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Speaker 1: What's anti semitic my organic farming. I'm Robert Evans hosted

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Speaker 1: Behind the Bastards. This was yet another trademark unbelievably bad introduction.

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Speaker 1: Uh my guest with me for part two of our

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Speaker 1: series on Rudolph Steiner, as with part one, Chris Croft Day. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm good man, Harry had to be back. I'm good.

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Speaker 1: I'm doing good. I'm drinking some cold brew coffee and

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Speaker 1: uh still got this sinus thing that I've had, but

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Speaker 1: I think I'm gonna have it for life, probably because

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Speaker 1: of bad shit I did when I was a ghost. Well,

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Speaker 1: your ghosts, no, I mean your ghost knew that. The

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Speaker 1: lessons you gain from this sinus infection, yeah nothing, I'm

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Speaker 1: bald too. Can you imagine what should I did when

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Speaker 1: I was a ghost? I can remember. I can remember

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Speaker 1: the deep satisfaction I had sitting in mosle and watching

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Speaker 1: air strikes hit apartment buildings and seeing little kids stream

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Speaker 1: out of them, just blood pouring down their face is

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Speaker 1: and going, I'm glad they're ghosts made the choice to

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Speaker 1: go through this. That was a smart decision for those ghosts.

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Speaker 1: Those kids are gonna learn some lessons. I went to

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Speaker 1: one do I go to those Rudolph Steiner doctor, what

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Speaker 1: are they calling in anthroposophist? And I was like, I

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Speaker 1: was sinus infection and he was like, what what do

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Speaker 1: you expect? And then I was good. I had to

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Speaker 1: pay him fifty gave you some crayons, though you know

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Speaker 1: how you behaved? Do you know how you behaved in

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Speaker 1: the fourteenth century? And I was like, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: You were a real dick. So you're yeah, you're you're

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Speaker 1: of course you're bald, never signus infection. Mm hmmm. So

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Speaker 1: we're talking Rudolph Steiner now. Uh. Rudolf Steiner obviously still

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Speaker 1: has huge numbers of admirers and followers in the world today.

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Speaker 1: Some of those people maintain a website called Waldorf Answers

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Speaker 1: that looks as if it was codd and last updated

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Speaker 1: around two thousand three. And immediately after I wrote that line,

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Speaker 1: I actually browsed over to the chunk of the site

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Speaker 1: where I could find out when it was started, and

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Speaker 1: I found out that it was actually opened in two

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Speaker 1: thousand and four. So I'm just pretty good at guessing

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Speaker 1: when websites were made, is all. I'm all I'm talking about. Uh,

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Speaker 1: So here's what they have to say about anthroposophy quote.

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Speaker 1: Waldorf education was developed by Rudolf Steiner eighteen sixty one

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Speaker 1: to nineteen at the beginning of the twentieth century. It

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Speaker 1: is based on Steiner's broader philosophy and teachings called anthroposophy.

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Speaker 1: Anthroposophy holds that the human being is fundamentally a spiritual being,

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Speaker 1: and that all human beings deserve respect is the embodiment

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Speaker 1: of their spiritual nature. This view was carried into Waldorf education,

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Speaker 1: is striving to develop in each child there in eight

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Speaker 1: talents and abilities. Waldorf schools operate in a non discriminatory

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Speaker 1: way without regard to race, gender, ethnicity, religion, or national origin.

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Speaker 1: Some of the ideas in Waldorf education and anthroposophy are

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Speaker 1: complex and require a degree of goodwill on behalf of

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Speaker 1: the reader to grasp. So goodwill, yeah, yeah, you gotta really,

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Speaker 1: you gotta really have some goodwill to ignore the racism.

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Speaker 1: That's a funny way to put it. That is a

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Speaker 1: funny way to play. Most taken a while to think

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Speaker 1: of that one. Yeah, that was a long meeting. How

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Speaker 1: do we how do we phrase? Our leader was basically

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Speaker 1: a Nazi? You know, Frank Lance is no, he's a

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Speaker 1: Republican guy that's made a zillion dollars off of naming uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, social programs, entitlements and uh and uh he

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Speaker 1: named you know, enhanced interrogation and he's in charge of

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Speaker 1: like language for the Republicans and he is a fortune.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I gotta say he's nailing It's what's interesting?

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Speaker 1: Go ahead? Yeah no, I just he. I was going

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Speaker 1: to say he's nailing it like the CIA was nailing

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Speaker 1: those men's testicles to their wooden chairs in the enhanced interrogation. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's that's that's um So the kind of people that

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Speaker 1: come up with, like, how are we gonna say, like,

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Speaker 1: you know, you should you should uh read this and

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Speaker 1: and not be freaked out by the racism, like what

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Speaker 1: what you know? Good will? Well, good will read it

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Speaker 1: with goodwill? Like read it like an asshole. Again. Once

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Speaker 1: I get my friends dangerously drunk on every clear at

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Speaker 1: the end of the night and they wake up in

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Speaker 1: horrible pain, I tell them it's going to take some

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Speaker 1: goodwill on their behalf to forgive me for poisoning them.

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Speaker 1: And it does. And just real quick, here's something in

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Speaker 1: terms of behind the bastards. I would definitely fucking classify

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Speaker 1: Frank Lance as a bastard and a friend of mine.

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Speaker 1: He's you know, he's he's made a zillion dollars off

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Speaker 1: of like rebranding. Uh. Social The thing that makes me

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Speaker 1: the maddest is social programs being called entitlements. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I just can't believe how why liberals got on board

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Speaker 1: with calling him entitlements. But probably because they're not really

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Speaker 1: politics and they're not really liberals either. Um, but he

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Speaker 1: hired my friend to play at his party. Frank Lance.

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Speaker 1: Frank Lance has a full sized diner, an actual diner

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Speaker 1: built on his property, like a fantasy diner, like a

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Speaker 1: whole you know, with a working soda gun and everything.

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Speaker 1: Jesus Christ, and he had, he had like uh, he had,

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Speaker 1: Like he's so much money. He has a replica of

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Speaker 1: a diner in his yard, and he he wants to

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Speaker 1: live that scene from the first Back to the Future

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Speaker 1: movie every day of his life. And nobody can do

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Speaker 1: this party. Nobody can hit like a thousand waiters and

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Speaker 1: a million He has no friends. Well, yeah, why would

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Speaker 1: you be that guy's friends behind the masters? The Master's

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Speaker 1: end up all alone with all their ship and all

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Speaker 1: their dumb theories. Yeah, now, so we just talked about

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Speaker 1: how in the Waldorf Answers site they they really point

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Speaker 1: out that like Waldrop schools are nondiscriminatory, they don't take

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Speaker 1: into account race, gender, ethnicity, religion, and national origin. And

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Speaker 1: here's where I point out that if you google Rudolph

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Speaker 1: Steiner anti Semitism, you will find yourself presented with a

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Speaker 1: return from this website and a page titled Rudolf Steiner

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Speaker 1: an active opponent of Anti Semitism. That title is all

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Speaker 1: in big capital letters, and it purports to be a

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Speaker 1: study of the man's life and writing that proves that

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Speaker 1: Steiner battled against anti Semitism his entire life. The website

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Speaker 1: notes in the eighteen nineties, Steiner vehemently argued against the

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Speaker 1: outrageous excesses of the anti Semites and condemned the anti

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Speaker 1: Semitic brutes as enemies of the human rights. As a

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Speaker 1: convinced liberal whose position coincided with that of reform Jewry,

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Speaker 1: he actively supported the integration and full legal and social

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Speaker 1: status of the Jews in Europe. In eighteen eighty eight,

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Speaker 1: he wrote, the Jews need Europe, and Europe needs the

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Speaker 1: Jews against the anti Semitic propaganda of hatred. He set

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Speaker 1: his ideal one should only value mutual actions between individuals.

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Speaker 1: It is completely uninteresting if one is a Jew or

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Speaker 1: a German. That is so simple that one is almost

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Speaker 1: stupid saying it. How stupid there's one then not have

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Speaker 1: to be to say the opposite. So it goes on

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Speaker 1: like that for quite a while, quoting very real things

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Speaker 1: that Steiner wrote or said arguing against anti Semitism. The

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Speaker 1: essay would probably be very convincing evidence of the fact

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Speaker 1: that Rudolf Steiner was not an anti Semite if it

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Speaker 1: weren't for the fact that number one, there's almost nothing

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Speaker 1: in there about statements made by Steiner after nineteen hundred

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Speaker 1: and number two, people who aren't anti Semitic rarely need

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Speaker 1: entire web pages to voted to how not anti semitic

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Speaker 1: they are. Um, you don't run into that, for say

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Speaker 1: Georgia O'Keeffe, Yeah, yeah, yeah, thankfully, our old friend Peter

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Speaker 1: Staudenmeyer of Marquette University. But together a detailed breakdown of

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Speaker 1: Rudolph's ideas about the Jews, titled Rudolf Steiner and the

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Speaker 1: Jewish Question. It's a very nuanced piece, and I'm sure

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Speaker 1: that the Waldorf people would describe it as a hit piece,

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Speaker 1: but I don't think it takes that tone at all.

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Speaker 1: Stodden Meyer acknowledges that Steiner's views of the Jews changed

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Speaker 1: significantly overhit the course of his published career. Quote in

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Speaker 1: the overall ark of Steiner's intellectual development, his attitude towards

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Speaker 1: Jews moved from an unreflective embrace of anti Semitic prejudices

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Speaker 1: to public denunciation of the excesses of organized anti Semitism,

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Speaker 1: to an elaborate racial theory of cosmic evolution in which

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Speaker 1: anti Semitic themes played a prominent role. So he was

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Speaker 1: an anti Semite who had a creative history to his

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Speaker 1: anti semitism. Um who is the stodden Meyer man. Studden

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Speaker 1: Meyer is a professor at Marquette University of German History

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Speaker 1: who has done most of the writing that I found

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Speaker 1: ound on Rudolf Steiner. He's like the expert on Rudolf

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Speaker 1: stein So the people of the Waldorf School do not

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Speaker 1: like this stoden Meyer man. They're not going to be

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Speaker 1: fans of this Stodden They're like, would you shut up? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: stop reading the things that are Guru wrote, Yeah, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you're making them look bad. You need to have more goodwill.

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Speaker 1: That's it. Yeah, you're not reading it right, you're not

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Speaker 1: using enough good will. So prior to about God, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's it's baddie. Now. I want you to remember. In

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Speaker 1: the Waldorf Answers section, one of the things they say

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Speaker 1: is that he wanted greater integration of Jewish people with Germans. Right,

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Speaker 1: he wanted more integration, which sounds nice if you just

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Speaker 1: think of the term integration the way it was used

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Speaker 1: when say, we moved away from segregation in the United States.

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Speaker 1: That's not what Steiner means. If most of your fucking

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Speaker 1: time or any of your time talking about let's put

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Speaker 1: it this way, if you if you spend a lot

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Speaker 1: of your time talking about Jews, there's something wrong with you.

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Speaker 1: If you, specifically, if you're talking about the Jews, if

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Speaker 1: you're a white guy, why are you talking about the

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Speaker 1: Jews all the time? And why is anybody talking about

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Speaker 1: just talk about Why don't you talk about what you

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Speaker 1: had for breakfast? Why don't you stop talking about the Jews? Well,

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Speaker 1: and Rudolph Steiner talked about the Jews a lot. I

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Speaker 1: mean that's the thing is, like the people defending Steiner,

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Speaker 1: it's like, well, but why did he talk so much

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Speaker 1: about the fucking Jews. He's not Jewish, so why are

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Speaker 1: you talking about Jews so much? Well, that's what we're

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Speaker 1: gonna get into. So prior to n O two, it's

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Speaker 1: fair to say that Rudolf Steiner's anti Semitism was not

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Speaker 1: out of line with mainstream anti semitism in Germany and Austria, Hungary,

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Speaker 1: uh during his Pan German nationalist period. He was no

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Speaker 1: more racist than the average person, and he was probably

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Speaker 1: less racist. He was no more racist than the average

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Speaker 1: person of goodwill. Yeah, yeah, well you gotta you gotta

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Speaker 1: be fair about that, Like people believed all sorts of

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Speaker 1: crazy shit about the Jews. As a matter of course,

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Speaker 1: back then, there's literally there's still to this day churches

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Speaker 1: in Europe with like reliefs of Jewish babies suckling at

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Speaker 1: the utters of a pig, Like that's a thing that's

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Speaker 1: on ancient medieval churches. So like you grow up in

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Speaker 1: that there's a base level line of anti Semitism, then

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Speaker 1: I can't judge you for more than you judge everyone

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Speaker 1: in the society for right, So there's like you have

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Speaker 1: to in order to for me to like really harp

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Speaker 1: on you specifically as an anti Semite, if you came

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Speaker 1: up in Germany and Austra Hungary during this period, you

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Speaker 1: have to go to another level of anti sent Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Um So in the early nineteen hundreds, Uh, Steiner's ship

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Speaker 1: got weird and decided the more hateful and extreme because

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Speaker 1: and h yeah, Uh, We're gonna spend a while talking

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Speaker 1: about that. Steiner spent most of his life is what

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Speaker 1: you would call an assimilationist, which is what they talk

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Speaker 1: about in that uh in that Waldorf Answers part where

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Speaker 1: he wanted to see integration. Um. But what this mint

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Speaker 1: in Steiner's context is he wanted to see Jewish people

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Speaker 1: assimilated into German culture. Now, this is better than wanting

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Speaker 1: to kill them all, but he'd still sought the elimination

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Speaker 1: of Judaism like that was his goal. He wrote that

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Speaker 1: he hoped quote Jewelry as a people would simply cease

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Speaker 1: to exist. He didn't want this to happen by them

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Speaker 1: being killed. He just wanted them absorbed into German society

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Speaker 1: and the whole culture and religion. To to die was

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Speaker 1: his goal. Fucking settlers that wanted to make Native Americans

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Speaker 1: go to Christian schools and just exactly make white people

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Speaker 1: out of them exactly. You can say it's better than

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Speaker 1: like the literal Nazi policy of gassing them to death,

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Speaker 1: but like not a lot better the same yea motivated

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Speaker 1: by the same yeah. And you can also see how

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Speaker 1: like that could easily turn into the other thing given

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Speaker 1: a couple of bad years. Um yeah. Now. Steiner considered

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Speaker 1: himself quote German by descent and racial affiliation, and he

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Speaker 1: was offended by the idea that Jewish people considered themselves

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Speaker 1: Jews as well as Germans. He thought that represented a

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Speaker 1: fundamental conflict of interest and made it impossible for Jews

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Speaker 1: people to truly be loyal to Germany. This is silly,

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Speaker 1: but I'd like to remind you that when JFK was elected,

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Speaker 1: a whole lot of Americans were worried he'd be loyal

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Speaker 1: to the pope rather than the United States. So everybody's

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Speaker 1: dumb is the point. Uh. In eighteen nineties, Steiner wrote

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Speaker 1: an article on stylistic corruption in the press, in which

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Speaker 1: he blamed Jewish journalists for using quote Jewish vernacular idioms

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Speaker 1: and other expressions mocking the German language with goodwill. Yeah

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Speaker 1: he didn't. I'm not going to say it's fucking amazing.

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Speaker 1: In eighteen eighty six, he wrote an article in which

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Speaker 1: he called Jews a people whose religion does not recognize

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Speaker 1: freedom of the spirit. He believed Jewish people had no

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Speaker 1: ability to appreciate the religion of love that was Christianity.

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Speaker 1: In eight eight he wrote extensive defenses of a book

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Speaker 1: Homunculous by Austrian author Robert Hammerling. Homunculus was, of course,

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Speaker 1: a work of profound anti Semitism, chronicling what Hammerling viewed

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Speaker 1: is the Jewish drive to conquer the entire world. Hamerling

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Speaker 1: thought Zionism, which was the desire of some Jewish people

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Speaker 1: to immigrate to Palestine. He believed that was part of

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Speaker 1: a scheme to quote found a new kingdom of Israel,

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Speaker 1: destined to encompass the whole world Eventually, y'all remember when

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Speaker 1: Israel conquered the world. Uh, if you're a racist, you

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Speaker 1: do um. Now. Rudolph loved this book. He called critics

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Speaker 1: of it over sensitive Jews who couldn't make an objective

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Speaker 1: judgment of the work. Is this Steiner quote? It certainly

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Speaker 1: cannot be denied that Jewry today still behaves as a

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Speaker 1: closed totality, and that it has frequently intervened in the

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Speaker 1: development of our current state of affairs in a way

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Speaker 1: that is anything but favorable to European ideas of culture.

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Speaker 1: But Jewy as such has long since outlived its time.

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Speaker 1: It has no more justification within the modern life of

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Speaker 1: people's and the fact that it continues to exist is

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Speaker 1: a mistake of world history whose consequences are unavoidable. We

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Speaker 1: do not mean the form of the Jewish religion alone,

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Speaker 1: but above all the spirit of Jewelry, the Jewish way

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Speaker 1: of thinking. Now, what's what's the charitable read of that? People?

