1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,880 Speaker 1: Hi, this is new. I am currently staying at home 2 00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:06,320 Speaker 1: in Rome to bring you this episode this week. I'm 3 00:00:06,400 --> 00:00:09,440 Speaker 1: recording from my home, so you may notice a difference 4 00:00:09,440 --> 00:00:15,600 Speaker 1: in audio quality on this episode of nest World. This 5 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:18,520 Speaker 1: is the third and a series of episodes were presenting 6 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:23,079 Speaker 1: about China and COVID nineteen. What role did China play 7 00:00:23,120 --> 00:00:26,759 Speaker 1: in the spread of COVID nineteen globally? What responsibility should 8 00:00:26,800 --> 00:00:30,520 Speaker 1: they bear for the devastation the virus has cost? In 9 00:00:30,560 --> 00:00:34,760 Speaker 1: this episode. On April twenty first, twenty twenty, the State 10 00:00:34,760 --> 00:00:37,880 Speaker 1: of Missouri filed suit against China and the United States 11 00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:42,240 Speaker 1: District Court for the Eastern District of Missouri, Southeastern Division. 12 00:00:42,960 --> 00:00:46,280 Speaker 1: The State of Missouri versus the People's Republic of China 13 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:51,800 Speaker 1: the Communist Party attendant is a groundbreaking case called China Accountable. 14 00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:57,920 Speaker 1: The complain outlines four key factual allegations. They are one 15 00:00:58,480 --> 00:01:03,760 Speaker 1: denying the risk of humanity and transmission, two silencing whistle blowers, 16 00:01:04,520 --> 00:01:10,800 Speaker 1: three failing to contain the outbreak, four supporting personal protective equipment. 17 00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:15,880 Speaker 1: The lawsuit persuasively argues that the COVID nineteen outbreak has 18 00:01:15,920 --> 00:01:20,959 Speaker 1: caused hardship in Missouri and across the blow death, isolation 19 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:26,920 Speaker 1: from sick and dying loved ones, massy unemployment, economic dislocation, uncertainty, 20 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:31,240 Speaker 1: and trillions of dollars of economic losses. China should be 21 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 1: held legally responsible. I'm pleased to welcome my guests Errick Schmidt, 22 00:01:36,440 --> 00:01:47,600 Speaker 1: Attorney General for the State of Missouri. I am delighted 23 00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:51,680 Speaker 1: to have as my guest the Attorney General Missouri, Errick Schmidt, 24 00:01:51,680 --> 00:01:55,559 Speaker 1: who has I think shown great courage and also great 25 00:01:55,600 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 1: leadership in being willing to follow a lawsuit against the 26 00:01:58,760 --> 00:02:02,040 Speaker 1: Chinese government. Would you share with us what legend to 27 00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:04,360 Speaker 1: decide to do this well. I think what we've come 28 00:02:04,360 --> 00:02:07,920 Speaker 1: to know, Newt is that the Chinese government has engaged 29 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:12,640 Speaker 1: in far reaching and sweeping campaign of deception and deceit 30 00:02:12,919 --> 00:02:19,240 Speaker 1: and misrepresentations malfeasance about the origin of this virus, it's 31 00:02:19,320 --> 00:02:21,920 Speaker 1: impact it could have on the world, and it's been unleashed. 32 00:02:22,040 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 1: We have a global pandemic that none of us have 33 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:27,880 Speaker 1: really seen in our lifetimes at least, that has had 34 00:02:27,919 --> 00:02:30,840 Speaker 1: a profound impact all across the globe, and no one's 35 00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:34,919 Speaker 1: been spared. You have a profound loss of life, economic 36 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:38,240 Speaker 1: impact that's affected people's ability to put food on the table. 37 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:42,360 Speaker 1: In the United States alone, thirty million jobs lost in 38 00:02:42,440 --> 00:02:46,440 Speaker 1: just two months, which is really unbelievable. And the fact 39 00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:48,920 Speaker 1: is this all could have been prevented if they would 40 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:51,680 Speaker 1: have been transparent and honest about it. In my state, 41 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:55,560 Speaker 1: the state of Missouri is no exception to this. We 42 00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 1: have estimated up to forty four billion dollars worth of 43 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:04,800 Speaker 1: economic loss, hundreds of lives lost, people being separated in 44 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:07,960 Speaker 1: unprecedented ways too, that are affecting folks. I mean not 45 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:10,880 Speaker 1: being able to visit loved ones and nursing homes, people 46 00:03:10,960 --> 00:03:14,440 Speaker 1: dying alone, people not being able to attend funerals. We 47 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:17,840 Speaker 1: have a legislature that's been meeting this spring now trying 48 00:03:17,880 --> 00:03:20,440 Speaker 1: to craft a budget for the next fiscal year, which 49 00:03:20,440 --> 00:03:24,079 Speaker 1: begins on July first, with revenues falling off of a cliff, 50 00:03:24,480 --> 00:03:27,360 Speaker 1: and so the impact has been enormous and I feel 51 00:03:27,440 --> 00:03:31,320 Speaker 1: very strongly and have a moral conviction that as the 52 00:03:31,360 --> 00:03:34,520 Speaker 1: state's chief legal officer, we need to hold the Chinese 53 00:03:34,560 --> 00:03:37,280 Speaker 1: government accountable for these actions, and as we filed the 54 00:03:37,320 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 1: forty seventh page complaint in federal court. The timeline is 55 00:03:41,920 --> 00:03:45,520 Speaker 1: really important because there were critical weeks that were lost, 56 00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:51,760 Speaker 1: people silenced, whistleblowers, silence, people gone missing, evidence destroyed in 57 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:54,000 Speaker 1: a campaign really to keep the world in the dark 58 00:03:54,040 --> 00:03:57,760 Speaker 1: that starts really in mid to late November or early December. 