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Speaker 1: On the evening of October eighteenth, nineteen ninety six, seventeen

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Speaker 1: year old Cain's story came over to see his friend

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Speaker 1: Brian Bowling, who lived with his family in a trailer

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Speaker 1: near Rome, Georgia. Cain had brought along his father's revolver,

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Speaker 1: and the two boys sat in Brian's bed and passed

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Speaker 1: it back and forth, pretending to play Russian Roulette while

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Speaker 1: Brian talked to his girlfriend Caprice on the phone. Suddenly,

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Speaker 1: Caprice heard screaming, and then a few moments later she

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Speaker 1: heard someone hang up the phone. Brian had been shot

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Speaker 1: in the head and was rushed to the hospital, where

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Speaker 1: he died the next day. Initially, Cain told police that

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Speaker 1: his friend had accidentally shot himself, but during a second

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Speaker 1: interrogation two days later, Cain made a statement that the

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Speaker 1: gun had been in his hand when it went off,

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Speaker 1: though he insisted it had been an accident. Then a

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Speaker 1: witness came forward, claiming that Brian, kan and their friendly

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Speaker 1: Clark had all been members of a vicious gang called

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Speaker 1: the Free Birds, and that Brian's death had been retaliation

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Speaker 1: for him snitching by the theft that they'd committed. So

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Speaker 1: police began investigating the incident as a homicide, ultimately charging

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Speaker 1: Cain and Lee with Brian's murder. At trial, a witness

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Speaker 1: testified that Cain and Lee had bragged to her about

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Speaker 1: exacting their revenge on Brian, and a handwritten note found

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Speaker 1: talking to Brian's coffin corroborated the gang killing narrative. It

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Speaker 1: was right there in black and white. But this is

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Speaker 1: wrongful conviction. Welcome back to wrongful Conviction. I'm Susan Simpson,

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Speaker 1: host of the podcast Proof and Undisclosed, filling in for

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Speaker 1: Jason Flohm. Today's case is one that Justinna Davis and

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Speaker 1: I covered in season one of Proof. In nineteen ninety six,

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Speaker 1: fifteen year old Brian Bowling died of a gunshot wound

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Speaker 1: to the head, and eventually his seventeen year old friends

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Speaker 1: Lee Clark and Kane's Story were wrongfully convicted of his death,

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Speaker 1: and a confluence of fabrications, coercion, and misconduct led to

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Speaker 1: their arrest and conviction. And we're about to get to

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Speaker 1: all of that. But first here today to share his

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Speaker 1: incredible story is Lee Clark. Lee. It's great to see

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Speaker 1: you again, and see you too, Susan. Now, Lee, before

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Speaker 1: we get into everything that happened. Can you tell the

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Speaker 1: audience a little bit about you?

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Speaker 2: I was born in Rowing, Georgia, Floyd County. Most of

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Speaker 2: my childhood, my early childhood. I grew up in our

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Speaker 2: Murchy but went to Glenwood Elementary School. I've only got

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Speaker 2: one blood brother, my brother Jamie. And I've got step

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Speaker 2: sister or stepbrother Candy and Mark.

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Speaker 1: And then the lead up to all of this, to

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Speaker 1: what happened in K and A six, you were seventeen

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Speaker 1: years old and living in a small community south of Rome,

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Speaker 1: Georgia called Silver Creek.

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Speaker 3: At that point in my life, I was young.

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Speaker 2: It's all one you at all. I was really dumber

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Speaker 2: on a box of rocks, is what my daddy used

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Speaker 2: to tell me. He's probably right too.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I was.

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Speaker 2: Getting into a lot of trouble back in nineteen ninety

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Speaker 2: six doing stuff I wasn't supposed to be doing, and

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Speaker 2: breaking into people's homes and stuff like that. I wasn't

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Speaker 2: knowl enough to do it. But we drank a little

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Speaker 2: bit if we'd get alcohol. If not that, we'd be

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Speaker 2: smoking marijuana or something. Just hanging out as kids doing.

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Speaker 3: Doing crazy stupid junk kids do. Teenagers do.

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Speaker 1: And one of your oldest friends was Cain. Tell me

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Speaker 1: about him.

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Speaker 2: I came we were coming up, coming through high school

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Speaker 2: and stuff, and he would be involved in some of

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Speaker 2: the stuff I was doing. But Kane, he was more

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Speaker 2: of a kind of goodie two shoes. He hung out

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Speaker 2: with the preppy crowd a lot that they all time

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Speaker 2: questioned him a lot about why he was hanging out

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Speaker 2: with me. And that's just because of the way I

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Speaker 2: was back then. I was just a young, stupid teenage kid.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I wasn't bad as I made out to be.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I just wanted people to think that, so

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Speaker 3: a lot of people would stay away from me.

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Speaker 1: And one of the boys that you guys hung out

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Speaker 1: with with a guy named Brian Bowling. How did you

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Speaker 1: know Brian.

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Speaker 2: I originally met Brian through Kane. When Kane moved out

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Speaker 2: to Silver Creek, he introduced me to Brian, and me

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Speaker 2: and Brian we became friends. Me and Brian were as

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Speaker 2: closest Kine and Brian were. I mean, I lot Brian,

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Speaker 2: I mean I love Brian. He was a good friend

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Speaker 2: of mine, and just as I got a little bit older,

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Speaker 2: me being down there at his house became less frequent.

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Speaker 1: So were of ninety six. There was an incident that

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Speaker 1: happened when you were over at Cane's house. Tell me

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Speaker 1: about that.

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Speaker 2: It was on October third, nineteen ninety six. Day haunts

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Speaker 2: me still to this day. Is something a regret of

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Speaker 2: mine that I lived with. It's today that I went

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Speaker 2: to Cayne's house and all of us teenage boys over me, Caine,

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Speaker 2: his buddy Joseph Wilkins, and a buddy of mine named

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Speaker 2: Pete Jordan. We all decided we was going to steal

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Speaker 2: Cayne's diaddy safe from him.

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Speaker 1: So the four of you stole the safe from Cane's dad,

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Speaker 1: took down the woods, busted it up, got some cash

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Speaker 1: out of it. How long did y'all get away with

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Speaker 1: a crime?

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Speaker 2: I was arrested four days after we stole this safe.

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Speaker 2: Caine and his buddy Joseph Wilkins, they were arrested today

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Speaker 2: we stole it, and then my friend Pete Jordan was

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Speaker 2: arrested three days later on October the tenth.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so it was not the crime of the century.

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Speaker 1: Y'all did not get away with it first more than a.

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Speaker 3: Few weeks, of course. No, it was straight stupid. It

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Speaker 3: is what it was Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Now, so Brian lived just down the hill for I'm Kane,

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Speaker 1: but he had nothing to do with this safe thas.

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Speaker 3: Right, No, no, he didn't have anything to do with it.

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Speaker 1: But as we'll see, that incident, along with Brian's close

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Speaker 1: friendship with Cain, became important the prosecution's case. But for now,

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Speaker 1: let's go back to just after the safeist. The night

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Speaker 1: this happened, both Kane and his friend Joseph Fulkins were

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Speaker 1: both arrested, and since shortly after you and your friend

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Speaker 1: Pete Jordan were also arrested, well, logically it made sense

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Speaker 1: that either Kin or Joseph Fulkins had been the ones

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Speaker 1: to give you up. Again, though this was not the

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Speaker 1: crime of the century, the stakes were pretty low, and

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Speaker 1: that brings us to what happened October eighteenth, nineteen ninety six.

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Speaker 2: On October eighteenth, so I went to make Caine that

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Speaker 2: day because I know I'd been arrested in CHRS. I

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Speaker 2: just wanted to find out for him if it had

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Speaker 2: been his buddy Joseph did it told on us? Or

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Speaker 2: if it was had been Kane did it did it?

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Speaker 2: I knew it had to be one of them, I

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Speaker 2: just was sure which one and I made him. He

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Speaker 2: sat there each tell him me. He swording up down

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Speaker 2: and may it wasn't him. He didn't do it. He

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Speaker 2: don't know who did it. And he played that on

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Speaker 2: and on. So it's made to believe his friend Joseph

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Speaker 2: was one told on us. What come to find out

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Speaker 2: a trial it was both Kane and Joseph they had

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Speaker 2: told on us.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so but that night you talked to Caine, He's like, no, man,

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Speaker 1: wasn't me. I didn't telling y'all. And your little brother

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Speaker 1: was there too.

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Speaker 3: Right, Yes, he was there. You have my little brother, Jamie.

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Speaker 1: The three of you ended up just kind of hanging out.

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Speaker 3: For a while. Yeah. Yeah, we just rolled around when

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Speaker 3: shoot some pool and stuff like that, what kind of stuff.

