WEBVTT - Ep52 - Rian Johnson / "Star Wars: The Last Jedi" 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:03.360 You were listening to playback a Variety podcast. I'm your host, 0:00:03.400 --> 0:00:06.680 Variety Awards Editor Chris Tapley. What's playing at the Museum 0:00:06.680 --> 0:00:09.160 of Modern Art in New York City from now until 0:00:09.240 --> 0:00:13.039 January twelve? It's a Contenders two thousand seventeen, MoMA's annual 0:00:13.119 --> 0:00:16.720 series of the year's most influential and innovative films bound 0:00:16.760 --> 0:00:19.200 for awards glory or destined to become a cult classic. 0:00:19.320 --> 0:00:20.880 These are the ones you really have to see on 0:00:20.920 --> 0:00:23.720 the big screen. Check out the whole schedule and all 0:00:23.720 --> 0:00:26.320 the other awesome films that are playing at MoMA dot org. 0:00:26.480 --> 0:00:58.400 Slash film. Uh, oh, it's actually right there, Chris. I'm 0:00:58.440 --> 0:01:02.200 good man tired? Where are you coming? All right? Were wrong? 0:01:03.440 --> 0:01:06.720 He's kind of That was gonna be our next question. 0:01:06.840 --> 0:01:11.840 How old your kid? Screaming and running around? Congratulations? Yeah, 0:01:11.880 --> 0:01:14.960 thank you. I have seen. Yeah, he screams and runs around. 0:01:15.000 --> 0:01:17.640 That's a good sign if they're screaming and running around. Yeah, 0:01:18.000 --> 0:01:20.160 that's what my barber said. I was telling about it. 0:01:20.319 --> 0:01:21.920 I was like, man, he's screaming all the time and 0:01:21.959 --> 0:01:24.760 I can't figure it out. He says, Oh, that's because 0:01:24.800 --> 0:01:27.600 that means he's healthy. Yeah, exactly, true. That's true. I 0:01:27.640 --> 0:01:33.720 guess Oh my god, that coffee is so good that 0:01:34.680 --> 0:01:38.959 I'm good, Thank you m It doesn't work on the cleans. 0:01:38.959 --> 0:01:41.960 I'm afraid. How are you doing that clans? Oh no, 0:01:42.319 --> 0:01:44.600 let's not talk about We thought about doing that. Crane 0:01:44.600 --> 0:01:47.960 and I we were. She actually got these soup cleans. 0:01:48.920 --> 0:01:51.440 She got in we ordered it and showed up and 0:01:51.480 --> 0:01:53.320 it landed right in the middle of when I started 0:01:53.320 --> 0:01:56.240 traveling to do as it's been sitting waiting on you. 0:01:58.600 --> 0:01:59.960 You know who turned me on this one was Gama 0:02:00.040 --> 0:02:03.680 to Toro. Really was what it's called clean? Is this 0:02:03.720 --> 0:02:07.000 the one? Because Edgar right is doing one too. It's 0:02:07.120 --> 0:02:08.519 is it? What is it? What's the deal? Is it? 0:02:08.560 --> 0:02:10.880 Where you eat lunch? But it's like Shakespeare dinner and 0:02:10.919 --> 0:02:12.760 shape for breakfast. And I think that's might be the 0:02:12.760 --> 0:02:18.440 one that Edgar Yeah, yeah, it Paltrow approved. It's approved. 0:02:18.639 --> 0:02:21.359 How long have you been on this day? Eight? Oh 0:02:21.400 --> 0:02:23.600 my god? How you feeling? I feel good? Man, Yeah, 0:02:23.639 --> 0:02:27.000 I feel great, jumping my step. You know, all right, 0:02:27.160 --> 0:02:28.960 maybe I gotta tread what I needed at the end 0:02:28.960 --> 0:02:30.960 of the year. I think a prey leaguer, I'll give 0:02:30.960 --> 0:02:35.079 it a shot. So we're here with Ryan Johnson, director 0:02:35.160 --> 0:02:40.360 of Star Wars The Last Jedi, also director of Looper, which, 0:02:40.480 --> 0:02:44.160 as he knows, is one of my favorite movies. Chris, 0:02:44.200 --> 0:02:46.240 that movie Blew Me Away. Thanks. That was in New 0:02:46.320 --> 0:02:48.440 York that year. Actually that was the year we lived 0:02:48.480 --> 0:02:50.600 in New York. Yeah, I saw it at the Sony 0:02:50.720 --> 0:02:54.440 Room there downtown. I love that movie. So as soon 0:02:54.480 --> 0:02:56.800 as I knew you were tapped for Star Wars, I 0:02:56.800 --> 0:03:00.320 was like, this is perfect. They tapped me. I got apt. 0:03:02.040 --> 0:03:05.799 Thanks for coming on. We're