Speaker 1: Like so many people across America, Hillary and I have
Speaker 1: a personal connection to the opioid epidemic. I'll never forget
Speaker 1: where I was when I heard that the son of
Speaker 1: one of my very best friends, a bright, young twenty
Speaker 1: eight year old who had worked for Hillary at the
Speaker 1: State Department and who was pursuing both an MBA and
Speaker 1: a law degree, had died in his sleep just before Christmas.
Speaker 1: And we knew him well and liked him so much,
Speaker 1: it just seemed impossible. Not long after, we learned that
Speaker 1: he died of a lethal combination of alcohol and oxy
Speaker 1: code on. Sadly, while he was the first person we
Speaker 1: knew who suffered a fatal overdose, he wasn't the last.
Speaker 1: Hillary and I now have five friends who have lost
Speaker 1: their children to this epidemic. So why am I telling
Speaker 1: you this? Because in America today, just about everyone knows
Speaker 1: someone who's died, as it was, to an overdose. Drug
Speaker 1: overdoses killed more Americans and HIV AIDS, car crashes, or
Speaker 1: gun violence. Behind every one of these statistics is a
Speaker 1: real person, someone with a real life, a real story,
Speaker 1: and real people who love them. While so much of
Speaker 1: our public health discourse over the last year has focused
Speaker 1: on the COVID nineteen pandemic. The overdose epidemic remains an
Speaker 1: urgent crisis, and the challenges of the COVID nineteen pandemic,
Speaker 1: from isolation to unemployment to the shuttering of community resources
Speaker 1: and gathering places, have had a disproportionate impact on people
Speaker 1: struggling with substance abuse disorders. We've got to find a
Speaker 1: way to turn the tide. Today's episode of Why Am
Speaker 1: I Telling You This features someone who is one of
Speaker 1: America's leading experts on the opioid and overdose epidemic, Dr
Speaker 1: Vivit Murphy. Dr Murphy served as Surgeon General of the
Speaker 1: United States from and was renominated by President Biden and
Speaker 1: reconfirmed last month. We recorded this conversation back in and
Speaker 1: I wish I could say it's no longer relevant, But unfortunately,
Speaker 1: the overdose epidemic continues to rage across America, leaving unfinished
Speaker 1: lives and broken hearts in its wake. The latest CDC
Speaker 1: data shows that overdose deaths increased by for the twelve
Speaker 1: months ending in September. Especially given that the pandemic has
Speaker 1: cut off people's access to healthcare and support systems, we
Speaker 1: need to recognize the impact it's having on people's mental
Speaker 1: health and redouble our efforts to combat this crisis. Dr
Speaker 1: Vivic Murphy, thanks for joining us. Thank you, Mr President.
Speaker 1: You did something really remarkable in first issuing the first
Speaker 1: Certain General's report ever on alcohol, drugs and health, and
Speaker 1: at the same time, more remarkably to me, you actually
Speaker 1: sent a let earn a card to two point three
Speaker 1: million doctors, nurses, dentists, and other clinicians asking them to
Speaker 1: help address the opioid epidemic. Now nobody had ever done
Speaker 1: this before. Why did you, Well, thanks for the question,
Speaker 1: Mr President, for having me joining this conversation on opioids.
Speaker 1: When I began my time in office, I remember thinking
Speaker 1: on my first day about my priorities on what they
Speaker 1: should be. But I had this instinct to spend the
Speaker 1: first few months on a listening tour, just visiting communities
Speaker 1: across the country, and the issue that kept coming up
Speaker 1: again and again and again was the issue of opioids,
Speaker 1: and so I quickly realized that that needed to be
Speaker 1: even higher on my priority list. It also dovetailed with
Speaker 1: the personal experience that I had had as a clinician.
Speaker 1: Uh you know, as a doctor, I took care of
Speaker 1: patients over the years who struggled with all kinds of
Speaker 1: chronic pain conditions, and I found myself prescribing opioids often.
