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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: David Edward served as a special Agent in the US

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Speaker 1: Army nineteen eighties and nineties and is a veteran of

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Speaker 1: multiple overseas combat tours. He was the Special Agent in

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Speaker 1: charge of the nineteen ninety Panama Canal counter Terrorism Threat

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Speaker 1: Assessment Report to the US Congress. He's a graduate of

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Speaker 1: the United States Army Intelligence School, where he's studied Advanced

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Speaker 1: Human Intelligence and Battlefield counter Intelligence, also completing training at

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Speaker 1: the Jungle Operations Training Center in Panama, Central America. He

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Speaker 1: holds advanced degrees in engineering, including a doctorate in engineering,

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Speaker 1: three related Masters of Science degrees, and has an undergraduate

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Speaker 1: degree in business. He's the author of scores of books.

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Speaker 1: Here's just a sampling a series called A Short History

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Speaker 1: of which includes volumes on The Coral Castle, The Maya,

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Speaker 1: and DMT, and his latest Atlantis Solved, The Final Definitive Proof.

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Speaker 1: David Edward, Welcome back to Coast to Coast. How are you.

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Speaker 1: I'm doing good, sir. How are you Richard. It's really

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Speaker 1: great to talk to you. Yeah, I'm I'm great, Thank you,

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Speaker 1: and it's great to have you aboard first of all,

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Speaker 1: because this whole arena is so you know, well trodden.

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Speaker 1: How do you even and as I mentioned, you're a

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Speaker 1: physical historian, you're a research or you're familiar with the

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Speaker 1: peer reviewed process, how do you even begin to review

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Speaker 1: the research in this area? Because I'm just is there

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Speaker 1: any quote end quote, serious academic research to review? Well,

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Speaker 1: you know, that's that's a good opening question. Typically in

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Speaker 1: an if you have an academic mindset or frame or methodology,

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Speaker 1: that's the very first thing you do is you do

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Speaker 1: what they call literature review when you when you have

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Speaker 1: decided that you have questions a challenge with Atlantis. And

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Speaker 1: it's where I can with that term physical historian. I

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Speaker 1: really struggled on what to call myself. What the approach

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Speaker 1: we took with Atlantis was to kind of turn it around.

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Speaker 1: And usually people look at it, they see if they

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Speaker 1: can find evidence that leads them to, you know, maybe

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Speaker 1: find pieces of the story. We said, you know what,

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Speaker 1: let's assume. Let's have an assumption. And that's okay. You're

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Speaker 1: allowed to have assumptions as long as you statum. Let's

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Speaker 1: assume that what Plato says, the physical attributes of what

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Speaker 1: Plato says, well, let's assume he's right, or at least

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Speaker 1: he thinks he's right. So if we assume all this

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Speaker 1: stuff exists, is there a way to go start looking

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Speaker 1: for it? And the approach there was to take all

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Speaker 1: of the academic knowledge that we have and the data.

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Speaker 1: There's lots of data, and many people have looked for it,

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Speaker 1: and you know, use the data, but we feel very

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Speaker 1: comfortable reaching our own conclusions. So we're not going to

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Speaker 1: use established conclusions, but we are going to use established data.

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Speaker 1: And when we did that, and we were very lucky

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Speaker 1: because we have a lot of technical tools. We have

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Speaker 1: a lot of technology. The people in the past even

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Speaker 1: just that I mean people if we're looking for Atlantis

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Speaker 1: in the nineties, nineteen nineties and before, I mean they

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Speaker 1: didn't have the Google that we have and the you know,

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Speaker 1: the Google Earth and the lighter and all different places

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Speaker 1: that we can look. So when you go start grabbing

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Speaker 1: all of those tools and you start with the dialogues,

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Speaker 1: as the physical aspects is true, you just have to

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Speaker 1: kind of push the other stuff away and do the

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Speaker 1: research from the beginning, which is what we did. So

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Speaker 1: you're very quick to credit Jim Corsetti a fellow veteran

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Speaker 1: and his work on identifying the location of Atlantis, and

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Speaker 1: David Stighanson as well. Just tell us a little bit

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Speaker 1: about about these two gentlemen, and I guess what they

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Speaker 1: kind of pieced together in twenty eighteen, which but we're

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Speaker 1: not able to prove definitively. Yeah, and that's and so

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Speaker 1: and thank you. I always try and mention them because

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Speaker 1: I you know, I'm not the sole author. None of

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Speaker 1: us really are the soul anything anymore. You know, there's

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Speaker 1: so much information out there. But yeah, Jimmy course said

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Speaker 1: he here's a YouTube channel called bright Insight, and uh

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Speaker 1: and Richard, you're a young guys. You don't know this,

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Speaker 1: but I'm a little old. And it turns out the

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Speaker 1: old guys can't sleep sometimes. So I was away from night.

