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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, a weekly

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Speaker 1: conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the small

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Speaker 1: decisions we can make to become the best possible versions

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Speaker 1: of ourselves. I'm your host, Dr joy hard and Bradford,

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Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or

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Speaker 1: to find a therapist, visit our website at Therapy for

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Speaker 1: Black Girls dot com. And while I hope you love

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Speaker 1: listening to and learning from the podcast, it is not

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Speaker 1: meant to be a substitute for a relationship with a

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Speaker 1: licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much for

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Speaker 1: joining me for session ninety eight of the Therapy for

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Speaker 1: Black Girls Podcast. A few weeks ago, on session two,

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Speaker 1: you heard my conversation with Melissa Eiffel, who shared incredible

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Speaker 1: information about living your life to bipolar disorder. Well, this week,

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Speaker 1: Melissa is back because she felt like there was something

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Speaker 1: else she really wanted to make sure she shared. And

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Speaker 1: that's tips for how to show up when you really

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Speaker 1: just want to sit down. We find ourselves in the

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Speaker 1: same patterns over and over and over again when we

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Speaker 1: have life lessons to learn that we haven't really mastered.

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Speaker 1: And so if you're engaged in patterns, whether it's the people,

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Speaker 1: or the things or the outcomes, then it's a good

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Speaker 1: sign for you to pick a step back and to

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Speaker 1: pay attention to what's happening around you. But before we

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Speaker 1: get into that conversation, I want to show some love

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Speaker 1: dot com. And let's get into our conversation with Melissa.

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Speaker 1: As a reminder, Melissa Eiffel is a licensed clinical social

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Speaker 1: worker in both New York and Maryland and has twenty

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Speaker 1: years experience working with communities of color in various capacities.

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Speaker 1: Melissa is passionate about her work with young adults, especially

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Speaker 1: women of color with the history of trauma and those

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Speaker 1: who are in transition, seeking to learn how to manage

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Speaker 1: their emotions, have better relationships, and take their life to

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Speaker 1: the next level. In this conversation, Melissa shares the fourth

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Speaker 1: steps she uses with her clients to help them show

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Speaker 1: up during the difficult times we all face. How you

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Speaker 1: know when it's time to push through versus take a

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Speaker 1: step back, and of course she shared more of her

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Speaker 1: favorite resources. While you're listening to the episode, make sure

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Speaker 1: to let us know what you think by sharing your

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Speaker 1: thoughts with us on social media using the hashtag a

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Speaker 1: b G in Session. Here's our conversation. Thank you so

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Speaker 1: much for joining us again. To Dave, Melissa, Oh absolutely.

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Speaker 1: You know I told you I'm open to come back,

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Speaker 1: and I'll just bring myself back here whenever I feel

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Speaker 1: like it's whenever you just want to chat about something

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Speaker 1: else that you think is important, yestely. So I'm excited

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Speaker 1: to have you back. Melissa up. You know, we've got

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Speaker 1: great response. I'm sure that you have gotten lots of

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Speaker 1: comments and messages after your episode talking about life with

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Speaker 1: the bipolar disorder. You know, it was a very hot

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Speaker 1: topic and lots of people really appreciate it what you

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Speaker 1: had to share, and so I'm glad that you could

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Speaker 1: join us again today to talk more about like how

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Speaker 1: you continue to show up even when it feels very difficult. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I found that and you know, just personal experience in

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Speaker 1: recent months and the work that I'm doing with my

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Speaker 1: clients that this is something that you know, people really

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Speaker 1: struggle with and so I just thought that, you know,

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Speaker 1: talking about it would be timely for a lot of

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Speaker 1: things that I see happening without population that I saw this. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so can you talk to us more about like where

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Speaker 1: would you even start? You know, like let's say somebody

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Speaker 1: struggling with something really big and they just you know,

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Speaker 1: don't even know, like how do I even pull my

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Speaker 1: life back together at this point? What kinds of things are?

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Speaker 1: Where would they may maybe even start with trying to

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Speaker 1: you know, put one ft in front of the other.

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Speaker 1: So you know, here's the thing I actually came up with,

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Speaker 1: like a cute little acronym, or at least I think

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Speaker 1: it's cute acronym. Yes, love a good acronym, and it's

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Speaker 1: packed P A C T. So I like to think

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Speaker 1: of it as like make a pact with yourself for

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Speaker 1: your healing, right, And so the first point is always

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Speaker 1: to have a plan. You know, a lot of times

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Speaker 1: we wait until something has happened in our life or

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Speaker 1: until we're feeling a certain type of way to sort

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Speaker 1: of like start thinking about like what should I do here?

