WEBVTT - What is biospeleology? 0:00:00.240 --> 0:00:03.040 Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray. 0:00:03.120 --> 0:00:07.480 It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you Should Know 0:00:08.080 --> 0:00:16.279 from House Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome to 0:00:16.280 --> 0:00:20.759 the podcast. I'm Josh Clark, and there's Charles W. Chuck Bryant, 0:00:21.120 --> 0:00:30.000 and there's an hell yeah, and it's dark and dank, dank, creepy. 0:00:30.240 --> 0:00:33.120 Remember that word dank? I do? Is that not a 0:00:33.120 --> 0:00:37.519 word anymore? Not really? Okay? Um, Hey, how are you? 0:00:37.760 --> 0:00:40.880 Thanks for meeting me here? Of course I've got the invitation. 0:00:40.880 --> 0:00:43.839 I couldn't resist. Um. Did you like the fact that 0:00:44.200 --> 0:00:48.800 I gave you the invitation in cutout letters from magazine? Yeah? 0:00:48.960 --> 0:00:53.400 Dealed with the kiss. It's very nice. Uh so Chuck, 0:00:53.560 --> 0:00:57.200 we are here in a cave, yeah, man, And the 0:00:57.240 --> 0:01:00.440 reason why is because we're talking about something thing called 0:01:00.520 --> 0:01:05.880 bio speleology. That's a big word. It is saying, biospeleology. 0:01:06.040 --> 0:01:13.800 Bio speleology. Yes, Um, you've heard of spelunking, Yeah done, 0:01:13.880 --> 0:01:17.360 minor spelunking, yeah, I mean not deep. But I love 0:01:17.400 --> 0:01:19.240 cave so I think they're really cool. So if you've 0:01:19.280 --> 0:01:24.000 gone caving or spelunking, probably caving where they're like harnesses 0:01:24.040 --> 0:01:26.560 and ropes and like helmets with lights on the top. 0:01:27.040 --> 0:01:29.360 Okay you want, Yes, that was it was me and 0:01:29.400 --> 0:01:32.399 my brother. You know, like poking around. Spelunking is like 0:01:33.440 --> 0:01:36.000 where you go into a cave and you like go 0:01:36.120 --> 0:01:41.480 into a cave like you may die. Yeah, but it's recreational. Yes, 0:01:41.560 --> 0:01:46.880 that's what differentiates It differentiates from spi spiology, which is 0:01:46.959 --> 0:01:52.960 slogy speleology which is cave research, and bio speleology is 0:01:53.040 --> 0:01:57.080 cave research on the life inside that cave. Bingo, And 0:01:57.160 --> 0:02:00.280 there's actually quite a bit of life. We only figured 0:02:00.320 --> 0:02:03.680 this out as recently as the seventeen hundreds. Um, But 0:02:03.880 --> 0:02:06.000 once we did figure it out, we realized that there's 0:02:06.080 --> 0:02:10.560 some really awesome, creepy, creaky life in caves. Like you 0:02:10.600 --> 0:02:15.000 sent me a cool picture of basically a faceless salamander, right, yeah, 0:02:15.040 --> 0:02:18.440 that's the proteus salamander, and that's yeah, that's one of 0:02:18.480 --> 0:02:21.239 the seventeen hundreds. They saw this thing and they were like, WHOA, 0:02:21.960 --> 0:02:25.120 something's different. Well, the first thing that I think they 0:02:25.160 --> 0:02:28.840 noticed that was different was that it was a foot long, um, 0:02:28.880 --> 0:02:31.080 and that's a big salamander. Can you imagine seeing that 0:02:31.120 --> 0:02:33.720 thing though with no eyes, no face, Yeah, no face. 0:02:34.080 --> 0:02:37.920 It's just like ahead. Did you ever see um? I 0:02:37.960 --> 0:02:40.360 think it was a Twilight Zone the movie, one of those. 0:02:42.120 --> 0:02:44.400 And you don't remember the kid who like created this 0:02:44.440 --> 0:02:48.040 whole like cartoon world and his sister. He didn't like 0:02:48.040 --> 0:02:51.000 his sister talking bad. She was missing the mouth, and 0:02:51.120 --> 0:02:53.600 she sat there and watched cartoons the whole time. It 0:02:53.760 --> 0:02:57.240 is creepy, and the salamanders creepy in much the same way. Yeah, 0:02:57.400 --> 0:02:59.600 slightly less because it's not a human. You know, we're 0:02:59.600 --> 0:03:02.919 not hard wired to really be disturbed by faceless salamanders 0:03:02.960 --> 0:03:06.160 like we are mouthless humans. But it's along the same lines, right. 