1 00:00:01,440 --> 00:00:07,880 Speaker 1: Quody Dams with Joseph Scott More. You know, in forensics 2 00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:14,239 Speaker 1: and forensic pathology, medical legal death investigation, we've got some 3 00:00:14,600 --> 00:00:19,159 Speaker 1: interesting terms that we use that other people might not 4 00:00:19,800 --> 00:00:25,560 Speaker 1: necessarily think about. But they're kind of short, sweet, hard 5 00:00:25,600 --> 00:00:29,520 Speaker 1: to beat their right to the point. And there's almost 6 00:00:29,720 --> 00:00:33,960 Speaker 1: many times an economy of language, I think in my field, 7 00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:37,280 Speaker 1: and a lot of it has to do with form 8 00:00:37,320 --> 00:00:39,800 Speaker 1: and function and you know, just getting right to the 9 00:00:39,800 --> 00:00:43,839 Speaker 1: heart of the matter. And in today's case that we're 10 00:00:43,880 --> 00:00:46,320 Speaker 1: going to talk about, there is a term that I've 11 00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:50,200 Speaker 1: heard throughout my entire career and there's something I love 12 00:00:50,200 --> 00:00:53,640 Speaker 1: about this term because it really sums things up. And 13 00:00:53,720 --> 00:01:00,240 Speaker 1: here you go, you ready, injuries incompatible with life. Now, 14 00:01:00,240 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 1: it doesn't matter if you are in Canada, the US, 15 00:01:05,640 --> 00:01:10,840 Speaker 1: the UK, Germany, it doesn't matter where you are. It 16 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:16,680 Speaker 1: doesn't even matter if you're in Argentina. That term in 17 00:01:16,720 --> 00:01:22,119 Speaker 1: the medical legal community, it defines something to make it 18 00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:27,399 Speaker 1: incompatible with life. That is, you can't go on. We're 19 00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:33,160 Speaker 1: going to be talking about the sudden and unexpected and 20 00:01:33,280 --> 00:01:39,560 Speaker 1: to this point unexplained death of a very high profile 21 00:01:39,680 --> 00:01:44,800 Speaker 1: individual that everyone is aware of. You know who I'm 22 00:01:44,800 --> 00:01:53,000 Speaker 1: talking about. Liam Payne formerly of One Direction. I'm Joseph 23 00:01:53,000 --> 00:02:00,639 Speaker 1: Scott Morgan and this is bodybacks Dave A covered I guess. 24 00:02:00,920 --> 00:02:04,800 Speaker 1: Over my career in media, I've covered a lot of 25 00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 1: deaths involving celebrities and let me see if I can 26 00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:12,200 Speaker 1: name a few. The first one that jumps to mind 27 00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:18,000 Speaker 1: is probably Paul Walker with his motor vehicle accident where 28 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:24,640 Speaker 1: he died and essentially significant fire element of fire was 29 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:30,359 Speaker 1: involved in that. Let's see who else, Oh, Robin Williams 30 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:34,520 Speaker 1: worked that one or covered it. Oh, and I think 31 00:02:34,639 --> 00:02:39,959 Speaker 1: probably Philip Seymour Hoffman. That's another one, and of course 32 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:43,040 Speaker 1: Marble Murphy. It just goes on and on and on, 33 00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:46,119 Speaker 1: And isn't that interesting? Do you find this interesting? I'd 34 00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:49,040 Speaker 1: love to know, because, look, man, you've been in media 35 00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:51,840 Speaker 1: for a long long time, all right, and I know 36 00:02:52,040 --> 00:02:56,720 Speaker 1: that you have this incredible ability to see trends and 37 00:02:56,840 --> 00:03:02,360 Speaker 1: patterns and things that I don't possess. But isn't it 38 00:03:02,440 --> 00:03:09,360 Speaker 1: interesting how when someone famous dies the media is all 39 00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:11,240 Speaker 1: over it. But you could have the same set of 40 00:03:11,280 --> 00:03:14,360 Speaker 1: circumstances with just John Q public and there might be 41 00:03:14,400 --> 00:03:18,480 Speaker 1: an overriding public health interest even and they're not going 42 00:03:18,560 --> 00:03:20,200 Speaker 1: to make it through two news cycles. 43 00:03:20,560 --> 00:03:20,840 Speaker 2: Isn't that? 44 00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 1: Isn't that kind of fascinating the way it is mind works. 45 00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:27,720 Speaker 3: But you know, people are born every day and people 46 00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:28,360 Speaker 3: die every day. 47 00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:29,200 Speaker 2: Yes they do. 48 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:33,000 Speaker 3: Famous people get more attention, but then it doesn't last long. 49 00:03:33,960 --> 00:03:37,880 Speaker 3: And sadly, Liam Payne right now, his passing is being 50 00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:41,320 Speaker 3: covered because he's thirty one years old and he's world 51 00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:44,600 Speaker 3: famous and rich, and he dies and people want to 52 00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 3: know why. And I think it's explainable. I actually am 53 00:03:49,720 --> 00:03:53,640 Speaker 3: an expert at addiction, and it's one of the It's 54 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:55,920 Speaker 3: probably the only thing I will say. I am an 55 00:03:56,000 --> 00:04:01,040 Speaker 3: expert at I've lived. I've been sober now since August seventh, 56 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 3: nineteen ninety And when I see public individuals talking about things, 57 00:04:07,640 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 3: especially in the world of addiction, a lot of times 58 00:04:10,480 --> 00:04:14,400 Speaker 3: you know they're really not sober. And it's sad because 59 00:04:14,440 --> 00:04:17,000 Speaker 3: they're not lying to themselves. They're lying to the world 60 00:04:17,120 --> 00:04:20,120 Speaker 3: in a lot of cases, and he was. Liam Payne 61 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:24,720 Speaker 3: was very public about his addiction issues alcoholic all. 62 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:27,000 Speaker 1: I got to stop you right here, because look, I mean, 63 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:29,799 Speaker 1: you got you rely on my expertise a lot. I'm 64 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:34,880 Speaker 1: really interested in exploring this, just very briefly, just indulge 65 00:04:34,920 --> 00:04:37,600 Speaker 1: me just for a second. I'm not talking about Liam 66 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 1: Payne here, I'm talking about just broad spectrum. 67 00:04:40,279 --> 00:04:40,640 Speaker 2: Okay. 68 00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:45,880 Speaker 1: So, having been in recovery for as long as you 69 00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:47,920 Speaker 1: have been, by the way, I love you and I'm 70 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:48,600 Speaker 1: proud of you. 71 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:50,320 Speaker 2: I want you to know that up front. 72 00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:54,200 Speaker 1: Thank you, because that is that's truly the good stuff 73 00:04:54,240 --> 00:04:56,720 Speaker 1: in life. Because you've been able to identify something, Dave, 74 00:04:56,800 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 1: and you've helped so many people. I don't think any 75 00:04:59,760 --> 00:05:02,240 Speaker 1: of our friends understand how many lives you've touched over 76 00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:02,679 Speaker 1: the years. 77 00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:03,840 Speaker 2: It's I don't. 78 00:05:04,000 --> 00:05:06,280 Speaker 1: I think it's you can't even put a number on it. 79 00:05:07,040 --> 00:05:12,680 Speaker 1: But I'm curious for you if you came across somebody 80 00:05:12,920 --> 00:05:19,120 Speaker 1: that is purporting to be in recovery, but yet there 81 00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:22,440 Speaker 1: is something about them as you're listening to them speak 82 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:27,000 Speaker 1: or act or interact. What What's what's one of the 83 00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:32,080 Speaker 1: first things that you notice about someone that's essentially lying 84 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:35,080 Speaker 1: that they're not telling the truth about their status of 85 00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:36,039 Speaker 1: being in recovery. 86 00:05:36,360 --> 00:05:40,080 Speaker 3: Can you it's something? I think it's only somebody it's 87 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:47,719 Speaker 3: it's it's so personal when you identify this, you just 88 00:05:47,960 --> 00:05:53,760 Speaker 3: know when somebody is lying about their truth because alcoholism 89 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:57,880 Speaker 3: and drug addiction. They're not to be messed with. They're 90 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:01,719 Speaker 3: non alcohol and drugs do not respect people station in life. 91 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:04,360 Speaker 3: You throw out race and everything else right on out 92 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:07,440 Speaker 3: the window, because it is the great equalizer. It affects 93 00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:10,360 Speaker 3: every family in the world today in one way or another, 94 00:06:10,600 --> 00:06:14,760 Speaker 3: some type of addiction. And to somebody who is sober 95 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:18,600 Speaker 3: and is living a sober life, you can tell when 96 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 3: somebody's not. And it's just it's tough to explain, but 97 00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:25,040 Speaker 3: I will tell you I would never actually say it 98 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 3: in public either. I would actually go to them privately 99 00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:31,000 Speaker 3: and have a talk. And and the reason with with Liam, 100 00:06:31,040 --> 00:06:33,280 Speaker 3: I don't know Liam Payne. I know who he is, 101 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:36,520 Speaker 3: you know, and look at his life, the life of 102 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:42,280 Speaker 3: Liam Payne. This is a young man who talked about 103 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:44,480 Speaker 3: addiction issues from a I mean, he's only thirty one 104 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:47,120 Speaker 3: when he passes away, and he was talking about addiction 105 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:51,400 Speaker 3: issues eight years ago when he's you know, in his 106 00:06:51,480 --> 00:06:56,680 Speaker 3: early twenties. And that was encouraging to me because when 107 00:06:56,720 --> 00:06:59,920 Speaker 3: you're talking openly about addiction at that age, you're on 108 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:04,640 Speaker 3: the right path. It's just that it takes people more 109 00:07:04,680 --> 00:07:07,120 Speaker 3: than one time often to get sober and stay sober. 