1 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:08,600 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:16,120 --> 00:00:19,000 Speaker 2: Well, Elon Musk gives now the richest person on the planet. 3 00:00:19,360 --> 00:00:22,200 Speaker 1: More than half the satellites in space are owned and 4 00:00:22,320 --> 00:00:24,239 Speaker 1: controlled by one man. 5 00:00:24,600 --> 00:00:27,360 Speaker 2: Starting his own artificial intelligence company. 6 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:31,120 Speaker 3: Well, he's a legitimate, super genius, legitimate, he says. 7 00:00:31,120 --> 00:00:33,720 Speaker 4: He's always voted for Democrats, but this year it will 8 00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:34,200 Speaker 4: be different. 9 00:00:34,200 --> 00:00:35,159 Speaker 1: He'll vote Republican. 10 00:00:35,440 --> 00:00:37,879 Speaker 4: There is a reason the US government is so reliant 11 00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 4: on him. 12 00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:41,400 Speaker 2: Elon Musk is a scam artist and he's done nothing enough. 13 00:00:42,760 --> 00:00:45,479 Speaker 5: Anything he does, he's fascinating the people. 14 00:00:52,920 --> 00:00:56,080 Speaker 2: Welcome to Elon Inc. Bloomberg's weekly podcast about Elon Musk. 15 00:00:56,240 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 2: I'm your host, Max Chapkin, and as promise, we're backquus 16 00:00:59,880 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 2: second time this week with a very special episode. We 17 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:06,759 Speaker 2: talk all the time on this podcast about the ways 18 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:10,280 Speaker 2: that Elon Musk runs his companies differently from what you 19 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:13,840 Speaker 2: might think of as a normal business. It's not just 20 00:01:14,200 --> 00:01:16,360 Speaker 2: that he works crazy hours. It's not just that he 21 00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:19,440 Speaker 2: makes outrageous demands on his employees or carries his toddler 22 00:01:19,480 --> 00:01:22,880 Speaker 2: around like a good luck charm. It's also reflected in 23 00:01:22,959 --> 00:01:26,559 Speaker 2: the actual setup of these companies, the way that people 24 00:01:26,600 --> 00:01:29,280 Speaker 2: who work for Elon relate to one another. What it 25 00:01:29,360 --> 00:01:33,720 Speaker 2: is is everybody reports to Elon. Ultimately, he is the 26 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:37,640 Speaker 2: sun and everybody around him revolves around him. And you know, 27 00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:41,039 Speaker 2: this has all kinds of implications for all of his companies, 28 00:01:41,319 --> 00:01:44,880 Speaker 2: none of which are normal. And happily Bloomberg just published 29 00:01:44,920 --> 00:01:47,560 Speaker 2: an infographic that kind of explains all of this. It's 30 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:51,720 Speaker 2: a beautiful piece of reporting and visualization that lays out 31 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:55,920 Speaker 2: the weird relationships that surround the thing that we have 32 00:01:56,000 --> 00:01:59,280 Speaker 2: been calling Elon Inc. The universe of Elon Musk's companies. 33 00:01:59,720 --> 00:02:02,680 Speaker 2: And you know, happily for us, two of the reporters 34 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:04,840 Speaker 2: who put this together, the two lead reporters to put 35 00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:08,560 Speaker 2: this together, are regulars on this very podcast. Dana Hall, 36 00:02:08,960 --> 00:02:12,480 Speaker 2: Bloomberg's Elon Musk correspondent, is joining us to discuss it. Hello, 37 00:02:12,639 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 2: Dana hey Hey and Kurt Wagner are social media reporter 38 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:21,000 Speaker 2: and regular on this show. Kurt, Welcome to Elon Inc. 39 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:22,720 Speaker 4: I wouldn't miss it. Thank you. 40 00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:25,680 Speaker 2: And because this is a very special episode, we have 41 00:02:25,720 --> 00:02:29,040 Speaker 2: a very special guest, Katie at Topolus, who covers tech 42 00:02:29,080 --> 00:02:32,000 Speaker 2: and culture for business insiders. Here. Katie welcome. 43 00:02:32,200 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having me. I like to 44 00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:35,839 Speaker 1: think of myself as the cat turd two of threats. 45 00:02:37,760 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 2: So Dana, let's start with you just tell us about 46 00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:45,480 Speaker 2: what this graphic is trying to accomplish. And for people 47 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:47,320 Speaker 2: who haven't looked at it, you really should pause a 48 00:02:47,360 --> 00:02:50,880 Speaker 2: podcast and look at it, because it's an amazing sort 49 00:02:50,919 --> 00:02:55,200 Speaker 2: of picture, amazing visualization. It's constructed around a solar system. 50 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:57,520 Speaker 2: Why a solar system, Dana. 51 00:02:57,560 --> 00:02:59,600 Speaker 6: Yeah, So the idea for this was, like, you know, 52 00:02:59,639 --> 00:03:03,880 Speaker 6: people always asking how can Elon Musk run six companies simultaneously? 53 00:03:04,680 --> 00:03:07,639 Speaker 6: Who else works for him? Like, is there a way 54 00:03:07,680 --> 00:03:09,880 Speaker 6: that we could do like a visual representation of the 55 00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:12,960 Speaker 6: org chart at all of his companies? And I think 56 00:03:13,160 --> 00:03:15,440 Speaker 6: instead of thinking of it as like a linear org 57 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:18,040 Speaker 6: chart like the people who run X or X dot 58 00:03:18,120 --> 00:03:21,440 Speaker 6: AI or SpaceX or Tesla, you really do have to 59 00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 6: think of it as a solar system, with Elon as 60 00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:27,640 Speaker 6: like the very bright burning sun, and then this constellation 61 00:03:27,680 --> 00:03:30,359 Speaker 6: of companies around him that are kind of circling him. 62 00:03:30,840 --> 00:03:34,239 Speaker 6: And then around the companies you've got space junk, you've 63 00:03:34,240 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 6: got satellites, you've got meteors, you've got certain people that 64 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:39,720 Speaker 6: kind of like bop around between the planets, and so 65 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:42,520 Speaker 6: that was kind of our visual framework, and I think 66 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:45,280 Speaker 6: it worked out really well. Anyone who's covered Elon for 67 00:03:45,320 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 6: a long period of time knows that there are certain 68 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:51,240 Speaker 6: characters who just emerge over and over and over again. 69 00:03:51,520 --> 00:03:54,640 Speaker 6: And while some of these names might be familiar to listeners, 70 00:03:54,760 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 6: others are not, and you should really get to know 71 00:03:57,440 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 6: who they are. 72 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:02,440 Speaker 2: Kurt, how did you you report through this? It's not 73 00:04:02,480 --> 00:04:04,520 Speaker 2: like you can just look this stuff up on the internet, 74 00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:07,960 Speaker 2: not like a normal company, Like how does anyone How 75 00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:10,320 Speaker 2: does a reporter or even like someone who works for 76 00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:13,880 Speaker 2: Elon musk figure out like who matters at a given 77 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:15,880 Speaker 2: company or within this universe. 78 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:19,320 Speaker 7: It's a challenge because, as you point out, they don't 79 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:22,000 Speaker 7: just simply say here's the executive team on a lot 80 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:24,800 Speaker 7: of these websites, certainly not with X, which is what 81 00:04:24,839 --> 00:04:26,920 Speaker 7: I cover most closely. So I mean it really comes 82 00:04:26,920 --> 00:04:29,599 Speaker 7: down to like shoe leather reporting, right, like trying to 83 00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:31,880 Speaker 7: talk to people who are inside these companies, trying to 84 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:34,720 Speaker 7: figure out, hey, you know, when a finance decision is 85 00:04:34,760 --> 00:04:35,440 Speaker 7: being made, like. 86 00:04:35,600 --> 00:04:36,760 Speaker 4: Where does that go to? 87 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 7: Who's sort of the final you know, approver of that 88 00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 7: or also just like following Elon's posts. Sometimes, you know, 89 00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:45,520 Speaker 7: he'll either post a photo or video and you'll see 90 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:47,800 Speaker 7: people like lingering in the background and be like, oh wow, 91 00:04:47,839 --> 00:04:50,719 Speaker 7: I didn't realize that that person was like involved in 92 00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:53,479 Speaker 7: that thing or company, right, And so it's really just 93 00:04:53,720 --> 00:04:56,680 Speaker 7: good old fashioned reporting. And I think the challenge is 94 00:04:57,080 --> 00:04:59,799 Speaker 7: people move around often as we get through this cushion. 