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Speaker 1: You can't eat this fucking one dude decides that a

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Speaker 1: whole fucking culture needs to go away because that's what

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Speaker 1: he thinks sitting in his fucking chair and his stupid

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Speaker 1: study or whatever. I mean, it's just so arrogant. It's

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Speaker 1: it's just the height of it's it's incredible that that

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Speaker 1: that someone would sit and say like, oh, a whole

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Speaker 1: culture needs to go away because I just I'm tired

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Speaker 1: of it or I don't like it, and it's it's

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Speaker 1: you know, it's particularly frustrating and particularly offensive because Steiner

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Speaker 1: directed his anti Semitic, his desire for assimilation was focused

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Speaker 1: primarily towards the Jewish people in his area, Viennese Jews,

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Speaker 1: which of all the Jewish communities in Europe, Austria's Jewish

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Speaker 1: population had done the most to integrate themselves in the

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Speaker 1: mainstream society. Is a general rule, the most patriotic people

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Speaker 1: in Austria and in a lot of like German speaking

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Speaker 1: areas were Jewish Germans. During World War One, they served

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Speaker 1: at a disproportionately high rate in both the Austria, Hungarian

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Speaker 1: and the German militaries. So the fact that Steiner targeted

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Speaker 1: these Jewish people in particular suggest that he was really, really,

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Speaker 1: really fucking anti Semitic, because like he wasn't just going

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Speaker 1: after like the like obviously it wouldn't be okay either,

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Speaker 1: But he wasn't focusing on like Jewish refugees from Russia

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Speaker 1: or whatever and like harping on them because they spoke

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Speaker 1: a different language. He was looking at people who were

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Speaker 1: identical to everyone else but wearing yamakas and like furious

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Speaker 1: about that. So like he's not just an anti Semite,

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Speaker 1: he's like a gold star fucking anti Semite. Like he's

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Speaker 1: he's particularly fucking racist in one of the most racist

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Speaker 1: places that's ever existed. Um, that's important to note. So

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Speaker 1: in the late eighteen nineties, Steiner became intellectually taken by

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Speaker 1: the writing of individualist anti religious thinkers like Max S. Turner.

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Speaker 1: As a result, he focused more on the Jewish religion

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Speaker 1: and Zionism. Now, if you'll remember that Wall dwarf answers

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Speaker 1: defensive Steiner. They called him an opponent of anti Semitism

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Speaker 1: and claimed that he railed against it. When they make

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Speaker 1: those claims, they pull out quotes like this from Steiner.

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Speaker 1: Anti Semitism is not only a danger to Jews, it

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Speaker 1: is also a danger to non Jews. Anti Semitism and

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Speaker 1: with it, racism is a symptom of spiritual decay. It

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Speaker 1: is a symptom of a cultural disease. Therefore, it is

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Speaker 1: a duty of everyone to fight against it in all

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Speaker 1: areas as energetically as possible. And that is something Steiner

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Speaker 1: really said. Here's another thing Steiner really said. Actual anti

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Speaker 1: Semitism is not the cause of this Jewish hyper sensitivity,

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Speaker 1: but rather the false image of the anti Jewish movement

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Speaker 1: invented by overwrought imaginations. Anyone who has dealt with Jews

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Speaker 1: knows how deep runs the tendency to create such an image.

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Speaker 1: Even among the best of their nation, mistrust towards non

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Speaker 1: Jews has completely taken over their souls. So Steiner is

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Speaker 1: saying that anti Semitism is bad and uh in you know,

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Speaker 1: evidence of ignorance. But he's also saying that anti Semitism

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Speaker 1: is for the most part, a fake problem invented by

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Speaker 1: Jewish people to justify their persecution complex, which sounds really

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Speaker 1: familiar to things some people say about racism today, like oh,

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Speaker 1: it's bad to be racist against you know, black people

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Speaker 1: in Native Americans or Hispanics. But really, most of the

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Speaker 1: time when those people see racism, they're just being oversensitive,

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Speaker 1: like like I'm tired fucking right wing Internet right there, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: right wing Internet or right wing people in general are

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Speaker 1: just like, oh, the liberals just love saying racist. It's

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Speaker 1: not because is terrible. Yeah, it's not because there since

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Speaker 1: they just can't stop saying that because they just the

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Speaker 1: other it's hysterical about race, and it has nothing to

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Speaker 1: do with the fact that we're all actively acting like

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Speaker 1: racists know it has everything. They're just they're just looking

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Speaker 1: for racist if racism is at the same level it's

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Speaker 1: always been, which is falling, don't charitably read our racism

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Speaker 1: Like if they did, they wouldn't have a problem with it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean I just saw it last night after the debates,

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Speaker 1: like something like, Um, the Democrat, I mean the Republicans

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Speaker 1: saying like the Liberals can't stop talking about racism, like

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Speaker 1: that's there, that's their thing. It's just yeah, it's a

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Speaker 1: fake problem. Yeum, the from over sensitive people of color. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And you know, Steiner was the kind of guy his

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Speaker 1: defenders will always pull out. He has a bunch of

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Speaker 1: quotes about anti Semitism being bad, and they'll always pull

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Speaker 1: out those quotes where he rails against particularly organized anti semitism. Um.

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Speaker 1: And you know he did say those things, but the

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Speaker 1: write ups of him that quote them ignore quotes like this,

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Speaker 1: which is also from Rudolf Steiner. I consider the anti

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Speaker 1: Semites to be a harmless people. The best of them

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Speaker 1: are like children. They want something to blame for their woes.

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Speaker 1: Much worse than the anti Semites are the heartless leaders

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Speaker 1: of the Jews, who are tired of Europe, Herzel and Nordau.

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Speaker 1: They exaggerate an unpleasant childnishnists into a world historical trend.

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Speaker 1: They pretend that a harmless squabble is a terrible roar

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Speaker 1: of cannons. They are seducers and tempters of their people,

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Speaker 1: again saying this about twenty years before the Holocaust. It's

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Speaker 1: just a gaslighting. And that's I mean, like there was

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Speaker 1: no you know, that's a modern expression. But the idea is,

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Speaker 1: it's what what Trump does too. He says something racist

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Speaker 1: and then says that he didn't say it or that

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Speaker 1: it was taken wrong, and you just keep flip flopping.

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Speaker 1: You keep saying something horrible and then saying that people

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Speaker 1: uh took it wrong, and then you say something horrible again,

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Speaker 1: and then and then somehow you end up like you're

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Speaker 1: I don't know. It's like you introduce this is so complicated,

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Speaker 1: but like you introduced, like you start the problem and

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Speaker 1: then it becomes a problem. And then you say that

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Speaker 1: that I don't know how. I just I can't do it.

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Speaker 1: I can't. I had it and I had it and

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Speaker 1: I lost it. But but just the idea that basically

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Speaker 1: you you caused this situation, and then you accuse everybody

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Speaker 1: else of being oversensitive to it, and and and then

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Speaker 1: use that as part of your proof that the race

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Speaker 1: you're talking about is is somehow flawed. Like look at

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Speaker 1: them flipping out, like you know what I mean, Like

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Speaker 1: that's kind of I'm not saying. I'm just saying, like

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Speaker 1: I didn't say anything that bad, but they're just their

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Speaker 1: nature is to flip out too much, which is a flaw,

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Speaker 1: like which is a way to be racist. Like look

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Speaker 1: at them, they can't take anything, like not like a

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Speaker 1: white person, I could take as much as possible, but

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Speaker 1: these Jews flip out about everything. Watch this, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's it's it's it's it's a very subtle um and

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Speaker 1: an insidious way of of of of continuing the racism

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Speaker 1: to say that they are overly sensitive. Yeah, and there's

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Speaker 1: a bunch of Steiner quotes that basically follow the pattern

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Speaker 1: of anti Semitism is bad. But here's what the Jews. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like these people can't take any criticism because they're Jews. Now,

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Speaker 1: for the sake of fairness, I have to point out

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Speaker 1: repeatedly that everybody was anti Semitic in Germany at this time,

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Speaker 1: pretty much everybody. It was in the air and literally

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Speaker 1: chiseled into the stone walls of churches. Winston Churchill is

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Speaker 1: famous today among Israeli's for being one of the greatest

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Speaker 1: advocates that nation has ever had. He was an intense

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Speaker 1: and outspoken supple order of Israel, and of course a

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Speaker 1: staunch foe of the Nazis. In February of nineteen twenty,

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Speaker 1: Churchill wrote an article for the Illustrated Sunday Herald titled

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Speaker 1: Zionism versus Bolshevism quote. This movement among the Jews is

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Speaker 1: not new, from the days of Spartacus why Shop, to

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Speaker 1: those of Karl Marx and down to Trotsky, Bella Coon,

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Speaker 1: Rosa Luxembourg and Emma Goldman. This worldwide conspiracy for the

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Speaker 1: overthrow of civilization and for the reconstitution of society on

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Speaker 1: the basis of arrested development, of envious malevolence and of

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Speaker 1: impossible equality has been steadily growing. So Winston Churchill, who

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Speaker 1: again UH is considered to be one of the great

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Speaker 1: UH patrons of of the Israeli nation in the twenties,

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Speaker 1: was saying stuff that was essentially directly in line with

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Speaker 1: Nazi theories about like the Jewish people is behind socialism

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Speaker 1: in the Bolshevik Revolution, which is the same ship Steiner

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Speaker 1: saying so, my point in bringing this up is the

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Speaker 1: fact that Steiner believed this ship during the late eighteen

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Speaker 1: hundreds and early nineteen hundreds definitely qualifies him as anti Semitic,

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Speaker 1: but it doesn't mean he was or would have been

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Speaker 1: a Nazi if he'd lived long enough. There were people

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Speaker 1: who believed similar things to this, and when the Nazis

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Speaker 1: came along, we're able to recognize Nazi propaganda as insane

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Speaker 1: and evil and work against the Holocaust. Like Winston Churchill

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Speaker 1: for all of his flaws, once the Nazis started saying

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Speaker 1: the same ship, he like stepped back from that. Um

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Speaker 1: so uh. We can't necessarily say that Rudolf Steiner would

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Speaker 1: have gone to bed with the Nazis, especially since he

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Speaker 1: died in but we can look at what his followers

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Speaker 1: did once the Nazis came to power. And speaking of

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Speaker 1: the Nazis coming to power, Chris, yes, it's time for

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Speaker 1: an ad transition. I don't know why that's a bad

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Speaker 1: ad transition to make that that's not a good one.

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Speaker 1: Oh boy, oh boy, I have I have made an

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Speaker 1: error speaking of Hitler's unique brand of esoteric anti semitent Nope,

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Speaker 1: that's not the right way either. Um, who shit, um yeah,

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Speaker 1: now a word from our sponsor, which is not a Nazi.

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Speaker 1: We're back. What I love about is that they aren't Nazism.

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Speaker 1: Oh boy. Uh, we're gonna lose some money from this.

423
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:16,120
Speaker 1: It's difficult to transition from this sort of subject matter

424
00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:19,760
Speaker 1: into lighthearted Uh, you know, whatever happens. I don't know

425
00:23:19,800 --> 00:23:23,080
Speaker 1: what sponsors you have, but you know something that delivers

426
00:23:23,359 --> 00:23:27,199
Speaker 1: candy bars. Yeah, they're not They're not Nazis. Uh. I

427
00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:34,320
Speaker 1: should note that several times, um, most were Nazis. Many

428
00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:39,520
Speaker 1: of Rudolf Steiner's followers. Yeah, funk, Rulf Steiner. This guy man,

429
00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:42,040
Speaker 1: someone needed to put him to bed. He talked, he

430
00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:45,040
Speaker 1: talked too much, he wrote too much. This man needed

431
00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:48,159
Speaker 1: to have his coffee taken away. Yeah, he's one of

432
00:23:48,160 --> 00:23:50,560
Speaker 1: those guys, like his whole life isn't that interesting. It's

433
00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:54,600
Speaker 1: just he had all these crazy ideas and people followed them,

434
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:58,199
Speaker 1: and a lot of problems have been I have nice ideas, like,

435
00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:00,720
Speaker 1: I have nice ideas, but I also have clinic coll depressions,

436
00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:03,560
Speaker 1: so I don't I don't write seventeen papers a day

437
00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:05,960
Speaker 1: about my nice ideas. But then there are these non

438
00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:10,520
Speaker 1: depressed assholes who are idiots who have boundless energy to

439
00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:15,760
Speaker 1: write five thousand racist treatises every fucking week. Okay, well,

440
00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:19,159
Speaker 1: but maybe if you would spend more time reading the

441
00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:22,640
Speaker 1: ghost library that lives in space, you would have more

442
00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:25,479
Speaker 1: ideas to write about two. All right, I'm too tired

443
00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:28,159
Speaker 1: to make up ship like that. You gotta visit the

444
00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:31,560
Speaker 1: ghost like I gotta have a defective brain to that

445
00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:34,320
Speaker 1: has like you have to be dumb and like really

446
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:38,080
Speaker 1: really really um not depressed, and just get out of

447
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:41,240
Speaker 1: bed every morning and just start fucking jabbering about nonsense.

448
00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:43,800
Speaker 1: I mean, that's these kind of people. They had endless energy.

449
00:24:43,840 --> 00:24:47,199
Speaker 1: That assholes with endless energy is what ruins everything. Trump's

450
00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:49,280
Speaker 1: an example. The guy's up on you want to run

451
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:51,960
Speaker 1: around all day to saying ship. I mean, the guys

452
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:55,680
Speaker 1: much energy. This goes into my theory that you shouldn't

453
00:24:55,720 --> 00:24:59,120
Speaker 1: stop rich people from developing problematic drug addictions. I think

454
00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:02,159
Speaker 1: that's true. Yeah, if you should just let him. If

455
00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:05,680
Speaker 1: if Rudolf Steiner at age nineteen had actually been doing

456
00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:08,720
Speaker 1: a shipload of opium and had died at age none

457
00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 1: of this would be a problem. Yeah, it's a shame.

458
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:17,439
Speaker 1: It's a shame. Hashtag give opiates to rich kids. Yeah, Like,

459
00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:22,720
Speaker 1: let's someone gives them opiates to Ben Superior, Ben Sapiro. Yeah, boy,

460
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:24,800
Speaker 1: he's an example of one of these guys. Like it's

461
00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:28,080
Speaker 1: just like, shut the funk up, never had a real job,

462
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:36,480
Speaker 1: way too much energy, fucking oxy sleep in one day, Shapiro. Now,

463
00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:40,160
Speaker 1: after nineteen o two, when Steiner joined the Theosophical Society,

464
00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:43,560
Speaker 1: he became inculcated with Madame Blavatsky's ideas about the mythical

465
00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:46,560
Speaker 1: arian race. After this point, the idea of root races

466
00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:49,919
Speaker 1: and arianism took an increasingly central role in his developing philosophy.

467
00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:54,439
Speaker 1: The Theosophical Society was not an explicitly anti Semitic organization

468
00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:57,280
Speaker 1: Jewish people were allowed to join, but an awful lot

469
00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:00,320
Speaker 1: of their beliefs sound like straight up Nazi propagy and a.

470
00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:03,840
Speaker 1: In a book called The Key to Theosophy, Madame Blovotsky

471
00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:07,400
Speaker 1: wrote quote, if the root of mankind is one, then

472
00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:10,040
Speaker 1: there must also be one truth which finds expression in

473
00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 1: all the various religions except in the Jewish. All religions

474
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:20,840
Speaker 1: are cool except Jewish people, Which does I mean for Europeans.

475
00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:27,159
Speaker 1: In the late eighteen hundreds, that's woker than most. Um,

476
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:33,320
Speaker 1: she wasn't like Europeans should own India, I guess, so, yeah, yeah, Now,

477
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:37,119
Speaker 1: Blovotsky viewed the Jew as the almost mythical antithesis to

478
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:40,520
Speaker 1: the Arian, the opposite of the spiritual and progressive ubermanch.

