:22,920 --> 01:06:27,160
Speaker 3: stuff to. But I wasn't a real therapy guy until

1152
01:06:27,200 --> 01:06:31,520
Speaker 3: I had trouble in my first marriage. But I'm happy

1153
01:06:31,560 --> 01:06:36,600
Speaker 3: to say that my two older children are regular therapy goers.

1154
01:06:36,720 --> 01:06:39,080
Speaker 3: And it just warms my heart because it wasn't like

1155
01:06:39,120 --> 01:06:41,080
Speaker 3: I said, you know, you guys should go to therapy.

1156
01:06:41,240 --> 01:06:43,920
Speaker 4: They just kind of did it on themselves. So I

1157
01:06:44,000 --> 01:06:45,880
Speaker 4: am a big believer in it.

1158
01:06:46,800 --> 01:06:49,720
Speaker 3: And I'm sure people have used this analogy before, but

1159
01:06:50,400 --> 01:06:53,360
Speaker 3: we tune up just about everything in our lives.

1160
01:06:53,640 --> 01:06:53,920
Speaker 4: You know.

1161
01:06:54,000 --> 01:06:57,160
Speaker 3: We tune up our cars, we tune up our electronics,

1162
01:06:57,600 --> 01:07:00,920
Speaker 3: but we don't tune up our minds and our emotions.

1163
01:07:01,080 --> 01:07:05,280
Speaker 4: And we should. And I have to say that.

1164
01:07:05,440 --> 01:07:09,840
Speaker 3: You got into therapy, I think before I did, and

1165
01:07:10,440 --> 01:07:12,840
Speaker 3: that kind of opened my eyes to it too, even

1166
01:07:12,880 --> 01:07:15,240
Speaker 3: before I was having trouble in my marriage.

1167
01:07:15,680 --> 01:07:18,880
Speaker 4: So you can share share your experience.

1168
01:07:18,840 --> 01:07:22,600
Speaker 2: Now, I believe in all the therapies that Craig just outlined.

1169
01:07:22,640 --> 01:07:26,600
Speaker 2: I believe in the friendship therapy. I believe in the

1170
01:07:26,640 --> 01:07:32,560
Speaker 2: power of sharing your challenges with other people that you trust,

1171
01:07:33,000 --> 01:07:35,640
Speaker 2: and that can come in many forms, and it has

1172
01:07:35,680 --> 01:07:39,080
Speaker 2: for me. I am a talker and I think you know,

1173
01:07:40,000 --> 01:07:43,920
Speaker 2: our family was you know, our first therapy was the

1174
01:07:44,000 --> 01:07:48,960
Speaker 2: kitchen table right right, and our first therapists were our

1175
01:07:49,000 --> 01:07:52,360
Speaker 2: parents and our family members. Because you'd have an experience

1176
01:07:52,760 --> 01:07:55,160
Speaker 2: that you needed to it's something you needed to let

1177
01:07:55,160 --> 01:07:57,440
Speaker 2: off your chest, something you had to let go of.

1178
01:07:58,160 --> 01:08:01,080
Speaker 2: And we have parents that create did a safe space

1179
01:08:01,200 --> 01:08:04,960
Speaker 2: to speak openly and honestly. They didn't treat us like

1180
01:08:05,120 --> 01:08:08,920
Speaker 2: children at that table. They treated us like thinking beings.

1181
01:08:09,440 --> 01:08:12,760
Speaker 2: So it was very early on that we learned the

1182
01:08:12,840 --> 01:08:16,720
Speaker 2: power of our own thoughts and to trust our own emotions.

1183
01:08:16,800 --> 01:08:19,959
Speaker 2: And with something felt off, you know, we were encouraged

1184
01:08:20,000 --> 01:08:22,679
Speaker 2: as like, no, you're not crazy, you're seeing what you're seeing,

1185
01:08:22,720 --> 01:08:25,720
Speaker 2: and yeah, you're angry, that anger is real, but you

1186
01:08:25,800 --> 01:08:27,360
Speaker 2: can't show it this way.

1187
01:08:27,439 --> 01:08:27,640
Speaker 4: You know.

1188
01:08:27,720 --> 01:08:31,960
Speaker 2: We were validated at our table, and that's what therapy is.