gonna talk about as much 0:03:05.840 --> 0:03:09.799 as we can. These movies are shrouded in secrecy. That 0:03:10.000 --> 0:03:11.920 difficult to anything you want to know, Matt, Come on, 0:03:12.000 --> 0:03:14.679 let's just see what's doing. Let's see what happened when When? 0:03:14.919 --> 0:03:20.600 When is Darth Plague is showing up Darth Uh? Yeah, 0:03:20.639 --> 0:03:22.560 you know it's it's weird. It's like a double edged 0:03:22.600 --> 0:03:25.600 sword because, um, I've been traveling around starting to do 0:03:25.720 --> 0:03:28.680 press the last couple of weeks, but nobody's nobody's seen 0:03:28.720 --> 0:03:34.000 the movie yet. I can't talk about anything. So on 0:03:34.040 --> 0:03:36.720 the man, the one hand, it's it's it is u 0:03:37.520 --> 0:03:39.880 this little dance you have to do. On the other hand, 0:03:39.920 --> 0:03:42.800 it's slowly, it's become the norm over the past few weeks, 0:03:42.800 --> 0:03:44.600 so I'm kind of used to it. So now I'm 0:03:44.600 --> 0:03:47.160 getting nervous about after people actually see the movie and 0:03:47.160 --> 0:03:51.720 I'll have to actually talk about I have to explain myself. 0:03:53.360 --> 0:03:56.080 That's an interesting way to go about it. Yeah, I 0:03:56.080 --> 0:03:59.520 can't imagine how exhausting this kind of thing has been 0:03:59.520 --> 0:04:01.640 the last weeks. Have been traveling around the world and 0:04:01.720 --> 0:04:04.680 meets real work. That's true, That's what I like to say, 0:04:05.080 --> 0:04:09.760 beats working. Uh, but how is it comparing to what 0:04:09.840 --> 0:04:11.720 you may be expected? I mean, you had to have 0:04:12.000 --> 0:04:14.720 expected a certain level of exhaustion coming into a big 0:04:14.920 --> 0:04:17.040 piece of machinery like this. But how was it? How 0:04:17.120 --> 0:04:19.640 was the whole thing different than what you I guess say, man, 0:04:19.680 --> 0:04:21.760 I mean, yeah, I didn't know what to expect because 0:04:21.800 --> 0:04:24.320 it was, you know, it's my first time doing any 0:04:24.440 --> 0:04:27.240 doing a studio movie full stop, you know, and it's 0:04:27.880 --> 0:04:32.360 obviously it's like, you know, just scale wise, there's nothing 0:04:32.480 --> 0:04:34.520 quite like it. So there's nothing I had done that 0:04:34.600 --> 0:04:37.359 was even close to it. Obviously, So I really didn't 0:04:37.360 --> 0:04:40.400 know what to expect. I gotta say, Um, I mean 0:04:40.400 --> 0:04:45.600 in terms of just process. Uh, the biggest surprise was 0:04:45.680 --> 0:04:49.880 how similar it was to my previous movies that I've made, 0:04:50.000 --> 0:04:53.960 How it really wasn't It sounds so strange to say 0:04:54.000 --> 0:04:57.120 it really wasn't that different, you know, I mean because 0:04:57.160 --> 0:05:00.880 I think the machine is so old tuned. It's a 0:05:00.920 --> 0:05:05.520 big machine, but it's it's such a well crafted, an 0:05:05.520 --> 0:05:09.160 oiled machine. And by that I mean the people who 0:05:09.839 --> 0:05:12.400 the heads of department and all the people, they're so 0:05:12.440 --> 0:05:15.479 good at their jobs. The analogy I keep making is 0:05:15.920 --> 0:05:18.640 it's not like chaplain in modern times, kind of stuck 0:05:18.680 --> 0:05:22.120 in this cog and this big machine. It's more like 0:05:22.279 --> 0:05:25.560 Pacific rim where you get in the body suit, in 0:05:25.560 --> 0:05:29.280 the brain and this massive machine perfectly follows your movements 0:05:29.320 --> 0:05:30.920 and can get you what you want. And that's how 0:05:30.960 --> 0:05:34.760 the whole thing felt to me. So Um, the truth is, 0:05:34.800 --> 0:05:37.039 I mean, it was a long shooting schedule. It was 0:05:37.040 --> 0:05:39.120 like a ten days so there is just like the 0:05:39.160 --> 0:05:42.600 marathon element of it. But um, I don't know. You're 0:05:42.600 --> 0:05:44.920 exhausted whether you do that or a twenty days shoot. 