95 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:02,480 Speaker 7: You'll like Tesla executives who are now over at X 96 00:05:02,560 --> 00:05:04,680 Speaker 7: or SpaceX, folks who are now at Boring Company or 97 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:07,039 Speaker 7: whatever it may be. And so just sort of keeping 98 00:05:07,120 --> 00:05:09,760 Speaker 7: up to speed with like the who's there at that 99 00:05:09,920 --> 00:05:12,360 Speaker 7: moment can be really tough. But generally we have a 100 00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:15,679 Speaker 7: pretty good idea of you know, as Dana mentioned, who's 101 00:05:15,800 --> 00:05:17,440 Speaker 7: orbiting Elon at any given time. 102 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:20,919 Speaker 2: Did you two have this like in your head already 103 00:05:20,960 --> 00:05:23,120 Speaker 2: before you worked on this project, and was it a 104 00:05:23,120 --> 00:05:24,440 Speaker 2: solar system or a different metaphor? 105 00:05:24,520 --> 00:05:26,719 Speaker 6: I can speak for covering Tesla. I've always kept an 106 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:30,120 Speaker 6: ORG chart because it changes so quickly. And you know what, 107 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:32,159 Speaker 6: I think it's wild about Tesla. If you look at 108 00:05:32,160 --> 00:05:35,719 Speaker 6: their website, there's nothing about people. It's all about the products. 109 00:05:35,760 --> 00:05:38,200 Speaker 6: It's all about the cars or the robot or the 110 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:41,640 Speaker 6: promise of autonomy or you know, the megapax, like there 111 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:44,600 Speaker 6: is nothing about people on that website at all. And 112 00:05:45,240 --> 00:05:48,480 Speaker 6: Tesla has you know, over one hundred and twenty thousand 113 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:52,040 Speaker 6: employees globally and they just have three named executive officers. 114 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:56,040 Speaker 6: So just figuring out the delta like okay, like besides 115 00:05:56,160 --> 00:05:58,960 Speaker 6: the three named people on securities filings? Who else is 116 00:05:58,960 --> 00:05:59,960 Speaker 6: actually like running the show? 117 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:00,120 Speaker 2: Oh? 118 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:03,560 Speaker 6: Is just this constant challenge. And you know, I think 119 00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 6: any reporter who covers the company always kind of has 120 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:07,440 Speaker 6: the ORG chart in mind. A lot of it is 121 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:10,279 Speaker 6: like asking our sources that are still at the company, 122 00:06:10,360 --> 00:06:13,120 Speaker 6: like has the ORG chart change? Like what are you seeing? 123 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:15,520 Speaker 6: Like I heard this executive left? Are they gone? Are 124 00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:17,760 Speaker 6: they back? Like are they on a leave of absence? 125 00:06:17,760 --> 00:06:20,920 Speaker 6: Like it's it's always very very fluid, and I think that, yeah, 126 00:06:20,960 --> 00:06:22,359 Speaker 6: like a solar system speaks to that. 127 00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:26,680 Speaker 2: These names, like I'm guessing you don't you're not covering 128 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:28,839 Speaker 2: elon mus day to day, so you don't know them all, 129 00:06:29,279 --> 00:06:32,000 Speaker 2: but I'm guessing many of them are familiar to you because, 130 00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:34,000 Speaker 2: like Kurt kind of hinted at this, a lot of 131 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:36,200 Speaker 2: this stuff is like playing out on social media, Like 132 00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:39,679 Speaker 2: some of these relationships we know about because they're tweeting 133 00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:40,279 Speaker 2: at one another. 134 00:06:40,520 --> 00:06:42,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. You can see it play out. 135 00:06:42,279 --> 00:06:44,039 Speaker 5: And there's also a little bit of an element of 136 00:06:44,120 --> 00:06:46,920 Speaker 5: like some of these figures have sort of moved from 137 00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:49,840 Speaker 5: one phase of his life or one company to another. 138 00:06:49,920 --> 00:06:53,040 Speaker 5: They sort of are intertwined. It's not just he has 139 00:06:53,040 --> 00:06:54,680 Speaker 5: a bunch of companies and these are the people that 140 00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:57,400 Speaker 5: work at them. Like there's sort of these satellite floaters 141 00:06:57,400 --> 00:07:00,080 Speaker 5: coming in. It's almost like sort of keeping track of 142 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 5: who's dating who on vander Pumper roles. 143 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 2: Well, I was just going to ask you, like, does 144 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:07,360 Speaker 2: his sort of universe of influence look like a celebrities, 145 00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:09,840 Speaker 2: you know, universe of influence or does it look different 146 00:07:09,920 --> 00:07:11,720 Speaker 2: or just kind of curious how you think about the 147 00:07:11,760 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 2: Elon community compared to other similar communities of influence or whatever. 148 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 5: So I think kind of the best real window into 149 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:22,640 Speaker 5: this that we ever had was that moment during the 150 00:07:23,400 --> 00:07:25,880 Speaker 5: chancery court lawsuit when he was trying to get out 151 00:07:25,880 --> 00:07:27,720 Speaker 5: of buying Twitter, where all of a sudden all his 152 00:07:27,920 --> 00:07:31,040 Speaker 5: text messages were revealed and you got to kind of 153 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:34,600 Speaker 5: see how he interacts with these other people that he 154 00:07:34,640 --> 00:07:37,000 Speaker 5: either works with or has a friendship with or a 155 00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:41,720 Speaker 5: quasi business relationship with, and how much like they suck 156 00:07:41,800 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 5: up to him, and like there's such a weird power 157 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:48,400 Speaker 5: imbalance and dynamic. It's not exactly like a boss. It's 158 00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:50,640 Speaker 5: not exactly like a friend. There's a really weird like 159 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 5: sycophantic thing going on, and that kind of feels like, 160 00:07:54,520 --> 00:07:57,560 Speaker 5: you know what you might imagine from like Entourage or 161 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:00,280 Speaker 5: something where like someone has these kind of yes men 162 00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:01,200 Speaker 5: and these hangers on. 163 00:08:01,640 --> 00:08:04,640 Speaker 2: That list of text messages. As Kurt also knows, it's 164 00:08:04,640 --> 00:08:06,960 Speaker 2: like the Rosetta Stone of like, you know, if you 165 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:09,400 Speaker 2: want to understand Elon, that that it has, it contains 166 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:12,840 Speaker 2: like everything you need to know. I think, Kurt, I'm 167 00:08:12,840 --> 00:08:15,560 Speaker 2: curious if you ever get questions from like Twitter employees 168 00:08:15,600 --> 00:08:17,720 Speaker 2: asking like how to get in touch with various people 169 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:20,520 Speaker 2: in Elon's orbit, Like do people who work for him 170 00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:21,680 Speaker 2: understand this empire? 171 00:08:22,920 --> 00:08:25,600 Speaker 7: I don't think so, certainly, not off the top of 172 00:08:25,640 --> 00:08:28,000 Speaker 7: their heads. I think like at a certain level of 173 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:30,880 Speaker 7: closeness to Elon, you know you probably obviously like the 174 00:08:30,960 --> 00:08:33,679 Speaker 7: higher up the food chain you are, the more exposure 175 00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:34,959 Speaker 7: you have to this kind of thing. But I think 176 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:38,520 Speaker 7: like the everyday rank and file sort of employees. Certainly 177 00:08:38,559 --> 00:08:41,080 Speaker 7: at X, I don't think they're necessarily aware of the 178 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:43,920 Speaker 7: you know, broad orbit here. And part of that is because, 179 00:08:43,920 --> 00:08:45,600 Speaker 7: like I can tell you, it was a little bit 180 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:48,280 Speaker 7: hard to put together on our end, right, Like it 181 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:50,960 Speaker 7: required like I said, like real reporting, real phone calls, 182 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:53,959 Speaker 7: real going out and asking people is certainly with the 183 00:08:54,080 --> 00:08:56,360 Speaker 7: X side. I remember talking to folks like all right, well, 184 00:08:56,360 --> 00:08:58,079 Speaker 7: like who's in charge of product? And they were sort 185 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:00,920 Speaker 7: of like, well, it's not like entire early clear, but 186 00:09:01,000 --> 00:09:03,800 Speaker 7: we think it's this person. But like sometimes decisions are 187 00:09:03,800 --> 00:09:06,280 Speaker 7: made over here. And so my point being is that 188 00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:10,080 Speaker 7: it's not a very transparent system, and I think some 189 00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:12,280 Speaker 7: of that is by design. I think some of that 190 00:09:12,400 --> 00:09:15,520 Speaker 7: is just what happens when you have six different companies 191 00:09:15,679 --> 00:09:19,480 Speaker 7: plus all of the extra you know, entourage that Elon 192 00:09:19,600 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 7: comes with on any given day. It's just like, this 193 00:09:22,000 --> 00:09:25,760 Speaker 7: is not a normal thing. And even other billionaires, like 194 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:27,920 Speaker 7: I was thinking, okay, Mark Zuckerberg is another person I 195 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:31,199 Speaker 7: covered very closely obviously as a huge you know, group 196 00:09:31,240 --> 00:09:33,920 Speaker 7: of advisors, people who are close to him, Like if 197 00:09:33,920 --> 00:09:35,240 Speaker 7: we were to do this with him, it would be 198 00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 7: much easier, in part because he's. 199 00:09:36,720 --> 00:09:38,680 Speaker 4: Just running one company. He's running one. 200 00:09:38,600 --> 00:09:41,920 Speaker 7: Business, like the six businesses thing is really what makes this, 201 00:09:42,000 --> 00:09:45,360 Speaker 7: I think, such a unique scenario and also makes it 202 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:47,920 Speaker 7: hard to kind of understand the org chart from the 203 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:48,520 Speaker 7: ground floor. 