WEBVTT - Making Sense of the Senseless 0:00:11.760 --> 0:00:14.520 Good morning, Peeves, and welcome to woke f Daily with 0:00:14.640 --> 0:00:19.000 me your girl, Danielle Moody, recording from the Home Bunker, Folks. 0:00:19.640 --> 0:00:23.200 For the last couple of days, there has been a 0:00:23.280 --> 0:00:31.480 pause in the murder bombing of the people of Gaza, 0:00:32.720 --> 0:00:37.680 and I know that for all of you listening, for 0:00:37.800 --> 0:00:43.040 many of you listening who stay tapped completely into the news, 0:00:43.920 --> 0:00:47.839 this has been heartbreaking. It has been traumatizing, and I 0:00:47.880 --> 0:00:51.760 don't use that word lightly. I posted a video this 0:00:51.840 --> 0:00:55.440 week talking about the trauma scrolling that is happening on 0:00:55.480 --> 0:01:00.840 social media, where you cannot avoid the pictures, the videos, 0:01:01.440 --> 0:01:07.440 the death, the destruction that weapons of war do to 0:01:07.640 --> 0:01:12.040 human bodies, that they do to communities, that they do 0:01:12.360 --> 0:01:22.240 to buildings. And this administration wants to receive credit for 0:01:22.520 --> 0:01:27.000 ushering in a pause while at the same time, at 0:01:27.000 --> 0:01:33.840 the same time standing unequivocally with Israel and not holding 0:01:34.760 --> 0:01:42.720 the State of Israel accountable to the same international laws 0:01:42.760 --> 0:01:46.320 that other nation states that are recognized by the UN 0:01:46.360 --> 0:01:53.960 and other bodies abide by. They continue to use our 0:01:54.160 --> 0:01:59.960 tax dollars, billions of dollars to fund the trauma that 0:02:00.160 --> 0:02:06.480 we are scrolling through. I have read articles over the 0:02:06.560 --> 0:02:09.960 last couple of days talking about the fact that if 0:02:09.960 --> 0:02:13.399 you care about the Palestinian people, then you won't want 0:02:13.400 --> 0:02:16.320 to cease fire because all of the ceasefire does is 0:02:16.360 --> 0:02:20.760 allow Hamas to build strength and radicalize more people. And 0:02:20.840 --> 0:02:25.720 I'm thinking to myself, what do you think contributes to 0:02:25.760 --> 0:02:32.880 the radicalization of people? Honestly, right, let's just take out 0:02:33.040 --> 0:02:38.200 this current situation. What the fuck do you think helps 0:02:38.280 --> 0:02:43.440 people become radicalized when there is nothing left to fucking lose, 0:02:44.280 --> 0:02:49.119 when everything they know right has been destroyed, has been 0:02:49.160 --> 0:02:55.080 taken from them, their children, their home, their livelihood, their hopefulness, 0:02:56.600 --> 0:02:59.799 and they see no path forward. Now, this is very 0:03:00.000 --> 0:03:03.679 different than the radicalization that we see in this country 0:03:04.320 --> 0:03:09.720 by white supremacists and white domestic terrorists that continue to 0:03:09.880 --> 0:03:13.720 grow in this country. That radicalization is different than what 0:03:13.919 --> 0:03:20.240 I am talking about because their radicalization comes from this 0:03:20.400 --> 0:03:23.880 idea that something is being taken from them, and in 0:03:24.040 --> 0:03:26.639 order for things not to be taken, then they need 0:03:26.680 --> 0:03:30.520 to destroy the very communities that they feel are taking 0:03:30.600 --> 0:03:40.640 from them. But we cannot believe that the continuation of 0:03:41.080 --> 0:03:48.120 more than fourteen thousand people being murdered, bombed, crushed to 0:03:48.400 --> 0:03:55.960 death is going to be a way to peace. And 0:03:56.400 --> 0:04:01.920 there are reports that continue to float around about this 0:04:02.880 --> 0:04:10.360 what they are referring to as a East Europe economic 0:04:10.520 --> 0:04:21.520 Middle India Middle East Europe economic corridor that links railways 0:04:21.560 --> 0:04:25.479 and ports and all of these things. But at the 0:04:25.600 --> 0:04:31.360 end of the day, is once again about who controls 0:04:31.480 --> 0:04:39.279 the dwindling resource of oil. And there's been reports about 0:04:41.000 --> 0:04:49.080 oil reserves that may in fact be in Gaza. So 0:04:50.040 --> 0:04:56.839 once again we start to think about is this war 0:04:57.839 --> 0:05:09.239 about liberation extermination? Is it about once again the one percent? 