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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg Surveillance Podcast. I'm Tom Keane. Along

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Speaker 1: with Jonathan Ferrell and Lisa Abramowitz. Daily we bring you

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Speaker 1: insight from the best and economics, finance, investment, and international relations.

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Speaker 1: Find Bloomberg Surveillance on Apple podcast, SoundCloud, Bloomberg dot Com,

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Speaker 1: and of course on the Bloomberg terminal. What we're gonna

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Speaker 1: do this morning, folks, and this is, of course, the

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Speaker 1: combination of equities, bonds, currencies, commodities is considered the bears

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Speaker 1: who've been successful. Douglas cast nailing it at Sea Breeze

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Speaker 1: on a short term basis, and as John mentions, Mr

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Speaker 1: Wilson over at Morgan Stanley, absolutely nailing it on a

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Speaker 1: more long term, measured let's call it institutional basis in

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Speaker 1: this storm. As Andrew Slim and Mr Wilson's colleague, senior

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Speaker 1: portfolio manager at Morgan Stanley Chicago, Andrew, thank you so

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Speaker 1: much for joining us in this turmoil. You go, as

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Speaker 1: a guy more optimistic where Mike Wilson goes, which is

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Speaker 1: now we must study earnings, and you suggest that margins

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Speaker 1: must be maintained. Can we be optimistic for maintained margins

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Speaker 1: through the end of the year. Well, we we certainly

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Speaker 1: haven't seen the you know, the earnings collapse that you know,

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Speaker 1: many of the bears have predicted. We'll have to see.

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Speaker 1: I would say from a stock picking standpoint, it's better

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Speaker 1: to find the companies that actually already have had the

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Speaker 1: the earnings clocks. I think he's talking at the at

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Speaker 1: the S and P level. You know, we'll have to see.

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Speaker 1: The counter argument is that we are still only two

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Speaker 1: years from the previous recession, and therefore balance sheets can

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Speaker 1: withstand the shocks that you're seeing to cost and so

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Speaker 1: forth better than they would if we were, you know,

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Speaker 1: coming off a long period of economic story with a

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Speaker 1: two year back to an Autumn two thousand seven yield?

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Speaker 1: Is cash attractive? Is a legit asset? Yeah? Yeah, yes.

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Speaker 1: And the point of this is is I am in

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Speaker 1: the camp of p compression. So I think that is

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Speaker 1: the negative. The FED raising rates, yields going up pushes

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Speaker 1: the pe down, and that's the negative that I see.

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Speaker 1: I'm just haven't embraced as much the you know, the

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Speaker 1: the earnings collapsing side, which is the positive that to

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Speaker 1: me has been the story of the year. And we

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Speaker 1: got a little but you know, we had a very

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Speaker 1: big bance off the June low on the fact that

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Speaker 1: the second quarter was not as bad as expepected. And

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Speaker 1: you know, now we're pulling back. That's the push pull

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Speaker 1: of you know, they're very much a lackluster year for

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Speaker 1: requas and I'm still on that camp Andrews. You know,

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Speaker 1: the bond market backdrop changed as well, since the middle

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Speaker 1: of June is back to where we were. So here's

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Speaker 1: the question about the June lows and the equity market.

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Speaker 1: If the two yield is back through the June fourteenth highs,

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Speaker 1: why do equities along anywhere near ten above the June

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Speaker 1: six loaves? Probably not. They probably will head lower. I think,

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Speaker 1: you know, September is not a great month, but I

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Speaker 1: still think we could get a you know, gate late

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Speaker 1: rally in the fourth quarter as the market starts to

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Speaker 1: price off, you know, next four months, next four quarters

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Speaker 1: of earning, which is three But you know, look, we've

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Speaker 1: had a big bounce. You know, high risk came back

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Speaker 1: in the market very quickly, and I think that's you

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Speaker 1: know that that was a dangerous sign. So your own

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Speaker 1: power getting up and saying what he said, and boom

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Speaker 1: down goes all the speculation that had come quickly back

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Speaker 1: to the market. So I think the Yeah, I think

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Speaker 1: the near term is it's negative for the market. Will

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Speaker 1: we hold the loads of June? I think it's possible,

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Speaker 1: even with rates higher, But I think speculation is right

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Speaker 1: for short term speculation right to be you know, washed out.

