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Speaker 1: Glory Adam, host of Well Read Black Girl. Oh. Each
Speaker 1: week we journey together through the cultural moment where art,
Speaker 1: culture and literature collide and pay homage to the women
Speaker 1: whose books we grew up reading. It's the literary kickback.
Speaker 1: You never knew you needed. Listen to a well read
Speaker 1: black girl on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Kate Flannery
Speaker 1: and I played Meredith Palmer on the Office. Hello everyone,
Speaker 1: and welcome to the Office. Deep dive with me. That's right,
Speaker 1: your host Brian bam Gartner. On today's show, we have
Speaker 1: the incredible Kate Flannery. As you just heard now. I
Speaker 1: have always felt a special bond with Kate because I
Speaker 1: think more than anyone else in the cast, Kate and
Speaker 1: I we put our bodies on the line for the show.
Speaker 1: I mean just in terms of pure physical comedy and
Speaker 1: like shameless personal humiliation. I think Kate and I deserve
Speaker 1: medals for bravery and maybe Kate most of all, she
Speaker 1: was just completely fearless and she was always up for
Speaker 1: anything she was asked to do. In fact, the last
Speaker 1: time I saw Kate before we sat down for this conversation,
Speaker 1: I went to see Kate uh in a taping for
Speaker 1: Dancing with the Stars that Kate was a contestant on,
Speaker 1: and she asked me to come see her perform, and
Speaker 1: I went, and let me be honest, it's kind of
Speaker 1: a weird experience. You're in this giant warehouse. There are
Speaker 1: assistants moving around everywhere, there's applause signs telling you when
Speaker 1: to laugh. And went to clap, and went to stand,
Speaker 1: and went to sit and and then all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: the music starts and Kate literally descends from the ceiling
Speaker 1: because she's doing this Mary Poppins number. She's Mary Poppins.
Speaker 1: And I see her start descending and I immediately start crying.
Speaker 1: I'm I am overcome with emotion because the fearlessness, and
Speaker 1: let's be honest, I'm not We're not spring chickens. And
Speaker 1: she had total commitment and she was dancing her heart out.
Speaker 1: But that's Kate anyway. I did not cry in this interview,
Speaker 1: but we did talk about how Kate had to flash
Speaker 1: her boobs a lot on the show, so that was
Speaker 1: the thing we didn't We didn't cry, but we talked
Speaker 1: about boobs. How's that for a setup? Without any more
Speaker 1: blabbering from me, here is the woman who bared it
Speaker 1: all for your entertainment, Kate Flannery. Bubble and Squeak, I
Speaker 1: love it, Bubble and squeak on Bubble and Squeaker cookie,
Speaker 1: every moment left over from the nut before. Well, well,
Speaker 1: I'm good, How are you good? How's it going? Oh
Speaker 1: my gosh, awesome. They be blocked in a box. They
Speaker 1: have been locked in a box. This is not our
Speaker 1: regular studio. Yes, this I thought was construction, but apparently
Speaker 1: it's a folly. Are you gonna make folly sounds? I'm
Speaker 1: gonna just start running on the grass. You can recreate
Speaker 1: the fire dress, Steven right, exactly. Um, you can throw
Speaker 1: your code on the thing unless you're cold. What's up
Speaker 1: to you? Is she fine? Here on the mic? Can
Speaker 1: I talk about people behind their back? On this? Can
Speaker 1: I curse? You can say whatever you want? Um? So
Speaker 1: now I know some of this. But two thousand four
Speaker 1: what Well, first of all, what was your training exactly? Like?
Speaker 1: What were you doing work wise before the office? Well?
Speaker 1: I was in Chicago right after college. I studied theater
Speaker 1: in Philadelphia and Virginia for a couple of years, and
Speaker 1: then I um graduated from the University aunts in phillip
Speaker 1: and then my aunt sent me a ticket to check
Speaker 1: out Chicago and Second City because she thought it would
Speaker 1: be a good fit. So I studied a Second City
Speaker 1: and then I got hired by the touring company, so
Speaker 1: I knew Steve. Steve was in one of the resident
Speaker 1: companies when I was touring. UM. But then I moved
Speaker 1: to New York. I didn't a year long tour of
Speaker 1: the real life Brady Bunch a few years later, and
Speaker 1: then moved to New York for six months. And then
Speaker 1: I got asked to do the show Valley the Dolls
Speaker 1: in l a uh, and then I was here for
Speaker 1: about a year and then came close to a few
Speaker 1: different shows. I was like up for the Data Carvey Show,
Speaker 1: which obviously Steve Coral and Steve Colbert got I tested
Speaker 1: for it, came close, um, and then UM the show
Speaker 1: I was doing off Broadway, So I went to New York.
Speaker 1: So I was in New York for three years. Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm old five years. So you were in Chicago in
Speaker 1: and around Second City for five years, then went back
Speaker 1: to New York, then l a then back to New
Speaker 1: York for three years. And then when did you come
Speaker 1: back to l a uh. I moved back because I
Speaker 1: got a new manager and I was basically like waiting
Speaker 1: tables and then started to do my comedy act, The Lampshades,
Speaker 1: And was you know, just like doing some guest star stuff.
Speaker 1: I did Bernie Mac. I guess Creed was in the
Speaker 1: same episode that I did a Bernie Mack. Yeah, he
Speaker 1: didn't have any lines. He was just like a doctor
Speaker 1: in the background or something. I was so funny. And
Speaker 1: then um, I booked a recurring gig on Boomtown and
Speaker 1: my second episode we were about to shoot and they
Speaker 1: said that the show got canceled. So that was that,
Speaker 1: And then I was I had auditioned for the pilot
Speaker 1: of the Office. I was up for the part of Jan.
Speaker 1: I read for the part of Jan, did not get it.