0:05:44.920 --> 0:05:48.680 Maybe more exhausted after a twenty days shoot. Um. And 0:05:48.800 --> 0:05:51.520 now right now and I don't feel tired, I feel 0:05:51.960 --> 0:05:53.919 I don't know, I feel energized. Maybe it'll hit you 0:05:53.920 --> 0:05:56.360 in February, I think it will, or maybe or maybe 0:05:56.400 --> 0:06:01.240 December fifteenth, I'll just collapse. Uh, you started shooting this 0:06:01.800 --> 0:06:05.039 just in the immediate wake of Force Awakens and the 0:06:05.080 --> 0:06:08.040 impact that it made massive box office around the world. 0:06:08.080 --> 0:06:12.240 It's hugely successful. Did that just talk about whether that 0:06:12.360 --> 0:06:15.000 felt like it elevated the stakes for you at all? Well, 0:06:15.040 --> 0:06:17.400 there's I mean, when Force Awakens came out, we were 0:06:17.400 --> 0:06:20.919 in prep and there was definitely kind of a little 0:06:20.960 --> 0:06:23.440 gasp and a little you know, the spotlight kind of 0:06:23.480 --> 0:06:26.440 turned on us briefly, and we went and like did 0:06:26.520 --> 0:06:28.839 like a quick like Okay, let's make sure the script 0:06:28.880 --> 0:06:30.640 is as tight as it can be, and we went 0:06:30.680 --> 0:06:33.960 back into a little polished to it and um, but 0:06:34.080 --> 0:06:36.120 you know, I mean, I think for me, the big 0:06:36.160 --> 0:06:39.120 thing that I'm thankful for looking back is that I 0:06:39.160 --> 0:06:43.680 wrote the script before the movie came, before Force Awakens 0:06:43.800 --> 0:06:46.560 was even really made. They were shooting it while I 0:06:46.640 --> 0:06:49.160 was making the script, so I got the best of 0:06:49.200 --> 0:06:53.039 both worlds. I got to just personally react to the 0:06:53.120 --> 0:06:55.279 story and the script and what I was seeing the 0:06:55.320 --> 0:06:58.520 actors bringing to the parts and the dailies, and I 0:06:58.560 --> 0:07:01.480 got to put that personal action into it without having 0:07:01.480 --> 0:07:06.240 to even try to filter all the world's reaction to it. Um. 0:07:06.320 --> 0:07:09.080 And so then once we had the script, I mean, 0:07:09.120 --> 0:07:11.160 the truth is, that's kind of the movie that we made, 0:07:11.240 --> 0:07:15.280 was that script. And so once you've got that, um, 0:07:15.320 --> 0:07:16.920 you know, you can feel the pressure of it. It's 0:07:16.960 --> 0:07:18.840 not going to really, it's not like it's going to 0:07:19.000 --> 0:07:21.440 change really what you're what you're doing. I guess. You know, 0:07:22.280 --> 0:07:24.520 it's interesting you say that the script that you wrote 0:07:24.560 --> 0:07:27.440 is the movie you made, because you know, a handful 0:07:27.480 --> 0:07:30.360 of filmmakers have struggled a little bit within the lucasfilm system, 0:07:30.400 --> 0:07:31.840 and you seem to have just been able to hit 0:07:31.880 --> 0:07:34.000 the ground running and really just crank out of the 0:07:34.080 --> 0:07:37.080 exact vision that you intended to. And I'm just what 0:07:37.120 --> 0:07:39.360 do you think that it's Well, I don't know. I mean, 0:07:39.400 --> 0:07:41.280 you know, it's it's I mean, first of all, just say, 0:07:41.320 --> 0:07:45.440 you know, other other people's sets or movies are like 0:07:45.480 --> 0:07:47.840 other people's marriages. You know, you've got to be very 0:07:48.240 --> 0:07:50.480 if you if you're judging them from the outside and 0:07:50.560 --> 0:07:52.600 you think you have an idea of what's happening in them, 0:07:52.640 --> 0:07:55.480 you're you're probably wrong. So it's and I was not 0:07:55.600 --> 0:07:58.760 in any of those processes, so I can't speak to 0:07:58.800 --> 0:08:01.040 them at all, you know, but uh, just speaking to 0:08:01.080 --> 0:08:04.320 what I the process I went through, I don't know 0:08:04.360 --> 0:08:06.560 we we uh you know, I say that I was. 0:08:06.720 --> 0:08:10.960 I was. I had an incredibly good time with Kathy 0:08:11.000 --> 0:08:15.080 Kennedy and Lucasfilm and also with Disney, UM, Bob Iger, 0:08:15.160 --> 0:08:19.480 Alan Horne, Allen