1 00:00:01,480 --> 00:00:04,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a production of I 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:13,160 Speaker 1: Heart Radio. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm joh 3 00:00:13,320 --> 00:00:19,680 Speaker 1: caught and then fun of me this. I'm sorry I 4 00:00:19,760 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: had something in my mouth. It is stuff you should know, 5 00:00:22,760 --> 00:00:24,760 Speaker 1: and I have no room to make fun of you. Friend. 6 00:00:24,800 --> 00:00:27,240 Speaker 1: I've been on my own dental journey for some time 7 00:00:27,280 --> 00:00:30,319 Speaker 1: now and I'm still in the midst of it. What 8 00:00:30,360 --> 00:00:32,519 Speaker 1: are you got going on? All sorts of stuff I 9 00:00:33,280 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 1: was not granted with, like great strong, um, indestructible, like 10 00:00:38,000 --> 00:00:40,920 Speaker 1: teeth and all that, you know, like the feeling I 11 00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:44,240 Speaker 1: thought like I just hadn't taken enough care of him whatever. 12 00:00:44,280 --> 00:00:46,839 Speaker 1: But now that I actually do take really good care 13 00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:49,239 Speaker 1: of my teeth, I found like, no, it's they're just 14 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:52,000 Speaker 1: not as great as they could be. I think, Yeah, 15 00:00:52,280 --> 00:00:55,000 Speaker 1: I'm I'm fully aware with that emotion, as you know. 16 00:00:55,360 --> 00:00:56,560 Speaker 1: And you know, I don't even know if I said 17 00:00:56,560 --> 00:00:58,279 Speaker 1: a may set on the air, but my front went, 18 00:00:58,320 --> 00:01:00,680 Speaker 1: I'm gonna have to have it redone. Yeah, yeah, when 19 00:01:00,760 --> 00:01:03,600 Speaker 1: is that going to happen? It's sort of I mean, 20 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:06,880 Speaker 1: right now, he's basically like, it's not causing any trouble 21 00:01:06,959 --> 00:01:09,840 Speaker 1: right now, but it's gonna happen at some point, so 22 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:12,399 Speaker 1: he almost made it sound like, whenever you feel like 23 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:15,560 Speaker 1: you're up for being toothless again for three months, let 24 00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:20,559 Speaker 1: me know just time, just in time for our next 25 00:01:20,600 --> 00:01:25,280 Speaker 1: live show whenever that is. Oh jeez, I forgot about that. Um, 26 00:01:25,600 --> 00:01:27,720 Speaker 1: I don't know, we'll see. Yeah, well, it's not like 27 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:30,280 Speaker 1: you haven't been on stage without a tooth before. You're 28 00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:32,640 Speaker 1: taking them out like that was your stick at at 29 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:34,880 Speaker 1: the beginning of a number of shows. So don't get 30 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:37,319 Speaker 1: shy these days, Chuck. No, you gotta you gotta work 31 00:01:37,360 --> 00:01:43,440 Speaker 1: your deficiencies. That's true. So we're talking about the history 32 00:01:43,440 --> 00:01:46,200 Speaker 1: of dynastry, which, by the way, people listening, I know 33 00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:49,600 Speaker 1: you know this probably, but it wasn't until like late 34 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:52,240 Speaker 1: in the eighteenth century that that word was even used. Really, 35 00:01:52,560 --> 00:01:55,240 Speaker 1: they didn't even call it dynastry until then. They called 36 00:01:55,240 --> 00:01:58,880 Speaker 1: it fizzle stick. And we should thank quite a few 37 00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:02,560 Speaker 1: people here. I'm sure you have some uh websites that 38 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:05,240 Speaker 1: you looked at, but I went to the British Dental 39 00:02:05,280 --> 00:02:09,880 Speaker 1: Association art took dot org History Daily, Uh, this great 40 00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:12,360 Speaker 1: website called all Things Georgian. I think it's a blog 41 00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:15,760 Speaker 1: where you can find some cool old pictures of antiquated 42 00:02:15,919 --> 00:02:20,280 Speaker 1: dentistry tools. Uh, and then a book by James Wybrandt 43 00:02:20,280 --> 00:02:26,440 Speaker 1: called The Excruciating History of Dentistry insert colon sound. Has 44 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 1: that been happening, by the way, I don't think so. 45 00:02:28,320 --> 00:02:31,040 Speaker 1: I think Jerry thought we were joking about that. Literally, 46 00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:33,680 Speaker 1: I've just been saying that. I'm pretty sure, well I 47 00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:35,760 Speaker 1: haven't picked it up on any of the QA I've 48 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:38,639 Speaker 1: been doing. I haven't either, So we'll find out. I'll 49 00:02:38,639 --> 00:02:42,520 Speaker 1: pay extra attention UM to some tales and oral oddities 50 00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:47,960 Speaker 1: from Babylon two braces. Very nice. Yeah, huge, huge shout 51 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:50,680 Speaker 1: out also to our boy Dave Ruse for helping us 52 00:02:50,720 --> 00:02:53,920 Speaker 1: with this one as well. Yeah, this was my idea, 53 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:56,519 Speaker 1: and as when we instructed Dave, I said, Hey, Dave, 54 00:02:56,840 --> 00:02:59,040 Speaker 1: how about history of dentistry? And it's like, I don't 55 00:02:59,040 --> 00:03:01,720 Speaker 1: want to talk about any thing modern that works. I 56 00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:03,840 Speaker 1: want to talk about all the old stuff, right, and 57 00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 1: all the stuff that they tried along the way that 58 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:09,840 Speaker 1: people screamed and excruciating pain. And actually that's I think 59 00:03:09,919 --> 00:03:12,880 Speaker 1: that's that's good for UM for pointing out, Chuck that 60 00:03:13,800 --> 00:03:16,240 Speaker 1: there are points where what stuff we're talking about like 61 00:03:16,320 --> 00:03:19,359 Speaker 1: might actually make you feel faint, like it happened to me. Yeah, 62 00:03:19,360 --> 00:03:21,520 Speaker 1: there's a trigger warning for sure. There was this one 63 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:28,120 Speaker 1: site called Science Museum Group Collection Cumbersome, but they have 64 00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 1: a lot of um dental old dental stuff in their collection, 65 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 1: and they have very high rise pictures and a lot 66 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:37,920 Speaker 1: of them have descriptions of how the thing was used, 67 00:03:37,960 --> 00:03:40,760 Speaker 1: and like, I like, i'd like break out in a 68 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 1: little trickle sweat along the top of my lip and 69 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:46,120 Speaker 1: like get a little woozy just reading about this stuff. 70 00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:48,280 Speaker 1: And I'm pretty tough with that kind of thing. I mean, 71 00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 1: I can talk about poop all the live long day, 72 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:54,760 Speaker 1: but when it comes to like pulling teeth out without 73 00:03:54,840 --> 00:03:57,640 Speaker 1: anesthetics and things like that, it's my knees get a 74 00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:00,400 Speaker 1: little wobbly. Yeah. And I don't know if you had 75 00:04:00,440 --> 00:04:02,800 Speaker 1: the same reaction, but looking at these ol dental tools, 76 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 1: it's it's like, well that was clearly also this you know, 77 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:12,320 Speaker 1: like some sort of ironsmithing tool or whatever. And they 78 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:14,240 Speaker 1: just said, well, hey, I bet you if you move 79 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:17,240 Speaker 1: that little spont dibbot over here, you could also use 80 00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:19,719 Speaker 1: it to crank out a molar. And as we'll see, 81 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:22,960 Speaker 1: if you wanted a tooth remove for a very long time, 82 00:04:23,080 --> 00:04:25,200 Speaker 1: depending on where you lived, you probably went to go 83 00:04:25,279 --> 00:04:29,640 Speaker 1: see your local smithie. Yeah, crazy stuff just settle in everybody. 84 00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:32,800 Speaker 1: Let's start at the very very beginning, because for at 85 00:04:32,880 --> 00:04:38,920 Speaker 1: least seven thousand years people have been talking and writing 86 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:42,840 Speaker 1: about toothaches. The Babylonians, I believe, we're among the first 87 00:04:42,880 --> 00:04:45,159 Speaker 1: to ever create an alphabet, to ever write anything down. 88 00:04:45,600 --> 00:04:49,440 Speaker 1: And one of the things they wrote about was toothaches 89 00:04:49,920 --> 00:04:52,760 Speaker 1: and the idea of where toothaches came from, which are 90 00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:57,640 Speaker 1: called toothworms chuck, which are cute sounding. Actually you know, yeah, 91 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:00,960 Speaker 1: the toothworm is what you I think it is, even 92 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:03,920 Speaker 1: though it's not real, but little tiny worms that get 93 00:05:03,960 --> 00:05:08,080 Speaker 1: in your mouth, and sometimes that they would originate in 94 00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:11,800 Speaker 1: your mouth like spontaneously. Sometimes they got into your mouth 95 00:05:11,960 --> 00:05:15,039 Speaker 1: somehow and worm their way literally into your tooth like 96 00:05:15,200 --> 00:05:19,760 Speaker 1: the the non existent core of an apple. And uh, 97 00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:21,440 Speaker 1: this is you know. They said, all right, here's what 98 00:05:21,640 --> 00:05:24,960 Speaker 1: you should do. You should you should uh do some 99 00:05:25,040 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 1: sort of ceremony to the gods and ask for a 100 00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:30,360 Speaker 1: little help from the gods. And then later on they said, oh, 101 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:34,040 Speaker 1: maybe we can actually try something. And that early something 102 00:05:34,080 --> 00:05:40,680 Speaker 1: and this is two to five zero BC years ago 103 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:44,200 Speaker 1: for most people would say, Uh, they would heat up 104 00:05:44,200 --> 00:05:48,400 Speaker 1: a piece of um. They would heat up bees wax 105 00:05:48,440 --> 00:05:51,640 Speaker 1: filled with hinbane seeds and put it in your mouth, 106 00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 1: and so it basically fills your mouth up with the 107 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:56,640 Speaker 1: smoke of the hinbane seed, which is a nightshade and 108 00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 1: it can be really dangerous if there's a lot of it. 109 00:05:59,200 --> 00:06:01,240 Speaker 1: But this guy, I just showed you where they were at. 110 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:05,160 Speaker 1: It seems like all the earliest and for a long 111 00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:09,000 Speaker 1: time mitigation efforts were trying anything to just numb the 112 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 1: pain a little bit for a while, because hem pain 113 00:06:11,040 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 1: will do that in small doses, I'm sure. And it 114 00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:15,640 Speaker 1: was basically like, let me stop the pain for a 115 00:06:15,680 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 1: little while, but the pain would always come back, so 116 00:06:18,240 --> 00:06:21,839 Speaker 1: eventually they had to move to extraction. Yes, and that 117 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:26,960 Speaker 1: those toothworm The toothworm theory of teeth pain had some 118 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:30,719 Speaker 1: really like um staying effect, like it was around in 119 00:06:30,839 --> 00:06:35,800 Speaker 1: the medieval medieval times in Europe. Uh, if you actually 120 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:38,560 Speaker 1: go to medieval times today in your local suburb, you'll 121 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:42,919 Speaker 1: hear them talk about toothworms. And there was this No, 122 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:45,719 Speaker 1: I don't think so unless somebody really did their homework. 