Speaker 1: Obviously they want a completely different way. But Allison Jones
Speaker 1: said that I think this show is good for you,
Speaker 1: which was awesome. And then I just remember, like doing
Speaker 1: my comedy act like Lampshades, that we were We were
Speaker 1: supposed to do so many things that like kind of
Speaker 1: fell through. We were supposed to be on Mad TV
Speaker 1: for four episodes, and I'm like they canceled when it
Speaker 1: was a whole lot of almost And then I remember
Speaker 1: getting a call that they were trying to fill a
Speaker 1: spot after they shot the pilot in August. You guys
Speaker 1: shot in February and in August, I got the call
Speaker 1: to go in and read for Allison Jones. And then
Speaker 1: by the time I got home from that I found
Speaker 1: out I got the job becase I didn't have a
Speaker 1: cell phone side away for my landline to get the message. Okay,
Speaker 1: so wait, so you read for jan I did not know.
Speaker 1: Yeah I did, but there would be too much sexual
Speaker 1: chemistry between me and seven if I got that part.
Speaker 1: She said she thought she still thought it would be
Speaker 1: a good like I love. That's why I love about Allison.
Speaker 1: It's like she remembers things. So I somehow registered, you know,
Speaker 1: And I remember going to the next audition for what
Speaker 1: became Meredith. I don't she was called Meredith at the audition,
Speaker 1: but I remember they said no makeup, like really no makeup.
Speaker 1: Usually when they say no makeup, it's like lip gloss
Speaker 1: and sebascara, and Alison was like really no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: take it off, take it off, take off the lashes. Now,
Speaker 1: I would wasn't very much, but yeah, interesting. Yeah, So
Speaker 1: then you so you came back and at the time
Speaker 1: you're do you remember what the what the description was
Speaker 1: of the character just said she was lactose intolerant, divorced
Speaker 1: and had to Hys directed me go great light chill right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you knew who did you know? I knew Angela
Speaker 1: because we were in an improv group in all chickenprov
Speaker 1: group called Bitch Planet in two thousand in l A.
Speaker 1: And I knew Steve because I knew him from from
Speaker 1: Second City and also he did the first few months
Speaker 1: of the Really Brady Bunch. He was the first Greg
Speaker 1: Brady when we used to do that crazy show. Yeah, yeah, crazy,
Speaker 1: but there was so much sexual chemistry between me and
Speaker 1: See that we could I'm just kidding, sorry, I mean
Speaker 1: he you definitely showed your boobs to him a lot. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1: The first time we shot that Christmas episode, he said,
Speaker 1: I'm not looking at them. I'm just gonna stay at
Speaker 1: your clavical I was like, I think, I mean, should
Speaker 1: I be insulted by I might? Should I feel? But
Speaker 1: I don't know what to do. He was such a
Speaker 1: gentleman though really I knew he was my best interest
Speaker 1: at heart to the end. I um I have said
Speaker 1: many times in terms of just pure comedy and the
Speaker 1: direction with McDougall, and like everything that moment with you
Speaker 1: at the end might be one of my favorite moments,
Speaker 1: oh my god, of no of the of the whole series,
Speaker 1: because he's so well directed too, and it's so like
Speaker 1: just the way that it played, it was such a subtle,
Speaker 1: unexpected crazy so unexpected, and you have that like that
Speaker 1: like gas band of like oh my gosh. And then
Speaker 1: him just the look on his face and picking up
Speaker 1: that camera and taking a picture just is so perfect.
Speaker 1: And even the moment after we were like he's you know,
Speaker 1: he's not going to do anything, Like he's like, he's done.
Speaker 1: That was it. That's all he wanted was a picture,
Speaker 1: which is so fantastic because I feel like so many
Speaker 1: other actors would have played that differently, and Steve had
Speaker 1: such economy and such brilliant I I mean, I'm sure
Speaker 1: you remember this, but I feel like every every you
Speaker 1: never knew exactly what he was going to do, and
Speaker 1: he could do five different, six different things in different takes,
Speaker 1: completely different with the same words, with the same dialect,
Speaker 1: and just be like, make these really amazing, subtle, strong choices,
Speaker 1: crazy great. I felt like I was watching someone who thought,
Speaker 1: I have to make the people in here laugh, Like
Speaker 1: that's what I'm gonna do. And if we rehearse it,
Speaker 1: and we do this, and we do that, like then
Speaker 1: everyone's gonna expect exactly. Yes, so great at that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's that's so well put. Yeah, he definitely had a plan.
Speaker 1: He definitely had many, many ideas all the time. Oh
Speaker 1: my god, I'm such a deadbeat as an actor, I think.
Speaker 1: But I think he's really one of those rare gems.
Speaker 1: And you know, it's just shocking that he didn't want
Speaker 1: an Emmy for that role. Yeah, it's a trapsty but
Speaker 1: he's he's not a politician. He's never been, never been so,
Speaker 1: and I think some of its politics, which is Um,
Speaker 1: so you come back in and you are now reading
Speaker 1: for Meredith or unnamed mis directed me character, and um,
Speaker 1: did they show you the pilot? Did you see the pilot?
Speaker 1: I saw the pilot later I saw the pilot. Uh yeah,
Speaker 1: after you were cast. Yes, okay, did you have any
Speaker 1: specific thoughts about it? Well, I was nervous, said it
Speaker 1: was exactly like the British pilot. I think everybody was nervous.
Speaker 1: But I still thought it was funny. And I thought
Speaker 1: what they added that was American was really funny. What's ah,
Speaker 1: what's a you know? And I thought everyone was much
Speaker 1: more understandable than the British. I'm one of those people
Speaker 1: that watch is the British Office with subtitles because I
Speaker 1: want to get it all. Is that terrible? No, it's
Speaker 1: not terrible. When I walked through life with you, I
Speaker 1: need subtitles too. But you're just like Philly, Pennsylvania. I
Speaker 1: hard to understand. Sorry. Um So I heard that Greg
Speaker 1: made a conscious decision to stay as close to the
Speaker 1: British pilot because he thought if he did, the network
Speaker 1: couldn't give Oh wow, brilliant, brilliant. It makes so much sense.