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Speaker 1: So you sound really farish, Andrew, and you're talking about

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Speaker 1: reducing risk. And then I look at some of the

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Speaker 1: stocks that you like, including restoration hardware, Lulu Lemon, among

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Speaker 1: other consumer discretionaries that usually do worse during downturns. What

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Speaker 1: gives what's the rush now? Yeah? So, first of all,

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Speaker 1: at the macro level, consumer sentiment hit a forty four

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Speaker 1: year low in July, so a lot of very negative views.

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Speaker 1: And when you think about that, it's all the stock

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Speaker 1: market rewards the direction of change, and so inevitably direction change,

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Speaker 1: it's got to go high. At some point. It has

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Speaker 1: and it has improved. And then from a stock standpoint,

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Speaker 1: those stacks are damned forty fifty, sixty, seventy piked the truck.

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Speaker 1: There is just a turn of bad news priced into

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Speaker 1: so so I guess going back to the original question

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Speaker 1: of earnings, you know, these companies have already brought down

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Speaker 1: their numbers. They you know, the market is priced sing

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Speaker 1: in as if they're going to miss earnings. So I

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Speaker 1: think that it's safer to buy companies that have already

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Speaker 1: you know, the expectation is is bad. I I always

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Speaker 1: am interested in buying companies with great long term track

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Speaker 1: records that that the stocks are down a lot, with

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Speaker 1: a lot of negative expectations. So I think that's safer

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Speaker 1: than thinking you can pick and choose companies that aren't

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Speaker 1: going to have earnings problems. Following that logic, Andrew, do

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Speaker 1: you think that the opposite holds true, that you should

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Speaker 1: sell the names that have held in better I'm thinking

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Speaker 1: of big tech that have had incredible rallies over the

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Speaker 1: past few months. I absolutely, I absolutely, I think it's

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Speaker 1: very dangerous, be careful if the Mike Wilson scenario comes

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Speaker 1: to bear. I don't want to stock this down from

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Speaker 1: its you know five. I think there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: risk into that area, and I'd rather buy the companies

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Speaker 1: that already priced in a lot of bad news. How

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Speaker 1: do our listeners and viewers do, Andrew? If everybody he's

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Speaker 1: buying four or five stocks which were x per cent

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Speaker 1: of the bullmarket rally out of June, and then you've

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Speaker 1: got to look at everything else. Do you participate in

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Speaker 1: those glory stocks and figure out what to buy or

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Speaker 1: do you finally jettison the glory stocks and actually run

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Speaker 1: a diversified portfolio. Well, yeah, I mean, for I I

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Speaker 1: think there's plenty of companies out there that are down,

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Speaker 1: uh you know a lot, as I said, and there's

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Speaker 1: real opportunities. But those big, very big stocks, some of

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Speaker 1: them are really not down that much. And you know,

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Speaker 1: if you go back in long time at the history

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Speaker 1: of the SMP, what brings down the largest companies that

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Speaker 1: they never stay on top for ever? It's usually the government,

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Speaker 1: the government, And I think, you know, you've you've got

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Speaker 1: a very high waiting and a few names, and that

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Speaker 1: is going to weigh on the S and P at

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Speaker 1: the index level, I think for the a few years,

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Speaker 1: which will be good for investors that go out and

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Speaker 1: buy individual stocks because I think the opportunities that is

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Speaker 1: probably better at the stock level than the index level,

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Speaker 1: just given the waiting in those few names at the

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Speaker 1: time when they're you know, the government is you know,

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Speaker 1: like I said, starting that you know knows in some

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Speaker 1: of these companies, Andrew got a squazes in energy when

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Speaker 1: with the year on spid, Jeff carrying the team over

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Speaker 1: a goldman. They're telling people to keep buying commodities, even

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Speaker 1: going into what could be in recession. They say, the

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Speaker 1: following commodities the best asset class to war into an

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Speaker 1: a late cycle face where demand remains above supply. Andrew,

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Speaker 1: where are you on the commodity equity side of things?

