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Speaker 1: Happy Monday. Welcome to another episode of the Chuck Podcast.

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Speaker 1: It is a big day in the future of Ukraine,

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Speaker 1: pure and simple, and that is going to be the

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Speaker 1: line's share of what we talk about here to start

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Speaker 1: the podcast. My guest today though, is has nothing to

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Speaker 1: do with Ukraine. In case you're wondering, it's Colin Coward.

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Speaker 1: He and I actually work with some of the same people,

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Speaker 1: so we're sort of, how do you We're not really

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Speaker 1: employees of the same entities, but we're sort of It's

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Speaker 1: like in law partners, is probably the way the way

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Speaker 1: to put it. We have some of the same business

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Speaker 1: partners in common these days with what we're doing in

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Speaker 1: the independent side of things, and we've had a great

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Speaker 1: we had a great conversation.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: It is a little bit both of us. Obviously, in

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Speaker 1: some ways the world of politics and sports sort of

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Speaker 1: share some DNA, at least in the media sense of

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Speaker 1: things and the media side of things. So I think

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Speaker 1: the part of the conversation, even if you're not a

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Speaker 1: sports fan, I think understanding sort of where the world

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Speaker 1: of sports media is going matters a lot. To understand

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Speaker 1: where the information ecosystem is headed, where people will get

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Speaker 1: their information where our culture is heading. All of it

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Speaker 1: is blurred together more than ever. So I don't think

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Speaker 1: even if, like I said, even if you're not a

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Speaker 1: sports fan, I think you're going to find this conversation

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Speaker 1: quite enlightening. Colin is not just a sports guy, even

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Speaker 1: though yes, that's what he.

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Speaker 2: Does professionally, but he.

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Speaker 1: Certainly has his own set of interest and I think

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Speaker 1: by the end of the conversation the likely thing you'll

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Speaker 1: be doing is running to Amazon or Apple wherever you

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Speaker 1: buy your books, to follow up on books that Colin

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Speaker 1: and I throw at each other, and then some I

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Speaker 1: will have a little bit of a sports update on

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Speaker 1: the other side of the podcast, or a couple of

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Speaker 1: things this weekend that I think are worth noting and

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Speaker 1: touching on, if you will. But before we begin, I think,

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Speaker 1: like I said, like I said at the start, today

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Speaker 1: is a huge day in the future of frankly, European security.

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Speaker 2: The future of Ukraine. Right.

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Speaker 1: The Alaska summit in Anchorage, well, look, it could have

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Speaker 1: been worse. That's about the best you could put it.

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Speaker 1: It could have been worse. It really wasn't much of

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Speaker 1: a summit, but it certainly was revealing. Once again, it

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Speaker 1: was not Donald Trump playing tough guy. It was Vladimir

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Speaker 1: Putin that sort of owned the show. And it made

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Speaker 1: the summit quite revealing, because if there is one large takeaway,

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Speaker 1: it's this, Donald Trump is still enamored with Vladimir Putin

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Speaker 1: after everything Putin has done, after every all the slaughtering

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Speaker 1: he's done in Ukraine. And it tells you more about

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Speaker 1: Trump's worldview really than anything else that came out of Anchorage.

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Speaker 1: Here's what I mean, and I'm gonna get to some

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Speaker 1: of the details here today. I mean, look, I think

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Speaker 1: zelene I mean, it's fascinating to me. Before I finish

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Speaker 1: up here with the Anchorage portion of this, it is

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Speaker 1: fascinating to me that that Zelensky's not coming to Washington alone.

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Speaker 1: He is flanked by essentially the European avengers, if you will, right.

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Speaker 1: He's got the leaders of Germany and the leader of Italy,

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Speaker 1: He's got multiple the leader of the EU. They're all

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Speaker 1: coming to have his back. They don't want to see

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Speaker 1: him bullied into something he doesn't want to agree to.

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Speaker 1: They don't want to see him humiliated on the national

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Speaker 1: stage like Trump did the early in this second turn

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Speaker 1: back in February that incredibly uncomfortable moment where Trump and

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Speaker 1: Vance ganged up on Zelenski.

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Speaker 2: So it is.

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Speaker 1: Clear that the Europeans basically are physically literally going to

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Speaker 1: have Zelensky's back at all of these meetings. It'll be

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Speaker 1: interesting to see, does Trump do Trump and Zelensky have

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Speaker 1: their own one on one without the European leaders. I'm

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Speaker 1: sure there'll be some form of that, But obviously these

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Speaker 1: European leaders are coming with to just make your Trump

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Speaker 1: doesn't run rough shot, and I assume sends a signal

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Speaker 1: to Trump how little they want him to be siding

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Speaker 1: with Russia. But look, it's clear that Trump is going

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Speaker 1: to be more generous to Russia than any other entity

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Speaker 1: involved in this war, not Europe and certainly not Zelenski.

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Speaker 1: And I think part of it has to do with

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Speaker 1: Trump's worldview. Trump doesn't believe respect is earned. He doesn't

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Speaker 1: think respect comes from behavior, from principles, from what you

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Speaker 1: stand for. To him, respect is simply forced right. You

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Speaker 1: either buy your way into respect or you bully your

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Speaker 1: way into respect. It's about size, about muscle, about the

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Speaker 1: rules of the jungle. The bigger you are, the more

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Speaker 1: deference you're owed. That's why in his mind, Putin deserves

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Speaker 1: some level of respect, no matter what kind of thug

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Speaker 1: he actually is. Putin doesn't deserve respect, but Trump thinks

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Speaker 1: he deserves. Not because Russia is virtuous, it isn't. Not

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Speaker 1: because Russia is a successful country.

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Speaker 2: It is not.

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Speaker 1: But because Putin has nuclear weapons, and Putin has wealth,

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Speaker 1: and because Putin bullies put and because Putin looms large.

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Speaker 1: That's why Trump feels like he has to pay deference.

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Speaker 1: It's why Trump believes. It's the way he thinks he

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Speaker 1: gets deference. He doesn't earn it right, Nobody respects him,

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Speaker 1: but he's bullied his way into making sure people have

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Speaker 1: to count out to it. And in some ways that's

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Speaker 1: if that's the way he has to behave, if that's

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Speaker 1: the way he has to survive in the American system,

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Speaker 1: then why not reward those in the in the global

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Speaker 1: order who behave the same way. So even though Russia

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Speaker 1: is agressor, even though Russia is the war criminal, even

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Speaker 1: though Russia is the destabilizer, Trump's Trump still defers. He

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Speaker 1: still convinces himself that Putin deserves some kind of special

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Speaker 1: treatment simply because he's bigger. I know some of you

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Speaker 1: may want to say, well, Putin's got something on him.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if he does or not. I don't think.

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Speaker 1: I think Trump, you know, is always going to be

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Speaker 1: supportive of anybody who says nice things about him. This

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Speaker 1: is how it's worked for a long time, right, And

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Speaker 1: that is what it is. But Trump's world views is

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Speaker 1: simply you know, who's with me and who's against me.

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Speaker 1: That's the lens with which Trump sees the whole world.

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Speaker 1: It's not democracy versus autocracy, right, it's not freedom versus tyranny.

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Speaker 1: To him, it's much simpler, who's for me and who's

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Speaker 1: against me. Zelenski he was against him, right. It was

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Speaker 1: Zelensky's phone call that got him impeached the first time.

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Speaker 1: It was Zelenski that had forged a very tight relationship

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Speaker 1: with Biden because Biden, Joe Biden, during his presidency, was

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Speaker 1: one hundred percent behind Zelenski and one hundred percent against

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Speaker 1: buten pure and simple. But to Trump, Zelensky made a

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Speaker 1: political decision, not a decision out of what's right and wrong,

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Speaker 1: but a decision about which American president he prefers. So

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Speaker 1: to Trump, I don't want to say Zelensky sees Zelensky

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Speaker 1: as an enemy, but he doesn't see him as an ally,

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Speaker 1: not at all. In some ways, he sees Putin personally

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Speaker 1: is more of an ally to him than Zelensky, because

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Speaker 1: Putin helped him get elected, and that he has he's

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Speaker 1: never made any apologies about that. His only contention is

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Speaker 1: he didn't coordinate, but he certainly welcomed the help that

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Speaker 1: the Russian intelligence agencies provided him, largely through wiki leaks

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Speaker 1: and of course their influence campaign and social media networks.

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Speaker 1: But Ukraine is a democratic cause as far as Donald

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Speaker 1: Trump's concern, right, That's why he continues to call it

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Speaker 1: Biden's war. That's why he says this nonsense that somehow,

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Speaker 1: if he were president, it wouldn't have happened. Putin of

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Speaker 1: course flatters him, right, Zelenski doesn't flatter him. He's trying

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Speaker 1: to lately, But you know it's Zelensky. I don't think

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Speaker 1: he knows how to bullshit well, right, he's sort of

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Speaker 1: not what you're going through, what he's gone through over

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Speaker 1: the last three years.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: But Putin says nice things to Trump. Trump likes hearing that.

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Speaker 1: Putin tells Trump the war wouldn't have happened if he

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Speaker 1: were in office. And so suddenly, magically Putin's a friend. Now,

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Speaker 1: let's make no mistake here. The fact that Putin has

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Speaker 1: decided to agree with Trump that if Trump were president,

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Speaker 1: the war wouldn't happen. It's a laughable comment because if

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Speaker 1: that logic held, if Putin only avoided war because Trump,

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Speaker 1: if Putin claims he would have avoided the war if

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Speaker 1: Trump was president, then why isn't he offering a ceasefire

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Speaker 1: right now? Why hasn't he stopped the fighting within twenty

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Speaker 1: four hours of Trump taking the oath of office?

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Speaker 2: So the logic collapses pretty quickly.

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Speaker 1: Right If somehow Trump being in the oval office would

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Speaker 1: have meant that Putin wouldn't started this war, then why

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Speaker 1: has he ended it six months ago when Trump actually

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Speaker 1: came into office. The fact that Trump embraces what Putin

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Speaker 1: said to hi him in these interviews, at these post

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Speaker 1: summit interviews. My gosh, this is insanity. Okay, this is insanity.

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Speaker 1: But the flattery works on him. It always has. And

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Speaker 1: here's the tragedy.

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Speaker 2: The US president, the leader of the free world, can

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Speaker 2: be played with the cheapest trick in the book. Putin

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Speaker 2: knows this, My god, he's been doing it for nearly

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Speaker 2: a decade, and the only reel question is does Trump

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Speaker 2: understand he's being played? Does Trump understand that that Putin

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Speaker 2: actually doesn't respect him whatsoever? The fact that he does

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Speaker 2: flattery instead of responding to Trump's demands have ceased fire.

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Speaker 2: Is Trump so desperate for validation that he doesn't care

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Speaker 2: that Putin is literally playing him like a fiddle, making

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Speaker 2: him look like a fool, telling him what he wants

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Speaker 2: to hear, but not be doing anything that Trump asks

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Speaker 2: him to do. It's truly amazing.

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Speaker 1: That Trump doesn't fully I guess he doesn't care that

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Speaker 1: he's being played. I'll say this, It is clear to

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Speaker 1: me that there are folks I do think this. Trump

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Speaker 1: is not hearing only one argument in his hear right.

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Speaker 1: A lot of times, he's surrounded on a lot of issues.

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Speaker 1: He has surrounded himself with sycophanic messaging on this issue.

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Speaker 1: His administration's pretty divided. I think that Marco Rubio is

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Speaker 1: still somebody who thinks Russia is and Putin is a

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Speaker 1: two bit dictator, and which is why there was so

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Speaker 1: much spin right noticed, unnamed spin from the White House

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Speaker 1: saying don't expect anything. He's not going to agree to anything.

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Speaker 1: It was almost as if they were they had just like,

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Speaker 1: just don't agree to anything. It's all they wanted to hear, right,

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Speaker 1: just don't agree to anything. So he didn't agree to anything,

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Speaker 1: you know, unless he was going to get a ceasefire,

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Speaker 1: which he didn't get. Just don't agree to anything. I

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Speaker 1: wonder if in these twenty four to forty eight hours,

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Speaker 1: if the Europeans it's Zelenski, if Rubio, if others around

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Speaker 1: him can convince him that Putin doesn't respect him, that

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Speaker 1: Putin thinks a couple of cheap flattery points like, hey,

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Speaker 1: the election was rigged in twenty twenty, and this war

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Speaker 1: doesn't happen if he's president.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: If the fact that Putin just signs off on his

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Speaker 1: delusional beliefs, that that's enough for Trump to essentially take

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Speaker 1: the side of Russia in this back and forth, It's

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Speaker 1: astonishing that it works. I know we've watched it over

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Speaker 1: and over again, right, and I know there are others

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Speaker 1: that are going There's no way Trump can be this simple.

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Speaker 1: It must be that Putin has something over him. Please

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Speaker 1: look at Trump's behavior. We've seen if you suck up

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Speaker 1: to him, he will change his tone now he'll come.

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Speaker 1: You know, he doesn't always stick to it, but he

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Speaker 1: will change his tone. You know, he doesn't care if

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Speaker 1: people really don't like him, as long as as they

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Speaker 1: fake it in public and fake it to him.

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Speaker 2: It's why he has no real friends. It's the strangest thing.

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Speaker 1: He has no close personal friend at all. Everybody who

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Speaker 1: pretends he's a friend is just there to get close

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Speaker 1: to power. There is no real friend. He had one

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Speaker 1: real friend who died of COVID, well, Frank, I think,

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Speaker 1: the developer. But he has no close friends. There's nobody, right,

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Speaker 1: It's just a collection of people he's acquired and about

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Speaker 1: every six years they rotate. But these are his friends.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: That's about it. But let's you know, this is huge

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Speaker 1: damage that's being done to the larger cause of democracy.

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Speaker 1: The idea that our defensive democracy is not about partisanship

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Speaker 1: but about principle has already been rattled, right. This was

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Speaker 1: something that was bipartisan for a long time. But now

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Speaker 1: with Trump, Trump is rattling it further when he accepts

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Speaker 1: Putin's praise, when he questions Zelensky's legitimacy, when he reduces

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Speaker 1: a brutal war to nothing more than a scorecard of

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Speaker 1: who's on his side and who isn't. It sends a

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Speaker 1: message that America's defensive freedom of democracy, of sovereignty is

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Speaker 1: simply conditional, that it's negotiable, that it depends on who's

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Speaker 1: flattering the president.

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Speaker 2: We've seen it. You know, if a country that's funding

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Speaker 2: Hamas gives him an airplane, I love them. They're the best.

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Speaker 1: If a country that violates human rights promises to give

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Speaker 1: them all sorts of money for his presidential library, he

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Speaker 1: looks the other way. So what if they kill journalists,

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Speaker 1: They're going to invest money in America when Trump is present.

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Speaker 1: That's not what America used to be. That is not

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Speaker 1: where Ronald Reagan led this country in the eighties. This

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Speaker 1: is not where Dwight Eisenhower was in the nineteen fifties.

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Speaker 1: And this is where I want to pivot to something,

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Speaker 1: because this moment Trump in Anchorage funning over Putin is

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Speaker 1: really just the latest evidence that today's Republican party is

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Speaker 1: not the party of Reagan. Okay, this is not peace

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Speaker 1: through Strength, this is not trust, but verify, this is

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Speaker 1: so far away from being the party of Reagan. It's

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Speaker 1: not the party of Bush. It's not the Party of Eisenhower.

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Speaker 1: This is something else entirely, and it actually brings me

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Speaker 1: to an interesting comment that Ron DeSantis made last week

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Speaker 1: right the Republican governor of Florida. He said something that

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Speaker 1: caught my attention. He was introducing his new lieutenant governor

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Speaker 1: that he appointed, and he threw in what sounded like

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Speaker 1: a bit of perfunctory language that actually seemed kind of

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Speaker 1: stupid at the moment, he said Florida shouldn't go back

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Speaker 1: to the kind of leadership it had ten, fifteen, and

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Speaker 1: twenty years ago. Now, all over Twitter, a lot of

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Speaker 1: people bunked on DeSantis. Look at this, He's trashing the

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Speaker 1: Republican Party. Why do I say that? Well, ten years ago,

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Speaker 1: Rick Scott was governor of Florida. Fifteen years ago, Charlie

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Speaker 1: christ As, a Republican, was the governor of Florida. Twenty

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Speaker 1: years ago, go Jeb Bush was the governor of Florida.

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Speaker 1: So was Desanti's stupid about this or was he actually

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Speaker 1: being serious? I actually think he was being serious because

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Speaker 1: Rond de Santis. There was no room for Rond de

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Speaker 1: Santis in Jeb Bush's Republican party. And that's what's fascinating

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Speaker 1: here because you know what he was telling the truth

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Speaker 1: he meant it. Because the fact is today's Republican Party

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Speaker 1: is not the same party that elected Jeb Bush. It's

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Speaker 1: not the same party that elected Ronald Reagan. It's certainly

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Speaker 1: not the same party that elected Dwight Eisenhower. They may

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Speaker 1: share the name, but it's not the same institution.

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Speaker 2: Think of it like this.

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Speaker 1: American Airlines today isn't really American Airlines. It's actually USAir.

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Speaker 1: But when USAir took over American it wasn't a merger.

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Speaker 1: It was a USAir takeover of American Airlines. They took

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Speaker 1: the American brand because the USA brand was US air

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Speaker 1: brand was shit, right, Americans brand was stronger, so they

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Speaker 1: kept the American name. But this was US Air underneath.

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Speaker 1: It was just simply looks like American Airlines. So you know,

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Speaker 1: the colors are the same, the logos the same, the

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Speaker 1: branding similar. Few of the hubs are the same, Dallas

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Speaker 1: and Miami, There's always have been American hubs. But Charlotte, right,

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Speaker 1: that's the big US Air hub, and it's Usair's DNA

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Speaker 1: in the airline. It's Usair's corporate culture. Trust me, my

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Speaker 1: frustration sometimes we have no choice, you know, not to

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Speaker 1: get off on a tangent. But you know, we have

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Speaker 1: no choice of airlines in America, right, if you fly

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Speaker 1: a lot, you end up having to fly one of

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Speaker 1: four airlines because there's because in law likelihood, only one

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Speaker 1: airline gets you to where you need to go at

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Speaker 1: the time you need it, right, So you end up

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Speaker 1: having wherever you travel most frequently is the airline you

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Speaker 1: end up stuck with, right as.

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Speaker 2: A frequent flyer. So I'm stuck with American. Trust me.

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Speaker 1: I wish I could be United or Delta, both of

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Speaker 1: which I feel like I have more pleasant experiences on

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Speaker 1: both feel like better customer service. But these are airlines

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Speaker 1: with cultures that go back decades, right, US Area is.

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Speaker 2: Still this.

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Speaker 1: Compilation of various little regional airlines that they created one

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Speaker 1: and it's still always and you know, it still always

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Speaker 1: feels like it's being run on the cheap, right, They're

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Speaker 1: always they never have the backup crewise, they never have

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Speaker 1: the backup planes. It's unlike how the other two major

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Speaker 1: airlines are run.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: Well, that's the Republican Party today. It kept the Republican name,

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Speaker 1: But what's inside is not the Republican Party that we

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Speaker 1: all knew for the last eighty years. It's mag It's

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Speaker 1: Trump's party, it's not Reagans, it's not Bushes, it's not Eisenhowers,

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Speaker 1: it's not Romney's, it's not mccains. And that matters because

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Speaker 1: MAGA doesn't stand for small government conservatives. Ronald Reagan's Republican

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Speaker 1: Party did. MAGA doesn't stand for democracy promotion abroad. Donald

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Speaker 1: Reagan's the White Eisenhowers both did. It doesn't even stand

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Speaker 1: for fiscal responsibility.

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Speaker 2: I think only.

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Speaker 1: Eisenhower's Republican Party did. But they paid lip service in

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Speaker 1: Reagan's era, and they paid lip service in Bush's era.

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Speaker 1: That now they don't even pay lip service to the

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Speaker 1: fiscal responsibility. This Republican Party, or excuse me, the MAGA

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Speaker 1: party stands for something else. It's transactionalism, it's grievance, and

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Speaker 1: it's some serious authoritarian instincts. Think about how the party

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Speaker 1: has changed. Look at the policies.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: Reagan joked that the most terrifying words in English were

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Speaker 1: I'm from the government, I'm here to help.

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Speaker 2: Well.

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Speaker 1: Trump wants more government power. Ronald Reagan wanted less government power.

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump wants the government to be the answer to everything,

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Speaker 1: including corporate America. Right, He's using government power in ways

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Speaker 1: we've never seen, really, not since FDR in this country.

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Speaker 1: And arguably it's stuff you see in Latin americaishing political enemies,

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Speaker 1: nationalizing local law enforcement, small government, dictating which companies get

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Speaker 1: to trade with China based on whether they cut Trump's

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Speaker 1: government in on a political deal. Right, you could sell

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Speaker 1: your chips to China as long as you pay a

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Speaker 1: you know, you pay a tax or a tithing to

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Speaker 1: the government. That's small government, conservatism, inserting yourself into a business. Apparently,

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Speaker 1: you know, the US government is a stake in US steel.

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Speaker 1: The US government's gonna end up with a stake in

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Speaker 1: Intel under Trump's leadership. This is not the Republican Party, folks,

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Speaker 1: not even close. This is not limited government. This is

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Speaker 1: authoritarian government. Now, maybe some of you think it's a

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Speaker 1: benevolent authoritarian government in some places and not so benevolent

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Speaker 1: in other places. But it's authoritarian. It's just dressed up

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Speaker 1: with the old Republican label. American airline and look at

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Speaker 1: the worldview. Right, Eisenhower cent American troops abroad to defend democracy.

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Speaker 1: Trump shrugs at democracy abroad and says, the dictator flatters me,

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Speaker 1: he's my friend. That's not Reagan's shining City on a hill,

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Speaker 1: that's not Eisenhower's defense of Europe. This is simply Trump's

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Speaker 1: rules of the jungle. Who's with me, who's against me?

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Speaker 1: I'll tell you think of it this way. If Donald

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Speaker 1: Trump announced tomorrow that he was officially renaming the Republican

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Speaker 1: Party what it actually is, get rid of that up

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Speaker 1: brand and go with the Mega party, how many current

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Speaker 1: Republican elected officials are actually, Oh, I don't know if

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Speaker 1: I can do that, I'm going to leave the party.

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Speaker 1: I guess not that many. Maybe twenty five or thirty

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Speaker 1: percent would leave the party and become independent or reform

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Speaker 1: a new Republican Party. But I think sixty seventy percent

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Speaker 1: of those already elected would be like, sign me.

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Speaker 2: Up, I'm a mega guy.

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Speaker 1: Because that's what you know. Today's GOP is parties just

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Speaker 1: a vehicle. It's not a set of principles to abide by.

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Speaker 1: It's just simply a vehicle for political survival or political power.

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Speaker 1: And right now it's just simply about aligning with Trump.

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Speaker 2: And that actually.

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Speaker 1: Probably does explain to Santis' comment. Now, it's possible he

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Speaker 1: wasn't meaning it the way he meant it, and yet

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Speaker 1: he did, and yet he did tell us something because

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Speaker 1: this party is less like Jeb Bush's Republican Party in Florida.

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Speaker 1: This party is less like George W. Bush's party, Ronald

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Speaker 1: Reagan's party. It's not very close at all. Again, I

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Speaker 1: know it looks similar. I'm sure some of you are going, oh,

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Speaker 1: that's right, American. USAir did buy American. And the more

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Speaker 1: you think about it, it's like, that's right, it's not

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Speaker 1: American Airlines. There's not many things left other than the logo.

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Speaker 1: And that's kind of where we are with the Republican

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Speaker 1: Party today and this summit. I mean, this was, as

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Speaker 1: you know, and again, none of it is surprising. This

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Speaker 1: is no longer shocking us the way it shocked us

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Speaker 1: in Trump one point oh. This is now, you know,

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Speaker 1: Trump one point zero could have been an asterisk. Coming

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Speaker 1: back a second time. It solidifies things. This is a

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Speaker 1: wholesale change. If the Republican Party ever goes back to

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Speaker 1: what it was, it's not going to happen for a generation.

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Speaker 1: Jeb Bush's you know, Jeb Bush probably could not get

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Speaker 1: elected in today's party. Kind of tried in twenty sixteen, right,

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Speaker 1: he couldn't win in this party. Party had no rule

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Speaker 1: for his style of governance, of his brand of you know,

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Speaker 1: they want grievance. And Trump belongs to a new Republican party. Again,

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Speaker 1: they share the name, but they don't share the soul.

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Speaker 1: So let's connect the dots here a little bit. Trump

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Speaker 1: deferring to putin an anchorage, the scantists dismissing Jeb Bush's Florida

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Speaker 1: both the reminders that this is not the Republican Party

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Speaker 1: of the last twenty or forty or sixty years. It's

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Speaker 1: something new, it's something different. Some argue this is what

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Speaker 1: the Republican Party kind of was pre World War Two.

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Speaker 2: And there's some with.

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Speaker 1: The isolationism and the nativism and the tariffs. Right, there's

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Speaker 1: some familiarity here, but this is a bit newer because

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Speaker 1: of the it really is wants its hands on government.

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Speaker 1: They want power, and that's the biggest change. Right, There

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Speaker 1: is no limited government, there's no light touch, right, take

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Speaker 1: over a city's police force. Have unidentified thugs behaving as thugs,

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Speaker 1: wearing law enforcement without identifying themselves.

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Speaker 2: That is not.

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Speaker 1: The libertarian influenced Republican party of the twentieth century. And

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Speaker 1: that's what's on subtly, because when the party that wants

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Speaker 1: defined itself by defending democracy abroad now shrugs at Ukraine's fate.

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Speaker 1: When the party that wants defined itself by small government

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Speaker 1: now cheers Trump's big government authoritarianism. Right, When the party

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Speaker 1: that wants to find itself by principle now defines itself

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Speaker 1: by loyalty to a single man, it raises the question

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Speaker 1: what exactly is left of this Republican party other than

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Speaker 1: the name and maybe a tax cut or too everything else.

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Speaker 1: It's not Reagan, it's not Bush, it's not Eisenhower.

