1 00:00:01,560 --> 00:00:05,240 Speaker 1: From Marhard. We're Innovation Money and Power co Line in 2 00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:10,560 Speaker 1: Silicon Valley, NBN. This is Bloomberg Technology with Caroline Hyde and. 3 00:00:10,640 --> 00:00:11,719 Speaker 2: Ed Ludlow. 4 00:00:25,840 --> 00:00:27,680 Speaker 3: Live from Roomberg's World headquarters in New York. 5 00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 4: And Caroline Hyde and I'm Ed Lovelow as if by 6 00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:31,320 Speaker 4: Magic also in the Big Apple. 7 00:00:31,400 --> 00:00:33,320 Speaker 5: This is Bloomberg Technology. 8 00:00:32,800 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 3: Coming up and Intel it plunges after disappointing investors with 9 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:37,920 Speaker 3: its forecast. We're going to be sitting down with the 10 00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:42,000 Speaker 3: Intel CEO, Pat Gelsinger to break down the company's results. 11 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:45,519 Speaker 4: For bet Amazon and Microsoft facing FTC probes about their 12 00:00:45,560 --> 00:00:50,280 Speaker 4: investments and partnerships with AI companies, Details ahead and salesforce. 13 00:00:50,320 --> 00:00:52,559 Speaker 3: Look, it's adding to a brutal string of tech layoffs 14 00:00:52,560 --> 00:00:56,200 Speaker 3: in twenty twenty four, announcing its slashing seven hundred workers. 15 00:00:56,520 --> 00:00:59,080 Speaker 4: Well, look, there's just a single point of focus in 16 00:00:59,120 --> 00:01:01,200 Speaker 4: tech right now, which is Intel. The stock in the 17 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 4: session down more than ten percent intraday, biggest dropping around 18 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:07,280 Speaker 4: a year. If it closes down beyond ten percent, it 19 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:09,520 Speaker 4: will be the biggest drop since the end of twenty 20 00:01:09,560 --> 00:01:10,039 Speaker 4: twenty one. 21 00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:10,840 Speaker 5: What is going on? 22 00:01:11,000 --> 00:01:14,520 Speaker 4: Well, the outlook has us worried, particularly about how Intel 23 00:01:14,600 --> 00:01:16,880 Speaker 4: is faring in the market for chips that go into 24 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 4: data centers. But remember they're also growing this fledgling foundry 25 00:01:20,760 --> 00:01:23,200 Speaker 4: business and there was just a lack of detail. We 26 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:25,880 Speaker 4: don't know who the customers are, but there also doesn't 27 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:29,040 Speaker 4: seem to be enough dollars committed to that foundry and 28 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 4: fab business. We're going to be speaking later in the 29 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:34,240 Speaker 4: hour with Pat Gelsinger, the CEO of Intel. If you're 30 00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:37,960 Speaker 4: watching on Bloomberg Television, you're on the terminal ibs, contact 31 00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:40,400 Speaker 4: us on social media with your questions because there are 32 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:42,640 Speaker 4: lots of questions to ask on where are we at 33 00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:45,920 Speaker 4: in this turnaround plan that bat Gelsinger has kind of 34 00:01:45,959 --> 00:01:48,000 Speaker 4: put in front of investors for a number of quarters. 35 00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 3: Right now, Cara and ed a lot of what he's 36 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:53,920 Speaker 3: been hoping for is well the wins of positivity coming 37 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:56,240 Speaker 3: from AI investment. But let's just talk about AI in 38 00:01:56,240 --> 00:01:58,720 Speaker 3: a different way right now from the regulatory perspective, because 39 00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:02,240 Speaker 3: the FTC has launch an inquiry into Alphabet, Amazon, Microsoft 40 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:06,680 Speaker 3: on their investments and partnerships with companies like Anthropic, like 41 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:09,359 Speaker 3: open Ai, those private companies. This is part of a 42 00:02:09,400 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 3: study on how artificial intelligence is impacting competition in the 43 00:02:13,200 --> 00:02:16,280 Speaker 3: tech industry and used to say bluemeggs. Jackie Davlas are 44 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:20,400 Speaker 3: AI expert and also Washington expert joins us now and Jackie. 45 00:02:20,520 --> 00:02:22,799 Speaker 3: The FDC here is really trying to garner as to 46 00:02:22,840 --> 00:02:25,080 Speaker 3: whether or not these are kind of M and A 47 00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:26,240 Speaker 3: deals by a backdoor. 48 00:02:27,840 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 6: Well, when you look at it, they're not small deals. 49 00:02:30,639 --> 00:02:33,760 Speaker 6: They might be creative and that it's not a traditional 50 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:38,079 Speaker 6: mergers and acquisition steal. But the FTC is well aware 51 00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:40,080 Speaker 6: of that. And the reason they are on their radar 52 00:02:40,240 --> 00:02:44,040 Speaker 6: is because it's a massive amount of money. It's nineteen 53 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:49,400 Speaker 6: billion dollars collectively between the thirteen billion Microsoft committed to 54 00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:54,320 Speaker 6: open AI, the two billion that Anthropic raked in from Alphabet, 55 00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:56,639 Speaker 6: and then the almost four billion. 56 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:58,080 Speaker 3: It got from Amazon. 57 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 6: These are enormous stay and the FTC wants to understand 58 00:03:02,160 --> 00:03:05,480 Speaker 6: should they be subject to the same types of merger rules. Now, 59 00:03:05,600 --> 00:03:08,960 Speaker 6: they're not the only regulators that got that have these 60 00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:12,200 Speaker 6: companies on their radar. The UK started their own inquiry 61 00:03:12,680 --> 00:03:15,800 Speaker 6: in December, and then you had the European Union also 62 00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:17,720 Speaker 6: starting to take a look at whether they should be 63 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:22,280 Speaker 6: kind of looked at like a merger would. Earlier this month, you. 64 00:03:22,240 --> 00:03:22,680 Speaker 5: Know, Jackie. 65 00:03:22,720 --> 00:03:26,400 Speaker 4: The FTC has the who's who of megacat tech in 66 00:03:26,440 --> 00:03:29,760 Speaker 4: their sites and the leaders in building of lms. But 67 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:32,119 Speaker 4: I want to go to Microsoft specifically because of being 68 00:03:32,120 --> 00:03:35,360 Speaker 4: the world's most valuable company as it stands, but also 69 00:03:35,840 --> 00:03:38,400 Speaker 4: the Microsoft OpenAI thing is somewhere. 70 00:03:38,120 --> 00:03:39,680 Speaker 5: Something We've done a lot of reporting on. 71 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:42,200 Speaker 4: What is Microsoft's response been to the news of the 72 00:03:42,240 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 4: last twenty four hours. 73 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 6: They defended the partnership and actually said that the US 74 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:52,080 Speaker 6: has been ahead in AI because of these partnerships. Their 75 00:03:52,160 --> 00:03:55,480 Speaker 6: top competition's lawyer also said that they look forward to 76 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:59,160 Speaker 6: providing the information the FTC needs to really assess the 77 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:03,920 Speaker 6: nature of this relationship. But you're absolutely rated. Microsoft here 78 00:04:04,120 --> 00:04:07,120 Speaker 6: is arguably more at risk than perhaps some of these 79 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:11,040 Speaker 6: other companies. Microsoft has overhauled its entire product line to 80 00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:16,240 Speaker 6: integrate open AI's AAI technology and large language model into 81 00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:20,240 Speaker 6: the most ubiquitous tools and its most profitable tools it has. 82 00:04:20,640 --> 00:04:23,920 Speaker 6: And so of course, whether the FTC decides that there's 83 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:27,480 Speaker 6: nothing to see here, that these partnerships are valid, that's 84 00:04:27,520 --> 00:04:30,240 Speaker 6: one outcome, But then the other one could mean untangling 85 00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:33,360 Speaker 6: these partnerships in some way. And this is where Microsoft 86 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:35,400 Speaker 6: is arguably more exposed. 87 00:04:35,279 --> 00:04:38,080 Speaker 4: Kay Bloomberg's Jackie Davlos out in DC with the reporting. 88 00:04:38,160 --> 00:04:38,400 Speaker 5: Thank you. 89 00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:42,560 Speaker 4: Let's continue the conversation with Christina Kafara, co founder and 90 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:45,880 Speaker 4: vice chair of the Competition Research Policy Network at the 91 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:49,760 Speaker 4: Center for Economic Policy Research in London. She's a specialist 92 00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:53,200 Speaker 4: in antitrust and it is advised on high profile landmark 93 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:57,159 Speaker 4: competition cases on behalf of the tech companies Microsoft, Apple, 94 00:04:57,400 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 4: Amazon and many others. We've been through the detail, but 95 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:02,800 Speaker 4: the timing for me is really interesting. There has been 96 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:05,480 Speaker 4: a large body of reporting, most of it from Bloomberg, 97 00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:09,880 Speaker 4: about regulators around the world looking at the relationship between 98 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 4: mega cat tech and the new players in AI. Why 99 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:15,480 Speaker 4: do you think the FTC is acted now. 100 00:05:17,120 --> 00:05:19,000 Speaker 7: It's a pleasure to be here. Thank you for having me. 101 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:24,919 Speaker 7: The reason this announcement by the FDC is significant is 102 00:05:25,520 --> 00:05:28,039 Speaker 7: that it is the first of the regulators who is 103 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:33,599 Speaker 7: actually doing a wide ranging type of investigation over these partnerships. 