1 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:12,160 Speaker 1: Hey, or hey, are you a fan of molecular gastronomy. 2 00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:15,880 Speaker 1: Molecular gastronomy is that like molecular astronomy, but you eat 3 00:00:15,920 --> 00:00:19,560 Speaker 1: it exactly. They used chemistry to like transform the texture 4 00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:21,920 Speaker 1: of your food into foams, so you might get like 5 00:00:22,120 --> 00:00:26,319 Speaker 1: burrito bubbles for example. I'm not sure burritos need to 6 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 1: give you more gas. Well, if you're not into spherical sandwiches, 7 00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:32,360 Speaker 1: then I've got an idea for a new frontier and 8 00:00:32,440 --> 00:00:37,960 Speaker 1: eating high energy physics gastronomy. What's that like proton pasta 9 00:00:38,159 --> 00:00:41,920 Speaker 1: or bosonic burritos? Did you already invest in this startup? No? No, 10 00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:44,479 Speaker 1: I'm thinking more about spices. What if you had a 11 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:48,200 Speaker 1: device that accelerated and heated up your spices and shot 12 00:00:48,240 --> 00:00:52,639 Speaker 1: them out of a gun like the large any accelerator Exactly? 13 00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:55,320 Speaker 1: Would you like a little molten salt on your proton pasta? 14 00:00:56,280 --> 00:00:57,760 Speaker 1: I think you should get your money back, But I 15 00:00:57,760 --> 00:01:15,200 Speaker 1: wonder what's for dessert. Hi, I'm more handmade cartoonists and 16 00:01:15,200 --> 00:01:17,959 Speaker 1: the creator of PhD comics. Hi, I'm Daniel. I'm a 17 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:21,319 Speaker 1: particle physicist and a professor you see Irvine, and I 18 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:24,720 Speaker 1: am actually a big fan of toasted spices when it 19 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:30,560 Speaker 1: was toasted spices like you pour spices on your toast raven. No, 20 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:33,319 Speaker 1: when you're cooking, you're supposed to warm up your spices, 21 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:35,760 Speaker 1: makes them volatile by toasting them in the pan, you know, 22 00:01:35,760 --> 00:01:38,880 Speaker 1: it like brings them to life. Oh I see, I see, 23 00:01:38,920 --> 00:01:40,880 Speaker 1: I see. Like if you don't put the spices at 24 00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:43,160 Speaker 1: the end, you cook with the spices. Yeah, you gotta 25 00:01:43,160 --> 00:01:45,680 Speaker 1: put the spices in the pan first so they warm 26 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 1: up and become alive, and then you eat them. And 27 00:01:49,440 --> 00:01:53,200 Speaker 1: then you eat them exactly interesting. Have you dug into 28 00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:55,040 Speaker 1: the physics of that. I've taken a big bite out 29 00:01:55,080 --> 00:01:57,000 Speaker 1: of it, But I wouldn't say I understood the science. 30 00:01:57,240 --> 00:01:59,840 Speaker 1: I see. It's more of an experimental thing. I guess. 31 00:02:00,240 --> 00:02:03,040 Speaker 1: Hands on so far, it's just exploratory. But I'm sure 32 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:05,600 Speaker 1: my wife, the biochemist, could explain to you why volatile 33 00:02:05,640 --> 00:02:10,760 Speaker 1: molecules create better reactions in the news, why being volatiles tastier? Anyways, 34 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:13,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to our podcast, Daniel and Jorge Explain the Universe, 35 00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:16,040 Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Radio in which we spice 36 00:02:16,160 --> 00:02:19,200 Speaker 1: up the universe by explaining all of it to you. 37 00:02:19,440 --> 00:02:21,880 Speaker 1: We go out there and dig into black holes to 38 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 1: understand what's going on on the inside. We take apart 39 00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:28,040 Speaker 1: the core of neutron stars. We dig deep into the 40 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 1: earth and into all the tiny particles that make it 41 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:33,400 Speaker 1: up in order to tease them apart and spice up 42 00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 1: your life with a little bit of understanding. That's right, 43 00:02:36,040 --> 00:02:38,800 Speaker 1: because it is a pretty tasty universe, full of amazing 44 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:45,320 Speaker 1: flavors and colors and textures and deliciousness to discover, and 45 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:47,359 Speaker 1: we like to serve it to you in a three 46 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:50,120 Speaker 1: course meal. Here. I think there's an interesting and unexplored 47 00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:52,799 Speaker 1: philosophy question there. You know, some people ask is it 48 00:02:52,880 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 1: necessary for us to find the universe beautiful? But I 49 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:57,080 Speaker 1: don't know if anybody has ever explored the question of 50 00:02:57,440 --> 00:02:59,919 Speaker 1: is it necessary for us to find the universe tasty? 51 00:03:00,360 --> 00:03:02,120 Speaker 1: Could we have evolved in the universe that we just 52 00:03:02,160 --> 00:03:05,720 Speaker 1: found kind of gross to eat? Well, I don't think 53 00:03:05,760 --> 00:03:09,560 Speaker 1: it's necessary, but it's certainly nicer that things taste good 54 00:03:10,040 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 1: and look nice. It would be kind of a bleak. 55 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:16,480 Speaker 1: I guess if everything didn't look nice or taste good. Yeah, 56 00:03:16,560 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 1: what if we evolved in an ugly, bland universe? Boy, 57 00:03:20,320 --> 00:03:22,840 Speaker 1: I'm sure glad we didn't. Or maybe we just lower 58 00:03:22,880 --> 00:03:26,000 Speaker 1: our bar and start to appreciate the the ugliness of 59 00:03:26,040 --> 00:03:29,080 Speaker 1: the universe. Maybe maybe that's what happened. Maybe there's another 60 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 1: version of the universe where everything is more beautiful and 61 00:03:32,240 --> 00:03:35,160 Speaker 1: more delicious interesting. So you think aliens would come to 62 00:03:35,240 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 1: Earth and be like, boy, what a crappy place. Look 63 00:03:37,960 --> 00:03:41,480 Speaker 1: at all this blue stuff and call the sky gets 64 00:03:41,480 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: all red. That's disgusting. Yeah, there's another unexamined frontier. When 65 00:03:45,120 --> 00:03:47,800 Speaker 1: aliens do come, they wouldn't just teach us about the universe. 66 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 1: They might give us tips about how to cook, hopefully 67 00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:54,280 Speaker 1: not how to cook us, hopefully not a direct lesson 68 00:03:54,880 --> 00:03:58,120 Speaker 1: spices to serve to humanity, not new spices to serve 69 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:01,680 Speaker 1: with you. Finally, get up humans really sort of makes 70 00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:06,119 Speaker 1: it more volatile, really activate activates their flavors. I don't 71 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:10,480 Speaker 1: think we want to learn about that dry aged Yeah, 72 00:04:11,640 --> 00:04:13,760 Speaker 1: but anyways, it is a wonderful universe that we like 73 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:16,279 Speaker 1: to talk about, and we'll hopefully we'll be here for 74 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:18,640 Speaker 1: a long time to sort of appreciate how did walls 75 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:20,880 Speaker 1: and how it changes and how it gets more and 76 00:04:20,960 --> 00:04:23,920 Speaker 1: more interesting and complex. And in order to stick around 77 00:04:23,960 --> 00:04:27,200 Speaker 1: a long time, we need to power our lifestyle. We 78 00:04:27,240 --> 00:04:30,240 Speaker 1: need to provide energy for our burners and for our 79 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 1: oven so that we can continue to cook and bake 80 00:04:33,120 --> 00:04:36,599 Speaker 1: delicious things to eat. As our society gets more and 81 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:40,760 Speaker 1: more complex, we have a larger and larger appetite for energy. Yeah, 82 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 1: and so far in human history, we've basically resorted to 83 00:04:43,760 --> 00:04:47,440 Speaker 1: one source of energy for most of you know, our existence, 84 00:04:47,560 --> 00:04:50,520 Speaker 1: and that is to basically burn stuff. You know, take 85 00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:53,440 Speaker 1: wood and set it on fire, or find oil and 86 00:04:53,480 --> 00:04:56,200 Speaker 1: set it on fire. And it's kind of dirty and 87 00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:59,839 Speaker 1: not as efficient as it could be. It's really shockingly inefficient. 88 00:04:59,839 --> 00:05:02,520 Speaker 1: And the amount of energy you take out of coal 89 00:05:02,560 --> 00:05:04,839 Speaker 1: when you burn it or when you burn wood is 90 00:05:04,880 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 1: really a tiny, tiny fraction of the energy that's in there. 91 00:05:08,440 --> 00:05:10,599 Speaker 1: It's like you find Bill gates wallet and you just 92 00:05:10,680 --> 00:05:12,479 Speaker 1: take a single dollar out of there and then give 93 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:15,880 Speaker 1: it back to him. That would be would be shocking 94 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:19,800 Speaker 1: to you. That seems just like the right thing to be. No, 95 00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:22,360 Speaker 1: clearly you should give Bill Gates his wallet back with 96 00:05:22,400 --> 00:05:25,080 Speaker 1: all of his billions, but it's you know, maybe another 97 00:05:25,080 --> 00:05:28,159 Speaker 1: analogy is like we're thirsty and we're standing next to 98 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 1: a rushing river, but we're just like sucking droplets of 99 00:05:31,440 --> 00:05:34,279 Speaker 1: water from the grass nearby. Yeah, because I guess we've 100 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:39,200 Speaker 1: only resorted to chemical means to extract energy out of matter, right, 101 00:05:39,279 --> 00:05:42,000 Speaker 1: We only sort of release the energy that's trapped in 102 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:44,279 Speaker 1: the chemical bonds of materials. But it turns out that 103 00:05:44,279 --> 00:05:46,960 Speaker 1: if you go deeper and smaller, you can release a 104 00:05:46,960 --> 00:05:50,240 Speaker 1: whole bunch more energy. Yeah. At this sort of maximum 105 00:05:50,279 --> 00:05:54,680 Speaker 1: efficiency would be to take particles and antiparticles and annihilate 106 00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:58,640 Speaker 1: them into pure energy. If you had a huge source 107 00:05:58,720 --> 00:06:02,240 Speaker 1: of antimatter, for examp couple, you could generate energy very, 108 00:06:02,360 --> 00:06:05,920 Speaker 1: very efficiently. You turn a hundred of the energy stored 109 00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:10,479 Speaker 1: in matter into energy. But of course antimatter not very plentiful, 110 00:06:10,839 --> 00:06:14,000 Speaker 1: very expensive to make, and so not really a practical 111 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:18,400 Speaker 1: choice for energy production. You're not pro antimatter. I love antimatter. 