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Speaker 1: But in the middle of a crisis or in the

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Speaker 1: middle of having an emotional moment is not always the

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Speaker 1: best time to sort of try and think about what

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Speaker 1: you need to be doing to feel better. If you

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Speaker 1: invested time and just getting to know yourself on an

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Speaker 1: everyday basis, right, knowing the things that you know bring

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Speaker 1: you joy, like knowing you know the things that are

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Speaker 1: triggers for you, like knowing like the things that you

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Speaker 1: respond best too. If you invest a lot of pre

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Speaker 1: work into developing your life that way, that it gives

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Speaker 1: you the ability to develop a self care plan that

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Speaker 1: will really help you during tough times. I'm really glad

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Speaker 1: you said that, Melissa, because I do think a lot

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Speaker 1: of time. You know, even there's the misconception that therapy

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Speaker 1: is only for like the crisis times, right, Um, so

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Speaker 1: you know when I hit red level red, then that's

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Speaker 1: the time I need to call a therapist. And what

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Speaker 1: you're really talking about is all of the things you

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Speaker 1: could be doing ahead of a crisis to maybe even

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Speaker 1: prevent a crisis from happening. Yeah, definitely. You know what

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Speaker 1: was interesting to me is if I recently read an

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Speaker 1: article and I can't even really think about where I

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Speaker 1: saw it, but it was talking about the fact that

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Speaker 1: they did this study about people who had attempted to aside,

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Speaker 1: and they interviewed them and something like fifty percent of

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Speaker 1: those people had no history of depression. They had no

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Speaker 1: history of having a suicidal thought. It was just something

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Speaker 1: that was impulsive because they were dealing with something in

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Speaker 1: the moment and they didn't know what to do. And

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Speaker 1: so we tend to create plans, you know, when we

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Speaker 1: have these past experiences or if we feel like we

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Speaker 1: anticipate that, you know, something might be happening, even if

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Speaker 1: we have the wherewithal to do it then. But what

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Speaker 1: we know is we get older, is life will always

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Speaker 1: be life. There will be something difficult that will happen

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Speaker 1: at some point in life. There is never this point

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Speaker 1: that you get to where life is just gonna cold,

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Speaker 1: at least not for most of us. So to understand

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Speaker 1: yourself and to you know, be so connected with yourself

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Speaker 1: that you know what your triggers are and you know

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Speaker 1: what are the best like interventions or tools to use

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Speaker 1: during certain moments. It's the best way to assist yourself

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Speaker 1: and recovery when life shows up, not if it shows up,

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Speaker 1: but like when it shows up. Okay, So you're encouraging

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Speaker 1: people to go ahead and him a plan, and we

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Speaker 1: talked about this on the podcast before, like a self

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Speaker 1: care plan for how you're regularly taking care of yourself,

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Speaker 1: and you're saying that that can be a really important

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Speaker 1: part of helping you to manage any life stuff that

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Speaker 1: will of course show up. Yes, absolutely got you. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So that's the pea. Yes, yes, that's the peak. That's

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Speaker 1: the peace. Now. The A is for acknowledge. The other

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Speaker 1: thing that I know for most of us is we

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Speaker 1: don't like to feel pain. You know. Pain is that

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Speaker 1: thing that you know, everybody is trying to escape, feel

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Speaker 1: like if we're hurting, then it's something wrong with us.

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Speaker 1: But taking the time to acknowledge your pain and to

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Speaker 1: really get curious about your pain and you know, see

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Speaker 1: it as a clue for something that you really want

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Speaker 1: to work on or shift or change, gives you the

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Speaker 1: opportunity to not try to push your feelings aside, but

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Speaker 1: to do some work around what it is that is

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Speaker 1: bothering you and to develop a sense of self or

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Speaker 1: a life path that will also prevent these things from

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Speaker 1: happening again. So I have found in my work, Melissa,

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Speaker 1: that that is really incredibly difficult for clients to do

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Speaker 1: like this whole idea of like sitting with the pain

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Speaker 1: and getting curious, because that's not something that you know,

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Speaker 1: we're like typically taught. And it feels very uncomfortable. So

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Speaker 1: how would you encourage people, like, what do they need

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Speaker 1: to do to even start trying to sit with things? Oh,

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Speaker 1: I think that's a good question. So I think getting

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Speaker 1: comfortable with this comfort is the first thing that I

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Speaker 1: always encourage people to do. So, Yes, sitting with pain

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Speaker 1: is uncomfortable. It feels crappy. We want to push it aside,

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Speaker 1: and I just think that from a societal perspective, we

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Speaker 1: are well trained to not want to be uncomfortable. But

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Speaker 1: if you look at the pain from a perspective of

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Speaker 1: this is telling me something and you can see that. Okay,

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Speaker 1: if I can set aside time to engage in it.

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Speaker 1: I mean, obviously, you don't want to sit in it

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Speaker 1: all day, right, you don't want to constantly be in,

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Speaker 1: you know, engaging with your pain point all day. But

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Speaker 1: if you can set aside time and safe space to

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Speaker 1: be able to engage in the feeling, then you can

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Speaker 1: actually come out on the other side of it. See

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Speaker 1: what happens when we try to push off this feeling

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Speaker 1: of pain is we often dell other emotions and we

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Speaker 1: miss out on joy, you know, happiness, love, because those

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Speaker 1: things require a certain amount of vulnerability that will bring

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Speaker 1: you pain as well. So the more you can practice

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Speaker 1: getting comfortable with being uncomfortable, you know, sometimes then it

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Speaker 1: will give you the opportunity, like when you have difficult

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Speaker 1: times to engage with your pain point, like even if

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Speaker 1: it's for just short birth of time throughout the course

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Speaker 1: of a day or weak. Yeah, and I often think

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Speaker 1: about it, you know, like let's say you get a headache, right,

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Speaker 1: Like you might grab some tolennel, but you know, to

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Speaker 1: make the pain go away, but you also want to

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Speaker 1: examine like, Okay, is there something that may be going

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Speaker 1: on that is giving me the headache? You know, and

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Speaker 1: I not drinking enough water? You know, like what kinds

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Speaker 1: of things may be going on? And it feels like

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Speaker 1: that could be similar for mental health, right that you

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Speaker 1: may use some of these coping strategies right to try

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Speaker 1: to help minimize the pain, but you also want to

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Speaker 1: sit with it to see, Okay, where is this pain

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Speaker 1: coming from? Right? Definitely, because you might grab tolenel or

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Speaker 1: you might grab something for a headache, but you know,

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Speaker 1: if you're not paying attention to where the pain is

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Speaker 1: actually coming from, maybe it's radiating down your neck or

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Speaker 1: your arm right, So it's the same sort of concept. Absolutely.

