Speaker 1: All right, ready for the theme. Ready, I'm not hearing it?
Speaker 2: Is it playing?
Speaker 1: It was playing, but we're not hearing it either.
Speaker 2: Okay, I don't need to hear the theme. I've heard.
Speaker 1: I don't need to either, as long as I might
Speaker 1: like it, I really trust it's that it's happening and
Speaker 1: he's leaving, and I don't blame him.
Speaker 2: Okay, my fireplace, No, that's fine. And just in terms
Speaker 2: of the theme case here, are we going to try
Speaker 2: again or are we just going to kind of say,
Speaker 2: like forget the theme this week? Who needs it?
Speaker 1: We had it for a second. I don't that and
Speaker 1: now we lost it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we done it. So this is I think, Chuck,
Speaker 2: just so you know, episode like six hundred and thirty
Speaker 2: five or something, And so what we're finding is they
Speaker 2: don't have the audio for the theme song, which is
Speaker 2: totally normal, totally fine.
Speaker 1: This yeah podcast, like how many you we doo? Oh no, sorry,
Speaker 1: that's six hundred just of our main show. Yeah, this show.
Speaker 1: We also do a bonus show every week and the
Speaker 1: show about basketball.
Speaker 2: Yeah we do so wow.
Speaker 1: Okay, and we're back with Chuck Klosterman. The book is footballs.
Speaker 2: The book is football and I can I actually launch
Speaker 2: in just with a Can I get the gripe of
Speaker 2: the week off my chest? As long as we're talking
Speaker 2: about football? Is that okay with everybody?
Speaker 1: It's okay with me, okay with you, Chuck crazy Chuck.
Speaker 2: For me, it's the hypocrisy. For me, it's the hypocrisy
Speaker 2: that's what's making me insane right now in this day
Speaker 2: and age in the world. I'm raising my children in
Speaker 2: for any journalist, nay, any human being to behave as
Speaker 2: if they have not gone on a romantic vacation with
Speaker 2: Mike Rabel m hm. Like it's disgusting, and it's like
Speaker 2: we all want to any embattled figure, you know, we
Speaker 2: all want to pile on, right, it's not me, anyone
Speaker 2: but me, and we're gonna just kick them while they're down.
Speaker 2: And it's you know, for me to have to look
Speaker 2: my son Rabel in the eye and try to explain
Speaker 2: to him that this kind of thing goes on and
Speaker 2: that people are just willing to pretend like we look,
Speaker 2: we all love football, right, We're all in the same place.
Speaker 2: We go to these stadiums, We're in the same hotel.
Speaker 2: You think nobody else got in the hot time.
Speaker 1: And Chuck, I noticed in the book you did not
Speaker 1: talk about the extramarital activities of coach Rabel. Is that
Speaker 1: because you were yourself conflicted out having like, let's just
Speaker 1: say it, every single person in this room.
Speaker 2: Every single person here participated. Yourself just jumped down into
Speaker 2: the tub.
Speaker 3: Did something happen with Mike Rabel? Is this about the combine?
Speaker 2: Oh? Chuck, Oh sweetie, You've been on such a such
Speaker 2: a worldwood But you know, I haven't seen I.
Speaker 3: I kind of you know, I try to. I don't
Speaker 3: want to know gabble too much in the news, So
Speaker 3: I just you know, I I.
Speaker 2: The book is about old stuff largely.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, so so like, uh so something went went
Speaker 3: on with Mike Rabel. I mean, you know, he's I
Speaker 3: thought he was a really durrated guy with the Titans, seem
Speaker 3: having real success with the Patriots. Uh, you know, loved
Speaker 3: by the media generally.
Speaker 2: So what the media?
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, so is something what's happening? What's what's happening now?
Speaker 2: So I don't want to be the one to bring
Speaker 2: this news.
Speaker 1: Hey, apparently kissing is illegal. Now now that's now you
Speaker 1: go to jail. Apparently in mister Trump's America. You are
Speaker 1: not allowed to smooch, to.
Speaker 2: Have affection, to show love, to express physically any kind
Speaker 2: of tenderness.
Speaker 1: In this fascist state. Go ahead.
Speaker 3: So that's involved with what like Drake May, I'm guessing,
Speaker 3: what's he?
Speaker 2: Who?
Speaker 3: What happened?
Speaker 2: I hope So, I hope Drake's been as busy as
Speaker 2: you are. I hope he hasn't seen any of this.
Speaker 1: Or I hope if he has, he's been inspired by
Speaker 1: the idea that you can actually show love too, for example,
Speaker 1: multiple receivers, as he did this season, distributing the ball
Speaker 1: equally among among his entire core, and not just having
Speaker 1: one person that you could shoot it.
Speaker 2: To that for the entire season going okay, well, I
Speaker 2: guess you know, Stephen Diggs has the sacred ring, you know,
Speaker 2: and then I can only throw to this one man
Speaker 2: because he's you know, he's been here the longest or something,
Speaker 2: when there's other people who deserve to have a shot
Speaker 2: to them.
Speaker 1: And we're back Chuck Closterman, The book is the book
Speaker 1: is football. So what made you want to do about
Speaker 1: a football?
Speaker 2: What made you say football?
Speaker 3: What made me say football? And white like that, you're
Speaker 3: pluralizing it as well, because Obviously the game involves multiple balls.
Speaker 1: It would be ridiculous to just talk about one.
Speaker 2: It only be one the whole time. Think about how
Speaker 2: filthy it would be.
Speaker 1: Well, I you know, I but I play this out. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Is it kind of unfair? And this is I mean,
Speaker 1: this is what they said to Tom right, Oh, this
Speaker 1: is a different footballs. This is different they said it
Speaker 1: to Tom. That's illegal too, mm hmm. Too many footballs
Speaker 1: that he used, so should so I guess what they
Speaker 1: want is you should just use the same footballs.