112 00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:20,159 Speaker 1: It's wonderful. I wish we had so much more of it, 113 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:21,919 Speaker 1: so we could study it and do all sorts of 114 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 1: things with it, and we could fuel all of our 115 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:26,320 Speaker 1: desires and charge up all of our bones with it. 116 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:29,120 Speaker 1: But it costs more energy to make antimatter than you 117 00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:32,200 Speaker 1: get out of the antimatter afterwards, so it's not efficient 118 00:06:32,240 --> 00:06:34,720 Speaker 1: for commercial industries for example. Right, Well, I think what 119 00:06:34,760 --> 00:06:37,000 Speaker 1: you're saying is that if we could somehow take pure 120 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:39,960 Speaker 1: matter and transform it into pure energy, there would be 121 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 1: a huge amount of energy, even just like a drop 122 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:46,320 Speaker 1: of water or even a tiny little raisin. A single 123 00:06:46,480 --> 00:06:50,760 Speaker 1: raisin has more energy stored in it than a nuclear bomb. 124 00:06:51,320 --> 00:06:54,120 Speaker 1: It's an incredible amount of energy that's all around us. 125 00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 1: It's just bound up. It's just tightly contained in the 126 00:06:57,400 --> 00:07:00,440 Speaker 1: atoms and the molecules that we are surrounded with. We 127 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:03,440 Speaker 1: haven't been great at figuring out how to tap into 128 00:07:03,440 --> 00:07:06,039 Speaker 1: that energy, right because I guess the energy inside of 129 00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:09,480 Speaker 1: a raisin likes to stay there, right, Like a raisin 130 00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:11,840 Speaker 1: I didn't want to give up its energy, or it 131 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:13,760 Speaker 1: doesn't want to turn into energy like it would take 132 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:17,840 Speaker 1: a lot of energy just to unlock that energy. Raisins 133 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 1: are not like particles. They don't just decay, right, They 134 00:07:20,040 --> 00:07:22,280 Speaker 1: just hang out. You take a raisin and you leave 135 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:24,600 Speaker 1: it in space, you come back a billion years later, 136 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:27,520 Speaker 1: you'll still have a raisin most likely. So raisins are 137 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:31,080 Speaker 1: stable elements of the universe exactly. This is energy locked 138 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:34,160 Speaker 1: into a certain configuration. To release it, you have to 139 00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:36,680 Speaker 1: somehow pride apart. One way to do that is to 140 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:40,520 Speaker 1: collide with an anti raisin, But without anti raisins floating around, 141 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:43,480 Speaker 1: it's harder to crack open that raisin. Right, Well, I 142 00:07:43,480 --> 00:07:46,960 Speaker 1: guess you could eat the raisin and somehow convert that 143 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:50,040 Speaker 1: to energy. Maybe you could, but humans are not very 144 00:07:50,080 --> 00:07:53,560 Speaker 1: efficient at extracting energy from stuff. You know, most of 145 00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:55,680 Speaker 1: the stuff in the raisin just passes right through you, 146 00:07:55,800 --> 00:07:58,800 Speaker 1: and the energy stored in its matter you don't even touch. 147 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:02,680 Speaker 1: Humans do like a chemical rearrangement of some of the 148 00:08:02,760 --> 00:08:06,280 Speaker 1: bonds in the raisin extract a tiny, tiny little sliver 149 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 1: of that energy, which is why the matrix doesn't make 150 00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:11,480 Speaker 1: any sense. You know, humans and sources of energy. I mean, 151 00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:15,080 Speaker 1: come on, that's the part that doesn't make sense. That's 152 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:17,480 Speaker 1: the part that drives me crazy. That's the physics of 153 00:08:17,520 --> 00:08:23,520 Speaker 1: it right there. You're like, you're so inefficient computers and 154 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 1: they have to power a hyper realistic simulated world. There's 155 00:08:26,560 --> 00:08:30,160 Speaker 1: no way they're doing that with human batteries. They should 156 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:33,760 Speaker 1: have used raisins. Maybe, yes, yes, exactly. Raisins are more efficient, 157 00:08:34,640 --> 00:08:38,000 Speaker 1: So chemical means have a limit. So over the years, 158 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:41,200 Speaker 1: humans have tried other things, right, more intricate physical ways 159 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:44,080 Speaker 1: to do things, and that includes fusion. Yeah, we have 160 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:47,440 Speaker 1: looked up into the sky and seeing a fusion reactor 161 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:49,960 Speaker 1: at work. Right, Most of the energy that it is 162 00:08:50,040 --> 00:08:53,640 Speaker 1: here on Earth originally came here Rhea the sun, the 163 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:56,200 Speaker 1: rays from the Sun, which are in the end the 164 00:08:56,240 --> 00:08:58,600 Speaker 1: output of a fusion reactor at the heart of the 165 00:08:58,640 --> 00:09:02,440 Speaker 1: star pushing high juging together to form helium. It's much 166 00:09:02,480 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 1: more efficient than chemical burning, although much less efficient still 167 00:09:06,760 --> 00:09:10,760 Speaker 1: than matter antimatter production. Interesting, and there's also fission, right, 168 00:09:10,800 --> 00:09:13,360 Speaker 1: I mean, we've sort of done both in terms of 169 00:09:13,400 --> 00:09:16,600 Speaker 1: at least nuclear weapons fusion and fission, but in terms 170 00:09:16,640 --> 00:09:20,920 Speaker 1: of making energy power plants, we've only really used fission plans, right, 171 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:23,720 Speaker 1: that's right. Fusion has a lot of advantages. It's much 172 00:09:23,720 --> 00:09:26,760 Speaker 1: more efficient, it doesn't produce any waste. You can use 173 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:30,480 Speaker 1: water essentially as fuel. But we haven't really managed to 174 00:09:30,559 --> 00:09:32,600 Speaker 1: make it work yet. There are a lot of efforts 175 00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:34,760 Speaker 1: in that direction, people working on it. We have a 176 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:37,600 Speaker 1: couple of episodes on how to make fusion power possible. 177 00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:40,480 Speaker 1: But fusion is one of these technologies that always seems 178 00:09:40,480 --> 00:09:44,240 Speaker 1: to be about twenty five years off, whereas fission splitting 179 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:47,120 Speaker 1: atoms in half and extracting the energy when a heavy 180 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:49,840 Speaker 1: atom breaks up. That is something we have working that 181 00:09:49,960 --> 00:09:52,959 Speaker 1: is part of the electrons that you are probably using 182 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:56,400 Speaker 1: come from fission power plants. Yeah, if you're in Europe, 183 00:09:56,440 --> 00:09:59,280 Speaker 1: most likely you're the energy you're using to listen to 184 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:02,959 Speaker 1: this podcast came from a fission power plant. And you're 185 00:10:02,960 --> 00:10:05,920 Speaker 1: in the U. S. There's a pretty high likelihood also, right, Yeah, 186 00:10:05,960 --> 00:10:08,480 Speaker 1: it's a significant fraction depending on the country. In France, 187 00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 1: for example, they have a very large fraction of their 188 00:10:10,800 --> 00:10:13,360 Speaker 1: energy comes from nuclear power plants. Yeah, and it's been 189 00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:16,560 Speaker 1: around for maybe like sixty years, right, a long time, 190 00:10:17,080 --> 00:10:19,520 Speaker 1: like this is old technology now, Yeah, the first power 191 00:10:19,559 --> 00:10:22,160 Speaker 1: plants were developed in the fifties, not long after we 192 00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:25,120 Speaker 1: cracked open the atom and developed the weapons technology in 193 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:28,240 Speaker 1: the forties. So it's been around for a long long time. 194 00:10:28,480 --> 00:10:32,800 Speaker 1: Of course, there are significant drawbacks to vision reactors, yeah, 195 00:10:32,920 --> 00:10:35,520 Speaker 1: and so people are always looking for a new kind 196 00:10:35,559 --> 00:10:38,560 Speaker 1: of fission plants that could maybe be safer and cleaner. 197 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:40,679 Speaker 1: And one such idea is the one we're going to 198 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:45,880 Speaker 1: talk about today, which is this idea of molten salt reactors. Exactly. 199 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:52,079 Speaker 1: They stole it from my heated spice accelerator. Maybe you 200 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:54,920 Speaker 1: should have filed the pattern sooner, Daniel, and so let's 201 00:10:54,920 --> 00:10:57,200 Speaker 1: talk about that. So to be on the podcast, we'll 202 00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:06,079 Speaker 1: be tackling the question can molten salt reactors solve our 203 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:09,359 Speaker 1: energy problems? Now, Daniel have to say, I'm not familiar 204 00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:11,880 Speaker 1: with molten salt. Is that the same as Morton salt. 205 00:11:11,960 --> 00:11:16,600 Speaker 1: That's a brand, right, that's a brand exactly. No, molten 206 00:11:17,040 --> 00:11:21,400 Speaker 1: means liquid like super hot, you know, like molten lead. 207 00:11:21,840 --> 00:11:23,840 Speaker 1: Heat up lead and it goes from being a solid 208 00:11:23,880 --> 00:11:26,560 Speaker 1: to being a liquid and it's all glowy. That's molten. 209 00:11:26,800 --> 00:11:30,240 Speaker 1: So in this case, molten salt refers to taking salts 210 00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:32,760 Speaker 1: and melting them down. Oh, I see, So it's like 211 00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:35,200 Speaker 1: melted salt, Like if you heat up salt, it'll melt 212 00:11:35,240 --> 00:11:37,640 Speaker 1: into a liquid. M hmm exactly. And we're not just 213 00:11:37,679 --> 00:11:41,280 Speaker 1: talking about like table salt. But there's a whole set 214 00:11:41,320 --> 00:11:45,760 Speaker 1: of compounds and elements that chemists call salts, and any 215 00:11:45,800 --> 00:11:48,559 Speaker 1: of those can be used. And so the idea is 216 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:52,200 Speaker 1: to use these for a fission nuclear power reactor to 217 00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:55,079 Speaker 1: make them better. Yeah, there are these really interesting designs 218 00:11:55,440 --> 00:11:59,720 Speaker 1: for nuclear power plants that use molten salts, which sounds 219 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:03,720 Speaker 1: you know, salty and dangerous and crazy, but it could 220 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:07,560 Speaker 1: actually be much safer than traditional nuclear power plants. So 221 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 1: this is kind of a new idea, and so it's usual. 222 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:11,840 Speaker 1: We were wondering how many people out there had heard 223 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:15,760 Speaker 1: of melting salt for fission power. So Daniel went out 224 00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:18,280 Speaker 1: there into the internet to ask the question, how do 225 00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:21,840 Speaker 1: you think a molten salt reactor works? And thank you 226 00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:25,280 Speaker 1: again to all of our cadre of volunteers who answer 227 00:12:25,400 --> 00:12:28,839 Speaker 1: crazy physics questions without the opportunity to look anything up. 228 00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:30,880 Speaker 1: If that sounds fun to you and you'd like to 229 00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:34,480 Speaker 1: hear your voice on a future podcast, please don't be shy. 230 00:12:34,679 --> 00:12:37,800 Speaker 1: Email us at Questions at Daniel and Jorge dot com 231 00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:40,480 Speaker 1: for instructions about how to participate. So think about it 232 00:12:40,480 --> 00:12:43,120 Speaker 1: for a second. What would you use melted salt for? 233 00:12:44,600 --> 00:12:47,280 Speaker 1: Here's what people had to say. I honestly have no idea. 234 00:12:47,880 --> 00:12:50,400 Speaker 1: If I had to guess, I would say that it 235 00:12:50,559 --> 00:12:55,960 Speaker 1: uses some kind of molten salt mixture as a fuel source. 