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Speaker 2: It's Trump. Just Trump. So we'll see what happens. I'm a.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to even say whether I'm optimistic or

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Speaker 1: pessimistic about what this outcome is going to be, all Right,

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Speaker 1: I think that our goal has to be Ukraine keeps

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Speaker 1: its sovereignty. That's a small victory. I think Trump's okay

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Speaker 1: with that. This idea of swapping land that has always

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Speaker 1: been Ukraine's a side of odd and I think Europe's

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Speaker 1: concerned about that. And then the question of security, Trump's

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Speaker 1: real Estate Pal Steve Whitcoff, who I think, really, you know.

429
00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:23,359
Speaker 1: In my Newsphere episode this week, I interviewed Bill Taylor,

430
00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:28,080
Speaker 1: former and US Ambassador to Ukraine, really well wired into

431
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:32,920
Speaker 1: your Ukraine's current government, and he thinks whit Cough really

432
00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:37,719
Speaker 1: just maybe it was lost in translation literally with Putin.

433
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:40,399
Speaker 1: Maybe he heard what he wanted to hear and not

434
00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:44,280
Speaker 1: what he actually heard. But if the fact that they

435
00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:47,879
Speaker 1: ended up holding that summit and Putin and the idea

436
00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:51,000
Speaker 1: of even a one week ceasefire wasn't even something he

437
00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:57,040
Speaker 1: was considering, what Cough still still advised to do this,

438
00:25:57,240 --> 00:25:58,040
Speaker 1: to do this meeting.

439
00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:00,760
Speaker 2: So Bill Taylor.

440
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 1: Thinks Whitkoff is sort of out of his element, right

441
00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:05,879
Speaker 1: in over his head. And I'll tell you if this

442
00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:09,399
Speaker 1: and this is what's really frustrating, you know, really pre Trump,

443
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:13,600
Speaker 1: when it came to things like this, national security challenges

444
00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:19,080
Speaker 1: like this, nobody cared what party you what party's president

445
00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:21,120
Speaker 1: you worked for. If you were the best at doing it,

446
00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:25,840
Speaker 1: you were tabbed to do it right. And Bill Burns,

447
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:29,760
Speaker 1: former CIA director, former ambassador at Russia, somebody who's worked

448
00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:34,520
Speaker 1: for presidents of both parties, probably is the single best

449
00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:37,240
Speaker 1: person that understands Putin, that knows how to talk with

450
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:41,320
Speaker 1: him one on one, that has done it. It's KGB

451
00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:48,560
Speaker 1: versus Cia, not KGB versus Century twenty one. Okay, it's

452
00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:52,000
Speaker 1: a fair fight. If Trump cared about democracy and cared

453
00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:56,000
Speaker 1: about Europe's security and cared about Ukraine's fate, he'd have

454
00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:58,399
Speaker 1: Bill Burns as a special envoy in dealing with this.

455
00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:02,199
Speaker 1: There is only one person I think right now in

456
00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:06,240
Speaker 1: the last couple of administrations that I would trust dealing

457
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:12,000
Speaker 1: with Putin, and it's Bill Burns. So the fact that

458
00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:14,800
Speaker 1: you know and and and you know, maybe Trump will

459
00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:20,520
Speaker 1: realize that, which cough blew it here. Maybe not, but

460
00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:22,879
Speaker 1: we'll see what happens. I do think the fact that

461
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:25,960
Speaker 1: Europe is coming in it's almost like, like I said,

462
00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:29,080
Speaker 1: like the super f it's it's Zelensky and the super Friends,

463
00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:37,360
Speaker 1: probably does minimize how much Trump ends upsiding with what

464
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:41,879
Speaker 1: Putin wants versus what Europe wants. All right, So with

465
00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:45,040
Speaker 1: that I will we'll sneak in a quick break here

466
00:27:46,440 --> 00:28:00,360
Speaker 1: and when we come back. My conversation with Coln College. Well,

467
00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:05,080
Speaker 1: as many of you know, I am a sports fanatic,

468
00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:07,080
Speaker 1: and I always say the word fan is short for

469
00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:09,400
Speaker 1: fanatic for a reason, and part of the reason I'm

470
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:11,520
Speaker 1: always a little more vocal about sports is that I

471
00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:14,680
Speaker 1: actually feel more comfortable sharing expressing an opinion about sports

472
00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:17,919
Speaker 1: than on politics, although some of you might think, but

473
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:19,120
Speaker 1: you do express your opinion.

474
00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:20,640
Speaker 2: About politics, but not the way you think.

475
00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:25,240
Speaker 1: I guess today is Colin Coward, who I think of

476
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:28,280
Speaker 1: all the sports media personalities, he's one of them.

477
00:28:28,560 --> 00:28:28,639
Speaker 2: No.

478
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:32,640
Speaker 1: I what I love about now, I'm teasing you, Colin.

479
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:35,600
Speaker 1: What I love about it is that you do feel

480
00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:37,560
Speaker 1: like you have a brain behind your opinions.

481
00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:38,280
Speaker 2: Right.

482
00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:41,640
Speaker 1: There's this is in this day and age where you know,

483
00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:46,200
Speaker 1: is there like, is there reason? Is there a thought process?

484
00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:48,880
Speaker 1: Is there historical context? Is there you know?

485
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:51,880
Speaker 2: Or is it just somebody manufacturing outrage?

486
00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:55,840
Speaker 1: And I feel as if that you don't just try

487
00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 1: to manufacture outrage. And this is the world both you

488
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:00,960
Speaker 1: and I live in now. I'm in the political side,

489
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:03,600
Speaker 1: you're in the sports side, and we're sort of up

490
00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:06,640
Speaker 1: against a weird world now, which is kind of how

491
00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:10,040
Speaker 1: I wanted to start our conversation because in some ways

492
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,000
Speaker 1: we're in the same business and even though it's different

493
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:15,280
Speaker 1: topics and we have the same challenges and our business

494
00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:16,120
Speaker 1: has changed.

495
00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 2: How do you describe what we do these days? Well,

496
00:29:22,160 --> 00:29:24,440
Speaker 2: my mission is always and I don't know if it's

497
00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:27,080
Speaker 2: your mission, but I would guess it is to be

498
00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:34,200
Speaker 2: well sourced, well prepared, and offer content that I'm teaching

499
00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:40,800
Speaker 2: somebody something. I'm trying to make you think, laugh, ponder.

500
00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:43,920
Speaker 2: I'm not trying to make you angry, but politics and

501
00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:48,800
Speaker 2: sports or tribal sore it often will. But I really

502
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:52,360
Speaker 2: prep for my show, and so did David Letterman, and

503
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:54,959
Speaker 2: so did you know, just so does Jimmy Kimmel. I

504
00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:57,600
Speaker 2: talked to Kimmel once years ago about this. He said, oh,

505
00:29:57,920 --> 00:30:00,920
Speaker 2: you have no idea how exhausting is The show is

506
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:03,600
Speaker 2: like a break. And my take is, by the way

507
00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 2: Tony and Mike at ESPN, you know they're prepping for

508
00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:10,400
Speaker 2: hours in wherever they are. Tony's in DC and Will

509
00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:13,720
Speaker 2: bond'sop in Arizona or Chicago or wherever. So I mean,

510
00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 2: I love the process. Philip Rivers once told me Chuck

511
00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:19,520
Speaker 2: he liked preparing for the game more than the game,

512
00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:25,120
Speaker 2: and my staff knows. I love the ninety minutes of

513
00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:27,840
Speaker 2: prep to the show. As I write notes, we try

514
00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:30,680
Speaker 2: to I feel if you're gonna give me nine minutes

515
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:33,320
Speaker 2: in a car, I gotta take you somewhere. And I

516
00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:37,960
Speaker 2: can't doing that ad libbing. Letterman couldn't ad lib his monologue,

517
00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:40,960
Speaker 2: and so I just I'm trying to make people think, ponder,

518
00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:43,560
Speaker 2: make them smarter, and I think that just comes with

519
00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:45,720
Speaker 2: preparation and consistency.

520
00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 1: Look, you gave a better description than maybe I would

521
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:51,800
Speaker 1: have done, but it's exactly the way. And I love

522
00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:53,360
Speaker 1: that you use the word teach. I always say that,

523
00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:58,480
Speaker 1: you know, we're educators first, and if you don't view

524
00:30:58,520 --> 00:31:02,400
Speaker 1: yourself as an educator, doing it right, right, because ultimately,

525
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:04,920
Speaker 1: why are people tuning in to learn something they didn't know?

526
00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:06,880
Speaker 1: Even if they think right, they're not tuning in if

527
00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:09,920
Speaker 1: they already know what you're gonna say. I'm convinced of that, right.

528
00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:13,040
Speaker 2: You do, So you've got to teach them.

529
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:15,840
Speaker 1: Which it's funny you said I used to I used

530
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:17,600
Speaker 1: to say, you know, what I do for a living,

531
00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:22,600
Speaker 1: I read meaning like I just constantly like I never

532
00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:27,280
Speaker 1: want to feel caught, Like I always said, I don't

533
00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:29,920
Speaker 1: you know? And that was what the staff always knew, right,

534
00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:32,920
Speaker 1: And it's funny you say your favorite ninety minutes was

535
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:33,480
Speaker 1: before the show.

536
00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:36,080
Speaker 2: I used to say that the only thing I miss.

537
00:31:35,880 --> 00:31:39,720
Speaker 1: About my old regime, if you will, was my morning

538
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:42,960
Speaker 1: staff meeting, where we spent an hour sort of design.

539
00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:43,240
Speaker 2: You know.

540
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 1: I always did this every day, every day. If we

541
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 1: were doing the show today, what would we do if

542
00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:49,080
Speaker 1: we were doing it? And it was always it was

543
00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:51,840
Speaker 1: a forced exercise. I love running a newsroom. I love

544
00:31:51,880 --> 00:31:55,040
Speaker 1: being an assignment editor. Like that's the best job is

545
00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:56,160
Speaker 1: to be an assignment editor.

546
00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:59,920
Speaker 2: I love it. Listen. I've got such smart, funny guys

547
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:03,160
Speaker 2: in my prep room. I mean there that we spitball.

548
00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:05,720
Speaker 2: I come in with a theory or two and then

549
00:32:05,720 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 2: they spitball and I write down the funny lines. And

550
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:11,560
Speaker 2: I mean, I just have the greatest staff and they're

551
00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:15,400
Speaker 2: just funny and they and I always say, you know,

552
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:18,520
Speaker 2: sandpaper my thoughts. I'm going to tell you how I

553
00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 2: see the world. Sandpaper make them funnier. Push back, don't.

554
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:23,720
Speaker 2: I don't need to be I don't need you to

555
00:32:23,760 --> 00:32:27,440
Speaker 2: agree with me. My day starts actually with The Atlantic

556
00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:30,240
Speaker 2: and the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal,

557
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:32,640
Speaker 2: and then I go into the Athletic in the New

558
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:37,240
Speaker 2: York Post Sports section and Morning brew so that's like

559
00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:39,000
Speaker 2: an a fifty minutes in the morning before I get

560
00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:41,000
Speaker 2: on the treadmill. I love that. Then I take the

561
00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:42,760
Speaker 2: train to work, and then I go into an hour

562
00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 2: and a half of my staff and it is, oh,

563
00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:49,680
Speaker 2: will you miss doing the show? Yeah, but I've done

564
00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:53,600
Speaker 2: so many they just melt into each other. It's almost

565
00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:55,720
Speaker 2: like you know when they say, chuck when an athlete retires,

566
00:32:56,080 --> 00:32:58,600
Speaker 2: he doesn't miss the games, he misses the plane rides,

567
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:04,040
Speaker 2: he misses. That's what I love. I love that what

568
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:06,640
Speaker 2: you did, that process of being around smart, funny people

569
00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:07,560
Speaker 2: who make me think.

570
00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:13,000
Speaker 1: One hundred percent what you're You're you're sort of you're

571
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:17,080
Speaker 1: you're talk native, right, your TV radio native. That's the

572
00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:20,400
Speaker 1: path you went into that sports journalism world. You could

573
00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:22,600
Speaker 1: have gone print. You did that, and you did it

574
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:27,440
Speaker 1: at a time when that wasn't Oh that didn't look

575
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:29,480
Speaker 1: like the best path to take.

576
00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 2: Yeah. I'm always thought of myself as a radio guy.

577
00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:37,440
Speaker 2: My my first love was like Vince Scully and Larry

578
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:40,280
Speaker 2: King on Mutual Radio. I told Larry that before he

579
00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:40,880
Speaker 2: passed away.

580
00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:43,400
Speaker 1: I used to be I was that kid when I yea.

581
00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:45,960
Speaker 1: I used to stay up Larry King and who came

582
00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:46,720
Speaker 1: after Larry King.

583
00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 2: Well it was late. I was a young one.

584
00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:52,640
Speaker 1: There was another guy who I would listen to. I

585
00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:56,280
Speaker 1: forget if you said the name, not Art Bell, but

586
00:33:56,320 --> 00:33:58,400
Speaker 1: I did a little Art Bell. I used to joke,

587
00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:00,320
Speaker 1: you know, Art Bell was on the high end of

588
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:03,320
Speaker 1: AM radio, which is where we handled conspiracy theories, and

589
00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:05,320
Speaker 1: all of a sudden high end of the AM radio

590
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:08,600
Speaker 1: became became central into the Oval office.

591
00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:12,160
Speaker 2: But got a camera. It's killing me that I forgot

592
00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:13,479
Speaker 2: the other. It was Larry.

593
00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:15,720
Speaker 1: It was the other, it was, and he replaced Larry

594
00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:18,040
Speaker 1: when Larry Fannie just did see it in solo. But

595
00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 1: I used to love that midnight show. In fact, I

596
00:34:20,600 --> 00:34:22,759
Speaker 1: was so obsessed with Larry King that the first time

597
00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:24,440
Speaker 1: I visited d C, I'm like, I got to go

598
00:34:24,440 --> 00:34:27,640
Speaker 1: to Duke Ziebert's because every night he would sign off,

599
00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:31,640
Speaker 1: you know, talking about Dukes that I'm saying something now

600
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:34,800
Speaker 1: that's really old guy stuff. Duke Zieberts hasn't been around

601
00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:38,200
Speaker 1: in DC in thirty five years. It's the palm, it's

602
00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:41,680
Speaker 1: the no, it's Morton's. It's a it's a Morton's. But

603
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:45,080
Speaker 1: they did keep Larry's booth, and there's always been a microphone.

604
00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:47,440
Speaker 1: Where where where Larry King's booth was?

605
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:48,200
Speaker 2: Uh?

606
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:50,080
Speaker 1: And I did see Jack Kent Cook in there once,

607
00:34:50,200 --> 00:34:52,080
Speaker 1: which I always thought that was my That was that

608
00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:55,279
Speaker 1: was that was the thing. He wearing the glasses. Oh yeah,

609
00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:57,120
Speaker 1: he had the whole outfit, and he had some young

610
00:34:57,160 --> 00:34:59,120
Speaker 1: woman like it was. You know, he always had somebody

611
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:01,759
Speaker 1: about thirty years young than him with him. He was

612
00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:04,279
Speaker 1: I'll give him this, he was always semi age appropriate.

613
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:06,799
Speaker 1: It was always thirty years younger than him. So as

614
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:09,800
Speaker 1: he got older, you know, he got instead of a

615
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:11,520
Speaker 1: thirty year old or forty year old or fifty year old.

616
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:13,480
Speaker 2: So you got to you gotta love that. So you went,

617
00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:14,520
Speaker 2: you went radio?

618
00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:17,759
Speaker 1: And what was because I say that, did you want

619
00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:20,319
Speaker 1: to be a play by play guy? Because that the

620
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:21,480
Speaker 1: jobs in the mid eighties?

621
00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:24,840
Speaker 2: Right, that's the north star, right, I wanted to be

622
00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:28,800
Speaker 2: a baseball radio guy. That's in college. And then I

623
00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:32,160
Speaker 2: discovered Bob Costas, who was my north star to this day.

624
00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:36,320
Speaker 2: Is Bob sent me the nicest message I've ever received

625
00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:40,239
Speaker 2: about six weeks ago. In fact, I'm going to ask

626
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:43,359
Speaker 2: him to give me my introduction into the Radio Hall

627
00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:46,160
Speaker 2: of Fame, which is October thirty first in Chicago. Congratulations,

628
00:35:46,320 --> 00:35:49,680
Speaker 2: all right, thanks, yeah, Bob. Bob was my north star.

629
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:52,480
Speaker 2: Just eranite thoughtful. At the time, I was with a

630
00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:54,279
Speaker 2: person in my life and she she said, if you

631
00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:58,120
Speaker 2: could ever be Bob Costas or a reasonable facsimile, you're successful.

632
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:01,480
Speaker 2: And and so that really was I was attuned to

633
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:04,200
Speaker 2: play by play and then there aren't a lot of

634
00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:06,560
Speaker 2: play by play jobs. I got a triple A job

635
00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:11,120
Speaker 2: one inning out of college. Kevin Harlan has them all correct. Yeah, yeah,

636
00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:12,759
Speaker 2: and he's great, by the way, I wonder he is.

637
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:14,320
Speaker 1: I love him, and I've gotten to know him a

638
00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:16,680
Speaker 1: little bit, but I swear to God he has he

639
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:18,040
Speaker 1: is every play by play take.

640
00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:20,520
Speaker 2: And then all of a sudden, I was doing one

641
00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:22,680
Speaker 2: inning of play by a play in a local TV station.

642
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:27,120
Speaker 2: One of the investors was a baseball freak, heard me

643
00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:29,440
Speaker 2: and said, who's the young kid doing an inning of

644
00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:32,719
Speaker 2: play by play? We need a weekend TV sportscaster. I

645
00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:35,560
Speaker 2: did that. It paid about six times more, and so

646
00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:38,680
Speaker 2: then I got into TV for about twelve years, bounced

647
00:36:38,680 --> 00:36:43,320
Speaker 2: around Tampa, Portland, and in Tampa I started doing sports

648
00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:46,440
Speaker 2: talk radio and I had a very interesting moment. I

649
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:50,400
Speaker 2: got a call on the air from a consultant. I

650
00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:53,080
Speaker 2: was done with my show, and the program director said,

651
00:36:53,120 --> 00:36:55,040
Speaker 2: you got a phone call from somebody who should take

652
00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,560
Speaker 2: And it was a consultant from Seattle, and he said,

653
00:36:58,719 --> 00:37:03,480
Speaker 2: give up television. You are going to do incredibly well

654
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:07,800
Speaker 2: in radio. I know you make more on TV. And

655
00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:10,279
Speaker 2: I pretty much in that moment did TV to pay

656
00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:12,879
Speaker 2: the bills. But I always I started. I started doing

657
00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:15,880
Speaker 2: talk radio regularly there and then in Portland, and then

658
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:20,160
Speaker 2: the ESPN found me out of Portland, Oregon, doing radio

659
00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 2: on a station, and they just everybody just kept putting

660
00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:26,640
Speaker 2: me on TV. And now simulcasts are more lucrative for everybody,

661
00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:29,439
Speaker 2: me the company, of course. So I essentially now I'm

662
00:37:29,440 --> 00:37:31,400
Speaker 2: doing a three hour TV show on radio or a

663
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:34,000
Speaker 2: three hour radio show on TV, and it works. We

664
00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:35,960
Speaker 2: keep the pace going and it just kind of works.

665
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:38,000
Speaker 1: What do you make of the fact that that is

666
00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:44,080
Speaker 1: what what YouTube has become, radio on TV, video, radio,

667
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:46,680
Speaker 1: you know it all?

668
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:52,480
Speaker 2: You know what, I've always looked at all of this stuff, Chuck,

669
00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:56,040
Speaker 2: even television, even when you were doing Meet the Press,

670
00:37:56,440 --> 00:38:02,000
Speaker 2: it's all storytelling. And storytelling works in books. Now it

671
00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:07,040
Speaker 2: works in radio, it works in podcasting people, I mean

672
00:38:07,239 --> 00:38:11,959
Speaker 2: Netflix streaming documentaries. It's all storytelling. Now, I do think

673
00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:15,040
Speaker 2: radio is better for storytelling than television, where you you know,

674
00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:18,320
Speaker 2: two minutes on cables and eternity. But when I watch,

675
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 2: if I'm watching any show, it could be you know,

676
00:38:21,600 --> 00:38:24,080
Speaker 2: it could be you know. I bounced around cable politics.

677
00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:26,359
Speaker 2: I watch it a lot in a big election years

678
00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:30,560
Speaker 2: or midterm years. But they're basically they have narratives and stories,

679
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:35,359
Speaker 2: and I think the platforms change, Chuck, but you and

680
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:40,400
Speaker 2: I are mission doesn't. It's to be informed and tell stories.

681
00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:43,000
Speaker 2: So I've never worried about the platform. I don't want

682
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:45,400
Speaker 2: to be behind the paywall. I've told Julie Talbot my

683
00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:47,799
Speaker 2: iHeart Boss and Eric Shanks, I don't want to be

684
00:38:47,800 --> 00:38:49,840
Speaker 2: behind a paywall. Bill Simmons and I've talked about this.

685
00:38:50,239 --> 00:38:52,440
Speaker 2: I want to be everywhere, and I want to compete

686
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:57,080
Speaker 2: against everybody. But I think it all. My job is

687
00:38:57,120 --> 00:38:59,800
Speaker 2: the same regardless of the platform. And I think YouTube

688
00:38:59,840 --> 00:39:02,799
Speaker 2: just figured out. You know, smart guys. I mean all

689
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:05,759
Speaker 2: the kids under twenty eight, they're all on YouTube. But

690
00:39:05,960 --> 00:39:08,120
Speaker 2: Fox has a deal that I work. Fox has a

691
00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:10,880
Speaker 2: deal with YouTube to stem some of the cable losses,

692
00:39:11,160 --> 00:39:15,399
Speaker 2: So everybody's in business together. I'm Fubo, YouTube.

693
00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:19,799
Speaker 1: Foxy, Fox and ESPN just did a deal. When I

694
00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:22,879
Speaker 1: think about you know, there was a time you were

695
00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:27,400
Speaker 1: considered edgy, that you were taking the edgiis right, and

696
00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:30,480
Speaker 1: now you're and now you look at like what we've

697
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:34,200
Speaker 1: seen with barstool and what you see with with McAfee,

698
00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:41,600
Speaker 1: and and you know what, you haven't changed, but everything

699
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:42,080
Speaker 1: else has.

700
00:39:42,160 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 2: Do you feel like that that?

701
00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:49,440
Speaker 1: Do you feel like you're owed a residual from all

702
00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:50,759
Speaker 1: these folks that have ripped you off?

703
00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:55,040
Speaker 2: No. I think McAfee is a very unique talent. I

704
00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:59,080
Speaker 2: think Portnoy knows exactly what he's doing. Big cat Ye.

705
00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:06,560
Speaker 2: I never considered myself edgy. At ESPN, I felt edgy,

706
00:40:07,480 --> 00:40:10,520
Speaker 2: but when I went to Fox, compared to Fox News,

707
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:13,839
Speaker 2: I'm not edgy at all. Right, So I I've never

708
00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:16,640
Speaker 2: really changed. It's what Bill Morrows says, I haven't changed

709
00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:19,319
Speaker 2: my party did now you can argue with that, but

710
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:20,840
Speaker 2: there's a lot of truth in that. And I and

711
00:40:20,880 --> 00:40:22,720
Speaker 2: I feel like I've been doing the same stuff forever.

712
00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:26,319
Speaker 2: The difference is with all the plant. Like I always say,

713
00:40:27,880 --> 00:40:32,760
Speaker 2: podcasting is essentially radio with a cocktail and not governed

714
00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:35,560
Speaker 2: by the FCC. You can drop f bolls. It's this

715
00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:39,719
Speaker 2: is talk radio. But I can drink a diet coke

716
00:40:39,800 --> 00:40:42,160
Speaker 2: on the air or a cocktail and we make it.

717
00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:44,960
Speaker 2: We can swear and it's okay. But we're doing radio.

718
00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:47,880
Speaker 2: So in our styles, I think what I what I

719
00:40:47,920 --> 00:40:51,200
Speaker 2: like about podcasting. It's a little looser, but I don't

720
00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:55,120
Speaker 2: I've never my mom years ago, my late mother British,

721
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:59,600
Speaker 2: she said, uh, I hear. My friend Norma says she

722
00:40:59,600 --> 00:41:02,520
Speaker 2: had a very strong brace. She says, you're very controversial,

723
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:05,840
Speaker 2: and I said, you know, mom, if you tell the

724
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:09,880
Speaker 2: truth in sports, it deemed controversial, and I said, so,

725
00:41:10,040 --> 00:41:12,480
Speaker 2: I don't look at it as controversial. I think the

726
00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 2: more honest you are, the more hate you get. And

727
00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:19,919
Speaker 2: honest is uncomfortable one hundred percent. I you know, there's

728
00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:23,280
Speaker 2: a point. And it was sometime twenty seventeen twenty eighteen

729
00:41:23,320 --> 00:41:27,040
Speaker 2: where I would always say I didn't care what people thought,

730
00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:30,600
Speaker 2: but when I actually what actually felt that way was

731
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:33,120
Speaker 2: sometime in twenty seventeen and twenty eighteen. And you realize,

732
00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:37,839
Speaker 2: if if you're not comfortable having somebody angry at you,

733
00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:40,279
Speaker 2: don't get out of journalism, right like that.

734
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:45,000
Speaker 1: That just is if you're practicing this as a popularity contest,

735
00:41:45,040 --> 00:41:46,560
Speaker 1: you're never actually going to be any good at it.

736
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:47,520
Speaker 2: That's right.

737
00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:52,359
Speaker 1: When did you get over caring? Look, we all care

738
00:41:52,400 --> 00:41:55,359
Speaker 1: a little bit about what some people think. Yeah, when

739
00:41:55,360 --> 00:41:58,399
Speaker 1: did you get over caring about what collectively people thought?

740
00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:01,920
Speaker 2: Well, Johnny Carson, there was a book about Johnny Carson

741
00:42:01,960 --> 00:42:04,520
Speaker 2: by his attorney, which seems incredibly unethical.

742
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:07,640
Speaker 1: Harrying the Greatest, I'm so glad you brought that book

743
00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:10,200
Speaker 1: is one of the Oh my god, I want to

744
00:42:10,239 --> 00:42:13,960
Speaker 1: make it into a movie a TV show. It starts

745
00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:17,239
Speaker 1: It's by the Bushkin, right, Oh my god. Look we're

746
00:42:17,239 --> 00:42:19,480
Speaker 1: old guys here, we're like old guying it out because

747
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:21,360
Speaker 1: half the audience is going, who's Johnny Carson?