Speaker 2: Let's have it be fair. Everyone has one football for
Speaker 2: the whole season, and if you don't take care of it,
Speaker 2: that's your fault.
Speaker 3: So she was saying, like one per game, one per.
Speaker 1: One, each hard game as in the game of footballs,
Speaker 1: and they play the games one at a time.
Speaker 2: I was gonna say, each team gets a football, that's
Speaker 2: your football. When you're having a home game, you're in
Speaker 2: charge of it.
Speaker 1: Not fair and if you and if.
Speaker 2: Something goes wrong, that's on you.
Speaker 1: They stagger the games obviously they have to be either
Speaker 1: played in the same place, think happened and the footballs
Speaker 1: is just there and that's where the football lives. And
Speaker 1: then everyone gets it when it's there turns to get
Speaker 1: in is also for little kids.
Speaker 2: Boy, that'd be That'd be a shame, wouldn't it, Chuck,
Speaker 2: If the sport, the most popular sport in America, was
Speaker 2: teaching us about sharing and taking turns.
Speaker 1: Well, that'd be bad, allowed to do that. But you
Speaker 1: take too long, you.
Speaker 3: Think, Well, I just think this idea of this football
Speaker 3: idea you have is kind of intriguing me because you
Speaker 3: think of valuable that football would be. Oh, sell it, you.
Speaker 2: Know, breaking in to steal the other teams football the night.
Speaker 1: Before check with who better to ask a question? Oh,
Speaker 1: it's everyone thinks, Oh, we use a different football for
Speaker 1: every single game, and sometimes a bunch in the game.
Speaker 1: But what if we're wrong? Hm? But what if we're wrong?
Speaker 3: That's great point? Great point. Well, I you know, I
Speaker 3: You've given me a lot to think about here regarding
Speaker 3: the football itself, because you know, I'm writing I wrote
Speaker 3: this book about football, but I only, like, I only
Speaker 3: spent a few pages on the actual ball.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you and and.
Speaker 3: You the shape of it.
Speaker 2: So it's like, you know, you talk about the sport
Speaker 2: how it can only kind of get bigger and grow,
Speaker 2: and that's kind of the nature of it, and that's
Speaker 2: going to ultimately lead to its demise. But what if
Speaker 2: it became smaller in terms of just there was only
Speaker 2: one football? And whose version do you prefer minor Hayeses
Speaker 2: version of what? Well, So my idea is each team
Speaker 2: gets one football for the whole season if you lose
Speaker 2: your football. Hayes's idea is that there's actually only one
Speaker 2: football in the NFL in the world.
Speaker 3: I think that is the one that is the one
Speaker 3: I prefer the world. Yeah, I mean, because it would
Speaker 3: become such a just such a sought after item, you know,
Speaker 3: be like uh, and and its future would be mean,
Speaker 3: you know, I I like the idea of all having
Speaker 3: I mean, that's a lot of sharing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and my and my and my idea cannon fodder.
Speaker 2: It was cannon fodder for me. I know, Hayes's only
Speaker 2: one in football the world. That's obviously, you know, the
Speaker 2: right choice. But I have to provide some cannon fodder.
Speaker 2: So you're making choices too on the show.
Speaker 1: Now, going back to the book, it was sort of
Speaker 1: a revelation for me, Uh what what you taught me?
Speaker 1: In the same way I remember reading you talk about
Speaker 1: Muhammad Ali and his influence on wrapping years ago, and
Speaker 1: the same way you sort of laid out the connection
Speaker 1: between Stewie the Baby being the inspiration for the shape
Speaker 1: of the football that his the shape of his head
Speaker 1: was what originally inspired the football to be shaped like
Speaker 1: Stee the Baby.
Speaker 3: You're talking about the Family Guy character.
Speaker 1: But he was on Family Guy.
Speaker 2: He's got his own show now, but he certainly was,
Speaker 2: so yeah he was.
Speaker 1: I had sort of forgotten that the Baby was on
Speaker 1: Family Guy.
Speaker 2: But know, yeah, yeah, I mean people forget that.
Speaker 3: Huh, there's spin off or something, and he has a
Speaker 3: different show now, this baby.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So yeah, Stue, he's got to show the two season. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so he's got his own job.
Speaker 1: It's basically Family Guy is basically a distant memory at
Speaker 1: this point for Stewie the Baby, but was not allowed
Speaker 1: to do. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I was like, no, Tom Brady got drafted by the
Speaker 2: Expos or whatever. But that's not how we think of him.
Speaker 2: It's not really how we think of him as it.
Speaker 3: No, that's true. That's a that's true. They do not
Speaker 3: associate him with the Expos.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're back with Chuck Closterman. The book is Football
Speaker 1: is Chuck we have a question you were of course
Speaker 1: they answering questions. We have been trying since you were
Speaker 1: first the epheicist to get you on the show because
Speaker 1: we have so many questions for you.
Speaker 2: The show, the world of the show is rife with
Speaker 2: moral quandaries.
Speaker 3: That would be you know, I feel I haven't done
Speaker 3: this in a while, but I would. I would love
Speaker 3: this go ahead.
Speaker 2: I gotta feeling the the muscles still work in there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, where to begin? So let's I mean, and
Speaker 1: we don't want to use real names in this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, just just it's sensitive for some people because we
Speaker 2: they are real issues.
Speaker 1: Uh say, some men are on a podcast. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: that podcast is on a network.
Speaker 3: Like a television network or like a podcast.
Speaker 2: Well, well they're filming it, but it is it is
Speaker 2: a podcast network primarily. But you know they've all got
Speaker 2: to do video, now, don't they.
Speaker 3: The computer network just on the the network of computers. Okay, Okay,
Speaker 3: sure I can imagine this.
Speaker 1: And the network. The face of the network is a
Speaker 1: famous man who is friends with Pete Carroll from your book, okay,
Speaker 1: and is in a movie and another movie, a dozen
Speaker 1: or so movies and and another and he has not
Speaker 1: done the men's podcast yet and he has not been asked.