236 00:12:57,240 --> 00:13:00,000 Speaker 1: I don't know if that's even possible. After I'm done 237 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:01,679 Speaker 1: answering this question, I'm definitely gonna look it up. Though 238 00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:06,440 Speaker 1: the word reactor makes me think of power generation, but 239 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:09,280 Speaker 1: then molten sodium. The first thing that comes to mind 240 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:12,360 Speaker 1: is the reaction between sodium and water and how violent 241 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:16,280 Speaker 1: it is. So maybe it's a reactor that can harness 242 00:13:16,360 --> 00:13:19,760 Speaker 1: the power of the reaction between sodium and water. Somehow. 243 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:27,319 Speaker 1: A molten salt reactor is a reactor that uses molten salt, 244 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:31,440 Speaker 1: and maybe something to do with the salts ions to 245 00:13:31,640 --> 00:13:37,800 Speaker 1: help facilitate reactions. Well, I know that salts typically don't 246 00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:40,520 Speaker 1: get molten. They have to be very very hot to 247 00:13:41,320 --> 00:13:45,520 Speaker 1: become molten. Something to do with their conductivity probably. I'm 248 00:13:45,559 --> 00:13:47,760 Speaker 1: not sure how that would work, but I expect it 249 00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:52,720 Speaker 1: as something to do with the electrical conductivity of salts 250 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:56,320 Speaker 1: when they are in a liquid rather than a solid state. 251 00:13:56,880 --> 00:13:59,480 Speaker 1: All Right, some pretty pretty cool answers here. A lot 252 00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:03,280 Speaker 1: of people it seemed like it seemed like they're chemists. Yeah, 253 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:06,920 Speaker 1: people thinking about salt maybe as fuel, you know, But 254 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:10,040 Speaker 1: none of these are actually even close at all to 255 00:14:10,160 --> 00:14:13,720 Speaker 1: the right answer. How we use molden salt inside a reactor. 256 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:15,920 Speaker 1: And that's not a criticism because to me, the whole 257 00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:18,360 Speaker 1: design of a molten salt reactor is kind of bonkers. 258 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:21,720 Speaker 1: I never would have guessed either it melts your mind 259 00:14:23,560 --> 00:14:25,560 Speaker 1: or at least the salt in your mind. Yeah, exactly. 260 00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:29,400 Speaker 1: I prefer the molten pepper reactors. I prefer the melted 261 00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:35,120 Speaker 1: oreganos because you know, I like my Italian energy compressed 262 00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:37,080 Speaker 1: cinnamon reactors. I mean, that's the way I'm gonna go. 263 00:14:37,800 --> 00:14:39,880 Speaker 1: It happens if you take like cinnamon and chocolate and 264 00:14:39,880 --> 00:14:42,480 Speaker 1: you fuse them together inside a reactor, you get some 265 00:14:42,520 --> 00:14:45,240 Speaker 1: new superspice. Interesting. I think you need to start a 266 00:14:45,240 --> 00:14:48,920 Speaker 1: new like think tank where it's just spices used for 267 00:14:49,160 --> 00:14:51,520 Speaker 1: making energy. Well, I think before I think about it. 268 00:14:51,520 --> 00:14:53,520 Speaker 1: I just want to build an accelerator so you can 269 00:14:53,520 --> 00:14:55,960 Speaker 1: shoot like cinnamon and chocolate particles at each other and 270 00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:58,080 Speaker 1: just see what happens. I mean, I'm an experimentalist, not 271 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:01,600 Speaker 1: a theorist after all. You see, you just want to 272 00:15:01,640 --> 00:15:06,320 Speaker 1: make like anti cinnamon maybe or dark cinnamon. What is 273 00:15:06,360 --> 00:15:08,800 Speaker 1: anti cinnamon? Is that something you can add to your 274 00:15:08,800 --> 00:15:11,640 Speaker 1: food to make it taste less like cinnamon? I don't know. 275 00:15:12,320 --> 00:15:15,560 Speaker 1: It's intriguing though, right, Like what is anti chocolate taste? Like? 276 00:15:15,640 --> 00:15:18,600 Speaker 1: Oh man, it doesn't sound very good, but I am curious. 277 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:26,400 Speaker 1: Or like anti salt, and speaking of salty situations, I 278 00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:29,040 Speaker 1: want to give a special birthday shout out to one 279 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:33,320 Speaker 1: Salty listener, Happy birthday to Ben. His girlfriend Natasha tells 280 00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:36,320 Speaker 1: us that Ben is something of a salt afficionado, so 281 00:15:36,400 --> 00:15:39,600 Speaker 1: happy salty Birthday, Ben. All Right, this is an interesting 282 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 1: idea to use, Maybe melted salt. I guess that's Stadia right, 283 00:15:43,280 --> 00:15:45,440 Speaker 1: to melt salt because if you heat up so I've 284 00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:47,960 Speaker 1: never tried heating up salt, does it actually melt into 285 00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:50,280 Speaker 1: a liquid? Yeah? A lot of salts if you heat 286 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:53,080 Speaker 1: them up hot enough and we're talking like four fifty c, 287 00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:57,600 Speaker 1: they'll melt into a transparent liquid. Can you said, like 288 00:15:57,640 --> 00:16:01,720 Speaker 1: salt on fire? Wow, that's something I want to type 289 00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:04,080 Speaker 1: into Google, but I don't want my university to have 290 00:16:04,120 --> 00:16:07,400 Speaker 1: seen me type that into Google. Silt, What do you mean? 291 00:16:07,440 --> 00:16:09,720 Speaker 1: He said, salt and fire. I think that's the kind 292 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:12,040 Speaker 1: that's going to get you on the t s A 293 00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:14,600 Speaker 1: watch list, Like trying to think you're thinking of, like 294 00:16:14,760 --> 00:16:16,880 Speaker 1: can I make a bomb at a salt? Yeah, that's 295 00:16:16,920 --> 00:16:21,400 Speaker 1: the next thing to google, right exactly, salt bombs? Bombs? 296 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:23,680 Speaker 1: Is that sort of like a bath bomb? You know, 297 00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:26,280 Speaker 1: like a salt bomb? Your I think that's that's what 298 00:16:26,360 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 1: I was thinking. I think those exist already bad salt 299 00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:33,840 Speaker 1: bombs are, Yeah, and then you can make a reactor. 300 00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:35,920 Speaker 1: You can convert yourself from a dirty person into a 301 00:16:35,960 --> 00:16:39,000 Speaker 1: clean person. Using a bath salt, you can make clean energy, 302 00:16:39,080 --> 00:16:41,240 Speaker 1: or at least a clean you. I wouldn't recommend dipping 303 00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:45,480 Speaker 1: your toes into four fifty molten salt, no matter how 304 00:16:45,560 --> 00:16:47,280 Speaker 1: much you want to get into the bath. Yeah, it 305 00:16:47,280 --> 00:16:49,920 Speaker 1: sounds like a bad idea, but this is all sort 306 00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:54,000 Speaker 1: of leading towards making maybe nuclear power more efficient, more clean, 307 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:55,800 Speaker 1: and more clean. And so maybe we should start with that. 308 00:16:55,920 --> 00:16:59,080 Speaker 1: Let's start maybe recapping how a nuclear reactor works, like 309 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:01,400 Speaker 1: the kind that we in our countries right now. You 310 00:17:01,400 --> 00:17:04,880 Speaker 1: have to understand why molten salt is an attractive idea. 311 00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:07,320 Speaker 1: You have to understand what it is doing in the 312 00:17:07,400 --> 00:17:10,720 Speaker 1: reactor and what it's replacing. A lot of current fission 313 00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:14,640 Speaker 1: reactors use water as an important element of it. Essentially, 314 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:16,959 Speaker 1: molten salt will be replacing the water. But you might 315 00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:19,479 Speaker 1: not be familiar with the role of water in fission, 316 00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:21,560 Speaker 1: like why would you even need water? So, yeah, we 317 00:17:21,560 --> 00:17:24,439 Speaker 1: should probably break down exactly how fission operates. Yeah, and 318 00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:27,399 Speaker 1: so fishing is like splitting the nucleus of an atom, 319 00:17:27,720 --> 00:17:29,679 Speaker 1: and then when you do that, energy gets released. And 320 00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 1: so if you do that in the right way, you 321 00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:33,760 Speaker 1: can just get energy from stuff. Yeah, I think it's 322 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 1: really quite interesting that for light elements hydrogen, helium, et cetera, 323 00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:41,199 Speaker 1: if you squeeze them together, you release energy, whereas for 324 00:17:41,280 --> 00:17:44,280 Speaker 1: heavy elements everything above iron, if you break them in 325 00:17:44,400 --> 00:17:47,080 Speaker 1: half you release energy. The reason for that is a 326 00:17:47,119 --> 00:17:50,159 Speaker 1: bunch of really interesting nuclear physics details, which, as usual, 327 00:17:50,400 --> 00:17:52,520 Speaker 1: we have planned for a future episode. But the point 328 00:17:52,600 --> 00:17:54,440 Speaker 1: is that when you do fishing, you need to use 329 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:58,560 Speaker 1: heavy elements. Things like uranium or plutonium are good for 330 00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:02,280 Speaker 1: fishing because when they break up, they produced neutrons which 331 00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:05,520 Speaker 1: can then create more fission and they produce some energy. 332 00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:08,040 Speaker 1: And so the way a fission reaction works is you 333 00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:11,280 Speaker 1: have like a bunch of uranium, It splits up, shoots 334 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:14,760 Speaker 1: off more neutrons, which hits more uranium, which split them up, 335 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:18,080 Speaker 1: which shoot off more neutrons. And if you get enough 336 00:18:18,240 --> 00:18:21,359 Speaker 1: uranium together, then it's going to self sustain, it's going 337 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:24,159 Speaker 1: to keep going, it's going to cause like a chain reaction. Right, 338 00:18:24,200 --> 00:18:26,040 Speaker 1: that's the idea. I mean, that's kind of how an 339 00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:28,359 Speaker 1: efficient bomb works, is that if you put enough of 340 00:18:28,359 --> 00:18:31,639 Speaker 1: it together, you break one atom one nucleus, and that 341 00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:35,040 Speaker 1: breaks other nuclei and then then you have a runaway explosion. 342 00:18:35,080 --> 00:18:37,240 Speaker 1: That's a bomb. But for a reactor you do the 343 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:38,840 Speaker 1: same thing, but you do it in a I guess 344 00:18:38,840 --> 00:18:43,639 Speaker 1: more controlled way. Yeah, naturally occurring uranium will just spontaneously decay, 345 00:18:43,680 --> 00:18:45,919 Speaker 1: and that doesn't always start a chain reaction, although we 346 00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:48,600 Speaker 1: did have a fun episode about a dense depositive uranium 347 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:53,200 Speaker 1: underground in Africa which did create a natural, self sustaining reaction. 348 00:18:53,320 --> 00:18:56,480 Speaker 1: But in general, naturally occurring uranium can't set off a 349 00:18:56,560 --> 00:18:59,360 Speaker 1: chain reaction. Those neutrons just go into whatever other material. 