479
00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:44,119
Speaker 1: If this sounds exactly like Nazi racial theory, that's because

480
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:47,400
Speaker 1: it essentially is. Now Chris, I'm gonna guess you've heard

481
00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:50,640
Speaker 1: of the Tuliss Society. You know, I have not. It's

482
00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:53,479
Speaker 1: spelled fuel society, like the top racks that people have

483
00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:57,000
Speaker 1: on their four wheel drive cars. Uh yeah, I still

484
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:59,719
Speaker 1: really not. I'm not familiar. I mean, I'm not an

485
00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:02,600
Speaker 1: exactly sure what it is. Well, if you've if you've

486
00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:05,600
Speaker 1: read your Hellboy comics or played a lot of Wolfenstein

487
00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:08,800
Speaker 1: games where there's like Nazis doing dark occult magic and stuff,

488
00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:12,399
Speaker 1: the actual historical root of all of those myths is

489
00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:17,400
Speaker 1: the Tulis Society. Uh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, they're they're

490
00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:21,280
Speaker 1: pretty famous, more famous, but yeah, exactly, this is the

491
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:25,320
Speaker 1: root of that um and the Tulist Society was a

492
00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:29,680
Speaker 1: real occult society, and they financially supported a little group

493
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,320
Speaker 1: you might have heard about called the Deutsche are Biter

494
00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:35,520
Speaker 1: Partei which became the Nazi Party back before you know

495
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:40,240
Speaker 1: Hitler actually joined UM Now. Hitler himself was never a

496
00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:43,440
Speaker 1: member of the Tulis Society, but many influential Nazis were,

497
00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:46,560
Speaker 1: guys like Hans Frank who ran Poland for the Reich,

498
00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:50,280
Speaker 1: Rudolf Hess, the Deputy Fewer, and Dietrich Eckhart, who actually

499
00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:54,640
Speaker 1: founded the original Nazi Party. The Tulist Society's impact gets

500
00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:57,560
Speaker 1: exaggerated often, but they did provide the core members of

501
00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:00,640
Speaker 1: the early Nazi movement, and these people held the same

502
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:04,240
Speaker 1: esoteric anti Semitic beliefs about the eternal struggle of Arians

503
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:07,600
Speaker 1: and Jews as the Theosophical Society did, which makes sense

504
00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:10,840
Speaker 1: because both groups were closely tied together. Many members of

505
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:15,080
Speaker 1: the Tulis Society were adherents of Madame Blovotsky's teachings, So

506
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:18,320
Speaker 1: the tool of society is like they have events with

507
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:21,360
Speaker 1: the Theosophical Society, they have members in common, a lot

508
00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:23,960
Speaker 1: of their teachings are based on Madame Blovotsky's writings, and

509
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:28,800
Speaker 1: the Thulish Society becomes the sort of intellectual and spiritual

510
00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:32,640
Speaker 1: center of the early Nazi movement and of course, Rudolf

511
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:35,520
Speaker 1: Steiner was a hugely influential part of the development of

512
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:39,680
Speaker 1: the Theosophical Society. It's hard to trace out how many

513
00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:43,080
Speaker 1: Nazi ideas are directly descendant of Steiner's and how many

514
00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:45,240
Speaker 1: are just sort of a lot of people thinking about

515
00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:47,760
Speaker 1: similar things. But he had a big influence on the

516
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:51,080
Speaker 1: Theosophical Society, and the Theosophical Society was like one of

517
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:54,760
Speaker 1: the strained carriers for the Nazi disease. So that's where

518
00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 1: we're going to here. So while it wouldn't be accurate

519
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:01,520
Speaker 1: to say that Anthroposophy inspire the development of Nazism, it

520
00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:05,040
Speaker 1: is accurate to say that Anthroposophy and Nazism share common

521
00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:09,560
Speaker 1: ideological origins. They are at least first cousins. It is

522
00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 1: true that Steiner was allowed critic of organized anti Semitism,

523
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:14,880
Speaker 1: his writing on the subject was mostly limited to the

524
00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:16,880
Speaker 1: period right around when he first got involved in the

525
00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:21,360
Speaker 1: Theosophical Society. Once he left in nineteen twelve and founded Anthroposophy,

526
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:24,560
Speaker 1: he progressed towards racial beliefs that were basically identical to

527
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:26,840
Speaker 1: where Hitler and his friends wound up. I'm going to

528
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:30,240
Speaker 1: quote one last time from Professor Staddenmeyer's piece on Steiner

529
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:35,480
Speaker 1: and the Jewish Question. In Steiner's eyes, racial exclusiveness was

530
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:39,440
Speaker 1: the hallmark of Jewish identity. He accused Jews of national egoism,

531
00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:43,640
Speaker 1: along with materialism, abstract thinking, and an obstinate refusal of progress,

532
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:46,080
Speaker 1: in a remarkable about face from his nineteen hundred and

533
00:29:46,160 --> 00:29:48,520
Speaker 1: nineteen oh one writings. By nineteen oh five, Steiner was

534
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:51,840
Speaker 1: complaining to his future wife about the corrosive and totally

535
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 1: materialistic consequences of the continuing Semitic influence within the Aryan epoch.

536
00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:01,320
Speaker 1: His wife was having a lot of fun. She's wife

537
00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:04,280
Speaker 1: was like, tell me more that he was great in bed.

538
00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:09,720
Speaker 1: Don't let me tell you about the Jews. God, she

539
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 1: must have been having a blast. Yeah, that's that's that

540
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:19,200
Speaker 1: was like, Yeah, could you please stop talking about the Jews. Yeah,

541
00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:22,960
Speaker 1: I'm trying to cop and this is really Jewish. Why

542
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:25,960
Speaker 1: do you talk so much about them? I mean, I

543
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,720
Speaker 1: think one thing history tells us is that literally nobody

544
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:31,480
Speaker 1: in Central Europe made a woman orgasm in the early

545
00:30:31,520 --> 00:30:36,080
Speaker 1: part of the twentieth century. I've thought, like, I don't

546
00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:39,360
Speaker 1: know why I've pictured Hitler's parents fucking, but I have,

547
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:42,960
Speaker 1: because we all seen pictures of their two of them,

548
00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:47,520
Speaker 1: and I just imagining, like not only did like that

549
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 1: poor woman his mother have the worst sex imaginable with

550
00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:55,680
Speaker 1: this fucking cartoon mustache of a husband who probably like

551
00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:59,160
Speaker 1: was smoking cigars while he was having sex with her.

552
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:02,000
Speaker 1: Then on top of that they have they give birth

553
00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 1: to the biggest monster in world history. I mean, it's unbelievable.

554
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:09,960
Speaker 1: I mean, she didn't like the journey of Hitler's mother,

555
00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:13,840
Speaker 1: I think is uh there's something worth Oh, I don't know,

556
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:15,480
Speaker 1: I just think about it because it's like Fox, she

557
00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:18,320
Speaker 1: probably was just I mean, there's just no upside any

558
00:31:18,360 --> 00:31:20,280
Speaker 1: of it. She didn't enjoy the sex she gave birth to,

559
00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:23,560
Speaker 1: like the history's greatest monster. Oh yeah, it's a bad

560
00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:26,040
Speaker 1: it's a bad tale. We do have a fun too,

561
00:31:26,080 --> 00:31:29,040
Speaker 1: partner of this show about Hitler's sex life and everything

562
00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:31,360
Speaker 1: we know about how the fewer fucked oh my god,

563
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:36,560
Speaker 1: like via post like probably that is firm delivered via

564
00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:42,400
Speaker 1: like horsebacked and had a dump a bronze ear Now

565
00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:46,400
Speaker 1: I'm gonna finish that quote about yeah, the continuing Semitic

566
00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:49,480
Speaker 1: influence within the area in HPOPS. This tendency continued throughout

567
00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:53,320
Speaker 1: Steiner's final anthroposophical period, even after his organizational break with

568
00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:57,040
Speaker 1: mainstream theosophy in nineteen thirteen. In a nineteen eighteen lecture

569
00:31:57,040 --> 00:31:59,440
Speaker 1: on Specters of the Old Testament and the Nationalism of

570
00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:02,400
Speaker 1: the Present, for example, he strongly associated the Jews with

571
00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:05,160
Speaker 1: a social element that is anti social as regards the

572
00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:08,160
Speaker 1: whole of humanity and insisted that Jewish culture was a

573
00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:13,479
Speaker 1: folk culture, not an individualized culture of humanity. So he

574
00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:17,320
Speaker 1: gets way more racist after his break with the theosophist society.

575
00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:20,160
Speaker 1: Now this brings us to the question what happened to

576
00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:23,560
Speaker 1: Steiner's followers once the Nazis took power. Well, the Waldorf

577
00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:26,400
Speaker 1: schools and the modern day anthroposophists will like to point

578
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:29,160
Speaker 1: out that they too were oppressed under the Nazis. That

579
00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:32,200
Speaker 1: Waldorf Answers site I referenced earlier has a page titled

580
00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 1: Anthroposophy in the time of Nazi Germany. Quote Anthroposophists belonged

581
00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:39,280
Speaker 1: to the many groups of people who were persecuted under

582
00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 1: the Nazi regime. Hitler's own disdaining remarks regarding Rudolf Steiner

583
00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:45,480
Speaker 1: and the Anthroposophists appeared as early as nineteen twenty one.

584
00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:48,320
Speaker 1: By the spring of nineteen thirty three, articles criticizing the

585
00:32:48,320 --> 00:32:51,720
Speaker 1: movement began appearing more frequently in National Socialist newspapers. But

586
00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:54,080
Speaker 1: the summer of that year, Steiner's books were banned from

587
00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 1: public libraries in Bavaria, and study groups and branches of

588
00:32:57,120 --> 00:33:01,000
Speaker 1: the General Anthroposophical Society, along with other cultural organizations, were

589
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:05,640
Speaker 1: ordered to submit to national Socialistic leadership. Now, Waldorf answers

590
00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:08,120
Speaker 1: will point out that the Anthroposophical Society was banned in

591
00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:10,880
Speaker 1: November of nineteen thirty five after the extensive lobbying of

592
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:14,719
Speaker 1: Heinrich Himler and Ryanhard Heydrich. This is in fact true,

593
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 1: but like all anthroposophist defenses of these kinds of charges,

594
00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:22,680
Speaker 1: they leave out quite a bit of contextualizing information. So

595
00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:26,440
Speaker 1: I'm going to quote now from Anthroposophy and eco Fascism. Quote.

596
00:33:26,840 --> 00:33:29,560
Speaker 1: Immediately after the Nazi movement attained state power in early

597
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:32,720
Speaker 1: nineteen thirty three, the leaders of organized Anthroposophy took the

598
00:33:32,720 --> 00:33:35,160
Speaker 1: initiative in extending their support to the new government. In

599
00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:38,160
Speaker 1: June of that year, a Danish newspaper asked guntherro Walshmouth,

600
00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 1: secretary of the International Anthroposophic Society in Switzerland, about Anthroposophy's

601
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:46,040
Speaker 1: attitude towards the Nazi regime, he replied, we can't complain.

602
00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:48,760
Speaker 1: We've been treated with the utmost consideration and have complete

603
00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:52,800
Speaker 1: freedom to promote our doctrine. Speaking for anthroposophists generally, walk

604
00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:55,560
Speaker 1: Smith went on to express his sympathy and admiration for

605
00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:59,719
Speaker 1: national socialism. Walk Schmouth, one of three top officers at

606
00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:02,720
Speaker 1: anthro Postophees World headquarters in door Knock, was hardly alone

607
00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:05,800
Speaker 1: and Steiner's followers and his vocal support for the Hitler dictatorship.

608
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:10,240
Speaker 1: The homeopathic physician Hans Roscher, for example, proudly proclaimed himself

609
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:13,640
Speaker 1: just as much an anthroposophist as a national socialist. In

610
00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:17,280
Speaker 1: ninety four, the German Anthroposophic Society sent Hitler an official

611
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:21,680
Speaker 1: letter pointing out Anthropostophe's compatibility with national socialist values and

612
00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:26,680
Speaker 1: emphasizing Steiner's Aryan origins and his pro German activism. The exception,

613
00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:30,239
Speaker 1: of course, was Jewish members of anthroposophist organizations. They were

614
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:33,239
Speaker 1: forced under pressure from the state to leave these institutions.

615
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:37,040
Speaker 1: There is no record of their gentile anthroposophist comrades protesting

616
00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:40,320
Speaker 1: this racial exclusion, much less putting up any internal resistance

617
00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:43,360
Speaker 1: to it. In fact, some anthroposophists like the law professor

618
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 1: Ernst von Hippel endorsed the expulsion of Jews from German universities.

619
00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:51,120
Speaker 1: So a couple I was just thinking about something like

620
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:54,680
Speaker 1: so that the post World War One period for UH

621
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:59,480
Speaker 1: Germany was um similar in a way to the post

622
00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:04,279
Speaker 1: um nine eleven UH post Iraq War period we're in

623
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:06,640
Speaker 1: now in the United States, in the sense that the

624
00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:09,960
Speaker 1: narrative has been shattered, Like the narrative that Germany was

625
00:35:10,000 --> 00:35:12,480
Speaker 1: this ascendant power was shattered by World War One. They

626
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:16,040
Speaker 1: lost UM and that fucked up their citizenry because there

627
00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:19,400
Speaker 1: was no more storyline. People need storylines to proceed ahead.

628
00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:22,960
Speaker 1: People like them, and they really need them for security sake,

629
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:26,160
Speaker 1: even if their imaginary. And in the United States right now,

630
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:30,279
Speaker 1: post nine eleven and post um government bailout of the

631
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:33,799
Speaker 1: banks and post um Iraq War, no one is sure

632
00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:35,960
Speaker 1: what we stand for anymore. They don't believe that America

633
00:35:36,080 --> 00:35:41,080
Speaker 1: stands for, you know, UH, bringing democracy to the globe.

634
00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:43,879
Speaker 1: They don't believe that we stand for They don't believe

635
00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:47,600
Speaker 1: the American dream anymore. And it's so often that these

636
00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:51,040
Speaker 1: these spaces in history are filled with racist narratives to

637
00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:55,240
Speaker 1: give a storyline back to culture, because right now American

638
00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:59,839
Speaker 1: culture is flailing around, similar to Germany post World War One.

639
00:35:59,880 --> 00:36:02,560
Speaker 1: I feel like America feels pretty bad about itself and

640
00:36:02,600 --> 00:36:06,560
Speaker 1: it's looking for a way a narrative to attach. Um.

641
00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 1: I'm sure you've seen hypernormalization. Yeah, you know that kind

642
00:36:11,200 --> 00:36:13,640
Speaker 1: of thing where it's just these these spaces and history

643
00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:18,080
Speaker 1: are very dangerous because they allow for anybody to come

644
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:20,960
Speaker 1: in with some crackpot philosophy that people will be like, oh,

645
00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:23,600
Speaker 1: thank god, I just need something to follow well. And

646
00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:26,160
Speaker 1: one of the things that's luckiest about our current time,

647
00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:28,040
Speaker 1: because we are in what I consider to be a

648
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:31,400
Speaker 1: dangerous situation, and there are some parallels to where Germany

649
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:35,000
Speaker 1: was in between nineteen thirty two. One of the big

650
00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:39,160
Speaker 1: benefits that we have is that a very very very

651
00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:43,840
Speaker 1: very very very very vanishingly tiny fraction of our adult

652
00:36:43,920 --> 00:36:47,040
Speaker 1: population has any experience in combat or war, and that

653
00:36:47,080 --> 00:36:49,720
Speaker 1: the wars that sort of have have had a cratering

654
00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:52,360
Speaker 1: impact on kind of our national self image didn't involve

655
00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:55,280
Speaker 1: very many people. One of the reasons that the early

656
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:58,400
Speaker 1: Nazis were so dangerous that is not something we see

657
00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:01,120
Speaker 1: with most of like the Proud Boys and the other

658
00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:03,840
Speaker 1: sort of fascist groups. The vast majority of those guys

659
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:07,160
Speaker 1: in modern day have never seen combat. All of the

660
00:37:07,239 --> 00:37:09,760
Speaker 1: Nazis where guys, not a single one of them flinched

661
00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:12,879
Speaker 1: from physical They were all physically courageous. Adolf Hitler got

662
00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:15,200
Speaker 1: into whip fights with people where he would be like

663
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:17,680
Speaker 1: tearing pieces of their faces off and would be like

664
00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:21,400
Speaker 1: getting shot at and stuff like. They they were all mean.

665
00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:24,799
Speaker 1: One of the benefits we have is that our fascists

666
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:29,799
Speaker 1: are mostly physical cowards, which is one of the reasons. Yeah,

667
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:31,560
Speaker 1: it's one of the reasons I have some hope that

668
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:34,600
Speaker 1: we can overwhelm this this thing is that most of

669
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:37,880
Speaker 1: these guys, like the Nazis, were more willing to gamble

670
00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:40,640
Speaker 1: than um our fascists have so far been. So I

671
00:37:40,719 --> 00:37:42,839
Speaker 1: just really have a saving grace. It's that I wish

672
00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:45,400
Speaker 1: there was a way democratic and I say democratic, I

673
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:49,479
Speaker 1: mean politicians could just say something like that instead of

674
00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:53,279
Speaker 1: the nonsense democratic candidates say in debates like I mean,

675
00:37:53,400 --> 00:37:55,399
Speaker 1: I I just I wish they could just say, hey,

676
00:37:55,440 --> 00:37:58,640
Speaker 1: here's here's a nuanced view of what's happening right now.

