1 00:00:02,759 --> 00:00:03,119 Speaker 1: Hi. 2 00:00:03,360 --> 00:00:07,440 Speaker 2: This is Laura Vandercamp. I'm a mother of five, an author, journalist, 3 00:00:07,480 --> 00:00:08,080 Speaker 2: and speaker. 4 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:10,240 Speaker 3: And this is Sarah hart Unger. 5 00:00:10,520 --> 00:00:13,520 Speaker 4: I'm a mother of three, a practicing physician and blogger. 6 00:00:13,560 --> 00:00:15,880 Speaker 4: On the side, we are two working parents who love 7 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:17,480 Speaker 4: our careers and our families. 8 00:00:17,920 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 1: Welcome to best of both worlds. 9 00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:22,479 Speaker 2: Here we talk about how real women manage work, family, 10 00:00:22,600 --> 00:00:25,800 Speaker 2: and time for fun, from figuring out childcare to mapping 11 00:00:25,840 --> 00:00:28,400 Speaker 2: out long term career goals. We want you to get 12 00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:30,880 Speaker 2: the most out of life. 13 00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:34,000 Speaker 3: Welcome to best of both worlds. 14 00:00:34,159 --> 00:00:34,880 Speaker 1: This is Laura. 15 00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 2: This is episode two hundred and six, which is airing 16 00:00:37,880 --> 00:00:41,120 Speaker 2: in mid July of twenty twenty one. I'll be interviewing 17 00:00:41,280 --> 00:00:44,160 Speaker 2: Rachel Rogers, who is the author of the new book 18 00:00:44,280 --> 00:00:48,159 Speaker 2: We Should All Be Millionaires, which I read and really enjoyed, 19 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:51,360 Speaker 2: so hopefully lots of you will pick that up as well. Sarah, 20 00:00:51,400 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 2: you are intrigued by it as well, right, Yes, I'm 21 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 2: intrigued by the title. I'm intrigued by the concept, and 22 00:00:57,600 --> 00:01:01,400 Speaker 2: I started googling her as one does, and her recent 23 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:03,440 Speaker 2: Twitter feed got me even more excited. She was just 24 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:05,920 Speaker 2: talking about, like kind of off the cuff, about fun 25 00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:07,480 Speaker 2: and that resonated with me. 26 00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:08,480 Speaker 3: Did I use that properly? 27 00:01:08,520 --> 00:01:08,720 Speaker 1: Laura? 28 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:09,480 Speaker 3: Yes, you did. 29 00:01:09,560 --> 00:01:13,319 Speaker 4: You did because I had listened to glennon Doyle's podcast recently. 30 00:01:13,319 --> 00:01:15,880 Speaker 4: There was a great episode on fun and how many 31 00:01:15,920 --> 00:01:18,760 Speaker 4: of us, including myself, have trouble doing things that are 32 00:01:18,800 --> 00:01:21,800 Speaker 4: purely fun and not productive in some fashion. And Rachel 33 00:01:21,959 --> 00:01:24,640 Speaker 4: started talking about the fun she had had with her 34 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:27,640 Speaker 4: kids on her solo parenting day, and she included activities 35 00:01:27,680 --> 00:01:30,640 Speaker 4: such as ski ball, which is totally something that's purely fun. 36 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 4: I mean, who doesn't love that? And her kids were 37 00:01:32,360 --> 00:01:32,840 Speaker 4: loving it too. 38 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:33,640 Speaker 3: Anyway. 39 00:01:33,720 --> 00:01:36,319 Speaker 4: I just she seems really, really cool, and I'm excited 40 00:01:36,319 --> 00:01:39,560 Speaker 4: for this interview. And even though I've pretty much planned 41 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:44,080 Speaker 4: on making the summer mostly juicy novels and not nonfiction, 42 00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:46,360 Speaker 4: I'm going to make an exception for Rachel's book. 43 00:01:46,560 --> 00:01:47,400 Speaker 3: Yes exactly. 44 00:01:47,920 --> 00:01:50,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean she makes the point and we'll talk 45 00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:52,000 Speaker 2: more about this than the interview. But a lot of 46 00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:57,160 Speaker 2: women really undervalue themselves financially. I read another book recently 47 00:01:57,200 --> 00:02:00,000 Speaker 2: called Think Like a Breadwinner that had a very similar 48 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:03,200 Speaker 2: theme that many of us grow up thinking, yes, we're 49 00:02:03,200 --> 00:02:05,840 Speaker 2: going to work. I mean, this is modern times. Most 50 00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:08,239 Speaker 2: women do grow up with the idea that you're doing 51 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:12,440 Speaker 2: something professionally, but we still don't have the idea that 52 00:02:12,760 --> 00:02:17,280 Speaker 2: our earnings could be what establishes our famili's standard of living. 53 00:02:17,880 --> 00:02:19,600 Speaker 2: Because if you do think that, you're going to make 54 00:02:19,639 --> 00:02:22,200 Speaker 2: different choices. And I'm not saying that all families need 55 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:24,040 Speaker 2: to be like that. I mean, Sarah and I have 56 00:02:24,080 --> 00:02:26,519 Speaker 2: discussed we are not necessarily in families that are set 57 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:30,440 Speaker 2: up that way, but it is always a possibility, and 58 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:32,560 Speaker 2: it's something that we can do by, you know, at 59 00:02:32,639 --> 00:02:36,040 Speaker 2: least thinking that way by taking our earning capacity seriously, 60 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:38,520 Speaker 2: like how are we investing in our career and how 61 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:41,560 Speaker 2: are we valuing our time. This is what really got 62 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:44,880 Speaker 2: me about this book, you know, because Rachel is preaching 63 00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:48,640 Speaker 2: that we should not cut the daily coffee to save three. 64 00:02:48,480 --> 00:02:49,600 Speaker 3: Thousand dollars a year. 65 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:53,160 Speaker 2: Instead, spend that effort thinking how could I make four thousand, 66 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:56,480 Speaker 2: five thousand, thirty thousand more dollars in the next year. 67 00:02:57,040 --> 00:03:01,720 Speaker 2: Don't think always about skimping, thinking about growing your earning capacity. 68 00:03:01,760 --> 00:03:04,720 Speaker 2: And she talks about doing that as an entrepreneur as 69 00:03:04,760 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 2: she is, but there are ways to do it within 70 00:03:08,200 --> 00:03:10,160 Speaker 2: more standard jobs as well. 71 00:03:10,280 --> 00:03:11,880 Speaker 3: I mean, Sarah, you've been. 72 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:15,959 Speaker 2: Really good about getting more seniority, more leadership roles going 73 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:16,800 Speaker 2: on over time. 74 00:03:16,919 --> 00:03:20,440 Speaker 4: Right, Yes, I chose a low paying specialty, but I 75 00:03:20,440 --> 00:03:23,480 Speaker 4: would say, what I'm doing right now, to some extent, 76 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:26,360 Speaker 4: I'm not doing it to maximize my earnings. Complete like, 77 00:03:26,400 --> 00:03:29,080 Speaker 4: that's not my entire reason for doing it. But I 78 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:33,600 Speaker 4: do appreciate that by adding leadership, I am able to 79 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:35,480 Speaker 4: earn more and am able to do more of what 80 00:03:35,560 --> 00:03:37,320 Speaker 4: I love and make an impact in a way that 81 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:40,480 Speaker 4: I think is important. So yeah, I've embraced this over 82 00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:43,560 Speaker 4: time to some extent, and it's taken. It's been a journey. 83 00:03:43,680 --> 00:03:44,360 Speaker 4: It's been a journey. 84 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:45,160 Speaker 3: Well me as well. 85 00:03:45,240 --> 00:03:48,880 Speaker 2: I mean, you know, especially in self employment, you can 86 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:51,640 Speaker 2: always run into the temptation to undervalue what you do. 87 00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:55,120 Speaker 2: And Rachel had a lot of great messages about that. 88 00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:58,000 Speaker 2: I mean, people who love what they do can be like, well, 89 00:03:58,040 --> 00:03:59,640 Speaker 2: I'd be doing it for free. But no, no, no, 90 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:03,600 Speaker 2: I'm not doing it for free ever anymore. So we 91 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:06,120 Speaker 2: should all be millionaires, Sarah, We should all be millionaires, 92 00:04:06,160 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 2: as Rachel said, So let's listen to what she has 93 00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:12,120 Speaker 2: to say. Well, I am thrilled to be here with 94 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:15,000 Speaker 2: Rachel Rogers, who, as we said in the introduction, is 95 00:04:15,040 --> 00:04:19,279 Speaker 2: the author of We Should All Be Millionaires. So, Rachel, 96 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:20,320 Speaker 2: welcome to the program. 97 00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:22,760 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited to 98 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:23,160 Speaker 1: be here. 99 00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:23,760 Speaker 3: Great. 100 00:04:23,800 --> 00:04:27,120 Speaker 2: Can you just tell our listeners a little bit about 101 00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:29,080 Speaker 2: your work and your life. 102 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:33,440 Speaker 5: Yeah, well, I'm from Flushing, Queens in New York City. 103 00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 5: That's where I grew up and I now live on 104 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:40,120 Speaker 5: a fifty acre ranch with three horses and three dogs 105 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:43,400 Speaker 5: and three children. I also have an older child who's 106 00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:46,880 Speaker 5: in New York and my husband. So that's what my 107 00:04:46,920 --> 00:04:50,000 Speaker 5: personal life is like, chaos basically. 