350 00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:02,080 Speaker 1: But you get uranium that's dense enough and you have 351 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:05,240 Speaker 1: it pure enough, then it can reach critical mass and 352 00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:07,320 Speaker 1: so it sustains itself. And as you said, if you 353 00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:09,399 Speaker 1: have the right kind of fuel, it can create a 354 00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:13,040 Speaker 1: runaway explosion or very rapid release of energy. That's a bomb. 355 00:19:13,480 --> 00:19:16,200 Speaker 1: You can slow it down and moderate it a little 356 00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:19,800 Speaker 1: bit so that for example, every neutron creates one more 357 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:22,880 Speaker 1: uranium that split, which creates one more and rather than 358 00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:26,160 Speaker 1: growing exponentially, it'll just keep going at the same level, 359 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:29,840 Speaker 1: producing some heat. Right, because each time the atom splits, 360 00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:33,520 Speaker 1: it releases sort of like other particles or you know, 361 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:36,000 Speaker 1: like light or heat in some way that you then 362 00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:40,679 Speaker 1: capture through another means exactly. Usually you capture that in 363 00:19:40,760 --> 00:19:43,560 Speaker 1: like water, which then you boil into steam and you 364 00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:46,920 Speaker 1: can feed it through some turbine and that generates electricity. 365 00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:49,119 Speaker 1: So that's the basic idea, but it turns out to 366 00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:51,560 Speaker 1: be a little bit more complicated in a crucial way 367 00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:54,879 Speaker 1: because there's different kinds of uranium, and the different kinds 368 00:19:54,920 --> 00:19:56,840 Speaker 1: of uranium some of them are really good to use 369 00:19:56,880 --> 00:19:58,680 Speaker 1: in fission and some of them are not very good 370 00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:00,720 Speaker 1: to use in fission. You got to get the right 371 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 1: blend and you've got to get the neutrons going at 372 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:04,719 Speaker 1: just the right speed. So there are a couple of 373 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:07,199 Speaker 1: details there. Yeah, and there have been a couple of 374 00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:10,840 Speaker 1: problems in history in making these things work. And so 375 00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:13,040 Speaker 1: let's get into all of those details and all of 376 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:28,399 Speaker 1: that history. But first let's take a quick break. All right, 377 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:34,000 Speaker 1: we're talking about melting salt to make fission power more efficient. Now, 378 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:36,240 Speaker 1: is this sort of a new idea, Daniel, or something 379 00:20:36,280 --> 00:20:38,680 Speaker 1: you just came up with this morning, or has this 380 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:41,320 Speaker 1: been around for a while. Now? This is fascinating history 381 00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:43,960 Speaker 1: because it's an idea that has been around for a while, 382 00:20:44,359 --> 00:20:46,960 Speaker 1: and it was explored early on, but then was put 383 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:51,920 Speaker 1: aside because it didn't have enough weapons applications. It wasn't 384 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 1: good for developing fuel for nuclear weapons, so it's basically ignored. 385 00:20:56,800 --> 00:20:59,880 Speaker 1: And now that's actually an advantage and so it's being 386 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:03,120 Speaker 1: looked at again, right, interesting, and it might make our 387 00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:06,280 Speaker 1: food tastier somehow. Exactly don't you want your kid to 388 00:21:06,280 --> 00:21:09,560 Speaker 1: have molten salt sprayers so they can shoot their own 389 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:12,320 Speaker 1: eggs with molten salt? I want my kist sweet food 390 00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:14,800 Speaker 1: that's not glowing perfectly. But you said there are some 391 00:21:14,800 --> 00:21:17,520 Speaker 1: details here about fishing that are important to understand, and 392 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:19,199 Speaker 1: they sort of have to do with the fact that 393 00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:22,040 Speaker 1: basically to do fishing and to make fission reactors, you 394 00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 1: need uranium. Now, I guess maybe step me through here, 395 00:21:24,840 --> 00:21:27,119 Speaker 1: like why do we need uranium? Like, you know, everyone 396 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:29,720 Speaker 1: has probably heard of uranium for movies or TV shows 397 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:32,520 Speaker 1: because they know it's related to making nuclear energy, But 398 00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:35,640 Speaker 1: like why uranium? Why not the next material over? Or 399 00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:38,680 Speaker 1: why not iron or why not you know, chlorine? Well, 400 00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:41,199 Speaker 1: you can do fishing with lots of different kinds of stuff, 401 00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:43,120 Speaker 1: and we'll talk a little bit later in the program 402 00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:46,800 Speaker 1: about alternative fuels. You can use plutonium, you can use thorium, 403 00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:49,520 Speaker 1: you can use all sorts of different heavy elements. Uranium 404 00:21:49,520 --> 00:21:51,439 Speaker 1: has been used traditionally because it satisfies a lot of 405 00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:54,840 Speaker 1: the requirements, like it is fizzile, meaning if you hit 406 00:21:54,920 --> 00:21:57,479 Speaker 1: it with a neutron, it will split in half and 407 00:21:57,520 --> 00:22:01,160 Speaker 1: produce more neutrons. And also because it's abundant, like there's 408 00:22:01,160 --> 00:22:05,080 Speaker 1: a lot of uranium around. There's more uranium than plutonium, 409 00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:08,840 Speaker 1: for example, which is almost non existent in the Earth's core. Interesting, 410 00:22:09,080 --> 00:22:11,400 Speaker 1: so it's like, and is there a reason why it's 411 00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:14,520 Speaker 1: more abundant. It's really interesting and deep question actually about 412 00:22:14,560 --> 00:22:17,680 Speaker 1: just like why various elements exist in the universe in 413 00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:20,480 Speaker 1: their various proportions. Typically there's a trend that, like the 414 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:23,080 Speaker 1: heavier elements, there's less of them because it's harder to 415 00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:26,080 Speaker 1: make them you need like collisions of neutron stars. And 416 00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 1: also the heavier ones are less stable. So uranium is 417 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:30,720 Speaker 1: a bit of a sweet spot there in terms of 418 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 1: being heavy enough to be fizzile, but also long lived 419 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:36,439 Speaker 1: enough to still be around in the Earth's core. I 420 00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:39,800 Speaker 1: see maybe there were other kinds of material, physical materials, 421 00:22:39,800 --> 00:22:42,919 Speaker 1: but they just naturally split by themselves over time, and 422 00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:45,840 Speaker 1: so they're not that material anymore. Yeah, And some of 423 00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:48,280 Speaker 1: the heavier ones there's just harder to make because the 424 00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:50,400 Speaker 1: heavier they are, the more neutrons you need to get 425 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:52,680 Speaker 1: together in the core of a neutron star to make them. 426 00:22:52,760 --> 00:22:55,119 Speaker 1: So there are just less of them. And so uranium 427 00:22:55,200 --> 00:22:57,320 Speaker 1: is around, and it's I guess there's enough of it 428 00:22:57,359 --> 00:23:01,080 Speaker 1: around right now that we use it for nuclear reactors 429 00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:04,760 Speaker 1: and so like, what's the process of using uranium for fission? 430 00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:08,000 Speaker 1: So uranium comes in two flavors in the Earth's core 431 00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:11,720 Speaker 1: is uranium two thirty five and uranium two thirty eight, 432 00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:14,160 Speaker 1: and there are the same element. They have the same 433 00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:17,119 Speaker 1: number of protons. Both of them have ninety two protons 434 00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:20,359 Speaker 1: in the nucleus, but uranium two thirty eight has three 435 00:23:20,400 --> 00:23:23,600 Speaker 1: more neutrons. So that doesn't change, you know, what element 436 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:26,159 Speaker 1: you are, doesn't change the number of electrons. It just 437 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:28,240 Speaker 1: changes how many neutrons are in the core. So it's 438 00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:30,880 Speaker 1: a different isotope. But uranium two thirty five and two 439 00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:34,360 Speaker 1: thirty eight are really quite different. Uranium two thirty five 440 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:38,520 Speaker 1: is great for fusion, it splits nicely, it produces more neutrons. 441 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:41,760 Speaker 1: It's excellent. But most of the uranium we find in 442 00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:44,359 Speaker 1: the Earth is uranium two thirty eight, the one that's 443 00:23:44,440 --> 00:23:47,240 Speaker 1: not good for fission. In fact, it's like more than 444 00:23:47,359 --> 00:23:50,840 Speaker 1: nine nine of the naturally occurring uranium. And I guess 445 00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:53,680 Speaker 1: for those of us who don't remember high school chemistry, 446 00:23:53,720 --> 00:23:56,160 Speaker 1: that the two thirty five and the two thirty eight means, 447 00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:58,280 Speaker 1: it's like the sum of the number of protons and 448 00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:00,840 Speaker 1: neutrons in the nucleus. Right, Like said, it has ninety 449 00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:04,679 Speaker 1: two protons and three neutrons. If you add those up, 450 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:07,200 Speaker 1: that gives you the two thirty five, And so uranium 451 00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:10,680 Speaker 1: to thirty eight has just three more neutrons in it exactly, 452 00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:13,359 Speaker 1: And uranium two thirty five is the one that is 453 00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,600 Speaker 1: really good for fission. Wait, why is two thirty five better? 