1189
01:08:32,000 --> 01:08:36,960
Speaker 2: It's a validation, and so very early on, I sought

1190
01:08:36,960 --> 01:08:40,040
Speaker 2: out the company of girlfriends, friends I could trust and

1191
01:08:40,040 --> 01:08:42,519
Speaker 2: that we could talk to and we could have that

1192
01:08:42,640 --> 01:08:47,320
Speaker 2: validation and present honestly. And as I said in my

1193
01:08:47,400 --> 01:08:51,160
Speaker 2: book The Light, you know, I cultivated those tables throughout

1194
01:08:51,200 --> 01:08:54,120
Speaker 2: my life. You know I had that those table. I

1195
01:08:54,160 --> 01:08:57,080
Speaker 2: needed that table in college when I was we were

1196
01:08:57,280 --> 01:09:00,559
Speaker 2: one of a few black kids on an all white

1197
01:09:00,600 --> 01:09:04,920
Speaker 2: Ivy League school campus. We needed a safe place to go,

1198
01:09:05,000 --> 01:09:08,559
Speaker 2: which might have been the Third World Center, right where

1199
01:09:08,840 --> 01:09:13,200
Speaker 2: minority students gathered. I found a mentor in an older

1200
01:09:13,320 --> 01:09:19,920
Speaker 2: administrator who was my confidant during those days, small mini sessions.

1201
01:09:20,040 --> 01:09:22,960
Speaker 2: Right then, when I got married and started having kids,

1202
01:09:23,040 --> 01:09:27,559
Speaker 2: I built this amazing community. We built together, this amazing

1203
01:09:27,600 --> 01:09:31,880
Speaker 2: community of moms parenting young, young kids and babies. And

1204
01:09:32,240 --> 01:09:35,760
Speaker 2: we started getting together every Saturday, taking our kids to

1205
01:09:35,880 --> 01:09:39,400
Speaker 2: all the activities, but sitting around, maybe opening a bottle

1206
01:09:39,439 --> 01:09:43,360
Speaker 2: of champagne and shedding our feelings and our fears and

1207
01:09:43,439 --> 01:09:49,120
Speaker 2: exchanging ideas. But I've also been to a formal therapist because,

1208
01:09:49,320 --> 01:09:52,519
Speaker 2: as Craig said, I think we need to be coached

1209
01:09:52,720 --> 01:09:55,320
Speaker 2: throughout our lives, and I think therapy is a form

1210
01:09:55,360 --> 01:09:58,840
Speaker 2: of coaching where somebody objective can come in and say,

1211
01:09:58,880 --> 01:10:02,160
Speaker 2: have you thought about this? Yes, this way, you're entering

1212
01:10:02,200 --> 01:10:05,519
Speaker 2: a new phase of life. How are you thinking about it?

1213
01:10:05,680 --> 01:10:08,360
Speaker 2: Having somebody that has a skill set to help you

1214
01:10:08,439 --> 01:10:11,479
Speaker 2: shape a paradigm. I fully believe in that. I believe

1215
01:10:11,520 --> 01:10:14,880
Speaker 2: in couples therapy. I believe I believe in it all.

1216
01:10:15,720 --> 01:10:18,759
Speaker 2: Whatever works for you. And at this you know, phase

1217
01:10:18,800 --> 01:10:23,120
Speaker 2: of my life, I'm in therapy right now because I'm transitioning.

1218
01:10:23,640 --> 01:10:27,240
Speaker 2: You know, I'm sixty years old. I've finished a really

1219
01:10:27,280 --> 01:10:30,760
Speaker 2: hard thing in my life with my family intact, I'm

1220
01:10:30,800 --> 01:10:34,600
Speaker 2: an empty nester. My girls are in you know, they've

1221
01:10:34,720 --> 01:10:37,800
Speaker 2: been launched. And now for the first time, as I've

1222
01:10:37,840 --> 01:10:41,960
Speaker 2: said before, every choice that I'm making is completely mine.

1223
01:10:42,520 --> 01:10:45,240
Speaker 2: I now don't have the excuse of, well, my kids

1224
01:10:45,280 --> 01:10:47,719
Speaker 2: need this, or my husband needs that, or the country

1225
01:10:47,760 --> 01:10:52,320
Speaker 2: needs that. So how do I think about this next phase?

1226
01:10:52,520 --> 01:10:55,439
Speaker 2: And let me get some help. Let me unwind some

1227
01:10:55,640 --> 01:10:59,720
Speaker 2: old habits, let me sort through some old guilt that

1228
01:10:59,760 --> 01:11:03,479
Speaker 2: I've been carrying around. Let me talk about how my

1229
01:11:03,560 --> 01:11:07,519
Speaker 2: relationship with my mother has affected how I think about things.

1230
01:11:08,000 --> 01:11:11,240
Speaker 2: So I'm getting that tune up for this next phase.