108 00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:51,279 Speaker 1: And then. 109 00:04:52,680 --> 00:04:55,640 Speaker 5: I run a business called Hello Seven. I'm the CEO 110 00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:58,520 Speaker 5: where we help marginalize folks build. 111 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:00,960 Speaker 3: Well, that is awesome mission. 112 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:03,320 Speaker 2: And as we all learn from the title of your book, 113 00:05:03,360 --> 00:05:06,600 Speaker 2: you think we should all be millionaires. But what's holding 114 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:10,760 Speaker 2: people and particularly women back from being millionaires? 115 00:05:11,279 --> 00:05:14,240 Speaker 5: Well, what isn't right? Like some of it is our 116 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:18,239 Speaker 5: stories and our thoughts. It's also the government and media 117 00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:21,799 Speaker 5: right like we are. There's a reason why I specifically 118 00:05:21,839 --> 00:05:25,239 Speaker 5: focus on systemically and historically marginalized people, which is pretty 119 00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:28,560 Speaker 5: much everybody who's not a sis, straight white guy, and 120 00:05:29,360 --> 00:05:33,280 Speaker 5: we can see what is happening We can see the 121 00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:37,440 Speaker 5: systemization of it by noticing that black families have an 122 00:05:37,440 --> 00:05:40,480 Speaker 5: average networth in the US of seventeen thousand, whereas white 123 00:05:40,480 --> 00:05:43,200 Speaker 5: families have an average networth of one hundred and seventy thousand, 124 00:05:43,240 --> 00:05:47,520 Speaker 5: literally ten x. And those gaps continue for women who 125 00:05:47,520 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 5: make around fifty four cents women of color for every 126 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 5: dollar made by a white guy, and those gaps continue 127 00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:58,400 Speaker 5: for every different segment of marginalized community, including queer people, 128 00:05:58,520 --> 00:06:02,520 Speaker 5: disabled people, people who identify as fat. It's sort of like, 129 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:06,160 Speaker 5: unless you're like straight white guy, you are, you know, 130 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 5: kind of kept out of this wealth building journey and 131 00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:13,279 Speaker 5: possibilities and opportunities, right, they come easy to you typically 132 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:16,040 Speaker 5: if that's your identity, and if that's not your identity, 133 00:06:16,080 --> 00:06:19,400 Speaker 5: they don't. Because literally, women, at least in the US, 134 00:06:19,440 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 5: and I'm sure this is true around the world as well, 135 00:06:21,880 --> 00:06:25,440 Speaker 5: that women couldn't have credit cards until the seventies, women 136 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:28,160 Speaker 5: couldn't have their own bank accounts, and still today, the 137 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 5: advice given to women around finances like cut coupons and 138 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:35,720 Speaker 5: stop buying lattes is if that made anyone ever a millionaire, right, 139 00:06:36,320 --> 00:06:38,359 Speaker 5: it just doesn't happen. And so we're taught like do 140 00:06:38,440 --> 00:06:42,440 Speaker 5: more with less, be less, shrink yourself, be a caregiver, 141 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:44,880 Speaker 5: and every way, take care of everybody else, show up 142 00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:48,240 Speaker 5: for everybody else. Don't have boundaries otherwise you're you know 143 00:06:48,279 --> 00:06:50,960 Speaker 5: what I mean. It's just like there's so much in 144 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:53,640 Speaker 5: our society sort of designed for us to not make money. 145 00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:56,720 Speaker 5: So that's why we're not millionaires. But those are all 146 00:06:56,760 --> 00:06:58,440 Speaker 5: things that we can definitely overcome. 147 00:06:59,200 --> 00:07:01,599 Speaker 2: Yeah, And why is it it's so important that people 148 00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:04,640 Speaker 2: who are in marginalized groups have more. 149 00:07:04,480 --> 00:07:09,080 Speaker 5: Wealth because it's the wealthy who make the decisions. You know, 150 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:13,120 Speaker 5: with our politics and in our government, the wealthy are 151 00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:18,440 Speaker 5: backing political candidates, they are lobbying for what they want, 152 00:07:18,880 --> 00:07:22,800 Speaker 5: and our needs continue to be marginalized, and our causes 153 00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:27,200 Speaker 5: continued to be pushed away and not prioritized. And so 154 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:30,400 Speaker 5: I think we need to have money, and because money 155 00:07:30,400 --> 00:07:32,880 Speaker 5: can buy you power, right, and so we need more 156 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:35,200 Speaker 5: of it, and also to fund the causes that we 157 00:07:35,240 --> 00:07:38,600 Speaker 5: care about, to create nonprofits, to be able to write 158 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:41,840 Speaker 5: checks that solve problems. Right, What would happen if the 159 00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:46,440 Speaker 5: world's millionaires were not all white guys, but that they 160 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 5: were black women and other women of color and queer 161 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:54,720 Speaker 5: people and disable people and you know, people who typically 162 00:07:54,760 --> 00:07:55,120 Speaker 5: are not. 163 00:07:55,600 --> 00:07:56,720 Speaker 1: What we see at the top. 164 00:07:57,080 --> 00:08:00,760 Speaker 5: If those folks were wealthy, what could they do right collectively? 165 00:08:01,160 --> 00:08:03,280 Speaker 5: And so I think that's why it's so important that 166 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:05,280 Speaker 5: we build wealth, because this is part of our fight, 167 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:08,080 Speaker 5: This is part of our protest right, this is part 168 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:11,360 Speaker 5: of our revolutionary act to build wealth and to decide 169 00:08:11,360 --> 00:08:12,920 Speaker 5: what we get to do with it and what we 170 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:15,320 Speaker 5: get to fund with it exactly. 171 00:08:15,720 --> 00:08:18,400 Speaker 2: So tell us a little bit about your own family 172 00:08:18,440 --> 00:08:21,160 Speaker 2: money story. I said, you grew up in Queen's which 173 00:08:21,240 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 2: is different from the fifty acre ranch, and you know, 174 00:08:23,920 --> 00:08:26,280 Speaker 2: maybe talk a little bit of it. Sounds from your 175 00:08:26,320 --> 00:08:29,400 Speaker 2: book for listeners who hopefully we will check that out. 176 00:08:29,640 --> 00:08:30,960 Speaker 3: But you had some periods that. 177 00:08:30,880 --> 00:08:33,640 Speaker 2: Were stable financially growing up, and also some periods that 178 00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:35,600 Speaker 2: definitely were not. So I wonder what you could tell 179 00:08:35,640 --> 00:08:37,600 Speaker 2: us about that and what you've learned from that. 180 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:41,280 Speaker 5: Yeah, Well, there was a time right when my I 181 00:08:41,280 --> 00:08:43,800 Speaker 5: mean my parents got together pretty young. 182 00:08:43,920 --> 00:08:46,400 Speaker 1: They had children young. My mom had my sister when 183 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:46,960 Speaker 1: she was eighteen. 184 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:49,720 Speaker 5: She had me at twenty two, and I remember we 185 00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:52,679 Speaker 5: lived in a one bedroom apartment and my parents slept 186 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:55,200 Speaker 5: in the living room on a pull out couch, and 187 00:08:55,240 --> 00:08:57,840 Speaker 5: me and my sister had the bedroom. And I didn't 188 00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:00,600 Speaker 5: think anything of it, right, Like I actually we don't 189 00:09:00,679 --> 00:09:03,760 Speaker 5: remember noticing a lot of struggle. I was pretty young 190 00:09:03,800 --> 00:09:07,280 Speaker 5: when we lived in that apartment. But then here's what happened. 