Speaker 2: It's been there's been a bit of an overture made. Uh,
Speaker 2: there's a So let's say he has a shingle on
Speaker 2: the network that has a label, maybe it's Big Money Players,
Speaker 2: and we are required to display this label promoting this brand.
Speaker 2: And yet this man, let's say he was in, uh, two.
Speaker 1: Movies called Achorman. Does he have a.
Speaker 2: Moral obligation to appear on the show as a guest.
Speaker 1: If he has time to literally do two movies that
Speaker 1: are both called Acreman, is that that est that he
Speaker 1: might have time to go his old podcast?
Speaker 3: I need to go to revisit the thing you mentioned earlier.
Speaker 3: He has not been asked, though you said he is
Speaker 3: not You've not asked this person to do this.
Speaker 2: Now. I don't think I used the word overture correctly,
Speaker 2: but but what was there was something sort of okay, good.
Speaker 3: So like like you said, like this individual whoever you
Speaker 3: were like around him? And you just mentioned like, hey,
Speaker 3: we have a podcast, we're always looking for guests.
Speaker 2: No, we've never been around him. That's not part of
Speaker 2: our around.
Speaker 3: Okay, but you've never met the individual.
Speaker 1: There's people who.
Speaker 2: Work with him okay, more direct by choice?
Speaker 3: By choice? Or are these like slaves? Are these like
Speaker 3: are these employees?
Speaker 1: Like what is the what is the God? I've never asked?
Speaker 1: I've never asked? And that interesting topic for the podcast,
Speaker 1: and it could explain that could explain the reluctance to participate.
Speaker 2: There's certainly a power dynamic there where I think the
Speaker 2: the general idea of there's a new podcast joining the
Speaker 2: network and it would be good for them to have
Speaker 2: you as a guest was maybe spoken aloud it immediately
Speaker 2: shut down.
Speaker 1: But does the famous anchor man have the obligation to
Speaker 1: take the initiative to appear on the show, even in
Speaker 1: a fun way where he just pops out sometimes m hm,
Speaker 1: where it's a surprise and he's just hanging out around
Speaker 1: the office. Hey guys, yeah, and we hang out after.
Speaker 2: Imagine he just plopped down sort of in the corner
Speaker 2: here with a bag of chips and said, don't mind me.
Speaker 3: Okay, this might be an impossible question for you guys
Speaker 3: to answer, But do you suspect he is aware that
Speaker 3: this desire even exists from you guys? Like is he
Speaker 3: are you under the impression that he consciously knows that
Speaker 3: people want him to go on a podcast and he's
Speaker 3: just not doing it.
Speaker 1: We so far have not determined a piece of that question,
Speaker 1: which is is he aware of the men.
Speaker 2: The Do the men exist in his mind at all?
Speaker 1: So whether the awareness is there of whether the men
Speaker 1: want him to be on the podcast, the men on
Speaker 1: the podcast Men on the.
Speaker 3: Podcast podcast is not called the men. You're talking about
Speaker 3: the two men.
Speaker 2: The the the In the hypothetical though, where someone were
Speaker 2: to ask him, do you think two men at a
Speaker 2: certain age with a podcast on your network would want
Speaker 2: you to appear? I think he would have to say yes,
Speaker 2: he knows that they would want that.
Speaker 3: Well, I guess it's myra celebrity.
Speaker 4: And what I would find what I have learned from
Speaker 4: the world of podcasting ahead and from the world which
Speaker 4: kind of you guys exist in the world of Hollywood
Speaker 4: and all this.
Speaker 3: It's kind of inactional world, right action?
Speaker 2: So what what would you what would.
Speaker 3: Be the what would be the transaction from the end
Speaker 3: of the man like, what are they? What would they provide?
Speaker 1: We offer?
Speaker 2: What would we offer? I would say, you guys, uh uh.
Speaker 2: You know, it's easier for me to talk about this
Speaker 2: if I sort of take on.
Speaker 1: The uh.
Speaker 3: Boy, I don't know.
Speaker 1: I really convinced myself for a second that this wasn't
Speaker 1: my life.
Speaker 2: I did not set out today to play chess with
Speaker 2: the grandmaster.
Speaker 3: Mm hmmm.
Speaker 1: And now I'm so, is this what you used to
Speaker 1: And I remember how you used to do this on
Speaker 1: the eficus now where you would spend most of your
Speaker 1: time and answering the questions, revealing the identities of the
Speaker 1: asker and the subject. Yes, for your own pleasure.
Speaker 2: Exposing though mm hmm, yes it was. It was honestly
Speaker 2: my first exposure to true got to journalism.
Speaker 3: That was a real stressful job, though, I have to
Speaker 3: say for a weird reason.
Speaker 1: Keeps a weird reason.
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, because like everyone thinks of now, like newspapers
Speaker 3: are just on the internet, but you know they still
Speaker 3: make the old physical copy, right, they own physical magazine.
Speaker 3: So in order to get that printed, I had to
Speaker 3: sort of have the entire thing done like nine days
Speaker 3: before it came out. So then once it was locked
Speaker 3: and it was going to be in the magazine, I
Speaker 3: would spend nine days thinking about how I might be incorrect.
Speaker 3: It would just be it was.
Speaker 1: Terrible standards change society of alls, Yes, and in nine days,
Speaker 1: people's relationship to for example, adultery changes on if you
Speaker 1: think about.
Speaker 2: It a day basis, nine days ago, the way I
Speaker 2: would have thought about even throwing a football to multiple receivers. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and how more objectionable that would be to me? And
Speaker 2: now to look at it from my current purview, with
Speaker 2: the perfect information that I have that actually that's good
Speaker 2: for the team. I uh, I would not I would
Speaker 2: not want that job.
Speaker 1: Next question, yep, okay, okay. A producer a man a
Speaker 1: man podcast. I guess this producer is actually producing a podcast.