Bergman, They've been just terrific collaborators who 0:08:19.560 --> 0:08:23.560 have just given me I've felt not only just creative freedom, 0:08:23.600 --> 0:08:27.720 but really protected to kind of pursue what I wanted 0:08:27.760 --> 0:08:30.200 to do with this story. Um. So, I mean that's 0:08:30.200 --> 0:08:32.560 the whole reason we're doing this new trilogy actually is 0:08:33.559 --> 0:08:35.120 just because we had such a good time working with 0:08:35.160 --> 0:08:37.240 these folks. My producer Rom and I were like, we 0:08:37.480 --> 0:08:39.319 should keep this going. This is a really good thing. 0:08:39.920 --> 0:08:43.000 So anyway, I mean, I know that we we all 0:08:43.080 --> 0:08:46.920 got on the same page from the very start. The 0:08:46.960 --> 0:08:52.959 script that we delivered, Um, you know, everyone was into it, 0:08:53.160 --> 0:08:56.240 and I think we all had conversations and I was 0:08:56.679 --> 0:08:59.840 communicated what it was that I really wanted to make 0:09:00.080 --> 0:09:02.600 and they were on board with that. So I think 0:09:02.600 --> 0:09:06.280 we all started pointing in the right direction. And I 0:09:06.320 --> 0:09:10.000 think UM and also just you know, we we all 0:09:10.080 --> 0:09:12.080 had kind of a bond of trust coming into it. 0:09:12.120 --> 0:09:14.640 Everyone felt really good about each other, and we just 0:09:14.679 --> 0:09:17.040 got off on the right foot. And I think that 0:09:17.600 --> 0:09:20.720 where you start, I think just is really what informs 0:09:20.760 --> 0:09:25.880 the entire process. Um. And yeah, I don't know. I 0:09:26.200 --> 0:09:30.720 also just and I've always you know, there's I think 0:09:30.720 --> 0:09:33.720 that there's kind of the perception sometimes I know I 0:09:33.760 --> 0:09:36.000 had this from the outside before I worked on a 0:09:36.040 --> 0:09:39.360 studio film like this, that um that it is a 0:09:39.440 --> 0:09:42.240 big kind of controlling machine. And maybe in some cases 0:09:42.320 --> 0:09:46.080 it is, but uh, but not in this case. And 0:09:46.120 --> 0:09:48.800 the truth is, even with independent film, I mean everywhere, 0:09:48.840 --> 0:09:51.520 anyone who has made an indie film and has a 0:09:51.559 --> 0:09:54.560 financer who financed it, or has a producer who's pretty 0:09:54.640 --> 0:09:57.840 or something knows that, you know, it's not like with 0:09:57.880 --> 0:10:01.120 an indie film you get to just really do whatever 0:10:01.200 --> 0:10:05.679 you want without any conversations or negotiations if anything. On 0:10:05.720 --> 0:10:08.080 some of the you know, on the smaller films that 0:10:08.120 --> 0:10:11.319 I've made, there have been more difficult waters to navigate 0:10:11.400 --> 0:10:14.000 than on this one. Um, you always have to come 0:10:14.000 --> 0:10:17.319 into it. And just part of the skill of making 0:10:17.320 --> 0:10:21.960 a movie is not just how to navigate the waters 0:10:22.000 --> 0:10:23.840 of all the people you're working with, but how to 0:10:25.640 --> 0:10:29.880 how to set the relationships from the start so that 0:10:29.920 --> 0:10:34.880 it's not antagonistic, but so that it's um you always 0:10:34.920 --> 0:10:38.079 frame everything, which because it's the truth of we're all 0:10:38.120 --> 0:10:40.000 on the same team. We're trying to make a great 0:10:40.040 --> 0:10:42.880 movie and the truth I mean, obviously that's only possible 0:10:42.920 --> 0:10:44.920 if the people you're working with are good folks who 0:10:44.920 --> 0:10:47.719 want that to happen. But if that is possible, that's 0:10:47.720 --> 0:10:49.360 what you're trying to do at the start. You know, 0:10:50.160 --> 0:10:51.760 when you did come in and you said, you know, 0:10:51.880 --> 0:10:54.040 this is the movie I want to make. Just in 0:10:54.080 --> 0:10:57.000 the broadest terms, I guess what was like the big 0:10:57.040 --> 0:10:59.960 idea that you wanted to introduce to this universe. Well, 0:11:00.200 --> 0:11:03.920 the you know, my pitch to Cathy was basically, you know, 0:11:04.120 --> 0:11:07.000 if the first movie was introduction, this movie is training. 