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Speaker 2: see dkang dot co slash audio. All Right, WelCom hoops tonight.
Speaker 2: You're at the volume Havy Friday. Everybody hope ath you
Speaker 2: guys are having a great start to your weekend. The
Speaker 2: NBA Playoffs have been very good to us this year
Speaker 2: as we continue to just get incredible night of hoops.
Speaker 2: After incredible night of hoops, the Cleveland Cavaliers go into
Speaker 2: Indiana and look like the Cleveland Cavaliers for the first
Speaker 2: time in this series. We're gonna be breaking that game
Speaker 2: down at the tail end of the show, but we're
Speaker 2: gonna be starting with yet another classic between the Denver
Speaker 2: Nuggets and the Oklahoma City Thunder. We were joking, the
Speaker 2: guys that iver joking before we started the show. The
Speaker 2: Nuggets have now won probably the best game I've ever
Speaker 2: seen Yokic play and the worst game I've ever seen
Speaker 2: Yokic play in the same series, which was super fascinating.
Speaker 2: So many different angles to get into a bunch of
Speaker 2: guys for Denver stepped up some really exciting stuff for
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City in their future, but then some of the
Speaker 2: classic concerns surrounding the team coming to the surface late
Speaker 2: in the game as their offense generates just twenty one
Speaker 2: points in the last seventeen minutes of the game. A
Speaker 2: lot of really ugly high ISO stuff. We're gonna be
Speaker 2: breaking that down. We'll get into both of those games
Speaker 2: from the perspective of both teams. At the tail end
Speaker 2: of the show, we'll take about ten minutes of questions
Speaker 2: from the chat, So make sure you guys in the
Speaker 2: stream here subscribe to the Hoops and Night YouTube channel.
Speaker 2: Drop your questions in there. We'll get to the chat
Speaker 2: at the tail end, and then when we are done
Speaker 2: here tonight, we'll be heading over to playback for our
Speaker 2: after show. We have the link in the description here.
Speaker 2: It's just playback dot tv slash Hoops Tonight. We'll be
Speaker 2: hanging out there for an extra half hour forty five
Speaker 2: minutes or so, taking some questions. We can take callers
Speaker 2: or watch some film what they can do. A bunch
Speaker 2: of stuff in the after show. You guys have the jop.
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Speaker 2: subscribe or excuse me, follow us there the last minute. Least,
Speaker 2: keep dropping those mail bag questions for the chat at
Speaker 2: the tail end of the show. So that was probably
Speaker 2: the worst Yokitch game I've ever seen, Shades of the
Speaker 2: Minnesota Timberwolves series last year where his jump shot completely
Speaker 2: leaves him. You know, I thought Jokic made a concerted
Speaker 2: effort early in this game to try to hunt scoring opportunities.
Speaker 2: It kind of like became one of those things where
Speaker 2: at first he was hunting scoring because he knew that
Speaker 2: that was what his team needed, and then it became
Speaker 2: almost like a come hell or high water, I'm finding
Speaker 2: a way to make a jump shot, and he just
Speaker 2: he just couldn't get one to go, and it was
Speaker 2: he was also just struggling making reads. Okay, see, he
Speaker 2: was bringing some baseline doubles and doing a good job
Speaker 2: gapping on the weak side in the two on one,
Speaker 2: and so Jokicic was turning the ball over and getting
Speaker 2: himself into some trouble. He was struggling to finish around
Speaker 2: the rim, smoked several shots at like point blank range
Speaker 2: right at the front of the rim. And yet here
Speaker 2: we are, Denver's up two to one in this series
Speaker 2: and in a really strong position when you consider the
Speaker 2: fact that it's highly likely that Nikola Jokic has a
Speaker 2: massive bounce back type of game in Game four, a
Speaker 2: very very important game of this series. My guess is
Speaker 2: that whoever wins Game four will win this series. And
Speaker 2: if Denver's going to win, they're gonna need a much
Speaker 2: better effort from Jokics. That said, I want to give
Speaker 2: Yoga some credit. He wanted some defensive battles late, he
Speaker 2: won some rebounding battles late, and he did get two
Speaker 2: big buckets in ot But I want to focus on
Speaker 2: a couple of other nuggets that I thought stepped up
Speaker 2: in a big way down the stretch of this game,
Speaker 2: first of all, Jamal Murray, as it became obvious that
Speaker 2: Jokis was not able to generate a quality look for himself,
Speaker 2: at least not one that he could knock down. Down
Speaker 2: the stretch of this game, Jamal Murray had to really
Speaker 2: hit the gas as a score and it wasn't always pretty. Again,
Speaker 2: like people, when you're playing against a defense like this,
Speaker 2: especially as a guard, it's not gonna be pretty. It's
Speaker 2: not gonna be super efficient, it's gonna be a chore.
Speaker 2: Jamal Murray missed more shots than he made tonight. There
Speaker 2: were some ugly ones. He had a couple shots around
Speaker 2: the room. He had an airball layup, he had a
Speaker 2: spinning like he tried to like shoot a three sixty
Speaker 2: layup in traffic that he kind of just threw into
Speaker 2: the bottom of the rim. They were difficult shots because
Speaker 2: there were a lot of late clock situations where he
Speaker 2: had to generate something. But then there were also situations
Speaker 2: where he was able to make something happen. A little
Speaker 2: step back over Isaiah Hartenstein along the left baseline, big
Speaker 2: threes at a couple of points in this game. He
Speaker 2: was just found a way to generate offense. He's been
Speaker 2: always a very gifted finisher in traffic to a couple
Speaker 2: of nifty finishes right at the front of the rim.
Speaker 2: And then Aaron Gordon. There are so many players in
Speaker 2: the league this year that have just in this playoff run,
Speaker 2: that have just been consistently great in the clutch, over
Speaker 2: and over again. Tyres Halliburton, Jalen Brunson, Aaron Gordon. Again,
Speaker 2: he's already had two game winners in this postseason run.