123 00:06:45,760 --> 00:06:48,680 Speaker 1: But it wouldn't surprise me. No, Um, there was a 124 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:52,120 Speaker 1: study I ran across that talked about and this was 125 00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:56,440 Speaker 1: a paper from talked about a Chinese traditional medicine practitioner 126 00:06:56,760 --> 00:07:00,240 Speaker 1: who cited toothworms as the cause of somebody's tooth that 127 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:04,000 Speaker 1: they were healing and they used that same beeswax, henbane, 128 00:07:04,520 --> 00:07:08,960 Speaker 1: he um like medicine to treat it. Here's what I 129 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:13,880 Speaker 1: want to know. Did they actually see any worms ever? Like, 130 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:16,400 Speaker 1: was this somebody whose mouth was so infected they got 131 00:07:16,400 --> 00:07:19,720 Speaker 1: worms or something? Oh boy, wouldn't that be something. I mean, 132 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:21,800 Speaker 1: I don't know if they were completely invisible. It just 133 00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:25,200 Speaker 1: seems a little weird. Maybe they saw pus and and 134 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 1: it came out as in kind of a worm like form, 135 00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:30,480 Speaker 1: like is it from the gums and somebody thought it 136 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:32,600 Speaker 1: was worms or who knows, maybe somebody did have worms. 137 00:07:32,680 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 1: It seems weird to just be like it's worms without 138 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:39,720 Speaker 1: anyone ever having seen worms of any kind. I told 139 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 1: you guys, I didn't know that you're talking about mouth 140 00:07:43,080 --> 00:07:48,560 Speaker 1: bus Uh. Let's skip forward to ancient Egypt where we 141 00:07:48,680 --> 00:07:52,720 Speaker 1: have who maybe the first dentist, and this is around 142 00:07:52,720 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 1: b C or to six zero zero during the time 143 00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 1: of king Is that dozer? That's what That's how I'd 144 00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:08,840 Speaker 1: say j is silent, right, uh de hooser a dohoeser. Uh. 145 00:08:08,880 --> 00:08:13,440 Speaker 1: There was a scribe called Hessy Ree who and they 146 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:17,560 Speaker 1: read the hieroglyphics on the scribes burial chamber that basically said, 147 00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:21,320 Speaker 1: this guy is the best in town dentistry. He was 148 00:08:21,360 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 1: the greatest of those who deal with teeth, uh, and 149 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:26,880 Speaker 1: of the physicians. And that was I think one of 150 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:30,160 Speaker 1: the first sort of mentions of someone you know, written 151 00:08:30,200 --> 00:08:33,640 Speaker 1: down on uh, well not paper, but hieroglyphics written down 152 00:08:33,640 --> 00:08:35,760 Speaker 1: that someone actually did this for a living. Yeah. The 153 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:40,160 Speaker 1: paper actually did come not too much longer after that. Um. 154 00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:43,679 Speaker 1: The Papyrus Ebers, which we've talked about many times, it's 155 00:08:43,720 --> 00:08:47,439 Speaker 1: a scroll, and it had a lot of stuff medical 156 00:08:47,440 --> 00:08:51,520 Speaker 1: ailments and treatments for those ailments, and there were treatments 157 00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:55,839 Speaker 1: for toothaches and um other kinds of like oral problems 158 00:08:55,880 --> 00:08:59,120 Speaker 1: like bleeding gums and stuff like that. And of course, 159 00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:01,880 Speaker 1: because what they had a hand at the time where 160 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:05,720 Speaker 1: like medicinal cures, they prescribed all sorts of medicinal cures. 161 00:09:05,720 --> 00:09:08,880 Speaker 1: And it's like you said, there was basically just this 162 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 1: aim to cure the pain um, and they would do 163 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:17,240 Speaker 1: all sorts of things like use opium, or they would 164 00:09:17,320 --> 00:09:20,520 Speaker 1: use that henbane or other kinds of night shade. But 165 00:09:20,600 --> 00:09:25,240 Speaker 1: then also, um, problematically, they would use arsenic, which um 166 00:09:25,559 --> 00:09:29,160 Speaker 1: is it really does kill disease tissue, sure, but it 167 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 1: also can kill you two in some pretty horrific ways. Um. 168 00:09:33,360 --> 00:09:36,160 Speaker 1: What's crazy about that is not that the ancient Egyptians 169 00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:40,160 Speaker 1: were using that, you know, like thirty years ago, but 170 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:44,440 Speaker 1: that that was still in use into the modern age, 171 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,839 Speaker 1: Like people were using arsenic for a very long time 172 00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:50,719 Speaker 1: to treat mouth stuff. Um. And in fact, we've done 173 00:09:50,720 --> 00:09:52,520 Speaker 1: a lot of weird stuff to our mouth and use 174 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:54,200 Speaker 1: a lot of things we shouldn't have been using in 175 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:57,400 Speaker 1: our mouths over the years. I was trying to think 176 00:09:57,400 --> 00:09:59,320 Speaker 1: of a bleeding gums Murphy joke there a minute ago. 177 00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:01,520 Speaker 1: But all you have to do is say his name 178 00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:06,280 Speaker 1: and then I guess, uh you you mentioned ancient Chinese 179 00:10:06,360 --> 00:10:10,199 Speaker 1: medicine or a traditional Chinese medicine, and they were kind 180 00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:13,439 Speaker 1: of on board early on. It's funny because sometimes people 181 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:16,880 Speaker 1: seem to be going toward the right thing because they 182 00:10:16,880 --> 00:10:20,760 Speaker 1: were using things like rinses and mouth washes. Makes sense 183 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:25,320 Speaker 1: they would also use enemas. I'm not sure about that. 184 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:28,640 Speaker 1: Enemas have been listed to cure a whole host of things, 185 00:10:28,679 --> 00:10:30,240 Speaker 1: but I think I don't know about toothaches. It was 186 00:10:30,280 --> 00:10:33,520 Speaker 1: more for the distraction, is my guess, right, than someone 187 00:10:33,559 --> 00:10:37,959 Speaker 1: punches you in the mouth. But acupuncture. Of the three 188 00:10:38,840 --> 00:10:43,120 Speaker 1: acupuncture sites for TCM, twenty six of them are tied 189 00:10:43,160 --> 00:10:49,199 Speaker 1: to toothache relief. UM. And then piling on from the 190 00:10:49,240 --> 00:10:52,640 Speaker 1: different cultures that added and contributed to like our general 191 00:10:52,800 --> 00:10:58,080 Speaker 1: human knowledge of how to treat problems with the mouth. Um. 192 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:01,960 Speaker 1: The Hindus from say like India and Southeast Asia and 193 00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:05,840 Speaker 1: South Asia. UM. They put their stuff down in the Vedas, 194 00:11:05,920 --> 00:11:08,080 Speaker 1: which were a bunch of ancient texts much like the 195 00:11:08,080 --> 00:11:13,360 Speaker 1: Papyrus Ebers, which dealt with things like medical conditions, including um, 196 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:17,160 Speaker 1: how did not just treat tooth problems in teeth pain 197 00:11:17,800 --> 00:11:21,160 Speaker 1: but also how to like prevent it. And they actually 198 00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:24,200 Speaker 1: prescribed using like a twig with the end with the 199 00:11:24,360 --> 00:11:27,959 Speaker 1: end fraid to um to basically chew on and also 200 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:30,000 Speaker 1: just kind of brush with it was like the first 201 00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:34,440 Speaker 1: earliest toothbrush. And they also had dentrifices, which is a 202 00:11:34,559 --> 00:11:38,120 Speaker 1: type something you would use to clean or polish or 203 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:43,880 Speaker 1: scrape off your teeth. Um made of honey oil and herbs, 204 00:11:44,280 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 1: which is pretty great. Like that was pretty groundbreaking, frankly. Yeah, 205 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:53,560 Speaker 1: and that's people still use, uh, I mean in survival 206 00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:57,400 Speaker 1: handbooks and stuff. They say, if you're you know, lost 207 00:11:57,440 --> 00:12:00,000 Speaker 1: in the woods for for many many days, you're gonna 208 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:02,040 Speaker 1: want to take care of your teeth. It sounds silly, 209 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:06,840 Speaker 1: but if you're wandering around for three weeks, uh, you 210 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:10,440 Speaker 1: want to just feel fresh. But but the whole twig 211 00:12:10,520 --> 00:12:13,320 Speaker 1: fraid twig thing is what they still people still do 212 00:12:13,360 --> 00:12:15,520 Speaker 1: that in different cultures around the world, chewing on twigs. 