191 00:09:07,360 --> 00:09:09,800 Speaker 5: This is when I started to notice money because my 192 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:13,160 Speaker 5: parents both got really good jobs. And by really good 193 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:15,560 Speaker 5: meaning like a stable job and a steady paycheck. They 194 00:09:15,760 --> 00:09:19,160 Speaker 5: weren't getting paid really well, but they were getting paid 195 00:09:19,240 --> 00:09:21,400 Speaker 5: enough to be comfortable and to take care of us 196 00:09:21,440 --> 00:09:23,760 Speaker 5: and not have to stress about bills every week, right, 197 00:09:24,360 --> 00:09:27,200 Speaker 5: And so I remember that period, and they saved up 198 00:09:27,200 --> 00:09:29,679 Speaker 5: money living in that one bedroom apartment and bought a condo, 199 00:09:30,320 --> 00:09:32,240 Speaker 5: and so then we lived in a two bedroom condo, 200 00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:35,120 Speaker 5: which was like so exciting. There was a second bedroom, 201 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:38,079 Speaker 5: dear god, it was amazing. And I mean it was 202 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:40,240 Speaker 5: the tiniest little bedroom that me and my sister were in, 203 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:43,160 Speaker 5: but still it was a second bedroom. And so I 204 00:09:43,200 --> 00:09:45,520 Speaker 5: remember living in the condo, and I remember like going 205 00:09:45,600 --> 00:09:47,839 Speaker 5: to Macy's every weekend with my mother. We would go 206 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:50,439 Speaker 5: to Queen Center mall, and like we would always be 207 00:09:50,440 --> 00:09:53,480 Speaker 5: able to get one thing like earrings or a bow 208 00:09:53,800 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 5: or a clothing item, right, like that was a big deal. 209 00:09:57,120 --> 00:09:59,760 Speaker 5: And then hit the fan, like both of them lost 210 00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:02,720 Speaker 5: their t jobs at the same time, within like a 211 00:10:02,720 --> 00:10:04,560 Speaker 5: couple of months of each other, and so then they 212 00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:07,240 Speaker 5: were both unemployed and like sort of struggling to find 213 00:10:07,679 --> 00:10:11,240 Speaker 5: different just like temp jobs, and there just really were 214 00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:14,000 Speaker 5: no jobs, and the jobs that were available did not 215 00:10:14,080 --> 00:10:16,679 Speaker 5: pay well. They did them, but like we just had 216 00:10:16,720 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 5: a lot of instability, and so we were on food stamps. 217 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:23,600 Speaker 5: We lost the condo. I remember our landlord coming to 218 00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:25,800 Speaker 5: the door, like banging on the door for the rent. 219 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:29,320 Speaker 5: I remember con Edison coming to the door to turn 220 00:10:29,360 --> 00:10:32,720 Speaker 5: off our lights, which happened, you know, quite a few times. 221 00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:36,400 Speaker 5: So I think when I was younger and we didn't 222 00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:39,040 Speaker 5: have a lot, but we had a really small lifestyle, 223 00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 5: it was you know, they still had jobs then, but 224 00:10:42,320 --> 00:10:44,800 Speaker 5: we were comfortable for a little while. But I think 225 00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 5: when you have that comfort and then it's taken away, 226 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:50,320 Speaker 5: it is very noticeable, right because I know other people 227 00:10:50,360 --> 00:10:52,480 Speaker 5: who grew up really low income and like they didn't 228 00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:55,840 Speaker 5: even know, like their parents just did such an amazing 229 00:10:55,960 --> 00:10:59,080 Speaker 5: job that they didn't even realize how little money they had. 230 00:10:59,120 --> 00:11:01,679 Speaker 5: But for me, I think I realized it because there 231 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:03,839 Speaker 5: was a very start, there was a point at which 232 00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:07,080 Speaker 5: everything changed and there was lots and lots of struggle. 233 00:11:07,640 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 5: And so as a result, I feel like I learned 234 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:13,880 Speaker 5: from that that I needed to create financial stability for 235 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:17,199 Speaker 5: myself and make sure that I didn't have that going 236 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:20,560 Speaker 5: on long term. So yeah, I mean, and my mother, 237 00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:23,640 Speaker 5: like my father, wound up passing away when I was 238 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:25,200 Speaker 5: really young, when I was twelve years old, and then 239 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:28,320 Speaker 5: there was even more financial struggle after that. And so 240 00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:30,920 Speaker 5: my way to get out of it, because I literally 241 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:33,920 Speaker 5: was in that financial struggle when I started college, and 242 00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:35,280 Speaker 5: that was my way to get out of it. It 243 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:38,480 Speaker 5: was going to school and getting a degree and taking 244 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:40,880 Speaker 5: out loans or getting scholars whatever I could do to 245 00:11:40,880 --> 00:11:42,680 Speaker 5: pay for it so that I could get that education, 246 00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:44,400 Speaker 5: so I could get a job so I could never 247 00:11:45,120 --> 00:11:47,520 Speaker 5: experience that again and help my mother with you know, 248 00:11:47,640 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 5: help my mother out as well. 249 00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:50,040 Speaker 3: Excellent. 250 00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 2: Well, let's take a quick ad break and we will 251 00:11:52,040 --> 00:12:06,600 Speaker 2: be back with more from Rachel. Well, we've been hearing 252 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:10,199 Speaker 2: from Rachel Rogers about why we should all be millionaires. 253 00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:13,079 Speaker 2: So you graduate from college, you get a good job, 254 00:12:13,160 --> 00:12:16,160 Speaker 2: But a good job is kind of a hard way 255 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:21,360 Speaker 2: to build wealth. It turns out that you know, I 256 00:12:21,360 --> 00:12:22,840 Speaker 2: wonder if you explain this for me. I mean, you 257 00:12:22,840 --> 00:12:25,800 Speaker 2: can become a millionaire working for somebody else, but it's 258 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:26,959 Speaker 2: a lot harder, right. 259 00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:29,480 Speaker 5: Yeah, it's just going to take you a long time. 260 00:12:29,640 --> 00:12:32,160 Speaker 5: So you could work at a job that you especially 261 00:12:32,200 --> 00:12:34,400 Speaker 5: if you love it and you're you're making enough to 262 00:12:34,400 --> 00:12:37,400 Speaker 5: be comfortable. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but it 263 00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:40,800 Speaker 5: will take you probably on average thirty years thirty plus 264 00:12:40,880 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 5: years to become a millionaire, meaning having a net worth 265 00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 5: of a million dollars or more. Because with inflation and 266 00:12:46,920 --> 00:12:49,000 Speaker 5: all of those things, often our jobs are not keeping 267 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:53,840 Speaker 5: up with the cost of living and so unfortunately that 268 00:12:54,120 --> 00:12:56,360 Speaker 5: tends to not be enough for a lot of us, 269 00:12:56,400 --> 00:12:59,320 Speaker 5: especially with the childcare cost, housing costs, all of those things. 270 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:03,800 Speaker 5: And another pathway is getting a job that maybe comes 271 00:13:03,800 --> 00:13:06,960 Speaker 5: with profit sharing or comes with sales commission, where it 272 00:13:07,040 --> 00:13:10,440 Speaker 5: is somewhat entrepreneurial and you have the opportunity to increase 273 00:13:10,480 --> 00:13:13,040 Speaker 5: the size of your paycheck. I think that's one of 274 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:15,439 Speaker 5: the best things that you could do. My entire team 275 00:13:15,640 --> 00:13:18,920 Speaker 5: gets profit sharing for that reason, because I believe in 276 00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:22,720 Speaker 5: financial independence for them as well as myself and the 277 00:13:22,720 --> 00:13:25,400 Speaker 5: people that I'm teaching. So that is another way, and 278 00:13:25,400 --> 00:13:27,520 Speaker 5: that would definitely be faster. So if you're an executive 279 00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:29,480 Speaker 5: at a company, for example, or if you're in a 280 00:13:29,520 --> 00:13:33,679 Speaker 5: position where you have commission based income, then usually your 281 00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:36,520 Speaker 5: income is rising faster and that can get you to 282 00:13:36,600 --> 00:13:39,560 Speaker 5: a million dollars in definitely less than thirty years, and 283 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:42,320 Speaker 5: usually it's like something like seventeen or nineteen years, I 284 00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:46,520 Speaker 5: forget exactly. And then there's entrepreneurship, which I think is 285 00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:49,280 Speaker 5: the most realistic path, especially for somebody who's from a 286 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:51,400 Speaker 5: marginalized community, who's not going to have a lot of 287 00:13:51,400 --> 00:13:53,520 Speaker 5: access to capital, who's not going to no one's giving 288 00:13:53,559 --> 00:13:56,199 Speaker 5: them a bank loan to start their business, right and 289 00:13:56,360 --> 00:14:00,560 Speaker 5: vcs and you know, angel investors basically ignore this group. 290 00:14:00,720 --> 00:14:06,160 Speaker 5: Until very recently, this group was largely ignored, And so 291 00:14:06,360 --> 00:14:09,600 Speaker 5: for us, building a business is a very realistic way 292 00:14:09,679 --> 00:14:12,959 Speaker 5: to rapidly build wealth. And so on average, if you're 293 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:16,440 Speaker 5: an entrepreneur, you build a business in seven years, you 294 00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:20,359 Speaker 5: can be having a net worth of seven figures. 295 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:23,800 Speaker 2: So many people with the more normal jobs, which is 296 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:26,640 Speaker 2: probably the majority of our listeners, have not really thought 297 00:14:26,680 --> 00:14:29,920 Speaker 2: about how they could increase their income sort of rapidly. 