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Speaker 1: I'm beginning to have that problem. Well, yes, it's in

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Speaker 1: front of you. It's a glimpse of stay it's in

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Speaker 1: front of you. So I listened to all of the

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Speaker 1: Coast to Coast day and weekend shows and all of

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Speaker 1: the Strange World podcast that I could, and I and

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Speaker 1: YouTube handed me Jimmy's one of Jimmy's videos about Atlantis,

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Speaker 1: and I was like, uh, you know, I watched it,

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Speaker 1: Actually I watched it three or four times. Like, I

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Speaker 1: think this guy's onto something, but you know he's he's

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Speaker 1: coming at this as a well intending lay person as

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Speaker 1: opposed to someone who can kind of um knows how

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Speaker 1: to combat the academic side and knows how to present

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Speaker 1: data as evidence, not just as intriguing stuff. And then

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Speaker 1: I later learned I was contacted by David steg Hanson,

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Speaker 1: who actually is the one who sent Jimmy the original

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Speaker 1: picture of this rich chat stressing thing, which is what

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Speaker 1: Jimmy has kind of made his name being a proponent

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Speaker 1: of it. But but David Stighanson, and David's been there

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Speaker 1: a couple of times. He last time he was there

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Speaker 1: was in October, and so he and I talk and

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Speaker 1: when he goes there, there's a number of things that

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Speaker 1: we look for. He's going to go back again this year.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, so I definitely always credit them and thank

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Speaker 1: you for bringing him up, because it starts with them.

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Speaker 1: And then what I want to do is seal the

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Speaker 1: deal because with Atlantis, you know, we've all fallen and

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Speaker 1: we continue to fall for the kind of the standard

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Speaker 1: Atlantis pitch, which is whether it's a book or a

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Speaker 1: TV show or a feature link documentary is roughly the

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Speaker 1: first half is kind of this whole setup where you

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Speaker 1: see beautiful people in Greek islands and scuba diving and

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Speaker 1: they kind of convince you they figured it out. And

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Speaker 1: then the second half is, well, we got to change this,

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Speaker 1: or maybe the years are wrong, or none of these

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Speaker 1: seven places line up, but they're all interesting, and then

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Speaker 1: it kind of fades away. I didn't want to do that.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to come up with an answer, and with

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Speaker 1: all those tools I mentioned, and having the work of

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Speaker 1: Jimmy and David to start with, I was able to

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Speaker 1: come up with what I think is, um, I'm calling

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Speaker 1: out a hypothesis or you know, a view of Atlantis

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Speaker 1: that's that's unified, which was something else I wanted to do.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to have a unifying theory. When I first

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Speaker 1: did the work on the risshat and it matches Plato.

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Speaker 1: We'll get into all of that. I started telling people

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Speaker 1: very naively, and the journey for me and all of

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Speaker 1: this is learning how to communicate fairly complex topics around

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Speaker 1: data that people hear lots of different ways, and how

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Speaker 1: do you how do you communicate a new idea in

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Speaker 1: that space, and I'm still learning how to do that,

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Speaker 1: and talking to you and other people kind of helps

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Speaker 1: me because it's very hard. You think it's easy, and

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Speaker 1: you think, you know, you just say, well, well here's

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Speaker 1: the answer, and then everyone's just going to jump on board.

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Speaker 1: But that's not the Atlantis space at all. Atlantis has

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Speaker 1: lots of things to lots of people, and right, I mean,

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Speaker 1: it's it's I don't know what, I don't know if

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Speaker 1: the term fanboys is appropriate here, but they're I mean,

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Speaker 1: the the legions of people that imbue the Atlantis legend

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Speaker 1: with I guess all of their their own sort of

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Speaker 1: personal hopes and aspirations and all of that. And we

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Speaker 1: you know, free energy and flying cars, and they had

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Speaker 1: nuclear submarines and they had a death ray and all

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Speaker 1: of that. So I mean, here you wait into this

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Speaker 1: with this very analytical mind, and it's you know, it

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Speaker 1: ends up being still a remarkable story, but perhaps far

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Speaker 1: more I don't know, prosaic or um. So you know,

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Speaker 1: people are bound to be sort of disappointed, right, well

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Speaker 1: they are, and part of it is because I'm not

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Speaker 1: I'm not very good explaining it. And so you know,

