1 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:07,480 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:08,640 --> 00:00:12,440 Speaker 2: Bloomberg property reporter Shauna Kwan already knew that one of 3 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:16,640 Speaker 2: Hong Kong's biggest real estate developers, New World Development, was 4 00:00:16,680 --> 00:00:19,720 Speaker 2: in real trouble when she got a tip that she 5 00:00:19,880 --> 00:00:20,720 Speaker 2: wasn't expecting. 6 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:26,440 Speaker 3: When I first heard it, I was super super surprised 7 00:00:26,440 --> 00:00:28,840 Speaker 3: because it seemed to me impossible. 8 00:00:29,640 --> 00:00:33,040 Speaker 2: Even amid a dramatic wipeout of the Hong Kong property market, 9 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:36,680 Speaker 2: New World stood out. It was deeper in debt than 10 00:00:36,720 --> 00:00:40,440 Speaker 2: any other major developer in the territory, and last month 11 00:00:40,520 --> 00:00:43,760 Speaker 2: it was expected to announce its first annual loss in 12 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:47,280 Speaker 2: two decades. But the tip Shauna got wasn't about the 13 00:00:47,280 --> 00:00:48,920 Speaker 2: company's financials. 14 00:00:49,240 --> 00:00:53,160 Speaker 3: I got a tip that Adrian Chang would step down 15 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:54,080 Speaker 3: as CEO. 16 00:00:55,120 --> 00:00:58,480 Speaker 2: Adrian Chang is a third generation scion of New World, 17 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:01,880 Speaker 2: a grandson of the company's main founder. He had been 18 00:01:01,960 --> 00:01:06,920 Speaker 2: named CEO of the family's flagship property business in twenty twenty. 19 00:01:07,040 --> 00:01:09,640 Speaker 2: It had been expected that he was going to take 20 00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:14,839 Speaker 2: over his family's entire conglomerate, which spans beyond property development 21 00:01:14,959 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 2: into hotels and jewelry and other ventures. The family's empire 22 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:22,720 Speaker 2: is valued at around twenty billion US dollars and the 23 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:26,280 Speaker 2: forty four year old Cheng seemed poised to run it all. 24 00:01:26,959 --> 00:01:30,320 Speaker 2: But now this tip that Shawna had received cast doubt 25 00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:34,880 Speaker 2: on all of that. Shawna and Bloomberg consumer reporter Shirley 26 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:39,000 Speaker 2: Jow reached out to their sources, got confirmation that Chang's 27 00:01:39,040 --> 00:01:41,759 Speaker 2: departure was eminent, and published their story. 28 00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:44,600 Speaker 3: It was just really the biggest news in Hong Kong's 29 00:01:44,600 --> 00:01:47,520 Speaker 3: business world in the past year or so. Everyone was 30 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 3: talking about it. Everyone was very surprised, and even when 31 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:53,600 Speaker 3: I talked to people who are in the property industry, 32 00:01:53,800 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 3: they were equally surprised because everyone saw adrians new world. 33 00:01:59,600 --> 00:02:02,559 Speaker 2: And then yes today. After Bloomberg broke the news, Chang 34 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 2: himself confirmed. 35 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:09,720 Speaker 3: It her Tamzo So Adrian said that after much consideration, 36 00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:14,320 Speaker 3: he decided to devote more time to public service, so 37 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:16,240 Speaker 3: that's why he submitted his resignation. 38 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:19,520 Speaker 2: The whole speech lasted just a few minutes, and then 39 00:02:19,639 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 2: Chang handed over the mic to the company's new CEO, 40 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:27,120 Speaker 2: Eric mass Yu Chunk, the company's chief operating officer. For 41 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:30,240 Speaker 2: the first time in the Property Group's history, it would 42 00:02:30,240 --> 00:02:33,280 Speaker 2: be run by someone who wasn't a member of the 43 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:34,080 Speaker 2: Chang family. 44 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:36,880 Speaker 3: When you look at all the other proper developers in 45 00:02:36,919 --> 00:02:41,200 Speaker 3: Hong Kong, they are still being led by the offspring 46 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:44,280 Speaker 3: of the founder, someone with the same surname. But then 47 00:02:44,320 --> 00:02:48,359 Speaker 3: now we have a maa leading New World that is 48 00:02:48,400 --> 00:02:52,000 Speaker 3: a Chang business, so that is very unusual. 