677
00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:01,360
Speaker 1: Here's what Trump is. I mean, I know that's not

678
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,800
Speaker 1: gonna happen. But you know what I mean, like Trump

679
00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:08,239
Speaker 1: is a cartoon um to fill space in a historical

680
00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:12,759
Speaker 1: narrative that is lacking direction right now. Yeah, we we

681
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:16,080
Speaker 1: need a new myth because myths are the core of

682
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:19,480
Speaker 1: any society. UM. And that's that's part of what like

683
00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:24,040
Speaker 1: Steiner and a number of other people like collectively and

684
00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:28,560
Speaker 1: over a long period of time created for Germans. That's

685
00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:31,919
Speaker 1: what that's kind of why Madame Blovotsky's teachings really take

686
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:35,400
Speaker 1: off UM in a big way. And like the immediately

687
00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:38,839
Speaker 1: pre war and post war period is like she's She's

688
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:41,760
Speaker 1: and these other thinkers like Steiner are providing this mythical

689
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:45,839
Speaker 1: idea of like the Aryan race and like this conflict

690
00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:49,920
Speaker 1: that they have with the Jews, and it explains like, um,

691
00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:52,400
Speaker 1: like that was necessary for the Germans to explain how

692
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:55,719
Speaker 1: they lost World War One. Um was this idea that

693
00:38:55,760 --> 00:38:59,080
Speaker 1: like there was this deeper conspiracy UM. And you know

694
00:38:59,239 --> 00:39:03,120
Speaker 1: Steiner wasn't saying that as much. He did say a

695
00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:06,520
Speaker 1: bit of stuff like that, but his beliefs about sort

696
00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:09,600
Speaker 1: of how these like alien races are like weakening the

697
00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:12,040
Speaker 1: Arians and how like the Jews are not really a

698
00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:14,840
Speaker 1: part of this this, this like thing like that. That

699
00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:18,800
Speaker 1: all played into this greater theory of somebody is trying

700
00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:22,200
Speaker 1: to stop us from taking our our rightful ascendant place

701
00:39:22,280 --> 00:39:27,720
Speaker 1: in the community of nations. Now let's talk about organic farming.

702
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:32,040
Speaker 1: So I've mentioned a couple of times that Rudolf Steiner

703
00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:35,200
Speaker 1: kind of invented organic farming. And I don't mean that

704
00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:38,719
Speaker 1: he invented the concept of like farming without like pesticides

705
00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:41,680
Speaker 1: or fertilizer, like obviously people have been doing that since forever,

706
00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:45,920
Speaker 1: but he is one of the main people behind inventing

707
00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 1: kind of our modern concept of organic farming, as in

708
00:39:49,239 --> 00:39:52,480
Speaker 1: opposition to industrial farming. What time does this guy get

709
00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:54,719
Speaker 1: up in the morning, That's what I wanted. He got

710
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:59,480
Speaker 1: a lot done right. Half Like a lot of criticisms

711
00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:02,160
Speaker 1: of Rudolph Steiner, laziness is not one of them. I

712
00:40:02,160 --> 00:40:06,000
Speaker 1: wish he had done less. Yeah, these people need the

713
00:40:06,120 --> 00:40:11,240
Speaker 1: fucking settled down. When I started my research into Steiner,

714
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:13,440
Speaker 1: I found my way to a Twitter thread started by

715
00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:16,520
Speaker 1: Dr Sarah Taper. She's a crop scientist, and she had

716
00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:20,640
Speaker 1: a hot take on Steiner's particular farming innovation, which is

717
00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:25,960
Speaker 1: called biodynamic farming. Quote. So organic is what happened when

718
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:28,799
Speaker 1: Europe had to start using artificial fertilizers because they'd spent

719
00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:31,200
Speaker 1: a hundred plus years throwing sewage into the ocean and

720
00:40:31,239 --> 00:40:34,239
Speaker 1: the land was all out of nutrients. German spiritualists were like,

721
00:40:34,360 --> 00:40:37,120
Speaker 1: chemical fertilizers in my food. Oh, hell no, that's way

722
00:40:37,120 --> 00:40:41,440
Speaker 1: too Jewish. Rudolf Steiner's work was like sixty racist theory

723
00:40:41,719 --> 00:40:43,600
Speaker 1: and organic was just the So this is what my

724
00:40:43,719 --> 00:40:46,600
Speaker 1: racist theory means for farming side of his work. German

725
00:40:46,680 --> 00:40:49,400
Speaker 1: racism was soon judged to be embarrassing, so later editions

726
00:40:49,400 --> 00:40:52,720
Speaker 1: of his work just deleted those chapters. Eventually, nineteen sixties

727
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:55,560
Speaker 1: U s counterculture kids picked up editions of Steiner's books

728
00:40:55,560 --> 00:40:58,759
Speaker 1: with the most egregious racial theory material deleted. They picked

729
00:40:58,840 --> 00:41:00,920
Speaker 1: up On the Nature and to the Land down with

730
00:41:01,040 --> 00:41:03,440
Speaker 1: artificial vibe and had no idea that it was all

731
00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:08,759
Speaker 1: an anti Semitic tirade. And that's essentially accurate. Uh Dr

732
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:11,480
Speaker 1: Sarah Tabor gives a pretty good summary there. But but

733
00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:14,760
Speaker 1: we're going to get into the weeds of biodynamic farming next.

734
00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 1: But before we get into the weeds, you know what

735
00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:21,759
Speaker 1: doesn't promote weeds? What is this are you doing? An

736
00:41:21,840 --> 00:41:26,200
Speaker 1: AD break from doing an AD plug. Yes, you know,

737
00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:30,359
Speaker 1: if you need glycophosphiate that you can healthily drink. Are

738
00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:38,720
Speaker 1: you tired of bees existing? Do bees piss you off?

739
00:41:38,719 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 1: They just play that scene from stand By Me when

740
00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:44,839
Speaker 1: McCauley Colkin gets killed by the bee. It's like Monsanto

741
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:49,799
Speaker 1: putting an into this bullshit. So this is an AD break.

742
00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:52,719
Speaker 1: I assume this is a fucking ad break. Yeah, is it?

743
00:41:53,400 --> 00:42:02,880
Speaker 1: Products We're back, So now we're talking about what what

744
00:42:02,880 --> 00:42:06,239
Speaker 1: did Rudolph Steiner do? Now? What did that fucking what

745
00:42:06,360 --> 00:42:11,640
Speaker 1: did the cafe? Did racist do? Now? Biodynamic farm still

746
00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:14,200
Speaker 1: a thing today? You know, it's funny, real quick, Robert,

747
00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:17,640
Speaker 1: I gotta tell you, I've I've mentioned this other podcasts.

748
00:42:18,440 --> 00:42:20,040
Speaker 1: I don't know why I just said that, but I

749
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:22,160
Speaker 1: just mentioned I mentioned this all the time. Let me

750
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:24,759
Speaker 1: put it that way, not on podcasts on the street anywhere,

751
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:27,000
Speaker 1: because I'm still knocked out by the fact that the

752
00:42:27,000 --> 00:42:31,960
Speaker 1: Renaissance happened because of coffee, Like coffee became readily available

753
00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:33,879
Speaker 1: in Europe at the exact same time that I mean

754
00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:38,120
Speaker 1: that kicked off of the Renaissance. Um, And I guess

755
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:41,240
Speaker 1: that's a real fact. So I really had an influence

756
00:42:41,280 --> 00:42:42,920
Speaker 1: for sure. Yeah, yeah, I know, and it's not probably

757
00:42:42,960 --> 00:42:44,960
Speaker 1: not the whole yeah, the whole thing, but I'd say

758
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:49,960
Speaker 1: it was, um so so, I just it's amazing. I

759
00:42:49,960 --> 00:42:52,560
Speaker 1: wish that we could have shut off the coffee supply

760
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:56,839
Speaker 1: to a Germany between the year's nineteen eighteen and nine.

761
00:42:58,440 --> 00:43:00,480
Speaker 1: I will say this, when you really get into the

762
00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:03,720
Speaker 1: weeds of reading about European history, one of the thoughts

763
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:06,080
Speaker 1: you repeatedly are are led to us, like, boy, we

764
00:43:06,080 --> 00:43:08,280
Speaker 1: should have really cut the Germans off from their caffee

765
00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:15,080
Speaker 1: and something people more tired. Yeah, these people needed to

766
00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:20,640
Speaker 1: be sleepy. I really got too much done. Time machine,

767
00:43:20,800 --> 00:43:24,040
Speaker 1: go back, smash all the coffee machines in Germany and nine. Well,

768
00:43:24,080 --> 00:43:26,600
Speaker 1: you know what, Speaking of where coffee came into Europe,

769
00:43:26,600 --> 00:43:28,480
Speaker 1: there's a single point in which you could have stopped

770
00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:32,120
Speaker 1: coffee spread. So one of the sort of the which

771
00:43:32,160 --> 00:43:34,880
Speaker 1: generally credited as like how coffee became part of Europe

772
00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:37,520
Speaker 1: is like when the Ottomans laid siege to I think

773
00:43:37,520 --> 00:43:40,080
Speaker 1: it was I think it might have been fucking I

774
00:43:40,520 --> 00:43:42,640
Speaker 1: don't know if it was Vienna or um, yeah, I

775
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:44,800
Speaker 1: think it was Vienna. When the Ottoman Empire laid sieged

776
00:43:44,840 --> 00:43:46,600
Speaker 1: one of the cities in Europe and they got their

777
00:43:46,640 --> 00:43:48,400
Speaker 1: asses beat. I think this is when like the Polish

778
00:43:48,400 --> 00:43:53,480
Speaker 1: winged Hussars like like broke their army and routed it there.

779
00:43:53,840 --> 00:43:56,480
Speaker 1: They left their camp behind, right, so they outside this

780
00:43:56,520 --> 00:43:59,320
Speaker 1: European city, they leave their camp behind, and being Turks,

781
00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:01,799
Speaker 1: their camping clue did huge bags of coffee and like

782
00:44:02,280 --> 00:44:04,400
Speaker 1: Jesuva's you know, they're kind of coffee pots that used

783
00:44:04,400 --> 00:44:08,839
Speaker 1: for Turkish coffee. So Europeans like started trying this ship

784
00:44:08,840 --> 00:44:10,240
Speaker 1: out and they were like, oh my god, this stuff

785
00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:12,120
Speaker 1: is amazing. But also they were like, oh my god,

786
00:44:12,120 --> 00:44:14,880
Speaker 1: this is like a heathen, evil Muslim drink, Like is

787
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:18,000
Speaker 1: this something we have to ban and prosecute? And so

788
00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:19,920
Speaker 1: they took it to the Pope and like the Pope

789
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:22,160
Speaker 1: tried the coffee because everyone was like, is this a

790
00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:24,319
Speaker 1: devil drink? Can we drink this? And the Pope cried

791
00:44:24,360 --> 00:44:26,640
Speaker 1: it and was like, this ship is amazing. I've never

792
00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:30,320
Speaker 1: wanted to say mass more than in my life. The pope,

793
00:44:30,400 --> 00:44:32,560
Speaker 1: I think it was Pope Clement. I forget which number,

794
00:44:32,600 --> 00:44:34,120
Speaker 1: but he had numbers after them, but it was a

795
00:44:34,160 --> 00:44:37,719
Speaker 1: Pope Clement, I think baptized the beverage of coffee in

796
00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:40,279
Speaker 1: order to make it acceptable for Christians. Like, that's how

797
00:44:40,320 --> 00:44:43,400
Speaker 1: coffee came into Christendom. Is the Pope like officially baptized

798
00:44:43,440 --> 00:44:50,520
Speaker 1: it so that that Christians could drink hats got tall too? Yeah, um,

799
00:44:50,560 --> 00:44:53,160
Speaker 1: that's an awesome story that. That's so great. I love

800
00:44:53,200 --> 00:44:56,120
Speaker 1: that the first people who discovered coffee in Europe, man

801
00:44:56,239 --> 00:44:58,360
Speaker 1: or anybody, the first person who discovered coffee, I'm just

802
00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:01,759
Speaker 1: jealous of. Oh yeah, A lot of cool myths about

803
00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:06,280
Speaker 1: that too. But back to biodynamic farming. The Biodynamic Association,

804
00:45:06,360 --> 00:45:10,400
Speaker 1: which is like a an organization for biodynamic farmers, says

805
00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:13,560
Speaker 1: this and explaining what it is. Quote, each biodynamic farmer

806
00:45:13,600 --> 00:45:16,719
Speaker 1: garden is an integrated, whole living organism. This organism is

807
00:45:16,760 --> 00:45:21,160
Speaker 1: made up of many interdependent elements fields, forests, plants, animals, soils, compost, people,

808
00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:24,120
Speaker 1: in the spirit of the place. Biodynamic farmers and gardeners

809
00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:26,520
Speaker 1: work to nurture and harmonize these elements, managing them in

810
00:45:26,560 --> 00:45:28,719
Speaker 1: a holistic and dynamic way to support the health and

811
00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:33,240
Speaker 1: vitality of the whole. So that sounds good, right yeah,

812
00:45:33,360 --> 00:45:36,680
Speaker 1: now right above that on their biodynamic principles and Practices page.

813
00:45:36,719 --> 00:45:40,040
Speaker 1: They say this quote biodynamics is rooted in the work

814
00:45:40,040 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 1: of philosopher and scientist Dr Rudolph Steiner. Lectures to farmers

815
00:45:44,640 --> 00:45:47,040
Speaker 1: opened a new way to integrate scientific understanding with the

816
00:45:47,120 --> 00:45:51,800
Speaker 1: recognition of spirit in nature. Now, as with anthroposophic medicine,

817
00:45:52,040 --> 00:45:57,640
Speaker 1: Rudolf Steiner was never a farmer. That's interesting, absolutely, and

818
00:45:58,480 --> 00:46:00,960
Speaker 1: was a scientist die there, Yeah, of course not. I

819
00:46:02,840 --> 00:46:05,160
Speaker 1: was wondering. I was saying, this man has got boundless.

820
00:46:05,239 --> 00:46:08,000
Speaker 1: It's never a fucking doctor either, Like he was dictating

821
00:46:08,000 --> 00:46:10,279
Speaker 1: while he was farming. I mean, I think he might

822
00:46:10,280 --> 00:46:14,560
Speaker 1: add like a PhD. But he was never a medical doctor. Yeah, wow, okay,

823
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:16,600
Speaker 1: so he never he just like he just posted, he's

824
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:21,920
Speaker 1: had this idea based on basically racism, that maybe farms

825
00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:25,120
Speaker 1: could be purer if they had less jew in them. Well,

826
00:46:25,160 --> 00:46:28,879
Speaker 1: that's that's kind of where this is headed. And yeah,

827
00:46:29,040 --> 00:46:31,520
Speaker 1: I mean one of the things about impurity. There's too

828
00:46:31,520 --> 00:46:35,640
Speaker 1: many impurities in society and in the farm. He wasn't

829
00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:38,520
Speaker 1: wrong about every aspect of biodamatic farming, because he was

830
00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:40,120
Speaker 1: one of a number of people looking at the way

831
00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:43,359
Speaker 1: industrial farming had been started in Europe since like World

832
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:46,000
Speaker 1: War one, and it was like really toxic and involved

833
00:46:46,040 --> 00:46:48,000
Speaker 1: a lot of horrible chemicals, and like people were doing

834
00:46:48,040 --> 00:46:50,239
Speaker 1: fucked up ship to the land, and he was able

835
00:46:50,280 --> 00:46:52,160
Speaker 1: to see, like, oh, maybe we should do less fucked

836
00:46:52,200 --> 00:46:54,640
Speaker 1: up ship to the land. He also mixed that in

837
00:46:54,680 --> 00:46:58,000
Speaker 1: with a bunch of insane notion, but every aspect of

838
00:46:58,040 --> 00:47:00,160
Speaker 1: what he was saying wasn't wrong. There were a lot

839
00:47:00,200 --> 00:47:04,480
Speaker 1: of problems with industrial agriculture as there are today, um,

840
00:47:04,520 --> 00:47:06,320
Speaker 1: and he was one of the first people who pointed

841
00:47:06,360 --> 00:47:08,680
Speaker 1: that out. He just also was not a farmer and

842
00:47:08,719 --> 00:47:10,560
Speaker 1: did not know what the funk he was talking about

843
00:47:10,600 --> 00:47:14,200
Speaker 1: in any complex sense of the phrase. It's clock being right.

844
00:47:14,320 --> 00:47:18,480
Speaker 1: Every whatever they say a racist clock is occasionally right

845
00:47:18,560 --> 00:47:24,080
Speaker 1: about farming sides. Yeah, yeah, Now, you may notice that

846
00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:26,360
Speaker 1: none of what I've read there gives us much insight

847
00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:30,000
Speaker 1: into what biodynamic farming actually involves. It's just a lot

848
00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:33,280
Speaker 1: of vaguely positive, flowery language about the spirit of the land.

