Speaker 1: Hey, that folks. It is Tuesday, July first, and the
Speaker 1: first full day of deliberations is underway in the Ditty trial.
Speaker 1: And sure enough, this morning, within an hour we heard
Speaker 1: from the jury once again, welcome to this did he
Speaker 1: update episode of Amy and TJ Robes it is? This
Speaker 1: jury keeps it interesting. But they've sent another note. We'll
Speaker 1: get the details about. There at least three notes they've
Speaker 1: sent with some kind of either problem or question. Right,
Speaker 1: but what do we Isn't this a good sign that
Speaker 1: they're taking this seriously?
Speaker 2: Yes, And I love that they're inquisitive and asking questions
Speaker 2: because it shows they want to make sure that they're
Speaker 2: understanding things clearly and fully. And so yes, three notes
Speaker 2: with questions, two notes with just letting the judge know
Speaker 2: who the four person was and when they wanted to
Speaker 2: end the day. But yeah, five notes total, three with
Speaker 2: questions in just what six and a half seven hours of.
Speaker 3: Deliberation so far.
Speaker 2: So that is a pretty active jury who is engaging
Speaker 2: directly with the judge quite often.
Speaker 1: Well, they and again it's like yesterday we got a
Speaker 1: note within an hour. Today or in about an hour today,
Speaker 1: we actually got the note within an hour And this
Speaker 1: just I was just struck by Wow. They've only been
Speaker 1: there chatting it up for a short time. They came
Speaker 1: with the very specific things that they wanted this morning.
Speaker 1: But before any of that either had it could even
Speaker 1: take place, we did, Like we say, usually there's some
Speaker 1: housekeeping in the courtroom before the jury actually gets going.
Speaker 1: We had that again. But it was interesting today. A
Speaker 1: couple of notes from the folks in the courtroom that
Speaker 1: we keep up with. On a personal note from Diddy
Speaker 1: having to do with his family, the lack of family,
Speaker 1: and frankly, what sounds like a sweet moment with his mom.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he told her he liked her outfit, did he not?
Speaker 2: He said he loved what she was wearing. It's a
Speaker 2: green and white zebra looking outfit. But yeah, he was
Speaker 2: able to whisper in her ear and he told her basically,
Speaker 2: it's I'm gonna be okay.
Speaker 3: It's gonna be okay.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he sounded it sounded sweet, it sounded reassured. Look,
Speaker 1: we're only doing it. We can only do this by
Speaker 1: reading comments from reporters in the room, but a couple
Speaker 1: of them took note that he had more of an
Speaker 1: interaction with his mom. However, he only has his mom
Speaker 1: was the only one in the courtroom today at first,
Speaker 1: I believe his sister, right.
Speaker 2: Or his sister has now just shown up with his
Speaker 2: mom to for this reading of this latest note that
Speaker 2: the jury said, So they came back. They had been
Speaker 2: hanging out in the cafeteria, I believe, and so they
Speaker 2: came up to be there with him. But yet we
Speaker 2: actually went by the courthouse earlier this morning, and it
Speaker 2: is active outside. Folks are waiting anxiously, it seems, outside
Speaker 2: of the courtroom. So yeah, it's been it's been an
Speaker 2: active day. But the courtroom itself, they say a fewer
Speaker 2: people are inside the actual courtroom today, understandably.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I mean, it's supposed to be boring because
Speaker 1: it's supposed to be no action in court. The judge
Speaker 1: comes in, he gallbols everybody to order, welcome to the jury,
Speaker 1: go do your work, and then we wait. So all
Speaker 1: we're doing is sitting and waiting. All did he is
Speaker 1: doing is sitting and waiting at the courthouse and a
Speaker 1: holding cell with his books that he's allowed to have.