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Speaker 1: I'll do I'll do my best. But Atlantis what I

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Speaker 1: believe Atlantis actually was, and at ninety nine point three

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Speaker 1: two we have a hypothesis around Atlantis that doesn't require

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Speaker 1: us to change anything we know about our history. Well

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Speaker 1: doesn't REQUI we reinterpret our history. But we're using data

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Speaker 1: that's well established um and it treats, you know, played

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Speaker 1: a kind of respectfully to what happens is it becomes

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Speaker 1: a very harmonious answer because I mean, if you look,

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Speaker 1: some people think Atlantis is the richette eing, which is

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Speaker 1: the word. I think that's the capital. But we're also

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Speaker 1: told there are ten provinces, so put some people like Doggerland,

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Speaker 1: Cadiz in Spain, the SEUs, Mesa and Morocco. They're like

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Speaker 1: the Canary Islands, Cape Rode, people like the Azores, like

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Speaker 1: the Viminy Road. They're like the Aztecs at Mexico. And think,

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Speaker 1: I think the truth of the matter is when you

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Speaker 1: when you look at the provinces of Atlantis, which which

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Speaker 1: we have, it's basically an early version of a king's list,

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Speaker 1: which became a historical norm. But we're dealing with the

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Speaker 1: story this kind of prehistory. There is a way the

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Speaker 1: King's List paints a kingdom, and it paints a technological

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Speaker 1: progression that we've mapped out. And and you mentioned the book,

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Speaker 1: and I appreciate that. I've also got the YouTube channel

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Speaker 1: a history of I think I've got twenty nine videos

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Speaker 1: on this, and I pretty much want anyone who's willing

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Speaker 1: to spend seven hours listening to me talking on videos.

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Speaker 1: I walk into the very very start of this word

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Speaker 1: story come from all the way to the discoveries we've

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Speaker 1: made on ground and all the physical evidence that that

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Speaker 1: kind of answers the kingdom. All right, So let's let's

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Speaker 1: basically let the cat out of the bag and then

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Speaker 1: we'll sort of work backwards from there. Because you mentioned

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Speaker 1: it already, the risch At structure a ka the eye

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Speaker 1: of the Sahara. There I said it. This is Corsetti's

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Speaker 1: David Stighanson's identifying the location in the western Sahara of Africa.

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Speaker 1: It's not submerged, it's right there in the middle of

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Speaker 1: the western Sahara desert. Just kind of give us a

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Speaker 1: description of what does it look like today? Sure, and

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Speaker 1: remember this is we're talking about the capital city. This

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Speaker 1: is one of the things that we have done with

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Speaker 1: Atlantis is everyone wants to win in the air quotes

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Speaker 1: and so the big that And I did a survey

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Speaker 1: by the way, so I was curious, you know, what

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Speaker 1: do people believe in the survey? I think I have

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Speaker 1: like two thousand people responded, did it on Reddit? So

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Speaker 1: it is what it is. But the people didn't think

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Speaker 1: it was this rish At structure in the western Sahara.

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Speaker 1: About thirty three percent think it's the Azores, and then

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Speaker 1: the rest kind of think it's everything else. When you

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Speaker 1: look at the risch At structure, and there are some

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Speaker 1: key points we'll get into. We can go we can

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Speaker 1: go into the dialogues. One of the key dimensions that's

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Speaker 1: given in the dialogues, it's often disregarded for disregards that right, disregarded, yes, okay,

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Speaker 1: good is that it says that the capital city sat

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Speaker 1: at the end of a gently sloping plane to the

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Speaker 1: sea of three thousand stadia. And it's a line that's

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Speaker 1: in there, and you have to do a lot of

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Speaker 1: work around what a stadia is. And all of that

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Speaker 1: turns out one measure you can use for a stadius,

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Speaker 1: the Alexandrian measure, which would have been what Plato would

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Speaker 1: have used in his lifetime, because both Plato and Alexander

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Speaker 1: the Great War alive at the same time about a decade,

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Speaker 1: so I think Alexander was eleven when Plato died. But this,

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Speaker 1: so you multiply the six thousand or six hundred six

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Speaker 1: point nine feet, which is what a stadius, the six

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Speaker 1: hundred and seven feet to make easy mac multiplied by

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Speaker 1: three thousand, and you get three hundred and forty five miles,

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Speaker 1: and that's how far inland the Rischette structure sits. So

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Speaker 1: that was like my first clue. And it's a gentle slope.