748
00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:27,560
Speaker 2: That book? Anyway, go for it? So I go for it.

749
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:31,719
Speaker 2: And then remember the passage in the book where his

750
00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:36,000
Speaker 2: attorney says, Johnny didn't care about the audience, nor did

751
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:38,480
Speaker 2: he care about the critics, but there were six or

752
00:42:38,560 --> 00:42:41,880
Speaker 2: seven people in the industry that he deeply cared about.

753
00:42:42,040 --> 00:42:45,319
Speaker 2: And that is me. That is nuts to say the

754
00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:48,440
Speaker 2: audience doesn't make good points. I've I've been taught lessons

755
00:42:48,440 --> 00:42:51,359
Speaker 2: by the audience. The audience will often people will come

756
00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:53,520
Speaker 2: up to me and say something, I'll go, God, that's

757
00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:56,360
Speaker 2: a really I've I've literally changed things on the show

758
00:42:56,600 --> 00:42:58,080
Speaker 2: based on somebody that comes up to me at the

759
00:42:58,080 --> 00:43:00,600
Speaker 2: restaurant and says, hey, why to do that? And I'm like, shit,

760
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:02,960
Speaker 2: that's a that's a good question. I don't whatever. Yeah,

761
00:43:03,480 --> 00:43:05,120
Speaker 2: that's not to say the audience doesn't matter and the

762
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:08,400
Speaker 2: critics don't have value. I've learned things from critics. Jackie

763
00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:10,759
Speaker 2: Gleese and Ustowas say, what's the point of a creer

764
00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:13,640
Speaker 2: if you're not teaching me something? Well, I have been

765
00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:17,560
Speaker 2: taught things by critics. But there are six or seven

766
00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:19,880
Speaker 2: seminal people in my life who have deep respect for

767
00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:22,720
Speaker 2: costUS would be one of them. If Bob was upset

768
00:43:22,760 --> 00:43:24,680
Speaker 2: with a tan. Bob called me one time and disagree

769
00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:26,839
Speaker 2: with something and we talked it out on I five

770
00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:29,400
Speaker 2: in Los Angeles, headed south. I remember exactly where I was.

771
00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:31,840
Speaker 2: Bob Costas was mad at me, but we talked it

772
00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:34,120
Speaker 2: out and it was a great conversation. And there's six

773
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:36,200
Speaker 2: or seven people that matter to me. You probably have

774
00:43:36,320 --> 00:43:39,880
Speaker 2: these people in your life. I could be a college professor.

775
00:43:39,920 --> 00:43:41,880
Speaker 2: It could be maybe it could be a parent, It

776
00:43:41,880 --> 00:43:44,600
Speaker 2: could be a cousin that you really respect, but I don't.

777
00:43:45,280 --> 00:43:47,399
Speaker 2: I would say this. At thirty two to thirty three,

778
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:49,280
Speaker 2: I felt like I found my voice and I stopped

779
00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:53,080
Speaker 2: doing like eight percent Bob cost This, nine percent, David Letterman,

780
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:56,279
Speaker 2: twelve percent, Carson about thirty two to thirty three, and

781
00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:59,600
Speaker 2: I would say it. I would say after I had kids.

782
00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:03,760
Speaker 2: I'm forties. You know when when you're dealing with kids,

783
00:44:04,040 --> 00:44:06,480
Speaker 2: there's just things that are more important than yourself. And

784
00:44:06,560 --> 00:44:10,520
Speaker 2: I stopped really worrying about what people thought about my

785
00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:13,120
Speaker 2: work because I was so much I was so concerned

786
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:15,680
Speaker 2: about what my kids thought about me, what my wife

787
00:44:15,719 --> 00:44:17,520
Speaker 2: thought about me. And I think he just kind of

788
00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:21,560
Speaker 2: your brain just sort of pivots to another tunnel, and

789
00:44:21,719 --> 00:44:24,239
Speaker 2: the self absorbed part of it just leaves to a

790
00:44:24,320 --> 00:44:24,920
Speaker 2: large extent.

791
00:44:27,000 --> 00:44:31,920
Speaker 1: So well, I rarely run into somebody who's read that book,

792
00:44:32,600 --> 00:44:34,839
Speaker 1: that Carson book. I like, sit there. I still to

793
00:44:34,840 --> 00:44:37,440
Speaker 1: this day. I interviewed him. I had a serious radio

794
00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:40,520
Speaker 1: show back. I don't know, you know, like like all

795
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:42,759
Speaker 1: of us, right, we've all had some X all these

796
00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:45,080
Speaker 1: like shows that have come and gone. I had a

797
00:44:45,080 --> 00:44:48,120
Speaker 1: serious XM show, a weekly show, and I got him

798
00:44:48,160 --> 00:44:50,040
Speaker 1: to come on to talk about the book, and I

799
00:44:50,080 --> 00:44:52,919
Speaker 1: was like, and he just simply said, he goes hey,

800
00:44:53,080 --> 00:44:56,120
Speaker 1: he died, and our attorney client privilege went away, and

801
00:44:56,160 --> 00:44:58,280
Speaker 1: clearly he wanted to make make a couple of bucks

802
00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:03,239
Speaker 1: on that. But that book was rivetings. It opens just

803
00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:06,280
Speaker 1: to get spokes the teas here. It opens with Johnny

804
00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:11,000
Speaker 1: and his buddies armed looking for the guy who's screwing

805
00:45:11,080 --> 00:45:14,120
Speaker 1: his wife, and it ends up being Frank Gifford. I

806
00:45:14,160 --> 00:45:17,440
Speaker 1: mean it just right like and you just like you

807
00:45:17,480 --> 00:45:19,600
Speaker 1: can't put the book down. I think I read that

808
00:45:19,719 --> 00:45:21,320
Speaker 1: thing in nine hours.

809
00:45:21,360 --> 00:45:23,440
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know if I ever stopped my

810
00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:26,120
Speaker 2: I would say my favorite book ever is the Walter

811
00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:29,080
Speaker 2: Isaacs and Steve Jobs Book, which is literally four books

812
00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:32,960
Speaker 2: in one. It's a Bill Gates jobs book, it's a

813
00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:36,920
Speaker 2: tech I learned more about tech than anything ever. It's

814
00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:41,440
Speaker 2: a Steve Jobs book, it's a rivalry book. And then

815
00:45:41,600 --> 00:45:44,040
Speaker 2: but I would put in the next ten books in

816
00:45:44,080 --> 00:45:45,759
Speaker 2: my life that I've and I love these kind of

817
00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:49,359
Speaker 2: books that Carson's book is in. Uh, have you ever

818
00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:55,520
Speaker 2: read the Phil Knight memoir? No? A Nike. That's an

819
00:45:55,520 --> 00:45:59,680
Speaker 2: old boy. That oh boy, that is really really that's

820
00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:02,480
Speaker 2: in my top ten. It is faccinitting. But the Carson

821
00:46:02,520 --> 00:46:07,359
Speaker 2: Book's fascinating to me because you know that the attorney

822
00:46:07,400 --> 00:46:11,000
Speaker 2: for Johnny often got the worst of Johnny right like

823
00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:12,680
Speaker 2: he got. I mean when you when I talk to

824
00:46:12,719 --> 00:46:15,640
Speaker 2: my agent, I don't talk to anybody like I talk

825
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:16,720
Speaker 2: along with my agent.

826
00:46:16,960 --> 00:46:18,920
Speaker 1: Do you ever feel guilty about I do the same thing.

827
00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:21,960
Speaker 1: I beat the crap out of my agent sometimes and

828
00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:24,400
Speaker 1: then I apologize to right like because I know how

829
00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 1: much money he's making and it's more than.

830
00:46:26,520 --> 00:46:30,160
Speaker 2: I'm making, you know, So I always feel like you

831
00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:34,200
Speaker 2: know you're right, yes, And I am willing to emote

832
00:46:34,239 --> 00:46:36,760
Speaker 2: with close friends. So I always want to be somewhat

833
00:46:36,840 --> 00:46:40,360
Speaker 2: under control on the air, as you did. So I

834
00:46:40,440 --> 00:46:44,080
Speaker 2: need an out what and my wife appreciates some of it.

835
00:46:44,200 --> 00:46:48,160
Speaker 2: But yeah, I mean I have really honest, raw conversations

836
00:46:48,200 --> 00:46:52,759
Speaker 2: with agents, and you know Jamie Horowitz who he and

837
00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:56,879
Speaker 2: I and Logan Swain tremendous people at the volume my game.

838
00:46:56,920 --> 00:46:59,799
Speaker 1: I'm working with those same guys and excited about it.

839
00:46:59,840 --> 00:47:03,520
Speaker 1: So yeah, so we have, Yeah, we have very raw

840
00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:04,880
Speaker 1: conversations about stuff.

841
00:47:04,880 --> 00:47:10,000
Speaker 2: And I find it. Uh. I drive home after those

842
00:47:10,040 --> 00:47:12,960
Speaker 2: meetings and I'm always like, was I too harsh? Was

843
00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:16,760
Speaker 2: I too? But in the end, I always appreciate harsh

844
00:47:16,840 --> 00:47:21,719
Speaker 2: and honesty. Like I've told my bosses, if you're mad

845
00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:24,080
Speaker 2: at me, tell me, I'm okay with conflict, like I

846
00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:26,239
Speaker 2: would much rather you beat me up and then we

847
00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:28,920
Speaker 2: can resolve it. So a lot of people don't like conflict.

848
00:47:28,920 --> 00:47:32,720
Speaker 2: I get it. I'm I'm here for it.

849
00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:38,080
Speaker 1: You're you and I are both sort of in this

850
00:47:39,080 --> 00:47:43,560
Speaker 1: nether world that's moved, the traditional media meets this new media.

851
00:47:43,719 --> 00:47:46,960
Speaker 1: And I look at sort of on the news side

852
00:47:47,120 --> 00:47:50,560
Speaker 1: that the three cables, the four net the really the

853
00:47:50,600 --> 00:47:54,880
Speaker 1: three networks, Fox doesn't really do do sort of news

854
00:47:54,880 --> 00:47:58,960
Speaker 1: on a national basis on the broadcast side, and I'm

855
00:47:59,000 --> 00:48:01,760
Speaker 1: sure you'd look at the same they all seem less

856
00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:08,400
Speaker 1: relevant collectively, and yet there's still something prestigious about them.

857
00:48:08,440 --> 00:48:10,560
Speaker 1: Where do you how do you where do you put

858
00:48:10,600 --> 00:48:14,080
Speaker 1: Fox in ESPN now on that level of prestige today

859
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:15,640
Speaker 1: versus where they were a decade ago.

860
00:48:16,320 --> 00:48:20,200
Speaker 2: Well, listen in twenty twenty nine. I mean the NFL

861
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:22,919
Speaker 2: now owns a part of ESPN and owns a part

862
00:48:22,960 --> 00:48:26,440
Speaker 2: of like I guess CBS or Paramount and Amazon and

863
00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:31,479
Speaker 2: Netflix aren't going away. So Fox is the little guy

864
00:48:31,640 --> 00:48:34,600
Speaker 2: compared to a lot of these you know, bohemos. But

865
00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:37,920
Speaker 2: Fox Fox is like what you would I remember when

866
00:48:37,960 --> 00:48:40,919
Speaker 2: I was in Connecticut and there was a place called

867
00:48:41,040 --> 00:48:44,080
Speaker 2: Avon Old Farms. It was it was a prep school

868
00:48:44,280 --> 00:48:50,200
Speaker 2: for boys, and the people who sent sometimes troubled young men,

869
00:48:50,760 --> 00:48:54,520
Speaker 2: and they always said they do boys right right, it

870
00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:57,359
Speaker 2: was all boys. You had to compete in the sport.

871
00:48:57,920 --> 00:49:03,160
Speaker 2: Fox does marketing sports well, I mean Fox Weather, Fox News, Searchlight,

872
00:49:03,520 --> 00:49:07,520
Speaker 2: that small independent I mean, they sold the region at

873
00:49:07,560 --> 00:49:11,640
Speaker 2: the perfect time. FS one will it will never be

874
00:49:11,680 --> 00:49:16,280
Speaker 2: the behemoth of ESPN. But I have never been managed

875
00:49:16,840 --> 00:49:24,120
Speaker 2: more appropriately, more stridently. I love my partnership with Fox.

876
00:49:24,360 --> 00:49:30,400
Speaker 2: They It's almost like Fox News creates an umbrella that

877
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:33,360
Speaker 2: we can all play under it. They've dealt with controversy,

878
00:49:33,560 --> 00:49:37,120
Speaker 2: They've dealt with the critics hating them. So at ESPN,

879
00:49:37,200 --> 00:49:40,680
Speaker 2: you know, Disney is Beauty and the Beast, you know,

880
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:46,560
Speaker 2: Fox's the Simpsons, Foxes, Fox they can handle it. So

881
00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:51,000
Speaker 2: they're just an incredible partner for me. I've never First

882
00:49:51,000 --> 00:49:53,719
Speaker 2: of all, I've never worked anywhere where anybody's told me

883
00:49:53,760 --> 00:49:55,800
Speaker 2: what to say. There was an incident with the Masters

884
00:49:55,800 --> 00:50:00,680
Speaker 2: and Martha Burke ESPN had like Thursday Friday. They sat

885
00:50:00,719 --> 00:50:03,160
Speaker 2: me down and they're like, Okay, you don't have to

886
00:50:03,200 --> 00:50:06,160
Speaker 2: avoid it. We'd really appreciated it you did, and I said, guys,

887
00:50:06,200 --> 00:50:07,879
Speaker 2: I've done my prep and it's not in the show.

888
00:50:08,000 --> 00:50:10,360
Speaker 2: I don't think my audience cares. So that was the

889
00:50:10,400 --> 00:50:13,560
Speaker 2: only day. So I've never dealt with that. But I like,

890
00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:17,839
Speaker 2: I like a corporate partner. I heart. I mean, they

891
00:50:17,840 --> 00:50:21,080
Speaker 2: had Rush Limbaugh, they have Sean Hannity, So my corporate partners,

892
00:50:21,960 --> 00:50:25,440
Speaker 2: they really allow me to just be me as you know.

893
00:50:25,760 --> 00:50:29,120
Speaker 2: That's not always the case. I mean, you were viewed

894
00:50:29,920 --> 00:50:33,200
Speaker 2: and you handled it, but because you would push back

895
00:50:33,760 --> 00:50:36,920
Speaker 2: on the left, sometime you were almost viewed as controversial,

896
00:50:37,480 --> 00:50:41,279
Speaker 2: and it's like now, thank god NBC is there for it.

897
00:50:41,320 --> 00:50:47,120
Speaker 2: But I mean, I think that balance with the podcasting explosion.

898
00:50:48,200 --> 00:50:50,960
Speaker 2: I think our bosses face a lot of pressure and

899
00:50:51,040 --> 00:50:52,799
Speaker 2: take a lot of calls that we're not aware of.

900
00:50:53,040 --> 00:50:56,760
Speaker 2: Maybe I'm rambling here, but I mean I feel like Fox,

901
00:50:56,880 --> 00:51:01,000
Speaker 2: if they ever got calls or iHeart, they'd have my back.

902
00:51:01,520 --> 00:51:04,239
Speaker 2: I have total freedom so I like that corporate partnership.

903
00:51:13,080 --> 00:51:15,839
Speaker 1: Well, but as you point out, they've had success sort

904
00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:20,120
Speaker 1: of weathering controversial storms and in some ways thriving because

905
00:51:20,120 --> 00:51:23,560
Speaker 1: of it, not inessent right like, And that's sort of

906
00:51:23,560 --> 00:51:25,719
Speaker 1: a different and I think it tells and you're right

907
00:51:25,840 --> 00:51:30,240
Speaker 1: that that's why we're all curious how's Disney and ESPN

908
00:51:30,320 --> 00:51:31,040
Speaker 1: going to handle all this?

909
00:51:31,200 --> 00:51:31,359
Speaker 2: Right?

910
00:51:31,360 --> 00:51:34,720
Speaker 1: Because there's always the question, and that was always the issue,

911
00:51:34,760 --> 00:51:38,040
Speaker 1: you know, does Comcast matter more than NBC?

912
00:51:38,239 --> 00:51:41,520
Speaker 2: Right? Like? When does the parents care too much? With Fox?

913
00:51:41,640 --> 00:51:44,480
Speaker 1: They're their own parent. But the question I have, and

914
00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:47,760
Speaker 1: this is where I don't think people realize what's coming.

915
00:51:47,880 --> 00:51:50,440
Speaker 1: You brought up twenty twenty nine. The NFL is going

916
00:51:50,480 --> 00:51:56,120
Speaker 1: to get its essentially get the early and what this

917
00:51:56,520 --> 00:51:58,759
Speaker 1: is going to mean for the information ecosystem. Right, I'm

918
00:51:58,760 --> 00:52:01,320
Speaker 1: sitting here trying to figure out how to repair local news,

919
00:52:01,600 --> 00:52:04,239
Speaker 1: and I think in all these different markets, you're going

920
00:52:04,280 --> 00:52:07,880
Speaker 1: to see this collapse of the affiliate system, right. And

921
00:52:07,960 --> 00:52:12,800
Speaker 1: I don't know if CBS and Fox can can match

922
00:52:12,960 --> 00:52:15,920
Speaker 1: the amount of money that Amazon and Netflix are going

923
00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:18,520
Speaker 1: to be able to poney up. Now here's my question.

924
00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:22,399
Speaker 1: You assume that Roger Goodell cares just enough about over

925
00:52:22,400 --> 00:52:26,959
Speaker 1: the air and free access to the NFL that he's

926
00:52:27,040 --> 00:52:30,520
Speaker 1: going to make sure CBS and Fox gets something.

927
00:52:31,120 --> 00:52:35,120
Speaker 2: Yes, because I think CBS and Fox are really good

928
00:52:35,800 --> 00:52:39,920
Speaker 2: at sports. I don't care if it's the Masters, the NFL,

929
00:52:40,160 --> 00:52:44,920
Speaker 2: March Madness, first class productions. Yeah. In fact, I believe

930
00:52:45,200 --> 00:52:50,040
Speaker 2: when Netflix, I believe, I mean Amazon rated our building

931
00:52:50,120 --> 00:52:52,040
Speaker 2: for many of their people to do football. And I

932
00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:55,880
Speaker 2: think hasn't Netflix used CBS production for some of their

933
00:52:55,920 --> 00:52:56,879
Speaker 2: sports stuff, Like.

934
00:52:56,840 --> 00:52:59,560
Speaker 1: One of them used CBS, one of them used NBC,

935
00:52:59,719 --> 00:53:01,920
Speaker 1: one of them using But yeah, see those three have

936
00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:04,840
Speaker 1: been sort of the the vendors, if you will, for

937
00:53:04,920 --> 00:53:05,360
Speaker 1: the stream.

938
00:53:05,520 --> 00:53:08,560
Speaker 2: Yes, so I and I think Roger Goodell realizes what's

939
00:53:08,600 --> 00:53:12,360
Speaker 2: the average age of a viewer? Well, it's pretty I

940
00:53:12,360 --> 00:53:15,840
Speaker 2: mean I saw Stephen Colbert's number was sixty eight and

941
00:53:15,880 --> 00:53:19,399
Speaker 2: I'm thinking at that hour, what so.

942
00:53:19,719 --> 00:53:23,840
Speaker 1: That's all about watching Colin. That's all that's watching linear television.

943
00:53:24,440 --> 00:53:27,840
Speaker 1: I mean, but this is the hell has a value sure,

944
00:53:28,239 --> 00:53:29,440
Speaker 1: but not to the advertiser.

945
00:53:31,440 --> 00:53:33,440
Speaker 2: Yeah. My dad and I used to talk about that.

946
00:53:34,600 --> 00:53:36,440
Speaker 2: I you know, my dad used to say something. He

947
00:53:36,520 --> 00:53:40,680
Speaker 2: used to always say, I finally get discounts and now

948
00:53:40,719 --> 00:53:43,439
Speaker 2: I have all my money. He goes, God, I'm gonna

949
00:53:43,520 --> 00:53:45,680
Speaker 2: use all these discounts at twenty eight when I was

950
00:53:45,680 --> 00:53:49,239
Speaker 2: a young optavatrist right, And I mean, you see these, chuck,

951
00:53:49,280 --> 00:53:51,480
Speaker 2: You see these stories regularly. I just saw another one.

952
00:53:51,520 --> 00:53:53,600
Speaker 2: I think it was Wall Street Journal. The baby boomers

953
00:53:53,640 --> 00:53:56,800
Speaker 2: are literally living a separate life than the rest of America.

954
00:53:57,120 --> 00:54:00,520
Speaker 2: They've got all the money, and so those have to

955
00:54:00,560 --> 00:54:03,319
Speaker 2: be attractive people to advertisers at some level. Their kids

956
00:54:03,320 --> 00:54:06,000
Speaker 2: are complaining. I mean, I help all my kids with rent.

957
00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:08,560
Speaker 2: Now I don't subsidence, you know, I don't. I don't

958
00:54:08,600 --> 00:54:11,000
Speaker 2: pay it. But my kids are in Los Angeles, and

959
00:54:11,040 --> 00:54:14,040
Speaker 2: my kids are going to be in New York or Chicago.

960
00:54:14,520 --> 00:54:17,920
Speaker 2: So I think the I think the boomers are we

961
00:54:18,000 --> 00:54:22,200
Speaker 2: can always roll at the you know, I roll that right.

962
00:54:22,320 --> 00:54:26,879
Speaker 2: They are the richest generation, and with that, I buy

963
00:54:26,920 --> 00:54:29,400
Speaker 2: a lot of things. My wife and I are consumers.

964
00:54:29,719 --> 00:54:32,200
Speaker 2: I think I'm valuable. I'm in my sixties now I'm

965
00:54:32,320 --> 00:54:37,080
Speaker 2: valuable as a consumer. You are you're you consider yourself

966
00:54:37,120 --> 00:54:42,879
Speaker 2: gen X or boomer probably boomer probably boom. Interesting, Wow,

967
00:54:42,880 --> 00:54:45,520
Speaker 2: what do you consider yourself? Oh, I'm hard of gen X.

968
00:54:45,640 --> 00:54:46,719
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm seventy two.

969
00:54:46,840 --> 00:54:50,520
Speaker 1: So I'm like, literally, you know halfway we're the forgotten generation.

970
00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:53,880
Speaker 1: And I just find it interesting that you know it is.

971
00:54:54,120 --> 00:54:57,800
Speaker 1: It is like I consider Obama more X than Boomer.

972
00:54:58,520 --> 00:54:59,319
Speaker 2: Yes I have.

973
00:54:59,440 --> 00:55:00,920
Speaker 1: I I sort of look at it is, how did

974
00:55:00,960 --> 00:55:02,959
Speaker 1: you grow up? My mother grew up with a black

975
00:55:03,040 --> 00:55:05,440
Speaker 1: The first television sheet they got was black and white.

976
00:55:05,800 --> 00:55:10,440
Speaker 1: I promise you right it was. You know, my childhood

977
00:55:10,440 --> 00:55:12,200
Speaker 1: had a color TV in it. Not all the way,

978
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:15,960
Speaker 1: not at the beginning, but that was right. So, and

979
00:55:16,040 --> 00:55:19,080
Speaker 1: I think Obama, if you didn't, if you weren't eighteen

980
00:55:19,120 --> 00:55:20,879
Speaker 1: at any time during the Vietnam War, to me, you're

981
00:55:20,880 --> 00:55:23,680
Speaker 1: not a Boomer. And Obama wasn't, you know. So I

982
00:55:23,680 --> 00:55:28,080
Speaker 1: always find the early sixties folks, you know, the boomers

983
00:55:28,120 --> 00:55:31,040
Speaker 1: this we've decided it's a twenty year generation. For whatever reason,

984
00:55:31,120 --> 00:55:33,319
Speaker 1: Gen X gets fifteen years. I've always tried to figure

985
00:55:33,360 --> 00:55:33,680
Speaker 1: that out.

986
00:55:34,719 --> 00:55:35,839
Speaker 2: Are you bitter about it?

987
00:55:36,440 --> 00:55:39,920
Speaker 1: Well, because we lost the leadership fight. The Boomers stayed

988
00:55:40,040 --> 00:55:42,879
Speaker 1: in too long, right, I mean, look at how many

989
00:55:42,920 --> 00:55:46,560
Speaker 1: Boomer presidents and throwing Biden as silent generation. I mean,

990
00:55:47,080 --> 00:55:51,040
Speaker 1: you know, one of my favorite stats is that George W. Bush,

991
00:55:51,080 --> 00:55:54,919
Speaker 1: Bill Clinton and Donald Trump were all born ninety days

992
00:55:55,239 --> 00:55:58,160
Speaker 1: I think seventy five days apart in nineteen forty six.

993
00:55:59,320 --> 00:56:01,520
Speaker 1: And these president and sies have gone from nineteen ninety

994
00:56:01,520 --> 00:56:04,520
Speaker 1: two to we're now going to go to twenty twenty eight. Right,

995
00:56:04,640 --> 00:56:06,920
Speaker 1: that is gen x isn't going to get a shot, right,

996
00:56:06,920 --> 00:56:08,840
Speaker 1: Millennials are going to grab the presidency after that.

997
00:56:11,200 --> 00:56:14,800
Speaker 2: You know, you know, I don't talk a lot of politics,

998
00:56:14,800 --> 00:56:18,200
Speaker 2: but I consume a ton of it. And I mean,

999
00:56:18,239 --> 00:56:20,960
Speaker 2: nobody wants to watch Bill Maherer give football picks, and

1000
00:56:21,000 --> 00:56:25,560
Speaker 2: I don't think anybody really cares deeply about my political opinion.

1001
00:56:25,600 --> 00:56:28,040
Speaker 2: Stephen A. Smith has moved into it, which I he's

1002
00:56:28,080 --> 00:56:30,960
Speaker 2: a friend and I'm happy for him, but I consume

1003
00:56:31,000 --> 00:56:31,640
Speaker 2: a ton of it.

1004
00:56:32,400 --> 00:56:35,080
Speaker 1: I can I confess that I resents the wrong word.