0:05:11.760 --> 0:05:16.760 Is it about greedy nations and their ability to extract 0:05:20.320 --> 0:05:29.560 from vulnerable poor places and nations? These are real questions 0:05:29.600 --> 0:05:35.760 that people are asking. These are real concerns that continue 0:05:35.800 --> 0:05:48.640 to grow, and this administration isn't answering those questions, the concerns, 0:05:48.839 --> 0:05:51.960 the fear, the anxiety that people have, and that is 0:05:52.080 --> 0:05:56.760 why eleven and a half months out from the twenty 0:05:56.839 --> 0:05:59.880 twenty four election, I am hearing people say that they 0:05:59.880 --> 0:06:03.359 are are not going to vote for Biden. Why do 0:06:03.480 --> 0:06:06.480 I continue to bring that up? Because it is fucking concerning, 0:06:07.360 --> 0:06:10.919 and I don't want us to wait until August or 0:06:11.000 --> 0:06:15.359 September or October of twenty twenty four and go, oh shit, 0:06:16.920 --> 0:06:21.440 when there is absolutely no time for a course correction. 0:06:23.839 --> 0:06:26.320 I posted this on social media and I had a 0:06:26.320 --> 0:06:29.520 bunch of people say, this administration doesn't need a course correction. 0:06:29.880 --> 0:06:33.520 Inflation is coming down, job numbers are good, blah blah. 0:06:33.560 --> 0:06:41.440 Are people actually feeling those things or is it media manipulation? 0:06:43.000 --> 0:06:46.680 And just because things look good on paper, does it 0:06:46.880 --> 0:06:53.440 actually feel good in real life? Because to ignore the 0:06:53.640 --> 0:06:59.240 issues and the emotions that people are having, we do 0:06:59.480 --> 0:07:03.320 so to the peril of our democracy and global stability. 0:07:06.200 --> 0:07:10.760 We saw what happened during the first Trump administration when 0:07:11.640 --> 0:07:16.560 he realigned with our enemies and backed out of deals 0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:22.160 and agreements that we were at the forefront of creating, 0:07:25.560 --> 0:07:32.920 and vacuum was left. And I would argue that a 0:07:32.960 --> 0:07:37.200 lot of the instability that we are seeing now is 0:07:37.240 --> 0:07:43.560 because of that. So what do you think happens if 0:07:43.600 --> 0:07:46.720 a Donald Trump and the Republicans take control again, Because 0:07:46.760 --> 0:07:53.440 they are never going to give it back up. It 0:07:53.520 --> 0:07:57.640 isn't just about what happens in this country. It will 0:07:57.680 --> 0:08:03.720 be about what happens globally. You think that we're close 0:08:03.720 --> 0:08:08.320 to World War three, now just wait because that time 0:08:08.400 --> 0:08:18.200 around will be on the wrong side. So I think 0:08:18.200 --> 0:08:21.280 that it is incredibly important for us to continue to 0:08:21.400 --> 0:08:27.160 get a fuller picture of what is happening, which is 0:08:27.160 --> 0:08:32.360 why I'm very happy to welcome back my friend, independent journalist, 0:08:32.600 --> 0:08:38.040 former Today Show journalist Danielle Campemore back onto the show, 0:08:38.559 --> 0:08:44.559 who in this episode will share what she observed, what 0:08:44.679 --> 0:08:48.520 she has learned when she was on the ground in Israel, 0:08:50.040 --> 0:08:54.600 just hundreds of feet away from Gaza, to get the 0:08:54.679 --> 0:08:58.080 stories that we need to hear and see. And so 0:08:58.240 --> 0:09:02.000 coming up next is that the very important conversation with 0:09:02.120 --> 0:09:06.320 Danielle Kampomore as we continue to try and make sense 0:09:07.520 --> 0:09:18.240 of what just seems absolutely insane, folks. I am always 0:09:18.400 --> 0:09:21.360 so grateful when I have the opportunity to bring my 0:09:21.520 --> 0:09:25.480 friend freelance journalists and report our former reporter for The 0:09:25.600 --> 0:09:31.240 Today Show dot Com, Danielle Kampomore, onto WOKF Daily, and 0:09:31.600 --> 0:09:36.840 most recently, Danielle was on the ground in Israel and 