849
00:47:33,640 --> 00:47:35,640
Speaker 1: So I found a two thousand seventeen article in The

850
00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:38,840
Speaker 1: Guardian which focuses on the rapid growth of biodynamic farms

851
00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:41,200
Speaker 1: in the United States. It cited the co director of

852
00:47:41,239 --> 00:47:44,719
Speaker 1: Demeter USA, remember the name of that company, A nonprofit

853
00:47:44,800 --> 00:47:48,280
Speaker 1: certifier of biodynamic farms in the United States. They claimed

854
00:47:48,280 --> 00:47:50,760
Speaker 1: to the acreage devoted to biodynamic farming in this country

855
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:54,359
Speaker 1: increased by sixteen percent in two thousand seventeen. Here's how

856
00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:58,720
Speaker 1: The Guardian described the methodology behind biodynamic farming. Quote Austrian

857
00:47:58,719 --> 00:48:02,720
Speaker 1: philosopher Rudolf Steiner, a controversial public figure, introduced biodynamic principles

858
00:48:02,719 --> 00:48:05,560
Speaker 1: by encouraging farmers to look to the Cosmos before planting

859
00:48:05,560 --> 00:48:10,960
Speaker 1: and harvesting crops. So it's space farming. It's space farming. Yeah,

860
00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:16,000
Speaker 1: what does look cosmos? Yeah it it means farming with

861
00:48:16,120 --> 00:48:22,120
Speaker 1: witchcraft basically essentially as wuy as that sounds, and it's

862
00:48:22,120 --> 00:48:25,879
Speaker 1: about to get wu were Biodynamic foods are growing in popularity.

863
00:48:26,120 --> 00:48:28,840
Speaker 1: Demeter works with more than fifty u S brands, including

864
00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:31,200
Speaker 1: Whole Foods, to add more of their food to the shelf.

865
00:48:31,360 --> 00:48:33,439
Speaker 1: They and a lot of people claim it tastes better.

866
00:48:33,760 --> 00:48:37,600
Speaker 1: But you know what doesn't taste good Nazism And that's

867
00:48:37,600 --> 00:48:41,680
Speaker 1: where biodynamic farming first got its start. So in the

868
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:44,359
Speaker 1: episode we recently done in fritz Haber, we talked about

869
00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:47,279
Speaker 1: how the explosion in the use of nitrogen fertilizers made

870
00:48:47,320 --> 00:48:49,879
Speaker 1: possible the growth of the world's population beyond around three

871
00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:53,399
Speaker 1: billion people or so. But all those chemical fertilizers also

872
00:48:53,400 --> 00:48:55,920
Speaker 1: fucked up the top soil, and in many cases they

873
00:48:55,920 --> 00:48:58,680
Speaker 1: had a negative effect on the flavor of food. This

874
00:48:58,840 --> 00:49:02,400
Speaker 1: was noticed at the time, particularly by people living in Germany,

875
00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:06,040
Speaker 1: and the organic farming movement first arose as a response

876
00:49:06,080 --> 00:49:09,160
Speaker 1: to this. Steiner was not the only person who started

877
00:49:09,160 --> 00:49:11,480
Speaker 1: pushing for a reformation of farming methods, but he was

878
00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:13,799
Speaker 1: among the first and might have been the most influential.

879
00:49:14,320 --> 00:49:18,880
Speaker 1: His biodynamic approach involved rejecting artificial fertilizers and pesticides and

880
00:49:18,920 --> 00:49:22,320
Speaker 1: instead using compost and maneure. He urged farmers to reject

881
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:26,000
Speaker 1: monocultures giant farms growing just a single crop. These are

882
00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:29,279
Speaker 1: all good enough ideas, but Steiner's biodynamism also involved a

883
00:49:29,280 --> 00:49:32,200
Speaker 1: lot of bullshit, not just following the lunar calendar, but

884
00:49:32,320 --> 00:49:35,480
Speaker 1: using homeopathy to channel astral energy and other dumb ship

885
00:49:35,640 --> 00:49:39,440
Speaker 1: like that. It wasn't just harmless magic, though. Biodynamism took

886
00:49:39,480 --> 00:49:41,520
Speaker 1: off in large part because it tapped into a very

887
00:49:41,600 --> 00:49:44,759
Speaker 1: dangerous part of the zeitgeist. I found an article from

888
00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:48,560
Speaker 1: the Journal of Environmental History titled organic Farming and Nazi Germany.

889
00:49:48,640 --> 00:49:53,160
Speaker 1: The Politics of Biodynamic Agriculture. It's written by guess who,

890
00:49:53,239 --> 00:49:57,160
Speaker 1: our old buddy, Peter staden Meyer of Marquette University. He

891
00:49:57,200 --> 00:49:59,520
Speaker 1: seems to have something of an obsession for all things Steiner,

892
00:49:59,600 --> 00:50:01,680
Speaker 1: and he's definitely the guy to go for on this one.

893
00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:04,600
Speaker 1: I'm gonna quote from him now. In the nineteen thirties,

894
00:50:04,640 --> 00:50:08,839
Speaker 1: biodynamic advocates touted their version of organic agriculture as spiritually

895
00:50:08,880 --> 00:50:12,759
Speaker 1: aware of peasant wisdom in contrast to civilization, technology and

896
00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:19,400
Speaker 1: modern urban culture. Now, yeah, hippies, But there's a thinner

897
00:50:19,440 --> 00:50:22,960
Speaker 1: line than you'd think between Nazis and hippies, because you

898
00:50:23,000 --> 00:50:25,560
Speaker 1: know who else stood against modern urban culture and really

899
00:50:25,600 --> 00:50:29,200
Speaker 1: pushed ideas of spiritually aware of peasant wisdom. The fucking

900
00:50:29,280 --> 00:50:33,480
Speaker 1: Nazis and biodynamic advocates found a welcome home once the

901
00:50:33,480 --> 00:50:36,480
Speaker 1: New Reich started winding up in nineteen thirty two. At

902
00:50:36,480 --> 00:50:39,320
Speaker 1: that point, the main company selling biodynamism to the German

903
00:50:39,360 --> 00:50:43,200
Speaker 1: people was Demeter, who's still around today now. Demeters sold

904
00:50:43,280 --> 00:50:46,799
Speaker 1: organic food and will Letta sold cosmetics and pharmaceuticals. Both

905
00:50:46,800 --> 00:50:49,040
Speaker 1: companies exist today and are, as far as I know,

906
00:50:49,440 --> 00:50:52,759
Speaker 1: responsible corporate citizens. But back in the nineteen thirties, they

907
00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:56,759
Speaker 1: were responsible corporate citizens of the National Socialist Government. In

908
00:50:56,840 --> 00:50:59,759
Speaker 1: July of nineteen thirty three, biodynamic farmers founded the Reich

909
00:51:00,280 --> 00:51:04,760
Speaker 1: for Biodynamic Agriculture. Their leader was an anthroposophist named Erhard BArch.

910
00:51:05,280 --> 00:51:07,719
Speaker 1: The movement saw Nazi policies as more or less in

911
00:51:07,760 --> 00:51:10,800
Speaker 1: line with their own esoteric beliefs. They encountered some early

912
00:51:10,880 --> 00:51:13,640
Speaker 1: issues and were briefly banned in nineteen thirty three, which

913
00:51:13,640 --> 00:51:16,719
Speaker 1: is something the anthroposophists will point out regularly, but that

914
00:51:16,880 --> 00:51:20,800
Speaker 1: ban only lasted a year. Quote As early as nineteen

915
00:51:20,840 --> 00:51:25,319
Speaker 1: thirty four, Nazi Interior minister Wilhelm Fricht visited Barch's biodynamic

916
00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:27,920
Speaker 1: estate and expressed his support for the organization. He was

917
00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:31,080
Speaker 1: followed by a parade of similarly high profile figures, including

918
00:51:31,160 --> 00:51:34,239
Speaker 1: Rudolf Hess, Robert Leigh, and Alfred Rosenberg, who were guests

919
00:51:34,239 --> 00:51:37,279
Speaker 1: at Biodynamic headquarters in bod Sorrow and a voice their

920
00:51:37,320 --> 00:51:40,320
Speaker 1: support for the undertaking. Representatives of the Reich League for

921
00:51:40,360 --> 00:51:44,080
Speaker 1: Biodynamic Agriculture publicized the achievements of their organic farming methods

922
00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:47,200
Speaker 1: in various media, highlighting the virtues of a natural approach

923
00:51:47,239 --> 00:51:49,760
Speaker 1: to growing food. For their revitalization of the German nation.

924
00:51:50,080 --> 00:51:53,080
Speaker 1: They claimed that biodynamic farms enjoyed more abundant harvest and

925
00:51:53,080 --> 00:51:56,880
Speaker 1: produced higher quality crops than conventional agriculture, adding that organic

926
00:51:56,920 --> 00:51:59,600
Speaker 1: procedures were more efficient, healthier, and more conducive to the

927
00:51:59,640 --> 00:52:02,520
Speaker 1: well being of the peasantry and the German people at large.

928
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:05,759
Speaker 1: Depicting the farm as a unified organism, Bart disdained the

929
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:10,280
Speaker 1: americanization and mechanization of agriculture as hazardous to the German

930
00:52:10,320 --> 00:52:14,399
Speaker 1: peasant life and its connection to the living soil. One

931
00:52:14,480 --> 00:52:17,520
Speaker 1: Nazi catchphrase that you'll hear a lot even today is

932
00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:20,959
Speaker 1: blood and soil, And most people think of that more

933
00:52:21,040 --> 00:52:23,080
Speaker 1: literally than they should is talking about like the area

934
00:52:23,160 --> 00:52:26,480
Speaker 1: and blood and the soil of Germany. But when they

935
00:52:26,560 --> 00:52:29,000
Speaker 1: talk about the soil, they're actually talking more about like

936
00:52:29,040 --> 00:52:32,759
Speaker 1: a metaphysical connection to the dirt. Because again, this sort

937
00:52:32,800 --> 00:52:35,400
Speaker 1: of like connection to like peasant farming and stuff is

938
00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:37,920
Speaker 1: a huge aspect of what the Nazis were pushing at

939
00:52:37,960 --> 00:52:42,280
Speaker 1: the time, and it's something that you know, biodynamic farming

940
00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:45,000
Speaker 1: really played into quite where the Nazis get all this

941
00:52:45,120 --> 00:52:48,000
Speaker 1: free time. This is what I want to understand, I mean,

942
00:52:48,000 --> 00:52:50,200
Speaker 1: I really do want to understand this Robert, you might

943
00:52:50,239 --> 00:52:55,920
Speaker 1: know something that I don't really understand. Why did like

944
00:52:56,760 --> 00:53:02,040
Speaker 1: what exactly made the German economy function? What was drying?

945
00:53:02,120 --> 00:53:06,600
Speaker 1: What what was the money behind all this? Like like obviously,

946
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:10,600
Speaker 1: if you want to sit around and talk about farming

947
00:53:10,680 --> 00:53:13,200
Speaker 1: and and and and whether or not people should be

948
00:53:13,239 --> 00:53:15,240
Speaker 1: more like peasants or any of this kind of stuff,

949
00:53:16,080 --> 00:53:20,520
Speaker 1: you need spare time, and you need a functioning society,

950
00:53:20,719 --> 00:53:23,760
Speaker 1: which certainly Germany did not have, like for a while

951
00:53:23,960 --> 00:53:29,399
Speaker 1: before what militarization, I mean, who was funding That's who

952
00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:33,200
Speaker 1: was funding honest free time speculation that these Germans were doing.

953
00:53:34,239 --> 00:53:36,360
Speaker 1: There's okay, so this is a very cop there's the answer.

954
00:53:36,400 --> 00:53:39,560
Speaker 1: That's very complicated. You don't want to for a lot

955
00:53:39,560 --> 00:53:42,239
Speaker 1: of these German philosophers, many of them did in the

956
00:53:42,280 --> 00:53:47,120
Speaker 1: twenties especially, received funding from a number of kind of

957
00:53:47,120 --> 00:53:50,200
Speaker 1: shady sources, including a lot of very wealthy American businessmen,

958
00:53:50,200 --> 00:53:52,759
Speaker 1: including some of the businessmen who carried out the business plot,

959
00:53:52,800 --> 00:53:56,719
Speaker 1: which was an attempted fascist coup against Um, which is

960
00:53:56,719 --> 00:53:59,360
Speaker 1: an incredible story. It is an incredible story. We do

961
00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:01,480
Speaker 1: in an episode on it. But more to the point,

962
00:54:01,719 --> 00:54:04,880
Speaker 1: Um number one, the Weimar Republic had a lot of

963
00:54:04,880 --> 00:54:08,080
Speaker 1: problems and was also came of age in a very

964
00:54:08,120 --> 00:54:10,759
Speaker 1: difficult time to be running Germany. But it was not

965
00:54:10,840 --> 00:54:13,919
Speaker 1: as dysfunctional as history books often painted. It had it's

966
00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:16,319
Speaker 1: bad years, but by the time the Nazi Party really

967
00:54:16,320 --> 00:54:19,839
Speaker 1: started to rise, the economy had started, it was well

968
00:54:19,880 --> 00:54:22,680
Speaker 1: on its path to recovery. Now a big part of

969
00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:24,960
Speaker 1: what you know, there's a lot of people who mistakenly

970
00:54:25,000 --> 00:54:27,319
Speaker 1: believe that at least Hitler's policies were good for the

971
00:54:27,360 --> 00:54:30,120
Speaker 1: economy of Germany. They were not. Where all of the

972
00:54:30,200 --> 00:54:33,720
Speaker 1: money came from in the early chunk of the Nazi parties,

973
00:54:33,760 --> 00:54:36,560
Speaker 1: like time and power was they stole it from all

974
00:54:36,600 --> 00:54:38,640
Speaker 1: of the Jewish people. They took their businesses, they took

975
00:54:38,640 --> 00:54:40,600
Speaker 1: their money, they took their houses, and they gave them

976
00:54:40,640 --> 00:54:44,279
Speaker 1: to party members, and robbery is a large part of

977
00:54:44,280 --> 00:54:47,759
Speaker 1: what stimulated the German economy. They also borrowed at sort

978
00:54:47,800 --> 00:54:50,680
Speaker 1: of like unsustainably high rates and used that to push

979
00:54:50,719 --> 00:54:53,520
Speaker 1: a remilitarization which like gave jobs and stuff, but it

980
00:54:53,560 --> 00:54:56,440
Speaker 1: was not sustainable and it was not sound economic policy,

981
00:54:56,719 --> 00:55:00,239
Speaker 1: which is part of why conquest eventually became necessary if

982
00:55:00,239 --> 00:55:02,120
Speaker 1: they were going to maintain anything close to the same

983
00:55:02,160 --> 00:55:06,440
Speaker 1: pace of development, but it's interested because deep thinking cultural

984
00:55:06,600 --> 00:55:11,239
Speaker 1: like like the like like intellectualism is not is is

985
00:55:11,320 --> 00:55:13,239
Speaker 1: good and we're kind of going through that right now.

986
00:55:13,280 --> 00:55:15,239
Speaker 1: Like the good part of it is maybe thinking well

987
00:55:15,520 --> 00:55:17,440
Speaker 1: maybe I just mean the good part would be the

988
00:55:17,480 --> 00:55:20,000
Speaker 1: part where you think about, well, maybe farming should be

989
00:55:20,200 --> 00:55:26,960
Speaker 1: should be organic like, but then that same thinking, that

990
00:55:27,120 --> 00:55:32,040
Speaker 1: same like sort of luxury to ruminate leads to terrible

991
00:55:32,120 --> 00:55:35,799
Speaker 1: ideas as well. Um, it's just very interesting to me

992
00:55:35,840 --> 00:55:38,640
Speaker 1: because you know, like what we it seems like this

993
00:55:38,680 --> 00:55:41,600
Speaker 1: is proceeding toward, is like so many things that are

994
00:55:41,680 --> 00:55:47,759
Speaker 1: currently happening came out of this fucking horrible period like

995
00:55:47,760 --> 00:55:49,640
Speaker 1: like and some of them are good and some of

996
00:55:49,680 --> 00:55:51,279
Speaker 1: them are horrible, but you know what I mean, like,

997
00:55:51,320 --> 00:55:53,640
Speaker 1: but they all come from this like deep thinking and

998
00:55:53,719 --> 00:55:58,040
Speaker 1: consideration that doesn't exist in culture anymore. It doesn't seem

999
00:55:58,080 --> 00:56:01,200
Speaker 1: to me anyways. Just the thought that's just something that's

1000
00:56:01,200 --> 00:56:04,120
Speaker 1: occurring to me. Is like it's like, it seems like

1001
00:56:04,160 --> 00:56:07,000
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff happened as a result of the

1002
00:56:07,080 --> 00:56:09,880
Speaker 1: Nazis having too much time on their hands, and I

1003
00:56:09,920 --> 00:56:12,000
Speaker 1: wonder where that time came from and why there's no

1004
00:56:12,200 --> 00:56:14,759
Speaker 1: time anymore for it or it seems like there's no

1005
00:56:15,600 --> 00:56:18,799
Speaker 1: there's no there's no bunch of good people doing the

1006
00:56:18,920 --> 00:56:23,440
Speaker 1: deep thinking that would be necessary to bring culture forward

1007
00:56:24,120 --> 00:56:26,480
Speaker 1: in good while not explain it. You know what we

1008
00:56:26,520 --> 00:56:29,600
Speaker 1: try to do. Hear it behind the best. Okay, maybe

1009
00:56:29,600 --> 00:56:31,680
Speaker 1: that's it. Maybe that's it. If you if you want to,

1010
00:56:31,719 --> 00:56:33,799
Speaker 1: if you want to draw even more comparisons between the

1011
00:56:33,880 --> 00:56:36,240
Speaker 1: rise of the Nazis and our own recipient fascist movement,

1012
00:56:36,400 --> 00:56:38,840
Speaker 1: one uncomfortable thing to look at could be the fact

1013
00:56:38,880 --> 00:56:41,880
Speaker 1: that if you, guys like Hitler and his his fellow

1014
00:56:41,960 --> 00:56:44,399
Speaker 1: thinkers in the Nazi Party did a lot of their

1015
00:56:44,440 --> 00:56:47,560
Speaker 1: development after they started becoming political figures, and they were

1016
00:56:47,640 --> 00:56:51,600
Speaker 1: essentially paid and subsisted on donations and sales of their books.