454 00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:19,560 Speaker 1: Like what is adding those just three neutrons to the 455 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:22,320 Speaker 1: nucleus due to the whole thing, it makes it more 456 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:24,919 Speaker 1: or less stable. So uranium two thirty five is a 457 00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:27,680 Speaker 1: little bit less stable. If you hit it with a neutron, 458 00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:31,600 Speaker 1: it's more likely to split up than uranium two thirty eight, 459 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:33,679 Speaker 1: And that has to do with like how the neutrons 460 00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:36,960 Speaker 1: are arranged. Remember we talked once about super heavy elements 461 00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:39,879 Speaker 1: and how the protons and the neutrons inside the atom 462 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:43,199 Speaker 1: arranged into these shells sort of the same way electrons 463 00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:45,679 Speaker 1: do in their orbits. And if you have the right number, 464 00:24:45,720 --> 00:24:48,840 Speaker 1: then they're much more stable. It's like completing an arch, 465 00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:50,840 Speaker 1: like a Roman arch. If you have all the pieces, 466 00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:53,520 Speaker 1: it's much more stable than if you're missing one or two. 467 00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,959 Speaker 1: So uranium two thirty eight is harder to split than 468 00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:59,639 Speaker 1: uranium two thirty five, right, which is weird because it 469 00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:03,359 Speaker 1: just had three more neutrons, which are you know, neutral, 470 00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:06,199 Speaker 1: but I guess they also sort of contribute to the 471 00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:10,280 Speaker 1: general stickiness of the nucleus, right, like through the gluons 472 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:14,800 Speaker 1: and quirks. Yeah, neutrons are neutrals. They don't have electromagnetic forces, 473 00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:16,960 Speaker 1: but they do have the strong force because they're made 474 00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:18,920 Speaker 1: of quarks, and it's a strong force that holds the 475 00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:22,080 Speaker 1: nucleus together. So the fact that neutrons are neutral doesn't 476 00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:24,119 Speaker 1: mean they don't play a role in the strong force. 477 00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:27,560 Speaker 1: They totally participate just as much as protons. Both of 478 00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 1: them have three quarks, and so just adding those three 479 00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:32,679 Speaker 1: makes a huge difference, and so that's why we prefer 480 00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:35,639 Speaker 1: uranium to thirty five. But it's like the minority in 481 00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:39,040 Speaker 1: the uranium we find it's the minority. And also uranium 482 00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:42,120 Speaker 1: two thirty five likes a very particular kind of neutron. 483 00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:45,840 Speaker 1: It likes slow moving neutrons. That's moving neutrons are much 484 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:48,679 Speaker 1: less likely to cause uranium two thirty five to split. 485 00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:51,920 Speaker 1: So the problem with naturally existing uranium, as we find it, 486 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:54,600 Speaker 1: is that there isn't enough uranium two thirty five, and 487 00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:57,320 Speaker 1: when it splits, it produces neutrons that are sort of 488 00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:00,320 Speaker 1: have too much energy. They're going too fast to be 489 00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:03,840 Speaker 1: effective to split more uranium two thirty five, right, So 490 00:26:04,080 --> 00:26:06,600 Speaker 1: it's rarer. So we that's why people could talk about 491 00:26:06,760 --> 00:26:09,680 Speaker 1: enriching uranium. Right, it's like you're sort of sifting through 492 00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:12,240 Speaker 1: the uranium and you're separating the two thirty five with 493 00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:15,359 Speaker 1: the exactly. So to solve these two problems, to like 494 00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 1: get more uranium two thirty five and to fix the 495 00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:22,000 Speaker 1: neutron speed, we have two solutions. One is enrich it, 496 00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:24,160 Speaker 1: and so we use centrifuges and all sorts of other 497 00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:26,879 Speaker 1: technologies to get uranium two thirty five to be a 498 00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:30,200 Speaker 1: larger percentage so that there's enough in there to do 499 00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:32,879 Speaker 1: the fission. And then we do things to slow down 500 00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:35,680 Speaker 1: the neutrons that are produced so that they are much 501 00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:39,080 Speaker 1: better at causing fission. And that's where the water comes in. 502 00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:43,240 Speaker 1: In traditional reactors, we bathe these uranium rods in water, 503 00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:46,199 Speaker 1: which is really good at slowing down neutrons, so they 504 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:49,200 Speaker 1: go from the fast speed to the slow speed where 505 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:52,040 Speaker 1: they're much better at causing fission. Right, So you make 506 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:54,399 Speaker 1: like a bar of this enriched uranium, and if you 507 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:56,920 Speaker 1: just leave it there, it's gonna decay, right, It's gonna glow, 508 00:26:56,960 --> 00:26:58,840 Speaker 1: it's gonna give up heat. And so the idea is 509 00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:01,080 Speaker 1: that you sort of put a bunch of these bars 510 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:04,560 Speaker 1: sort of together, and like the neutrons from one bar 511 00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:08,840 Speaker 1: then cause the atoms from the next bar to split up, 512 00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:11,880 Speaker 1: and then that one releases more stuff and that then 513 00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 1: causes the atoms and the other bars to split up, 514 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:16,879 Speaker 1: and that's how you get the chain reaction exactly. And 515 00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:19,840 Speaker 1: the water plays a crucial role between the bars there 516 00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:23,359 Speaker 1: and slowing down the neutrons, because slower neutrons are much 517 00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:26,000 Speaker 1: more likely to cause fission. You need to enrich the 518 00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:28,439 Speaker 1: YouTube thirty five component, and you need to slow down 519 00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:32,720 Speaker 1: those neutrons. And so that's called a light water thermal reactor. 520 00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:35,600 Speaker 1: Thermal there just means the neutrons are slow and water 521 00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:38,520 Speaker 1: means the thing you're using to moderate the neutrons and 522 00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:40,960 Speaker 1: also to provide coolant for the whole thing and to 523 00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:44,560 Speaker 1: suck off the heat to create electricity is water. So 524 00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:47,520 Speaker 1: that's the traditional structure of a fission reactor. Right. You 525 00:27:47,560 --> 00:27:50,000 Speaker 1: just take a bunch of rods of enriched uranium and 526 00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:52,920 Speaker 1: you dip them in water, basically, right. But it's interesting, 527 00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:55,240 Speaker 1: I think too, because the way they control the reaction 528 00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:57,720 Speaker 1: is they control how much do you dip the rods 529 00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:02,000 Speaker 1: in water? Right? Exactly? If you overmoderated, for example, then 530 00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:04,920 Speaker 1: you'll slow down the reaction. You'll slow all those neutrons 531 00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:07,560 Speaker 1: down so that they can't even provide fission anymore. Right, 532 00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:10,520 Speaker 1: And so what is it called light water thermal reactor? Oh? 533 00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:13,480 Speaker 1: As opposed to heavy water. Sometimes they use like deuterium 534 00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:16,240 Speaker 1: water and that has different Properties' is like a thousand 535 00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:19,639 Speaker 1: different varieties of these reactors. And this is the one 536 00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:21,879 Speaker 1: that uses like normal water, the kind of water that 537 00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:25,000 Speaker 1: we can drink. I see, all right, So then you 538 00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:27,399 Speaker 1: dip the rods and water. That's how you get a reactor. 539 00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:29,520 Speaker 1: But there are problems with that, right. There are a 540 00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:32,640 Speaker 1: bunch of problems with these reactors. Number one is that 541 00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:36,320 Speaker 1: you're only really burning the uranium two thirty five, which 542 00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:39,240 Speaker 1: is a tiny fraction of your fuel. So the uranium 543 00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:42,280 Speaker 1: two it's in there, you're just sort of wasting it 544 00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:46,040 Speaker 1: like it could maybe be turned into fission, but you 545 00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:49,720 Speaker 1: don't use it. And so uranium depleted uranium is uranium 546 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:52,320 Speaker 1: where you've burned the uranium two thirty five, just like 547 00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:55,560 Speaker 1: leaving most of the uranium gone, sort of like you know, 548 00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:58,360 Speaker 1: you try to burn a camp fire and you only 549 00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:00,520 Speaker 1: burn the pine needles on the tree. You burn like 550 00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:02,840 Speaker 1: the real core of the tree. So most of the 551 00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:05,640 Speaker 1: energy is wasted. It's not even used. Wow, and then 552 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:08,400 Speaker 1: that becomes nuclear waste, right because this stuff is still 553 00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:12,400 Speaker 1: like breaking down shooting off dangerous particles. And that's why 554 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:15,840 Speaker 1: it's radioactive exactly that you two thirty eight doesn't burn, 555 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:18,720 Speaker 1: it doesn't participate in fission, but all the neutrons that 556 00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:22,160 Speaker 1: are flying around will convert it into really dangerous stuff 557 00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:24,680 Speaker 1: like plutonium and all sorts of other stuff, and that 558 00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:28,360 Speaker 1: stuff has half lives of like tens of thousands of years. 