110 00:07:07,960 --> 00:07:10,720 Speaker 3: He even had gone through a one hundred day of 111 00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:15,280 Speaker 3: recovery program in Louisiana recently. And I will tell you, 112 00:07:16,600 --> 00:07:20,320 Speaker 3: just like you know, it's easy to be a Christian 113 00:07:20,320 --> 00:07:25,360 Speaker 3: when you're in church. It's easy to be sober in 114 00:07:25,400 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 3: recovery if that's what you want in rehab. Although, to 115 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:31,560 Speaker 3: be honest with you, alcohol and drigs are available everywhere, 116 00:07:31,640 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 3: including most rehabs. You have to really want to change 117 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:39,080 Speaker 3: your life and get it going back on track. And 118 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 3: he did made several attempts at it. Just to give 119 00:07:43,080 --> 00:07:48,720 Speaker 3: you an idea. There are so many famous people who 120 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:53,360 Speaker 3: suffer alcoholism and drug addiction issues. Yeah, the percentage is 121 00:07:53,400 --> 00:07:55,200 Speaker 3: no different for them than it is the rest of 122 00:07:55,240 --> 00:07:55,680 Speaker 3: the world. 123 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:58,680 Speaker 1: And that's something. Yeah, well that makes sense. I don't 124 00:07:58,680 --> 00:08:01,360 Speaker 1: think that. Yeah, and I don't think that it would. 125 00:08:01,440 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 1: And to that point, let me ask you this, and 126 00:08:04,920 --> 00:08:07,280 Speaker 1: it's nearly you throwing questions at me, but I gotta 127 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:14,040 Speaker 1: I'm fascinated by this because I'm interested from the perspective 128 00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:17,800 Speaker 1: because I don't follow. I have certain music that I 129 00:08:17,920 --> 00:08:22,240 Speaker 1: listen to, and no disrespect one direction is outside of 130 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:24,760 Speaker 1: my generation. It's not something I would normally listen to. 131 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:31,600 Speaker 1: But I appreciate talent, okay, and I know you do too. 132 00:08:31,680 --> 00:08:34,600 Speaker 1: And this is the the beautiful thing about your brain 133 00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:36,840 Speaker 1: is that you and I can sit around and talk 134 00:08:36,880 --> 00:08:39,880 Speaker 1: about music, and you will call, you will recall some 135 00:08:39,920 --> 00:08:44,079 Speaker 1: of the most obscure things about modern music, and we'll 136 00:08:44,120 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 1: begin to talk about it. And I thought that I 137 00:08:45,559 --> 00:08:48,280 Speaker 1: knew something about, you know, the world inside the world 138 00:08:48,280 --> 00:08:50,920 Speaker 1: of either country or rock music. And here's another thing, 139 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:53,480 Speaker 1: my friends, that you don't know about Dave mac big 140 00:08:53,520 --> 00:08:58,360 Speaker 1: reveal here is that Dave has literally sat across the 141 00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:01,920 Speaker 1: broadcast desk from some of the most famous people in 142 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:06,280 Speaker 1: music over the years. And I was, I'm curious about this. 143 00:09:06,440 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 1: Can you give any kind of insight into what that's 144 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:14,559 Speaker 1: like from the perspective of why is it so dangerous 145 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:17,920 Speaker 1: for somebody in that world that has a predisposition to 146 00:09:17,960 --> 00:09:21,439 Speaker 1: an addictive behavior? Because I think we might know it. 147 00:09:21,840 --> 00:09:23,560 Speaker 1: But dude, you've had your You've kind of had your 148 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:26,400 Speaker 1: finger on the pulse of it. You've watched you've watched 149 00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:29,600 Speaker 1: careers probably rise and fall. You've seen some people fly 150 00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:31,559 Speaker 1: it into the side of the mountains, and you've probably 151 00:09:31,559 --> 00:09:35,160 Speaker 1: seen other people that have been raging success. They've overcome 152 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:38,400 Speaker 1: and they're still out there producing art or music or whatever. 153 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:39,320 Speaker 1: You know. 154 00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:42,840 Speaker 3: It's amazing that you mentioned the number of celebrities that 155 00:09:42,920 --> 00:09:47,880 Speaker 3: you've covered in your time. The very first celebrity I 156 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:51,280 Speaker 3: was actually on the air when she died was Natalie 157 00:09:51,280 --> 00:09:54,599 Speaker 3: Wood and I was on the air in Raleigh, North Carolina. 158 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:57,160 Speaker 3: I had met her for the very first time only 159 00:09:57,240 --> 00:10:01,520 Speaker 3: one month before and oh, oh wow, yeah, and I 160 00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:03,600 Speaker 3: wasn't I didn't really know who she was because by 161 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:05,640 Speaker 3: the time she did when she died, she had made 162 00:10:05,640 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 3: a movie called Brainstorm with Christopher Walken and they filmed 163 00:10:08,920 --> 00:10:10,839 Speaker 3: and they filmed most of it in the Raleigh Durham 164 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:13,559 Speaker 3: Chapel Hill area, So they had come back through Raleigh 165 00:10:13,600 --> 00:10:17,000 Speaker 3: Durham to do a publicity tour. And that's why I 166 00:10:17,040 --> 00:10:20,480 Speaker 3: met her while she was in town and actually had 167 00:10:20,480 --> 00:10:22,360 Speaker 3: a meet and greet at the radio station with her, 168 00:10:22,720 --> 00:10:24,840 Speaker 3: and so that was kind of neat gets shaken all that. 169 00:10:24,880 --> 00:10:27,199 Speaker 3: And then a month later she dies at Catalina Island 170 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:31,319 Speaker 3: in south the coast of California, you know, and it 171 00:10:31,360 --> 00:10:33,280 Speaker 3: was oh that was that was a weird one. I 172 00:10:33,320 --> 00:10:35,200 Speaker 3: had to announced it that night, and I remember thinking, 173 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:38,600 Speaker 3: I just met her. You know, and then after that 174 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:42,520 Speaker 3: Brian Wilson's little brother, Dennis. The death of Dennis Wilson 175 00:10:42,600 --> 00:10:45,320 Speaker 3: hit me really hard and still affects me to this day. 176 00:10:45,760 --> 00:10:49,400 Speaker 3: And Dennis was an alcoholic. Yeah, yeah, I have a 177 00:10:52,600 --> 00:10:54,600 Speaker 3: There have been a number of famous people that have 178 00:10:54,640 --> 00:10:57,240 Speaker 3: passed away due to alcoholism and drug addiction. The only 179 00:10:57,240 --> 00:10:59,360 Speaker 3: difference between them and everybody else is they're famous. 180 00:10:59,760 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 1: And yeah, would you say that there is a difference though, 181 00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:05,920 Speaker 1: in the area of like access. I think because I've 182 00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:10,360 Speaker 1: always heard these terms about how if you're famous, you 183 00:11:10,520 --> 00:11:13,240 Speaker 1: literally have people warning to give you dress, you know, 184 00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:16,000 Speaker 1: And I say you in the universal, yes, that you 185 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:19,040 Speaker 1: have either backstage or people coming into your hotel room. 186 00:11:19,240 --> 00:11:21,040 Speaker 1: And how many stories have we heard over the years 187 00:11:21,120 --> 00:11:23,120 Speaker 1: you think about I don't know, let's pull a name 188 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:26,800 Speaker 1: the who, right, you know? We think about Moon and 189 00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:29,520 Speaker 1: those guys like that, and that whole generation of people 190 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:33,840 Speaker 1: where some of them would have their drug dealers even 191 00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:37,280 Speaker 1: travel with them, right, but they always had access. 192 00:11:37,280 --> 00:11:41,240 Speaker 3: Interesting that there's two examples, and they tend to come 193 00:11:41,280 --> 00:11:43,839 Speaker 3: to mind when people talk about alcoholism, drug addiction, and 194 00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:48,000 Speaker 3: early death. Dying at the age of thirty three John Belushi, Yeah, 195 00:11:48,040 --> 00:11:50,920 Speaker 3: and Chris Farley. Both died at the age of thirty three, 196 00:11:50,960 --> 00:11:53,840 Speaker 3: and both from cocaine and alcohol. And they were both 197 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:56,640 Speaker 3: big men who were abusers of their body. Both of 198 00:11:56,679 --> 00:12:00,360 Speaker 3: them fought for sobriety, and both of them had people 199 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:02,640 Speaker 3: willing to give them whatever they wanted when they wanted it. 200 00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:06,600 Speaker 3: But in both of their cases when they died, they 201 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:11,360 Speaker 3: died alone in a hotel room. You know, well, they 202 00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:13,760 Speaker 3: didn't both die in a hotel room. John Belushi died 203 00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:18,040 Speaker 3: the hotel the Chateau Mamon Beverly in California, in la 204 00:12:18,160 --> 00:12:21,439 Speaker 3: and Chris died at his place in the John Hancock 205 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:24,439 Speaker 3: Building in Chicago. But they're both alone when they died, 206 00:12:24,480 --> 00:12:27,120 Speaker 3: and they had spent the night with women who were 207 00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:31,079 Speaker 3: drug people who got them the drugs. And in both 208 00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:33,319 Speaker 3: cases they were they weren't having to buy the drugs 209 00:12:33,400 --> 00:12:36,520 Speaker 3: just like anybody else. They weren't being given drugs. At 210 00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:38,120 Speaker 3: that point, they were at the end of that addiction 211 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:40,760 Speaker 3: road where pretty much friends and neighbors knew it was 212 00:12:40,800 --> 00:12:43,160 Speaker 3: time to leave. Last two people in the room with 213 00:12:43,240 --> 00:12:45,800 Speaker 3: John Belushi the night he died, Robert de Niro and 214 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:49,160 Speaker 3: Robin Williams. They were both in the hotel in that room, 215 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:51,599 Speaker 3: and then Kathy Evelyn Smith went out and got the 216 00:12:51,640 --> 00:12:54,000 Speaker 3: drugs and came back and she was one that injected 217 00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:56,320 Speaker 3: him with a speedball. And that comes into play with 218 00:12:56,360 --> 00:12:59,440 Speaker 3: Liam Payne here, Yes, because when you look at the 219 00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 3: toxic color your report of Liam Payne, there's a lot 220 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:03,200 Speaker 3: to go over here. 221 00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:06,679 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, yeah, there really is. And I'm glad 222 00:13:06,720 --> 00:13:09,000 Speaker 1: you brought up Belushi because he's probably one of the 223 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:13,960 Speaker 1: more famous cases. And he was speedballing, which is people 224 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:17,679 Speaker 1: are not familiar with speedballing. That's a combination of cocaine 225 00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 1: and heroin, and those two things seem counterintuitive, you know, 226 00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:27,200 Speaker 1: like opposite, they completely opposite, and so I think that 227 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:31,600 Speaker 1: you know, application of both of those substances at that 228 00:13:31,640 --> 00:13:38,040 Speaker 1: particular time is you never can tell what might happen. 229 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:43,120 Speaker 1: But you know what my friends with Liam Paine, with 230 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:47,120 Speaker 1: Liam Payne, the combination, if you think the combination with 231 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:50,880 Speaker 1: Belushi was scary. When you begin to think about what 232 00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:57,760 Speaker 1: Liam Pain may may have been involved with, speedballs seem 233 00:13:57,880 --> 00:14:16,079 Speaker 1: like child's play. Dad, you've heard me mention my granddaughter Harper, 234 00:14:16,559 --> 00:14:20,400 Speaker 1: and I love that child. I love both of my grandchildren, 235 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:25,840 Speaker 1: Jameson and Harper Harper right now, at the stage in 236 00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:29,560 Speaker 1: her life she likes. There's two colors she likes. She 237 00:14:29,680 --> 00:14:34,360 Speaker 1: likes purple because I hope, I hope I don't make 238 00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:36,440 Speaker 1: enemies by saying this, because in my heart, I'm an 239 00:14:36,520 --> 00:14:39,840 Speaker 1: LSU fan. That brings me a lot of pleasure. But 240 00:14:39,880 --> 00:14:42,920 Speaker 1: the other color she likes, which I really love, is 241 00:14:42,920 --> 00:14:45,000 Speaker 1: the fact that she's a little girl and she loves pink. 242 00:14:45,640 --> 00:14:48,960 Speaker 1: She wants pink dresses, she wants pink shoes. She asked 243 00:14:48,960 --> 00:14:51,200 Speaker 1: me for her birthday if I could get her a 244 00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:54,560 Speaker 1: pink unicorn. And let me tell you how much I 245 00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:59,480 Speaker 1: love this child. Papa actually went looking for a pinky unicorn. 246 00:14:59,560 --> 00:15:01,720 Speaker 1: So yeah, I pretty much do anything she wants me 247 00:15:01,800 --> 00:15:04,800 Speaker 1: to do. But you know, those are happy thoughts for me. 248 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:07,240 Speaker 1: But David, I never thought that I would be having 249 00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:13,160 Speaker 1: a conversation in regards to a death investigation that literally 250 00:15:13,240 --> 00:15:18,640 Speaker 1: involves the color pink. I was struck by it the 251 00:15:18,640 --> 00:15:22,280 Speaker 1: first time I heard about it, because it's not necessarily 252 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:28,400 Speaker 1: cases that we've covered that haven't been involving this pink substance, 253 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:31,560 Speaker 1: because nothing has gotten on the radar until now. But 254 00:15:31,600 --> 00:15:35,640 Speaker 1: apparently it is an insidious problem that has been going 255 00:15:35,680 --> 00:15:38,480 Speaker 1: on both in Europe and South America for some time now. 256 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:42,120 Speaker 3: It's amazing how something will become a trend in a 257 00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:44,520 Speaker 3: different world than you exist in. You know, you and 258 00:15:44,520 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 3: I don't run in that world. For those who are 259 00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:49,840 Speaker 3: in the drug world, drug culture, they've heard about it 260 00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:51,880 Speaker 3: and been playing with it for a while. You and 261 00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:53,560 Speaker 3: I hear about it in the news and we're like, 262 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:56,960 Speaker 3: what pink cocaine? I told you the other day. My 263 00:15:57,000 --> 00:16:00,160 Speaker 3: first thought was, somebody is taking a marketing thing. It 264 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:02,240 Speaker 3: just took him ten years to get Walter White from 265 00:16:02,320 --> 00:16:06,560 Speaker 3: the blue meth to the pink cocaine and then with Ditty, 266 00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:10,880 Speaker 3: with everything going on with Ditty right now, this pink 267 00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:13,640 Speaker 3: cocaine was a part of that story as well. 268 00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:15,040 Speaker 2: All of those drug combos. 269 00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:17,200 Speaker 3: And you start looking at it, and pink cocaine is 270 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:21,320 Speaker 3: a mix of ecstasy, ketamine, caffeine, and a psychedelic known 271 00:16:21,480 --> 00:16:25,320 Speaker 3: as two CB or two CY. And I was looking 272 00:16:25,440 --> 00:16:30,600 Speaker 3: for some type of analytical to this and found Lamar Odom. 273 00:16:31,040 --> 00:16:34,920 Speaker 3: Lamar is an NBA former NBA player who's been with 274 00:16:34,960 --> 00:16:37,760 Speaker 3: one of the Kardashians or whatever, but he has gone 275 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 3: through He's one of the guys who actually overdosed at 276 00:16:40,240 --> 00:16:41,200 Speaker 3: the Bunny Ranch. 277 00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:43,680 Speaker 2: I remember Nevada. 278 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:47,440 Speaker 3: And nearly died. And anyway, he has now become sober. 279 00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:51,360 Speaker 3: And I don't know lamar Odem personally. I'm only talking 280 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:53,360 Speaker 3: about this from the standpoint of what we've been told. 281 00:16:53,840 --> 00:16:59,600 Speaker 3: And he actually said that pink cocaine can cause auditory hallucinations. 282 00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:03,440 Speaker 3: Does that mean you hear things in your head telling 283 00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:06,040 Speaker 3: you to do something like hey man, you can fly. 284 00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:08,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm not. 285 00:17:07,920 --> 00:17:10,359 Speaker 1: Going to say that it's on the same level as like, 286 00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 1: because you know, some some instances with schizophrenia, you will 287 00:17:16,080 --> 00:17:22,960 Speaker 1: have auditory and visual hallucinations. And listen, you're talking about 288 00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:29,520 Speaker 1: two drugs here that are part of this of this 289 00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:33,080 Speaker 1: mix and this recipe that can lead to that. We're 290 00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:36,640 Speaker 1: talking about one is ketamine, and ketamine has been used 291 00:17:36,640 --> 00:17:39,600 Speaker 1: for you. It started out as like a vet med 292 00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:42,880 Speaker 1: That's what I thought it was. Yeah, well you use it. 293 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:44,919 Speaker 1: It can be used, and it is used. You can 294 00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:47,960 Speaker 1: go and look and like if you've ever wondered like 295 00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:50,760 Speaker 1: what a surgical suite looks like. The instruments and everything 296 00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:53,000 Speaker 1: are pretty cool. But if you go to the drug 297 00:17:53,080 --> 00:17:56,879 Speaker 1: cart where the antesiologists work, It's mind blowing because in 298 00:17:56,960 --> 00:18:00,520 Speaker 1: every single drawer they have multiple vial of all of 299 00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:04,680 Speaker 1: these types of applications that they that they can actually 300 00:18:05,040 --> 00:18:08,959 Speaker 1: use and apply under different circumstances. Ketamine is actually one 301 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:12,399 Speaker 1: of those. And one of the properties of ketamine is 302 00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:17,600 Speaker 1: that it has a hallucinogenic effect on individuals. Now it's 303 00:18:17,640 --> 00:18:20,359 Speaker 1: going to be different, say, for instance, it from like 304 00:18:20,800 --> 00:18:25,600 Speaker 1: if somebody is like tripping on mushrooms or something like that. 305 00:18:26,119 --> 00:18:32,040 Speaker 1: But also you throw ecstasy the MDMA in there as well, 306 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:36,800 Speaker 1: it has hallucinogenic effects as well. Some of these things. 307 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:41,640 Speaker 1: Remember they're calling this pink cocaine, which is combo. Well, 308 00:18:41,720 --> 00:18:45,359 Speaker 1: cocaine is obviously a stimulant. You know, it'll put you 309 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:48,719 Speaker 1: on the roof and also causes heart problems and all 310 00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:49,480 Speaker 1: those sorts of things. 311 00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:51,400 Speaker 3: And also got to see you to sell your TV 312 00:18:51,440 --> 00:18:53,400 Speaker 3: at three o'clock in the morning for five dollars. 313 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:56,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, it will. And just because you want to 314 00:18:56,960 --> 00:19:00,359 Speaker 1: feed that habit. And it's even it becomes even more 315 00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:04,760 Speaker 1: insidious when you convert that down to crack, you know, 316 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:09,119 Speaker 1: because crack is very inexpensive, but it's so highly addictive. 