204 00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:51,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, just jumping on that. Are there legal or ethical 205 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:54,760 Speaker 2: questions raised by this? The weirdness here? I mean the 206 00:09:54,800 --> 00:09:58,319 Speaker 2: fact that you potentially have, say, like a Tesla's a 207 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 2: public company, you potentially have a Tesla employer being dragged 208 00:10:00,920 --> 00:10:03,520 Speaker 2: off into some other part of Elon's empire, or being 209 00:10:03,559 --> 00:10:06,160 Speaker 2: asked to work on a maybe even a personal project 210 00:10:06,200 --> 00:10:08,880 Speaker 2: for him or something like that. Is that something that 211 00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:12,080 Speaker 2: creates pitfalls? Legal pitfalls, ethical pitfalls, that sort of thing. 212 00:10:12,160 --> 00:10:14,400 Speaker 6: Oh, oh sure, I mean it's a big part of 213 00:10:14,440 --> 00:10:19,000 Speaker 6: the whole like fight over Musk's twenty eighteen compensation package, right, 214 00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 6: Like you have shareholders and you know, smaller investors, a 215 00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:24,559 Speaker 6: lot of pension funds, being like, this is a part 216 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:28,560 Speaker 6: time CEO, he has never paid full attention to our company, 217 00:10:29,120 --> 00:10:31,800 Speaker 6: and if anything, like he's just doing more and more 218 00:10:31,840 --> 00:10:34,680 Speaker 6: crazy things and starting newer and newer companies and like 219 00:10:34,880 --> 00:10:38,240 Speaker 6: borrowing Peter to pay Paul and like using Tesla resources 220 00:10:38,280 --> 00:10:40,640 Speaker 6: to help prop up his other companies. I mean, now 221 00:10:41,080 --> 00:10:44,360 Speaker 6: Tesla is advertising on X and you know, I think 222 00:10:44,400 --> 00:10:46,520 Speaker 6: the thing to remember is that Tesla is the only 223 00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:49,439 Speaker 6: public company out of the six. The other five are 224 00:10:49,440 --> 00:10:52,600 Speaker 6: all privately held, and so Tesla has to test to 225 00:10:52,600 --> 00:10:55,360 Speaker 6: disclose and its proxy all the ways in which these 226 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:58,679 Speaker 6: companies relate, like they share the corporate jet, like they 227 00:10:58,760 --> 00:11:03,080 Speaker 6: share security, and so just the whole fact that that 228 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:05,760 Speaker 6: Tesla resources are used for other parts of the empire 229 00:11:06,040 --> 00:11:08,880 Speaker 6: is a big concern. The question is, like, leney whatever, 230 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:15,920 Speaker 6: do anything about it? So far, the board certainly hasn't. 231 00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:20,240 Speaker 2: All right, Let's move on the Elon universe. As we're explaining, 232 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:24,320 Speaker 2: it's a very complex cosmos, very hard for somebody who 233 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 2: isn't studying this closely to understand, which and you know, 234 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:29,360 Speaker 2: that's a big problem because Elon is an important guy 235 00:11:29,400 --> 00:11:31,600 Speaker 2: with a lot of money. So it makes sense of this. 236 00:11:31,720 --> 00:11:34,040 Speaker 2: To get some more insight into this world, we're going 237 00:11:34,080 --> 00:11:37,600 Speaker 2: to use one of the great tools of American journalism, 238 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:42,720 Speaker 2: the senior Superlative List. Now, for those of you who 239 00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:46,560 Speaker 2: have not gone to an American high school, or have 240 00:11:46,679 --> 00:11:50,600 Speaker 2: not watched a movie involving one, or just forgot what 241 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:54,080 Speaker 2: it's like. Basically at the end of the year, a 242 00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:57,680 Speaker 2: committee of students puts together a yearbook, which is a 243 00:11:57,720 --> 00:12:00,319 Speaker 2: book with two covers on either side that has all 244 00:12:00,360 --> 00:12:03,480 Speaker 2: the names of the students and there's usually a several 245 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:07,360 Speaker 2: page full color section in which the students vote on 246 00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:10,640 Speaker 2: who has the best hair, the best smile, and so on. 247 00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:14,400 Speaker 2: And so for this panel, we're all gonna pretend to 248 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:17,120 Speaker 2: be editors of a high school yearbook and we're going 249 00:12:17,200 --> 00:12:22,240 Speaker 2: to choose the superlatives for the members of the Elon Universe. Now, 250 00:12:22,280 --> 00:12:25,080 Speaker 2: ahead of the show, just tell everyone, I asked everyone 251 00:12:25,120 --> 00:12:28,760 Speaker 2: to send me their senior superlatives for the for the 252 00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:32,240 Speaker 2: Elon Musk Universe. I've collected them here and I will 253 00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:35,280 Speaker 2: moderate this discussion and try to rain everybody in. And 254 00:12:35,320 --> 00:12:37,640 Speaker 2: before we do that, I need to ask, was anybody 255 00:12:37,679 --> 00:12:41,319 Speaker 2: on this panel a senior superlative? And if so, which 256 00:12:41,520 --> 00:12:42,760 Speaker 2: what was your superlative? 257 00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:47,160 Speaker 5: Katie, I was, and I actually had two. I was 258 00:12:47,400 --> 00:12:50,239 Speaker 5: class clown and most funfilled. 259 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:51,760 Speaker 4: Wow. 260 00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:54,920 Speaker 6: I was just the editor of the yearbook, so I 261 00:12:54,920 --> 00:12:57,680 Speaker 6: didn't get a superlative, but I put the yearbook together. 262 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:01,400 Speaker 2: Well, Dan, that's great. I mean, I'm so happy that 263 00:13:01,440 --> 00:13:04,640 Speaker 2: you are here with us to keep me honest, Kurt. 264 00:13:05,240 --> 00:13:08,400 Speaker 4: Yeah, this is sort of embarrassing, but you know why not. 265 00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:13,360 Speaker 7: I got first place and third place in the Cutest 266 00:13:13,360 --> 00:13:19,199 Speaker 7: Couple competition. I got first place with my actual girlfriend 267 00:13:19,200 --> 00:13:21,400 Speaker 7: and I got third place with my best friend who 268 00:13:21,640 --> 00:13:23,960 Speaker 7: I spent a lot of time hanging out with and 269 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:27,679 Speaker 7: we played football together, and apparently everyone thought we made 270 00:13:27,679 --> 00:13:29,760 Speaker 7: a nice couple as well. So I was taking home 271 00:13:29,840 --> 00:13:32,520 Speaker 7: multiple prizes, which is pretty impressive. 272 00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, so mine was, like, I think it was best 273 00:13:36,760 --> 00:13:40,640 Speaker 2: all Around, which sounds like a really good category, but 274 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:43,360 Speaker 2: I actually think it's like a maybe bit of a 275 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:46,760 Speaker 2: burn and just because it's like you don't have anything 276 00:13:46,800 --> 00:13:49,719 Speaker 2: to offer. So anyway, we're gonna start with kind of 277 00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:52,400 Speaker 2: a classic, maybe not as classic as class clown, but 278 00:13:52,760 --> 00:13:57,800 Speaker 2: a classic senior superltive category. Life of the Party Katie 279 00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 2: and Atopolas. Who is the life of the party in 280 00:14:00,360 --> 00:14:01,440 Speaker 2: Elon Musk's universe. 281 00:14:01,640 --> 00:14:05,960 Speaker 5: I so my vote is for his brother, Kimball Musk, 282 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:08,640 Speaker 5: and for a very straightforward reason, which is that he's 283 00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:11,240 Speaker 5: a chef and like I'm sure he throws a great party, 284 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:12,080 Speaker 5: he can actually cook. 285 00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:14,600 Speaker 2: I mean, I completely agree with that. 286 00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:17,760 Speaker 5: He also seems like he's a guy who loves to party. 287 00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:20,120 Speaker 2: He likes some party. Dana, Kurt, what do we make 288 00:14:20,160 --> 00:14:22,440 Speaker 2: of Kimball? Do you how do you rate him on 289 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:24,640 Speaker 2: the life of the party scale? And who was your 290 00:14:24,680 --> 00:14:25,360 Speaker 2: life at the party? 291 00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:27,440 Speaker 4: I think that's a fun pick. 292 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:30,600 Speaker 7: I think my life of the party choice was Elon himself, 293 00:14:30,640 --> 00:14:33,160 Speaker 7: which was, to be clear, the only time I picked 294 00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:36,880 Speaker 7: Elon because I know we're mostly talking about his crew here. 295 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,600 Speaker 7: It seems like Elon, you know, is maybe dabbling in 296 00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 7: some extracurriculars. 