104 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:38,840 Speaker 7: As your reporter mentioned, the uk CMA, the UK regulator, 105 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 7: the European Commissioner already looking into this specific partnership between 106 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:47,600 Speaker 7: OpenAI and Microsoft, but there is a border focus in 107 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:51,120 Speaker 7: the FDC's announcement and what's behind it. And it is 108 00:05:51,200 --> 00:05:55,360 Speaker 7: really common to all of these regulators that I certainly 109 00:05:55,400 --> 00:06:00,000 Speaker 7: would describe them as a triad of fairly progressive regulators 110 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:04,799 Speaker 7: European Commissioned, the UK Regulator, and the US agencies. What's 111 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:12,760 Speaker 7: common between them is an anxiety that essentially we do 112 00:06:12,839 --> 00:06:16,560 Speaker 7: not want to see the same playbook unfold again. What 113 00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:19,480 Speaker 7: has happened in the past is that regulators has been 114 00:06:19,839 --> 00:06:24,279 Speaker 7: very slow in intervening. For the first decade and the 115 00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:25,440 Speaker 7: second decade, really. 116 00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:29,480 Speaker 8: There's been a reluctance to intervening these sectors because there 117 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:32,240 Speaker 8: was a sense that anti trust is really a problem 118 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:37,240 Speaker 8: that affects law, innovation sectors, an analog rather than digital. 119 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:40,880 Speaker 7: And things will take care of themselves. So anti trust 120 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:45,600 Speaker 7: intervention as being late, and this is really what is 121 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:49,719 Speaker 7: powering the anxiety. The regulators are we cannot let this 122 00:06:49,880 --> 00:06:53,279 Speaker 7: playbook unfold yet again. We need to be vigilant, We 123 00:06:53,320 --> 00:06:54,920 Speaker 7: need to be seen to be doing something. 124 00:06:55,080 --> 00:07:00,560 Speaker 3: Christina, what about the anxiety? Is it a reality that 125 00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:05,240 Speaker 3: anxiety that basically these partnerships are more than partnerships, They 126 00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:07,719 Speaker 3: are indeed em and a they are indeed control. 127 00:07:08,960 --> 00:07:09,120 Speaker 4: Oh. 128 00:07:09,160 --> 00:07:14,960 Speaker 7: Absolutely, the anxiety extends to this because The concern internal 129 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:20,520 Speaker 7: to the agencies is that boardrooms have internalized that the 130 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:25,480 Speaker 7: climate of enforcement has become more hostile to deals. I mean, 131 00:07:25,480 --> 00:07:28,520 Speaker 7: if you think about Microsoft activision into two years and 132 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:30,840 Speaker 7: it is int obit there. So there is a general 133 00:07:31,040 --> 00:07:34,680 Speaker 7: awareness that doing deals is much more difficult now, and 134 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:37,800 Speaker 7: there is an anxiety that companies are effectively the fact 135 00:07:37,800 --> 00:07:44,000 Speaker 7: to circumventing merger control by dressing up these relationships as partnerships. 136 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:47,160 Speaker 7: So this is certainly the second leg of the anxiety. 137 00:07:47,240 --> 00:07:49,800 Speaker 7: We've been too late, We've not done enough, and now 138 00:07:50,160 --> 00:07:52,640 Speaker 7: we are exposed to the rest that these companies are 139 00:07:52,680 --> 00:07:56,080 Speaker 7: actually doing deals by the backdoor. So that's really. 140 00:07:55,960 --> 00:07:59,679 Speaker 4: Why Christian significant, Caroline and I have covered so many 141 00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:03,920 Speaker 4: these FTC inquiries on this program Bloomberg Technology. All of 142 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:06,600 Speaker 4: them slightly different, but the question they all share in 143 00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:11,240 Speaker 4: common is to whose benefit is the FTC acting. You know, 144 00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:13,680 Speaker 4: people are worried about AI, but there's also a broad 145 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:16,840 Speaker 4: body of people that say this could really help humankind. 146 00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:20,560 Speaker 4: It's very expensive to achieve, and those names that are 147 00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:23,520 Speaker 4: the subject of this inquiry are those with the capital 148 00:08:23,880 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 4: to drive the progress. Does the FTC put any weight 149 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:27,520 Speaker 4: on that latter argument? 150 00:08:28,560 --> 00:08:32,000 Speaker 7: Of course, and I think Lina Khan in her announcement 151 00:08:32,080 --> 00:08:36,080 Speaker 7: yesterday emphasized at the beginning that these points are well taken. 152 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:40,000 Speaker 7: I think humanity to the extent possible wants to benefit 153 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:42,040 Speaker 7: from this. And of course we're all aware that there 154 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:44,480 Speaker 7: are massive investments that need to be put into this, 155 00:08:44,559 --> 00:08:48,160 Speaker 7: which is why these players out at the forefront of development. 156 00:08:48,240 --> 00:08:52,439 Speaker 7: That said, we have a recent history, which is a 157 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:56,520 Speaker 7: history of failure of engaging with these questions and why 158 00:08:56,679 --> 00:08:59,720 Speaker 7: one doesn't want to prejudge the outcome. One needs to 159 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:04,320 Speaker 7: be vigilant because we have spent the last ten years, 160 00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:09,079 Speaker 7: certainly in Europe, but I reside trying to pursue exposed 161 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:12,240 Speaker 7: investigations of conduct. You're at that point in the US too, 162 00:09:12,280 --> 00:09:14,559 Speaker 7: you have an number of complaints. How many years will 163 00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:17,760 Speaker 7: it take before anything will move? Before everything comes even 164 00:09:17,880 --> 00:09:19,000 Speaker 7: to a court? 165 00:09:20,520 --> 00:09:24,600 Speaker 3: The google Christina's when you look at what's happening in Europe, 166 00:09:24,920 --> 00:09:29,160 Speaker 3: they're actually taking regulatory action that forces a change. Will 167 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:31,760 Speaker 3: we see actually companies front run this. 168 00:09:34,559 --> 00:09:38,160 Speaker 7: In Europe? What you've seen is because anti trust has 169 00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:41,680 Speaker 7: failed spectacularly to deliver so far, we've been at it 170 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:44,160 Speaker 7: for fifteen years. There hasn't been a moving of the dial. 171 00:09:44,200 --> 00:09:47,559 Speaker 7: There hasn't been a single anti trust decision on Google 172 00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:51,760 Speaker 7: and others that has actually changed the situation on the ground. 173 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:54,800 Speaker 7: So we pivoted to regulation. Now it remains to be 174 00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:57,920 Speaker 7: seen whether this is regulation which is now being implemented 175 00:09:57,960 --> 00:10:01,400 Speaker 7: it's going to move the dial itself. These are all experiments, Frankly. 176 00:10:02,160 --> 00:10:04,880 Speaker 7: The sense is therefore that if you kind of try 177 00:10:04,920 --> 00:10:09,560 Speaker 7: and correct the issue when the monopolies are established, where 178 00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:14,520 Speaker 7: market power is established, when power is entrenched, you struggle, 179 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:17,960 Speaker 7: you are not going to be able to effectively undo 180 00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:22,080 Speaker 7: that power. And so the notion of looking at it 181 00:10:22,160 --> 00:10:25,880 Speaker 7: early and looking at what the nature of this partnership, 182 00:10:25,960 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 7: for example, is so, what are the potential issue here? 183 00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 7: I mean, think about this industry as a supply chain 184 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:34,720 Speaker 7: that's practicalized. Never mind that there is at the bottom 185 00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:38,200 Speaker 7: a lot of competition. The issue is the power at 186 00:10:38,240 --> 00:10:40,679 Speaker 7: the level of the inputs, the power the level of 187 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:44,559 Speaker 7: the models. Now, if that power is very concentrated, then 188 00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:46,800 Speaker 7: the question that I relate us need to ask is 189 00:10:47,080 --> 00:10:50,080 Speaker 7: how will that input which is essential to all of 190 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:55,000 Speaker 7: these products the general models be effectively supplied, will be 191 00:10:55,200 --> 00:10:58,400 Speaker 7: supplied on conditions that are these advantageous that are extracted. 192 00:10:58,440 --> 00:11:02,439 Speaker 7: That that exploi is actively remove the ability of arders 193 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:06,640 Speaker 7: to compete. The fact that at the product level there's 194 00:11:06,920 --> 00:11:11,720 Speaker 7: thousands of people implementing AI application, it's jolly good. But 195 00:11:11,800 --> 00:11:14,920 Speaker 7: if there's only one, two or three suppliers of this, 196 00:11:15,440 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 7: then the question becomes will they preference themselves? Will they 197 00:11:18,400 --> 00:11:21,360 Speaker 7: have advanced notice of the work Christina x development? 