Speaker 1: I also, at the same time was seeing people come
Speaker 1: in struggling with addiction to heroin, to prescription opioids, and
Speaker 1: to other all manner of substances, and I began to
Speaker 1: realize that there was a connection between the way we
Speaker 1: were as doctors prescribing these pain medicines and what was
Speaker 1: actually happening to our patients. I wish I had realized
Speaker 1: that earlier, but I, like many doctors, was taught that
Speaker 1: if we gave opioid medicines to someone who had quote
Speaker 1: unquote legitimate pain, that they would not become addicted to
Speaker 1: that substance. And why were we wrong? So coming into office,
Speaker 1: when I realized that we had, inadvertently, as a profession,
Speaker 1: contributed to the epidemic, you know, I realized that in
Speaker 1: addition to publishing the first Surgeon General's Report on the
Speaker 1: subject of addiction, we also needed to do more. We
Speaker 1: needed to call our profession to action to rectify an
Speaker 1: issue that we had helped create. And so that's why
Speaker 1: I penned a personal letter to doctors and nurse practitioners
Speaker 1: and dentists all across the country. And at the time
Speaker 1: it was you know, I did it an instinct. I
Speaker 1: didn't know quite what the reaction would be, but I
Speaker 1: was gratified to hear from many doctors and nurses over
Speaker 1: the coming months, UH that it actually changed how they practiced,
Speaker 1: how they prescribed these kind of pain medications. And I
Speaker 1: remember going to an oral surgeon actually recently to get
Speaker 1: my own wisdom tooth pulled, uh, and he told me
Speaker 1: that in addition to receiving that letter, that he had
Speaker 1: made a decision when he read it that he was
Speaker 1: going to stop prescribing percoset automatically to everyone who had
Speaker 1: wisdom teeth removed. And he gave all of them his
Speaker 1: personal cell phone number, and he braced for what he
Speaker 1: thought would be an onslaught of calls from patients saying
Speaker 1: that their pain wasn't well controlled on ibyprofen and they
Speaker 1: needed something stronger. But days went by and the calls
Speaker 1: never came, and he realized that, hey, we can actually
Speaker 1: get by treating pain safely and effectively without necessarily using opioids.
Speaker 1: I want to thank you for this. We live in
Speaker 1: an age of denial about a lot of things. When
Speaker 1: Chelsea was in high school, all our friends used to
Speaker 1: say that denial it's not just a river in Egypt
Speaker 1: and uh, And I think it takes a certain amount
Speaker 1: of courage just to say I once thought the truth
Speaker 1: was this, and I learned something and I changed. And
Speaker 1: that's what I think more and more people have to
Speaker 1: do about more and more issues, but especially this one.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about this a little bit. I think a
Speaker 1: lot of people know about the lock zone, and no,
Speaker 1: it can bring people back, but it's just the first step.
Speaker 1: So could you briefly describe what should be done to
Speaker 1: someone who's overdosed, who's injected or inhaled the lock zone
Speaker 1: and then comes back. That's the beginning, not the end
Speaker 1: of this process. So describe how that works. Well. The
Speaker 1: lockson is a really powerful medication and remarkably effective at
Speaker 1: reversing the effects of opioids. And for people who have
Speaker 1: who's breathing has been compromised by these medicines, they can
Speaker 1: reverse that and enable them to breathe again. I've administered
Speaker 1: in the locks on myself. I've seen just how rapidly
Speaker 1: it acts, so it's good that we are getting that
Speaker 1: medication to the hands at first responders and family members,
Speaker 1: but for far too many people who overdose, the treatment
Speaker 1: does stop there. And it's shocking how many people are
Speaker 1: treated with the lock zone and go right back into
Speaker 1: the community and often in fact, will get more prescriptions
Speaker 1: for opiate medications. What we really need to do is
Speaker 1: to bring those people in and connect them to treatment
Speaker 1: right away, treatment often with medication assisted therapies including methodone Bupid,
Speaker 1: Norphine UH and now trek Zone. And what we've realized
Speaker 1: now is that there should be no wrong door to treatment.
Speaker 1: So whether it's a first responder UH finding you having overdosed,
Speaker 1: let's say, in the community, whether it's somebody in the
Speaker 1: emergency room who encounters you, whether it's a somebody in
Speaker 1: your place of employment who realizes that you have a
Speaker 1: challenge with addiction. We have to find ways to create
Speaker 1: channels which people can go from where they are in
Speaker 1: their communities to getting directly connected to treatment. Right now,
Speaker 1: it's too hard for people in communities across the country.
Speaker 1: But if we can change that, and I think we
Speaker 1: can take people who need and want treatment and actually
Speaker 1: get them the life stating treatment that they deserve. I
Speaker 1: think you made a really important point. I remember a
Speaker 1: couple of summers ago, I was playing golf out on
Speaker 1: a public golf course and all these folks gathered around me.
Speaker 1: All they want to talk about was the open wood problem.
Speaker 1: And there was only one young person there. All the
Speaker 1: others walked away after about forty five minutes. He stayed
Speaker 1: behind and said, thank you. I didn't know anybody like
Speaker 1: you cared about this. I'm four days out of rehab,
Speaker 1: and he said, I'm not worried about myself. I want
Speaker 1: to live and now I know how. But he said,
Speaker 1: I think it's a terrible shame that you've got to
Speaker 1: have as much money as my family does to afford this.