Speaker 1: And I remember my brother Chris Hasten, who I met
Speaker 1: on the show. He's a still photographer for NBC. He
Speaker 1: was shooting the pilot Gal and he was told if
Speaker 1: anybody looks at the camera except for Steve, that's it.
Speaker 1: We're done. Like Greg really wanted to look documentary. And
Speaker 1: and Chris said there were so many specific instructions because
Speaker 1: Greg was so uh protective of making sure to get
Speaker 1: this absolutely rights. Thank god. Interesting. So even in the
Speaker 1: PR shoots, Chris the photographer was directed, yes, which is
Speaker 1: never the case, I mean very rarely. There might be
Speaker 1: a note or two, but nothing, nothing, that's intense. And
Speaker 1: Greg was like just you know, very stressed, stressed out
Speaker 1: about it. He just wanted to be absolutely right, Thank goodness.
Speaker 1: Do you feel like, um, you had any specific hurdles
Speaker 1: or anything you had to overcome specifically because you weren't
Speaker 1: on the pilot. Well, I wasn't sure if I was
Speaker 1: coming back every week. I wasn't sure. I remember talking
Speaker 1: to Phillis about it. She goes, I think you might.
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, because I definitely felt like I was
Speaker 1: getting stories, um because I I'm allowed to say that
Speaker 1: I replaced somebody from the pilot. So I was getting
Speaker 1: stories at like you know, uh, they're gonna see you know,
Speaker 1: if if this is actually even a place like maybe
Speaker 1: it's you know, maybe this character won't even exists. I
Speaker 1: don't even know. So there was pressure definitely, but you know,
Speaker 1: I was like, okay, we'll see. I mean, everybody's nice.
Speaker 1: This is and they told I don't remember this. They
Speaker 1: told us to bring paperwork, which so the first season
Speaker 1: we literally sat at our desks because they wanted us
Speaker 1: to really be busy doing real what looked like real
Speaker 1: office work. I thought that was so brilliant. Yeah, do
Speaker 1: you think that that did anything to help create the ensemble.
Speaker 1: I do because I feel like everyone had a focus immediately.
Speaker 1: You weren't like looking for someone to throw you the ball,
Speaker 1: and if you did get the ball, you were busy
Speaker 1: doing your work, Like that's what people doing a documentary.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's so it must be so uncomfortable for
Speaker 1: somebody in a regular scrant Pennsylvania office to have a
Speaker 1: camera around, Like that's not a comfort zone. There's nothing
Speaker 1: comfortable about that. So I love that that was part
Speaker 1: of the mix. And then we had this weird medical
Speaker 1: paperwork that was like they bought, the prop department bought.
Speaker 1: So I remember creating these like weird little patterns of
Speaker 1: stapling things and like, and I remember Jenna and I
Speaker 1: had a whole dance where we would have these weird
Speaker 1: clearance papers that we would sign for each other. It
Speaker 1: was so bizarre, but it was fantastic, right, right, No
Speaker 1: one's talked about that before, but yeah, Like our prop
Speaker 1: papers were essentially old expired medical documents from people's procedures,
Speaker 1: like a bunch of the ton of them. They lasted
Speaker 1: for years. Yes, And I remember doing the same thing, like, okay,
Speaker 1: and I would pull pieces of paper that looked more
Speaker 1: like Excel like like that. So like so like if
Speaker 1: I had a whole thing that was mostly writing, I
Speaker 1: was like, wow, this doesn't really look right, right, Like
Speaker 1: I need something that looks like numbers, and then you
Speaker 1: would look and it would be like red blood cell
Speaker 1: counter numbers for Jason Alexander. Wow, Jason's okay, though, everybody,
Speaker 1: it's okay. Yeah. It was a bizarre This is so
Speaker 1: pre internet recycling. There you go, all right, we were
Speaker 1: doing some greenwork. You're hilarious recycling. This is true repurposing,
Speaker 1: repurposing a paper company office needs paper, ladies and gentlemen.
Speaker 1: We were not destrowing trees for this charge and show.
Speaker 1: That's hilarious. And of course you know Ken koppas directing
Speaker 1: like go ahead, you never say action, go ahead. Loved
Speaker 1: him just understanding that, like you're not just suddenly turning
Speaker 1: on your already in You're already in it. You're you're working,
Speaker 1: so just continue, go ahead. It's perfect. It's like the
Speaker 1: perfect direction. We talked to him about that some too. Yeah,
Speaker 1: bringing us in early and having that thirty minutes of
Speaker 1: like worktime and having us all there together in that
Speaker 1: room doing BS paperwork and quiet, and that's very quiet,
Speaker 1: so quiet painful sometimes yes, and then you would just
Speaker 1: hear like John or Leslie or Phyllis, pretend to be honest. Sure, sure.
Speaker 1: And I also remember during the healthcare episode that was
Speaker 1: the first time I improvised. And the whole thing about
Speaker 1: the uters is different from a vagina. I still have
Speaker 1: a vagina. Remember Gregg telling me I run in him.
Speaker 1: I was still waiting tables during the first season, and
Speaker 1: I would see some people from the show at my
Speaker 1: restaurant and I would see Ken Kappas sometimes and then
Speaker 1: I saw Greg and I wasn't waiting on it, but
Speaker 1: he had talked to you. I love that he like
Speaker 1: completely ignored that I was wearing a uniforms fantastic. I'm
Speaker 1: fighting with the network about vagina. I just really want
Speaker 1: to keep it in. I'm really hoping it works out.
Speaker 1: And I was like, yeah, I mean, like he just can't.