49 00:02:54,760 --> 00:02:58,440 Speaker 2: Welcome to the Big Take Asia from Bloomberg News. I'm wanh. 50 00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:01,359 Speaker 2: Every week we take you inside some of the world's 51 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:05,560 Speaker 2: biggest and most powerful economies and the markets, tycoons and 52 00:03:05,720 --> 00:03:10,040 Speaker 2: businesses that drive this ever shifting region. Today on the show, 53 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:13,640 Speaker 2: the succession drama of one of the richest families in 54 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 2: Hong Kong, and while other family dynasties follow suit, hiring 55 00:03:18,240 --> 00:03:26,280 Speaker 2: non relatives to run their companies. When Adrian Cheng stepped 56 00:03:26,280 --> 00:03:29,359 Speaker 2: into leadership at New World, he embarked on a number 57 00:03:29,360 --> 00:03:33,240 Speaker 2: of mega projects. His most famous one was K eleven Musea. 58 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:36,560 Speaker 1: A decade ago. My team and I had the honor 59 00:03:36,880 --> 00:03:40,760 Speaker 1: of working with one hundred creative powers from all around 60 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:43,240 Speaker 1: the world to revitalize this cultural gym. 61 00:03:43,360 --> 00:03:47,200 Speaker 2: K eleven Musea is an ornate art and luxury retail 62 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:51,440 Speaker 2: galleria on Prime harborfront in Hong Kong. It was part 63 00:03:51,480 --> 00:03:54,320 Speaker 2: of a two point six billion dollar project a decade 64 00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:57,200 Speaker 2: in the making, and it was a cornerstone of Cheng's 65 00:03:57,280 --> 00:03:58,360 Speaker 2: vision for New World. 66 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:01,840 Speaker 3: What he wanted to do is to incorporate art and 67 00:04:01,880 --> 00:04:08,000 Speaker 3: cultural elements into these commercial property projects like shopping malls, 68 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 3: residential buildings, and offices. 69 00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:15,680 Speaker 2: Seana says this approach of melding art with commercial property 70 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:19,919 Speaker 2: projects was seen as unnecessary by other real estate developers 71 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:20,800 Speaker 2: in the city. 72 00:04:20,760 --> 00:04:25,159 Speaker 3: Because land and properly have been so valuable in the city. 73 00:04:25,839 --> 00:04:29,000 Speaker 3: As a developer, you literally just have to build something, 74 00:04:29,640 --> 00:04:32,280 Speaker 3: provide a space, and you can make money. You don't 75 00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:37,440 Speaker 3: really have to add anything artsy or cultural. So I 76 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:40,279 Speaker 3: think he was really taking a step further. 77 00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:43,200 Speaker 2: And there were other signs that Chang intended to be 78 00:04:43,240 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 2: a different type of leader for New World. 79 00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:49,800 Speaker 3: He would wear sneakers quite early in his career, and 80 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:53,240 Speaker 3: then over time his attire would diverge more and more 81 00:04:53,279 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 3: from the usual business type. And in the past few 82 00:04:56,640 --> 00:05:00,159 Speaker 3: years he also grew a beard that was that have 83 00:05:00,279 --> 00:05:01,479 Speaker 3: been the talk of a town. 84 00:05:01,760 --> 00:05:02,279 Speaker 2: Just a beard. 85 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:05,360 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, Kala is just a beard. But then 86 00:05:05,440 --> 00:05:10,360 Speaker 3: in Hong Kong's very old money world, it's very unusual 87 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:15,359 Speaker 3: I think it also reflects how different Adrian tries to 88 00:05:15,440 --> 00:05:19,599 Speaker 3: portray himself, as he's not just another boring executive. He 89 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:23,200 Speaker 3: is someone who has tayste who has connection in the 90 00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:26,000 Speaker 3: art world, who doesn't just care about money. So I 91 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:31,120 Speaker 3: think that really differentiates him from the other tycoons in. 92 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:34,320 Speaker 2: Hong Kong, Chang also became known for being one of 93 00:05:34,360 --> 00:05:38,880 Speaker 2: the most aggressive property investors in town. Under his leadership, 94 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:41,840 Speaker 2: New World poured billions into a number of major real 95 00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:45,119 Speaker 2: estate projects, from a sports center that Hong Kong hopes 96 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:47,960 Speaker 2: will one day attract the likes of Taylor Swift to 97 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:52,040 Speaker 2: a sprawling shopping and entertainment complex at the airport. On 98 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:54,919 Speaker 2: top of that, New World was also snapping up land 99 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:59,359 Speaker 2: in mainland China, particularly the Greater Bay Area, an economic 100 00:05:59,400 --> 00:06:02,760 Speaker 2: hub inter grading Hong Kong with Shanzen and other cities 101 00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:06,359 Speaker 2: in southern China. Here's Chang speaking to Bloomberg TV in 102 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:09,760 Speaker 2: twenty twenty one about the company's China ambitions. 