1 00:00:02,240 --> 00:00:05,680 Speaker 1: Hello, and Happy Saturday. We have picked today's Saturday Classic 2 00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:08,400 Speaker 1: because once again this person is coming up on a 3 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:13,200 Speaker 1: forthcoming episode of the show. It's Marie Toussau and her 4 00:00:13,240 --> 00:00:16,280 Speaker 1: wax sculptures. But really the story is so much bigger 5 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:19,639 Speaker 1: than just the wax likenesses of famous people. Uh. This 6 00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:23,200 Speaker 1: episode also talks about wax venuses and all the beheadings 7 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:25,759 Speaker 1: during the Reign of Terror, and a lot of very 8 00:00:25,840 --> 00:00:31,240 Speaker 1: savvy business decisions. This originally came out April and it 9 00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:37,239 Speaker 1: is by our previous host Sarah and Deblina, So enjoy 10 00:00:37,880 --> 00:00:40,919 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 11 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:50,280 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. Hello and welcome to the podcast. 12 00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:53,120 Speaker 1: I'm Sarah Dowdy and I'm Deblina Chokoateboarding. And every now 13 00:00:53,159 --> 00:00:57,240 Speaker 1: and then listener suggestions sync up exactly with ideas we're 14 00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:00,520 Speaker 1: already thinking of, and that has definitely happened this week. Yeah, 15 00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:03,160 Speaker 1: y'all are mind readers for sure. It kind of scares 16 00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 1: me a little bit. I'm not gonna lie, but I've 17 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:07,360 Speaker 1: been thinking for a month or so of doing a 18 00:01:07,400 --> 00:01:11,240 Speaker 1: podcast on Madam Tisseau, the famous woman who started the 19 00:01:11,240 --> 00:01:16,120 Speaker 1: wax works in London, and since then listener emails have 20 00:01:16,200 --> 00:01:20,440 Speaker 1: been trickling in, not tons of them, but very very 21 00:01:20,560 --> 00:01:24,119 Speaker 1: pro Madam Tissau listeners. Suddenly, I don't know where y'all 22 00:01:24,160 --> 00:01:28,000 Speaker 1: came from. Yeah, And it's interesting because a lot of us, 23 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:30,960 Speaker 1: I mean me in particular, I hardly ever think about 24 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:35,640 Speaker 1: Madam Tussau the woman behind the wax figures. But I 25 00:01:35,720 --> 00:01:39,280 Speaker 1: think of David Beckham or whatever wax figure is, the 26 00:01:39,360 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 1: celebra of the moment. Yeah, exactly, will stop in on 27 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:45,240 Speaker 1: this particular visit or not. But her story is actually 28 00:01:45,280 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 1: really amazing. It combines court life at Versailles, revolutionary dangers, 29 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 1: and plucky business acumen. At least, depending on who you 30 00:01:53,840 --> 00:01:57,800 Speaker 1: believe according to her own memoirs that's true. In reality, 31 00:01:57,840 --> 00:02:00,640 Speaker 1: you might find that that's a little bit different. Definitely. 32 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:06,080 Speaker 1: But one recent biographer, Kate Barrage, wrote Madam Tisso Life 33 00:02:06,080 --> 00:02:08,440 Speaker 1: in Wax I think it came out in two thousand six, 34 00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:14,440 Speaker 1: and she described the wax artists as an original tabloid journalist. 35 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 1: And I thought that was a really interesting way to 36 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:18,480 Speaker 1: think of her, and kind of a different way to 37 00:02:18,480 --> 00:02:22,519 Speaker 1: think of her, somebody who traded in celebrity and images 38 00:02:22,639 --> 00:02:27,000 Speaker 1: long before photography or video or even color printing. I mean, 39 00:02:27,040 --> 00:02:29,840 Speaker 1: just think of the little engravings you would get in 40 00:02:29,840 --> 00:02:32,919 Speaker 1: the newspaper. If you were lucky enough to read a newspaper, 41 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:34,960 Speaker 1: that would be all you you had to go on 42 00:02:35,160 --> 00:02:38,160 Speaker 1: to know what your king looked like. Even so, she 43 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 1: was a bit of a reporter, we could say, and 44 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:42,959 Speaker 1: it was really more than entertainment. There was sort of 45 00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:46,320 Speaker 1: this sideshow nature of wax works at the time. They 46 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:50,560 Speaker 1: were a little d class a depending on which exhibits 47 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:53,480 Speaker 1: you were going to. But it was about information, you know, 48 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:56,840 Speaker 1: letting people know what folks looked like and teaching them 49 00:02:57,000 --> 00:02:59,560 Speaker 1: a little bit about history too, which is always good 50 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 1: for our per This is yeah, definitely, But first, before 51 00:03:02,919 --> 00:03:06,079 Speaker 1: we delve into all those bigger issues, I think we 52 00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:09,280 Speaker 1: should take a look back at how she got into this. 53 00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:12,240 Speaker 1: I mean that's what I find most interesting. How does 54 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:15,440 Speaker 1: a woman of this era get into waxy and education 55 00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:18,400 Speaker 1: in wax. Yeah, it all began for her. She was 56 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:23,680 Speaker 1: born Marie Grossholtz on December one, seventeen sixty one, in Strasburg. Actually, 57 00:03:23,720 --> 00:03:25,880 Speaker 1: her mother was a cook and her father was a 58 00:03:25,919 --> 00:03:28,960 Speaker 1: soldier who died before she was born, but when she 59 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:31,160 Speaker 1: was still an infant, her mother went to work as 60 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:34,720 Speaker 1: the housekeeper for a young doctor named Philippe Courtius who 61 00:03:34,760 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 1: lived in Bairn. Yeah, but he was more than a doctor. 