0:11:07.000 --> 0:11:11.000 But that doesn't mean like, you know, necessarily Yoda style 0:11:11.080 --> 0:11:13.679 training or a training montage. To me, what that means 0:11:13.760 --> 0:11:16.240 is it's the movie where we test each one of 0:11:16.320 --> 0:11:18.560 the characters and we find the hardest possible thing they 0:11:18.600 --> 0:11:20.520 could come up against, and we throw it at them, 0:11:20.880 --> 0:11:22.800 just like the second act of any movie. It's where 0:11:22.800 --> 0:11:25.880 the complications come in and everyone gets stumbling blocks thrown 0:11:25.880 --> 0:11:30.160 in their way. And you know, that's how you define characters, 0:11:30.200 --> 0:11:33.800 how characters react, what they do when they hit the 0:11:33.840 --> 0:11:37.480 toughest thing that's coming at them. So um, in my mind, 0:11:38.440 --> 0:11:43.319 taking these characters who I think it's a small miracle 0:11:43.440 --> 0:11:46.080 with j J. And you know, Larry and Michael were 0:11:46.080 --> 0:11:48.199 able to create with that first movie. The fact that 0:11:48.240 --> 0:11:52.200 they create these characters who came to life so vividly 0:11:52.440 --> 0:11:55.640 and who stuck every single one of them, you know, 0:11:55.960 --> 0:11:58.600 so well up on the screen. Um. And you can 0:11:58.640 --> 0:12:01.679 see it reflected in in the culture. How those new 0:12:01.760 --> 0:12:04.400 characters hit. It's it's amazing. There's a reason for it, 0:12:04.440 --> 0:12:08.600 the really good introductions to these characters. Um. So I 0:12:08.640 --> 0:12:12.000 think someone put it to me like the sandboxes back, Yeah, exactly, 0:12:12.040 --> 0:12:14.080 That's how it felt. Well that's a tunnel thing. Also, 0:12:14.200 --> 0:12:16.720 I think that j J really pulled off, which I 0:12:17.240 --> 0:12:21.600 is something I really consciously wanted to carry forward, you know, um, 0:12:21.679 --> 0:12:24.440 the the and especially knowing that it was going to 0:12:24.520 --> 0:12:27.839 be um, you know, because it's the middle chapter and 0:12:27.840 --> 0:12:29.760 we've got to do this challenging of everyone. It was 0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:32.640 going to go to some more intense places. I was 0:12:32.760 --> 0:12:35.679 really conscious that I wanted to. I loved the tone 0:12:35.760 --> 0:12:38.520 from The Force Awakens. I thought captured the original movies 0:12:38.559 --> 0:12:41.680 in this great way. And I was really conscious I 0:12:41.679 --> 0:12:45.160 wanted to be fun and funny and um, you know 0:12:45.520 --> 0:12:47.640 all the things of Star Wars movies should be. I 0:12:47.679 --> 0:12:54.120 didn't want it to descend into heavy aosity. Um. In 0:12:54.200 --> 0:12:58.680 many ways, Star Wars is its own aesthetic, right. But 0:12:59.160 --> 0:13:03.319 were you interested all and introducing new visual concepts, new 0:13:03.360 --> 0:13:07.760 visual language? Uh? Were there reference points? Was there anything 0:13:07.800 --> 0:13:09.800 in art or photography that you want that you kind 0:13:09.800 --> 0:13:12.319 of the ultimate question being what did you want your 0:13:12.360 --> 0:13:15.360 Star Wars movie to look like? I guess yeah, I 0:13:15.360 --> 0:13:17.920 mean it's it's uh. I mean you don't come into 0:13:17.960 --> 0:13:19.959 it thinking how do I shake this up? You come 0:13:19.960 --> 0:13:21.760 into it just thinking like how do I make this 0:13:21.800 --> 0:13:24.520 feel like Star Wars? But once you get into it, 0:13:24.559 --> 0:13:26.320 I mean there are a lot of things that that 0:13:27.920 --> 0:13:30.280 there are a lot of things to factor into it 0:13:30.360 --> 0:13:33.000 being a balance of those two things you talked about. Um, 0:13:33.559 --> 0:13:35.920 you have a lot of conversations with I LM. We 0:13:35.960 --> 0:13:39.480 had a couple of key designers and I m um. 