213 00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:18,800 Speaker 1: You can even buy some of that stuff still uh 214 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:22,000 Speaker 1: here in the West, and uh like dental twigs to 215 00:12:22,080 --> 00:12:24,280 Speaker 1: chew on and stuff. Yeah, And if you ever have 216 00:12:24,440 --> 00:12:28,840 Speaker 1: closely watched Shakespeare in Love, Gwyneth Paltrow uses one in 217 00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:33,000 Speaker 1: that movie that she really she does. I saw it. 218 00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:35,080 Speaker 1: I don't know if I closely watched it, though, Well, 219 00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:36,960 Speaker 1: you need to go back and closely watch it. That 220 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:41,040 Speaker 1: thing is full of so many um like, so much imagery, 221 00:12:41,160 --> 00:12:45,920 Speaker 1: so much illuminatut stuff. It's crazy. Really, did you watch 222 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:49,080 Speaker 1: it recently? No? For some reason, her chewing on that 223 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:51,480 Speaker 1: twig made an enormous impression on me because I haven't 224 00:12:51,520 --> 00:12:54,760 Speaker 1: seen that movie since the nineties, but I've never forgotten that, 225 00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:57,800 Speaker 1: And it's not like one of those things where you know, 226 00:12:57,880 --> 00:13:01,160 Speaker 1: like I only think of it when I'm confronted with 227 00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:04,000 Speaker 1: Shakespeare and love, like it just pops into my head 228 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:07,280 Speaker 1: every once in a while, weirdly, so I was primed 229 00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:09,920 Speaker 1: for this episode, Chuck. So when you think when I 230 00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:11,960 Speaker 1: say the words Gwyneth Paltrow, I know you think of 231 00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:16,319 Speaker 1: two things in this order. Her duet with Huey Lewis 232 00:13:16,920 --> 00:13:21,280 Speaker 1: that's third cruising? Did you just do that to me? 233 00:13:22,760 --> 00:13:25,319 Speaker 1: Chewing on twigs? What's what's the third one? Just goop 234 00:13:25,360 --> 00:13:29,920 Speaker 1: in general? Okay, that's probably just goop. Second, so chewing 235 00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:33,240 Speaker 1: on the twig goop. And then yes, that duet that 236 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:35,920 Speaker 1: I can sometimes push out of my head until you 237 00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:40,600 Speaker 1: bring it up. Um. So, now we move on to 238 00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:44,360 Speaker 1: ancient Rome, which is where you know, things sort of 239 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:47,240 Speaker 1: took a leap forward in a way, like a lot 240 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:49,559 Speaker 1: of stuff did in ancient Rome, not to the kind 241 00:13:49,559 --> 00:13:52,480 Speaker 1: of modern dental work that we're you know, used to 242 00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:55,920 Speaker 1: today obviously, but for the time not too bad, and 243 00:13:55,960 --> 00:13:59,880 Speaker 1: that they did things like crowns, they did bridge work, Uh, 244 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:03,720 Speaker 1: had dental prosthetics made from things like ivory or bone, 245 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:07,160 Speaker 1: which makes sense. Uh, so they kind of advanced things 246 00:14:07,200 --> 00:14:09,840 Speaker 1: a little bit. There was a huge bit, if you 247 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:14,280 Speaker 1: ask me, yeahs enormous leap forward. Yeah, but I mean 248 00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:17,360 Speaker 1: I don't I'm sure they look pretty jankie. You know. Well, 249 00:14:18,120 --> 00:14:20,520 Speaker 1: you could still chew a turkey leg, and by god, 250 00:14:20,560 --> 00:14:23,480 Speaker 1: you'd be grateful you could. Probably it didn't matter what 251 00:14:23,560 --> 00:14:26,280 Speaker 1: you looked like in ancient room. Everybody too wasted on wine. 252 00:14:26,560 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 1: Oh I missed my time and place, didn't I you 253 00:14:28,880 --> 00:14:32,960 Speaker 1: really did. Uh. There was a position, their name all 254 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:38,400 Speaker 1: less Cornelius Celsus, who filled supposedly filled the first cavities, 255 00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:42,600 Speaker 1: but they weren't traditionally like we think of cavities. They 256 00:14:42,640 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 1: were from poard lead, and they were meant to serve 257 00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 1: as something to grab onto to actually pull a tooth. 258 00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:51,880 Speaker 1: So I guess he would do it to like some 259 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:54,800 Speaker 1: sort of a post or a stem or something. I 260 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:58,080 Speaker 1: think he would poor. Yeah, it's weird because you would 261 00:14:58,120 --> 00:14:59,920 Speaker 1: have to use molten lead, and you can't just go 262 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:03,000 Speaker 1: around pouring that on people's teeth and expecting their face 263 00:15:03,080 --> 00:15:07,040 Speaker 1: to not fall off or develop a nice post. So 264 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 1: so yeah, I'm not. I'm not. I get the impression 265 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:13,080 Speaker 1: that he molded it around whatever tooth was left so 266 00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:16,360 Speaker 1: that he had more gripping power on That was my 267 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:21,440 Speaker 1: take on it. But but it did end up becoming like, um, 268 00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:24,960 Speaker 1: I guess at the very least, it's noteworthy that he 269 00:15:24,960 --> 00:15:28,680 Speaker 1: he kind of came up with the dental fillings, even 270 00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:31,840 Speaker 1: if that wasn't the point of it. Uh. And then 271 00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:33,640 Speaker 1: before I guess we break, we should mention this one 272 00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:38,080 Speaker 1: more kind of fun fact. An ancient room for a 273 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:41,760 Speaker 1: for a mouth wash, they recommended rinsing the mouth with 274 00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:46,040 Speaker 1: the first yurin of the morning, which everyone knows is 275 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:52,240 Speaker 1: the densest yellowest urine protein rich. So we are going 276 00:15:52,280 --> 00:15:54,240 Speaker 1: to break now because I have that taste in my 277 00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:59,720 Speaker 1: mouth thanks to you, urine. Yeah, I'm very very um suggestible. 278 00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:04,160 Speaker 1: Have you ever drank your in? No, No, I can 279 00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:09,240 Speaker 1: say that I never have. I think most people can 280 00:16:09,240 --> 00:16:11,560 Speaker 1: say one way or the other. Right, Yeah, well, yeah, 281 00:16:11,560 --> 00:16:14,600 Speaker 1: that's a yes or no question. Yeah, yeah, I'm sort 282 00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:17,560 Speaker 1: of a little bit. I haven't either. I was just 283 00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:19,840 Speaker 1: I was just wondering, you never know. Yeah, well, it's 284 00:16:19,880 --> 00:16:22,680 Speaker 1: good that after thirteen years we're still exploring one another. 285 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:25,680 Speaker 1: All right, well, let's take a break and we'll be 286 00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:48,800 Speaker 1: back right after this. So Chuck, we're back, and we're 287 00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:51,040 Speaker 1: into the Middle Ages. Now. I don't know if anyone's 288 00:16:51,080 --> 00:16:56,320 Speaker 1: caught onto this, but we're loosely organizing this. Um yeah, 289 00:16:56,480 --> 00:16:59,440 Speaker 1: over the over the years, okay, and we've reached the 290 00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:02,320 Speaker 1: Middle Age Middle Ages of Europe, I should say specifically, 291 00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:08,359 Speaker 1: um and after Rome fell in so many ways. And 292 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:10,320 Speaker 1: of course we've talked about it before, but the Middle 293 00:17:10,359 --> 00:17:12,199 Speaker 1: Ages are often called the Dark Ages. You're not even 294 00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:14,200 Speaker 1: supposed to call them the Middle Ages because it makes 295 00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:17,520 Speaker 1: the stuff that happened during this time inconsequential and it's 296 00:17:17,560 --> 00:17:20,320 Speaker 1: just not the case. But it is true that, like 297 00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:25,200 Speaker 1: the practice of dentistry really took a nose dive during 298 00:17:25,280 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 1: this time. So this is actually a pretty good example 299 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:32,479 Speaker 1: of how human knowledge in um, well, the human knowledge 300 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:35,200 Speaker 1: of how to do things smartly really fell off for 301 00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:39,520 Speaker 1: a little while had to be rediscovered, that's right. And 302 00:17:39,560 --> 00:17:43,080 Speaker 1: it was around this time that physicians like they were 303 00:17:43,119 --> 00:17:46,320 Speaker 1: something special back then. But the physician said, I'm not 304 00:17:46,440 --> 00:17:49,520 Speaker 1: messing around with teeth, like the mouth is beneath me. 305 00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:52,920 Speaker 1: Which is funny that that's still sort of a thing, right, Yeah, 306 00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:56,000 Speaker 1: it's true as far as like, uh, what movie was 307 00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:58,920 Speaker 1: that the The Hangover when Ed Helms was a dentist 308 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:02,160 Speaker 1: and none of the doctors like them any respect, wasn't it? Um? 309 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:06,040 Speaker 1: Wasn't it on Seinfeld that George pretended to be a 310 00:18:06,119 --> 00:18:09,200 Speaker 1: dentist for a little while? Was it? He pretended to 311 00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:12,320 Speaker 1: be an architect? Right? But there was something about a 312 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:14,760 Speaker 1: dentist there. It was going to be like a dentist 313 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:17,359 Speaker 1: at first. Maybe I don't know. Well there was the 314 00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:21,680 Speaker 1: dentist too, which was what's his face? Kranston, Tim Whatley, 315 00:18:21,200 --> 00:18:26,600 Speaker 1: Tim Whatley, I don't know. It's I don't know. Okay, 316 00:18:26,640 --> 00:18:28,760 Speaker 1: well there's something to pretend to be a dentist. Maybe 317 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:31,919 Speaker 1: the kid double cross the kid that George was sponsoring 318 00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:37,600 Speaker 1: for the the Susan's Foundation was said he wanted to 319 00:18:37,600 --> 00:18:39,359 Speaker 1: be an architect, and then when he takes him in 320 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:41,800 Speaker 1: there for the scholarship, he changes, he double crosses him 321 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:44,600 Speaker 1: and says he wants to be a dentist, and everybody 322 00:18:44,680 --> 00:18:48,640 Speaker 1: laughed about how stupid architects are, even though Georgia an architect. 323 00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:51,840 Speaker 1: I think we may have hammered it out here live 324 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:56,520 Speaker 1: on the episode. So if physicians did not pull teeth. 325 00:18:56,880 --> 00:19:01,160 Speaker 1: That was left to a couple of other people professions. 326 00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:05,520 Speaker 1: One was called a tooth drawer, uh, not a tooth drawer. 