298 00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:33,760 Speaker 2: And in your bookie talk about this ten thousand dollars challenge. Yeah, 299 00:14:33,800 --> 00:14:35,720 Speaker 2: so why don't you talk a little bit about that, 300 00:14:35,760 --> 00:14:38,840 Speaker 2: why people should at least think about that, Like what 301 00:14:38,880 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 2: the ten thousand dollar challenge is? 302 00:14:41,720 --> 00:14:43,600 Speaker 1: Yes, I love this, Okay. 303 00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:46,080 Speaker 5: So I just had this idea, and I've done this 304 00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:48,640 Speaker 5: with myself many times, where I've challenged myself to come 305 00:14:48,720 --> 00:14:50,080 Speaker 5: up with a certain amount of money in a short 306 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:52,600 Speaker 5: period of time because I wanted to go to an event, 307 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:55,880 Speaker 5: or I wanted to take my family on vacation or whatever. 308 00:14:55,960 --> 00:14:58,600 Speaker 5: I was motivated by some outside thing and was like, 309 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:00,760 Speaker 5: let me see if it's possible for me to make 310 00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:02,600 Speaker 5: a certain amount of money in a short period of time. 311 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:04,760 Speaker 5: And there were times that I did it and it 312 00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:06,360 Speaker 5: didn't work, and there were times that I did it 313 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,920 Speaker 5: and it totally worked. And then numbers got increasingly larger, 314 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:14,520 Speaker 5: and so I challenged myself in twenty twenty, in the 315 00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:17,600 Speaker 5: midst of a pandemic, to have a million dollar month 316 00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:20,720 Speaker 5: in my business. And so and at the time, probably 317 00:15:20,760 --> 00:15:23,600 Speaker 5: our recurring revenue was probably something like two fifty a month, 318 00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:25,480 Speaker 5: so this wasn't a tiny business. But I was trying 319 00:15:25,520 --> 00:15:28,240 Speaker 5: to for ex my business in thirty days, and I 320 00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:30,640 Speaker 5: did it my team and I we accomplished that and 321 00:15:30,640 --> 00:15:33,560 Speaker 5: had a million dollar month. And that gave me the idea, 322 00:15:33,760 --> 00:15:37,440 Speaker 5: like my community sort of rallied around me and helped 323 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:39,760 Speaker 5: make it happen and helped spread the word about what 324 00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:42,960 Speaker 5: we were selling, and all of that sort of helped 325 00:15:43,040 --> 00:15:45,320 Speaker 5: us make this happen. And so then I was like, well, 326 00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:47,800 Speaker 5: we should do a challenge for our people and see 327 00:15:47,840 --> 00:15:49,600 Speaker 5: if they could do it. So maybe not a million dollars, 328 00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:53,480 Speaker 5: but ten thousand dollars. And so I last July July 329 00:15:53,600 --> 00:15:57,040 Speaker 5: twenty twenty, I did this challenge inside my community. So 330 00:15:57,080 --> 00:15:59,840 Speaker 5: I have a club where I helped people build wealth 331 00:15:59,840 --> 00:16:02,320 Speaker 5: and teach them and there's coaching and all these things. 332 00:16:02,760 --> 00:16:04,480 Speaker 5: And so I said to the community, I want to 333 00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:07,080 Speaker 5: challenge y'all to make ten thousand dollars in ten days. 334 00:16:07,080 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 5: Here's how it's going to work. Like I'm going to 335 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:10,920 Speaker 5: give you the tools and the resources and the ideas 336 00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:12,640 Speaker 5: for how you're going to go about doing it. Then 337 00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:14,120 Speaker 5: we're going to start the clock. You're going to have 338 00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:16,480 Speaker 5: ten days to go, go, go, go go, and then 339 00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 5: we'll unpack it and say like what worked, what didn't work? 340 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:23,080 Speaker 5: What do we learn from this experience? And it was incredible, 341 00:16:23,120 --> 00:16:25,240 Speaker 5: like this was our first time doing it, and so 342 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:30,239 Speaker 5: I had about three hundred mostly women, participate, and collectively 343 00:16:30,280 --> 00:16:34,400 Speaker 5: they made two point three million dollars in ten days. 344 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:36,600 Speaker 5: And I literally almost fainted. 345 00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:37,880 Speaker 1: And we didn't even have that. 346 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:40,680 Speaker 5: We didn't have that metric, right, So I said, we 347 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:42,880 Speaker 5: were like collecting information from them, and I was like, 348 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:45,440 Speaker 5: add up what everybody said that they made, Like we 349 00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:47,720 Speaker 5: didn't have a convenient way to do it. We collected 350 00:16:47,800 --> 00:16:49,440 Speaker 5: data on the back end, like we had a survey 351 00:16:49,480 --> 00:16:52,520 Speaker 5: to everybody, and so my assistant had to go in 352 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:57,760 Speaker 5: and like manually add up everybody's tally. And when she 353 00:16:57,800 --> 00:17:02,400 Speaker 5: added it up, she's like gonna believes. And I was 354 00:17:02,480 --> 00:17:06,640 Speaker 5: like what it was unbelievable, Like. 355 00:17:06,680 --> 00:17:08,960 Speaker 2: Well, what were they doing? I mean, tell us what 356 00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:10,959 Speaker 2: they did? I mean, did they find new clients? They 357 00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:13,080 Speaker 2: raised their rates, they like asked for a raise, Like 358 00:17:13,119 --> 00:17:14,159 Speaker 2: what were people. 359 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:15,879 Speaker 1: Doing all of those things? 360 00:17:15,920 --> 00:17:18,320 Speaker 5: So they were going out and getting clients, they were 361 00:17:18,359 --> 00:17:21,320 Speaker 5: selling like pick my brain, right, so somebody who doesn't 362 00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:23,800 Speaker 5: have a business, who has you know, a professional job, 363 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:26,200 Speaker 5: but like they're a marketing professional, or are they're a lawyer, 364 00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:29,080 Speaker 5: are they're an accountant, or they do something for some company. 365 00:17:29,520 --> 00:17:31,440 Speaker 5: And so now they're saying, hey, I've got this area 366 00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:34,679 Speaker 5: of expertise. I'll sell you an hour of my time 367 00:17:34,840 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 5: to ask me whatever questions you have and to give 368 00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 5: you some advice. They were also having a yard sale 369 00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:44,600 Speaker 5: and cleaning out their garages and selling old sports equipment 370 00:17:44,680 --> 00:17:48,600 Speaker 5: or whatever they had lying around that one woman actually 371 00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:52,240 Speaker 5: had old yarn. She had all of this old yarn 372 00:17:52,359 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 5: and she made a couple thousand dollars just selling basically 373 00:17:56,119 --> 00:17:58,960 Speaker 5: what feels like junk right like all of this yarn 374 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:02,240 Speaker 5: that she had. I was like, this is my favorite story. 375 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 5: So it was just it was unbelieva that there was 376 00:18:04,600 --> 00:18:07,719 Speaker 5: one woman who in June had made a total of 377 00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:11,320 Speaker 5: like six hundred bucks total, that was her total income 378 00:18:11,359 --> 00:18:14,200 Speaker 5: for the month of June because her business had dried 379 00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:17,840 Speaker 5: up completely because of COVID, and then in July she 380 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:21,360 Speaker 5: had a twenty three thousand dollars month because she did 381 00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:24,760 Speaker 5: this challenge and just like found a way. So it's 382 00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:27,560 Speaker 5: incredible the stories that come out of there, and the 383 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:30,119 Speaker 5: really the point of it is is to prove to 384 00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 5: ourselves that we actually can make money happen whenever we want. 385 00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:36,679 Speaker 5: We're just kind of sitting around dialing it in and 386 00:18:36,800 --> 00:18:39,320 Speaker 5: just choosing not to make a million dollars, but actually, 387 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:41,359 Speaker 5: if we wanted to, we could put a little effort 388 00:18:41,400 --> 00:18:43,439 Speaker 5: in and actually see a big return. 389 00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:46,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, and see a much bigger return than you would 390 00:18:46,320 --> 00:18:50,320 Speaker 2: by say, not getting your morning coffee or cutting those coupons. 391 00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:53,600 Speaker 1: Right exactly exactly like cutting lattes. What does that say. 392 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:55,320 Speaker 5: I think we did the math, and it's like, I 393 00:18:55,359 --> 00:18:57,440 Speaker 5: don't know, maybe twelve hundred bucks over the course. 