59 00:03:58,040 --> 00:04:01,560 Speaker 1: We document in our federal complaint that was filed that 60 00:04:01,640 --> 00:04:05,120 Speaker 1: as soon as December fifth, there's an individual life of 61 00:04:05,120 --> 00:04:08,400 Speaker 1: someone who's been infected who was not present at the 62 00:04:08,440 --> 00:04:13,200 Speaker 1: wet market. So there's early evidence in December of human 63 00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:18,599 Speaker 1: to human transmission that's really denied by Chinese authorities until 64 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:21,840 Speaker 1: well into January. January twenty first, I think, is when 65 00:04:22,320 --> 00:04:25,200 Speaker 1: it's finally acknowledged of the human to human transmission, you've 66 00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:28,640 Speaker 1: got weeks and weeks of the Chinese government keeping the 67 00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 1: world in the dark. Unfortunately, on December thirtieth, a doctor 68 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:36,840 Speaker 1: in China sounding the alarm about this and who was 69 00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:41,680 Speaker 1: forced three cants in early January, passed away. So then 70 00:04:41,680 --> 00:04:44,599 Speaker 1: the question is do we have a cognizable legal claim, 71 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:47,560 Speaker 1: and we believe we do. We feel very strongly about this. 72 00:04:47,680 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 1: So for example, some of the criticism might be, well, 73 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:54,520 Speaker 1: you can't sue another sovereign nation a foreign country. Well 74 00:04:54,560 --> 00:04:57,800 Speaker 1: that's not true. Under the Foreign Sovereign Immunities Act, there 75 00:04:57,800 --> 00:05:00,799 Speaker 1: are exceptions to that, and one of which we identify 76 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:04,600 Speaker 1: and focus on, of course, is the commercial activity exception, 77 00:05:05,080 --> 00:05:10,440 Speaker 1: and so that broad protection doesn't extend if you're engaged 78 00:05:10,480 --> 00:05:13,680 Speaker 1: in commercial activity. And so we alleged that the hoarding 79 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 1: of PPE China, going from a net exporter to a 80 00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:20,920 Speaker 1: net importer of Ppe, all the while keeping the world 81 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:23,680 Speaker 1: in the dark, was a commercial activity. They run the 82 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:27,000 Speaker 1: hospital system and they also run the virology lab there 83 00:05:27,000 --> 00:05:30,400 Speaker 1: in Muhan, and so those are objective commercial activity, and 84 00:05:30,440 --> 00:05:34,000 Speaker 1: there's a case from the nineteen eighties of Justice. Kalia 85 00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:36,920 Speaker 1: notes that when you have that kind of evidence of 86 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:40,479 Speaker 1: objectively commercial activity where they're not just a regulator but 87 00:05:40,560 --> 00:05:43,560 Speaker 1: actually engaged in the marketplace, that sets you outside of 88 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:47,000 Speaker 1: the federal Sovereign Communities Act protection. So we feel very 89 00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:49,480 Speaker 1: strongly we're the first state to do it. I don't 90 00:05:49,520 --> 00:05:51,960 Speaker 1: think will be the last. And ultimately this is about 91 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:54,240 Speaker 1: placing the blame work belongs, which is its fee to 92 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:57,200 Speaker 1: the Chinese government and holding them account. Ones also worth 93 00:05:57,240 --> 00:06:00,719 Speaker 1: noting Newt that another way that we deal with the 94 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:04,280 Speaker 1: sovereign immunity issue is we also name non state actors 95 00:06:04,839 --> 00:06:09,279 Speaker 1: the Communist Party of China principally, and that they don't 96 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:11,800 Speaker 1: get to avail themselves those same protections. So again we 97 00:06:11,839 --> 00:06:13,919 Speaker 1: feel strongly about the merits of this claim and we 98 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:17,200 Speaker 1: intend to move forward aggressively. We did a podcast recently 99 00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:21,720 Speaker 1: with the CEO of a Canadian firm called Blue Dot, 100 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:27,720 Speaker 1: which is a very sophisticated monitoring system for viruses, and 101 00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:31,600 Speaker 1: as early as the separate thirty first they had posted 102 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:34,560 Speaker 1: a warning to their clients that something was going on 103 00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:38,200 Speaker 1: in Wuhan that could potentially become an epidemic. But at 104 00:06:38,240 --> 00:06:40,720 Speaker 1: that point they didn't say pandemic, but they could sense 105 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:44,400 Speaker 1: already something was going on. And I think there's a 106 00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:49,920 Speaker 1: general agreement that the Chinese Communist dictatorship been open with 107 00:06:50,040 --> 00:06:53,360 Speaker 1: the world in the first week of January, we might 108 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:57,720 Speaker 1: actually have contained the virus. When you file a suit 109 00:06:57,800 --> 00:07:01,560 Speaker 1: like this, first of all, did the courting supersition. Yeah, 110 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:04,000 Speaker 1: So it's been filed in federal court in the Eastern 111 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:08,640 Speaker 1: District of Missouri. The next step is to effectuate service 112 00:07:08,880 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 1: and then we'll see what their response is. The principally, 113 00:07:11,760 --> 00:07:15,000 Speaker 1: you've got the Chinese government and the CCP, which is 114 00:07:15,080 --> 00:07:17,760 Speaker 1: named two because we believe they are directly responsible for 115 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:20,600 Speaker 1: the suffering and they are a non state actor. It's 116 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 1: not going to happen overnight. This will be a slog 117 00:07:23,200 --> 00:07:26,760 Speaker 1: but I think these questions are very important to have answered. 118 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:28,880 Speaker 1: And you've got the denying of the risk of the 119 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:31,640 Speaker 1: human to human transmission, there's no question, and these are 120 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 1: all published, open record reports of what they knew. And 121 00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:38,360 Speaker 1: you've got the failing to contain the virus in Wuhan. 122 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 1: On January first alone, one hundred and seventy five thousand 123 00:07:41,520 --> 00:07:44,960 Speaker 1: people left Wuhan as people start to travel for the 124 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:47,840 Speaker 1: new year. And on January sixteenth, when this is mature 125 00:07:47,960 --> 00:07:51,080 Speaker 1: enough of a problem in China, you've got the pot 126 00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:54,160 Speaker 1: luck in Wuhan, which officials allowed to move forward. And 127 00:07:54,200 --> 00:07:56,080 Speaker 1: it's important to know too, the Chinese people have been 128 00:07:56,160 --> 00:07:58,960 Speaker 1: victimized by this regime in this regard to you've got 129 00:07:59,120 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 1: forty thousand people congregating well over a month after they're 130 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:06,080 Speaker 1: aware of a lot of the real dangers here, and 131 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 1: you're living and dealing with that. In Europe, it was 132 00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 1: hit before the United States, but now that it's come 133 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:13,920 Speaker 1: to our shores, the impact has been dramatic, and you're 134 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:17,240 Speaker 1: starting to see states slowly sort of open up with 135 00:08:17,360 --> 00:08:21,080 Speaker 1: health and safety guidelines, but the businesses, the families, the 136 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:23,800 Speaker 1: small businesses have been impacted. And I think it's important 137 00:08:23,840 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 1: to note that it's no coincidence that China is the 138 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:30,200 Speaker 1: largest net exporter of PPE and they become the largest 139 00:08:30,200 --> 00:08:34,000 Speaker 1: net importer of PPE. And there are certainly allegations in 140 00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 1: our complaint about junk PPE being sent out to the 141 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:41,319 Speaker 1: world as China horts the PPE and sort of continues 142 00:08:41,360 --> 00:08:44,440 Speaker 1: to gobble up everything in their country that was being 143 00:08:44,440 --> 00:08:47,000 Speaker 1: produced by industry as well. So it's pretty egregious the 144 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:50,040 Speaker 1: actions as they're laid out. We claim in our complaint 145 00:08:50,080 --> 00:08:53,000 Speaker 1: that there is a cognizable legal action that we can 146 00:08:53,040 --> 00:08:56,480 Speaker 1: assert as a state to recover damages from China. And 147 00:08:56,520 --> 00:08:59,320 Speaker 1: I think as legal observers look at this and further 148 00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:01,959 Speaker 1: understand and some of the exceptions we point out in 149 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:04,600 Speaker 1: the Federal Sovereign Immunities Act, the more people I think 150 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 1: are starting to understand that this is a serious action. 151 00:09:21,160 --> 00:09:26,360 Speaker 1: Would you provide service to the ambassador in Washington or 152 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:31,680 Speaker 1: to the dictatorship in the Chinese government's official response to 153 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:33,959 Speaker 1: this was telling. I mean, they just dismiss it. I 154 00:09:34,040 --> 00:09:37,360 Speaker 1: think they understand that the microscope of the world is 155 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 1: now on them. I think the world is asking for 156 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:42,280 Speaker 1: answers here. So I think as we move forward in 157 00:09:42,360 --> 00:09:45,920 Speaker 1: affectual eight service and get into discovery, that will be 158 00:09:45,960 --> 00:09:49,960 Speaker 1: a very important aspect of the lawsuit, understanding more fully 159 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:53,040 Speaker 1: their denial and their cover up. And it has had 160 00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:57,320 Speaker 1: global ramisfications to whatever credibility they had or were trying 161 00:09:57,320 --> 00:10:01,000 Speaker 1: to establish with the world about openness and transparency. I 162 00:10:01,040 --> 00:10:03,960 Speaker 1: think the world is beginning, if not already understood the 163 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:07,800 Speaker 1: real dangers here with this regime. The Chinese Communist Party 164 00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:11,680 