1231
01:11:11,320 --> 01:11:13,840
Speaker 2: Because I believe this is a whole nother phase in

1232
01:11:13,920 --> 01:11:17,040
Speaker 2: life for me, and I now have the wisdom to

1233
01:11:17,080 --> 01:11:20,160
Speaker 2: know let me let me go get some coaching while

1234
01:11:20,160 --> 01:11:23,240
Speaker 2: I'm doing it, so I've got other voices other than

1235
01:11:23,280 --> 01:11:25,920
Speaker 2: people the people who know me best. I've got a

1236
01:11:25,960 --> 01:11:28,360
Speaker 2: new person that's getting to know me and seeing me

1237
01:11:28,760 --> 01:11:33,000
Speaker 2: completely new and hearing all these emotions. I am an

1238
01:11:33,080 --> 01:11:36,760
Speaker 2: advocate of it. Everybody needs to find their form of

1239
01:11:36,800 --> 01:11:40,000
Speaker 2: it the best way they can. For some people, it's

1240
01:11:40,120 --> 01:11:45,240
Speaker 2: podcasts like ours, you know, that are providing people with

1241
01:11:45,360 --> 01:11:48,040
Speaker 2: that therapy. And it's one of the reasons why I'm

1242
01:11:48,040 --> 01:11:52,639
Speaker 2: excited about doing these things, coming on yours and developing IMO,

1243
01:11:53,240 --> 01:11:55,680
Speaker 2: because I hope that maybe for the people who are

1244
01:11:55,680 --> 01:11:59,639
Speaker 2: a little bit skeptical of it, that these forms become

1245
01:11:59,680 --> 01:12:03,080
Speaker 2: the place where they start at least getting some ideas,

1246
01:12:03,360 --> 01:12:05,760
Speaker 2: you know, and thinking wow, I never thought of it

1247
01:12:05,760 --> 01:12:08,479
Speaker 2: that way. I never saw it that way. And maybe

1248
01:12:08,520 --> 01:12:10,720
Speaker 2: they'll never go to therapy, but they come here for

1249
01:12:10,800 --> 01:12:14,439
Speaker 2: ninety minutes and they, you know, they find some answers

1250
01:12:14,479 --> 01:12:17,240
Speaker 2: for themselves. I firmly believe in it.

1251
01:12:17,439 --> 01:12:19,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love what you were saying about needing them

1252
01:12:20,000 --> 01:12:26,320
Speaker 1: at transitions where shape shifting and molding, and it's almost

1253
01:12:26,360 --> 01:12:29,280
Speaker 1: like ever since someone graduates, if they went to college,

1254
01:12:29,400 --> 01:12:31,920
Speaker 1: it's like from that point on you just left to

1255
01:12:31,960 --> 01:12:34,679
Speaker 1: figure it out. And it's almost like they were these markers,

1256
01:12:34,720 --> 01:12:37,439
Speaker 1: Like when you went from elementary school to high school

1257
01:12:37,479 --> 01:12:40,960
Speaker 1: to college, there were markers, and there were transitions, and

1258
01:12:41,000 --> 01:12:43,960
Speaker 1: there were summers in between where you knew what was

1259
01:12:44,000 --> 01:12:47,320
Speaker 1: coming next. And then you become an adult and then

1260
01:12:47,720 --> 01:12:51,040
Speaker 1: now there's not really the well, there are the markers

1261
01:12:51,120 --> 01:12:53,640
Speaker 1: of get married, you have kids, you get to a

1262
01:12:53,680 --> 01:12:55,840
Speaker 1: career success or whatever it is, the kids leave, as

1263
01:12:55,840 --> 01:12:59,679
Speaker 1: you said, but there's no real transitionary summers anymore. There's

1264
01:12:59,720 --> 01:13:02,760
Speaker 1: not not everyone's talking to you about, hey, what's going on.

1265
01:13:02,840 --> 01:13:07,360
Speaker 1: And also there's less there's less formal training for those

1266
01:13:07,400 --> 01:13:12,799
Speaker 1: transitions that are so emotionally tough because you're you're almost

1267
01:13:12,880 --> 01:13:17,599
Speaker 1: grieving an identity you had, but then knowing there's a

1268
01:13:17,640 --> 01:13:21,000
Speaker 1: new version that exists, and that push and pull of

1269
01:13:21,240 --> 01:13:23,880
Speaker 1: do I stay or do I go in all of

1270
01:13:24,080 --> 01:13:27,240
Speaker 1: areas of your life. And I wonder, Michelle, from your

1271
01:13:27,280 --> 01:13:29,200
Speaker 1: perspective and then of course from yours as well, Craig,

1272
01:13:29,280 --> 01:13:31,760
Speaker 1: like and you mentioned their guilt, like I was like,

1273
01:13:31,840 --> 01:13:34,040
Speaker 1: what was the what is the guilt that you feel

1274
01:13:34,080 --> 01:13:37,040
Speaker 1: you you're having to learn to let go of or

1275
01:13:37,120 --> 01:13:39,120
Speaker 1: in the beautiful upbringing you had, like what were the

1276
01:13:39,160 --> 01:13:41,599
Speaker 1: things that you're like? But these are certain ideas that

1277
01:13:42,160 --> 01:13:45,160
Speaker 1: aren't serving us anymore or aren't helping to who.