Speaker 1: But this is a waiting game. Now, the back and
Speaker 1: forth with the lawyers to answer the questions Roode's other
Speaker 1: point here, before we get into these, before we get
Speaker 1: into the notes that they did send, this seems to
Speaker 1: be taking time, like it's drawing deliberations that we're all
Speaker 1: already expected to not go that quickly. It seems like
Speaker 1: we're losing a lot of time on notes already.
Speaker 3: That's right.
Speaker 2: But honestly, you and I have talked about it. We
Speaker 2: looked at as much as we could, we read the
Speaker 2: judge's instructions.
Speaker 3: To the jury.
Speaker 2: This is a complicated case. This is not did he
Speaker 2: do it, did he not do it? This is so
Speaker 2: much more than that, and each charge is very specific
Speaker 2: and hard to grasp what is what, So the language
Speaker 2: they're having issue with some of the at least that
Speaker 2: was the question that they gave the judge before they
Speaker 2: broke deliberations yesterday, and it was the question that they
Speaker 2: had to answer this morning first thing, and it was
Speaker 2: about what it means to distribute drugs. I mean, it's
Speaker 2: it is a little unclear.
Speaker 1: So that's yes, that's how the days started. They sent
Speaker 1: a note yesterday, Yes, because we debated right here about it. Right,
Speaker 1: if I go get drugs from this person and then
Speaker 1: they're from my personal use and then I'm hanging out
Speaker 1: with somebody else and said, hey, you want one of
Speaker 1: my pills and give it to that person. Am I
Speaker 1: a drug distributor? The prosecutors essentially are saying, hell yeah.
Speaker 1: But the jury asked that question, and this morning, before
Speaker 1: things got started, the judge did give the official response,
Speaker 1: that's right.
Speaker 2: Well, it's funny you say that, because the prosecution asked
Speaker 2: that the judge just simply respond to that question with
Speaker 2: a yes.
Speaker 3: The defense not so much.
Speaker 2: They wanted to refer the jury back to a full
Speaker 2: set of instructions and other parts of the charge, kind
Speaker 2: of confusing. The judge said, okay, here's what I'm going
Speaker 2: to do.
Speaker 3: So he told the.
Speaker 2: Jury to refer back to page thirty seven, lines one
Speaker 2: through three of its jury charge, and then he quoted
Speaker 2: the language from the instruction.
Speaker 3: So here is what they said. This is what the
Speaker 3: judge told the jury.
Speaker 2: The word distribution means actual, constructive, or attempted transfer. To
Speaker 2: distribute simply means to deliver, to pass over, or to
Speaker 2: hand over something to another person, or cause it to
Speaker 2: be delivered, passed on, or handed over to another. Distribution
Speaker 2: does not require a sale.
Speaker 3: I thought that was really interesting.
Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, once you got to the end. I was
Speaker 1: confused up to that, Like what does all that mean?
Speaker 1: And they're having to figure this out. I don't know
Speaker 1: I could fig it word for word actual constructive or
Speaker 1: attempted transfer?
Speaker 2: Like even if if I try to give you a pill,
Speaker 2: that still counts as me being a distributor, even if
Speaker 2: you didn't take it or if you didn't want it.
Speaker 1: Fine, what's a constructive transfer?
Speaker 3: It actually was something that happened.
Speaker 2: There was there was a there was something that happened
Speaker 2: from the transfer. You actually received the pill. That would
Speaker 2: be how I read that.
Speaker 1: What if I caused it to be passed on?
Speaker 2: Doing you told someone else, hey give If I told
Speaker 2: a friend of mine, hey give this pill to TJ.
Speaker 1: Okay, here's my next question I would send if I
Speaker 1: was sitting the jerk, Can we ask this, Am I
Speaker 1: a distributor if I never touched the drug? If I
Speaker 1: tell my guy go pick up these drugs, he comes
Speaker 1: back to the room with the stuff and then he
Speaker 1: gives a pill, that would be my next question.
Speaker 2: The way I read it, the answer is yes to that,
Speaker 2: because you are causing it to be delivered, passed on,
Speaker 2: or handed over to another, not necessarily directly by your hand,
Speaker 2: but you've caused the transfer to happen.