62 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:43,680 Speaker 1: Quite notably, he made anatomical waxes, which originally, when you 63 00:03:43,720 --> 00:03:46,800 Speaker 1: were short on cadavers, that would be a good way 64 00:03:46,840 --> 00:03:50,960 Speaker 1: to train your doctors to to study the human body. 65 00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:54,040 Speaker 1: But the waxes he made were also kind of erotic 66 00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:57,600 Speaker 1: in a way. They were sometimes called anatomical venuses, and 67 00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:01,839 Speaker 1: they were usually these young women man waxes that had 68 00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 1: parts you could unfold and look at their inner organs 69 00:04:05,320 --> 00:04:08,240 Speaker 1: and all of that and and study them anatomically. But 70 00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:11,960 Speaker 1: he did portraits to curiosity type stuff and started to 71 00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:14,480 Speaker 1: build a name for himself because he was quite good 72 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:18,560 Speaker 1: at it, and most importantly for young Marie's future career, 73 00:04:18,960 --> 00:04:22,000 Speaker 1: he was really good at getting the color of the 74 00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 1: skin right, making the waxes appear like flesh, not just 75 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:29,560 Speaker 1: like a candle that melted down into a human shape. 76 00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:32,680 Speaker 1: They really look kind of like they're alive. Yeah. And 77 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:35,919 Speaker 1: because of his skill at this, eventually word of Courtius's 78 00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:39,120 Speaker 1: talents spread to the French court, and when the Prince 79 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:42,920 Speaker 1: de Conti Louis the fifteen cousin visits the wax maker. 80 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:46,039 Speaker 1: He invites Cortius back to Paris, where he opens a 81 00:04:46,080 --> 00:04:49,359 Speaker 1: salon and does private commissions. So he's made it to 82 00:04:49,480 --> 00:04:51,800 Speaker 1: the big time. And it's a good time to be 83 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:55,920 Speaker 1: in Paris in general, because it's booming. People of all 84 00:04:56,000 --> 00:04:59,719 Speaker 1: classes are seeking entertainment. It seems like just about constantly 85 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:03,160 Speaker 1: you read about it. And there's something new going on too, 86 00:05:03,240 --> 00:05:05,640 Speaker 1: and that's a culture of celebrity, so people are really 87 00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:09,080 Speaker 1: interested in images all of a sudden, So a wax 88 00:05:09,120 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 1: works like this is a potentially profitable business. Yeah, but 89 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 1: taste changed so quickly that the wax head and Curtius 90 00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:18,840 Speaker 1: of salon are actually chiseled off when they go out 91 00:05:18,839 --> 00:05:22,960 Speaker 1: of style, which is a little bit forebodings considering when 92 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:27,080 Speaker 1: this takes place. But after after a little while in Paris, 93 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:29,560 Speaker 1: you know, sort of setting things up, he has his 94 00:05:29,720 --> 00:05:33,719 Speaker 1: former housekeeper and her daughter joined him. So this seems 95 00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:38,400 Speaker 1: a little suspicious, and a lot of historians have speculated 96 00:05:38,480 --> 00:05:42,760 Speaker 1: on what the relationship between Curtius and Marie really was. 97 00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:47,119 Speaker 1: Some think that Marie's mother was his sister and so 98 00:05:47,480 --> 00:05:50,719 Speaker 1: he was her uncle, and then other people think that 99 00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:54,880 Speaker 1: maybe he was even secretly Mrie's father, but regardless of 100 00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:59,039 Speaker 1: any possible blood relation between them, Curtius really treated Marie 101 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:01,640 Speaker 1: like a daughter definitely in every way. He took her 102 00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:05,240 Speaker 1: on as his pupil. He started her off modeling fruit 103 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:07,599 Speaker 1: and flowers, which was a lot easier to do than 104 00:06:08,120 --> 00:06:11,839 Speaker 1: modeling the human form with all its different textures and colors. 105 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:14,360 Speaker 1: And um, I guess we should give you a little 106 00:06:14,360 --> 00:06:18,480 Speaker 1: description of how the wax heads were made, because it's 107 00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:20,880 Speaker 1: pretty cool, yeah, and it really helps with the understanding, 108 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:23,760 Speaker 1: I think. Um So, basically, a clay head would be made, 109 00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 1: and from that a plaster of Paris mold was created 110 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 1: in sections, and then the sections would be fitted together 111 00:06:31,320 --> 00:06:34,880 Speaker 1: and molten eggs and stuff connecting them exactly, and molten 112 00:06:34,920 --> 00:06:37,200 Speaker 1: wax would be poured inside, and you had to be 113 00:06:37,279 --> 00:06:39,640 Speaker 1: really careful so that bubbles didn't form when you did 114 00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 1: that part. When bubble like taking out the nose or 115 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:45,640 Speaker 1: something in a way. Um So, then when the crust hardened, 116 00:06:45,680 --> 00:06:49,440 Speaker 1: the center was poured out because the outsides would harden 117 00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:52,559 Speaker 1: a little faster than the center. And when the whole 118 00:06:52,640 --> 00:06:55,520 Speaker 1: thing was solid, the molds would be removed and then 119 00:06:55,640 --> 00:06:58,400 Speaker 1: glass eyes would be fitted in from the inside right, 120 00:06:58,480 --> 00:07:00,719 Speaker 1: and that was apparently one of the tricky parts, because 121 00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:03,000 Speaker 1: you've got to make sure the eyes are going in 122 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:06,400 Speaker 1: the right direction. One isn't kind of protruding more than 123 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:09,320 Speaker 1: the other. Um, you don't pop them out of the 124 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:13,920 Speaker 1: mold entirely or the new wax more. Yeah, exactly, So 125 00:07:14,200 --> 00:07:16,720 Speaker 1: I think the eyes were the tricky part, but the 126 