Speaker 2: Hits the three that sends this to overtime and extends
Speaker 2: the game. I want to shout out Aaron Gordon defensively
Speaker 2: as well. He got cooked a little bit by j
Speaker 2: Dubb at various points in the fourth quarter, but he
Speaker 2: was playing good defense. To his credit. He was hitting
Speaker 2: some tough, contested shots and then he got several stops
Speaker 2: late when he needed to. And then I also have
Speaker 2: to shine the light on Christian Brown. I thought, Christian Brown,
Speaker 2: you know, it's been interesting. There have been two stretches
Speaker 2: of this series where I feel like he's played good
Speaker 2: defense on Shae Gildes Alexander crunch time of Game one,
Speaker 2: crunch time of Game three. Now, I think there's kind
Speaker 2: of an overarching theme there involving slow down half court basketball,
Speaker 2: and we'll dive further into that concept a little bit
Speaker 2: later on in the show, But there was a stretch
Speaker 2: there in that third quarter where I'm like, he's just
Speaker 2: not doing a good enough job on Shae or Jdev.
Speaker 2: He's just getting beat to the spot over and over
Speaker 2: again at the point of attack. A lot of times
Speaker 2: he wasn't even offering any sort of physical contact or
Speaker 2: resistance until Shaye or Jadev were in the lane. He
Speaker 2: just wasn't doing a good enough job. But they are
Speaker 2: in crunch time over and over again, beating Shaye to
Speaker 2: the spot on multiple occasions, actually forcing Shaye into trying
Speaker 2: to grip for fouls, which obviously wasn't going to work
Speaker 2: in this type of game. Late Christian Brown Two's credit
Speaker 2: I talk about all the time the playoffs are about
Speaker 2: solving puzzles, and while he struggled in the meat and
Speaker 2: potatoes of this series, there have been two pivotal stretches
Speaker 2: or he's been able to get multiple stops against Shake
Speaker 2: Gildess Alexander, solving the puzzle in that sort of situation,
Speaker 2: and honestly, guys, like if we zoom out on this series.
Speaker 2: It's a whole lot of okc outplaying Denver and Denver
Speaker 2: just pulling these games out late. And there's two different
Speaker 2: ways to look at that. Right, there's the obvious fact
Speaker 2: that Oklahoma City is very, very good and that they're
Speaker 2: going to be very difficult to put out of their misery.
Speaker 2: This is not a oh, you're up to one, you're
Speaker 2: in control. This is they win game four that things
Speaker 2: going back to Oklahoma City, You're probably not winning this series.
Speaker 2: So like everything still hangs in the balance. But the
Speaker 2: flip side to look at that is there's a lot
Speaker 2: of opportunity for Denver to play better. I thought Oklahoma
Speaker 2: City outworked Denver tonight. I thought they played with more
Speaker 2: force throughout the game tonight they got Denver got demolished
Speaker 2: on the glass again, giving up eighteen offensive rebounds if
Speaker 2: they only got five offensive rebounds, and if we go back,
Speaker 2: because even further back into game two, they didn't have
Speaker 2: much success on the offensive glass relative to Game one.
Speaker 2: In that game either, they had more rebounds offensively in
Speaker 2: game one than they did in Game two in game
Speaker 2: three combined, and so ok See has like completely flipped
Speaker 2: the script on the whole Yokic dominating inside dynamic. They
Speaker 2: flipped the script on the whole offensive rebounding dynamic. They've
Speaker 2: taken the two arguably the two biggest advantages that Denver
Speaker 2: has in this series, and they've flipped them in their direction,
Speaker 2: as Yokich has been pretty bad the last two games
Speaker 2: and they haven't been able to do much damage on
Speaker 2: the offensive glass. And so again there's two ways to
Speaker 2: look at that. There's okay se has clear advantages that
Speaker 2: they're showing, and and then there's this all obvious fact
Speaker 2: that Denver can play much better. Denver is capable of
Speaker 2: doing more physical damage on the glass than they've been doing.
Speaker 2: Yokich is obviously capable of playing a lot better. I
Speaker 2: talked about this after Game two. The advantages for the
Speaker 2: two teams are pretty clear, right Like for ok see
Speaker 2: it's dribble penetration. They are dominating these games, and the
Speaker 2: meat and potatoes just in those semi transition pushes with
Speaker 2: Shay and j dubb quickly within like the first you know,
Speaker 2: seven to ten seconds of the shot clock getting deep
Speaker 2: dribble penetration, and then everything really pascating from there, all
Speaker 2: of a sudden you're drawing tons of helpers, which is
Speaker 2: putting your defense in rotation. Okay See, outside of crunch
Speaker 2: time in the series, has passed the ball very well.
Speaker 2: They're moving the ball out of those dribble penetration situations.
Speaker 2: As Denver's rotating, okay See is getting offensive rebounds because
Speaker 2: guys aren't matched up to box out because they're in rotation.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of damage that Oklahoma City is doing
Speaker 2: early in possessions with their dribble penetration that is trickling
Speaker 2: down to all of these other elements of the game.
Speaker 2: And for Denver, their advantage is very clearly the size
Speaker 2: with Jokic on the interior and their ability to contend
Speaker 2: on the offensive glass. And what's crazy is, for the
Speaker 2: most part throughout this series, okay See has done a
Speaker 2: better job of leveraging their advantages. But Denver, over and
Speaker 2: over again, as long as they're within striking distance late,
Speaker 2: has been the better half court team. And that's where
Speaker 2: we got to dig into it a little bit deeper.
Speaker 2: So JDub had a beautiful game tonight. I thought he
Speaker 2: was in command of the floor. Moved the ball well
Speaker 2: on ball and off ball, scoring good on ball, playmaking.