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Speaker 1: That's all in the motion, though, was that night before

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Speaker 1: Cain went out to meet with you and Jamie he

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Speaker 1: decided to grab a revolver from his dad's bedside table.

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Speaker 1: He was gonna go target cheoting. It was not the

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Speaker 1: smartest idea since he was already in trouble with his dad.

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Speaker 1: But well, while you're hanging out, he pulls the gun

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Speaker 1: out and he shows it to you and even fires

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Speaker 1: it out of a car window. While you're driving around,

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Speaker 1: just playing around. Eventually you decided to take him home.

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Speaker 3: I wasn't going back to his house, cousin.

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Speaker 2: I wasn't gonna take no chance of his parents being home,

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Speaker 2: his mom or anything, or his dad. I don't want

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Speaker 2: either one tore saving me back to his house. So

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Speaker 2: I dropped him all the same place. I picked him

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Speaker 2: up at Silver Creetman in the market. You know, I

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Speaker 2: think about something now that I told Kane back then

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Speaker 2: that uh me telling him this. I could still hear

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Speaker 2: it so clearly in my head that wakes me up

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Speaker 2: sometimes the middle of the night still to this day.

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Speaker 2: I told him when was pulling up I was getting out,

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Speaker 2: I told him, I said, look, we've done stole yourdaddy

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Speaker 2: safe and now here it is. You've got your daddy's

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Speaker 2: gun on you. I said, if your diddy comes in

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Speaker 2: says that gun gone, he's gonna swer up down that

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Speaker 2: we stole that too. So I don't need this hanging

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Speaker 2: over me, like, just take that gun back home where

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Speaker 2: you got it from. Well, hey, sister and tells me, yeah, man,

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna do it. I said, Okay, I'm serious, man,

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Speaker 2: Just get out the car, go straight home.

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Speaker 3: Put that gun back.

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Speaker 2: He swears up and down to me he's gonna do it,

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Speaker 2: And that's the complete opposite of what he just told

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Speaker 2: me he was feeling to do.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, after you dropped him off with the mini, mart

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Speaker 1: Kin did not go directly home. Instead, he stopped at

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Speaker 1: Brian's trailer on the way. They are now Brian's parents,

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Speaker 1: his sister, and her boyfriend. They were all in the

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Speaker 1: living room watching TV with some neighbors, Waining and Charlie Childers.

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Speaker 1: When King got there, came knocking the door, said hi

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Speaker 1: to everyone. They told him that Brian's back in the

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Speaker 1: bedroom talking to his girlfriend Caprice. So he goes back

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Speaker 1: there and finds Brian sos high and you know they

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Speaker 1: they're two teenage boys on the phone with the girlfriends.

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Speaker 1: So they start passing the phone back and forth talking

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Speaker 1: to her. Then at some point Kane puts out his

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Speaker 1: gun and shows it to Brian and he's like, came in,

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Speaker 1: look what I got. So what happened then?

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Speaker 2: Well, the way Kane explains it to me, he's in

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Speaker 2: there and him and Brian put the bullet in the

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Speaker 2: gun and he says they started playing Russian rou lit

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Speaker 2: and he said there was cheating. They was putting it

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Speaker 2: in there, and they was taking the chamber of a revolver.

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Speaker 2: Anybody who knows anything about the revolver knows if you're

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Speaker 2: looking down at it from the back of it, you

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Speaker 2: can see where the bullets were at. And that's what

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Speaker 2: they were doing. They were taking the revolver and they

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Speaker 2: were spinning it to the bottom and making sure the

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Speaker 2: bullets wouldn't know where around down there. And then they

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Speaker 2: were cocking it, sticking it to her head and pulling

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Speaker 2: the trigger. And Kane says they had went back a

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Speaker 2: couple of rounds like he is, back and forth and

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Speaker 2: the whole time, Brian is the phone with his girlfriend,

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Speaker 2: Caprice Hoyt, and he tells Kane to tell her what

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Speaker 2: I'm doing. So Kane tells her He's playing Russian rou lit. Now,

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Speaker 2: first she didn't know what it was. I mean, she

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Speaker 2: was a little alarm by, but she didn't know what

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Speaker 2: Russan roulett was. I mean, she was telling him, tell

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Speaker 2: him to stop, but she she didn't understand fully what

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Speaker 2: he was in there doing, sticking it to his head,

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Speaker 2: pulling the trigger until her mom came in later after

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Speaker 2: the fact, and she asked her mom what rushing Roulette was,

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Speaker 2: and her mom told her what it was. Well, Kane,

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Speaker 2: he plays it and then Brian just he says, let

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Speaker 2: me see that gun. What Kane says, he snatched it

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Speaker 2: from him, opened it up, spun the cylinder, slapped it

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Speaker 2: back in, caught the hammer back. When Brian stuck it

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Speaker 2: to his head, Kane says, he looked at him and

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Speaker 2: told him and said, don't do it, bro He said

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Speaker 2: it's to one.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 2: Kane says that Brian looked at him and said you

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Speaker 2: think so and pulled the trigger.

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Speaker 3: Now, that's what Kine has told me.

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Speaker 2: Every time I've talked to him about this stuff, every

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Speaker 2: time I've confronted him body, He's always told me the

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Speaker 2: same thing and the.

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Speaker 3: Truth he told right now.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I can't tell you one hundred percent positive

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Speaker 2: what went downe in there, but that's like I've told

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Speaker 2: you before, Susan. Look, I've struggled with that stuff for

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Speaker 2: many and many years. If he may have accidentally did

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Speaker 2: it and didn't want to tell me, but there's too

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Speaker 2: much stuff too support it, and that's why I choose

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Speaker 2: to believe it.

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Speaker 1: And a lot of what was observed immediately after the

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Speaker 1: shooting supports what can say. The folks in the living

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Speaker 1: room who had heard the gunshot rushed into Brian's room

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Speaker 1: and found him there on the floor with blood pulled

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Speaker 1: around his head and critically the gun was underneath Brian

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Speaker 1: where he was lying on the floor, and Caprice was

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Speaker 1: still in the phone. She was yelling trying to figure

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Speaker 1: it what was happening she could kill the screaming, heard

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Speaker 1: someone say they got to call her back, and the

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Speaker 1: line going dead as the family then calls nine one

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Speaker 1: one very quickly after that, the police and paramedics arrive

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Speaker 1: and Brian was transported to the hospital as he fought

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Speaker 1: for his life. Meanwhile, though, Lee, you had no idea

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Speaker 1: that any of this was happening. After you dropped can off,

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Speaker 1: what did you do the rest.

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Speaker 2: Of the night, Me and my brother turned around with

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Speaker 2: my apartment in Lyndale where my girlfriend Shelley at a time,

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Speaker 2: and a bunch of my other buddies were showing up

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Speaker 2: over there. I was having a party at my apartment

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Speaker 2: that night and we got over went to party and dranking,

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Speaker 2: smoking while you doing stupid teenager stuff.

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Speaker 1: And at around eight thirty that night, two of your

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Speaker 1: friends Doug and Dawn were dropped out by their mom,

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Speaker 1: and she testified later at trial that while she was

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Speaker 1: there to drop her sons off, you were standing out

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Speaker 1: by her car and you were talking, and she told

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Speaker 1: you that something was happening down at Brian Bowling's place.

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Speaker 2: I asked her what she meant, and she told me

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Speaker 2: that there's a bunch of cop cars down in their driveways.

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Speaker 2: We were making all kinds of sumptions to what we

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Speaker 2: thought it may have been, but we were fall off face.

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Speaker 1: The next morning, the doctors told Brian's family that there

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Speaker 1: was no hope of recovery, and his parents agreed to

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Speaker 1: donate his organs, and around noon the day after he

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Speaker 1: was shot, he was declared dead.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, the next morning I got up and I found

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Speaker 2: out that two different people that Brian had shot herself

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Speaker 2: the night before. My mom had called me and told me,

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Speaker 2: and also Doug and Don's grandmother had told us about

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Speaker 2: it when she come by to pick Doug.

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Speaker 3: And down up.

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Speaker 1: Now, during the initial investigation, the police took photos of

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Speaker 1: the scene and talked to some of the family and

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Speaker 1: other witnesses at the hospital, and of course they talked

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Speaker 1: to Kane, who was taken down to the police station

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Speaker 1: and had his hand swap for gunshot residue. When the

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Speaker 1: police spoke to Caprice, she corroborated Cane's story that Brian

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Speaker 1: and Kan told her on the phone that they had

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Speaker 1: a gun and they were playing Russian Roulette. The last

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Speaker 1: thing she heard was Brian saying I'm playing with the gun,

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Speaker 1: followed by screaming and someone hanging up. After talking to

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Speaker 1: Kane at Caprice, the police initially declared it next andal death.