103 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:14,000 Speaker 1: Anwa is actually the earliest dominant player in Greater Bay Area. 104 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:18,240 Speaker 1: Since twenty and sixteen, we have spent over thirty billion 105 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:21,640 Speaker 1: in acquiring one point five million square meter of land. 106 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:25,400 Speaker 2: But this buildings free in Hong Kong and the company's 107 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:29,919 Speaker 2: expansion into mainland China started to look like risky bets 108 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:33,000 Speaker 2: for New World as the Hong Kong property market hit 109 00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 2: a major slump starting in twenty nineteen. 110 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:39,080 Speaker 3: When the antiq government protests starts to take place in 111 00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:41,760 Speaker 3: Hong Kong and then followed by the pandemic. So overall, 112 00:06:42,200 --> 00:06:44,640 Speaker 3: the marqueat hasn't been doing so great. 113 00:06:45,080 --> 00:06:48,160 Speaker 2: Two hundred and seventy billion dollars have been wiped out 114 00:06:48,200 --> 00:06:51,159 Speaker 2: from the real estate market in the city since twenty nineteen. 115 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:55,760 Speaker 2: That's according to an analysis by Bloomberg Intelligence. But even 116 00:06:55,800 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 2: among its struggling peers, New World stood out taken on 117 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:02,839 Speaker 2: a lot of debt to fund its new projects, and 118 00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 2: its dead load was getting worrisome. 119 00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 3: It's by twenty twenty two when the share prices of 120 00:07:09,960 --> 00:07:15,200 Speaker 3: Newer started to underperform its peers, because it's when New 121 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:18,880 Speaker 3: World's debt level had raised more and more concerns among 122 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 3: investors and as well as analysts. 123 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:24,880 Speaker 2: That's also right about the time that China's property market 124 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:27,400 Speaker 2: also started to unwind as well and collapse. 125 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:28,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. 126 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:32,160 Speaker 2: On top of this, rising interest rates were also hurting 127 00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:35,280 Speaker 2: the company. The city's base rate had been at its 128 00:07:35,400 --> 00:07:38,200 Speaker 2: highest level since two thousand and seven before the Hong 129 00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:42,119 Speaker 2: Kong Monetary Authority lowered it last month, and Chang says 130 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:46,000 Speaker 2: a rate that high was especially problematic for New World. 131 00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:49,640 Speaker 3: The increasing interest rate on the one hand, for the 132 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:53,080 Speaker 3: exacerbated the downturn, and on they had a hand would 133 00:07:53,160 --> 00:07:56,880 Speaker 3: add interest expanse for the company who had the most 134 00:07:57,160 --> 00:08:00,320 Speaker 3: debt among its majored peers. 135 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:02,240 Speaker 2: And that was partly because they were expanding so. 136 00:08:02,280 --> 00:08:05,480 Speaker 3: Much exactly and in all the projects that I just shared, 137 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:07,080 Speaker 3: needed a lot of money. 138 00:08:07,760 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 2: By the end of June this year, Bloomberg Intelligence said 139 00:08:10,880 --> 00:08:14,320 Speaker 2: New World's net debt to equity was ninety two percent. 140 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:18,560 Speaker 2: That's an important metric of a company's financial leverage, and 141 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:22,560 Speaker 2: the company's competitors have posted smaller ratios as low as 142 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:31,000 Speaker 2: eighteen percent. After the break, a shock announcement by Adrian's father, 143 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:35,400 Speaker 2: Henry Chang, and could other wealthy Asian families follow New 144 00:08:35,400 --> 00:08:38,920 Speaker 2: World's lead and put non family members at the helm 145 00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:54,880 Speaker 2: of their companies. Under Adrian Chang, New World had expanded 146 00:08:54,880 --> 00:08:58,080 Speaker 2: aggressively in China and was working on two of the 147 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:02,120 Speaker 2: biggest retail developments in Hong Kong, But by twenty twenty three, 148 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:06,160 Speaker 2: Chang's strategy came into