Speaker 3: You've ordered or asked for the transfer to happen.
Speaker 1: And this is what they're trying to figure out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and to the possibly send this man to jail for
Speaker 1: the rest of his life. They're having to figure that out. Now.
Speaker 1: It's feeling weightier and weightier that it comes down to
Speaker 1: nuance and legalese and one pill and my understanding and
Speaker 1: comprehension of the law and your understanding and comprehension. And
Speaker 1: you're a deli clerk and I'm a molecular biologist. And
Speaker 1: the guy down at the end there is a retired banker,
Speaker 1: and this one over here as an analyst. And you're
Speaker 1: from Westchester and I'm from the Bronx. This is what
Speaker 1: you're trying to get on the same page about this. Yes, so,
Speaker 1: mar you've been my best friend for five years. You
Speaker 1: and I are not gonna see eye to eye on
Speaker 1: this quest. I'm saying, even sitting here with you, we
Speaker 1: can't come to Oh, okay, I get it. Oh that
Speaker 1: makes sense.
Speaker 2: Oh I see now, it seems just it seems ridiculous
Speaker 2: when you think about how many times in your life.
Speaker 2: If you even just put it to like alcohol or
Speaker 2: something else you're giving someone, Suddenly now you're committing some
Speaker 2: racketeering charge that could put you away for the rest
Speaker 2: of your life because you handed something to someone or
Speaker 2: you told someone to give someone something that may or
Speaker 2: may not be illegal. That's something that a lot of
Speaker 2: folks will take to heart and probably personalize and humanize.
Speaker 2: And so I know they're not supposed to do that.
Speaker 2: This is supposed to be about the law, but that
Speaker 2: law is not something that I think most people are
Speaker 2: familiar with. It is a law that just seems like
Speaker 2: the punishment is fairly intense given what the alleged crime is.
Speaker 1: Oh, so we answered that question for the jury this
Speaker 1: morning when they first got started. Sends them back to
Speaker 1: deliberate and what was it forty five minutes I believe.
Speaker 1: Later they give another note and they were very specific
Speaker 1: about what they wanted in the note. So this is
Speaker 1: the fresh note now that we got from the jury
Speaker 1: today about forty five minutes into deliberations, and they wanted
Speaker 1: to hear ropes from two people in particular.
Speaker 2: Yes, they are asking for key testimony transcripts.
Speaker 3: Yes, this happened around ten fifteen this morning.
Speaker 2: It's taken a while for it to all take place
Speaker 2: in court because they had to bring Diddy back into court,
Speaker 2: his mother, his sister, and by the way, his youngest
Speaker 2: daughter I just saw is back in court today with
Speaker 2: them as well, so he's got three members of his family,
Speaker 2: but everyone had to get seated again, the defense and
Speaker 2: the prosecution. So finally, this is what the jury said.
Speaker 2: They would like to see the.
Speaker 3: Specific transscripts up.
Speaker 2: Number one, they want to see Cassie Ventura's testimony regarding
Speaker 2: the Intercontinental incident, that, of course is the surveillance video
Speaker 2: that we've all seen. Number two, they want to see
Speaker 2: Cassie Ventura's testimony concerns about the events at Cannes and
Speaker 2: the immediate and.
Speaker 3: What happened afterwards.
Speaker 2: So they want to hear what she testified to about
Speaker 2: what happened when she and Diddy went to can They
Speaker 2: also want venturas testimony regarding interactions and freak offs, specifically
Speaker 2: with the male escort Daniel Phillip. And they want Daniel
Speaker 2: phillips testimony regarding the Essex Hotel incident with Ventur because
Speaker 2: I believe that is the moment in which he said
Speaker 2: she didn't want to continue the freak off he heard,
Speaker 2: he claims, he testified, did he slapping her around? There
Speaker 2: was some beating going on, and then he told her
Speaker 2: to get back in and continue the freak off. And
Speaker 2: that's when Daniel Phillips said he couldn't actually perform because
Speaker 2: of what he witnessed. He just wasn't able to get
Speaker 2: heart basically.