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Speaker 1: An autopsy, if it was done, would have shown conclusively

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Speaker 1: that Brian had been holding the gun up to his

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Speaker 1: head when it was fired, except one was never done,

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Speaker 1: or at least there's no record of it. Unfortunately, without

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Speaker 1: an autopsy, and after talking to Brian's family as well,

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Speaker 1: investigators were free to get imaginative. So later that weekend,

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Speaker 1: Detective Dallas Battle and Sergeant Mike Wallace brought Caanan for

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Speaker 1: a second interview. This time they recorded it. At first,

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Speaker 1: Cain insist again and again that Brian shot himself and

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Speaker 1: they've been playing Russian Roulette and it was something more

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Speaker 1: than that. But detectives keep telling him, we know you

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Speaker 1: had the gun. Just tell us you had the gun.

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Speaker 1: If you tell us that you had the gun when

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Speaker 1: it went off, nothing will happen to you. You won't

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Speaker 1: be in trouble to tell us that. And after this

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Speaker 1: goes on for half an hour or so, Kane eventually

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Speaker 1: gives in and says that, yeah, the gun was in

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Speaker 1: my hand when it went off. Lee, what has Kane

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Speaker 1: told you about this interview?

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Speaker 2: Well, he said they kept coming at him, but during

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Speaker 2: the interview they were making him singing like that it

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Speaker 2: was no big deal that he just say what they

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Speaker 2: wanted him to say. They won't gonna be in any trouble.

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Speaker 2: Just go ahead and bit to you did this wild?

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Speaker 2: You say what was then accident? That's gonna be it

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Speaker 2: and we can now all go home. And Kane, being

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Speaker 2: young like he was, battles tricked him. He just deceived

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Speaker 2: him into it. I mean, Kane, he's easily misled. I

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Speaker 2: mean he's always been that way. He's a full grown

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Speaker 2: man now and I hate to say it, but he's

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Speaker 2: still easily misled today.

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Speaker 1: So when Cain admitted to this, to having the gun

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Speaker 1: in his hand when it accidentally goes off, he's arrested

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Speaker 1: charges manslaughter and at least a bond and then a few

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Speaker 1: months later, that gunshot residue test comes back and it's negative.

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Speaker 1: There was no jess horn Kan's hands. Now, these tests

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Speaker 1: are often junk science because the false positives and false

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Speaker 1: negatives they can generate. You can hear all about that

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Speaker 1: on Wrong Fiction Junk Science. We'll have that episode linked

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Speaker 1: in this episode's bio. But Dallas Battle believed in these tests,

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Speaker 1: and since Kane tested negative for gunshot residue, this gave

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Speaker 1: Dallas Battle a problem because if this was a murder,

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Speaker 1: that meant Kin couldn't have done it, and he now

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Speaker 1: needed a second shooter, which is what made leads wrongful

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Speaker 1: conviction even possible. So Lee, how do you think you

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Speaker 1: got drawn to this whole investigation?

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Speaker 2: Well, shortly after Brian had shot herself and everything, I

333
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Speaker 2: was hearing all these rumors, these lies going around that

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Speaker 2: I was there, that I was hit outside, all this

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Speaker 2: and that, and I wasn't sure where all that was

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00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:24,080
Speaker 2: coming from at the time, But later down the line,

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Speaker 2: after I was all said and done, I started pacing

338
00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:28,880
Speaker 2: together had been coming from a guy that I knew

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Speaker 2: when I was younger and had a little bad blove

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Speaker 2: with him, And his name was Tommy Hyde, Me and

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Speaker 2: Tommy were never on good terms and stuff, and no

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Speaker 2: doubt Dallas Battles was using him to spread stuff.

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Speaker 1: Now, you and battle had a bit of history.

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Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, we had pretty deep history, man, Dallas Battles.

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Speaker 1: Did do you think your previous run ends with the law,

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Speaker 1: including that recent safe theft, had anything to do with

347
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Speaker 1: Battles zeroing in on you?

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Speaker 3: Well, I'll tell you straight up.

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Speaker 2: Dallas Battles was a corrupt cop, crooked as they come.

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Speaker 2: This man took an oath when he with that badge

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Speaker 2: owned uphold the law. And even though I was a young,

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Speaker 2: stupid teenage boy and stuff, Dallas Battles knew what he

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Speaker 2: was doing. He was a full grown man. And what

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Speaker 2: he did to me he broke every law did he

355
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Speaker 2: know all of them? And wanted to make stuff seem

356
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Speaker 2: like it was a certain way, and that's what he did.

357
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Speaker 2: He spun it that way, made it look like it.

358
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Speaker 2: That's no doubt my mind. He knew the truth about it.

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Speaker 2: He just didn't want to put it out there as

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Speaker 2: he was dead set on setting me up.

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Speaker 1: Now, around this time, another Fwood County officer, David Stewart,

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Speaker 1: joined the investigation, and he and battle developed this theory

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Speaker 1: that Brian had not been shot accidentally, there had been

364
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Speaker 1: no Russian roulette, but rather this was all a gang

365
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Speaker 1: related revenge hit killing. Now, remember this is late nineteen

366
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Speaker 1: nineties and there's kind of the massesteria going on about

367
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Speaker 1: quote unquote gang buns in America, which, although was not

368
00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:52,360
Speaker 1: prominent in Rome, Georgia at the time, was nevertheless sort

369
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Speaker 1: of in the public ze guist and affecting how people

370
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Speaker 1: interpreted this evidence, which is why bone Thugs in Harmony

371
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Speaker 1: and the fact that Brian and his friends listened to

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Speaker 1: that came an important part of the case. Anyway, there

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Speaker 1: was a woman named Debor Kelly, who Kan's mother once

374
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Speaker 1: hired to clean her house, and she told the police

375
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Speaker 1: that while she was cleaning the house, she'd found this

376
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Speaker 1: what she called a devilish notebook because it had skulls

377
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Speaker 1: and crossbones on it, and when she snooped through the notebook,

378
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Speaker 1: that's how she says she discovered that you Can and

379
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Speaker 1: Brian were all members of this gang called the Freebirds. Now,

380
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Speaker 1: Debora Kelly also said that this notebook had the gang's

381
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Speaker 1: rules written out inside of it. Now, Lee, what were

382
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Speaker 1: some of the alleged rules that this gang had, so.

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Speaker 2: I wanted to try to say he was in there

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Speaker 2: and never do drugs. Yeah right, Yeah, that really went

385
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Speaker 2: well with us. Back in every time you turn around,

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Speaker 2: we spoke in pot.

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Speaker 1: The gang's other rules were always stand by your brother,

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Speaker 1: never talked to the police, and if a brother does

389
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Speaker 1: talk to police, you have to kill him. If you

390
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Speaker 1: don't kill them, you get killed yourself.

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Speaker 3: That's what they say it.

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Speaker 1: So the police decided that Brian had narked quote unquote

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Speaker 1: on the other gang members by turning them in for

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Speaker 1: the safe theft, and therefore Lee and Kane had been

395
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Speaker 1: obligated to kill him because of their gang of rules.

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Speaker 1: Don't forget that. Another influence on this murder was Bone

397
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Speaker 1: Thugs and Harmony and they're nineteen what ninety six hit single,

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00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:17,800
Speaker 1: yeah Lacrossroad, gross Roads. Yeah. Now, Crossroads was a favorite

399
00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:20,520
Speaker 1: song of Brian's. It was playing at the time he

400
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Speaker 1: was shot, and the investigators tracked down the lyrics and

401
00:17:24,119 --> 00:17:29,399
Speaker 1: decided that the song Crossroads is about shooting narcs and

402
00:17:29,440 --> 00:17:32,840
Speaker 1: that that was why the song was playing when Brian died.

403
00:17:35,119 --> 00:17:37,720
Speaker 2: And whoever listened to that song knows that's not what

404
00:17:37,760 --> 00:17:41,440
Speaker 2: that song is about. You know, this whole gang stuff.

405
00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:44,160
Speaker 2: It's so comical to me. It's simply it's just a joke.

406
00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:45,680
Speaker 2: And if I don't have a sense of humor about it,

407
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Speaker 2: I'm gonna cry about it, because in fact this the

408
00:17:47,600 --> 00:18:01,359
Speaker 2: blase or what destroyed my life for many years.

409
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Speaker 1: Their theory was hair brained. It defies logic and reason,

410
00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:11,720
Speaker 1: but Atal and Stewart were committed to it and somehow

411
00:18:11,760 --> 00:18:13,879
Speaker 1: needed to drum up evidence to support it. That's why

412
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Speaker 1: they ended up exhooming Brian's body in a search for evidence,

413
00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:19,240
Speaker 1: and in the coffin when they opened it up, they

414
00:18:19,359 --> 00:18:22,400
Speaker 1: found two handwritten notes. One of them had the lyrics

415
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Speaker 1: to Crossroads written out on it, and the other was

416
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Speaker 1: a note from Joseph Wilkins, the fourth member of the

417
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Speaker 1: Safe Theft group. It had a drawing of a little

418
00:18:30,520 --> 00:18:32,840
Speaker 1: eagle carrying a bag of weed and a banner that

419
00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:35,480
Speaker 1: said freebirds, and the note to Brian below it was

420
00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:38,399
Speaker 1: something like, fly high, brother, see you at the crossroads.