question as a company's debt load 149 00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:10,600 Speaker 2: grew while interest rates soared. By last November, New World 150 00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:14,080 Speaker 2: stock had hit a twenty year low. That same month, 151 00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:18,559 Speaker 2: Adrian's father, Henry Chang made an announcement on television that 152 00:09:18,760 --> 00:09:20,200 Speaker 2: shook Hong Kong. 153 00:09:20,640 --> 00:09:25,760 Speaker 3: No nigo yatna you want you go one dollar? What 154 00:09:25,920 --> 00:09:30,080 Speaker 3: a face you're going. Henry, who had been very low 155 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:34,720 Speaker 3: key in the past few years, went on TV out 156 00:09:34,760 --> 00:09:38,800 Speaker 3: of sudden, out of the blue, saying that he hadn't 157 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:42,520 Speaker 3: found a successor and he was still looking for a successor, 158 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:46,319 Speaker 3: and then the whole of Hong Kong was very confused, 159 00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:49,880 Speaker 3: like what hasn't it been Adrian the whole time? 160 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:53,720 Speaker 2: When I asked about the remarks, Adrian's sister Sonya Cheng, 161 00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:56,959 Speaker 2: who manages the Rosewood hotel chain as well as the 162 00:09:57,000 --> 00:10:01,120 Speaker 2: family's jewelry group, said that all family members worked together 163 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:04,800 Speaker 2: for the benefit of the company, and a cousin denied 164 00:10:04,920 --> 00:10:08,760 Speaker 2: family infighting. New World declined to comment to Bloomberg about 165 00:10:08,800 --> 00:10:12,800 Speaker 2: Henry Chang's remarks at the time, but now less than 166 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:17,480 Speaker 2: a year later, Adrian's resignation as CEO appears to confirm 167 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:20,880 Speaker 2: that the successor role that one seemed promised to him 168 00:10:21,360 --> 00:10:24,920 Speaker 2: is no longer on the table. Although Adrian Cheng said 169 00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:28,200 Speaker 2: he resigned on his own accord, Shanna told us she 170 00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:32,040 Speaker 2: heard a different explanation for his departure, that his father 171 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:36,560 Speaker 2: and other family members weren't happy with his leadership. 172 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:39,400 Speaker 3: Basically like he got pushed out by the family, and 173 00:10:39,520 --> 00:10:43,880 Speaker 3: our sources say that Henry himself hasn't been very satisfied 174 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:48,480 Speaker 3: with Adrian's spending habits and also the fact that he 175 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:51,640 Speaker 3: got the company into a lot of debt. 176 00:10:52,240 --> 00:10:56,200 Speaker 2: Sources told Bloomberg that as New World's performance floundered, the 177 00:10:56,280 --> 00:10:59,960 Speaker 2: Cheng family began to express concern that Adrian was spending 178 00:11:00,120 --> 00:11:04,000 Speaker 2: too much time on cultural pursuits, including those involving K 179 00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:08,160 Speaker 2: eleven Museia. After stepping down, Chang remains as a non 180 00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:11,880 Speaker 2: executive vice chairman at New World and said he'll continue 181 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:16,600 Speaker 2: to contribute to the commercial strategy of the K eleven brand. Meanwhile, 182 00:11:16,600 --> 00:11:19,120 Speaker 2: Shanna said she expects to see more of Henry Chang, 183 00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:21,520 Speaker 2: who had taken a back seat to his son in 184 00:11:21,559 --> 00:11:22,320 Speaker 2: recent years. 185 00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:25,960 Speaker 3: Henry for the safe of the past decade had been 186 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:29,520 Speaker 3: quite low key. He didn't have a lot of public appearance. Meanwhile, 187 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:32,520 Speaker 3: Adrian had become the face of the Chang family and 188 00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:36,120 Speaker 3: also New World, and then obviously we see him being 189 00:11:36,200 --> 00:11:41,560 Speaker 3: more focal about the family's operation. And what we heard 190 00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:44,360 Speaker 3: is that Henry has taken a more hands on role 191 00:11:45,200 --> 00:11:51,360 Speaker 3: in managing the family's conglomerate. So I wouldn't be surprised 192 00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:54,040 Speaker 3: if we see Henry more often in public. 193 00:11:54,760 --> 00:11:57,240 Speaker 2: As for the rest of the family, Henry Chang's other 194 00:11:57,320 --> 00:12:00,720 Speaker 2: children run different parts of the family business, So I 195 00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:04,080 Speaker 2: asked Shauna if one of them could potentially take over 196 00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:05,120 Speaker 2: as successor. 