Speaker 2: Jadub had a great game, but once again, when things
Speaker 2: got slowed down, when things really slowed down late in
Speaker 2: the game, those semi transition opportunities aren't there. I've got
Speaker 2: a head of steam because I started my drive out
Speaker 2: fifty feet from the basket and Christian Brown's picking me
Speaker 2: up at the foul line. That's not there anymore. It's
Speaker 2: slowed down. It's a knockdown, dragout half court fight. And
Speaker 2: in those situations in both games, in game one, in
Speaker 2: Game two, it's turned into a lot of high ISOs,
Speaker 2: a lot of high ISOs for JDub, a lot of
Speaker 2: high ISOs for Shay, a lot of tough in traffic,
Speaker 2: contested shots in the middle of the floor, not a
Speaker 2: lot of kickouts. How many times did you see a
Speaker 2: kickout out of those clutch situations for the Thunder, they're
Speaker 2: not there. So similar to Game one, Denver was consistently
Speaker 2: able to offer late help. A lot of these shots
Speaker 2: are being shot over double teams, over late secondary contests,
Speaker 2: just a lot of traffic in the middle of the floor,
Speaker 2: whereas with Denver there's like a solid two man game
Speaker 2: taking place in the middle of the floor where you
Speaker 2: don't know where it's gonna go. It might be Jamal
Speaker 2: running action and looking for something from the three point line,
Speaker 2: something in the mid range. It might be Yo kitch
Speaker 2: in the pocket. It might be Yo kitchen the post.
Speaker 2: Oh you overplayed yokich on a roll and left Aaron
Speaker 2: Gordon wide open in the left corner. He's gonna hit
Speaker 2: a three to burn you and tie the game. There's
Speaker 2: more variety, there's more consistency. There is a better, more reliable,
Speaker 2: clutch offense for Denver in this series, and so that's
Speaker 2: really where this is gonna swing. I think if it's
Speaker 2: close in Game four late, Denver's gonna win, and they're
Speaker 2: probably gonna win the series. Oklahoma City does have a
Speaker 2: pathway though, with their speed, with their defense to build
Speaker 2: margin against this team. It's kind of similar to the
Speaker 2: way I felt about the Clippers series. There's just not
Speaker 2: a team in the league that's gonna be able to
Speaker 2: execute the way Denver does in the half court Layton games.
Speaker 2: They're just the very best at it. You know, I
Speaker 2: used to, you know, I have a lot of like
Speaker 2: random basketball debates with my friends who covered different teams
Speaker 2: around the league, And I remember samis fondi Ario covers
Speaker 2: the Warriors. He texted me once after the Lakers lost
Speaker 2: that regular season game, the late regular season game, the
Speaker 2: first Luka Doncic game against the Warriors, and he goes,
Speaker 2: he just said to me, he goes, like, I love
Speaker 2: it when teams go small ball against the Warriors because
Speaker 2: just no one's ever going to play small ball as
Speaker 2: well as we do. And it's such a simple idea,
Speaker 2: but it's so true because the Warriors have been doing
Speaker 2: the Draymond at center thing literally since twenty fourteen. Like that,
Speaker 2: They've been doing it over a decade. They have every
Speaker 2: detail of that style of game down pat same thing
Speaker 2: goes for Denver. You're just not gonna eat them in
Speaker 2: the clutch when you do. It's bizarre. What was the
Speaker 2: game they lost to the Clippers. You had Aaron Gordon
Speaker 2: missed a wide open dunk right under the rim. I
Speaker 2: can't remember what mistake Jokic made, but Jokic made a
Speaker 2: big mistake down the stretch of that game. They just
Speaker 2: that was like the exception. Every other time you end
Speaker 2: up in these close games against Denver, I've I've been
Speaker 2: on the wrong side of this, guys. I've rooted for
Speaker 2: the Lakers the last couple of years, so like they
Speaker 2: are just completely indomitable in a tie game with five
Speaker 2: minutes left. It's it's one of the crazier things I've
Speaker 2: seen in my time following the league. And they just
Speaker 2: got it done again tonight against Oklahoma City. And like,
Speaker 2: there's obvious the main thing if you're looking at it
Speaker 2: from Okac's standpoint, in the way that they can try
Speaker 2: to avoid that slow down environment. Can't change the way
Speaker 2: you play. Can't change the way you play just because
Speaker 2: it slows down late, especially when you're going against Denver.
Speaker 2: You gotta keep pushing in transition, you gotta attack early
Speaker 2: in possessions. You got to move the ball. A good
Speaker 2: semi transition drive that kicks leads to an advantage. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you're right. You're gonna have to count on somebody like
Speaker 2: a lou Dort to drive a close out, but you're
Speaker 2: gonna start the engine, and your speed is such an
Speaker 2: advantage when you're in motion, when there's ball in player
Speaker 2: movement against this team, But when you just stare down
Speaker 2: Jamal Murray in an ISO at the top of the
Speaker 2: key and you can gap into driving lanes, it's just
Speaker 2: an easier thing for Denver to deal with. You're playing
Speaker 2: into their style of game, and so that's gonna be
Speaker 2: the main thing that they're gonna have to flip again
Speaker 2: moving forward in the series. I left Game two feeling
Speaker 2: coin flip slight edge OKC. Now at Game three, I'm
Speaker 2: coin flip slight edge Denver. Denver will be likely. I'm
Speaker 2: not even sure what the lion is in game four.
Speaker 2: I haven't looked yet, but I give Denver a slightly
Speaker 2: better than a coin flip chance of winning Game four
Speaker 2: at home. And if they win that game, I think
Speaker 2: they're gonna win the series, because all of a sudden,
Speaker 2: OKC has to win three games in a row and
Speaker 2: Denver just has the best player in the world on
Speaker 2: the time, and it can go either way. But I mean,
Speaker 2: you gotta be kicking yourself if you're a thunderfan, because
Speaker 2: you played well enough to win all three of these
Speaker 2: games and you're down to one in this series. And like,
Speaker 2: I've gotten into this argument a lot with a bunch
Speaker 2: of people, and like I want to be clear, this
Speaker 2: series is not over. I would not be the slightest
Speaker 2: bit surprised if Oklahoma City won this series. And with
Speaker 2: the way Boston's playing, guys, you could talk me into
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City right now being the most likely team to
Speaker 2: win the championship. So this is not some sort of
Speaker 2: big sweeping Oklahoma City's bad kind of take. But I've
Speaker 2: been preaching this all year. The team full of early
Speaker 2: twenty year olds that's gonna play way harder than everybody
Speaker 2: in the regular season, that's going to put up dramatic
Speaker 2: statistical markers, that are going to do things like Jackson,
Speaker 2: what was the odds before it was minus six hundred
Speaker 2: after minus yeah, after Game one when Denver won Oka,
Speaker 2: See was minus six hundred to win the series, Like,
Speaker 2: the odds are being fed by these number and it's everyone.