297 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:42,160 Speaker 4: And I think. 298 00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:45,880 Speaker 7: Kimball and Elon seem like, you know, two brothers who 299 00:14:45,920 --> 00:14:48,480 Speaker 7: tend to maybe get in trouble together from time to time, 300 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:51,360 Speaker 7: and as far as long term consequences go, I'm not 301 00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:54,040 Speaker 7: sure that's best. But for one night life of the party? 302 00:14:54,120 --> 00:14:54,360 Speaker 6: Sure? 303 00:14:54,400 --> 00:14:54,960 Speaker 1: Why not? 304 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:58,120 Speaker 2: Dan? I know this has falls under the normal description 305 00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:00,120 Speaker 2: of your job, But who was your life of the party. 306 00:15:00,440 --> 00:15:03,600 Speaker 6: Alex Spiro, Elon's lawyer, I mean, you know, like fast 307 00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:05,840 Speaker 6: talking New Yorker. I don't know. Maybe I think he 308 00:15:05,880 --> 00:15:09,160 Speaker 6: lives in Miami now, but he's at all these big trials, 309 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:12,920 Speaker 6: right he defended Elon during the Pedo Guy trial. He 310 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:15,960 Speaker 6: like is just front and center. He's always filing these 311 00:15:16,040 --> 00:15:18,400 Speaker 6: crazy motions late on a Friday night, Like I get 312 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:21,680 Speaker 6: these pacer alerts and there's an alex Buro motion. And 313 00:15:21,720 --> 00:15:24,040 Speaker 6: if you're a guy like Elon Musk and you're involved 314 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:25,960 Speaker 6: in a lot of litigation and you want to have 315 00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:29,720 Speaker 6: a hardcore litigation team, you kind of need like a 316 00:15:29,760 --> 00:15:30,560 Speaker 6: fun lawyer. 317 00:15:30,760 --> 00:15:34,880 Speaker 2: These are all good choices. But this is grimes erasure. Everybody. 318 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:47,800 Speaker 2: I think we all know. Okay, we did it. Okay, 319 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:51,640 Speaker 2: let me compose myself. Everyone knows that Grimes is the 320 00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:57,720 Speaker 2: life of the party as well. All right, best dressed, Dana. 321 00:15:57,920 --> 00:16:01,520 Speaker 2: You had Franz von Holds, who sounds like a well 322 00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:04,560 Speaker 2: dressed guy, but remind us like who he is, and 323 00:16:05,000 --> 00:16:06,240 Speaker 2: you know kind of why you put him. 324 00:16:06,560 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 6: Yeah, So, Franz is Tesla's chief designer. He lives in La. 325 00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:13,560 Speaker 6: I actually saw him in person recently. I flew down 326 00:16:13,640 --> 00:16:17,080 Speaker 6: to the Peterson Automotive Museum in la and it was 327 00:16:17,160 --> 00:16:19,240 Speaker 6: just such a wild seed. It was like a Sunday morning. 328 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:21,400 Speaker 6: They were having this evy event at the museum on 329 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:24,440 Speaker 6: the roof and Franz rolled up in his cyber truck 330 00:16:24,920 --> 00:16:27,440 Speaker 6: and emerged from the cyber truck wearing like a black 331 00:16:27,480 --> 00:16:30,000 Speaker 6: T shirt and jeans and like some kind of like 332 00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:32,960 Speaker 6: high end high top basketball shoes, and he had on 333 00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:36,400 Speaker 6: like eighty eater sunglasses and he was just mobbed by 334 00:16:36,400 --> 00:16:38,880 Speaker 6: people wanting his autograph. And it was kind of like 335 00:16:38,920 --> 00:16:42,000 Speaker 6: a good reminder that, like, you know, Elon obviously has 336 00:16:42,040 --> 00:16:45,360 Speaker 6: like tons of fans, but other people within his orbit 337 00:16:45,440 --> 00:16:47,920 Speaker 6: are sort of celebrities in their own right, and Franz 338 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:49,000 Speaker 6: is definitely this way. 339 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:52,320 Speaker 2: So we had some other good good picks here. Katie 340 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:54,680 Speaker 2: had Linda Yakarino, who I want to save for our 341 00:16:54,720 --> 00:16:58,440 Speaker 2: next category. Kurt had May Musk, Elon Musk's mom, who's 342 00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:03,200 Speaker 2: a professional model, professionally well dressed. All right, this is 343 00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:08,160 Speaker 2: like I think my favorite category, school spirit. Kurt, most 344 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:09,800 Speaker 2: school spirit? Who is your pick? 345 00:17:11,200 --> 00:17:16,200 Speaker 7: I picked ex CEO Linda Yakarino as the most school spirit. 346 00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:19,719 Speaker 7: I think you see, you know, her out there pumping 347 00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:21,800 Speaker 7: up Elon, and I think you see her out there 348 00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:26,600 Speaker 7: pumping up X seemingly totally behind him and everything that 349 00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:29,560 Speaker 7: he says and tweets, like, she just seems like his 350 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:32,000 Speaker 7: big cheerleader, right and if and if the school, if 351 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:34,159 Speaker 7: we're at the School of Elon, I just get the 352 00:17:34,240 --> 00:17:37,720 Speaker 7: sense that Linda's is really bought in. It's interesting because 353 00:17:37,760 --> 00:17:41,720 Speaker 7: like he makes her job so hard, Like he tweets things, 354 00:17:42,119 --> 00:17:46,440 Speaker 7: he says things that make you know, selling X's business 355 00:17:46,680 --> 00:17:49,320 Speaker 7: so so so hard, and yet there she is rooting 356 00:17:49,400 --> 00:17:51,080 Speaker 7: him on at every step, and so I had to 357 00:17:51,080 --> 00:17:51,680 Speaker 7: give this to her. 358 00:17:51,720 --> 00:17:53,320 Speaker 2: We have a little tabe of this. Let's let's let's 359 00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:55,080 Speaker 2: give it a listen X. 360 00:17:55,720 --> 00:17:58,920 Speaker 8: We need to keep our minds open that it's developing 361 00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:03,399 Speaker 8: into this globebal town square that is fueled by free 362 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:07,760 Speaker 8: expression where the public gathers in real time. 363 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:11,760 Speaker 2: You know, Linda, she's leading the fencing team pep rally, 364 00:18:12,040 --> 00:18:15,160 Speaker 2: She's there cheering on the math team. She is all 365 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:18,679 Speaker 2: about X, and like, I have to think that's like 366 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:22,720 Speaker 2: a self preservation tactic. But it does make me wonder, 367 00:18:23,040 --> 00:18:26,840 Speaker 2: like if this is a guide to like how you 368 00:18:26,600 --> 00:18:29,080 Speaker 2: if you like report up to Elon Musk. I guess 369 00:18:29,080 --> 00:18:30,080 Speaker 2: this is what you have to do. 370 00:18:30,560 --> 00:18:34,120 Speaker 6: I think that the key to surviving at Musk's companies, 371 00:18:34,119 --> 00:18:37,720 Speaker 6: if you're up high is you either have incredibly deft 372 00:18:37,720 --> 00:18:40,000 Speaker 6: emotional intelligence and you know how to manage him with 373 00:18:40,119 --> 00:18:43,119 Speaker 6: like the right level of like synco fancy and like 374 00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:47,080 Speaker 6: obedience or you like somehow dodge him and you stay 375 00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:50,000 Speaker 6: out of his line of fire, which is not always easy. 376 00:18:50,520 --> 00:18:52,840 Speaker 5: I mean, I think I had originally thought maybe someone else, 377 00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:56,440 Speaker 5: but I'm completely swayed by Kurt here. I'm voting Linda too. 378 00:18:56,560 --> 00:18:59,880 Speaker 5: And I think that like what really embodies the schools 379 00:19:00,359 --> 00:19:02,320 Speaker 5: the sort of the person who's like, these are the 380 00:19:02,359 --> 00:19:06,320 Speaker 5: best days of our lives, like remember this, like so exciting, 381 00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:08,080 Speaker 5: like you have to sign my yearbook, Like that's the 382 00:19:08,119 --> 00:19:10,560 Speaker 5: school streat. I think that there was this moment when 383 00:19:10,560 --> 00:19:11,720 Speaker 5: she sort of first took over. 384 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:15,159 Speaker 1: At X of like did she know what she was 385 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:15,800 Speaker 1: getting into? 386 00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:17,359 Speaker 5: Did she take this because she thought it was just 387 00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:19,320 Speaker 5: gonna be a fun job and now it's a nightmare? 388 00:19:19,640 --> 00:19:21,080 Speaker 1: Like does she regret this? 389 00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:23,119 Speaker 5: And there were sort of reports that she was getting 390 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:25,159 Speaker 5: text and phone calls from people she had worked with 391 00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:27,560 Speaker 5: back at NBC being like get out now before you 392 00:19:27,600 --> 00:19:28,720 Speaker 5: like ruin your reputation. 393 00:19:29,320 --> 00:19:30,879 Speaker 1: And then there were sort of more reporting that came out. 394 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:33,360 Speaker 5: It's like, no, she really is just like a true believer, 395 00:19:33,640 --> 00:19:38,560 Speaker 5: like she absolutely believes it. She's in like full you know, 396 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:40,600 Speaker 5: full cent, she's she's in. 397 00:19:41,080 --> 00:19:46,160 Speaker 2: These are the best years of our lives. Yeah, all right, 398 00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:50,120 Speaker 2: class clown Katie on top list class clown of her 399 00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:53,040 Speaker 2: of her senior class, who is a class clown of 400 00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:54,840 Speaker 2: Elon's senior class. 