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Speaker 1: If you don't take the time to identify what it

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Speaker 1: is that you're feeling, then you might be trying to

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Speaker 1: like number feeling, but that's not actually the thing that

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Speaker 1: you need to be paying attention to. I think the

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Speaker 1: other piece of acknowledging how you feel as well, now

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Speaker 1: that you bring that up, is that we often label

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Speaker 1: emotions based on the emotions that were most familiar with.

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Speaker 1: So if you tend to feel anger, or you allow

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Speaker 1: yourself to feel anger, or if that's the emotion that

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Speaker 1: sort of bubbles up to the surface all the time,

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Speaker 1: then you may label whatever you're experiencing as anger, and

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Speaker 1: then you may address the situation as such. But if

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Speaker 1: you really get curious as to why you're feeling what

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Speaker 1: you're feeling, maybe it's not anger, you know, maybe it

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Speaker 1: is disappointment, frustration, sadness, heartbreak, loneliness, And if you don't

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Speaker 1: get curious about that, like, addressing being angry with someone

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Speaker 1: is a different sort of conversation than addressing a loneliness

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Speaker 1: or disappointment. That's a really good pointment, listen. I mean

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Speaker 1: because then then of course leads you to have to

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Speaker 1: maybe have some difficult conversations with people, or do you

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Speaker 1: need to like look at your boundaries, you know, so

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Speaker 1: I think it feels like acknowledging the pain fees into

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Speaker 1: lots of different areas. Definitely, absolutely, Okay, all right, so

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Speaker 1: what is I see so our see if compartmentalizing. Unfortunately,

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Speaker 1: because we are adulting and because we are engaged in

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Speaker 1: life and we have to do certain things throughout the

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Speaker 1: course of our day to be able to pay our

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Speaker 1: bills or you know, just even feed ourselves, we can't

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Speaker 1: engage in our pain everywhere, and we can't engage in

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Speaker 1: our pain with everyone. So you have to be able

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Speaker 1: to know what are your safe spaces. So, you know,

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Speaker 1: do you have the type of work environment that allows

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Speaker 1: you to be emotional, that allows you to be transparent

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Speaker 1: when you show up to work? Is your supervisor really

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Speaker 1: accommodating for that? I mean, I'm the type of supervisor

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Speaker 1: I do have staff and you know, like they have

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Speaker 1: come to work and we have cried together. But then

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Speaker 1: I've been in other work environments where because of the

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Speaker 1: type of work that we were doing, we didn't really

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Speaker 1: have that amount of stabilities. So you have to spend

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Speaker 1: some time really thinking about the environments that you're in

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Speaker 1: and you know, how do you need to show up?

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Speaker 1: So you know what that might mean is if you

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Speaker 1: know that you need to reserve or have a certain

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Speaker 1: amount of emotional energy to be in certain places and

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Speaker 1: to show up as your best self. Maybe you're not

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Speaker 1: doing everything that you used to do before. If you're

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Speaker 1: going through a difficult time and you may have had

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Speaker 1: a day in the past where maybe you went to

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Speaker 1: the gym, work, schooled, and hung out with a whole

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Speaker 1: bunch of friends, and you came home and you did homework.

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Speaker 1: If you're going through a difficult time, you might not

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Speaker 1: be able to keep that same schedule. You might have

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Speaker 1: to shift how you spend your time to be able

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Speaker 1: to deal emotionally with the challenges. It's the same thing

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Speaker 1: with who you spend your time with. So the understanding

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Speaker 1: safe spaces and safe people. You can't share all of

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Speaker 1: you with everyone. We have friends who you know, maybe

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Speaker 1: we can be completely vulnerable and transparent with because we

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Speaker 1: know that they show up for us in very specific

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Speaker 1: ways and encourage us. But then we have other friends

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Speaker 1: who we know that, Okay, if I speak to her

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Speaker 1: this way, she's gonna respond to me in this way

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Speaker 1: and in this specific moment. I don't have the capacity

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Speaker 1: for that. So you have to understand your environment and

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Speaker 1: be able to develop ways to address your needs in

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Speaker 1: different moments and with different people to keep yourself safe

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Speaker 1: during these times. So I'm glad to hear you say this, Melissa,

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Speaker 1: because I know, of course that compartmentalizing can be super helpful,

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Speaker 1: right Like, that is a real, for real, like life skill,

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Speaker 1: right like p able to know how to move in

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Speaker 1: different spaces and you know which you can share with

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Speaker 1: who and whatever. But I also think it is one

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Speaker 1: of those things that we kind of sometimes like overly

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Speaker 1: rely on, and people get really really good at compartmentalizing,

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Speaker 1: and then you see a whole host of other issues.