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:20,360 Speaker 1: hair was the really painstaking part because unless there was 127 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:23,800 Speaker 1: a wig involved, it had to be threaded through the 128 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:28,240 Speaker 1: wax strand by strand, So you can imagine it would 129 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 1: be really tedious. But by her teens, Marie is really 130 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:35,200 Speaker 1: good at making these wax models. She's as good as 131 00:07:35,240 --> 00:07:39,720 Speaker 1: her so called uncle. And so with these talents, it's 132 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:43,920 Speaker 1: maybe no surprise that in seventeen eighty a nineteen year 133 00:07:43,920 --> 00:07:47,560 Speaker 1: old Marie somehow ends up at very Sigh, or at 134 00:07:47,600 --> 00:08:00,520 Speaker 1: least that's her story. According to her memoirs, Marie instructed 135 00:08:00,560 --> 00:08:03,400 Speaker 1: the devout younger sister of Louis the sixteenth, who was 136 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:07,360 Speaker 1: Madame Elizabeth, and she instructed her in religious vote of making, 137 00:08:07,440 --> 00:08:10,400 Speaker 1: which was kind of like making wax relics. So the 138 00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:12,800 Speaker 1: two teenagers they really hit it off, and they hit 139 00:08:12,840 --> 00:08:15,680 Speaker 1: it off so well that Marie actually became a bourgeois 140 00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:19,160 Speaker 1: star of the court, so she'd supposedly sit in while 141 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:22,640 Speaker 1: the king met privately with his sister. She'd have sittings 142 00:08:22,640 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 1: for waxes with Louis, Marie Antoinette and their children. She 143 00:08:26,800 --> 00:08:29,640 Speaker 1: supposedly got hit on by the future Louis the eighteen 144 00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:33,440 Speaker 1: and she stayed there for nine years at court. Yeah, 145 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:37,439 Speaker 1: so this sounds really remarkable, and it's been a crucial 146 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:41,280 Speaker 1: part of her legend since then, and especially since she 147 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:45,680 Speaker 1: set up shop in England, especially considering what's to come 148 00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:47,320 Speaker 1: in the Revolution. We're going to get into that in 149 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:50,360 Speaker 1: a minute. But it's interesting to me that it's reported 150 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:55,440 Speaker 1: without questions in most sources you find on Madame Tissou's life. 151 00:08:55,480 --> 00:08:59,640 Speaker 1: It's in Oxford Dictionary, National Biography, It's and Encyclopedia Britannica 152 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:03,280 Speaker 1: History Magazine. But in that two thousand six biography I 153 00:09:03,320 --> 00:09:07,000 Speaker 1: mentioned in the beginning, Barrage Kate Barrage's biography, she kind 154 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:11,400 Speaker 1: of raises some questions about many aspects of Marie's memoirs, 155 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 1: but especially this versside part, because I mean, and we 156 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:19,080 Speaker 1: certainly learned this in our in our Bourbon series. I 157 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:21,880 Speaker 1: I would imagine you'll remember this too, But Versaille is 158 00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:25,720 Speaker 1: a really rule driven place. It's not somewhere where you 159 00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:29,800 Speaker 1: have breakout stars from the middle class. Really, court etiquette 160 00:09:29,800 --> 00:09:33,080 Speaker 1: would have made it pretty unlikely that Marie, who, of 161 00:09:33,120 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 1: course her family's main livelihood is this kind of sideshow 162 00:09:37,160 --> 00:09:43,599 Speaker 1: wax exhibit, would really thoroughly infiltrate Versi. And perhaps most significantly, 163 00:09:43,840 --> 00:09:46,439 Speaker 1: there are no records of her in kind of two 164 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:48,840 Speaker 1: key areas. There are no records of her in the 165 00:09:48,840 --> 00:09:53,040 Speaker 1: Almanactive for SI, which is the exhaustive list of court employees, 166 00:09:53,320 --> 00:09:56,080 Speaker 1: has everybody who worked in Versailles. Yeah, she really should 167 00:09:56,080 --> 00:09:58,640 Speaker 1: have been on that. Or there are also no records 168 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:03,280 Speaker 1: of her in Madame Elizabeth's staff, which even includes Madame 169 00:10:03,280 --> 00:10:08,200 Speaker 1: Elizabeth's part time hairdresser. So yeah, even the little guys 170 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:10,000 Speaker 1: were making it on the list well, and even if 171 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:12,560 Speaker 1: he was important to her. I mean, the the main 172 00:10:12,640 --> 00:10:15,560 Speaker 1: thing there is that if it's including part time people, 173 00:10:16,520 --> 00:10:20,680 Speaker 1: it's really unlikely that she would have just completely slipped 174 00:10:20,720 --> 00:10:23,199 Speaker 1: through the cracks like this. So she might have been 175 00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:26,560 Speaker 1: to Versailles, and she might have even taught Madame Elizabeth 176 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:30,400 Speaker 1: a few classes here and there. But what's perhaps more 177 00:10:30,559 --> 00:10:32,720 Speaker 1: likely is that she was really spending most of her 178 00:10:32,760 --> 00:10:37,080 Speaker 1: time back in Paris working with her family's booming wax 179 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:40,120 Speaker 1: business and honing her art. You know, she was making 180 00:10:40,160 --> 00:10:42,080 Speaker 1: a lot of the figures herself by the time she 181 00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:45,400 Speaker 1: was in her teens, and learning the business to learning 182 00:10:45,400 --> 00:10:49,200 Speaker 1: how to attract customers and advertise, all things that are 183 00:10:49,240 --> 00:10:52,960 Speaker 1: going to serve her really well later in life. Of course, 184 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:55,880 Speaker 1: things changed a little bit when the Revolution came around, 185 00:10:56,000 --> 00:10:58,120 Speaker 1: or a lot, depending on how you look at it. 186 00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:02,560 Speaker 1: If in fact Marie was Versailles, Curtius recalled her and 187 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:05,920 Speaker 1: they consolidated their shows at