Speaker 2: It's breaking everybody's brain. Greatest net rating in NBA history
Speaker 2: and all this kind of stuff, And all year long,
Speaker 2: I've said, yeah, they're awesome. But young basketball players, I've
Speaker 2: been preaching this for years. What are young basketball players?
Speaker 2: What is the behavior of young basketball players? They struggle
Speaker 2: to have success and then replicate it, and they struggle
Speaker 2: to have failure, identify it, and avoid it. Veteran basketball
Speaker 2: teams have succeeded and failed so many times that when
Speaker 2: they identify success, they hammer it, and when they see failure,
Speaker 2: they quickly identify it and they remove it from their diet.
Speaker 2: They trim the fat. That is the difference between grown
Speaker 2: ass men playing basketball and dudes in their early twenties.
Speaker 2: And again that does not mean okay, so you can't
Speaker 2: win the series. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised
Speaker 2: if they won Game four, won Game five, one, game six,
Speaker 2: beat the shit out of Minnesota, went into the finals,
Speaker 2: and beat Boston or New York or Indiana or Cleveland,
Speaker 2: whoever it is that comes out, I would not be surprised.
Speaker 2: But they are vulnerable, and they are vulnerable because when
Speaker 2: they get into these situations, they are young and inexperienced,
Speaker 2: and the veteran older team who's been here a million times,
Speaker 2: is very comfortable in these settings. And they have lost
Speaker 2: two games that they should have won in this series.
Speaker 2: And so like that's that's that is why, like the
Speaker 2: next time this happens, the next time we see a
Speaker 2: team full of early twenty year olds that win sixty
Speaker 2: something games and dominates in the regular season. That is
Speaker 2: why I bring this talking point up. It is not
Speaker 2: a attempting to prevent them from getting the shine they deserve.
Speaker 2: It is simply just something I've learned from a long
Speaker 2: time watching basketball. The older veteran teams are just way
Speaker 2: more comfortable in adversity than the younger basketball teams. And
Speaker 2: maybe this will be the lesson, Maybe this will be
Speaker 2: the one that triggers it. And maybe they beat the
Speaker 2: Thunder six times in the series, or maybe they beat
Speaker 2: the Nuggets six times in this series. But I just
Speaker 2: think it's a really fascinating concept that the Thunder were
Speaker 2: torching the Nuggets with a high variety attack, moving the ball,
Speaker 2: driving kick hitting cutters, hitting shooters, and then they went
Speaker 2: brain dead late in the game and played high io.
Speaker 2: Because that's the kind of thing that can happen with
Speaker 2: a young basketball team in those sorts of settings. All right,
Speaker 2: let's move on to Cavs Pacers. Donovan Mitchell just logged
Speaker 2: back to back forty point games in the playoffs for
Speaker 2: the Cleveland Cavaliers for the first time since Lebron James
Speaker 2: did so in the twenty sixteen NBA Finals. Finally got
Speaker 2: his three point shot going a little bit. He was
Speaker 2: two for eighteen in the first two games, but he
Speaker 2: got several clean catch and shoot looks that helped him
Speaker 2: build that rhythm. He got one on the left wing
Speaker 2: and transitioned a couple ones on like other transition sequences.
Speaker 2: Just those easy catch and shoot threes are great ways
Speaker 2: to build rhythm as a three point shooter. He actually
Speaker 2: hit five in this game, and he was able to
Speaker 2: go to one of his patented step backs after the
Speaker 2: Pacers cut the lead down to eleven in the early
Speaker 2: fourth quarter. It was kind of like it felt like
Speaker 2: one of those Pacers runs was coming. He had a
Speaker 2: huge step back three that kind of stymied them, brought
Speaker 2: it back to fourteen. They never got that close again.
Speaker 2: That three point shot is a big piece of it
Speaker 2: because especially when you're in a high volume offensive role
Speaker 2: like he was before Garland got in the series, and
Speaker 2: even now with Garland being in kind of a smaller role,
Speaker 2: he's just leaned on for so much offensively, and if
Speaker 2: you can step into threes and not come down, it's
Speaker 2: such a great way to provide scoring without having to
Speaker 2: like really exert yourself physically. But we got to emphasize
Speaker 2: the job he was doing athletically. Donovan's moving probably like
Speaker 2: he's always been an elite athlete, but it looks to
Speaker 2: me like he's moving as well as ever, and he's
Speaker 2: having these insane contact finishes in this series where he's
Speaker 2: like it's almost like he gets that first angle and
Speaker 2: then he just pops off the ground and just improvises,
Speaker 2: like he pops off the ground, and then the ball
Speaker 2: just starts win milling around at all these different angles
Speaker 2: and then he finds a finishing angle to get a
Speaker 2: shot off, whether it's like below the rim scoop or
Speaker 2: he shoots like a really soft almost like floater layup
Speaker 2: that he'll get a lot of really good roles on
Speaker 2: right at the front of the rim. I just thought
Speaker 2: he was fantastic tonight as he goes for a second
Speaker 2: consecutive forty point game. Strus had his second consecutive twenty
Speaker 2: point game. A little bit of everything, open catch and
Speaker 2: shoot jump shots, contested catch and shoot jump shots, cutting, driving, closeouts,
Speaker 2: running second side action, you know, big transition dunk there
Speaker 2: in the fourth quarter. Darius Carland came back and like
Speaker 2: he was a little rusty, but you could just tell
Speaker 2: how much of greases the wheels for the offense. He
Speaker 2: brings the ball up with pace, hits some sort of
Speaker 2: action early in the possession and usually we'll get the
Speaker 2: defense in rotation. And again, look beyond the box score.