0:13:39.640 --> 0:13:42.880 Kevin Jenkins was one of them. James Klein was another 0:13:43.880 --> 0:13:45.800 who we worked with on a lot of the concepts 0:13:45.800 --> 0:13:49.719 for some of the bigger design pieces. And you you 0:13:49.760 --> 0:13:53.400 find folks um pretty quickly who just kind of have 0:13:53.559 --> 0:13:56.680 a innate sense of of something that feels Star Wars 0:13:56.720 --> 0:13:59.000 e And it's tough to really like nail it down 0:13:59.240 --> 0:14:02.040 and put in words, but there is just a feel 0:14:02.400 --> 0:14:07.000 um that you can because it's not futurism. That's that's 0:14:07.040 --> 0:14:09.160 the That's kind of the trap is anytime a new 0:14:09.200 --> 0:14:12.200 designer would come in and they would they would want 0:14:12.240 --> 0:14:14.880 to push it forward. The problem is when you you know, 0:14:14.960 --> 0:14:17.800 pushing it forward nine times out of ten meant it 0:14:17.920 --> 0:14:22.800 started looking like um, not to denigrate this, because it's 0:14:22.840 --> 0:14:25.640 beautiful design that started looking like Marvel movie spaceships where 0:14:25.640 --> 0:14:28.920 it's enough lots of holograms and glowing surfaces, or it 0:14:29.000 --> 0:14:32.240 started looking like an Apple store, you know, Um, and 0:14:32.320 --> 0:14:35.280 it's futurism. It's like pushing forward into like what feels 0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:38.880 modern now. And Star Wars is not that it's a 0:14:39.080 --> 0:14:41.520 it's a period film, you know, in the period is 0:14:42.080 --> 0:14:44.280 this world that we loved when we were watching the 0:14:44.320 --> 0:14:48.040 movie as as kids. Anyway, Um, so there's you find 0:14:48.040 --> 0:14:50.160 designers who are good at just kind of capturing that. 0:14:50.200 --> 0:14:53.920 But and I think this is a healthy thing. You know. 0:14:54.920 --> 0:14:57.080 When I came in, a lot of the designers I 0:14:57.160 --> 0:15:00.280 was working with had just had worked on Force Awake Ends. 0:15:00.320 --> 0:15:02.480 A lot of them had also done work on Rogue One. 0:15:03.240 --> 0:15:05.360 They have been working, they have been just doing nothing 0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:07.320 but Star Wars for the past few years. And so 0:15:07.600 --> 0:15:11.200 it's almost like, you know, um, you know, get wanting 0:15:11.240 --> 0:15:14.800 to give you know, give everyone like fresh water, you 0:15:14.840 --> 0:15:18.400 know it. It feels you just to keep them creatively 0:15:18.520 --> 0:15:21.800 engaged and invigorated. It does feel good to come up 0:15:21.840 --> 0:15:24.400 with challenges of Okay, here's something we've never seen a 0:15:24.440 --> 0:15:27.200 Star Wars movie before. What's the Star Wars version of this? 0:15:27.400 --> 0:15:31.200 You know? Um, and it's you know, you can't just 0:15:31.320 --> 0:15:35.360 tag old bases because mainly because that's boring for the 0:15:35.360 --> 0:15:39.480 team that's making the movie. Yeah, and it's interesting too. 0:15:39.480 --> 0:15:42.560 I mean, like David Tattersall is the only DP that 0:15:42.600 --> 0:15:45.480 shot more than one Star Wars movie. Every movie has 0:15:45.480 --> 0:15:48.200 had its own kind of visual author in a way. 0:15:48.280 --> 0:15:51.120 Dan Mendel Brick Fraser and Steve Vidlin for you on 0:15:51.200 --> 0:15:54.400 your on on the new films. Uh, and I've all. 0:15:54.440 --> 0:15:56.600 You know, it's always been fascinating to me how the 0:15:56.600 --> 0:16:00.760 there's a definitive shift in the visual language of Empire 0:16:01.120 --> 0:16:06.360 versus Star Wars with was it Peter Shitsky came in 0:16:06.400 --> 0:16:08.800 to to shoot that one, and you know that That's 0:16:08.840 --> 0:16:11.720 kind of what I'm curious about, is just yeah, finding 0:16:11.720 --> 0:16:16.960 that different flourish. Yeah, you know, well, and and just 0:16:16.960 --> 0:16:18.880 just talked a little bit about this in the run up, 0:16:18.880 --> 0:16:23.400 