327 00:19:06,280 --> 00:19:09,320 Speaker 1: And the first reference I found that this was Peter 328 00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:12,400 Speaker 1: of London in thirteen twenty. Okay, you're a better researcher 329 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:15,879 Speaker 1: than I am. That's not true, but it is Chuck, 330 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:18,119 Speaker 1: at least in this case, it is very true because 331 00:19:18,160 --> 00:19:20,080 Speaker 1: I tried. I looked high and low and did not 332 00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 1: turn that up to find them. Two drawers drawers from 333 00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:26,240 Speaker 1: the Middle Ages. Well, I think they started in the 334 00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:28,879 Speaker 1: thirteen hundreds, but I do think you're right in that 335 00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:31,840 Speaker 1: they had their sort of apex probably in like the 336 00:19:31,920 --> 00:19:36,439 Speaker 1: seventeen and eighteen hundreds, because and we'll explain what they are. 337 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:41,080 Speaker 1: They are exactly the character that uh what's his face 338 00:19:41,119 --> 00:19:45,919 Speaker 1: played in Christoph Waltz in Django unchained. Yes, when he 339 00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:50,159 Speaker 1: played the dentist, he now he would have been he 340 00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:52,560 Speaker 1: was kind of like a tooth drawer. No, he definitely was. 341 00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:55,920 Speaker 1: He was. He was an itinerant dentist for sure. Um 342 00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:58,359 Speaker 1: And yes, he he was like a more tooth drawer 343 00:19:58,400 --> 00:20:02,200 Speaker 1: than what you would consider a dentist in today's standards. 344 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:05,960 Speaker 1: But I also have the impression that tooth drawers were 345 00:20:05,960 --> 00:20:10,919 Speaker 1: way more like showman like, um, much less scrupulous and 346 00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:13,320 Speaker 1: and like refined, and they were just kind of like 347 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:17,560 Speaker 1: well like Charlotte Charlottean's and actually the word Charlatan is 348 00:20:17,600 --> 00:20:21,720 Speaker 1: the Italian for tooth drawer. Yeah, I thought that that's 349 00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:23,879 Speaker 1: who that character was, though we just didn't get to 350 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:27,719 Speaker 1: see him practice that much. I see, I see, okay, 351 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:30,000 Speaker 1: because he wasn't doing dentistry in the movie, but he 352 00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:33,399 Speaker 1: rolled through with that you know, big old tooth on 353 00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:37,359 Speaker 1: the spring of his buggy, which is pretty fun. But 354 00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:39,640 Speaker 1: I'm sure at the very least Tarantino, you know, sort 355 00:20:39,680 --> 00:20:42,960 Speaker 1: of based it on this practice, which was they would 356 00:20:43,119 --> 00:20:47,400 Speaker 1: come into town. They were sort of part entertainer, part um, 357 00:20:47,440 --> 00:20:50,600 Speaker 1: not even part dentist, because what they really were were 358 00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:56,600 Speaker 1: just people with enough uh verve to take pliers and 359 00:20:56,680 --> 00:20:59,760 Speaker 1: yanka tooth out of somebody's mouth. Yeah, and they on 360 00:20:59,840 --> 00:21:02,320 Speaker 1: a stage, yes, on a stage, and they would be 361 00:21:02,359 --> 00:21:06,679 Speaker 1: surrounded by a band maybe depending on um, you know 362 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:09,879 Speaker 1: what errow we're talking about, they would uh might they 363 00:21:09,960 --> 00:21:14,960 Speaker 1: might have jugglers and acrobats like they basically like surrounded 364 00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:17,960 Speaker 1: themselves with a circus and the main attraction, the main 365 00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:21,919 Speaker 1: event was the pulling of teeth, and it would just 366 00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:23,960 Speaker 1: be like one after the other, come on up here. 367 00:21:24,240 --> 00:21:26,920 Speaker 1: And that was a lot of times your only option, 368 00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:29,840 Speaker 1: depending on where you lived, was to wait around for 369 00:21:29,920 --> 00:21:33,280 Speaker 1: the tooth drawer to come along and hopefully pull your teeth, 370 00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:36,239 Speaker 1: or again, like we talked about before, you might have 371 00:21:36,400 --> 00:21:40,480 Speaker 1: somebody in town who was a blacksmith or a goldsmith 372 00:21:41,080 --> 00:21:43,440 Speaker 1: um who would be willing to pull teeth and maybe 373 00:21:43,480 --> 00:21:46,720 Speaker 1: even made like some sort of primitive dental appliances to 374 00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:49,440 Speaker 1: to replace the pulled tooth what with, So you would 375 00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:51,159 Speaker 1: go see him, they pull the tooth and then they 376 00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:54,040 Speaker 1: put like a I don't know, an iron tooth in 377 00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:56,560 Speaker 1: in its place or something like that. But that was 378 00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:59,600 Speaker 1: your options for a very long time. Yeah, and I 379 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:01,800 Speaker 1: think the tooth drawer that you know, the purpose of 380 00:22:01,840 --> 00:22:05,840 Speaker 1: the band was to distract people from the pain, the 381 00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:08,480 Speaker 1: howling pain. So the band would they would literally tap 382 00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:11,200 Speaker 1: on the stage louder for the band to play louder 383 00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:13,760 Speaker 1: when it got more intense, and they would, you know, 384 00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:16,080 Speaker 1: they would dope them up with like liquor or something, 385 00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:19,199 Speaker 1: and part of it was to like pull teeth but 386 00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:20,920 Speaker 1: not like, hey, I want to pull fifty teeth in 387 00:22:20,960 --> 00:22:22,280 Speaker 1: this sound to make money. I think it was like 388 00:22:22,320 --> 00:22:25,159 Speaker 1: fifty cents of tooth. It was mainly, I think, to 389 00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:28,200 Speaker 1: sell the tonics and the salves and all that snake 390 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:30,280 Speaker 1: oil stuff that came along with it as well. Yeah 391 00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:33,639 Speaker 1: that's where they get you. That's totally where they get you. 392 00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:36,199 Speaker 1: Still where they get you. Yeah, so so okay, So 393 00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:40,320 Speaker 1: tooth drawers were medieval, but that's really impressive that they 394 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:44,280 Speaker 1: lasted until the eighteenth century. They were They were around 395 00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 1: for a really long time. One of the problems was 396 00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:51,520 Speaker 1: that not only were they Charlatan's like one of their techniques. 397 00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:54,359 Speaker 1: When they came into town, the first person they would 398 00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:56,600 Speaker 1: call on was like a plant who was working with 399 00:22:56,680 --> 00:22:58,760 Speaker 1: them and would come up with like a tooth in 400 00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:01,359 Speaker 1: their mouth already, and the dentists would pretend to just 401 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:03,639 Speaker 1: painlessly pull it, and they'd spit this tooth out and 402 00:23:03,800 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 1: there you go. And then all of a sudden, everybody 403 00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:08,000 Speaker 1: who actually did have tooth paint would be willing to 404 00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:10,960 Speaker 1: come up on stage. They were hucksters. There were from 405 00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:13,879 Speaker 1: what I saw, actual like legit ones who cared about 406 00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:17,359 Speaker 1: people and wanted to ease suffering that Christoph Waltz is 407 00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:21,119 Speaker 1: of the tooth drars, but there were plenty. For the 408 00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:24,760 Speaker 1: most part, they were generally viewed as carneys, like you 409 00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:27,879 Speaker 1: didn't you didn't you know, you didn't like talk openly 410 00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:29,720 Speaker 1: about how much money you had in your wallet around 411 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:33,119 Speaker 1: him kind of thing. Right, Um, And you know, at 412 00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:34,919 Speaker 1: the beginning of this section we mentioned that there were 413 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,200 Speaker 1: a couple of types of people would do it because 414 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:40,800 Speaker 1: physicians wouldn't. The tooth roar was one, and then the 415 00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:44,919 Speaker 1: barber surgeon was the other. If you've ever seen the 416 00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:47,480 Speaker 1: great Saturday Night Live skit from years ago with Steve 417 00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:50,919 Speaker 1: Martin as Theodoric of York, one of the great all 418 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:53,760 Speaker 1: time skits, I don't think i've seen that one. He 419 00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:56,000 Speaker 1: was a barber and as you know, of course, everything 420 00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:57,479 Speaker 1: that comes in there, and he's like, you just need 421 00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:00,640 Speaker 1: a good bleeding, Like Bill Murray came men with both 422 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:03,359 Speaker 1: of his legs broken off and just blood everywhere, and 423 00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:07,520 Speaker 1: he's like, you need a bleeding. He's like, I'm already bleeding. Uh. 424 00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:11,760 Speaker 1: It's good stuff. But um. Barbering was first introduced in 425 00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:15,480 Speaker 1: Rome and about two nineties six, and they think that 426 00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:18,680 Speaker 1: they got into dentistry some because they already had the tools, 427 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:23,119 Speaker 1: like sharp things basically. Uh. And eventually they would split. 428 00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:27,520 Speaker 1: Barber surgeons would split up in seventy. But before that 429 00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:31,080 Speaker 1: they were literally barbers and surgeons. They would cut hair 430 00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:35,160 Speaker 1: and stuff and also cut you open if they needed to. Yeah. 431 00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 1: But when they split off, it's not like the barber 432 00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:42,600 Speaker 1: surgeons stopped cutting you open. They would still do limb amputations. 