198 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:23,160 Speaker 5: Will they and. 199 00:11:23,160 --> 00:11:28,599 Speaker 7: To conclude, will they effectively favor the development of technology 200 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:29,439 Speaker 7: ways that suit them? 201 00:11:30,240 --> 00:11:32,719 Speaker 3: Some food for thought for sure, Christina Kafara, We thank 202 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:35,120 Speaker 3: you for the time and the expertise Center of Economic 203 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:39,240 Speaker 3: Policy Research over in London, Happy weekend. Meanwhile, sticking on 204 00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:42,120 Speaker 3: a theme of AI open, AI CEO Sam Altman when 205 00:11:42,120 --> 00:11:44,280 Speaker 3: he's actually visiting leaders in South Koreas se in conductor 206 00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:46,840 Speaker 3: industry this week. This is as he's weighing, of course, 207 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:50,320 Speaker 3: a pretty ambitious move into chip production. Altman has arrived 208 00:11:50,360 --> 00:11:53,120 Speaker 3: in Seoul last night and he's touring some songs chip 209 00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:56,199 Speaker 3: fabrication plants today. According to a source, he's also scheduled 210 00:11:56,360 --> 00:11:58,720 Speaker 3: to meet the CEO of rival s k Heinex to 211 00:11:58,760 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 3: discuss ways to collaborate and something. 212 00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:02,120 Speaker 5: We're reporting that yeah, big time. 213 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:05,200 Speaker 3: So in another effort to cut costs, Salesforce is now 214 00:12:05,240 --> 00:12:08,800 Speaker 3: the latest big tech company resorting to layoffs. Gloomberg's Brody 215 00:12:08,840 --> 00:12:11,920 Speaker 3: Ford has details and Brody Salesforce has already kind of 216 00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:15,200 Speaker 3: number of staff. This time. It's small than percentage form, 217 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:17,679 Speaker 3: But seven hundred is nothing to be sniffed. 218 00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:20,920 Speaker 9: At, right, Yeah, it's tempting to say that, hey, a 219 00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 9: year ago there was you know, seven thousand people cut. 220 00:12:24,600 --> 00:12:26,920 Speaker 9: Now it's seven hundred, so we don't care so much. 221 00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:29,720 Speaker 9: But it's still What it shows to us is that 222 00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:33,000 Speaker 9: the tech industry is still focused on cutting costs, and 223 00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:37,080 Speaker 9: this may become a more regular part of the year. Right, 224 00:12:37,800 --> 00:12:40,240 Speaker 9: It's like we're going back to nineteen fifty and ge 225 00:12:40,280 --> 00:12:41,200 Speaker 9: and stack ranking. 226 00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:41,480 Speaker 10: Right. 227 00:12:41,520 --> 00:12:45,400 Speaker 9: We saw this with Microsoft, Amazon, Google. Companies that made 228 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:49,560 Speaker 9: big cuts last year are doing well financially still see 229 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:53,559 Speaker 9: it in their interest to trim a couple percentage points periodically, 230 00:12:53,679 --> 00:12:56,079 Speaker 9: So I expect this to be a trend to continue. 231 00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:59,160 Speaker 4: The point of difference from this time last year is, yes, 232 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:01,000 Speaker 4: the size of the c but if you go on 233 00:13:01,080 --> 00:13:04,680 Speaker 4: any website of those that have cut Salesforce, Microsoft, whatever, 234 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:08,840 Speaker 4: they're also hiring and where they're hiring is clear as day. 235 00:13:08,840 --> 00:13:12,719 Speaker 9: Brody, Yeah, where there. I mean, it's two letterers. We've 236 00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:14,160 Speaker 9: been here and every day for the last year and 237 00:13:14,200 --> 00:13:18,440 Speaker 9: a half. AI Right Salesforce has told me that they're 238 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:21,440 Speaker 9: really hiring for engineering roles and for those who are 239 00:13:21,520 --> 00:13:24,720 Speaker 9: going to market for their AI products. I think a 240 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:28,520 Speaker 9: lot of companies salesforce more than most, really focused on 241 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:32,160 Speaker 9: pairing back these traditional sales and marketing rules. Yeah, so 242 00:13:32,240 --> 00:13:34,200 Speaker 9: now they're kind of investing in what's going to bring 243 00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:38,600 Speaker 9: them further. And you know, unfortunately for some workers, it 244 00:13:38,679 --> 00:13:41,800 Speaker 9: is probably cheaper to fire than hire externally than it 245 00:13:41,880 --> 00:13:43,680 Speaker 9: is maybe to retrain some of your people. 246 00:13:44,200 --> 00:13:48,719 Speaker 4: Goodbye marketing, Hello computers, Bloombog's Brody forward, Thank you very much. 247 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:51,400 Speaker 4: Now coming up here on Bloomberg Technology, we go back 248 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 4: to Earning's coverage and we sit down with Intel CEO 249 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:58,079 Speaker 4: Pat Gelsinger amid the company's results that often investors a 250 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:02,200 Speaker 4: disappointing forecast in the stock down significantly as a result. 251 00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:09,760 Speaker 4: That's coming up next. This is Bloomberg Technology. Welcome to 252 00:14:09,800 --> 00:14:14,160 Speaker 4: our Bloomberg television and radio audiences worldwide. The focus Intel 253 00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:17,040 Speaker 4: and the chip makers earnings a forecast for the current 254 00:14:17,080 --> 00:14:21,440 Speaker 4: period that makes the market nervous about Pat Gelsinger's turnaround 255 00:14:21,520 --> 00:14:25,640 Speaker 4: plan for Intel, some worry about its data center business 256 00:14:25,880 --> 00:14:28,760 Speaker 4: and a fledgling foundry business. I'm delighted to say we 257 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:33,840 Speaker 4: are joined by Pat Gelsinger, Intel CEO. The stock is 258 00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:37,600 Speaker 4: down more than ten percent. What is it that the 259 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 4: market is not understanding here for Intel? 260 00:14:41,800 --> 00:14:44,160 Speaker 11: Well, thanks, Ed, and always a pleasure to be with 261 00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:45,320 Speaker 11: you and Carolyn on the show. 262 00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:47,800 Speaker 1: First, we've finished a great year. 263 00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:51,160 Speaker 11: At Q four, beat on top and bottom line, finishing 264 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 11: a year that was comfortably ahead and showing the transformation 265 00:14:55,200 --> 00:14:56,640 Speaker 11: journey that we're on, and. 266 00:14:57,040 --> 00:14:58,680 Speaker 1: We believe we're putting points on. 267 00:14:58,640 --> 00:15:03,320 Speaker 11: The board for a law term transformation of this iconic company. 268 00:15:03,640 --> 00:15:05,840 Speaker 11: In light of that, Hey, the Q one, you're at 269 00:15:05,880 --> 00:15:08,280 Speaker 11: the low end of seasonal, So we think the market 270 00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:12,240 Speaker 11: reaction is a bit overstated in that respect. We understand it, 271 00:15:12,560 --> 00:15:16,480 Speaker 11: but our company, our employees are doing an incredible job 272 00:15:16,760 --> 00:15:22,240 Speaker 11: at delivering our process technology, restoring product leadership, defining new 273 00:15:22,320 --> 00:15:26,400 Speaker 11: categories like the AIPC. We're on a multi year journey 274 00:15:26,520 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 11: and we're not going to be judged on a ninety 275 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:30,960 Speaker 11: day shot clock. We are out to rebuild this company 276 00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:34,120 Speaker 11: and we had a great twenty three and I'm confident 277 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:35,920 Speaker 11: in a grade twenty four for this company. 278 00:15:36,240 --> 00:15:38,280 Speaker 4: Pat there were there were so many questions on the 279 00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:41,360 Speaker 4: call about your foundry business, and for our global audience, 280 00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:44,880 Speaker 4: that's the sort of contract manufacturing business where you make 281 00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:49,200 Speaker 4: chips for others, and you seem to say that you 282 00:15:49,320 --> 00:15:53,200 Speaker 4: didn't get as many committed dollars as you thought you might, 283 00:15:53,240 --> 00:15:55,440 Speaker 4: and I wonder what's standing in the way of that 284 00:15:55,960 --> 00:15:59,760 Speaker 4: customers committing to backing your foundry business. 285 00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:03,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, and we're very comfortable with the progress. You know. 286 00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:05,600 Speaker 11: We said that we'd have one on our leading edge 287 00:16:05,640 --> 00:16:09,120 Speaker 11: Node eighteen A as it's called, and we delivered four 288 00:16:09,200 --> 00:16:11,280 Speaker 11: for the year. We also found that there was a 289 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:15,520 Speaker 11: lot of momentum in our packaging business where we now 290 00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:20,320 Speaker 11: have five major customers on our advanced packaging technology and 291 00:16:20,360 --> 00:16:22,920 Speaker 11: we said, hey, we went from four billion to over 292 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:24,880 Speaker 11: ten billion of lifetime deal values. 293 00:16:24,920 --> 00:16:26,120 Speaker 1: So good momentum. 294 00:16:26,200 --> 00:16:30,360 Speaker 11: But most importantly is the process technology itself. Are we 295 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:33,520 Speaker 11: back to a leadership technology and we're hitting all the 296 00:16:33,560 --> 00:16:37,960 Speaker 11: milestones this audacious five nodes and four year plan and 297 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 11: all the milestones are on track to have us back 298 00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:43,120 Speaker 11: to process leadership in twenty five and as I say, 299 00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:46,080 Speaker 11: a foundery company, they want to know that if they 300 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:48,760 Speaker 11: design on us, they can build the best products. And 301 00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:53,120 Speaker 11: we're gaining momentum in delivering on exactly that promise, and 302 00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:56,400 Speaker 11: so proud of my team's for delivering on such an 303 00:16:56,400 --> 00:16:57,280 Speaker 11: audacious plan. 304 00:16:57,400 --> 00:16:58,160 Speaker 1: We're on track. 