0:09:36.920 --> 0:09:42.280 palestein reporting on the conditions there, speaking with women, speaking 0:09:42.320 --> 0:09:45.400 with people on the ground about what was happening, how 0:09:45.480 --> 0:09:50.920 they were feeling. Your recent piece Danielle is now up 0:09:51.320 --> 0:09:57.440 at Time Magazine and it's entitled their Kibbutz was attacked 0:09:57.480 --> 0:10:02.840 on October seventh. They're determined to rebuild. Danielle, talk to 0:10:03.000 --> 0:10:07.800 us just first. I really want to know what compelled you, 0:10:08.440 --> 0:10:13.760 right as we saw war begin, as we saw the 0:10:13.800 --> 0:10:17.120 attacks happen on October seventh, and now we have witnessed 0:10:17.120 --> 0:10:22.200 the devastation thereafter, what compelled you to leave the safety 0:10:22.240 --> 0:10:24.800 of your home to go and report on the ground. 0:10:26.840 --> 0:10:28.880 Right. That's a really great question, and I think it 0:10:28.920 --> 0:10:34.920 really boils down to the stories that I knew were 0:10:34.960 --> 0:10:37.160 present on the ground and that needed to be told. 0:10:37.600 --> 0:10:39.839 You know, when the war broke out in Ukraine after 0:10:39.920 --> 0:10:45.400 Russia invaded, and I covered that international crisis, it was 0:10:45.440 --> 0:10:48.199 the stories that were really, to me the most compelling 0:10:49.400 --> 0:10:54.840 about survival, about hardship, about endurance, about vulnerability. And it 0:10:54.920 --> 0:10:59.320 just goes to show that politics as personal and vice versa, 0:10:59.440 --> 0:11:02.120 and there are the real life stories that are happening 0:11:02.160 --> 0:11:04.560 as a result of people's governments, the results of other 0:11:04.600 --> 0:11:09.320 people's governments, of our government governments and other countries. And 0:11:10.000 --> 0:11:14.080 we can get really bogged down with the geopolitical discussions 0:11:14.160 --> 0:11:18.640 and what this means both internationally and domestically, and overlook 0:11:18.800 --> 0:11:23.000 the stories of real humans who just like us, are 0:11:23.120 --> 0:11:25.720 just trying to put food on the table, take their 0:11:25.800 --> 0:11:29.240 kids to school, enjoy life, you know, be in love, 0:11:29.280 --> 0:11:33.080 and be in community with friends and neighbors. And so 0:11:33.160 --> 0:11:37.280 that was really what compelled me to go, is those stories. 0:11:37.520 --> 0:11:41.520 It's so easy, especially leading up to an election, to 0:11:41.559 --> 0:11:44.720 get bogged down by the politics and ignore the fact 0:11:44.720 --> 0:11:49.280 that that this is, this is affecting every aspect of 0:11:49.280 --> 0:11:52.679 these people's lives. Who are who are there to pick 0:11:52.760 --> 0:11:54.680 up the pieces and try to move forward. 0:11:55.520 --> 0:11:58.040 So tell us, you know, to take us on your journey. 0:11:58.200 --> 0:12:02.280 You know, you're you're leaving your own family, your husband, 0:12:02.320 --> 0:12:06.840 your two kids behind, and you get on a plane 0:12:07.080 --> 0:12:10.320 and you're heading to essentially the other side of the 0:12:10.360 --> 0:12:15.480 world to report talk to us about getting onto the 0:12:15.520 --> 0:12:18.800 ground and you know, and where you were headed. 0:12:19.960 --> 0:12:24.160 Right, So it was pretty overwhelming. The process of just 0:12:24.200 --> 0:12:28.760 even boarding the plane, given security measures, you know, it 0:12:28.880 --> 0:12:31.040 was pretty difficult in terms of, you know, why are 0:12:31.040 --> 0:12:33.640 you going to Israel, what are you going to do there, 0:12:34.679 --> 0:12:38.959 et cetera. So even just the security process, I perhaps 0:12:39.120 --> 0:12:42.040 I naively had assumed that the flight would be empty. 