1005
00:56:35,160 --> 00:56:37,680
Speaker 1: I kind of feel I feel like Stephen A. Smith

1006
00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:39,640
Speaker 1: is using politics and I don't like it.

1007
00:56:39,920 --> 00:56:43,080
Speaker 2: But that's just you're That's what I've had to me. Yeah, no,

1008
00:56:43,160 --> 00:56:48,439
Speaker 2: I've had people say that to me. He didn't ask

1009
00:56:48,480 --> 00:56:51,520
Speaker 2: my opinion. I said on a text to him not

1010
00:56:51,560 --> 00:56:55,480
Speaker 2: long ago. I said, never forget there are winners and

1011
00:56:55,520 --> 00:56:58,360
Speaker 2: losers in sports, and that's a great thing. You set goals.

1012
00:56:58,400 --> 00:57:02,200
Speaker 2: You finish first, you get a trophy. Nobody wins. Even

1013
00:57:02,239 --> 00:57:06,080
Speaker 2: if your policies were great, will somebody will fabricate or

1014
00:57:06,120 --> 00:57:09,319
Speaker 2: marginalize it. There are no winners. Long term. You can

1015
00:57:09,360 --> 00:57:12,759
Speaker 2: be the most popular president. Eight years later in a podcast,

1016
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:16,200
Speaker 2: you will be deemed wildly controversial. And I said, never

1017
00:57:16,280 --> 00:57:19,960
Speaker 2: forget is that sports is a community and politics is

1018
00:57:19,960 --> 00:57:22,960
Speaker 2: a shark tank. And he's like, okay, I'll remember that.

1019
00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:26,480
Speaker 2: The next day he was talking politics. I do. I

1020
00:57:26,560 --> 00:57:29,520
Speaker 2: like the joy and the energy, and in sports it's

1021
00:57:29,600 --> 00:57:34,040
Speaker 2: less gray first place, last winner, loser, Heisman runner up.

1022
00:57:34,480 --> 00:57:37,200
Speaker 1: Well, it's also a pure meritocracy. It's I mean, we

1023
00:57:37,240 --> 00:57:39,960
Speaker 1: can it's more of a meritocracy than any other people.

1024
00:57:40,800 --> 00:57:45,760
Speaker 2: Yeah. So, but I consume a ton of politics and

1025
00:57:45,800 --> 00:57:49,200
Speaker 2: find it fascinating. It's the first stuff I read is

1026
00:57:49,240 --> 00:57:52,280
Speaker 2: the Times, the Journal and the Atlantic. I missed the

1027
00:57:52,360 --> 00:57:52,800
Speaker 2: joy of it.

1028
00:57:52,840 --> 00:57:54,200
Speaker 1: I used to say that, you know, I used to

1029
00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:57,120
Speaker 1: say I covered I was Hubert Heminfriest memoir was called

1030
00:57:57,120 --> 00:57:59,800
Speaker 1: the Politics a joy and I always loved that, which

1031
00:57:59,880 --> 00:58:03,400
Speaker 1: is you know, hey, look it's you know, I enjoy

1032
00:58:03,520 --> 00:58:07,000
Speaker 1: I still enjoy it. Unfortunately now, I mean, you know,

1033
00:58:07,560 --> 00:58:12,200
Speaker 1: the way Trump practices it. It has made it less joyful. Right,

1034
00:58:12,280 --> 00:58:15,120
Speaker 1: It has just sucked the joy out of it, both

1035
00:58:15,200 --> 00:58:18,479
Speaker 1: left and right in different ways. And you know, try

1036
00:58:18,520 --> 00:58:20,640
Speaker 1: having a light moment in a political show and it's

1037
00:58:20,680 --> 00:58:22,840
Speaker 1: like you're not being serious or you're you know, it

1038
00:58:22,880 --> 00:58:25,400
Speaker 1: is a it has become what used to be really

1039
00:58:25,440 --> 00:58:31,200
Speaker 1: easy to sort of have some levity in a political discussion.

1040
00:58:32,120 --> 00:58:34,520
Speaker 1: It's been really hard in the Trump era. You know,

1041
00:58:34,600 --> 00:58:37,880
Speaker 1: look look at political comedians. They have a hard time. Yeah,

1042
00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:40,400
Speaker 1: I mean didn't have any problem with political comedians from

1043
00:58:40,440 --> 00:58:43,960
Speaker 1: twenty fifteen, you know, before twenty fifteen, and here we

1044
00:58:44,000 --> 00:58:44,440
Speaker 1: are today.

1045
00:58:45,040 --> 00:58:47,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think mar and John Stewart have done a

1046
00:58:47,560 --> 00:58:51,439
Speaker 2: pretty good job to still make me laugh while they

1047
00:58:51,480 --> 00:58:54,880
Speaker 2: deliver it. But it's hard, and it's it's just a

1048
00:58:54,920 --> 00:59:00,160
Speaker 2: different world. I mean, listen, I knew it was different when,

1049
00:59:01,280 --> 00:59:03,120
Speaker 2: regardless of what you think of Trump, when he started

1050
00:59:03,120 --> 00:59:06,640
Speaker 2: weaponizing it was called Twitter, and I just remember thinking,

1051
00:59:06,960 --> 00:59:11,160
Speaker 2: wait a minute, that's this is a president. And from

1052
00:59:11,160 --> 00:59:14,120
Speaker 2: that moment on, it was like fair game. He would

1053
00:59:14,120 --> 00:59:17,280
Speaker 2: go after you, you could go after him. And I

1054
00:59:17,400 --> 00:59:19,720
Speaker 2: always looked at that as I'm not sure how comfortable

1055
00:59:19,760 --> 00:59:22,440
Speaker 2: I am with it, But apparently lots of people in

1056
00:59:22,520 --> 00:59:26,320
Speaker 2: politics are, and like everybody else, I try not to

1057
00:59:26,360 --> 00:59:30,600
Speaker 2: go I try to really monitor my usage. But I

1058
00:59:30,600 --> 00:59:33,240
Speaker 2: think we're I think society is a little more coarse

1059
00:59:33,320 --> 00:59:36,480
Speaker 2: than it used to be. But I also I also think, Chuck,

1060
00:59:36,760 --> 00:59:40,080
Speaker 2: this is there is a distinction we do forget. You know,

1061
00:59:40,280 --> 00:59:44,400
Speaker 2: I watch a lot of true crime, and you know,

1062
00:59:44,440 --> 00:59:48,040
Speaker 2: we forget there was. There are fewer serial killers today

1063
00:59:48,040 --> 00:59:50,440
Speaker 2: than in the sixties, seventies, eighties people used to hitchhike,

1064
00:59:50,840 --> 00:59:54,000
Speaker 2: like there are parts of our society that are much

1065
00:59:54,120 --> 00:59:56,400
Speaker 2: less course. I mean, AI is going to give us

1066
00:59:56,480 --> 00:59:59,120
Speaker 2: medical advances. People will not die in pain as much

1067
00:59:59,440 --> 01:00:02,000
Speaker 2: this point or for the next rest of our lives.

1068
01:00:02,280 --> 01:00:04,280
Speaker 2: So I do think sometimes if I have a criticism

1069
01:00:04,360 --> 01:00:08,080
Speaker 2: of the media, that it's sometimes a bit neurotic and

1070
01:00:08,120 --> 01:00:11,720
Speaker 2: a bit hyperbolic. And especially as the media has gotten

1071
01:00:12,080 --> 01:00:14,680
Speaker 2: you say, we're old guys. The media is younger because

1072
01:00:14,680 --> 01:00:18,240
Speaker 2: they're cheaper, and as it's become more corporatized, you know,

1073
01:00:18,280 --> 01:00:21,160
Speaker 2: you don't want to pay that anchor six million, eight million,

1074
01:00:21,200 --> 01:00:23,880
Speaker 2: You'd rather pay eight hundred thousand. So I think my

1075
01:00:23,960 --> 01:00:27,240
Speaker 2: biggest criticism on all of this, what did Obama say

1076
01:00:27,280 --> 01:00:31,160
Speaker 2: about Trump. He's not the cause, he's the is a symptom. Yeah,

1077
01:00:31,200 --> 01:00:33,560
Speaker 2: He's a symptom. And I just think it's part of

1078
01:00:33,640 --> 01:00:38,240
Speaker 2: it that the media often inflames something. I mean, the

1079
01:00:38,240 --> 01:00:41,560
Speaker 2: Sydney Sweeney's note non story. It really is a non story,

1080
01:00:41,640 --> 01:00:43,320
Speaker 2: and the media fed into it.

1081
01:00:43,720 --> 01:00:46,240
Speaker 1: Okay, let me ask you this. It's this is a

1082
01:00:46,240 --> 01:00:50,000
Speaker 1: pet peeve of mine, the phrase the media. I get

1083
01:00:50,000 --> 01:00:55,000
Speaker 1: this the media. Yeah, who's the media? When you say

1084
01:00:55,000 --> 01:00:57,439
Speaker 1: the media, what are you referring to? Like, I think

1085
01:00:57,480 --> 01:00:59,160
Speaker 1: I know, right Like, I'm not going to sit here

1086
01:00:59,160 --> 01:01:01,440
Speaker 1: and say it, but i'd sit there and say, you know,

1087
01:01:01,480 --> 01:01:03,560
Speaker 1: I get this stuff the media, and I'm like, hey man,

1088
01:01:04,360 --> 01:01:05,480
Speaker 1: Fox is the media.

1089
01:01:06,080 --> 01:01:07,560
Speaker 2: You know, YouTube's the media.

1090
01:01:07,640 --> 01:01:10,480
Speaker 1: There's a lot of I mean, what you know it is, no,

1091
01:01:10,720 --> 01:01:13,440
Speaker 1: it's you know, it's harder for me to accept the

1092
01:01:13,480 --> 01:01:17,440
Speaker 1: premise of quote unquote. Was Sydney Sweeney a story that

1093
01:01:18,120 --> 01:01:21,840
Speaker 1: mainstream media overreacted and manufactured or was it a right

1094
01:01:21,920 --> 01:01:26,080
Speaker 1: wing meme that was trolling left wingers who I'd never

1095
01:01:26,160 --> 01:01:28,600
Speaker 1: heard of, who they elevated and turned it into a

1096
01:01:28,680 --> 01:01:31,320
Speaker 1: left right thing right like? And by the way, it's

1097
01:01:31,360 --> 01:01:34,520
Speaker 1: a little bit of both. Yeah, I think the media.

1098
01:01:36,000 --> 01:01:40,160
Speaker 1: Remember when we were young, it's expanded. When we were young.

1099
01:01:40,960 --> 01:01:43,080
Speaker 2: There was no sports talk radio when I was fifteen,

1100
01:01:43,720 --> 01:01:45,560
Speaker 2: I mean maybe WIPU wfan.

1101
01:01:45,640 --> 01:01:48,920
Speaker 1: I remember when wfan happened. Everybody's like, oh, this is

1102
01:01:48,960 --> 01:01:51,080
Speaker 1: not going to work. Remember all sports all the time.

1103
01:01:51,480 --> 01:01:54,160
Speaker 1: And I remember as a I was probably fifteen or sixteen.

1104
01:01:54,160 --> 01:01:57,720
Speaker 1: What was that eighty four eighty five, right, And I

1105
01:01:57,760 --> 01:02:00,000
Speaker 1: remember being so jealous. Oh my god, they have an

1106
01:02:00,080 --> 01:02:02,760
Speaker 1: all sports radio station. I hope Miami gets one. That's

1107
01:02:02,800 --> 01:02:05,600
Speaker 1: all I cared about it. Yes, I wanted what New

1108
01:02:05,680 --> 01:02:07,280
Speaker 1: York had that double a.

1109
01:02:07,640 --> 01:02:10,720
Speaker 2: I wanted that. You know, even though wfan was the

1110
01:02:10,760 --> 01:02:12,960
Speaker 2: first big one, I miss did the mornings for years.

1111
01:02:12,960 --> 01:02:16,400
Speaker 2: They wouldn't even give the mornings to sports. They're like,

1112
01:02:16,480 --> 01:02:18,280
Speaker 2: I must will make the money. You guys go yell

1113
01:02:18,280 --> 01:02:20,760
Speaker 2: at each other in the afternoon, right, So I think,

1114
01:02:20,800 --> 01:02:23,320
Speaker 2: what But it used to be when I was growing up,

1115
01:02:23,360 --> 01:02:25,320
Speaker 2: there was no sports talk radio, so the fan had

1116
01:02:25,760 --> 01:02:28,479
Speaker 2: little chance for an opinion. In fact, where the fan

1117
01:02:28,680 --> 01:02:31,000
Speaker 2: really did well was letters to the editor in your

1118
01:02:31,040 --> 01:02:34,360
Speaker 2: local sports section. And by the way, some of the

1119
01:02:34,400 --> 01:02:38,240
Speaker 2: greatest lines ever produced in a newspaper were fans writing

1120
01:02:38,360 --> 01:02:41,080
Speaker 2: letters to the editor on Saturday in the La Times

1121
01:02:41,160 --> 01:02:43,160
Speaker 2: because it's the city of comedy writers. I mean, it

1122
01:02:43,200 --> 01:02:46,280
Speaker 2: was just I would read it and think I could

1123
01:02:46,360 --> 01:02:48,120
Speaker 2: just start a sports section on the people who write

1124
01:02:48,160 --> 01:02:50,720
Speaker 2: letters to the sports section in the La Times. But

1125
01:02:50,720 --> 01:02:53,000
Speaker 2: what I think has happened with the media, it's expanded.

1126
01:02:53,280 --> 01:02:57,439
Speaker 2: Podcasting now counts as media, fans now blogs now count

1127
01:02:57,440 --> 01:02:59,560
Speaker 2: as me. So I think it's it's not blurred, it's

1128
01:02:59,600 --> 01:03:02,880
Speaker 2: just so I probably long, but I tend to look

1129
01:03:02,920 --> 01:03:06,200
Speaker 2: at the media as more corporate and more established. I

1130
01:03:06,200 --> 01:03:09,040
Speaker 2: think the podcasters have their say, but I don't think

1131
01:03:09,080 --> 01:03:11,320
Speaker 2: it's I don't think it's as fact checked. They don't

1132
01:03:11,360 --> 01:03:14,920
Speaker 2: have the assignment desk. Who are they called out by?

1133
01:03:15,040 --> 01:03:19,960
Speaker 2: You're often you're often motivated to be blurry and be

1134
01:03:20,080 --> 01:03:23,120
Speaker 2: conspiratorial where in our business, like you just I just

1135
01:03:23,240 --> 01:03:25,840
Speaker 2: can't make stuff up. I can make a mistake, but

1136
01:03:25,880 --> 01:03:29,040
Speaker 2: I can't make stuff up on f s one. Well,

1137
01:03:29,080 --> 01:03:30,520
Speaker 2: I would think you don't want to make stuff up

1138
01:03:30,520 --> 01:03:31,120
Speaker 2: anywhere you are.

1139
01:03:31,160 --> 01:03:34,240
Speaker 1: That's right, that's right, right, It shouldn't really matter. I mean,

1140
01:03:34,240 --> 01:03:36,320
Speaker 1: in some ways, the only thing that matters is that

1141
01:03:36,520 --> 01:03:39,600
Speaker 1: you know we came from an environment that you know

1142
01:03:39,800 --> 01:03:43,480
Speaker 1: put in all these guardrails, and we've learned how to

1143
01:03:43,640 --> 01:03:47,040
Speaker 1: use those guardrails to make sure we're producing content that

1144
01:03:47,160 --> 01:03:48,640
Speaker 1: isn't you know that, frankly.

1145
01:03:48,400 --> 01:03:50,720
Speaker 2: Is is consumable.

1146
01:03:51,120 --> 01:03:53,959
Speaker 1: You know, it's honest, it's transparent, it's you know, fact checked,

1147
01:03:53,960 --> 01:03:57,280
Speaker 1: et cetera. So in that sense, I think that's probably

1148
01:03:57,320 --> 01:03:59,720
Speaker 1: going to be a distinction going forward, is that they'll

1149
01:03:59,720 --> 01:04:02,480
Speaker 1: be the in the world of YouTube, there are those that,

1150
01:04:02,560 --> 01:04:07,360
Speaker 1: you know that sort of have some sort of fact

1151
01:04:07,440 --> 01:04:09,880
Speaker 1: checking or whatever you want to call it, versus those

1152
01:04:09,920 --> 01:04:11,040
Speaker 1: that'll be less professional.

1153
01:04:12,360 --> 01:04:17,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think you know how the saying is

1154
01:04:17,160 --> 01:04:22,400
Speaker 2: separate the art from the artists, right, I kind of

1155
01:04:22,440 --> 01:04:28,200
Speaker 2: consider it media and casual media, like there is a

1156
01:04:28,280 --> 01:04:34,600
Speaker 2: Chuck Todd, or there is NBC or their CNN whether

1157
01:04:34,640 --> 01:04:36,840
Speaker 2: I agree with you know, they lean left, they lean right.

1158
01:04:37,120 --> 01:04:39,720
Speaker 2: There is what I would call like traditional media, and

1159
01:04:39,760 --> 01:04:42,600
Speaker 2: then they're sort of like casual media, which is the

1160
01:04:42,640 --> 01:04:45,760
Speaker 2: standards are different. But I do think they present is

1161
01:04:46,080 --> 01:04:50,560
Speaker 2: interesting ideas. I mean, I listen to podcasts, I watch TikTok,

1162
01:04:51,360 --> 01:04:53,520
Speaker 2: I have been inspired. It makes me think of a rant.

1163
01:04:53,560 --> 01:04:56,840
Speaker 2: It jars something. So I'm not real hyper critical of it.

1164
01:04:56,880 --> 01:05:00,200
Speaker 2: I just think I'm not going to source them. I

1165
01:05:00,200 --> 01:05:02,919
Speaker 2: don't necessarily trust them, but I will be honest Chuck

1166
01:05:03,840 --> 01:05:08,280
Speaker 2: covid To today. I read even the New York Times

1167
01:05:08,680 --> 01:05:12,840
Speaker 2: and The Atlantic, not cynically, but with more suspicion. I

1168
01:05:12,960 --> 01:05:18,400
Speaker 2: don't I don't covid To today. I don't trust traditional media.

1169
01:05:18,440 --> 01:05:20,080
Speaker 2: And I always thought I was a kind of left

1170
01:05:20,160 --> 01:05:24,720
Speaker 2: leaning moderate, fiscal moderate conservative. Is I don't look at

1171
01:05:24,720 --> 01:05:28,040
Speaker 2: the traditional media that's supposed to be fact based. I

1172
01:05:28,160 --> 01:05:29,960
Speaker 2: don't look at it quite the same as I used to.

1173
01:05:30,120 --> 01:05:33,000
Speaker 2: I still consume it, but I feel differently when I'm

1174
01:05:33,080 --> 01:05:33,480
Speaker 2: doing it.

1175
01:05:34,040 --> 01:05:38,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've always sort of I've always been journalists specific.

1176
01:05:38,480 --> 01:05:41,600
Speaker 1: You know, I know how The Times puts their stuff together,

1177
01:05:41,640 --> 01:05:44,880
Speaker 1: and I know certain reporters how they work and versus

1178
01:05:44,920 --> 01:05:48,120
Speaker 1: others and so. But I had the luxury of knowing

1179
01:05:48,120 --> 01:05:50,880
Speaker 1: that right because I was in I was in press

1180
01:05:50,920 --> 01:05:53,280
Speaker 1: press scrumbs with them. I know how they operate and

1181
01:05:53,320 --> 01:05:55,200
Speaker 1: sort of, you know, I would cherry pick and and

1182
01:05:55,800 --> 01:05:59,600
Speaker 1: you would sit there. And I've never I've always said,

1183
01:05:59,680 --> 01:06:02,960
Speaker 1: you know, there isn't really a heavy hand. It really

1184
01:06:03,040 --> 01:06:06,120
Speaker 1: is individual. But you do get group think, right, you

1185
01:06:06,200 --> 01:06:09,200
Speaker 1: do see how the group think happens and all of that.

1186
01:06:09,320 --> 01:06:15,400
Speaker 1: But I've always been tell me the byline and I'll

1187
01:06:15,400 --> 01:06:18,160
Speaker 1: know the angle to the story, you know. And I

1188
01:06:18,200 --> 01:06:22,240
Speaker 1: still feel that way, and I read that way a lot.

1189
01:06:22,320 --> 01:06:24,439
Speaker 1: I read The Atlantic that way, I read the Journal

1190
01:06:24,520 --> 01:06:26,800
Speaker 1: that way. I read National Review that way. I read

1191
01:06:26,840 --> 01:06:30,760
Speaker 1: you know, I have this sort of very bipartisan diet

1192
01:06:30,760 --> 01:06:33,040
Speaker 1: out of defense, right, I want to know. I got

1193
01:06:33,040 --> 01:06:35,400
Speaker 1: to hear what's happening. I got to feel like I

1194
01:06:35,480 --> 01:06:38,400
Speaker 1: do that, and I'll tell you this. It's funny you

1195
01:06:38,440 --> 01:06:43,480
Speaker 1: brought up Sidney Sweeney. I missed this meaning for whatever reason,

1196
01:06:43,560 --> 01:06:47,760
Speaker 1: it didn't penetrate my news feeds. And I thought, on

1197
01:06:47,760 --> 01:06:50,680
Speaker 1: one hand, the consumer in me was like, great, I

1198
01:06:50,720 --> 01:06:55,560
Speaker 1: didn't want to consume that story as a consumer. The

1199
01:06:55,640 --> 01:06:57,800
Speaker 1: media person in me said, well, I do need to

1200
01:06:57,880 --> 01:07:00,960
Speaker 1: know that story and how it And I was trying

1201
01:07:01,000 --> 01:07:04,040
Speaker 1: to figure out why didn't that story penetrate my news feeds?

1202
01:07:04,080 --> 01:07:06,480
Speaker 1: And so I've been that that sort of jarred me

1203
01:07:06,560 --> 01:07:10,920
Speaker 1: a little bit, like how did I miss this one?

1204
01:07:11,600 --> 01:07:14,960
Speaker 1: Do you worry about that that you're you're yes, you know,

1205
01:07:15,080 --> 01:07:18,200
Speaker 1: you're you're gonna you know, look, Trump just tweeted, tweeted

1206
01:07:18,200 --> 01:07:20,760
Speaker 1: at me the other day on something I said about

1207
01:07:20,840 --> 01:07:24,200
Speaker 1: him a month ago. I said it again to a

1208
01:07:24,280 --> 01:07:26,720
Speaker 1: conservative outlet and he saw it for the first time,

1209
01:07:27,200 --> 01:07:30,360
Speaker 1: and I thought, boy, I've written this, I've said this.

1210
01:07:31,080 --> 01:07:33,280
Speaker 1: He never saw it there, but he saw it over here.

1211
01:07:34,080 --> 01:07:38,280
Speaker 2: Wow, are we fragmented? You know? Right? I do worry

1212
01:07:38,320 --> 01:07:42,439
Speaker 2: about because I know I'm not online as much as

1213
01:07:42,640 --> 01:07:46,040
Speaker 2: a thirty six year old me. And so you know,

1214
01:07:46,120 --> 01:07:47,920
Speaker 2: one of it's not a trick, but one of the

1215
01:07:47,960 --> 01:07:52,360
Speaker 2: things I've done with my staffing is I always higher

1216
01:07:52,440 --> 01:07:55,760
Speaker 2: younger than me, especially no kids. You can stay up

1217
01:07:55,800 --> 01:07:58,200
Speaker 2: and watch all those games on a Saturday. My wife's

1218
01:07:58,240 --> 01:08:00,640
Speaker 2: not letting me watch six college football games. I get

1219
01:08:00,680 --> 01:08:02,840
Speaker 2: two and then I got to go to YouTube Sunday

1220
01:08:02,880 --> 01:08:05,920
Speaker 2: morning and watch them. So I've always loved a young

1221
01:08:05,960 --> 01:08:07,760
Speaker 2: you know, because I got to watch the game. So

1222
01:08:07,760 --> 01:08:11,000
Speaker 2: so I you know, I'm older, I've got kids, i

1223
01:08:11,040 --> 01:08:15,240
Speaker 2: got responsibilities, I've got my company. So I'm always I mean,

1224
01:08:15,520 --> 01:08:18,519
Speaker 2: thank God Chuck for YouTube. I take the train into work,

1225
01:08:18,680 --> 01:08:21,400
Speaker 2: that is thirty minutes to watch in YouTube. That's what

1226
01:08:21,439 --> 01:08:23,400
Speaker 2: I do. I sit and watch games and watch articles.

1227
01:08:24,240 --> 01:08:27,439
Speaker 2: Well it depends, like during the NBA playoffs, I don't

1228
01:08:27,439 --> 01:08:29,400
Speaker 2: get to watch all four, so I get to watch two,

1229
01:08:29,800 --> 01:08:31,599
Speaker 2: and then I got to catch up on the Orlando

1230
01:08:31,680 --> 01:08:35,280
Speaker 2: Magic Boston game because I was a dinner so you know,

1231
01:08:35,280 --> 01:08:38,519
Speaker 2: I watched the twenty two minute clip. So I have

1232
01:08:38,640 --> 01:08:42,720
Speaker 2: a very young staff and they and it's big on

1233
01:08:42,800 --> 01:08:45,640
Speaker 2: both the volume and FS one, and iHeart and I

1234
01:08:45,680 --> 01:08:47,760
Speaker 2: think I the youth people when I'm young. When I

1235
01:08:47,800 --> 01:08:50,200
Speaker 2: was younger and didn't have kids, I had more freedom

1236
01:08:50,240 --> 01:08:52,200
Speaker 2: to watch for as long as I wanted to. I

1237
01:08:52,200 --> 01:08:54,000
Speaker 2: would go out with my buddies all night long and

1238
01:08:54,040 --> 01:08:58,080
Speaker 2: close the place over beers watching my sixth NBA game.

1239
01:08:59,160 --> 01:09:01,920
Speaker 1: All right, let's I do want to start actually landing

1240
01:09:01,920 --> 01:09:03,280
Speaker 1: this plane. I know you're not going to be on

1241
01:09:03,320 --> 01:09:06,240
Speaker 1: here forever, so let's get into a little bit of

1242
01:09:07,400 --> 01:09:11,400
Speaker 1: actual sports here. What's your first love? What's your first

1243
01:09:11,400 --> 01:09:14,559
Speaker 1: sports love? What's like you know what I just I'm

1244
01:09:14,600 --> 01:09:17,000
Speaker 1: always going to be I'm going to know everything about

1245
01:09:17,000 --> 01:09:19,120
Speaker 1: this sport because I want to, regardless of whether I

1246
01:09:19,120 --> 01:09:19,960
Speaker 1: have to cover it or not.