305 00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:02,520 Speaker 3: What about track for AI accelerators not just AI on 306 00:17:02,560 --> 00:17:06,879 Speaker 3: the PC, but I put it bluntly, pat and videos 307 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:10,840 Speaker 3: run away with this, when or can you regain any 308 00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:12,199 Speaker 3: sort of leadership in that space? 309 00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:16,000 Speaker 11: Yeah, and clearly that's been an area of strength for them. 310 00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:19,080 Speaker 11: We appreciate that they've as I say, focused on that 311 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:21,880 Speaker 11: for many years and the market has come their way 312 00:17:21,920 --> 00:17:25,000 Speaker 11: in a strong way. But our roadmap is gaining momentum. 313 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:28,600 Speaker 11: Goudy two, we said, we're seeing a significant expansion in 314 00:17:28,600 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 11: the customer pipeline. 315 00:17:30,359 --> 00:17:30,880 Speaker 1: That we have. 316 00:17:30,960 --> 00:17:33,399 Speaker 11: We're ramping up supply, so I'll say we're chasing to 317 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:36,639 Speaker 11: have enough supply to meet marketing. We're well underway on 318 00:17:36,720 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 11: our next generation Gouty three as it's called, with four 319 00:17:40,520 --> 00:17:43,040 Speaker 11: x the compute, two x the network in the lab, 320 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:49,200 Speaker 11: gaining really really good early debug in bringing that product 321 00:17:49,240 --> 00:17:51,880 Speaker 11: to market later this year. So we feel like, hey, 322 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:54,199 Speaker 11: you know, yes, we have a lot of work to 323 00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:57,080 Speaker 11: do here, but the momentum is building, the market is 324 00:17:57,119 --> 00:18:00,159 Speaker 11: looking for alternatives, and our roadmap is strengthening is we 325 00:18:00,160 --> 00:18:03,159 Speaker 11: go through the year. But more importantly, Carolyn, is this 326 00:18:03,320 --> 00:18:06,720 Speaker 11: idea that last year was the year of high end training. 327 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:09,560 Speaker 11: This year it's about how do I use those models? 328 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:12,439 Speaker 11: And that's much more about the enterprise strength. 're Intel 329 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:15,760 Speaker 11: is at the edge in the PC and in the 330 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:18,600 Speaker 11: enterprise data center. So we see the market coming our 331 00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:21,760 Speaker 11: way in AI in twenty four and twenty five. 332 00:18:21,680 --> 00:18:23,960 Speaker 3: And let's go to that core segment. Let's go to 333 00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:27,320 Speaker 3: data centers. Because you promised that you are not losing 334 00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:30,240 Speaker 3: market share there, how do you show that evidence of 335 00:18:30,240 --> 00:18:30,720 Speaker 3: that path? 336 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:32,360 Speaker 1: In Q four? 337 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:35,720 Speaker 11: Our estimates are we are about flat in market share 338 00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:39,040 Speaker 11: in Q four, So clearly we lost share weakness of products, 339 00:18:39,200 --> 00:18:42,080 Speaker 11: but that's now being overcome. We are executing on our 340 00:18:42,080 --> 00:18:44,919 Speaker 11: product roadmap and we're ahead of schedule on the products 341 00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:47,840 Speaker 11: for twenty four. We're seeing great momentum for the twenty 342 00:18:47,880 --> 00:18:52,240 Speaker 11: twenty four product line, good execution, and I'm very happy 343 00:18:52,280 --> 00:18:55,000 Speaker 11: to say we sent our first twenty twenty five product 344 00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:58,360 Speaker 11: on eighteen A already into fab ahead of schedule, so 345 00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:02,440 Speaker 11: our execution momentum as building. We see that we've stabilized 346 00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:04,800 Speaker 11: our market share, and now it's time for us to 347 00:19:04,920 --> 00:19:07,560 Speaker 11: rebuild where we were before, and we have the products 348 00:19:07,880 --> 00:19:10,119 Speaker 11: and the strength to go do it. Really proud of 349 00:19:10,119 --> 00:19:11,440 Speaker 11: our team's progress here. 350 00:19:11,680 --> 00:19:14,679 Speaker 4: For our Bloomberg television and radio audience worldwide, we're speaking 351 00:19:14,680 --> 00:19:18,040 Speaker 4: with the Intel CEO, Pat Gelsinger, and Pat when I've 352 00:19:18,040 --> 00:19:20,840 Speaker 4: been down to Santa Clara and sort of seeing the 353 00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:24,120 Speaker 4: reality of Intel, it's always strikes me as being more 354 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:27,800 Speaker 4: multifaceted than say in video, right, and it's a high 355 00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:31,400 Speaker 4: end performance GPU. A part of that is the packaging, 356 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:35,320 Speaker 4: A part of that is your differentiation with Foundry. But 357 00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:38,080 Speaker 4: I go back to Caroline's point on the core business. 358 00:19:38,280 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 4: What seems to be happening in the context of data 359 00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:44,160 Speaker 4: center is CPU and I just wondered if you'd explained 360 00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:46,960 Speaker 4: to our audience what you think is happening in that market, 361 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:49,400 Speaker 4: specifically on the CPU side. 362 00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 11: Yeah, and then the CPU last year was clearly here 363 00:19:53,600 --> 00:19:56,800 Speaker 11: there was more energy on the GPU right for these 364 00:19:56,840 --> 00:19:59,560 Speaker 11: high end training systems. But as we come into this year, 365 00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:01,480 Speaker 11: we think there's going to be more balanced between the 366 00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:05,200 Speaker 11: CPU and the accelerator marketplace. Clearly we're going to be 367 00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:08,399 Speaker 11: participating more in the accelerator. But the strength of Intel 368 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:12,480 Speaker 11: has been our Xeon, the core data center CPU and 369 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:16,080 Speaker 11: you know, coming out of World Economic Form and Davos 370 00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:19,600 Speaker 11: and CEES, I probably met with fifty customers and the 371 00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:23,119 Speaker 11: enthusiasm that they have and the traditional strength that Intel 372 00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:25,960 Speaker 11: has in the enterprise. And you know, we're in year 373 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:29,919 Speaker 11: twenty of the clouded and sixty percent of computing is 374 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:33,040 Speaker 11: in the cloud, but eighty percent of the data remains 375 00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:36,720 Speaker 11: on prem in the enterprise data center. That's where Intel 376 00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:40,919 Speaker 11: is uniquely strong, and our CPUs and accelerators are going 377 00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:43,960 Speaker 11: to unlock that capability for our customers. This is an 378 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:47,000 Speaker 11: exciting time for us to really enable them to use 379 00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:50,600 Speaker 11: those models. And that's the strength for Intel and our CPUs. 380 00:20:50,200 --> 00:20:53,400 Speaker 4: Pat When I look at the cloud and the hyperscalers themselves, 381 00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:57,560 Speaker 4: the really interesting story is their in house design work 382 00:20:57,960 --> 00:21:01,199 Speaker 4: and they're in house silicon progress. Do you consider that 383 00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:05,119 Speaker 4: a factor in how your own business in the data 384 00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:07,920 Speaker 4: center and cloud side performed and how you think it 385 00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:09,240 Speaker 4: will perform going forward. 386 00:21:10,359 --> 00:21:12,280 Speaker 11: Yeah, And one of the things that I said at 387 00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:16,160 Speaker 11: is Intel has the opportunity of a hundred percent of 388 00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:18,480 Speaker 11: the AI market for it. 389 00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:20,320 Speaker 1: Because we're going to have our product. 390 00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:24,879 Speaker 11: Offerings Xeon is strong showing up with greater improvement in 391 00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:27,960 Speaker 11: our Accelerator product line, but we're also going to be 392 00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:31,119 Speaker 11: a foundry and all of those internal programs that you 393 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:34,840 Speaker 11: see at Amazon and at Google and a Microsoft. Hey, 394 00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:37,600 Speaker 11: I want to be the foundry for those and all 395 00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:39,960 Speaker 11: of the competitors' products. I want to be the foundry 396 00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:42,879 Speaker 11: for them as well as we're seeing the momentum of 397 00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:45,920 Speaker 11: our packaging technology. So when you think about it that way, 398 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:49,280 Speaker 11: Intel uniquely is the company that has the opportunity to 399 00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:52,600 Speaker 11: participate in one hundred percent of the AI market with 400 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:55,359 Speaker 11: our products and our foundry, and that's exactly what we're 401 00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:56,600 Speaker 11: intent upon doing. 