Speaker 1: So I don't know why. I mean, just it's just
Speaker 1: fascinating to think of what's happening in the jury room
Speaker 1: that they are focused on this particular guy.
Speaker 2: It's racketeering still, I believe because they're trying to this
Speaker 2: is either kidnapping or this is sex trafficking within the
Speaker 2: racketeering charge because that those are two of the or
Speaker 2: coersion forced labor is another one of the crimes that
Speaker 2: could fit the racketeer. So it could be any of
Speaker 2: those things.
Speaker 1: And it is fair to say, I mean, we don't
Speaker 1: know how they are working in there, but does it
Speaker 1: makes sense that they would do this one at a
Speaker 1: time right right now? It's all racketeering, right right. We
Speaker 1: haven't gotten to the other four. It seems again we
Speaker 1: don't know.
Speaker 2: It seems like they're checking off the racketeering charges to
Speaker 2: see if there's enough to fit right, so the drug charges,
Speaker 2: whether it's forced labor or sex trafficking, a corrosion, one
Speaker 2: of those things, because I had to go back and
Speaker 2: look what happened in Can. But there were two parts
Speaker 2: to her testimony about Can. One, she talked about getting
Speaker 2: kicked off the yacht without shoes and without her passport
Speaker 2: because she and Diddy got into a fight over her.
Speaker 2: He claimed she stole drugs from him. But then there
Speaker 2: was also something she spoke about in the flight on
Speaker 2: the way home from Can where she claimed that she
Speaker 2: saw him watching videos of a freak off with her
Speaker 2: that she thought he had deleted and showing them to
Speaker 2: other people in a way that made her feel intimidated.
Speaker 2: So it could be either one or both of that
Speaker 2: part of her testimony.
Speaker 1: Again reminder, he's they have to prove. They have to
Speaker 1: be convinced that he committed crimes that he's actually not
Speaker 1: charged with. That sounds crazy, but to be convicted of racketeering,
Speaker 1: they have to be convinced you committed at least two
Speaker 1: of this long list of other crimes. And so they're
Speaker 1: having to go through and check off did he do kidnapping, arsery, arson, bribery,
Speaker 1: forced labor transportation, to engage in prostitution, possession with the
Speaker 1: intent to distribute, witness tampering. They have to go through
Speaker 1: he said he did he do at least two of
Speaker 1: these with one other person. If so, he's guilty of
Speaker 1: racketeering and he could possibly go to jail the rest
Speaker 1: of his life.
Speaker 3: Right, And that is the other key.
Speaker 2: He had to conspire with someone in any of those
Speaker 2: crimes you just listed off. He couldn't have done it
Speaker 2: on his own because that wouldn't be racketeering. He has
Speaker 2: to do it with someone within his enterprise, as the
Speaker 2: prosecution has called it. So that's even more confusing. Even
Speaker 2: if you could say, okay, we think he did one
Speaker 2: or two or several of these things.
Speaker 3: It wouldn't matter.
Speaker 2: They have to actually believe and see that he did
Speaker 2: it with a co conspirator.
Speaker 3: That's wild to me.
Speaker 2: That's why that specific charge, which again carries the longest
Speaker 2: prison term life in prison up to life in prison,
Speaker 2: is a bizarre crime that I don't think a lot
Speaker 2: of us understand because it almost feels like a trumped
Speaker 2: up charge or and I know it's a charge that
Speaker 2: they use in mob bosses and other but it just
Speaker 2: isn't one that I think many of us are very
Speaker 2: familiar with.
Speaker 1: We hear about it, right, I hear about it plenty,
Speaker 1: and nobody could ever a rico case of Sean Diddy Colmbs.