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Speaker 1: Can you talk a little bit about that, Yes, So

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Speaker 1: oftentimes people think about compartmentalizing and they stuff a real

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Speaker 1: good job because they're stuffing their emotion away. So this

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Speaker 1: type of compartmentalizing isn't stuffing your emotional way. It's not saying, well,

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Speaker 1: I'm just not gonna deal with this thing because I

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Speaker 1: need to be present in these places. It's saying that

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Speaker 1: I understand that there are different places and times and

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Speaker 1: people who like you know, can share with So you're

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Speaker 1: still making the choice to share. You're still getting curious

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Speaker 1: about how you feel. Right, You're still engaging in your

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Speaker 1: self care plan. You're not ignoring it. You know, you

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Speaker 1: can't sex pain away, you can't drug pain away, you

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Speaker 1: can't even be mad all day and then think that

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Speaker 1: you're addressing your pain. So people think about compartmentalizing, and

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Speaker 1: they think that they're just like stuffing their emotions into

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Speaker 1: this nice little box and closing it up and just

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Speaker 1: putting it on a shelf. That's not compartmentalizing. What that

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Speaker 1: is is you're essentially in denial and you're trying to

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Speaker 1: ignore how you feel. So it's not that we're talking

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Speaker 1: about figuring out the places, spaces and times to deal

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Speaker 1: appropriately with how you feel so that you're actually working

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Speaker 1: through your emotions in a safe environment and you're not

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Speaker 1: further damaging yourself during this time. Because if you're, you know,

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Speaker 1: putting yourself in a vulnerable position at work, and like

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Speaker 1: work isn't the best place to be vulnerable, then you

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Speaker 1: might be creating other situations that can just sort of

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Speaker 1: exacerbate whatever challenges you're having got you. And I think

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Speaker 1: that's such an important distinction, you know. So you're talking

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Speaker 1: about like, Okay, I'm gonna wrap this up and put

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Speaker 1: it in the closet until I come back home from work,

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Speaker 1: not I'm gonna show this all the way to the

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Speaker 1: back of the closet until somebody finds this five years

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Speaker 1: from now exactly, you know. Or I'm like carrying it

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Speaker 1: with me, but I think it's in the closet, I'm

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Speaker 1: pumping around and it's actually on my back and so

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Speaker 1: I'm pissed off all day, or I'm on the burgetteers

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Speaker 1: all day. It's not that we're actually addressing it, but

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Speaker 1: we're addressing it in the best environment to address it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So can you say more about that, Melissa, because I

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Speaker 1: do think that that does happen sometimes, right that you

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Speaker 1: think that you have kind of either stuffed it away

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Speaker 1: or you think that you are compartmentalizing it, but it's

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Speaker 1: actually kind of leaking out. And typically other people can

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Speaker 1: see this more and clearer than you can. Yeah. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you know, we all have triggers, and we all have

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Speaker 1: things that we're reactive to. And one of the questions

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Speaker 1: I get, you know, very often, is well, how do

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Speaker 1: I know I've healed? How do I know that my

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Speaker 1: work is done? Like? When is this gonna be over?

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Speaker 1: And what I tell people is, you know, there is

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Speaker 1: always going to be more work to do where we're all,

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Speaker 1: you know, growing consistently and trying to figure out this

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Speaker 1: thing called life. But if you find yourself in positions

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Speaker 1: where you are having emotionally reactive experiences, meaning someone said

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Speaker 1: something to you and you instantly get angry, or someone

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Speaker 1: does something to you and you instantly have a response

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Speaker 1: and you don't even really know where that response is

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Speaker 1: coming from, or you're so used to simply responding to

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Speaker 1: situations you don't even have the capacity to think about

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Speaker 1: what you're responding to, that is a good indicator that

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Speaker 1: you still have some healing to do. Yeah, So when

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Speaker 1: people say, well, you know, I don't even know this

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Speaker 1: is just something that that that bothers me, that's something

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Speaker 1: that you need to unpack because that that typically means

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Speaker 1: that it's a loaded situation, it's something from your past

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Speaker 1: and you really don't even know how it's still impacting

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Speaker 1: your life to that. Yeah, And do you think there's

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Speaker 1: any way to, like besides kind of just being very

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Speaker 1: aware and like paying attention to like how you're reacting

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Speaker 1: and what kinds of thoughts you're having. Do you think

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Speaker 1: there's a way to like really examine what those things

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Speaker 1: are for you, like what those triggers are for you,

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Speaker 1: or whether there are some things that you're kind of

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Speaker 1: ring around that you don't know you're having emotional reactions too. Well.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know, obviously I'm a huge mindfulness fan,

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Speaker 1: so I do think that, you know, mindfulness and paying

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Speaker 1: attention to yourself is the number one way, but I

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Speaker 1: also think paying attention to people's reactions to you is

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Speaker 1: another way. Um, you know, we don't always have the

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Speaker 1: opportunity to see ourselves. We don't give ourselves the opportunity.

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Speaker 1: So unless you are a super mindful or insightful person,

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Speaker 1: or your journal and you can go back and you

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Speaker 1: need your journal, you know, like would you have clues.