but like the color read for instance. Yeah, well just generally, 0:16:23.400 --> 0:16:25.520 I mean, you know, Steve and I and we have 0:16:25.560 --> 0:16:28.440 you know, my Simaitarirapher Steve Yadlin. We've been best friends 0:16:28.440 --> 0:16:31.520 since we were seventeen years old. We met, you know, 0:16:31.680 --> 0:16:33.480 I was a freshman in film school. He was still 0:16:33.520 --> 0:16:36.040 a senior in high school. And we met as like 0:16:36.160 --> 0:16:39.520 pas on a student film said at USC. So, um, 0:16:39.880 --> 0:16:41.800 so we've never been doing you know, each other a 0:16:41.840 --> 0:16:46.360 long time. We looked at Empire as our main visual reference, 0:16:46.680 --> 0:16:49.560 um in terms of the Star Wars movies. Um, just 0:16:49.600 --> 0:16:52.040 because it's the closest to our taste in terms of 0:16:52.400 --> 0:16:55.440 I mean, it's the most just playing flat out beautiful 0:16:55.680 --> 0:16:58.640 of all the films, I think, and the lighting and it, um, 0:16:59.680 --> 0:17:02.680 the the way that the lightning was genuinely daring, the 0:17:02.680 --> 0:17:04.960 way they let faces go dark, the way they let 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:10.600 you know, places be shadowy, the way that they didn't compromise. Um. 0:17:10.640 --> 0:17:13.520 I think it's gorgeous. Um. But then also, you know, 0:17:14.359 --> 0:17:16.240 we also at the beginning of it, and this was 0:17:16.280 --> 0:17:20.000 something I give some thought to, you know, face both 0:17:20.040 --> 0:17:23.440 with lightning and also but mainly with camera. The question 0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:26.520 of do I look at the the older films and 0:17:26.560 --> 0:17:31.040 try and somehow mimic the visual style, which was not 0:17:31.160 --> 0:17:33.359 a ton of camera movement kind of locked down a 0:17:33.440 --> 0:17:37.919 more formal sort of approach, and I, you know, I 0:17:38.000 --> 0:17:42.679 quickly decided, no, I can't do that, Like it's this movie. 0:17:43.000 --> 0:17:45.119 You know, those movies were shot that way because that 0:17:45.200 --> 0:17:47.119 felt right to the people who were making them, and 0:17:47.119 --> 0:17:50.800 that felt and for me, I I gotta shoot it 0:17:50.960 --> 0:17:52.879 in a way that's going to feel like the gears 0:17:52.880 --> 0:17:55.480 are going to catch on in my head for this movie. 0:17:55.800 --> 0:17:57.960 How to get me excited what we're doing visually on 0:17:58.040 --> 0:18:00.560 set every day and saying with you if you gotta 0:18:01.400 --> 0:18:03.320 you know, you gotta make a movie that feels exciting 0:18:03.359 --> 0:18:05.119 to you. They're also a product of their era in 0:18:05.119 --> 0:18:09.520 that way. Yeah, absolutely, you want your movie to necessarily 0:18:09.560 --> 0:18:12.400 feel like everything else this in theaters, but there's kind 0:18:12.440 --> 0:18:14.920 of like this. Yeah. I mean they're a product of 0:18:14.960 --> 0:18:19.840 the filmmakers who are a product of their Uh. Let's 0:18:19.840 --> 0:18:23.879 talk about Carrie Fisher. Um. You know, we've often heard 0:18:24.000 --> 0:18:27.840 about her talents as a script doctor. So my curiosity 0:18:27.920 --> 0:18:30.560 for you is what kind of invaluable input did she 0:18:30.640 --> 0:18:34.200 bring to uh the project for you? Well, I mean 0:18:34.200 --> 0:18:36.240 that's how we connected with as right now. She was 0:18:36.280 --> 0:18:40.040 a writer first and foremost. I think that she um, 0:18:40.280 --> 0:18:45.560 you know, she in my experience with her, you know, 0:18:45.840 --> 0:18:50.119 performing was was on camera was you know, the thing 0:18:50.240 --> 0:18:53.320 she was least comfortable with. She was more she loved 0:18:53.320 --> 0:18:58.360 writing and she loved words, and she um uh. And 0:18:58.560 --> 0:19:00.600 so I mean, I you know, I after I wrote 0:19:00.640 --> 0:19:03.960 the script, I would come over to her house or 0:19:03.960 --> 0:19:05.560 did this