402 00:21:57,040 --> 00:21:59,360 Speaker 3: Has any of the weakness in demand thus far been 403 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:03,600 Speaker 3: because of this in house design and build commitment from 404 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:05,919 Speaker 3: some of these companies, or have you already managed to 405 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:08,680 Speaker 3: sort of seal verbal approval that you'll be doing these 406 00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:12,800 Speaker 3: for them from a foundry business at this point. 407 00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:13,639 Speaker 1: I'd say it's pretty early. 408 00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:17,080 Speaker 11: I don't think it's really affected the market that much, Carolyn, 409 00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 11: so far, but I do think this forward looking view 410 00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:22,439 Speaker 11: is a unique one for intel that we do get 411 00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:26,000 Speaker 11: to participate in both sides of that market. There's a 412 00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:29,119 Speaker 11: lot of energy here as the cloud vendors are saying, 413 00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:33,359 Speaker 11: how do I have a more cost effective solution for 414 00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:38,520 Speaker 11: these large training and inferencing demands of generative AI? And 415 00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:41,840 Speaker 11: for that every one of them has these projects underway 416 00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:44,240 Speaker 11: and we're engaging with all of them as we speak. 417 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:46,960 Speaker 11: So I really see that as a long term opportunity. 418 00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:50,919 Speaker 11: Takes multiple years for those to materialize, but our technologies 419 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:53,520 Speaker 11: as they gain momentum are showing up at just the 420 00:22:53,600 --> 00:22:57,400 Speaker 11: right time to satisfy a unique AI market for those 421 00:22:57,440 --> 00:22:58,159 Speaker 11: cloud vendors. 422 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:02,679 Speaker 3: And we've just been hearing how within this change that 423 00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 3: we see around AI, so comes a change in talent. 424 00:23:05,800 --> 00:23:08,240 Speaker 3: And many of these companies. Are you in any way 425 00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:11,600 Speaker 3: having to reorientate your own workers, your own colleagues, Pat, 426 00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:13,600 Speaker 3: are you having to let go of people? 427 00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:18,080 Speaker 11: Well, every day it's focused on talent and in the 428 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:24,159 Speaker 11: technology industry. Carol talent right is one of our CFOs 429 00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:26,800 Speaker 11: used to say, he said, we start with sand, right, 430 00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:30,440 Speaker 11: the second most plentiful material on earth, and everything else 431 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:34,080 Speaker 11: is talent between then and delivering our products and technology. 432 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:37,520 Speaker 11: So this idea of talent is so critical to our 433 00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:41,080 Speaker 11: markets now. Intel has a well tenured and very capable 434 00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:45,040 Speaker 11: base in bost software and in hardware, but we're reorienting 435 00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:49,600 Speaker 11: them very fast to the AI requirements, to data skills, 436 00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:52,520 Speaker 11: to software skills. But we build on a very firm 437 00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:55,919 Speaker 11: foundation and we're making good moves to bring additional talent 438 00:23:56,320 --> 00:23:59,240 Speaker 11: into the company as well to continue to have the 439 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:02,560 Speaker 11: best people to do the best products to enable the 440 00:24:02,600 --> 00:24:05,879 Speaker 11: best customer experience that they could possibly have. And a 441 00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:09,359 Speaker 11: great example of that is the AIPC, where we're unquestionably 442 00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:13,240 Speaker 11: defining the category, have a strong roadmap and delivering on 443 00:24:13,280 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 11: it at scale with ISVs and our OEMs in the 444 00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:17,800 Speaker 11: marketplace today. 445 00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,879 Speaker 4: Pat, before we let you go, you mentioned eighteen A. 446 00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:24,000 Speaker 4: You in the past have been kind and explained to 447 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:27,919 Speaker 4: me what it takes to jump generation to generation on 448 00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:33,120 Speaker 4: the manufacturing side and kind of the process to retain 449 00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:38,480 Speaker 4: and regain technology leadership. So in the time small time 450 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:40,919 Speaker 4: we have left, what evidence do you have that that 451 00:24:40,960 --> 00:24:43,240 Speaker 4: beautiful chart you drew from me on the whiteboard is 452 00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:45,679 Speaker 4: playing out the way that you expected to. 453 00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:49,280 Speaker 1: Well, we delivered the design collateral. 454 00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:52,200 Speaker 11: It's called a PDK and Q four of last year, 455 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:57,639 Speaker 11: we've seen our customers expand against that, and most importantly, 456 00:24:57,880 --> 00:25:01,000 Speaker 11: we sent our first major product into the fab just 457 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:03,760 Speaker 11: before Earning's Call started, ahead of schedule. 458 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:04,920 Speaker 1: And if you can take. 459 00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:08,280 Speaker 11: A big processor design like a server chip and send 460 00:25:08,320 --> 00:25:12,920 Speaker 11: it with stable design rules into manufacturing, that's a pretty 461 00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:18,040 Speaker 11: definitive statement of momentum. And we're adding customers and we 462 00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,320 Speaker 11: have seventy five test chips in the plan right now, 463 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:24,200 Speaker 11: so lots of customers are saying, let me try my design. 464 00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:27,280 Speaker 11: And importantly, we have our Foundry day. You know, this 465 00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:31,000 Speaker 11: opening of the doors of Intel Foundry coming up in February, 466 00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:34,399 Speaker 11: so a moment for the ecosystem, the EEDA partners, the 467 00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:38,040 Speaker 11: IP providers, and our customers to show up and see 468 00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:40,399 Speaker 11: the progress that we're making. And for the first time 469 00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:42,800 Speaker 11: we'll talk about what comes after eighteen A. 470 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:45,879 Speaker 1: You know, we're not finished. You know the Moore's Law. 471 00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:49,480 Speaker 11: We are the stewards until the periodic table is exhausted. 472 00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:52,520 Speaker 11: We ain't finished, and we're confident we're the company that's 473 00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:56,320 Speaker 11: going to keep innovating in process technology for decades to come. 474 00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:57,160 Speaker 5: Moore's Law. 475 00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:03,080 Speaker 4: Indeed, Intel CEO Pat Gelsinger, thank you, Caroline. You and 476 00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:05,199 Speaker 4: I have also been talking about that it's an election 477 00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:09,159 Speaker 4: year and first and foremost, in the coming week, you 478 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:12,280 Speaker 4: have all of the social media CEOs in one place. Meta, 479 00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 4: for example, is adding further measures to protect teams from 480 00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:20,560 Speaker 4: unwanted contact by turning off their ability to receive direct 481 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:24,159 Speaker 4: messages from anyone they don't follow or aren't connected to 482 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:28,400 Speaker 4: on Instagram by default. They're also increasing parental controls. These 483 00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:31,600 Speaker 4: measures come ahead of a Senate hearing on online child 484 00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:36,439 Speaker 4: sexual exploitation, where the CEOs of Meta, x, TikTok, Snap, 485 00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:39,240 Speaker 4: and Discord will testify next week. 486 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:40,600 Speaker 5: There is a lot to pass over. 487 00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:43,159 Speaker 4: Let's break it down with Sharon Franco, head of Legal 488 00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:47,119 Speaker 4: and public policy at Uboa, Paris based social discovery platform 489 00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:50,240 Speaker 4: for gen Z, which has just unveiled its own reference 490 00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:54,040 Speaker 4: document on universal safety principles for young people online. 491 00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:55,480 Speaker 5: Welcome to the program. 492 00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:59,320 Speaker 4: We're very familiar with getting all of the CEOs of 493 00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:02,320 Speaker 4: social media companies in one place and lobbing questions at 494 00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:07,080 Speaker 4: them because cynicism or skepticism is what does it achieve? 