1247
01:09:20,360 --> 01:09:23,080
Speaker 2: Well, college football baseball is the one I first fell

1248
01:09:23,120 --> 01:09:26,799
Speaker 2: in love with because it was really the national pastime

1249
01:09:27,080 --> 01:09:30,040
Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy two. I've always had a soft spot

1250
01:09:30,080 --> 01:09:33,559
Speaker 2: for the NBA because in the seventies the Portland trail

1251
01:09:33,560 --> 01:09:35,559
Speaker 2: Blazers and the Sonics won titles and I was an

1252
01:09:35,560 --> 01:09:39,280
Speaker 2: Newarost kid. You're right there. Yeah, so I've always been

1253
01:09:39,280 --> 01:09:41,400
Speaker 2: an NBA fan. I would say I'm morphed into an

1254
01:09:41,479 --> 01:09:45,960
Speaker 2: NFL fan. But I would say college football is special

1255
01:09:46,000 --> 01:09:49,880
Speaker 2: to me. It's the bands, it's the student sections. I

1256
01:09:49,920 --> 01:09:54,120
Speaker 2: grew up going to Husky Stadium, Apple Cups, Civil Wars,

1257
01:09:55,080 --> 01:09:57,280
Speaker 2: college football at its best. I mean, I said this

1258
01:09:57,320 --> 01:10:00,280
Speaker 2: today on the air. USC Texas maybe the best van

1259
01:10:00,320 --> 01:10:03,240
Speaker 2: I've ever been at. It was absolutely insane in two

1260
01:10:03,240 --> 01:10:05,760
Speaker 2: thousand and five, even in Los Angeles, which is distracted,

1261
01:10:05,880 --> 01:10:07,400
Speaker 2: it may have been the second coolest thing in the

1262
01:10:07,439 --> 01:10:11,200
Speaker 2: city or third coolest all year. It was insane. And

1263
01:10:11,680 --> 01:10:16,519
Speaker 2: so I think college football NFL is better for my business, right,

1264
01:10:17,800 --> 01:10:22,440
Speaker 2: Baseball is not great for my business. I have emerging

1265
01:10:22,640 --> 01:10:26,880
Speaker 2: I've like UFC more than most of my peers. I

1266
01:10:26,960 --> 01:10:30,040
Speaker 2: really love the World Cup. But I'd say college is

1267
01:10:30,080 --> 01:10:32,080
Speaker 2: the one that is. If I had a lot of

1268
01:10:32,160 --> 01:10:36,880
Speaker 2: choices like Texas, Ohio State, Yeah, will be as good

1269
01:10:36,880 --> 01:10:39,720
Speaker 2: a day as I can have for four hours. Yeah.

1270
01:10:40,320 --> 01:10:43,320
Speaker 1: Look, I'm a college football and baseball it's the same same,

1271
01:10:43,600 --> 01:10:46,439
Speaker 1: I mean, and I think you point out something that's important.

1272
01:10:46,439 --> 01:10:48,160
Speaker 2: It's sort of when do you become a sports fan?

1273
01:10:48,280 --> 01:10:51,280
Speaker 1: And you know, my first real sports memory is the

1274
01:10:51,320 --> 01:10:54,439
Speaker 1: seventy seven World Series Dodgers Yankees. My dad was a

1275
01:10:54,479 --> 01:10:57,760
Speaker 1: Dodger fan. My grandfather was a Yankees fan. And that's

1276
01:10:57,760 --> 01:10:59,800
Speaker 1: why my dad was a Dodger fan, because his father

1277
01:10:59,880 --> 01:11:02,840
Speaker 1: was the Yankees fan. Right like your father. Suddenly I'm

1278
01:11:02,840 --> 01:11:05,000
Speaker 1: a Dodger fan or was I'm more of a Nats

1279
01:11:05,000 --> 01:11:08,040
Speaker 1: fan now because my father was a Dodger fan. Right,

1280
01:11:08,200 --> 01:11:10,320
Speaker 1: So you either love the same teams as your dad,

1281
01:11:10,840 --> 01:11:13,000
Speaker 1: or you go with the opposite to annoy your dad, right,

1282
01:11:13,040 --> 01:11:15,880
Speaker 1: which is sort of what he did. And then I

1283
01:11:15,920 --> 01:11:19,679
Speaker 1: grew up in Miami during the greatest college football run

1284
01:11:19,880 --> 01:11:22,880
Speaker 1: outside of Alabama that any program has ever had, and

1285
01:11:23,640 --> 01:11:27,839
Speaker 1: it was I don't realize what I got to consume.

1286
01:11:27,880 --> 01:11:30,639
Speaker 1: We were season ticket holders. My family's been season ticket

1287
01:11:30,640 --> 01:11:34,040
Speaker 1: holders and Hurricanes going back to fifty eight. So I

1288
01:11:34,120 --> 01:11:35,880
Speaker 1: grew up going even when I didn't want to go

1289
01:11:35,920 --> 01:11:37,160
Speaker 1: as a three or four year old.

1290
01:11:37,640 --> 01:11:41,840
Speaker 2: And then the magic of Howard Snellenberger and it was

1291
01:11:42,000 --> 01:11:45,320
Speaker 2: just but still what's amazing on the lad that you

1292
01:11:45,360 --> 01:11:48,360
Speaker 2: know what's amazing about that dynasty, which shows you how

1293
01:11:48,439 --> 01:11:53,799
Speaker 2: much talent in Dadeen Broward County, whereas Saban's is all Bama's,

1294
01:11:53,840 --> 01:11:57,280
Speaker 2: all Saban or all Bear Bryant. Miami one was Schellenberger,

1295
01:11:57,400 --> 01:12:01,200
Speaker 2: Dennis Erickson, Jimmy Johnson, Butch Davis.

1296
01:12:01,400 --> 01:12:03,960
Speaker 1: The funny thing I always tell people is I tell him, yeah,

1297
01:12:04,000 --> 01:12:08,880
Speaker 1: and it's Dennis Erickson who has two h Like Schnellenberger

1298
01:12:08,960 --> 01:12:11,400
Speaker 1: only got one. Jimmy, everybody assumes he must have gotten

1299
01:12:11,439 --> 01:12:13,760
Speaker 1: more than one. No, he only got one. You know

1300
01:12:14,760 --> 01:12:15,719
Speaker 1: Erickson got two.

1301
01:12:16,439 --> 01:12:19,280
Speaker 2: Yeah. I would never got back down. Well, but Butch

1302
01:12:19,439 --> 01:12:23,799
Speaker 2: probably I would argue that one. Yeah, the most talented

1303
01:12:23,880 --> 01:12:28,200
Speaker 2: roster in Miami history may have been the Butch Butch

1304
01:12:28,280 --> 01:12:31,080
Speaker 2: had a roster. It was his last or second to

1305
01:12:31,160 --> 01:12:31,880
Speaker 2: last year, two.

1306
01:12:31,840 --> 01:12:34,040
Speaker 1: Thousand and the two thousand and one teams, both of

1307
01:12:34,080 --> 01:12:37,600
Speaker 1: them are the two of the Arguably there's more, probably

1308
01:12:37,640 --> 01:12:40,640
Speaker 1: more Hall of Famers for each's NFL players. I just

1309
01:12:40,640 --> 01:12:42,639
Speaker 1: heard the stat today, the two thousand and one Miami team.

1310
01:12:43,160 --> 01:12:46,360
Speaker 1: I was at that Rose Bowl where we humiliated Nebraska.

1311
01:12:46,400 --> 01:12:49,320
Speaker 1: But I always hated that title game because we shouldn't

1312
01:12:49,320 --> 01:12:52,120
Speaker 1: have played Nebraska. I wanted Oregon. We should have played

1313
01:12:52,160 --> 01:12:54,400
Speaker 1: Oregon in that game, and we would have humiliated Orgon too.

1314
01:12:54,400 --> 01:12:57,000
Speaker 1: It didn't matter that that defense with ed Reied. I mean,

1315
01:12:57,000 --> 01:13:00,439
Speaker 1: it was just thirty eight NFL thirty eight NFL players

1316
01:13:00,439 --> 01:13:00,960
Speaker 1: on that roster.

1317
01:13:01,600 --> 01:13:04,160
Speaker 2: The only team you can argue is better in pure

1318
01:13:04,200 --> 01:13:07,120
Speaker 2: talent was the Joe Burrow LSU team.

1319
01:13:07,360 --> 01:13:09,839
Speaker 1: That's only because of the offense, and only because Burrows

1320
01:13:09,880 --> 01:13:14,439
Speaker 1: better than Dorsey. I'm sorry. You know, Andre Johnson was

1321
01:13:14,439 --> 01:13:18,559
Speaker 1: a is A and he was on that team. Stana Moss,

1322
01:13:19,160 --> 01:13:22,719
Speaker 1: so you know, Jamar Chase Justine, I've got a soft

1323
01:13:22,760 --> 01:13:25,960
Speaker 1: spot for Miami. I've always said college football is not glamorous.

1324
01:13:26,000 --> 01:13:30,160
Speaker 1: The NFL, the NBA Yankees are glamorous. English Premier League glamorous.

1325
01:13:30,200 --> 01:13:34,599
Speaker 2: There's only three glamor programs Miami, USC and Texas interesting

1326
01:13:34,600 --> 01:13:40,640
Speaker 2: and Notre Dame's academic Alabama Georgia toughness Texas. You know,

1327
01:13:40,760 --> 01:13:44,040
Speaker 2: Sixth Street in Austin, Texas, Southern California and Coral Gables

1328
01:13:45,280 --> 01:13:48,080
Speaker 2: compared to those are Rodeo Drive compared to Main Street,

1329
01:13:48,120 --> 01:13:51,439
Speaker 2: Those and very there was a time when they were

1330
01:13:51,479 --> 01:13:55,200
Speaker 2: all great simultaneously. And that's what I miss about college football.

1331
01:13:55,240 --> 01:13:57,879
Speaker 2: I know everybody thinks it's the college football playoffs.

1332
01:13:57,880 --> 01:14:00,000
Speaker 1: Well yeah, and that's my question is sort of like

1333
01:14:00,120 --> 01:14:03,080
Speaker 1: there's Look, I'm glad Miami's a have and not a

1334
01:14:03,160 --> 01:14:06,960
Speaker 1: have not and so I'm constantly and nervous about that

1335
01:14:08,000 --> 01:14:10,960
Speaker 1: because Miami's always been hot or cold about investing.

1336
01:14:11,000 --> 01:14:11,760
Speaker 2: Now they're all in.

1337
01:14:12,080 --> 01:14:15,200
Speaker 1: I mean, what the dirty little secret about college football

1338
01:14:15,200 --> 01:14:18,840
Speaker 1: now is how many programs are funded by universities with

1339
01:14:19,040 --> 01:14:23,679
Speaker 1: profitable hospital nonprofit hospital systems. The reason Miami is able

1340
01:14:23,720 --> 01:14:27,560
Speaker 1: to fund its program is through you, Miami Health Texas.

1341
01:14:27,640 --> 01:14:30,320
Speaker 1: You know why they get a lion's share of their cash.

1342
01:14:30,880 --> 01:14:35,280
Speaker 1: M d Anderson USC has a hospital system, having a

1343
01:14:35,320 --> 01:14:37,639
Speaker 1: hospital system right now, and don't get me started.

1344
01:14:37,680 --> 01:14:38,639
Speaker 2: There's got to be something.

1345
01:14:39,200 --> 01:14:43,280
Speaker 1: The fact that nonprofit hospitals are more profitable than for

1346
01:14:43,439 --> 01:14:46,000
Speaker 1: profit hospitals tells you we probably have something wrong in

1347
01:14:46,040 --> 01:14:47,799
Speaker 1: the tax code.

1348
01:14:48,680 --> 01:14:50,080
Speaker 2: But it is why it is.

1349
01:14:50,200 --> 01:14:53,439
Speaker 1: You would be amazed, and I'm waiting for the athletic

1350
01:14:53,520 --> 01:14:57,120
Speaker 1: to do this story that most of these college football

1351
01:14:57,160 --> 01:14:59,800
Speaker 1: programs that are spending the thirty to forty million dollar,

1352
01:15:01,120 --> 01:15:04,640
Speaker 1: how many of them have hospital systems that are essentially

1353
01:15:04,760 --> 01:15:05,920
Speaker 1: the cash cow for them.

1354
01:15:06,040 --> 01:15:10,839
Speaker 2: Well, so I have had this theory is that NIL

1355
01:15:11,160 --> 01:15:14,680
Speaker 2: was great for the Big Ten and Miami's actually protected.

1356
01:15:15,240 --> 01:15:20,920
Speaker 2: USC is protected as you know, Glocier in the SEC

1357
01:15:21,040 --> 01:15:24,400
Speaker 2: footprint warm Weather. By and large, the Big Ten has

1358
01:15:24,479 --> 01:15:28,760
Speaker 2: larger schools, more graduates at the workforce. You know, when

1359
01:15:28,800 --> 01:15:32,439
Speaker 2: Auburn's sixteen thousand, Wisconsin's fifty. You know how many people

1360
01:15:32,439 --> 01:15:35,439
Speaker 2: it Wisconsin become presidents and CEOs.

1361
01:15:35,000 --> 01:15:37,320
Speaker 1: My brothers, I will be really happy for you mentioning

1362
01:15:37,320 --> 01:15:39,840
Speaker 1: that Auburn is actually a small school that they have

1363
01:15:39,880 --> 01:15:41,559
Speaker 1: all the hard time, right it is?

1364
01:15:41,800 --> 01:15:45,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And so the Big Ten they just have

1365
01:15:45,800 --> 01:15:47,920
Speaker 2: more money and there's more people out there that have

1366
01:15:48,000 --> 01:15:50,400
Speaker 2: hit it, and it's much easier to give money back.

1367
01:15:50,520 --> 01:15:53,200
Speaker 2: When college football was the SEC panned through a church

1368
01:15:53,520 --> 01:15:55,559
Speaker 2: and everybody else would get the death penalty. You know,

1369
01:15:55,600 --> 01:15:58,519
Speaker 2: packed fall schools were actually pretty clean now that everybody

1370
01:15:58,520 --> 01:16:04,440
Speaker 2: can pay. Those Big ten institution Minnesota, Penn State, Ohio, State, Wisconsin,

1371
01:16:04,479 --> 01:16:09,200
Speaker 2: they're massive schools and they just flush all these graduates

1372
01:16:09,200 --> 01:16:13,240
Speaker 2: into the workforce and they circle back to, you know,

1373
01:16:13,439 --> 01:16:14,320
Speaker 2: help with the NIL.

1374
01:16:15,400 --> 01:16:18,200
Speaker 1: What does college football look like in five years and

1375
01:16:18,360 --> 01:16:19,800
Speaker 1: is there what are the conferences?

1376
01:16:19,880 --> 01:16:26,519
Speaker 2: Are there conferences or are we epl I think you

1377
01:16:26,600 --> 01:16:30,240
Speaker 2: know the current system is twelve five highest rank conference champions.

1378
01:16:31,320 --> 01:16:34,960
Speaker 2: I think it may expand to sixteen. The networks wanted

1379
01:16:35,240 --> 01:16:37,600
Speaker 2: ESPN and Fox wanted college football. They thought it was

1380
01:16:37,640 --> 01:16:42,320
Speaker 2: the most abhorrently run sport. They were just wasting money.

1381
01:16:42,320 --> 01:16:44,800
Speaker 2: They wanted it to look like AFC NFC, and it

1382
01:16:44,840 --> 01:16:47,960
Speaker 2: never will perfectly, but it looked more like big I

1383
01:16:48,000 --> 01:16:50,160
Speaker 2: think Notre Dame will join the Big Ten, maybe a

1384
01:16:50,200 --> 01:16:53,759
Speaker 2: Florida State will join, but it'll it'll be okay because

1385
01:16:53,880 --> 01:17:01,040
Speaker 2: you know those are two super conferences. Yes, but I

1386
01:17:01,120 --> 01:17:03,120
Speaker 2: still think there'll be another. I think they'll go to

1387
01:17:03,160 --> 01:17:07,880
Speaker 2: sixteen teams and there'll be another eight teams that don't

1388
01:17:07,920 --> 01:17:10,360
Speaker 2: come out of those or six. And Miami will be

1389
01:17:10,400 --> 01:17:13,080
Speaker 2: protected because they spend money. USC will be protected because

1390
01:17:13,080 --> 01:17:15,960
Speaker 2: they're insult in California. So Miami and USC are very

1391
01:17:16,040 --> 01:17:19,160
Speaker 2: unique that they're in really high finance territory. I mean,

1392
01:17:19,200 --> 01:17:22,439
Speaker 2: the tech business in Miami has been exploding for seven or.

1393
01:17:22,439 --> 01:17:25,960
Speaker 1: Eight years, coming a home of private equity too. Yes,

1394
01:17:26,080 --> 01:17:31,160
Speaker 1: So Miami's protected. USC's protected, it's private. UCLA's public. They

1395
01:17:31,160 --> 01:17:33,320
Speaker 1: have to disclose what they pay coaches. It's much tougher

1396
01:17:33,320 --> 01:17:37,000
Speaker 1: for them. USC's private, Miami's private, so you you don't

1397
01:17:37,000 --> 01:17:39,960
Speaker 1: have to disclose everything. So Miami and USC are protected regardless.

1398
01:17:40,160 --> 01:17:42,480
Speaker 1: But I think it will be mostly two major conferences.

1399
01:17:43,320 --> 01:17:46,200
Speaker 1: Teams like Clemson will eventually have to go into the SEC,

1400
01:17:46,520 --> 01:17:50,599
Speaker 1: I mean, if they want automatic qualifying. But I think

1401
01:17:51,600 --> 01:17:55,519
Speaker 1: in our lifetimes, I'll make this argument, only one program

1402
01:17:55,600 --> 01:17:59,479
Speaker 1: has entered the top ten in the last thirty years, Oregon,

1403
01:17:59,520 --> 01:18:02,000
Speaker 1: because of all night is that if you look at

1404
01:18:02,000 --> 01:18:04,479
Speaker 1: the preseason top ten today, it's the preseason top ten

1405
01:18:04,520 --> 01:18:08,880
Speaker 1: and seventy five. Miami's always going to be glamorous. It's

1406
01:18:08,920 --> 01:18:11,240
Speaker 1: always going to have money, and it will always matter.

1407
01:18:12,840 --> 01:18:15,080
Speaker 1: So you know, it's funny you say that that the

1408
01:18:15,120 --> 01:18:17,960
Speaker 1: networks feel like college football is poorly run. I look

1409
01:18:17,960 --> 01:18:20,000
Speaker 1: at what the SEC and the Big Ten have done

1410
01:18:20,040 --> 01:18:22,920
Speaker 1: here with having you know, basically picking each one has

1411
01:18:22,960 --> 01:18:29,360
Speaker 1: their network, you know, partner, and if they actually if

1412
01:18:29,400 --> 01:18:32,559
Speaker 1: they hold their media rights the way the NFL does it,

1413
01:18:34,360 --> 01:18:37,880
Speaker 1: I think then you you know, if college football went

1414
01:18:37,960 --> 01:18:41,120
Speaker 1: back to that College Football Association where all the schools

1415
01:18:41,200 --> 01:18:45,679
Speaker 1: negotiated together, I think Washington State would be a power

1416
01:18:45,680 --> 01:18:46,800
Speaker 1: for school again.

1417
01:18:46,960 --> 01:18:48,599
Speaker 2: I'd bring that up. Be you being in an eastern

1418
01:18:48,680 --> 01:18:49,439
Speaker 2: Washington guy, and.

1419
01:18:49,840 --> 01:18:55,639
Speaker 1: I lament the fact that Spokane, Washington can't can't feel

1420
01:18:55,640 --> 01:18:58,080
Speaker 1: like it's part of the big time. And I sort

1421
01:18:58,120 --> 01:19:01,080
Speaker 1: of look at it and it this is to me,

1422
01:19:01,200 --> 01:19:04,439
Speaker 1: what what college football actually has as an advantage of

1423
01:19:04,479 --> 01:19:06,479
Speaker 1: the NFL is that they have actually more markets they

1424
01:19:06,520 --> 01:19:09,080
Speaker 1: can succeed in than the NFL can. Yeah, and they've

1425
01:19:09,160 --> 01:19:11,559
Speaker 1: kind of pissed it away because they've decided to go

1426
01:19:11,600 --> 01:19:14,280
Speaker 1: with the two. Now, ESPN and Fox are smart, They're

1427
01:19:14,320 --> 01:19:17,479
Speaker 1: saving money. I think if you know, if you took

1428
01:19:17,520 --> 01:19:20,120
Speaker 1: Colorado State, why if you said to the networks you

1429
01:19:20,160 --> 01:19:23,720
Speaker 1: want Alabama Georgia, you want the Alabama Auburn game, You're

1430
01:19:23,720 --> 01:19:26,160
Speaker 1: gonna have to carry Colorado State, Washington State.

1431
01:19:27,000 --> 01:19:27,360
Speaker 2: Okay.

1432
01:19:27,439 --> 01:19:29,880
Speaker 1: You know It's like because if you negotiated the NFL

1433
01:19:29,960 --> 01:19:32,960
Speaker 1: rights the way college football does, nobody Jacksonville Jaguars would

1434
01:19:32,960 --> 01:19:33,519
Speaker 1: never be in TV.

1435
01:19:34,320 --> 01:19:38,800
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I think I always thought college football had

1436
01:19:38,920 --> 01:19:43,760
Speaker 2: one major dilemma, a scarcity of great games, not not

1437
01:19:43,840 --> 01:19:47,519
Speaker 2: competitive game, big games Texas, Ohio State on. I didn't

1438
01:19:47,560 --> 01:19:51,639
Speaker 2: think the problem. It just everybody was avoiding early games

1439
01:19:52,320 --> 01:19:55,000
Speaker 2: and so you get an occasional Florida State LSU. I

1440
01:19:55,040 --> 01:19:57,200
Speaker 2: can turn into a one o'clock window in the NFL

1441
01:19:57,240 --> 01:19:59,400
Speaker 2: and get four great finishes. I'm not even to the

1442
01:19:59,479 --> 01:20:02,200
Speaker 2: late window, the Sunday or the Monday or the Thursday games.

1443
01:20:02,400 --> 01:20:05,320
Speaker 2: So in the NFL, I there's thirty two teams, and

1444
01:20:05,360 --> 01:20:09,080
Speaker 2: I feel you want great nine. I want greatness. I'm

1445
01:20:09,160 --> 01:20:14,040
Speaker 2: not worried about the bottom or middle. College sports has

1446
01:20:14,080 --> 01:20:18,479
Speaker 2: always been run in basketball by twelve programs, maybe ten,

1447
01:20:19,200 --> 01:20:21,600
Speaker 2: and college football has been run by eight. And I

1448
01:20:22,160 --> 01:20:25,680
Speaker 2: think they carry the water. They pay the bills. And

1449
01:20:27,439 --> 01:20:31,120
Speaker 2: I don't think Purdue mattered in nineteen forty eight. I

1450
01:20:31,160 --> 01:20:33,920
Speaker 2: don't think it mattered pre twelve team playoff, and I

1451
01:20:33,920 --> 01:20:37,120
Speaker 2: don't think it matters no. But they reward their fans

1452
01:20:37,400 --> 01:20:41,160
Speaker 2: because now they get USC games, Ohio State games, Michigan. Oh,

1453
01:20:41,160 --> 01:20:44,400
Speaker 2: here's Washington. You're gonna get more good games. And Purdue

1454
01:20:44,400 --> 01:20:46,959
Speaker 2: fans know they're not a national title contender in football.

1455
01:20:47,400 --> 01:20:50,160
Speaker 2: Just give people more quality Saturdays.

1456
01:20:50,439 --> 01:20:53,320
Speaker 1: When does the president of Ohio State wake up and say,

1457
01:20:53,360 --> 01:20:54,880
Speaker 1: how come Purdue gets an equal share?

1458
01:20:56,000 --> 01:20:58,759
Speaker 2: Well, that's what USC. That's why USC left the pack twelve.

1459
01:20:58,760 --> 01:21:00,920
Speaker 2: They're like, why does Oregon stay get an equal score.

1460
01:21:01,000 --> 01:21:02,759
Speaker 2: That's exactly why USC left.

1461
01:21:03,320 --> 01:21:07,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's where that's what and we're seeing it all right,

1462
01:21:07,240 --> 01:21:08,320
Speaker 1: let me get you out of here on this.

1463
01:21:09,200 --> 01:21:11,360
Speaker 2: I just renewed my national season tickets.

1464
01:21:11,760 --> 01:21:15,600
Speaker 1: I'm not thrilled by the management or the ownership, but

1465
01:21:15,640 --> 01:21:19,720
Speaker 1: I had an interesting conversation with the guy and my

1466
01:21:20,280 --> 01:21:23,320
Speaker 1: rap who have known a little bit. And you know,

1467
01:21:23,439 --> 01:21:25,840
Speaker 1: I love the young reps because they're trying to make

1468
01:21:25,840 --> 01:21:27,840
Speaker 1: it in the business, right, They're trying to you know,

1469
01:21:27,880 --> 01:21:30,760
Speaker 1: you go from there managing season ticket holders, you know,

1470
01:21:30,880 --> 01:21:33,200
Speaker 1: to trying to become you know, they want to be gms, right,

1471
01:21:33,240 --> 01:21:36,840
Speaker 1: they want to they want to run franchises. And he

1472
01:21:36,920 --> 01:21:39,720
Speaker 1: said the way most people were talking inside of the

1473
01:21:39,840 --> 01:21:43,639
Speaker 1: organization is they think there's about a fifty to fifty

1474
01:21:43,720 --> 01:21:45,960
Speaker 1: chance there's no season in twenty twenty seven.

