1 00:00:11,840 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to Okay f Daily with 2 00:00:14,600 --> 00:00:19,279 Speaker 1: Meet your Girl Danielle Moody. Recording from the Home Bunker, Folks, 3 00:00:19,880 --> 00:00:24,120 Speaker 1: this show was recorded before the polls closed for the 4 00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:28,880 Speaker 1: midterm elections, and so the conversation upcoming between Jonathan and 5 00:00:28,960 --> 00:00:32,280 Speaker 1: I is really one at the fifty thousand foot level 6 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:35,879 Speaker 1: of what is at stake and what we do the 7 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:39,600 Speaker 1: day after and the day after that. And here's what 8 00:00:39,680 --> 00:00:42,320 Speaker 1: I want to impart upon, folks. And I know I 9 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:45,000 Speaker 1: say often on this show that you know, I hold 10 00:00:45,120 --> 00:00:48,120 Speaker 1: about a mustard seed of hope, and to be honest, 11 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:51,400 Speaker 1: that's really not true. I've been kind of thinking about 12 00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:55,240 Speaker 1: my relationship to hope and my relationship to faith over 13 00:00:55,760 --> 00:00:58,440 Speaker 1: the last couple of months, but truly the last couple 14 00:00:58,440 --> 00:01:02,760 Speaker 1: of years. And the thing is, I do this work 15 00:01:03,560 --> 00:01:07,600 Speaker 1: on Woke af with my other show, Democracy Ish, writing 16 00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:11,760 Speaker 1: and spending time on social media platforms because I truly 17 00:01:11,800 --> 00:01:14,800 Speaker 1: believe in the promise of this country. I really do. 18 00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:18,399 Speaker 1: I believe that it can be better than what the 19 00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:23,920 Speaker 1: founding fathers have even framed. I believe that there is 20 00:01:24,760 --> 00:01:29,200 Speaker 1: a lot that is good here. And I remember, you know, 21 00:01:29,360 --> 00:01:33,840 Speaker 1: naively when I was younger I remember President Bill Clinton 22 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:36,560 Speaker 1: saying that there is more that is right with America 23 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:39,600 Speaker 1: than that is wrong, and there's nothing that can't be 24 00:01:39,760 --> 00:01:44,880 Speaker 1: fixed about America with what is right about America. I 25 00:01:44,959 --> 00:01:49,080 Speaker 1: remember Barack Obama when he became the talk of the 26 00:01:49,120 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 1: town at convention talking about the fact that there are 27 00:01:51,680 --> 00:01:53,640 Speaker 1: no red states and there are no blue states. They 28 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:57,320 Speaker 1: are just the United States. The reason why I went 29 00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:01,840 Speaker 1: into politics was because I believe that all people in 30 00:02:01,880 --> 00:02:04,800 Speaker 1: this country should be treated with dignity and respect and 31 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:08,679 Speaker 1: have the opportunity to access their version of the American 32 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:14,600 Speaker 1: dream without oppression, without degradation or dehumanization. And so I've 33 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:18,040 Speaker 1: made it my mission in order to wake people up 34 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:21,560 Speaker 1: to their power. It isn't just about waking people up 35 00:02:21,560 --> 00:02:24,040 Speaker 1: and to live in a state of rage all the time, 36 00:02:24,080 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: but it is to understand that we are powerful. Your 37 00:02:27,840 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 1: vote is powerful, your voice is powerful, and if it wasn't, 38 00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:34,760 Speaker 1: then people wouldn't be working overtime to try and silence 39 00:02:34,800 --> 00:02:37,720 Speaker 1: you and to try and throw out the thing that 40 00:02:37,840 --> 00:02:41,080 Speaker 1: makes this country great, which is our ability to choose 41 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:44,400 Speaker 1: our elected officials, the ability to live in a country 42 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:47,320 Speaker 1: that is governed for and by the people. We have 43 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:51,520 Speaker 1: lost sight of that we have become complacent. We have 44 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 1: allowed our elected officials to become complacent and to become 45 00:02:56,120 --> 00:03:00,720 Speaker 1: the fucking proxy of corporate America. And so what I 46 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:05,080 Speaker 1: am saying is that regardless of where things stand right, 47 00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:07,920 Speaker 1: whether there's a red wave or a blue wave, the 48 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:10,160 Speaker 1: reality is is that we need to wake the fuck 49 00:03:10,280 --> 00:03:14,080 Speaker 1: up before we all drowned, right before we all drown 50 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:20,720 Speaker 1: in their ideas of what America should be. We are 51 00:03:20,760 --> 00:03:23,440 Speaker 1: the ones with the power, We are the ones with 52 00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:25,960 Speaker 1: the vision. We are the ones that know what is 53 00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:30,000 Speaker 1: best for ourselves, and for too long we put up 54 00:03:30,040 --> 00:03:32,799 Speaker 1: these representatives because we believe that they knew more than 55 00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 1: we do. The fucking reality is is that if you 56 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:38,080 Speaker 1: see the slate of Republican candidates, you know, good god 57 00:03:38,160 --> 00:03:40,400 Speaker 1: damn well, you know a hell of a lot more 58 00:03:40,440 --> 00:03:42,520 Speaker 1: than they do, and you care a hell of a 59 00:03:42,600 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 1: lot more than they do. So, folks, what I need 60 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 1: us to get to a place of, after we rest, 61 00:03:51,640 --> 00:03:55,640 Speaker 1: after we wipe away tears and wipe our brows right, 62 00:03:55,960 --> 00:03:59,080 Speaker 1: and stretch our sore backs and hands from dialing and 63 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:04,080 Speaker 1: campaigning and canvassing and doing all the things, is that 64 00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:07,640 Speaker 1: I need for you to harken back to those that 65 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:13,080 Speaker 1: fought for freedom and equality and justice that they would 66 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:18,640 Speaker 1: never see. This is not about us anymore. And once 67 00:04:18,640 --> 00:04:23,400 Speaker 1: we remove our egos and our need for immediate gratification away, 68 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:30,359 Speaker 1: then we see a bigger picture, right, We see what 69 00:04:30,600 --> 00:04:37,679 Speaker 1: is actually possible, because possibility doesn't come from a place 70 00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:41,080 Speaker 1: of scarcity. It comes from a place of abundance. It 71 00:04:41,120 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 1: comes from understanding that we can do the audacious things 72 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:48,360 Speaker 1: if we decide to be audacious. And what fear does. 73 00:04:49,480 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 1: What fear does is shrink us into being afraid of 74 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:58,240 Speaker 1: our own fucking shadows, our own neighbors across the street 75 00:04:58,520 --> 00:05:02,320 Speaker 1: or next door, or above us or below. That's what 76 00:05:02,360 --> 00:05:06,599 Speaker 1: Republicans want. They want us living in fear of ourselves 77 00:05:06,600 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 1: and everybody around us, and only they alone can come 78 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:12,680 Speaker 1: in and save the day with their fucking law and order. 