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Speaker 1: The energy equities which have delivered some stellar returns this year.

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Speaker 1: So we solicit some stocks that we like, we got

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Speaker 1: to sell something to buy them because I'm a long

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Speaker 1: equity marriage or what have I been reducing energy? And

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Speaker 1: I've been reducing energy because just where you said, it's

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Speaker 1: a significant to do at Uh, this industry is classically cyclical,

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Speaker 1: and if in fact the economy does weaken, UH, to me,

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Speaker 1: energy is vulnerable because it's done so well versus stocks

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Speaker 1: that you know we're listed that are already done a lot.

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Speaker 1: So I think energy is a source of funding. It's

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Speaker 1: come roaring back here. I would continue to view it

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Speaker 1: as a source of uh source of funny. So I'm

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Speaker 1: you know that the halt pitch in energy was a

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Speaker 1: year and a half two years ago, when you know

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Speaker 1: the poor occurred with negative prices. I think the fat

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Speaker 1: pitch right now is a sentiment is at a forty

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Speaker 1: four year loved. I think that's the that's the opportunity,

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Speaker 1: and you sell things that are done very well like energy. Andrew,

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Speaker 1: thank you, Andrew Slim and management Numerus Surveillers has been

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Speaker 1: committed to economics. We're really looking forward to giving the

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Speaker 1: Jackson Whole treatment to CenTra when they come around again.

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Speaker 1: In poor artegal and at those efforts there are academics.

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Speaker 1: We avoid them like the plague. We do that for

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Speaker 1: all sorts of reasons. But every once in a while

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Speaker 1: we get lucky and lasso in one of them. If

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Speaker 1: at Jackson Hall this year, Francesco Biancy of Johns Hopkins

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Speaker 1: Ex Duke, EX Princeton stop traffic by speaking the word

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Speaker 1: that no one wanted to speak, and that is fiscal economics.

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Speaker 1: It's a twenty nine page paper loaded with math. I

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Speaker 1: don't understand matrix algebra. We just can't do that on TV,

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Speaker 1: but we can talk about the basics and the policy

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Speaker 1: prescription out of this. You say there can be a

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Speaker 1: monetary lead solution or a fiscal lead solution rhythm MMT.

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Speaker 1: Does the FED do a fiscal lead solution or is

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Speaker 1: that the part of Congress and the president so sor

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Speaker 1: right now, I think the FED is committed to bringing

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Speaker 1: fish on down. I guess the main point of our

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Speaker 1: paper is to show that the FED also needs a

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Speaker 1: cooperation from the physical authority. So we take an historical

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Speaker 1: perspective and we look back at the sixties and seventies

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Speaker 1: and provide an argument that that was a phisical phenomenon.

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Speaker 1: Ultimately was dabbish monetary policy, but combined with overspending and

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Speaker 1: not commitment to de stability. And so now the question

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Speaker 1: the FED is acting is moving interest rates up. So

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Speaker 1: our question in the paper is that if going forward

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Speaker 1: we will see the necessary physical adjustments to bring thecation down,

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Speaker 1: that would be the fiscal solution to the problem. What

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Speaker 1: did you learn from Stephanie Kelton's mm T. This has

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Speaker 1: been all the ways the media loves to pick on it.