1475
01:21:46,400 --> 01:21:49,560
Speaker 2: I've heard that. Yeah, what do you think. Well, I

1476
01:21:49,600 --> 01:21:54,920
Speaker 2: think it would be a tragic mistake because Rob Manfred

1477
01:21:55,120 --> 01:21:59,040
Speaker 2: has made more moves that have landed in the last

1478
01:21:59,080 --> 01:22:03,080
Speaker 2: three years than any commissioner of my life. They've all worked,

1479
01:22:03,439 --> 01:22:04,120
Speaker 2: all of them.

1480
01:22:04,520 --> 01:22:07,840
Speaker 1: I agree, I think as much as I think he's Look,

1481
01:22:08,080 --> 01:22:11,479
Speaker 1: he and Celick were terrible at this picking owners for

1482
01:22:11,560 --> 01:22:15,160
Speaker 1: franchises right, screwed up the Marlins. It looks like he

1483
01:22:15,160 --> 01:22:17,240
Speaker 1: may have picked the wrong ownership group here in Washington.

1484
01:22:17,320 --> 01:22:20,599
Speaker 1: Back in the day, they just did. They were terrible

1485
01:22:20,720 --> 01:22:23,639
Speaker 1: because Selig had this mindset, I don't want rich people owning.

1486
01:22:23,760 --> 01:22:25,960
Speaker 1: I want people who can't afford teams to own teams.

1487
01:22:26,800 --> 01:22:29,400
Speaker 1: I'm being a little facetious, but not much. Right when

1488
01:22:29,479 --> 01:22:32,439
Speaker 1: you let Frank McCourt get the team for parking lots

1489
01:22:33,439 --> 01:22:36,800
Speaker 1: and the Dodgers, right, it was just this weird mass Yeah, this.

1490
01:22:36,880 --> 01:22:38,919
Speaker 2: Weird no business owning a major.

1491
01:22:38,880 --> 01:22:41,320
Speaker 1: But it was because Celic didn't want. They didn't want.

1492
01:22:41,360 --> 01:22:43,840
Speaker 1: They thought that was the way to control spending. Right,

1493
01:22:44,040 --> 01:22:46,840
Speaker 1: have owners that can't quite afford to do it. Now

1494
01:22:46,880 --> 01:22:51,360
Speaker 1: of course went a whole different era. And I agree

1495
01:22:51,360 --> 01:22:55,120
Speaker 1: with you on Manfred, and yet I also, how the

1496
01:22:55,120 --> 01:22:57,320
Speaker 1: hell do you have two teams playing in minor league parks.

1497
01:22:57,520 --> 01:23:00,840
Speaker 1: I also hold that against man Okay, but I'll defend him.

1498
01:23:01,120 --> 01:23:05,240
Speaker 1: The NFL, for about a year and a half had

1499
01:23:05,479 --> 01:23:09,640
Speaker 1: USC the Rams. Weren't they playing I mean, remember.

1500
01:23:09,360 --> 01:23:13,320
Speaker 2: They were playing that lum The Raiders, the Niners, the

1501
01:23:13,439 --> 01:23:16,840
Speaker 2: Chargers were playing in a twenty five thousand seat soccer stadium.

1502
01:23:16,920 --> 01:23:20,800
Speaker 2: So the NFL had this weird three year stretch. We

1503
01:23:20,800 --> 01:23:23,800
Speaker 2: all these West Coast teams were playing in funky spaces,

1504
01:23:24,200 --> 01:23:26,679
Speaker 2: so it will work out, but this has happened before,

1505
01:23:26,920 --> 01:23:30,000
Speaker 2: we've had I mean there's old baseball photos and NFL

1506
01:23:30,040 --> 01:23:33,040
Speaker 2: photos where teams are playing in funky areas.

1507
01:23:33,120 --> 01:23:35,400
Speaker 1: Well, but get it on a temporary basis. Although I

1508
01:23:35,439 --> 01:23:38,920
Speaker 1: look the NFL the NFL, what they did to San

1509
01:23:38,920 --> 01:23:41,920
Speaker 1: Diego was a gigantic mistake. They had a bad owner,

1510
01:23:42,920 --> 01:23:45,559
Speaker 1: San Diego is a good market, and they've screwed the

1511
01:23:45,640 --> 01:23:49,360
Speaker 1: Chargers right. The Chargers aren't even LA's third favorite team.

1512
01:23:49,760 --> 01:23:53,920
Speaker 1: I mean, what in the NFL could have financed the stadium,

1513
01:23:54,200 --> 01:23:56,160
Speaker 1: which I think is what they should have done. They

1514
01:23:56,160 --> 01:23:58,640
Speaker 1: financed the stadium and then over time probably could have

1515
01:23:58,680 --> 01:24:00,760
Speaker 1: gotten the city in the county to do more. But

1516
01:24:00,800 --> 01:24:04,880
Speaker 1: they really blew it in San Diego, and and that

1517
01:24:04,880 --> 01:24:08,240
Speaker 1: that to me was I think these leagues don't help

1518
01:24:08,360 --> 01:24:10,719
Speaker 1: teams with stadium issues as much as.

1519
01:24:10,680 --> 01:24:14,160
Speaker 2: They don't no, so that's that is true. And they

1520
01:24:14,160 --> 01:24:16,400
Speaker 2: don't want and I've I've talked to people in the league.

1521
01:24:16,400 --> 01:24:17,760
Speaker 2: They don't want to do that. They don't want to

1522
01:24:17,760 --> 01:24:18,680
Speaker 2: be in that business.

1523
01:24:18,880 --> 01:24:21,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's a mistake. To me, they this

1524
01:24:21,880 --> 01:24:24,599
Speaker 1: is their potential super Bowl venues. I mean, you've taken

1525
01:24:24,640 --> 01:24:27,280
Speaker 1: San Diego away from being one of the better super

1526
01:24:27,320 --> 01:24:30,240
Speaker 1: Bowl towns. It's a good super Bowl hole city.

1527
01:24:30,560 --> 01:24:33,160
Speaker 2: It's also a I mean, listen, they're at Sofi, which

1528
01:24:33,200 --> 01:24:35,040
Speaker 2: is and I don't know if you've been to Sofi,

1529
01:24:35,360 --> 01:24:38,120
Speaker 2: it is a magnificent No. I know it makes Jerry

1530
01:24:38,160 --> 01:24:42,360
Speaker 2: Jones jealous? Does it really is? Nice? Is the best

1531
01:24:42,360 --> 01:24:47,080
Speaker 2: stadium I've ever been in? So I just I think

1532
01:24:47,280 --> 01:24:49,559
Speaker 2: back to your initial question. I think it would be

1533
01:24:49,560 --> 01:24:54,559
Speaker 2: a tragic mistake because I think there I hope people

1534
01:24:54,640 --> 01:24:58,360
Speaker 2: understand that Otani is better than Babe Ruth. He's an

1535
01:24:58,439 --> 01:25:05,400
Speaker 2: unbelievable player. That mostly between Bryce Harper and Philadelphia Judge

1536
01:25:05,400 --> 01:25:09,680
Speaker 2: in New York Soto with the Mets, Braves driving an offseason.

1537
01:25:10,000 --> 01:25:14,599
Speaker 2: But the Cubs have star players, San Diego Dodgers, most

1538
01:25:14,600 --> 01:25:17,280
Speaker 2: of your star players are in the right cities.

1539
01:25:17,520 --> 01:25:19,959
Speaker 1: Now, there's like, no they're having I mean this playoff

1540
01:25:20,040 --> 01:25:22,880
Speaker 1: what they have coming in the playoffs, Like, if you're unbelievable,

1541
01:25:23,160 --> 01:25:25,759
Speaker 1: you get the Cubs, the Dodgers, the Mets and the Yankees.

1542
01:25:26,080 --> 01:25:28,880
Speaker 1: Really and throwing at Detroit Tigers, which is a great

1543
01:25:29,160 --> 01:25:33,000
Speaker 1: old school baseball city. That's a pretty good lineup. And

1544
01:25:33,080 --> 01:25:35,439
Speaker 1: yet then you have the Minnesota Twins, the Chicago White

1545
01:25:35,479 --> 01:25:37,360
Speaker 1: Sox right like at Pittsburgh Pirates right.

1546
01:25:37,479 --> 01:25:41,200
Speaker 2: Well, is it that's because of the collapse of that

1547
01:25:41,920 --> 01:25:43,880
Speaker 2: regional right?

1548
01:25:43,920 --> 01:25:48,000
Speaker 1: So the the question what I wonder is does baseball

1549
01:25:48,000 --> 01:25:50,120
Speaker 1: have to contract?

1550
01:25:50,600 --> 01:25:53,519
Speaker 2: Uh? I don't think they will, but I do think

1551
01:25:53,680 --> 01:25:56,920
Speaker 2: they have to strongly consider this will really be because

1552
01:25:56,960 --> 01:25:59,400
Speaker 2: Manfred I had him on my show two months ago.

1553
01:25:59,680 --> 01:26:03,240
Speaker 2: He was uncomfortable when I asked the question. I said, listen,

1554
01:26:03,320 --> 01:26:06,320
Speaker 2: you you've got all the stars in the right places.

1555
01:26:07,240 --> 01:26:11,960
Speaker 2: But I mean Minnesota is a corporate headquarters. They can't compete.

1556
01:26:11,960 --> 01:26:14,320
Speaker 2: Seattle is a corporate headquarters. Now they have a good

1557
01:26:14,320 --> 01:26:18,320
Speaker 2: team this year, so that the gap is absurd now

1558
01:26:18,680 --> 01:26:22,120
Speaker 2: and and at some point I don't think they'll contract.

1559
01:26:22,920 --> 01:26:25,920
Speaker 2: I really wonder if we're going I know Bryce Harper

1560
01:26:25,920 --> 01:26:29,439
Speaker 2: got upset discussing it, but some level of a salary cap.

1561
01:26:29,800 --> 01:26:33,760
Speaker 1: How do you you have if baseball has to pull revenue? Right,

1562
01:26:33,920 --> 01:26:37,960
Speaker 1: the Dodgers make more money out of Japan than Minnesota

1563
01:26:38,040 --> 01:26:40,439
Speaker 1: is going to make in their entire media rightes, deal, right,

1564
01:26:41,360 --> 01:26:43,559
Speaker 1: you cannot have a competitive league.

1565
01:26:43,400 --> 01:26:48,040
Speaker 2: That does this. You can share anue to a point. Okay,

1566
01:26:48,200 --> 01:26:51,400
Speaker 2: I agree, But here's what's interesting. How many World Series

1567
01:26:51,479 --> 01:26:56,600
Speaker 2: titles do the Yankees and Dodgers have? Baseball is so quirky,

1568
01:26:56,640 --> 01:26:57,840
Speaker 2: you know, you don't have the NBA.

1569
01:26:58,120 --> 01:27:00,479
Speaker 1: The playstoffs are the equalizer. I will say that the

1570
01:27:00,520 --> 01:27:02,800
Speaker 1: five games, you never know who's gonna win. That's right,

1571
01:27:03,080 --> 01:27:06,040
Speaker 1: you know. Look, I remember saying it to my son.

1572
01:27:06,120 --> 01:27:08,759
Speaker 1: I said, the Nats only can win the World Series

1573
01:27:08,760 --> 01:27:10,439
Speaker 1: in nineteen if they can get the Dodgers in the

1574
01:27:10,439 --> 01:27:13,000
Speaker 1: five game, and sure enough, they got it. They never

1575
01:27:13,080 --> 01:27:15,200
Speaker 1: beat the Dodgers in a seven game. They get them

1576
01:27:15,200 --> 01:27:17,519
Speaker 1: in the five game and they're able to win with

1577
01:27:17,640 --> 01:27:21,840
Speaker 1: Susier Strasburg and course, right right, So that's and by

1578
01:27:21,840 --> 01:27:24,400
Speaker 1: the way, the Tigers. This is why I think the

1579
01:27:24,439 --> 01:27:27,759
Speaker 1: Tigers are are probably going to get to the World

1580
01:27:27,800 --> 01:27:30,519
Speaker 1: Series and if they get in the playoffs because of

1581
01:27:30,560 --> 01:27:31,360
Speaker 1: that pitching staff.

1582
01:27:31,760 --> 01:27:34,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I think the Tigers have the best bullpen

1583
01:27:34,360 --> 01:27:36,519
Speaker 2: in baseball right now. I could be wrong on that

1584
01:27:36,680 --> 01:27:39,080
Speaker 2: in fact check, but so baseball is in a weird

1585
01:27:39,080 --> 01:27:42,680
Speaker 2: spot that because of pitching injuries, you can beat in

1586
01:27:42,720 --> 01:27:46,320
Speaker 2: a volume of games, you'll win, but in a baseball

1587
01:27:46,360 --> 01:27:49,200
Speaker 2: playoffs you can unravel so quickly.

1588
01:27:49,400 --> 01:27:52,000
Speaker 1: No, that's the way you can analytics your way into

1589
01:27:52,000 --> 01:27:55,320
Speaker 1: the playoffs. And I take your point there, but you're

1590
01:27:55,400 --> 01:27:58,120
Speaker 1: just players aren't going to want to play for those teams.

1591
01:27:58,360 --> 01:28:01,000
Speaker 2: That's the problem. Yeah, And I mean I think it

1592
01:28:01,120 --> 01:28:04,240
Speaker 2: is the gap between the Dodgers and the Pirates. The

1593
01:28:04,240 --> 01:28:06,400
Speaker 2: Pirates are a triple A baseball team.

1594
01:28:06,920 --> 01:28:09,479
Speaker 1: I mean that that they are with two of players

1595
01:28:09,479 --> 01:28:12,560
Speaker 1: that I love watching, like I'm a look, I'm a

1596
01:28:12,720 --> 01:28:16,559
Speaker 1: I'm total steamhead. The Nats aren't playing I see a

1597
01:28:16,800 --> 01:28:19,120
Speaker 1: you know, I love watching O'Neil Cruz at bats and

1598
01:28:19,160 --> 01:28:22,400
Speaker 1: of course I love watching Skeen's bitch. It's a shame

1599
01:28:22,479 --> 01:28:25,439
Speaker 1: how the Pirates. I I the Pirates. You know, that's

1600
01:28:25,520 --> 01:28:28,080
Speaker 1: just bad ownership. And to me, that's what Manfred's got

1601
01:28:28,120 --> 01:28:30,880
Speaker 1: to do, is he needs some better owners he doesn't have.

1602
01:28:31,040 --> 01:28:33,559
Speaker 1: There's there's a good six or seven franchise with dish

1603
01:28:33,600 --> 01:28:34,559
Speaker 1: really shitty owners.

1604
01:28:34,840 --> 01:28:38,120
Speaker 2: I know. I know this, Scott Borrows and players will

1605
01:28:38,120 --> 01:28:41,240
Speaker 2: push back, but they're probably we have probably reached a

1606
01:28:41,320 --> 01:28:43,599
Speaker 2: point where you need some level of a salary cap

1607
01:28:44,000 --> 01:28:45,920
Speaker 2: and now I still I think. I think one of

1608
01:28:45,920 --> 01:28:48,040
Speaker 2: the beauties of the NFL. The two New York teams

1609
01:28:48,080 --> 01:28:52,479
Speaker 2: are a disaster. Green Bay's great, Kansas City's great, Buffalo's great.

1610
01:28:52,520 --> 01:28:54,799
Speaker 2: Baltimore is great. I mean, that's what makes the NFL

1611
01:28:54,880 --> 01:28:57,400
Speaker 2: special is that market size is irrelevant. I don't think

1612
01:28:57,439 --> 01:28:59,439
Speaker 2: it has to be irrelevant. By the way, in the NBA,

1613
01:28:59,439 --> 01:29:03,280
Speaker 2: Adams still created an irrelevant market size league. But baseball

1614
01:29:03,320 --> 01:29:06,600
Speaker 2: now has gone the other way too much. No, I

1615
01:29:06,640 --> 01:29:07,720
Speaker 2: love you, I'll get you.

1616
01:29:07,880 --> 01:29:10,200
Speaker 1: One of my favorite examples was we had Chiefs forty

1617
01:29:10,280 --> 01:29:12,240
Speaker 1: nine ers and that was one of the five highest

1618
01:29:12,320 --> 01:29:15,120
Speaker 1: rated Super Bowls ever. I think about about ten years

1619
01:29:15,160 --> 01:29:19,240
Speaker 1: ago we had Giants Royals, one of the lowest rated

1620
01:29:19,240 --> 01:29:23,200
Speaker 1: World Series ever. Same two markets. Yep, right, was this

1621
01:29:24,200 --> 01:29:28,439
Speaker 1: not even close? All right, Colin, what any advice? As

1622
01:29:28,439 --> 01:29:32,599
Speaker 1: I've been sort of getting getting into more of a

1623
01:29:32,720 --> 01:29:38,800
Speaker 1: of a radio mindset, I think, give me some.

1624
01:29:38,760 --> 01:29:42,280
Speaker 2: Of your custod advice. Well, my bet, you're a worker,

1625
01:29:42,400 --> 01:29:45,040
Speaker 2: you're a prepper. So I think all that's really valuable

1626
01:29:45,720 --> 01:29:52,800
Speaker 2: is that I I don't believe that you have to

1627
01:29:52,880 --> 01:29:59,120
Speaker 2: be outrageous conspiratorial to have I think everybody that succeeds

1628
01:29:59,120 --> 01:30:02,880
Speaker 2: in podcasting. I mean, Mark Meron was funny before he

1629
01:30:02,920 --> 01:30:04,760
Speaker 2: was doing podcasts. He was a very talented guy. He

1630
01:30:04,800 --> 01:30:06,559
Speaker 2: just watched them in a movie about six months ago,

1631
01:30:06,920 --> 01:30:08,360
Speaker 2: and I forget the name of the movie. I was

1632
01:30:08,400 --> 01:30:09,840
Speaker 2: thinking about this the other day with Mark, because he

1633
01:30:09,880 --> 01:30:12,640
Speaker 2: got out of the podcast business. He's had a successful

1634
01:30:12,640 --> 01:30:16,240
Speaker 2: stand up He acts is be true to yourself and

1635
01:30:16,520 --> 01:30:22,640
Speaker 2: and I think you have in podcasting, interesting is always important,

1636
01:30:23,320 --> 01:30:27,800
Speaker 2: but in podcasting getting a little uncomfortable, a little less

1637
01:30:27,800 --> 01:30:32,439
Speaker 2: sanitized as a traditional broadcaster, it's never a bad idea.

1638
01:30:32,520 --> 01:30:35,360
Speaker 2: You can be a little less sanitized. I know I've

1639
01:30:35,400 --> 01:30:38,680
Speaker 2: battled this. I'm like, come on, pour a cocktail and

1640
01:30:38,760 --> 01:30:41,000
Speaker 2: let's get down and dirty. And I think that's the

1641
01:30:41,040 --> 01:30:44,840
Speaker 2: key to people that have a traditional podcast broadcasting background.

1642
01:30:45,920 --> 01:30:50,360
Speaker 2: You know, is there there's a reason Dak Shepherd, Joe

1643
01:30:50,439 --> 01:30:52,439
Speaker 2: Rogan if I would have told you, here's the three

1644
01:30:52,479 --> 01:30:55,240
Speaker 2: guys that are going to crush it in podcasting. Dak Shepherd,

1645
01:30:55,320 --> 01:30:56,559
Speaker 2: Joe Rogan, and Mark Merren.

1646
01:30:57,000 --> 01:31:00,600
Speaker 1: Yeah all are reprisal too. And I will say this,

1647
01:31:00,680 --> 01:31:03,200
Speaker 1: two of them were stand up comedians right first.

1648
01:31:03,640 --> 01:31:07,479
Speaker 2: And also very vulnerable about their flaws. I mean Maren

1649
01:31:07,600 --> 01:31:11,080
Speaker 2: just undresses himself. Dak Shepherd talks about it, So what

1650
01:31:11,120 --> 01:31:13,320
Speaker 2: does that tell you about all of these guys. Rogan

1651
01:31:13,400 --> 01:31:15,559
Speaker 2: talks a lot about being picked on, and you know

1652
01:31:15,600 --> 01:31:21,080
Speaker 2: he was shorter his dad relationship. Allowing your vulnerabilities Dak

1653
01:31:21,160 --> 01:31:24,120
Speaker 2: Shephard mark meron Joe Rogan, there is a there's a

1654
01:31:24,160 --> 01:31:26,280
Speaker 2: win in that, like, hey, guys, you're not going to

1655
01:31:26,360 --> 01:31:28,320
Speaker 2: do that as a broadcaster. You don't want to show weakness.

1656
01:31:28,320 --> 01:31:30,480
Speaker 2: Now that vulnerability works.

1657
01:31:30,760 --> 01:31:35,080
Speaker 1: I always think it's because it's a more intimate relationship. Yes,

1658
01:31:35,200 --> 01:31:39,040
Speaker 1: as a podcaster, because you're literally in people's heads. Most

1659
01:31:39,080 --> 01:31:42,280
Speaker 1: people are listening by putting little earpieces in their ears,

1660
01:31:42,840 --> 01:31:44,800
Speaker 1: so they're eavesdropping on your conversation.

1661
01:31:45,640 --> 01:31:48,599
Speaker 2: To wrap it up, that's what Johnny Carson said. Remember

1662
01:31:48,720 --> 01:31:53,280
Speaker 2: in the In the Bushkin book is that Johnny Carson

1663
01:31:53,360 --> 01:31:55,360
Speaker 2: was more powerful than any actor. But he was on

1664
01:31:55,400 --> 01:31:59,000
Speaker 2: a small screen in your house. And so people, that's

1665
01:31:59,040 --> 01:32:02,720
Speaker 2: in your bedroom. It's in your bedroom, movie stars you

1666
01:32:02,760 --> 01:32:04,920
Speaker 2: looked up to on a big screen. Johnny died. He

1667
01:32:05,000 --> 01:32:08,160
Speaker 2: left four hundred and fifty six million to a children's hospital.

1668
01:32:08,640 --> 01:32:12,400
Speaker 2: Actors are so waiting for their sag check, but because

1669
01:32:12,439 --> 01:32:15,360
Speaker 2: it was so intimate. Johnny was part of your life

1670
01:32:15,479 --> 01:32:20,479
Speaker 2: laying in bed, and I think podcasting has that visceral connection. Colin.

1671
01:32:20,560 --> 01:32:36,479
Speaker 2: Thanks for being so generous, appreciate, Thank you. It's fun. Well.

1672
01:32:36,520 --> 01:32:38,439
Speaker 1: I hope you enjoyed that conversation with Colin.

1673
01:32:38,479 --> 01:32:39,040
Speaker 2: I know I did.

1674
01:32:39,120 --> 01:32:44,479
Speaker 1: And if if you're hoping for more, I think we

1675
01:32:44,600 --> 01:32:47,160
Speaker 1: signed a home and away, so you know, be on

1676
01:32:47,200 --> 01:32:51,639
Speaker 1: the lookout. It's up to them when when I show

1677
01:32:51,720 --> 01:32:56,040
Speaker 1: up there. But you know, we're uh, like I said,

1678
01:32:57,000 --> 01:32:59,920
Speaker 1: we are a professional in loss when it comes to

1679
01:33:00,080 --> 01:33:04,479
Speaker 1: the podcasting in the world in independent media, so we

1680
01:33:04,560 --> 01:33:09,120
Speaker 1: will be there. It's a few things. Since I've got

1681
01:33:09,280 --> 01:33:11,519
Speaker 1: Colin is today's thing, I feel like I can lean

1682
01:33:11,560 --> 01:33:13,880
Speaker 1: in a little bit more to a few sports thoughts

1683
01:33:13,960 --> 01:33:15,160
Speaker 1: I have. First of all, I just want to give

1684
01:33:15,160 --> 01:33:17,360
Speaker 1: a shout out to Spike Lee. He was a Bill

1685
01:33:17,360 --> 01:33:20,720
Speaker 1: Simmons guest last week on his pod and they were

1686
01:33:20,720 --> 01:33:24,200
Speaker 1: having a conversation about any loose conversation. It was mostly

1687
01:33:24,200 --> 01:33:27,120
Speaker 1: about Spike's new movie. They're run a loose conversation about

1688
01:33:27,600 --> 01:33:29,479
Speaker 1: you know, the greatest of all time these debates, and

1689
01:33:30,160 --> 01:33:32,000
Speaker 1: Spike Lee made a mention he goes, I hate these

1690
01:33:32,080 --> 01:33:34,519
Speaker 1: Lebron Jordan debates, it's not about who's the goat, it's

1691
01:33:34,560 --> 01:33:37,439
Speaker 1: who's in the room. And I actually thought, you know,

1692
01:33:37,439 --> 01:33:40,040
Speaker 1: when we're looking at ways to improve debate in our

1693
01:33:40,080 --> 01:33:43,479
Speaker 1: political world and frankly to improve debate, right, the single

1694
01:33:43,520 --> 01:33:45,280
Speaker 1: dumbest thing any of us want to hear is Steven A.

1695
01:33:45,360 --> 01:33:48,200
Speaker 1: Smith's foutting off on who's the goat. Okay, none of

1696
01:33:48,240 --> 01:33:50,200
Speaker 1: us care, and Steven ain't. Smith ain't in charge of this.

1697
01:33:50,320 --> 01:33:52,360
Speaker 1: It's just who Stephen A. Smith thinks. But there's nothing

1698
01:33:52,360 --> 01:33:54,720
Speaker 1: wrong with that, right, we all have our you know,

1699
01:33:54,880 --> 01:33:56,800
Speaker 1: I'm a person I will make the argument about Magic

1700
01:33:56,840 --> 01:33:59,320
Speaker 1: Johnson as the goat if you really want to go

1701
01:33:59,360 --> 01:34:02,320
Speaker 1: down this road. But what Spike Lee said, and I

1702
01:34:02,320 --> 01:34:05,599
Speaker 1: think it is a better conversation who's in the room,

1703
01:34:06,400 --> 01:34:08,439
Speaker 1: who there should be like more of a of a

1704
01:34:08,720 --> 01:34:11,519
Speaker 1: there's like a room a goat room, right, Kurry Abdul

1705
01:34:11,560 --> 01:34:14,160
Speaker 1: Jabbar's in that room, Bill Russell's in that room. Lebron

1706
01:34:14,280 --> 01:34:16,280
Speaker 1: James is in that room. I might put Steph Curry

1707
01:34:16,280 --> 01:34:19,200
Speaker 1: in that room, right, Michael Jordan's certainly in that room, magic,

1708
01:34:19,240 --> 01:34:21,799
Speaker 1: et cetera. And I just think it's a George Miket

1709
01:34:21,840 --> 01:34:23,360
Speaker 1: you have to put in that room because he was

1710
01:34:23,400 --> 01:34:26,880
Speaker 1: probably the first goat. The point is, then there are

1711
01:34:26,920 --> 01:34:29,639
Speaker 1: people that are not in that room, right, we might

1712
01:34:29,680 --> 01:34:32,320
Speaker 1: have a debate. It's Tim Duncan in that room, right,

1713
01:34:33,360 --> 01:34:35,360
Speaker 1: and that is the it you know, It's like it's

1714
01:34:35,439 --> 01:34:38,000
Speaker 1: that it's that idea of like who gets to be,

1715
01:34:39,240 --> 01:34:41,800
Speaker 1: you know, in the penhouse of the Hall of Fame,

1716
01:34:41,840 --> 01:34:44,880
Speaker 1: which is really the goat conversation. Anyway, I just think

1717
01:34:44,880 --> 01:34:46,840
Speaker 1: he's right. It's a healthier conversation.

