1 00:00:00,640 --> 00:00:02,840 Speaker 1: Hi, everyone. I hope you're enjoying your Saturday morning and 2 00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:05,240 Speaker 1: your weekend so far, and I hope this episode makes 3 00:00:05,280 --> 00:00:06,920 Speaker 1: it a little bit better because it's about one of 4 00:00:07,000 --> 00:00:10,479 Speaker 1: my favorite trees, the mangrove. I discovered mangroves in person 5 00:00:10,480 --> 00:00:13,399 Speaker 1: when I went to Coastal Mexico for the first time, 6 00:00:13,720 --> 00:00:15,200 Speaker 1: and I'll tell you what, I fell in love with 7 00:00:15,240 --> 00:00:20,720 Speaker 1: these things. They are amazing. Mangroves colon Nature's best tree, 8 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:21,439 Speaker 1: I think. 9 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:34,680 Speaker 2: So welcome to Stuff you should know, a production of iHeartRadio. 10 00:00:36,600 --> 00:00:39,440 Speaker 3: Hey, welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh, and there's Chuck 11 00:00:39,479 --> 00:00:42,120 Speaker 3: and there's Jerry over there. So let's get to it. 12 00:00:42,159 --> 00:00:46,400 Speaker 3: While we're talking about mangroves. Everybody mangroves gather around while 13 00:00:46,440 --> 00:00:48,040 Speaker 3: we talk about mangrove. 14 00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:51,440 Speaker 1: My new favorite tree. 15 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:54,200 Speaker 3: It's a great tree. It's a good favorite tree to. 16 00:00:54,160 --> 00:00:56,880 Speaker 1: Have, it is, and this is one of those. I 17 00:00:56,880 --> 00:00:59,480 Speaker 1: think this is the second and probably final that was 18 00:00:59,520 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 1: inspired by my recent trip to Mexico because we were 19 00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:10,160 Speaker 1: surrounded by mangroves, literally surrounded by mangroves, and we couldn't 20 00:01:10,160 --> 00:01:12,880 Speaker 1: get enough of them, and like riding the bikes round 21 00:01:12,920 --> 00:01:17,399 Speaker 1: and looking in these mangrove forests and considering what it 22 00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:22,320 Speaker 1: must be like to try and navigate through them, nearly impossible, 23 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:25,880 Speaker 1: I would say, because yeah, I mean you've seen them 24 00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 1: in person. I'm sure like just how dense these things are. 25 00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:32,640 Speaker 1: And you know we're gonna be talking about different kinds, 26 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:35,399 Speaker 1: but really sort of the money mangroves sure are the 27 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:37,360 Speaker 1: ones that we're going to focus on, and they are 28 00:01:37,440 --> 00:01:40,040 Speaker 1: just I was knocked out just by how they looked, 29 00:01:40,080 --> 00:01:42,760 Speaker 1: and I could tell that they were a remarkable wonder 30 00:01:42,880 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 1: of nature and evolution. And then after this stuff Dave 31 00:01:46,959 --> 00:01:50,240 Speaker 1: Rus helped us put this together, after learning everything that 32 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:54,760 Speaker 1: they're capable of, it's just like, what kind of tree 33 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:55,800 Speaker 1: is this? It's amazing. 34 00:01:56,240 --> 00:01:58,920 Speaker 3: It's an amazing tree. Like I said, it's maybe one 35 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:00,960 Speaker 3: of the best trees to have as your favorite tree, 36 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:04,000 Speaker 3: because there are very few trees that are this amazing, 37 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:08,040 Speaker 3: Chuck Man, and we're talking mangroves, and we should say 38 00:02:08,639 --> 00:02:12,280 Speaker 3: mangroves aren't necessarily like a species or even a family 39 00:02:12,320 --> 00:02:14,760 Speaker 3: of tree. One of the other things that makes them 40 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:17,080 Speaker 3: such a cool tree to have as a favorite is 41 00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:19,600 Speaker 3: that there's something like eighty or ninety species of them, 42 00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:24,240 Speaker 3: and they're not genetically related in every case. Instead, biologists 43 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:28,160 Speaker 3: classify them by their ability to survive and even thrive 44 00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:34,360 Speaker 3: in salty water, that in soil that has little to 45 00:02:34,440 --> 00:02:37,640 Speaker 3: no oxygen, which are two things that most trees can't do. 46 00:02:38,040 --> 00:02:40,040 Speaker 3: And that's just the tip of the iceberg in what 47 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:42,160 Speaker 3: makes mangroves so amazing. 48 00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:45,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, but like I said, we're talking mainly about those 49 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:48,680 Speaker 1: amazing trees that sit up above the water with this 50 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:52,520 Speaker 1: network of you know, look like fingers just sort of 51 00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:55,799 Speaker 1: propping up the tree, which are the roots. They are 52 00:02:56,520 --> 00:03:00,240 Speaker 1: a woodland tree, also could be called a shrub, and 53 00:03:00,320 --> 00:03:06,600 Speaker 1: they grow in a pretty narrow area between well they're 54 00:03:06,680 --> 00:03:09,679 Speaker 1: subtropical along the coastlines first of all, but they grow 55 00:03:09,720 --> 00:03:14,600 Speaker 1: between literally between the terrestrial and the marine environment in 56 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 1: salty brackish water. 57 00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:21,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, and there's I want to say a lot of them. 58 00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:23,760 Speaker 3: It's really not though. I think they make up like 59 00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:26,760 Speaker 3: one percent of the forests of the world mangrove forests are. 60 00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:29,799 Speaker 3: But it's still eighty five thousand square miles, which is 61 00:03:29,840 --> 00:03:32,919 Speaker 3: a pretty decent amount of area for you know, one 62 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:35,080 Speaker 3: kind of tree. It's about the size of the state 63 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 3: of Arkansas, and the largest mangrove forest in the world 64 00:03:39,280 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 3: is at the mouth of the Ganges near the Bay 65 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:45,960 Speaker 3: of Bengal. It's called the Sundarbans and that's where the 66 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:48,120 Speaker 3: Bengal tiger lives, which is pretty cool. 67 00:03:49,040 --> 00:03:54,680 Speaker 1: Agreed. They exist in one hundred and eighteen countries and 68 00:03:54,920 --> 00:03:58,440 Speaker 1: here in the United States, in Texas, Louisiana, and Florida. 69 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 1: And I thought, oh, surely the Georgia coast so close 70 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:05,160 Speaker 1: to Florida, surely they've got some mangroves. 71 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:06,200 Speaker 3: Don't even try. 72 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:09,240 Speaker 1: Not quite that. I did see some people that were like, oh, 73 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:12,560 Speaker 1: it's so mangroves, but it's not true. It looks like 74 00:04:13,040 --> 00:04:15,840 Speaker 1: the closest mangroves are about forty miles from the Georgia border, 75 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:18,760 Speaker 1: near the Georgia coast line. So it was really sad 76 00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:22,200 Speaker 1: that we don't have our mangroves. But they do have 77 00:04:22,240 --> 00:04:27,960 Speaker 1: them in Florida and Louisiana and Texas, in Mexico, that's right. 78 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:31,719 Speaker 3: And again you said that they grow subtropically, and Chuck, 79 00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:35,800 Speaker 3: I want to share that it was just today that 80 00:04:35,880 --> 00:04:39,240 Speaker 3: I finally stopped and was like, this subtropical thing is 81 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:44,279 Speaker 3: driving me crazy, Like it's above the tropics on either side. 82 00:04:44,279 --> 00:04:46,839 Speaker 3: It's either above or below, depending on where your perspective, 83 00:04:47,120 --> 00:04:50,839 Speaker 3: but it's not below. It's not below the equator. And 84 00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:53,159 Speaker 3: then I realized, if you're on the equator from the 85 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:56,640 Speaker 3: perspective of the equator, it's below the equator on either side, 86 00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:58,360 Speaker 3: so it's sub tropical. 87 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:00,000 Speaker 1: You've never stood on the equator. 88 00:05:00,240 --> 00:05:02,839 Speaker 3: I never have, and I think I can be a blame. 89 00:05:03,560 --> 00:05:04,880 Speaker 3: I've never been to Ecuador. 90 00:05:06,080 --> 00:05:07,920 Speaker 1: Well, we should go sometime. We should do a podcast 91 00:05:08,000 --> 00:05:10,800 Speaker 1: live live from the equator. 92 00:05:11,279 --> 00:05:12,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, and see if we melt. 93 00:05:13,080 --> 00:05:16,840 Speaker 1: I know I will. I'm melting this week. As far 94 00:05:16,839 --> 00:05:18,800 Speaker 1: as man the money mangroves that I was talking about, 95 00:05:18,839 --> 00:05:23,440 Speaker 1: we're talking about red, black and white, and for my money, 96 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:27,120 Speaker 1: I love those red mangroves. Those are the ones that 97 00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:30,280 Speaker 1: grow along the water's edge. They have those proper roots 98 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:33,480 Speaker 1: that and if you've never seen a ma mangrove, please 99 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:37,280 Speaker 1: just look up red mangrove. And they're called prop roots 100 00:05:37,279 --> 00:05:40,000 Speaker 1: because they prop that tree up off the ground. They 101 00:05:40,040 --> 00:05:43,159 Speaker 1: are fully well, not fully exposed because they also go 102 00:05:43,200 --> 00:05:46,239 Speaker 1: into the water, into the soil, but they are largely 103 00:05:46,320 --> 00:05:52,120 Speaker 1: exposed and they are just tangled, gnarly beautiful roots that again, 104 00:05:53,000 --> 00:05:55,920 Speaker 1: I can't imagine trying to navigate through a mangrove forest. 105 00:05:56,080 --> 00:05:57,279 Speaker 1: You probably had to go around. 