79 00:05:13,160 --> 00:05:17,279 Speaker 1: Their law and order and their values are bullshit, and 80 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:23,120 Speaker 1: we know that. So at this time, dear friends, we 81 00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 1: must hold steadfast to who the fuck we are and 82 00:05:26,360 --> 00:05:29,840 Speaker 1: how we want to show up, because regardless whether the 83 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:34,359 Speaker 1: outcome is good, bad, or indifferent, there is still work 84 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:37,440 Speaker 1: to be done. Because this union is not yet perfect, 85 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:40,839 Speaker 1: and it is each generation's responsibility to perfect it to 86 00:05:40,880 --> 00:05:43,400 Speaker 1: the best of our ability and then pass on the baton. 87 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:48,320 Speaker 1: And right now we're doing a shit fucking job because 88 00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:55,520 Speaker 1: we have polluted waters, we have crumbling schools, and we 89 00:05:55,640 --> 00:06:01,800 Speaker 1: have a white supremacist national part that is working to 90 00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:05,520 Speaker 1: assume power. And here's the thing. We know that every 91 00:06:05,640 --> 00:06:09,719 Speaker 1: time that we make progress that there is whitelash. Every 92 00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:12,840 Speaker 1: single time that we move the needle further, that we 93 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:16,560 Speaker 1: bend that are a little more, there is always backlash. 94 00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 1: This ain't nothing new, but the question, and this came 95 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:24,200 Speaker 1: from Ann who you will hear from later in the week, 96 00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:29,120 Speaker 1: The question is how long? How long will the white 97 00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 1: lash be? Because following the Civil War we had reconstruction. 98 00:06:36,120 --> 00:06:39,960 Speaker 1: Reconstruction only lasted twelve years, and then following that reconstruction 99 00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:45,920 Speaker 1: we had Jim Crow for about a hundred. So it 100 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:49,640 Speaker 1: isn't about what that backlash is going to be, because 101 00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:53,520 Speaker 1: that's going to be expected because these are the ancestors. 102 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:57,600 Speaker 1: These are the fucking people whose ancestors were standing in 103 00:06:57,640 --> 00:07:01,360 Speaker 1: front of public schools because they didn't want integration. Right. 104 00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:04,760 Speaker 1: These are the same people that held up bats and 105 00:07:04,839 --> 00:07:08,360 Speaker 1: were beaten queer people for daring to live their lives 106 00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 1: out in the open. These are who these people have 107 00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 1: always fucking been. They ain't dying off. They're like motherfucking gremlins. 108 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:25,560 Speaker 1: So what is being asked is for persistence, is for vigilance, 109 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:28,920 Speaker 1: and is for hope and to have faith that the 110 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 1: work that we're putting in will have impact. If there's 111 00:07:35,240 --> 00:07:38,560 Speaker 1: nothing else to be taken from this time, win or lose, 112 00:07:39,440 --> 00:07:41,920 Speaker 1: it is that we took our eye off the ball. 113 00:07:42,640 --> 00:07:46,920 Speaker 1: We just assumed that democracy was something that would just 114 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:50,120 Speaker 1: continue because it had for over two hundred and some 115 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 1: odd years. But things don't just continue without hard work. 116 00:07:58,520 --> 00:08:03,040 Speaker 1: We don't always get to see the fruits of that labor, 117 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:08,120 Speaker 1: but we plant the seeds anyway. Coming up next, my 118 00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 1: conversation with our friend, our in house doctor, doctor Jonathan Metzel. Hey, 119 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:18,440 Speaker 1: I'm David. Plots of Slates Political Gabfest. As another election 120 00:08:18,720 --> 00:08:22,200 Speaker 1: season accelerates, it can be tricky to sort through all 121 00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:25,119 Speaker 1: the noise and the news. Each week on the gap Fest, 122 00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:28,560 Speaker 1: John Dickerson, Emily Bathlona and I decipher the headlines, break 123 00:08:28,560 --> 00:08:31,840 Speaker 1: down the races, and tell you what issues really matter. 124 00:08:32,200 --> 00:08:35,560 Speaker 1: We do not always agree, We definitely do not always agree, 125 00:08:35,880 --> 00:08:38,920 Speaker 1: but we always deliver thoughtful debate and we always have 126 00:08:38,960 --> 00:08:42,880 Speaker 1: a good time. So subscribe to Slate's Political Gapfest, new 127 00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:47,480 Speaker 1: episodes every Thursday, folks. So you know that whenever we 128 00:08:47,520 --> 00:08:50,440 Speaker 1: have the opportunity to talk to our good, good friend, 129 00:08:50,440 --> 00:08:55,680 Speaker 1: doctor Jonathan Metzel, we are always pleased. Jonathan. At the 130 00:08:55,679 --> 00:08:59,319 Speaker 1: time of this recording, we don't know the official outcome 131 00:08:59,520 --> 00:09:03,439 Speaker 1: of uh the midterm elections, and frankly, even if we 132 00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:05,920 Speaker 1: were recording this a week from the election day, we 133 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:09,400 Speaker 1: may not know. Um. But I want to start off 134 00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 1: today with just kind of you know, taking your temperature. 135 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:21,319 Speaker 1: You have been on a media junket, mad dash, spreading 136 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:24,880 Speaker 1: the good good word about the danger that we are in, 137 00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:28,800 Speaker 1: about what people need to be paying attention to. The 138 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 1: thing Jonathan that you know that I always appreciate about 139 00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 1: you is that you try and weave in optimism, you 140 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:39,559 Speaker 1: try and weave in hopefulness while also sounding the alarm. 