Speaker 1: runs the country. The government is actually just an arm 165 00:10:11,679 --> 00:10:14,880 Speaker 1: of the Chinese Communist Party, and in that sense, you 166 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:18,439 Speaker 1: may be in a very unique position to sidestep much 167 00:10:18,440 --> 00:10:21,800 Speaker 1: of the sovereignty argument by going straight at the party, 168 00:10:22,480 --> 00:10:25,439 Speaker 1: because ultimately they would have been responsible for most of 169 00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:27,880 Speaker 1: the decisions. Well, I think that's right, and you look 170 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 1: at the top down approach. I mean you've got local 171 00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:35,680 Speaker 1: officials in January ordering folks in Wuhan to destroy evidence, 172 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:40,200 Speaker 1: people being censored for so called rumor mongering, people going missing, 173 00:10:40,640 --> 00:10:44,880 Speaker 1: journalists expelled. Then you have the Chinese National Organization in 174 00:10:44,920 --> 00:10:49,160 Speaker 1: early January January third issuing those same orders, and so 175 00:10:49,520 --> 00:10:52,439 Speaker 1: whatever information could have been gleaned early on was destroyed. 176 00:10:52,720 --> 00:10:57,160 Speaker 1: You've got CDC officials on January sixth denied entry into 177 00:10:57,160 --> 00:11:01,319 Speaker 1: the country, and so if they were serious notifying the world, 178 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:03,880 Speaker 1: And part of the duty in our complaint that we 179 00:11:03,960 --> 00:11:07,079 Speaker 1: note is that under international standards, when you become aware 180 00:11:07,120 --> 00:11:11,520 Speaker 1: of a public health emergency like this, you're expected to 181 00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:14,679 Speaker 1: let the world know. In the World Health Organization unfortunately 182 00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:19,079 Speaker 1: parroted a lot of China's downplaying of this until late January, 183 00:11:19,280 --> 00:11:21,120 Speaker 1: but they had a responsibility of the world. If you're 184 00:11:21,120 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 1: going to be a global power and something like this 185 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:24,960 Speaker 1: is about to be unleashed on the world, you have 186 00:11:24,960 --> 00:11:27,199 Speaker 1: a responsibility to let people know. And that just didn't happen. 187 00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:31,320 Speaker 1: And your lawsuit, since you're filing as the attorney general 188 00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:35,200 Speaker 1: of Missouri, will you be asking only for damages for 189 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:38,640 Speaker 1: the people of Missouri and what other attorney generals then 190 00:11:38,880 --> 00:11:42,800 Speaker 1: have to file their own taste for their particular stage damages. 191 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:46,000 Speaker 1: That's right, because those damages, as we alleged, unique to 192 00:11:46,040 --> 00:11:49,480 Speaker 1: each state. And so I have filed on behalf of 193 00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:53,000 Speaker 1: the six million Missourians. I think there'll be others that 194 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:55,360 Speaker 1: follow suit, but each lawsuit would be based on the 195 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:59,600 Speaker 1: damages for their state. Now, ultimately, if we get to 196 00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:02,640 Speaker 1: that point, I'm sure there's a lot of cooperation that 197 00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:05,880 Speaker 1: can happen as relates to uncovering evidence. But as far 198 00:12:05,920 --> 00:12:09,080 Speaker 1: as the complaint in the prayer for relief, as it's 199 00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:12,400 Speaker 1: noted in the lawsuit, those are specific to Missouri. How 200 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:16,240 Speaker 1: much would you like the Chinese communists to pay the 201 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:20,200 Speaker 1: people of Missouri. We've estimated this point upwards of forty 202 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:23,280 Speaker 1: four billion dollars. When you look at the loss of life, 203 00:12:23,400 --> 00:12:27,600 Speaker 1: the suffering, the economic damage, it's immense. In our complaint, 204 00:12:27,800 --> 00:12:30,200 Speaker 1: we note that at this point, when we filed on 205 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:33,079 Speaker 1: April twenty first, our estimate was up to forty four 206 00:12:33,080 --> 00:12:35,920 Speaker 1: billion dollars worth the damages for one state, Missouri, which 207 00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:38,839 Speaker 1: is six million Missouri's population wise, sort of right on 208 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:40,920 Speaker 1: the average. So you could extrapolate that out for a 209 00:12:40,960 --> 00:12:43,560 Speaker 1: number of other states as well. It's interesting because one 210 00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:48,000 Speaker 1: of the leading newspapers in Germany has calculated the China 211 00:12:48,040 --> 00:12:51,199 Speaker 1: Ow's Germany one hundred and forty nine billion euros, which 212 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:53,959 Speaker 1: should be about one hundred and fifty five billion dollars. 213 00:12:54,480 --> 00:12:56,520 Speaker 1: People around the world will beginning to accept the idea 214 00:12:56,600 --> 00:13:00,720 Speaker 1: that something really wrong happened here and that they have 215 00:13:00,840 --> 00:13:03,959 Speaker 1: to be held accountable. I think that's right. I think 216 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:07,360 Speaker 1: it's an opportunity for people to wake up and understand 217 00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:11,640 Speaker 1: how these kinds of issues are dealt with by this 218 00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:17,839 Speaker 1: communist regime. And in America, we believe in openness and accountability. 