559 00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:30,720 Speaker 1: So most of the stuff in your fuel doesn't contribute 560 00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:33,480 Speaker 1: in a useful way and then turns into like poison 561 00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:36,720 Speaker 1: which will kill people and ruin the environment for like 562 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 1: you know, thousands and thousands of years. Wow. Not good. 563 00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:43,360 Speaker 1: Definitely not good. Yeah, And it's also a little bit 564 00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:47,280 Speaker 1: you know, risky too, because if you don't control the 565 00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:49,960 Speaker 1: the reaction well enough, you can have a big meltdown. Yeah. 566 00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:52,520 Speaker 1: One problem with water is that it boils at a 567 00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:56,040 Speaker 1: pretty low temperature, right a hundred C, and so you 568 00:29:56,080 --> 00:29:58,520 Speaker 1: need to keep it at a very high pressure in 569 00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:00,360 Speaker 1: order to keep it liquid because it has to be 570 00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:02,960 Speaker 1: liquid to play this role to flow through your reactor 571 00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:05,080 Speaker 1: and to pull off the energy and to be a moderator. 572 00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:08,920 Speaker 1: And so a lot of these reactors operated extremely high temperatures, 573 00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:12,800 Speaker 1: like a hundred atmospheres, which is you know, dangerous, and 574 00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:15,440 Speaker 1: it means that these things are big and bulky. They 575 00:30:15,480 --> 00:30:18,120 Speaker 1: have to have like thick, thick layers of steel to 576 00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,800 Speaker 1: contain them, and it takes work to maintain this, you know, 577 00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:22,960 Speaker 1: to keep this thing flowing and to keep it under pressure. 578 00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:24,479 Speaker 1: And for it all to be safe, and you can 579 00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:27,600 Speaker 1: also have accidents which have happened in the past, right, 580 00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:31,440 Speaker 1: notably like Kushima and Chernobyl. Those were sort of like 581 00:30:31,520 --> 00:30:35,120 Speaker 1: failures in controlling the fission reaction exactly, And all those 582 00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:37,720 Speaker 1: failures are linked to the water. You know, in Chernobyl 583 00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:41,080 Speaker 1: that water boiled because it got too hot. In Fukushima, 584 00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:44,360 Speaker 1: the water pumps were knocked out by the tsunami. In 585 00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:47,960 Speaker 1: Three Mile Island and earlier disaster, the water hatch was 586 00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:50,400 Speaker 1: jammed and so the water didn't flow. And so like 587 00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:53,000 Speaker 1: this water, it can work. And you know, more modern 588 00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:57,080 Speaker 1: reactors have more and more layers of safety, but it's complicated. 589 00:30:57,440 --> 00:30:59,520 Speaker 1: It's interesting from an engineering point of view. I think 590 00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:02,680 Speaker 1: that as we learned to do fission reactors with water, 591 00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:04,880 Speaker 1: the time it takes to build and get one of 592 00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:07,880 Speaker 1: these things up and running gets longer, not shorter, right, 593 00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:09,920 Speaker 1: because we're learning how to do it safely. We're just 594 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:13,320 Speaker 1: like adding layers and layers of precaution as we developed 595 00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:15,760 Speaker 1: new reactors, right, because I guess you know, when they 596 00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:18,120 Speaker 1: built Fukushima, they were probably didn't think, like, hey, what 597 00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:20,160 Speaker 1: if there's an earthquake in the middle of the ocean 598 00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:22,880 Speaker 1: and that causes a giant tsunami wave that then hits 599 00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:26,080 Speaker 1: our water pumps. Right, Like, you have to think of everything, 600 00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:29,040 Speaker 1: and that's really hard. Why didn't they think of that though? 601 00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:32,560 Speaker 1: Like who builds a nuclear power plant near an earthquake 602 00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:34,800 Speaker 1: line or near the ocean? You know, it doesn't make 603 00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:37,320 Speaker 1: any sense to me. You're expecting this thing to be 604 00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:40,240 Speaker 1: there for decades and decades, Like she's put it far 605 00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:43,480 Speaker 1: away from everything that could potentially cause it any damage. 606 00:31:43,560 --> 00:31:46,320 Speaker 1: But I guess there's always something unexpected. I guess, you know, 607 00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:47,920 Speaker 1: even if you put it in the middle of the mountain, 608 00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:50,320 Speaker 1: then something else is going to happen, right, There's always 609 00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:52,640 Speaker 1: something I expected. That's true. Yeah, And you know that's 610 00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:55,960 Speaker 1: the danger here. We're dealing with very high pressure, very 611 00:31:56,040 --> 00:31:59,160 Speaker 1: high temperature environment and it needs to maintain that or 612 00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:01,560 Speaker 1: it's going to melt on and cause a disaster. And 613 00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:03,960 Speaker 1: so it's a bit fragile, and I think that's one 614 00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:07,360 Speaker 1: main concern of these water reactors. All right, Well, um, 615 00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:10,480 Speaker 1: let's talk about then, how to make things better, how 616 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:12,960 Speaker 1: to make them cleaner and safer. It seems like water 617 00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:16,080 Speaker 1: is kind of a problem here because water boils too 618 00:32:16,160 --> 00:32:18,680 Speaker 1: easily maybe, And so you have you have to be 619 00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:21,320 Speaker 1: very careful with it because if it evaporates, then you 620 00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:24,240 Speaker 1: don't have anything controlling the reaction. Yeah, and that's why 621 00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:27,920 Speaker 1: people think about using molten salt. Right. You take fluoride, 622 00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:30,160 Speaker 1: for example, and you heat it up to four hundred 623 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,760 Speaker 1: and fifty c it melts into a transparent liquid. It 624 00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:36,400 Speaker 1: looks like water, right, It flows. It's clear, sort of 625 00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:38,840 Speaker 1: weird to think about it, but that's what happens. That's 626 00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:41,840 Speaker 1: the chemistry of it. And so you can use molten 627 00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:45,680 Speaker 1: salt in your reactor instead of water. And the advantage 628 00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:49,120 Speaker 1: is that this thing stays liquid at much higher temperatures, 629 00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:51,480 Speaker 1: that doesn't boil, right, and so so you don't need 630 00:32:51,600 --> 00:32:54,520 Speaker 1: really high pressure. You can keep it like one atmosphere 631 00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:57,360 Speaker 1: and you can still do the same job that water 632 00:32:57,440 --> 00:32:59,280 Speaker 1: does for you. So you're talking about like a salt 633 00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:01,760 Speaker 1: that uses four rain and then melting it and then 634 00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:06,200 Speaker 1: using that like bathing the uranium rods in that liquid. Yeah. 635 00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:08,200 Speaker 1: And here when we say salt again, we're talking about 636 00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:10,880 Speaker 1: in a chemical definition of what as salt is, right, 637 00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:14,360 Speaker 1: the same way that like astronomers consider everything heavier than 638 00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:17,760 Speaker 1: helium to be a metal chemists have a specific definition 639 00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:21,200 Speaker 1: of salt, and so fluoride is one example. And so yeah, 640 00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:23,320 Speaker 1: you melt it, and then you can use this to 641 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:26,000 Speaker 1: cool your reactor, to pull the energy out of it. 642 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:28,520 Speaker 1: And you don't even have to wrap your rods in it. 643 00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:32,240 Speaker 1: You can dissolve the fuel itself into the salt. So 644 00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:35,160 Speaker 1: you just have this like mixture of molten salt with 645 00:33:35,280 --> 00:33:39,400 Speaker 1: your fuel flowing around your reactor. Whoa, so you you 646 00:33:39,640 --> 00:33:42,880 Speaker 1: mix the fuel into the this salt that's at the 647 00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:45,840 Speaker 1: four and fifty degrees celsius? Is that the idea? So 648 00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:51,719 Speaker 1: you have this boiling hot stew of radioactive uranium and salt, 649 00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:53,840 Speaker 1: and and then how do you get the energy out? 650 00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:56,719 Speaker 1: Or like what happens to does it just stay hot forever? 651 00:33:56,880 --> 00:33:59,200 Speaker 1: Does it start to heat up if you leave it alone? 652 00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:00,800 Speaker 1: What do you get? What are you gotta do? Well, 653 00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:03,480 Speaker 1: you have the reactor and you pump some of this 654 00:34:03,560 --> 00:34:06,600 Speaker 1: salt out into a heat exchanger, so then you can 655 00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:09,840 Speaker 1: like you know, take the heat out and spin turbines, etcetera, etcetera. 