Speaker 1: He came up to you. So you're working at Cape
Speaker 1: Manolini still, which is Beverly Hills fancy restaurant. Every famous
Speaker 1: person on the planet came in, So you were there
Speaker 1: through When did you stop? I stopped right before we
Speaker 1: started season two, so literally a couple of weeks. So
Speaker 1: I quit my no I I covered my ships during
Speaker 1: the weekend. The I used to work my Sunday brunch
Speaker 1: and then I because we only shot it was you know,
Speaker 1: after the pilot was just five episodes. So yeah, and
Speaker 1: then and then I remember Amy Hackerling came in with
Speaker 1: their parents, Brian Gordon came. A few people came in,
Speaker 1: and they kind of gave me this look like, oh him, sorry,
Speaker 1: I mean they didn't. They were a little condescending or
Speaker 1: a little too sympathetic. I was like, it's fine, whatever
Speaker 1: on the four year old wags. I know, I get
Speaker 1: up steves the four year old version of the four
Speaker 1: year old wages whatever. I mean, it is what it is,
Speaker 1: you know. And then when Greg came in, he completely
Speaker 1: ignored the fact that I was working. Like I love
Speaker 1: him for that so much. I mean, I'm sure he
Speaker 1: just was like, oh, but we got business to attend to.
Speaker 1: Let's get to it, you know, So we're you still
Speaker 1: working there once the start started airing. Yeah, did you
Speaker 1: have people come up to you? I did some. Actually,
Speaker 1: one time someone asked me. They said, hey, I have
Speaker 1: a question for you. Are you lactose intolerant, and I said, yes,
Speaker 1: thanks for not bringing up my hystery. Activation that was
Speaker 1: like their way of yeah. And then I remember like
Speaker 1: Marty Panzer, who was Bart barry Maneleo's lyricist was Piste,
Speaker 1: because he said, I come on here on Tuesday nights
Speaker 1: and you, uh, you're not here. But everybody, nobody was
Speaker 1: away on me because they're all watching the show. They're
Speaker 1: all up at the bar watching you, and I can't
Speaker 1: get any good service, like whatever, looks like you did it?
Speaker 1: Oh my god, um did you did you think the
Speaker 1: show would be picked up? I wasn't sure. And I
Speaker 1: remember we didn't get invited to the first upfronts, and
Speaker 1: I remember thinking like, okay, well, and I think technically
Speaker 1: we weren't regular until Loose curs Um, but I felt
Speaker 1: like we had a shot. I felt like there was
Speaker 1: some vibe something that just felt different from anything else
Speaker 1: I'd ever been involved with. It was really intense and
Speaker 1: really great and just half unfolded so wonderfully. It was
Speaker 1: like a slow, steady, wonderful rise, which never happens in
Speaker 1: this town. And I know that there had been documentary
Speaker 1: mocumentary movies like Spinal Tap and stuff, but never Never
Speaker 1: a TV show, even some of the mocumentary stuff, Like
Speaker 1: I feel like our show is up with the very best.
Speaker 1: I mean I really feel that way, even all nine seasons.
Speaker 1: Like there's things where you just go yes, Yes. It's
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Speaker 1: get your favorite shows. So the office, you know, I
Speaker 1: want to tell you I have this sort of theory
Speaker 1: that part of the specialness I'm not sure it's a
Speaker 1: word specialness or uniqueness of the ensemble had to do with,
Speaker 1: you know, how attractive we all were, how completely fucking
Speaker 1: sexy we were. But that was new, you know that
Speaker 1: that was a new thing. You know, I mean that
Speaker 1: was definitely a concept, is that we were not supposed
Speaker 1: to be attracted, and I felt like I held that
Speaker 1: mantel pretty well all nine years. I just have to
Speaker 1: say some people ask for a little more makeup. I
Speaker 1: was like, nope, I'm sticking with the game, sticking with it.
Speaker 1: Love it, lived it, living it, love it. And my
Speaker 1: boyfriend used to say, I look better taking out the
Speaker 1: trash and I did on the show, and which is
Speaker 1: fine with me. I'm really it's fine, you know. And
Speaker 1: now I know I'm not looking so good. People go,
Speaker 1: you look exactly like you did on the show, compliment
Speaker 1: and a dig I'll take it all. Um, I you
Speaker 1: know we're in the same um space. But you had
Speaker 1: you and Steve and Angela and Oscar who you were
Speaker 1: great improblems and Rain and I we were doing check
Speaker 1: off right, and then you had b J and and
Speaker 1: Craig doing stand up right. Sure so true, and you
Speaker 1: know I love the way you broke down. And um,
Speaker 1: were you in the Seagull or Three Sisters? When you
Speaker 1: were three sisters? Three sisters? We did Three Sisters together.
Speaker 1: I also did the Seagull. I was at the Seagull
Speaker 1: in college. I think I was in The Three Sisters
Speaker 1: at least twice, once with Rain. Um. But yeah, I
Speaker 1: know it's crazy. That's so, that's so right on. I
Speaker 1: mean truly like I was doing the darkest of darkest Yes,
Speaker 1: And I used to always say that I was in
Speaker 1: a drama. I used to say that to Greg and
Speaker 1: actually he said that to me once he goes, this
Speaker 1: isn't a drama, and I was like, is for me?
Speaker 1: It is like, Um, you are the only person from Pennsylvania. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Zach Woods is too, he's from He's in Bucks County,
Speaker 1: but he came along later. So I was the one
Speaker 1: always bitching to get tasty cakes into the vending machines
Speaker 1: because there's no there really is no vending machine in
Speaker 1: Pennsylvania that does not have tasty cakes. And we eventually did,
Speaker 1: but it was very brief s mission accomplished. They were
Speaker 1: too expensive. I don't know, I'm not sure. Maybe, Um,
Speaker 1: what do you think about setting the show specifically in Scranton, Pennsylvania.