394 00:18:57,280 --> 00:18:57,800 Speaker 1: Of a year. 395 00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:01,280 Speaker 5: It's like, get your latte, get two lattes, get the 396 00:19:01,280 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 5: foam and whatever else you want on top as well, 397 00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:06,400 Speaker 5: and then go actually. 398 00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:08,879 Speaker 2: Or whatever they put on it exactly. 399 00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:12,399 Speaker 5: You want procolate chips, you want caramel sauce, have it 400 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:15,800 Speaker 5: all okay, because it does it. 401 00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:17,720 Speaker 1: It does not shift the bottom line. 402 00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:20,359 Speaker 5: And that's what's so aggravating too, is the messages to 403 00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:24,520 Speaker 5: men are like, go be powerful, invest in yourself, take risks, 404 00:19:24,680 --> 00:19:27,600 Speaker 5: invest in the stock market, make these moves right, like 405 00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:31,439 Speaker 5: invest in your own education or your own network or whatever. 406 00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:34,040 Speaker 5: And women are told do less, do less, do less, 407 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:36,360 Speaker 5: stop spending money, stopping frivolous. 408 00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:40,080 Speaker 1: It's just it's really aggravating and it's. 409 00:19:40,000 --> 00:19:44,720 Speaker 5: Nonsense, like these are not realistic pieces of valuable financial advice. 410 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:49,359 Speaker 2: Yep, they keep us away from our power really exactly. 411 00:19:49,960 --> 00:19:50,960 Speaker 1: On this show we are we. 412 00:19:50,920 --> 00:19:52,320 Speaker 3: Are big fans of outsourcing. 413 00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:54,520 Speaker 2: So I was thrilled to read your book and find 414 00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:57,080 Speaker 2: out that you were also a big fan of outsourcing. 415 00:19:57,880 --> 00:20:01,080 Speaker 2: So let's let's talk about why more of us should 416 00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:03,720 Speaker 2: be doing more of this than we are, and some 417 00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:08,520 Speaker 2: practical ways people could start lessening their burdens and things 418 00:20:08,600 --> 00:20:09,800 Speaker 2: that don't matter so much. 419 00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:12,520 Speaker 1: Yes, So it was fascinating. 420 00:20:12,520 --> 00:20:15,479 Speaker 5: When I was researching for the book, I found a 421 00:20:15,520 --> 00:20:18,439 Speaker 5: study that researched, you know, people who are making a 422 00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:20,920 Speaker 5: decent income, so probably like a lot of your listeners, 423 00:20:21,200 --> 00:20:24,720 Speaker 5: they're professionals, they make pretty good money, they have good jobs, 424 00:20:25,240 --> 00:20:28,359 Speaker 5: they're not necessarily living hand in mouth or struggling right like, 425 00:20:28,400 --> 00:20:30,960 Speaker 5: they're doing okay, and they're securely middle class or even 426 00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:34,800 Speaker 5: upper middle class. And they found that the people who 427 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:38,920 Speaker 5: delegated and spent their money on buying their time back 428 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:43,080 Speaker 5: actually were so exponentially happier than people who did not. 429 00:20:43,520 --> 00:20:45,600 Speaker 5: So like when you make more money, but you keep 430 00:20:45,640 --> 00:20:48,520 Speaker 5: doing everything you It sort of like expands your levels 431 00:20:48,520 --> 00:20:51,920 Speaker 5: of responsibility, even just say like having a you know, 432 00:20:52,080 --> 00:20:54,960 Speaker 5: like you have children that you're taking care of, you 433 00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:58,199 Speaker 5: have work stuff, you have big responsibilities at work, you 434 00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:00,320 Speaker 5: have things that you're doing to build wealth, and then 435 00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:03,919 Speaker 5: you're doing it all and you're not letting anyone help you, right, 436 00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:06,960 Speaker 5: which is true for especially a lot of women. What 437 00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:09,400 Speaker 5: happened is is that those people were miserable even though 438 00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:11,880 Speaker 5: they were making more money. And so the people who 439 00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:15,120 Speaker 5: made more money and use that additional money to buy 440 00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:20,320 Speaker 5: time versus buying material things were actually exponentially happier. And 441 00:21:20,359 --> 00:21:22,920 Speaker 5: so it's things like just paying people to run errands 442 00:21:22,960 --> 00:21:26,480 Speaker 5: for them, sending their laundry out hiring someone to help 443 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:31,640 Speaker 5: with cleanup, hiring a personal assistant, outsourcing gifts at birthday 444 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:34,400 Speaker 5: time or whatever, or even organizing the birthday. I mean, 445 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:36,760 Speaker 5: I know, my kid's birthdays used to drive me insane 446 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:38,560 Speaker 5: because I want to be on top of it. I 447 00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:39,960 Speaker 5: want to feel like a great mom. I want to 448 00:21:39,960 --> 00:21:42,080 Speaker 5: give them a great day. But it was also like 449 00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:44,840 Speaker 5: all of these moving parts and it was a lot. 450 00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:49,800 Speaker 5: So having help with those things is really important. So 451 00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:52,920 Speaker 5: I pride myself on being a master delegator. I look 452 00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:54,359 Speaker 5: in my to do list every day and say, is 453 00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:56,360 Speaker 5: there anything on here that I could have somebody else 454 00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:58,919 Speaker 5: on my team? Do somebody else in my household do 455 00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:01,280 Speaker 5: so that I don't have to do it? And then 456 00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:03,720 Speaker 5: I can stay focused on the things that are most important. 457 00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:06,560 Speaker 5: And yeah, I mean that has worked for me, and 458 00:22:06,600 --> 00:22:09,600 Speaker 5: it's so funny. I did an Instagram live yesterday with 459 00:22:09,640 --> 00:22:12,119 Speaker 5: my friends, two of my closest friends, and they were 460 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:14,360 Speaker 5: laughing at me, saying, like, you're such a good delegator 461 00:22:14,359 --> 00:22:15,960 Speaker 5: that you don't know how to do anything anymore? 462 00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:18,720 Speaker 3: What's wrong with that? 463 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:22,679 Speaker 5: I'm like, but yes, but I don't need to do 464 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:26,160 Speaker 5: it also, so maybe that's a good thing. But yes, 465 00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:29,240 Speaker 5: it's true, like you can lose some of your skill 466 00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:32,840 Speaker 5: if you outsource it, but also like if you weigh it, 467 00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:35,439 Speaker 5: like how important is that it allows you to focus 468 00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:37,399 Speaker 5: on the important things? And the beauty of it is 469 00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:40,200 Speaker 5: because people always think like delegating means exploiting people. 470 00:22:40,359 --> 00:22:43,040 Speaker 1: I don't exploit people. I pay all my people very well. 471 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:45,760 Speaker 5: Everybody that works for me gets profit sharing, they get 472 00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 5: paid time off, they get a four to one K 473 00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:50,760 Speaker 5: and they are happy, which they tell me on a 474 00:22:50,800 --> 00:22:54,320 Speaker 5: regular basis, and they're doing work that they love that 475 00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:57,199 Speaker 5: lights them up, that is their best work in the 476 00:22:57,240 --> 00:23:00,119 Speaker 5: world right now. And I'm doing what's good for me, 477 00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:02,240 Speaker 5: you know, and what's my best work. I don't think 478 00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:04,400 Speaker 5: you need to be exploitive. I think that is sort 479 00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:06,840 Speaker 5: of like the white supremacy model that we've been taught. 480 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:08,840 Speaker 1: But we don't have to do that. And that's the thing. 