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Speaker 1: You can measure a slope, it's basically the rise over

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Speaker 1: the run. So you can take the run, which is

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Speaker 1: three hundred and forty five miles, and the rise we

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Speaker 1: know it shits about fifteen hundred feet above sea level.

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Speaker 1: That puts the slope well below one percent, which fits

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Speaker 1: the category of a gently sloping, gentle slope to the sea.

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Speaker 1: There would have been a river where at a time

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Speaker 1: when it's very much the green Sahara. And then we've

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Speaker 1: found there's lots of physical remnants we've found on the

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Speaker 1: ground around the Rishat structure. But as you mentioned what

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Speaker 1: it looks like. The big thing with the rish Hate

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Speaker 1: structure is it looks like Atlantis. It's the only place

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Speaker 1: on Earth I've seen that that meets those dimensions of

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Speaker 1: a center island and then alternating concentric rings of water

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Speaker 1: and land. And you can type just type in eye

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Speaker 1: of this hair or richest structure and google or duck

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Speaker 1: duckt go or whatever you use to search, go to

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Speaker 1: the images and you'll see hundreds of images of the thing.

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Speaker 1: So it's got that look. And then all the other

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Speaker 1: measurements you can start to line up. And then when

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Speaker 1: you start with this in the center, this area which

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Speaker 1: we'll call Atlas because he's he's the you know, the

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Speaker 1: first king, and this is the capital. I mean, it

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Speaker 1: aligns people like the Dogon tribe who know about the

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Speaker 1: you know, the dog Star. We find patric lifts showing

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Speaker 1: chariots in the westerns. The hair they didn't have any

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Speaker 1: answers for. Well, we're told that they had a lot

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Speaker 1: of farms in Atlantis, and one of the things they

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Speaker 1: had to do is every farm had to contribute one

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Speaker 1: six of a chariot. So you know what I mean,

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Speaker 1: Once you can establish that first location, just about everything

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Speaker 1: else lines up and you start to understand what was

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Speaker 1: going on at the time, which is this transitory exchange

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Speaker 1: of information people who are able to traverse the Atlantic

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Speaker 1: and trade ideas and come back, which of course is

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Speaker 1: very important to any trip. But I would just assume

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Speaker 1: that after all this time, it would the desert would

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Speaker 1: have completely overtaken any anything visible. Isn't it buried underneath

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Speaker 1: the sand? I mean, what actually can you see? That's

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Speaker 1: a good question. So the rist Shat is basically bedrock.

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Speaker 1: So what I believe happened in the general consensus is

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Speaker 1: that this thing is a collapsed volcanic dome, like a

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Speaker 1: mud volcano, which fits kind of perfectly to this story.

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Speaker 1: We know Plato tells us in the dialogues, and one

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Speaker 1: of the things they had to do was when they

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Speaker 1: were digging the channels for the boats to come in,

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Speaker 1: they had to dig him three hundred feet wide and

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Speaker 1: one hundred feet deep, which we all do today any

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Speaker 1: canal or waterway. You have to constantly clear the the

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Speaker 1: silt out so the boats can get through. But we

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Speaker 1: know that he told us it's one hundred feet, so

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Speaker 1: we know there was at least one hundred foot of

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Speaker 1: top soil. If you look at where the rist Shat

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Speaker 1: is and then you look just I hear more than

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Speaker 1: halfway between where it sits and where the Atlantic Ocean is,

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Speaker 1: there are a series of mud hills that are very tall.

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Speaker 1: And I believe that Atlantis was the first recorded mud flood,

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Speaker 1: which is basically the conditions that we're giving given we're told,

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Speaker 1: you know, if a tsunami, saltwater came up the river,

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Speaker 1: it flooded the volcano basically liquefied it. It turned, you know,

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Speaker 1: we have a mud flood scenario. It slides down. We

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Speaker 1: can see where those hills are and and for me,

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Speaker 1: I think that's where we should start digging. People always

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Speaker 1: wanted to know know where to dig. We know that a

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Speaker 1: shall of mud blocked the waterway, so it aligns to

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Speaker 1: the dialogues. And then frustratingly, the country of Mauritania, through

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Speaker 1: a shell company, has been strip mining this area and

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Speaker 1: there's just mud hills. You know, there isn't really any

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Speaker 1: reason to be strip mining here, but they've been strip

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Speaker 1: mining since two thousand and six. So I think I

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Speaker 1: think culturally they found you know, the remnants are there

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Speaker 1: and they've been collecting them and destroying them like like

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Speaker 1: like happens to a lot of our history. Oh, dear lord,

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Speaker 1: perhaps it could be arguably one of the greatest archaeological

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Speaker 1: finds in history. And they're strip mining it as we speak,

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Speaker 1: the strip mining as we speak. The workers revolted in

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Speaker 1: like twenty thirteen and it's been inconsistently operated since then.