401 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:58,080 Speaker 1: So I vote Grimes and hear me out. 402 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:01,399 Speaker 5: She is one of the few people in his orbit 403 00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:04,600 Speaker 5: who like she's not a business person, right, I mean, 404 00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:07,959 Speaker 5: she does have some business interests or whatnot, but like 405 00:20:08,040 --> 00:20:10,960 Speaker 5: she does have the freedom to kind of say. 406 00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:13,200 Speaker 1: Really wild weird. 407 00:20:13,040 --> 00:20:15,240 Speaker 5: Stuff, and I get the sense that she secretly like 408 00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:18,080 Speaker 5: does have a good sense of humor. Like she also 409 00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:22,320 Speaker 5: is the voice of a children's AI stuffed animal toy. 410 00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:24,160 Speaker 2: Called Groco Groc. 411 00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:26,119 Speaker 1: Also, okay, I guess I own a Grock. 412 00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:28,200 Speaker 2: She couldn't bring it next time? 413 00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:30,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, my kids love Groc. 414 00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:32,600 Speaker 5: But I've I've spent a lot of time with Grok, 415 00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:35,960 Speaker 5: and I feel like I feel like her spirit in 416 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:39,520 Speaker 5: that is humorous to me in a way that I 417 00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:43,159 Speaker 5: don't necessarily find some of his other business associates to 418 00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:46,720 Speaker 5: be humorous. And unfortunately I know that Elon himself I 419 00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:48,320 Speaker 5: think would love to be the glass clown. 420 00:20:48,440 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 2: But sorry, buddy, what is it about Elon's humor? 421 00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:55,959 Speaker 5: It's it's just sweaty, right, Like he misses the mark 422 00:20:56,320 --> 00:20:59,320 Speaker 5: it's like he thinks he's so funny, but it's kind 423 00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 5: of just like warmed overifunny dot com. 424 00:21:02,359 --> 00:21:04,080 Speaker 1: He steals memes. 425 00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:06,479 Speaker 5: Is is a bude in the throat of a lot 426 00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:09,320 Speaker 5: of people that they just cancel, Like it's just annoying 427 00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:12,040 Speaker 5: that he does that and it's not funny, like and 428 00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:13,119 Speaker 5: it's kind of rude. 429 00:21:15,040 --> 00:21:15,200 Speaker 9: Dan. 430 00:21:15,440 --> 00:21:17,440 Speaker 2: I mean, you and I of course have talked many 431 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:20,960 Speaker 2: times about about Elon's humor, and have you noticed any 432 00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:24,880 Speaker 2: changes in the human like he's been. He's more on Twitter? Now, 433 00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:26,600 Speaker 2: what for you sticks out about Elon's humor. 434 00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:28,200 Speaker 6: I mean others have meant to have said this before, 435 00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:30,520 Speaker 6: but he's really like a comedian kind of trying out 436 00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:32,760 Speaker 6: his bits. And like if you've listened to him long enough, 437 00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:35,080 Speaker 6: which you know, for better or worse, those of us 438 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:37,280 Speaker 6: on this podcast do listen to him quite a lot, 439 00:21:37,320 --> 00:21:40,320 Speaker 6: Like he just recycles a lot of the same things, 440 00:21:40,359 --> 00:21:42,199 Speaker 6: like over and over again. It's almost like he's so 441 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:46,760 Speaker 6: sleep deprived and he's running on empty so much that 442 00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:48,879 Speaker 6: like he just he forgets what he's saying is what 443 00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:49,800 Speaker 6: he said before. 444 00:21:50,040 --> 00:21:52,760 Speaker 7: I've sort of described his humor as like middle school 445 00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:56,320 Speaker 7: humor before, right, like it feels like the kind of 446 00:21:56,359 --> 00:21:59,600 Speaker 7: thing that you know, there's like a lot of kind 447 00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:02,600 Speaker 7: of weird sex jokes and then a lot of weird 448 00:22:02,920 --> 00:22:07,320 Speaker 7: you know, like jokes about females and their bodies and things, 449 00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:08,960 Speaker 7: and it's like it feels like the kind of thing 450 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,120 Speaker 7: that you know, a fourteen year old boy would do 451 00:22:12,280 --> 00:22:14,440 Speaker 7: to try and like impress his friends type of thing, 452 00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:18,360 Speaker 7: and it feels like he doesn't really deviate a ton 453 00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:18,719 Speaker 7: from that. 454 00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:26,320 Speaker 2: All Right, So I know Kurt is the cutest couple 455 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:29,360 Speaker 2: in this room, but I'm gonna ask Katie for her 456 00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:33,119 Speaker 2: cutest couple because it was a good one. Katie, cutest 457 00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:34,520 Speaker 2: couple in elon Land. 458 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:37,320 Speaker 5: It's got to be David Sachs and Jason Kalkanas. They 459 00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 5: do the podcast together. 460 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:42,359 Speaker 2: Yeah, these are the co hosts of the. 461 00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:46,480 Speaker 5: All In Yeah, And you know, and I like watching them. 462 00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:50,560 Speaker 5: They sometimes will disagree and have little spats with each 463 00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:54,080 Speaker 5: other on Twitter, which I find charming. I mean, I 464 00:22:54,119 --> 00:22:57,280 Speaker 5: find I guess I should say I find not that 465 00:22:57,400 --> 00:23:02,720 Speaker 5: much about them charming, but together they're clearly they've got a. 466 00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:05,120 Speaker 1: Thing going on. They've got chemistry. You can't deny that. 467 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 2: Well, and they are both gonna come up individually later on, 468 00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:11,880 Speaker 2: So let's just keep moving. But but I totally agree 469 00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:14,520 Speaker 2: they have a wonderful banter. I was a little disappointed, 470 00:23:14,560 --> 00:23:17,080 Speaker 2: have to say, Kurt had Elon and may you know 471 00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:19,600 Speaker 2: Elon and his mom, which to me feels like a 472 00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:21,200 Speaker 2: cop out choice a little bit. 473 00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:23,679 Speaker 4: Well, they showed up at the met gala together. Is 474 00:23:23,680 --> 00:23:25,959 Speaker 4: that not cute? Or what? To you know? Bring your 475 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:27,040 Speaker 4: mom to the met gala. 476 00:23:27,840 --> 00:23:33,200 Speaker 2: Next category we have is most likely to succeed Dana Hall. 477 00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:37,240 Speaker 2: Who is your most likely to succeed in Elon Lands? 478 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:39,320 Speaker 6: Well, this was an easy one for me. Gwen shotwell, 479 00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:41,960 Speaker 6: I mean, come on, the woman has been the number 480 00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:44,920 Speaker 6: two at SpaceX for all these years. She clearly knows 481 00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:49,840 Speaker 6: how to manage Elon. She's a survivor, she's incredibly respected. 482 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:52,680 Speaker 6: She handles all the contracts with NASA and a Pentagon. 483 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:55,400 Speaker 6: If Elon is like the bad dad or the scary 484 00:23:55,480 --> 00:23:58,000 Speaker 6: dad at the office, Gwen is like the good mom 485 00:23:58,280 --> 00:24:02,359 Speaker 6: and she clearly has his trust. And I mean, Max, 486 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:04,280 Speaker 6: you and I got to interview her at the SpaceX 487 00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:08,000 Speaker 6: headquarters in La you know, several years ago, and you know, 488 00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:11,600 Speaker 6: for all of the talk about how Elon, there's like 489 00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:14,240 Speaker 6: sort of turnover in the executive ranks at Elon's companies. 490 00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:16,959 Speaker 6: I mean, Gwen, there's no turnover there. I mean she 491 00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:19,080 Speaker 6: has been at SpaceX since the beginning. She was like 492 00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:23,320 Speaker 6: the seventh employee, and she's gonna she's you know, I 493 00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:26,639 Speaker 6: think she's she's she's clearly the most successful. 