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Speaker 3: Love you.

422
00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:42,320
Speaker 1: But on the little flag the eagles carring, the one

423
00:18:42,359 --> 00:18:45,320
Speaker 1: that says freebird's on it. Here's like a little addition

424
00:18:45,440 --> 00:18:47,679
Speaker 1: made in the corner of the flag it has the

425
00:18:47,720 --> 00:18:50,199
Speaker 1: word narks on it and it's crossed out like with

426
00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:53,160
Speaker 1: the no smoking sign and a trial. It's this note

427
00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:56,240
Speaker 1: that's uses evidence that Brian was killed as a gang

428
00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:59,560
Speaker 1: revenge murder, although it's worth noting that the handwriting of

429
00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:03,120
Speaker 1: the word arks is very different from the neat cursive

430
00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:04,439
Speaker 1: that the rest of the note is written in.

431
00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:07,520
Speaker 2: Yes it is, and you know, Susan, I would not

432
00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:10,600
Speaker 2: put it past Dallas Bidles to have did that, because

433
00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:12,240
Speaker 2: you've done did some other shady stuff.

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00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:14,719
Speaker 3: So you ain't gonna stop her, not I see it.

435
00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:17,359
Speaker 1: And then in May of nineteen eighty seven, the police

436
00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:20,399
Speaker 1: got two more key pieces to their theory. The first

437
00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:23,280
Speaker 1: was a woman named Angela Bruce, who was interviewed and

438
00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:26,640
Speaker 1: told Battle and Stuart that in about February of that year,

439
00:19:26,720 --> 00:19:29,679
Speaker 1: she'd had a party and that's when Cain and this

440
00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:31,960
Speaker 1: other boy he brought along with him had bragged her

441
00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:35,119
Speaker 1: about killing Brian. They told her the whole story about

442
00:19:35,160 --> 00:19:37,359
Speaker 1: how they had a gang and the rules. So they

443
00:19:37,359 --> 00:19:39,600
Speaker 1: had a killing member who narked on them, so they

444
00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:41,840
Speaker 1: put a pill over his head and shot him. Now,

445
00:19:41,840 --> 00:19:44,280
Speaker 1: the first time that Angela Bruce is interviewed, her story

446
00:19:44,320 --> 00:19:46,480
Speaker 1: has nothing about Caprice in it, nothing about the girl

447
00:19:46,480 --> 00:19:49,119
Speaker 1: from the phone who says she heard Brian say he's

448
00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:52,840
Speaker 1: playing Russian Roulette and then screaming. So a couple days later,

449
00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:55,400
Speaker 1: the cops go back and talk to Angela again, and

450
00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:57,800
Speaker 1: this time she has more to that add the story.

451
00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:00,960
Speaker 1: She says that Bryan's girlfriend, Caprice, was also a member

452
00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:03,320
Speaker 1: of the Freeburg gang, and that she had conspired with

453
00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:07,240
Speaker 1: Kin and Lee to kill him, which effectively discredited Caprice,

454
00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:10,680
Speaker 1: who had initially corroborated that Brian's death was accidental. Now, Lee,

455
00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:12,200
Speaker 1: did you even know Caprice?

456
00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:15,879
Speaker 2: No? No, I'd never met Capri before. I never actually

457
00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:17,080
Speaker 2: sent her till we got to trial.

458
00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:17,840
Speaker 3: Yeah.

459
00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:20,080
Speaker 1: Kin hadn't actually met her either. I mean he talked

460
00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:21,520
Speaker 1: with her on the phone a few times when it's

461
00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:24,080
Speaker 1: over at Brian's, but he hadn't seen her in person.

462
00:20:24,680 --> 00:20:27,240
Speaker 1: But Angela's story making Caprice part of the gang and

463
00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:29,760
Speaker 1: part of the murder conspiracy was still not enough by

464
00:20:29,760 --> 00:20:32,720
Speaker 1: itself to hold this theory together. Lee, you had about

465
00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:35,040
Speaker 1: ten witnesses who could have placed you at your home

466
00:20:35,080 --> 00:20:37,359
Speaker 1: that night, and no one in the living room at

467
00:20:37,359 --> 00:20:40,560
Speaker 1: Brian's trailer mentioned you being there, said anything about you

468
00:20:40,600 --> 00:20:43,640
Speaker 1: at all. But then Battle says he gets a tip

469
00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:46,280
Speaker 1: it wasn't just Brian's family who'd been in the living

470
00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:49,080
Speaker 1: room that night. Two neighbors, Wayne and Charlie Childers, were

471
00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:52,600
Speaker 1: also there and apparently were never interviewed. Seven months later,

472
00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:56,560
Speaker 1: he talks to them and Wayne says, my brother, Charlie, yeah,

473
00:20:56,640 --> 00:20:58,359
Speaker 1: he saw something important that he needs to tell you.

474
00:20:58,880 --> 00:20:59,040
Speaker 3: Now.

475
00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:03,119
Speaker 1: Charlie Childers is stuff and didn't speak standard American sign language,

476
00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:08,200
Speaker 1: but he allegedly somehow told Dallas Battle that after everyone

477
00:21:08,200 --> 00:21:10,120
Speaker 1: had run in to Brian's room that night after hearing

478
00:21:10,160 --> 00:21:13,160
Speaker 1: a gunshot, he'd stayed behind in the living room, and

479
00:21:13,400 --> 00:21:16,359
Speaker 1: that's how he'd looked out a window and seeing a

480
00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:19,400
Speaker 1: boy running across the bowling's front yard. Battle would later

481
00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:22,040
Speaker 1: testify a trial that Charlie had add this boy in

482
00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:25,040
Speaker 1: a lineup as Lee Clark. So with Angela Bruce, and

483
00:21:25,119 --> 00:21:27,879
Speaker 1: Charlie Childers, Dallas Battle and David Stewart now had with

484
00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:30,240
Speaker 1: a needed to charge you and Kine with conspiracy and

485
00:21:30,359 --> 00:21:31,240
Speaker 1: first degree murder.

486
00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:33,320
Speaker 2: Well, never forget that day as long as I live.

487
00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:38,760
Speaker 2: Maybe the twenty third of nineteen ninety seven, Memorial Day weekend,

488
00:21:39,240 --> 00:21:40,840
Speaker 2: I was on my way to go to the lake,

489
00:21:41,119 --> 00:21:45,040
Speaker 2: my mom, my stepdad, my brother, my girlfriend, Shelley, her

490
00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:46,720
Speaker 2: boy to code. We going down there to teach the

491
00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:48,000
Speaker 2: code to hide the ski and everything.

492
00:21:48,359 --> 00:21:49,200
Speaker 3: Well, I got over.

493
00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:52,040
Speaker 2: To my mom's house and stuff, and she come out,

494
00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:54,399
Speaker 2: she's crying and stuff. I didn't know what was going on.

495
00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:56,800
Speaker 2: She told me they'd been by there would have warrant

496
00:21:56,800 --> 00:21:58,520
Speaker 2: from my risk. She said, what they've been by your

497
00:21:58,600 --> 00:21:59,360
Speaker 2: daddy's place too?

498
00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:00,560
Speaker 3: All my dad.

499
00:22:00,640 --> 00:22:02,199
Speaker 2: First thing you asked when I got on there, he said, well,

500
00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:03,600
Speaker 2: have you done got yourself a boald? Then I said,

501
00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:05,399
Speaker 2: I ain't did nothing. I said, this has got to

502
00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:07,600
Speaker 2: be a mistake. We did going down here to the

503
00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:09,840
Speaker 2: jail and find out what's going on. And we rode

504
00:22:09,840 --> 00:22:12,120
Speaker 2: down there to county jail. I went inside the county

505
00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:13,720
Speaker 2: jail thinking I was going in there to get something

506
00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:15,600
Speaker 2: straightened out. I go in there to tell the lady

507
00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:18,080
Speaker 2: behind the register that my name and stuff and what

508
00:22:18,280 --> 00:22:20,080
Speaker 2: was going on. And they come out there, snatch me ut,

509
00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:22,080
Speaker 2: throw me up on the wall, talking about we got you.

510
00:22:22,119 --> 00:22:23,760
Speaker 2: Don't try to run, And I was sitting there thanking

511
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:25,800
Speaker 2: to myself, I'm really you think I come in here

512
00:22:25,920 --> 00:22:27,080
Speaker 2: just to walk in here in the middle of the

513
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:27,720
Speaker 2: police station and.