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Speaker 1: But most of us, it's about the types of relationships

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Speaker 1: that we have with people. If you find that you're

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Speaker 1: receiving feedback from people that's consistent and you really don't

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Speaker 1: know what people are talking about, that's often the clue

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Speaker 1: that there's some work that you need to do. Or

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Speaker 1: if your relationships or the situations and like you're looking

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Speaker 1: for really aren't panning out in the same ways that

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Speaker 1: you envision your life panning out, that's also often a

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Speaker 1: clue that you have some more work to do. We

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Speaker 1: find ourselves in the same patterns over and over and

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Speaker 1: over again when we have life lessons to learn that

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Speaker 1: we haven't really mastered. And so if you're engaged in patterns,

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Speaker 1: whether it's the people or the things or the outcomes,

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Speaker 1: then it's a good sign for you to pick a

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Speaker 1: step back and to pay attention to what's happening around you. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: what is the saying Like wherever you go, there you

390
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Speaker 1: are right, So, I mean, so we're huh No, I

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Speaker 1: was gonna say. People always say, well, well, you know what,

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna move that way because I don't know

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Speaker 1: what you want, because I mean, you're gonna be there

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Speaker 1: no matter where he was, I'm not quite sure where

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Speaker 1: you're going right right, Yeah, I mean there is the

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Speaker 1: whole tendency like, Okay, this situation is not working out

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Speaker 1: for me, so maybe I need a new job, or

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Speaker 1: maybe I need a new partner, or maybe I need

399
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Speaker 1: to move to a new city. But really, if the

400
00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:57,520
Speaker 1: issue is something that's going on with you that you

401
00:21:57,600 --> 00:21:59,880
Speaker 1: have not resolved and worked through, you're going to bring

402
00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:02,560
Speaker 1: to the new job, the new relationship, the new city.

403
00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:06,680
Speaker 1: Absolutely absolutely, and you'll find yourself having the same sort

404
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,720
Speaker 1: of reactions to things all the time. Well, like why

405
00:22:09,720 --> 00:22:12,720
Speaker 1: are people so screwed up? Or like all employeers stuck

406
00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:16,160
Speaker 1: and it's like, you know, like you've like you've been

407
00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:19,840
Speaker 1: the consistent with like every job, every relationship, every landlord.

408
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Speaker 1: I mean absolutely, you take you wherever you are, and

409
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Speaker 1: you have to give yourself the opportunity to understand sometimes

410
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Speaker 1: you are wrong right, Like you're not the person always

411
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Speaker 1: in the right or like someone that's always doing something

412
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Speaker 1: to you. You have a role to play and whatever's

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Speaker 1: happening in your life, you know. I think that that

414
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Speaker 1: could be interesting to kind of umpact also, Melissa kind

415
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Speaker 1: of given especially you know, for black women, given the

416
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Speaker 1: sexist and racist and you know all the other is

417
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Speaker 1: environments that we find ourselves in. I think that sometimes

418
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Speaker 1: it can be hard to tell like what is my

419
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Speaker 1: own stuff versus what is the environment stuff? Yeah, there

420
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Speaker 1: weed the you can, you know that maybe you help

421
00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:03,679
Speaker 1: your clients trying to figure out like what is yours

422
00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:07,160
Speaker 1: and what is somebody else's. Oh, that's a that's such

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Speaker 1: a deep question. So I do think that whenever I

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Speaker 1: find myself talking about social constructs in session, because I think,

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Speaker 1: you know, how we show up as especially black women,

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Speaker 1: I think in the workplace is often like a double

427
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Speaker 1: edged sword because we don't want to fall into the

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Speaker 1: trope of being an angry black woman, and we don't

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Speaker 1: want to fall into this place of not feeling like

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Speaker 1: we're you know, being authentic and if we can't express ourselves,

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Speaker 1: because then that creates it its own challenges in and

432
00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:52,440
Speaker 1: of itself. I am more inclined to have conversations with

433
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:57,879
Speaker 1: clients about how they feel as individuals and what do

434
00:23:57,960 --> 00:24:03,080
Speaker 1: they see playing out in environment or an environment that

435
00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:07,280
Speaker 1: may be prone to a social construct that are similar

436
00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:11,600
Speaker 1: to patterns that may play out in other environments in

437
00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:13,960
Speaker 1: their life, And then what does that mean to you?

438
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:18,960
Speaker 1: Because if you received the same messaging at work as

439
00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:22,680
Speaker 1: you received at church or you know, from your partner,

440
00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:26,000
Speaker 1: maybe that has to do with how society views women.

441
00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:28,840
Speaker 1: But you know, maybe that has to do with how

442
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:31,880
Speaker 1: you show up as an individual, and you know, are

443
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:34,639
Speaker 1: you showing up as an individual the way that you

444
00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:37,159
Speaker 1: want to show up as an individual versus how you

445
00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:39,840
Speaker 1: want other people to see you? And so what does

446
00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:42,760
Speaker 1: that mean to you ultimately who you are as a person,

447
00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:46,000
Speaker 1: and then how is that playing out in the environments

448
00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:48,639
Speaker 1: that you're in. The other piece, too, is are you

449
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:52,480
Speaker 1: getting the results that you want? Because while there is

450
00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:58,000
Speaker 1: some truth to sexism and racism, we still have to

451
00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:03,080
Speaker 1: function in vi fignments that are not necessarily always welcoming

452
00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:06,760
Speaker 1: of us. And so paying attention to if the results

453
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,359
Speaker 1: that we're receiving are the results that we want, and

454
00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:12,399
Speaker 1: you know, are there ways to still be authentic and

455
00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:15,879
Speaker 1: to receive the results that we're looking for is often

456
00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:19,240
Speaker 1: a conversation that I have with my clients as well. Yeah,

457
00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:21,320
Speaker 1: and I do think it's important to also think about

458
00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:24,920
Speaker 1: like how you may have changed your behavior to you know,

459
00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:27,840
Speaker 1: maybe show up in an environment that wasn't very welcoming,

460
00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:30,359
Speaker 1: but it's not actually something that you want to continue.