433 00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:46,439 Speaker 1: They would do bleedings like blood lighting with leeches. They 434 00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:49,920 Speaker 1: would do um, tooth pulling, um. And they would also 435 00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:52,239 Speaker 1: shave you and give you a haircut. It was like 436 00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:55,359 Speaker 1: the other stuff that the medical surgeons who went to 437 00:24:55,480 --> 00:25:00,080 Speaker 1: the universities, the earlier universities for training, um, that's what 438 00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:02,320 Speaker 1: they kind of kept as their own. They became the 439 00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:05,479 Speaker 1: physicians where the barber surgeons were, you know, doing like 440 00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:10,360 Speaker 1: stuff anybody could do, you know, like amputating a limb. Right, 441 00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:14,320 Speaker 1: And the theodoric of York Bit is appropriate here because 442 00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:16,800 Speaker 1: that's sort of what you know, the whole blood letting 443 00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:20,000 Speaker 1: and bleeding thing was they were. They would bleed people 444 00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:23,359 Speaker 1: for all kinds of things, including tooth pain. Um. They 445 00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:25,679 Speaker 1: would say, you know, I think all the way up 446 00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:29,480 Speaker 1: until like the first half of the eight hundreds. If 447 00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:32,240 Speaker 1: you had a cavity or something, they would bleed you first, 448 00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:35,760 Speaker 1: like first thing. It was just a matter of course. Yeah, 449 00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:39,040 Speaker 1: And Dave turned up UM. As late as nineteen seventeen, 450 00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:42,480 Speaker 1: a guy named Charles Edmund Kells, who was respected for 451 00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:46,879 Speaker 1: dentistry UM wrote a treatise on how to um put 452 00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:50,480 Speaker 1: how to direct leeches to a specific spot on the gums, 453 00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:54,200 Speaker 1: to that part of the gums. And I looked into 454 00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:57,360 Speaker 1: my great astonishment, Chuck, we have not done an episode 455 00:25:57,359 --> 00:25:59,439 Speaker 1: on leeches, and by god, we are going to do 456 00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:03,600 Speaker 1: an episode. Really. I know. We didn't want to medical leeches, right, 457 00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:07,159 Speaker 1: we did a bizarre medical treatments episode and that was 458 00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:08,760 Speaker 1: in there, and it was in there, but I mean 459 00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:14,280 Speaker 1: it's perfect. It's like weird medical stuff animal episode. It's 460 00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:19,119 Speaker 1: got it all. It's yeah to the movie leeches. Gotta 461 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,200 Speaker 1: talk about stand by me? Oh yeah, yeah, that movie, 462 00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:24,600 Speaker 1: but also leeches too. Was there a movie called Leeches? 463 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:26,439 Speaker 1: I'm sure there was. And I think I had an 464 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:29,720 Speaker 1: exclamation exclamation point. Well, I'll tell you what. If there's 465 00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:33,199 Speaker 1: not that movie, we'll do that movie too, Okay, like 466 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:36,760 Speaker 1: we'll make it ourselves. Yeah, starring us, written directed by us. 467 00:26:36,800 --> 00:26:39,800 Speaker 1: The whole deal. This sounds awesome. We could we could 468 00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:41,840 Speaker 1: just go back and use our This Day in History 469 00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:44,320 Speaker 1: series and just dub in new dialogue and call it 470 00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:48,440 Speaker 1: as right. Um. So the tools that they would use, 471 00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:50,760 Speaker 1: this is where I went to that Georgian All Things 472 00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:53,720 Speaker 1: Georgian website. There were all kinds of things. It was 473 00:26:53,760 --> 00:26:57,080 Speaker 1: something called a dental pelican. All these were sort of 474 00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:00,480 Speaker 1: versions of forceps. At the end of the day. Uh, 475 00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:03,800 Speaker 1: the pelican looks I was sort of like ice tongs, 476 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:05,920 Speaker 1: like for big blocks of ice. I couldn't make heads 477 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:08,399 Speaker 1: or tails of how it used. I don't know. I 478 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:12,760 Speaker 1: mean there's something called a dental key, which um could 479 00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:15,080 Speaker 1: be used to either lever out your tooth or just 480 00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:17,280 Speaker 1: break it into pieces. That was the one that made 481 00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:21,080 Speaker 1: me feel first faint. So George the Third's operator for 482 00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:25,520 Speaker 1: the teeth, Thomas Bird Moore, uh wrote some stuff in 483 00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:29,200 Speaker 1: his Tristas on the disorders and Deformities of the teeth 484 00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:31,840 Speaker 1: and gums in seventeen seventy and he talked about this 485 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:34,159 Speaker 1: lady that came in that had, you know, had a 486 00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:35,800 Speaker 1: bad tooth that needed to be pulled. One of our 487 00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:39,800 Speaker 1: upper molars and he said that after some work, he 488 00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,200 Speaker 1: brought away the affected tooth together with a piece of 489 00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:46,800 Speaker 1: jawbone as big as a walnut and three neighboring molars. Lord. Yeah, 490 00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:48,960 Speaker 1: so that was I'm glad you said that. I ran 491 00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:51,280 Speaker 1: into that all over the place. One of the problems 492 00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:57,520 Speaker 1: with pre trained dentistry, um, where there was like actual 493 00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:02,479 Speaker 1: like science based treatments and stuff like that when you 494 00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,320 Speaker 1: had your tooth pulled, like there was a really good 495 00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:09,280 Speaker 1: chance that a chunk of the bone and like your 496 00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:11,800 Speaker 1: your jaw was going to come out along with it 497 00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:14,760 Speaker 1: because they didn't know what they were doing, and um, 498 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:16,679 Speaker 1: like do you could die from it? Like a lot 499 00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:20,000 Speaker 1: of people actually died from an infection that was brought 500 00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:24,520 Speaker 1: on by a badly pulled tooth, a botched tooth tooth drawing. Yeah, 501 00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:26,520 Speaker 1: this is um. I mean, it's sad, but it's kind 502 00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:28,960 Speaker 1: of funny too because it was so long ago. But 503 00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:33,280 Speaker 1: the Bill of mortality in London in sixteen, Uh what 504 00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:36,000 Speaker 1: the number five cause of death on the bill of mortality? 505 00:28:36,040 --> 00:28:40,720 Speaker 1: It was just teeth, That's all you need to say. 506 00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:44,760 Speaker 1: That's it. They were apparently a hundred and eleven people 507 00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:48,920 Speaker 1: in London died from infections in one week, um, brought 508 00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:53,000 Speaker 1: on by botch dental dental pullings. Again, we don't mean 509 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:56,920 Speaker 1: to be laughing, but uh, comedy is tragedy perfect plus time. Right. Yeah, 510 00:28:57,080 --> 00:28:59,200 Speaker 1: I know exactly what you mean. I've got one that's 511 00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:03,080 Speaker 1: coming up that I just can't help. Okay, So we 512 00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:08,760 Speaker 1: finally have reached that eighteenth century where that's interestingly, that's 513 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:11,680 Speaker 1: the heyday of the tooth drawers that we described, like 514 00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:14,440 Speaker 1: where they roll into town with like a circus around 515 00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:18,160 Speaker 1: him and everything. The early eighteenth century was when they 516 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:21,760 Speaker 1: were really doing that up. Um. But at the same time, 517 00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:25,200 Speaker 1: this is also the origin of dentistry as we understand 518 00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:28,040 Speaker 1: it today, like modern dentistry. And there are two guys 519 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:32,560 Speaker 1: that are typically pointed to as the um the fathers 520 00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:38,040 Speaker 1: of dentistry. One is a Frenchman named Pierre Fauchard, Yeah, 521 00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:41,760 Speaker 1: and the other is that an American named green Vardamin Black, 522 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:47,480 Speaker 1: which is a pretty cool name. G BB. Yeah, two 523 00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:50,440 Speaker 1: colors in your name, that is impressive. You don't see 524 00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:54,680 Speaker 1: that very often. Like his name is Green Black, Yeah, 525 00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:56,880 Speaker 1: I never thought about that. Well, you just heard his 526 00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:59,280 Speaker 1: name recently. You know what you get when you mixed 527 00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:03,200 Speaker 1: green and black, like black I think black, right, Yeah, 528 00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:07,360 Speaker 1: so you could just call him black. So Pierre Fourchard 529 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:10,160 