Speaker 1: You've got to do something to help the people that
Speaker 1: have no money. So let's start with what the government
Speaker 1: should do, or the federal land state government, how should that?
Speaker 1: Where are we on that? Well, there's no question that
Speaker 1: when of the big barriers to treatment is the cost
Speaker 1: and the availability of these services, including the availability of
Speaker 1: trained personnel. The problem is in part of funding issue.
Speaker 1: In the last several years, we have seen Congress allocate
Speaker 1: substantial amounts of money, several billion dollars in fact, but
Speaker 1: the reality is that we need far more than a
Speaker 1: few billion dollars to expand treatment sufficiently so that everyone
Speaker 1: who needs care can get it. When we published the
Speaker 1: Certain General's Report on Alcohol, Drugs and Health in one
Speaker 1: of the things that we noted was that only one
Speaker 1: in ten people who are struggling with the substance use
Speaker 1: disorder actually getting treatment. And part of that is because
Speaker 1: people can't get treatment, and part of it also has
Speaker 1: to do with this stigma, the unfortunate stigma associated with
Speaker 1: substance use disorders, which prevents people often from seeking help.
Speaker 1: When I was traveling through Tennessee, for example, I met
Speaker 1: many people who either had loved ones who are struggling
Speaker 1: with an opiad use disorder or themselves were who refused
Speaker 1: to talk to me if there were any cameras around,
Speaker 1: And the reason was because they felt if somebody knew
Speaker 1: that they had a problem and that they needed help,
Speaker 1: that they would be ostracized not just by their neighbors,
Speaker 1: but also by their doctors. And sadly, I did meet
Speaker 1: doctors when I was in Tennessee and in other states
Speaker 1: who didn't believe what they were reading about medication assist
Speaker 1: to treatment who thought it was just another way of
Speaker 1: perpetuating a dependence on opioids, and these unfortunate misconceptions, combined
Speaker 1: with the lack of adequate funding, have combined to make
Speaker 1: it too hard for people to get treatment. We have
Speaker 1: evidence about what works. We know, for example, that medication
Speaker 1: assists to treatment with these three medications in particular method
Speaker 1: and guben orphine and now trek zone not only reduce
Speaker 1: the risk of overdose, but they also reduce crime in communities.
Speaker 1: They reduced the acquisition of needleborn infections like HIV and
Speaker 1: hepatitis c UH. They are good overall. Um, there are still,
Speaker 1: unfortunately a majority of treatment facilities in the country right
Speaker 1: now which do not offer medication assists to treatment, and
Speaker 1: that to me is uh is an unthinkable tragedy because
Speaker 1: at a time where we know what works, for the
Speaker 1: majority of treatment facilities, to not have what works and
Speaker 1: to be charging people tends of thousands of dollars for
Speaker 1: that treatment, UH is just it's just horrible, and that's
Speaker 1: something that I think we absolutely need to change. Well,
Speaker 1: let me ask you this, is it not offered because
Speaker 1: the money is not there, or because there's a stigma
Speaker 1: associated with the use of method on about for northern Well.
Speaker 1: Partially this is about payment, but only partially. So I
Speaker 1: think that once we get insurance programs of Medicaid and
Speaker 1: private insurance to fully reimburse for the full suite of
Speaker 1: medication assisted treatment UM, once we ensure that we actually
Speaker 1: have adequate personnel trained to deliver that treatment, that will
Speaker 1: help a lot. But the stigma piece that you brought
Speaker 1: up is a is a really good point because I
Speaker 1: have visited communities across the country where treatment is available,
Speaker 1: but people will not access it because they are worried
Speaker 1: that they will be looked down upon. You know, if
Speaker 1: they engage in treatment that they will doctor in fact,
Speaker 1: will look down upon them. And I visited communities that
Speaker 1: do not want to invite treatment centers in because they
Speaker 1: feel it will bring the wrong kind of people into
Speaker 1: their community and because they have been led to believe
Speaker 1: that this is uh that this treatment is just perpet
Speaker 1: awaiting opiate addiction. If you understand like what's really happening
Speaker 1: with the opia epidemic, you realize that this is not
Speaker 1: about inviting quote unquote bad people in, but the people
Speaker 1: who are struggling with opiate addiction are in all of
Speaker 1: our communities anyway, there are friends, our neighbors, often family members,
Speaker 1: and they struggle in the shadows though, unable to come
Speaker 1: forward and share their stories because the unfortunate shame associated
Speaker 1: with it. One of the things I've tried to do
Speaker 1: is to get rid of stigma by getting the whole
Speaker 1: community involved. We have this fight based initiative where we
Speaker 1: have people from all fights traditions to gather to get
Speaker 1: people to come together because everybody's congregation has got somebody
Speaker 1: in it with this problem. Education, whether it's in in