219 00:13:17,880 --> 00:13:20,640 Speaker 1: And I've taught a Civics class at my alma mater. 220 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:23,240 Speaker 1: The idea of that class was to gain a greater 221 00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:26,920 Speaker 1: appreciation for the American idea and who we are. We're 222 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:30,040 Speaker 1: credle nation, really the first of its kind. We're bound 223 00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:32,800 Speaker 1: together by this belief that all life has dignity and 224 00:13:32,960 --> 00:13:35,280 Speaker 1: a government as our shared project to protect our God 225 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:37,880 Speaker 1: given rights. That is not the view of the CCP. 226 00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:40,840 Speaker 1: That is not the view of the Chinese government. And 227 00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:45,199 Speaker 1: I think the sooner we appreciate the differences, I think 228 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:48,440 Speaker 1: it matters and how we deal with China and also 229 00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:50,959 Speaker 1: how we deal with our allies. I think a lot 230 00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:53,400 Speaker 1: of the conversation so far has been related to trade, 231 00:13:53,600 --> 00:13:56,079 Speaker 1: but there are much bigger and deeper conversations that I 232 00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:58,000 Speaker 1: think we're going to have as a country and as 233 00:13:58,080 --> 00:14:02,480 Speaker 1: Western democracies about the impact that this virus has had 234 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:04,440 Speaker 1: and why was it unleashed the way that it was, 235 00:14:04,480 --> 00:14:07,000 Speaker 1: and I think again the blame fall squarely on a 236 00:14:07,080 --> 00:14:10,440 Speaker 1: regime that prioritize secrecy and the cover up over the 237 00:14:10,480 --> 00:14:13,320 Speaker 1: health and welfare not only its own citizens, but the 238 00:14:13,320 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 1: people the world. Somebody listening to the two of us 239 00:14:16,600 --> 00:14:20,200 Speaker 1: wants to actually see the lawsuit. That's both available from 240 00:14:20,240 --> 00:14:24,000 Speaker 1: the court and is it also available from your office? Yeah, 241 00:14:24,200 --> 00:14:28,080 Speaker 1: Ago dot dot gov is our website and it's available 242 00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:31,520 Speaker 1: through the court system, and it's a forty seven page complaint. 243 00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:33,440 Speaker 1: One of the things that we were proud of is 244 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:37,120 Speaker 1: that it is an assemblage of facts that I'm not 245 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,640 Speaker 1: sure we're available in one place. Our folks took a 246 00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:41,720 Speaker 1: lot of time to make sure that we laid out 247 00:14:41,760 --> 00:14:45,520 Speaker 1: the factual basis and then the legal claims, and that's 248 00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:48,520 Speaker 1: there for the world to see. That in itself is 249 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:53,240 Speaker 1: a huge asset to have that document available. I know 250 00:14:53,360 --> 00:14:56,760 Speaker 1: the House Republicans are now setting up a task force 251 00:14:56,800 --> 00:14:59,280 Speaker 1: to look at China. I suspect the sun I will 252 00:14:59,280 --> 00:15:01,560 Speaker 1: be doing the same. Both of them would do well 253 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:05,600 Speaker 1: to have your documents. I think the other thing, too, 254 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:09,160 Speaker 1: is I think worth mentioning. Recently, I joined with seventeen 255 00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:12,040 Speaker 1: other attorneys general from across the country asking for a 256 00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:15,160 Speaker 1: congressional investigation. In my view of this is all of 257 00:15:15,160 --> 00:15:18,600 Speaker 1: the above. Missouri's got our lawsuit, We expect there to 258 00:15:18,640 --> 00:15:22,480 Speaker 1: be more state based lawsuits, a congressional investigation. I think 259 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:26,160 Speaker 1: it's all hands on deck. This is a historical pandemic 260 00:15:26,680 --> 00:15:45,840 Speaker 1: gets unprecedented, and so does start response be If in fact, 261 00:15:46,360 --> 00:15:52,280 Speaker 1: the communist dictatorship can cause the death of three or 262 00:15:52,280 --> 00:15:55,400 Speaker 1: four hundred thousand or more people around the world, the 263 00:15:55,520 --> 00:16:00,000 Speaker 1: destruction of tens of trillions of dollars of economic actors, 264 00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:05,760 Speaker 1: and have no consequence, that would vote very badly for 265 00:16:05,880 --> 00:16:10,400 Speaker 1: the future. I think teach the Chinese and really terrifying 266 00:16:10,560 --> 00:16:13,960 Speaker 1: lesson that they could get away with almost anything. Some 267 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:16,000 Speaker 1: people have asked me, what do you hope to accomplish 268 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:20,880 Speaker 1: with this? And it's justice, it's accountability, it's getting to 269 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:25,000 Speaker 1: the truth. And certainly our damages claim is real. As 270 00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:28,520 Speaker 1: I said, you've got the emotional suffering of people in 271 00:16:28,560 --> 00:16:31,160 Speaker 1: my state and across the globe who've been separated from 272 00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:34,400 Speaker 1: loved ones and loved ones who've died, the loss of jobs. 273 00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 1: I mean, if you just put that in context, it's 274 