141 00:09:39,679 --> 00:09:42,480 Speaker 1: So I just you know, again, folks, as we're as 142 00:09:42,520 --> 00:09:45,839 Speaker 1: we're talking right now, the polls have not even closed yet, 143 00:09:47,040 --> 00:09:50,560 Speaker 1: but I want to get a sense of how you're feeling. 144 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:53,680 Speaker 1: I'll share how I'm feeling, and then we'll talk about 145 00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:58,320 Speaker 1: you know, where we go from here, well, I think 146 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:00,480 Speaker 1: if I had to say again, not knowing that outcome, 147 00:10:01,040 --> 00:10:03,360 Speaker 1: I heard a rumor that Trump got every single vote, 148 00:10:03,360 --> 00:10:07,120 Speaker 1: but I can't confirm it until we know for sure. 149 00:10:08,440 --> 00:10:10,000 Speaker 1: But I would say, if there's a if there's a 150 00:10:10,040 --> 00:10:12,720 Speaker 1: silver lining to all this, it does seem like there 151 00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:15,840 Speaker 1: are an awful lot of people voting, and it does 152 00:10:15,920 --> 00:10:18,480 Speaker 1: feel like people are paying attention. I mean, as you 153 00:10:18,559 --> 00:10:22,240 Speaker 1: and I've been talking about a lot of bad stuff's 154 00:10:22,240 --> 00:10:26,000 Speaker 1: been happening, people understandably are living their lives and just 155 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:30,400 Speaker 1: trying to stay a float right now. But part of 156 00:10:30,400 --> 00:10:33,160 Speaker 1: the reason we're in this pickle right now is because 157 00:10:33,800 --> 00:10:38,800 Speaker 1: January sixth happened, and the Republicans doubled down on running 158 00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:44,840 Speaker 1: for every school board, every election, monitoring every single thing. 159 00:10:45,480 --> 00:10:50,480 Speaker 1: And Democrats, god love them, Um, we're not We're not engaged. 160 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:53,280 Speaker 1: I mean, the Republicans really saw this as a power 161 00:10:53,320 --> 00:10:56,959 Speaker 1: grab moment, and we were doing other things. I mean, certainly, 162 00:10:57,559 --> 00:11:02,320 Speaker 1: you know, saving the economies and important, and stimulus money 163 00:11:02,320 --> 00:11:04,839 Speaker 1: is important, all those kind of things, but we were 164 00:11:04,880 --> 00:11:07,840 Speaker 1: not focusing in the place where the change was really happening. 165 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:09,760 Speaker 1: And I think if we had to do it again, 166 00:11:11,880 --> 00:11:14,440 Speaker 1: you know, the minute all these people were storming school boards, 167 00:11:14,480 --> 00:11:16,720 Speaker 1: we should have like stormed back with our own people 168 00:11:16,760 --> 00:11:18,640 Speaker 1: storming the school boards. And if they were running for 169 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:21,800 Speaker 1: a crazy election post, we should have been running our 170 00:11:21,800 --> 00:11:24,080 Speaker 1: own person for that election post. So I just think 171 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:26,720 Speaker 1: we gave up on the local government angle of this 172 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:29,640 Speaker 1: too much. And I think that's really the issue. But 173 00:11:29,679 --> 00:11:32,720 Speaker 1: I'd say that the optimism is right now. There are 174 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:35,559 Speaker 1: a lot of people who appear to be engaged and 175 00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:40,480 Speaker 1: paying attention, and hopefully that's something we can sustain, you know, 176 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:45,599 Speaker 1: going forward, you know there, I think that there is 177 00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:50,560 Speaker 1: actually a lot to take away from this moment. I 178 00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:54,839 Speaker 1: think one, Jonathan, is that we, oftentimes, and we, I'm 179 00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:58,000 Speaker 1: talking about the big we Democratic Party. We not you 180 00:11:58,080 --> 00:12:02,400 Speaker 1: and I, but we in the Democrat Party often, you know, 181 00:12:02,520 --> 00:12:07,080 Speaker 1: play this game from election to election, from candidate to candidate. 182 00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:09,480 Speaker 1: And what I heard the other day, and I keep 183 00:12:09,520 --> 00:12:12,400 Speaker 1: saying this because I like to get folks's reaction, is that, 184 00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:16,320 Speaker 1: you know, former Senator Doug Jones from Alabama, and if 185 00:12:16,360 --> 00:12:20,200 Speaker 1: you remember, he was placed into the Senate in a 186 00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:24,720 Speaker 1: mid term election because of black women voters in Alabama, 187 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:27,560 Speaker 1: not because of the investment that had been put in 188 00:12:27,640 --> 00:12:34,319 Speaker 1: by the DNC or the DSCC, the big establishment funders 189 00:12:35,160 --> 00:12:37,360 Speaker 1: in order to win his campaign. And he said this, 190 00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:42,720 Speaker 1: He said, the Democratic Party is too vested in candidates 191 00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:47,320 Speaker 1: and not a movement. They move from candidates to candidates 192 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:50,880 Speaker 1: as opposed to here is who we are. Here are 193 00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:55,200 Speaker 1: our values as Democrats, right, and this is and this 194 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:58,440 Speaker 1: is who regardless of the name that is on the ticket, 195 00:12:58,480 --> 00:13:00,520 Speaker 1: this is what they stand for. And I wanted to 196 00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:05,160 Speaker 1: get your reaction to that because I also thought, you know, 197 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,960 Speaker 1: we as Democrats, we love to fall in love with 198 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:11,559 Speaker 1: our candidates. We want to fall in love with them, 199 00:13:11,559 --> 00:13:13,240 Speaker 1: we want to have a beer or a glass of 200 00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:15,520 Speaker 1: wine with them, we want to hang out with them. 201 00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:18,839 Speaker 1: And I don't necessarily think that we need to take 202 00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:23,160 Speaker 1: our democracy like we do dating frankly, right, this is 203 00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:27,120 Speaker 1: so I want to get your reactions to what he said. Well, 204 00:13:27,120 --> 00:13:29,640 Speaker 1: I think that it's not like we have to agree 205 00:13:29,720 --> 00:13:32,200 Speaker 1: on an issue. I mean, I certainly don't think that 206 00:13:32,240 --> 00:13:36,559 Speaker 1: the Republicans all agree on an issue. I think the 207 00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:42,080 Speaker 1: Republicans agree on the importance of power, and so it's 208 00:13:42,120 --> 00:13:45,040 Speaker 1: more like if somebody may or may not agree with 209 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:47,360 Speaker 1: us about this one issue, but the idea of like, 210 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:50,280 Speaker 1: I mean, Republicans understand what it means to take over 211 00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:53,000 Speaker 1: the judiciary. And I feel like with all this noise, 212 00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:56,400 Speaker 1: there have been two people on television who have been 213 00:13:56,520 --> 00:14:01,440 Speaker 1: warning about this for the past two years. Us we've 214 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:08,040 Speaker 1: been saying this ship, you know, spoiler alert, Yeah, like, 215 00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 1: where's already been. We've been saying this ship forever. And 216 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:17,200 Speaker 1: so I just think that I think that it's it's 217 00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:21,920 Speaker 1: not even like everybody agrees on one issue. It's more like, oh, 218 00:14:22,040 --> 00:14:24,720 Speaker 1: that person doesn't agree with me about filling the blank issue, 219 00:14:24,760 --> 00:14:27,760 Speaker 1: therefore I'm not gonna blah blah blah with them. And 220 00:14:28,360 --> 00:14:32,400 Speaker 1: it's more like the bigger goal is not this one issue. 