Speaker 1: So goes along with Slough, England, which is this kind
Speaker 1: of forgettable town that had a glory day. But I mean,
Speaker 1: growing up in Philadelphia, Scranton was a joke. So it
Speaker 1: was always the butt of many jokes. I think what
Speaker 1: Greg did was he got very very specific and used
Speaker 1: contradictory ideas that you don't see in television, like there's
Speaker 1: the big dumb guy Kevin, but he's really good at
Speaker 1: basketball and he's a poker savant. But Meredith as well,
Speaker 1: like the ways that she was very specific. Yes, yes,
Speaker 1: and sometimes I didn't always like every one. While I
Speaker 1: remember improvising and feeling like I'm not sure if this
Speaker 1: is gonna work whatever. I felt like season three was
Speaker 1: a little bit of a struggle. I feel like I
Speaker 1: got I mean, or there was a little more trial
Speaker 1: and error or something. And then I feel like once
Speaker 1: we got to season four, once I got hit by
Speaker 1: the car in the fun Run episode, was like We're
Speaker 1: off to the races. But season three, I feel like
Speaker 1: I was particularly cut out a lot, and I felt
Speaker 1: like some of it was like we were trying for
Speaker 1: things that didn't quite hit um. And some of that
Speaker 1: might may have just been me not getting it, but
Speaker 1: I was I was a little bit like, oh my gosh,
Speaker 1: I I hope we you know, I hope we find
Speaker 1: something you know suddenly, and boy did we. But just
Speaker 1: kind of like understanding, like another layer of like, oh
Speaker 1: she's she's a mess, but she's also not a victim,
Speaker 1: and she's not she's not as involved, but in a
Speaker 1: in a very conscious way, she's not excluded. She just
Speaker 1: wants to stay in her life, like literally, like she
Speaker 1: doesn't want to get involved with I don't know. I've
Speaker 1: had women come up to me and be like, oh
Speaker 1: my god, I'm the Meredith of my office. And and
Speaker 1: it's not just because they're like a drinker, because they
Speaker 1: usually are, and and they're loud and proud, so I
Speaker 1: totally believe them, like only a Meredith would be like
Speaker 1: a Meredith. Wow. You know it's like that to me
Speaker 1: is like the ultimate compliment. It's fantastic. You know, my
Speaker 1: dad owned a bar. I don't know if you knew this,
Speaker 1: but so I'm a bar owner's daughter. Remember that Halloween episode,
Speaker 1: the first Halloween episode that was supposed to be when
Speaker 1: it was revealed that Meredith was a drinker and the
Speaker 1: whole thing got cut, and remember Paul Fiek was like,
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry. The network just wanted more of Michael
Speaker 1: Scott handing candy to the kids from his new condom
Speaker 1: and like, uh, Anyway, my dad own a bar, and
Speaker 1: my dad understood the complexities of alcoholics too, and some
Speaker 1: of them were extremely functional in some ways and charming
Speaker 1: and others and then blow it and then get get
Speaker 1: back you know, really mess up their life and then
Speaker 1: get it back together. You know, there's little elements. I
Speaker 1: feel like there were subtle, subtle things that kept showing up,
Speaker 1: like Meredith's relationship with her son Jakie, and you know,
Speaker 1: bring your daughter to work day, Mered brings her son, uh,
Speaker 1: who's a nightmare and calls Michael Scott Mr Poop so good.
Speaker 1: But again like and and Meredith's ever forgiving and she's
Speaker 1: not like a mean mom, She's she's a little indulgent,
Speaker 1: you know, which again, like I don't know if that
Speaker 1: would have been my first choice, but I totally respect it.
Speaker 1: I get it, and I see that in other people,
Speaker 1: and I think, oh my god, the writing was so great,
Speaker 1: Like they really did not need my help, right. I
Speaker 1: think you touched on something that I never really thought
Speaker 1: about before. But you have a lot of kind of
Speaker 1: wonderful moments with Michael Scott, like specifically with him. You know,
Speaker 1: there's obviously the Christmas episode where you know you flash
Speaker 1: him for the first time. Um, but yeah, fun run
Speaker 1: when he hits you with the car, breaks your pelvis.
Speaker 1: There's a very tender moment at the end of that
Speaker 1: that episode when you hear what he's done for you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's interesting to me that Meredith functions kind of solo
Speaker 1: in the in the group of an I mean, this
Speaker 1: has never occurred to me before. But you know that
Speaker 1: sort of iconic shot of you playing solitaire on the computer,
Speaker 1: like there's some convection to that, and you weren't, by
Speaker 1: and large, you weren't going over and hanging out at
Speaker 1: sales or coming over to the account, which I think
Speaker 1: gave your character an opportunity to do a lot of
Speaker 1: special things. And obviously you being gifted physically as well. Well,
Speaker 1: it's fun to get to do the physical comedy. And
Speaker 1: I was thinking, you know, the Valentine episode of the the
Speaker 1: first Valentine episode, season two, when Phyllis is getting all
Speaker 1: these gifts and Pam is really upset, and you just seem,
Speaker 1: you know, Meredith with her big open and then we
Speaker 1: find out that she's drinking and then she's passed out
Speaker 1: with a line in her hair. I mean that to
Speaker 1: me was like, what a perfect, perfect little just just
Speaker 1: perfect enough. We get it, We've been there, we know that.
Speaker 1: I mean again, there's so many layers and it's just
Speaker 1: I don't know, I just feel so um, it's just
Speaker 1: so fortunate to be a part of something that will
Speaker 1: I think, always have a respect level that most other
Speaker 1: TV shows don't have. I really don't. How do you
Speaker 1: feel like Kate influenced Meredith? Um? I think I will.
Speaker 1: For one, I was always willing to do most of
Speaker 1: my own stunts, and for me, that made it more fun.
Speaker 1: I felt I felt like I was really experiencing more
Speaker 1: that makes any sense. Um. And and I also think
Speaker 1: that audience knows sometimes when you know there's you know,
Speaker 1: I don't if you guys used to watch The Bionic Woman,
Speaker 1: but there was always like some six foot guy in
Speaker 1: a blonde wig pretending to be Jamie Snummers, like so bad.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I just it made me feel a little
Speaker 1: more part of the process, and I felt like it
Speaker 1: was one of my strengths that I really enjoyed it.
Speaker 1: So when I was planking in the men's room and
Speaker 1: Dwight comes and blows me off the top of the
Speaker 1: stall with the fire extinguisher. That was me, So you
Speaker 1: know you didn't you didn't do one thing though, Uh,
Speaker 1: there's a couple of things I didn't do. I did.