Speaker 3: Okay, podcast.
Speaker 1: So you're thinking, so you're thinking of a pro, you're
Speaker 1: thinking of a producer. Yeah, okay, this is a this
Speaker 1: is a this is a producer. And this is a
Speaker 1: man who actually produces a podcast.
Speaker 2: Okay, produces like seventeen of them or something. And then
Speaker 2: every time he drops one, he goes like.
Speaker 5: Good news, good news, it's just one. I'm doing one less. Okay,
Speaker 5: I'll have more time for you. This is how this
Speaker 5: guy talks really anyways.
Speaker 2: A podcast producer Okay, and he is. He's a little boy.
Speaker 2: He's from a insanely wealthy insurance dynasty. So so so
Speaker 2: then what he even does is like the fact that
Speaker 2: he's producing podcast at all, I think is just a
Speaker 2: fuck you to his old man sort.
Speaker 1: Of a joke. Okay, okay, or it's another way to
Speaker 1: prop it off people. I guess yes.
Speaker 3: Would classify this man's father as as like wealthy or
Speaker 3: very rich? Is he very is the father very rich?
Speaker 3: Like if if you looked up this guy on Wikipedia,
Speaker 3: would mentioned the wealth of his father.
Speaker 1: The producer likes to say he has freak you money.
Speaker 3: Mm hm okay, okay, okay, okay, okay.
Speaker 2: So this producer, he's a producer and uh, he has
Speaker 2: over the course of several years sort of burrowed his
Speaker 2: way under the skin of this podcast so that he
Speaker 2: is kind of inextricable without pulling out something crucial to
Speaker 2: the sort of existence of it.
Speaker 3: Is this troubling or is this positive?
Speaker 1: It's just part of the it's become a body part.
Speaker 2: There was a time when there have been different times
Speaker 2: throughout the length of the relationship that it has been.
Speaker 3: Both oh really at the same time.
Speaker 1: You know how you have like a tick. Sometimes it
Speaker 1: gets in like to your feet and you're just like, okay,
Speaker 1: well that's like another toe now basically mm hmmm, like, well,
Speaker 1: that's kind.
Speaker 3: Of a that's outside the box thinking that's not really
Speaker 3: usually simultaneously positive. But okay, I guess it could be.
Speaker 3: I mean I guess, well.
Speaker 2: You know, sometimes it feels kind of good.
Speaker 3: I mean, well, you're you're you guys come from more
Speaker 3: of a tick place, like I feel like, well, I'll say,
Speaker 3: in New England there are ticks or like you're like,
Speaker 3: you know, like Fire Island places like that.
Speaker 2: Rather you said it, yeah, I get that one tick.
Speaker 3: You're not like red meat or whatever. Though, let's say
Speaker 3: with the lone star tick, are you familiar with this?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, no, yes, every single one. We're familiar.
Speaker 2: There's there's not a tick under the side.
Speaker 3: I don't want to I don't want to get you
Speaker 3: after it. So this producer kind of has kind of
Speaker 3: the Michael jacksony voice. You described wealthy, come from wealth.
Speaker 1: And Michael Jackson, Yeah, like nineteen eighty one.
Speaker 2: And I'm dating myself.
Speaker 3: Yeah, off the wall is.
Speaker 1: Yes, And this little boy has moved has also burrowed
Speaker 1: himself into a woman's affections somehow, and the two of
Speaker 1: them have moved to let's say, let's call it Klitsburgh.
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's use a fake name. So it's like Plittsburgh,
Speaker 2: Plencylblania Okay, for.
Speaker 1: Undisclosed reasons, Well, undisclosed to you or to anyway. We
Speaker 1: haven't asked, don't care, okay, would rather not know? Would Yeah,
Speaker 1: And this man, as of right now, the financial arrangement
Speaker 1: with the podcast is unchanged. Does the podcast have an
Speaker 1: ethical obligation to adjust the producer boys payment according to
Speaker 1: the cost of living in his new home?
Speaker 2: Just in terms, just in terms of the ethics of it.
Speaker 2: So let's say, and it just as an example, the
Speaker 2: kind of thing this producer might do, let's say, just
Speaker 2: so you have a sense of kind of what he
Speaker 2: does for the show. So's you know, for a long time,
Speaker 2: I ever know what producers do on these show. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so for a long time he was sort of boots
Speaker 2: on the ground in Los Angeles. You get to the studio,
Speaker 2: you know, not really do anything we could see, but
Speaker 2: there was an assumption that something had been set up
Speaker 2: for us.
Speaker 1: He'd make something. If you make a pizza sandwich for us,
Speaker 1: Have you ever had a pizza sandwich?
Speaker 3: Is that like that like a subway? But it's just
Speaker 3: like there's just pepperoni and cheese.
Speaker 1: There's cheese and marion Ao sauce. But it's on bread
Speaker 1: like sandwich bread. It's not hot.
Speaker 3: Oh that that's well. How what it's cold marion Ao sauce.
Speaker 2: Cold, mari and Ea, it's not cold. It's not like
Speaker 2: and the bread's like bread's actively cold. The bread comes
Speaker 2: out of the free but it's not like frozen. It's
Speaker 2: like Marionaro sauce. Yeah, room temp. It's a cold room.
Speaker 2: But they that's one thing does so that's so that's.
Speaker 1: What he used to do.
Speaker 2: Now that he's in in Pittsburgh, maybe a guest is
Speaker 2: coming on the show. Hell, maybe he's the epicist.
Speaker 1: And uh you.
Speaker 2: Would maybe see him torturing this person with uh little
Speaker 2: technical nitpicks. Yeah here pull pull down menus in quick time,
Speaker 2: et cetera, completely ignoring that incredibly.
Speaker 1: Completely microphone bullshit.
Speaker 2: And and the host may sit down and sort of
Speaker 2: try to engage a little bit, have a little bit
Speaker 2: like warm banter with the guests prior to the recording starting,
Speaker 2: and that would be forbidden by this producer who needs
Speaker 2: to play his sick sort of jigsaw like games with
Speaker 2: the different recording menus.