221 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:35,880 Speaker 1: And so I just think that because the Democrats aren't 222 00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 1: going to agree on energy policy, they're not going to 223 00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:43,840 Speaker 1: agree on Middle East policy. I think that if the 224 00:14:43,880 --> 00:14:46,240 Speaker 1: bigger goal is not just like we're all on board 225 00:14:46,280 --> 00:14:48,280 Speaker 1: with one agenda, that's not going to work with the Democrats. 226 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:52,880 Speaker 1: But but the Republicans, the bigger goal is to control 227 00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:56,760 Speaker 1: the judiciary. It's not about any one particular issue. And 228 00:14:56,840 --> 00:14:58,880 Speaker 1: I don't think the Democrats see that. They see it 229 00:14:58,920 --> 00:15:04,160 Speaker 1: as a bunch to different interests that are whatever. So again, 230 00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:06,560 Speaker 1: like because I'm not optimistic that there could be one 231 00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:12,000 Speaker 1: slate that everybody who identifies as a Democrat would agree on. 232 00:15:12,040 --> 00:15:15,880 Speaker 1: I don't think that's there is no core value set, really, 233 00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:19,160 Speaker 1: but I do think if the goal is, like, Okay, look, 234 00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:21,640 Speaker 1: as you and I've been saying, the goal is to 235 00:15:21,720 --> 00:15:28,440 Speaker 1: have people in positions of power who are gonna you know, 236 00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:30,360 Speaker 1: blah blah blah. I mean, I just think of how 237 00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:32,760 Speaker 1: many Democratic candidates have been picked apart because of one 238 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:37,080 Speaker 1: particular issue, and really it's more than Democrats don't ever 239 00:15:37,160 --> 00:15:40,000 Speaker 1: see the bigger picture, or they don't see it often enough. 240 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:43,120 Speaker 1: So I want to push back a little bit because 241 00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:47,000 Speaker 1: I wrote a piece probably a couple of weeks ago 242 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:50,440 Speaker 1: now for the Daily Beast, and the piece was on 243 00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:57,720 Speaker 1: patriotism and the fact that we seed patriotism, we've ceded freedom, liberty, 244 00:15:58,760 --> 00:16:03,040 Speaker 1: family values right all to the far right. And language matters, 245 00:16:03,280 --> 00:16:06,960 Speaker 1: particularly when you're trying to persuade people from one point 246 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:09,440 Speaker 1: of view to the next. So when you say, you know, 247 00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:11,960 Speaker 1: there's not a slate of things that we can agree on, 248 00:16:12,000 --> 00:16:15,520 Speaker 1: and I agree with you to that point, But couldn't 249 00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:19,720 Speaker 1: the banner of freedom be that thing that we are 250 00:16:19,760 --> 00:16:25,400 Speaker 1: coalescing around because frankly, you know, from healthcare, to public 251 00:16:25,520 --> 00:16:29,640 Speaker 1: education to the formation or not forming a family is 252 00:16:29,680 --> 00:16:32,560 Speaker 1: based around the idea that you have freedom, you have 253 00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:34,880 Speaker 1: choice in this country. And so rather than use the 254 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:38,840 Speaker 1: word of choice, we take the word freedom back from them. 255 00:16:39,160 --> 00:16:44,160 Speaker 1: And then whether you're going in front of a climate audience, 256 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:46,080 Speaker 1: or you're going in front of a school board, or 257 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:49,520 Speaker 1: you're going in front of you know, a medical board 258 00:16:49,680 --> 00:16:53,880 Speaker 1: or what have you, that what you're carrying with you, right, 259 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 1: and what you're weaving in is this idea of freedom. 260 00:16:57,360 --> 00:16:59,400 Speaker 1: Is that not something that you think that we can 261 00:16:59,440 --> 00:17:05,120 Speaker 1: coalesce around because we've seeded that conversation and allowed these 262 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:09,520 Speaker 1: red hat you know, rabbit racists to claim that, to 263 00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:12,920 Speaker 1: claim that mantle. I mean, I guess the question would 264 00:17:12,920 --> 00:17:16,879 Speaker 1: be do you feel like defending democracy was enough, was 265 00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:20,520 Speaker 1: concrete enough for people to mobilize around. But that's not 266 00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:22,720 Speaker 1: what I'm talking about. I don't because I'm when I 267 00:17:22,760 --> 00:17:26,880 Speaker 1: say freedom, I'm not just talking about democracy versus fascism. 268 00:17:27,119 --> 00:17:30,399 Speaker 1: I'm literally talking about your freedom to live the life 269 00:17:30,440 --> 00:17:32,880 Speaker 1: that you want to live, that your family wants to live. 270 00:17:33,119 --> 00:17:35,639 Speaker 1: And I think that there are so many ways to 271 00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:40,080 Speaker 1: weave in whatever issue or interest area you want to 272 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:46,240 Speaker 1: under this larger battern of Americans. We're about freedom, right, 273 00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:49,159 Speaker 1: the freedom to live, the freedom to like, and you 274 00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:52,000 Speaker 1: can run down that list. But we don't talk in 275 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:56,080 Speaker 1: that way. We don't speak to the electorate in that way. 276 00:17:56,160 --> 00:17:58,520 Speaker 1: And I wonder if you think, in all of the 277 00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:01,399 Speaker 1: ways in which you have talked to people, particularly those 278 00:18:01,880 --> 00:18:04,679 Speaker 1: in the in the middle and then these red states 279 00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:10,159 Speaker 1: and in these rusted areas, you know, patriotism and freedom 280 00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:13,760 Speaker 1: I think is something that would resonate with them. I mean, 281 00:18:15,080 --> 00:18:17,879 Speaker 1: I don't I don't know. I mean, I'll give you 282 00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:20,479 Speaker 1: a counterexample to that, which I think it is pretty interesting. 