514
00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:30,760
Speaker 3: Say hey, here I am, and then turn around running.

515
00:22:30,840 --> 00:22:31,840
Speaker 3: That don't make no sense.

516
00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:34,200
Speaker 2: But they drove me in the back and any hold

517
00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:36,919
Speaker 2: and selling there and here come walking in Dallas battles.

518
00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:39,320
Speaker 2: I looked at him, and they sit down from me.

519
00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:41,640
Speaker 2: He said, Well, he said, I got you. I said,

520
00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:43,080
Speaker 2: you played all these games. I don't even know what

521
00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:45,880
Speaker 2: you talk about. Well, he said, we know you and Kane,

522
00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:48,560
Speaker 2: we know y'all conspired to kill you, buddy, Brian I said,

523
00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:51,480
Speaker 2: everybody in this county knows that Brian Boldi's shot itself.

524
00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:54,800
Speaker 1: Now, Lee, it was January of twenty eight when you

525
00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:57,800
Speaker 1: and Kane went on trial together, and you each had

526
00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:01,440
Speaker 1: your own attorney. Your father had hired Zabernathy, and Cain

527
00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:04,359
Speaker 1: had a court appointed attorney named Larry J. Barkley. And

528
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:07,280
Speaker 1: the prosecutor and his opening statement started out by telling

529
00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:09,440
Speaker 1: the jury that they were going to hear all about

530
00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:12,040
Speaker 1: this vicious gang called the Freebirds.

531
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:14,639
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, he built it all up on all that

532
00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:17,520
Speaker 2: stuffal about a vic gang called the free Birds and

533
00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:20,640
Speaker 2: how they how many basically were just notorious gangster killers.

534
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:22,800
Speaker 3: And it was a joke. It was a joke, and

535
00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:24,080
Speaker 3: it wasn't a funny joke either.

536
00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:26,840
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, you could laugh at it because it's laughable,

537
00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:28,440
Speaker 2: but it wasn't nothing funny body.

538
00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:30,359
Speaker 1: And then probably one of the more damaging things that

539
00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:33,960
Speaker 1: happened a trial is that they played the tape of

540
00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:37,840
Speaker 1: Ken's confession. They've pled the entire tape where he starts

541
00:23:37,840 --> 00:23:40,560
Speaker 1: off saying that he did not shoot Brian, and eventually,

542
00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:43,159
Speaker 1: after being told by the police that he wouldn't be

543
00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:45,520
Speaker 1: any trouble if he admitted to it, he admits to it.

544
00:23:46,160 --> 00:23:48,600
Speaker 1: So the jury hears Caine his own words, say that

545
00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:52,640
Speaker 1: gums in my hand when it went off. Now this

546
00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:55,080
Speaker 1: is all given to the jury. They listen to it,

547
00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:57,480
Speaker 1: they hear about it, and then a few days later

548
00:23:57,560 --> 00:24:00,880
Speaker 1: the judge says, you know what, I changed my That

549
00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:04,840
Speaker 1: confession probably not legal, It was improper. It shouldn't have

550
00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:07,840
Speaker 1: been admitted. So the judge then tells the jury, pretend

551
00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:11,000
Speaker 1: you never heard that, ignore that confession. Let's proceed. Do

552
00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:13,040
Speaker 1: you think the jury was able to forget the fact

553
00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:14,040
Speaker 1: that it heard that confession.

554
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:18,680
Speaker 3: No, no, I don't believe that one minute. I mean, look, way,

555
00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:21,880
Speaker 3: as human beings, just human nature. When something, just put

556
00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:22,720
Speaker 3: it in your head.

557
00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:25,120
Speaker 2: You got it in there, and I don't for one

558
00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:27,240
Speaker 2: minute believe that You'll sit there and let the jury

559
00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:30,120
Speaker 2: hear that, and you disrespect them to disregard that, throwed

560
00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:30,720
Speaker 2: out their head.

561
00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:32,879
Speaker 3: You never should have did it to begin with. It

562
00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 3: never should have been admitted to begin with.

563
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:37,720
Speaker 1: So the jury has just heard Caine confess to at

564
00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:41,359
Speaker 1: least accidentally shooting Brian. But the theory a trial, the

565
00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:44,040
Speaker 1: one they're trying to convince you of, is that you

566
00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:47,040
Speaker 1: Lee are the shooter and this whole thing was a

567
00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:50,360
Speaker 1: gang related revenge killing. So to support that, they bring

568
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:52,879
Speaker 1: in Dobor Kelly, the house cleaner, who testifies that she

569
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:55,840
Speaker 1: found the skull and crossbands notebook, which, by the way,

570
00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:59,800
Speaker 1: never located, never found, never seen again, just gone, no

571
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:03,439
Speaker 1: physical evidence that ever existed beyond what Debora Kelly and

572
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:06,240
Speaker 1: another woman a friend of her, say about them seeing it.

573
00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:08,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, how do you come under use in that? How

574
00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:10,240
Speaker 3: does that work? Right?

575
00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:12,640
Speaker 1: They never found any sort of evidence to actually back

576
00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:15,480
Speaker 1: up the story that she gives. But the state's case

577
00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:19,560
Speaker 1: relies more heavily on Angela Bruce and this alleged confession

578
00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:22,479
Speaker 1: that you and Kane supposedly made to her at a party.

579
00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:25,880
Speaker 1: According to Angela Bruce, you and Kin explained to her

580
00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:29,720
Speaker 1: in explicit detail how this killing happened, and according to her,

581
00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:32,879
Speaker 1: this is what you say. That night, You, Caine, and

582
00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:35,560
Speaker 1: Caprice all conspired to kill Brian, and you did it

583
00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:38,760
Speaker 1: by having Caprice call Brian on the phone to distract him.

584
00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:41,639
Speaker 1: Then Kane shows up. He goes into Brian's bedroom and

585
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:45,840
Speaker 1: distracts Brian even further. Meanwhile, Lee is sneaking up outside

586
00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 1: of Brian's bedroom window. And by the way, at the time,

587
00:25:48,760 --> 00:25:50,800
Speaker 1: this window was actually boarded up with a piece of

588
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:53,200
Speaker 1: plywood that you could kind of move back and forth

589
00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:57,320
Speaker 1: to open. But according to Angela Bruce, what your role

590
00:25:57,400 --> 00:25:59,959
Speaker 1: was to do was to shoot Brian through the window

591
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:02,600
Speaker 1: and then run away, while Kin stayed behind to tell

592
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,919
Speaker 1: everyone that live be playing Russian Roulette and Brian had lost.

593
00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:08,639
Speaker 2: I couldn't wrap my mind around while she was up

594
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:10,280
Speaker 2: for saying what she was saying. I mean, I was

595
00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:12,520
Speaker 2: sitting there thinking to myself, I mean, this woman has

596
00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:14,879
Speaker 2: never laid eyes on me, and they in her life

597
00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:17,200
Speaker 2: doesn't even know me. But it's up he telling these

598
00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,520
Speaker 2: lies on me, and I wasn't really for sure what

599
00:26:19,920 --> 00:26:22,640
Speaker 2: the deal was there, and my attorney at the time,

600
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:25,119
Speaker 2: Rex Sabergathi, he said, I'm to tell you what it is.

601
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:27,800
Speaker 2: He said, they got something on her kids, and they're

602
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:31,680
Speaker 2: using that against her. Right here, that's where Rex's mind

603
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:33,800
Speaker 2: was at. So I want to thinking that stuff too.

604
00:26:34,119 --> 00:26:36,520
Speaker 2: I mean, I understand, Okay, they're holding your kids over

605
00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:39,680
Speaker 2: your head, and I get that part right there. Apparently

606
00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:42,520
Speaker 2: do just about anything for their kids. But what would

607
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:44,720
Speaker 2: have been the right thing to do on her part

608
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:47,280
Speaker 2: would have been to go up to the police station

609
00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:50,280
Speaker 2: and let it be known that they're over her, rassing her,

610
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:53,399
Speaker 2: trying to get her to tell lies and using her kids,

611
00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:55,520
Speaker 2: holding them over her is what she should have did.