00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:41,800 Speaker 1: almost hard to fathom, thirty million jobs in sixty days 275 00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:46,080 Speaker 1: essentially is unprecedented, and I agree with you they need 276 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:48,840 Speaker 1: to be held accountable for this. It's possible this is 277 00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 1: not going to be the last time a virus comes 278 00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:54,040 Speaker 1: out of that part of the world. And so part 279 00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:56,960 Speaker 1: of this two is I think demanding accountability and answers 280 00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 1: and making sure this doesn't happen again. I think what 281 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:02,840 Speaker 1: you're doing senses vitally important. As you went through this 282 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:06,200 Speaker 1: and you assembled the supporties of the page brief, did 283 00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:11,160 Speaker 1: anything particularly leap out and surprise you, knowing what happened 284 00:17:11,560 --> 00:17:17,280 Speaker 1: in late December and really through January twenty first, when 285 00:17:17,280 --> 00:17:21,000 Speaker 1: the world becomes really aware of what this thing really is. 286 00:17:21,960 --> 00:17:25,680 Speaker 1: It's the knowledge of the human to human transmission, and 287 00:17:25,720 --> 00:17:32,359 Speaker 1: then the authoritative state mobilizing in full swing, and medical 288 00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:35,520 Speaker 1: professionals being told to be quiet, and of course we 289 00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:37,840 Speaker 1: know what that means in a state like that, evidence 290 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:42,960 Speaker 1: being ordered to be destroyed, citizen journalists gone missing. I 291 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:46,199 Speaker 1: mean the extent of the cover up. This could have 292 00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:49,399 Speaker 1: been prevented. It really could have been prevented or contained 293 00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:51,919 Speaker 1: to a large degree. It did not have to be 294 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:55,720 Speaker 1: this way. And I think the prioritization of whatever that 295 00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:57,800 Speaker 1: face they were trying to save, or the story they 296 00:17:57,840 --> 00:18:01,320 Speaker 1: were trying to tell over human life, to me is 297 00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:04,040 Speaker 1: compelling in why I say that felt the had a 298 00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:07,000 Speaker 1: moral obligation to do this. As the state's chief legal officer, 299 00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:09,480 Speaker 1: the people in my state look to me as their lawyer, 300 00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:13,680 Speaker 1: their advocate, and when you see this kind of malfeasance 301 00:18:13,680 --> 00:18:16,000 Speaker 1: and you see the impact it's had across the globe 302 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:18,800 Speaker 1: and people that I represent, I felt was imperative to 303 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:21,800 Speaker 1: take action. China is a country in which the party 304 00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:25,520 Speaker 1: owns the government. The government doesn't own the party, and 305 00:18:25,560 --> 00:18:27,840 Speaker 1: I always tell people that we'd be much better off 306 00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:31,760 Speaker 1: if we introduced to Jiji and Ping as general secretary 307 00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:36,080 Speaker 1: rather than as president, because his primary power base is 308 00:18:36,119 --> 00:18:39,280 Speaker 1: as the general secretary of the Chinese Communist Party. His 309 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:42,840 Speaker 1: secondary power base is as the head of the Military 310 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:47,000 Speaker 1: Commission because the People's Liberation Army is actually an arm 311 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:49,800 Speaker 1: of the Chinese Communist Party. And then finally he has 312 00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:52,560 Speaker 1: the job of being president. Of course, they're very smart 313 00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:57,600 Speaker 1: and they understand that we will be much more sympathetic 314 00:18:57,640 --> 00:19:00,000 Speaker 1: to him as though he were normal if we call it. 315 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:03,440 Speaker 1: At present, I am certain none of these major decisions 316 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:08,760 Speaker 1: were made without him. That's a Leninist style, hierarchical tyranny. 317 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:12,920 Speaker 1: And in the tottitarian system, no big decision gets made 318 00:19:12,920 --> 00:19:16,160 Speaker 1: below the top, and so all of the major things 319 00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:18,719 Speaker 1: we have a grievance over had to have come in 320 00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:21,280 Speaker 1: front of Jsian thing. I think that's right, and I 321 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:25,360 Speaker 1: think you look and see how the Hong Kong protesters 322 00:19:25,359 --> 00:19:28,919 Speaker 1: were dealt with. I mean, these decisions are vertical. In 323 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:31,800 Speaker 1: this country. We believe in the separation of powers and 324 00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:37,480 Speaker 1: diffusion of interests and authority as a way to protect liberty. 