a few times. I would just sit with 0:19:05.560 --> 0:19:08.439 her for hours, go over every scene. And not that 0:19:08.520 --> 0:19:11.280 we would like totally rewrite the scenes or anything, but 0:19:11.359 --> 0:19:15.200 she what she loved. She loved jokes, she loved puns, 0:19:15.280 --> 0:19:18.880 she loved word play. She loved and so she at 0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:21.920 every single line, she would just throw out three thousand 0:19:22.080 --> 0:19:26.199 possible jokes or puns. That could happen, and you know, 0:19:27.000 --> 0:19:31.800 in nine times out of ten, two thousand and of 0:19:31.880 --> 0:19:34.080 them were unusable. And then there will be that one 0:19:34.160 --> 0:19:35.880 that was just like, oh my god, that's pretty cool, 0:19:35.960 --> 0:19:39.080 let's do that. Uh. And then but then there were 0:19:39.200 --> 0:19:45.360 you know, there was um one scene in particular that 0:19:45.560 --> 0:19:50.399 was you know that involved Laura Dern's character where the 0:19:50.440 --> 0:19:53.040 three of us got together and kind of did rework 0:19:53.119 --> 0:19:57.080 the scene from the ground up, and that was that 0:19:57.160 --> 0:19:59.800 was pretty amazing geting Gang to actually work with Carrie 0:20:00.000 --> 0:20:03.840 on a on a scene and and finding the emotional 0:20:03.880 --> 0:20:06.159 beats of it. And it's I mean, it's one of 0:20:06.200 --> 0:20:10.280 the scenes in the movie that I just yeah that, yeah, 0:20:10.400 --> 0:20:13.600 I think that teams. That's it's really special. Um, And 0:20:13.640 --> 0:20:17.000 what do you think you learned from her? I mean, 0:20:18.760 --> 0:20:21.640 I mean it's not like you know, it's it's not 0:20:21.720 --> 0:20:24.800 like here are some lessons that I learned from her 0:20:24.880 --> 0:20:28.840 or anything like that. I think she I I learned. 0:20:29.119 --> 0:20:31.240 I mean she she just had this sense of she 0:20:31.320 --> 0:20:35.000 just had a playfulness and she had a m I 0:20:35.040 --> 0:20:38.159 guess you know, it's it's just a reminder that the 0:20:38.160 --> 0:20:41.239 the only sin in writing really is being boring. And 0:20:41.320 --> 0:20:45.240 Carrie was incapable of being boring. And you know, aside 0:20:45.280 --> 0:20:48.640 from taking lessons from the way that she lived her 0:20:48.680 --> 0:20:53.720 life openly and honestly and was just you know, um 0:20:53.760 --> 0:20:58.840 constantly just living in living in that mode and without shame. 0:20:58.920 --> 0:21:00.879 I think that's something you can a lesson from in 0:21:00.960 --> 0:21:03.960 terms of writing. I mean, just the there's a less 0:21:03.960 --> 0:21:06.800 a lesson is less a lesson. It was more just 0:21:07.680 --> 0:21:13.320 drawing inspiration from how amped up she was about making 0:21:13.320 --> 0:21:16.160 words saying you know, I mean, she just it just 0:21:17.040 --> 0:21:19.600 you could see her eyes start to glow when she 0:21:19.720 --> 0:21:22.919 hit like but she found a new phrase and she 0:21:23.040 --> 0:21:25.639 was just you know, saying it and you could see 0:21:25.720 --> 0:21:30.359 like this that was like food to her. Yeah, that's inspiring. Man. Uh. 0:21:30.400 --> 0:21:32.280 You know, in the first film, we didn't get a 0:21:32.320 --> 0:21:36.640 whole lot of her, So you know, what did she 0:21:37.520 --> 0:21:42.480 bring ideas to like fully more fully flesh out who 0:21:42.520 --> 0:21:44.439 this character has been for her? Like, I'm just curious 0:21:44.520 --> 0:21:45.840 what she brought to the table in terms of these 0:21:45.840 --> 0:21:48.840 are the ideas I have, Yeah about this character that's 0:21:48.880 --> 0:21:52.200 meant you know, plenty to her in her career and 0:21:52.280 --> 0:21:55.240 that she's now tackling again later in life and she 0:21:55.400 --> 0:21:58.640 have like did she come forth with ideas for that well, 0:21:59.240 --> 0:22:01.720 I mean she one thing that she was really conscious 0:22:01.720 --> 0:22:05.400