the Boulevard de Temple, and 188 00:11:05,920 --> 00:11:09,480 Speaker 1: what followed from there was nothing short of amazing. Courtius 189 00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:13,040 Speaker 1: and Marie somehow managed to actually capitalize on the revolution 190 00:11:13,200 --> 00:11:15,960 Speaker 1: good money during it. Yeah, they actually profited. They switched 191 00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:18,440 Speaker 1: from displays of the King and Queen at the Grand 192 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 1: Couvert to revolutionary heroes to later suit scenes like the 193 00:11:23,120 --> 00:11:26,920 Speaker 1: death of murat Um, all without losing their heads. So 194 00:11:27,160 --> 00:11:30,560 Speaker 1: it's pretty impressive because you can imagine the mob in 195 00:11:30,679 --> 00:11:34,760 Speaker 1: Paris during the revolution. There. It's not just like somebody 196 00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:37,160 Speaker 1: goes out of style. They go out of style and 197 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 1: you better not still be exhibiting the wax works when 198 00:11:40,200 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 1: it when it happened. So Curtius himself, though played a 199 00:11:44,240 --> 00:11:46,760 Speaker 1: role in the revolution. He was among those who stormed 200 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:50,280 Speaker 1: the Best Steal, and his wax works had a role too. 201 00:11:50,520 --> 00:11:54,000 Speaker 1: Surprisingly enough, even before the storming of the Bastil, just 202 00:11:54,040 --> 00:11:57,160 Speaker 1: a few days before it, a crowd came to the 203 00:11:57,160 --> 00:12:00,840 Speaker 1: salon and obtain the heads of the heroes of the moment. 204 00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:03,840 Speaker 1: This is pre guillotine, so heads don't have quite the 205 00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:06,960 Speaker 1: significance they would have later. At this point it was 206 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:11,160 Speaker 1: Jacques Nicuire and the Duke Dorleon, and the crowd takes 207 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:13,480 Speaker 1: the heads and they go and show them off and 208 00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:16,800 Speaker 1: um march around with them and eventually run into some 209 00:12:16,840 --> 00:12:20,760 Speaker 1: trouble with royal soldiers and try to protect the heads. 210 00:12:20,800 --> 00:12:23,040 Speaker 1: It's a it's a really wild story. Some of them 211 00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:26,960 Speaker 1: are killed trying to defend the wax heads, and the 212 00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:30,960 Speaker 1: Orleans bus is lost in the scramble, but the Nick 213 00:12:31,000 --> 00:12:34,720 Speaker 1: Caroline actually comes back to the shop badly sinned. You 214 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:37,120 Speaker 1: can imagine at that point maybe the eyes would be 215 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:39,760 Speaker 1: a little out of whack and the hair would be 216 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:44,079 Speaker 1: burned off, but makes it back. Just a strange story. 217 00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:49,320 Speaker 1: Before the French Revolution even really starts. Yeah, definitely, and 218 00:12:49,320 --> 00:12:52,560 Speaker 1: they keep going with us though. They keep following the crowd, 219 00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:56,359 Speaker 1: and they keep following the trends. So when Bastille memorabilia 220 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 1: becomes big, Marie models a figure of the Comte de Lorge, 221 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:02,640 Speaker 1: a prisoner who's actually been made up, since the real 222 00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:05,880 Speaker 1: guys inside had been a little less than heroic forgerers. 223 00:13:05,920 --> 00:13:07,839 Speaker 1: I think there was a guy in there for incest 224 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:10,840 Speaker 1: and his family wanted him locked up. Nobody in the 225 00:13:10,880 --> 00:13:15,120 Speaker 1: best deal was really like super heroic. You wouldn't want 226 00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:17,120 Speaker 1: a figure of him hanging out in your house exactly, 227 00:13:17,160 --> 00:13:19,160 Speaker 1: So you just make one up and then Murray makes 228 00:13:19,160 --> 00:13:21,520 Speaker 1: a wax of it for you. There you go. So 229 00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:24,760 Speaker 1: by the summer of seventeen eighty nine, an entire tableau 230 00:13:24,880 --> 00:13:27,520 Speaker 1: of the siege was featured in the waxworks. Yeah, but 231 00:13:27,600 --> 00:13:32,880 Speaker 1: as the revolution turned, obviously, Murray's work became a lot grimmer, 232 00:13:32,920 --> 00:13:36,280 Speaker 1: and she started to model the guillotined heads of her 233 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:39,480 Speaker 1: supposed former friends at her side. And this is a 234 00:13:39,559 --> 00:13:43,240 Speaker 1: really poignant part of the two so legend. You know, 235 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:46,560 Speaker 1: she claimed to have molded the heads of the Princess 236 00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:49,480 Speaker 1: de Lambal, who had been tortured for four hours at 237 00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:53,240 Speaker 1: the Twilery mass her Louis the sixteenth before he was 238 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:57,840 Speaker 1: interred in a double heaping helping of quicklime, because the 239 00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:02,760 Speaker 1: revolutionaries really didn't want any rel left and Marie Antoinette herself, 240 00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:05,360 Speaker 1: although this story didn't come from Marie, it came from 241 00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:10,000 Speaker 1: a nineteenth century exhibit catalog. Again, though, there's some issues 242 00:14:10,120 --> 00:14:14,000 Speaker 1: with this idea of her catching the heads from the 243 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:18,280 Speaker 1: guillotine essentially and making molds of them. Yeah, Marie always 244 00:14:18,280 --> 00:14:21,560 Speaker 1: mentions that she models the head at the order of 245 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:26,720 Speaker 1: the National Assembly. Perhaps unlikely though, considering the efforts that 246 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:29,920 Speaker 1: the revolutionaries would take to erase all relics of the royals. 247 00:14:29,960 --> 00:14:32,240 Speaker 1: Like you just mentioned, you don't want anyone to have 248 00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:35,000 Speaker 1: Louie's body, Why would you want him? Why would you 249 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:37,680 Speaker 1: want them to have a perfect likeness of him? Right? 