495 00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:13,879 Speaker 10: Yes, so I cannot speak for a platform by now 496 00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:17,440 Speaker 10: and head over your life as you will, so it 497 00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:20,080 Speaker 10: dies matter. I think that's speaking set up and the 498 00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:21,760 Speaker 10: die makes cita, but I. 499 00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:24,159 Speaker 3: Expoke of that we're just having some struggles hearing you 500 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:26,800 Speaker 3: at the moment. Let us just focus in on your 501 00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:29,239 Speaker 3: microphone for a second, because I think that we are 502 00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:31,960 Speaker 3: going to be hearing from the UBO perspective is, of course, 503 00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:35,000 Speaker 3: this is a company that's building in collaboration with Meta 504 00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:37,440 Speaker 3: and some of these other companies, social media companies, Away 505 00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:39,359 Speaker 3: in which you can sort of self police Away, in 506 00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:41,520 Speaker 3: which they can put in guardrails and in many ways 507 00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:46,040 Speaker 3: use artificial intelligence as a means of not just a 508 00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:49,120 Speaker 3: worry when it comes to exposure for children, but more 509 00:27:49,119 --> 00:27:52,040 Speaker 3: of a tool to heal and a way in which 510 00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:55,560 Speaker 3: that companies can identify when there's bad behavior going on, 511 00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:58,440 Speaker 3: when there's child exploitation potentially happening across that platform. 512 00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:01,320 Speaker 4: Remember that this hearing next week was due to happen 513 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:05,239 Speaker 4: before the holidays, and my understanding from sources is they 514 00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:07,280 Speaker 4: couldn't get their BacT together and the CEOs couldn't be 515 00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:08,240 Speaker 4: in one place a one time. 516 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:11,040 Speaker 5: You raise really good points. I brought up the election cycle. 517 00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:13,040 Speaker 4: You bring up AI and the thing that you and 518 00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:15,959 Speaker 4: I hear all the time in the cybersecurity context is 519 00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:16,480 Speaker 4: all of the. 520 00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:19,639 Speaker 5: Great tools that we have to advance our work and 521 00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:20,320 Speaker 5: things at home. 522 00:28:20,760 --> 00:28:24,960 Speaker 4: The threat actors have to amplify malicious content. So it's 523 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:27,920 Speaker 4: going to be interesting if that's the point of focus 524 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:30,600 Speaker 4: that the lawmakers go after, because often when you get 525 00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:35,080 Speaker 4: all these CEOs one place, they don't focus really. 526 00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:37,800 Speaker 3: On, well, sandlights, Isn't it unfortunate point the. 527 00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:40,640 Speaker 4: Conversation, as Sharon, I believe your your microphones back up 528 00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:42,400 Speaker 4: and running, So let's go with that. You know, what 529 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:44,600 Speaker 4: is it that you think the industry, the social media 530 00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:48,360 Speaker 4: industry needs to demonstrate to the public in the coming week. 531 00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:52,360 Speaker 10: They need to demonstrate them I think it's already something 532 00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:55,640 Speaker 10: that is already a work in progress that needs to 533 00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:59,880 Speaker 10: demonstrate that they are invested and committed into tackling the 534 00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:05,360 Speaker 10: issues and protecting children's online. But I think that now 535 00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:08,880 Speaker 10: we need to focus on solution, and I expect from 536 00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:11,360 Speaker 10: this hearing, for example, that it will be focused on 537 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:15,560 Speaker 10: solutions or peressional solution, practical solutions. I think that the 538 00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:21,120 Speaker 10: purpose that the SAY is looking for with this hearing 539 00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:25,120 Speaker 10: not only having an overview of the issues. Because we 540 00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:27,800 Speaker 10: know the issues, we know the impact of the use 541 00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:30,000 Speaker 10: of social media and the risk that the children are 542 00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:33,640 Speaker 10: facing and using these platforms. But now we need to 543 00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:37,200 Speaker 10: focus on operasional solutions and that's the work that we've 544 00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:40,520 Speaker 10: been doing as you go. Also really since the beginning 545 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:45,080 Speaker 10: of the company, working on finding solutions, practical solutions. 546 00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:47,360 Speaker 3: Let's talk about them. Man. In many ways, you are 547 00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:50,600 Speaker 3: trying to ensure that someone is the age they identify 548 00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:54,640 Speaker 3: themselves as, in particular, whether that's using photos and artificial 549 00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:57,760 Speaker 3: intelligence to identify where they are indeed older or younger 550 00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:01,160 Speaker 3: than the age they've put in. Anyone under thirteen shouldn't 551 00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:03,560 Speaker 3: be used in the app. How have you done that 552 00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:05,880 Speaker 3: from a privacy perspective? How have you done that from 553 00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:07,240 Speaker 3: an opt in perspective? 554 00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:10,520 Speaker 10: You're pointing out one of the biggest issue when you 555 00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:14,800 Speaker 10: talk about putting in place of parisional solution to in 556 00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:18,400 Speaker 10: terms of safety, it's the privacy obligation. So as you know, 557 00:30:18,880 --> 00:30:21,520 Speaker 10: you boys a French company, so we are Europeans. Or 558 00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:24,680 Speaker 10: privacy and with the GPR is something that comes natural 559 00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:28,360 Speaker 10: for us, and that's why since the creation of the company, 560 00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:32,960 Speaker 10: we've been developed all our products safety pride design but 561 00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:35,360 Speaker 10: also privacy by design is the work that we need 562 00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:40,680 Speaker 10: to do at the same time, and it's doable. I mean, 563 00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:44,360 Speaker 10: we can do it. It's just a question of priority 564 00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:48,160 Speaker 10: and also a question of at what moment you start 565 00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:53,840 Speaker 10: to think about this question of compliance with privacy that 566 00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:58,040 Speaker 10: you that you need to take in consideration. And for example, 567 00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:00,600 Speaker 10: one of the work that we've been doing is working 568 00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:04,280 Speaker 10: with all the institution and administration in France but also 569 00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:07,560 Speaker 10: in UK for example, to work on what's obligation we 570 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:11,640 Speaker 10: need to integrate and the work that we've been doing 571 00:31:11,680 --> 00:31:15,960 Speaker 10: with the French standard Organization, we've created we created a 572 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:19,280 Speaker 10: working group with this agency and we in this working 573 00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:21,840 Speaker 10: group we had a lot of companies. 574 00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:22,560 Speaker 3: Like a Meta for example. 575 00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:27,760 Speaker 10: We're also ENGOs child protection ENGOs, but also institutions and 576 00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:31,040 Speaker 10: agencies such as the French that are protection authority for example. 577 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:34,120 Speaker 10: And we've came up with one hundred pages of operational 578 00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:39,280 Speaker 10: solution giving a guidelines and recommendation on how to protect 579 00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:41,880 Speaker 10: my nods online, how to protect my nots on social media, 580 00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:46,200 Speaker 10: how to moderate content, how to work on age assurance. 581 00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:49,280 Speaker 10: Because there's a lot of solutions today that we can use. 582 00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:54,640 Speaker 3: You've come here to talk to lawmakers to show off 583 00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:57,200 Speaker 3: this document and to see whether or not will be adopted. 