1017
00:56:51,640 --> 00:56:53,520
Speaker 1: Hitler got very wealthy off of the sales of Mind

1018
00:56:53,560 --> 00:56:54,960
Speaker 1: comp and that's what gave him a lot of the

1019
00:56:55,000 --> 00:56:57,200
Speaker 1: time to formulate the rest of his philosophies. And like

1020
00:56:57,280 --> 00:57:01,719
Speaker 1: figure sh it out um and nowadays we have a

1021
00:57:01,760 --> 00:57:04,560
Speaker 1: class of people who have been paid by a mix

1022
00:57:04,719 --> 00:57:08,560
Speaker 1: of largely by right wing oil billionaires and fracking billionaires

1023
00:57:08,560 --> 00:57:12,040
Speaker 1: like the Wilkes uh family and stuff um, people like

1024
00:57:12,080 --> 00:57:15,880
Speaker 1: Ben Shapiro, people like Dave Ruben Um, people like Jordan Paterson,

1025
00:57:16,000 --> 00:57:17,919
Speaker 1: and you know also from the fact that they sell

1026
00:57:17,920 --> 00:57:20,160
Speaker 1: a ship load of books about their philosophies and stuff.

1027
00:57:20,160 --> 00:57:23,160
Speaker 1: And these people are just continuing to think about things

1028
00:57:23,640 --> 00:57:27,560
Speaker 1: and stuff like cultural Marxism and whatnot. And uh, it's

1029
00:57:27,600 --> 00:57:30,040
Speaker 1: scary where that might lead. And we kind of saw

1030
00:57:30,080 --> 00:57:34,439
Speaker 1: where it lead once. When you give dumb assholes, uh,

1031
00:57:34,680 --> 00:57:36,440
Speaker 1: tell them that they're really smart and give them a

1032
00:57:36,440 --> 00:57:38,360
Speaker 1: bunch of money to think of more dumb shit, it

1033
00:57:38,440 --> 00:57:43,280
Speaker 1: gets really bad. And uh, yeah, I'm just thinking about Okay,

1034
00:57:43,280 --> 00:57:48,720
Speaker 1: so maybe maybe the best is less less thinking. Um

1035
00:57:49,120 --> 00:57:50,840
Speaker 1: I am okay, I'm just I'm just trying to figure

1036
00:57:50,840 --> 00:57:52,160
Speaker 1: out what the what the hell is going on? This

1037
00:57:52,240 --> 00:57:57,280
Speaker 1: is a lot It's hard to find lessons from history sometimes. Yeah.

1038
00:57:57,440 --> 00:58:01,480
Speaker 1: So when the Auto bond construction started in nineteen thirty four,

1039
00:58:01,560 --> 00:58:04,960
Speaker 1: a group of landscape advocates oversaw the construction. The guy

1040
00:58:04,960 --> 00:58:08,440
Speaker 1: in charge of this was Altwin Siefert, a biodynamic advocate

1041
00:58:08,440 --> 00:58:12,240
Speaker 1: who was considered the Third Reich's most prominent environmentalist. Siefert

1042
00:58:12,280 --> 00:58:15,640
Speaker 1: considered himself to be national socialist through and through, and

1043
00:58:15,680 --> 00:58:18,960
Speaker 1: his beliefs on biodynamism were directly intertwined with his beliefs

1044
00:58:18,960 --> 00:58:23,040
Speaker 1: on race science. It is true that anthroposophists and biodynamists,

1045
00:58:23,040 --> 00:58:25,800
Speaker 1: who are often one and the same, regularly encountered pushback

1046
00:58:25,840 --> 00:58:28,919
Speaker 1: and even oppression from Reich officials, but that's had less

1047
00:58:28,960 --> 00:58:30,680
Speaker 1: to do with the fact that Nazis saw them as

1048
00:58:30,720 --> 00:58:33,960
Speaker 1: fundamentally dangerous movements and more to do with petty in

1049
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:38,040
Speaker 1: fighting and bickering between different factions of Nazis. So, like

1050
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:40,360
Speaker 1: the Waldorf answers, people will claim that, like, well, no,

1051
00:58:40,440 --> 00:58:43,640
Speaker 1: look the all these Nazis hated anthroposophy and like banded

1052
00:58:43,640 --> 00:58:45,640
Speaker 1: it a couple of points, and like, that's proof that

1053
00:58:45,640 --> 00:58:48,600
Speaker 1: we were oppressed by the Nazis too. And the reality

1054
00:58:48,760 --> 00:58:52,600
Speaker 1: is that certain Nazis loved anthroposophy and certain Nazis hated

1055
00:58:52,600 --> 00:58:54,960
Speaker 1: it because Nazis were caddy bitches who spent most of

1056
00:58:54,960 --> 00:58:57,880
Speaker 1: their time fighting with each other. As Stott and Meyer

1057
00:58:57,960 --> 00:59:01,040
Speaker 1: lays out, most practitioners of Steiner based philosophies had no

1058
00:59:01,200 --> 00:59:04,400
Speaker 1: problem with the third Reich quote. In nineteen thirty seven,

1059
00:59:04,400 --> 00:59:07,080
Speaker 1: an organic dairy farmer from side Leezie declared that both

1060
00:59:07,080 --> 00:59:10,720
Speaker 1: biodynamics and Nazism were based on closeness to nature, while

1061
00:59:10,720 --> 00:59:14,320
Speaker 1: in nineteen thirty eight, biodynamic advocates blamed profit oriented chemical

1062
00:59:14,360 --> 00:59:18,040
Speaker 1: agriculture on Jewish influence. A nineteen forty one letter from

1063
00:59:18,040 --> 00:59:21,920
Speaker 1: an anthroposophist and biodynamic advocates similarly limited that German efforts

1064
00:59:21,960 --> 00:59:25,200
Speaker 1: to maintain healthy soil were threatened by Jewish influence and

1065
00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:29,520
Speaker 1: racially for an infiltration. The biodynamic movements anti materialist stance

1066
00:59:29,560 --> 00:59:32,840
Speaker 1: sometimes when it prays from Nazi anti semites, and adulatory

1067
00:59:32,920 --> 00:59:36,560
Speaker 1: nineteen forty texts proclaimed, we are confident that biodynamic agriculture

1068
00:59:36,560 --> 00:59:40,000
Speaker 1: will continue to realize the ideal goal. Ordinary materialism is

1069
00:59:40,000 --> 00:59:42,480
Speaker 1: digging its own grave. The cow is not a milk factory.

1070
00:59:42,520 --> 00:59:44,720
Speaker 1: The hen is not an egg laying machine. The soil

1071
00:59:44,800 --> 00:59:48,080
Speaker 1: is not a chemical laboratory, as the jew professors would

1072
00:59:48,080 --> 00:59:53,160
Speaker 1: have us believe. See first half of the sentences there.

1073
00:59:53,320 --> 00:59:56,240
Speaker 1: Maybe they're being in college when my Jewish professor told

1074
00:59:56,280 --> 01:00:03,000
Speaker 1: me that hens were egg laying machines. Yeah, classic Judaism. Yeah,

1075
01:00:03,320 --> 01:00:08,520
Speaker 1: the class was called hands. Yeah. Now, anthroposophy did succeed

1076
01:00:08,760 --> 01:00:11,640
Speaker 1: in getting itself heavily purged by the Nazis. Now this

1077
01:00:11,840 --> 01:00:15,240
Speaker 1: is largely because of a little fella named Rudolph Hess.

1078
01:00:15,640 --> 01:00:18,160
Speaker 1: What do you know about Rudolph Hess, Well, I know

1079
01:00:18,320 --> 01:00:21,560
Speaker 1: Rudolph Hess was wasn't a Hitler's best friend for a

1080
01:00:21,600 --> 01:00:26,160
Speaker 1: long time, or he was Hitler's best his Reich's fearer

1081
01:00:26,280 --> 01:00:28,400
Speaker 1: or his second in command or what he was the

1082
01:00:28,520 --> 01:00:31,560
Speaker 1: deputy fearer of the Reich for a while. Um, he

1083
01:00:31,680 --> 01:00:34,080
Speaker 1: was like Butcher or something. I mean, all these fucking

1084
01:00:34,160 --> 01:00:38,080
Speaker 1: Reich guys were all like ex like like just regular motherfucker's,

1085
01:00:38,160 --> 01:00:43,960
Speaker 1: like loading doc managers and ship who put on stupid

1086
01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:47,160
Speaker 1: ass outfits. So Hess was the guy. He was Hitler's

1087
01:00:47,200 --> 01:00:48,920
Speaker 1: best friend for a long time. When they were in

1088
01:00:49,000 --> 01:00:52,280
Speaker 1: prison together, Hitler dictated mind comp and Hest did a

1089
01:00:52,360 --> 01:00:54,240
Speaker 1: lot of the actual typing for it. So Hess was

1090
01:00:54,320 --> 01:00:56,720
Speaker 1: like as close to Hitler as a person could be.

1091
01:00:57,480 --> 01:01:00,880
Speaker 1: And Hess was a believer in all of the ridiculous

1092
01:01:01,080 --> 01:01:04,760
Speaker 1: esoteric witchcraft Nazism stuff that you could possibly fucking believe.

1093
01:01:05,720 --> 01:01:08,880
Speaker 1: A picture of his eyebrows, that's the first thing that

1094
01:01:08,960 --> 01:01:11,040
Speaker 1: came to my mind. I don't understand how these Master

1095
01:01:11,200 --> 01:01:16,000
Speaker 1: Race motherfucker's excused like these these obvious I mean, the

1096
01:01:16,120 --> 01:01:19,600
Speaker 1: Master Race has fucking eyebrows look like to goddamn snakes

1097
01:01:20,520 --> 01:01:24,640
Speaker 1: or Yeah, anyway, it's Battie. So yeah. Hess was a big,

1098
01:01:24,720 --> 01:01:26,840
Speaker 1: big fan of the occult, big supporter of He was

1099
01:01:26,880 --> 01:01:28,920
Speaker 1: in you know, the the Toulist Society. He was a

1100
01:01:28,960 --> 01:01:31,680
Speaker 1: big believer in like a lot of the stuff Steiner said, uh.

1101
01:01:31,760 --> 01:01:34,960
Speaker 1: And he was a major supporter of anthroposophy and like

1102
01:01:35,120 --> 01:01:38,080
Speaker 1: biodynamic farming, and like was a big advocate for Steiner

1103
01:01:38,160 --> 01:01:42,720
Speaker 1: type beliefs in the Reich. But in he hopped in

1104
01:01:42,800 --> 01:01:45,840
Speaker 1: a plane and flew to Scotland. Now we don't know

1105
01:01:46,120 --> 01:01:49,120
Speaker 1: why exactly. The most plausible theory is that he was

1106
01:01:49,200 --> 01:01:53,320
Speaker 1: a legitimately delusional person and actually mentally ill, and convinced

1107
01:01:53,400 --> 01:01:55,840
Speaker 1: himself that he could negotiate peace with England on the

1108
01:01:55,920 --> 01:01:58,480
Speaker 1: eve of the German invasion of Russia. He did not

1109
01:01:58,640 --> 01:02:01,720
Speaker 1: succeed in this and was instantly captured, and the bear

1110
01:02:01,840 --> 01:02:06,040
Speaker 1: was incredibly embarrassing together um Has had again been Hitler's

1111
01:02:06,120 --> 01:02:07,840
Speaker 1: right hand man throughout most of his rise to power,

1112
01:02:08,000 --> 01:02:10,640
Speaker 1: literally writing down, yeah, a lot of Hitler's words. When

1113
01:02:10,720 --> 01:02:13,680
Speaker 1: Has abandoned him, Hitler took it personally, and since Hess

1114
01:02:13,720 --> 01:02:16,400
Speaker 1: had been a major Nazi advocate for a cult bullshit,

1115
01:02:16,760 --> 01:02:20,280
Speaker 1: his exiting the picture provided more practical monsters like Reinhard

1116
01:02:20,360 --> 01:02:23,800
Speaker 1: Hydrick with an opportunity to purge other Nazis. They disagreed

1117
01:02:23,880 --> 01:02:27,360
Speaker 1: with Hydrick, by the way, is like maybe the worst

1118
01:02:27,440 --> 01:02:30,760
Speaker 1: of the Nazis, widely considered to be the architect of

1119
01:02:30,800 --> 01:02:35,040
Speaker 1: the Holocaust, the Butcher of Moravia. Terrible person um. Now,

1120
01:02:35,320 --> 01:02:38,720
Speaker 1: while anthroposophy was excised from German public life due to this,

1121
01:02:39,200 --> 01:02:42,600
Speaker 1: biodynamic farming continued. From the very start of World War two.

1122
01:02:42,680 --> 01:02:45,720
Speaker 1: Biodynamic growers had worked with Heinrich Hitler's s S to

1123
01:02:45,800 --> 01:02:49,920
Speaker 1: help plan for the agricultural colonization of the occupied Eastern territories.

1124
01:02:50,400 --> 01:02:52,920
Speaker 1: The plan was to uproot and eliminate the slabs and

1125
01:02:53,000 --> 01:02:56,880
Speaker 1: replace them with German farmers. To biodynamic advocates, this represented

1126
01:02:56,880 --> 01:02:59,760
Speaker 1: an incredible opportunity. They would have a chance to rework

1127
01:03:00,000 --> 01:03:04,080
Speaker 1: all of Eastern Europe into one enormous organic, biodynamic farm.

1128
01:03:04,680 --> 01:03:06,960
Speaker 1: Starting in October of nineteen thirty nine, the s S

1129
01:03:07,040 --> 01:03:12,200
Speaker 1: established a biodynamic agricultural school and occupied Poland. So after

1130
01:03:12,360 --> 01:03:15,680
Speaker 1: Hess's flight, uh Heinrich Himmler ordered the s S to

1131
01:03:15,800 --> 01:03:20,720
Speaker 1: use the term natural farming for organic agriculture rather than biodynamic,

1132
01:03:20,880 --> 01:03:23,880
Speaker 1: but nothing changed about the methods or the individuals involved,

1133
01:03:24,120 --> 01:03:28,439
Speaker 1: many of whom were dedicated anthroposophists and Steiner followers. Gunther punk,

1134
01:03:28,600 --> 01:03:30,880
Speaker 1: a biodynamic advocate, became a head of the s S

1135
01:03:30,960 --> 01:03:33,680
Speaker 1: Office of Race and Settlement in nineteen thirty eight. His

1136
01:03:33,800 --> 01:03:36,560
Speaker 1: goal was to fill the conquered East with biodynamic farms

1137
01:03:36,640 --> 01:03:39,880
Speaker 1: run by soldier farmers. I'm going to quote from Staudenmeyer

1138
01:03:39,920 --> 01:03:43,800
Speaker 1: one more time. The centerpiece of the biodynamic operations was

1139
01:03:43,920 --> 01:03:47,280
Speaker 1: the sizeable plantation at Dachau, which produced medicinal herbs and

1140
01:03:47,320 --> 01:03:50,120
Speaker 1: other organic goods for the s S. As that ravens Brook,

1141
01:03:50,320 --> 01:03:53,120
Speaker 1: the labor of the Dachau biodynamic plantation was performed by

1142
01:03:53,160 --> 01:03:56,240
Speaker 1: camp inmates from nineteen forty one onwards. The Dachau operation

1143
01:03:56,360 --> 01:03:59,360
Speaker 1: was overseen by anthroposophist Fronds Lippert, a leader of the

1144
01:03:59,400 --> 01:04:02,000
Speaker 1: biodynamic movement from its beginnings and head gardener at will

1145
01:04:02,080 --> 01:04:05,440
Speaker 1: Lada from nine to nineteen forty. So in at least

1146
01:04:05,480 --> 01:04:10,760
Speaker 1: two concentration camps there were biodynamic farms operated by slave laborers.

1147
01:04:11,200 --> 01:04:16,760
Speaker 1: That is the birth of organic biodynamic farming. Um was

1148
01:04:16,880 --> 01:04:20,760
Speaker 1: literal concentration camps. So that's cool, we'll let it end demeter.