106 00:05:58,400 --> 00:06:01,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, it can be really really thick, both above water 107 00:06:01,720 --> 00:06:04,160 Speaker 3: and below water because of those roots. So those roots, 108 00:06:04,839 --> 00:06:07,159 Speaker 3: if you see them, that means that it's low tide. 109 00:06:07,160 --> 00:06:10,080 Speaker 3: At high tide, they're usually covered up with water. But 110 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:12,560 Speaker 3: it's like you said, they prop the tree up, and 111 00:06:12,640 --> 00:06:15,360 Speaker 3: so for that reason, because at low tide you can 112 00:06:15,400 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 3: see the bottom of the tree and it's above ground. 113 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:22,159 Speaker 3: They're sometimes called walking trees, but they're pretty neat. And 114 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:25,000 Speaker 3: the red mangrove is I think anyone who knows about 115 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:27,880 Speaker 3: mangroves or seen a mangrove probably is what they're thinking 116 00:06:27,920 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 3: of as a red mangrove because they're just those those 117 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:35,120 Speaker 3: roots are just so characteristic and unusual, you know. 118 00:06:35,760 --> 00:06:39,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, the black mangroves are still really cool looking because 119 00:06:39,000 --> 00:06:42,960 Speaker 1: they have these protrusions coming up out of the water 120 00:06:43,760 --> 00:06:47,080 Speaker 1: called neumataphores and just you know, put a pin in 121 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:50,120 Speaker 1: this they but they allow the plant to basically breathe. 122 00:06:50,160 --> 00:06:52,480 Speaker 1: And we'll talk about that later. But if you look 123 00:06:52,480 --> 00:06:54,040 Speaker 1: at a picture of these, it looks sort of like 124 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:57,400 Speaker 1: almost like little just spiky roots sticking up out of 125 00:06:57,400 --> 00:06:58,640 Speaker 1: the ground all around the tree. 126 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:04,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, almost like stalagmites. Yeah, and I got that right too, 127 00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:08,760 Speaker 3: by the way, right, white mangroves are. It's weird. I 128 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:12,520 Speaker 3: don't understand fully why they're considered mangroves aside from the 129 00:07:12,560 --> 00:07:15,760 Speaker 3: fact that they must still thrive and brackish or salty 130 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 3: water and poor poor oxygen soil, that's it. But I 131 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:23,640 Speaker 3: guess so. But they grow inland and they have normal 132 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:27,520 Speaker 3: shallow root systems like any other terrestrial tree, but they're 133 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:28,960 Speaker 3: still considered mangroves. 134 00:07:29,400 --> 00:07:31,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, and I don't think I've mentioned the black mangroves 135 00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:34,400 Speaker 1: to grow a little bit further inland than the reds. 136 00:07:35,120 --> 00:07:37,320 Speaker 3: Yeah. So if you are, you know, looking at a 137 00:07:37,320 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 3: cross section of the ocean hitting the land and going inland, 138 00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:45,440 Speaker 3: you would see at the ocean or at the bay 139 00:07:45,560 --> 00:07:50,920 Speaker 3: or wherever, red mangroves on the shoreline actually growing into 140 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 3: the ocean, depending on where the tide is behind them. 141 00:07:54,760 --> 00:07:57,400 Speaker 3: You would have the black mangroves on slightly higher ground, 142 00:07:57,640 --> 00:08:00,560 Speaker 3: and then behind those on the highest ground you would 143 00:08:00,640 --> 00:08:02,640 Speaker 3: have the white mangroves. And that's what it would look like. 144 00:08:02,800 --> 00:08:04,680 Speaker 3: You put it all together, well, you have as a 145 00:08:04,720 --> 00:08:07,920 Speaker 3: mangrove forest also known as a mangal. 146 00:08:08,320 --> 00:08:12,000 Speaker 1: A mangal, which is one of the more amazing We're 147 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:13,760 Speaker 1: gonna be talking about a lot of amazing things about 148 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:17,920 Speaker 1: mangroves and mangoals. But it's the only species of tree 149 00:08:18,440 --> 00:08:23,400 Speaker 1: that can grow in salt water, and big time they grow. 150 00:08:23,560 --> 00:08:25,160 Speaker 1: And it's not like they love the salt. We'll see 151 00:08:25,200 --> 00:08:27,239 Speaker 1: in a minute. They have some great ways of getting 152 00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:30,040 Speaker 1: rid of it, but they figured all that stuff out. 153 00:08:30,080 --> 00:08:35,120 Speaker 1: But they can grow in salinity levels of seventy five 154 00:08:35,160 --> 00:08:37,840 Speaker 1: parts per thousand, which is about twice as salty as 155 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:38,440 Speaker 1: ocean water. 156 00:08:39,320 --> 00:08:42,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's pretty impressive because I mean, where are they 157 00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:46,040 Speaker 3: growing that's twice as salty as ocean water? You know, 158 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:48,520 Speaker 3: I think that's just kind of showing off at that point. 159 00:08:49,640 --> 00:08:52,840 Speaker 1: Well, I didn't know if like that inland water, like 160 00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:54,720 Speaker 1: just accumulate salt or something. 161 00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:59,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, I would, Yeah, I think you might be right. Yeah, yeah, 162 00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:01,000 Speaker 3: I think you've hit upon it. Okay, So they're not 163 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:02,920 Speaker 3: show offs. They're just doing what they've got to do. 164 00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:06,080 Speaker 3: I mean that they're making lemonade out of the lemons 165 00:09:06,120 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 3: that they were handed by natural selection for where they grow. 166 00:09:10,360 --> 00:09:12,040 Speaker 1: So what about the salt. How do they get rid 167 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:12,280 Speaker 1: of it? 168 00:09:12,880 --> 00:09:15,440 Speaker 3: So you would think like they just they can drink 169 00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:18,280 Speaker 3: salt water and use it like you know terrestrial trees 170 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:22,400 Speaker 3: use water. Not true. There's actually two techniques where they 171 00:09:22,400 --> 00:09:27,319 Speaker 3: can either keep salt from entering their roots or they 172 00:09:27,320 --> 00:09:29,280 Speaker 3: can take the salt in and then get rid of 173 00:09:29,320 --> 00:09:31,440 Speaker 3: it in certain ways. And so that means that there's 174 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 3: two types secreters and non secrets. And black mangroves are secrets, 175 00:09:36,520 --> 00:09:37,480 Speaker 3: I believe, right. 176 00:09:37,720 --> 00:09:40,319 Speaker 1: That's right. Those are the ones with a little nubby 177 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:42,920 Speaker 1: they look like sticks almost sticking out of the water. 178 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,760 Speaker 1: They filter it out and they secrete it on the leaves. 179 00:09:46,800 --> 00:09:49,480 Speaker 1: So that means if you see a black mangrove and 180 00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:52,520 Speaker 1: you see some you know, kind of chalky white stuff 181 00:09:52,640 --> 00:09:54,959 Speaker 1: on the leaf that is salt, like goat, well, I 182 00:09:55,000 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 1: don't know if I should say go lick it, because 183 00:09:56,920 --> 00:10:00,360 Speaker 1: I don't know if that's dangerous salt, but it's. 184 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:04,560 Speaker 3: Just trust me, it tastes like salt and DDT gosh. 185 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:10,160 Speaker 3: Red mangroves they're non secrets. So they actually just don't 186 00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:13,360 Speaker 3: allow salt to be taken up by their roots. Now 187 00:10:13,360 --> 00:10:17,200 Speaker 3: that's easier said than done, because their roots are planted 188 00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:20,440 Speaker 3: in the water, right, so there's water. They're taking up 189 00:10:20,559 --> 00:10:23,800 Speaker 3: water from the ocean, from salt water. And what they 190 00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:27,680 Speaker 3: do is they have cell walls that actually act through 191 00:10:28,080 --> 00:10:31,360 Speaker 3: reverse osmosis. It lets water through, but it doesn't let 192 00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:34,480 Speaker 3: solids through, which is quite a trick. I mean, that's 193 00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:36,840 Speaker 3: something that humans have only recently figured out how to do. 194 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:39,760 Speaker 3: Mangroves have been doing it for who knows how many 195 00:10:40,080 --> 00:10:43,040 Speaker 3: hundreds of thousands or millions of years. But they do 196 00:10:43,080 --> 00:10:47,080 Speaker 3: it in part because they have this hydrophobic, lipophilic material 197 00:10:47,200 --> 00:10:49,439 Speaker 3: called suberin that really serves them. 198 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:52,080 Speaker 1: Well, that's right. It allows them to get rid of 199 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:54,360 Speaker 1: more than ninety percent of the salts in the water, 200 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:57,480 Speaker 1: which also means which I better really think about until 201 00:10:57,520 --> 00:11:00,760 Speaker 1: just now, that they can literally toller I guess about 202 00:11:00,800 --> 00:11:02,360 Speaker 1: ten percent salt content. 203 00:11:02,840 --> 00:11:05,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, I saw ninety to ninety five percent. But yeah, 204 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:08,800 Speaker 3: that's still a lot of salt for a plant, totally. Yeah. 205 00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:11,280 Speaker 3: So they have at least adapted in some ways to 206 00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:14,839 Speaker 3: tolerate salt more than other plants. But for the most part, 207 00:11:14,920 --> 00:11:19,280 Speaker 3: they're just really good at at keeping salt from being 208 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:22,920 Speaker 3: taken up by their roots. I just find that fascinating. 209 00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 1: And I love how Dave puts these. His sections are 210 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:31,640 Speaker 1: labeled either mangrove Magic Tricks or what was the other one, 211 00:11:31,679 --> 00:11:34,760 Speaker 1: mangrove Superpowers. Yeah, and that's pretty fun. 212 00:11:35,000 --> 00:11:36,520 Speaker 3: They're both apt they are. 213 00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:40,600 Speaker 1: So this is magic trick number two. Is we mentioned? 