494 00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:29,760 Speaker 2: You know. This came up in the teacher's peck category. 495 00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:32,760 Speaker 2: I do think a large portion of most likely to 496 00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:36,720 Speaker 2: succeed in Elon Land is being willing to essentially defend 497 00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:39,840 Speaker 2: anything he does. Actually, we have some madio right here 498 00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:42,040 Speaker 2: of Gwen Shotwell talking to Forbes women. 499 00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:45,800 Speaker 10: I also have learned that he's rarely wrong, even if 500 00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,679 Speaker 10: that's super irritating and it feels not right when you 501 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:51,639 Speaker 10: first hear what he wants to go achieve, and so 502 00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:56,080 Speaker 10: if it doesn't sound like what you think we should 503 00:24:56,119 --> 00:24:59,639 Speaker 10: be doing, I always stop and think, Okay, we've been 504 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 10: through that before, think hard about what he's saying, what 505 00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:06,000 Speaker 10: he's trying to achieve, and figure out how to. 506 00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:06,400 Speaker 2: Make it work. 507 00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:08,520 Speaker 1: It's very inspirational music in the background. 508 00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:11,879 Speaker 5: I love that it feels like I'm like watching like 509 00:25:11,960 --> 00:25:13,320 Speaker 5: a nineties infomercial. 510 00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:18,080 Speaker 2: All right, now, this this category so most likely to succeed. 511 00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:20,600 Speaker 2: That's always kind of like a fifty to fifty year. 512 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,040 Speaker 2: You know, in some ways that's a compliment. In some ways, 513 00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:24,840 Speaker 2: you know, we're all on the yearbook committee sort of 514 00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:27,520 Speaker 2: making fun of you. The next few categories sort of 515 00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:33,760 Speaker 2: get into, i'd say less flattering categories. Teacher's pet, Katie, 516 00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:35,280 Speaker 2: who is your teacher's pet? 517 00:25:35,359 --> 00:25:37,240 Speaker 1: I mean it's got to be Jason, right. 518 00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:41,679 Speaker 2: That is the correct Let's listen for ourselves. Here's Jason 519 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:44,440 Speaker 2: Calcanis talking with Lex Friedman. 520 00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:47,080 Speaker 9: I have never seen an entrepreneur suffer more than him, 521 00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:49,159 Speaker 9: and you know he's been public about that, like you 522 00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:52,199 Speaker 9: do not want to be me. He has suffered for 523 00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 9: those companies. 524 00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:54,439 Speaker 2: He has suffered to get them where they are. 525 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:55,880 Speaker 9: It has not been easy. 526 00:25:57,080 --> 00:26:00,480 Speaker 5: You see that he has this close friendship that has 527 00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:03,560 Speaker 5: gone on for a long time. But really, really where 528 00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:06,960 Speaker 5: those tweets that were revealed in the Delaware courts during 529 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:11,760 Speaker 5: the X takeover, where he is he's saying wild stuff. 530 00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:14,680 Speaker 2: I would jump on a ground for you yonde. 531 00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:14,919 Speaker 1: Did he. 532 00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:21,040 Speaker 5: Wasn't he like you have my sword, like really dramatic, 533 00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:25,760 Speaker 5: like sycophantic things like and of course also like my 534 00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:28,400 Speaker 5: dream would be to be Twitter CEO, like also an ask, 535 00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:31,760 Speaker 5: but like it was just really like he's laying it 536 00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:32,480 Speaker 5: on Fish. 537 00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:34,320 Speaker 2: Oh kay, I can't help it. I have to play 538 00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:36,480 Speaker 2: another clip from the Freedman interview. This one's kind of 539 00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:38,840 Speaker 2: a personal interest, you know, off mic, A lot of 540 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,119 Speaker 2: us will talk about who are our favorite journalists, and 541 00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:45,120 Speaker 2: right here we have Jason Calcanis talking about his favorite journalists. 542 00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:47,840 Speaker 9: People were kind of a gas that he was asking 543 00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:50,360 Speaker 9: that such good questions and they're like, oh my god, 544 00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:52,600 Speaker 9: Elon's the best journalist on the planet. And it was 545 00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:56,040 Speaker 9: like anybody who knows Elon knows he has great questions. 546 00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:57,160 Speaker 2: I mean, I've been I used to. 547 00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:01,000 Speaker 1: Oh, wow, Katie. 548 00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:04,440 Speaker 2: You're only you're only criticizing Jason Calcanus because you're worried 549 00:27:05,520 --> 00:27:06,840 Speaker 2: coming through that clip. 550 00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:07,320 Speaker 4: That's great. 551 00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:10,960 Speaker 2: Okay. Now for most likely to be President, we have 552 00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:14,879 Speaker 2: Kurt Had, Jason's co host as your pick, David Sacks. 553 00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:16,600 Speaker 2: Why Kurt, I did? 554 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:19,280 Speaker 7: He just seemed of everyone in the university, seems the 555 00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:24,119 Speaker 7: most interested in politics and like having an influence over 556 00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:28,000 Speaker 7: geopolitical stuff. I don't know, it's like he seems to 557 00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:31,080 Speaker 7: want to be involved in all this stuff. He talks 558 00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:34,840 Speaker 7: about Russian and Ukraine all the time. He talks about 559 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:38,000 Speaker 7: like other geopolitical issues on the All In pod, but 560 00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:39,800 Speaker 7: also on his Twitter account. And I was just like, 561 00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:41,800 Speaker 7: I was looking through the list of all these people, 562 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:45,920 Speaker 7: and he seems the most in tune with what's going 563 00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:48,640 Speaker 7: on at least, like he likes to talk about what's 564 00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:50,119 Speaker 7: going on in the world. And I thought, if anyone 565 00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:51,800 Speaker 7: wants to be president, it's got to be this guy. 566 00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:55,560 Speaker 5: He's he's hosting a big fundraiser for Trump. He and 567 00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:58,560 Speaker 5: his wife, that's right, hosting, So he's you know, he's 568 00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:01,080 Speaker 5: he is very interested in politics. 569 00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:04,400 Speaker 2: With another All In co host we've not mentioned Schamath Pollopatia. 570 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:06,359 Speaker 2: I think it's like a five hundred thousand dollars a 571 00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:08,040 Speaker 2: plate dinner. 572 00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:10,240 Speaker 1: You know, that might be a little above my budget. 573 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:15,480 Speaker 6: To be clear, Elon Musk has not endorsed anyone, and 574 00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:18,520 Speaker 6: he claims that he is not giving money to any candidates, 575 00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:22,359 Speaker 6: but he has left open the possibility of donating money 576 00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:26,439 Speaker 6: via a pack and he obviously, I mean he's he 577 00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:27,840 Speaker 6: is not a big fan of. 578 00:28:27,840 --> 00:28:28,720 Speaker 2: President Joe Biden. 579 00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:30,120 Speaker 6: I mean he's made that abundantly clear. 