283 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:25,720 Speaker 1: The minute New York election was on the I mean, 284 00:18:25,760 --> 00:18:28,440 Speaker 1: it seemed absurd that the New York governor election was 285 00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:33,679 Speaker 1: going to be about crime, because crime is way lower 286 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:37,160 Speaker 1: in New York than it is here in Tennessee. And 287 00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:40,480 Speaker 1: New York actually, for all the crap, has actually been 288 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:45,119 Speaker 1: doing pretty good. Subway ridership is as of last month's 289 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:48,760 Speaker 1: back up to the pre pandemic levels. The more people 290 00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:53,680 Speaker 1: who come back, the more people there are around. So 291 00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:57,639 Speaker 1: this idea of like New York is a burning hellscape 292 00:18:57,720 --> 00:19:01,719 Speaker 1: with immigrants running around with mattresses and all this crazy stuff, 293 00:19:03,600 --> 00:19:06,320 Speaker 1: you know. But the thing is, there are all these 294 00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:08,760 Speaker 1: great things about New York, right, I mean New York, 295 00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:11,960 Speaker 1: as you and I have talked about could you run? 296 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:14,160 Speaker 1: I mean, I just feel like New York. New York 297 00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:16,360 Speaker 1: didn't fight back and say, hey, here's what's great about 298 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:19,400 Speaker 1: New York and here's what fighting for is the ability 299 00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:21,800 Speaker 1: to have like ten million people living in a dense 300 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:26,639 Speaker 1: urban area and bike lanes that go everywhere, and you 301 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:28,719 Speaker 1: can get a train anywhere at night, like just to 302 00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:32,160 Speaker 1: make that cool or something I understand like this, I mean, 303 00:19:32,359 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 1: I know Zeldon was trying to He wasn't. He didn't 304 00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:36,720 Speaker 1: give a crap about New York. He's trying to scare 305 00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:39,760 Speaker 1: people in the suburbs that like exactly who never who 306 00:19:39,800 --> 00:19:42,719 Speaker 1: don't live, who don't live, and don't have a daily 307 00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:46,320 Speaker 1: understanding of what it is like what the beauty that 308 00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:49,239 Speaker 1: you describe last week of being able to bike from 309 00:19:49,320 --> 00:19:51,879 Speaker 1: one borough to the next, and like where in the 310 00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:54,760 Speaker 1: country where you know, can you do that other than 311 00:19:54,800 --> 00:19:58,520 Speaker 1: in New York safely? And so you know, Obama framed 312 00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:01,240 Speaker 1: the election as hope, and that was a guiding principle. 313 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:04,040 Speaker 1: I just felt like New York was caught so flat 314 00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:07,440 Speaker 1: footed that it even New York at a hard time articulating. 315 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:09,760 Speaker 1: And it's not just some random bs like New York 316 00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:16,639 Speaker 1: actually has a relative degree of safety compared to other cities. 317 00:20:17,040 --> 00:20:22,360 Speaker 1: It has public transportation, it has I don't know, as 318 00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:24,080 Speaker 1: you know, I go to the airport every week. It 319 00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:27,639 Speaker 1: takes me nineteen minutes from Atlantic Terminal to JFK Airport 320 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:29,960 Speaker 1: on a Long Island railroad. It costs seventy dollars and 321 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 1: seventy five cents. When I go to the airport here 322 00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:36,240 Speaker 1: in Nashville, it's fifty bucks and I'm stuck in traffic 323 00:20:36,280 --> 00:20:38,800 Speaker 1: for two hours. New York, I can take Long Island 324 00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:42,560 Speaker 1: railroad Atlantic Terminal to Jamaica for less than ten bucks, 325 00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:46,320 Speaker 1: and it always is nineteen minutes. So I just think, 326 00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:49,880 Speaker 1: you know, if you're flat footed all the time, you're 327 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:54,120 Speaker 1: not kind of selling all the stuff. And so I 328 00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:57,040 Speaker 1: just I just think that I don't know, I guess 329 00:20:57,040 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 1: freedom is awfully abstract to me, but I do think 330 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:03,760 Speaker 1: that here's what we're fighting for in New York, and 331 00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:05,879 Speaker 1: then these kind of examples and make it concrete and 332 00:21:05,920 --> 00:21:09,320 Speaker 1: not just New York, but across the country. I would 333 00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:11,080 Speaker 1: like to think that. I mean, I don't know what's 334 00:21:11,119 --> 00:21:13,560 Speaker 1: your sense, because for me, like these zelden Ads, by 335 00:21:13,600 --> 00:21:16,120 Speaker 1: the end, they were just embarrassing. Like you maybe yeah, 336 00:21:16,119 --> 00:21:17,760 Speaker 1: the whole time you were heart you heard it and 337 00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:20,680 Speaker 1: it was like, oh man, somebody trying to jack my shit. 338 00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:25,640 Speaker 1: Um like after thirty after thirty times of hearing, hey, 339 00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:28,639 Speaker 1: somebody's trying to jack your ship, and then you're like, um, 340 00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:33,679 Speaker 1: this is embarrassing, dude. And so but there was no counter, right, 341 00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:36,480 Speaker 1: there was no counter. So we're more like playing offense 342 00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:41,360 Speaker 1: on these things that Hey, there, I want to tell 343 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:44,000 Speaker 1: you about another podcast I think you'll love The Brown 344 00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:46,960 Speaker 1: Girl's Guide to Politics, hosted by a Shanty Gohler the 345 00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:50,399 Speaker 1: President I've Emerged. BGG is the one stop shop for 346 00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:52,560 Speaker 1: women of color who want to hear and talk about 347 00:21:52,600 --> 00:21:55,360 Speaker 1: the world of politics. 