0:03:06.160 --> 0:03:08.480 They did that in the Matrix too. Kean had the 0:03:08.960 --> 0:03:10.680 no mouth in that one tee but you could sort 0:03:10.680 --> 0:03:12.680 of see the makeup, and that just bug me. Yeah, 0:03:12.800 --> 0:03:16.519 it wasn't that good. There's also plenty of slightly less 0:03:16.520 --> 0:03:21.519 exotic um life in in caves. You've got beetles, you've 0:03:21.520 --> 0:03:25.720 got worms, kind of crickets. Cricket bats of course, are 0:03:25.760 --> 0:03:30.480 the stars of caves, right um. And it turns out 0:03:30.560 --> 0:03:35.240 from reading this article how cave biology works, I guess 0:03:36.000 --> 0:03:38.200 all of if not most, if not all, of the 0:03:38.240 --> 0:03:42.320 life in caves is based on well they basically they're 0:03:42.400 --> 0:03:47.200 descended from above ground dwelling species, right, Yeah, I was 0:03:47.280 --> 0:03:49.320 kind of surprised. I was also surprised to learned that 0:03:49.360 --> 0:03:52.320 there were shrimp in caves for some reason that just 0:03:52.840 --> 0:03:54.880 I don't know. I could see like cave shrimp being 0:03:54.920 --> 0:03:58.720 some exotic you know, I think you would find it a 0:03:58.680 --> 0:04:01.600 a four star restaurant because it tastes different because it's 0:04:01.600 --> 0:04:05.760 never like seen the sun. They were um like over 0:04:05.800 --> 0:04:10.440 the shoulder furs, very like big wooden clothes. But yeah, 0:04:10.440 --> 0:04:14.080 you're right. They weren't necessarily born there, but they made 0:04:14.080 --> 0:04:18.760 their way down there and in the process called regressive evolution, right, 0:04:18.800 --> 0:04:21.400 and fans of the Lord of the Rings trilogy will 0:04:21.440 --> 0:04:26.840 recognize this because it's pretty much what Gollum did. Yeah remember, yeah, yeah, 0:04:27.040 --> 0:04:31.040 I mean that's pretty much regressive evolution within a single organism, 0:04:31.080 --> 0:04:35.840 which never happens, right, but this was this is over 0:04:35.880 --> 0:04:38.719 the course of many, many generations, right, Yeah, they would 0:04:38.760 --> 0:04:42.000 like not devolved, it's called regressive evolution. They would actually 0:04:42.080 --> 0:04:46.480 lose features to adapt to the environment rather than you know, 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:49.440 gain features. Right. Well, I mean, if you think about it, 0:04:49.440 --> 0:04:52.960 with the faceless salamander that had no eyes. If it 0:04:53.000 --> 0:04:56.200 lives in complete darkness, constant darkness, there's no reason for 0:04:56.200 --> 0:04:58.800 it to have eyes, so it might as well just 0:04:58.839 --> 0:05:00.680 not have them and maybe put it up for an 0:05:00.760 --> 0:05:04.560 energy elsewhere. Yeah, you've seen the one of the common 0:05:05.200 --> 0:05:08.320 uh pictures of aliens from outer space. You always see 0:05:08.320 --> 0:05:10.919 as the sort of the big head, the huge eyes 0:05:11.480 --> 0:05:15.160 and the little nostrils without a nose, the Whitney Striber 0:05:15.279 --> 0:05:18.080 communion aliens, right, and then it's the holes for ears 0:05:18.080 --> 0:05:21.840 but not ears. My buddy Jerry always thought that these 0:05:21.839 --> 0:05:25.640 were like super evolved humans from the future and that like, 0:05:25.720 --> 0:05:28.240 we don't need the structure of the nose, We just 0:05:28.279 --> 0:05:30.320 need the nostrils. We don't need the structure of the ears, 0:05:30.320 --> 0:05:33.160 we just need the hole. And eventually and our brains 0:05:33.200 --> 0:05:34.640 are getting bigger. So he was like, that's why they 0:05:34.640 --> 0:05:36.200 got the big heads, that's why they don't have nose, 0:05:36.200 --> 0:05:38.520 They just have nostrils, and kind of blew me away. 0:05:38.560 --> 0:05:41.280 I was like, Wow, maybe they are like humans from 0:05:41.279 --> 0:05:44.919 the future. He's like, and George Washington grew him exactly. 0:05:45.080 --> 0:05:48.000 You guys are laying on top of your car um 0:05:48.000 --> 0:05:50.880 speaking of aliens, have you ever seen bad taste? And 0:05:50.960 --> 0:05:56.159 speaking of Peter Jackson crazy Now you haven't so. Peter Jackson, 0:05:56.240 --> 0:05:58.760 the guy who did UM The Lord of the Rings. 