250 00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 1: And then also some of the heads just plane didn't 251 00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:43,760 Speaker 1: show up for a really long time. For instance, Louie 252 00:14:43,800 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 1: and Marie Antoinette weren't displayed at the waxworks after the 253 00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:50,680 Speaker 1: Revolution until the eighteen sixties in London, so it would 254 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:55,280 Speaker 1: have been dangerous to display them. Absolutely. Courtiers sold off 255 00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 1: a lot of the royal figures actually to an exhibit 256 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:00,440 Speaker 1: traveling through India, which I think is interesting. Stand you, 257 00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:05,320 Speaker 1: Marie Antoinette and folks traveling traveling around a lot safer there, 258 00:15:05,560 --> 00:15:08,480 Speaker 1: I guess, so, unless it's hot, I'm not sure. But 259 00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:12,280 Speaker 1: that's not to say that Curtius and Marie weren't taking 260 00:15:12,320 --> 00:15:15,680 Speaker 1: models from guillotine victims. I mean, it is quite possible 261 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:19,160 Speaker 1: they were doing that. Um, maybe just not Louis the 262 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:23,280 Speaker 1: sixte himself. It's possible that Curtius made a deal with 263 00:15:23,560 --> 00:15:26,800 Speaker 1: one of the really famous executioners during the revolution to 264 00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:31,320 Speaker 1: inspect all the outgoing heads to see if any famous 265 00:15:31,400 --> 00:15:34,440 Speaker 1: faces were among them. And it's also likely that he 266 00:15:34,480 --> 00:15:37,560 Speaker 1: would visit the cemeteries and he may have modeled Madame 267 00:15:37,640 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 1: de Barry that way, um, since she was supposed to 268 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:45,640 Speaker 1: be a remarkably good likeness. Marie actually even recounts her 269 00:15:45,680 --> 00:15:48,520 Speaker 1: own near brush with the guillotine when she, her mother 270 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:50,720 Speaker 1: and an aunt were seized in the middle of the night, 271 00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:55,040 Speaker 1: imprisoned and they got their weekly haircuts for the blade. 272 00:15:55,280 --> 00:15:58,840 Speaker 1: But by seventeen nine four Marie was safe and supposedly 273 00:15:58,880 --> 00:16:02,040 Speaker 1: making a mold of robes Year's head, always one step 274 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:05,560 Speaker 1: ahead of the game that Marie definitely, But that same year, 275 00:16:06,120 --> 00:16:09,600 Speaker 1: Courteous died at home. I mean, this is probably kind 276 00:16:09,600 --> 00:16:13,040 Speaker 1: of an amazing stat for the time. Anyways, dying at home, 277 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:17,360 Speaker 1: and he left Marie everything he had. Like we said earlier, 278 00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:19,920 Speaker 1: he really did treat her like a daughter, and one 279 00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:21,920 Speaker 1: of the things he left her, one of his most 280 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:25,480 Speaker 1: valuable possessions, was, of course, the core of his wax works. 281 00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:29,680 Speaker 1: He had thirty six full figures, seven half length figures, 282 00:16:29,680 --> 00:16:33,680 Speaker 1: and three reclining figures. So it seems like Marie is 283 00:16:33,720 --> 00:16:36,320 Speaker 1: going to be able to carry on the family business. Yeah, 284 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:38,560 Speaker 1: and she does that, and she makes it even more 285 00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:40,640 Speaker 1: of a family business, I guess when she marries an 286 00:16:40,640 --> 00:16:43,800 Speaker 1: engineer named Francois Toussau at the age of thirty four, 287 00:16:44,040 --> 00:16:47,040 Speaker 1: and they have three children, the first of whom unfortunately 288 00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:50,840 Speaker 1: dies young. But Francois he wasn't really a good partner, 289 00:16:50,920 --> 00:16:54,840 Speaker 1: either at home or in their business. He gambles and 290 00:16:54,880 --> 00:16:58,080 Speaker 1: gets them into pretty bad debt. Plus business just isn't 291 00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:01,640 Speaker 1: going that well in general. I mean, you think Marie 292 00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:04,639 Speaker 1: would be happy to be out of the revolutionary horrors, 293 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:09,080 Speaker 1: but business just has slumped since then, maybe because people 294 00:17:09,080 --> 00:17:12,919 Speaker 1: aren't interested in seeing grizzly thieves and heads and that 295 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:15,399 Speaker 1: type of thing when they've seen it firsthand, not that 296 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:26,560 Speaker 1: long ago. So Marie takes up the offer of showman 297 00:17:26,600 --> 00:17:29,720 Speaker 1: Paul to Philip Stall to tour England with him, and 298 00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:32,760 Speaker 1: he owes her one. That's why she gets this deal 299 00:17:32,840 --> 00:17:35,040 Speaker 1: with him. She owes her one since Courtius saved him 300 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:38,760 Speaker 1: from the guillotine. Um. Again, though it's a poor partnership 301 00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:41,400 Speaker 1: between the two of them. Marie actually has to pay 302 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:44,560 Speaker 1: her own way and split her takings fifty fifty. She 303 00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:47,160 Speaker 1: also has to leave behind her younger son and her 304 00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:50,560 Speaker 1: elderly mother. Yeah, but she does well for herself even then. 305 00:17:50,600 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 1: So she's she's taking her older son with her, and 306 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:57,879 Speaker 1: she's learning enough English to get by and competing with 307 00:17:57,920 --> 00:18:00,840 Speaker 1: the existing wax works in England, which I know now 308 00:18:00,920 --> 00:18:03,960 Speaker 1: we only think of her as far as waxworks go, 309 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:06,679 Speaker 1: but at the time there were other big names in 310 00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:10,760 Speaker 1: the business. Her quality, though, is better, and because