Speaker 1: school based settings grade school and colleges, or in workplaces
Speaker 1: or through faith based organizations, can be remarkably effective. The
Speaker 1: other thing that can happen in these settings is that
Speaker 1: conversations can be started to actually share the real stories
Speaker 1: of people who are struggling with addiction. This is hard
Speaker 1: to do because in an environment where you're not sure
Speaker 1: how you're going to be received. I can understand how
Speaker 1: challenging it can be for someone struggling with an opiate
Speaker 1: used disorder, for example, to come forward and say I
Speaker 1: have a problem. But what I have seen time and
Speaker 1: time again is that when people take that courageous step,
Speaker 1: people all around them respond, sometimes often silently saying oh gosh,
Speaker 1: I thought I was the only one, or I thought
Speaker 1: my family was the only one impacted, but often vocally
Speaker 1: as well, voicing their support. And I think of faith
Speaker 1: organizations as powerful partners in this regard. They convene conversations
Speaker 1: anyway on topics related to faith and life. More broadly,
Speaker 1: their ability to convene conversations where people share their real
Speaker 1: story with addiction can be extraordinarily powerful in helping to
Speaker 1: remove some of that stigma. There are times when culture
Speaker 1: trump's policy when it comes to ultimate impact, and this
Speaker 1: is a place where the culture around addiction are underlying
Speaker 1: belief around it. Uh is has to be addressed before
Speaker 1: we're fully able to address the epidemic. As much as
Speaker 1: we feel like we're reading about the opiate epidemic in
Speaker 1: the Pay Purse, there are still millions of people in
Speaker 1: our country who don't fully understand what opioids are, how
Speaker 1: to protect ourselves, you know, from combining opioids with alcohol,
Speaker 1: and how to protect ourselves when we're using opiods to
Speaker 1: begin with, when it's appropriate versus not. We still have
Speaker 1: so many people, for example, who store opioid medicines in
Speaker 1: their medicine cabinet, and it turns out the medicine cabinet
Speaker 1: is the worst place for that medicine because other people
Speaker 1: when they come and visit, can often just easily go
Speaker 1: and take those opioids. And this is actually what happens
Speaker 1: in households all across America. Do you have the sense
Speaker 1: of Congress as well into properly fund this. I mean,
Speaker 1: if there's ever been a bipartisan or a nonpartisan national epidemic,
Speaker 1: this is yes. And in it at a time where
Speaker 1: a few things seem bipartisan, this stands out as as
Speaker 1: as a rare opportunity, rare issue. I don't think though,
Speaker 1: that many in Congress have shown the appetite to fund
Speaker 1: the opiate epidemic at the level that it requires. What's
Speaker 1: happening right now with the how we're funding the opiated
Speaker 1: epidemic is we're providing oftentimes these one time grants to
Speaker 1: communities that will run out after a short period of time,
Speaker 1: and they're trying to figure out, in part, okay, we
Speaker 1: get something up and running, what's going to sustain us
Speaker 1: in years two, three, four, and five. But we're also
Speaker 1: providing that support at a mere fraction of what's needed
Speaker 1: to really turn the tide on the epidemic in those communities.
Speaker 1: I think many members of Congress, and some of them
Speaker 1: have told me this privately, they worry about the price
Speaker 1: tag on a bill that would really adequately resource the epidemic,
Speaker 1: because it would be at least ten times greater than
Speaker 1: the numbers that you're seeing out there. But I think
Speaker 1: what we have to realize is that the long term
Speaker 1: cost of not funding that is far greater. Uh And
Speaker 1: and this is why there's an urgency around this issue.
Speaker 1: It's why you know, having people like you start discussing
Speaker 1: this issue and helping raise public awareness are so important
Speaker 1: because this is one of those times where we need
Speaker 1: the public to push our policymakers not just to make
Speaker 1: an investment, but to make the right investment. But I
Speaker 1: lastly think though it's worth consider also that is in
Speaker 1: all the discussions we have on opioids, in talking about
Speaker 1: what's driving this epidemic, from you know, prescribing patterns, to
Speaker 1: pharmaceutical companies marketing these medicines irresponsibly uh to the public,
Speaker 1: to a whole host of other factors. There are also
Speaker 1: some emotional factors that are driving this epidemic as well.
Speaker 1: I was struck so often and heartbroken often when I
Speaker 1: visited communities around the country. How behind the stories of
Speaker 1: mental illness and addiction and even physical illness were often
Speaker 1: stories of deeper emotional pain that people were experiencing. Sometimes
Speaker 1: it was the pain of poverty, of discrimination. Sometimes it
Speaker 1: was a pain that came with disability um Sometimes it
Speaker 1: was a pain that came from not having a job
Speaker 1: and not being able to find a job and feeling
Speaker 1: like they were outcasts. Sometimes it was a pain of loneliness,
Speaker 1: which is extremely common, much more so than we realized.