317 00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:12,879 Speaker 1: When I came into my field, Dave, crack was just 318 00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:17,160 Speaker 1: hitting the streets. And it's not necessarily the same thing, 319 00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:21,199 Speaker 1: but you know, to give you an idea, this is 320 00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:23,680 Speaker 1: back during the days like when the movie Colors came 321 00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:28,720 Speaker 1: out back in like eighty five or eighty six, Sean 322 00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:33,080 Speaker 1: Penn and great movie, very well done. Matter of fact, 323 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:37,320 Speaker 1: Dennis Hopper directed that movie. And it was gritty. I 324 00:19:37,359 --> 00:19:39,000 Speaker 1: mean it really was for that day in time. Well, 325 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:42,199 Speaker 1: that had to do with the crack epidemic when I 326 00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:45,280 Speaker 1: was working in New Orleans when it hit the streets. Dude, 327 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,440 Speaker 1: it was we literally did have dry by shootings all 328 00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:50,520 Speaker 1: the time. It seemed like we would have three or 329 00:19:50,520 --> 00:19:53,639 Speaker 1: four per week. And I'm sure I'm overestimating that, but 330 00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:56,160 Speaker 1: it sticks out in my mind. But crack is so 331 00:19:56,200 --> 00:19:59,520 Speaker 1: insidious that people would do anything for it. You see 332 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:03,280 Speaker 1: that now meth which also meth, can be found in 333 00:20:03,359 --> 00:20:08,440 Speaker 1: this combo of pink cocaine. Here, here's here's the problem. 334 00:20:08,960 --> 00:20:11,199 Speaker 1: You don't you don't have people. This is not like 335 00:20:11,320 --> 00:20:15,960 Speaker 1: you're talking about Pfizer or Roach laboratories or any of 336 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:20,000 Speaker 1: Johnson and Johnson. This is not being manufactured in some 337 00:20:20,119 --> 00:20:24,919 Speaker 1: kind of factory somewhere where everybody's wearing a hairnet. They're gloved. 338 00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:27,720 Speaker 1: You know, you've got all of these people on production. 339 00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:32,560 Speaker 1: Now this stuff is being whipped up in somebody's basement. 340 00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:37,680 Speaker 1: The fact that you mentioned Walter White, Walter White would 341 00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:43,960 Speaker 1: be uh, would be more desirable, Yes, you know, because 342 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:47,399 Speaker 1: he had controls on relative to his chemistry background. You 343 00:20:47,400 --> 00:20:49,439 Speaker 1: don't know what you're going to get. So just because 344 00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:52,880 Speaker 1: they say that something is pink cocaine, the only thing 345 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:56,000 Speaker 1: that is there that makes it pink is they use 346 00:20:56,520 --> 00:20:58,479 Speaker 1: food coloring in this stuff and it makes it more 347 00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:02,000 Speaker 1: attractive and so, and you can identify that, but you 348 00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:03,440 Speaker 1: don't know what's going to be in the mix. 349 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:05,960 Speaker 2: Man, you have no idea. 350 00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:08,679 Speaker 3: In talking about all of this and the death of 351 00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:13,520 Speaker 3: Liam Payne. Yeah, you know, the man fell or jumped 352 00:21:13,560 --> 00:21:17,720 Speaker 3: from a third story window of a hotel in Buenos Aires. 353 00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:21,639 Speaker 3: And yet the drug story, that drug angle is the 354 00:21:21,680 --> 00:21:22,520 Speaker 3: real issue. 355 00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:24,400 Speaker 2: It is because. 356 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:25,880 Speaker 3: They don't even know. I was looking at this show 357 00:21:25,920 --> 00:21:34,320 Speaker 3: because knowing I mentioned that every family is affected by 358 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:38,840 Speaker 3: alcohol and drug and addiction in some form. And I 359 00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 3: say that because I want people to look at this. 360 00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:42,760 Speaker 3: If you've got people under the age of twenty five 361 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:46,040 Speaker 3: in your home, they know who One Direction is. They 362 00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:49,959 Speaker 3: had One Direction got together on the X Factor in 363 00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:54,480 Speaker 3: Great Britain. Liam he actually auditioned in two thousand and 364 00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:57,120 Speaker 3: eight when he was fourteen years old and didn't make it. 365 00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:58,959 Speaker 3: He made it onto the show, but he didn't make 366 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:02,120 Speaker 3: it all the way he got but Simon call said, 367 00:22:02,160 --> 00:22:04,480 Speaker 3: come back in two years, come back in two years. 368 00:22:04,280 --> 00:22:04,840 Speaker 2: And he did. 369 00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:08,600 Speaker 3: In twenty ten, Liam Panne goes back on the show 370 00:22:08,920 --> 00:22:11,440 Speaker 3: and this time he doesn't make it as a solo 371 00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:13,960 Speaker 3: artist through there. But neither did Harry Styles or any 372 00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:16,359 Speaker 3: of the rest of the guys in One Direction. They 373 00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:20,359 Speaker 3: were formed at the X Factor in twenty ten in London, 374 00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:24,639 Speaker 3: and that's how this whole thing of One Direction came together. 375 00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:28,320 Speaker 3: They were on X Factor, they were created by Simon 376 00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:32,840 Speaker 3: Cowell on TV, and they had talent and the boy 377 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:35,400 Speaker 3: band experience had been over for eight years at that point, 378 00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:38,120 Speaker 3: seven or eight years, because it was twenty ten twenty eleven. 379 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:41,879 Speaker 3: The boy band thing died. When you had in Sync 380 00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:46,480 Speaker 3: and Backstreet and ninety eight degrees and you know you 381 00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:49,080 Speaker 3: name it. O Town named the band and by two 382 00:22:49,119 --> 00:22:51,439 Speaker 3: thousand and four they were over. And so here we 383 00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:54,119 Speaker 3: are six seven, eight years later, and Simon cal puts 384 00:22:54,119 --> 00:22:57,760 Speaker 3: together a boy band in Willems. They become one direction 385 00:22:58,119 --> 00:23:00,679 Speaker 3: the biggest band in the world for about three years 386 00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:02,280 Speaker 3: the world. 387 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:06,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and it's a completely Can you imagine being 388 00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:09,680 Speaker 1: that age. It's obviously something you're desiring. I'm not talking 389 00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:12,080 Speaker 1: about the drugs. I'm talking about the fame and the success. 390 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 1: And then you're thrust into that world and you bear 391 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:19,600 Speaker 1: witness to everybody that is around you, and you work 392 00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:23,000 Speaker 1: at such a pace. There's such a demand on you 393 00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:26,959 Speaker 1: that I think that some people might use that as 394 00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:31,520 Speaker 1: an opportunity to imbibe. Perhaps maybe they just toy with 395 00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:33,920 Speaker 1: it a little bit at first, like you know what, Wow, 396 00:23:33,960 --> 00:23:35,360 Speaker 1: I can go a little bit longer. 397 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:36,280 Speaker 2: I feel good. 398 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:39,280 Speaker 1: And then they start to do variations on everything, and 399 00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:43,200 Speaker 1: then perhaps you wind up you're in a hotel all 400 00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:47,439 Speaker 1: by yourself, now done in buenous areas. Just think about 401 00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:53,920 Speaker 1: that down there, and you know you're you're there, You're alone, 402 00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:58,760 Speaker 1: you're fighting addiction. His you know, from what I'm understanding 403 00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:01,920 Speaker 1: right now, his girlfriend and some people are using this. 404 00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:04,320 Speaker 1: S ain't me saying this right. Some people are using 405 00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:07,760 Speaker 1: the term abandonment. She's twenty five years old. She went 406 00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:10,439 Speaker 1: back to the US and left him down there. He 407 00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:13,440 Speaker 1: extended his stay. Maybe she had had too much. 408 00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:15,800 Speaker 2: Maybe she was done. Yeah, Joe, there. 409 00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:18,120 Speaker 3: You you said something a minute ago. 410 00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:19,439 Speaker 2: Yeah, And. 411 00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:26,760 Speaker 3: Here's the reality. When I started drinking as a teenager 412 00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:31,520 Speaker 3: with my friends. Yeah, you know, it's something not everybody does, 413 00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:34,439 Speaker 3: but our generation did because our generation, you know, you 414 00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:37,120 Speaker 3: could drink alcohol at eighteen years old when I went 415 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:39,840 Speaker 3: to college. You drank in college, you went to the 416 00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:42,240 Speaker 3: bar because you were every you know, freshman turned eighteen 417 00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:46,000 Speaker 3: and so alcohol in high school it was kind of 418 00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:48,160 Speaker 3: a rite of passage. Who could get the beer this weekend? 