0:05:59.160 --> 0:06:05.839 He directs this horrible schlock graphically violent UM movie called 0:06:05.839 --> 0:06:08.960 Bad Taste in you have to see it. Well, he 0:06:09.000 --> 0:06:12.080 did another one too. UM. I can't remember the name 0:06:12.120 --> 0:06:15.719 of it, but the same thing. Yeah, he started out 0:06:15.720 --> 0:06:19.520 doing like schlocky horror like movies. It's it's pretty it's 0:06:19.520 --> 0:06:22.839 worth seeing. What does that have to do with this? Um? 0:06:22.880 --> 0:06:28.479 Aliens and Peter Jackson got you alrighty, thanks for that. 0:06:28.520 --> 0:06:30.280 We have been going off on a good tangent in 0:06:30.320 --> 0:06:33.360 a while. No, you know that felt good. Thanks. Well, 0:06:33.360 --> 0:06:35.800 you know what, woodsman, this is very nice out here 0:06:35.839 --> 0:06:37.560 and all, but I feel like we should, you know, 0:06:37.640 --> 0:06:44.680 get back to the office. Yeah, you're right, let's go, Jerry, 0:06:47.080 --> 0:06:51.360 so check. We talked about regressive evolution, right, um. And 0:06:51.760 --> 0:06:56.640 it's not just the loss of eyes, you lose skim pigmentation. Um. 0:06:56.760 --> 0:07:02.280 And you also we found that long cave organisms, cave 0:07:02.360 --> 0:07:06.360 dwelling organisms, their metabolism is super efficient because there's so 0:07:06.440 --> 0:07:09.320 little food down there that um, they have to make 0:07:09.360 --> 0:07:12.520 do with what they have. It's like, um, if you 0:07:12.600 --> 0:07:15.280 are if you have to have a section of your 0:07:15.520 --> 0:07:19.440 intestine removed, you like basically spend the rest of your life. 0:07:19.480 --> 0:07:22.920 Male nurse because their metabolism is used to like taking 0:07:22.920 --> 0:07:27.240 its time absorbing nutrients, So if there's less place for 0:07:27.280 --> 0:07:30.520 it to go, we we become malnurished. These guys are 0:07:30.600 --> 0:07:33.600 like the exact opposite. It's like hypermetabolism. And so as 0:07:33.600 --> 0:07:36.480 a result, we're figuring out that we can really learn 0:07:36.520 --> 0:07:39.560 a lot by studying freaks of nature, right, Well, yeah, 0:07:39.600 --> 0:07:41.559 and they said they look at fish because I didn't 0:07:41.560 --> 0:07:44.480 know that a lot of our water, uh passes through 0:07:44.480 --> 0:07:47.480 a cave ecosystem at some point, and so they'll study 0:07:47.560 --> 0:07:50.280 like fish and how they live in the water to 0:07:50.320 --> 0:07:52.480 study water quality that we end up drinking, which is 0:07:52.520 --> 0:07:55.560 kind of crazy too. Yeah, you're drinking stuff that cave 0:07:55.600 --> 0:07:58.360 shrimp has been in. Cave shrimp is pooped in the 0:07:58.400 --> 0:08:03.320 water that you're drinking. Monkey Eat, Push me Dead Alive. 0:08:03.520 --> 0:08:06.040 I think that was the movie. I think you're right, 0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:09.840 it's funny how it comes back like that. We also, 0:08:10.080 --> 0:08:14.680 um can learn a lot from studying the their lack 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:18.040 of eyes of normal eye development, right, Remember the Asian 0:08:18.040 --> 0:08:21.120 Orange podcast. Remember those kids that were born without eyes? 0:08:21.480 --> 0:08:24.520 How does that happen? Jeans are responsible for that. Well, 0:08:24.760 --> 0:08:29.200 you learn it by comparing, say, an eyelis proteuce salamander 0:08:29.240 --> 0:08:32.920 to a regular salamander and figure out what jeans they lack. 0:08:33.120 --> 0:08:36.600 It's pretty cool. Yeah, humans are smarter, so Chuck, we 0:08:36.679 --> 0:08:39.720 started to go into the caves. We figured out why 0:08:39.760 --> 0:08:42.559 people are going into caves when they started going in. 0:08:43.040 --> 0:08:46.679 What are we finding there? Well, they you find one 0:08:46.720 --> 0:08:50.800 of three categories of species in a cave. Noticed it 0:08:50.800 --> 0:08:57.720 didn't say species. People often say species, species or warsh 0:08:57.840 --> 0:09:00.280 Have you ever been when to say warsh, I mean neither. 