Speaker 1: But whatever the pain source was, that deeper emotional pain
Speaker 1: was often driving people to places of despair, and it
Speaker 1: was manifesting often as disconnection from others. And I realized
Speaker 1: that if we want to address the opiate epidemic, we
Speaker 1: don't just need good treatment and counseling. We actually need community.
Speaker 1: We need connection as well. There's nobody I have met
Speaker 1: who has come through the dark tunnel of addiction and
Speaker 1: emerged on the other side who has not had somebody
Speaker 1: that they trust, who has believed in them, especially when
Speaker 1: they were not able to believe in themselves. That is
Speaker 1: why I think about the opiate epidemic is not only
Speaker 1: an illness, but as a disease of disconnection in part.
Speaker 1: And this is a place where each of us can
Speaker 1: be helpful. You don't need a medical degree or a
Speaker 1: nursing degree to be able to provide support and a
Speaker 1: listening ear to somebody who is struggling with addiction, to
Speaker 1: help them feel that they are not being judged for
Speaker 1: an illness that's not a character flaw, but that's actually
Speaker 1: a medical condition. And I will tell you that despite
Speaker 1: my training as a doctor, despite all the years that
Speaker 1: you know I put into learning how to treat in
Speaker 1: biological illnesses, that the power of a family member, of
Speaker 1: friend um building a loving, trusting relationship with someone is
Speaker 1: far greater than any medicine I could prescribe, or any
Speaker 1: treatment that I could give. And that's why I believe
Speaker 1: that in the fight against the opiate addiction, that love
Speaker 1: is in fact our most powerful medicine. It's one that
Speaker 1: anyone can dispense, and it's one that we need now
Speaker 1: more than ever. Our country was very lucky to have
Speaker 1: you as our Surgeon General, and I thank you. The
Speaker 1: only thing I'd like to say before we close to
Speaker 1: the doubters is that no progress to human life would
Speaker 1: ever be made if we never tried, because we couldn't
Speaker 1: win every time. That's someone who's lived in a family
Speaker 1: that's experienced addiction, who's what's friends bury their children. You
Speaker 1: won't win them all, but you can win a lot,
Speaker 1: and we have to try. Thank you very much, Thank you,
Speaker 1: Mr President. We'll be right back. My name is Sarah Gad.
Speaker 1: I'm a c g i U Clinton Global Initiative University alumni.
Speaker 1: It was actually the very first time I decided to
Speaker 1: share my story and my history with opioid addiction was
Speaker 1: in that discussion room at c g i U. They
Speaker 1: were just so supportive, and I realized, why have I
Speaker 1: been so secretive about this for so long? I first
Speaker 1: became addicted to opioids when I was in my third
Speaker 1: year of medical school. I ended up in a pretty
Speaker 1: horrific car accident which I remember nothing about. I woke
Speaker 1: up in a hospital room with my leg in a sling.
Speaker 1: I had undergone emergency surgery on my leg because my
Speaker 1: ankle bone literally pierced through my skin and had to
Speaker 1: be hammered and screwed back into place. So it was
Speaker 1: a pretty long, pretty painful recovery process. And during that
Speaker 1: time I was prescribed opioids like perk set An, OxyContin,
Speaker 1: and at first I was just taking them for pain.
Speaker 1: But as I was recovering, I was watching all of
Speaker 1: my classmates graduate onto their fourth year of medical school.
Speaker 1: Meanwhile I was bedridden and I was depressed. My opioid
Speaker 1: prescription pain medication was by that point they had become
Speaker 1: my only source of joy and happiness. And then maybe
Speaker 1: about a year out after my accident, my doctor sat
Speaker 1: down with me and was like, look, you cannot be
Speaker 1: in this much pain this far out. Do you have
Speaker 1: a dependency problem? And I denied it. I just didn't
Speaker 1: want to acknowledge it. Once my doctor stopped prescribing me opioids,
Speaker 1: I started going to see a bunch of other doctors
Speaker 1: and then it didn't take too long for them to
Speaker 1: figure out that I had been doctor shopping and so
Speaker 1: as a third year medical student, I was familiar with
Speaker 1: how to write prescriptions and that's what landed me in
Speaker 1: legal trouble and got me arrested. And once you're criminalized
Speaker 1: and you have a criminal record and arrest record, very
Speaker 1: difficult to reintegrate back into society in any sort of
Speaker 1: meaningful way. It was always just kind of the cycle
Speaker 1: of going to jail and detoxing cold turkey and going
Speaker 1: through the hell of physical withdrawal, getting out, trying to
Speaker 1: get my life back on track, and then relapsing and
Speaker 1: then going back to jail. And then I was incarcerated
Speaker 1: for five days, and the day that I got out,
Speaker 1: I actually ended up overdosing. It was just because my
Speaker 1: tolerance had gone down so much during that period, and
Speaker 1: I woke up in an ambulance being injected with narcan
Speaker 1: and told that I had just overdosed on opioids. The
Speaker 1: Centers for Disease Control reports that more than people died
Speaker 1: from opioid to overdoses in two thousand sixteen. Addicts need
Speaker 1: help without the fear of being stigmatized or arrested. The
Speaker 1: crisis has become so widespread that the Surgeon General is
Speaker 1: urging ordinary citizens to carry the locks on, a drug
Speaker 1: that reverses the effects of a drug overdose and saves lives.