Speaker 1: I didn't get my hair on fire, and did not
Speaker 1: light my hair on fire. When I heard that there
Speaker 1: was like face gel involved, I was like, I don't
Speaker 1: know if I wanted. I didn't know that. I just
Speaker 1: think you didn't shave, I didn't shake my hand, I
Speaker 1: did not. Yeah, good for you. I think I disappointed Greg,
Speaker 1: but that's okay. Really he was shocked. He was like, really,
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm sorry, but no, my hair is my thing.
Speaker 1: What I um? Well, actually leading into that, do you
Speaker 1: there was so much sexual stuff with Meredith. My parents
Speaker 1: were so happy about that. My dad's so catholic, is like,
Speaker 1: what is going on? Do you when people say that
Speaker 1: we couldn't do the show today? Do you think that?
Speaker 1: Do you think that's a part of it. I was
Speaker 1: reminded doing the research about you selling sex for steak Yeah,
Speaker 1: for steak coupons? Yeah yeah yeah. But she was contrite,
Speaker 1: she admitted it, and she was asking for forgiveness. Right,
Speaker 1: There's got to be I mean, there's some conscience in
Speaker 1: that which is funny and sad. I mean, that's that's
Speaker 1: the best thing about the office is that it's the
Speaker 1: funny and sad. Right. Um, there was a time I
Speaker 1: thought Kevin and Meredith mte we did kiss that one time?
Speaker 1: You remember that. I didn't make it on the air.
Speaker 1: I can't. I don't remember now. What was it? What
Speaker 1: was the contact like that? I know, I'm I can't remember.
Speaker 1: It was at my desk? You know? Why did we
Speaker 1: do that? Was it? Was it a party? I remember
Speaker 1: it was like a test, Like I remember. I think
Speaker 1: about it every night. I just can't remember so much
Speaker 1: sexual at tension between you and I. Oh my gosh,
Speaker 1: what was it? I can't remember. Shoot, I'm not sure.
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. I felt like they toyed. I felt
Speaker 1: like the writer's toyed with it for a membure. Yes
Speaker 1: they did. I do remember this a little bit, and
Speaker 1: I think it was before the Valentine episode when Kevin
Speaker 1: was looking for a girlfriend. Okay, but I think it's
Speaker 1: before that. It was to be explored. That's so fun.
Speaker 1: I forgot that we're not lives. We can't have a
Speaker 1: fan phone in, we can't answer damnit. Um. Yeah, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna have to I'm gonna have to think about it.
Speaker 1: I don't know that it aired now that it may
Speaker 1: not have. It may not have. Was that tough for
Speaker 1: you though? The getting naked part of it was a
Speaker 1: little likely ship, but it's a little like jumping out
Speaker 1: of an airplane. And I will tell you, as great
Speaker 1: as you know Randal and Matt were, I always felt
Speaker 1: like I didn't get much. I kind that lunch after
Speaker 1: we shot me Big topless. It was a little uncomfortable,
Speaker 1: and I think the last season, season nine, there was
Speaker 1: an episode where we're watching parts of the documentary at
Speaker 1: Oscar's desk in a scene and I would have like
Speaker 1: a little bit of moleskin and it fell and Ed's like, whoa, whoa, whoa,
Speaker 1: we have to stop this. He was like, we could
Speaker 1: really see your boob. I'm like, oh no, I had
Speaker 1: no idea. I was so embarrassed. Oh I forgot about that.
Speaker 1: Yeah no, But you were so fearless in both the
Speaker 1: physicality that you did and the pranks that you did.
Speaker 1: I feel like you and I had did a lot
Speaker 1: of really bad I remember the one which you wouldn't
Speaker 1: think about it like watching the show, but we were
Speaker 1: loading boxes. We were the warehouse was gone and there
Speaker 1: was like oil on the on the warehouse floor and
Speaker 1: we're like pushing boxes like that was our idea to
Speaker 1: be more efficient was to push boxes and they just
Speaker 1: kept having me ball and I'm like, guys, this is concorde,
Speaker 1: like this is not like there's no padding, there's no
Speaker 1: thing there. Yeah. I think that was I think the
Speaker 1: hardest one for weirdly, like you wouldn't think it right, No, no, no,
Speaker 1: but it's those little things because you're not padded and no,
Speaker 1: I totally no. There was no safety meeting about it before,
Speaker 1: Like seriously, there's a reason why they used to do
Speaker 1: that stuff because you don't want to get hurt. We'll meet.
Speaker 1: Holding you on my back with that was intense. That's
Speaker 1: That's one of those things ups like what drugs? Was
Speaker 1: someone on who came up with that idea that merediths
Speaker 1: trapped on Kevin's back? Crazy make the idiots perform like monkeys.
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Speaker 1: your podcast. What do you remember about finding out that
Speaker 1: Steve was leaving U? I literally was with Creed. We
Speaker 1: were on the side of the office doing like a
Speaker 1: satellite press junket um and we and they had announced
Speaker 1: it that morning, so every venue wanted to talk about it.
Speaker 1: And I was like wow, because of course it was emotional.
Speaker 1: I mean, who are we We're not I mean Michael Scott.
Speaker 1: You know, Michael Scott is thunder reveling, he is the office. Um. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was so freaked out. And literally I told Creed
Speaker 1: him like, Okay, anytime they talk about this, just just
Speaker 1: pretend like we can't hear the feet, like I think
Speaker 1: the feed's going. I'm sorry, I'm getting some interference. What
Speaker 1: was the question? Wishing him all the best, Like I
Speaker 1: we had this little thing where we would figure out
Speaker 1: how to get out of the conversation. So but I
Speaker 1: was I was definitely freaked out. And I mean, the
Speaker 1: great thing, the great thing about our show is that
Speaker 1: I feel like Greg Daniels is so trustworthy and I
Speaker 1: feel like he's picked so many great writers, and I
Speaker 1: feel like if anything could have survived a couple more
Speaker 1: years without step Growl, it was because of Greg Daniels.