0:12:42.160 --> 0:12:45.280 It was not. It was filled with people going back home, 0:12:46.000 --> 0:12:48.360 which I thought, really from even the beginning, before I 0:12:48.360 --> 0:12:55.360 even gotten Israel was really incredible. And then similar to honestly, 0:12:55.400 --> 0:12:58.440 when I was preparing to go to Ukraine overseas and 0:12:58.480 --> 0:13:01.600 then rob Elementary happened, and instead I was told, you're 0:13:01.640 --> 0:13:03.080 not going to go to Ukraine, You're going to go 0:13:03.080 --> 0:13:06.319 to rob. On the flight, the shooting in Maine happened, 0:13:06.760 --> 0:13:10.600 and I found myself once again as a member of 0:13:10.960 --> 0:13:15.480 the press in the United States, covering a war overseas 0:13:15.800 --> 0:13:20.040 and simultaneously writing about weapons of war and the devastation 0:13:20.120 --> 0:13:22.200 that they cause here at home. So even that was 0:13:22.360 --> 0:13:25.240 just getting off the plane and having that shooting happening 0:13:25.280 --> 0:13:28.800 at home and then preparing to go into a war zone. 0:13:29.280 --> 0:13:34.000 I stayed in Tel Aviv, got to also visit the 0:13:34.120 --> 0:13:37.480 Kaboots Kafarazah, which is less than two miles away from Gaza. 0:13:38.800 --> 0:13:41.440 That's the closest that I was allowed to get without 0:13:41.480 --> 0:13:47.000 an IDF escort. And in order for journalists to be 0:13:47.120 --> 0:13:50.120 escorted into Gaza with IDF you have to turn over 0:13:51.120 --> 0:13:54.080 your footage, which was not something that I was willing 0:13:54.120 --> 0:13:57.840 to do as an independent journalist. So that's the closest 0:13:57.880 --> 0:13:59.600 that I could get to Gaza was a little less 0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:03.840 than too miles away. And then just spoke to family 0:14:03.880 --> 0:14:07.240 members of those who were kidnapped, those who were killed, 0:14:07.400 --> 0:14:11.200 those who were managed to survive either a Kibbutz raid 0:14:11.400 --> 0:14:16.840 or the raid at the rave at the concert, and 0:14:16.920 --> 0:14:22.680 simultaneously seeing how strange it is for people to continue 0:14:22.760 --> 0:14:25.520 living at a time of war. Sirens would go off 0:14:25.680 --> 0:14:28.920 three times every single day, and every single day everyone 0:14:28.960 --> 0:14:31.600 would stop what they're doing, run to the nearest shelter, 0:14:32.040 --> 0:14:34.000 wait for it to be over, and then continue on 0:14:34.080 --> 0:14:36.400 with their life. And that was a real big culture 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:39.120 shock for me, of just it was really part of 0:14:39.160 --> 0:14:45.000 everyday life at that point of sirens and bombings going off. Yeah, 0:14:45.040 --> 0:14:46.160 it was there for a week. 0:14:47.400 --> 0:14:50.880 You know, Danielle. I said this the other day to 0:14:52.280 --> 0:14:55.120 another friend of mine, where I said, you know, it 0:14:55.160 --> 0:14:57.640 never occurred to me when I was learning about the 0:14:57.640 --> 0:15:01.520 Black Plague that people were still going to work, right, Like, 0:15:01.560 --> 0:15:04.400 it never occurred like as you're you know, you're in 0:15:04.440 --> 0:15:07.240 school and you're learning about these points in history, and 0:15:07.280 --> 0:15:11.640 you never really think about, well, what is actually happening 0:15:11.640 --> 0:15:14.880 with the people. You have this idea of war, you 0:15:14.920 --> 0:15:18.760 have this idea of pandemic of plague, and so when 0:15:18.800 --> 0:15:22.160 you just explain the fact that these sirens are going 0:15:22.200 --> 0:15:26.640 off three times a day. How are people, the people 0:15:26.680 --> 0:15:31.480 that you're talking to, how are they even maintaining any 0:15:31.560 --> 0:15:35.760 semblance of normalcy? Like the sirens go off and then 0:15:36.640 --> 0:15:39.000 it's all clear and they can go about their day, 0:15:39.040 --> 0:15:42.200 Like what does it even mean to go about your 0:15:42.320 --> 0:15:43.840 day in a time of war? 0:15:45.200 --> 0:15:46.840 Right? I think that is one of the things that's 0:15:46.880 --> 0:15:49.640 most fascinating, And it's very difficult to quantify for those 0:15:49.680 --> 0:15:52.640 who've never been in that kind of situation or in 0:15:52.680 --> 0:15:55.360 that kind of environment, but you really see that people 0:15:55.360 --> 0:15:58.440 aren't a monolith, and the varying ways in which people 0:15:58.480 --> 0:16:02.120 