656 00:34:09,920 --> 00:34:11,680 Speaker 1: And there you know, you could transfer it to water 657 00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:13,759 Speaker 1: or whatever you need to do. But there's lots of 658 00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:17,240 Speaker 1: really cool options because it's much hotter because molten salt 659 00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:20,640 Speaker 1: stays liquid at higher temperatures. It's much more efficient actually 660 00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:23,239 Speaker 1: for energy generation, and it gives you other options like 661 00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:26,799 Speaker 1: creating hydrogen fuel as like sort of chemical battery to 662 00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:29,480 Speaker 1: store all this energy. So, yeah, you have this molten 663 00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:32,640 Speaker 1: salt flowing around in your reactor and some of it 664 00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:35,600 Speaker 1: gets pumped out into a heat exchanger so that you 665 00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:38,880 Speaker 1: can pull the energy out. Well, it's intense because you 666 00:34:38,920 --> 00:34:41,120 Speaker 1: pump it out, but it's radioactive to right, Yeah, it 667 00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:43,480 Speaker 1: is radioactive. It still has your fuel in it, so 668 00:34:43,560 --> 00:34:45,840 Speaker 1: fission is happening in it. And so I guess what 669 00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:48,880 Speaker 1: happens if you just have a vat of this dissolved fuel. 670 00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:51,560 Speaker 1: Does it eventually just heat up to like a million 671 00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:55,200 Speaker 1: degrees or I guess it eventually would melt whatever container 672 00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:57,480 Speaker 1: it's in. Well, you're pulling the heat out of it, right, 673 00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:00,239 Speaker 1: because you're using it as a reactor. And there's also 674 00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:02,640 Speaker 1: sort of a safety valve which is at the bottom 675 00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:04,839 Speaker 1: of this thing. They have a plug which is made 676 00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:07,399 Speaker 1: out of another frozen salt, and so if the whole 677 00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:09,839 Speaker 1: thing overheats, if it gets too hot, then it will 678 00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:12,840 Speaker 1: melt this frozen plug and it'll just all sort of 679 00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:15,680 Speaker 1: like drip out of the reactor and it'll cool down 680 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:18,760 Speaker 1: fast enough to become solid and then the reaction will stop. 681 00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:22,440 Speaker 1: The reaction only happens when it's liquid. Oh, that's a 682 00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:26,040 Speaker 1: good mechanism for safety. Like it, so if the salt solidifies, 683 00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:29,000 Speaker 1: then that stops the reaction, like the reaction only works 684 00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:31,640 Speaker 1: if the salt is melted. All right, Well, that's sort 685 00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:34,360 Speaker 1: of one idea to make fission safer and cleaner. And 686 00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:37,000 Speaker 1: so let's get into another one that it may or 687 00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:39,759 Speaker 1: may not be related to the Avengers. But first let's 688 00:35:39,800 --> 00:35:54,880 Speaker 1: take another quick break. All right, we're talking about making 689 00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:59,640 Speaker 1: fission energy safer by maybe some new ideas to make 690 00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:02,840 Speaker 1: the fission reactor process safer. And one of them we 691 00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:05,920 Speaker 1: talked about was melting salt or a kind of salt 692 00:36:05,960 --> 00:36:10,200 Speaker 1: as the sort of mediator between the field enrich uranium. 693 00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:13,600 Speaker 1: And so that's a pretty good idea, right, it seems safer, 694 00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:17,080 Speaker 1: it does exactly. It seems like a cool idea. Another 695 00:36:17,280 --> 00:36:20,160 Speaker 1: version of that is using molten metals, like you can 696 00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:23,960 Speaker 1: have liquid lead in your reactor instead of water, and 697 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:26,840 Speaker 1: it's actually maybe even safer than water because again it 698 00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:29,120 Speaker 1: doesn't have to be at such high pressures, right, And 699 00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:32,080 Speaker 1: that's good because I guess high pressure of things that 700 00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:35,719 Speaker 1: are radioactive are kind of danger. Yeah, exactly. It's just 701 00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:37,760 Speaker 1: less likely to blow if it's not a high pressure, 702 00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:40,279 Speaker 1: all right, So melting salt is one way. Another way 703 00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:43,200 Speaker 1: is to use something called thorium exactly. And I'm desperate 704 00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:47,000 Speaker 1: to hear about your avenger's connection. Well, I'm just wondering 705 00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:51,000 Speaker 1: if it's related to holkium in in iron manium. Well, 706 00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:55,520 Speaker 1: I see thrium, right, How can I have missed that? No, 707 00:36:55,800 --> 00:36:59,240 Speaker 1: Thorium is an element. It's something that exists in the Earth. 708 00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:03,040 Speaker 1: It's actually more plentiful than uranium, and it's something that 709 00:37:03,080 --> 00:37:06,920 Speaker 1: we produce as a byproduct already of rare earth mining. 710 00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:09,600 Speaker 1: You know, when you're trying to get like cobalt or 711 00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:13,239 Speaker 1: namibium or whatever you need for your new batteries. When 712 00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,439 Speaker 1: you're doing the rare earth element mining, you already are 713 00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:19,560 Speaker 1: just like digging through lots of thorium to get it. 714 00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:22,000 Speaker 1: And so thorium is something we have a lot of, 715 00:37:22,400 --> 00:37:24,560 Speaker 1: and it turns out to be an excellent fuel for 716 00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:28,440 Speaker 1: nuclear reactors. Wait, what, so there's something else it's not 717 00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:32,040 Speaker 1: uranium that could also be used for fission reactors. Is 718 00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:35,120 Speaker 1: it like lighter or heavier or what's what's different about it? 719 00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:37,200 Speaker 1: The cool thing abou thorium is that it can't actually 720 00:37:37,239 --> 00:37:39,520 Speaker 1: do fission on its own, but when you hit it 721 00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:43,960 Speaker 1: with a neutron, it turns into uranium two thirty three. 722 00:37:44,560 --> 00:37:48,160 Speaker 1: So now another version of uranium. See it is kind 723 00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:51,880 Speaker 1: of like the Hulk. It turns green and more volatile. 724 00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:55,080 Speaker 1: Sounds like the Hulk. Yeah, and uranium two thirty three 725 00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:57,600 Speaker 1: is not something that exists in the Earth crust in 726 00:37:57,680 --> 00:38:01,080 Speaker 1: anything but trace amounts. But it's an slow fuel for 727 00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:03,799 Speaker 1: FISHI and it's very fiscile, and it can operate with 728 00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:06,800 Speaker 1: slow neutrons. If you just hit thorium with a neutron, 729 00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:09,400 Speaker 1: it turns into uranium, which is then fuel. So the 730 00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:15,200 Speaker 1: reactor can turn thorium into fuel four itself. Wait what like? Wait, 731 00:38:15,239 --> 00:38:18,480 Speaker 1: so you take thorium, you somehow bombarded with neutrons, it 732 00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:21,960 Speaker 1: becomes uranium two thirty three, and then when that splits, 733 00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:24,319 Speaker 1: it splits back into thorium. Is that the idea? Now, 734 00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:27,720 Speaker 1: when that splits, it splits into lighter stuff, releases energy 735 00:38:27,840 --> 00:38:31,080 Speaker 1: and neutrons and those neutrons. It produces enough neutrons not 736 00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:34,080 Speaker 1: just to split other uranium two thirty three atoms, but 737 00:38:34,239 --> 00:38:37,640 Speaker 1: also to hit thorium and turn it into uranium two 738 00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:41,759 Speaker 1: thirty three, So it like breeds its own fuel. Oh interesting, 739 00:38:42,600 --> 00:38:45,839 Speaker 1: I see, Like the process of the fission reaction would 740 00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:47,880 Speaker 1: actually make more fuel in the process if you put 741 00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:50,200 Speaker 1: more thorium in it. Like it's not making stuff out 742 00:38:50,200 --> 00:38:52,320 Speaker 1: of the blue. No, it's not just generating it. But 743 00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:55,040 Speaker 1: if you pour thorium into the reactor, it will turn 744 00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:57,760 Speaker 1: thorium into the fuel that it needs and then burn 745 00:38:57,800 --> 00:39:00,960 Speaker 1: that fuel, turning more thorium into the fuel that it needs. 746 00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:03,839 Speaker 1: So you need to keep adding thorium. But thorium by 747 00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:06,719 Speaker 1: itself is very stable. It's not fizzle, so it's not 748 00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:09,279 Speaker 1: like dangerous the way uranium, right, And it's also better 749 00:39:09,320 --> 00:39:12,000 Speaker 1: because it's not it's not as wasteful, right or dangerous 750 00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:14,480 Speaker 1: when it gets used exactly, it burns up a lot 751 00:39:14,560 --> 00:39:18,399 Speaker 1: of the uranium, and it doesn't produce crazy dangerous things 752 00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:20,880 Speaker 1: that last tens and thousands of years. I mean, it 753 00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:25,439 Speaker 1: produces very dangerous byproducts. Sum one thirty seven is very 754 00:39:25,520 --> 00:39:27,799 Speaker 1: very poisonous, but it has a half life of like 755 00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:32,040 Speaker 1: fifty issue years, not ten thousand years. So you need 756 00:39:32,080 --> 00:39:33,680 Speaker 1: to put this stuff in a barrel and wait a 757 00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:36,040 Speaker 1: couple hundred years before anybody goes near it. But you 758 00:39:36,080 --> 00:39:39,720 Speaker 1: don't need to wait fifty thousand years. Wow, this sounds great. 759 00:39:39,920 --> 00:39:42,439 Speaker 1: Why don't we use that? Like, why are we still 760 00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:47,080 Speaker 1: using uranium regular uranium? Let's switch to the avengers. Exactly, 761 00:39:47,080 --> 00:39:49,640 Speaker 1: it's a much better idea, but historically it hasn't been 762 00:39:49,640 --> 00:39:53,480 Speaker 1: pursued in the United States because it doesn't produce plutonium 763 00:39:53,719 --> 00:39:56,400 Speaker 1: and other heavy elements, those things which are very dangerous 764 00:39:56,480 --> 00:40:00,440 Speaker 1: and last forever. Those are also excellent for building nuclear weapons, 765 00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:03,400 Speaker 1: and so the Department of Energy, for example, Yeah, they 766 00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:06,239 Speaker 1: wanted to promote atomic power, but they also wanted to 767 00:40:06,280 --> 00:40:10,040 Speaker 1: develop facilities which would generate fuel for nuclear weapons. And 768 00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:14,799 Speaker 1: so burning uranium two thirty five was very inefficient. But 769 00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:17,160 Speaker 1: the uranium two thirty eight that was there, some of 770 00:40:17,200 --> 00:40:21,360 Speaker 1: it turned into plutonium, so you could make weapons grade fuel. Wait, 771 00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:24,520 Speaker 1: what are you saying that most nuclear power plants are 772 00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:29,840 Speaker 1: also secretly like weapons weapons and factories, not secretly. A 773 00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:33,439 Speaker 1: lot of nuclear power plants can produce plutonium, and it's 774 00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:35,759 Speaker 1: certainly an issue you need to also enrich it. Right, 775 00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:38,399 Speaker 1: it doesn't come out with pure plutonium, but a lot 776 00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:42,120 Speaker 1: of the uranium two thirty eight gets converted into very dangerous, 777 00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:45,080 Speaker 1: long lived waste, and some of that waste is excellent 778 00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:47,960 Speaker 1: fuel for weapons. Wow. So I guess maybe they saw 779 00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:50,640 Speaker 1: it as like a two for like a bonus, Like, Hey, 780 00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:53,239 Speaker 1: if we use this kind of fuel, this uranium two 