1149
01:04:20,880 --> 01:04:23,360
Speaker 1: Both operated happily under the Third Reich, along with other

1150
01:04:23,480 --> 01:04:27,439
Speaker 1: less mystical companies like IBM, but the inherently fascistic roots

1151
01:04:27,480 --> 01:04:30,040
Speaker 1: of much of the organic farming movement have continued today.

1152
01:04:30,200 --> 01:04:32,640
Speaker 1: A sizeable minority of organic farmers in the US and

1153
01:04:32,720 --> 01:04:36,520
Speaker 1: Europe are far right extremists whose quest for purity unfortunately

1154
01:04:36,560 --> 01:04:40,080
Speaker 1: extends beyond keeping their corn pesticide free. Obviously, this doesn't

1155
01:04:40,080 --> 01:04:42,760
Speaker 1: mean anyone who runs an organic farmer supports organic farming

1156
01:04:42,880 --> 01:04:45,440
Speaker 1: is a Nazi. The ideas of evolved a lot since then,

1157
01:04:45,520 --> 01:04:47,760
Speaker 1: anymore than the IBM chip in my laptop makes me

1158
01:04:47,840 --> 01:04:50,640
Speaker 1: a fascist. But it is important to understand the problematic

1159
01:04:50,760 --> 01:04:53,520
Speaker 1: roots of Steinerist ideas because they are still very much

1160
01:04:53,600 --> 01:04:59,680
Speaker 1: influential to this day. And this, my friend, is when

1161
01:04:59,720 --> 01:05:03,440
Speaker 1: we tell talk about Mary Anne Williamson. Okay, yeah, now

1162
01:05:03,880 --> 01:05:06,160
Speaker 1: she is not, to my knowledge and anthroposophist, but her

1163
01:05:06,200 --> 01:05:08,720
Speaker 1: beliefs are close enough in line to anthroposophy that she

1164
01:05:08,840 --> 01:05:12,400
Speaker 1: regularly shows up alongside them in literature. For example, I

1165
01:05:12,480 --> 01:05:14,920
Speaker 1: found the book is Ms and Ologies, All the movement's

1166
01:05:15,000 --> 01:05:17,720
Speaker 1: ideas and doctrines that have shaped our world. It includes

1167
01:05:17,760 --> 01:05:21,160
Speaker 1: a brief discussion of Steiner and anthroposophy. The very next

1168
01:05:21,240 --> 01:05:24,400
Speaker 1: paragraph discusses the Unity Church, which was founded in eighteen

1169
01:05:24,440 --> 01:05:28,120
Speaker 1: eighty nine as a sort of combination of New Thought, Hinduism, Buddhism,

1170
01:05:28,320 --> 01:05:32,080
Speaker 1: and theosophy quote today Unity a new Thought have blurred

1171
01:05:32,120 --> 01:05:34,520
Speaker 1: into the New Age, which adds a spiritualized version of

1172
01:05:34,640 --> 01:05:38,360
Speaker 1: quantum physics and a psychological therapeutic aspect to the doctrinal mix.

1173
01:05:38,680 --> 01:05:41,760
Speaker 1: Mary Ann Williamson, who is a Unity pastor, Gary Zukov,

1174
01:05:41,840 --> 01:05:43,919
Speaker 1: and Wayne Dwyer are only a few best selling writers

1175
01:05:43,960 --> 01:05:46,760
Speaker 1: who proclaimed that spiritual growth follows from a transformation of

1176
01:05:46,800 --> 01:05:50,320
Speaker 1: our ways of thinking. Now, I found another interesting article

1177
01:05:50,360 --> 01:05:54,040
Speaker 1: on the Southern Cross Review reflection on the Anthroposophical path

1178
01:05:54,120 --> 01:05:57,920
Speaker 1: of Schooling. It mentions Williamson and Steiner in the same paragraph.

1179
01:05:58,360 --> 01:06:00,320
Speaker 1: Like Sneiner, we must read and make connect actions with

1180
01:06:00,360 --> 01:06:02,960
Speaker 1: the great spiritual literatures of the world. This enriches our

1181
01:06:03,040 --> 01:06:05,360
Speaker 1: view of the spiritual world and can also provide assistance

1182
01:06:05,400 --> 01:06:07,760
Speaker 1: when we have difficulty with meditation or get stuck in

1183
01:06:07,800 --> 01:06:10,560
Speaker 1: our personal growth. Although our goal is to gain knowledge

1184
01:06:10,600 --> 01:06:13,600
Speaker 1: of the spiritual worlds that Steiner saw so clearly and beautifully,

1185
01:06:13,800 --> 01:06:16,000
Speaker 1: we should not become dependent on his insights. If we

1186
01:06:16,080 --> 01:06:18,000
Speaker 1: were to develop our own ability to see the spirit,

1187
01:06:18,080 --> 01:06:20,919
Speaker 1: we must develop the ability to think for ourselves. Even

1188
01:06:20,960 --> 01:06:24,680
Speaker 1: study of contemporary spiritual teachers like mary Ann Williamson can

1189
01:06:24,760 --> 01:06:28,400
Speaker 1: help us develop this ability. So that's that's a guy

1190
01:06:28,480 --> 01:06:33,000
Speaker 1: advocating for the charitable reading of Steiner's texts. Now, again,

1191
01:06:33,120 --> 01:06:35,360
Speaker 1: there's nothing inherently Nazi here. And I'm not saying the

1192
01:06:35,440 --> 01:06:38,000
Speaker 1: author of that Peace or Marianne are fascist, because again,

1193
01:06:38,080 --> 01:06:40,080
Speaker 1: a lot of the racism has been pruned out of

1194
01:06:40,120 --> 01:06:43,720
Speaker 1: the modern publications of Steiner's work. But it is worrying

1195
01:06:43,800 --> 01:06:45,680
Speaker 1: to me how close some of our beliefs seemed to

1196
01:06:45,800 --> 01:06:49,720
Speaker 1: intertwine with Steiner's. A terrifying number of his followers had

1197
01:06:49,800 --> 01:06:52,840
Speaker 1: no difficulty diving head first into fascism. Many considered it

1198
01:06:52,840 --> 01:06:55,000
Speaker 1: a natural step forward, and I'm worried that some of

1199
01:06:55,040 --> 01:06:58,320
Speaker 1: those same ideas are still very common today. Now. Marianne

1200
01:06:58,360 --> 01:07:00,600
Speaker 1: Williamson herself, is, of course Jew, and I do not

1201
01:07:00,720 --> 01:07:02,880
Speaker 1: believe she is a fascist, but I do think she

1202
01:07:03,000 --> 01:07:06,280
Speaker 1: harbors a number of these toxic beliefs. She's famously said

1203
01:07:06,480 --> 01:07:10,000
Speaker 1: sickness is an illusion and does not actually exist. And

1204
01:07:10,080 --> 01:07:12,040
Speaker 1: the fact that this sort of nonsense isn't seen as

1205
01:07:12,040 --> 01:07:15,880
Speaker 1: immediately disqualifying and a candidate deeply concerns me. When one

1206
01:07:15,920 --> 01:07:18,960
Speaker 1: type of anti scientific bullshit can propagate other more toxic

1207
01:07:19,080 --> 01:07:22,400
Speaker 1: ideas can also breed. This is the most important lesson

1208
01:07:22,520 --> 01:07:25,680
Speaker 1: we can take from the life and ideas of Rudolf Steiner.

1209
01:07:26,680 --> 01:07:28,520
Speaker 1: That's the end of the episode. Hey, listen to this.

1210
01:07:29,280 --> 01:07:32,800
Speaker 1: Maryann Williamson, there's another one of these rich kids. She

1211
01:07:33,440 --> 01:07:36,080
Speaker 1: she had a wasted decade where she moved to New

1212
01:07:36,160 --> 01:07:40,520
Speaker 1: Mexico and lived in a geodesic dome with her boyfriend.

1213
01:07:41,560 --> 01:07:45,280
Speaker 1: And she also was gonna pursue a career as a

1214
01:07:45,360 --> 01:07:49,760
Speaker 1: cabaret singer, but got distracted by quote, bad boys and

1215
01:07:49,960 --> 01:07:52,880
Speaker 1: good dope. I mean, well, you know, we all get

1216
01:07:52,920 --> 01:07:55,160
Speaker 1: distracted by bad boys and good dope for a period

1217
01:07:55,200 --> 01:07:57,840
Speaker 1: of time, right, But then when these people find the way,

1218
01:07:58,080 --> 01:08:01,760
Speaker 1: or what they think is the way, these big ego

1219
01:08:01,960 --> 01:08:07,760
Speaker 1: people decide that everybody. I mean it's so like you

1220
01:08:07,880 --> 01:08:12,640
Speaker 1: basically attach universal. You have a huge ego, so you attached,

1221
01:08:12,720 --> 01:08:15,040
Speaker 1: like you take your personal journey and then you you

1222
01:08:15,240 --> 01:08:17,519
Speaker 1: kind of try and impose it on everybody else. It's

1223
01:08:17,560 --> 01:08:24,240
Speaker 1: like it's very it's very like uh myopic uh tunnel visions.

1224
01:08:26,560 --> 01:08:28,880
Speaker 1: It's just very selfish. It's this idea that that your

1225
01:08:29,000 --> 01:08:33,360
Speaker 1: personal journey somehow, um, you forget that you're a privilege

1226
01:08:33,400 --> 01:08:36,120
Speaker 1: you're one of this privileged class that gets to spend

1227
01:08:36,200 --> 01:08:41,639
Speaker 1: all its time, um you know, uh thinking about ship

1228
01:08:41,800 --> 01:08:44,280
Speaker 1: that you really shouldn't be thinking about. You should just

1229
01:08:44,400 --> 01:08:49,559
Speaker 1: be most of the time, probably minding your own fucking business. Um.

1230
01:08:49,680 --> 01:08:51,960
Speaker 1: But you ended up with this huge amount of space

1231
01:08:52,000 --> 01:08:54,080
Speaker 1: in your life where you live in jazesic domes. And

1232
01:08:54,160 --> 01:08:57,919
Speaker 1: then it just leads to this, I don't know, attaching

1233
01:08:58,000 --> 01:09:01,800
Speaker 1: so much importance to your own narrative that it doesn't deserve. Yeah,

1234
01:09:01,840 --> 01:09:05,840
Speaker 1: and it's it leads to problematic shit, like like what

1235
01:09:06,000 --> 01:09:09,519
Speaker 1: you see in Marianne Williamson's writings and stuff, where she'll

1236
01:09:09,560 --> 01:09:13,160
Speaker 1: talk about sickness and disease as if it's it's not

1237
01:09:13,320 --> 01:09:16,120
Speaker 1: a thing that just happens randomly to some people. It's

1238
01:09:16,160 --> 01:09:19,680
Speaker 1: tied into like aspects of your what you believe, or

1239
01:09:19,800 --> 01:09:22,639
Speaker 1: like how you act, like what sort of energy you invite,

1240
01:09:22,880 --> 01:09:25,519
Speaker 1: and it's it's not She would never say you, if

1241
01:09:25,560 --> 01:09:27,840
Speaker 1: you have cancer, it's your fault, but that's one of

1242
01:09:27,920 --> 01:09:30,559
Speaker 1: the interpretations of the things that she writes. And it's

1243
01:09:30,600 --> 01:09:32,479
Speaker 1: why a lot of like disabled people are like people

1244
01:09:32,479 --> 01:09:36,040
Speaker 1: who were born with like you know, disabilities or whatever, um,

1245
01:09:37,000 --> 01:09:39,759
Speaker 1: like get really scared when they see this person starting

1246
01:09:39,760 --> 01:09:42,240
Speaker 1: to gain steam and politics, because a shipload of stuff

1247
01:09:42,280 --> 01:09:44,799
Speaker 1: that she's written is the same kind of ship Steiner

1248
01:09:44,920 --> 01:09:47,160
Speaker 1: was writing about. How like, oh, well, you know, if

1249
01:09:47,200 --> 01:09:50,240
Speaker 1: you didn't, I don't think she would literally says that, like, oh,

1250
01:09:50,439 --> 01:09:54,160
Speaker 1: you're your ghost, you know, balked before jumping into your body,

1251
01:09:54,240 --> 01:09:57,800
Speaker 1: and that's why your arm doesn't work right. But a

1252
01:09:57,880 --> 01:10:01,240
Speaker 1: lot of her beliefs about sickness and stuff are very

1253
01:10:01,360 --> 01:10:03,920
Speaker 1: much in line with that. And it's this like it's

1254
01:10:04,000 --> 01:10:07,599
Speaker 1: this new Age positive thinking bullshit, a lot of which

1255
01:10:07,680 --> 01:10:11,000
Speaker 1: is directly descended from theosophy, which is also one of

1256
01:10:11,080 --> 01:10:14,240
Speaker 1: the root movements of the Nazi movement. And it doesn't

1257
01:10:14,320 --> 01:10:17,000
Speaker 1: mean that like if you're into New Age ship, you're

1258
01:10:17,000 --> 01:10:20,639
Speaker 1: a Nazi, obviously, but it does mean that, like similar

1259
01:10:20,760 --> 01:10:24,920
Speaker 1: patterns of thought can lead to both things. And like,

1260
01:10:25,080 --> 01:10:26,960
Speaker 1: one of the things I found that was really interesting

1261
01:10:27,000 --> 01:10:28,479
Speaker 1: to me while I was doing this research was just

1262
01:10:28,560 --> 01:10:31,000
Speaker 1: like a Twitter post Marian Williamson said where she noted

1263
01:10:31,040 --> 01:10:33,639
Speaker 1: that like, oh, people on the left or way meaner

1264
01:10:33,680 --> 01:10:35,559
Speaker 1: than me than people on the right. Like everybody talks

1265
01:10:35,560 --> 01:10:37,000
Speaker 1: about how me and the right is, but the left

1266
01:10:37,040 --> 01:10:38,720
Speaker 1: has been really like those are the ones who've been

1267
01:10:38,720 --> 01:10:40,920
Speaker 1: the meanest to me. And somebody quoted and said, I

1268
01:10:40,960 --> 01:10:43,720
Speaker 1: think one of the scary things about American politics in

1269
01:10:43,760 --> 01:10:45,840
Speaker 1: the next few years is that people don't realize how

1270
01:10:45,960 --> 01:10:49,120
Speaker 1: easy it is for folks with kind of kookie new

1271
01:10:49,240 --> 01:10:52,840
Speaker 1: age left wing views to turn hard right. Um, I

1272
01:10:53,000 --> 01:10:54,800
Speaker 1: knew and not like it was a journalis talking about

1273
01:10:54,800 --> 01:10:56,840
Speaker 1: Like I talked to a Nazi militia leader once who

1274
01:10:56,880 --> 01:11:00,320
Speaker 1: sent his kids to a Waldorf school because he leaved

1275
01:11:00,360 --> 01:11:02,280
Speaker 1: in a lot of the same wooey bullshit, Like there's

1276
01:11:02,280 --> 01:11:05,439
Speaker 1: a certain level of like if you get into some

1277
01:11:05,520 --> 01:11:10,640
Speaker 1: of these weird esoteric beliefs, other esoteric belief systems like Nazism,

1278
01:11:10,760 --> 01:11:12,560
Speaker 1: are going to be more enticing into you than just

1279
01:11:12,760 --> 01:11:16,840
Speaker 1: embracing like the world's like like let's not believe this

1280
01:11:17,040 --> 01:11:20,800
Speaker 1: kind of bullshit, Like you'll be more ext like fixed problems. Yeah,

1281
01:11:20,960 --> 01:11:23,519
Speaker 1: if you get you'll be more accepted. If you get cookie,

1282
01:11:23,560 --> 01:11:26,680
Speaker 1: you're gonna want to hang out with kuks And um,

1283
01:11:27,840 --> 01:11:30,880
Speaker 1: only cooks are gonna are gonna tolerate you or or

1284
01:11:31,000 --> 01:11:33,920
Speaker 1: respect you because you are talking ship and you make

1285
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:38,280
Speaker 1: no sense. I mean, she has no business, um speculating

1286
01:11:38,320 --> 01:11:40,960
Speaker 1: about the causes of diseases. She's not a doctor, She's

1287
01:11:41,080 --> 01:11:43,679
Speaker 1: a person who comes from a background of geodesic domes

1288
01:11:43,680 --> 01:11:47,200
Speaker 1: and bad boys and good dope and uh and you know,

1289
01:11:47,760 --> 01:11:50,120
Speaker 1: I hate the expressions day in your lane. But to

1290
01:11:50,200 --> 01:11:53,920
Speaker 1: an expect to it is it's a matter of you're

1291
01:11:54,000 --> 01:11:56,840
Speaker 1: talking out of your ass, and people who are also

1292
01:11:56,960 --> 01:11:59,360
Speaker 1: talking out of their asses will be a lot nicer

1293
01:11:59,439 --> 01:12:02,400
Speaker 1: to you than other people who are like realistic and

1294
01:12:02,560 --> 01:12:05,800
Speaker 1: saying you don't know what you're talking about. Stop talking

1295
01:12:05,840 --> 01:12:09,240
Speaker 1: about diseases and causes of diseases. You don't know what

1296
01:12:09,360 --> 01:12:12,680
Speaker 1: the funk you are saying? Pure, you know, And then oh,

1297
01:12:12,800 --> 01:12:15,559
Speaker 1: but these other people are much nicer to me because, um,

1298
01:12:15,840 --> 01:12:19,640
Speaker 1: because they're insane, that's why. Yeah. And it's it's like

1299
01:12:19,800 --> 01:12:21,160
Speaker 1: you find like a lot of the ship that like

1300
01:12:21,320 --> 01:12:23,320
Speaker 1: was at the core of biodynamism is also at the

1301
01:12:23,400 --> 01:12:25,680
Speaker 1: core of like what Williamson says about health care. She

1302
01:12:25,760 --> 01:12:28,320
Speaker 1: said this recently in Detroit while she was like campaigning

1303
01:12:28,360 --> 01:12:31,880
Speaker 1: for president and talking about like reforming the health care system.