1278
01:13:45,120 --> 01:13:50,320
Speaker 2: Much is given, much is expected. I feel incredibly blessed

1279
01:13:50,479 --> 01:13:54,360
Speaker 2: in this life, you know, And it's almost like knocking

1280
01:13:54,400 --> 01:13:57,919
Speaker 2: on wood. It's like, let me never take it for granted,

1281
01:13:58,080 --> 01:14:01,960
Speaker 2: let me always find ways of giving back. And so

1282
01:14:02,160 --> 01:14:05,479
Speaker 2: the guilt comes from am I doing enough? You know,

1283
01:14:05,640 --> 01:14:09,599
Speaker 2: which is a form of am I enough? Right? That's

1284
01:14:09,640 --> 01:14:13,679
Speaker 2: the guilt of feeling should I do this next thing?

1285
01:14:13,840 --> 01:14:16,559
Speaker 2: Should I say yes? When I say no, I mean

1286
01:14:16,560 --> 01:14:19,160
Speaker 2: because there's so many requests, there's so much you can

1287
01:14:19,320 --> 01:14:24,360
Speaker 2: possibly do in life that you could never stop. And

1288
01:14:24,439 --> 01:14:28,280
Speaker 2: I do hold guilt to tell somebody that is asking

1289
01:14:28,360 --> 01:14:32,320
Speaker 2: for help or need something to say I can't or

1290
01:14:32,439 --> 01:14:36,599
Speaker 2: I don't want to, you know, I need to even

1291
01:14:36,680 --> 01:14:41,080
Speaker 2: say those words. It's hard to I don't want to

1292
01:14:41,200 --> 01:14:47,760
Speaker 2: do that right now. It's like unpacking that right. So

1293
01:14:47,800 --> 01:14:51,960
Speaker 2: to say that too for me, Michelle Obama, to say

1294
01:14:51,960 --> 01:14:55,360
Speaker 2: that to a therapist, you know, I mean, my therapist

1295
01:14:55,400 --> 01:15:00,000
Speaker 2: is like, what you still think you haven't done it?

1296
01:15:00,400 --> 01:15:04,280
Speaker 2: And I was like, honestly, yeah, it's like so let's

1297
01:15:04,320 --> 01:15:09,920
Speaker 2: unpack that, right. So yeah, that's you know, that's probably

1298
01:15:10,040 --> 01:15:14,559
Speaker 2: what overachievers. We're all dealing with that in some way. Right,

1299
01:15:15,439 --> 01:15:19,040
Speaker 2: when's enough's enough? Where's the bar? Who sets it? We're

1300
01:15:19,120 --> 01:15:22,720
Speaker 2: setting it for ourselves, and we keep setting it so

1301
01:15:23,000 --> 01:15:28,280
Speaker 2: incredibly high right at all times, and then I'm thinking about, oh,

1302
01:15:28,400 --> 01:15:31,040
Speaker 2: what am I modeling for my girls? It's like at

1303
01:15:31,080 --> 01:15:34,920
Speaker 2: some point, you know, I used to say this to

1304
01:15:35,080 --> 01:15:38,639
Speaker 2: Rosalind Carter, you know, you the Carters. They were giving

1305
01:15:38,760 --> 01:15:42,200
Speaker 2: until they were you know, they couldn't walk, you know.

1306
01:15:42,800 --> 01:15:44,840
Speaker 2: And when I was in the White House, every year

1307
01:15:45,000 --> 01:15:47,639
Speaker 2: Rosalind Carter was set up a meeting, you know, because

1308
01:15:47,680 --> 01:15:49,439
Speaker 2: she want to talk to a set of issues and

1309
01:15:49,479 --> 01:15:52,160
Speaker 2: things she wanted to do and update me on everything.

1310
01:15:52,200 --> 01:15:54,280
Speaker 4: She was just she was just, she was she.

1311
01:15:54,360 --> 01:15:57,320
Speaker 2: They were those people constantly doing it. And I used

1312
01:15:57,320 --> 01:16:00,960
Speaker 2: to joke with her when she was in how must

1313
01:16:01,000 --> 01:16:03,320
Speaker 2: she have been when I'm in office? That requires math.

1314
01:16:03,400 --> 01:16:05,680
Speaker 2: So let's say she was in her early eighties or

1315
01:16:06,200 --> 01:16:09,320
Speaker 2: you know, she was an older woman who had done

1316
01:16:09,439 --> 01:16:11,680
Speaker 2: enough and I used to joke it's like, if you

1317
01:16:11,720 --> 01:16:16,920
Speaker 2: don't stop, because you're my bar, right, And I don't

1318
01:16:17,000 --> 01:16:19,800
Speaker 2: know that I want to be coming to the White

1319
01:16:19,840 --> 01:16:24,080
Speaker 2: House with an agenda list when I'm in my eighties, right.

1320
01:16:24,560 --> 01:16:26,599
Speaker 2: But then I realized it's like, well, that's her bar.