612
00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:59,080
Speaker 1: But the jury heard Angela's testimony, and they heard the

613
00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:01,960
Speaker 1: prosecutor tell them that there was no reason to find

614
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,199
Speaker 1: her not credible. And this was all shored up by

615
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:06,600
Speaker 1: Charlie Childers, the deaf witness who'd been at the bowlings

616
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:09,880
Speaker 1: watching TV that night. Now, Charlie's story doesn't actually come

617
00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:12,480
Speaker 1: in through Charlie. The prosecution put Dallas Battle in the

618
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:15,760
Speaker 1: stand and he testified what Charlie had told him in

619
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:18,760
Speaker 1: his interview. Min jew protective. Battle did not speak sign

620
00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:21,760
Speaker 1: language and Charlie did not speak American Sign language, so

621
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:27,200
Speaker 1: how Charlie and Battle communicated is a mystery. Wayne Charlie's

622
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:30,119
Speaker 1: brother didn't speak sim language either, so there's no one

623
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:32,800
Speaker 1: there who actual communicate with Charlie. So it's never explained

624
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:35,600
Speaker 1: how exactly Charlie was able to tell Dallas Battle any

625
00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:38,480
Speaker 1: of this. And all of this happens without a single

626
00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:42,080
Speaker 1: hearsaym chection from Canaan Lee's attorneys, which is insane all

627
00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:45,199
Speaker 1: by itself, but it gets worse. Dallas Battle testifies that

628
00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,680
Speaker 1: Charlie told him that he had seen someone run across

629
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:51,800
Speaker 1: the front yard after the gunshot. And then, according to

630
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,639
Speaker 1: Dallas Battle, in the stand, Charlie has given a line

631
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:57,439
Speaker 1: up with like six photos and he circles Lee Clark.

632
00:27:57,880 --> 00:28:00,359
Speaker 1: So they then put Charlie on the stand with an

633
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:01,240
Speaker 1: ASL interpreter.

634
00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:04,359
Speaker 2: And I'm not trying to speak bad about anybody. He

635
00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:07,520
Speaker 2: was on the stand. He could not use regular sign language.

636
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:11,800
Speaker 2: The interpreter could clearly not communicate with him. The interpreter

637
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:15,520
Speaker 2: told the judge a couple different points that she was

638
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:17,479
Speaker 2: having difficult to communicate with him.

639
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,760
Speaker 1: She tells the court, your honor. He's not speaking American

640
00:28:20,760 --> 00:28:23,680
Speaker 1: sign language. He's using home signs.

641
00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:26,240
Speaker 2: The judge should have shut that down right then, but

642
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:27,920
Speaker 2: he unless it play on, to play on.

643
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:31,000
Speaker 1: I can say that Charlie's testimony at your trial is

644
00:28:31,040 --> 00:28:34,080
Speaker 1: hands down the most chaotic witness testimony I've ever encountered

645
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:37,160
Speaker 1: in any criminal trial and any trial ever. The poor

646
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:40,120
Speaker 1: interpreter came in and very quickly realizes that she cannot

647
00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:43,360
Speaker 1: effectively talk to Charlie. But it's also very clear that

648
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:47,000
Speaker 1: this story that Dallas Battle testified to about Charlie seeing

649
00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:49,960
Speaker 1: anyone the lonely clerk right across the front yard, that's

650
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:53,120
Speaker 1: not something Charlie can say. In the stand, he talks

651
00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:55,560
Speaker 1: about all kinds of things, talks about dogs and puppies,

652
00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 1: and about how the boy he saw was a black

653
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:00,840
Speaker 1: boy who had a wife.

654
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:03,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, black boy. I couldn't get I couldn't get over

655
00:29:03,080 --> 00:29:04,040
Speaker 3: that black boy, black hair.

656
00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:06,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, has a wife. You know this is not

657
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:08,720
Speaker 1: going great. You can see frustration from everyone, Like the

658
00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:11,600
Speaker 1: prosecutor is frustrated, the fence is frustrated, Like everyone in

659
00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:13,840
Speaker 1: this courtroom is about to lose it because they've been

660
00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 1: here for hours trying to talk to Charlie and is

661
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:19,640
Speaker 1: not working. He does say he only saw Caine's story

662
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:22,440
Speaker 1: at the house that night, just story. It's only after

663
00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:25,320
Speaker 1: all that that they have the prosecutor stand behind Lee

664
00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:28,120
Speaker 1: Clark put his hands on his shoulders that Charlie Childers

665
00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,360
Speaker 1: allegedly says, yep, that's the boy I saw. So that

666
00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:34,240
Speaker 1: was the prosecution's case, and the defense, for its part,

667
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:38,880
Speaker 1: carls Caprice's point, and she says exactly the same thing

668
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:42,720
Speaker 1: she said the knight that Brian was shot, which should

669
00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 1: have been compelling testimony for the defense. However, the prosecution

670
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:49,200
Speaker 1: made her an unindicted co conspirator. They decided they did

671
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 1: not have enough evidence to actually put her on trial,

672
00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:53,719
Speaker 1: but they say she was also gang member, was part

673
00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:56,600
Speaker 1: of the murder conspiracy, and therefore that's why she's lying.

674
00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:59,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, so, Bason, we don't have enough, We don't have

675
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:01,520
Speaker 2: enough ividence far as you as a co conspirator, but

676
00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:02,760
Speaker 2: we'll go ahead and mudy your name.

677
00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:05,000
Speaker 3: What was some lies just so nobody believed the truth

678
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:07,080
Speaker 3: to tell him. That's basically what it boiled down to.

679
00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:11,200
Speaker 1: And then for his defense, Kine testifies on his own behalf,

680
00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:15,040
Speaker 1: which unfortunately, did nothing to help you. Actually, it hurt

681
00:30:15,040 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 1: you quite a lot because Cain got up there and

682
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:20,480
Speaker 1: told the truth, and the truth was that the two

683
00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:22,600
Speaker 1: of you had hung out together that night and that

684
00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:25,240
Speaker 1: you'd parted ways at the mini mart. But it wasn't

685
00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:27,680
Speaker 1: until Kane testified that anyone can actually place the two

686
00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:29,640
Speaker 1: of you together that day. There was no other evidence

687
00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:31,960
Speaker 1: that shows that you and Kane had ever even talked

688
00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:34,160
Speaker 1: or met up or had anything to do with one

689
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:37,320
Speaker 1: another on that day. But then Kane's on the stand

690
00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:41,960
Speaker 1: and explains what happened earlier. He was also extremely emotional

691
00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:45,160
Speaker 1: the whole time. Apparently he cried through his entire testimony.

692
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:47,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was a disaster when he was on the stand.

693
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 2: I mean he could tell his emotions were getting the

694
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:52,360
Speaker 2: better of him, and I don't know, looking back on

695
00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:54,760
Speaker 2: it now, I could see it for what it was

696
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:57,440
Speaker 2: at the time. I mean, he's dealing with a lot

697
00:30:57,480 --> 00:31:00,320
Speaker 2: of stuff in his heyd he's got a friend he

698
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:02,479
Speaker 2: he watched kill hisself, and he's got all that bouncing

699
00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:05,480
Speaker 2: in his head and he was trying to trying.

700
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:06,960
Speaker 3: To make things right by telling the truth.

701
00:31:07,160 --> 00:31:08,960
Speaker 2: But just didn't know that a lot of people a

702
00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:11,360
Speaker 2: lot of people perceived all his crying and all that stuff.

703
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:13,600
Speaker 2: They perceived that is some kind of guilt. That's not

704
00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 2: what it was, but that's why a lot of people

705
00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:16,240
Speaker 2: perceived it at.

706
00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:18,520
Speaker 1: That pointly, how did you think the trial was going

707
00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 1: for you?

708
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:20,360
Speaker 3: I thought it was going great for me.

709
00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:22,440
Speaker 2: I mean I thought Rex shabern Atthew was doing a

710
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:24,200
Speaker 2: really good job at the time. I mean I was

711
00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:26,560
Speaker 2: sitting there thinking, yeah, man, he's showing the people I

712
00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:28,040
Speaker 2: ain't had nothing to do with this junk here.

713
00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:30,200
Speaker 3: I'm finil to go home. That's what I'm thinking the

714
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:31,360
Speaker 3: whole time, and.

715
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 2: Me not knowing that little stuff that Rex was missing,

716
00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:37,640
Speaker 2: that he wasn't hitting on, was going to wind up

717
00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:39,240
Speaker 2: hitting us really bad in the end.

718
00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:42,160
Speaker 1: So after closing arguments, the jury goes back to deliberate,

719
00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:45,120
Speaker 1: and in Georgia, the charges that you and canterfacing murder

720
00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:47,840
Speaker 1: and conspiracy commit murder. Even in the case of juveniles

721
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:50,800
Speaker 1: like you and Kane, they carry an automatic life sentence.

722
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:54,160
Speaker 1: The jury went into deliberate on Saturday, and the judge

723
00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 1: will have the next day off, but on Monday when

724
00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:59,680
Speaker 1: they come back on January nineteenth, thineteen eighty eight, it

725
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:02,360
Speaker 1: didn't not take them long before they returned with the verdict.