1304
01:12:32,040 --> 01:12:33,680
Speaker 1: We need to be the party talking about why so

1305
01:12:33,760 --> 01:12:36,080
Speaker 1: many of our chemical policies and our food policies, and

1306
01:12:36,080 --> 01:12:38,800
Speaker 1: our agricultural policies and our environmental policies and even our

1307
01:12:38,840 --> 01:12:42,719
Speaker 1: economic policies are leading to people getting sick to begin with, which, again,

1308
01:12:43,200 --> 01:12:45,320
Speaker 1: you can interpret that in a reasonable way, or you

1309
01:12:45,360 --> 01:12:48,080
Speaker 1: can interpret it in a Stinerian way where it's like, oh,

1310
01:12:48,200 --> 01:12:52,360
Speaker 1: that could lead to some really fucking uncomfortable conclusions about

1311
01:12:52,479 --> 01:12:55,680
Speaker 1: the world. Um. She said, ship like people who want

1312
01:12:55,680 --> 01:12:58,200
Speaker 1: to avoid the swine flu should pour God's love on

1313
01:12:58,280 --> 01:13:02,720
Speaker 1: their immune systems. Um Like she said, shit about vaccines.

1314
01:13:02,840 --> 01:13:06,759
Speaker 1: That's really unsettling. Um. And you know, obviously, like Steiner

1315
01:13:06,920 --> 01:13:08,800
Speaker 1: was an anti vaccine guy, and so are a lot

1316
01:13:08,840 --> 01:13:10,760
Speaker 1: of Nazis. And it's one of those things. There's a

1317
01:13:10,800 --> 01:13:12,880
Speaker 1: lot of very far left people who are very anti

1318
01:13:12,960 --> 01:13:15,160
Speaker 1: vaccine and a lot of Nazis who are anti vaccine.

1319
01:13:15,600 --> 01:13:17,720
Speaker 1: And one of the things that's scary to me is

1320
01:13:17,760 --> 01:13:19,680
Speaker 1: that if you push a lot of those far left

1321
01:13:19,680 --> 01:13:23,200
Speaker 1: anti vax people, they won't drop being anti vax and

1322
01:13:23,280 --> 01:13:26,280
Speaker 1: stay left wing. They'll just go over to the Nazis. Like,

1323
01:13:26,439 --> 01:13:28,280
Speaker 1: not all of them, but a decent amount of them.

1324
01:13:28,400 --> 01:13:32,439
Speaker 1: It happens. Yeah, I feel like I feel like, um

1325
01:13:32,840 --> 01:13:36,680
Speaker 1: um uh. People need to uh tell more people who

1326
01:13:36,760 --> 01:13:39,360
Speaker 1: are talking about stuff that they don't know anything about

1327
01:13:39,400 --> 01:13:43,760
Speaker 1: to shut the funk up. Yeah, and and when somebody who, yeah,

1328
01:13:43,800 --> 01:13:46,320
Speaker 1: when somebody who. I mean, it's narcissism. All all it

1329
01:13:46,439 --> 01:13:48,840
Speaker 1: is is narcissism. It's just narcissism makes you think you're

1330
01:13:48,840 --> 01:13:52,519
Speaker 1: an expert on fucking everything and and want someone. It's

1331
01:13:52,520 --> 01:13:55,760
Speaker 1: just annoying to me. Those are so many good people

1332
01:13:55,800 --> 01:13:59,040
Speaker 1: who don't aren't aren't, just aren't blabbing what is I

1333
01:13:59,160 --> 01:14:01,400
Speaker 1: forget what anchor it was said this, but like the

1334
01:14:01,680 --> 01:14:04,640
Speaker 1: greatest problem in the world is that fools are so

1335
01:14:04,840 --> 01:14:08,200
Speaker 1: confident and wise men are so full of doubt. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

1336
01:14:08,360 --> 01:14:12,160
Speaker 1: it's it's trying to get this whole episode. Yeah, be

1337
01:14:13,160 --> 01:14:16,479
Speaker 1: be really fucking careful about anybody. And this is one

1338
01:14:16,520 --> 01:14:19,080
Speaker 1: of the problems, the fundamental problems with having a president

1339
01:14:19,240 --> 01:14:20,760
Speaker 1: is that then you have this person who has to

1340
01:14:20,800 --> 01:14:24,799
Speaker 1: pretend like they are competent about everything from nuclear policy

1341
01:14:24,880 --> 01:14:28,519
Speaker 1: to energy policy, to climate change, to international policy, to

1342
01:14:28,760 --> 01:14:32,479
Speaker 1: national defense to military intervention. There's not a single human

1343
01:14:32,520 --> 01:14:34,280
Speaker 1: being on the face of this earth, and there never

1344
01:14:34,400 --> 01:14:37,120
Speaker 1: will be who is competent on all those things. Not one,

1345
01:14:37,479 --> 01:14:40,360
Speaker 1: never will be, never will happen never ever ever ever ever.

1346
01:14:40,840 --> 01:14:42,920
Speaker 1: But because of our system, they all have to be

1347
01:14:42,960 --> 01:14:44,640
Speaker 1: able to bullsh it at being good at all that,

1348
01:14:44,800 --> 01:14:48,839
Speaker 1: even though at best the best of them are competent

1349
01:14:48,920 --> 01:14:54,360
Speaker 1: at like two or three of those things. I mean, yeah,

1350
01:14:54,560 --> 01:14:57,599
Speaker 1: the yeah, and and once you get into the world

1351
01:14:57,680 --> 01:15:00,400
Speaker 1: of like, oh, I know about diseases even though I

1352
01:15:00,479 --> 01:15:03,880
Speaker 1: don't have any background in science, then next thing, you know,

1353
01:15:04,040 --> 01:15:08,320
Speaker 1: your best friends are gonna be uh uh people who

1354
01:15:08,360 --> 01:15:10,880
Speaker 1: don't believe in climate change because they think it's uh

1355
01:15:11,320 --> 01:15:14,439
Speaker 1: you know, some people who have expert opinions on things

1356
01:15:14,520 --> 01:15:19,240
Speaker 1: that they know nothing about. Yep. Fuck then and fuck

1357
01:15:19,320 --> 01:15:23,599
Speaker 1: Rudolph whatever Steiner, Rudolph Steiner. So in conclusion for today,

1358
01:15:23,880 --> 01:15:28,880
Speaker 1: fuck Rudolph Steiner, country dancer, and uh, farms are bad?

1359
01:15:29,080 --> 01:15:30,880
Speaker 1: May that might not be the lesson to take out

1360
01:15:30,920 --> 01:15:37,160
Speaker 1: of this uh uh fuck Rudolph Steiner. Man, he's you know,

1361
01:15:39,360 --> 01:15:41,960
Speaker 1: I don't know what to say. Yeah, it's just a

1362
01:15:42,080 --> 01:15:45,240
Speaker 1: wild story. It's almost hard because it's like, obviously there

1363
01:15:45,280 --> 01:15:49,320
Speaker 1: are actually very important aspects of like organic farming, and

1364
01:15:49,439 --> 01:15:52,439
Speaker 1: some of the ideas even in biodynamic farming, like about

1365
01:15:52,520 --> 01:15:54,880
Speaker 1: like that are critical, like like we're having a major

1366
01:15:54,960 --> 01:15:57,160
Speaker 1: problem now with like our top soil is being eroded

1367
01:15:57,240 --> 01:16:00,640
Speaker 1: and there's like certainly aspects of organic farming and biodynamic

1368
01:16:00,720 --> 01:16:03,160
Speaker 1: farming that are better for the top soiled than a

1369
01:16:03,240 --> 01:16:05,960
Speaker 1: lot of the industrial ship we're doing. That's absolutely a

1370
01:16:06,040 --> 01:16:09,880
Speaker 1: fair point. He wasn't wrong about everything. He just talked

1371
01:16:09,960 --> 01:16:14,320
Speaker 1: about everything, so he was mostly wrong like that Steiner

1372
01:16:14,360 --> 01:16:17,639
Speaker 1: in a nutshell. Yeah, I wonder if Jefferson's a farmer.

1373
01:16:18,840 --> 01:16:21,120
Speaker 1: I don't know. I wonder if Jennifer Aniston was just

1374
01:16:21,160 --> 01:16:22,719
Speaker 1: like I just thought it was a school about acting,

1375
01:16:22,880 --> 01:16:25,240
Speaker 1: Like I just learned how to be an actress. Yeah,

1376
01:16:25,320 --> 01:16:28,720
Speaker 1: that's right. Uh, these these kids, I uh, you know,

1377
01:16:28,840 --> 01:16:31,280
Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know. I I think that. Um,

1378
01:16:32,560 --> 01:16:34,599
Speaker 1: I have no idea. I'm trying to think of something

1379
01:16:34,680 --> 01:16:37,080
Speaker 1: to say, and I can't think of anything. I mean,

1380
01:16:37,240 --> 01:16:39,920
Speaker 1: I guess. In order to determine whether or not Steiner's

1381
01:16:39,960 --> 01:16:42,560
Speaker 1: influence was on balance bad or good, you have to

1382
01:16:42,640 --> 01:16:46,960
Speaker 1: weigh on one hand slave farms, on concentration camps, and

1383
01:16:47,040 --> 01:16:50,240
Speaker 1: on another hand Rutger Howard's Tears in the Rain speech

1384
01:16:50,280 --> 01:16:52,680
Speaker 1: from the end of Blade Runner, and really, who's to

1385
01:16:52,760 --> 01:16:58,320
Speaker 1: say which is worth more? Uh, concentration camps it was bad,

1386
01:17:01,000 --> 01:17:04,840
Speaker 1: oh boy, good times. How do you wrap it up? Usually?

1387
01:17:04,880 --> 01:17:06,400
Speaker 1: Do you wrap it up with a with a grand

1388
01:17:06,439 --> 01:17:08,400
Speaker 1: statement about the history, or is it just sort of

1389
01:17:08,520 --> 01:17:13,360
Speaker 1: like a public service. I don't trust grand statements. If

1390
01:17:13,360 --> 01:17:15,439
Speaker 1: I were to come out with some like conclusive, simple

1391
01:17:15,520 --> 01:17:18,720
Speaker 1: one sentence summary of like what actually is worth understanding

1392
01:17:18,760 --> 01:17:21,920
Speaker 1: in this, that would be me oversimplifying things to the

1393
01:17:21,960 --> 01:17:24,240
Speaker 1: point of inaccuracy, just like all of these grifters I

1394
01:17:24,320 --> 01:17:25,920
Speaker 1: talk about do. I'm not going to try to do it.

1395
01:17:26,000 --> 01:17:31,000
Speaker 1: It's fucking complex context, it's information. It's really I tend

1396
01:17:31,040 --> 01:17:34,360
Speaker 1: to want I tend to want narratives with endings and things,

1397
01:17:34,439 --> 01:17:36,320
Speaker 1: but this is sort of seems like one of those

1398
01:17:36,360 --> 01:17:38,680
Speaker 1: things where it's like you're just it's good to know

1399
01:17:38,880 --> 01:17:41,320
Speaker 1: these things, and they give you the ability to keep

1400
01:17:41,360 --> 01:17:45,360
Speaker 1: an eye on on warning signs and and sort of

1401
01:17:45,560 --> 01:17:51,679
Speaker 1: problematic little things about yeah, there's an organic farmer because

1402
01:17:51,720 --> 01:17:54,679
Speaker 1: he might be getting a little too weird. If there's

1403
01:17:54,720 --> 01:17:57,719
Speaker 1: a single sentence summary I can give this that isn't

1404
01:17:58,080 --> 01:18:02,360
Speaker 1: entirely inaccurate or two to succinct to be valuable, it

1405
01:18:02,360 --> 01:18:07,559
Speaker 1: would be don't trust anyone who talks with expertise about everything,

1406
01:18:07,880 --> 01:18:11,080
Speaker 1: because no one's an expert on everything. Uh, and sometimes

1407
01:18:11,160 --> 01:18:14,519
Speaker 1: that includes me. Definitely don't trust me. I'm I'm a

1408
01:18:14,680 --> 01:18:17,760
Speaker 1: I'm a terrible person. And that's the note that we

1409
01:18:17,800 --> 01:18:20,280
Speaker 1: should end on. You want to plug your plug. Thank

1410
01:18:20,360 --> 01:18:23,200
Speaker 1: you Robert so much. I really really enjoyed being on

1411
01:18:23,320 --> 01:18:26,320
Speaker 1: your show, and I'm I'm deeply impressed with with your

1412
01:18:26,400 --> 01:18:29,680
Speaker 1: research and writing and uh and uh, I would love

1413
01:18:29,720 --> 01:18:31,519
Speaker 1: to come back on again. And in the meantime, you

1414
01:18:31,600 --> 01:18:33,880
Speaker 1: can find me on at the Crofton Show or I

1415
01:18:33,960 --> 01:18:37,080
Speaker 1: talk about uh complete nonsense, so you don't have to

1416
01:18:37,120 --> 01:18:39,400
Speaker 1: worry about me being an expert on anything on there.

1417
01:18:39,600 --> 01:18:43,559
Speaker 1: And um my advice column which is equally uh uh,

1418
01:18:44,520 --> 01:18:47,000
Speaker 1: I mean it's sometimes it's serious, sometimes it's not serious,

1419
01:18:47,000 --> 01:18:49,320
Speaker 1: but it's called the Advice King. And you can listen

1420
01:18:49,360 --> 01:18:52,760
Speaker 1: to my album Hello It's Me on Spotify and everywhere

1421
01:18:52,880 --> 01:18:55,760
Speaker 1: and uh uh Pitchfork gave it a seven point four.

1422
01:18:55,920 --> 01:19:00,720
Speaker 1: So go listen to my Pitchfork approved album, Hello It's Me,

1423
01:19:01,280 --> 01:19:03,960
Speaker 1: and go buy a Pitchfork along with some bolt cutters

1424
01:19:04,040 --> 01:19:07,040
Speaker 1: to get ready for the upcoming civil unrest. That's that's

1425
01:19:07,120 --> 01:19:10,840
Speaker 1: my plug. Um, I am Robert Evans. You can find

1426
01:19:10,920 --> 01:19:12,920
Speaker 1: me on well, you can find the sources for this

1427
01:19:13,000 --> 01:19:15,439
Speaker 1: website on Behind the Bastards dot com. I do want

1428
01:19:15,439 --> 01:19:17,639
Speaker 1: to give a special shout out to Peter stouten Meyer,

1429
01:19:17,720 --> 01:19:21,040
Speaker 1: who has done a whole funkload of the left eide

1430
01:19:21,040 --> 01:19:23,519
Speaker 1: with his own research. So thank you, Professor stotten Meyer.

1431
01:19:23,560 --> 01:19:26,920
Speaker 1: I hope I pronounced your name not wrong. Um. You

1432
01:19:27,000 --> 01:19:29,280
Speaker 1: can also find us on Instagram and Twitter at at

1433
01:19:29,320 --> 01:19:32,200
Speaker 1: Bastards pod. Uh. You can find me on Twitter at

1434
01:19:32,280 --> 01:19:34,760
Speaker 1: I right. Okay. You can buy T shirts at t

1435
01:19:34,920 --> 01:19:37,000
Speaker 1: public dot com. If you want T shirts that have

1436
01:19:37,080 --> 01:19:40,360
Speaker 1: anything to do with this podcast, you should look up

1437
01:19:40,400 --> 01:19:44,400
Speaker 1: Behind the Bastards on t public dot com. And that

1438
01:19:44,920 --> 01:19:49,160
Speaker 1: is it. That's the episode. Go fucking hug a cat

1439
01:19:49,439 --> 01:19:54,800
Speaker 1: and punch of Dancer. Thanks Robert. Okay, Sophie, should we

1440
01:19:54,880 --> 01:19:59,519
Speaker 1: be advising people to assault random dancers? Okay, well, the

1441
01:19:59,600 --> 01:20:03,600
Speaker 1: episode is over. Coolm