Speaker 3: Okay, okay, the power the attempt, the attempt to say
Speaker 3: warm the guest up getting comfortable. That's undercut by these
Speaker 3: technical the technical jargon.
Speaker 2: Which, by the way, is what is what these podcasts
Speaker 2: would be known for, is making everyone so comfortable doing
Speaker 2: the show, which is supposed to be cool.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, podcast just like guys talking. They always guys.
Speaker 3: People complement a podcast by saying it just sounds like
Speaker 3: Jude's at a bar chatting.
Speaker 1: Are flowing conversation that occasionally touches.
Speaker 3: On subjects, yes, yes, yes, real friends.
Speaker 1: Yes. Instead, we have an expensive boy in Plittsburgh. Who
Speaker 1: imagine this if he had been living in Plittsburgh and
Speaker 1: moved to Los Angeles. I have a feeling we would
Speaker 1: get a get another text about how, hey, it's really
Speaker 1: expensive to live here. How about a cost of living adjustment.
Speaker 2: Some sort of some sort of transportation fee, yes, uh,
Speaker 2: some sort of housing you know, stipend, and.
Speaker 1: Something like hooks to area median income for example, is
Speaker 1: our ethical obligation?
Speaker 2: Now this guy moves to a fucking palace in the
Speaker 2: middle of the country.
Speaker 3: I mean this is complicated for a couple of reasons. One, yeah,
Speaker 3: you keep calling him a boy. Is he a minor?
Speaker 3: Is this a child or he just sort of is
Speaker 3: that a kind of a pejorative way you.
Speaker 2: Refer to him, and he's a major child because they
Speaker 2: fucking little baby.
Speaker 3: The cost of living thing is is confusing because I've
Speaker 3: been seeing these these ads from a mayorial candidate, Spencer Pratt.
Speaker 3: It actually looks real cheap to live in la. It
Speaker 3: seems like there's lots of places you can just live.
Speaker 3: So I don't know if the cost of living is
Speaker 3: really a problem.
Speaker 1: So he is actually the one making those ads he's
Speaker 1: been very involved in.
Speaker 2: Really Yeah, the producer is again he's moonlighting. He's always
Speaker 2: doing nineteen other shows and then and then he's got,
Speaker 2: you know, time to.
Speaker 1: Work with.
Speaker 2: Expencer Pratt. That's what he calls because he has an
Speaker 2: expense account with the campaign.
Speaker 3: But but you're and you're wondering if ethically you can
Speaker 3: reduce his salary because we have.
Speaker 1: A more obligation obligation.
Speaker 2: Okay, are you just from an ethical standpoint?
Speaker 3: Yes, well, I mean I suppose one could argue that
Speaker 3: like you need to refer to him as a boy,
Speaker 3: like needs to learn the value of.
Speaker 6: Dollar boy, it could help him, huh Yeah, And maybe
Speaker 6: it might be to his benefit in a way to
Speaker 6: make less it's for him, awsible.
Speaker 2: I don't want to take his money away, But how
Speaker 2: ese is he gonna understand exactly you make the same
Speaker 2: amount of Pittsburgh.
Speaker 3: He did in La It's actually it's Pittsburgh. You know,
Speaker 3: what is the town? Maybe some kind of weird like
Speaker 3: sex town outside of Vegas the way you were describing
Speaker 3: it before. But it was like, that's a Pittsburgh, you know,
Speaker 3: is a kind of undergrade.
Speaker 2: He did go to Vegas a lot and he didn't gamble,
Speaker 2: and that's not making me wonder is there Pittsburgh there?
Speaker 2: That was actually we were spending a lot of the time.
Speaker 1: Go to Vegas to smoke cigars. And now that I'm
Speaker 1: thinking about it, like that doesn't really why would you
Speaker 1: go all the way that you can do that here?
Speaker 2: Yeah, that doesn't seem like a it requires travel.
Speaker 1: But he does say you can have a sex town anywhere, like.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's sort of a famous.
Speaker 3: Okay, okay, question three.
Speaker 1: Okay, So we're back with Chuck close from in the
Speaker 1: book is the book is Football's and we're.
Speaker 3: Coming back from He keeps saying that they're gonna be
Speaker 3: ads dropped in here is this like real lucrative keep
Speaker 3: fingers crossed.
Speaker 1: You know, we're going to do the beginning of this
Speaker 1: at the end, so like we're gonna so like sorry,
Speaker 1: did he not explain this? Do you like?
Speaker 2: We we this is when we have to cut his pay.
Speaker 1: We always kind of like we heat up over the
Speaker 1: course of of the show. Fourth quarter guys, Yeah, yeah, right,
Speaker 1: And we want that energy at the beginning.
Speaker 2: To launch us because otherwise people will turn the show off.
Speaker 2: If people hear the beginning of the show first, they
Speaker 2: turn it off.
Speaker 3: It was boring. Our early interaction was boring.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the whole thing, the whole thing has been bad.
Speaker 2: But the but the other thing I'll say, Chuck, is
Speaker 2: when when you ask whether you know whether we're gonna
Speaker 2: have ads dress for the job you want, you know,
Speaker 2: host for the podcast you want, and there's sort of
Speaker 2: a fake it to you make it. I think if
Speaker 2: we do enough coming back from an ad break, those
Speaker 2: ads are going to find their way to us.
Speaker 7: Well, I've always thought a good idea for a podcast
Speaker 7: would be two ads for like, have you have no
Speaker 7: relationship to the product yet, like you think you actually
Speaker 7: like the thing, and then you'd think the company would
Speaker 7: hear that, knowing that it's a sincere, you know, endorsement,
Speaker 7: and then they would come in later and say, like, okay.