461
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:33,800
Speaker 1: And also like maybe you have gotten really hardened or

462
00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:36,480
Speaker 1: when you have, you know, use anger or something as

463
00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:38,320
Speaker 1: a way because you felt like you needed to in

464
00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:40,879
Speaker 1: those moments, but maybe that type of behavior is no

465
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:43,040
Speaker 1: longer serving you. So is there something that you can

466
00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:45,600
Speaker 1: take off at some point and say, Okay, I don't

467
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:50,199
Speaker 1: have to be this person anymore, right, right, because ultimately

468
00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:54,239
Speaker 1: we are with some total of our experiences. But if

469
00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:57,159
Speaker 1: you pay attention to your experiences and your behavior is

470
00:25:57,320 --> 00:26:00,359
Speaker 1: enough to know that, yes, I might be more client

471
00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 1: to respond this way because of things I've been through.

472
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:06,840
Speaker 1: You can choose to do something different, right, You can

473
00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:10,119
Speaker 1: make a choice to do something different, And I think

474
00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:13,119
Speaker 1: that that is not something that's ingrained enough in us,

475
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:16,000
Speaker 1: you know, like we're often sort of told, well, I

476
00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:17,840
Speaker 1: am who I am, and you either like me or

477
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:19,480
Speaker 1: you don't like me, or you love me or you

478
00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:21,320
Speaker 1: don't love me, and just you know, take me as

479
00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:24,439
Speaker 1: I am. And while some of that is true, you know,

480
00:26:24,520 --> 00:26:27,639
Speaker 1: people really don't have to take you as you are. Okay,

481
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:29,760
Speaker 1: you can make the choice to you know, not take

482
00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:32,359
Speaker 1: you at all and just put you back. Right, So

483
00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:35,639
Speaker 1: you have to know if that's okay with you, You know,

484
00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:39,000
Speaker 1: if you need to function differently to be able to

485
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:41,720
Speaker 1: have the life that you want to have, not the

486
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:44,280
Speaker 1: life that was given to you because of the experiences

487
00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:47,960
Speaker 1: that you've been very good place. So what is our tea, Melissa?

488
00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:54,800
Speaker 1: So our t is time. Time. Healing is not something

489
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:58,640
Speaker 1: that is going to happen overnight. You know, Once again,

490
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:03,040
Speaker 1: as I said earlier, there's always this magic question, you

491
00:27:03,040 --> 00:27:06,040
Speaker 1: know that I hear so many clients acts when they

492
00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 1: begin services. Is so tell me how many sessions? You know,

493
00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:12,919
Speaker 1: will it take for me to feel better? And so

494
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:14,600
Speaker 1: do I have to come here, you know, twice a

495
00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,399
Speaker 1: week for six months? And I'm like uh, and then

496
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:20,160
Speaker 1: like that way, you know, like this is the kind

497
00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:22,160
Speaker 1: of rest that I do. And you know, there are

498
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:26,800
Speaker 1: absolutely some great you know, re therapeutic treatments and some

499
00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:30,040
Speaker 1: like manualized treatments that might take you up through certain

500
00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:33,359
Speaker 1: steps in a certain period of time. But then even

501
00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:37,760
Speaker 1: with those modalities, they can't really tell you exactly how

502
00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:40,640
Speaker 1: you're going to feel and by when right. We can

503
00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:43,639
Speaker 1: talk about learning certain skills, we can talk about practicing

504
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,280
Speaker 1: certain things. We may even be in a place where

505
00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:50,080
Speaker 1: we're developing your plan. But to really get to this

506
00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:53,200
Speaker 1: point where you are engaged and you're healing and you're

507
00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:57,879
Speaker 1: noticing not your responses to your experiences are different, it

508
00:27:57,920 --> 00:28:02,280
Speaker 1: takes time and it's different or every single person. I

509
00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:06,560
Speaker 1: think the more that you can be comfortable or to

510
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:10,679
Speaker 1: you know, learn to be comfortable with the process, then

511
00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:14,199
Speaker 1: I think that it, you know, gives you the opportunity

512
00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:17,240
Speaker 1: to you know, take your time, you know, give yourself

513
00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:21,680
Speaker 1: some grace, be gentle with yourself, but to also do

514
00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:25,399
Speaker 1: better for yourself the next time, to not engage in

515
00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 1: the same patterns the next time. The more we try

516
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:31,399
Speaker 1: to rush the process, so we try to you know,

517
00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:34,439
Speaker 1: stuff our feelings away, or we try to you know,

518
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 1: time ourselves with the process, the more inclined you are

519
00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:41,280
Speaker 1: to engage in the same patterns of behavior that would

520
00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 1: cause you to you know, make the same mistakes or

521
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:47,480
Speaker 1: to have the same results that are creating this very

522
00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:49,640
Speaker 1: pain that you're trying to get away from, so you'll