Speaker 1: But I was nervous. I was, and I was nervous
Speaker 1: about Spader um, just because he's not a comedy guy.
Speaker 1: And he's brilliant, but he's not a comedy guy. And
Speaker 1: I kind of had this whole thing like, oh no,
Speaker 1: he's holding the baby, he's gonna drop the baby. Don't
Speaker 1: drop the baby. And also I was intimidated because he's
Speaker 1: he's like a movie star and I had seen so
Speaker 1: many all of his movies and you know, and there
Speaker 1: was so much sexual tension between the two of us,
Speaker 1: so much. But I felt like there was sexual tension
Speaker 1: between me and Spade. They're they're probably even more even
Speaker 1: more Si Spader, he liked anyone here is sexual. Um.
Speaker 1: The season eight Christmas episode, there was one take where
Speaker 1: he's sort of like Meredith thinks she's actually made me
Speaker 1: gonna go to dinner with them or something like that,
Speaker 1: she's got a chance with them, and he sort of
Speaker 1: touches her cheek like no, no, no, and she goes
Speaker 1: to hug me, and I literally one take, I grabbed
Speaker 1: his ass and then I was like, immediately when we start,
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry, I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. I just felt like, oh my god, he goes, no,
Speaker 1: he goes. That was the right thing to do. End
Speaker 1: up using it, but I was like, don't grab James
Speaker 1: Spader's ask Kate what the wh was amazing. I was
Speaker 1: so nervous. I was like, oh no, oh no, oh no,
Speaker 1: he's amazing, amazing pool party supposedly at Robert California's house.
Speaker 1: That was the hardest episode for me to do. Wow.
Speaker 1: I was in the pool a really, really really long
Speaker 1: time and it was one of the hardest for me
Speaker 1: because I had to be in a bathing suit on
Speaker 1: camera in my forties, my dream not and you think, like,
Speaker 1: you're in a pool, why are you complaining? But like
Speaker 1: because of like hypothermia. They had it, but it was crossed.
Speaker 1: It was heated, but it was indoors. So it was
Speaker 1: kind of like an old holiday inn that you can
Speaker 1: swim in that's hot, and then you're in it for
Speaker 1: like in a day, maybe nine hours in the water. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you guys were doing those chicken fights with with
Speaker 1: on your shoulder. Yeah, oh my god. That was crazy. Again,
Speaker 1: the sexual tension was off the charts. UM, so we
Speaker 1: had how important it was, you know, for the pilot specifically, um,
Speaker 1: but then the guest casting after that to not have
Speaker 1: any stars, Yes, to keep it as unknown people. Yes. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And I remember even Carol Burnett at the TC as
Speaker 1: she said she she loved our show during her speech
Speaker 1: and she wanted to be involved. And I think they
Speaker 1: were like, Nope, too famous, too funny, too much of Yes,
Speaker 1: that's right, that was an idea. But yeah, but then
Speaker 1: you know, of course, um, Cathy Bates, come on, Cathy
Speaker 1: Bates Spader. Yeah, well, well I loved working with the
Speaker 1: will so fun Oh my god, just the greatest. He
Speaker 1: had remembered. We had had dinner literally in like nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety four, uh, in New York when he first got
Speaker 1: hired on SNL with Andy Richter, and I was like,
Speaker 1: I couldn't believe that he remembered. And I remember being
Speaker 1: embarrassed because I had a really embarrassing ex boyfriend who
Speaker 1: was a real douche bag. He's like, I felt really
Speaker 1: intimidated because all you guys were from Chicago, and I
Speaker 1: felt like you guys were like so great at while
Speaker 1: I was like, what is so crazy? Anyway? But I
Speaker 1: love love, love love wolfore that's right. Uh. My story
Speaker 1: similar to that was Kathy Bates went to s m U.
Speaker 1: She was there before me. But while I was there,
Speaker 1: she had already won the oscar and she came back
Speaker 1: to like they opened a new theater and my mom
Speaker 1: got a book of Shakespeare's sonnets sent it to Cathy Bates,
Speaker 1: told her that I was a really big fan, and
Speaker 1: I went to s m U and I did this
Speaker 1: show and got it. Rea. I believe the only autographed
Speaker 1: item that I have of anyone that I can recall,
Speaker 1: like to Brian and you know, good luck in your future.
Speaker 1: Blah blah blah Kathy Bates. So I hear she's going
Speaker 1: to be on the show, And now here we are
Speaker 1: and we're in the makeup trailer, and I came up
Speaker 1: behind her and I said, I wanted, Kathy, I want
Speaker 1: to show you. It wasn't her first day, so I
Speaker 1: did not want to seem like a crazy stalker, but
Speaker 1: I came up behind her and I said, you know,
Speaker 1: I just want to show you that my mom. And
Speaker 1: of course I wasn't expecting her to remember, I'm sure
Speaker 1: she's signed you know a lot of thure just to say, like,
Speaker 1: how crazy is this that my mom did this? I know, crazy,
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, that's awesome. She then had me arrested,
Speaker 1: but she would do from time she had me arrested too.
Speaker 1: That's just a little fun thing we used to do
Speaker 1: with get people arrested. Um. What do you remember about
Speaker 1: going in to shoot the finale? Um? I remember trying
Speaker 1: to be as present as possible and just to try
Speaker 1: to enjoy all of it because it was such a
Speaker 1: great ending. And um, and then I remember Greg just
Speaker 1: saying one more take, one more take, how about this?
Speaker 1: How about this? I remember we were all two hours
Speaker 1: late for our own rap party that people were texting
Speaker 1: and calling like where are you? Like, just like, no
Speaker 1: one wanted to end. No one wanted to end. There's
Speaker 1: so few moments like that in this business where you
Speaker 1: can actually feel the emotional part of the joy that
Speaker 1: all those years represented, and the way all of our
Speaker 1: lives changed, and the way that it the show continues
Speaker 1: to speak to people, and like people feel so connected
Speaker 1: and they feel so comfortable. It's so rare. I mean, really,
Speaker 1: I I make jokes like if I got hit by
Speaker 1: a car tomorrow, for real, I'd be fine, Like I
Speaker 1: would be like it was. This was such an amazing chapter,
Speaker 1: you know, And so few actors get this. So few
Speaker 1: actors it's it's uh, it's really an honor. Why do
Speaker 1: you think that young people have connected to the show.