1321
01:16:28,080 --> 01:16:30,519
Speaker 2: That doesn't have to be my bar. What if my

1322
01:16:30,600 --> 01:16:36,120
Speaker 2: bar is different? And so now I'm practicing out some

1323
01:16:36,240 --> 01:16:40,439
Speaker 2: different bars for myself, right, some different limits, and seeing

1324
01:16:40,479 --> 01:16:43,479
Speaker 2: how I really feel in those limits rather than what

1325
01:16:43,600 --> 01:16:47,920
Speaker 2: I think I'm supposed to do. So you know, that's

1326
01:16:48,120 --> 01:16:51,479
Speaker 2: you know, it just makes me sigh just saying it,

1327
01:16:51,520 --> 01:16:54,519
Speaker 2: but that's how my brain works, and so sometimes you

1328
01:16:54,680 --> 01:16:57,919
Speaker 2: need help with right sizing your thinking.

1329
01:16:58,760 --> 01:17:02,439
Speaker 1: Thank you for sharing that being so open and vulnerable,

1330
01:17:02,439 --> 01:17:04,080
Speaker 1: because I know it takes a lot to be able

1331
01:17:04,120 --> 01:17:06,680
Speaker 1: to say what you're saying in therapy, to say it

1332
01:17:06,680 --> 01:17:08,320
Speaker 1: out loud, and I can see the emotion in your

1333
01:17:08,320 --> 01:17:10,680
Speaker 1: face that it's not you know, something you're grappling with,

1334
01:17:10,760 --> 01:17:12,960
Speaker 1: it's real. So you're working on it right now. And

1335
01:17:13,720 --> 01:17:15,600
Speaker 1: I hope that gives everyone who's listening. I know it

1336
01:17:15,640 --> 01:17:19,639
Speaker 1: will give everyone who's listening and watching courage to think, yeah,

1337
01:17:19,680 --> 01:17:23,240
Speaker 1: you know, like maybe I'm setting the boss too high

1338
01:17:23,320 --> 01:17:27,040
Speaker 1: for myself, you know whatever. That maybe or a different question,

1339
01:17:27,200 --> 01:17:29,200
Speaker 1: but thank you, Yeah, Craig.

1340
01:17:29,240 --> 01:17:34,479
Speaker 3: I'd love to No, no, no, that's I actually thought

1341
01:17:34,520 --> 01:17:36,479
Speaker 3: me she was going to touch on this a little earlier.

1342
01:17:37,080 --> 01:17:40,960
Speaker 3: But our mom whent and you've been so gracious to

1343
01:17:41,000 --> 01:17:45,519
Speaker 3: say nice things about us and our success and all

1344
01:17:45,560 --> 01:17:48,240
Speaker 3: the wonderful things that we've been able to do.

1345
01:17:49,479 --> 01:17:50,439
Speaker 4: Marian Robinson.

1346
01:17:50,479 --> 01:17:54,719
Speaker 3: Our mom used to say, my kids aren't any different

1347
01:17:54,720 --> 01:17:57,439
Speaker 3: from the kids they grew up with, and she is

1348
01:17:57,600 --> 01:18:02,120
Speaker 3: absolutely right. She would say, I was fortunate enough not

1349
01:18:02,240 --> 01:18:05,439
Speaker 3: to have to go to work, and we encourage them

1350
01:18:05,479 --> 01:18:08,400
Speaker 3: to work hard. They never said you had to get

1351
01:18:08,400 --> 01:18:12,839
Speaker 3: straight a's. They just said work hard, have high self esteem,

1352
01:18:13,640 --> 01:18:18,840
Speaker 3: you know, treat people nicely. But she always bragged on

1353
01:18:19,280 --> 01:18:22,240
Speaker 3: the kids who we grew up with, and kids around

1354
01:18:22,280 --> 01:18:23,599
Speaker 3: the globe.

1355
01:18:23,760 --> 01:18:27,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, she would say, there are a million machiness.

1356
01:18:28,320 --> 01:18:33,639
Speaker 3: She would say that, and that's I take that to heart,

1357
01:18:34,360 --> 01:18:38,320
Speaker 3: and that's where my guilt is. I am fortunate to

1358
01:18:38,400 --> 01:18:42,480
Speaker 3: be sitting here talking to Jay Shetty in his studio

1359
01:18:43,479 --> 01:18:48,519
Speaker 3: about myself. It's just as it's almost embarrassing because I

1360
01:18:48,560 --> 01:18:51,320
Speaker 3: feel like my mom, like I grew up with a

1361
01:18:51,560 --> 01:18:54,760
Speaker 3: ton of guys who could have been bond traders, could

1362
01:18:54,760 --> 01:18:58,880
Speaker 3: have been easy, and they just had some different decisions

1363
01:18:58,920 --> 01:19:03,160
Speaker 3: and different parenting and different different bumps in the road

1364
01:19:03,240 --> 01:19:04,759
Speaker 3: that they couldn't handle.