Speaker 1: he uh. He pioneered a lot of things. But one 530 00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:12,000 Speaker 1: of the funny things that you never really think about 531 00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:14,760 Speaker 1: as far as an advancement was literally just putting people 532 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:19,480 Speaker 1: in an armchair to work on them. Apparently before then 533 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,200 Speaker 1: they would lay people on the floor and I guess 534 00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:25,880 Speaker 1: get on their knees. The dentist would and put their 535 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:28,880 Speaker 1: head between their knees and like hold it between their 536 00:30:28,960 --> 00:30:31,320 Speaker 1: knees and thighs to keep it steady because it was 537 00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:35,320 Speaker 1: such an awful thing. Yes, I mean that that was dentistry. Yeah, 538 00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:38,000 Speaker 1: so it really was like cutting edge to be like, 539 00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:40,280 Speaker 1: how about you just make yourself comfortable in this chair 540 00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:43,800 Speaker 1: and I'll stand under you instead and me comfortable, right. Um. 541 00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:46,800 Speaker 1: And that wasn't the extent of Fouchard's contributions. He was 542 00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:51,280 Speaker 1: the first to to create like evidence based treatments. Um, 543 00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:54,360 Speaker 1: he didn't. He just kind of pooh pooed the idea 544 00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:57,920 Speaker 1: of just following tradition. He felt tradition was probably not 545 00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:00,880 Speaker 1: so great and he wanted to do a apply science 546 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:04,000 Speaker 1: and and um ration rationalism, I guess to the to 547 00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:08,800 Speaker 1: the whole pursuit of treating people's teeth problems. Um. He 548 00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:14,520 Speaker 1: also got really good at um creating um like prosthetics 549 00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:19,320 Speaker 1: like dentures and things like that that he would string together. Um. 550 00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:23,600 Speaker 1: He also was um known for introducing a lot of 551 00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:25,800 Speaker 1: the dental tools. I don't know if he invented all 552 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:28,480 Speaker 1: of them, but he he organized and categorized him and 553 00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:31,320 Speaker 1: basically his treatise, I think it was a two volume 554 00:31:31,360 --> 00:31:35,280 Speaker 1: work that spanned eight hundred pages, basically set down like 555 00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:39,840 Speaker 1: here's how you be like a legitimate dentist, seventeen fifties style. 556 00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:44,400 Speaker 1: And a lot of his his observations were so um 557 00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:47,480 Speaker 1: they were just accurate that they still hold hold true today. 558 00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:50,760 Speaker 1: Although I've seen his his work as being described as primitive, 559 00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:55,280 Speaker 1: but he was. That's what pioneers do, They produced accurate 560 00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:59,560 Speaker 1: primitive work. What about green Black? Was he basically in 561 00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:02,520 Speaker 1: the same out. I didn't see a lot about him. 562 00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:04,600 Speaker 1: I didn't do a lot of research on green Black. 563 00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:07,440 Speaker 1: I just saw that both of them tend to be 564 00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:12,200 Speaker 1: tied together as they kind of split that um that 565 00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:15,640 Speaker 1: that name is the father. Yeah. I saw much more 566 00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:20,920 Speaker 1: on Fochard. Uh should we take a break now, all right? 567 00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:26,520 Speaker 1: We'll take a break and we'll talk about anesthetics and toothbrushes, toothpaste, 568 00:32:26,840 --> 00:32:49,800 Speaker 1: all that good stuff right after this. So, now, Chuck, 569 00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:52,800 Speaker 1: we finally reached the point where dentistry doesn't have to 570 00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:55,040 Speaker 1: be the worst thing that ever happened to you in 571 00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:58,120 Speaker 1: your entire life? Then why is it the worst thing 572 00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:01,760 Speaker 1: that happens to me? Be as you're failing to imagine 573 00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:04,600 Speaker 1: how bad it could be? All right, I got you. Well, 574 00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:06,960 Speaker 1: like we should thank our lucky stars that we were 575 00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:09,200 Speaker 1: born into an era where there's such a thing as 576 00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:12,680 Speaker 1: an anesthetics. Yeah, I mean they did their best back 577 00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:15,120 Speaker 1: in the day. Like we mentioned earlier, they were using plants, 578 00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:20,080 Speaker 1: they're using night shades, they're using opium, hashish, uh, kind 579 00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:21,840 Speaker 1: of whatever they could get their hands on to make 580 00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:24,760 Speaker 1: people feel a little better while you're doing this horrific 581 00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:28,360 Speaker 1: stuff party at the dentist's office. That's right, Uh, you 582 00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:30,280 Speaker 1: would use That's still the best part of when I 583 00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:33,920 Speaker 1: get my implants. You know that like twelve seconds of 584 00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:36,760 Speaker 1: bliss of what do you get? Do they give you 585 00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:41,520 Speaker 1: nitrous twilight sleep? Okay, wow, that's good stuff. Huh And 586 00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:44,720 Speaker 1: with that huh, yeah, you get the I V and 587 00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:47,800 Speaker 1: about eight seconds of you know, the best part of 588 00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:50,760 Speaker 1: your week, and then you wake up in your mouth 589 00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:53,760 Speaker 1: is a little sore, like when you're when you're counting backwards. 590 00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:57,160 Speaker 1: You're like, oh man, they know I'm totally wasted. I know, 591 00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:01,400 Speaker 1: and they're making fun of me. Uh so sleep Sponges 592 00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:04,640 Speaker 1: was another thing they used. They would soak sponges in 593 00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:08,840 Speaker 1: him luck again, opium, man drake whatever they had, and 594 00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:10,360 Speaker 1: then dry it out in the sun and then it 595 00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:12,839 Speaker 1: was just kind of there at your disposal, and when 596 00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:14,759 Speaker 1: you wanted to use it, you would just activate it 597 00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:17,600 Speaker 1: by dipping it in some water, put under their nostrils 598 00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:22,960 Speaker 1: and there you go, goodbye, good night. Um. I also 599 00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:24,759 Speaker 1: didn't know this, and apparently a lot of people don't, 600 00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:27,760 Speaker 1: because I saw it mentioned here there, but nobody seemed 601 00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:31,399 Speaker 1: to have much detail about it. But ether Um, which 602 00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:34,440 Speaker 1: I squarely placed in the nineteenth century, as far as 603 00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:38,279 Speaker 1: anti sex go, was usually known to humans from the 604 00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:41,040 Speaker 1: twelve hundreds. I didn't know that. Yeah, there was an 605 00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:45,240 Speaker 1: alchemist named Raymond Lollis or Raman Lowly. He was Spanish, 606 00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:47,880 Speaker 1: but he was an alchemist, and he somehow stumbled onto 607 00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:51,120 Speaker 1: ether I could not get the details, but he saw that, like, oh, 608 00:34:51,160 --> 00:34:55,080 Speaker 1: this is really good at painkilling. He called it sweet vitriol. 609 00:34:55,680 --> 00:34:59,040 Speaker 1: But um, apparently it was just lost. The knowledge was 610 00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:03,480 Speaker 1: lost to Stree for about five six years, which is 611 00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:05,640 Speaker 1: that's an example of why the Middle Ages or that 612 00:35:05,719 --> 00:35:07,960 Speaker 1: shouldn't be called the Dark Ages or the Middle Ages, 613 00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:11,040 Speaker 1: like that was a discovery. It's just that at the 614 00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:16,759 Speaker 1: time everybody was too stupid to spread that information. I guess, right. Uh. 615 00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:21,160 Speaker 1: And then finally in the seventeen seventies we come upon 616 00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:25,560 Speaker 1: one of the greatest discoveries, nitrous oxide, which is so 617 00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:28,279 Speaker 1: great we did a whole episode on it, so we 618 00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:30,240 Speaker 1: don't really need to go over all of this again. 