Speaker 3: Keeps promoting, you know, like whatever it is, whatever, whatever,
Speaker 3: I'll take that. Yeah, you guys love the shampoos. Obviously
Speaker 3: they love the shampoo, modern.
Speaker 2: Mammals, et cetera.
Speaker 1: Or just send the invoice, right, don't even do it, Yeah,
Speaker 1: just send out send out sentiment. Gonna check they're gonna
Speaker 1: five hundred invoices. Yeah, not everyone is gonna.
Speaker 2: They're gonna pay.
Speaker 1: I have to deal, like maybe.
Speaker 3: Three will more a kind of a gamble, more of
Speaker 3: a gamble.
Speaker 1: Yes, we have, but that's seventy five bucks, you know, like.
Speaker 2: Really picture it the I guess. The third question would be.
Speaker 1: If there was a man.
Speaker 2: Okay, maybe a podcast was maybe he's not who through
Speaker 2: some sort of deceit or trick, he was able to
Speaker 2: get the Mandalorian's friend Grogu, to use his force choke
Speaker 2: powers on him in order to participate in some sort
Speaker 2: of autoerotic asphyxiation.
Speaker 1: Activity.
Speaker 2: Is that morally wrong for Grogu to be unaware that
Speaker 2: he's participating in a kink? Just before you answer, before
Speaker 2: you answer before you answer it. I just need to
Speaker 2: say it because I can already hear the comments. So
Speaker 2: this is a hypothetical question. Anyway, the term baby Yoda
Speaker 2: is a misnomer. Grogu' is at least fifty years old,
Speaker 2: which is older, which is older than me, older than
Speaker 2: this man and the example.
Speaker 1: It's not canon like everyone calling him that is actually
Speaker 1: the sick one. You could argue, yes, disgusting. This is
Speaker 1: a transaction between adults. Everything else aside like this. This
Speaker 1: is two adults and.
Speaker 2: And potentially, you know, Grogu may be willing to participate
Speaker 2: in this with the knowledge, but that would then not
Speaker 2: feel as good to the man.
Speaker 3: Oh that's this is this is interesting now. So you're
Speaker 3: saying that in order for this to have like the
Speaker 3: maximum erotic power, the baby Yoda has to be in
Speaker 3: some way tricked into this.
Speaker 2: But he's choosing to force choke, you know, maybe it's
Speaker 2: a training exercise something like this. It's gonna leave him
Speaker 2: quite tired.
Speaker 1: At the very least. Can we please call him Yoda
Speaker 1: the grown up? Yes?
Speaker 3: Okay, yes, okay?
Speaker 2: Or or.
Speaker 1: I don't know what's Yoda of a certain age.
Speaker 3: He can't really call him an adult Yoda though, right,
Speaker 3: that wouldn't make sense.
Speaker 2: He's not old Yoda, but I think he is. I
Speaker 2: think he's I think he's a grown up.
Speaker 3: And it's also what his what is this one's relationship
Speaker 3: to Yoda?
Speaker 1: Mm hmm?
Speaker 3: Is that explained? I didn't watch the Mandalorian Is he
Speaker 3: is the ma some people call the baby Yoda? I
Speaker 3: guess I initially assume that was just really young.
Speaker 1: They have they have they do sort of imply it.
Speaker 1: He wears a lockett mm hmm with a with a
Speaker 1: broken heart picture inside that has like real Yoda in it.
Speaker 1: So they are divorced.
Speaker 2: One half is forced So what.
Speaker 1: Grogu and Yoda? And again it's not like spelled out
Speaker 1: and the like. The implication is that.
Speaker 2: One thing I like about show I haven't seen it,
Speaker 2: but one thing I like about it is the way
Speaker 2: they do sort of bury these They they kind of
Speaker 2: leave the information there for the audience to come pick
Speaker 2: it up. They don't force feed it to you. And so, yeah,
Speaker 2: there's this Lockett and everyone now and then at the
Speaker 2: top or bottom of a scene you'll see Grogus or
Speaker 2: looking long and you get the broken heart photo of Yoda.
Speaker 3: Okay, so we're first of all, so we're all agreements.
Speaker 3: There's no element of use of a child. We're looking
Speaker 3: at this thing as an adult. The thing is an adult.
Speaker 1: Look at it over years old. Everyone's an adult.
Speaker 3: Okay, then you know, I guess, I mean, what what
Speaker 3: what's even the potential problem?
Speaker 1: I mean, what what do you like this individual? Just
Speaker 1: say if I can just say, this individual is committing
Speaker 1: crimes on behalf of the empire in order to gold.
Speaker 3: Wait okay, wait a second, I will now you finally
Speaker 3: frame this. So what the idea here is is someone
Speaker 3: is using this It was grokuh you say his name
Speaker 3: is baby OTAs Groku Goku. Someone someone is is is
Speaker 3: committing like genocide or whatever, blowing up planets whatever.
Speaker 1: I'm just saying, the bottom of mine. He's the bottom mine.
Speaker 1: He's the entire town. He's a minor character. He's sending
Speaker 1: the somebody minor.
Speaker 3: He kills a tonton for fun. But this causes the
Speaker 3: little the creature to then and then and the idea
Speaker 3: is then he will masturbate while this is happening.
Speaker 2: You're gonna.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well I don't know now because it's like, uh,
Speaker 3: I mean, is what do you.
Speaker 2: Commit on whether the crime is wrong, would you have
Speaker 2: committed that?
Speaker 3: Was like, if he was going to kill and just
Speaker 3: in this hypothetical he's going to kill the tonton anyways
Speaker 3: for sport, then this is just sort of And but
Speaker 3: if he's killing these things, he's doing these crimes in
Speaker 3: order to cause this thing to do, and otherwise what
Speaker 3: never happens. I guess I gotta say it's unethical.
Speaker 2: Become sticky.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it barely got on the episode too. It was
Speaker 1: implied by mister Favreau that it was going to be
Speaker 1: potentially like a star making, like if if this could
Speaker 1: all be filmed, that this that that this character would
Speaker 1: then become yes, potentially like a back door pilot like.