0:09:01.000 --> 0:09:07.240 The first one is uh? Is it a trogolo sine i? Yeah, 0:09:08.480 --> 0:09:12.959 troczin uh and trogolos is Greek for cave, Zenos is 0:09:13.040 --> 0:09:16.280 Greek for guests, And so as you would or stranger, 0:09:16.320 --> 0:09:20.000 and as you would imagine, this is uh a cave visitor. 0:09:20.360 --> 0:09:22.559 And the three branches here of the things you will 0:09:22.559 --> 0:09:25.679 find there, they categorize them depending on how much time 0:09:25.720 --> 0:09:28.480 they spend in the cave. So they spend the least 0:09:28.480 --> 0:09:31.840 amount of time and they can come and go when 0:09:31.920 --> 0:09:35.480 they want to, and they go in there for specific reasons, 0:09:35.559 --> 0:09:38.480 like a bear to hibernate or to nest or to 0:09:38.520 --> 0:09:45.520 give birth, so probably for shelter talking bears, skunks, coons, moths, 0:09:46.280 --> 0:09:50.040 right right, So that's number one. Bats as well make 0:09:50.080 --> 0:09:53.440 that list as they make that list as well. Okay, yeah, 0:09:53.800 --> 0:09:57.719 because they hibernate in there, right and poop, which will 0:09:57.720 --> 0:09:59.839 get to in a little bit because that's important, so 0:10:00.040 --> 0:10:03.320 us number two. The other The next one is trogolo files, 0:10:03.360 --> 0:10:06.560 which means m Cave lovers. Yeah. I like that name, 0:10:06.679 --> 0:10:08.960 which is like, hey, cave, how's it going. They just 0:10:09.000 --> 0:10:10.960 like you're looking good and none. Yeah, they love it 0:10:11.040 --> 0:10:13.959 so much that they actually enjoy being in there. Right. 0:10:14.040 --> 0:10:18.320 These described species that are um capable of living inside 0:10:18.440 --> 0:10:21.560 or outside of caves, but they love the caves so 0:10:21.640 --> 0:10:24.640 they decided to stick around there. Um, so you've got 0:10:24.679 --> 0:10:27.880 like beetles, worms, frogs, that kind of stuff. These things 0:10:28.120 --> 0:10:30.720 could live outside of the caves, but they tend to 0:10:30.760 --> 0:10:34.360 spend their their lifetimes inside of caves. And they'll go 0:10:34.400 --> 0:10:36.280 out to to get food a lot of times and 0:10:36.280 --> 0:10:39.080 then bring it back in, which will also get to 0:10:39.160 --> 0:10:42.280 that's a good thing to do, that, Yes it is, man, 0:10:42.320 --> 0:10:46.400 there's foreshadowing going on all the place. The third one, schuckers, Yeah, 0:10:46.440 --> 0:10:49.400 that that's the creepiest one obviously is the troglo bites 0:10:49.920 --> 0:10:53.080 and bios for life obviously, and this these are the 0:10:53.080 --> 0:10:55.360 ones that never leave. They can't leave. They will die 0:10:55.440 --> 0:10:57.120 outside of the cave. Yeah. I thought that was a 0:10:57.160 --> 0:11:03.079 bit of of a stretch to go from bios of bites. Now, Well, 0:11:03.120 --> 0:11:07.840 I mean you've got a files there. Those were good 0:11:07.840 --> 0:11:12.320 ones and then bites. Yeah, should be chruglob chrug lobios. 0:11:12.840 --> 0:11:16.880 It's good. Uh. And these these little guys have adapted 0:11:16.920 --> 0:11:19.080 so well. Like I said, they can't leave. These are 0:11:19.080 --> 0:11:21.800 the ones that either have eyes that don't work well 0:11:21.920 --> 0:11:24.960 or don't have eyes at all. Not much pigmentation like 0:11:25.000 --> 0:11:27.520 the salamander we talked about was sort of a almost 0:11:27.520 --> 0:11:31.960 a translucent pink pink a shoe. And they they have 0:11:32.280 --> 0:11:36.320 adaptive metabolisms so they don't have a lot of food 0:11:36.400 --> 0:11:38.600 nutrients down there, so they don't need it to live. 0:11:39.000 --> 0:11:42.200 They're the ones with the hypermetabolisms, right, and what else 0:11:42.280 --> 0:11:46.439 the oh, the legs and antenna are longer to help them, 0:11:46.480 --> 0:11:49.760 you know, find food when there is food. So let's 0:11:49.760 --> 0:11:52.040 talk about food, man, Well let's talk about the different 0:11:52.440 --> 0:11:56.480 places you're gonna find these things, right, so I like 0:11:56.640 --> 0:11:58.480 think I think one of the reasons I'm I like 0:11:58.600 --> 0:12:02.400 this cave biology article or k biology in general, is 0:12:02.520 --> 0:12:07.079 um that everything's divided up so neatly and cleanly. Right. Yeah, 0:12:07.280 --> 0:12:10.679 So we've got the three different kinds of um organisms. 