Speaker 1: Why is the show more popular now than to two reasons.
Speaker 1: The most basic reason is that being in an office
Speaker 1: like dunder Mifflin with one big room with all the offices,
Speaker 1: it's much like being in the classroom and Michael Scott
Speaker 1: is like he's the boss, but he's like the teacher.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think kids can always relate to having
Speaker 1: to sit next to someone that they didn't necessarily pick,
Speaker 1: but they're kind of stuck with for years. And also
Speaker 1: I think the show is so smart. There's so many
Speaker 1: subtle things. You can watch it a million times and
Speaker 1: see different things that you didn't see before that you
Speaker 1: weren't paying attention, Like you can notice different things. There's
Speaker 1: so many Easter eggs and like weird little things that
Speaker 1: just kind of keeping. And some of it's like stuff
Speaker 1: that got cut, like I don't remember the weight loss
Speaker 1: episode where like people still have questions about like Meredith's
Speaker 1: skin because there's a whole storyline where Meredith got sun
Speaker 1: poisoned on a fishing boat, and um, it got worse
Speaker 1: and worse as a week went on and it never
Speaker 1: got explained, and I remember Steve was like he thought
Speaker 1: it was so brilliant that they just didn't worry about
Speaker 1: any again, because how many times you work with people
Speaker 1: that you're not that close to and like something's going on.
Speaker 1: You're like, I don't even want to know what's going
Speaker 1: on with you, know what I mean, Like I'm not
Speaker 1: even go And also like skin is like a weird
Speaker 1: personal things, so you would be like, what's wrong with
Speaker 1: your skin? No one would do, you know, So it's
Speaker 1: like this kind of wonderful thing. It's just we're just
Speaker 1: kind of existing as as a real documentary would happened,
Speaker 1: where some things are not explained. And I feel like
Speaker 1: kids are so smart, and I feel like they feel
Speaker 1: like they're smarter maybe than their parents by the way
Speaker 1: that they notice the office in a way that maybe
Speaker 1: people have been watching very typical sitcoms for years don't
Speaker 1: don't necessarily plug into immediately. I feel like they're not
Speaker 1: as tainted by that. I don't know, that's just a thought. Yeah, No,
Speaker 1: I think you're right. No, that's great. Um, all right,
Speaker 1: last question, hardest question. What does the office mean to you?
Speaker 1: The office means joy, validation, success, um love fun, great
Speaker 1: process and probably the best part of my life. I
Speaker 1: knew you were going to say well before you set it.
Speaker 1: I know, I almost said it for you, and I
Speaker 1: was like, nope, find it. Yeah, oh yeah, OK, thank
Speaker 1: you so much, Thank you so much. I'm so glad
Speaker 1: we could get drunk like this. This is awesome. This
Speaker 1: coffee has you have no idea what's in it? Actually
Speaker 1: no clue? Um, so awesome. I always loved watching your
Speaker 1: process too. I have to say this because I always
Speaker 1: felt like you you had You just had certain instincts
Speaker 1: that like just I feel like you were such a
Speaker 1: co creator and Kevin, like just in your not speaking
Speaker 1: as well, but like there would be things that you
Speaker 1: would just it was you. You were fearless and really amazing,
Speaker 1: and I feel like, yes, the writing is amazing, but
Speaker 1: I feel like no one else could do what you did.
Speaker 1: No one. Well. Thank you all right everyone? That is
Speaker 1: all for the one and only Kate Flannery. Kate, I
Speaker 1: know you called me fearless there, but you are the
Speaker 1: fearless one. I admire you so much and I cannot
Speaker 1: wait to get absolutely wasted with you again soon. And
Speaker 1: you know what, same to all your listeners out there,
Speaker 1: Let's do it sometime as long as you're of age,
Speaker 1: of course, But until then, please join me back here
Speaker 1: next week for another interview. I need to go fill
Speaker 1: up this coffee cup the office. Deep Dive is hosted
Speaker 1: and executive produced by me Brian Baumgartner, alongside our executive producer,
Speaker 1: Lang Lee. Our senior producer is Tessa Kramer, our producer
Speaker 1: is Emily Carr, and our assistant editor is Diego Tapia.
Speaker 1: My main man in the booth is Alec Moore. Our
Speaker 1: theme song Bubble and Squeak, performed by my great friend
Speaker 1: Creed Bratton, and the episode was mixed by seth Olansky.
Speaker 1: We've all felt left out, and for people who moved
Speaker 1: to this country, that feeling lasts more than a moment.
Speaker 1: We can change that. Learn how it Belonging begins with
Speaker 1: us dot Org. Brought to you by the Ad Council.
Speaker 1: I'm Jake Halbern, host of deep Cover. Our new season
Speaker 1: is about a lawyer who helped the mob run Chicago.
Speaker 1: He bribed judges and even helped a hit man walk free,
Speaker 1: until one day when he started talking with the FBI
Speaker 1: and promised that he could take the mob down I've
Speaker 1: spent the past year trying to figure out why he
Speaker 1: flipped and what he was really after. Listen to deep
Speaker 1: Cover on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. The Black Effect presents I
Speaker 1: didn't know, maybe you didn't either, But the history or
Speaker 1: black people ain't rooted in slavery. Oh no, his royalty
Speaker 1: not despair beat out here and every day in February,
Speaker 1: I will give you a Black history fact that I
Speaker 1: didn't know, and maybe you didn't either. It's a rugged, ratchet,
Speaker 1: realistic look at history. Listen and so I didn't know,
Speaker 1: maybe you didn't either. On the Black Effect podcast network,
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Speaker 1: get your podcasts from.