she 311 00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:13,920 Speaker 1: was French and fresh from the Revolution, that added sort 312 00:18:13,920 --> 00:18:17,280 Speaker 1: of a cachet to the whole the whole enterprise. Yeah, 313 00:18:17,320 --> 00:18:20,960 Speaker 1: but even though Marie is doing well, her partner Philip Stall, 314 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:23,480 Speaker 1: really isn't and so he kind of changes the nature 315 00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:26,960 Speaker 1: of their working relationship. It turns more and more into 316 00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:30,720 Speaker 1: a kind of indentured servitude. He drags her to Scotland, 317 00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:34,040 Speaker 1: always leaving one city right when she's taking off and 318 00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:37,159 Speaker 1: getting really successful. And from Scotland they go to Dublin, 319 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:39,960 Speaker 1: where she's finally able to buy him off, and she 320 00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:42,800 Speaker 1: starts advertising under her own name instead of the better 321 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:46,280 Speaker 1: known Courtius. Yeah. And it's also in Dublin where she 322 00:18:46,359 --> 00:18:48,560 Speaker 1: decided she's not going to go home to France, but 323 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:51,840 Speaker 1: had always been the plan. Stir up some interest, makes 324 00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: some money, and then go back to France because that's 325 00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:56,000 Speaker 1: where the core of her businesses and where the rest 326 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:59,320 Speaker 1: of her family is. But her husband won't respond to 327 00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:03,520 Speaker 1: her letters. He loses their house, he loses the collection, 328 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:06,840 Speaker 1: and there's really nothing there for her anymore except her 329 00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:09,800 Speaker 1: younger son. And it becomes clear to her that the 330 00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 1: only way she's going to make a future for her 331 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:16,960 Speaker 1: two children is to either succeed or fail in England. Yeah. So, 332 00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:19,800 Speaker 1: after four years in Dublin, she makes the decision to 333 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:23,520 Speaker 1: go on the road and as a traveling exhibit and 334 00:19:23,640 --> 00:19:26,520 Speaker 1: tours Great Britain for twenty seven years. Or so she 335 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:30,480 Speaker 1: perfects her advertising in her business strategy. At this point, 336 00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:33,840 Speaker 1: she starts plastering the towns that she's in with her show. 337 00:19:33,960 --> 00:19:37,600 Speaker 1: Before her arrival. She threatens to leave, you know, with 338 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:41,200 Speaker 1: signs that say things like only one day left yeah, 339 00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:45,520 Speaker 1: and then actually ends up staying instead of a popular demand. Right, um, 340 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:48,639 Speaker 1: she really only leaves a place when her business slows, 341 00:19:49,080 --> 00:19:51,720 Speaker 1: and she takes out these grand rooms to show off 342 00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:55,000 Speaker 1: the figures, and she really makes her customers feel comfortable too, 343 00:19:55,080 --> 00:19:57,960 Speaker 1: which was something of note at the time. There would 344 00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:00,920 Speaker 1: be refreshments, there would be autumn men, so you could 345 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:04,280 Speaker 1: relax and chat with each other and look at the 346 00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:08,760 Speaker 1: wax works at your leisure, not just some exhausting trip. 347 00:20:08,920 --> 00:20:12,560 Speaker 1: There was background music that was another kind of revolutionary thing, 348 00:20:13,280 --> 00:20:16,200 Speaker 1: make the place feel a little more comfortable, not quiet 349 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:19,879 Speaker 1: and weird. And she pitched the educational value of the 350 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:22,719 Speaker 1: wax works too, Like we mentioned in the in the introduction, 351 00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:26,959 Speaker 1: she distanced herself from the side show from those wax 352 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:30,359 Speaker 1: works with her quality with her little biographies. It was like, 353 00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:33,320 Speaker 1: this is a really good way for people to learn 354 00:20:33,359 --> 00:20:38,000 Speaker 1: about the heroes of the day, the famous criminals, famous 355 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:41,520 Speaker 1: people from the past. She she pitched it from different angles, 356 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:46,000 Speaker 1: and she also spent a lot of time making figures. Still, 357 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,440 Speaker 1: all the new celebrities, the thieves, the royals, she would 358 00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:51,480 Speaker 1: make them, and she would fix the ones that got 359 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:55,200 Speaker 1: banged up during stage coach journeys between towns because gosh, 360 00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:58,879 Speaker 1: I mean, can you imagine toting wax figures in a 361 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:03,399 Speaker 1: stage coach? Yeah, can't be good, risky. An article in 362 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:07,080 Speaker 1: Chambers Journal from eighteen eighty one actually describes the appeal 363 00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:11,159 Speaker 1: of these waxworks. It says, one can fearlessly criticize the 364 00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:13,960 Speaker 1: crowned kings of England, and one can enter securely into 365 00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:16,440 Speaker 1: a layer of thieves and murderers and feel with a 366 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:20,440 Speaker 1: chill that they are shockingly like commonplace mortals. Yeah. So, 367 00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:23,960 Speaker 1: I mean, I think that's it's an interesting way to 368 00:21:24,040 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 1: look at it, to to have that closeness to your 369 