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Speaker 1: There's a political polarity to that. You come from the

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Speaker 1: neutrality of Europe, of Italy, Caustanza over in Portugal and

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Speaker 1: the rest of them. So you're the foreigner looking in

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Speaker 1: at the debate of MMT. What have you learned about

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Speaker 1: MMT in this crisis? Um So, I think what we

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Speaker 1: learn the more, I think all of us. What we

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Speaker 1: learn is that phisical policy can be extremely powerful. Phisical

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Speaker 1: policy are probably put a stop to the low interest

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Speaker 1: rate environment, and we were for ten years in at

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Speaker 1: the zero over bound. In fact, we risk of deflation.

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Speaker 1: I think we tend to forget where we were one

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Speaker 1: year ago. The FED was generally concerned about deflation. Um

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Speaker 1: we intervene very forcefully with fiscal policy, and that contributed

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Speaker 1: to the solution. Um. Of course, it cause a big

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Speaker 1: jump in inflation, arguably because it compounded with some exogenous

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Speaker 1: forces like the pandemic of course, uh, the supply chain problems,

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Speaker 1: the Russian conflict. But ultimately fiscal policy proved to be

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Speaker 1: a very powerful mechanism. I think what we learned, on

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Speaker 1: the other hand, is that this comes with a cost,

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Speaker 1: and and the cost is inflation. Now, it's always easy

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Speaker 1: to do policy with the benefit of hindsight, but with

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Speaker 1: the benefit of insightro we went a little bit overboard. Well, Francesco,

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Speaker 1: there's a really profound application here. It's not just what

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Speaker 1: the rest PUNTS was, it's the expectation of the consumer's

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Speaker 1: mind that there will be more fiscal stimulus if there

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Speaker 1: is another downturn, and that that is what it's going

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Speaker 1: to lead to inflation expectations becoming unmoored. How much does

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Speaker 1: that really crimp the ability of policymakers to either add

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Speaker 1: phiscal stimulus in the face of a recession, mitigating some

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Speaker 1: of the downturn, or be going for the fiscal stimulus

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Speaker 1: of the past few years and leading to inflation that's

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Speaker 1: much higher than it has been in the past. That's

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Speaker 1: an excellent point, and in fact, what we emphasize is

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Speaker 1: what really matters is a long run phiscal sustainability. So

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Speaker 1: what we want is to be able to use this

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Speaker 1: powerful mechanist during recessions. But in order to do that,

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Speaker 1: we need to guarantee that overall in the long run,

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Speaker 1: or at least in the medium run, we are on

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Speaker 1: a stable path. So what that implies is essentially that

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Speaker 1: when things are good, when we don't need that to

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Speaker 1: uh provide fiscal steamulus, we should refrain from doing that

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Speaker 1: exactly to keep this ammunition to when we need it.

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Speaker 1: I got one quick question. I saw Richard the Jackson Hole,

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Speaker 1: and I want to go back to the core of

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Speaker 1: your paper, which is DSG. Richard Claire has worked with

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Speaker 1: Girdler and the rest. Right, how can we trust this math,

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Speaker 1: all the math in smart guys like you are doing.

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Speaker 1: Has it been proven wrong given these shocks that we've

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Speaker 1: seen that So I don't think so. I think like

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Speaker 1: the math is just a way to formalize some ideas.

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Speaker 1: So what we are discussing here, I think is something

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Speaker 1: that everybody can relate to. People have had first ideas

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Speaker 1: and then came the math. So the math is only

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Speaker 1: a way to put order there. And I don't think

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Speaker 1: that um DSG models of money general macro models in

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Speaker 1: themselves have failed. If anything, there are some risks that

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Speaker 1: we forgot about. Okay and John, it's important, Lisa, good news.

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Speaker 1: I just got the car to take you to the

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Speaker 1: brandma with house to explain matrix algebra to Lisa's kids.

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Speaker 1: It's waiting, Marcesco. Thank you, Francesco Biankee. That on fiscal

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Speaker 1: policy and what it makes for inflation expectations, some legitimate

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Speaker 1: tension with record dollar strength off the good Bloomberg Dollar Index.