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Speaker 1: But if you look at the map and you find

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Speaker 1: you know, you go at halfway and you look at

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Speaker 1: these mud hills, you can see the giant open strip

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Speaker 1: mine it. It's the Mauritania Copper Mine INK, which is

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Speaker 1: a shell subsidiary of some Canadian company. But if it's

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Speaker 1: Classic Energy, you know, big energy coming in. They do

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Speaker 1: this everywhere. But yeah, there's strip mining where I believe

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Speaker 1: the remnants of the city ended up. Now we have

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Speaker 1: lots of places to look and there's not that there's

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Speaker 1: lots of things they can't destroy. But you know, if

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Speaker 1: we're gonna find anything, we're gonna find writing or anything,

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Speaker 1: it's gonna be where the remnants of the city sank

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Speaker 1: below the waves. This area of Africa would have been

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Speaker 1: underwater for years after tsunami hit Um. Yeah, and it's

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Speaker 1: above it's above water now, but it's that's in the

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Speaker 1: western Sahara. All right, So let's get into the Plato dialogues,

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Speaker 1: which um Crittius, and to make the two dialogues, it's

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Speaker 1: Curtius and Tomas. I will say Timius, because if I

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Speaker 1: try and say Tameris, I'll stumble and I'll sound stupid,

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Speaker 1: and I just say it. That's okay. I know I'm

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Speaker 1: mispronouncing it. I mispnounced a lot of things, but this

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Speaker 1: one I know I'm doing. But I have to. All right,

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Speaker 1: So we got about three minutes here before the break,

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Speaker 1: so we'll just start. We'll get into it slowly now,

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Speaker 1: and then we'll come back after the break and discuss further.

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Speaker 1: But so why was Plato in his dialogues talking about

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Speaker 1: Atlantis in the first place. Well, Plato is recording conversations

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Speaker 1: that his teacher, Socrates had, And what Plato is generally

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Speaker 1: trying to do is two things. He's trying to capture

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Speaker 1: what he thinks is important thoughts and emerging thoughts through Socrates.

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Speaker 1: And then he's always trying to figure out if there's

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Speaker 1: a way to understand whether governmental structures and how people

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Speaker 1: manage themselves, is there a right and wrong to it?

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Speaker 1: Or is it just always whoever's in charge sets the

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Speaker 1: rules and we all have to kind of fall in line.

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Speaker 1: And that's what he's always struggling with, those two things.

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Speaker 1: And I guess he found the story of Atlantis compelling

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Speaker 1: enough in both regards that he captured them. I don't.

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Speaker 1: I can tell you, interestingly, with Critius, there's actually two Critiuses,

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Speaker 1: and there's a whole story around Critius which we can

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Speaker 1: get into maybe when we come back. It's still longer

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Speaker 1: than hover long I have left here, right, So some

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Speaker 1: people have basically sort of blown off the whole idea

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Speaker 1: of Atlantis, the existence of Atlantis, and argued what that

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Speaker 1: Plato was simply using it as an allegory. It was

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Speaker 1: supposed to be some sort of a cautionary tale. Is

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Speaker 1: that the idea? Yeah, and that's certainly in there and

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Speaker 1: any any and remember Plato wasn't doing anything. Plato was

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Speaker 1: recording what Socrates conversations. Socrates has, So Socrates was having

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Speaker 1: conversations where Atlantis was being used as an allegory, and

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Speaker 1: that that's certainly in there, But we don't, we don't

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Speaker 1: the allegorical component. Something looks like I tell people the

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Speaker 1: fact that Poseidon married a mountain girl, that's great, but

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Speaker 1: I'm not going to go try and find where they

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Speaker 1: got married, you know, I mean, I deal with that

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Speaker 1: from Atlanta standpoint. So that's why we made the We

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Speaker 1: did the assumption we're going to look for the physical

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Speaker 1: aspects of what he's talking about. The rest of it,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know, and you know, I mean,

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Speaker 1: that's that's not my thing. My thing is physically, is

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Speaker 1: it possible for to have existed? And if so, what

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Speaker 1: conditions would have to be meant, what technologies would they

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Speaker 1: have to have? And where is it? And that's kind

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Speaker 1: of where my focus is. Listen to more Coast to

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Speaker 1: Coast AM every weeknight at one am Eastern, and go

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Speaker 1: to Coast to Coast am dot com for more