00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:32,399 Speaker 1: king or to people who you're reading about in the news, 370 00:21:32,480 --> 00:21:35,359 Speaker 1: and and really get to see them almost firsthand. But 371 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:39,879 Speaker 1: Marie and her elder son's constant travel is interrupted a 372 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:43,040 Speaker 1: few times by real life drama. They were shipwrecked once 373 00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:45,720 Speaker 1: sailing from Liverpool to Dublin. A lot of people on 374 00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:49,120 Speaker 1: board the ship drowned and they narrowly miss losing their 375 00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:53,359 Speaker 1: collection entirely to fire during the eight thirty one Bristol riots, 376 00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:56,120 Speaker 1: which I think it was always a constant concern, even 377 00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:58,840 Speaker 1: back when she was traveling with Philip Stall. She was 378 00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:02,560 Speaker 1: really concerned when this new gas light show is like 379 00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:06,560 Speaker 1: going to come in downstairs, because if you're dealing in wax, 380 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:10,760 Speaker 1: it better be a pretty stable temperature. But when her 381 00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:14,640 Speaker 1: younger son was twenty two, he finally rejoined his mother 382 00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:18,159 Speaker 1: and brother in England, and the two sons got married 383 00:22:18,240 --> 00:22:21,920 Speaker 1: to English women and they started families, and as late 384 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:25,480 Speaker 1: as nineteen sixty seven even the tissueda operation was still 385 00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:29,959 Speaker 1: a family affair. But anybody who knows the company today 386 00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:34,160 Speaker 1: knows that the original was in London. So when did 387 00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:38,280 Speaker 1: she finally change her operation from this traveling company to 388 00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:43,520 Speaker 1: brick and mortar building. Well, in eight thirty five Marie 389 00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:45,359 Speaker 1: and her sons took out a nice spot at the 390 00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:49,320 Speaker 1: bazaar on Baker Street, still a short term lease as usual, 391 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:51,679 Speaker 1: um nothing too serious, but it proved to be just 392 00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:56,000 Speaker 1: about the perfect spot for them. There were commercial businesses nearby, 393 00:22:56,320 --> 00:22:59,520 Speaker 1: so it was a busy area. The annual Smithfield Cattle 394 00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:01,960 Speaker 1: show all so took place downstairs and brought in a 395 00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,639 Speaker 1: lot of folks from the country. So by eight thirty 396 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:07,040 Speaker 1: six they had decided to stay. Yeah, and the Sun 397 00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:10,320 Speaker 1: spent a lot to really outfit the place beautifully. They 398 00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:12,879 Speaker 1: bought a lot of treasures, you know, and they started 399 00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:15,800 Speaker 1: actually buying art and nice furniture and that sort of thing. 400 00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:19,760 Speaker 1: The Duke of Wellington paid them a visit and they 401 00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 1: really focused on Victorian stuff too, because this coincides with 402 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:29,520 Speaker 1: the start of Victoria's Rain, and so they had comfy exhibits, 403 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:33,280 Speaker 1: way different from Louis and Marie Antoinette at the Grand Couvert, 404 00:23:33,320 --> 00:23:35,960 Speaker 1: where they're very formal and stiff. At dinner, they had 405 00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:39,479 Speaker 1: displays of Victoria and Albert and their young kids just 406 00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:43,600 Speaker 1: sort of relaxing at home like a normal family would. Yeah. 407 00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:48,840 Speaker 1: The collection starts acquiring real stuff too, not just good copies. Marie, 408 00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:52,080 Speaker 1: for example, buys the original guillotine from the Plas to 409 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:56,200 Speaker 1: grev for the Chamber of Horrors. She also purchases George 410 00:23:56,240 --> 00:24:01,119 Speaker 1: the Fourth's actual coronation robes, and perhaps most tellingly, amount 411 00:24:01,119 --> 00:24:04,119 Speaker 1: of dis becomes a star herself in her old age. 412 00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:08,240 Speaker 1: Dickens actually parodies her as Mrs Jarley, and consequently doesn't 413 00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:10,800 Speaker 1: make it into the collection until both of them are dead. 414 00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:14,320 Speaker 1: So even though he's arguably the biggest star of the era, 415 00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:17,280 Speaker 1: he must she must have not liked that very much. Currently, 416 00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:20,399 Speaker 1: not Westminster Abbey, which we just talked about on a 417 00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:24,760 Speaker 1: recent podcast. They asked her to refurbish their waxes, which 418 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:28,280 Speaker 1: we also mentioned. She refuses, says, I have my own 419 00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 1: wax shops. Sorry, guys, and Barnum the circus man tries 420 00:24:33,119 --> 00:24:35,840 Speaker 1: to buy them out. She refuses him to, probably because 421 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:39,120 Speaker 1: she's been into these She's gotten herself into these bad 422 00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:41,320 Speaker 1: partnerships before, and she's not going to do it again. 423 00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:47,480 Speaker 1: She's still sort of feeling the effects of her degenerate husband. 