580 00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:34,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, And also possibility he saunters into this fundraiser in 581 00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:38,920 Speaker 2: early June with May Muskintoe or somebody else. Okay, last 582 00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:41,960 Speaker 2: of these categories. And I will say that Katie and 583 00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:44,560 Speaker 2: I were the only ones brave enough to answer this 584 00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:49,360 Speaker 2: question for biggest flirt, Katie, you had Alex Spiro, who 585 00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:57,520 Speaker 2: was was Dana's life of the party. Actually, you know what, 586 00:28:57,560 --> 00:28:59,920 Speaker 2: I'd like Dana to defend that. Why why do you 587 00:28:59,920 --> 00:29:02,520 Speaker 2: think why would Alex Spiro be the biggest flirt at 588 00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:03,120 Speaker 2: Elon Land? 589 00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:03,480 Speaker 1: Oh? 590 00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:06,360 Speaker 6: Well, because if you're doing a jury trial, you've got 591 00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:09,240 Speaker 6: to be able to basically flirt with the jury to win, right, 592 00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:11,440 Speaker 6: So I could see that, you know, like you've got 593 00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:14,160 Speaker 6: to have a sort of amount of like confidence in 594 00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:17,800 Speaker 6: bravado at a real rapport with you know, with everyday 595 00:29:17,800 --> 00:29:20,040 Speaker 6: people to kind of sway them to your side. I could. 596 00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:22,800 Speaker 2: I could definitely see that. Is that enough for you? 597 00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:23,360 Speaker 1: I think so? 598 00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:27,080 Speaker 5: And I mean he's also someone who he's unlike some 599 00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:29,640 Speaker 5: of the people who work for Elon Musk, where Elon 600 00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:32,240 Speaker 5: Musk is their sole boss, Like he has other clients. 601 00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:34,720 Speaker 5: He's bitping and bopping around with lots of people. You know, 602 00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:37,200 Speaker 5: Elon is just one of many of his clients, you know. 603 00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:42,560 Speaker 2: All right. So for our final segment, we are I've 604 00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:45,280 Speaker 2: asked everyone to come up with their own category that 605 00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:50,000 Speaker 2: wasn't on this list and and a nominee. So Katie, 606 00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:53,360 Speaker 2: why don't you go first? What was your imaginary category? 607 00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:53,800 Speaker 1: Okay? 608 00:29:53,840 --> 00:29:55,440 Speaker 5: So mine was one that we did have in my 609 00:29:55,520 --> 00:29:58,880 Speaker 5: high school, which was most likely to stay past twelfth grade. 610 00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:02,240 Speaker 1: Which again is a little bit of an insult, I think. 611 00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:03,760 Speaker 2: I'd say a little bit. 612 00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:05,840 Speaker 5: It's I think it's a mix of you either love 613 00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:09,040 Speaker 5: the school so much that like kind of like school spirit, 614 00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:11,400 Speaker 5: or like, buddy, I don't think you're gonna make. 615 00:30:11,280 --> 00:30:12,520 Speaker 1: It, but you can graduate. 616 00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:16,520 Speaker 5: But I had Franz von Holtzausen, and the reason is 617 00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:19,520 Speaker 5: because he has been there a long time and I 618 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,160 Speaker 5: can sort of see him being a lifer and holding on. 619 00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:26,120 Speaker 2: Like Matthew McConaughey and you know whatever. Moving Yeah, exactly, 620 00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:30,800 Speaker 2: all right, Kurt? What was your category? 621 00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:34,360 Speaker 7: I had most likely to move your family to the 622 00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:38,760 Speaker 7: surface of Mars, And for that I had Steve Davis, 623 00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 7: the president of the Boring Company, because you may recall, 624 00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:47,240 Speaker 7: shortly after Elon took over X, Steve moved his family 625 00:30:47,360 --> 00:30:50,720 Speaker 7: into X's office and literally like lived in the conference 626 00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:55,200 Speaker 7: room with his partner and their I believe newborn child 627 00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:58,360 Speaker 7: while they were transitioning from Twitter to X. 628 00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:00,280 Speaker 4: And I just. 629 00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:03,239 Speaker 7: Thought, if anybody's willing to move their family into a 630 00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:07,760 Speaker 7: you know, office cubicle, then they're probably willing to follow 631 00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:08,680 Speaker 7: Elon to the. 632 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:11,200 Speaker 4: Surface of Mars. So Steve Davis wins that one. 633 00:31:11,320 --> 00:31:14,200 Speaker 2: Steve Davis is like a really interesting and sort of 634 00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:17,040 Speaker 2: important person in Elon Land who's been really close to him. 635 00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:20,440 Speaker 2: Is another probably another candidate. Frankly for Stay Pass twelfth grade, 636 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:23,760 Speaker 2: worked with him very closely at SpaceX was involved a 637 00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:26,600 Speaker 2: Twitter boring company. I actually had him as my class 638 00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:29,640 Speaker 2: clown for because there was a time I think he 639 00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:31,640 Speaker 2: closed it, but he for a while he owned a 640 00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:35,680 Speaker 2: frozen yogurt shop in Washington, d C. Called Mister Yogato 641 00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:39,120 Speaker 2: for some reason, like in addition to all this other 642 00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:43,440 Speaker 2: stuff he was doing. So he's he's he's an interesting person. 643 00:31:43,880 --> 00:31:46,280 Speaker 2: My category was, which I think we may have had 644 00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:49,240 Speaker 2: in my yearbook, was worst case of senioritis. This is 645 00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:52,400 Speaker 2: someone who is not not putting in all the effort, 646 00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:55,400 Speaker 2: maybe not involved enough. And I picked Peter Teel because 647 00:31:55,400 --> 00:31:57,520 Speaker 2: we think of him as being a you know, really 648 00:31:57,560 --> 00:31:59,920 Speaker 2: important power broker. But if you look at this graphic, 649 00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:01,840 Speaker 2: he's just kind of like a little piece of space 650 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:05,080 Speaker 2: garbage off to the far right corner. And and it's 651 00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:07,920 Speaker 2: it's a little bit surprising because of course Elon Musk 652 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:11,840 Speaker 2: has really like moved to Peter Thiel's worldview. He's sort 653 00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:14,880 Speaker 2: of in almost every way they've they've like come together, 654 00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:18,640 Speaker 2: and he's like managed to somehow maybe lose some of 655 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:21,440 Speaker 2: the luster. Maybe Elon's taken some of his thunder, Dana, 656 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:24,720 Speaker 2: I'm gonna give you the last category. What was it? 657 00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:27,200 Speaker 6: Well, of course my category was most dramatic. 658 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:29,480 Speaker 2: All right, let's listen to some tape that that helps 659 00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:31,080 Speaker 2: explain or maybe predicts the answer. 660 00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:34,520 Speaker 3: Look, I know I sometimes say or post strange things, 661 00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:37,480 Speaker 3: but that's just how my brain works. Do anyone have offended? 