Speaker 2: Sort of the New Window or whatever.
Speaker 3: This is why it would have been much more interesting
Speaker 3: to be the ephicist for like the La Times, where
Speaker 3: the questions be more like this. This is like most
Speaker 3: of the questions I got were mostly from rabbis or
Speaker 3: lawyers or women who were breastfeeding. Those are the three
Speaker 3: people who asked the most questions to the ephesis.
Speaker 2: And what they want to know about breastfeeding.
Speaker 3: Was well, it was always issues. There was always issues
Speaker 3: about the ethics.
Speaker 2: Of it, and it cast out wherever I want.
Speaker 3: Well, nothing much that It was more like if I
Speaker 3: recall to do with like the idea of kind of
Speaker 3: shaming people or forcing people to breastfeed, and some people
Speaker 3: couldn't the use of formula. It just came up more
Speaker 3: than I would have I would I would might have
Speaker 3: anticipated that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, I wouldn't think. I wouldn't think the question
Speaker 2: of should I be shaming people would come up that much?
Speaker 1: And you would say, what, just like.
Speaker 3: Oh, I can't even remember a long time.
Speaker 2: Okay, all right, what do you want to talk about?
Speaker 1: We're back with Chuck Closterman. The books.
Speaker 2: It's huge. He's telling us Jim Thorpe's the goat, not
Speaker 2: Tom Brady. Okay, I didn't mean to spoil the whole chapter,
Speaker 2: but let's hear it, not the whole thing.
Speaker 1: Just is that true?
Speaker 7: Well?
Speaker 3: The argument is that, yes, that for greatness, for it's
Speaker 3: really an argument about how one gauges greatness.
Speaker 1: Okay, let's do this.
Speaker 2: Tom Brady is, Paul McCartney, Peyton Manning is John Lennon,
Speaker 2: Drew Brees is, George Harrison, Phil Rivers is Ringo.
Speaker 1: Tell me I'm wrong I'm wrong.
Speaker 3: Actually, that's like, that's not that's not bad. Well, you
Speaker 3: tom Brady was Paul, and Peyton.
Speaker 2: By Paul, and and Peyton's John.
Speaker 3: You want to flip, it needs to be reversed.
Speaker 2: I think Brady's John, Peyton's Paul George.
Speaker 3: Because Pyton was Peyton was more of the technician, you know.
Speaker 3: It's sort of like you know and whereas you know
Speaker 3: and Tom Brady is sort of the gritch you know,
Speaker 3: all that coming out. So that's but that's not bad.
Speaker 3: Philip Rivers is Ringo. That's kind of an interesting one.
Speaker 3: I don't know how Ringo doesn't have like nineteen kids
Speaker 3: or whatever. At first I was trying to figure this,
Speaker 3: so that was the connection.
Speaker 2: But I was thinking more about the football part of it,
Speaker 2: just because of your book or whatever.
Speaker 3: But just to be you know, the thing about that
Speaker 3: is the argument that I make in this book. If
Speaker 3: you're trying to classify something, because the most talented football
Speaker 3: player of all time is always going to be who's
Speaker 3: ever the most talented player right now because of the
Speaker 3: way the world improves and technology changes, and but if
Speaker 3: you're going to call something great needs to be the
Speaker 3: first elite, rendering of something whose qualities still exist in
Speaker 3: the modern version.
Speaker 1: So that would mean that the podcasters, yes, who are
Speaker 1: doing a podcast right now today, yep, this morning, are
Speaker 1: the best podcasters to ever do it before in the world.
Speaker 3: Well, if somebody ice, do you feel like the best
Speaker 3: podcast of all time are in our past, that there
Speaker 3: was a golden age of podcasting that's all over. I
Speaker 3: don't know if that's.
Speaker 2: Oh no, our best episodes are ahead of us, ahead
Speaker 2: of us there we are looking forward. If you even
Speaker 2: think about how much better this episode has gotten from
Speaker 2: when we started, and didn't we tell you that we
Speaker 2: were going to warm up into it? And isn't this
Speaker 2: feeling now that we started talking about music and football
Speaker 2: like all of a sudden, it's like whoa Like this
Speaker 2: is like, yes, we are on a rocket. I think
Speaker 2: the next episode we do after this.
Speaker 1: That is gonna be number one.
Speaker 3: Baby, ever you can putting that aside, what was your
Speaker 3: greatest episode? Do you do feel like you guys look
Speaker 3: back on these six hundred and some pods you've done
Speaker 3: and be like, that was the apex, this is when
Speaker 3: it was, This is when we really did it? Who
Speaker 3: is the guest?
Speaker 1: Who was it? Who just popped into your head. Well,
Speaker 1: because this is this is Malcolm right, it's blink.
Speaker 2: It's blink.
Speaker 1: Whoever, whoever, whoever just popped into your head is who
Speaker 1: it is? Yeah, and I'll tell you who, But you say.
Speaker 3: Say it at the same time.
Speaker 2: Okay, go ahead on G three, Michael Lawrence.
Speaker 3: Well there you go. I guess there's real, real kind
Speaker 3: of agreeming on it.
Speaker 1: That was amazing. He's right, Malcolm was right, Yeah.
Speaker 2: Malcolm's I mean, you know, the guys sees something about
Speaker 2: people that they don't necessarily see in themselves, writes about it.
Speaker 1: And the book is Footballs and we're back with you
Speaker 1: are here you brag about being friends with the octopus
Speaker 1: that predicts a super Bowl in the book, what he's
Speaker 1: saying about this season? And how did you guys become
Speaker 1: such good friends my octopus friend.
Speaker 3: Oh you may maybe that was not in the book.
Speaker 3: I don't think. I don't think in the final version.
Speaker 2: Again it's it's it's a little mandalorian keV asking that
Speaker 2: we read between the lines.