214 00:11:40,640 --> 00:11:43,360 Speaker 1: You know, I mentioned earlier that they actually breathe through 215 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:47,640 Speaker 1: these roots. I think typically you might like to think 216 00:11:47,640 --> 00:11:52,440 Speaker 1: about plants as you know, just eating up that CO two, 217 00:11:52,800 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 1: which they definitely do. But plants need oxygen and they 218 00:11:56,400 --> 00:12:00,360 Speaker 1: need to get oxygen from the roots, and you know, 219 00:12:00,480 --> 00:12:03,600 Speaker 1: with a regular tree and a regular forest, they're getting 220 00:12:03,640 --> 00:12:07,000 Speaker 1: that like through the soil and these little gaps between 221 00:12:07,040 --> 00:12:12,120 Speaker 1: the soil in mangrove or mangols. I guess you would 222 00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:15,640 Speaker 1: say they can't do that because the tidal sediments come 223 00:12:15,640 --> 00:12:18,600 Speaker 1: in and it's all water log and compacted, so they 224 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:20,800 Speaker 1: don't have those air gaps that you have in a 225 00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:23,480 Speaker 1: normal forest. So they kind of came up with a 226 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:25,160 Speaker 1: brilliant little trick to get around that, right. 227 00:12:26,040 --> 00:12:30,559 Speaker 3: Yeah. So the pneumataphors that black mangroves have, those stalagmites 228 00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:34,640 Speaker 3: that are coming up in spikes around them, those act 229 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:37,080 Speaker 3: as snorkels. So they stick up out of the water 230 00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 3: and they're covered in these little cells called lenisoles, and 231 00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:46,400 Speaker 3: that's where oxygen exchange happens, so they actually absorb oxygen 232 00:12:46,440 --> 00:12:50,439 Speaker 3: through these snorkels. They get taken into the snorkel underground, 233 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:54,680 Speaker 3: into the other roots of the tree and used for 234 00:12:55,480 --> 00:12:59,000 Speaker 3: aerobic respiration, which is converting food into energy. 235 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:04,079 Speaker 1: Just pretty and nu metaphor actually is Greek for air carrier, 236 00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:06,400 Speaker 1: so makes sense. Pretty on the nose. 237 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:09,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, some of those new metaphors can reach up to 238 00:13:09,080 --> 00:13:10,480 Speaker 3: ten feet tall. Did you see that? 239 00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:14,080 Speaker 1: Yeah? I didn't. I looked at a lot of pictures. 240 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:16,440 Speaker 1: I didn't see any. That's all with my eyeballs, but 241 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:18,280 Speaker 1: I looked because I wanted to see that. 242 00:13:18,679 --> 00:13:20,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, I didn't see it either, could be made up. 243 00:13:21,640 --> 00:13:24,800 Speaker 1: So then you've got this, I don't think. So. Then 244 00:13:24,840 --> 00:13:27,520 Speaker 1: you've got these red mangroves that we talked about for 245 00:13:27,600 --> 00:13:30,920 Speaker 1: my money, like the money mangrove, and those proper roots 246 00:13:31,240 --> 00:13:35,160 Speaker 1: serve the same purpose as the new metaphors. They you know, 247 00:13:35,200 --> 00:13:37,640 Speaker 1: like I said, they sit up on those long, sort 248 00:13:37,640 --> 00:13:42,840 Speaker 1: of curvy stilts and they stay above water, like a 249 00:13:42,840 --> 00:13:45,040 Speaker 1: lot of it stays above water even at high tide 250 00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:49,360 Speaker 1: at times, and they are also covered with those linisols 251 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:51,160 Speaker 1: and they do the same thing. They allow for that 252 00:13:51,200 --> 00:13:52,760 Speaker 1: oxygen exchange to take place. 253 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:56,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, so that explains also why there's so many roots 254 00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:01,360 Speaker 3: and so many noumataphors that spread around these trees. It's 255 00:14:01,480 --> 00:14:04,600 Speaker 3: like if you dug up a tree of roughly the 256 00:14:04,640 --> 00:14:08,559 Speaker 3: same size, it would probably have a similar sized root structure, 257 00:14:08,800 --> 00:14:10,800 Speaker 3: maybe a little less, but you don't see it. It's 258 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:14,120 Speaker 3: all underground. This is above ground, so it like looks 259 00:14:14,160 --> 00:14:15,839 Speaker 3: like a lot of roots, and it is a lot 260 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:19,239 Speaker 3: of roots, but it's not necessarily more than a terrestrial 261 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:20,960 Speaker 3: tree would have. We just don't see them. 262 00:14:21,080 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like a tree that is dropped trow. 263 00:14:25,400 --> 00:14:27,600 Speaker 3: That's exactly right. It's porky pig in it. 264 00:14:27,640 --> 00:14:31,640 Speaker 1: Should we should we take a break at mangrove Magic 265 00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:32,320 Speaker 1: trick number two? 266 00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:33,320 Speaker 3: Yeah? 267 00:14:33,400 --> 00:14:33,960 Speaker 1: To number three? 268 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:36,240 Speaker 3: Pick Yeah, we'll come back with number three right after this. 269 00:14:39,240 --> 00:14:40,360 Speaker 1: Shit. 270 00:14:57,480 --> 00:15:01,000 Speaker 3: So, Chuck, which mangrove is your favorite kind? 271 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:05,960 Speaker 1: Well, I think I've been clear. I know you're teasing 272 00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:10,240 Speaker 1: me because me and my red mangrove tirades. To me, 273 00:15:10,360 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 1: this is the best part of the episode and the 274 00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:16,640 Speaker 1: most amazing thing that maybe besides, and we'll get to 275 00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:19,840 Speaker 1: carbon sequestration because it's amazing too. But to me, this 276 00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:25,160 Speaker 1: just knocked my socks off that mangroves kind of give 277 00:15:25,280 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 1: birth to baby mangroves. 278 00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:30,880 Speaker 3: I think the only reason you want to qualify it 279 00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:34,240 Speaker 3: with kind of is because our mind rails against accepting 280 00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:37,920 Speaker 3: that that's what's going on. But that is what's going 281 00:15:37,920 --> 00:15:42,520 Speaker 3: on for all intents and purposes. That some mangroves are viviparous, 282 00:15:42,760 --> 00:15:46,760 Speaker 3: meaning that it means live bearing to where they have 283 00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:51,760 Speaker 3: seeds on their plants that they develop. They're about acorn sized. 284 00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:54,560 Speaker 3: But then rather than the seed falling off and dispersing 285 00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:58,400 Speaker 3: and then eventually growing into a seedling, something much more 286 00:15:58,440 --> 00:16:00,359 Speaker 3: mind blowing happens with mangoes. 287 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 1: That's right. The seedling is actually produced on the tree itself, 288 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:11,200 Speaker 1: and they they sort of that sort of I keep 289 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:15,920 Speaker 1: qualifying it, They self plant themselves. Eventually this thing is 290 00:16:15,920 --> 00:16:17,760 Speaker 1: going to fall off. You've got to look up the 291 00:16:17,840 --> 00:16:21,000 Speaker 1: video on the internet. There are many out there where 292 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:24,080 Speaker 1: it shows these you know, acorn like things, they grow 293 00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:27,000 Speaker 1: down to these sort of long arrow like, you know, 294 00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:30,120 Speaker 1: green arrows that are pointing down and eventually they just 295 00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:33,800 Speaker 1: go whoop, and they snap off and they go straight 296 00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:36,800 Speaker 1: down and they either stick into the ground at low 297 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:40,080 Speaker 1: tide or I saw them in two feet of ocean water, 298 00:16:40,520 --> 00:16:42,840 Speaker 1: just going straight through and sticking into the sand and 299 00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:44,040 Speaker 1: they plant themselves. 300 00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:47,280 Speaker 3: They do. They plant themselves in that sandy bottom, and 301 00:16:47,280 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 3: then they sprout roots really fast. I saw that they 302 00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:54,240 Speaker 3: can start growing roots within hours, which means that also 303 00:16:54,320 --> 00:16:56,920 Speaker 3: if they don't fall straight down, if they fall and 304 00:16:56,960 --> 00:17:00,680 Speaker 3: they land on their side, they can actually stay themselves 305 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:04,600 Speaker 3: up by growing roots on the ground facing side and 306 00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:07,200 Speaker 3: then grow roots on the other side as well, which 307 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 3: is pretty amazing. What's even more amazing is that if 308 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:12,640 Speaker 3: they fall, they happen to fall it like high tide, 309 00:17:12,640 --> 00:17:14,680 Speaker 3: and it's pretty deep, and they never touch the bottom 310 00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:17,960 Speaker 3: in any way. They'll float along, they'll go out to 311 00:17:18,080 --> 00:17:21,080 Speaker 3: sea and as they're out to see they're a little 312 00:17:21,119 --> 00:17:26,000 Speaker 3: tree growing like growing leaves, getting water from the ocean 313 00:17:26,280 --> 00:17:29,160 Speaker 3: and doing photosynthesis in the sunlight. And they can float 314 00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:32,159 Speaker 3: around for up to a year before they make land 315 00:17:32,560 --> 00:17:35,560 Speaker 3: and stand themselves up and grow roots wherever they land. 316 00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:42,760 Speaker 1: It's just unbelievable because this was an evolutionary adaptation. Because 317 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:45,480 Speaker 1: my first thought was, well, why doesn't the acorn like 318 00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:48,439 Speaker 1: seed just fall into the water and float around. But 319 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:52,200 Speaker 1: it must have just not been able to survive and 320 00:17:52,280 --> 00:17:56,280 Speaker 1: got water logged and died and adapted to grow on 321 00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:58,680 Speaker 1: the tree itself and get that little seedling started. 