can respond to traumatic events and continued dramatic events. So, 0:16:02.720 --> 0:16:08.840 for example, the survivors of Kafaraza are temporarily relocated and 0:16:08.840 --> 0:16:12.640 they're staying at a hotel. Daily life does look different 0:16:12.640 --> 0:16:14.680 for them, and then at the same time it doesn't. 0:16:14.720 --> 0:16:17.080 They made a makeshift kindergarten, The kids are going to 0:16:17.120 --> 0:16:21.240 school and playing. Elderly folks are coming together going back 0:16:21.240 --> 0:16:23.640 to rebuild the kaboots. A lot of people are volunteering, 0:16:25.360 --> 0:16:27.840 and so there's still joy. You see people still playing 0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:30.760 with their children, holding their newborns, talking with friends. They're 0:16:30.800 --> 0:16:35.000 on social media there's joy and then a siren goes off. 0:16:35.080 --> 0:16:38.400 And it was very interesting to be in a safe 0:16:38.480 --> 0:16:41.880 room with a group of survivors and then see some 0:16:41.880 --> 0:16:46.000 people looked really angry, some people looked extremely scared, some 0:16:46.040 --> 0:16:49.800 people looked completely unfazed, some people were able to joke, 0:16:50.040 --> 0:16:54.160 some people look completely disassociated. So I saw this group 0:16:54.200 --> 0:16:56.840 of people who'd gone through a very similar experience, but 0:16:56.920 --> 0:16:59.480 the varying ways in which it's impacting them and how 0:16:59.520 --> 0:17:02.800 they're trying to manage, and so it really is this 0:17:02.880 --> 0:17:05.720 kind of weird suspension of time where you can see 0:17:05.760 --> 0:17:10.040 some people are still incredibly scared, some people the fear 0:17:10.119 --> 0:17:13.360 has been overtaken by anger and they're really really, really angry. 0:17:14.119 --> 0:17:17.720 Some people are just completely trying to disassociate and put 0:17:17.720 --> 0:17:20.040 one foot in front of the other. And so it 0:17:20.080 --> 0:17:23.440 depends on really who you're talking to. But one thing 0:17:23.520 --> 0:17:26.320 is for sure is that everyone that I spoke to, 0:17:27.160 --> 0:17:29.119 even if they have a different opinion of what should 0:17:29.119 --> 0:17:31.959 come next, agree that something must come next. There is 0:17:32.000 --> 0:17:36.120 no waiting, there's no pausing. It's one foot in front 0:17:36.119 --> 0:17:39.119 of the other. We have to keep moving forward. And 0:17:39.160 --> 0:17:41.639 you see that every day. And like I said, friends 0:17:41.640 --> 0:17:44.000 will be sitting at a cafe, they hear a siren, 0:17:44.240 --> 0:17:47.160 run into the nearest restaurant to go into their safe room, 0:17:47.359 --> 0:17:50.200 come back out, finish their coffees, and they're laughing two 0:17:50.240 --> 0:17:54.240 minutes later. I mean, it's truly unbelievable, the resiliency of humanity, 0:17:55.560 --> 0:17:58.399 and it's unfortunate that we only really see that or 0:17:58.440 --> 0:18:01.000 acknowledge that resilience in moments like this. 0:18:02.080 --> 0:18:05.480 You know, I want to speak to you too about 0:18:05.840 --> 0:18:12.600 being two miles away from Gaza. Since you have returned 0:18:13.720 --> 0:18:21.600 and since the beginning of the bombings, over ten thousand 0:18:22.520 --> 0:18:26.520 people have been killed, more than half of them being 0:18:26.600 --> 0:18:31.280 children in Gaza, and I want to get your thoughts 0:18:32.320 --> 0:18:36.480 or from what you heard from people in and around 0:18:36.520 --> 0:18:42.800 that area about their feelings about Netanyahu and their government's 0:18:42.880 --> 0:18:48.880 response to the trauma and the tragedy that occurred on 0:18:48.960 --> 0:18:49.879 October seventh. 