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Speaker 1: Part of that, of course is commodities. We're looking at

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Speaker 1: all the asset classes this morning, in this turmoil, this

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Speaker 1: reset into the end of the year, Ellen Wall provides

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Speaker 1: advice senior fellow in Atlantic Atlantic Council. I should say

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Speaker 1: in a definitive effort, Saudi, I can't say enough about

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Speaker 1: the terseness of her book. Saudi inc. Just a really

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Speaker 1: wonderful walk through of the originality of what we see

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Speaker 1: in riod Ellen. I want to talk what John mentioned earlier,

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Speaker 1: which is the idea of the US as a global

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Speaker 1: manufacturer of hydrocarbons. In a select few saying it's un

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Speaker 1: American export the stuff discussed. That is the adult in

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Speaker 1: the room. Yeah, I can I can understand where these

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Speaker 1: people are coming from, especially because for so long we

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Speaker 1: did have a crude oil export band, uh and that.

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Speaker 1: But you have to remember that that really is only

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Speaker 1: a very recent phenomenon. We only had a crude oil

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Speaker 1: export band starting in the seventies during the um when

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Speaker 1: when we had the oil shocks, and the idea was

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Speaker 1: to try to keep as much oil as we had

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Speaker 1: at home. Before that, America was a major supplier of

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Speaker 1: energy to the world. Basically during World War Two, American

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Speaker 1: crude oil, American energy, American gasoline and diesel, and jet

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Speaker 1: fuel was essentially you could argue responsible for winning World

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Speaker 1: War Two for the Allies. UH. So, I think to

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Speaker 1: say that it's un American to export our energy products

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Speaker 1: UH is a very shortsighted view of of America. So Ellen,

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Speaker 1: the deparotmat of Energy, led by Secondary ground Home, appears

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Speaker 1: to be very concerned about the low stock pass of

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Speaker 1: diesel and gasoline, particularly in the Northeast. This is what

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Speaker 1: she said in a letter to some of the energy

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Speaker 1: players here it is our hope that companies will proactively

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Speaker 1: address this need or quote the administration will need to

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Speaker 1: consider additional federal requirements or other emergency measures. And on

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Speaker 1: how credible it's that threat. I mean, if that's not

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Speaker 1: a threat, then I'm not sure what is a threat.

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Speaker 1: I mean that was She pretty much laid it out, saying,

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Speaker 1: if you don't get American stockpiles out of you don't

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Speaker 1: stop exporting products that are you know, commercially viable uh

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Speaker 1: to to export, then we're going to you know, ban

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Speaker 1: the export of certain products. And that's I think very

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Speaker 1: damaging to the global energy market because the United States

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Speaker 1: is an important participant in this global energy market and

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Speaker 1: we we import tons of products as well as as

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Speaker 1: we export them, and that's what helps things run smoothly.

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Speaker 1: Right now, the prices in Europe for diesel, for liquefied

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Speaker 1: natural gas, for all sorts of products are much higher

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Speaker 1: than you can get in being United States, and so

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Speaker 1: that's why we're seeing a lot of products go to Europe,

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Speaker 1: especially because Russian products are no longer available for these

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Speaker 1: places to import. If you know, we wanted to correct this,

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Speaker 1: we could stop, you know, sanctioning Russian exports, or Europe

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Speaker 1: could take a hard look at it. You know, it's

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Speaker 1: the answer to this problem is not to say don't

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Speaker 1: export or we're gonna ban exports. The answer is to

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Speaker 1: look at the larger flow of of products and figure out,

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Speaker 1: you know, where things could be improved. For example, they

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Speaker 1: could get rid of the Jones Act or suspend the

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Speaker 1: Jones Act, which would make it much easier to transport

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Speaker 1: diesel from certain places in the United States to the

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Speaker 1: Eastern Seaboard where diesel supplies are very low. Well, there's

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Speaker 1: a question about whether Jennifer Granham has credibility within the

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Speaker 1: energy industry at this point. We could get into that.