424 00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:52,280 Speaker 1: To Francoists makes one last attempt to get in touch 425 00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:54,879 Speaker 1: and get something out of his longest strange wife. I 426 00:24:54,880 --> 00:24:57,560 Speaker 1: mean they haven't talked in decades by this point, but 427 00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:00,640 Speaker 1: he contacts her in the eighteen forties and she's really 428 00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:04,160 Speaker 1: disturbed by it. She's disturbed that if she dies before him, 429 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,080 Speaker 1: and she is a few years older than him, um, 430 00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:10,280 Speaker 1: he'll he'll get the business and and her sons will 431 00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:13,280 Speaker 1: be left out in the cold and so she signs 432 00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:16,440 Speaker 1: articles of partnership between herself and her sons to protect 433 00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:20,560 Speaker 1: their interest, and she dies not too long after that 434 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:25,560 Speaker 1: April eighteen fifty, which is one year before Prince Albert's 435 00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:29,639 Speaker 1: famous Great Exhibition, which proves to be sort of a 436 00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:34,000 Speaker 1: turning point for the show. They her sons prepare for it, 437 00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:37,280 Speaker 1: they enlarged their rooms. They really know how big it's 438 00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:39,600 Speaker 1: going to be, and they get ready and it it 439 00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:44,119 Speaker 1: serves to their advantage, and the exhibit eventually moves to 440 00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:47,040 Speaker 1: Marley Bun Road, and it was damaged during the Blitz, 441 00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:51,160 Speaker 1: but has since become an international chain with locations, of course, 442 00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:56,200 Speaker 1: in Hollywood, New York, Bangkok, Berlin, d C, Shanghai, all 443 00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:59,520 Speaker 1: over the place. They ditched the possessive too, so now 444 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:02,760 Speaker 1: it's Madam Tusso it's yeah, But you might still be 445 00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:05,800 Speaker 1: wondering about our title, the two so test of Popularity. 446 00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:08,760 Speaker 1: I guess it's pretty obvious. But it came about in 447 00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:12,439 Speaker 1: an eighty nine issue of Punch magazine. And I'm just 448 00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:14,840 Speaker 1: gonna go ahead and read to you what was written 449 00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:18,520 Speaker 1: in Punch. In these days, no one can be considered 450 00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:21,800 Speaker 1: properly popular unless he has admitted into the company of 451 00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:25,480 Speaker 1: Madam Tussot's celebrities in Baker Street. The only way in 452 00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:28,080 Speaker 1: which a powerful and lasting impression can be made on 453 00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:31,719 Speaker 1: the public mind is through the medium of wax. And 454 00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:34,520 Speaker 1: I think that's interesting because it's still kind of true. 455 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 1: Today I went to the Tusso's website and saw, you 456 00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:41,679 Speaker 1: know who their latest figures were. There was like a 457 00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:45,879 Speaker 1: giant picture of Justin Bieber and Madam Tusso's in Hollywood 458 00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:50,000 Speaker 1: even has a hot or Not voting system. Lady Gaga, though, 459 00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:53,800 Speaker 1: seems to be the wax celebrity of the moment because 460 00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:57,920 Speaker 1: there are eight Lady Gagas in different costumes around the world. 461 00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:00,600 Speaker 1: I thought they'd at least be identical, because how many 462 00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:02,159 Speaker 1: people are going to go to the one in London 463 00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:05,160 Speaker 1: and then Shanghai and then New York. I guess they've 464 00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:08,200 Speaker 1: given super fans of a reason to do so now, 465 00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:12,439 Speaker 1: absolutely and here. Helen Mirren once commented on what it 466 00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:14,480 Speaker 1: was like, I guess to be immortalized in wax, and 467 00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:18,080 Speaker 1: she said, it's like becoming a dame, really a great honor. 468 00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:23,240 Speaker 1: So there you go. Thanks so much for joining us 469 00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:26,320 Speaker 1: on this Saturday. Since this episode is out of the archive. 470 00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:28,320 Speaker 1: If you heard an email address or a Facebook U 471 00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:30,640 Speaker 1: r L or something similar over the course of the show, 472 00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:34,679 Speaker 1: that could be obsolete now. Our current email address is 473 00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:39,320 Speaker 1: History Podcast at i heart radio dot com. Our old 474 00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:42,560 Speaker 1: health stuff works email address no longer works, and you 475 00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:45,920 Speaker 1: can find us all over social media at missed in History. 476 00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:49,119 Speaker 1: And you can subscribe to our show on Apple podcasts, 477 00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:52,400 Speaker 1: Google podcast, the I heart Radio app, and wherever else 478 00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:57,600 Speaker 1: you listen to podcasts. Stuff you Missed in History Class 479 00:27:57,640 --> 00:28:00,720 Speaker 1: is a production of I heart Radio. For our podcasts 480 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:04,280 Speaker 1: from I heart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, 481 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:10,399 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. H m 482 00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:10,720 Speaker 1: hm