0:18:51.880 --> 0:18:55.199 Yes, absolutely, that's a great question. Every single person that 0:18:55.280 --> 0:18:58.000 I spoke to was very quick to want to talk politics, 0:18:58.000 --> 0:19:01.080 which I also thought was very interesting. Think again, there 0:19:01.080 --> 0:19:04.000 in Israel, people are very very acutely aware, especially after 0:19:04.080 --> 0:19:08.120 October seventh, how much their politics and government failed them 0:19:08.440 --> 0:19:11.800 and how that has impacted their lives. Now, no one 0:19:11.840 --> 0:19:15.160 that I spoke to, like snet Yahoo, They all blame him. 0:19:16.000 --> 0:19:19.959 There was a lot of discussion about him perhaps prolonging 0:19:20.040 --> 0:19:23.160 the war in order to maintain power, because he continues 0:19:23.200 --> 0:19:26.160 to say, we'll look at you know, how this happened, 0:19:26.200 --> 0:19:29.440 We'll have investigations, but when the war is over, which 0:19:29.520 --> 0:19:32.679 really kind of gave people a sense of perhaps that 0:19:33.160 --> 0:19:35.240 doesn't give him a whole lot of incentive to end 0:19:35.240 --> 0:19:40.040 the war sooner. Everyone was very, very very upset, worried 0:19:40.280 --> 0:19:45.280 and concerned about those that were kidnapped and how little 0:19:45.359 --> 0:19:48.200 was being done to get them back. You know, one 0:19:48.240 --> 0:19:52.720 mom in particular, she survived the attack with her three 0:19:52.800 --> 0:19:56.320 children and her husband. Her best friend's husband died protecting 0:19:56.359 --> 0:20:00.760 their home. You know. She said, look, we've lived to Gaza. 0:20:01.000 --> 0:20:04.959 We want our Palestinian neighbors to be happy, to have 0:20:05.040 --> 0:20:09.280 joyful lives. It wasn't uncommon for Palestinians to come from 0:20:09.359 --> 0:20:12.879 Gaza into the Kiboots to work and then go back 0:20:13.000 --> 0:20:14.800 because they would get paid more in a day than 0:20:14.800 --> 0:20:18.000 they would in a week in Gaza, So it was 0:20:18.160 --> 0:20:23.840 not uncommon, you know. So she was very forthread about 0:20:23.840 --> 0:20:25.720 how we just want to live in peace. We want 0:20:25.760 --> 0:20:30.159 peace for everybody you know, calls for a ceasefire and 0:20:30.200 --> 0:20:34.880 specifically to get the kidnapped out, And so really there's 0:20:34.920 --> 0:20:37.880 a lot of distrust with the government. They don't think 0:20:37.960 --> 0:20:41.760 that the government is able to keep them safe, and 0:20:41.840 --> 0:20:44.440 a lot of anger at nan Yahoo for not taking 0:20:44.480 --> 0:20:48.800 responsibility for at least not seeing that this attack was 0:20:48.840 --> 0:20:49.560 going to happen. 0:20:55.880 --> 0:20:57.920 I think about this a lot, and I think about 0:20:57.920 --> 0:21:05.119 the way in which corporate media, mainstream media has given 0:21:05.359 --> 0:21:09.320 Americans in particular, an incredibly sanitized, in one side view 0:21:10.000 --> 0:21:13.480 of conflict in general, but particularly as it pertains to 0:21:13.560 --> 0:21:17.360 Israel and Palestine, where billions of our tax dollars go 0:21:17.840 --> 0:21:22.719 every single year since the creation of Israel. And I wonder, 0:21:23.000 --> 0:21:26.119 you know, just as if we all in the United 0:21:26.160 --> 0:21:29.720 States are not maga right, are not in support of 0:21:29.800 --> 0:21:35.280 Donald Trump. I think that what has been shown about 0:21:35.400 --> 0:21:38.760 Israel is as if everyone is in support of net 0:21:39.000 --> 0:21:42.359 Yahoo and is in support of these raids. And so 0:21:43.080 --> 0:21:48.439 Danielle being now, you know, a freelance journalist, what do 0:21:48.480 --> 0:21:53.359 you think about one the amount of journalists that have 0:21:53.440 --> 0:21:58.280 been killed right in their coverage, whose homes have been bombed, 0:21:58.280 --> 0:22:01.160 whose families have been killed. There have been I think 0:22:01.280 --> 0:22:07.640 over fifty at this point, you know, or more, what 0:22:07.640 --> 0:22:12.879 do you think about the portrayal of people inside of 0:22:13.000 --> 0:22:20.800 Israelis and our understanding of the depth and dimension of 0:22:20.880 --> 0:22:27.720 political thought, frustration, anger, and grief that we don't see. 0:22:26.720 --> 0:22:28.560 Right, I mean, you nailed it on the head, as 0:22:28.560 --> 0:22:31.280 there's a depth there, and there's so much substance that 0:22:31.440 --> 0:22:34.560 I think mainstream media is just quite frankly