322 00:17:59,119 --> 00:18:02,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, because think about this, chuck. A seedling is a small, 323 00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:05,719 Speaker 3: viable tree. It has everything it needs to grow. So 324 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:12,240 Speaker 3: it's an individual organism. And when the mangrove is growing 325 00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:16,960 Speaker 3: the seedling on its tree, on itself, that's gestation. Because 326 00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:19,399 Speaker 3: when it drops off, it's like a girafte dropping a 327 00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:22,960 Speaker 3: baby out like three or four feet above above the ground. 328 00:18:23,359 --> 00:18:26,240 Speaker 3: It's the same thing. It's gestation. It's a live birth 329 00:18:26,440 --> 00:18:29,080 Speaker 3: of a plant. It's nuts, man, I love it. 330 00:18:29,320 --> 00:18:32,359 Speaker 1: And the baby draft sticks its nose into the ground. 331 00:18:33,560 --> 00:18:34,600 Speaker 1: It grows from there for. 332 00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:37,040 Speaker 3: Months and months, plant some roots out of its head, 333 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:37,600 Speaker 3: and there you go. 334 00:18:38,840 --> 00:18:41,160 Speaker 1: Let's talk about the mangoals a little bit. We've talked 335 00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:44,520 Speaker 1: about the fact that these forests are very dense, but 336 00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:48,920 Speaker 1: it is a dense ecosystem that is dense in more 337 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:51,040 Speaker 1: ways than one. It's not just all these gnarly roots 338 00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:54,399 Speaker 1: that you see everywhere. There are all kinds of fish 339 00:18:54,440 --> 00:18:58,480 Speaker 1: habitats and wildlife habitats that exist in these mangoals. 340 00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:01,960 Speaker 3: Yeah. One of the reason why these root systems and 341 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:06,040 Speaker 3: why the above water parts of the trees are all 342 00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:08,600 Speaker 3: just so thick, like you were saying it's so hard 343 00:19:08,640 --> 00:19:10,880 Speaker 3: to get through, is because of the way that they 344 00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:15,280 Speaker 3: drop seedlings right off of their tree right around them. 345 00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:19,000 Speaker 3: So these mangols develop into these really thick deposits of 346 00:19:19,040 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 3: trees and shrubs above water and below water because they 347 00:19:22,880 --> 00:19:26,080 Speaker 3: grow so closely together, and as they grow, they migrate 348 00:19:26,119 --> 00:19:28,560 Speaker 3: one way or another, or they just spread out one 349 00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:31,080 Speaker 3: way or another, sometimes towards the ocean, sometimes behind them, 350 00:19:31,119 --> 00:19:34,120 Speaker 3: sometimes to either side of the shore. But that's how 351 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:37,480 Speaker 3: they grow, and that's why they're so dense too, and. 352 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:40,560 Speaker 1: That provides a lot of protection for these habitats. They 353 00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:43,520 Speaker 1: are all manner of fish. If you're in Florida, you're 354 00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:46,120 Speaker 1: gonna see gray snapper in there, or you probably won't 355 00:19:46,160 --> 00:19:51,479 Speaker 1: see them snook tarpin. This is pretty remarkable that goliath grouper, 356 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:56,600 Speaker 1: which is actually endangered, spends their first six years in 357 00:19:56,600 --> 00:19:58,520 Speaker 1: that mangol before it goes to open water. 358 00:19:59,119 --> 00:20:01,399 Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's not like a few kinds of fish, 359 00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:07,679 Speaker 3: like things like octopi sharks, shrimp, molluscs, just tons of 360 00:20:07,680 --> 00:20:10,800 Speaker 3: different kinds of fish, Like this is their nursery ground 361 00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:14,359 Speaker 3: because these roots, these tangle of roots, provide a place 362 00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:18,159 Speaker 3: for juveniles to hide out of reach of predators and 363 00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:20,760 Speaker 3: get bigger and bigger because it's also a very nourishing 364 00:20:20,800 --> 00:20:24,480 Speaker 3: place for them to eat too. So they're really really 365 00:20:24,520 --> 00:20:28,560 Speaker 3: important as nurseries for all kinds of sea life. 366 00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:32,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, and if you're talking about eating seafood, the commercial 367 00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:35,240 Speaker 1: fishing industry, and this just sort of shows you how 368 00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:40,080 Speaker 1: important these mangoals are. A one square mile loss of mangroves, 369 00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:43,240 Speaker 1: for us would lose about two hundred and seventy five 370 00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:48,280 Speaker 1: thousand pounds of fish every year. And then that's not 371 00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:54,359 Speaker 1: even to speak of all the indigenous communities that rely 372 00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:56,320 Speaker 1: on these fish to provide their sustenance. 373 00:20:57,119 --> 00:20:59,320 Speaker 3: Right, And so that's just the below water part of 374 00:20:59,320 --> 00:21:02,000 Speaker 3: the mangol. The above water part of the mangol basically 375 00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:05,919 Speaker 3: does the same thing. But for terrestrial and arboreal animals 376 00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:11,359 Speaker 3: like monkeys, insects, reptiles, birds, they make their home and 377 00:21:11,400 --> 00:21:16,440 Speaker 3: their nurseries in those the mangols too. The branches, the leaves, 378 00:21:16,520 --> 00:21:20,160 Speaker 3: the trunks, those are really just as important for above 379 00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:23,040 Speaker 3: ground animals as they are for below water animals. 380 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:27,200 Speaker 1: Yeah. And you mentioned that Bengal tiger. This was also 381 00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:33,240 Speaker 1: in the sum darbins, right. Yes, And this is the 382 00:21:33,359 --> 00:21:36,840 Speaker 1: largest single population of Bengal tigers on planet Earth, and 383 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:39,000 Speaker 1: it's only about one hundred of them, but they live 384 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:40,680 Speaker 1: in these mangols. 385 00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:46,800 Speaker 3: Yes. And also attention, Kristen Bell, if you are ambivalent 386 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:52,199 Speaker 3: about mangrove forests, prepared to care because in Panama, the 387 00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:56,800 Speaker 3: pigmy three toadsloth, critically endangered by the way, only makes 388 00:21:56,800 --> 00:22:00,840 Speaker 3: its home in mangrove forests. Sound there, right, So you 389 00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:01,720 Speaker 3: got to care now. 390 00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:04,320 Speaker 1: I still watch that video of her in that sloth 391 00:22:04,359 --> 00:22:07,520 Speaker 1: about once every two years. Yes, It's just one of 392 00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:09,639 Speaker 1: the great human reactions to something. 393 00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:12,080 Speaker 3: Yeah. And I remember how hardened we were when we 394 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:14,919 Speaker 3: realized that she didn't touch it, even though you clearly 395 00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:16,960 Speaker 3: wanted to more than she's ever wanted to do anything 396 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:18,879 Speaker 3: in her life. But she doesn't. She didn't do it, 397 00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:20,199 Speaker 3: you know, so good for her. 398 00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:22,960 Speaker 1: It's pretty great. I think we can move on to 399 00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:24,240 Speaker 1: some superpowers, right. 400 00:22:24,920 --> 00:22:29,520 Speaker 3: Yeah, mangrove superpower number one, which is coastline protection, which 401 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:31,720 Speaker 3: is pretty important if you live along the coast. 402 00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:36,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, this is a big one. One great benefit of 403 00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:40,800 Speaker 1: all those above ground gnarly mess of roots that are 404 00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:43,960 Speaker 1: everywhere is and it just makes perfect common sense when 405 00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:46,800 Speaker 1: you look at them. Is they make great wave breaks 406 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:50,840 Speaker 1: any kind of wave, even like a tsunamic. 407 00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:51,680 Speaker 3: Is that a word? 408 00:22:52,520 --> 00:22:52,720 Speaker 1: Yeah? 409 00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,199 Speaker 3: It is now I think it's a great word. Right. 