1718
01:34:47,439 --> 01:34:47,800
Speaker 2: It is.

1719
01:34:48,120 --> 01:34:51,559
Speaker 1: It is hard to compare errors, but you know, right,

1720
01:34:51,600 --> 01:34:54,040
Speaker 1: who belongs anyway. I just thought it was just it

1721
01:34:54,160 --> 01:34:56,720
Speaker 1: was a you know, it would I think it's a

1722
01:34:56,720 --> 01:34:58,240
Speaker 1: healthy way to have this guy. You can do it

1723
01:34:58,280 --> 01:35:01,599
Speaker 1: about any common say you want. Right, you can't compare

1724
01:35:01,640 --> 01:35:05,519
Speaker 1: Montana and Brady and which one is the all time great?

1725
01:35:05,640 --> 01:35:08,320
Speaker 1: But they're both in the room, right. Dan Marino is

1726
01:35:08,320 --> 01:35:11,880
Speaker 1: not in the room, right. Terry Bradshaw gets to be

1727
01:35:11,880 --> 01:35:14,599
Speaker 1: in the room. He figured out how to win four

1728
01:35:14,640 --> 01:35:18,240
Speaker 1: Super Bowls. Bart starrs in that room. He's got five

1729
01:35:18,360 --> 01:35:21,920
Speaker 1: NFL championships. That doesn't mean I'm gonna sit here and

1730
01:35:21,920 --> 01:35:24,840
Speaker 1: make the case stars better than Brady, but the question

1731
01:35:24,960 --> 01:35:28,680
Speaker 1: is who's in the room. Jim Brown a quarterback. It's

1732
01:35:28,680 --> 01:35:31,360
Speaker 1: not gonna just be quarterbacks in that room. I'm gonna

1733
01:35:31,360 --> 01:35:33,280
Speaker 1: put Jim Brown in that room. But you see where

1734
01:35:33,280 --> 01:35:35,639
Speaker 1: I'm going here, Right, You just know who's in the room,

1735
01:35:37,280 --> 01:35:39,160
Speaker 1: and it's better than trying to have the dumb debate

1736
01:35:39,160 --> 01:35:40,920
Speaker 1: of one because you could sit there and no one's

1737
01:35:40,960 --> 01:35:44,000
Speaker 1: ever gonna be satisfied. But you actually might have a

1738
01:35:44,120 --> 01:35:47,680
Speaker 1: more a smarter conversation if you debate who belongs in

1739
01:35:47,680 --> 01:35:51,120
Speaker 1: the room. One other sports note, actually two other sports notes.

1740
01:35:53,000 --> 01:35:55,040
Speaker 1: I'm a gambler, but you know what, I don't do

1741
01:35:55,200 --> 01:35:58,080
Speaker 1: player props. I don't do player props because I don't

1742
01:35:58,080 --> 01:36:01,040
Speaker 1: trust players on any given. That to me, at the

1743
01:36:01,120 --> 01:36:03,880
Speaker 1: end of the day, you're dealing because we're all human beings, right.

1744
01:36:04,960 --> 01:36:07,280
Speaker 1: I'm more comfortable betting on teams. I don't bet golf

1745
01:36:07,280 --> 01:36:09,679
Speaker 1: for tennis, because you're betting on an individual. You're betting

1746
01:36:09,720 --> 01:36:12,200
Speaker 1: on something. You know what if they woke up on

1747
01:36:12,200 --> 01:36:14,120
Speaker 1: the wrong side of the bed and all this stuff. Right,

1748
01:36:14,360 --> 01:36:17,360
Speaker 1: of course, ultimately any team sport you could have that

1749
01:36:17,400 --> 01:36:21,439
Speaker 1: same issue. But I'll tell you another reason why. Now

1750
01:36:21,680 --> 01:36:24,719
Speaker 1: I'm wondering whether player props should even be legal at all.

1751
01:36:24,760 --> 01:36:26,720
Speaker 1: I want to read you something that I caught over

1752
01:36:26,760 --> 01:36:30,559
Speaker 1: the weekend. Michael Porter Junior, his brother Michael Porter Juniors,

1753
01:36:30,560 --> 01:36:32,200
Speaker 1: an NBA player, and his brother's caught up in a

1754
01:36:32,240 --> 01:36:34,519
Speaker 1: gambling scandal. But I want to read you a quote

1755
01:36:34,520 --> 01:36:36,360
Speaker 1: he said. This is what he said on a podcast

1756
01:36:36,360 --> 01:36:41,639
Speaker 1: now talking about the idea of potential gambling scandals. Here's

1757
01:36:41,640 --> 01:36:44,320
Speaker 1: what he said. He said, think about it. If you

1758
01:36:44,360 --> 01:36:46,760
Speaker 1: can get all your homi's rich by telling them, YO,

1759
01:36:47,200 --> 01:36:50,559
Speaker 1: bet ten thousand dollars on my under this one game,

1760
01:36:50,560 --> 01:36:52,439
Speaker 1: I'm going to act like I got an injury and

1761
01:36:52,479 --> 01:36:54,240
Speaker 1: I'm going to sit out, and I'm going to come

1762
01:36:54,240 --> 01:36:56,680
Speaker 1: out of the game after three minutes, and they all

1763
01:36:56,720 --> 01:36:58,679
Speaker 1: get a little bag because you did.

1764
01:36:58,560 --> 01:37:01,160
Speaker 2: It one game. That is not okay.

1765
01:37:01,200 --> 01:37:03,680
Speaker 1: Though now he admits this is so not okay, But

1766
01:37:03,760 --> 01:37:06,960
Speaker 1: some people probably think like that. He added, they come

1767
01:37:07,000 --> 01:37:09,479
Speaker 1: from nothing and all their homies have nothing. And if

1768
01:37:09,520 --> 01:37:11,280
Speaker 1: I come out of the game after three minutes and

1769
01:37:11,360 --> 01:37:13,680
Speaker 1: y'all hit on my under, we're all gonna get a

1770
01:37:13,720 --> 01:37:17,960
Speaker 1: little bag. And he goes, Obviously, my brother went through

1771
01:37:18,120 --> 01:37:21,320
Speaker 1: his situation. Malik Beasley is going through his situation right now,

1772
01:37:21,520 --> 01:37:24,160
Speaker 1: Terry Rozier was in some hot water. But the whole

1773
01:37:24,200 --> 01:37:26,559
Speaker 1: sports gamely entity. Bro, It's bad and it's only going

1774
01:37:26,640 --> 01:37:27,160
Speaker 1: to get worse.

1775
01:37:29,200 --> 01:37:29,639
Speaker 2: He said.

1776
01:37:29,680 --> 01:37:34,160
Speaker 1: The quiet part out load right, which is, if you've

1777
01:37:34,160 --> 01:37:36,240
Speaker 1: got a bunch of friends who need a couple of bucks,

1778
01:37:36,840 --> 01:37:38,400
Speaker 1: you don't want to hand them money. But you're like,

1779
01:37:38,439 --> 01:37:41,519
Speaker 1: all right, I'm not feeling good tonight. Bet on my

1780
01:37:41,640 --> 01:37:44,360
Speaker 1: under and I'll sit out.

1781
01:37:45,439 --> 01:37:47,040
Speaker 2: Claire props need to be banned, folks.

1782
01:37:47,960 --> 01:37:52,559
Speaker 1: And if I were FanDuel or DraftKings or ESPN bet

1783
01:37:52,800 --> 01:37:56,040
Speaker 1: or Caesar's, YadA YadA YadA, you see something like that.

1784
01:37:57,160 --> 01:37:59,719
Speaker 1: Claire pops ought to be banned, folks. Now, it's interesting

1785
01:38:00,000 --> 01:38:02,920
Speaker 1: the state of Virginia, while they allow player props and

1786
01:38:03,040 --> 01:38:09,080
Speaker 1: professional football and baseball, they don't allow player PLoP player plops,

1787
01:38:09,640 --> 01:38:12,920
Speaker 1: say that real fast sally at the seashore, they don't

1788
01:38:12,920 --> 01:38:17,519
Speaker 1: allow player props on college players. Charlie Baker, who's president

1789
01:38:17,560 --> 01:38:20,000
Speaker 1: of NCAA, he said this to me two years ago

1790
01:38:20,040 --> 01:38:21,439
Speaker 1: in an interview I did with him, and he said,

1791
01:38:21,680 --> 01:38:23,320
Speaker 1: the one thing I'd like to get rid of for

1792
01:38:23,400 --> 01:38:27,160
Speaker 1: sure is player props in college because it is way

1793
01:38:27,280 --> 01:38:30,680
Speaker 1: too tempting. It is way too much pressure on an

1794
01:38:30,680 --> 01:38:32,360
Speaker 1: eighteen nineteen twenty year old.

1795
01:38:34,200 --> 01:38:35,800
Speaker 2: It's and it's just.

1796
01:38:35,760 --> 01:38:38,519
Speaker 1: The the ability to manipulate. Look, some of the largest

1797
01:38:38,520 --> 01:38:42,439
Speaker 1: gambling scandals around the world have had to do with tennis. Again,

1798
01:38:42,479 --> 01:38:45,880
Speaker 1: when you're dealing with individuals, it's much harder to tank

1799
01:38:46,320 --> 01:38:50,439
Speaker 1: a team than it is to tank an individual. Anyway,

1800
01:38:50,600 --> 01:38:53,759
Speaker 1: as somebody who really is happy that gambling is legal,

1801
01:38:54,680 --> 01:38:57,240
Speaker 1: I'm a resp I'd like to think I'm a responsible gambler.

1802
01:38:57,280 --> 01:38:58,759
Speaker 1: I'll let you know at the end of this football

1803
01:38:58,800 --> 01:39:02,160
Speaker 1: season how responsible I've been. But I can tell you this,

1804
01:39:02,960 --> 01:39:05,479
Speaker 1: I personally don't do player props because I just I

1805
01:39:05,560 --> 01:39:09,080
Speaker 1: just think there's this extra there's this extra issue in

1806
01:39:09,120 --> 01:39:11,519
Speaker 1: my head about whether I can just trust on any

1807
01:39:11,520 --> 01:39:12,040
Speaker 1: given day.

1808
01:39:12,200 --> 01:39:12,360
Speaker 2: Right.

1809
01:39:12,439 --> 01:39:16,640
Speaker 1: That's I'd rather put my trust in a team than

1810
01:39:16,680 --> 01:39:21,559
Speaker 1: an individual on that front. But that extra what Michael

1811
01:39:21,600 --> 01:39:23,560
Speaker 1: Porter Junior said, he said something out loud that not

1812
01:39:23,640 --> 01:39:27,479
Speaker 1: many players will say, and it's important people listen to that.

1813
01:39:28,600 --> 01:39:30,760
Speaker 1: And my final little sports item before I get my

1814
01:39:31,120 --> 01:39:33,840
Speaker 1: to get to a little as chuck. So if you

1815
01:39:33,880 --> 01:39:35,759
Speaker 1: follow me on X, you know I was a little

1816
01:39:35,760 --> 01:39:39,920
Speaker 1: snarky about the story the Big ten is apparently circulating

1817
01:39:39,920 --> 01:39:43,320
Speaker 1: a new college football playoff plan that would include twenty

1818
01:39:43,360 --> 01:39:46,840
Speaker 1: four to twenty eight teams. And I remember the minute

1819
01:39:46,840 --> 01:39:49,000
Speaker 1: I saw the headline. I'll i admit I rolled my

1820
01:39:49,040 --> 01:39:51,160
Speaker 1: eyes and said, oh, great, another way for Ohio on

1821
01:39:51,200 --> 01:39:53,519
Speaker 1: a six and six Ohio state team to get.

1822
01:39:53,320 --> 01:39:53,960
Speaker 2: Into the playoff.

1823
01:39:55,280 --> 01:39:58,040
Speaker 1: And then I read the proposal, and you know what,

1824
01:39:59,360 --> 01:40:03,000
Speaker 1: it's a pretty good idea. And here's why it's so,

1825
01:40:03,240 --> 01:40:05,040
Speaker 1: this is what the idea would do. We would there

1826
01:40:05,040 --> 01:40:09,200
Speaker 1: would be no more conference championship games. Honestly, it's probably

1827
01:40:09,280 --> 01:40:13,519
Speaker 1: barely going to mean conferences other than for scheduling that

1828
01:40:13,680 --> 01:40:17,759
Speaker 1: conferences and conference standings to decide who gets into the playoffs.

1829
01:40:17,800 --> 01:40:18,960
Speaker 2: That's about it. There'll be no.

1830
01:40:19,000 --> 01:40:22,040
Speaker 1: Championship game under this scenario. So if it were, let's

1831
01:40:22,080 --> 01:40:24,400
Speaker 1: go with there. So twenty four teams is not a

1832
01:40:24,880 --> 01:40:26,800
Speaker 1: you know, you wonder where they pulled that number out.

1833
01:40:26,800 --> 01:40:28,439
Speaker 1: If it's twenty four to twenty, let's stick with twenty

1834
01:40:28,439 --> 01:40:34,880
Speaker 1: four because it's what FCS right Division one. But the

1835
01:40:34,920 --> 01:40:36,160
Speaker 1: next level down, it's what they do.

1836
01:40:36,200 --> 01:40:36,439
Speaker 2: They do.

1837
01:40:36,479 --> 01:40:41,320
Speaker 1: Twenty four, Top eight get a bye, next sixteen, you know,

1838
01:40:41,360 --> 01:40:44,559
Speaker 1: start playing each other. So if you did that, you'd

1839
01:40:44,560 --> 01:40:46,280
Speaker 1: do the same thing. Top eight would get a bye.

1840
01:40:46,439 --> 01:40:50,880
Speaker 1: Top eight seeds committee would decide those seeds, and under

1841
01:40:50,880 --> 01:40:52,599
Speaker 1: this scenario, I think it would be the Big ten

1842
01:40:52,600 --> 01:40:56,280
Speaker 1: would get six, Top six get in Top six SEC.

1843
01:40:56,439 --> 01:41:00,479
Speaker 1: So there's twelve Top four ACC that's sixteen, four Big

1844
01:41:00,560 --> 01:41:03,400
Speaker 1: twelve that's twenty. So the other four slots two go

1845
01:41:03,439 --> 01:41:06,679
Speaker 1: to a group of five and two would go at large.

1846
01:41:07,960 --> 01:41:10,640
Speaker 1: And when you start looking, my son and I did this.

1847
01:41:10,680 --> 01:41:13,720
Speaker 1: We did the whole thing last night and a Saturday night,

1848
01:41:13,760 --> 01:41:16,880
Speaker 1: and we started looking at what the playoff would have

1849
01:41:16,880 --> 01:41:20,760
Speaker 1: been last year, and it gets the bubble teams all in.

1850
01:41:22,920 --> 01:41:26,040
Speaker 1: There is no team I think there was one eight

1851
01:41:26,080 --> 01:41:28,599
Speaker 1: and five team would get in, but almost everybody else

1852
01:41:28,600 --> 01:41:31,559
Speaker 1: would be nine or ten or eleven win teams. Think

1853
01:41:31,560 --> 01:41:33,719
Speaker 1: about two weeks before the end of the regular season,

1854
01:41:33,760 --> 01:41:38,000
Speaker 1: you may have fifty fan bases engaged because there's a

1855
01:41:38,040 --> 01:41:43,320
Speaker 1: scenario where they can make it into the playoff. Now,

1856
01:41:43,360 --> 01:41:45,200
Speaker 1: I know SEC fans aren't going to like this because

1857
01:41:45,240 --> 01:41:48,920
Speaker 1: it doesn't treat the SEC like the only conference that exists.

1858
01:41:49,479 --> 01:41:53,679
Speaker 1: Right there is this sort of blinders that the SEC,

1859
01:41:53,960 --> 01:41:57,160
Speaker 1: its fan base, its commissioner puts on. You know, they're

1860
01:41:57,200 --> 01:41:59,320
Speaker 1: only working with the Big ten because the Big ten

1861
01:41:59,320 --> 01:42:01,880
Speaker 1: has more markets than they do. But other than that,

1862
01:42:02,320 --> 01:42:05,040
Speaker 1: they'd love to just create their own little league.

1863
01:42:04,800 --> 01:42:05,800
Speaker 2: If they could.

1864
01:42:07,760 --> 01:42:09,920
Speaker 1: But this would raise this would this would you know

1865
01:42:09,920 --> 01:42:13,200
Speaker 1: what this would do? This would stop the conference mess. Okay,

1866
01:42:13,240 --> 01:42:17,880
Speaker 1: there'd be no more conference poaching. Okay, it would allow

1867
01:42:17,960 --> 01:42:20,519
Speaker 1: these large conferences. You would still you know, you have

1868
01:42:20,640 --> 01:42:23,320
Speaker 1: to win in the upper half, all right. It's not

1869
01:42:23,479 --> 01:42:26,880
Speaker 1: like the NBA, which now allows twenty of thirty teams

1870
01:42:26,920 --> 01:42:29,400
Speaker 1: to essentially make the playoffs if you count the play in,

1871
01:42:29,760 --> 01:42:32,599
Speaker 1: so we're not putting half and if you look at it,

1872
01:42:32,920 --> 01:42:35,360
Speaker 1: you know we're the top twenty five. Is you know

1873
01:42:35,400 --> 01:42:37,920
Speaker 1: how we talk about college sports, Well, essentially the entire

1874
01:42:37,920 --> 01:42:40,360
Speaker 1: top twenty five would make it. And then you start

1875
01:42:40,400 --> 01:42:45,000
Speaker 1: your playoff at the top twenty five again, now the

1876
01:42:45,040 --> 01:42:47,240
Speaker 1: best then the next thing that you adopt if you

1877
01:42:47,320 --> 01:42:50,759
Speaker 1: do this, because look, I do think this, this engages

1878
01:42:50,800 --> 01:42:58,200
Speaker 1: more fan bases. This probably improves the the the media

1879
01:42:58,320 --> 01:43:05,200
Speaker 1: rights value for all of college football, including some smaller conferences.

1880
01:43:06,680 --> 01:43:11,439
Speaker 1: It opens the door to sixty seventy schools to at

1881
01:43:11,520 --> 01:43:17,519
Speaker 1: least have a semi realistic chance, and it allows the

1882
01:43:17,560 --> 01:43:21,040
Speaker 1: sport to grow. It's already ready to burst out of

1883
01:43:21,080 --> 01:43:23,920
Speaker 1: its seams. Right, the only thing that can stop college

1884
01:43:23,960 --> 01:43:27,400
Speaker 1: football from growing more popular is that the SEC and

1885
01:43:27,439 --> 01:43:30,920
Speaker 1: the Big Ten squeeze everybody else out of it. But

1886
01:43:31,040 --> 01:43:34,360
Speaker 1: kudos to the Big Ten for thinking this way because

1887
01:43:34,360 --> 01:43:37,240
Speaker 1: it probably puts a stop to the expansion of conferences.

1888
01:43:38,640 --> 01:43:41,840
Speaker 1: That's the big thing that it does. It allows more

1889
01:43:41,880 --> 01:43:43,599
Speaker 1: to be involved, which means you don't have any anti

1890
01:43:43,680 --> 01:43:47,000
Speaker 1: trust violations, which I do think the current college football

1891
01:43:47,000 --> 01:43:49,360
Speaker 1: playoff and the SEC and the Big Ten are creating here,

1892
01:43:53,720 --> 01:43:54,360
Speaker 1: and I think it would be.

1893
01:43:54,360 --> 01:43:54,920
Speaker 2: A lot more fun.

1894
01:43:55,760 --> 01:43:58,640
Speaker 1: Now here's what You would eliminate all bowl games that

1895
01:43:58,680 --> 01:44:00,840
Speaker 1: had nothing to do with the playoffs. But in a

1896
01:44:00,960 --> 01:44:04,040
Speaker 1: twenty you know, you're twenty four, you'd have twenty three games. Right,

1897
01:44:06,960 --> 01:44:09,840
Speaker 1: It's a decent amount of bowl games that you can

1898
01:44:09,880 --> 01:44:12,040
Speaker 1: go all around the country, do some on campus, and

1899
01:44:12,080 --> 01:44:15,360
Speaker 1: then you still have some nice bowl cities to support.

1900
01:44:15,680 --> 01:44:17,760
Speaker 1: And then you move all those bowl games that used

1901
01:44:17,760 --> 01:44:20,640
Speaker 1: to not involve the playoff and you move into the

1902
01:44:20,640 --> 01:44:24,479
Speaker 1: preseason for the following year, and then they become great

1903
01:44:24,520 --> 01:44:28,520
Speaker 1: matchups to kick off the year, and then those matchups

1904
01:44:28,560 --> 01:44:31,639
Speaker 1: count and then you don't have players leaving, you know,

1905
01:44:31,720 --> 01:44:34,599
Speaker 1: sort of opting out to focus on the NFL draft.

1906
01:44:35,680 --> 01:44:38,360
Speaker 1: You let the postseason only be about the playoff teams,

1907
01:44:39,080 --> 01:44:42,240
Speaker 1: and then you have a much bigger, expanded preseason of

1908
01:44:42,439 --> 01:44:45,920
Speaker 1: bowl games that count, and you maybe start a couple

1909
01:44:46,000 --> 01:44:49,400
Speaker 1: weeks earlier in August, and you own the month of August.

1910
01:44:49,880 --> 01:44:52,840
Speaker 1: Not a lot of sports going on right now other

1911
01:44:52,920 --> 01:44:57,320
Speaker 1: than baseball. Speaking of baseball, give you my quick match update.

1912
01:44:57,479 --> 01:45:03,920
Speaker 1: Was at the Cadkavala game yesterday. It was, man, look,

1913
01:45:04,200 --> 01:45:06,640
Speaker 1: when you're out of it like the Nats are, and

1914
01:45:06,680 --> 01:45:08,920
Speaker 1: when you're a fanatic type of fan like I am,

1915
01:45:09,280 --> 01:45:12,240
Speaker 1: you're always looking for a green shoot. So suddenly I'm thinking,

1916
01:45:12,320 --> 01:45:14,600
Speaker 1: Kay Cavali, McKenzie, Gores are one to two going in

1917
01:45:14,640 --> 01:45:16,120
Speaker 1: the next season. That's not so shitty.

1918
01:45:17,520 --> 01:45:18,839
Speaker 2: Anyway, Cade was terrific.

1919
01:45:19,360 --> 01:45:22,400
Speaker 1: We ended up splitting with the Phills as hot as Hades,

1920
01:45:22,439 --> 01:45:23,960
Speaker 1: by the way, in case you're wondering at the game

1921
01:45:24,520 --> 01:45:28,599
Speaker 1: on Saturday, but we had a little hope. Wood drove

1922
01:45:28,640 --> 01:45:30,920
Speaker 1: in the only two runs. I mean it like it

1923
01:45:30,960 --> 01:45:32,559
Speaker 1: was the future. It was sort of like what the

1924
01:45:32,560 --> 01:45:34,439
Speaker 1: future could look like if the Nats are a winning

1925
01:45:34,520 --> 01:45:38,000
Speaker 1: franchise sooner rather than later. Now, let's just hope they

1926
01:45:38,000 --> 01:45:41,919
Speaker 1: have a front office and an ownership that is interested

1927
01:45:41,960 --> 01:45:44,519
Speaker 1: in doing that. All right, So there's my ten minute

1928
01:45:44,520 --> 01:45:47,639
Speaker 1: sports page for you. But I felt like I got

1929
01:45:47,640 --> 01:45:50,400
Speaker 1: a little I had the ability to do a little

1930
01:45:50,439 --> 01:45:53,559
Speaker 1: bit more simply because I had a sports guest.

1931
01:45:53,760 --> 01:45:55,360
Speaker 2: So hopefully your head's.

1932
01:45:55,120 --> 01:45:57,679
Speaker 1: In there, curious what you think of the expanded playoff.

1933
01:45:58,560 --> 01:46:00,320
Speaker 1: My guess is the only people that hate it we'll

1934
01:46:00,360 --> 01:46:02,920
Speaker 1: be SEC fans, because so far in my circle, to

1935
01:46:02,960 --> 01:46:05,120
Speaker 1: my SEC friends that hate it the most, everybody else

1936
01:46:05,200 --> 01:46:07,280
Speaker 1: is like, all right, let me think about it. Right

1937
01:46:07,320 --> 01:46:09,439
Speaker 1: at first, it seems diluted, but then when you start

1938
01:46:09,479 --> 01:46:12,400
Speaker 1: to actually look at the plan makes more sense than

1939
01:46:12,439 --> 01:46:16,040
Speaker 1: you think. It's a better idea and it may actually

1940
01:46:16,160 --> 01:46:20,040
Speaker 1: stabilize college football for a decade or so rather than

1941
01:46:20,080 --> 01:46:22,200
Speaker 1: it changing it seems like every two years.

1942
01:46:23,080 --> 01:46:25,519
Speaker 2: All right, let's do a little last chuck as chuck.

1943
01:46:29,200 --> 01:46:29,519
Speaker 2: All right.

1944
01:46:29,560 --> 01:46:32,599
Speaker 1: First question comes from Jake. Hey, Chuck, Jake here from Phoenix.