1365
01:19:05,280 --> 01:19:08,360
Speaker 4: And I do feel guilty about that.

1366
01:19:08,280 --> 01:19:10,759
Speaker 2: Which survivors remorse.

1367
01:19:10,960 --> 01:19:14,439
Speaker 3: Yeah, and it explains my sort of wanting to be

1368
01:19:14,479 --> 01:19:21,400
Speaker 3: philanthropic with my time, my emotions, my stories, because they're

1369
01:19:21,439 --> 01:19:22,679
Speaker 3: but for the grace of God.

1370
01:19:22,880 --> 01:19:23,080
Speaker 4: Right.

1371
01:19:23,360 --> 01:19:26,880
Speaker 3: And so she when when she would say that, I

1372
01:19:26,960 --> 01:19:28,920
Speaker 3: would it'd be like, what are you going to say?

1373
01:19:28,960 --> 01:19:33,760
Speaker 3: She's absolutely right? She is absolutely right, and she was.

1374
01:19:33,880 --> 01:19:37,880
Speaker 3: She led by example. So not only did she parent us,

1375
01:19:38,040 --> 01:19:41,799
Speaker 3: but she was up at the school parenting other people, helping.

1376
01:19:42,120 --> 01:19:46,240
Speaker 3: I remember when she taught this kid how to multiply,

1377
01:19:47,520 --> 01:19:53,320
Speaker 3: and she said, like a before there were room parents,

1378
01:19:53,360 --> 01:19:56,960
Speaker 3: she just came up and volunteered. And she was teaching

1379
01:19:57,000 --> 01:20:00,439
Speaker 3: this young kid who was in my grade, fourth grade,

1380
01:20:00,600 --> 01:20:03,719
Speaker 3: how to multiply and he just couldn't figure it out.

1381
01:20:04,120 --> 01:20:09,240
Speaker 3: And she said, multiplication is just adding multiple times and

1382
01:20:10,200 --> 01:20:12,439
Speaker 3: he was like, well, I can't figure this out, and

1383
01:20:12,479 --> 01:20:15,320
Speaker 3: she said, use your fingers, and he said, I don't

1384
01:20:15,360 --> 01:20:17,479
Speaker 3: want to use my fingers. I'm in fourth grade, I'm

1385
01:20:17,520 --> 01:20:20,160
Speaker 3: embarrassed to use my fingers, and my mom would.

1386
01:20:19,960 --> 01:20:21,919
Speaker 4: Say, well, then don't show anybody.

1387
01:20:22,040 --> 01:20:24,719
Speaker 3: Just put your hand on your desk and press down

1388
01:20:24,800 --> 01:20:25,640
Speaker 3: on your fingers.

1389
01:20:26,120 --> 01:20:28,839
Speaker 4: I was like, that's ingenious, that's ingenious.

1390
01:20:28,840 --> 01:20:32,920
Speaker 3: But she was sharing the kind of knowledge with others

1391
01:20:32,920 --> 01:20:37,360
Speaker 3: that we got that every day, every day when you

1392
01:20:37,360 --> 01:20:42,280
Speaker 3: know so, I feel a little bit of survivor's guilt

1393
01:20:42,360 --> 01:20:47,479
Speaker 3: when it comes to the opportunities that I've had in

1394
01:20:47,520 --> 01:20:50,920
Speaker 3: my life, because I do feel like she does that

1395
01:20:51,920 --> 01:20:53,360
Speaker 3: it could have been anybody.

1396
01:20:53,479 --> 01:20:56,400
Speaker 1: You've both been so gracious and generous with your time today.

1397
01:20:56,439 --> 01:20:59,360
Speaker 1: I could truly talk to you for another three hours,

1398
01:20:59,400 --> 01:21:02,640
Speaker 1: but I'm going to end with one last question for

1399
01:21:02,760 --> 01:21:07,479
Speaker 1: you each, well maybe two, maybe one. One one last

1400
01:21:07,560 --> 01:21:10,800
Speaker 1: question for you each. It would be for you to

1401
01:21:10,840 --> 01:21:14,280
Speaker 1: share with each other what you believe your mother would

1402
01:21:14,280 --> 01:21:17,080
Speaker 1: be most proud of, but of each other.

1403
01:21:17,320 --> 01:21:19,280
Speaker 2: All right, I'm gonna make him start so that I

1404
01:21:19,280 --> 01:21:20,240
Speaker 2: don't start crying.

1405
01:21:21,200 --> 01:21:23,040
Speaker 1: If you could say what your mother would be most

1406
01:21:23,040 --> 01:21:25,840
Speaker 1: proud about, Michelle, if she was here with us today.