410 00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:58,880 Speaker 1: Tsunami's wave is going to be cut down big time 411 00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:01,639 Speaker 1: when it hits. This stuff is just gonna, you know, 412 00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:03,560 Speaker 1: just cut through and disperse it in in a really 413 00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:04,240 Speaker 1: profound way. 414 00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:08,359 Speaker 3: Yeah, because there's so many different like roots and individual 415 00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:11,320 Speaker 3: things to bump into on the way to the shore 416 00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:14,480 Speaker 3: that it's going to reduce its energy, which means that 417 00:23:14,720 --> 00:23:18,320 Speaker 3: it reduces one of the pernicious effects that waves have 418 00:23:18,440 --> 00:23:21,359 Speaker 3: on shore, which is erosion. And not only does it 419 00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:24,280 Speaker 3: reduce erosion because the waves don't have enough energy to 420 00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:27,600 Speaker 3: take stuff back out to sea, it actually has them 421 00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:31,040 Speaker 3: deposit the sediments that they're bringing to the shore in 422 00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:34,040 Speaker 3: the mangrove swamps. And if you compare it, if you 423 00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:38,159 Speaker 3: combine that, i should say, with the really low oxygen 424 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 3: environments that make up the mucky bottom in a mangrove 425 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:47,320 Speaker 3: mangal I guess you can kind of flash back to 426 00:23:47,359 --> 00:23:49,600 Speaker 3: our coal the Mystery of Coal episode where we talked 427 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:53,280 Speaker 3: a lot about how swamps work like that. So mangrove 428 00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:55,479 Speaker 3: swamps are very much like that as well. But then 429 00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:59,040 Speaker 3: in addition to that, they have ocean sediments being brought 430 00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:01,440 Speaker 3: all this organic stuff being brought from the ocean's layering 431 00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:05,440 Speaker 3: with the mucky sediment that from the mangroves falling into 432 00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:08,840 Speaker 3: the muck, which means that they're like holding on to 433 00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:12,679 Speaker 3: a lot of stuff and building up soil as a 434 00:24:12,720 --> 00:24:15,920 Speaker 3: matter of fact, so much so that they outpaces sea 435 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:17,720 Speaker 3: level rises in some areas. 436 00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:20,159 Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean this kind of falls under one of 437 00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:23,200 Speaker 1: their other superpowers is the fact that they are literally 438 00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:28,679 Speaker 1: sequestering carbon. But I think that they add about and 439 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:30,399 Speaker 1: we'll get to that in more detail in a minute. 440 00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:34,960 Speaker 1: But in Australia, some mangrove or some mangals in Australian 441 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:39,879 Speaker 1: belize at about ten millimeters or more of coastal soil 442 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:43,159 Speaker 1: each year one hundredth of a meter. Yeah, I mean, 443 00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:46,240 Speaker 1: that doesn't sound like that much, but a sea level 444 00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:48,800 Speaker 1: rise is coming in at about three point two meters 445 00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:51,679 Speaker 1: a year or so in parts of Australian belize it 446 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:53,639 Speaker 1: is actually outpacing climate change. 447 00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:56,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's pretty cool, and that's really really important because 448 00:24:56,760 --> 00:24:59,159 Speaker 3: the sea levels rise. If the soil level is rising, 449 00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:01,040 Speaker 3: we don't have to work quite as much about sea 450 00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 3: level rise there. But that's only in some spots, as 451 00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:04,600 Speaker 3: we'll see. 452 00:25:05,040 --> 00:25:07,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, and as far as the waves go, and we're 453 00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:11,720 Speaker 1: talking about tsunamis well with just regular waves. For every 454 00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:14,640 Speaker 1: one hundred meters of a mangro forest that a wave 455 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:18,640 Speaker 1: will hit, its height can decrease by as much as 456 00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:19,760 Speaker 1: sixty six percent. 457 00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:20,840 Speaker 3: Wow. 458 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:25,359 Speaker 1: And if you're looking at storm surges, which is you know, 459 00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:27,119 Speaker 1: one of the big dangers, it's not just the wave, 460 00:25:27,119 --> 00:25:31,000 Speaker 1: it's that water surge. If you listen to our tsunami episode, 461 00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:35,840 Speaker 1: there was a study that found that surge depths were 462 00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:38,879 Speaker 1: reduced about a little over a foot and a half 463 00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:43,040 Speaker 1: for every little more than a half a mile fifty 464 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:46,840 Speaker 1: centimeters over every kilometer. And that doesn't sound like a ton, 465 00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:50,199 Speaker 1: but if you've got a mangrove forest that's you know, 466 00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:53,359 Speaker 1: several miles deep, then we're talking you know, six or 467 00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:58,320 Speaker 1: seven feet of less storm surge happening, and that can 468 00:25:58,400 --> 00:25:59,960 Speaker 1: make a really big difference. In flow. 469 00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:02,960 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, because the storm surges would get you. I 470 00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:06,000 Speaker 3: mean it can flood miles and miles inland. It carries 471 00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:09,000 Speaker 3: all sorts of debris with it. It has so much energy 472 00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:12,040 Speaker 3: it can just rip buildings down. It's a real problem 473 00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:15,320 Speaker 3: from hurricanes. It's that flooding from the storm surge. But 474 00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:18,560 Speaker 3: because those mangroves are there to absorb a bunch of 475 00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:21,680 Speaker 3: that energy, it just doesn't have the opportunity to come 476 00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:25,679 Speaker 3: nearly as far inland. So mangrove forests, especially thick ones, 477 00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:29,760 Speaker 3: save human lives and you would guess animal lives too. 478 00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:33,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, And we've seen the sort of this bear out 479 00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:37,800 Speaker 1: in very sad ways when mangro forests have disappeared. I 480 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:41,119 Speaker 1: think it was in the Indo Pacific region in the 481 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:44,520 Speaker 1: nineteen fifties they used to have about five miles like 482 00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:48,280 Speaker 1: deep of mangrove forest. By the nineteen nineties they were 483 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:51,760 Speaker 1: depleted because of shrimp farming. We'll talk about that later 484 00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:56,080 Speaker 1: as well, but basically, you know, human cause depletion. And 485 00:26:56,119 --> 00:26:58,760 Speaker 1: in ninety one there was a cyclone that hit the 486 00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:01,880 Speaker 1: coast of Bangladesh where there were no longer any mangrove 487 00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:04,719 Speaker 1: for us to cut down on that impact and there 488 00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:07,200 Speaker 1: was no buffer, and there was a big twenty foot 489 00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:12,320 Speaker 1: storm surge and almost one hundred and forty thousand people died, right. 490 00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:16,480 Speaker 3: I saw that they had a lot of those people 491 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:19,959 Speaker 3: died because they weren't they didn't use storm shelters in 492 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:22,959 Speaker 3: addition to the mangrove buffer being gone, and that they 493 00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:26,639 Speaker 3: had built the storm shelters Chuck after a nineteen seventy 494 00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:31,480 Speaker 3: cyclone that killed five hundred thousand people in Bangladesh. 495 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:33,320 Speaker 1: Wow, can you believe that? 496 00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:37,600 Speaker 3: Can you imagine a storm killing half a million people 497 00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:39,560 Speaker 3: in your country or your little area. 498 00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:43,919 Speaker 1: That's insane, it is, that's devastating. 499 00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:45,720 Speaker 3: Biblical you know. 500 00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:50,520 Speaker 1: Yeah. They did some studies too with the tsunami and 501 00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:53,760 Speaker 1: the Indian Ocean in two thousand and four, and they 502 00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:56,960 Speaker 1: found that the mangroves there were about one hundred meters 503 00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:01,719 Speaker 1: deep and they at least helped reduce those waves between 504 00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:05,119 Speaker 1: five and thirty percent. So that's a big deal. You know, 505 00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:08,199 Speaker 1: six feet of storm surge up to thirty percent of 506 00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:11,639 Speaker 1: wave height and the initial rush in from the ocean 507 00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:14,439 Speaker 1: is you're saving a lot of lives in that case. 508 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:18,119 Speaker 3: Yeah, And I mean you saw how bad the Indian 509 00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:20,639 Speaker 3: Ocean tsunami was too. It just makes you wonder, like 510 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:24,520 Speaker 3: how much worse it could have been without mangroves. So 511 00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:26,600 Speaker 3: I say we take our second break and we come 512 00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:28,840 Speaker 3: back and talk about carbon sequestration. 513 00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:54,080 Speaker 1: That's right, aka superpower number two. All right, we had 514 00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:57,600 Speaker 1: promise of superpower number two and we tease a little 515 00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:02,520 Speaker 1: bit early earlier I did about carbon sequestration. So we 516 00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:05,760 Speaker 1: need to talk a little bit about what people are 517 00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:11,560 Speaker 1: calling a blue carbon ecosystem, blue sort of referencing the ocean. 