0:12:10.920 --> 0:12:15.640 You've got uh, trug laws and these right, trouglo files 0:12:15.679 --> 0:12:20.160 truglo bites. There's also three different segments of a cave, right, 0:12:20.600 --> 0:12:22.520 and they all fit in each one. And the second 0:12:22.520 --> 0:12:25.240 one is a great great name too. Yeah. The first 0:12:25.240 --> 0:12:28.000 one is the entrance zone, and that's um. You still 0:12:28.000 --> 0:12:31.400 obviously will have some sunlight coming in and out, recessive sunlight, 0:12:31.920 --> 0:12:34.280 and that means you can have some plant life a 0:12:34.320 --> 0:12:37.120 little bit. You've got bears sleeping. You've got bear sleeping, 0:12:37.120 --> 0:12:41.040 You've got coon sleeping. Uh, they're nesting, laying eggs and 0:12:41.080 --> 0:12:45.760 what have you. You've got some moss, snails, owls. And 0:12:45.800 --> 0:12:47.719 this is in the in the in this cool picture too. 0:12:47.760 --> 0:12:50.120 It really it's kind of creepy looking. That's like a 0:12:50.280 --> 0:12:53.160 Lead Dempsey picture. Yeah, I'm sure it is. So that's 0:12:53.200 --> 0:12:55.400 the first one, but the second one is the really 0:12:55.440 --> 0:13:00.400 good one, the twilight zone, and it's called You're about 0:13:00.400 --> 0:13:03.800 to enter the twilight Zone. And you mentioned twilight zone earlier. 0:13:06.040 --> 0:13:10.880 Yeah with the kid who that did you? I feel 0:13:10.880 --> 0:13:14.600 like I'm about to wake up. Really, this didn't happen. 0:13:15.360 --> 0:13:17.439 Uh in the twilight Zone. This is the middle zone 0:13:17.520 --> 0:13:20.280 and there is a little bit of light and there 0:13:20.320 --> 0:13:22.280 can be a little bit of plant life, but don't 0:13:22.320 --> 0:13:25.360 count on it. No, but there's gonna be plenty of 0:13:25.400 --> 0:13:30.920 mushrooms and probably some albino mushrooms. Well that's plant life, right, Yeah, 0:13:30.960 --> 0:13:35.160 well it's fungus okay, So yeah, it's in the plant Kingdom. Uh. 0:13:35.200 --> 0:13:38.240 And the temperature there is um, we should mention that 0:13:38.280 --> 0:13:41.240 the temperature and the entrance zone varies obviously according to 0:13:41.480 --> 0:13:44.560 the weather outside, but it gets a little more static 0:13:45.040 --> 0:13:49.319 in the twilight Zone. I just love saying that. And uh, 0:13:49.520 --> 0:13:53.520 it's very moist and very cool. And that is where 0:13:53.559 --> 0:14:00.960 the trunk lessene lives. Spiders, millipedes, bats, moths right, um. 0:14:01.000 --> 0:14:04.240 And I think Trocolo files you'll find those here as well, 0:14:04.320 --> 0:14:06.560 hanging out too. And I guess, I mean, don't you 0:14:06.600 --> 0:14:09.360 imagine that this is where Rod Serling got the name 0:14:09.720 --> 0:14:13.199 for twilight Zone, because think about he was talking about 0:14:13.200 --> 0:14:16.160 this place between this world and another world, you know, 0:14:16.320 --> 0:14:20.000 that thin fibrous transition place. And this is the this 0:14:20.040 --> 0:14:22.760 is that to look that up. I can't believe we 0:14:22.800 --> 0:14:25.560 didn't already. That's the third one. This is a good one. 0:14:25.640 --> 0:14:28.960 Third one is the dark zone. This is the creepy 0:14:29.080 --> 0:14:32.320 slag tight This is where you're going to find no 0:14:32.520 --> 0:14:38.560 light whatsoever, no UM change in temperature, no UM weather, 0:14:39.120 --> 0:14:43.600 and definitely no vegetation at all. Right, yeah, creep but 0:14:43.720 --> 0:14:46.720 lots of trocolo bytes. Yeah, you're gonna find lots of 0:14:46.720 --> 0:14:50.360 footlong salamanders that have no faces. Did you see The Descent? 0:14:50.680 --> 0:14:53.120 That movie kind of a not too great horror movie. 0:14:53.480 --> 0:14:55.480 I know what you're talking about. Them These girls go 0:14:55.600 --> 0:14:58.600 caving deep deep, and there there are these psych I 0:14:58.640 --> 0:15:01.600 think they were human end from way back when that 0:15:01.680 --> 0:15:04.800 never left the cave. But they're basically like human trocolobytes. 