481 00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:12,080 Speaker 5: It's like for us, for marginalized people to have money, 482 00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:14,520 Speaker 5: that is a new thing, and so we need to 483 00:23:14,560 --> 00:23:16,840 Speaker 5: find new ways of being with money, new ways to 484 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:20,240 Speaker 5: be in right relationship with money, and you know, new 485 00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:23,919 Speaker 5: ways of working with other people and finding solutions that 486 00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 5: are like win win. 487 00:23:25,119 --> 00:23:26,960 Speaker 1: It doesn't have to be I win, you lose. 488 00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:27,960 Speaker 3: Yeah. 489 00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:30,800 Speaker 2: And it's so interesting because I think we don't talk 490 00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:35,160 Speaker 2: about this, that you have to learn how to be rich. Yes, 491 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:39,159 Speaker 2: there's this assumption that once you have money, if you 492 00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:41,679 Speaker 2: start earning a lot of money, for instance, like you 493 00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:45,000 Speaker 2: will no longer have any problems, perhaps because it solves 494 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:47,600 Speaker 2: all the problems. But you have to figure out how 495 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:49,080 Speaker 2: to use it, like you have to figure out how 496 00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:51,040 Speaker 2: to use it as a tool and This is not 497 00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:53,760 Speaker 2: exactly a problem that lots of people have any sympathy for. 498 00:23:53,800 --> 00:23:56,679 Speaker 3: And not that you should, but it is a skill 499 00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:57,800 Speaker 3: that you have to learn. 500 00:23:57,680 --> 00:23:59,960 Speaker 1: Correct absolutely. 501 00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:01,919 Speaker 5: I mean I joke all the time that I'm like 502 00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:04,200 Speaker 5: new rich or I'm new money. Is what I say 503 00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:06,439 Speaker 5: to some of my friends sometimes. And I go to 504 00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:08,280 Speaker 5: my friends who are a little bit older than me 505 00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:11,600 Speaker 5: or you know, have had money longer, and I say, like, 506 00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:13,760 Speaker 5: what are you doing about this? Like how are you 507 00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:16,200 Speaker 5: saving for retirement? What are you doing with the excess? 508 00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:20,240 Speaker 5: What are your tax strategies? What is your charitable giving strategy? 509 00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:22,320 Speaker 5: And you have to learn these things because you don't 510 00:24:22,320 --> 00:24:24,320 Speaker 5: know it. I mean, my parents did not have this problem, 511 00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:27,040 Speaker 5: and I certainly didn't have this problem until very recently. 512 00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:28,359 Speaker 1: So I think that's true. 513 00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:31,600 Speaker 5: And I do agree that like conversations about money, especially 514 00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:34,280 Speaker 5: when they become more than just enough. If you have 515 00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:36,480 Speaker 5: you can have a little bit more than just enough, 516 00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:39,080 Speaker 5: but don't have more than that. Otherwise we hate you 517 00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:42,120 Speaker 5: and you're you're a bad person, right, especially if you're 518 00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:45,560 Speaker 5: a woman. We absolutely love to knock a successful woman 519 00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:49,480 Speaker 5: off her pedestal. As a society, we desire it, we 520 00:24:49,600 --> 00:24:53,240 Speaker 5: crave it. We freaking love it, sadly, and there's whole 521 00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:56,359 Speaker 5: books written about this concept. It's madness, and you can 522 00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:59,760 Speaker 5: see it with celebrity women as well. We love to 523 00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:01,960 Speaker 5: women up and then knock them off their pedestal, and 524 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,359 Speaker 5: so that is a hazard of making money, but I 525 00:25:04,359 --> 00:25:06,800 Speaker 5: think it's worth it. So yes, for sure, I think 526 00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:08,040 Speaker 5: we have to learn how to make money. And I 527 00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:11,439 Speaker 5: think when we make more than enough, what happens is 528 00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:16,040 Speaker 5: if we talk about it, we're classist or elitist, or 529 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:19,240 Speaker 5: we don't care about people's struggles and we sort of 530 00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:21,040 Speaker 5: no longer connect to It's almost like, once you have 531 00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 5: a certain amount of money, you don't care about anything. 532 00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:26,200 Speaker 5: But money is the assumption, right, which is absolutely wrong. 533 00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:28,159 Speaker 5: You do still have problems, you do still have to 534 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:30,600 Speaker 5: figure things out, and often you are very generous because 535 00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:32,919 Speaker 5: when you have access, you can be more generous than 536 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:35,320 Speaker 5: you can be when you don't, Like I could be 537 00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:37,760 Speaker 5: more generous as a friend than I could be one 538 00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:40,000 Speaker 5: of my children were really young. When my children were 539 00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:41,320 Speaker 5: really little, I was like, yeah. 540 00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:41,800 Speaker 3: It can't help you. 541 00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:44,879 Speaker 5: I'm very occupied. But now I got more time. Now 542 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:47,600 Speaker 5: I could be more generous. Right, So I think we 543 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:49,280 Speaker 5: have to think of it that way. But yes, we 544 00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:51,760 Speaker 5: need to have more conversations about money, especially as women 545 00:25:51,840 --> 00:25:53,720 Speaker 5: and sharing our secrets. What are we getting paid for 546 00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:54,439 Speaker 5: speaking gigs? 547 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:54,680 Speaker 2: Right? 548 00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:57,320 Speaker 1: Like? How do you get those big clients? Right? How 549 00:25:57,320 --> 00:25:58,719 Speaker 1: do you get those brand deals? 550 00:25:58,720 --> 00:25:58,800 Speaker 3: Like? 551 00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:01,320 Speaker 5: Yes, let's tell people, tell people how much we're making 552 00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:04,000 Speaker 5: and what we're doing I think is really important. 553 00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:07,679 Speaker 2: Yeah, great, just a few more quick questions because we're 554 00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:10,639 Speaker 2: almost out of time here, But how can we change 555 00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:13,400 Speaker 2: our money self talk? You have some great new scripts 556 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:16,239 Speaker 2: that people can start saying in their brains. What are 557 00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:18,560 Speaker 2: some of the more powerful ones people can start saying 558 00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:19,360 Speaker 2: to themselves? 559 00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:22,320 Speaker 5: Yeah, well it's about like, you know, we have these 560 00:26:22,359 --> 00:26:25,040 Speaker 5: thoughts that you know, I call them million dollar thoughts 561 00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:29,480 Speaker 5: versus broke thoughts, and I want us to replace those 562 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,800 Speaker 5: broke thoughts with million dollar thoughts, right, with things like, well, 563 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:34,639 Speaker 5: I'm in debt and I always will be. Might be 564 00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:36,520 Speaker 5: a story that you tell yourself when you could just 565 00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 5: tell yourself a new story like I'm in debt right 566 00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:41,439 Speaker 5: now and other people have gotten out of it and 567 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:43,400 Speaker 5: been able to build wealth, and I can do it too. 568 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:46,240 Speaker 5: And that's actually the truth of the matter, right, We 569 00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,320 Speaker 5: actually the broke. Thoughts are broke because it's lies. It's 570 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,479 Speaker 5: actually not true, pretending that there's no possibility when there 571 00:26:52,520 --> 00:26:55,720 Speaker 5: absolutely is. Maybe it's not easy, maybe it's not going 572 00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:57,760 Speaker 5: to like walk up to you and like slap you 573 00:26:57,800 --> 00:26:59,439 Speaker 5: in the face, but you're gonna have to put in 574 00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:03,199 Speaker 5: some help grease, but it is definitely within reach. So 575 00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:05,720 Speaker 5: I think it starts with not saying like, oh, I'm 576 00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:08,440 Speaker 5: bad with money, which is something that you know, society 577 00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:11,399 Speaker 5: teaches women that were bad with money, and just say like, 578 00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:13,159 Speaker 5: I don't know that much about money yet, but I 579 00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:15,800 Speaker 5: can learn, you know, is another way. And so there's 580 00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:18,479 Speaker 5: all of these reframes in the book about how to 581 00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:21,560 Speaker 5: shift the stories that you tell yourself about what you 582 00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:23,800 Speaker 5: can do with money. I used to like whenever I 583 00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:26,800 Speaker 5: had money, it would just rapidly disappear. That used to 584 00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:28,639 Speaker 5: be my problem. I found a way to like spend 585 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:32,240 Speaker 5: every dime that came into my possessions. It's like, subconsciously 586 00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:34,720 Speaker 5: I didn't trust myself with money, and I just felt 587 00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:36,600 Speaker 5: like I was going to squander it and make bad decisions. 