Speaker 1: It's just this is what they're trying to piece get. Look,
Speaker 1: the law is law, and they have used this before
Speaker 1: in ways that this rico statue that has nothing to
Speaker 1: do with Maha barses prosecutors have been using. Hey R.
Speaker 1: Kelly is sitting in jail right now with a racketeering charge,
Speaker 1: so they have used it before. It's it's hard and
Speaker 1: it's fascinating here to try to piece together. This all
Speaker 1: has come about today after yesterday's I don't want to
Speaker 1: call it rocky. It was a little bizarre, but I
Speaker 1: don't know what to make of it. But it seems
Speaker 1: everything is calmed down. We haven't heard anything more about
Speaker 1: JURR number twenty five.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we have not gotten an update.
Speaker 2: It seems as though I guess this is one of
Speaker 2: those moments where you just figure no news is good news,
Speaker 2: that somehow they figured it out, because right away there
Speaker 2: must have just been a turbulent start or juring number
Speaker 2: twenty five for whatever reason, the other jurors felt like
Speaker 2: he was not willing to play nice, or he wasn't
Speaker 2: willing to deliberate, or he wasn't willing to participate in
Speaker 2: what they believed was what the judge told them to do,
Speaker 2: which was to actually sit down and try to work
Speaker 2: things out, and maybe he had already made up his mind.
Speaker 3: That was our best guess.
Speaker 2: I can't wait to hear one of the jurors come
Speaker 2: out and explain what exactly was going on with jur
Speaker 2: number twenty five, because I cannot think of another explanation
Speaker 2: other than he had just already made up his mind
Speaker 2: and did not want to have a conversation.
Speaker 1: The judge, you know, send them back, said you all
Speaker 1: keep doing your thing, and they have continued to do so.
Speaker 1: But we I don't know. I'm holding my breath, it
Speaker 1: seems because a verdict could come any moment in this trial,
Speaker 1: any moment. But then every note that I've seen so far,
Speaker 1: like wow, they're nowhere closes It almost aems like they're
Speaker 1: just getting started. I know, well they kind of are,
Speaker 1: but yesterday with the jury issue and then today with
Speaker 1: these some of these questions they are. I do not
Speaker 1: envy this group. So this is all civic duty. We're
Speaker 1: all supposed to do. This is a responsibility, and they
Speaker 1: are serving right now.
Speaker 3: They certainly are.
Speaker 2: And I can't help but wonder what the Diddy defense
Speaker 2: team is thinking right now, because everyone always tries to
Speaker 2: read the tea leaves about where the jurors are with
Speaker 2: the questions they ask or the transcripts they want to see.
Speaker 2: And I don't know if this feels scary to them,
Speaker 2: if this is reassuring to them. I can't even imagine
Speaker 2: what this Every single little bit of information that comes
Speaker 2: down has to just be so jarring for the team,
Speaker 2: for Diddy, for his mother. Even that's why he said,
Speaker 2: you know, calm down, it's gonna be all right. But
Speaker 2: I just can't imagine what that would be like when
Speaker 2: your life is on the line.
Speaker 1: All right, well, folk, we are keeping a very close
Speaker 1: eye on it. A reminder of the jury yesterday left
Speaker 1: at five. That was their their choice, but the judge
Speaker 1: said he was going to leave it up to them
Speaker 1: when they wanted to and how they wanted to work
Speaker 1: during the day, so we could expect them possibly to
Speaker 1: keep bankers hours they're going to work nine to five,
Speaker 1: it seems every single day. But man fourth of July
Speaker 1: is coming, and that's got to be a motivating factor
Speaker 1: for this group.
Speaker 3: It has to be. It certainly has to be.
Speaker 2: But we of course will keep our eye on that
Speaker 2: Manhattan Courthouse and we will jump in jump back on
Speaker 2: your feet if there are any updates to give you.
Speaker 2: But until then, I want to thank you for listening
Speaker 2: to us. I am robot on behalf of my partner T. J. Holmes.
Speaker 2: Hope you'll have a great day.