0:15:07.240 --> 0:15:09.720 It was in the woods sort of maybe, so the 0:15:11.800 --> 0:15:15.240 um We're gonna get some mail for that one. I 0:15:15.280 --> 0:15:21.320 think the problem with the Dark Zone is there's organisms 0:15:21.400 --> 0:15:25.880 running around that are alive and healthy. Uh. That kind 0:15:25.920 --> 0:15:28.760 of flies in the face of this um rule of 0:15:28.800 --> 0:15:32.960 thumb here on planet Earth that everything uh is kept 0:15:33.000 --> 0:15:36.640 alive by the sun, right right, If there's no light whatsoever? 0:15:37.320 --> 0:15:40.280 How are animals in the dark zone allowed to live? 0:15:40.840 --> 0:15:45.640 Food chain? Which I guess still I mean, she didn't 0:15:45.640 --> 0:15:49.600 really draw the conclusion that the food chain depends on 0:15:49.640 --> 0:15:52.960 the sun, but I guess that's what it means, right, right, 0:15:53.040 --> 0:15:55.200 The sun still comes into play, just not deep down 0:15:55.200 --> 0:15:58.400 within their right they get the um they benefit from 0:15:58.640 --> 0:16:07.000 photosynthesis the lee rather than proximately. Uh So, you know, 0:16:07.120 --> 0:16:09.800 if there's gonna how do you get food deep down 0:16:09.800 --> 0:16:12.320 in the cave. One way is, and I didn't even 0:16:12.360 --> 0:16:15.680 consider this is by flooding. Right when the waters rise, 0:16:15.720 --> 0:16:18.920 it'll just wash things in there that the animals can eat, right, 0:16:19.040 --> 0:16:21.120 And it's it's rather than a food chain. I mean, 0:16:21.120 --> 0:16:23.080 the food chain is actually a good way to describe it. 0:16:23.160 --> 0:16:26.480 It's almost like a food bucket brigade, you know what 0:16:26.480 --> 0:16:29.640 I mean. So, like you have you have food maybe 0:16:29.800 --> 0:16:35.120 washed in um leaves, twigs, sticks or actual food um, 0:16:35.120 --> 0:16:38.920 maybe a dead raccoon um, and then things feast on 0:16:38.960 --> 0:16:42.080 it in the entrant zone, right, and then things that 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:45.760 are things that are living in the twilight zone can 0:16:45.760 --> 0:16:49.080 feast on those things that ate it in the entrant zone, 0:16:49.640 --> 0:16:51.520 and then it just kind of goes and goes until 0:16:51.880 --> 0:16:54.640 you finally reach the dark zone and then they're eating 0:16:55.360 --> 0:16:58.840 you know, maybe four times removed what washed into the 0:16:59.480 --> 0:17:02.880 entrant zone, right right, Yeah, Well, and that's just one 0:17:02.920 --> 0:17:06.400 way it gets in watching. Another way is your favorite 0:17:06.440 --> 0:17:10.400 thing guano bat poop, which is a really good fertilizer. 0:17:10.800 --> 0:17:15.480 Is it that you can usually buy it at um nurseries? Really? Yeah, 0:17:15.520 --> 0:17:17.880 Well there's lots of it, because I've seen the specials 0:17:17.880 --> 0:17:22.119 where there's like mounds, like mountains of bat poop because 0:17:22.160 --> 0:17:25.680 they're there for months on end, right hibernating and they're 0:17:25.680 --> 0:17:28.720 all just pooping. That's all they're doing, eating and pooping, 0:17:29.000 --> 0:17:32.959 and it stinks to um. You can't eat it right 0:17:33.000 --> 0:17:35.320 away though, isn't that right? Or like they can't just 0:17:35.400 --> 0:17:38.000 feed on the poop initially didn't have to decompose. Well, 0:17:38.000 --> 0:17:42.320 it depends you've got decomposers muture organisms that are actually 0:17:42.320 --> 0:17:45.679 eating the poop, right, So bat guano is a food 0:17:45.720 --> 0:17:49.359 source for these these organisms at the very bottom of 0:17:49.400 --> 0:17:54.840 the bio speleology food bucket brigade, right, the unsung heroes. Yeah, well, 0:17:54.920 --> 0:17:57.840 so they decompose that they break it down for themselves, 0:17:57.840 --> 0:18:00.320 turning into food themselves. But they're also leaving the trains 0:18:00.400 --> 0:18:04.640 is byproducts, and these decomposers of micro organisms make make 0:18:04.720 --> 0:18:10.880 up food for slightly larger organisms, right, like um, millipedes 0:18:10.920 --> 0:18:14.600 and centipedes and other small insects, right, and then it 0:18:14.640 --> 0:18:17.560 just kind of goes up from up to the apex, 0:18:18.119 --> 0:18:22.680 which is the predators. Yeah, it's a food pyramid, which 0:18:22.720 --> 0:18:27.480 really all all ecosystems are at the top of of predators. 