523
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:52,880
Speaker 1: find yourself in the same situation again. So you know,

524
00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:56,400
Speaker 1: definitely give yourself some time to heal. Yeah, I really

525
00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:58,000
Speaker 1: like the way that you put them in listen, in

526
00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:01,600
Speaker 1: terms of giving yourself grave, giving yourself time, but also

527
00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:04,480
Speaker 1: holding yourself accountable for maybe doing better the next time,

528
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:07,280
Speaker 1: because I think when you go too far on either

529
00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:10,200
Speaker 1: of those extremes, right then you are not getting closer

530
00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:12,480
Speaker 1: to the results that you say you wanted. Whether you

531
00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:15,720
Speaker 1: are too lenient with yourself or too critical of yourself,

532
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:18,480
Speaker 1: then for both of those things, you're moving further away

533
00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:24,720
Speaker 1: from your results. Right. Accountability is critical because we were

534
00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:29,760
Speaker 1: often so used to what we do and we do

535
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:31,720
Speaker 1: what we do, and we know how to do what

536
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:35,400
Speaker 1: we do well that you know, either we are overly

537
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:37,840
Speaker 1: critical as you stated, you know, or we can be

538
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:41,800
Speaker 1: so lenient with ourselves because it's that place that we

539
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:46,240
Speaker 1: feel most comfortable, because we don't want to be uncomfortable.

540
00:29:46,360 --> 00:29:50,280
Speaker 1: We don't want to feel you know, that we're you know,

541
00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:54,480
Speaker 1: not understanding our own path in this moment. And so

542
00:29:54,600 --> 00:29:58,320
Speaker 1: what that does is it, you know, allows us to

543
00:29:58,400 --> 00:29:59,960
Speaker 1: kind of go back to what we used to do.

544
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:03,080
Speaker 1: And yeah, so we have to hold ourselves accountable for

545
00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:06,040
Speaker 1: doing something different and for doing the work right for

546
00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:09,200
Speaker 1: you know, for being mindful about our reactions, engaging in

547
00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:11,680
Speaker 1: our plan, and for doing the things that we know

548
00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:14,640
Speaker 1: we need to do two before in our healing. So

549
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:18,960
Speaker 1: this is incredible information and listen, but I'm also thinking of,

550
00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:21,800
Speaker 1: like what's the line. So I do think it's really

551
00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:24,040
Speaker 1: important to like make a plan, like you said, and

552
00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:26,240
Speaker 1: you know, we still have to show up for life

553
00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:29,000
Speaker 1: even though it's difficult. But I do think, of course

554
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:32,360
Speaker 1: that there are times where like you just cannot even

555
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:34,640
Speaker 1: get to that place right, Like, so you may need

556
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 1: to consider like a leave of absence from work, or

557
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:40,520
Speaker 1: you need to consider taking a semester off. Can you

558
00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:42,760
Speaker 1: talk about where that line would be, Like, how do

559
00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,640
Speaker 1: you know when to make this plan for yourself and

560
00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:47,880
Speaker 1: when you maybe do need to take a break. So

561
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:51,680
Speaker 1: I think we should all have a plan consistently about

562
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:56,040
Speaker 1: what we need. You know, when we know that, we

563
00:30:56,120 --> 00:30:59,640
Speaker 1: respond a certain way to difficult times. Like for instance,

564
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:01,960
Speaker 1: I read suddenly went through a lot of life transitions.

565
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:04,920
Speaker 1: It felt like all at the same time. Basically as

566
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:08,680
Speaker 1: I worked through my own um processes with these transitions,

567
00:31:08,720 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 1: I had a particular day where I was instantly triggered

568
00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:17,360
Speaker 1: by something. I mean literally, I had a moment I

569
00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:21,480
Speaker 1: saw someone and I was angry. I was angry, but

570
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:24,680
Speaker 1: because I have a good friend, I know that this

571
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:27,320
Speaker 1: is someone I can talk to when I need support.

572
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:30,000
Speaker 1: I know exactly who the call, I knew exactly what

573
00:31:30,120 --> 00:31:32,440
Speaker 1: to say, I knew how she was gonna respond, and

574
00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 1: within minutes it assisted me in resolving a moment that

575
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:39,520
Speaker 1: in the past for me, like really would have sent

576
00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:42,440
Speaker 1: me on a spial throughout the course of my whole day. Right,

577
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:45,480
Speaker 1: So I think that we all should have a plan.

578
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:48,680
Speaker 1: We should all know basic things about ourselves and support

579
00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:50,960
Speaker 1: systems that we need to be able to make it through.