afraid of. 0:22:35.000 --> 0:22:37.440 And that's something that you know, you asked at the 0:22:37.520 --> 0:22:40.600 beginning what compelled me to go, and it's the stories, 0:22:40.680 --> 0:22:43.360 and it's also you know, part of that, this kind 0:22:43.400 --> 0:22:46.000 of fear I think that I saw play out in 0:22:46.040 --> 0:22:49.960 real time while I was still you know, formally employed, 0:22:50.280 --> 0:22:54.080 of just this is a complicated issue, and that complicated 0:22:54.119 --> 0:23:01.119 issue deters editors from assigning certain things or for quite frankly, 0:23:01.240 --> 0:23:04.600 us doing our job. If an issue is complicated, that 0:23:04.720 --> 0:23:08.840 means that we then have the obligation to inform the 0:23:08.840 --> 0:23:14.480 public of this complicated, nuanced thing, war certainly being one 0:23:14.480 --> 0:23:18.119 of them, and in this situation, that fear is very palpable, 0:23:18.160 --> 0:23:23.080 I think in newsrooms across the country, in particularly mainstream ones, 0:23:23.119 --> 0:23:27.640 of just not wanting to step into this complicated thing 0:23:28.520 --> 0:23:33.040 and being called out or being labeled biased, as if 0:23:33.160 --> 0:23:36.800 that's not going to happen in this political climate anyways. 0:23:37.160 --> 0:23:38.920 And so no, I think that there is this very 0:23:38.960 --> 0:23:42.320 singular viewpoint. And that's why again I think it's so 0:23:42.359 --> 0:23:44.920 important to really get on the ground and actually speak 0:23:44.960 --> 0:23:48.000 to people, because then you will learn that this is 0:23:48.119 --> 0:23:53.040 not everyone. I mean, Israel is certainly united as a 0:23:53.200 --> 0:23:56.320 group of people after the October seventh attack, but that 0:23:56.400 --> 0:23:59.680 certainly doesn't mean that they were united behind their government. 0:24:00.840 --> 0:24:03.160 And I think that that is a very big difference, 0:24:03.200 --> 0:24:05.399 and and that's at least what I heard on the 0:24:05.400 --> 0:24:08.520 ground is that they are very skeptical, skeptical of their 0:24:08.560 --> 0:24:13.360 government and of what has transpired since October seventh. And 0:24:13.440 --> 0:24:16.879 so again, if we got past our fear here of 0:24:17.520 --> 0:24:22.240 of appearing biased, of appearing like we have an ulterior 0:24:22.320 --> 0:24:27.000 motive as journalists, and instead just reporting on complicated situations 0:24:27.040 --> 0:24:33.240 and nuanced ways, with nuanced and perhaps a more realistic 0:24:34.040 --> 0:24:37.399 group of voices, then I think our public would be 0:24:37.400 --> 0:24:39.840 better for it. And we've seen how polarizing it can 0:24:39.880 --> 0:24:42.320 be when when we fail to do our jobs and 0:24:42.440 --> 0:24:43.600 provide that context. 0:24:44.520 --> 0:24:48.480 You know, coming back now after having been there, for 0:24:48.520 --> 0:24:53.960 a week. What was the adjustment like in in coming 0:24:54.000 --> 0:25:01.520 back for you, and and how how does and on 0:25:01.600 --> 0:25:06.320 the ground journalists take care of your own mental health 0:25:06.440 --> 0:25:12.280 after you've seen and heard and reported on something so devastating. 0:25:14.400 --> 0:25:17.040 Coming back was really difficult. I didn't want to get 0:25:17.040 --> 0:25:23.439 on the plane, you know, when I went. One of 0:25:23.440 --> 0:25:26.359 the things that I had a personal security that had 0:25:26.400 --> 0:25:28.320 to go with me, and one of the things that 0:25:28.359 --> 0:25:31.440 I had to download was in Israel, they have a 0:25:31.560 --> 0:25:34.119 warning system on your phone for when the Iron Dome 0:25:35.040 --> 0:25:38.680 is initiated, basically just shows you where the sirens are 0:25:39.600 --> 0:25:42.320 before they show up. It's like a couple of seconds 0:25:42.320 --> 0:25:44.639 before I can't bring myself to take it off, so 0:25:44.680 --> 0:25:48.159 I'm still getting notifications of when they're being hit in 0:25:50.040 --> 0:25:54.320 Tel Aviv or in parts of Israel. It was really 0:25:54.400 --> 0:26:00.960 challenging to dive back into the