Speaker 1: The only reason I survived was at that point we
Speaker 1: had been given the locks on. The gentleman that I
Speaker 1: was using with that his house knew how to administer it.
Speaker 1: As I said when we were talking earlier with Dr Marthy,
Speaker 1: this challenge is one that requires all hands on deck.
Speaker 1: One of the most important partners that we've had is
Speaker 1: Julie Stamper, a board member for the harm Reduction Coalition
Speaker 1: and the locks On Advocate and someone who is an
Speaker 1: indispensable force if we're ever going to turn this thing around. So, Julie,
Speaker 1: why have you been so passionate about this for so long? First,
Speaker 1: I'll say thank you so much for having me here
Speaker 1: and and giving me a platform and for all the
Speaker 1: work the Clinton Foundation has done, because you've been there
Speaker 1: for years right along with me, and I come to
Speaker 1: the work and the passion about the work, partly unwillingly
Speaker 1: and partly proudly. Proudly because my stepfather, Jack Fishman, is
Speaker 1: credited with inventing a lock zone in the nineteen sixties,
Speaker 1: So anything that I can do to further his legacy
Speaker 1: and a chance to talk about him. He passed a
Speaker 1: few years ago, so he's we miss him greatly. So
Speaker 1: for me to talk about in a lock zone means
Speaker 1: I get to talk about him, But I also get
Speaker 1: to talk about my brother, who died of an overdose
Speaker 1: in two thousand three, so his legacy exists as well.
Speaker 1: So for me, the unwilling part is that I had
Speaker 1: to come in to do the work because I lost
Speaker 1: my brother. But I'm proud to do the work because
Speaker 1: of my stepfather and a lock zone has saved hundreds
Speaker 1: of thousands of lives across the world. But now we
Speaker 1: need to do more to make it because we're losing
Speaker 1: people here all the time. You cite a mission of
Speaker 1: your own endeavor? Is harm reduction? What does that mean?
Speaker 1: It actually is what it sounds like. It's harm reduction,
Speaker 1: reducing harm. We practice harm reduction every day. You get
Speaker 1: up in the morning, you brush your teeth, you're using
Speaker 1: a toothpaste that has fluoride in it. That's harm reduction.
Speaker 1: You get in your car, you put your seatbelt on,
Speaker 1: also harm reduction. You inject drugs and have an also nearby,
Speaker 1: that's harm reduction. And even in that capacity with with
Speaker 1: substance use, if you are an ivy drug user, you're
Speaker 1: hopefully going to have access to clean syringes, sterile water,
Speaker 1: any kind of rig anything that you need to inject
Speaker 1: safely so that you're not getting infected. So anything that
Speaker 1: we can do to reduce harm for people who use
Speaker 1: drugs is key. So harm reduction is something that we
Speaker 1: practice all the time. What role was reducing stigma and
Speaker 1: harm reduction. Stigma is one of the biggest obstacles people
Speaker 1: who use drugs face on a daily basis. We're trying
Speaker 1: to do things by even just simply changing language. So
Speaker 1: instead of referring to someone as an addict, we say
Speaker 1: someone who uses drugs. All right, it's people first language.
Speaker 1: So it's not what they do, it's who they are, right,
Speaker 1: So it's simple, it's a it's very subtle even, but
Speaker 1: what it does it actually honors that that you are
Speaker 1: a person. You know, So, in terms of my history
Speaker 1: with my brother and his substance use, my brother was
Speaker 1: a junkie, all right. That was the word that was
Speaker 1: used talking about my brother who I grew up with. Now,
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, I'm supposed to call him a junkie,
Speaker 1: and I did because that's what I was told. And
Speaker 1: as a result of that, I lost years with my brother.