726
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:04,880
Speaker 2: When they read off that guilty verdict on them both

727
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:08,600
Speaker 2: charges and found me guilty, I mean I felt something

728
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:12,280
Speaker 2: a feeling to come over me that It's difficult to

729
00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:14,840
Speaker 2: explain it, but my heart was sitting in my chest.

730
00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:18,080
Speaker 2: I was about to choke to death sitting there watching

731
00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:20,560
Speaker 2: at eighteen years old and watching my life flashing before

732
00:32:20,560 --> 00:32:23,320
Speaker 2: my eyes. I'm seeing everything that I ain't never gonna have.

733
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:25,840
Speaker 2: It's all just like it's passing in front of me

734
00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:29,120
Speaker 2: so much I've been to miss out on and wanting

735
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:31,280
Speaker 2: to myself, I'm not even gonna make it through what they're.

736
00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 3: Finishing me to.

737
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:53,440
Speaker 2: After we're convicted, were sent down to the prison, Jackson

738
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 2: State Prison. Men came.

739
00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:57,240
Speaker 3: We were on the same bus together.

740
00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,479
Speaker 2: We pull up in there looking at that prison engaged

741
00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:02,120
Speaker 2: out there, and just I looked at him, I said, well,

742
00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:03,680
Speaker 2: ain't gonna make at me. I said, I don't know

743
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:05,680
Speaker 2: what to tell you, man, but in this aintle in

744
00:33:05,800 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 2: well force. And we get to going going through Jackson

745
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:11,720
Speaker 2: died Nasi walking in there, and they take you around

746
00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:14,200
Speaker 2: there and put you in that sale and we used

747
00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:16,160
Speaker 2: to hear them bars slamming a home lot.

748
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:19,400
Speaker 3: They did, and I'm just sitting there knowing that here

749
00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:19,880
Speaker 3: I am.

750
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:23,040
Speaker 2: The whole lies go went destroyed for some lives, and

751
00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 2: I sit there for twenty five years.

752
00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:27,800
Speaker 1: So your shared fight for freedom could not have been

753
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:29,880
Speaker 1: more dire. And you appealed your case to the Supreme

754
00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:32,760
Speaker 1: Court of Georgia in nineteen ninety nine. And even though

755
00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:35,040
Speaker 1: the court agreed that the non existent Gang Roe book

756
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:38,200
Speaker 1: shouldn't have been entered into evidence, they weighed against Angela

757
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:42,600
Speaker 1: Bruce's testimony about the alleged confession and ultimately upheld the convictions.

758
00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:44,960
Speaker 1: Over the years, you and King spent a lot of

759
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:47,840
Speaker 1: time in the same presence together, and eventually, when you

760
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 1: were up in Walker, you met another teenager who'd been

761
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:53,560
Speaker 1: convicted of murder in Floyd County. That was Joey Watkins.

762
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:55,640
Speaker 1: In fact, the two of you had had the same attorney,

763
00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 1: Rex Abernathy.

764
00:33:56,640 --> 00:34:00,040
Speaker 2: Yes, and if it were not for Joey, Hello, but

765
00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:03,040
Speaker 2: I met you, Susan, And what with Joey, I'd still be.

766
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:05,240
Speaker 3: In prison right now doing our life sentence.

767
00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:09,680
Speaker 1: In twenty sixteen, I covered Joey's case for my podcast Undisclosed,

768
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:12,680
Speaker 1: and while I was working on Joey's case. Joey told

769
00:34:12,719 --> 00:34:15,640
Speaker 1: me about someone else he knew in prison who had

770
00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:19,080
Speaker 1: also been falsely convicted of a murder in Floyd County

771
00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:22,120
Speaker 1: as a teenager. And then one day when he was

772
00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:24,359
Speaker 1: on the phone with me, he mentioned your case again,

773
00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:26,520
Speaker 1: and I was like, can I talk to him? And

774
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:29,200
Speaker 1: He's like, yeah, hold on, I got him right here,

775
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:30,839
Speaker 1: And that's how we talked for the very first time.

776
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:33,399
Speaker 2: When I got talking to you and you got telling

777
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:35,440
Speaker 2: me what you were wanting to do and all that stuff,

778
00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:37,520
Speaker 2: I was thinking myself, well, he.

779
00:34:37,640 --> 00:34:38,719
Speaker 3: Be hot, you get this done.

780
00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:41,600
Speaker 2: But I'll be honest, I fully expected when you went

781
00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:44,000
Speaker 2: out started talking to people, did you go and get

782
00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:46,440
Speaker 2: all the same lives that these people had been telling

783
00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:47,080
Speaker 2: years ago?

784
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:49,880
Speaker 1: When just Sinda and I started investigating your case in

785
00:34:49,920 --> 00:34:52,600
Speaker 1: twenty twenty one, we went down to Floyd County several

786
00:34:52,640 --> 00:34:57,520
Speaker 1: times looking for documents, talking witnesses, and unfortunately Dallas Battle

787
00:34:57,560 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 1: died about a week before our very first trip, but

788
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:02,839
Speaker 1: we were able to talk to Angela Bruce, which was

789
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:06,239
Speaker 1: really eye opening. She told us, just like you and

790
00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:09,640
Speaker 1: your attorney head guest, that Battle and Stewart had threatened

791
00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:12,000
Speaker 1: to charge her with a crime and have family Services

792
00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:14,360
Speaker 1: take her children away if she didn't tell them what

793
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:16,800
Speaker 1: they wanted to hear. Also, she said the Dallas Battle

794
00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:19,480
Speaker 1: had frequently coerced her her sex, though she told us

795
00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:22,840
Speaker 1: she'd always turned him down despite that, And when Jasinda

796
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:25,560
Speaker 1: and I went to her house, I mean, she was emotional,

797
00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:28,280
Speaker 1: but she told us, I feel terrible for what happened

798
00:35:28,280 --> 00:35:30,480
Speaker 1: to Lea and Kane, and I'm sorry, but I would

799
00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:32,520
Speaker 1: have lost my kids if I hadn't done it, And

800
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:34,880
Speaker 1: what mother wouldn't do that if they had to. We

801
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:39,080
Speaker 1: also tracked down Charlie Childers, and equally importantly, we tracked

802
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:42,560
Speaker 1: down his high school teacher, who had known Charlie for decades,

803
00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:45,520
Speaker 1: like forty years, and he was familiar with though Charlie

804
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:49,360
Speaker 1: and his unique style of sign language and could just

805
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:51,760
Speaker 1: talk to Charlie in a way that the trial translator couldn't.

806
00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:54,239
Speaker 2: If I'm not mistaking Susan, he's able to communicate with

807
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:56,120
Speaker 2: him better than anybody one faced his planet.

808
00:35:56,440 --> 00:35:58,560
Speaker 1: And we first began talking to Charlie with the translator,

809
00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:01,080
Speaker 1: which struck me was just how eager and relieved he

810
00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:03,880
Speaker 1: was to finally be able to tell his story because

811
00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:06,680
Speaker 1: he remembered this ordeal. He remember Brian dying and testifying

812
00:36:06,719 --> 00:36:10,239
Speaker 1: a trial, and clearly it had seriously affected him. But

813
00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:13,560
Speaker 1: what we found out through the translator is that a trial.

814
00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:17,480
Speaker 1: Charlie hadn't been testifying about Brian's death at all. He

815
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:20,400
Speaker 1: thought he was there to talk about another shooting he'd witnessed,

816
00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:23,920
Speaker 1: because years before Brian's death, back in the late seventies,

817
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:26,960
Speaker 1: Charlie's brother Wayne had been in his bedroom with a

818
00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:29,839
Speaker 1: friend named Ronnie Quarrels, and the two boys had also

819
00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:32,479
Speaker 1: been playing with a gun when Ronnie ended up betting,

820
00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:35,480
Speaker 1: shot in the head and later died. It was this

821
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:37,560
Speaker 1: event that Charlie thought the police were there to ask

822
00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:40,640
Speaker 1: him about, and it was Ronnie's death he was trying

823
00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:44,799
Speaker 1: to describe to them with his own limited home signing abilities.

824
00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:47,000
Speaker 1: And when we explained to Charlie that the trial he

825
00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:50,080
Speaker 1: had been at had been about Brian's death, not Ronnie's,

826
00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:53,200
Speaker 1: Charlie told us, but I didn't see anything for Brian's death.

827
00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:55,799
Speaker 1: I wasn't the house, but I didn't know anything about

828
00:36:55,800 --> 00:36:57,880
Speaker 1: how he died. And he definitely never saw a boy

829
00:36:58,360 --> 00:37:00,439
Speaker 1: run through the yard, and he'd never seen Lee Clark

830
00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:01,560
Speaker 1: before ever, it was.

831
00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:04,319
Speaker 2: A trip made to find out all these years later

832
00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:07,200
Speaker 2: that that's what Charlie was testifying about.