662 00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:40,720 Speaker 3: I just want to say, I reinvented electric cars and 663 00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:48,280 Speaker 3: I'm sending people to Mars in our rocket ship. Did 664 00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:49,960 Speaker 3: you think I was also going to be a chill 665 00:32:50,040 --> 00:32:51,560 Speaker 3: normal dude. 666 00:32:51,360 --> 00:32:53,160 Speaker 2: Dana, couldn't have any been any other way. 667 00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:55,160 Speaker 6: It really couldn't have been. But I actually thought you 668 00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:57,360 Speaker 6: were gonna play the clip from when he spoke a 669 00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:00,000 Speaker 6: due book and told Bob Iger and all the advertised 670 00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:02,960 Speaker 6: who were boycotting acts to go f themselves. I mean, 671 00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:07,000 Speaker 6: this is not a subtle person. And you know, this 672 00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:09,760 Speaker 6: is a guy who like fire. You know, he's laid 673 00:33:09,800 --> 00:33:12,440 Speaker 6: off or fired like thousands of people at Tesla over 674 00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:15,760 Speaker 6: the last month. In one case, he basically disbanded an 675 00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:18,880 Speaker 6: entire team and then started quietly hiring some people back. 676 00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:22,040 Speaker 6: He doesn't do anything subtle, and even his like emails 677 00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:24,880 Speaker 6: to his employees are like you've got to be totally 678 00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:29,280 Speaker 6: hardcore work all weekend, Like there's nothing, I mean everything, 679 00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:31,080 Speaker 6: Everything is always dramatic with him. 680 00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:34,880 Speaker 2: Can you when do you think this like Elon as 681 00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:39,000 Speaker 2: this like figure of cultural fascination, Like when did it 682 00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:41,040 Speaker 2: be in for like when did it start to really 683 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:43,880 Speaker 2: feel like in your world like that he was somebody 684 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:46,560 Speaker 2: who mattered just like beyond the companies and like like 685 00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:47,440 Speaker 2: what caused it? 686 00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:49,120 Speaker 1: So that's a good question. 687 00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:51,760 Speaker 5: I feel like for a while I sort of was 688 00:33:53,160 --> 00:33:58,040 Speaker 5: as someone who's not primarily interested in like cars or 689 00:33:58,080 --> 00:34:02,200 Speaker 5: space in I mean, I guess I'm interested in them existing, 690 00:34:02,280 --> 00:34:04,920 Speaker 5: but you know, in my coverage or whatnot, I wasn't 691 00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:08,120 Speaker 5: that you know, excited by him. 692 00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:10,719 Speaker 1: But then I want to say, actually, like we just 693 00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:11,920 Speaker 1: played a clip. 694 00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:13,400 Speaker 5: From when he was on Saturday Night Live, and I 695 00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:16,000 Speaker 5: feel like that sort of was right at a moment 696 00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:21,839 Speaker 5: where like something was turning with him where he was 697 00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:27,839 Speaker 5: going from like a guy who is a famous businessman 698 00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:31,400 Speaker 5: to like someone who kind of exists in pop culture 699 00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:34,480 Speaker 5: in a much much bigger and fascinating and weird way. 700 00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:38,400 Speaker 5: And I also think that the moment where he showed 701 00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,640 Speaker 5: up on the met gala with Grimes was that was 702 00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:43,839 Speaker 5: like that was sort of the damn breaking of like 703 00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:47,359 Speaker 5: this is just fun, Like this is now you are 704 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:48,600 Speaker 5: a pop culture figure. 705 00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:53,160 Speaker 7: Once he you know, decided once he became the richest 706 00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:56,239 Speaker 7: person in the world, and once she bought a website 707 00:34:56,239 --> 00:35:00,640 Speaker 7: that is all about influencing culture and shape being the 708 00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:02,600 Speaker 7: news and the facts. 709 00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:03,040 Speaker 4: That people get. 710 00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:06,520 Speaker 7: Like to me that obviously he was a well known, 711 00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:10,440 Speaker 7: of course, and very prominent person before that, but I 712 00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:11,920 Speaker 7: feel like to me that was more of the tipping 713 00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:14,799 Speaker 7: point was like suddenly he wasn't just this famous tech guy. 714 00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:18,120 Speaker 7: He was now the famous tech guy who owns the 715 00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:22,239 Speaker 7: distribution channel for what has created like a lot of 716 00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:26,440 Speaker 7: really important Internet moments right, which was Twitter. So to me, 717 00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:29,120 Speaker 7: like that purchase was what sort of you know, it's 718 00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:32,920 Speaker 7: not been two years or whatever. I think that purchase 719 00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:35,680 Speaker 7: is sort of what pushed him into this, Like, Okay, 720 00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:37,760 Speaker 7: we're not just looking at him as the cool iron 721 00:35:37,800 --> 00:35:39,759 Speaker 7: man guy. We're now looking at him in a very 722 00:35:39,800 --> 00:35:42,799 Speaker 7: different light because of the power that he has over speech. 723 00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:42,960 Speaker 9: In the world. 724 00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:43,680 Speaker 1: Yeah. 725 00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:45,600 Speaker 6: I think that peak Elon may have been when he 726 00:35:45,640 --> 00:35:49,239 Speaker 6: hosted Saturday Night Live. And then now it's like he's 727 00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:52,319 Speaker 6: kind of on the downward slope in that when once 728 00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:55,440 Speaker 6: you become so powerful, then you have a target on 729 00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:58,000 Speaker 6: your back. And like the backlash is very real. People 730 00:35:58,080 --> 00:35:59,920 Speaker 6: used to hold him in very high esteem. There's now 731 00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:03,040 Speaker 6: like a real Elon backlash. You're seeing like bumper stickers 732 00:36:03,360 --> 00:36:05,600 Speaker 6: on Tesla's in the Bay Area that say things like 733 00:36:05,680 --> 00:36:08,120 Speaker 6: I bought my car before I knew Elon was crazy. 734 00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:09,879 Speaker 1: You have people. 735 00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:13,880 Speaker 6: Actively saying that they're voting no at the Tesla shareholder meeting. 736 00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:17,239 Speaker 6: I don't know if he inspires the same kind of like, 737 00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:21,680 Speaker 6: you know, feeling that he used to when he was 738 00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:23,960 Speaker 6: just like this guy trying to solve the problem of 739 00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:24,760 Speaker 6: climate change. 740 00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:28,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I mean that is I think ultimately like 741 00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:32,440 Speaker 2: why this graphic, why this discussion matters, Because as funny 742 00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:35,239 Speaker 2: as it is to like, you know, talk about who 743 00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:39,520 Speaker 2: is the biggest flirt in elon Land, it's also these 744 00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:43,840 Speaker 2: are the people that are causing this incredibly wealthy, incredibly 745 00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:46,040 Speaker 2: powerful person to do the things that he does. I mean, 746 00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:48,480 Speaker 2: they could even I mean, you know, David Sax could 747 00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:49,279 Speaker 2: be president. 748 00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:49,239 Speaker 10: Y' all. 749 00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:52,920 Speaker 2: So that's why we're doing this, and I'm sure we 750 00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:56,480 Speaker 2: will revisit these topics again and again in the weeks 751 00:36:56,520 --> 00:37:02,920 Speaker 2: to come. Yeah, thank you, Katie not Topolas, thank you 752 00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:06,160 Speaker 2: so much for having me. Kurt Dana, thanks for being 753 00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:07,120 Speaker 2: on the podcast. 754 00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:09,400 Speaker 4: As always, absolutely thank you. 755 00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:10,960 Speaker 6: Always a pleasure. 756 00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:20,480 Speaker 2: This episode is produced by Stacey Wong, Naomi Shavan and 757 00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:23,600 Speaker 2: Rayhan Are Monsieur senior editors. The idea for this very 758 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:27,920 Speaker 2: show also came from Rayhn Blake Maple's Handles Engineering, and 759 00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:31,759 Speaker 2: we get special editing assistants from Jeff Grocott and Antonia Mufarich. 760 00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:35,960 Speaker 2: Our supervising producer is Magnus Hendrickson. The Elonink theme is 761 00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:40,040 Speaker 2: written and performed by Takai Yasusawa and Alex Segiera. Brendan 762 00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:43,880 Speaker 2: Francis Newnham is our executive producer, and Sage Bauman is 763 00:37:43,880 --> 00:37:47,000 Speaker 2: the head of Bloomberg Podcasts. I'm Max Chafkin. If you 764 00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:49,200 Speaker 2: have a minute, rate and review our show, it'll help 765 00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:52,240 Speaker 2: other listeners find us and we will see you next week.