Speaker 1: He barely met my children. Right, It's devastating to consider
Speaker 1: what something, so what we think is simple stigma could
Speaker 1: do because of this stigma attached to substance use. I
Speaker 1: lost him before I actually lost him. So stigma plays
Speaker 1: a big part in in preventing people who use drugs
Speaker 1: from getting the help that they need. A lot of
Speaker 1: the conversations that happened now. You know, we heard for
Speaker 1: years about the war on drugs, and now we know
Speaker 1: it was the wrong way to try to help the situation.
Speaker 1: You know, we we we could go back to you know,
Speaker 1: the commercial where you cracking the egg and the frying pan.
Speaker 1: This is your brain and it is your brain on drugs.
Speaker 1: This is your brain on drugs. And we became less
Speaker 1: credible because of it, because it wasn't true in the
Speaker 1: sense that you know, when we tell our children marijuana
Speaker 1: will kill you, Uh, they look at us like we're
Speaker 1: crazy because we're not telling them the truth. And so
Speaker 1: we need to do more to tell the truth. And
Speaker 1: you know, I've said this before and and I don't know,
Speaker 1: maybe it's controversial. The reason we're having this conversation, you
Speaker 1: and I right now is because more white people are
Speaker 1: dying right this This epidemic has impacted black and brown
Speaker 1: people in ways that we can't even fathom. And we
Speaker 1: kind of not that we ignore it, but we just
Speaker 1: kind of say, oh, well, it wasn't an issue then,
Speaker 1: but now it's an issue because all these you know,
Speaker 1: white teenagers are overdosing. So we need to recognize that
Speaker 1: that's a big component of the stigma for sure, and
Speaker 1: and one of our biggest obstacles. And and so I
Speaker 1: I you know, I've said this before. Evolution is tremendous, right.
Speaker 1: I came a long way from thinking my brother was
Speaker 1: a junkie to now realizing no, he was a person
Speaker 1: who had some serious issues and they were compounded by
Speaker 1: his substance. Use, you, sir, have m a tremendous way,
Speaker 1: and I applaud the effort and the willingness for you
Speaker 1: to come to the place where you're at now to
Speaker 1: try to help Stay tuned for more of the conversation
Speaker 1: after this short break. I read a study sometime in
Speaker 1: the last year that said most people who die of
Speaker 1: overdoses are in effect not alone. There's somebody in the
Speaker 1: room with them, or somebody in the next room, or
Speaker 1: somebody in the house, or if they're outside, within twenty
Speaker 1: ft of them, almost half, which means that, given the
Speaker 1: scale of this opioid epidemic, it would be better if
Speaker 1: in almost every social setting or work setting, somebody had
Speaker 1: the locks on. What do you think we could do
Speaker 1: to change the willingness of people to tote that around everywhere?
Speaker 1: Because the more people who have it in their pocket
Speaker 1: to better off. We are, absolutely so you know we
Speaker 1: the last time you and I had a conversation, I
Speaker 1: brought you an overdose prevention kit and one of the
Speaker 1: things that I've shown people because if you if you've
Speaker 1: seen the narcan that's out now, it's a teeny tiny
Speaker 1: little box. I mean it's like a box of altoys
Speaker 1: or tic TACs or you know, the breath mints that
Speaker 1: you're going to keep in your bag. So I I joke,
Speaker 1: but I mean it sincerely. Like if I'm going out
Speaker 1: for an evening and I have my little evening bag,
Speaker 1: I take a dose with me and it's in my bag.
Speaker 1: Because you never know where you're gonna possibly encounter someone.
Speaker 1: The opportunity to give someone the locks on who might
Speaker 1: actually have access to someone who needs it is important,
Speaker 1: and I think we should be doing something about making
Speaker 1: sure restaurants have it. You know, any place where there
Speaker 1: is a single use bathroom is a risk because that's
Speaker 1: where someone might go to use drugs. We're now training
Speaker 1: librarians because a lot of overdoses are happening in libraries,
Speaker 1: so it's important. Oh yes, because there's always little corners
Speaker 1: and their single use bathrooms. So yeah, no, we've got
Speaker 1: to do a whole lot to get it out there.
Speaker 1: I mean, I I have a friend who who owns
Speaker 1: a restaurant, and I was like, let me give you
Speaker 1: a kid so you can keep it behind the bar.
Speaker 1: And I know, you know Clinton Foundation along with Emergent
Speaker 1: Bio Solutions, the company that that produces narcan, making it
Speaker 1: available for schools, universities, colleges. But maybe there should be
Speaker 1: an effort for a one time you know, for for
Speaker 1: the Starbucks location on the corner of whatever, that that
Speaker 1: that the owner can can right in and get a kit.
Speaker 1: And I you know, the conversations that I have had
Speaker 1: with people over the years who wish they had had it,
Speaker 1: that's what's sad. What have you told your children about opioids?