0:18:27.760 --> 0:18:30.919 And there's going to be the smaller well, the larger 0:18:30.960 --> 0:18:33.439 the animal, the fewer there are of them. You know, 0:18:33.480 --> 0:18:37.520 if you compare sharks to plankton, there's a lot more 0:18:37.520 --> 0:18:40.399 plankton than sharks in the ocean. Good point. One of 0:18:40.440 --> 0:18:42.120 the things that really creeped me out, And this one's 0:18:42.119 --> 0:18:45.600 gonna keep me awake tonight. Uh. The insects get bigger 0:18:45.600 --> 0:18:51.040 and bigger, centipedes, spider salamanders, and then uh, apparently some 0:18:51.119 --> 0:18:54.440 centipedes are so big that they can feed on bats. 0:18:55.680 --> 0:18:58.240 That's what I want to see. I do too, actually, 0:18:58.320 --> 0:19:00.960 And it's kind of like, why mess around with guano 0:19:01.080 --> 0:19:03.160 and wait for the whole food chain thing to happen, 0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:04.800 to go right to the source and eat the bat, 0:19:05.320 --> 0:19:08.560 you know. Yeah, the heck of a centipede. That's yeah, 0:19:08.760 --> 0:19:11.159 I'd like to see that too. We're gonna look for 0:19:11.200 --> 0:19:13.920 some video of that after this. Okay, So how do 0:19:13.920 --> 0:19:19.280 these guys get in there? And these researchers um very carefully. 0:19:19.840 --> 0:19:23.480 You gotta look out for crazy hillbillies who have um 0:19:23.840 --> 0:19:29.400 regressively evolved. You have to not fall off of ledges, 0:19:29.960 --> 0:19:33.040 you have to go through very narrow crevasses, watch out 0:19:33.040 --> 0:19:35.000 for bears initially, and I'm sure the entrance zone can 0:19:35.000 --> 0:19:39.639 be a little dodgy definitely. And um, I guess we 0:19:39.760 --> 0:19:45.240 said that bio speleology or speleology in general is um 0:19:45.280 --> 0:19:48.560 a pretty recent feel of the science that couple hundred 0:19:48.600 --> 0:19:52.359 years old. Um. And we figured out pretty quick though 0:19:52.760 --> 0:19:58.680 that these are almost pristine ecosystems. And when we show 0:19:58.760 --> 0:20:04.560 up and we're cover it in fungi or bacteria or whatever, um, 0:20:04.600 --> 0:20:08.320 we introduced that to that that ecosystem and can cause 0:20:08.359 --> 0:20:12.760 its collapse pretty quick. Yeah. Debbie Bronco, my buddy who 0:20:12.960 --> 0:20:15.199 you met as well, who wrote this, pointed out that 0:20:15.280 --> 0:20:17.720 even just like shedding like lent off of your shirt 0:20:17.880 --> 0:20:20.600 or Dan driff or Dan Driff off your head, off 0:20:20.680 --> 0:20:25.640 your scaby head can can start a reaction that can 0:20:25.680 --> 0:20:30.119 like destroy the ecosystem potentially, right creepy, And there's something 0:20:30.240 --> 0:20:33.440 that there's nothing sadder than seeing a footlong faceless salamander 0:20:34.200 --> 0:20:36.720 die and you know that it was because of your 0:20:37.480 --> 0:20:39.920 your version of smallpox. You would know it was sad, 0:20:39.960 --> 0:20:43.000 though you wouldn't be able to tell. It just looked 0:20:43.040 --> 0:20:46.320 like the faceless beast that it was. Are you happy? 0:20:47.320 --> 0:20:48.960 I had another point to make, but I can't remember 0:20:48.960 --> 0:20:51.320 it right now. Were you going to make the point 0:20:51.359 --> 0:20:56.560 about the Federal Cave Resources Protection Act of But go ahead, Well, 0:20:56.880 --> 0:20:59.360 the US passed an act that said if you go 0:20:59.400 --> 0:21:01.520 into a cave, you and you spray paint and cave 0:21:01.600 --> 0:21:06.040 go to jail. You go to jail. You can't spray 0:21:06.040 --> 0:21:09.480 paint in a cave. Well, maybe that was my point 0:21:09.520 --> 0:21:11.679 was that that's pretty recent. Like I get the feeling 0:21:11.720 --> 0:21:14.959 because they didn't explore caves until sort of recently as 0:21:15.000 --> 0:21:16.719 far as if you talk about how long science has 0:21:16.720 --> 0:21:19.080 been around, so I think caves have kind of just 0:21:19.119 --> 0:21:23.399 been ignored, or maybe hundreds of years ago they were 0:21:23.440 --> 0:21:26.840 like I ain't going in there. No, there's no or 0:21:26.880 --> 0:21:28.399 maybe they didn't think there was a reason too there 0:21:28.400 --> 0:21:32.800 was anything worth finding in there. Plus, they're just really scary. 