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I think that all 353 00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:13,880 Speaker 1: of the things that you lift up as opposed to 354 00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:19,600 Speaker 1: being in a reactionary posture, meaning that the Republicans and 355 00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:23,320 Speaker 1: a Zelden say the cities are filled with crimes and 356 00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:27,400 Speaker 1: undocumented people and disease and all of the whatever rhetoric 357 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:32,000 Speaker 1: that they're using. Democrats normal responses, No, it's not. And 358 00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:35,320 Speaker 1: then to tell you all the ways in which they're 359 00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:37,359 Speaker 1: going to be tougher on crime, and they're going to 360 00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:38,960 Speaker 1: be this, that and the other thing. And what you're 361 00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:41,520 Speaker 1: saying is, why can't we just lift up what's good? 362 00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:44,320 Speaker 1: Why can't you just lift up the reason why New 363 00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:48,600 Speaker 1: York City is one of the beacons and most traveled 364 00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:52,160 Speaker 1: places in the world. Right that the place is you know, yeah, 365 00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:54,840 Speaker 1: the rent is too damn high here, but it's because 366 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:58,080 Speaker 1: everyone wants to be here. And why is that because 367 00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:01,520 Speaker 1: of the offerings that it has. The other day I 368 00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:05,159 Speaker 1: was I had decided to take an evening walk. I 369 00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:09,040 Speaker 1: watched the sunset over the city, walk back home to 370 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:12,679 Speaker 1: my block. It's you know, it was before daylight saving, 371 00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:16,120 Speaker 1: so it's pretty dark outside. I can tell you that 372 00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:21,960 Speaker 1: I have never felt unsafe in my neighborhood. I have 373 00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:27,920 Speaker 1: never felt unsafe when I'm traveling around the city, and 374 00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:32,199 Speaker 1: so his idea of this violence, and I mean, the 375 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,639 Speaker 1: thing that has bothered me is that there is a 376 00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:38,080 Speaker 1: lack of a plan for the homeless in New York 377 00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:42,679 Speaker 1: and that when people left the subways there people have 378 00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:48,160 Speaker 1: set up full, you know, homeless condominiums in the cars, right, 379 00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:50,520 Speaker 1: and so there was a lack of a plan to 380 00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:55,520 Speaker 1: deal and to help those people and to mitigate that issue. 381 00:23:56,760 --> 00:24:00,440 Speaker 1: But again, that wasn't about crime. And so I think 382 00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:05,119 Speaker 1: that the counter to these these these the antics that 383 00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:09,480 Speaker 1: Republicans like Zelden us is to be like, show me 384 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:12,920 Speaker 1: the pictures of how you actually want to live, Hey, Tennessee, 385 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:15,440 Speaker 1: wouldn't it be great if you didn't sit in traffic 386 00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:18,760 Speaker 1: for two hours to just get to you know, a 387 00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:22,200 Speaker 1: mode of transportation. Wouldn't you like to be able to 388 00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:25,960 Speaker 1: bike to work, um and and and and and send 389 00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:29,560 Speaker 1: off your kids and and feel comfortable doing so. And 390 00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:33,640 Speaker 1: instead of it being this reactionary about how tough you are, 391 00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:37,480 Speaker 1: to show like, how great it would be if we 392 00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:40,560 Speaker 1: all had the access to these things. And I love 393 00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:42,639 Speaker 1: your framing of that, and I think that that is 394 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:46,080 Speaker 1: where democrats have missed the boat this time. Around. But 395 00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:50,440 Speaker 1: to me, it doesn't mean that there isn't an opportunity 396 00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,720 Speaker 1: because I this is this is why people have been 397 00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:55,719 Speaker 1: texting me all day Jonathan, and probably the same with 398 00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:57,680 Speaker 1: you and asking you how are you feeling? How are 399 00:24:57,680 --> 00:25:00,239 Speaker 1: you doing today? Selection day? How are you doing? How 400 00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:02,920 Speaker 1: are you feeling? And I got to be honest, I 401 00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:05,760 Speaker 1: feel fine? And why do I feel fine? Why am 402 00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:08,480 Speaker 1: I not filled with anxiety and stress and pulling my 403 00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:11,320 Speaker 1: hair out? Because I know, regardless I'm waking up tomorrow 404 00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:14,280 Speaker 1: to fight for freedom, regardless of what happens, I'm waking 405 00:25:14,359 --> 00:25:16,800 Speaker 1: up tomorrow and I'm doing the same work to try 406 00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:19,600 Speaker 1: and wake people up to their power and that this 407 00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:23,200 Speaker 1: is a long haul movement, right, And you know, if 408 00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:26,960 Speaker 1: Republicans take over, yeah, the work is going to be harder. 409 00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:29,840 Speaker 1: But it's always been hard, right, And that that's kind 410 00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:32,639 Speaker 1: of my reality because if if it's like, if we're 411 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:35,800 Speaker 1: pinning our hopes and dreams on one election or the other, 412 00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:38,600 Speaker 1: then we're always going to be in a place of devastation. 