1407
01:21:25,920 --> 01:21:28,240
Speaker 3: But if you can, there's so many things that my

1408
01:21:28,360 --> 01:21:31,800
Speaker 3: mom would be proud of. She would be proud of

1409
01:21:31,800 --> 01:21:35,240
Speaker 3: her as a parent. Well, another one of her greatest

1410
01:21:35,280 --> 01:21:39,320
Speaker 3: compliments was the fact that she never had to worry

1411
01:21:39,320 --> 01:21:43,679
Speaker 3: about her grandkids. That that warms both of our hearts because,

1412
01:21:43,760 --> 01:21:46,800
Speaker 3: as me said, you know, our older kids are off

1413
01:21:46,840 --> 01:21:51,000
Speaker 3: and running and not bounced back. And that made her

1414
01:21:51,080 --> 01:21:57,160
Speaker 3: felt feel like she taught us how to be good parents.

1415
01:21:57,520 --> 01:22:00,679
Speaker 2: And I think and it was the gift of allowing

1416
01:22:00,720 --> 01:22:03,440
Speaker 2: her to be just grandma.

1417
01:22:03,240 --> 01:22:07,880
Speaker 3: Just a cool grandma, because she didn't have to discipline, discipline.

1418
01:22:07,360 --> 01:22:10,720
Speaker 4: Or raise or yeah house.

1419
01:22:10,400 --> 01:22:14,479
Speaker 3: She could just come over and candy for everybody, jump

1420
01:22:14,479 --> 01:22:17,200
Speaker 3: on the couch and do whatever you want. And she

1421
01:22:17,439 --> 01:22:21,880
Speaker 3: really relished in that role. I think I think she

1422
01:22:21,920 --> 01:22:25,080
Speaker 3: would be proud of Mesh for that. I think she

1423
01:22:25,120 --> 01:22:29,519
Speaker 3: would be proud of how Miche has been able to

1424
01:22:29,640 --> 01:22:36,400
Speaker 3: have a colossal effect on so many people. And that

1425
01:22:36,640 --> 01:22:41,880
Speaker 3: is white House. Notwithstanding white House is gone. Look look

1426
01:22:41,880 --> 01:22:45,040
Speaker 3: at what she's doing now, I mean it is It

1427
01:22:45,160 --> 01:22:52,639
Speaker 3: is a massive, massive lift, uplift for so many people

1428
01:22:52,720 --> 01:22:56,719
Speaker 3: who don't get to to you know, be her sister,

1429
01:22:56,800 --> 01:23:00,799
Speaker 3: be her brother, or be her husband or or child.

1430
01:23:01,400 --> 01:23:05,479
Speaker 3: So I think those are two really good things. But

1431
01:23:05,760 --> 01:23:10,640
Speaker 3: most importantly, she would be very proud that she is

1432
01:23:10,800 --> 01:23:18,080
Speaker 3: a terrific wife because we all revered my father, all

1433
01:23:18,120 --> 01:23:21,760
Speaker 3: of us, my mom, the kids, all of our relatives.

1434
01:23:21,800 --> 01:23:26,120
Speaker 3: He was like the beacon in our family, and my

1435
01:23:26,320 --> 01:23:31,160
Speaker 3: mom was tough on him, but she loved him. And

1436
01:23:31,720 --> 01:23:34,759
Speaker 3: Mish reminds me of that with her relationship with Barack.

1437
01:23:35,680 --> 01:23:37,479
Speaker 3: Just because you the president of the United States doesn't

1438
01:23:37,479 --> 01:23:41,920
Speaker 3: mean you're getting off easy. My mom would like that,

1439
01:23:42,439 --> 01:23:44,400
Speaker 3: But then she would be like, he's got a lot

1440
01:23:44,439 --> 01:23:46,479
Speaker 3: of stuff going on. Don't be so hard on him,

1441
01:23:47,680 --> 01:23:50,080
Speaker 3: you know what I mean. It's just I think she

1442
01:23:50,120 --> 01:23:51,439
Speaker 3: would appreciate that.

1443
01:23:51,800 --> 01:23:53,719
Speaker 2: I like that. It's the good ones.

1444
01:23:54,280 --> 01:23:55,639
Speaker 4: I'm a podcaster now.

1445
01:23:57,320 --> 01:23:58,200
Speaker 1: Run this UF for.