Speaker 2: The Calves logged a one thirty five offensive rating tonight
Speaker 2: when Darius Garland was on the floor. But what I
Speaker 2: want to zoom in on tonight is the defensive end
Speaker 2: for the Cavs, because this is what I thought was
Speaker 2: the ultimate, like kind of revealing thing that came out
Speaker 2: of this game. We knew that the Calves could score
Speaker 2: in this matchup. Donovan's been pretty comfortable all series. Obviously,
Speaker 2: even down bodies, they were in position to win Game two.
Speaker 2: But one of the things we talked about after Game
Speaker 2: two is like their defense got cut to pieces in
Speaker 2: Game one. And yeah, they came out in the first
Speaker 2: quarter of Game two and they held the Pacers down,
Speaker 2: but then for three straight quarters after that they gave
Speaker 2: up at least thirty four points. They hadn't had any
Speaker 2: sort of sustained success defensively against Indiana. Tonight they finally did.
Speaker 2: They held him to just thirty eight points total in
Speaker 2: the second and fourth quarters combined, when they built the
Speaker 2: first big lead and when they put the game away.
Speaker 2: So another way of looking at it is this was
Speaker 2: the first time the Cavs had some defensive success against
Speaker 2: the Pacers. So let's talk about how there's three concepts
Speaker 2: that I want to get into. One the denial of
Speaker 2: Tyres Halliburn to the zone defense that worked tonight, and
Speaker 2: then three the job that Evan Mobley and Jared Allen
Speaker 2: did on the back line tonight. So the denial of Haliburton.
Speaker 2: This has been the Cavs game playing the entire series.
Speaker 2: Started in Game one with sam Merril. They just in
Speaker 2: the early part of that game didn't take the ball
Speaker 2: out of the net enough times for them to be
Speaker 2: able to do it as effectively. But basically what they're
Speaker 2: doing is just trying to prevent Tyre's Halliburton from ever
Speaker 2: having the basketball. So any made basket or defensive rebound,
Speaker 2: whoever is closest to Halliburton will just run up and
Speaker 2: basically hug him, like position themselves directly between Haliburton and
Speaker 2: the ball and just not let him go get it.
Speaker 2: Then on any ballscreen action, they're coming up super aggressive
Speaker 2: and high to get him to get rid of the
Speaker 2: ball if he ever does get the ball. So like
Speaker 2: Tyree's will just sometimes just do a little shove off
Speaker 2: move he'll get the ball, they'll run a ball screen,
Speaker 2: they'll just immediately get the ball out of his hands.
Speaker 2: And it's worked to varying degrees in this series. In
Speaker 2: Game one, they tried Merrill on him, and Hollie still
Speaker 2: got into a rhythm and he was still great. Game two,
Speaker 2: they switched Truce on to him and it worked much better,
Speaker 2: but then they lost control of Haliburton late in the game.
Speaker 2: You could tell the difference between Struce and Meryl Strus
Speaker 2: when he's kind of like bear hug denying Halliburton. He's
Speaker 2: just stronger. So when Haliburtn tries to shed him through
Speaker 2: that off ball contact, he's just having a harder time
Speaker 2: than he did on Sam Meryl. But it succeeded in
Speaker 2: a big way tonight in Game three, and it succeeded
Speaker 2: in that it just killed his aggression. After taking fifteen
Speaker 2: shots in game one, he's taken just nineteen shots total
Speaker 2: in the last two games. Took only eight shots Tonight,
Speaker 2: finished with just four points and five assists. A couple
Speaker 2: of things. You can tell that even when he has
Speaker 2: the ball, he's rushing, he's missing reads that he doesn't
Speaker 2: usually miss, and he's not looking to be aggressive to score.
Speaker 2: So the game plan is working. It's psyching Haliburton out.
Speaker 2: We'll talk about Halliburton and how he can adjust to
Speaker 2: that later, but that's the first piece of how the
Speaker 2: Cavs are finally getting some defensive success against Indiana, denying
Speaker 2: Tyre's Haliburton the basketball whenever they can. The second piece
Speaker 2: of it was his own defense. We saw it to night.
Speaker 2: In the second quarter, with about eleven minutes left, the
Speaker 2: game was tied at thirty four, the Calves ran fifteen
Speaker 2: possessions of a three to two zone. We'll get into
Speaker 2: that concept here in a minute. The Pacers scored just
Speaker 2: seven points on those fifteen possessions of zone. By the
Speaker 2: end of the of the second quarter of the Calves
Speaker 2: were up by twenty one points, so from a tie
Speaker 2: game to a blowout, in large part because the Pacers
Speaker 2: couldn't score against the zone. Now, a three to two
Speaker 2: zone is very different from a two three zone. A
Speaker 2: two three zone is built around taking away the rim,
Speaker 2: and usually if you move the ball well against it,
Speaker 2: you'll get wide open catch and shoot threes. Essentially, you
Speaker 2: have the middle man whose responsibility it is to cover
Speaker 2: the basket and depending on the scheme up to the elbows,
Speaker 2: So like anybody who catches in the middle, sometimes the
Speaker 2: middle guy will cover that. Sometimes different zones will use
Speaker 2: different guys to cover that when they want to keep
Speaker 2: someone at the basket, like we saw Houston in games
Speaker 2: when they weren't playing Steph Curry, they would have Steven
Speaker 2: Adams just sit right underneath the basket in their zone.
Speaker 2: But a three to two zone is very different because
Speaker 2: in a two three zone, the other four guys are
Speaker 2: splitting the remainder of the three point line right, but
Speaker 2: in a three to two zone, both of the bottom guys,
Speaker 2: so again there's three guys up top, guy on the top,
Speaker 2: guy on the wings, two guys that are on the bottom.
Speaker 2: Both of those bottom guys are actually responsible for the corner.
Speaker 2: So as a result, all five players have responsibility at
Speaker 2: the three point line. And with the way that the
Speaker 2: Cavs were doing it too, it's kind of similar to
Speaker 2: what Houston was doing in the sense that, like as
Speaker 2: ball and player movement would occur, guys would be willing
Speaker 2: to change spots to make the whole thing function. But
Speaker 2: there are opportunities against a three to two zone in
Speaker 2: the interior that are not there against the outside and
Speaker 2: it just flummixed Indiana early in the game. They did
Speaker 2: do much better in the second half. They scored eleven
Speaker 2: points in just nine possessions against the three to two,
Speaker 2: so they did have some success there. The main thing
Speaker 2: they started doing is two things. One high ball screens.