413 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,920 Speaker 1: And that's not where power comes from, right. I Mean, 414 00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:45,520 Speaker 1: you know, it's an interesting proposition because I do are 415 00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:52,560 Speaker 1: people burned out on all this stuff? Quite possibly, you know, 416 00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:55,000 Speaker 1: could we do for America what we're talking about doing 417 00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:57,040 Speaker 1: for New York, which is like, hey, here's what's cool 418 00:25:57,040 --> 00:26:03,119 Speaker 1: about America and then kind of make the other side 419 00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:07,040 Speaker 1: uncool by nature of you being cool. Now, I don't 420 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:09,840 Speaker 1: know how you're feeling. I kind of really can't see 421 00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:14,120 Speaker 1: Biden running again, to be honest, And if that's the case, 422 00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:17,879 Speaker 1: then the Democrats will have the chance to reset again. 423 00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:20,480 Speaker 1: I have no inside information. I just I know the 424 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:24,280 Speaker 1: cards seem like it's probably time for like there might 425 00:26:24,280 --> 00:26:26,879 Speaker 1: be a change. That's just my feeling, I'm you know, 426 00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:29,880 Speaker 1: And so whatever happens, that the Democrats have a chance 427 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:34,760 Speaker 1: maybe for a reset. But it's also I don't know, 428 00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:37,320 Speaker 1: there's so much like crap going on with just the 429 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:40,600 Speaker 1: machinery of elections that it's going to take a lot 430 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:43,960 Speaker 1: of work. Yeah, I think that it's all going to 431 00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:45,639 Speaker 1: take a lot of work. I don't know if Biden 432 00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:48,080 Speaker 1: is going to run again. I can't imagine that he 433 00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:52,080 Speaker 1: won't barring some type of like medical disaster. I don't 434 00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:55,119 Speaker 1: see him seating and saying like, oh, I'm not going 435 00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:57,440 Speaker 1: to run. And then we open up the clown car 436 00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:00,480 Speaker 1: of a primary to figure out who is going to 437 00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:05,840 Speaker 1: come up behind him. There was an awful it was funny, 438 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:09,359 Speaker 1: but it was like also sad snl skit. That was 439 00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:12,200 Speaker 1: all about the Democrats going back to the same people 440 00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:15,640 Speaker 1: over and over again to be the champions of this party. 441 00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:20,120 Speaker 1: And it's just like, you know, I don't foresee anything 442 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:23,639 Speaker 1: different than what they've been doing. But what I'm saying 443 00:27:23,760 --> 00:27:26,960 Speaker 1: is that people can do things that are different, right, 444 00:27:27,040 --> 00:27:29,920 Speaker 1: Like we have to be the ones that are challenging 445 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:33,280 Speaker 1: these people to be different. And it doesn't we can't 446 00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:38,600 Speaker 1: just care about our freedoms every two and four years 447 00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:41,320 Speaker 1: and then the time in between we just kind of 448 00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:43,800 Speaker 1: throw up our hands or bury our heads in the sand, 449 00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:48,160 Speaker 1: Like that's we've lost that privilege because we hadn't been 450 00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:52,040 Speaker 1: vigilant this entire time about the courts about our democracy. 451 00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:55,520 Speaker 1: So the privilege of just walking around dazed and confused 452 00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:58,800 Speaker 1: is over. And that's kind of what I want people 453 00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:02,520 Speaker 1: to take away from the mid term is that like, yeah, 454 00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:06,560 Speaker 1: not being engaged or saying politics isn't for you, that 455 00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:12,199 Speaker 1: time has passed. Yeah, I mean you know, remember like 456 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:16,119 Speaker 1: it and it's not even like democracy or equality, Like 457 00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:19,080 Speaker 1: remember when all these people were storming the school boards 458 00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:23,000 Speaker 1: demanding no more books and stuff like that when they 459 00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:25,600 Speaker 1: were burning the books on top of burning masks. Yeah, 460 00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:28,760 Speaker 1: and you and I were saying, like, where's the counter 461 00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:32,120 Speaker 1: to that? So it's not like, but like where were 462 00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,399 Speaker 1: the ten thousand people out there in support of having 463 00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:37,199 Speaker 1: lots of books in the library, you know what I mean? Like, 464 00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:39,640 Speaker 1: it's not even like it's got to be some one thing, 465 00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:43,000 Speaker 1: but it just feels like one there's no counter to 466 00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 1: a lot of this stuff that is about daily life. Also, Yeah, 467 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:48,880 Speaker 1: so we'll see. I'm I'm curious to know what we 468 00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:51,360 Speaker 1: know by tomorrow when the show ends. Right now, we're 469 00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:55,240 Speaker 1: obviously talking into a in the show airs. Obviously, we're 470 00:28:55,240 --> 00:29:00,560 Speaker 1: talking to a vacuum right now. But yeah, so you know, 471 00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:03,520 Speaker 1: let with the last minute or so that we have, 472 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:09,960 Speaker 1: if Democrats are able to squeak out a win, what 473 00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:13,320 Speaker 1: do you think we do next? I don't think they're 474 00:29:13,320 --> 00:29:17,479 Speaker 1: gonna sweek out a win. Maybe I'm this is Devil's 475 00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:23,560 Speaker 1: Advocate Jonathan. Oh, yeah, that's true. A good point. Um, 476 00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:30,520 Speaker 1: I think corrupt all the voting machines and uh, and no, 477 00:29:30,560 --> 00:29:39,080 Speaker 1: I was kidding. I think I just have a feeling 478 00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:41,600 Speaker 1: that people are awfully burned out on all this crap, 479 00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:44,800 Speaker 1: and I feel like if there was some reasonable way 480 00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:49,120 Speaker 1: to come back towards some kind of middle ground, that 481 00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:56,000 Speaker 1: is even