197 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:08,480 Speaker 3: Honestly, we don't know, and from what we see so far, 198 00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:11,800 Speaker 3: a New World looks like it will be controlled or 199 00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:15,160 Speaker 3: it would be led by someone external of the family. 200 00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:18,520 Speaker 2: In that same TV interview last year, when the Chang 201 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:21,760 Speaker 2: patriarch said he was still looking for a successor, he'd 202 00:12:21,800 --> 00:12:25,000 Speaker 2: also said that if there were no suitable candidates among 203 00:12:25,080 --> 00:12:29,920 Speaker 2: the Changs, he would consider hiring outside the family. For now, 204 00:12:30,080 --> 00:12:32,480 Speaker 2: New World is being led by Eric Mah, who was 205 00:12:32,520 --> 00:12:36,880 Speaker 2: the company's chief operating officer. So could Ma's appointment be 206 00:12:36,960 --> 00:12:39,320 Speaker 2: a model for other families in the future. 207 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:44,240 Speaker 3: Broadly speaking, in terms of family succession, I think if say, 208 00:12:44,320 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 3: when Eric Maher takes over and then he does a 209 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:49,680 Speaker 3: very good job with managing the company, I think it 210 00:12:49,800 --> 00:12:54,160 Speaker 3: may raise the question to other families that maybe you 211 00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:59,559 Speaker 3: don't really have to pass your company to your offspring. 212 00:12:59,640 --> 00:13:04,600 Speaker 3: Maybe it's even better to let someone professional outside family 213 00:13:04,679 --> 00:13:06,320 Speaker 3: to take care of it. So I think it may 214 00:13:06,400 --> 00:13:10,719 Speaker 3: open doors to more innovative or different session plans. In 215 00:13:10,800 --> 00:13:12,480 Speaker 3: Hong Kong and maybe in the region. 216 00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:16,520 Speaker 2: A smooth succession is paramount for dynasties like New Worlds 217 00:13:16,520 --> 00:13:20,600 Speaker 2: in Hong Kong and around the region. Asia's richest clans, 218 00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:24,680 Speaker 2: whose businesses span everything from real estate to airports to 219 00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:28,240 Speaker 2: the biggest consumer brands, will hand down five point eight 220 00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:32,560 Speaker 2: trillion dollars to the next generation by twenty thirty. That's 221 00:13:32,559 --> 00:13:36,800 Speaker 2: according to a McKenzie report. Yet there's sometimes divide between 222 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:40,360 Speaker 2: the generations over how businesses should be managed and the 223 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:44,880 Speaker 2: well spent. Shanna says Chang's fall highlights the problems many 224 00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:48,240 Speaker 2: third generation airs face as more of them take over 225 00:13:48,280 --> 00:13:50,920 Speaker 2: the reigns of family businesses and fortunes. 226 00:13:52,200 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 3: I think in Asia we see more and more of 227 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:57,840 Speaker 3: the third generation really taking control of the family. But 228 00:13:57,880 --> 00:14:01,040 Speaker 3: then they are the third generation who would very naturally 229 00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:05,440 Speaker 3: want to do something different instead of really taking the 230 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:09,360 Speaker 3: same routine or taking the same strategy as their fathers 231 00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:13,400 Speaker 3: of their grandfathers. So I think that's when problems may arise, 232 00:14:13,520 --> 00:14:16,400 Speaker 3: because if they want to do something ambitious and they 233 00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:19,760 Speaker 3: say the external environment doesn't allow it, then they may 234 00:14:19,880 --> 00:14:21,920 Speaker 3: end up having a lot of trouble like what we 235 00:14:21,960 --> 00:14:22,720 Speaker 3: see in New World. 236 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:30,160 Speaker 2: This is The Big Take Asia from Bloomberg News. I'm wanha. 237 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:34,720 Speaker 2: This episode was produced by Naming Jessica Beck and Young Young. 238 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:37,760 Speaker 2: It was mixed by Alex Sugera in fact checked by 239 00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:41,200 Speaker 2: Eddie Dwan. It was edited by Caitlin Kenny and Lulu Chen. 240 00:14:41,720 --> 00:14:45,040 Speaker 2: There was additional reporting by Shirley Jowell. Nicole Beemster Bower 241 00:14:45,200 --> 00:14:48,680 Speaker 2: is our executive producer, Elizabeth Konso is our senior editor, 242 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:52,600 Speaker 2: and Safe Bauman is Bloomberg's head of Podcasts. Please follow 243 00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:55,880 Speaker 2: and review The Big Take Asia wherever you listen to podcasts. 244 00:14:56,040 --> 00:14:58,760 Speaker 2: It really helps new listeners find the show. See you 245 00:14:58,800 --> 00:14:59,240 Speaker 2: next time.