Speaker 1: Kevin, are you there? What's up? You explicitly said that
Speaker 1: he would exclusively on our show talk about how he's
Speaker 1: friends with the octopus that the Super Bowl and would
Speaker 1: tell us what was going to happen in every single
Speaker 1: game this season. I did period.
Speaker 3: Sorry that sounded like in between a question and a statement,
Speaker 3: but I did.
Speaker 2: There are different kinds of intelligence, aren't there, Chuck?
Speaker 3: For instance, you're yes, that's that's also do you listeners
Speaker 3: realize that you the one where's the exact same hat
Speaker 3: as the producer? Why is that? Are you supposed to
Speaker 3: wear the same hat?
Speaker 1: This is like part of his you know, it's Ripley's
Speaker 1: game he's playing, but he's not even hiding it.
Speaker 2: Okay, well one, Chuck, Is that why you're asking why
Speaker 2: we can get your hat back? Hat? Chuck?
Speaker 3: Well, I just it was I didn't expect it.
Speaker 2: You know, we take your hat some of the money.
Speaker 3: But yeah, same hat. Well, I you know, I I
Speaker 3: I would love to have insight about, you know, the
Speaker 3: this octopus scenario, but I I was there is this?
Speaker 3: Are you basing this was? There's like some news story
Speaker 3: about an octopus who did this? It seems vaguely familiar
Speaker 3: to me.
Speaker 2: Probably? Yeah.
Speaker 1: Do you try to stay away from the news several.
Speaker 3: Dozenas often like the animal picks something and you have
Speaker 3: for the NCAA tournament or something. They'll like put like
Speaker 3: every team, all sixty four teams in the under like
Speaker 3: golf balls or something, and they'll see like if the.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because then they it's which bananas the OCAs?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Uh, this isn't that. This is a super intelligent
Speaker 2: octopus who chooses the winner of the super Bowl. Maybe
Speaker 2: is influencing who wins in the choice.
Speaker 1: It's unclear, always correct, yes, if if the ocopus can
Speaker 1: see the future or create it.
Speaker 2: Whether it's an alien life force that actually is able
Speaker 2: to manipulate reality to fit whatever it decides.
Speaker 1: Or sees time as a cohesive block.
Speaker 2: Is already aware. The super Bowl has already happened for
Speaker 2: the octopus and is happening right now and will happen again.
Speaker 3: I mean, the octopus is a pretty interesting creature. I'm
Speaker 3: sure you've seen the footage of like the octopus who
Speaker 3: can like escape from its cage.
Speaker 1: This is the same one, same one, same exact.
Speaker 3: Guy, and he like kind of become different colors.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's how he announced what murder put on a helmet?
Speaker 3: Like, what did you throw in the idea that can
Speaker 3: like travel through time.
Speaker 2: Or experiencing that it is experiencing times.
Speaker 1: I mean we're all traveling through time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean episode, we're.
Speaker 3: Not really like astro projecting I guess into the future.
Speaker 3: I mean that would I suppose though, if we think
Speaker 3: the octopus can pick the super Bowl? He asked to
Speaker 3: travel through time, right.
Speaker 1: And we're back with chu of the book.
Speaker 2: It's about an octopus that can travel through time.
Speaker 1: What's the what's the what's the name of the next book?
Speaker 2: What are we doing next?
Speaker 3: The next book? Actually a book coming out in the fall.
Speaker 3: Weird two books this year. I wrote one book, wrote
Speaker 3: one book entirely. The publisher declined to publish it so
Speaker 3: it was too weird. So then I wrote the football book.
Speaker 3: They put that out, So then I took the other
Speaker 3: book to a different publisher, and now they're.
Speaker 2: Putting out all rub their nose in it. And what's
Speaker 2: the weird one. It's just called rock and it's fiction nonfiction.
Speaker 2: I know, we do both.
Speaker 1: I had sort of wonder, Chuck, and I didn't want
Speaker 1: to correct you about this at the time, but when
Speaker 1: you wrote sex, Drugs and Cocoa Puffs, I was like,
Speaker 1: I think this is a mistake. That book was supposed
Speaker 1: to be called sex drugs and rock. And so now
Speaker 1: that you're doing rock, is it sort of making amends.
Speaker 2: To make good, isn't it. We have to do those
Speaker 2: for our advertisers all the time. A little bit of
Speaker 2: a make good comes up frequently.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was in retrospect. I mean, I don't know
Speaker 3: if this is a makeup, but it was pretty stupid
Speaker 3: to have coco puffs in the title of a book
Speaker 3: when I look back at it now, Oh yeah, it's
Speaker 3: like that was because because I had a different title
Speaker 3: for that book, and then they were like, no, no,
Speaker 3: this title makes no sense whatsoever. And then like I said, well,
Speaker 3: you just want something like I don't know, sex, drugs
Speaker 3: and cocoa pops and they were like yes, And I
Speaker 3: was still, yeah, I wasn't successful or anything. I had
Speaker 3: no leverage. I couldn't say like, we're you know, we're
Speaker 3: not sticking with the you know, they wouldn't stick with
Speaker 3: the original title. So then you know, now I have
Speaker 3: to live with this that I don't love the title
Speaker 3: of that book.
Speaker 2: It seems kind of me but that's what what's the
Speaker 2: original title that you want.
Speaker 3: To American Minotaur?
Speaker 2: Oh interesting.
Speaker 1: That because they were horny the guys that it were horny.
Speaker 1: Uh no, by that would be that.
Speaker 3: Would be uh that would that would be That's unseemly
Speaker 3: that you would even suggest that would be.
Speaker 2: Well, we're experiencing now, a little bit of the Tory paradox,
Speaker 2: aren't we.
Speaker 3: By you really you've learned, you're making all these references. Wow,
Speaker 3: you know it's like this is this is proof that
Speaker 3: you were well informed. How old are you guys?
Speaker 1: Bye I, Hollywood, Hamburg,