possible. Um, I don't know. It's just like 482 00:29:56,040 --> 00:30:00,600 Speaker 1: you're not going to out Trump Trump or to Santists 483 00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:03,560 Speaker 1: or whoever. But it does seem like it does open 484 00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:07,120 Speaker 1: up a space to like, I don't know, maybe that's 485 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:09,720 Speaker 1: too hopeful, but that is kind of my feeling. I mean, 486 00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:13,040 Speaker 1: even the right wingers I interview, they're like, I mean, 487 00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:15,200 Speaker 1: I do think a lot of people are afraid right now, 488 00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:18,560 Speaker 1: and so I don't know, but I know the negative 489 00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:22,240 Speaker 1: affect always takes the air out of the room. So 490 00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:25,360 Speaker 1: but yeah, but I do feel like the root the 491 00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:28,239 Speaker 1: attack is to the center, not to the extreme. I 492 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:32,440 Speaker 1: feel like, if what happens after this election is it's 493 00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:37,600 Speaker 1: Marjorie Taylor Green against AOC for the next three decades, 494 00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:39,960 Speaker 1: then the Democrats were just going to be a perennial 495 00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:43,360 Speaker 1: protest party. So I don't know, that's my feel How 496 00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:46,720 Speaker 1: would you answer that question? How I answer it is 497 00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:50,600 Speaker 1: that you know, people need to understand that our rights 498 00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:54,600 Speaker 1: and privileges that we have in this country don't go 499 00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:58,160 Speaker 1: by election cycle, And the reality is is that you know, 500 00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:01,120 Speaker 1: I am going back to you. And I continue to 501 00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:03,280 Speaker 1: say this on Wokaeth and every other show that I 502 00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:06,280 Speaker 1: am on, that I'm going back to the roots of abolition. 503 00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:13,880 Speaker 1: They had an audacious idea about abolishing the founding economy 504 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:19,160 Speaker 1: of this country after centuries of watching enslaved human beings 505 00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:25,160 Speaker 1: beat down, broken apart, terrorized and murdered and raped for centuries, 506 00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:28,840 Speaker 1: and they had this audacious vision to end it and 507 00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:32,160 Speaker 1: what would what could we what could we do instead? 508 00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:34,959 Speaker 1: And they kept at it and they did not for 509 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:37,240 Speaker 1: those that were fighting, those that were free and those 510 00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:39,440 Speaker 1: that were enslaved. For those that were fighting, they were 511 00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:41,960 Speaker 1: fighting for something that they would never see. And so 512 00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:44,360 Speaker 1: I kind of need people to pull themselves and this 513 00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:48,120 Speaker 1: is me saying this, to pull themselves out of marinating 514 00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:50,960 Speaker 1: in the misery and start to think about what they 515 00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:54,160 Speaker 1: are going to do to recharge and refocus and think 516 00:31:54,280 --> 00:31:57,840 Speaker 1: not inside of their own egos about the immediate gratification 517 00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:00,120 Speaker 1: about what they want to see, but what they want 518 00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:02,760 Speaker 1: their legacies to be. Yeah, that's where I want people 519 00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:05,760 Speaker 1: to think. That's what I want the tomorrow and the 520 00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:08,240 Speaker 1: day after tomorrow and the day after that to be 521 00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:11,400 Speaker 1: about because it cannot be just about what we need 522 00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:15,080 Speaker 1: in this moment, because what we need no longer matters. 523 00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:19,360 Speaker 1: You know, if let's just say, for conversation's sake, Biden 524 00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:22,480 Speaker 1: doesn't run again, it will be an opportunity for the 525 00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:27,520 Speaker 1: Democrats to define their values. I think that, you know, 526 00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:32,840 Speaker 1: there's that opportunity. So you know, again, who knows what 527 00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:34,640 Speaker 1: this opportunity will be and who does what'll happen. But 528 00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:37,600 Speaker 1: if that's the case, it does seem like something like 529 00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:40,960 Speaker 1: that might come up organically. But again, you know, I 530 00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:43,320 Speaker 1: don't want to I'm not trying to push anybody out 531 00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:48,360 Speaker 1: the doors the President of the United States with that, Jonathan. 532 00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:51,680 Speaker 1: By the time that this airs, we still probably will 533 00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:55,880 Speaker 1: have no idea where things lie. But I hope that 534 00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:58,800 Speaker 1: folks that are listening to this recognize and start to 535 00:32:58,840 --> 00:33:02,760 Speaker 1: think about where their fight is going to lie. Regardless 536 00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:06,040 Speaker 1: of the outcome of this election. It may be easier, 537 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:10,040 Speaker 1: it may be much harder, but regardless, we're still going 538 00:33:10,080 --> 00:33:12,520 Speaker 1: to have to fight. And that's just the reality of 539 00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:16,680 Speaker 1: what it means to be part of a democracy. It 540 00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:20,520 Speaker 1: doesn't just happen. Thank you, dear friend, for making the 541 00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:23,760 Speaker 1: time to join us. We appreciate you, my pleasure see 542 00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:31,640 Speaker 1: you guys. That is it for me today. Dear friends 543 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:35,719 Speaker 1: on woke f As always, power to the people and 544 00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:40,000 Speaker 1: to all the people. Power, get woke and stay woke 545 00:33:40,040 --> 00:33:40,440 Speaker 1: as fuck.