419 00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:49,280 Speaker 2: You know. Yeah. Yeah. 420 00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:52,600 Speaker 3: And as a teenager in high school, Joe, I drank 421 00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:56,280 Speaker 3: differently than my counterparts did my friends. When we would drink, 422 00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:57,520 Speaker 3: I drank differently. 423 00:24:57,560 --> 00:24:57,760 Speaker 2: Then. 424 00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:00,920 Speaker 3: I knew from a very early age that I drank differently. 425 00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:04,000 Speaker 3: I was competitive with it, you know. And I read 426 00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:06,919 Speaker 3: Liam's story over the last couple of days, and I 427 00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:12,320 Speaker 3: understand him in a huge way. And I'm telling you 428 00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:16,240 Speaker 3: that I'd never drank like a regular person. Other things 429 00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:18,719 Speaker 3: didn't really appeal to me. When Liam talked about when 430 00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:19,920 Speaker 3: they were out on tour and they had a few 431 00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:21,399 Speaker 3: days of a break. You know what he would do, 432 00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:23,960 Speaker 3: stay in the hotel room with the beer fridge or 433 00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:26,359 Speaker 3: the cooler in between his legs, pretty much drinking beer 434 00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:29,239 Speaker 3: or whatever alcohol was in there. I've done that, and 435 00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:32,040 Speaker 3: I'm not a superstar. You know, I'm not leaving my 436 00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:34,560 Speaker 3: house with people waiting to see me paying twenty five. 437 00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:37,720 Speaker 3: You know that isn't I'm just a regular Joe who 438 00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:40,440 Speaker 3: did the exact same thing because I was alcoholic, and 439 00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:43,000 Speaker 3: I'm not putting that on him. He's the one that 440 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:47,280 Speaker 3: volunteered this information. And this isn't two guys making up 441 00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:49,639 Speaker 3: stories about Liam Payne. I'm telling you, this is what 442 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:51,720 Speaker 3: he shared, and that's why my heart goes out to him. 443 00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:53,320 Speaker 3: But my heart goes out to those who loved him 444 00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:56,320 Speaker 3: knew him, because all right, let's say the girlfriend did 445 00:25:56,359 --> 00:25:59,480 Speaker 3: have her fill. Well, you know what, from what they 446 00:25:59,560 --> 00:26:01,600 Speaker 3: found in his hotel room, Joe, there was a lot 447 00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:04,359 Speaker 3: going on in there, and if you don't want to 448 00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:07,600 Speaker 3: take part in this, you're going to leave. That's not abandonment, 449 00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:08,880 Speaker 3: that's actually being an adult. 450 00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:13,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, and I'm glad you. I'm glad you pointed that out, 451 00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:15,960 Speaker 1: because you know people that throw that term around. I 452 00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:19,000 Speaker 1: don't think that they know what it's like to be 453 00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 1: around someone who is crashing before your eyes, and it's overwhelming, 454 00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:27,840 Speaker 1: and at some point in time, self preservation comes in. Now, look, 455 00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:31,280 Speaker 1: we don't have all of the information at this point, 456 00:26:31,640 --> 00:26:37,119 Speaker 1: but I do know this. There are multiple questions that 457 00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:40,240 Speaker 1: are still out there that have yet to be answered. 458 00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:43,399 Speaker 1: And one of the biggest questions I have at this 459 00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:47,280 Speaker 1: point is not only what did he have on board 460 00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 1: in his system, but how in the world did Liam 461 00:26:51,119 --> 00:27:05,119 Speaker 1: Payne wind up with all of these injuries to his body? 462 00:27:10,040 --> 00:27:13,520 Speaker 1: Incompatible with life? Well, what does that mean? Well, there's 463 00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:20,280 Speaker 1: another term that is applied in our field, and engineering 464 00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:23,640 Speaker 1: uses it too. They use the term a catastrophic failure, 465 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:29,239 Speaker 1: and that goes to like plane crashes, bridges collapsing, all 466 00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:32,320 Speaker 1: those sorts of things. But we also use the term 467 00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:36,159 Speaker 1: in forensic pathology called catastrophic injuries, and that goes to 468 00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:40,520 Speaker 1: this idea of incompatibility with life. That is to go 469 00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:43,240 Speaker 1: on and you know one or more of the systems 470 00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:47,080 Speaker 1: are impacted in the body. You can have maybe too 471 00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:49,719 Speaker 1: much cocaine on board or some other drug that's going 472 00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:53,680 Speaker 1: to impact the way you breathe or the way your 473 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,959 Speaker 1: heart functions or maybe the way your brain functions, and 474 00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:00,520 Speaker 1: that leads to the incompatibility. But also, Dave, one of 475 00:28:00,520 --> 00:28:04,240 Speaker 1: the other things that you begin to explore with these 476 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:08,679 Speaker 1: catastrophic events is injuries. You know, because if you just 477 00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:11,040 Speaker 1: think about it, somebody's in a car accident, you can 478 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:13,640 Speaker 1: be there's any number of different types of car accidents 479 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:15,480 Speaker 1: you can be in. Doesn't mean you're going to have 480 00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:19,119 Speaker 1: a catastrophic injury. But if you have flail chess, which 481 00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:23,440 Speaker 1: means bilateral broken ribs and maybe a skull fracture, that's catastrophic. Okay, 482 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:25,760 Speaker 1: that's going to be incompatible with life more than likely. 483 00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:29,280 Speaker 1: So now you know they're throwing this turn around about 484 00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:32,480 Speaker 1: Liam Payne and to this date, first off, they have 485 00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:35,479 Speaker 1: yet to release his body. They've told his dad that 486 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:38,480 Speaker 1: it could take up to ten days from the end 487 00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:41,200 Speaker 1: of the actual initial autopsy till the body is going 488 00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:41,800 Speaker 1: to be released. 489 00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:43,600 Speaker 2: They still need to take so long. 490 00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:46,320 Speaker 1: That was one of the big questions I have because 491 00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:49,400 Speaker 1: when we do autopsies, this is the way it happens. 492 00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:53,280 Speaker 1: We do the external examination, which includes X rays, so 493 00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:57,160 Speaker 1: we capture all of that, we photograph everything. Then once 494 00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,600 Speaker 1: we get to close off we're going to draw fluids. Okay, 495 00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:03,520 Speaker 1: We'll draw a fluid from the eye, which is vitreous fluid. 496 00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:09,240 Speaker 1: It's very thick in viscous and I often compare vitreous 497 00:29:09,240 --> 00:29:12,440 Speaker 1: fluid to like reading the rings on a tree. You 498 00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:15,800 Speaker 1: can't necessarily be very specific from a quantitative or a 499 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:20,560 Speaker 1: number standpoint, but you can look back almost historically to 500 00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:23,760 Speaker 1: see what this individual has been involved in. Because the 501 00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:30,200 Speaker 1: fluid in your eye, it does not circulate like blood does, okay, 502 00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:32,880 Speaker 1: so it will hold on to some of these residual factors. 