619 00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:32,600 Speaker 1: But one of the things I don't even know if 620 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:35,399 Speaker 1: we mentioned back then, because I feel like I would 621 00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:38,479 Speaker 1: have remembered this. But one of the young scientists early 622 00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:41,840 Speaker 1: on who was practicing with it, named Humphrey Davy, uh, 623 00:35:42,120 --> 00:35:44,480 Speaker 1: would put it in a sack to huff and he 624 00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:50,000 Speaker 1: called them paradise bags. What a great name. I think 625 00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:53,319 Speaker 1: I remember saying that. Well, there were you know, the 626 00:35:53,360 --> 00:35:55,440 Speaker 1: long and short of nitris is it sort of came 627 00:35:55,480 --> 00:35:59,400 Speaker 1: and went over the years with various successful demonstrations in 628 00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:02,160 Speaker 1: front of groups of doctors in Dennis, so I'm not 629 00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:04,759 Speaker 1: so successful in front of big groups, and so it 630 00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:07,800 Speaker 1: kind of ebbed and flowed in popularity as a result. Yeah, 631 00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:12,319 Speaker 1: Horace Wells um famously botched the demonstration that set um 632 00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:17,239 Speaker 1: nitrous oxide back a good twenty years basically, but a 633 00:36:17,280 --> 00:36:23,719 Speaker 1: couple of years after that, one of his students, UM W. T. G. Morton, said, Hey, everybody, 634 00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:28,040 Speaker 1: you thought nitrous oxide was something, check out ether And 635 00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:33,359 Speaker 1: he introduced ether um through a demonstration and showed how 636 00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:36,880 Speaker 1: somebody could have a tumor removed without even batting an eyelash, 637 00:36:36,920 --> 00:36:39,719 Speaker 1: and everybody was like, Okay, this ether is pretty good. 638 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:43,520 Speaker 1: So either ether sotoaked rags were a UM for a 639 00:36:43,600 --> 00:36:46,359 Speaker 1: very long time and anesthetic used in surgery but also 640 00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:50,279 Speaker 1: dentistry too. And then laughing gas kind of UM came 641 00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:55,160 Speaker 1: back about like twenty years after wells is botched demonstration. 642 00:36:55,480 --> 00:37:00,359 Speaker 1: So by the late nineteenth century, the mid late nineteenth century, 643 00:37:00,560 --> 00:37:04,399 Speaker 1: UM we had two very powerful anesthetics that just completely 644 00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:08,360 Speaker 1: changed the course of dentistry and I think allowed people 645 00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:12,000 Speaker 1: to start being like, Okay, I'll I'm willing to start 646 00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:15,040 Speaker 1: like actually going to see a dentist now if they've 647 00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:18,319 Speaker 1: got this stuff to offer, right, and so they said, 648 00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:20,160 Speaker 1: you know it would be even better is if we 649 00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:24,560 Speaker 1: gave them cocaine. Uh. And there was a dentist, an 650 00:37:24,560 --> 00:37:28,200 Speaker 1: American named William Stewart Halstead, who was the first person. 651 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:31,680 Speaker 1: I guess you know, they noticed, hey, when we're when 652 00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:33,359 Speaker 1: we're taking this stuff and we put it in our mouth, 653 00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:35,640 Speaker 1: it makes our mouth numb. So maybe we can use 654 00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:39,360 Speaker 1: it for dentistry. Right, and so somebody this in the bathroom, 655 00:37:40,600 --> 00:37:42,440 Speaker 1: that's right, and they're like, oh god, this's got such 656 00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:45,319 Speaker 1: a bore. Uh, they injected He was the first one 657 00:37:45,360 --> 00:37:48,279 Speaker 1: to inject it into the patient's gum and jaw for 658 00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:51,520 Speaker 1: pain relief. And so that, you know, following that forward, 659 00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:56,880 Speaker 1: there were a lot of cocaine based toothache remedies. Obviously, Um, 660 00:37:56,920 --> 00:37:59,719 Speaker 1: you know, cocaine had the dark side, so uh, they 661 00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:04,440 Speaker 1: placed it with new cocaine or no vocane and some 662 00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:07,560 Speaker 1: other you know, non addictive pain relievers. But for a 663 00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:10,880 Speaker 1: while there, cocaine was certainly used in dentistry. Yeah. Apparently 664 00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:15,400 Speaker 1: Halsted said that he lost three assistance to cocaine addiction. 665 00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:19,480 Speaker 1: And Dave puts like they actually died and I was 666 00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:23,320 Speaker 1: just thinking, like I can just imagine Halstead like hearing 667 00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:25,680 Speaker 1: like a thump in the other room and just being 668 00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:30,040 Speaker 1: like another one. Can you just imagine like losing three 669 00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:34,040 Speaker 1: of your assistance to overdose deaths from cocaine, shooting up 670 00:38:34,080 --> 00:38:36,239 Speaker 1: cocaine and and like you're just trying to do your 671 00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:39,480 Speaker 1: dentistry practice. And then he threw him in his convertible 672 00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:43,319 Speaker 1: and drove him over to Eric Stoltz's house, right, and 673 00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:47,280 Speaker 1: it all worked out. Man. We got pop culture flying 674 00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:50,279 Speaker 1: all over the place today too. Uh So, now we're 675 00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:53,360 Speaker 1: at toothbrushes and toothpaste sort of a little more in 676 00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:56,080 Speaker 1: earnest in that they you know, we kind of talked 677 00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:58,120 Speaker 1: about the ancient stuff that they would use these tree 678 00:38:58,680 --> 00:39:02,399 Speaker 1: um uh wigs and stuff like that. Gwyneth Paltrow, Yeah, 679 00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:06,480 Speaker 1: Gwyneth Paltrow. Um, they they would use cloth. I think 680 00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:10,000 Speaker 1: the Queen of England use cloth and toothpicks until the 681 00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:14,880 Speaker 1: mid nineteenth century. Basically any kind of um manufacturing process 682 00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:17,920 Speaker 1: kind of didn't make it affordable to even make regular toothbrushes, 683 00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:21,359 Speaker 1: so it's cloth and sponge and rinses and stuff like that. 684 00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:25,560 Speaker 1: But I think they eventually worked out the toothbrush and 685 00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:29,160 Speaker 1: they needed something to put on the toothbrush, at which 686 00:39:29,200 --> 00:39:34,000 Speaker 1: point they said, how about just some really strong uh 687 00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:38,200 Speaker 1: scrubbing what's the word I'm looking for? Bubbles? No, like, 688 00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:41,920 Speaker 1: what's the power? Like an abrace of powder, and they 689 00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:44,520 Speaker 1: use stuff like crushed coral and pumice, but that would 690 00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:48,000 Speaker 1: ruin your teeth after a few weeks really quickly, and 691 00:39:48,080 --> 00:39:52,160 Speaker 1: so um toothpaste came along, and it's still followed that 692 00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:58,440 Speaker 1: same pattern where apparently the earliest incarnations of pepsodent had 693 00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:01,320 Speaker 1: um something that was it was an abrasive that you 694 00:40:01,360 --> 00:40:05,080 Speaker 1: could actually cut glass with. And there was another one, 695 00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:09,120 Speaker 1: another toothpaste called tartar Off, that had hydrochloric acid in it. 696 00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:12,000 Speaker 1: Tartar Off for sure, I mean it would make your 697 00:40:12,040 --> 00:40:14,200 Speaker 1: teeth white, for sure, but then it would eventually wear 698 00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:17,200 Speaker 1: them down to nubs in like a few months. You know. Yeah, 699 00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:19,080 Speaker 1: I think it took a while to kind of um 700 00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:23,800 Speaker 1: find the right balance between protecting the teeth and cleaning 701 00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:25,440 Speaker 1: the teeth at the same time. Yeah, And I mean 702 00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:27,919 Speaker 1: there's still abrasives in your toothpaste today. They've just gotten 703 00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:30,360 Speaker 1: a lot better at getting it just the right amount 704 00:40:30,400 --> 00:40:32,920 Speaker 1: so that, yeah, it doesn't wear your enamel down baking 705 00:40:32,920 --> 00:40:35,160 Speaker 1: soda and stuff like that, right, yeah, And I ran 706 00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:37,640 Speaker 1: across something and I think the A d A website. 707 00:40:37,960 --> 00:40:43,880 Speaker 1: Um that in America, toothpaste and brushing your teeth in 708 00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:47,280 Speaker 1: general did not become widespread. It wasn't like the norm 709 00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:50,720 Speaker 1: until after World War Two. And it was because American 710 00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:55,360 Speaker 1: g i's returned from Europe saying, hey, it's crazy. Everybody 711 00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:58,520 Speaker 1: over in Europe has like actually like nice breath and 712 00:40:58,560 --> 00:41:00,520 Speaker 1: this is how they do it. And that's when it 713 00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:03,319 Speaker 1: really took off from what I and yeah, very cool, 714 00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:06,160 Speaker 1: Yeah it is. It is cool in a way, but 715 00:41:06,239 --> 00:41:08,680 Speaker 1: also like wow in another way, like these are my 716 00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:13,879 Speaker 1: grandparents were talking about. Right, Uh, the greatest generation, that's right, 717 00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:18,480 Speaker 1: the greatest generation. Uh. We can dispel the myth that 718 00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:22,440 Speaker 1: George Washington had wooden teeth. Uh, he had terrible teeth 719 00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:25,280 Speaker 1: and he had a really bad time with his teeth. Uh. 720 00:41:25,320 --> 00:41:27,680 Speaker 1: So he did have fake teeth, but they were I 721 00:41:27,719 --> 00:41:30,520 Speaker 1: think the bases were made from ivory and tusk and 722 00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:34,160 Speaker 1: stuff like that, but the human the teeth were actually 723 00:41:34,239 --> 00:41:37,800 Speaker 1: human teeth. They were from We talked about grave robbing 724 00:41:37,920 --> 00:41:40,879 Speaker 1: in the live episode that we did. They would grave 725 00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:43,440 Speaker 1: rob for teeth. Good teeth. They would people poor people 726 00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:46,000 Speaker 1: that had decent teeth would sell their teeth for money. 