580
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 1: You know, like there are times when you need to disconnect,

581
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:57,880
Speaker 1: and there are times when you need to take time

582
00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:01,280
Speaker 1: for yourself so that you can really really focus on

583
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:05,520
Speaker 1: your healing. And the thing about that is functioning. If

584
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:10,720
Speaker 1: you absolutely cannot function, like your mood is so low

585
00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:14,080
Speaker 1: that you're not able to get up out of bed,

586
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 1: you're not able to take care of the basic necessities

587
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:21,040
Speaker 1: that you need, and you can't even really put one

588
00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:24,280
Speaker 1: foot in front the other, then you might need to

589
00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:26,680
Speaker 1: take a leave of absence. You might need to call

590
00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:29,480
Speaker 1: in sick on a particular day. You might need to,

591
00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 1: you know, take some time to regroup. And that is

592
00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:36,040
Speaker 1: also okay. That is also something that can be a

593
00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:38,880
Speaker 1: part of a plan for you, because if you don't

594
00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:41,760
Speaker 1: have enough savings, if you don't have any sick time,

595
00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:45,120
Speaker 1: if you don't have a job that allows you to

596
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:48,240
Speaker 1: take any kind of medical leave, then like that can

597
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:51,959
Speaker 1: create some barriers for you. So if you like know

598
00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:55,600
Speaker 1: yourself well enough that you know that you have these

599
00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:57,960
Speaker 1: moments in life where you need to sort of take

600
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,840
Speaker 1: a step back, then you can always put the proper

601
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:02,720
Speaker 1: measures in place to be able to do what you

602
00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:05,520
Speaker 1: need to do to keep yourself safe. I do think

603
00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:07,600
Speaker 1: that that is an important line, and you know, like

604
00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:09,960
Speaker 1: you said, an important distinction to know, Okay, we do

605
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:11,960
Speaker 1: I need to keep you know, working the plan or

606
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:14,040
Speaker 1: do I need to take a step back so that

607
00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:18,000
Speaker 1: I can get to you a place where I'm more functional? Yeah, definitely,

608
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:20,680
Speaker 1: And you know, and I mean everything really works together

609
00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:23,520
Speaker 1: in tandem too. I think we tend to think about

610
00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: things from a perspective of like all or nothing. But

611
00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:32,200
Speaker 1: you know, maybe taking a step back is your safe space, right,

612
00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:35,760
Speaker 1: you know, maybe that is your compartmentalization for like this

613
00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:39,320
Speaker 1: moment in time, and like not being afraid to check

614
00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:42,680
Speaker 1: in with yourself consistently through your process. I think that's

615
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:46,960
Speaker 1: a part of the time piece too, because you know,

616
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 1: once again, like healing isn't linear, right, So you might

617
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 1: have a good day to day and then you might

618
00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:54,160
Speaker 1: have a day tomorrow that you know, really set you

619
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:56,080
Speaker 1: to a place where you need to take a step

620
00:33:56,120 --> 00:33:58,080
Speaker 1: back for to day, but then yesterday you were able

621
00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:01,959
Speaker 1: to fully engage. So being able to like jump in

622
00:34:02,040 --> 00:34:04,920
Speaker 1: and out of the process as you need is a

623
00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:08,200
Speaker 1: part of you know one, understanding yourself and also giving

624
00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:12,480
Speaker 1: yourself time love it. So, Melissa, are there any additional

625
00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:15,319
Speaker 1: resources that you would have particular to this beyond the

626
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:18,759
Speaker 1: ones that you shared UM in the last episode. Yes. So,

627
00:34:19,120 --> 00:34:24,440
Speaker 1: Burnet Brown has an amazing book that's called Rising Strong UM.

628
00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:27,800
Speaker 1: And you know in that book she talks tangibly about

629
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,879
Speaker 1: a lot of different that's and this you know process

630
00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:35,640
Speaker 1: of you know, how to heal and to reconcile with

631
00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:39,520
Speaker 1: you know, different um pain points or experiences in your

632
00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:43,040
Speaker 1: life and to understand yourself better through the healing process.

633
00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:45,040
Speaker 1: So I think that that is an amazing book that

634
00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:47,759
Speaker 1: I do recommend to people as well. Got you and

635
00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:50,200
Speaker 1: remind us where we can find you online, Melissa, your

636
00:34:50,239 --> 00:34:53,319
Speaker 1: website as well as your social media handles. So my

637
00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:57,240
Speaker 1: website is Melissa I Felt, M E L I S

638
00:34:57,239 --> 00:35:01,000
Speaker 1: S A I S as in Strength I L dot com.

639
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,879
Speaker 1: And my Instagram, which is where I took the who

640
00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:11,160
Speaker 1: he am is Melissa I Phoe L C S. W perfect.

641
00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:12,839
Speaker 1: Of course, all that will be in the show notes

642
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:15,200
Speaker 1: for people to find it. Well, thank you for joining

643
00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:17,440
Speaker 1: us again, Melissa. I really appreciate you coming back to

644
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:20,239
Speaker 1: chat with us, saying here saying may thank you so

645
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:23,080
Speaker 1: much for having me and I always loved talking to you.

646
00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:26,359
Speaker 1: Thank you. I'm so thankful Melissa was able to come

647
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:29,319
Speaker 1: back and share her expertise with us today. To find

648
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:32,680
Speaker 1: out more information about her practice or to check out

649
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Speaker 1: the resources that she shared, visit the show notes at

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Speaker 1: Therapy for Black Girls dot Com slash Session ninety eight,

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Speaker 1: a therapist in your area, check out our directory at

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Speaker 1: Therapy for Black Girls dot com slash directory, and make

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Speaker 1: sure to visit our online store at Therapy for Black

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Speaker 1: Girls dot Com slash shouts, where you can find our

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Speaker 1: guided affirmation track, break up journal, and your Therapy for

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Speaker 1: Black Girls sweatshirts and T shirts. Thank y'all so much

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Speaker 1: for joining me again this week. I look forward to

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Speaker 1: continuing this conversation with you all real soon. Take it care,

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Speaker 1: part of a hotter