503 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 1: Of course, we draw urine, we draw blood, we draw 504 00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:40,040 Speaker 1: bile from the liver, and once those are captured, then 505 00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:43,520 Speaker 1: we do the autopsy. We remove the organs way the morgans, 506 00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:47,040 Speaker 1: examine the organs, you know, and take sections of them, 507 00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:49,440 Speaker 1: which is also something that you're looking for and what 508 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:55,480 Speaker 1: you suspect might be a drug related death. But you've 509 00:29:55,520 --> 00:29:58,600 Speaker 1: got another element here, Dave, you talked about this three 510 00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:02,080 Speaker 1: he went over a balcony and it's a three story fall. Well, 511 00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:04,920 Speaker 1: I found out the number, the height number, because you 512 00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:09,240 Speaker 1: generally think in our mind, we think, okay, one story 513 00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:13,960 Speaker 1: is equal to essentially ten feet. So if you think 514 00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:17,760 Speaker 1: of a standard room Florida ceiling. You're talking about maybe 515 00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:22,840 Speaker 1: ten feet in height. Okay, give or take all. Right, dude, 516 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,440 Speaker 1: this is a three story fall. It's a forty five 517 00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:30,640 Speaker 1: foot fall. Forty five Wow, more than thirty I was thinking. Yeah, 518 00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:33,440 Speaker 1: I thought thirty two as well. And one of the 519 00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:36,200 Speaker 1: things you might not be aware of relative to a fall, 520 00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:39,840 Speaker 1: it's not just the falling, it's also the surface that 521 00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:42,920 Speaker 1: you're going to impact. Sounds kind of obvious, but a 522 00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:44,960 Speaker 1: lot of people don't think about this. You know, I've 523 00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:50,080 Speaker 1: had I've had people that had shoot failures with parachutes 524 00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:54,320 Speaker 1: where they kind of spun in and they landed in 525 00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:58,320 Speaker 1: kind of turned loamy earth, if you will, where a 526 00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:02,160 Speaker 1: field had been plowed. They didn't actually have a lot 527 00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:05,840 Speaker 1: of external visual injuries. There was a point of impact, 528 00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:11,400 Speaker 1: but their insights were just torn to pieces. You had 529 00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:14,760 Speaker 1: multiple fractures, these sorts of things. Whereas I've had people 530 00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:18,000 Speaker 1: that have fallen from one story and landed on a rock, 531 00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:24,120 Speaker 1: like maybe a deciduous boulder down below, and you bet 532 00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:28,080 Speaker 1: they've got external injuries. But Dave, here's the thing. They're 533 00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:35,120 Speaker 1: saying that Liam had close to twenty five injuries to 534 00:31:35,240 --> 00:31:39,520 Speaker 1: his body mark twenty five twenty five. Yeah, that's the number. 535 00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:41,920 Speaker 1: It's been thrown around for twenty four and twenty five. 536 00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:45,400 Speaker 1: And so I got to tell you, brother, one of 537 00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:49,760 Speaker 1: the problems I have if somebody says this is it's 538 00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 1: kind of like if you have a kid or a 539 00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:56,280 Speaker 1: child where the parents are being investigated for child abuse 540 00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:00,000 Speaker 1: and they bring this kid if their doctor shopping, for instance, 541 00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:03,520 Speaker 1: which abusers do, they will bring the child into the 542 00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:07,000 Speaker 1: hospital said yeah, my child's arm is hanging inside and. 543 00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:07,680 Speaker 2: He won't move it. 544 00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:12,560 Speaker 1: He did take a fall, and automatically the hospital staff 545 00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:15,040 Speaker 1: doesn't think child abuse. They look at the arm and 546 00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:17,000 Speaker 1: they say, well, we're going to assess it, take an 547 00:32:17,160 --> 00:32:19,800 Speaker 1: X ray. Yeah, he's got a greensick fracture or the 548 00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:22,880 Speaker 1: collarbone fracture or whatever it is. It's causing to hang down, 549 00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:25,920 Speaker 1: which you don't expect because dad said that's from the fall. 550 00:32:26,080 --> 00:32:27,680 Speaker 1: You get to look at the rest of the kid's 551 00:32:27,760 --> 00:32:30,720 Speaker 1: body and they got resolving injuries all over them. They've 552 00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:34,120 Speaker 1: got bruises, they've got abrasions, and they're all in different ages. 553 00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:38,000 Speaker 1: So if you're talking to me and you're trying to 554 00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:42,040 Speaker 1: tell me the sky falls out off of a balcony impacts. 555 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,840 Speaker 1: What I think is probably either it's on a patio 556 00:32:44,920 --> 00:32:48,160 Speaker 1: or a courtyard area. There's a high probability. I guess 557 00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:51,520 Speaker 1: it could have been a ceramic tile, or maybe a 558 00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:54,640 Speaker 1: brick brick area, or maybe he landed in a flower bed. 559 00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:57,320 Speaker 1: But we know it's a forty five foot fall. How 560 00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:00,600 Speaker 1: do you account for all these other injuries. We expect 561 00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:04,320 Speaker 1: to have an injury where you impact, and I don't 562 00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:07,280 Speaker 1: know that he passed through like limbs or something like this. 563 00:33:07,600 --> 00:33:09,240 Speaker 1: It just doesn't make sense to me. 564 00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:12,520 Speaker 3: Not the photos I've seen. I was looking for photos 565 00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:16,200 Speaker 3: of the hotel. I was looking for pictures of news too, 566 00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:19,840 Speaker 3: you know, because there have been reports that TMZ briefly 567 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:23,560 Speaker 3: published a picture of his dead body, and at the 568 00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:27,240 Speaker 3: height of distaste, they did pull it down finally apparently. 569 00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:30,800 Speaker 3: I'm saying apparently because I haven't confirmed. I haven't found 570 00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:33,400 Speaker 3: that picture. I just have read the commentary about it. 571 00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:36,800 Speaker 3: Washington posted a story about TMZ posting a picture. But 572 00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:41,040 Speaker 3: there is a picture that is being posted of his father, Jeff, 573 00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:44,520 Speaker 3: Liam Payne's father Jeff, at the hotel room in Buenos 574 00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:48,360 Speaker 3: Aires and looking out the balcony over the railing and 575 00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:51,560 Speaker 3: looking down and that's it looked like it was towards 576 00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:53,920 Speaker 3: a you mentioned a patio type area or towards the 577 00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:57,000 Speaker 3: pool area, an area that would be that type of cement, 578 00:33:57,400 --> 00:33:59,400 Speaker 3: not tree branches and things to fall through that you 579 00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:02,560 Speaker 3: could have land into Rambo through the woods. I can't 580 00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:04,880 Speaker 3: believe there were that many injuries, but I will tell 581 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:09,480 Speaker 3: you that there was some warning. One of the people 582 00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:16,040 Speaker 3: working in the hotel actually told investigators they were concerned 583 00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:22,480 Speaker 3: about this guest in the hotel who was acting out 584 00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:26,759 Speaker 3: apparently under the influence of something, not saying anything specifically 585 00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:30,279 Speaker 3: saying somebody under the influence of alcohol or drugs was 586 00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:34,040 Speaker 3: acting in a way that made them concerned about the balcony. 587 00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:38,560 Speaker 3: And actually the quote from the worker was, we need 588 00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:41,600 Speaker 3: to send someone with urgency because I don't know if 589 00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:44,080 Speaker 3: the guest life is in danger because he is in 590 00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:46,560 Speaker 3: a room with a balcony, and we were afraid he 591 00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:48,200 Speaker 3: could do something that threatens life. 592 00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:53,080 Speaker 1: And really insightful on that person's part. I wonder if 593 00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:56,359 Speaker 1: that individual, like when they did that assessment, I'm wondering 594 00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:59,440 Speaker 1: if they actually had eyes on or ears on they 595 00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:02,560 Speaker 1: hurt something through the door they're knocking on the door. 596 00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:04,839 Speaker 2: Maybe you know, the. 597 00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:09,160 Speaker 1: Person responds with slurred speech or they start cursing them 598 00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:13,160 Speaker 1: or something like this. What gives them this idea that 599 00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:17,160 Speaker 1: he might be a danger to himself or others, or 600 00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:20,400 Speaker 1: you know, whatever the case might be. I have heard 601 00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:24,440 Speaker 1: and this is kind of interesting again going back to 602 00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:27,479 Speaker 1: the model of the sixties rocker that tears the room 603 00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:33,200 Speaker 1: to pieces. The room was disrupted. Okay, there were things broken, 604 00:35:33,239 --> 00:35:35,920 Speaker 1: bits that were around there being very kind of coy 605 00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:38,520 Speaker 1: about that at this point in time, but the room 606 00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:42,240 Speaker 1: to a certain degree was disheveled. There were things knocked about. 