1446
01:24:00,160 --> 01:24:03,800
Speaker 2: What sums it up is that Mom would be so

1447
01:24:04,760 --> 01:24:07,240
Speaker 2: proud of the fact that you're a good man in

1448
01:24:07,280 --> 01:24:11,320
Speaker 2: the world and that you have been a good father,

1449
01:24:11,560 --> 01:24:16,519
Speaker 2: fathering for a long long time and passing on the

1450
01:24:17,320 --> 01:24:21,120
Speaker 2: that's a dig because he's an old dad, right, this

1451
01:24:21,280 --> 01:24:26,760
Speaker 2: is still long, long, long time, but passing on the wisdom,

1452
01:24:26,960 --> 01:24:29,360
Speaker 2: you know, showing up in the world in a way

1453
01:24:29,439 --> 01:24:33,600
Speaker 2: that would make Dad proud, living out his his his

1454
01:24:33,960 --> 01:24:37,040
Speaker 2: view of what it means to be a man, and

1455
01:24:37,080 --> 01:24:39,559
Speaker 2: then sharing that with a lot of other men. I

1456
01:24:39,600 --> 01:24:42,120
Speaker 2: mean the fact that she would be proud of the

1457
01:24:42,160 --> 01:24:45,479
Speaker 2: fact that you walked away from a lucrative career in

1458
01:24:45,760 --> 01:24:50,599
Speaker 2: finance to help other young men figure out how they

1459
01:24:50,640 --> 01:24:54,240
Speaker 2: can be fast and strong but good too and build

1460
01:24:54,280 --> 01:24:58,000
Speaker 2: a life for themselves. That you've taken that same that

1461
01:24:58,000 --> 01:25:01,640
Speaker 2: that same wisdom and you find always to continue to

1462
01:25:01,720 --> 01:25:04,679
Speaker 2: multiply it to who much is given. She'd be proud

1463
01:25:04,680 --> 01:25:07,880
Speaker 2: of that, and that you're still here right by my side.

1464
01:25:08,560 --> 01:25:11,160
Speaker 2: I think that would make her proud.

1465
01:25:12,200 --> 01:25:15,519
Speaker 1: Thank you both so much. I am so grateful to

1466
01:25:15,560 --> 01:25:19,120
Speaker 1: welcome you to the world of podcasting. I hope everyone

1467
01:25:19,160 --> 01:25:23,360
Speaker 1: who's listening and watching goes and subscribes to IMO. You're

1468
01:25:23,360 --> 01:25:25,400
Speaker 1: going to get so much wisdom, so much insight from

1469
01:25:25,479 --> 01:25:28,519
Speaker 1: two of the smartest, brightest minds, but two people who

1470
01:25:28,520 --> 01:25:31,920
Speaker 1: have such sweet, soft hearts. And I love that combination

1471
01:25:32,080 --> 01:25:36,200
Speaker 1: that you both bring of being absolutely bold powerhouses, but

1472
01:25:36,320 --> 01:25:38,240
Speaker 1: in the times I've got to know you both and

1473
01:25:38,280 --> 01:25:40,559
Speaker 1: spend with you both, you also have the most beautiful

1474
01:25:40,600 --> 01:25:44,599
Speaker 1: hearts and that combination is unstoppable, and I am so

1475
01:25:44,680 --> 01:25:46,240
Speaker 1: excited to see what you both do in.

1476
01:25:46,160 --> 01:25:48,120
Speaker 4: This next season of your life.

1477
01:25:48,200 --> 01:25:54,200
Speaker 2: Thanks you are family, Yes, sir, Yes, we just have

1478
01:25:54,280 --> 01:25:55,080
Speaker 2: to meet your sister.

1479
01:25:57,400 --> 01:26:02,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, we're going to drag her up. We're going to

1480
01:26:02,200 --> 01:26:03,200
Speaker 4: drag her up here.

1481
01:26:03,520 --> 01:26:05,160
Speaker 2: Thank you so much.

1482
01:26:05,240 --> 01:26:05,800
Speaker 4: Thanks man.

1483
01:26:06,080 --> 01:26:08,880
Speaker 1: If you enjoyed this podcast, you're going to love my

1484
01:26:09,000 --> 01:26:13,280
Speaker 1: conversation with Michelle Obama where she opens up on how

1485
01:26:13,320 --> 01:26:16,559
Speaker 1: to stay with your partner when they're changing, and the

1486
01:26:16,640 --> 01:26:20,040
Speaker 1: four check ins you should be doing in your relationship.

1487
01:26:20,360 --> 01:26:23,200
Speaker 1: We also talk about how to deal with relationships when

1488
01:26:23,200 --> 01:26:26,360
Speaker 1: they're under stressed. If you're going through something right now

1489
01:26:26,400 --> 01:26:29,439
Speaker 1: with your partner or someone you're seeing, this is the

1490
01:26:29,520 --> 01:26:30,559
Speaker 1: episode for you.

1491
01:26:30,600 --> 01:26:33,599
Speaker 2: No wonder our kids are struggling. We have a new

1492
01:26:33,680 --> 01:26:37,599
Speaker 2: technology and we've just taken it in hookline and Sinker,

1493
01:26:38,000 --> 01:26:40,960
Speaker 2: and we have to be mindful for our kids. They'll

1494
01:26:41,080 --> 01:26:44,479
Speaker 2: just be thumbing through this stuff. You know, their mind's

1495
01:26:44,560 --> 01:26:45,320
Speaker 2: never sleeping