588 00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:38,200 Speaker 5: So it was almost like I was like get it away, 589 00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:40,320 Speaker 5: like it's hot coal, Like let me throw it as 590 00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:44,560 Speaker 5: quickly as possible. And so I had to learn actually 591 00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:46,800 Speaker 5: to just sit with money, like to have money and 592 00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:48,640 Speaker 5: leave it in my bank account and not touch it 593 00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:51,320 Speaker 5: and be like, that's mine and I have money, you 594 00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:53,840 Speaker 5: know what I mean, and get comfortable just with that. 595 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:56,640 Speaker 5: So I think it's important to just doing thought work, 596 00:27:56,800 --> 00:28:00,360 Speaker 5: retraining our brain to believe something different about our relifationship 597 00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:00,919 Speaker 5: with money. 598 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:03,199 Speaker 3: Yep, that we can be very good with money. 599 00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:06,160 Speaker 2: Well, Rachel, we always end with a love of the week, 600 00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:08,520 Speaker 2: which is just something that we're enjoying this week. We 601 00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:11,680 Speaker 2: try to keep it positive on this podcast. How old 602 00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:14,000 Speaker 2: are your kids now? Holds your youngest one. 603 00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:17,760 Speaker 1: My youngest one just turned three and then I'm an 604 00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:18,680 Speaker 1: eight nine year old. 605 00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:21,639 Speaker 2: Yeah, so you can probably sympathize with this. I just 606 00:28:21,680 --> 00:28:24,840 Speaker 2: put blackout shades in the room where my toddler sleeps. 607 00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:31,320 Speaker 2: It's like a total game changer. Yes, So, like not 608 00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:34,160 Speaker 2: waking up at five point forty five with the sun 609 00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:35,600 Speaker 2: is a beautiful thing. 610 00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:38,120 Speaker 3: So that is my love of the week. 611 00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:41,800 Speaker 5: I love that. That does sound fabulous. It's like one 612 00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:43,200 Speaker 5: of those major upgrades. 613 00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:46,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, a major cheap, but a major upgrade. So what's 614 00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:48,000 Speaker 2: working for you right now? 615 00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:48,440 Speaker 3: Rachel. 616 00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:51,360 Speaker 1: It's interesting. I'm trying to think. 617 00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:55,400 Speaker 5: I mean, I think, honestly, it's probably around food. Okay, 618 00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,920 Speaker 5: Like it's summertime and I've been eating salads for lunch 619 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:01,840 Speaker 5: for I don't know, six months, and I'm so over it. 620 00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:06,120 Speaker 5: So I've had ratitui this week, which is like a 621 00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 5: nice it's a roasted vegetable dish, and then I just 622 00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:11,640 Speaker 5: like I had it with couscous, I had it with chicken, 623 00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:13,480 Speaker 5: and like I've been eating it all week, just in 624 00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:16,440 Speaker 5: different ways and it's been magical. And then another thing 625 00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:18,400 Speaker 5: that I really look forward to every night. It's like 626 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:23,520 Speaker 5: my special treat at night is sparkling water with fruit juice. 627 00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:27,320 Speaker 5: I drink Spend Drift, I think is the brand that 628 00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:31,600 Speaker 5: I love. Anyway, the orange flavored one is life changing, wonderful. 629 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:34,400 Speaker 5: So I just I'm just trying to like eat healthy 630 00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:37,280 Speaker 5: and not grab a cookie every time I'm feeling stressed, 631 00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:40,160 Speaker 5: because I notice that, like every time I'm like just 632 00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 5: tired or cranky or whatever, it's like a cookie will 633 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:45,600 Speaker 5: solve all my problems, and I'm like, maybe it won't. 634 00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:49,160 Speaker 2: Actually, Okay, it's like money, maybe it'll solve all the problems. 635 00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:52,120 Speaker 2: Maybe it will some of the problems, Yeah, all of 636 00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:55,680 Speaker 2: the problems exactly. Well, Rachel, tell our listeners where they 637 00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:56,880 Speaker 2: can find out more about you. 638 00:29:57,680 --> 00:29:59,880 Speaker 5: Yes, well, you can hang out with me over on 639 00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:03,240 Speaker 5: on Instagram. I'm at Rache Rogers ESQ. If you want 640 00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:05,720 Speaker 5: to check out the ranch and see our shenanigans with 641 00:30:05,760 --> 00:30:09,120 Speaker 5: the horses, you could go to the Rogers Ranch. That's 642 00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:11,719 Speaker 5: Rogers with a D. And you can check out our 643 00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:13,640 Speaker 5: website at Hello seven dot com. And we have a 644 00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:15,840 Speaker 5: podcast too called the Hello seven Podcast. 645 00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:18,880 Speaker 2: Wonderful and please pick up a copy of her book. 646 00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:21,120 Speaker 2: We should all be millionaires. Rachel, thank you so much 647 00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:21,760 Speaker 2: for joining us. 648 00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:23,520 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having me. 649 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:25,800 Speaker 3: Well, that was awesome. 650 00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:28,520 Speaker 2: I'm so glad to have Rachel on the show. This 651 00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:32,360 Speaker 2: brings us to our question section. So we got a 652 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,240 Speaker 2: listener question saying congrats on your two hundredth show. We 653 00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:37,360 Speaker 2: just had that come out, so please go back and 654 00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:39,680 Speaker 2: listen to all those. She's been a listener since twenty 655 00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:42,720 Speaker 2: nineteen and is glad that we have been sharing our thoughts. Anyway, 656 00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:45,720 Speaker 2: She's got more than twenty five years of working experience, 657 00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:49,200 Speaker 2: and about half a year ago she just took on 658 00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:54,680 Speaker 2: a major major leadership role within her large company, and 659 00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:56,960 Speaker 2: she had a nice little note thanking us for helping 660 00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:59,040 Speaker 2: her know that she could take the leap. We won't 661 00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:01,640 Speaker 2: take credit for it, but we're glad to know we 662 00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:05,640 Speaker 2: had a small part in nudging her to that. She 663 00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:08,360 Speaker 2: says she now has a lot more budget, direct reports, 664 00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:12,040 Speaker 2: consultants working for her, etc. Control over resources and team 665 00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:15,880 Speaker 2: go her. However, she said she recently completed a leadership 666 00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:19,080 Speaker 2: potential assessment. The results were good, but she realized she 667 00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:23,240 Speaker 2: may not be behaving assertively enough in some situations or 668 00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:26,960 Speaker 2: pushing her team hard enough. She says, thinking through her 669 00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:29,760 Speaker 2: previous roles, she probably put more of an emphasis on 670 00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:33,600 Speaker 2: preserving positive relationships with her peers. And now that she 671 00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:36,720 Speaker 2: is the big boss, that's not her words. 