584 00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:01,640 Speaker 3: Has it landed on air? Is that welcoming? Are these 585 00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:04,680 Speaker 3: sorts of one hundred pages that you've given going to 586 00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:07,120 Speaker 3: work in the United States as well as in Europe 587 00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:07,560 Speaker 3: and the UK. 588 00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:10,200 Speaker 10: We hope, So we hope so that that's a purpose 589 00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:13,720 Speaker 10: that there's no reason why it shouldn't work because we 590 00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:16,320 Speaker 10: have all the we face all the same issues in 591 00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:20,240 Speaker 10: terms of risk, but we also now kind of ending 592 00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:24,520 Speaker 10: at a point where the legislation in terms of privacy 593 00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:30,040 Speaker 10: but also of child protection and social media legislation, it's 594 00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:33,320 Speaker 10: kind of not the same everywhere, but we are heading 595 00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:38,040 Speaker 10: all in the same direction. So there's no there's no 596 00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:41,440 Speaker 10: no reason why it shouldn't work here. As I said, 597 00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:44,160 Speaker 10: Meta was part of this working group for example, and 598 00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:48,520 Speaker 10: uh and uh, and we had no difficulty ending up 599 00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:51,440 Speaker 10: on something that we are all agreed on. And that's 600 00:32:51,600 --> 00:32:53,320 Speaker 10: that's the way we should That's the thing we should 601 00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:57,080 Speaker 10: keep in mind to day. Multi stake order work is 602 00:32:57,120 --> 00:33:00,600 Speaker 10: the way we we will achieve This of us and 603 00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:05,840 Speaker 10: who will achieve and having a social platform that protects 604 00:33:06,160 --> 00:33:10,920 Speaker 10: children and that's that are safe for them, that's really 605 00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:14,360 Speaker 10: the gold that we all want to achieve and it's yeah. 606 00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:17,880 Speaker 3: Sharon Franco, thank you for talking us through this document 607 00:33:18,080 --> 00:33:19,560 Speaker 3: and of course many can go out there and see 608 00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:20,880 Speaker 3: it what you've made at You've both the head of 609 00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:23,720 Speaker 3: legal and public policy there. Meanwhile, coming up, we'll take 610 00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:27,160 Speaker 3: a deep dive into healthcare investing and more. That's with 611 00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:30,000 Speaker 3: the Obvious Ventures. Stick with us. The VC Spotlight is 612 00:33:30,120 --> 00:33:42,680 Speaker 3: room meg Technology. Let's talk about investing from a venture perspective, 613 00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:45,680 Speaker 3: particularly in health tech. Right now, VC Spotlight is upon us. 614 00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:49,800 Speaker 3: Obvious Ventures co founder and managing director Vischelle Fasiche is 615 00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:52,880 Speaker 3: with us Obvious over one billion dollars in assets and 616 00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:55,320 Speaker 3: management and how much you've been able to put to 617 00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:57,200 Speaker 3: work as you kick off the new year, how much 618 00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:59,760 Speaker 3: you're seeing opportunities to write new checks at the moment. 619 00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,040 Speaker 2: First of all, thanks very much for inviting me here. 620 00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:08,200 Speaker 2: Ed and Caroline great great to be here at Obvious. 621 00:34:08,320 --> 00:34:12,719 Speaker 2: We've been busy. As you said, we have over one 622 00:34:12,719 --> 00:34:18,640 Speaker 2: billion dollars under management. We believe at Obvious that the 623 00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:21,439 Speaker 2: most valuable companies of our times would be companies which 624 00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:23,440 Speaker 2: are solving humanity is biggest challenges. 625 00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:27,359 Speaker 5: We believe that if we focus. 626 00:34:27,040 --> 00:34:32,200 Speaker 2: With this intentionality around three broad areas. One is planet health, 627 00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:36,200 Speaker 2: human health, and economic health. We'll create amazing companies for 628 00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:39,279 Speaker 2: our times, and this kind of investing is what we 629 00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:41,040 Speaker 2: call world positive investing. 630 00:34:42,040 --> 00:34:45,200 Speaker 4: What I find so interesting about this area, Michel, is 631 00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:48,640 Speaker 4: if you take health as an example, being a piece 632 00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:52,520 Speaker 4: of software or even in the hardware space in North America, 633 00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:56,040 Speaker 4: you're trying to build a product in a company that's 634 00:34:56,080 --> 00:35:01,080 Speaker 4: selling it to a highly regulated sector, doing business with 635 00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:04,360 Speaker 4: private and public orgs that have to go through tender 636 00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:08,640 Speaker 4: processes that move really slow. And I wonder how difficult 637 00:35:08,640 --> 00:35:10,959 Speaker 4: that makes life for you when you're trying to write 638 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:14,320 Speaker 4: an early check to a company. Who's the future you're assessing. 639 00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:20,879 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's a great question. You know, all 640 00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 2: of us can agree that we believe that we're not 641 00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:30,719 Speaker 2: getting banged for our healthcare buck. There's huge amount of 642 00:35:30,760 --> 00:35:35,080 Speaker 2: opportunities in our healthcare system. We spend four trillion dollars 643 00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:39,120 Speaker 2: in our healthcare system, but our outcomes are not that 644 00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:43,560 Speaker 2: great as compared to other similar nations. We have an 645 00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:47,799 Speaker 2: aging population, and this aging population is going to put 646 00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:51,719 Speaker 2: more pressure on our healthcare system as well as our 647 00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:56,120 Speaker 2: healthcare workers, who are wonderful friend tine workers. Healthcare is 648 00:35:56,120 --> 00:36:01,719 Speaker 2: a regulated industry. Things move slowly, but it's good as 649 00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:06,759 Speaker 2: new innovations come like AI that because of regulation, we 650 00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:09,400 Speaker 2: are able to be very thoughtful upfront to make a 651 00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:12,240 Speaker 2: positive den and solve these big problems in healthcare. 652 00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:13,360 Speaker 5: Visa. 653 00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:16,440 Speaker 4: I'm in New York today, just hopped over from San Francisco, 654 00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:19,160 Speaker 4: where I'm normally based. Caroline, and I love to get 655 00:36:19,160 --> 00:36:22,200 Speaker 4: the scoop. Okay, we just had JP Morgan where all 656 00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:25,319 Speaker 4: of your industry pairs were in the city, all of 657 00:36:25,360 --> 00:36:28,480 Speaker 4: the bankers, all of the vcs, all of the startup founders, 658 00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:31,359 Speaker 4: and all of the bigger biotech companies. Is there any 659 00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:34,080 Speaker 4: movement in the days that have followed, you know, any 660 00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:36,840 Speaker 4: deals that have crossed your desk is a direct result 661 00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:38,480 Speaker 4: of JP Morgan Healthcare Conference. 662 00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:40,239 Speaker 1: Yeah, I know. 663 00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:43,520 Speaker 2: JP Morgan always brings all the industry players here in 664 00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:47,680 Speaker 2: our wonderful city in San Francisco. I think the critical 665 00:36:47,760 --> 00:36:51,680 Speaker 2: thing all of us are talking about is what are 666 00:36:51,719 --> 00:36:53,759 Speaker 2: the kind of big problems and what are the solutions? 667 00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:58,680 Speaker 2: At obvious we focus on three broad areas in healthcare. 668 00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:03,239 Speaker 2: One believe our healthcare payment system has to come of 669 00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:08,040 Speaker 2: move towards more outcome driven versus paying for services only, 670 00:37:08,480 --> 00:37:14,120 Speaker 2: and the industry calls this value based approach of healthcare. 671 00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:18,959 Speaker 2: Number two, we believe the infrastructure of healthcare right now 672 00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:22,839 Speaker 2: is being powered from a technology point of view for 673 00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:27,040 Speaker 2: episodic care and for billing, and we need to move 674 00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:32,120 Speaker 2: towards more holistic care, more longitudinal care, and thanks to 675 00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:36,160 Speaker 2: new technologies like generative AI in future, move towards more 676 00:37:36,200 --> 00:37:41,160 Speaker 2: intelligent care so that we can provide excellent care for 677 00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:44,960 Speaker 2: every human being on the planet. And number three, from 678 00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:47,640 Speaker 2: a biology point of view, we believe biology is not 679 00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:51,560 Speaker 2: very well understood, so computational approaches as a way to 680 00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:55,919 Speaker 2: decode biology so that we can build amazing drugs at 681 00:37:56,120 --> 00:38:00,440 Speaker 2: great prices, fast timelines, and in personalized ways. So all 682 00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:04,560 Speaker 2: the industry people are thinking about that at JPM, and 683 00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:07,200 Speaker 2: we at Obvious have been investing in these three areas. 