discourse here when, like 0:26:01.040 --> 0:26:04.080 you said, that nuance and that depth, people just aren't 0:26:04.119 --> 0:26:08.880 getting it. It's been really challenging to hear certain opinions 0:26:08.920 --> 0:26:12.080 that I think are not born out of fact or 0:26:12.560 --> 0:26:18.239 an actual knowledge of the region or the people, and 0:26:18.280 --> 0:26:23.440 that's been really challenging. It's been challenging to continue to 0:26:23.520 --> 0:26:27.560 check in on the people that I spoke to. You know, 0:26:27.760 --> 0:26:30.760 I want to go back. So that's been hard. In 0:26:30.840 --> 0:26:33.560 terms of mental health, I think so much of it 0:26:33.680 --> 0:26:38.040 is this talking about it. I think what would do 0:26:38.240 --> 0:26:40.879 my mental health the worst is feeling like I didn't 0:26:40.920 --> 0:26:43.480 do my job, I didn't tell those stories that if 0:26:43.520 --> 0:26:46.000 I was if I took the time to be there, 0:26:46.119 --> 0:26:48.560 came home and didn't do what I promised I would do, 0:26:48.640 --> 0:26:51.560 then that would be devastating. So talking about it, writing 0:26:51.600 --> 0:26:56.240 about it, but then also spending time with my kids, 0:26:57.520 --> 0:27:03.439 turning off the news at least at night, and you know, 0:27:03.600 --> 0:27:09.440 trying to remember those moments of joy that we talked about. 0:27:09.800 --> 0:27:11.840 And I know that those moments of joy are happening 0:27:12.040 --> 0:27:16.360 in Gaza as well, And I'm hoping to be able 0:27:16.400 --> 0:27:19.600 to go back and actually go into Gaza again under 0:27:19.600 --> 0:27:24.439 those what conditions, I don't know, And I know for 0:27:24.560 --> 0:27:28.320 a fact that there's so many stories in Gaza that 0:27:28.320 --> 0:27:32.040 aren't being told, not just ones of deep sorrow and 0:27:32.080 --> 0:27:35.320 loss and trauma, but of joy. And I think, you know, 0:27:35.600 --> 0:27:39.439 both Israelis and Polsinians deserve to see their people in 0:27:39.480 --> 0:27:43.520 the media also being joyful and celebrating their lives, not 0:27:43.680 --> 0:27:48.080 just in the wreckage of war. So I think about 0:27:48.080 --> 0:27:51.080 a lot about that, about seeing, you know, a toddler 0:27:51.080 --> 0:27:54.359 who had survived a horrific attack playing with his dad 0:27:54.680 --> 0:27:59.800 and mom, friends hugging each other and just supporting each other. 0:27:59.840 --> 0:28:02.240 You know, I think about that and that that helps. 0:28:01.960 --> 0:28:06.600 Too, you know, Danielle, I am always in awe of 0:28:06.640 --> 0:28:08.560 the work that you do and the writing that you 0:28:08.640 --> 0:28:13.320 do and the coverage, and you know, I thought like 0:28:14.000 --> 0:28:16.159 it sent you a quick note when I saw that 0:28:16.240 --> 0:28:18.639 you were leaving, and you know, said like, you know, 0:28:18.720 --> 0:28:21.760 I'm I'll pray for you and you know, and send 0:28:21.800 --> 0:28:24.800 positive energy because I was really you know, as I'm 0:28:24.840 --> 0:28:29.760 certain so many people who follow you were. But I 0:28:30.600 --> 0:28:34.679 recognize in your reporting and your coverage always that you 0:28:34.720 --> 0:28:38.120 bring us to stories that we need, and you do 0:28:38.240 --> 0:28:41.240 it at you know, it is it is a public 0:28:41.280 --> 0:28:45.000 service that that you are doing. And I just want 0:28:45.040 --> 0:28:49.000 to appreciate you and and you know, and uplift you 0:28:49.120 --> 0:28:53.800 for that and tell folks you know. Danielle's story is 0:28:53.920 --> 0:28:58.160 up now at time dot com. Their kibbutz was attacked 0:28:58.200 --> 0:29:02.040 on October seventh, their I'm in too rebuild. I encourage 0:29:02.080 --> 0:29:05.920 everyone to read it, to share it to post it. 0:29:05.920 --> 0:29:08.520 It's this kind of reporting and work that we need 0:29:08.560 --> 0:29:12.120 to really uplift, and so thank you. Thank you for 0:29:12.440 --> 0:29:15.200 you know, for saying I'm back and I can come 0:29:15.320 --> 0:29:18.040 on this show, and I'm so glad that we were 0:29:18.080 --> 0:29:21.760