518 00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:15,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's basically the same thing. Like you know, 519 00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:20,200 Speaker 3: trees inland capturing carbon and storing them in their bits 520 00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:24,800 Speaker 3: and parts. This is this is just coastal vegetation doing 521 00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:29,200 Speaker 3: the same thing. And the thing is is, like trees, 522 00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:33,600 Speaker 3: they're really efficient at capturing carbon and storing it. But 523 00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:38,600 Speaker 3: because of our friends fungi and rot, when the tree dies, 524 00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:42,200 Speaker 3: that carbon gets released back into the ecosystem and even 525 00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:45,800 Speaker 3: possibly back into the atmosphere if say, like a wildfire 526 00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:49,280 Speaker 3: happens atmosphere hot wheels. 527 00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:53,240 Speaker 1: That is right, But you know how we mentioned before 528 00:29:53,360 --> 00:29:57,160 Speaker 1: that with that soil that the water is basically the 529 00:29:57,200 --> 00:29:59,680 Speaker 1: ocean water is just sitting on top of it is 530 00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:03,800 Speaker 1: not it's just building up to that salty peat and 531 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:06,320 Speaker 1: that carbon is not being released like it does in 532 00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:09,880 Speaker 1: interrestrial forest, and it's not breaking down. So it is 533 00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:14,320 Speaker 1: a champion at storing carbon. Not only good at it, 534 00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:15,440 Speaker 1: but really good at it. 535 00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:20,239 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like the Judah Friedlander of forests as far 536 00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:21,720 Speaker 3: as carbon sequestration go. 537 00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:26,440 Speaker 1: I love Judi Freelander. We actually met him once, but 538 00:30:26,440 --> 00:30:27,320 Speaker 1: I don't get the joke. 539 00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:30,360 Speaker 3: Oh he always wore a hat that'said World Show. Oh okay, 540 00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:33,200 Speaker 3: and he was always boasting about stuff like that. 541 00:30:33,360 --> 00:30:35,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I love that guy. When we met him 542 00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:38,320 Speaker 1: at an event with Jesse Thorn and Hodgemen many years ago, 543 00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:42,440 Speaker 1: and this was kind of during his run on thirty 544 00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:45,320 Speaker 1: Rock thirty Rock, and this is when I was also 545 00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:48,400 Speaker 1: wearing my Last Chance garage at all the time, which 546 00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:49,840 Speaker 1: I haven't put on in a couple of years. I 547 00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:53,920 Speaker 1: hate to say so probably a few years. But he 548 00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:57,120 Speaker 1: I remember when I met him, he went and in 549 00:30:57,200 --> 00:30:59,000 Speaker 1: that face of his he kind of peered up at 550 00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:02,480 Speaker 1: my hat and that patch and hear it. All right, okay, cool. 551 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:05,200 Speaker 3: That was a great chee the freed Land. 552 00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:07,080 Speaker 1: I was like, Okay, I got the stamp of approval 553 00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:08,160 Speaker 1: from the hat guy. 554 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:10,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, definitely the hat guy version. 555 00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:10,440 Speaker 1: It's cool. 556 00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:15,520 Speaker 3: So but yeah, so, mangroves are the champion of carbon sequestrations, 557 00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:18,760 Speaker 3: so much so that they are four times more efficient 558 00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:24,120 Speaker 3: than terrestrial vegetation at storing carbon, which makes them like 559 00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:28,360 Speaker 3: a bona fide carbon sink. Mangrove forests are and again 560 00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:31,000 Speaker 3: it's because there's just no decay, there's no fungus, there's 561 00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:33,680 Speaker 3: no rot. All the stuff that all the vegetation that 562 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:37,480 Speaker 3: dies and falls down into the muck just gets stuck 563 00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:39,480 Speaker 3: there and covered over and doesn't get a chance to 564 00:31:39,520 --> 00:31:43,000 Speaker 3: break down. So as long as you don't dig up 565 00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:46,040 Speaker 3: or destroy a mangro forest and cut up the peat 566 00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:49,160 Speaker 3: to use it as cheap fuel, you've got a really 567 00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:51,440 Speaker 3: good carbon sink on your hands. 568 00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:56,240 Speaker 1: Yeah. To the tune of worldwide mangal's account for about 569 00:31:56,280 --> 00:32:00,520 Speaker 1: six point four billion tons of carbon that's being held 570 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,640 Speaker 1: in check. That means when you do do something like 571 00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:08,760 Speaker 1: you hinted at, it can have devastating effects for the world. Surprise, surprise, 572 00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 1: If you cut down a mangrove forest, that carbon is 573 00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:15,480 Speaker 1: going to be released, That sequestered carbon is slowly going 574 00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:19,760 Speaker 1: to creep back into the atmosphere. From twenty to twenty fifteen, 575 00:32:20,600 --> 00:32:23,000 Speaker 1: roughly one hundred and twenty two million tons of carbon 576 00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:27,240 Speaker 1: extra carbon were released into the atmosphere because of the 577 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:33,080 Speaker 1: destruction of mangrove forests, and between eighty and two thousand 578 00:32:33,080 --> 00:32:36,240 Speaker 1: and thirty percent of the mangols of the world have 579 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:41,040 Speaker 1: been stripped away and it is outpacing like the tropical 580 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:42,600 Speaker 1: rainforest construction. 581 00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:46,200 Speaker 3: That's mind boggling because if you just hear the figures 582 00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:50,040 Speaker 3: on how frequently and how much rainforest is cut down, 583 00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:53,840 Speaker 3: the idea that mangrove forest is outpacing it is pretty nuts. 584 00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 3: But apparently Me and Mar is the current hot spot 585 00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:02,520 Speaker 3: for mangrove D four station. Between nineteen ninety six and 586 00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:05,840 Speaker 3: twenty sixteen, Me and Mark cut down sixty percent of 587 00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:11,040 Speaker 3: its mangals just gone. And part of the problem is 588 00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:13,640 Speaker 3: is like you can restore mangrove forest. Fortunately, we'll talk 589 00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:16,080 Speaker 3: about some people who do that, but it can take 590 00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:19,719 Speaker 3: a while. And sometimes when you restore some mangroves, you 591 00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:23,800 Speaker 3: put the seedlings in and typhoon or a cyclone or 592 00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,160 Speaker 3: a hurricane comes along and just washes them all away. 593 00:33:26,520 --> 00:33:29,480 Speaker 3: So if your timing's wrong. It might take a very 594 00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:32,000 Speaker 3: long time for you to restore a mangrove forest, so 595 00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:36,520 Speaker 3: it's not something you want to cut down willy nilly. Basically, No. 596 00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:39,640 Speaker 1: Shrimp farming is something we mentioned earlier in passing. But 597 00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:44,040 Speaker 1: they are the biggest culprit, responsible for thirty five percent 598 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:48,360 Speaker 1: of mangrove forest loss. And you know, people love shrimp 599 00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,000 Speaker 1: all around the world, and in Thailand in the eighties 600 00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:55,320 Speaker 1: and nineties and other places as well, but especially Thailand, 601 00:33:55,760 --> 00:33:58,000 Speaker 1: they cut down a lot of mangro forests to make 602 00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:02,080 Speaker 1: these shrimp farms along the hostline. And then you've also 603 00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:06,080 Speaker 1: got the sea level rise that's causing destruction. We mentioned 604 00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:11,279 Speaker 1: parts of Australian belize that those soiled deposits are outpacing it, 605 00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:14,640 Speaker 1: but that's only in a couple of those places. It 606 00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:16,360 Speaker 1: is not doing that in other areas. 