Speaker 2: They started just screening the top man and having that
Speaker 2: man roll into the middle of the floor, so they
Speaker 2: were able to get some pocket passes into the middle
Speaker 2: of the floor. They also got like a deep seal
Speaker 2: for Thomas Bryant on a play where they had a
Speaker 2: shooter in one corner that occupied one of the low
Speaker 2: men and then they had Thomas Bryant just seal the
Speaker 2: other low man, so it created a very big passing window.
Speaker 2: They were able to throw them the ball and he got
Speaker 2: a big dunk. So they kind of figured it out
Speaker 2: in the second half. And I don't think we're going
Speaker 2: to see a ton of that zone moving forward. I
Speaker 2: think we'll see it a little bit here and there.
Speaker 2: But again, as I often talked about, the zone defenses
Speaker 2: are not meant to like permanently flummix NBA teams. If
Speaker 2: they do, you stick with it, and we will see
Speaker 2: that from time to time, Like you'll see long stretches
Speaker 2: of it, like shot a lot today. You'll see it,
Speaker 2: you know, like in what was a Game six against
Speaker 2: the Warriors when the Rockets ran a bunch of their zone.
Speaker 2: But like it's primarily its primary purpose is to just
Speaker 2: disrupt rhythm. Oh you're used to playing this way, Well
Speaker 2: how about we just you know, throw a giant wrench
Speaker 2: in things and make you play a very different style
Speaker 2: of basketball. And it worked for fifteen possessions in the
Speaker 2: second quarter. It threw the Pacers out of whack. Yeah,
Speaker 2: they eventually figured it out, but it didn't matter because
Speaker 2: they were already down twenty one at that point. So like,
Speaker 2: just this is why, like when I talk about with
Speaker 2: coaches mixing up coverages, like you cats just run the
Speaker 2: same damn thing every time. You got to do something
Speaker 2: that just kind of disrupts the flow. It's like you
Speaker 2: can't just you know, run high drop ten possessions in
Speaker 2: a row, then low drop ten possessions in a row
Speaker 2: in an adjustment. A lot of time, the best coaches
Speaker 2: will mix in various different coverages multiple times in the
Speaker 2: same quarter just to keep an offensive player or an
Speaker 2: entire offense off balance. The third piece of it Evan
Speaker 2: Mobley and Jared Allen multiple efforts at the rim. Defensively,
Speaker 2: those two guys are pretty rough in game one, and
Speaker 2: they've had their playoff moments where they haven't been very
Speaker 2: good defensively over the years, but I thought they were
Speaker 2: amazing tonight. This Indiana Pacers team applies so much rim
Speaker 2: pressure with their speed, and they're just in a lot
Speaker 2: of positions. In a lot of times, they're expected to
Speaker 2: be in multiple places at once, step up and contest
Speaker 2: a driver, then recover to someone at the basket. They
Speaker 2: forced a bunch of misses at the rim or near
Speaker 2: the rim for the Pacers tonight with their activity. All
Speaker 2: three of those guys just did are really excuse me?
Speaker 2: All three of those factors, I should say, Mobile and
Speaker 2: Allen on the back line. The zone defense, the denial
Speaker 2: of Halliburton finally had some sustained success slowing down Indiana's offense,
Speaker 2: which I thought was the main takeaway from tonight's game.
Speaker 2: And then for the Pacers moving forward, Tyres Halliburn's got
Speaker 2: to find a way to get involved. The opportunities are
Speaker 2: still there when he is aggressive to the ball, he
Speaker 2: can still get a catch, he can shed the deny.
Speaker 2: Then once they get up the floor, he's rushing against
Speaker 2: the blitzes. He's usually so comfortable he's like rushing that
Speaker 2: pass and not putting it into a place where they
Speaker 2: can quickly compromise the defense. He missed two floaters early
Speaker 2: in the game, one where he got blocked and one
Speaker 2: where he missed it long, and on both of them
Speaker 2: there were kickout reads, but he's like rushed. You can
Speaker 2: tell like this is legitimately just kind of getting him
Speaker 2: out of sorts. And so some of this is like
Speaker 2: Haliburton just needs to take a deep breath, understand the
Speaker 2: coverage and what it's doing, and find a way to
Speaker 2: be impactful anyway, meaning like overcome that circumstance we talked
Speaker 2: about shedding the deny and still looking to be aggressive
Speaker 2: making the proper reads. There's also when you're being face guarded,
Speaker 2: that guy is most likely not going to help as
Speaker 2: on a screening action. I would like to see Carlisle
Speaker 2: really be aggressive with Haliburton as a screener in game
Speaker 2: four to try to just generate some openings for him there.
Speaker 2: If he sets good screens, Struce will have no choice
Speaker 2: but to help. If Streuce doesn't help, if he sets
Speaker 2: a good screen, then there's an opportunity for someone to
Speaker 2: drive downhill. Just I would just run a bunch of
Speaker 2: Siakam Halliburton inverted pick and roll and just try to
Speaker 2: get Siakam going downhill, or get Struce off of Halliburton
Speaker 2: with a slower defender on Halliburton so that he can
Speaker 2: get going with the dribble. But your offense is pre
Speaker 2: dedicated on ty rees and his advantage creation, and right
Speaker 2: now he's all out of whack and you gotta find
Speaker 2: a way to get that right. All right, For about
Speaker 2: ten minutes before we get out here, we're gonna take
Speaker 2: some questions from the chat. We're gonna bring Jackson up
Speaker 2: on stage. Let's do it.
Speaker 3: First question is about Shake Gilles Alexander, who also had
Speaker 3: a bit of a stinker tonight. Do you believe that
Speaker 3: s J can solve the puzzles against elite Slash Smart
Speaker 3: Defenses Slash. What is he actually struggling with so far
Speaker 3: in this series?