325 00:19:37,640 --> 00:19:40,919 Speaker 1: I mean, that's what our founders based this great experiment, 326 00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:43,520 Speaker 1: was that people had the maximum amount of liberty through 327 00:19:43,520 --> 00:19:45,639 Speaker 1: this system that was created of checks and balances and 328 00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:48,719 Speaker 1: separation of powers and federalism, all these things that does 329 00:19:48,760 --> 00:19:51,080 Speaker 1: not exist in communist shine and quite the opposite. And 330 00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:53,360 Speaker 1: we're seeing how that can play out in a really 331 00:19:53,400 --> 00:19:58,280 Speaker 1: negative way. I think maybe for the first time worldwide, 332 00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:00,840 Speaker 1: people are looking at China with a different right now, 333 00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:04,560 Speaker 1: whether or not people like you, following the rule of 334 00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:09,440 Speaker 1: law and living in an open society can actually impose 335 00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:14,040 Speaker 1: sufficient consequence that the lesson inside China will be never 336 00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:16,480 Speaker 1: again that's just not going to do it. But I 337 00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:22,160 Speaker 1: think that's really unbelievably important what happens next to the lawsuit. 338 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:26,119 Speaker 1: So we'll move forward with service again, that'll take some time, 339 00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 1: and then file whatever emotions they're going to file or 340 00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:31,200 Speaker 1: not file. We'll see what their response is. I don't 341 00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:33,600 Speaker 1: want to make any predictions. I am hopeful and look 342 00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:37,000 Speaker 1: forward to their answers to our allegations. I think that 343 00:20:37,040 --> 00:20:39,199 Speaker 1: would be instructive that I think there'll be probably some 344 00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:42,040 Speaker 1: other states that pursue this course of action. My hope 345 00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:45,480 Speaker 1: is that Congress begins an investigation and all of that 346 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:49,119 Speaker 1: momentum to hold China accountable for their bad actions. I 347 00:20:49,160 --> 00:20:51,600 Speaker 1: think that is all leading to a point where hopefully 348 00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:54,800 Speaker 1: we can get some answers. We're going to pursue it aggressively, 349 00:20:55,160 --> 00:20:57,800 Speaker 1: and we'll certainly keep everybody informed as of the progress. 350 00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:01,439 Speaker 1: Is it your ask to it that the life of 351 00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:05,280 Speaker 1: this will be largely in the US. Course, we believe 352 00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:08,160 Speaker 1: that we have jurisdiction. There's a couple really important aspects 353 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:11,159 Speaker 1: of the complaint. One is, as I mentioned, the laying 354 00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:14,200 Speaker 1: out of the factual allegations in one document with a 355 00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:17,439 Speaker 1: wide variety of sources I think is important for the 356 00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:21,600 Speaker 1: public and for the lawsuit, but also the exceptions of 357 00:21:21,640 --> 00:21:24,000 Speaker 1: the federal sovereign immunities, the act that we lay out, 358 00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:26,520 Speaker 1: the fact that we've got the non state actors in there, 359 00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:29,720 Speaker 1: and the fact that the commercial activity that they were 360 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:33,359 Speaker 1: engaged in that objectively is commercial activity. The lab and 361 00:21:33,400 --> 00:21:36,640 Speaker 1: the PPE and the hospital system. I think those are 362 00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:40,160 Speaker 1: really big important issues for this case that I think 363 00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:43,240 Speaker 1: will be important. I know Congress is considering other exceptions, 364 00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:45,960 Speaker 1: and again I'm sort of all of the above approach here, 365 00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:48,600 Speaker 1: but that'll be the focal point from a legal perspective. 366 00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:53,280 Speaker 1: Is it your estimation that other countries should engage in 367 00:21:53,320 --> 00:21:55,600 Speaker 1: the same way that the German government, for example, should 368 00:21:55,600 --> 00:22:01,160 Speaker 1: file suit in germant so the Chinese face with a 369 00:22:01,200 --> 00:22:05,679 Speaker 1: remarkable range of lursuits around the world, I think so. 370 00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:09,840 Speaker 1: I do think a growing chorus calling for answers and 371 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:13,919 Speaker 1: accountability is for the benefit not just for America and 372 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:17,760 Speaker 1: Missourians that I represent, but for the entire world. Well. Frankly, 373 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:20,119 Speaker 1: sitting here in Rome and looking at the damage that 374 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:22,880 Speaker 1: they've done to Italy, which is head its economy shattered, 375 00:22:23,280 --> 00:22:26,360 Speaker 1: I think the Giants are a pretty powerful case when 376 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:29,119 Speaker 1: you're dealing with large numbers in general. But as you 377 00:22:29,160 --> 00:22:31,919 Speaker 1: sit there in Italy and look at the welder whose 378 00:22:31,960 --> 00:22:36,200 Speaker 1: life