781 00:40:53,360 --> 00:40:56,600 Speaker 1: thirty five to thirty eight, then as a byproduct, we 782 00:40:56,680 --> 00:40:58,920 Speaker 1: have kind of kind of a steady source of nuclear 783 00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:02,040 Speaker 1: weapons exactly. And so if, on the other hand, you 784 00:41:02,040 --> 00:41:07,120 Speaker 1: would like nuclear power without creating weapons fuel and without 785 00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:11,160 Speaker 1: creating environment poisoning waste that last tens and thousands of years, 786 00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:13,480 Speaker 1: you can do both at the same time by switching 787 00:41:13,560 --> 00:41:17,160 Speaker 1: to thorium. Wow. Well, it seems like countries that you 788 00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:20,759 Speaker 1: know don't have nuclear weapons, like does France have nuclear weapons? Like, 789 00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:22,880 Speaker 1: why wouldn't they switch to thorium. Well, it's just not 790 00:41:22,960 --> 00:41:25,319 Speaker 1: something that's been as developed. You know, we did some 791 00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:28,239 Speaker 1: research in the fifties and sixties and developed these reactors, 792 00:41:28,239 --> 00:41:30,960 Speaker 1: but uranium turned out to be kind of cheap and plentiful, 793 00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:32,680 Speaker 1: and people didn't really care about the fact that you 794 00:41:32,680 --> 00:41:35,320 Speaker 1: were wasting most of it, and it had these nuclear 795 00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:39,439 Speaker 1: weapons benefits. So it's largely just sort of abandoned for 796 00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:42,719 Speaker 1: decades and decades and just not really pursued. Oh I see, 797 00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:45,759 Speaker 1: So now it's maybe more of like a historical inertia 798 00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:48,120 Speaker 1: kind of like this is what we know what to do, 799 00:41:48,160 --> 00:41:49,600 Speaker 1: This is what we know how to do it. We 800 00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:53,040 Speaker 1: know how to make the safe. But thorium who knows, right, Like, 801 00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:55,400 Speaker 1: who knows? We don't know enough of it. Nobody has 802 00:41:55,440 --> 00:41:57,839 Speaker 1: done it enough to really kind of meet the same 803 00:41:57,840 --> 00:42:01,160 Speaker 1: safety standards. Maybe is that? Could that be an obstacle? Yeah, 804 00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:03,560 Speaker 1: it's a regulatory issues. You know, you're a company and 805 00:42:03,600 --> 00:42:07,360 Speaker 1: you're deciding to invest one billion dollars into a nuclear 806 00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:09,560 Speaker 1: power plant. What are you gonna do? You're gonna use 807 00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:11,960 Speaker 1: the plans for one that where was recently approved that 808 00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:14,399 Speaker 1: already sailed through the approval process and is working well, 809 00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:16,520 Speaker 1: instead of like, yeah, we're going to work on development 810 00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:19,359 Speaker 1: of some new technology. It requires the government to take 811 00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:21,879 Speaker 1: the lead in terms of research and developing and making 812 00:42:21,920 --> 00:42:24,720 Speaker 1: sure these things work. And so outside the United States, 813 00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:28,280 Speaker 1: some governments are doing this. China, for example, recently completed 814 00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:31,759 Speaker 1: a flora thorium reactor and they were supposed to turn 815 00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:34,520 Speaker 1: it on at the end of one. I haven't heard 816 00:42:34,560 --> 00:42:36,560 Speaker 1: if that thing has been turned on yet and works. 817 00:42:36,640 --> 00:42:38,480 Speaker 1: But you know, a lot of other countries are looking 818 00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:42,160 Speaker 1: into this. They can't find a thor's hammer to start 819 00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:46,000 Speaker 1: the reaction or something. Every time you gotta reboot it. Exactly, 820 00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:51,480 Speaker 1: you've gotta call thora um. And not just China, India. Also. 821 00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:54,480 Speaker 1: India is home to twenty five percent of the world's 822 00:42:54,520 --> 00:42:56,880 Speaker 1: thorium deposits, so it would be a great place to 823 00:42:56,920 --> 00:42:59,640 Speaker 1: rely on this kind of energy, and so they're developing 824 00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:03,640 Speaker 1: a the orium nuclear power program as well. Wow. Interesting, 825 00:43:03,680 --> 00:43:06,160 Speaker 1: I guess it just takes a long time, right, I mean, 826 00:43:06,400 --> 00:43:08,879 Speaker 1: you gotta you can't just like do this in a rush. 827 00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:11,040 Speaker 1: You gotta do this, do this very carefully. You do. 828 00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:14,359 Speaker 1: And there are some challenges to salt reactors that don't 829 00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:17,680 Speaker 1: exist for water reactors. For example, molten salt is kind 830 00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:20,120 Speaker 1: of corrosive. Like you have that in the inside of 831 00:43:20,120 --> 00:43:21,960 Speaker 1: a chamber for a long time, it's going to eat 832 00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:25,080 Speaker 1: away at the inside. So that was an obstacle a 833 00:43:25,080 --> 00:43:27,839 Speaker 1: long time ago. But these days we have fancy new 834 00:43:27,880 --> 00:43:31,360 Speaker 1: materials that can be basically hardened to the salt and 835 00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:34,000 Speaker 1: so it's no longer really a challenge. So with the 836 00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:37,160 Speaker 1: help of new technologies to overcome some of these technical challenges. 837 00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:39,560 Speaker 1: There's lots of places that are looking into this. There's 838 00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:43,399 Speaker 1: a company in Denmark actually called Copenhagen Atomics, and they 839 00:43:43,480 --> 00:43:46,480 Speaker 1: have a strategy to build one of these thorium reactors 840 00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:49,000 Speaker 1: and they want to make them into shipping containers. The 841 00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:51,279 Speaker 1: whole thing is just totally self contained. You never have 842 00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:53,480 Speaker 1: to open it up or do anything. You just turn 843 00:43:53,560 --> 00:43:57,520 Speaker 1: it on. It runs for like fifty years, produces energy 844 00:43:57,840 --> 00:44:00,920 Speaker 1: steadily for fifty years, and you can like them. You're like, oh, 845 00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:02,920 Speaker 1: we need ten of those. All we need five of those. 846 00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:04,799 Speaker 1: And to the self contained, what do you mean like 847 00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:07,320 Speaker 1: they produce the waste, But it's the wayt stays inside, 848 00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:10,000 Speaker 1: the waist stays inside, and you just like bury it 849 00:44:10,080 --> 00:44:12,440 Speaker 1: for two hundred years and then it's done. So that's 850 00:44:12,480 --> 00:44:15,560 Speaker 1: pretty cool idea. It's a company called Copenhagen Atomics. And 851 00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:17,960 Speaker 1: for the record, you're not you haven't invested in this 852 00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:22,680 Speaker 1: company heavy, You're not like Elon Musk trying to game 853 00:44:22,719 --> 00:44:25,560 Speaker 1: the markets. No, but you should buy Daniel coin. Really, 854 00:44:25,760 --> 00:44:32,000 Speaker 1: it's my new cryptocurrency, dan Coin, there you go, Exactly, 855 00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:36,040 Speaker 1: it's going to fund all of my heated spices for 856 00:44:36,120 --> 00:44:39,239 Speaker 1: your other the other arm of your subsidiary corporation, right, 857 00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:45,640 Speaker 1: spicy dan exactly working on development of anti chocolate technology. 858 00:44:45,680 --> 00:44:48,320 Speaker 1: All right, So those are two pretty interesting ideas using 859 00:44:48,560 --> 00:44:52,120 Speaker 1: melted salt molten salt and also maybe switching up the 860 00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:54,960 Speaker 1: fuel to do something that's maybe cleaner. And it sounds 861 00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:56,680 Speaker 1: like people are working on it, and maybe we should 862 00:44:56,719 --> 00:44:59,040 Speaker 1: too because it sounds like other countries are working on it. 863 00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:02,279 Speaker 1: It's definitely pro missing technology. And if you think that 864 00:45:02,360 --> 00:45:05,520 Speaker 1: nuclear power is an important part of a clean future, 865 00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:09,160 Speaker 1: then definitely thorium is a better choice than uranium. It's 866 00:45:09,160 --> 00:45:11,200 Speaker 1: a question, you know, whether or not even the waste 867 00:45:11,200 --> 00:45:14,080 Speaker 1: produced by thorm reactors is worth the risks, but it's 868 00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:17,279 Speaker 1: definitely all better than burning fossil fuels, right, and it's 869 00:45:17,320 --> 00:45:19,799 Speaker 1: much better than hawkeye. Um. Yeah, maybe you should just 870 00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:22,520 Speaker 1: take the avengers and grind them up into fuel. Well, 871 00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:27,560 Speaker 1: they definitely make enough money to self sustained. It's its 872 00:45:27,600 --> 00:45:31,080 Speaker 1: own reaction there, Yeah, exactly, will mint avenge coins at 873 00:45:31,080 --> 00:45:36,240 Speaker 1: a ground up avengers? There you go, marvel Coin, marvel Coin, 874 00:45:36,360 --> 00:45:39,600 Speaker 1: you might as well have their own economy, right, they're 875 00:45:39,600 --> 00:45:42,440 Speaker 1: basically just printing money, all right, Well, this is kind 876 00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:44,920 Speaker 1: of hopeful news to know that maybe they're people are 877 00:45:44,960 --> 00:45:47,759 Speaker 1: working on cleaner and more efficient energies and to get 878 00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:51,320 Speaker 1: humanity into the stars maybe and into the far future 879 00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:55,320 Speaker 1: so we can learn more about the universe and discover 880 00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:58,000 Speaker 1: more of it exactly. And it's always fascinating to learn 881 00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:00,560 Speaker 1: about the history of these things and how like political 882 00:46:00,719 --> 00:46:04,520 Speaker 1: choices that were made decades ago really changed the direction 883 00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:07,520 Speaker 1: of research. And it's not always for a good reason, 884 00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:10,360 Speaker 1: not always for reasons that we would agree with today, 885 00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:13,000 Speaker 1: And so the things that people are working on currently 886 00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:15,560 Speaker 1: are just sort of the things people have been working on, 887 00:46:15,640 --> 00:46:19,680 Speaker 1: and they're often really promising directions that were overlooked for 888 00:46:19,920 --> 00:46:22,360 Speaker 1: silly reasons. All right, Well, we hope you enjoyed that. 889 00:46:22,760 --> 00:46:33,680 Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us, See you next time. Thanks for listening, 890 00:46:33,680 --> 00:46:36,400 Speaker 1: and remember that Daniel and Jorge explained. The Universe is 891 00:46:36,440 --> 00:46:39,960 Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Radio. For more podcast from 892 00:46:39,960 --> 00:46:43,719 Speaker 1: my Heart Radio, visit the i Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 893 00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:46,200 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.