Speaker 2: You know, it's interesting because I feel like j Dubb
Speaker 2: has been more the player that has been like the
Speaker 2: get the defense and rotation guy. He's bringing a lot
Speaker 2: of downhill force, He's moving the ball quickly through action,
Speaker 2: and it feels like Shay is more leaning on his
Speaker 2: shot making in this series. That said, I did think
Speaker 2: there were sequences in this game where he passed the
Speaker 2: ball well, it was mostly in that late game sequence
Speaker 2: where he just completely went away from the player movement. Also, secondarily,
Speaker 2: I thought that he and you know, Jackson, you and
Speaker 2: I were talking about this texting while the game is
Speaker 2: still going, but he kind of got into like the
Speaker 2: foul baity thing late against Christian Brown, and like that
Speaker 2: just wasn't the right approach in that sort of situation,
Speaker 2: especially since like he hit some shots, like there was
Speaker 2: a Shane and Jada kind of had a nice shot
Speaker 2: making fourth quarter there there were like five or six
Speaker 2: like pretty tough jump shots that those dudes hit. But
Speaker 2: in general, the two of them, you know, we talked
Speaker 2: about this a lot on the show, like there's a
Speaker 2: flow of the game piece that comes from a ball handler,
Speaker 2: Like you've got to be in charge of the flow
Speaker 2: of the game, and when you've got Chaed Holmgren on
Speaker 2: the floor, you got to find a way to keep
Speaker 2: him involved in those late game sequences when you like,
Speaker 2: you've just got to keep that flow, keep that motion
Speaker 2: late in games. And that's the main thing is in
Speaker 2: both of these games that they've lost, Shay is kind
Speaker 2: of hijacked things into a slow, high ISO attack, and
Speaker 2: I just don't think it's been the right move.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree, it does feel like they're and they're
Speaker 3: choosing to drag the pace of it down at the
Speaker 3: end of the those possession at the end of the game.
Speaker 2: Why why are they doing that?
Speaker 3: They don't need to do that, That's not where they
Speaker 3: have advantagies. Why are you let Why Why Isosha against
Speaker 3: Christian Brown, who you know, who isn't a perfect defender,
Speaker 3: but is their best defender for Shay, Why not involve
Speaker 3: Jokchin the pick and roll? Why not try to do
Speaker 3: something on the second side. It's it seems like from
Speaker 3: a strategic standpoint, whether it's coaching or Shay, they're they're there.
Speaker 3: It seems like they're intentionally putting themselves in tougher spots.
Speaker 2: No, they absolutely are. It's a there's a very difficult
Speaker 2: way to play basketball. Trust me, I've figured this out
Speaker 2: with the with the Lakers this year. You know, like
Speaker 2: everyone keeps wondering like what's going on, Like why is
Speaker 2: it that Golden State is causing so many more problems
Speaker 2: for Minnesota? And it's like, here's the thing. I've watched
Speaker 2: Luca before do this spam helio centric thing, and I've
Speaker 2: seen it work, but it hasn't worked in a championship context.
Speaker 2: And really, the only player ever in NBA history that's
Speaker 2: won a championship with the heliocentric style is Lebron James.
Speaker 2: And even then and then he became a very good
Speaker 2: off ball player played off of Kyrie Irving and that
Speaker 2: sort of thing, and he's probably the most conditioned athlete
Speaker 2: in the history of the sport. So like that's an exception.
Speaker 2: The truth is that's just a really hard way to
Speaker 2: play basketball. It's a really hard way to play basketball
Speaker 2: to hunt matchups in the middle of the floor, especially
Speaker 2: against these elite defenses that and that's the thing, like
Speaker 2: even Denver, a weaker defense that doesn't have elite defensive
Speaker 2: personnel can have success when you become predictable with the
Speaker 2: way that you attack, especially when the physicality is allowed.
Speaker 2: And so it's like, ultimately the way they need to
Speaker 2: approach these late game situations is the scale through the
Speaker 2: scope of advantage creation. So if they're just gonna switch
Speaker 2: any action with Shane J. Dubb And or Dort for instance,
Speaker 2: bring up Jokic into the screening action, find a way
Speaker 2: to get the defense in rotation and play the drive
Speaker 2: and kick style that was actually giving you the success
Speaker 2: you were having throughout the rest of the game.
Speaker 3: Yeah, one hundred percent. Sort of on this note, can
Speaker 3: you evaluate? Question is can you evaluate Mark Dagenall after
Speaker 3: fouling early in the game in game one and then
Speaker 3: tonight he had the weird challenge he didn't call time
Speaker 3: out at the end of the fourth quarter and then
Speaker 3: he started overtime with chat on the bench. Where how
Speaker 3: do you feel like he's handled the series so far?
Speaker 2: I don't necessarily have an issue with the lack of
Speaker 2: the time out there because Jadab it's kind of a
Speaker 2: similar concept to what you do with Tatum on that
Speaker 2: game winning attempt in the second Knicks game. In that situation,
Speaker 2: you're going high. I soo obviously that's the game plan,
Speaker 2: that's what they were doing, And there's something to be
Speaker 2: said about, like Dad Jenn't needs to do a better
Speaker 2: job of kind of like orchestrating the offense from the
Speaker 2: sideline and being like, hey, guys, if we do this,
Speaker 2: we're playing directly into their hands. But like I thought,
Speaker 2: where they went wrong on that possession is they gave
Speaker 2: the ball to JDub on the inbound and then Jup
Speaker 2: gave the ball to Shay and like, even though she
Speaker 2: hit a couple of shots in that stretch, I thought
Speaker 2: Jay Dubb had a better matchup and was in better rhythm,
Speaker 2: and so that was where it got weird. But you know,
Speaker 2: in a lot of these situations, you know how it
Speaker 2: is with me, guys, Like when it comes to on
Speaker 2: court decision making, I primarily focus on the players, right
Speaker 2: the challenge piece, the Chet Homer piece. Chet wasn't involved
Speaker 2: in the offense at all at that point in the game,
Speaker 2: so like, I kind of see where he's probably just thinking,
Speaker 2: I want to get an extra like perimeter defender on
Speaker 2: the floor in that situation, especially since Jamal Murray was
Speaker 2: attacking the way that he was attacking at that point
Speaker 2: in the game. I'm just not going to be as
Speaker 2: on the coach for the decisions the players are making
Speaker 2: on the floor, if that makes sense. But yeah, Mark
Speaker 2: does need to do a good job in the off
Speaker 2: day here of expressing to his team how they need
Speaker 2: to change their approach when they end up in these
Speaker 2: late game situations for sure.