607 00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:19,960 Speaker 3: No, So that means that sea level rise is out 608 00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:23,319 Speaker 3: pacing soil deposition there. I want to say one more 609 00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:25,160 Speaker 3: thing about shrimp farming too. I looked a little bit 610 00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:28,640 Speaker 3: into it and I cannot decide maybe it deserves its 611 00:34:28,680 --> 00:34:31,960 Speaker 3: own episode. Who knows. Okay, one of the other problems 612 00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:36,280 Speaker 3: with shrimp farming in addition to a shrimp farm sharing 613 00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:39,719 Speaker 3: the same kind of land or a mangro forest that 614 00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:42,520 Speaker 3: land occupies being desirable for a shrimp farm, so you 615 00:34:42,560 --> 00:34:44,960 Speaker 3: cut down mangro forest to build a shrimp farm, is 616 00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:48,360 Speaker 3: that when you harvest shrimp, you basically have to refresh 617 00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:52,360 Speaker 3: the water. So shrimp farmers typically just basically open a 618 00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:55,200 Speaker 3: dam and let all the water out, and that water's 619 00:34:55,239 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 3: filled with tons of nutrients that overwhelm the carrying opacity 620 00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:04,240 Speaker 3: of the ecosystems the mangro forests around the shrimp farm, 621 00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:07,840 Speaker 3: and you get what's called an algae bloom, which sucks 622 00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:10,239 Speaker 3: up all the oxygen, kills off all the fish, and 623 00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:14,560 Speaker 3: has just this devastating effect on the ecosystem surrounding it. 624 00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:19,080 Speaker 3: So shrimp farming is really hard on the areas where 625 00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:22,600 Speaker 3: it takes place, not just from the shrimp farms themselves, 626 00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:25,080 Speaker 3: but from what comes out of the shrimp farms as well. 627 00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:29,120 Speaker 3: And there's just so many basic good best practices that 628 00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:32,240 Speaker 3: could be followed that just aren't followed that there's almost 629 00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:35,520 Speaker 3: like a general like the coming out of the shrimp 630 00:35:35,520 --> 00:35:37,920 Speaker 3: farming industry as far as I can tell, that really 631 00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:38,960 Speaker 3: needs to be fixed. 632 00:35:39,600 --> 00:35:42,080 Speaker 1: It's almost as if they just wanted to continue to 633 00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:45,400 Speaker 1: make as much money as they can before they're regulated 634 00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:45,959 Speaker 1: in some way. 635 00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:47,600 Speaker 3: But I mean, what are you going to do if 636 00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:49,400 Speaker 3: you try to regulate them at all? You've got a 637 00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:51,520 Speaker 3: nanny state on your hands. And who wants that? 638 00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:55,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, and it shrimp farming is just one tiny fraction 639 00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:59,759 Speaker 1: of the great amounts of harm that are happening to 640 00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:03,239 Speaker 1: the because of lots of things, but commercial fishing and 641 00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:04,399 Speaker 1: is certainly one of them. 642 00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:07,120 Speaker 3: I will say, though, it's really hard to turn down 643 00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:12,360 Speaker 3: shrimp on pizza that you're heading or something. No, no, 644 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:15,000 Speaker 3: that's that was from years back. I used to love 645 00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:15,920 Speaker 3: shrimp on pizza. 646 00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:19,080 Speaker 1: All right, talk to me more about this. What are 647 00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:21,240 Speaker 1: we talking? You just throw some shrimp on a regular 648 00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:24,359 Speaker 1: cheese or is it like a barbecue pineapple thing? 649 00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:24,440 Speaker 2: No? 650 00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:26,879 Speaker 3: No, no, no, no, a regular pizza. But you don't 651 00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:28,560 Speaker 3: want to use just any shrimp. You certainly don't want 652 00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:30,279 Speaker 3: to use jumbo shrimp. You want to use the little 653 00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:34,600 Speaker 3: tiny salad shrimp because they cook just enough with the pizza. 654 00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:36,960 Speaker 3: Bigger shrimp might still be partially raw, it's going to 655 00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:40,719 Speaker 3: be too big to eat. Yeah, you just throw some 656 00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:43,440 Speaker 3: of those. Well, now, I think they usually come already 657 00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:45,000 Speaker 3: cook now that I think about it, but you just 658 00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:47,719 Speaker 3: throw a couple of handfuls on your pizza, put it 659 00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:51,879 Speaker 3: in the oven, and they thank me later. Basically, Oh, man, 660 00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:52,480 Speaker 3: I love shrimp. 661 00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:53,880 Speaker 1: I don't know about shrimp and pizza. 662 00:36:54,040 --> 00:36:56,200 Speaker 3: Well, now I feel bad about eating shrimp, knowing how 663 00:36:56,200 --> 00:36:57,319 Speaker 3: bad shrimp farming is. 664 00:36:57,520 --> 00:37:01,279 Speaker 1: I know. It's uh, it's another wake up call, isn't it. 665 00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:05,640 Speaker 3: Well, yes, and I've been awokened because I'm now farming 666 00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:08,000 Speaker 3: my own shrimp here at home in a very sustainable 667 00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:10,200 Speaker 3: manner so that I can have it on my pizza. 668 00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:13,560 Speaker 1: Ah, bathub shrimp, It's delicious. 669 00:37:13,760 --> 00:37:15,240 Speaker 3: We don't take baths anyway. 670 00:37:15,800 --> 00:37:18,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, Yiman's like, why do you have an out of 671 00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:19,719 Speaker 1: orders on on our bathroom door? 672 00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:21,839 Speaker 3: Right? I'm still trying to figure out how to break 673 00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:23,759 Speaker 3: the news to U me we don't really have a 674 00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:26,440 Speaker 3: working bathsub anymore. So. 675 00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:31,640 Speaker 1: There are also invasive species that can totally wreck the 676 00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:35,000 Speaker 1: health of a man gaul. In the seventies in China, 677 00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:37,160 Speaker 1: they were trying to do the right thing. I think 678 00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:40,960 Speaker 1: there were conservationists that transplanted some marsh grasses that were 679 00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:43,960 Speaker 1: from the United States there to try and slow erosion, 680 00:37:44,520 --> 00:37:48,120 Speaker 1: but it crowded out mangroves. And then in Texas they 681 00:37:48,239 --> 00:37:51,960 Speaker 1: weren't trying to do the right thing. They the vision 682 00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:56,160 Speaker 1: game officials there, they said, Hey, people like hunting this 683 00:37:57,040 --> 00:38:02,600 Speaker 1: exotic Asian antelope. It's called a nilghai. I guess n ilgai. 684 00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:05,839 Speaker 1: So let's put them in Texas so people can hunt them. 685 00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:08,239 Speaker 1: And it turns out they love to eat mangroves. 686 00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:12,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, so they're being deforested by the game that was 687 00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:15,480 Speaker 3: imported to Texas to hunt, which means I'm sure there's 688 00:38:15,600 --> 00:38:17,319 Speaker 3: huge bounties on these things now too. 689 00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:20,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's funny how that all works out. 690 00:38:20,560 --> 00:38:23,000 Speaker 3: So there are people who are like, we really need 691 00:38:22,840 --> 00:38:25,400 Speaker 3: to work on this, We need to get mangroves back, 692 00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:28,800 Speaker 3: and there are places where this is the good news. 693 00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:34,480 Speaker 3: Mangrove deforestation globally speaking, on average has actually stopped progressing 694 00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:36,200 Speaker 3: and is now starting to decline. 695 00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:37,040 Speaker 1: Yeah. 696 00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:40,480 Speaker 3: The deforestation is so people are, you know, kind of 697 00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:42,719 Speaker 3: getting hip to the idea that we really need these things. 698 00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:47,000 Speaker 3: They provide countless services for us humans, so even the 699 00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:50,640 Speaker 3: most selfish human can get behind mangrove restoration, right. 700 00:38:51,200 --> 00:38:54,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean I think there's about forty two percent 701 00:38:54,400 --> 00:38:57,839 Speaker 1: of the worldwide mangols are protected now, but you need 702 00:38:57,840 --> 00:39:00,840 Speaker 1: that number at like ninety two, well at one hundred. 703 00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:02,680 Speaker 1: But I would feel much better if it was like 704 00:39:02,719 --> 00:39:03,960 Speaker 1: in the eighties or nineties, you know. 705 00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:07,239 Speaker 3: Yeah, And not only that, like areas that have been 706 00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:10,680 Speaker 3: developed coastly need to replant the mangroves that they cut 707 00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:15,560 Speaker 3: down to build because they need them really bad. You 708 00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:19,319 Speaker 3: need mangrove buffers, as we've found. Whatever you can get 709 00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:20,640 Speaker 3: is helpful. 