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Speaker 1: Perhaps a little more instructive is what companies are actually

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Speaker 1: doing whether they're going to actually invest in producing more

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Speaker 1: natural gas, producing more crude products in the United States.

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Speaker 1: What do you see on the investment side at a

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Speaker 1: time when prices, while they have come down, are still

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Speaker 1: much more elevated than they have been in years. You know,

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Speaker 1: you you would think that ordinarily, when prices are high,

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Speaker 1: that there's a much higher level of certainty for producers

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Speaker 1: to say, Okay, we're going to invest, We're going to

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Speaker 1: produce more. But right now, at least according to the

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Speaker 1: survey that the Dallas Set and other fans have done

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Speaker 1: of energy producers in their regions, show that actually there's

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Speaker 1: a very high level of uncertainty, and a big part

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Speaker 1: of that has to do with inflation and supply chain issues.

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Speaker 1: A lot of producers are finding that while they thought

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Speaker 1: that their costs would go up maybe ten, they're finding

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Speaker 1: that costs are up or higher and that's really hurting

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Speaker 1: their ability. Even those that want to produce more, that

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Speaker 1: want to drill more, they want to open more wells, Uh,

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Speaker 1: they're finding that this is very difficult. They don't know

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Speaker 1: where they can get this steel, they don't know where

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Speaker 1: they can find labor and sand and other inputs. That

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Speaker 1: they need in order to get get these wells going.

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Speaker 1: So wells are taking these seven to eight months to complete,

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Speaker 1: whereas before that timeline was much much shorter. Can we

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Speaker 1: just probe the tail risk it? Just to wrap up, Allen,

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Speaker 1: what do you think would happen if the administration cut

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Speaker 1: out the export of a fuel of energy product to

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Speaker 1: say Europe. What would happen? What would the main characteristics

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Speaker 1: of the energy market look like in that world? I

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Speaker 1: think that the first thing we would see is a major,

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Speaker 1: major spike in the price of um fuel products and

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Speaker 1: oil all over. I mean, speculators would just you know,

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Speaker 1: ramp things up, and it would be such a high,

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Speaker 1: you know, increase that maybe the likes of which we

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Speaker 1: we've almost never seen, or at least even if this

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Speaker 1: was just foreshadowed, we'd see a jump in prices. And

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Speaker 1: then we probably also see some issues in terms of

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Speaker 1: w t I that would see a much bigger differential

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Speaker 1: between Brent and w t I developing. And then thank

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Speaker 1: you and I'm wild the Atlanta Council. We celebrate now

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Speaker 1: and we do this of Washington, and whether conservative or liberal,

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Speaker 1: we celebrate someone who in this geriatric Senate that we

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Speaker 1: have is doing the right thing. Lady of Vermont will

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Speaker 1: retire and he's retiring with his full abilities at eighty

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Speaker 1: two years old, and he retires with a wonderful memoir

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Speaker 1: for all the Road taken a memoir. Senator Patrick Lahy,

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Speaker 1: we welcome the former DJ at W S. S. E. St.

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Speaker 1: Michael's College, Patrick Lady. This morning, Senator, I want to

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Speaker 1: cut to the chase. The liberals of your youth, Scoop

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Speaker 1: Jackson of Washington, H. H. H. Of Minnesota and a

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Speaker 1: young lady have been substituted for the new progressives. What

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Speaker 1: do the new progressives need to learn from the liberal

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Speaker 1: three theology you lived well? I think they have to

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Speaker 1: learn that you can talk about doing things or you

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Speaker 1: can do it. Yep, they accomplishing the accomplishing legislation is

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Speaker 1: more difficult, but it requires you to uh stop talking

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Speaker 1: except with each other work out. Both Republicans and Democrats

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Speaker 1: try to get coalitions and past six I mean, you

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Speaker 1: go way back at the time of Lennon Johnson getting

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Speaker 1: civil rights bill has passed and he had a number

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Speaker 1: of senators who supported segregation. All he brought people together,

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Speaker 1: but it required hard work. Humphrey and Jackson did the

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Speaker 1: same thing. They would bring in Republicans, uh and work

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Speaker 1: with him and get it done. I worry that, and

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Speaker 1: I appreciate a number of things that you so called

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Speaker 1: progressive stand for on climate control, it and education all.