607 00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:48,480 Speaker 1: So I'm wondering if these injuries that he has allegedly sustained, 608 00:35:48,520 --> 00:35:51,239 Speaker 1: if any of those can be married up would say 609 00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:55,040 Speaker 1: a broken piece of glass, because they're not being specific 610 00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:57,400 Speaker 1: about the nature of the injuries. Did he cut himself 611 00:35:57,440 --> 00:35:59,360 Speaker 1: after he broke something in the room? Did he punch 612 00:35:59,360 --> 00:36:03,440 Speaker 1: a wall? Is a sheet rock knocked out in certain spots? 613 00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:06,160 Speaker 1: Has he flipped anything over that could have caused him 614 00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:09,080 Speaker 1: to bruise an arm or a leg? And how old 615 00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:11,640 Speaker 1: are these injuries? You know, when we're doing these assessments 616 00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:13,000 Speaker 1: like this, I want to know if the guy is 617 00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:16,920 Speaker 1: bumping into furniture regularly, and we can grade bruises, we 618 00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:19,280 Speaker 1: can go through the color scheme that they all go through. 619 00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:24,480 Speaker 1: So we have so many questions relative to what went 620 00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:28,480 Speaker 1: on just prior to his death. But I think probably 621 00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:32,160 Speaker 1: the most insidious thing that's being floated about Dave. 622 00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:32,960 Speaker 2: Is that. 623 00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:37,680 Speaker 1: It is being alleged that perhaps one of the workers 624 00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:45,600 Speaker 1: in the hotel had supplied Liam with drugs. And I 625 00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:49,440 Speaker 1: think that they're probably going to be barking up that 626 00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:51,040 Speaker 1: tree the authorities, will. 627 00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:53,799 Speaker 3: You know, you mentioned his room and one of the 628 00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:56,239 Speaker 3: pictures that I've seen from his room is of the 629 00:36:56,320 --> 00:36:59,440 Speaker 3: TV that has been bashed right in the middle. It 630 00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:02,040 Speaker 3: looks like a went into that one or an elbow. 631 00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:05,680 Speaker 3: There is a coffee table that has a lot of 632 00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:10,840 Speaker 3: drug paraphernalia out on it. Tenfoil, white powdery substance, wax 633 00:37:10,920 --> 00:37:13,080 Speaker 3: from a candle which you would use if you were 634 00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:15,920 Speaker 3: burning down a substance so you could inject it. A 635 00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:18,400 Speaker 3: lot of tenfoil, a lot of plastic baggies that often 636 00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:20,879 Speaker 3: is a sign of cocaine or something being wrapped in that. 637 00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:24,520 Speaker 3: And they're saying that a drug, A dove dove soap, 638 00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:26,960 Speaker 3: you know, the little box box that was used to 639 00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:30,680 Speaker 3: transport the drugs by a hotel worker to the room. 640 00:37:31,120 --> 00:37:34,680 Speaker 3: I will tell you this, I know we were As people, 641 00:37:34,719 --> 00:37:37,360 Speaker 3: we have to place blame when we have to assign 642 00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:41,080 Speaker 3: blame when something happens because the person we care about 643 00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:44,040 Speaker 3: and we spent money on or whatever. We don't want 644 00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:46,040 Speaker 3: to see their failures in life. We don't want to 645 00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:48,600 Speaker 3: think it was just them that they made this decision. 646 00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:54,520 Speaker 3: But in reality, Joe, alcoholics and addicts, they know, drug 647 00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:57,120 Speaker 3: addicts nowhere to get the drugs, and in the world 648 00:37:57,160 --> 00:38:01,280 Speaker 3: they live in, it's around them. Drug people surround themselves 649 00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:06,040 Speaker 3: with other drug people. It happens in every walk of life. 650 00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:08,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that even if you worked in a 651 00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:12,000 Speaker 1: law in a law office, you know, you can have 652 00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:15,719 Speaker 1: acts you could work at I don't know, a police department. 653 00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:16,239 Speaker 2: Yep. 654 00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:19,160 Speaker 1: Perhap happens all the time. Yeah, it does, It really does. 655 00:38:19,239 --> 00:38:22,480 Speaker 1: So they know what it likes. Yeah, they certainly do. 656 00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:23,400 Speaker 3: Uh. 657 00:38:23,440 --> 00:38:25,880 Speaker 1: And so you never know what the sourcing of this 658 00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:28,279 Speaker 1: is going to be. But I think that from an 659 00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:31,880 Speaker 1: investigative standpoint, this has got to be pursued. And really 660 00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:34,080 Speaker 1: they have to look at this long and hard because 661 00:38:34,680 --> 00:38:39,880 Speaker 1: just and I'm just saying from a cold perspective, Uh, 662 00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:42,719 Speaker 1: looking at this as an investigator, I would want to 663 00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:46,239 Speaker 1: know who this person was, how many times have they 664 00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:49,799 Speaker 1: interacted with you. My understanding is that all the CCTV 665 00:38:49,880 --> 00:38:51,439 Speaker 1: stuff has been pulled at this point. 666 00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:53,800 Speaker 2: I bet yeah. 667 00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:57,799 Speaker 1: And I don't know, like if we were to give 668 00:38:58,280 --> 00:39:01,719 Speaker 1: a star rating on this hotel, I don't know if 669 00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:04,319 Speaker 1: it's like a bottom of the barrel place or if 670 00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:07,400 Speaker 1: it's a nicer, upscale place where people with money and 671 00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:10,200 Speaker 1: celebrity might go. Where you're going to have to act 672 00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:12,400 Speaker 1: it the only way you know nowadays, even in the 673 00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:15,680 Speaker 1: lower end hotels, in order to access your floor in 674 00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:18,879 Speaker 1: an elevator, not only you don't just push the button, 675 00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:20,840 Speaker 1: you have to have your card key and you tap 676 00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:22,680 Speaker 1: it and then you press the button to go to 677 00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:25,640 Speaker 1: the floor that your room is on. So they're going 678 00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:29,160 Speaker 1: to have CCTV of everybody that was coming and going 679 00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:33,680 Speaker 1: in that hallway. And to that point, I'm interested in 680 00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:37,960 Speaker 1: who made this call where they're worried about this individual. 681 00:39:38,080 --> 00:39:41,520 Speaker 1: And remember we had mentioned earlier or you had specifically 682 00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:45,719 Speaker 1: that this could be at the hand of an employee 683 00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:49,360 Speaker 1: of the hotel. You know, was that the individual that 684 00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:52,200 Speaker 1: actually called it in that was also dealing them drugs. 685 00:39:52,239 --> 00:39:53,800 Speaker 1: I have no idea, Dave. 686 00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:56,040 Speaker 3: I know, and that's the part that will come out, 687 00:39:56,200 --> 00:39:58,960 Speaker 3: you know, we'll find out. I was really curious when 688 00:39:59,000 --> 00:40:01,080 Speaker 3: you mentioned the number of ends that he had and 689 00:40:01,120 --> 00:40:04,959 Speaker 3: I'm thinking, Okay, a third floor balcony. They're concerned about 690 00:40:04,960 --> 00:40:08,320 Speaker 3: it because the guy is acting in a way that's 691 00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:10,839 Speaker 3: making him unsafe to be at a place that has 692 00:40:10,840 --> 00:40:15,520 Speaker 3: a balcony. And I guess, I'm I'm concerned about how 693 00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:17,000 Speaker 3: do you get twenty five injuries. I guess if we 694 00:40:17,080 --> 00:40:19,560 Speaker 3: fall face first, head first. Because the one thing that 695 00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:22,560 Speaker 3: I did find out from and I'm verifying this by 696 00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:26,080 Speaker 3: the way, you know, because people can claim to be anything. 697 00:40:26,120 --> 00:40:28,000 Speaker 3: I oh, I was the paramedic who was on the scene, 698 00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:31,480 Speaker 3: and it gets reported. Well, this is actually all verified 699 00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:37,360 Speaker 3: through the actual national news in Argentina and the Minister 700 00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:41,520 Speaker 3: of Communications that is issuing they're issuing statements on this 701 00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:46,080 Speaker 3: just to prevent it from spiraling out of control. Pablo 702 00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:50,320 Speaker 3: Policio is their communications director for the Buenos Area Security Ministry. 