0:21:32.920 --> 0:21:35.040 I think that more than anything that's kept us out 0:21:35.160 --> 0:21:37.280 ain't going in there. I would like to do this 0:21:37.359 --> 0:21:41.080 though that like the the caves and the snots. Is 0:21:41.080 --> 0:21:46.520 that what they're called? Yeah? Those are those are really neat. Yeah, 0:21:46.520 --> 0:21:50.960 the underground water like it's a it's fascinating to me. 0:21:51.520 --> 0:21:53.960 I want someone to like email us and say, hey, guys, 0:21:54.359 --> 0:21:56.200 I do this, and I'd love to fly heat down 0:21:56.240 --> 0:21:59.560 and take you spe linking. I think the coolest stuff 0:21:59.600 --> 0:22:04.680 may have done something and saying no tastes maybe we'll see. Um, 0:22:04.760 --> 0:22:07.680 so you got anything else? I guess the one thing 0:22:07.720 --> 0:22:11.080 that um we took away from this is that instead 0:22:11.119 --> 0:22:14.199 of stranger danger, you could also say zenos danger if 0:22:14.200 --> 0:22:17.000 you're in Greece, and they'd be like, we get the 0:22:17.080 --> 0:22:20.640 zenos part, but I didn't catch the second. Uh. If 0:22:20.640 --> 0:22:24.960 you want to learn about cave biology or bio speleology, 0:22:25.520 --> 0:22:29.439 you should type in cave biology or bio speleology in 0:22:29.480 --> 0:22:32.240 the search bar at how stuff works dot com. There's 0:22:32.240 --> 0:22:37.560 some pretty cool illustrations in there. Um and uh, or 0:22:37.600 --> 0:22:41.160 google a proteus salamander too. Yeah, that's pretty cool. Get 0:22:41.359 --> 0:22:45.080 it's creepy. Folk show. It's a creepy like ten times. 0:22:45.240 --> 0:22:47.960 I wonder also we were talking about guano and being 0:22:47.960 --> 0:22:52.919 a fertilizer. I wonder if um, the bat guano fertilizer 0:22:53.000 --> 0:22:58.119 market is contributing to declineing cave ecosystems. It's got to 0:22:58.160 --> 0:23:00.600 go in there and harvest it in the dark own, right. 0:23:01.400 --> 0:23:03.280 I know. One thing we did forget was she made 0:23:03.280 --> 0:23:07.000 a point that they are concerned that climate change is 0:23:07.520 --> 0:23:09.320 not going to be too good for for what's in 0:23:09.320 --> 0:23:11.200 the cave because they kind of depend on that constant 0:23:11.240 --> 0:23:13.639 temperature in the dark zone. Right. You know, we we 0:23:13.720 --> 0:23:16.760 can get used to changes in temperature. These organisms like 0:23:16.880 --> 0:23:21.080 literally don't experience the temperature change in generations and generations. 0:23:21.080 --> 0:23:23.680 I would imagine even a couple of degrees could could 0:23:23.680 --> 0:23:26.800 wipe them out. And plus also we've got the um 0:23:26.800 --> 0:23:31.080 white nose syndrome facing our bat populations. Yeah, what is that? 0:23:31.359 --> 0:23:33.760 We talked about it before, I remember, um, I can't 0:23:33.760 --> 0:23:35.600 remember how it came up, but we were talking about 0:23:35.600 --> 0:23:37.680 bats with like little fungus on their nose and it 0:23:37.760 --> 0:23:41.960 was killing like entire populations of bats and it's just 0:23:42.440 --> 0:23:45.600 they're dropping by the millions and our our I guess. 0:23:45.600 --> 0:23:48.800 Bat researchers are like, we have no idea what's going on. 0:23:48.880 --> 0:23:50.879 We don't know how to fight this. And it's actually 0:23:50.920 --> 0:23:54.199 a big problem because if you hate mosquitoes, brother, you 0:23:54.320 --> 0:23:57.720 better like bats. They can eat up to six mosquitoes 0:23:57.760 --> 0:23:59.919 in an hour. I need to get some bats, somebody 0:24:00.040 --> 0:24:03.639