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Speaker 1: But it's one thing to talk about it. It's another

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Speaker 1: thing to accomplish it. And you had a lot of

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Speaker 1: these things. You have to settle for eighty five percent

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Speaker 1: this year in legislation, get another fift pcent next year.

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Speaker 1: It's never an all or nothing game. Senator, did you

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Speaker 1: think that President Biden is the right person to take

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Speaker 1: that country and lead that a particular effort post, Well,

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Speaker 1: he's done a lot of great legislation past. He's uh

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Speaker 1: uh lord the deficit in many ways he's and most importantly,

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Speaker 1: he brought us back into the world of nations. Look

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Speaker 1: at the animosity Mr Trump has shown towards NATO and

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Speaker 1: other countries and his favoritism of Russia, and said, Joe

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Speaker 1: Biden came remember the clear view of what Russians like,

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Speaker 1: what Putiners like with Ukraine. He brought the natural countries,

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Speaker 1: our European allies together in the way we haven't seen

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Speaker 1: in decades. And uh, I know that totally surprised a

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Speaker 1: lot of our putent, but it also showed that the

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Speaker 1: United States was back in the leadership role. Senator. There

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Speaker 1: are a lot of people speculating that perhaps he shouldn't

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Speaker 1: be the person to run again, specifically because of the

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Speaker 1: fact that he is older and that he isn't necessarily

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Speaker 1: generating the same enthusiasm, and we're certainly seeing that in

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Speaker 1: the polling. Do you agree, do you think that it

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Speaker 1: is time for new leadership? Well, I think if Joe

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Speaker 1: Biden wants to run again, I'll support him. That's a

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Speaker 1: decision only he could make. It's the same way I

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Speaker 1: had a lot of people urged me to run again

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Speaker 1: in Vermont, but it's a six year term and I

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Speaker 1: have things I want to do and still do, and

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Speaker 1: so I retired probably at the top of my influence

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Speaker 1: of the Senate is protrac But but Joe's gonna Joe

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Speaker 1: Biden's going to make that decisions out. But I I

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Speaker 1: can't think of anybody, any the people who ran, including

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Speaker 1: the former president, who could have brought NATO together the

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Speaker 1: way he did and could have gotten uh some of

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Speaker 1: the legislation we've passed and everything from from COVID to

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Speaker 1: uh Child, no treasure, I mean name it. I don't

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Speaker 1: think anybody else could have done that the way he did. Senator,

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Speaker 1: we are out of time, but I urge you to

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Speaker 1: speak again to Bloomberg, to David Weston and all of

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Speaker 1: us about the road take in a memoir. It is

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Speaker 1: really extraord and I can't say enough, folks about how

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Speaker 1: it is of a liberal of another time and place.

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Speaker 1: The gentleman from the from Vermont, Patrick Lay, this is

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Speaker 1: the Bloomberg Surveillance Podcast. Thanks for listening. Join us live

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Speaker 1: weekdays from seven to ten am. He's Stern on Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: Radio and on Bloomberg Television each day from six to

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Speaker 1: nine am for insight from the best in economics, finance, investment,

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Speaker 1: and international relations. And subscribe to the Surveillance podcast on

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Speaker 1: Apple podcast, SoundCloud, Bloomberg dot com, and of course on

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Speaker 1: the terminal. I'm Tom Keene and this is Bloomberg