has been destroyed, as I talk to people who 379 00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:40,320 Speaker 1: work in factories in Missouri who have lost the ability 380 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:43,640 Speaker 1: to feed their families, and that is not to discount 381 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:47,520 Speaker 1: at all the tens of thousands of lives lost to 382 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:49,440 Speaker 1: all of this, I think it's just really important for 383 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:51,960 Speaker 1: us to keep that in perspective. And again, I think 384 00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:54,520 Speaker 1: this is worthy and it's important for us to have 385 00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:57,840 Speaker 1: a big, broad discussion about where we're headed in dealing 386 00:22:57,840 --> 00:23:01,400 Speaker 1: with China. But the human law us and human suffering 387 00:23:01,920 --> 00:23:04,440 Speaker 1: people just at a very human level, not being able 388 00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:07,560 Speaker 1: to visit their grandmother or mother in a nursing home. 389 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:10,720 Speaker 1: All of this was avoidable. All this was preventable. And 390 00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:12,879 Speaker 1: that is that the heart of this lawsuit is to 391 00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:17,000 Speaker 1: hold them accountable for their actions or inactions. If you 392 00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:20,600 Speaker 1: were to end up being awarded the forty billion dollars, 393 00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:23,000 Speaker 1: how would you divide that up? And would part of 394 00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:25,720 Speaker 1: it then go to families that have lost a loved 395 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:28,879 Speaker 1: one and part of the businesses that have suffered losses. 396 00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:32,000 Speaker 1: That's all on the table. Our allegations of course that 397 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,800 Speaker 1: not just the state has been damaged but individual citizens. 398 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:38,919 Speaker 1: When you take into account the forty four billion dollars 399 00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:43,200 Speaker 1: worth of damages, that includes people losing their livelihoods, loss 400 00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:46,400 Speaker 1: of life, the real economic impact on a broad scale. 401 00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:49,119 Speaker 1: But again, I feel very strongly about the merits of 402 00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:52,200 Speaker 1: our legal claims that we've made here, and I think 403 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:54,119 Speaker 1: it's got a lot of attention for good reason. It's 404 00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:56,320 Speaker 1: an important case. That's okay, we listen, We're going to 405 00:23:56,800 --> 00:23:58,840 Speaker 1: keep track of you, and at some point in the 406 00:23:58,880 --> 00:24:01,719 Speaker 1: future hope you'll come back and join us again and 407 00:24:02,200 --> 00:24:05,040 Speaker 1: give us a progress report as this winds its way 408 00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:08,920 Speaker 1: towards being I think a truly historic action on your point. 409 00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:11,640 Speaker 1: Wish you and your family all the best and hope 410 00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:17,200 Speaker 1: you guys continue to stay safe. Thank you to my guest, 411 00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:21,160 Speaker 1: Missouri Attorney General Eric Schmidt. You can learn more about 412 00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:23,840 Speaker 1: the case Missouri is about in its China on our 413 00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:28,200 Speaker 1: show page at newtsworld dot com. Newts World is produced 414 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:32,720 Speaker 1: by Gaingwich three sixty and iHeart Media. Our executive producer 415 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:37,439 Speaker 1: is Debbie Myers and our producer is Garnsey Slump. The 416 00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:41,440 Speaker 1: artwork for the show was created by Steve Penn. Special 417 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:44,679 Speaker 1: thanks to the team at Gingwis three sixty. Please email 418 00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:48,040 Speaker 1: me with your questions at Gainwish three sixty dot com 419 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:52,640 Speaker 1: slash questions. I'll answer them in future episodes. If you've 420 00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:55,639 Speaker 1: been enjoying Newtsworld, I hope you'll go to Apple Podcast 421 00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:58,840 Speaker 1: and both rate us with five stars and give us 422 00:24:58,840 --> 00:25:04,080 Speaker 1: a review. Others can learn what it's all about. On 423 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,679 Speaker 1: the next episode of Newsworld, is California Dreaming the new 424 00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:12,560 Speaker 1: national anthem? The Pelosi led democrats new three trillion dollars 425 00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:16,560 Speaker 1: bill has sixty eight references to cannabis and only fifty 426 00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:20,960 Speaker 1: two references to jobs. I'll talk about Nancy Pelosi's insane 427 00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:25,119 Speaker 1: three trillion dollars one thousand, eight hundred and fifteen page 428 00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:28,920 Speaker 1: bill on the next episode. I'm new Gingwich. This is 429 00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:29,560 Speaker 1: news World.