703 00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:55,080 Speaker 3: That's where he's He actually said Wednesday that Liam Payne 704 00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:59,279 Speaker 3: jumped from the balcony of his room they received a 705 00:40:59,320 --> 00:41:01,720 Speaker 3: nine one one call around five o'clock about a quote 706 00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:04,440 Speaker 3: aggressive man who could be under the influence of drugs 707 00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:08,200 Speaker 3: or alcohol. His body was found on the ground floor 708 00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:10,680 Speaker 3: with a bottle of whiskey, a lighter, and a cell phone. 709 00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:16,120 Speaker 3: One of the other things was that when medics arrived 710 00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:19,840 Speaker 3: on the scene, Joe the top medics said, based on 711 00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:24,360 Speaker 3: what the team saw, there was apparently a cranial fracture 712 00:41:24,600 --> 00:41:31,600 Speaker 3: and extremely serious injuries that led to his immediate death. Yeah, 713 00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:34,320 Speaker 3: that you're incompatible with life. That they got there and 714 00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:35,359 Speaker 3: saw his. 715 00:41:35,400 --> 00:41:38,880 Speaker 1: Head immediately, and lots of times with fractured skulls. One 716 00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:42,520 Speaker 1: of the things that you'll see, well, let's just say 717 00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:47,640 Speaker 1: that we're absent this kind of compound fracture where the 718 00:41:47,680 --> 00:41:50,239 Speaker 1: bone will actually rip through skin and you'll see it 719 00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:54,279 Speaker 1: visibly lots of times when you have skull fractures. I'm 720 00:41:54,280 --> 00:41:57,319 Speaker 1: not trying to be disrespectful, but this is literally how 721 00:41:57,320 --> 00:42:01,320 Speaker 1: it looks. You'll see, first off, if there's a certain 722 00:42:01,360 --> 00:42:03,880 Speaker 1: asymmetry to the head, Like if you're looking at a 723 00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:06,040 Speaker 1: person that's got a severe skull fracture and you look 724 00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:09,880 Speaker 1: at their face dead on, the head will actually be 725 00:42:10,040 --> 00:42:14,440 Speaker 1: skewed slightly, like one eye will literally be lower than 726 00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:17,080 Speaker 1: the other, particularly if you've got one of these really 727 00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:20,360 Speaker 1: high velocity kind of events that occurs like this, you 728 00:42:20,400 --> 00:42:22,480 Speaker 1: see what gunshot wants to the head as well. So 729 00:42:22,840 --> 00:42:26,799 Speaker 1: the architecture of the skull that I don't think that 730 00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:30,719 Speaker 1: people fully appreciate the foundation of it many times, how 731 00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:33,040 Speaker 1: it sets you up, how you appear to other people, 732 00:42:33,120 --> 00:42:35,720 Speaker 1: and this sort of thing. It'll be greatly skewed many times, 733 00:42:35,960 --> 00:42:38,920 Speaker 1: so they would have seen that. But another way that 734 00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:41,120 Speaker 1: you can kind of assess that is that you check 735 00:42:41,160 --> 00:42:44,279 Speaker 1: the ears. Now people say look for spinal fluid, the 736 00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:47,479 Speaker 1: clear fluid. Yeah, you'll see the clear fluid, but it'll 737 00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:50,359 Speaker 1: also be commealed with blood as well, So you've got 738 00:42:50,680 --> 00:42:54,120 Speaker 1: blood coming out of the ears. And just because somebody 739 00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:56,239 Speaker 1: impacts on the ground, and let me tell you this 740 00:42:56,440 --> 00:42:59,759 Speaker 1: as well, just because somebody impacts with the ground doesn't 741 00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:01,520 Speaker 1: mean die instantaneously. 742 00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:02,520 Speaker 2: Okay. 743 00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:05,240 Speaker 1: I think a lot of people labor under that idea. 744 00:43:05,560 --> 00:43:09,120 Speaker 1: I'm not saying that they would be conscious, but you 745 00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:12,600 Speaker 1: can have these catastrophic events where you will still have 746 00:43:12,680 --> 00:43:16,600 Speaker 1: this individual that is lingering, you know, after the fact, 747 00:43:18,640 --> 00:43:22,480 Speaker 1: and look EMT's they're the best sources of information, and 748 00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:24,560 Speaker 1: you're right, people can claim that they were the first 749 00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:28,400 Speaker 1: people there. We don't know, but they will have eyes 750 00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:30,839 Speaker 1: on at a scene to be able to make this 751 00:43:30,960 --> 00:43:35,439 Speaker 1: assessment pretty readily, you know, relative to what was going 752 00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:38,319 Speaker 1: on with him and the condition of his body, you know, 753 00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:41,759 Speaker 1: when they're observing it. And here's something fascinating to me. 754 00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:45,160 Speaker 1: I want to know if this was a witnessed event, 755 00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:49,720 Speaker 1: if somebody actually saw him go over the balcony, watch 756 00:43:49,800 --> 00:43:51,640 Speaker 1: him all the way down to the ground, saw him 757 00:43:51,640 --> 00:43:54,160 Speaker 1: strike the ground, or if this is kind of an 758 00:43:54,200 --> 00:43:56,239 Speaker 1: after the fact where they walk out and they look 759 00:43:56,280 --> 00:43:58,200 Speaker 1: down and say, oh my gosh, there's a man laying 760 00:43:58,200 --> 00:44:00,440 Speaker 1: in the courtyard and he is dead. He's got a 761 00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:03,000 Speaker 1: lighter lay in there, his bottle of booze or whatever 762 00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:06,160 Speaker 1: else that he's got there with him. I think that's 763 00:44:06,680 --> 00:44:10,120 Speaker 1: that's kind of intriguing as well in a case like this, Dave. 764 00:44:11,080 --> 00:44:13,800 Speaker 3: I need I just kind of went on the assumption 765 00:44:14,040 --> 00:44:16,160 Speaker 3: based on the reporting and everything else. You know that, 766 00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:20,080 Speaker 3: But you're right, You're absolutely right, Joe. We need to 767 00:44:20,120 --> 00:44:25,520 Speaker 3: know that they've I think the media has done what 768 00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:29,120 Speaker 3: they do. They report the story as it evolves. You 769 00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:31,600 Speaker 3: know from the very first stories that you get, and 770 00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:33,880 Speaker 3: that's why it's a it's been. 771 00:44:33,760 --> 00:44:34,560 Speaker 2: Such a huge story. 772 00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:38,840 Speaker 3: But I will tell you this, if you've ever ever 773 00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:43,520 Speaker 3: had a thought of harming yourself suicide, if your alcoholism, 774 00:44:43,560 --> 00:44:46,000 Speaker 3: drug addiction, whatever it is, there is a hotline for 775 00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:49,800 Speaker 3: if you have and it's nine eight eight. Those three numbers. 776 00:44:49,880 --> 00:44:51,840 Speaker 3: Nine eight eight is a suicide number if you have 777 00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:54,319 Speaker 3: ever felt like that. And I will tell you this 778 00:44:54,360 --> 00:44:56,560 Speaker 3: with regard to alcohol. And I'm only saying this because 779 00:44:58,320 --> 00:45:02,680 Speaker 3: Liam Payne talked about it openly. Yeah, And I will 780 00:45:02,719 --> 00:45:07,560 Speaker 3: tell you I reading it, I understand it, and my 781 00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:11,799 Speaker 3: heart hurts for him. I also have I understand it, 782 00:45:12,040 --> 00:45:13,279 Speaker 3: and I will tell you. I can tell you I 783 00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:14,800 Speaker 3: was at an AA meeting. I can't tell you anybody 784 00:45:14,840 --> 00:45:17,040 Speaker 3: else was there. And I will tell you that when 785 00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:20,040 Speaker 3: you decide that it's time, there's an eight hundred number 786 00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:22,480 Speaker 3: you can call. You can look up AA anywhere you know. 787 00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:26,080 Speaker 3: You just AA. You'll find Alcoholics Anonymous if you want 788 00:45:26,120 --> 00:45:27,560 Speaker 3: to find it. You know there is a number, and 789 00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:30,680 Speaker 3: it's eight hundred nine three four nine five one A. 790 00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:33,239 Speaker 3: You can go back on the podcast and get this 791 00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:36,160 Speaker 3: and we'll put it in the body. But I will 792 00:45:36,200 --> 00:45:41,400 Speaker 3: tell you there's no shame in seeking help. And I 793 00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:44,879 Speaker 3: will tell you that alcoholism, drug addiction will will leave 794 00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:49,320 Speaker 3: you in jail or dead, the only two things that happened. 795 00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:51,400 Speaker 3: And it just hurts my heart that a thirty one 796 00:45:51,480 --> 00:45:55,319 Speaker 3: year old man who tried to get help was not 797 00:45:55,400 --> 00:45:58,120 Speaker 3: able to find what he was looking for. 798 00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:06,279 Speaker 1: No, he was, And you wonder about what circumstances had 799 00:46:06,360 --> 00:46:08,480 Speaker 1: led up to this. I think that may have been 800 00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:11,280 Speaker 1: the trigger. But there's kind of this insidious, lurking monster 801 00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:15,120 Speaker 1: that's out there that's always right beneath the surface for 802 00:46:15,360 --> 00:46:19,440 Speaker 1: people that are suffering with addiction. And sometimes all it 803 00:46:19,480 --> 00:46:23,439 Speaker 1: takes is one person to turn their back or one 804 00:46:23,440 --> 00:46:26,360 Speaker 1: person to at least appear that they don't care anymore. 805 00:46:26,680 --> 00:46:30,400 Speaker 1: But you know what, for every circumstance like that, there's 806 00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:33,680 Speaker 1: always one person out there that might be willing to 807 00:46:33,680 --> 00:46:37,120 Speaker 1: help you. And Dave said it right. You can check 808 00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:43,080 Speaker 1: into AA or particularly if you're having thoughts of injuring yourself. Please, 809 00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:50,680 Speaker 1: I implore you dial nine eight eight. I'm Joseph Scott 810 00:46:50,760 --> 00:46:53,720 Speaker 1: Morgan and this is Bodybacks