833
00:37:07,480 --> 00:37:10,120
Speaker 1: By then, the Georgia Edison's Project had also taken on

834
00:37:10,160 --> 00:37:13,319
Speaker 1: your case, and you ended up being the first non

835
00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:15,919
Speaker 1: DNA related case that they had an exoneration in based

836
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:17,560
Speaker 1: in the evidence that we found in proof. They were

837
00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:19,600
Speaker 1: able to file an extraordinary motion for a new trial

838
00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:22,279
Speaker 1: in Floyd County as well as a habeas petition in

839
00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:25,000
Speaker 1: the county where you were in prison. But since the

840
00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:28,120
Speaker 1: Georgia Edison's Project couldn't also represent your co defendant, that

841
00:37:28,239 --> 00:37:31,560
Speaker 1: meant that Cain didn't have an attorney. After our show aired, though,

842
00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:34,680
Speaker 1: Luc Martin, an attorney from Floyd County, and Ross Hamrick,

843
00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:37,360
Speaker 1: who was in the PD's office there, contacted us. We

844
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:40,520
Speaker 1: put them touch with Kine and they became his attorneys

845
00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:43,560
Speaker 1: as well. So all of the attorneys were preparing for

846
00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:46,400
Speaker 1: a hearing. But then, in a case that was already

847
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:50,319
Speaker 1: beyond shocking, perhaps the most shocking thing yet occurred. The

848
00:37:50,320 --> 00:37:53,360
Speaker 1: Floyd County District Attorney ended up talking to your council

849
00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:55,759
Speaker 1: and agreeing that this case should be dismissed.

850
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:58,920
Speaker 2: Yes, they did, I mean it was evident did much

851
00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:00,479
Speaker 2: conduct with the cops in there.

852
00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:01,920
Speaker 3: I mean there was no voiding it.

853
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:04,480
Speaker 2: I mean, Dallas battles and David Stewart broke so many

854
00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:06,960
Speaker 2: laws doing this. I mean it was so obvious that

855
00:38:07,160 --> 00:38:08,360
Speaker 2: there was no sense of fighting.

856
00:38:08,719 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 1: Do you remember getting the news that you and came

857
00:38:11,719 --> 00:38:12,400
Speaker 1: to be released.

858
00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:14,280
Speaker 3: I do remember getting the news.

859
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:16,480
Speaker 2: I had called my dad and I was telling him

860
00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:18,600
Speaker 2: that I thought I was going to a hearing on

861
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:21,440
Speaker 2: December to sixth. He said, well, you ain't gonna be

862
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:23,600
Speaker 2: going no hearing on December to sixth. You got to

863
00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:26,279
Speaker 2: hear it coming up on December to eighth, and when

864
00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:28,919
Speaker 2: December to eighth gets here, you're gonna be coming home.

865
00:38:29,400 --> 00:38:31,719
Speaker 2: When he told me that, right there, Susan, I was

866
00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:35,120
Speaker 2: still riding at the cloud right now. I never felt

867
00:38:35,120 --> 00:38:37,560
Speaker 2: to feeling so great in my life. I'll stay in

868
00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:39,520
Speaker 2: that cloud now for the rest of my life, because

869
00:38:39,560 --> 00:38:42,040
Speaker 2: I know what it's like to sit behind prison walls

870
00:38:42,040 --> 00:38:43,799
Speaker 2: and not have a life, to sit there and have

871
00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:46,120
Speaker 2: it all snatched from you for something you didn't even do.

872
00:38:46,320 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 2: To finally have my life back, to have my freedom back,

873
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:52,080
Speaker 2: and I'll tell you I plan on living all of

874
00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:54,000
Speaker 2: it up to the fullest every day no matter what

875
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:57,640
Speaker 2: comes my way. Anything I'm on face a life cannot

876
00:38:57,680 --> 00:39:01,240
Speaker 2: be nowhere. It's difficult face while I was in prison.

877
00:39:01,440 --> 00:39:03,439
Speaker 2: What's hard for a lot of people out here, It's

878
00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 2: a cakewalk to me because I walk worse past, far worse.

879
00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:10,239
Speaker 1: So we first of all, thank you so much for

880
00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:12,759
Speaker 1: being here today and sharing your story with us. I

881
00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:14,480
Speaker 1: know you've been trying to rebuild your life since you

882
00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:17,120
Speaker 1: were released, and if listeners want to help support you

883
00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:19,719
Speaker 1: on that, they can go to Mightycause dot com and

884
00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:22,520
Speaker 1: search for Lee Clark. Now, this is the part of

885
00:39:22,520 --> 00:39:24,960
Speaker 1: the show called Closing Arguments. It is your chance to

886
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:26,799
Speaker 1: share any final thoughts that you might have with our

887
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:28,520
Speaker 1: listeners about anything at all.

888
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:32,759
Speaker 3: The flora is yours, I would like.

889
00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:36,200
Speaker 2: I mean, if there's any young young listeners out there,

890
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:39,239
Speaker 2: are any god to be young listeners, there's anybody out

891
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:41,640
Speaker 2: there just listening in general, if you're doing some.

892
00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:43,920
Speaker 3: Wild stuff out there that you shouldn't.

893
00:39:43,520 --> 00:39:46,279
Speaker 2: Be doing anything like that. I mean, there's all kinds

894
00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:49,000
Speaker 2: of stuff that can happen to your life. Just be

895
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:53,879
Speaker 2: smart about things, approach life from a positive angle. I mean, look,

896
00:39:53,920 --> 00:39:56,480
Speaker 2: I sit behind prison walls for twenty five years for

897
00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:59,160
Speaker 2: a crime I didn't commit, but I didn't bring the

898
00:39:59,200 --> 00:40:02,040
Speaker 2: negativity of it with me. I didn't let the negativity

899
00:40:02,080 --> 00:40:05,279
Speaker 2: of it destroyed me. Stay in headstrong and believe it

900
00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:07,879
Speaker 2: in yourself a lot of times if you'll just stay

901
00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:10,359
Speaker 2: that way. I mean, yeah, it's not guaranteed to pay

902
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:13,080
Speaker 2: off every time, but it's a better attitude to have

903
00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:15,960
Speaker 2: than to sit there and approach everything in life from

904
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:19,399
Speaker 2: a negative standpoint, because negativity it's only going to weigh

905
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:23,520
Speaker 2: you down and destroy you and n so anything in life,

906
00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:26,120
Speaker 2: approach it from a positive angle and take the good

907
00:40:26,120 --> 00:40:29,000
Speaker 2: from it. Even when there ain't much good to be found, Well,

908
00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:31,480
Speaker 2: pick what is good up and take it with you.

909
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:33,919
Speaker 3: It may not be much sturd to grab or grab

910
00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:34,399
Speaker 3: what you can.

911
00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:39,719
Speaker 2: And I'm so thankful to everybody, from Joey Watkins to you,

912
00:40:40,080 --> 00:40:43,799
Speaker 2: to the Innocent Project to just send to Kevin, everybody.

913
00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:47,240
Speaker 2: I'm just so thankful everybody to just put all the horror,

914
00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:49,319
Speaker 2: work and time and different into all this stuff to

915
00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:51,480
Speaker 2: get this truth to come out like it did.

916
00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:54,520
Speaker 3: I tell you it's something I'm not going to live now.

917
00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:57,600
Speaker 3: I'll be living on this cloud nine for a long time.

918
00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:06,160
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Wrongful Conviction. I'm your guest

919
00:41:06,160 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 1: host Susan Simpson. Thanks to executive producers Jason Flahm and

920
00:41:09,719 --> 00:41:12,240
Speaker 1: Kevin Wardis for inviting me to be here, and thanks

921
00:41:12,280 --> 00:41:15,440
Speaker 1: also to our production team Connor Hall, Annie Chelsea, Llyla

922
00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:18,479
Speaker 1: Robinson and Jeff Kleiberg. The music in this production comes

923
00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:21,719
Speaker 1: from three time OSCAR nominated composer Jay Ralph. Be sure

924
00:41:21,719 --> 00:41:24,520
Speaker 1: to follow us on Instagram at Wrongful Conviction, on Facebook

925
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:27,840
Speaker 1: at Wrongful Conviction Podcast, and on Twitter at wrong Conviction,

926
00:41:28,200 --> 00:41:30,759
Speaker 1: as well as Lava for Good. On all three platforms,

927
00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:32,680
Speaker 1: you can find me on Twitter at the View from

928
00:41:32,920 --> 00:41:36,120
Speaker 1: LL two and Instagram at soosimp, and you can listen

929
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:38,920
Speaker 1: to my podcast Proof and Undisclosed wherever you listen to

930
00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:41,880
Speaker 1: your podcasts. Wrongful Conviction is a production of Lava for

931
00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:45,040
Speaker 1: Good podcast, an association with Signal Company Number one