684 00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:09,920 Speaker 3: How much are you thinking and how much your founders 685 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:14,640 Speaker 3: thinking about a political change and about potential for policymaking 686 00:38:14,840 --> 00:38:19,319 Speaker 3: to be different under potentially a different president come the 687 00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:20,000 Speaker 3: end of this year. 688 00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:24,759 Speaker 2: Yeah again, I think all of us, whether we are 689 00:38:24,840 --> 00:38:29,120 Speaker 2: Democrats or Republicans, we all agree that we are not 690 00:38:29,280 --> 00:38:33,799 Speaker 2: getting banked for our healthcare bark and because we are 691 00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:36,000 Speaker 2: not getting a bank for our healthcare work, all of 692 00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:39,360 Speaker 2: us need to figure out how do we move towards 693 00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:45,800 Speaker 2: solutions and supporting solutions. We are investing in innovation economy. 694 00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:49,680 Speaker 2: We are thinking about what would happen in next ten years. 695 00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:53,200 Speaker 2: We don't think about kind of you know what is 696 00:38:53,239 --> 00:38:56,520 Speaker 2: going to happen in next quarter. And these problems are 697 00:38:56,960 --> 00:39:03,000 Speaker 2: real and there's potential for companies will be using your technologies. 698 00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:06,040 Speaker 4: Like Jennerald b I, Obvious Ventures co founder and managing 699 00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:09,040 Speaker 4: director Vishor Vashish thank you so much for your time. 700 00:39:09,160 --> 00:39:10,920 Speaker 4: It's time for talking tech and first start. This is 701 00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:12,600 Speaker 4: something I reported overnight with our. 702 00:39:12,440 --> 00:39:14,320 Speaker 5: Deals team and Ian King Chips. 703 00:39:14,360 --> 00:39:18,720 Speaker 4: Startup Sarah Brass Systems is considering an initial public offering 704 00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:21,840 Speaker 4: as soon as this year. Bloomberg sources say that AI 705 00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:25,560 Speaker 4: supercomputer maker is aiming for the second half of the year. 706 00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:28,520 Speaker 4: An IPO corend value Sarah brafs above the four billion 707 00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:31,640 Speaker 4: dollar figure it achieved in its last round in twenty 708 00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:34,840 Speaker 4: twenty one. And Microsoft is warning others about a Russian 709 00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:38,520 Speaker 4: state sponsored hacking group. Last week, Microsoft accused the group, 710 00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:42,319 Speaker 4: known as Midnight Blizzard or Cozy Bear of hacking into 711 00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:45,840 Speaker 4: its executive's emails in December twenty twenty three. Earlier this week, 712 00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:49,960 Speaker 4: HPE reported a data breach that was likely caused by 713 00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:53,080 Speaker 4: the same group. Plus, after securing fifty million dollars in 714 00:39:53,120 --> 00:39:57,160 Speaker 4: funding from investors, Crew Trim has officially become India's first 715 00:39:57,239 --> 00:40:00,560 Speaker 4: AI startup to gain a billion dollar valuation. In mind, 716 00:40:00,760 --> 00:40:04,840 Speaker 4: there's only been one month since the debuted. It's LLLM Caroline. 717 00:40:04,880 --> 00:40:07,480 Speaker 3: Wow, things move fast. Meanwhile, so does the world of crypto. 718 00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:09,400 Speaker 3: Let's just get a check in on where bitcoin is, 719 00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:11,799 Speaker 3: because actually it's above forty one thousand dollars. It's well 720 00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:13,880 Speaker 3: off the highs that we've seen in the month or so. 721 00:40:14,080 --> 00:40:17,120 Speaker 3: But is there a slow down in outflows from the 722 00:40:17,160 --> 00:40:20,239 Speaker 3: all important gray scale? Bitcoin trust strategist seem to think 723 00:40:20,280 --> 00:40:23,040 Speaker 3: that maybe if we can slow that outflow, maybe we'll 724 00:40:23,040 --> 00:40:25,799 Speaker 3: see some resilience in the price of bitcoin. Let's talk 725 00:40:25,840 --> 00:40:29,360 Speaker 3: about the tokens. James Stephens with US BlueBag Intelligence and James, 726 00:40:30,080 --> 00:40:33,799 Speaker 3: why should outflows of an ETF matter, particularly to a 727 00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:34,440 Speaker 3: price point? 728 00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:38,399 Speaker 12: Yeah, I mean so, the outflows of an ETF. They 729 00:40:38,480 --> 00:40:41,160 Speaker 12: are part of the entire pie that makes up the 730 00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:43,680 Speaker 12: price of bitcoin. Because you were dealing in spot bitcoin 731 00:40:43,719 --> 00:40:45,480 Speaker 12: at the end of the day, So outflows of the 732 00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:49,600 Speaker 12: etf are selling of bitcoin. That said, we've had net 733 00:40:49,640 --> 00:40:52,680 Speaker 12: inflows since these things launched on the spot bitcoin ETFs 734 00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:55,359 Speaker 12: in the US. You look at a little more broadly, though, 735 00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:57,400 Speaker 12: you can see that open interests of futures in the 736 00:40:57,400 --> 00:41:00,840 Speaker 12: CME Bitcoin futures that's down. You've had a little bit 737 00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:03,040 Speaker 12: of outflows from Canadian ets, You've had a little bit 738 00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:06,799 Speaker 12: of outflows from European bitcoin ETFs. So net, there has 739 00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:08,919 Speaker 12: been net outflow. But what a lot of people seem 740 00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:11,040 Speaker 12: to be missing is like these are just a piece 741 00:41:11,080 --> 00:41:13,520 Speaker 12: of the pie. There's a lot of other things going 742 00:41:13,520 --> 00:41:16,120 Speaker 12: on here. These are a small percentage point in what's 743 00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:18,760 Speaker 12: actually happening to the bitcoin price. 744 00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:21,080 Speaker 4: I'm reading the Bloomberg terminal and there's this sort of 745 00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:25,160 Speaker 4: narrative around rebounding back toward forty two hundred US dollars betoken. 746 00:41:25,600 --> 00:41:27,600 Speaker 4: But if you just look at a char we kind 747 00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:30,399 Speaker 4: of tumbled down from that January eight high and we're 748 00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:35,759 Speaker 4: having a sprightly uptick. Explain that that trading action relative 749 00:41:35,880 --> 00:41:39,319 Speaker 4: to the actual mechanics of the products that have come 750 00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:41,280 Speaker 4: online in the last three weeks. 751 00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:43,880 Speaker 12: Yeah, so, I mean from my point of view, it's 752 00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:46,840 Speaker 12: kind of been sideways since like January, right, So we 753 00:41:47,160 --> 00:41:49,479 Speaker 12: had on the ETF launch, we had a massive spike 754 00:41:49,560 --> 00:41:51,080 Speaker 12: up to forty nine, but for the most part we've 755 00:41:51,080 --> 00:41:53,239 Speaker 12: been in this low forties ranges, dip below forty a 756 00:41:53,280 --> 00:41:55,319 Speaker 12: little bit here and there, but I think a lot 757 00:41:55,320 --> 00:41:57,200 Speaker 12: of the selling, I mean, we knew this was going 758 00:41:57,239 --> 00:41:58,840 Speaker 12: to happen. There was a lot of money that was 759 00:41:58,920 --> 00:42:02,480 Speaker 12: tied up in GBTC, institutional capital capital from bankruptcies like 760 00:42:02,600 --> 00:42:05,319 Speaker 12: FTX DCG has a lot of money tied up in 761 00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:07,759 Speaker 12: here that they probably need access to themselves. They're the 762 00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:11,920 Speaker 12: parent company of grey Scales GBTC. So there's been like 763 00:42:12,040 --> 00:42:14,880 Speaker 12: force selling in the market because people they want to 764 00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:17,600 Speaker 12: get their capital out. But there has also been buying 765 00:42:17,600 --> 00:42:20,960 Speaker 12: on the other side of this, So there was undoubtedly 766 00:42:20,960 --> 00:42:23,720 Speaker 12: foreselling that caused what we've seen the in recent weeks. 767 00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:25,960 Speaker 12: I think people are expecting this to slow down. We've 768 00:42:25,960 --> 00:42:28,400 Speaker 12: seen some of it hinted at this, Like Caroline mentioned, 769 00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:30,480 Speaker 12: we only saw three hundred and ninety four million come 770 00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:32,879 Speaker 12: out of GBTC yesterday, which is which is a low 771 00:42:32,920 --> 00:42:35,560 Speaker 12: of over the last couple of weeks James. 772 00:42:35,760 --> 00:42:38,839 Speaker 3: Great to catch up with you never dials down when 773 00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:40,279 Speaker 3: it comes to the world of the new ats you 774 00:42:40,320 --> 00:42:42,520 Speaker 3: thank you from Blueberg Intelligence that does it for this 775 00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:44,640 Speaker 3: edition of Bluemeg Technology. Nice to have you here. 776 00:42:44,840 --> 00:42:45,200 Speaker 5: Thank you. 777 00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:48,520 Speaker 4: Check out the pod from New York City and a 778 00:42:48,560 --> 00:42:51,560 Speaker 4: little trip. There's the deats. 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