672 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:39,600 Speaker 3: That's mine. She's wondering how. 673 00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:41,360 Speaker 2: She should change with that, and if she needs to 674 00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:43,360 Speaker 2: learn to be more assertive, and do we have any 675 00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:47,960 Speaker 2: resources for figuring that out. So, Sarah, as a leader yourself, 676 00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:49,440 Speaker 2: what do you have to say about that? 677 00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:53,840 Speaker 4: Well, you know, interestingly, as I listened to this question again, 678 00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:58,640 Speaker 4: I thought about how I probably have some of similar 679 00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:02,120 Speaker 4: challenges in at some time times I do want to 680 00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:07,600 Speaker 4: preserve relationships over exerting authority in instances where maybe a 681 00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:10,960 Speaker 4: little more authority is needed. So I guess I understand 682 00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:13,200 Speaker 4: this challenge, so I may not have a great answer. 683 00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:16,800 Speaker 4: I do recommend the book Crucial Conversations. It's not just 684 00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:22,040 Speaker 4: about having specific conversations, but more about running teams and leadership, 685 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:25,800 Speaker 4: and it was a pretty good read that might have 686 00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:29,000 Speaker 4: some relevance to this topic. I also welcome you to 687 00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:32,360 Speaker 4: question no, is the goal specifically to be assertive, which, 688 00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:36,280 Speaker 4: unfortunately for women can have can be a little trickier 689 00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:36,920 Speaker 4: than it is. 690 00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:38,160 Speaker 3: For those of the male gender. 691 00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:41,080 Speaker 4: Or is your goal to lead your team successfully? And 692 00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:44,640 Speaker 4: maybe there are ways in which you can be leading 693 00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:47,800 Speaker 4: towards success but without overt assertiveness. 694 00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:48,120 Speaker 1: I don't know. 695 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:49,600 Speaker 4: I don't know the answer to that, and this is 696 00:32:49,640 --> 00:32:52,560 Speaker 4: not certainly an area that I have expertise in, but 697 00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:54,720 Speaker 4: just questions to think about. And I think Laura has 698 00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:57,560 Speaker 4: some more ideas for specific resources you might turn to. 699 00:32:58,200 --> 00:33:00,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, one thing I'd recommend checking out is fran 700 00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:04,040 Speaker 2: Hauser's book. Fran Hauser was a guest on this program, 701 00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:06,640 Speaker 2: maybe be about two years ago. Her book is called 702 00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:08,880 Speaker 2: The Myth of the Nice Girl, and she had a 703 00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:12,480 Speaker 2: hugely successful corporate career booth at time ink and other 704 00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:17,280 Speaker 2: places where she was just very nice. She's a lovely woman, 705 00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:20,120 Speaker 2: but she was lovely as a boss as well. And 706 00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:23,160 Speaker 2: long story short, what she talks about is that you 707 00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:25,600 Speaker 2: have to be you. It is going to be totally 708 00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:29,000 Speaker 2: inauthentic if you suddenly come in guns ablazing because you 709 00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:31,240 Speaker 2: read in some management book that that is what you 710 00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:34,200 Speaker 2: are supposed to do to be assertive. And so one 711 00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:37,200 Speaker 2: of the ways that she was successful is all of 712 00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:39,760 Speaker 2: it felt a little bit more like a dialogue. So 713 00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:42,960 Speaker 2: if you think that your team could push more and 714 00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:45,520 Speaker 2: you think they are not doing so, ask them for 715 00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:47,880 Speaker 2: some stretch goals. Be like, okay, well this is you 716 00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:49,560 Speaker 2: know what we're aiming for right now. Tell me what 717 00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:51,960 Speaker 2: you think your stretch goals would be. Talk about what 718 00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:54,840 Speaker 2: resources you could give them to make them happen. Like, hey, 719 00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:56,920 Speaker 2: that sounds like a great idea of what you think 720 00:33:56,920 --> 00:33:58,320 Speaker 2: you could do. What if I gave you two more 721 00:33:58,360 --> 00:33:59,720 Speaker 2: people on your team, what do you think you could 722 00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:01,760 Speaker 2: do that? I mean, if you have control of resources. 723 00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:04,000 Speaker 2: Frame it that way, right, and it's really a dialogue. 724 00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:06,320 Speaker 2: You know, could you meet an earlier deadline? If I 725 00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:10,480 Speaker 2: did that. If you are unhappy with someone's performance, you 726 00:34:10,520 --> 00:34:13,560 Speaker 2: can absolutely tell them that. You can also frame that 727 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:17,600 Speaker 2: as a problem solving conversation, Like, I think we both 728 00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:20,440 Speaker 2: recognized this was a really tough project. How can we 729 00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:22,759 Speaker 2: work together to get better results next time? What can 730 00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:25,160 Speaker 2: I do to support you? What would change this? But 731 00:34:25,280 --> 00:34:28,839 Speaker 2: approaching it from that sort of problem solving dialogue perspective 732 00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:31,759 Speaker 2: can help you really lead, but also have people who 733 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,320 Speaker 2: honestly would jump off a cliff for you, right, And 734 00:34:34,680 --> 00:34:36,640 Speaker 2: that's what you want to do, Like, you want your 735 00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:41,480 Speaker 2: team to be motivated to achieve great results together. And 736 00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:44,440 Speaker 2: maybe sometimes people do that because they're scared of the boss, 737 00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:46,920 Speaker 2: but they're going to work harder if it's because they 738 00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:50,360 Speaker 2: really love you and want to see everyone succeed together. 739 00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:52,960 Speaker 2: So I don't know that it's assertiveness. I think what 740 00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:55,799 Speaker 2: you need to do is lean in more to being you, 741 00:34:56,440 --> 00:35:00,279 Speaker 2: but you in charge and you working together with your 742 00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 2: team to make awesome things happen. But I think she 743 00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:05,640 Speaker 2: sounds like she's pretty good with that as it is. 744 00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:08,880 Speaker 4: Yes, maybe she'll send us an update several months in 745 00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:10,680 Speaker 4: and let us know how it is going in her 746 00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:11,959 Speaker 4: new amazing role. 747 00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:13,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, all right. 748 00:35:13,360 --> 00:35:15,680 Speaker 2: Well, this has been best of both worlds. We've been 749 00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:19,040 Speaker 2: talking with Rachel Rogers about how we should all be millionaires. 750 00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:21,879 Speaker 2: I hope everyone enjoyed that. But we'll be back next 751 00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:24,160 Speaker 2: week with more on making work and life fit together. 752 00:35:26,080 --> 00:35:28,840 Speaker 4: Thanks for listening. You can find me Sarah at the 753 00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:33,239 Speaker 4: shoebox dot com or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram, 754 00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:34,040 Speaker 4: and you. 755 00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:38,239 Speaker 6: Can find me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. This 756 00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:41,520 Speaker 6: has been the best of both worlds podcasts. Please join 757 00:35:41,640 --> 00:35:44,360 Speaker 6: us next time for more on making work and life 758 00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:45,160 Speaker 6: work together.