1945
01:46:32,640 --> 01:46:35,960
Speaker 1: I'm a former campaign hack to an nonprofit fundraiser, and

1946
01:46:36,040 --> 01:46:37,880
Speaker 1: when I ask about your vision for local media, could

1947
01:46:37,880 --> 01:46:40,200
Speaker 1: there be a crash course or trading path for folks

1948
01:46:40,240 --> 01:46:42,240
Speaker 1: like me who might want a second act in journalism

1949
01:46:42,240 --> 01:46:46,120
Speaker 1: without going back to school full time. Uh, finally, fun

1950
01:46:46,120 --> 01:46:48,240
Speaker 1: thing I heard. I loved watching to meet the press,

1951
01:46:48,240 --> 01:46:50,519
Speaker 1: and when my boys were young they're still young at

1952
01:46:50,600 --> 01:46:52,240
Speaker 1: nine to eleven, but when they were like four or

1953
01:46:52,240 --> 01:46:55,000
Speaker 1: five and six ish really into things like trucks. Try

1954
01:46:55,000 --> 01:46:57,160
Speaker 1: to get them watching with me by making up things

1955
01:46:57,240 --> 01:46:58,320
Speaker 1: like truck Todd.

1956
01:46:58,520 --> 01:46:59,880
Speaker 2: For example, what do.

1957
01:46:59,800 --> 01:47:02,879
Speaker 1: You call Chuck Todd when he's taking out the trash garbage?

1958
01:47:02,880 --> 01:47:03,479
Speaker 2: Truck Todd.

1959
01:47:03,520 --> 01:47:06,680
Speaker 1: The kids didn't quite get this one, man, your dad

1960
01:47:06,760 --> 01:47:10,120
Speaker 1: humor's strong, strong, strong in you, Jake, I like it.

1961
01:47:10,840 --> 01:47:12,439
Speaker 1: But what do you call Chuck Todd at a singles

1962
01:47:12,439 --> 01:47:13,080
Speaker 1: bar pickup?

1963
01:47:13,120 --> 01:47:15,559
Speaker 2: Truck Todd? That's funny, that's funny stuff.

1964
01:47:16,640 --> 01:47:18,200
Speaker 1: I had to share that with you. Thanks for a

1965
01:47:18,240 --> 01:47:20,400
Speaker 1: great show and for creating so much content.

1966
01:47:20,479 --> 01:47:21,240
Speaker 2: Sincerely, Jake.

1967
01:47:21,720 --> 01:47:25,760
Speaker 1: Look, you know the fact that you're throwing yourself into

1968
01:47:25,800 --> 01:47:28,040
Speaker 1: it already. I mean, I think you see you know

1969
01:47:32,000 --> 01:47:35,559
Speaker 1: I'm I have That's what I want to create as

1970
01:47:35,600 --> 01:47:38,599
Speaker 1: a bit of a of a blueprint, you know, if

1971
01:47:38,600 --> 01:47:40,680
Speaker 1: I'm successful at what I'm trying to do here in

1972
01:47:40,720 --> 01:47:44,799
Speaker 1: local news, there's a fairly large platform where I think

1973
01:47:44,840 --> 01:47:46,880
Speaker 1: that if we could turn it into a hub for

1974
01:47:46,960 --> 01:47:51,320
Speaker 1: community information and then you recruit local publishers, right, you know,

1975
01:47:51,360 --> 01:47:53,280
Speaker 1: it could be a local publisher like yourself. If you're

1976
01:47:53,320 --> 01:47:55,760
Speaker 1: raising money for a nonprofit, that's what publishers do, right,

1977
01:47:55,760 --> 01:47:59,200
Speaker 1: You're trying to find the money to do this. You

1978
01:47:59,280 --> 01:48:02,120
Speaker 1: just got to have a norse star. I don't think

1979
01:48:02,160 --> 01:48:03,960
Speaker 1: you need a uh. I don't think you need to

1980
01:48:04,000 --> 01:48:06,000
Speaker 1: go to journalism school. I kind of think I always

1981
01:48:06,000 --> 01:48:08,920
Speaker 1: said journalism is a trade. I've never never thought it

1982
01:48:08,920 --> 01:48:12,680
Speaker 1: should be degreed for what it's worth, you know, I

1983
01:48:12,680 --> 01:48:14,760
Speaker 1: think you should get a degree in something you're an

1984
01:48:14,800 --> 01:48:18,160
Speaker 1: expert in. You know, I don't want a general assignment

1985
01:48:18,200 --> 01:48:22,400
Speaker 1: reporter covering health. I want somebody who's got you know,

1986
01:48:22,400 --> 01:48:26,200
Speaker 1: who's got some credentials in the healthcare industry. Who then

1987
01:48:26,479 --> 01:48:30,640
Speaker 1: you teach them the trade of journalism and how to

1988
01:48:30,720 --> 01:48:34,719
Speaker 1: convey information, fact checks, sources, you know, the difference between

1989
01:48:34,760 --> 01:48:38,200
Speaker 1: on the record, off the record, things like that, and

1990
01:48:38,280 --> 01:48:40,479
Speaker 1: sort of you know what, how to how to put

1991
01:48:40,479 --> 01:48:43,600
Speaker 1: together a fair story, not not balanced. Balance is a

1992
01:48:43,600 --> 01:48:47,280
Speaker 1: bullshit word, right. The only people that say balanced are partisans.

1993
01:48:48,280 --> 01:48:50,920
Speaker 1: Fair is what journalism is about. You call them like

1994
01:48:50,960 --> 01:48:53,559
Speaker 1: you see them, right, an umpire is fair. They don't

1995
01:48:53,560 --> 01:48:56,639
Speaker 1: balance the calls. I've made two safe calls here. I've

1996
01:48:56,640 --> 01:48:57,960
Speaker 1: got to make two safe calls there.

1997
01:48:58,160 --> 01:49:00,639
Speaker 2: Noop, But.

1998
01:49:02,680 --> 01:49:05,240
Speaker 1: I have a feeling you don't need as much as

1999
01:49:05,320 --> 01:49:07,439
Speaker 1: much training as you think. But I take your point,

2000
01:49:07,920 --> 01:49:10,599
Speaker 1: and that is something I'm hopeful to be doing. Look

2001
01:49:10,640 --> 01:49:12,679
Speaker 1: the America, if you're in the middle of what you're doing,

2002
01:49:12,840 --> 01:49:14,680
Speaker 1: I would love to steer you right now to the

2003
01:49:14,720 --> 01:49:18,840
Speaker 1: American Journalism Project. They're a nonprofit entity that is trying

2004
01:49:18,840 --> 01:49:21,559
Speaker 1: to help that is basically there as a helping hand.

2005
01:49:21,560 --> 01:49:24,120
Speaker 1: You said, You're based in Phoenix, Arizona State, and the

2006
01:49:24,160 --> 01:49:29,360
Speaker 1: Cronkite School is involved with something called Newswell. Newswell is

2007
01:49:29,400 --> 01:49:31,400
Speaker 1: run by a woman named Nicole Carroll. She's the former

2008
01:49:31,800 --> 01:49:36,000
Speaker 1: editor in chief of USA Today. She's doing it. She's

2009
01:49:36,479 --> 01:49:41,280
Speaker 1: basically she's been putting together She's gotten a few local publications,

2010
01:49:41,360 --> 01:49:44,280
Speaker 1: you know, as publishers decide not to sell and instead

2011
01:49:45,280 --> 01:49:47,599
Speaker 1: give them to the school to operate and to try

2012
01:49:47,640 --> 01:49:48,920
Speaker 1: to come up with a better way to do it.

2013
01:49:49,000 --> 01:49:52,799
Speaker 1: So I would like, I said, if you're in Phoenix,

2014
01:49:52,840 --> 01:49:54,960
Speaker 1: go reach out to the Kronkite School see if you

2015
01:49:54,960 --> 01:49:55,599
Speaker 1: can connect with.

2016
01:49:55,600 --> 01:49:57,000
Speaker 2: Nicole Carroll and Newswell.

2017
01:49:58,160 --> 01:50:00,559
Speaker 1: They're they're in the middle of this, and I have

2018
01:50:00,600 --> 01:50:03,960
Speaker 1: a feeling they will be very, very helpful to you.

2019
01:50:05,320 --> 01:50:09,120
Speaker 1: So I hope that very specific answer for you there

2020
01:50:09,320 --> 01:50:09,920
Speaker 1: is quite helpful.

2021
01:50:09,920 --> 01:50:10,160
Speaker 2: All right.

2022
01:50:10,200 --> 01:50:13,080
Speaker 1: Next question comes from Chris in Orlando. Good afternoon, check,

2023
01:50:13,120 --> 01:50:15,400
Speaker 1: long time listener, first time caller. You're right about making

2024
01:50:15,439 --> 01:50:17,360
Speaker 1: the Democrats earn the votes needed to turn a district

2025
01:50:17,400 --> 01:50:19,640
Speaker 1: blue by doing the groundwork. But following principle is what

2026
01:50:19,720 --> 01:50:22,920
Speaker 1: led to the Supreme Court getting a conservative supermajority. What

2027
01:50:22,960 --> 01:50:25,160
Speaker 1: Mitch McConnell did to the Supreme Court is what changed

2028
01:50:25,200 --> 01:50:28,000
Speaker 1: my mind about how Republicans behave when they get political power.

2029
01:50:28,400 --> 01:50:30,519
Speaker 1: But my question is in reference to another topic that

2030
01:50:30,560 --> 01:50:32,759
Speaker 1: you like to mention. You have a saying about Miami

2031
01:50:32,760 --> 01:50:35,439
Speaker 1: politics being the future of politics across the States. So

2032
01:50:35,479 --> 01:50:37,919
Speaker 1: I was wondering now when I was more about Miami's

2033
01:50:37,960 --> 01:50:41,120
Speaker 1: the future of sort of America, not necessarily politics politics

2034
01:50:41,200 --> 01:50:44,760
Speaker 1: Miami's kind of grimy, but I take your point there.

2035
01:50:44,800 --> 01:50:46,920
Speaker 1: So I was wondering now that Miami has postponed their

2036
01:50:46,920 --> 01:50:49,240
Speaker 1: elections from twenty five to twenty six, where the Republican

2037
01:50:49,400 --> 01:50:51,719
Speaker 1: Party find a way to postpone elections and remain in power.

2038
01:50:51,800 --> 01:50:54,719
Speaker 1: So think you've misheard me about what I've said. Miami

2039
01:50:54,720 --> 01:50:56,160
Speaker 1: has always been the city of the future.

2040
01:50:56,240 --> 01:50:56,479
Speaker 2: Right.

2041
01:50:56,560 --> 01:50:59,839
Speaker 1: The problems that Miami deals with today are the problems

2042
01:51:00,000 --> 01:51:01,639
Speaker 1: the rest of the country deals with tomorrow.

2043
01:51:01,880 --> 01:51:02,040
Speaker 2: Right.

2044
01:51:02,120 --> 01:51:06,320
Speaker 1: Miami was dealing with an influx of immigrants in nineteen eighty, Right.

2045
01:51:06,360 --> 01:51:07,120
Speaker 2: The eighties were.

2046
01:51:07,000 --> 01:51:10,520
Speaker 1: About that and how to deal with a diversifying population.

2047
01:51:13,080 --> 01:51:15,519
Speaker 1: Now that's what America's dealing with. Right, And there was

2048
01:51:15,880 --> 01:51:18,679
Speaker 1: step backs and step forward. So I you know, it's

2049
01:51:18,680 --> 01:51:22,200
Speaker 1: not about Miami's politics sort of foreshattering, it's sort of

2050
01:51:22,200 --> 01:51:28,679
Speaker 1: the the cultural changes they have. Everything happens in Miami first,

2051
01:51:28,680 --> 01:51:29,040
Speaker 1: and then.

2052
01:51:28,960 --> 01:51:30,720
Speaker 2: It seems you do see it elsewhere.

2053
01:51:32,640 --> 01:51:34,719
Speaker 1: The courts have already said that the City of Miami

2054
01:51:34,720 --> 01:51:39,519
Speaker 1: cannot postpone it selection. And by the way, I know

2055
01:51:39,680 --> 01:51:43,280
Speaker 1: everybody wants to sometimes see a boogeyman around every corner.

2056
01:51:44,400 --> 01:51:48,120
Speaker 1: The city of Los Angeles did the same thing. They

2057
01:51:48,200 --> 01:51:50,920
Speaker 1: used to also be on the odd numbered year, and

2058
01:51:50,960 --> 01:51:53,960
Speaker 1: they extended the terms of everybody one year to move

2059
01:51:54,000 --> 01:51:56,240
Speaker 1: the LA Mayor's races to the even numbered year.

2060
01:51:56,920 --> 01:51:58,880
Speaker 2: So I get that.

2061
01:51:58,960 --> 01:52:04,120
Speaker 1: Everybody, you know sometimes you know every problems, you know,

2062
01:52:04,200 --> 01:52:07,160
Speaker 1: every problem is the nail and every solution is a hammer.

2063
01:52:07,680 --> 01:52:11,000
Speaker 1: This is not what it looks like. I know everybody

2064
01:52:11,000 --> 01:52:13,080
Speaker 1: portrayed it that way because we're living in the Trump

2065
01:52:13,080 --> 01:52:14,320
Speaker 1: era and there's a lot of.

2066
01:52:14,280 --> 01:52:19,120
Speaker 2: Skepticism and distrust. But again, the city of the City

2067
01:52:19,160 --> 01:52:21,120
Speaker 2: of Los Angeles did the same thing a few years back,

2068
01:52:21,120 --> 01:52:23,360
Speaker 2: and they shifted. They used to always be on the

2069
01:52:23,400 --> 01:52:26,160
Speaker 2: off year, on the odd numbered year, and they were

2070
01:52:26,160 --> 01:52:30,880
Speaker 2: having super low turnouts, like in the low teens. You know,

2071
01:52:30,960 --> 01:52:33,680
Speaker 2: a massive city deciding who its mayor is with like

2072
01:52:33,720 --> 01:52:36,360
Speaker 2: seventeen people. That seemed like a bad idea. And so

2073
01:52:36,439 --> 01:52:40,559
Speaker 2: the idea was, hey, coincide with the mid actual midterm election,

2074
01:52:40,680 --> 01:52:45,160
Speaker 2: so there's more you actually have more people show up

2075
01:52:45,200 --> 01:52:51,080
Speaker 2: to vote, and that's you know, is again so I

2076
01:52:51,080 --> 01:52:55,080
Speaker 2: I know you have plenty of reason to be cynical, okay,

2077
01:52:55,320 --> 01:52:58,559
Speaker 2: and you have plenty of reason to be skeptical, but

2078
01:52:59,840 --> 01:53:01,519
Speaker 2: I think on this one, for what, and like I said,

2079
01:53:01,560 --> 01:53:02,679
Speaker 2: for it's what the courts aren't.

2080
01:53:02,520 --> 01:53:06,040
Speaker 1: Letting them do it because they want to change. It

2081
01:53:06,160 --> 01:53:08,080
Speaker 1: still means I actually think it's a good idea to

2082
01:53:08,080 --> 01:53:10,360
Speaker 1: move the election. I mean, when you have these you know,

2083
01:53:10,640 --> 01:53:13,439
Speaker 1: when you have these low turnout odd year elections, that

2084
01:53:13,800 --> 01:53:16,000
Speaker 1: cities go on, but the rest of the state doesn't.

2085
01:53:16,400 --> 01:53:18,760
Speaker 1: It only guarantees that you know, you get. That's how

2086
01:53:18,800 --> 01:53:23,479
Speaker 1: you end up with either fascist mayors or socialist mayors. Okay, right,

2087
01:53:23,520 --> 01:53:25,720
Speaker 1: And if you have a larger turnout of voters, you're

2088
01:53:25,760 --> 01:53:29,320
Speaker 1: going to get something in between those two extremes. Last

2089
01:53:29,400 --> 01:53:32,280
Speaker 1: question comes from John B. And he writes, greetings from

2090
01:53:32,320 --> 01:53:35,839
Speaker 1: Saint Louis, Chuck. I've long enjoyed your podcasts, a thoughtful commentary,

2091
01:53:35,880 --> 01:53:38,000
Speaker 1: and after listening to the Atomic Bowl episode, I wanted

2092
01:53:38,040 --> 01:53:41,320
Speaker 1: to pose a counterfactual. Your guest noted Japan's desire to

2093
01:53:41,360 --> 01:53:43,200
Speaker 1: move on after the war due to their role as

2094
01:53:43,240 --> 01:53:46,640
Speaker 1: aggressor and the immense suffering they caused millions dead in

2095
01:53:46,720 --> 01:53:50,600
Speaker 1: China alone, with atrocities continuing daily until surrender, if the

2096
01:53:50,640 --> 01:53:53,240
Speaker 1: atomic bombs hadn't been used and the war dragged on

2097
01:53:53,360 --> 01:53:56,280
Speaker 1: even weeks longer, when the Allies had faced similar post

2098
01:53:56,280 --> 01:53:59,960
Speaker 1: war criticism in Asia as they did for not bombing

2099
01:54:00,080 --> 01:54:02,360
Speaker 1: the rail lines to concentration camps in Europe.

2100
01:54:02,400 --> 01:54:02,960
Speaker 2: Thanks John B.

2101
01:54:03,439 --> 01:54:11,040
Speaker 1: Look that it's it's a It's an excellent question. It's

2102
01:54:11,040 --> 01:54:13,599
Speaker 1: always been the rationale of why we dropped these bombs,

2103
01:54:13,640 --> 01:54:16,360
Speaker 1: which was too. You know, the Japanese were not going

2104
01:54:16,439 --> 01:54:20,240
Speaker 1: to surrender easily. I mean, arguably they had the war

2105
01:54:20,360 --> 01:54:25,160
Speaker 1: was lost, and yet they weren't surrendering. And you know,

2106
01:54:25,240 --> 01:54:27,519
Speaker 1: the the the way history, the way history has been

2107
01:54:27,520 --> 01:54:30,000
Speaker 1: written on this, if we'd not dropped the bombs, we

2108
01:54:30,040 --> 01:54:32,760
Speaker 1: would have invaded, you know, done a land invasion and

2109
01:54:32,920 --> 01:54:39,800
Speaker 1: et cetera. And yeah, it might have made you may

2110
01:54:39,800 --> 01:54:43,080
Speaker 1: be right, it may have. It may have arguable injust

2111
01:54:43,160 --> 01:54:51,040
Speaker 1: as bad right, But I think the the the hardest

2112
01:54:51,040 --> 01:54:52,760
Speaker 1: thing to defend is the second bomb drop.

2113
01:54:53,320 --> 01:54:55,480
Speaker 2: Right. We can have the conversation.

2114
01:54:55,000 --> 01:54:59,080
Speaker 1: About bomb one, but it was dropping bomb two just

2115
01:54:59,120 --> 01:55:02,200
Speaker 1: three days later because you couldn't because you had it.

2116
01:55:03,520 --> 01:55:06,920
Speaker 1: Rather than saying, hey, we got another one of these.

2117
01:55:08,560 --> 01:55:12,920
Speaker 1: Are you going to surrender or not? And so in

2118
01:55:12,960 --> 01:55:15,200
Speaker 1: that sense, I think that the the the.

2119
01:55:16,840 --> 01:55:17,320
Speaker 2: I think the.

2120
01:55:18,840 --> 01:55:21,320
Speaker 1: I think it is better to focus on on what

2121
01:55:21,560 --> 01:55:27,440
Speaker 1: feels like, what feels like an unnecessary second bomb drop.

2122
01:55:27,480 --> 01:55:30,320
Speaker 1: We can debate whether the first one was necessary or not.

2123
01:55:31,040 --> 01:55:34,600
Speaker 1: And there's there's there's the arguments for it, arguments against it,

2124
01:55:36,720 --> 01:55:38,760
Speaker 1: but it's a lot hard no matter where you stand

2125
01:55:38,760 --> 01:55:41,160
Speaker 1: on those issues. I think it's a much different discussion

2126
01:55:41,160 --> 01:55:45,080
Speaker 1: when you talk about the second bomb drop on that front.

2127
01:55:46,400 --> 01:55:46,520
Speaker 2: Uh.

2128
01:55:46,720 --> 01:55:52,600
Speaker 1: Speaking of Japan, it was an interesting my My daughter

2129
01:55:52,680 --> 01:55:54,640
Speaker 1: was really quizzing me. She was home for a couple

2130
01:55:54,640 --> 01:55:57,280
Speaker 1: of days in between coming back from her summer job,

2131
01:55:57,400 --> 01:56:00,480
Speaker 1: headed back to school for her senior year college. I

2132
01:56:00,480 --> 01:56:04,240
Speaker 1: can't believe I've a college senior. But she was asking

2133
01:56:04,280 --> 01:56:06,400
Speaker 1: me a lot of questions about the Japanese in tournament camp.

2134
01:56:07,080 --> 01:56:11,040
Speaker 1: And she goes, boy, we really don't She goes, we

2135
01:56:11,040 --> 01:56:13,000
Speaker 1: really don't talk about it much, do we. I said, oh, no,

2136
01:56:13,080 --> 01:56:14,960
Speaker 1: we don't. It is it is one of the worst

2137
01:56:15,080 --> 01:56:18,120
Speaker 1: you know. She goes, she goes, it's the second worst

2138
01:56:18,160 --> 01:56:20,720
Speaker 1: thing we've done after slavery, right, And I said, yeah,

2139
01:56:20,760 --> 01:56:26,600
Speaker 1: I think that's a fair that's a fair statement. She

2140
01:56:26,760 --> 01:56:29,120
Speaker 1: was watching. There's a there's a couple of interesting shows

2141
01:56:29,120 --> 01:56:30,720
Speaker 1: that are based there. There's a show she was telling

2142
01:56:30,760 --> 01:56:34,400
Speaker 1: me about that she was watching that's based on It's

2143
01:56:34,440 --> 01:56:37,120
Speaker 1: it's not quite it's not like based on it's based

2144
01:56:37,160 --> 01:56:38,120
Speaker 1: on a true story.

2145
01:56:38,160 --> 01:56:40,320
Speaker 2: It's not a true story, but it's sort of similar.

2146
01:56:40,760 --> 01:56:48,320
Speaker 1: But it was, you know, there's it is a reminder, right,

2147
01:56:48,480 --> 01:56:51,000
Speaker 1: And this is why in some ways that I'm you know,

2148
01:56:51,040 --> 01:56:54,120
Speaker 1: people ask me, how are you optimistic in the Trump era?

2149
01:56:54,240 --> 01:56:56,680
Speaker 1: And I'm like, we've done bad things in this country before,

2150
01:56:56,720 --> 01:57:01,240
Speaker 1: and we've owned it and moved don and try to

2151
01:57:01,320 --> 01:57:05,400
Speaker 1: right the wrong right we've been in Japan's most important ally,

2152
01:57:05,480 --> 01:57:07,760
Speaker 1: We've tried to rebuild the country. We try to repair

2153
01:57:07,800 --> 01:57:12,240
Speaker 1: those relationships. We can never undo what we did, but.

2154
01:57:14,560 --> 01:57:17,440
Speaker 2: We can be in it. We can be a great ally.

2155
01:57:17,160 --> 01:57:22,480
Speaker 1: Going forward, right. And I think it's one of those

2156
01:57:22,520 --> 01:57:26,440
Speaker 1: things that we Americans, we we know and we're we

2157
01:57:26,520 --> 01:57:28,920
Speaker 1: know when we're on the wrong side of history, and

2158
01:57:28,960 --> 01:57:30,480
Speaker 1: we know when we need leaders to put us on

2159
01:57:30,480 --> 01:57:33,280
Speaker 1: the right side of history. And so that's why I

2160
01:57:33,360 --> 01:57:37,520
Speaker 1: continue to remain long term optimistic, even if I'm short

2161
01:57:37,560 --> 01:57:40,280
Speaker 1: term pessimistic. Things could be ugly in the next couple

2162
01:57:40,280 --> 01:57:41,080
Speaker 1: of years.

2163
01:57:41,320 --> 01:57:41,520
Speaker 2: You know.

2164
01:57:41,640 --> 01:57:47,560
Speaker 1: I am really uncomfortable with the idea that in order

2165
01:57:47,640 --> 01:57:53,200
Speaker 1: to fight voter disenfranchisement in Texas, that the Democrats believe

2166
01:57:53,200 --> 01:57:56,720
Speaker 1: they have to do voter disenfranchisement in California. Right, the

2167
01:57:56,800 --> 01:57:59,120
Speaker 1: only thing you can give the Democrats credit for in

2168
01:57:59,160 --> 01:58:02,720
Speaker 1: California versus what the Republicans are doing in Texas is

2169
01:58:02,760 --> 01:58:04,880
Speaker 1: at least Avenusom's going to the voters.

2170
01:58:04,560 --> 01:58:05,720
Speaker 2: And asking for permission.

2171
01:58:06,720 --> 01:58:10,320
Speaker 1: The Texas Republicans don't care about the voters to do that, right,

2172
01:58:10,840 --> 01:58:15,680
Speaker 1: So I do think that that does matter, that distinction matters,

2173
01:58:17,080 --> 01:58:19,920
Speaker 1: But it I do think this is going to lead

2174
01:58:19,960 --> 01:58:22,480
Speaker 1: us down a bad road for the next You know this,

2175
01:58:22,480 --> 01:58:25,440
Speaker 1: this is only going to prolong polarization, This is only

2176
01:58:25,440 --> 01:58:29,680
Speaker 1: going to prolong this era of pugilistic politics that we're in.

2177
01:58:34,160 --> 01:58:37,680
Speaker 1: And so but I you know, again, I get why

2178
01:58:37,680 --> 01:58:41,480
Speaker 1: we're here, and I understand the frustrations that are out there.

2179
01:58:43,520 --> 01:58:48,400
Speaker 1: But again, looking at our history, we've made it, We've

2180
01:58:48,400 --> 01:58:50,640
Speaker 1: taken we've taken the wrong fork in the road a

2181
01:58:50,640 --> 01:58:51,480
Speaker 1: few times.

2182
01:58:52,960 --> 01:58:54,120
Speaker 2: And we found our way back.

2183
01:58:55,480 --> 01:58:58,320
Speaker 1: We'll do it again, just may take longer than we want,

2184
01:58:58,880 --> 01:59:01,880
Speaker 1: all right with that, I'll take a twenty four to

2185
01:59:01,920 --> 01:59:03,160
Speaker 1: thirty six hour break.

2186
01:59:04,160 --> 01:59:12,040
Speaker 2: Until we upload again. M m m hmm.