Speaker 1: How do you deal with it? And blessed three times over?
Speaker 1: I have three incredible boys, a nineteen year old, a
Speaker 1: sixteen year old, and a twelve year old, and it's
Speaker 1: it's I think for me, you know, I think about
Speaker 1: the loss of my brother and them not not getting
Speaker 1: to know their uncle who was super cool and funny
Speaker 1: and a great singer and a guitar player, and and
Speaker 1: my my youngest reminds me so much of my brother
Speaker 1: sometimes that it's heartbreaking. But so when I think about
Speaker 1: my brother's death, I think, if it's going to do anything,
Speaker 1: it's going to help save my children because we talk
Speaker 1: about Uncle Jonathan and why he's not here, and a
Speaker 1: lot of that has an impact on them. You know,
Speaker 1: when we've had conversations about when you go out into
Speaker 1: the world and you may experiment with substances, your body
Speaker 1: chemistry will likely react differently than somebody else's because you
Speaker 1: have addiction around you. Both sides of the families have
Speaker 1: struggles with addiction, so you have to be prepared for that.
Speaker 1: So I I know I have conversations with my boys
Speaker 1: that a lot of parents aren't capable of having, aren't
Speaker 1: willing to have. That to me is the most important
Speaker 1: right because they're the ones who were looking out for
Speaker 1: It's their future, So we have to have these conversations
Speaker 1: with them that I have a friend who shared with
Speaker 1: me that her sixteen year old son was at a
Speaker 1: party and there were children snorting Heroin sixteen and there
Speaker 1: was no n a locks on. I want to strangle somebody,
Speaker 1: because that's an easy fix. So I said to her,
Speaker 1: let me give you a kit. He could put it
Speaker 1: in his pocket. It is small enough, no one will know.
Speaker 1: And of course the immediate responses, well, he would never
Speaker 1: do that. And it's the same message I give to
Speaker 1: my children. You're going out to a party, and my
Speaker 1: older ones takeing a locks on with you, not for you,
Speaker 1: for someone else, just in case. So we have to
Speaker 1: talk to our children. We have talked to the parents
Speaker 1: of children. We need to get in there and we
Speaker 1: need to have real conversations because now we see you know,
Speaker 1: when I do a training, I tell people the first
Speaker 1: thing I say is you're gonna all walk out of
Speaker 1: here superheroes, because you're going to be able to save
Speaker 1: a life. If anybody's listening to me, you should think
Speaker 1: about how much in the locks owner is in your
Speaker 1: community and who's got it, and realize that most of
Speaker 1: you with health insurance, particularly you live in open prescription cities,
Speaker 1: could get it with a very small copae and disremember,
Speaker 1: you never know when you're gonna need it. Thank you,
Speaker 1: Thank you. Why Am I telling You? This is a
Speaker 1: production of our Heart Radio, the Clinton Foundation and at
Speaker 1: Will Media. Our executive producers are Craig Manascian and Will Malnadi.
Speaker 1: Our production team includes Mitch Bluestein, Jamison cat Sufis, Tom Galton,
Speaker 1: Sarah Harrows, and Jake Young, with production support from Tyler
Speaker 1: Scott and Oltavia Young. Original music by What White. Special
Speaker 1: thanks to John Sykes, Tina Flinois, John Davidson on hell Arena,
Speaker 1: Corey Gantley, Oscar Flores, Kevin Thurm and all our dedicated
Speaker 1: staff and partners at the Clinton Foundation. If you have
Speaker 1: an idea of suggestion for the show, we'd love to
Speaker 1: hear it from you, so please visit Clinton Foundation dot
Speaker 1: org slash podcast to share your thoughts with us. If
Speaker 1: you like the show, tell someone else about it. You
Speaker 1: can subscribe to Who I Am I Telling You This
Speaker 1: on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever
Speaker 1: you get your podcast. By listening to this podcast, you're
Speaker 1: helping support the work of the Clinton Foundation. So thank you. Hi.
Speaker 1: I'm Chris Thrasher, and I serve as the Senior Director
Speaker 1: of Substance Use Disorders and recovery with the opiotor Sponse
Speaker 1: Network at the Clinton Foundation. According to the Centers for
Speaker 1: Disease Control and Prevention, each year we lose tens of
Speaker 1: thousands of lives to an opiate overdose in the United States,
Speaker 1: and now with COVID nineteen, this tragic and preventable epidemic
Speaker 1: has only worsened and intensified. At the Clinton Foundation, we're
Speaker 1: working to combat this crisis head on. We invite you
Speaker 1: to learn more about our work and see how you
Speaker 1: can get involved. Please visit us at Clinton Foundation dot org.
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