710 00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:24,760 Speaker 1: That's right. But there's another kind of clever financial instrument, 711 00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:28,080 Speaker 1: as they call it, called blue bonds. It is a 712 00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:32,560 Speaker 1: subset of green bonds. Green bonds came around a while ago, 713 00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:35,440 Speaker 1: and these are basically, if you have money and you 714 00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:40,839 Speaker 1: want to invest responsibly in a way that not only 715 00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:43,520 Speaker 1: doesn't impact the environment but can help the environment, you 716 00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:45,399 Speaker 1: invest in a green bond, or if you're really into 717 00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:48,959 Speaker 1: the ocean, the subset of blue bonds, which were first 718 00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:51,200 Speaker 1: introduced in twenty eighteen. 719 00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:54,720 Speaker 3: Right, And so like you want to offset your emissions, 720 00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:56,200 Speaker 3: you buy a blue bond, and all of a sudden, 721 00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:59,680 Speaker 3: you've just paid somebody to go plant some mango or 722 00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:05,000 Speaker 3: not mango, maybe mango too, but mangrove forests. 723 00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:06,720 Speaker 1: Right, yeah, mango forest. 724 00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:10,600 Speaker 3: It sounds delicious, would be I'd be like planet in 725 00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:13,319 Speaker 3: my backyard. That's right, I want to plane it with 726 00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:14,120 Speaker 3: my blue bond. 727 00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:17,640 Speaker 1: So look into blue bonds and green bonds. It's I 728 00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:19,759 Speaker 1: saw something depressing the other day when they were I 729 00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:21,200 Speaker 1: don't know what they were talking about on the news, 730 00:40:21,239 --> 00:40:23,960 Speaker 1: but they basically said, like, if you have an IRA like, 731 00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:27,080 Speaker 1: you were supporting all kinds of companies that you would 732 00:40:27,080 --> 00:40:28,399 Speaker 1: probably never support in real life. 733 00:40:28,400 --> 00:40:30,160 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, definitely mutual funds. 734 00:40:30,280 --> 00:40:33,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, mutual funds. Just everything's all lumped in. So they 735 00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:35,359 Speaker 1: were trying to encourage people that if they're able to 736 00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:38,600 Speaker 1: to be a little more selective in what they choose 737 00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:39,719 Speaker 1: to invest in. 738 00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:43,840 Speaker 3: Well, there's a lot of sustainable mutual funds too that 739 00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:47,760 Speaker 3: where they're you know, very carefully selected. Unfortunately, that means 740 00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:50,400 Speaker 3: the management fee is going to be higher. But if 741 00:40:50,440 --> 00:40:52,759 Speaker 3: you care, it doesn't really matter, you know. 742 00:40:53,080 --> 00:40:55,200 Speaker 1: Oh, is it really a higher management fee? 743 00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:59,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, any time it requires any additional thought or effort, 744 00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:01,839 Speaker 3: the management he just automatically goes up. 745 00:41:02,040 --> 00:41:04,160 Speaker 1: I had to click them three extra things. 746 00:41:04,480 --> 00:41:06,600 Speaker 3: Right, I had to find out what these blue bonds 747 00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:10,200 Speaker 3: were that's my impression of a mutual fund manager. 748 00:41:10,320 --> 00:41:13,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, financial advisor. If that's your financial advisors, another wrong person. 749 00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:17,000 Speaker 3: I meet him at Burger King every couple of weeks 750 00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:19,160 Speaker 3: in the back. 751 00:41:19,640 --> 00:41:20,839 Speaker 1: Yeah, where else did you meet? 752 00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:22,840 Speaker 3: You got anything else? 753 00:41:23,280 --> 00:41:24,040 Speaker 1: You got nothing else? 754 00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:28,279 Speaker 3: Up with Mangroves, Up with Mangroves. And since we both 755 00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:30,279 Speaker 3: set up with Mangroves, everybody, that means it's time for 756 00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:31,000 Speaker 3: a listener mail. 757 00:41:34,080 --> 00:41:36,759 Speaker 1: This is a thank you from a Satanist. We had 758 00:41:36,760 --> 00:41:38,960 Speaker 1: a great podcast that we must have put this on 759 00:41:39,000 --> 00:41:40,040 Speaker 1: a select recently. 760 00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:41,560 Speaker 3: I guess yeah, like two weeks ago. 761 00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:45,360 Speaker 1: Okay, Hey, guys discovered your podcast in twenty eleven. Have 762 00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:49,080 Speaker 1: been hooked ever since. Your informative, banter filled episodes remained 763 00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:52,759 Speaker 1: a welcome constant in my life throughout college, adult years 764 00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:55,960 Speaker 1: in now parenthood was helping me stay sane during sleepless 765 00:41:56,000 --> 00:41:58,840 Speaker 1: nights with my newborns. When I saw the episode on 766 00:41:58,880 --> 00:42:02,000 Speaker 1: Satanism guess ahead and listen to it previously, I was 767 00:42:02,000 --> 00:42:05,480 Speaker 1: simultaneously excited and nervous. I would hope you'd give it 768 00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:08,160 Speaker 1: the usual Josh and Chuck treatment, and I was not disappointed. 769 00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:10,440 Speaker 1: Over the years, I've been given a lot of grief. 770 00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:13,279 Speaker 1: Being a Satanist, people often assume that I'm a very 771 00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:15,720 Speaker 1: devout Christian based on the way I look, and often 772 00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:19,840 Speaker 1: go from praising me to threatening my family upon learning 773 00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:22,400 Speaker 1: that I followed the tenants set forth by the Satanic 774 00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:25,640 Speaker 1: Temple by shedding some light on the true nature of Satanism, 775 00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:27,640 Speaker 1: I feel that you have given many people a look 776 00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:30,240 Speaker 1: into the practice in a non threatening way, and hopefully 777 00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:33,720 Speaker 1: this will help people choose kindness over fear based hatred 778 00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:37,000 Speaker 1: when interacting with Satanist in the future. And thank you 779 00:42:37,040 --> 00:42:38,920 Speaker 1: for being bold enough to put this episode out in 780 00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:41,359 Speaker 1: the world. I'm sure it wasn't that easy, but this 781 00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:46,759 Speaker 1: long time listener appreciates it. Your friendly Satanist. Donna, thanks 782 00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:48,920 Speaker 1: a lot, Donna, Donna a Satanist. 783 00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:53,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, that was a good one because I went back 784 00:42:53,040 --> 00:42:55,320 Speaker 3: and listened to it to QA it before it was 785 00:42:55,360 --> 00:42:58,000 Speaker 3: a selectime. I was like, this is a really good episode. Yeah. 786 00:42:58,000 --> 00:42:59,920 Speaker 3: But there was one thing at the beginning, Chuck, that 787 00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:02,880 Speaker 3: now I wish we had back, because a couple of 788 00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:06,680 Speaker 3: people wrote in and it was that we coaight at 789 00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:09,280 Speaker 3: the beginning, saying like, if you're, you know, a Christian, 790 00:43:09,680 --> 00:43:11,520 Speaker 3: you probably don't want to listen to this, and people 791 00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:13,279 Speaker 3: wrote in and said, no, like you, you should not 792 00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:15,080 Speaker 3: have said that, because there's plenty of people out there 793 00:43:15,080 --> 00:43:17,840 Speaker 3: who should hear this and you know, change their views 794 00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:20,840 Speaker 3: on people who hold these views. So if you go 795 00:43:20,920 --> 00:43:22,640 Speaker 3: back and listen to that, just plug your ears for 796 00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:25,000 Speaker 3: that first part and then listen to it through again. 797 00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:28,759 Speaker 1: Yeah, that was forty year old Chuck talking, right, not 798 00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:30,719 Speaker 1: fifty one year old Chuck. 799 00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:31,359 Speaker 3: That's right. 800 00:43:31,480 --> 00:43:33,840 Speaker 1: It's Oh, that's a weird number to say. 801 00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:37,160 Speaker 3: It is, Chuck. Fifty one is a weird number, and 802 00:43:37,200 --> 00:43:38,799 Speaker 3: it's going to be a weird time in your life. 803 00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:39,520 Speaker 3: I'm sure of it. 804 00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:47,319 Speaker 1: Juck. That's one thing I'll always say it is You'll 805 00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:49,239 Speaker 1: always be younger than me. No matter how much I 806 00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:51,720 Speaker 1: want you to speed up the aging process, You'll always 807 00:43:51,800 --> 00:43:52,280 Speaker 1: be younger. 808 00:43:52,680 --> 00:43:55,920 Speaker 3: You would have to travel to Mars and suspended animation 809 00:43:56,200 --> 00:43:57,759 Speaker 3: and I might just have to stay here on. 810 00:43:57,719 --> 00:44:01,080 Speaker 1: Earth for me to catch all right, I'm going to 811 00:44:01,160 --> 00:44:01,600 Speaker 1: look into that. 812 00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:05,040 Speaker 3: Thanks a lot, Donna. We appreciate that big time. And 813 00:44:05,080 --> 00:44:06,560 Speaker 3: if you want to be like Donna and send us 814 00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:09,120 Speaker 3: some kudos, we'll take them. You can send it in 815 00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:17,360 Speaker 3: an email to Stuff Podcast at iHeartRadio dot com. 816 00:44:15,880 --> 00:44:18,799 Speaker 2: Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For 817 00:44:18,880 --> 00:44:23,040 Speaker 2: more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 818 00:44:23,160 --> 00:44:25,000 Speaker 2: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.