Speaker 3: Next question, what does Minnesota have that OKAC is seemingly
Speaker 3: unable to replicate against Denver? It seems like okay See
Speaker 3: has more weapons and talent and skill almost across the board.
Speaker 3: Is it just Gobert? What's the why does Minnesota seem
Speaker 3: to have Denver's number?
Speaker 2: Comparative size, Minnesota is substantially bigger than Oklahoma City, substantially bigger.
Speaker 2: It was like Jamal Murray and Michael Porter Junior and
Speaker 2: all these guys, all of their individual matchups are several
Speaker 2: inches taller than what you have in the OKAC matchup.
Speaker 2: It's just there's also a frontline depth piece. Like it's
Speaker 2: all higher heart and sign and chet. You had a
Speaker 2: steady diet of Karl Anthony Towns and Rudy Gobert and
Speaker 2: nasried in that series. They were just cycling bigs in
Speaker 2: to just beat the shit out of Jokic. But like,
Speaker 2: I mean, the other thing too, is like the there
Speaker 2: is a little bit of a rim pressure piece with
Speaker 2: ant that is very different than the rim pressure piece
Speaker 2: you get from even Shay and J Dubb like ant
Speaker 2: cut Denver to pieces that series. And like even in
Speaker 2: Game seven, when he wasn't putting up the big numbers
Speaker 2: necessarily like efficiency wise, in that second half, he was
Speaker 2: in attack mode and he was getting that defense in
Speaker 2: rotation consistently, and like there's a little bit of like
Speaker 2: when this game slowed down, it's like, oh, way, J
Speaker 2: Dub is an elite athlete, but he's not like ant athlete.
Speaker 2: And Shae's an elite athlete, but he's not like ant athlete,
Speaker 2: and they can actually kind of manage that dynamic a
Speaker 2: little bit better. But I just the simple answer to
Speaker 2: your question is just that Minnesota's defense is substantially bigger
Speaker 2: than oklahoma sagy for sure.
Speaker 3: Let's do one more question and then we'll go over
Speaker 3: to playback for a bit. Aaron Gordon has now hit
Speaker 3: obviously the game winning three in Game one, hit a
Speaker 3: very very clutch three again tonight. Have you ever seen
Speaker 3: a shooting turnaround this drastic?
Speaker 2: Okay, let's have some fun here, Jackson. What are examples
Speaker 2: of guys in our lives that we can remember that
Speaker 2: sucked at shooting and then became good at it?
Speaker 3: Kawhi Leonard is one that pops the mind from me.
Speaker 2: KWHI Leonard is a great example.
Speaker 3: I don't know statistically whether if it's as drastic, but
Speaker 3: he pops the mind from me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm trying to think like Jason Kidd, that's a
Speaker 2: good one towards the tail end of his career. Who's
Speaker 2: the big Brook Lopez.
Speaker 3: I don't think Kawhi is even the best example. Why
Speaker 3: is shockingly good three point percentage early on in his career.
Speaker 3: He I don't know if he's even the best example, right.
Speaker 2: No, Yeah, you're right. Yeah, it was like weirdly good
Speaker 2: with touch. He just wasn't a volume shooter until yeah
Speaker 2: in his career. Well that I remember. That was the
Speaker 2: thing with Kawhi is everyone was like in his pre
Speaker 2: draft workout he'd made like eighty five percent of his
Speaker 2: free throws or something, and everyone was, wow, this means
Speaker 2: he can shoot.
Speaker 1: Right right right.
Speaker 3: One that came to mind for me is uh, not
Speaker 3: as obvious one, but just as I watched it a
Speaker 3: lot as Derek White the season that he was not
Speaker 3: that he was as bad of a shooter as Aaron
Speaker 3: Gordon was, but he was like low thirties thirty one percent,
Speaker 3: thirty percent, and then in that finals year that they
Speaker 3: lost the Warriors, it was like, we're going to just
Speaker 3: let him shoot it in the corner, and he missed
Speaker 3: a bunch of shots, and now he's like thirty eight.
Speaker 2: That's a good one. Now, Derek White's a good one there. Yeah,
Speaker 2: this is a this is a good question. But Aaron
Speaker 2: Gordon is one of the classic ones in the sense
Speaker 2: that it wasn't like typical player development, like I mean,
Speaker 2: you could be like you could go to like Lebron
Speaker 2: became a better shooter over the course of his career,
Speaker 2: but it's like he never was that bad, you know,
Speaker 2: he just got Aaron Gordon was a guy that like
Speaker 2: that you would just leave completely wide open, and now
Speaker 2: he's become a guy that like legitimately is a knockdown
Speaker 2: three point shooter, and I feel like it's gonna go
Speaker 2: in every time. Sneaky guy on this list too is
Speaker 2: Russell Westbrook at this point in his career is like
Speaker 2: suddenly becoming a guy that, like he had a big
Speaker 2: three out of the left corner or was it out
Speaker 2: of the right corner in tonight's game. But that's a
Speaker 2: very good question, all right, guys, we're gonna head over
Speaker 2: to playback again playback dot tv slash Hoops tonight. We're
Speaker 2: gonna go a little bit shorter tonight, just for about
Speaker 2: a half hour forty five minutes, but we'll meet you
Speaker 2: guys over there in just a few minutes. We'll take
Speaker 2: some callers, we'll take some questions from the chat, we
Speaker 2: may watch a little bit of film again. I always
Speaker 2: appreciate you guys for rocking with us and walking rocking
Speaker 2: with the show. We will see you guys over on playback. So, guys,
Speaker 2: as always, I appreciate you for listening and supporting Hoops tonight.
Speaker 2: It would actually be really helpful for us if you
Speaker 2: guys would take a second and leave a rating and
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Speaker 2: But if you could take a minute to do that,
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