727 00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:50,000 Speaker 1: They actually documented that he paid his slaves for teeth, which, 728 00:41:50,040 --> 00:41:51,680 Speaker 1: on the one hand, you're like, oh, that's pretty cool 729 00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:54,080 Speaker 1: he actually paid his slaves rather than said, go bring 730 00:41:54,120 --> 00:41:57,000 Speaker 1: me some of my slaves teeth. But at the same time, 731 00:41:57,040 --> 00:41:58,719 Speaker 1: I was reading about it and they were like, it 732 00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:00,920 Speaker 1: doesn't matter really what he paid him, unless it was 733 00:42:00,960 --> 00:42:04,160 Speaker 1: just some eye popping amount. It's still like it's an 734 00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:10,680 Speaker 1: inherently inequitable transaction. But um, I do feel bad for 735 00:42:10,719 --> 00:42:15,480 Speaker 1: George Washington in that. Um he he apparently kind of 736 00:42:15,520 --> 00:42:18,640 Speaker 1: suffered with his teeth. Like, there's nobody, especially in America, 737 00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:21,200 Speaker 1: whose teeth have ever been talked about and written about 738 00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:25,640 Speaker 1: more than George Washington. You are a close second, but 739 00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:29,799 Speaker 1: he's definitely the first, first place winner. And um he 740 00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:33,799 Speaker 1: apparently one of the reasons why he wore dentures and 741 00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:36,560 Speaker 1: like kind of suffered through this and and and insisted 742 00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:40,719 Speaker 1: on wearing them all the time was because his he 743 00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:42,960 Speaker 1: was the face of this new nation. He was the 744 00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:47,000 Speaker 1: first president, right and at the time it was it 745 00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:52,480 Speaker 1: was um his vitality, his health, his strength was basically 746 00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:56,160 Speaker 1: the same as the nation's health and strength, and so 747 00:42:56,200 --> 00:42:58,640 Speaker 1: for him to show any kind of weakness or problem 748 00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:02,200 Speaker 1: or disease or anything like that would make people wonder like, oh, 749 00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:05,319 Speaker 1: does that also mean that this new American experiment is 750 00:43:05,360 --> 00:43:08,759 Speaker 1: also diseased and problem as problems And so in a 751 00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:11,200 Speaker 1: way like he really kind of carried this burden for 752 00:43:11,600 --> 00:43:15,160 Speaker 1: the country, for the image of the country. But um, yeah, 753 00:43:15,320 --> 00:43:18,120 Speaker 1: his teeth are he had like no teeth by the 754 00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:19,719 Speaker 1: time he was fifty one. They all fell out, and 755 00:43:19,719 --> 00:43:22,560 Speaker 1: they started falling out when he was in his early twenties. 756 00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:26,239 Speaker 1: I was talking to you because I was like, we've 757 00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:30,640 Speaker 1: seen his teeth, and I thought we both actually thought 758 00:43:30,719 --> 00:43:34,640 Speaker 1: that maybe we saw it at the the Memorial Masonic 759 00:43:34,680 --> 00:43:38,160 Speaker 1: Temple and in Old Town Alexandria. But I don't think 760 00:43:38,160 --> 00:43:40,320 Speaker 1: they're there. So we think we saw him in Mountain 761 00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:42,759 Speaker 1: Vernon because supposedly that's where they are. But both of 762 00:43:42,840 --> 00:43:46,640 Speaker 1: us remember seeing them at that Masonic Temple. I've been 763 00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:48,399 Speaker 1: to Mount Vernon a couple of times. I don't remember 764 00:43:48,440 --> 00:43:51,000 Speaker 1: seeing his teeth, So I wonder if we did see 765 00:43:51,080 --> 00:43:53,439 Speaker 1: his teeth at the Masonic Temple and they moved into 766 00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:56,360 Speaker 1: Mountain Vernon and now I'm looking on the internet. It's like, no, 767 00:43:56,440 --> 00:43:59,440 Speaker 1: they're at Mountain Vernon. Silly. Maybe it was a museum 768 00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:05,719 Speaker 1: of sex. They had George Washington's chattering teeth. So now 769 00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:08,600 Speaker 1: we move on to X rays, which were discovered in 770 00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:13,600 Speaker 1: by German scientists. They started using those on the mouth 771 00:44:13,640 --> 00:44:17,000 Speaker 1: pretty quickly, but a thing kind of popped up early 772 00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:19,399 Speaker 1: on that it ended up being bad and that they 773 00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:22,600 Speaker 1: didn't really know how to read X rays that well, 774 00:44:23,239 --> 00:44:25,920 Speaker 1: at least probably everywhere at first, but at least around 775 00:44:25,960 --> 00:44:30,600 Speaker 1: the mouth. And they discovered these things a condition when 776 00:44:30,600 --> 00:44:32,600 Speaker 1: they would take the teeth in the jaw X rays 777 00:44:33,080 --> 00:44:35,920 Speaker 1: where they would find pockets of infection under the gum line, 778 00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:39,840 Speaker 1: which now we just know are I mean, what is 779 00:44:39,880 --> 00:44:44,080 Speaker 1: that just pockets of infection pus mouth pus. Yeah. Um. 780 00:44:44,120 --> 00:44:48,360 Speaker 1: They called them focal infections. And the problem is is, 781 00:44:48,760 --> 00:44:50,479 Speaker 1: I mean, it's a good thing that they spotted these, 782 00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:52,960 Speaker 1: but they didn't know what they were, so they linked 783 00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:55,200 Speaker 1: it to other stuff and other organs of the bodies, 784 00:44:55,640 --> 00:44:58,960 Speaker 1: sometimes the brain even, and it become it became almost 785 00:44:59,000 --> 00:45:01,680 Speaker 1: like a new version of blood letting in that for 786 00:45:01,719 --> 00:45:04,799 Speaker 1: a while, if you had almost anything going wrong with you, 787 00:45:04,880 --> 00:45:09,319 Speaker 1: sometimes and they showed, uh, these these pockets on the 788 00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:11,759 Speaker 1: X ray. They would just pull your teeth like if 789 00:45:11,760 --> 00:45:14,480 Speaker 1: you had a kidney disorder, they would pull your teeth first. Yeah, 790 00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:17,000 Speaker 1: there was a guy who was apparently one of the 791 00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:21,520 Speaker 1: leading proponents and practitioners of this focal infection hysteria. His 792 00:45:21,600 --> 00:45:25,920 Speaker 1: name was Henry Cotton. He worked at the New Jersey 793 00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:28,560 Speaker 1: State Lunatic Asylum is what they called at the time, 794 00:45:28,920 --> 00:45:32,719 Speaker 1: between nineteen oh seven and nineteen thirty and he he 795 00:45:32,840 --> 00:45:37,440 Speaker 1: and his team pulled eleven thousand human teeth during that time, 796 00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:41,640 Speaker 1: including his own teeth, his wife's teeth, his children's teeth, 797 00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:44,799 Speaker 1: but mostly inmates of this asylum. And the idea was 798 00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:47,080 Speaker 1: that that infection had gone to your brain, so you 799 00:45:47,080 --> 00:45:48,759 Speaker 1: had to pull the teeth out around it to treat 800 00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:52,080 Speaker 1: the infection to cure your mental illness. And it just 801 00:45:52,120 --> 00:45:55,760 Speaker 1: so happens, Chuck, that our good friend, our dear friend, 802 00:45:56,080 --> 00:45:59,719 Speaker 1: beloved friend, John Hodgman played that man on the TV 803 00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:04,040 Speaker 1: show of the Nick Oh, that's true, was that his character? Yeah, 804 00:46:04,120 --> 00:46:07,400 Speaker 1: that guy existed in real life Hodgman's character and I 805 00:46:07,440 --> 00:46:10,360 Speaker 1: read I came across a mention of it in Paste 806 00:46:10,400 --> 00:46:15,200 Speaker 1: magazine said that um Hodgman played Henry Cotton quote with 807 00:46:15,360 --> 00:46:20,000 Speaker 1: perfect offhand authority. I think it's one. But yeah, I 808 00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:22,640 Speaker 1: didn't remember that he was playing Henry Cotton, this guy 809 00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:26,000 Speaker 1: who was just pulling eleven thousand teeth from people over 810 00:46:26,160 --> 00:46:29,160 Speaker 1: twenty three years to cure their mental illness, which is nuts, 811 00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:32,759 Speaker 1: but it actually happened. You have to text him let 812 00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:37,160 Speaker 1: him know we were talking about his acting career. I will. 813 00:46:37,280 --> 00:46:39,319 Speaker 1: I'm sure he'll hear it when this comes out. He 814 00:46:39,400 --> 00:46:42,399 Speaker 1: listens to every episode. The moment that really doesn't, someone 815 00:46:42,440 --> 00:46:45,279 Speaker 1: will let him know. Uh. And then we wind out 816 00:46:45,320 --> 00:46:49,040 Speaker 1: to kind of a guy who um weirdly ended up 817 00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:52,479 Speaker 1: being uh for the wrong reasons, the person who changed 818 00:46:52,560 --> 00:46:55,680 Speaker 1: dentistry for the better, and that he was not a 819 00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:58,839 Speaker 1: good dentist. And he was came along at a time 820 00:46:58,880 --> 00:47:01,520 Speaker 1: when the a d A had just formed in eighteen 821 00:47:01,560 --> 00:47:04,200 Speaker 1: fifty nine. They met at Niagara Falls formed the a 822 00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:07,600 Speaker 1: d A in eighteen sixty six. They said, you can't 823 00:47:08,520 --> 00:47:11,200 Speaker 1: use you can't be a snake oil salesman anymore. You 824 00:47:11,239 --> 00:47:16,640 Speaker 1: can't have these advertisements and personally solicit uh business like 825 00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:18,839 Speaker 1: we gotta we gotta kind of put ourselves up there 826 00:47:18,840 --> 00:47:22,040 Speaker 1: with the doctors guys and not do this stuff. And 827 00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:24,879 Speaker 1: a dude came along that defied all that so much 828 00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:28,520 Speaker 1: so that they really started to sort of codify and 829 00:47:28,560 --> 00:47:30,319 Speaker 1: put that stuff in the rear view mirror. Well, they 830 00:47:30,320 --> 00:47:32,879 Speaker 1: were trying to figure out how to differentiate themselves from 831 00:47:32,880 --> 00:47:35,400 Speaker 1: just people who pulled teeth for a living but didn't 832 00:47:35,400 --> 00:47:39,400 Speaker 1: go to dental school. And it's hard to do that, um. 833 00:47:39,520 --> 00:47:42,640 Speaker 1: And they a way to do that is defined a 834 00:47:42,719 --> 00:47:46,080 Speaker 1: scapegoat and point out how terrible they are, to to 835 00:47:46,320 --> 00:47:49,000 Speaker 1: use them as an example of how great you are, 836 00:47:49,320 --> 00:47:51,239 Speaker 1: right to make yourselves look good. And that's what they 837 00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:55,040 Speaker 1: did with this guy, Edgar Randolph Painless Parker, who was 838 00:47:55,239 --> 00:47:58,319 Speaker 1: very much as snake oil salesman, a charlatan. He was 839 00:47:58,360 --> 00:48:01,680 Speaker 1: of the m of the kind of dentists that he 840 00:48:01,760 --> 00:48:04,400 Speaker 1: actually did go to dental school. But he he was like, 841 00:48:04,600 --> 00:48:07,680 Speaker 1: I'm losing money to these these tooth pullers, these tooth drawers, 842 00:48:07,680 --> 00:48:10,080 Speaker 1: so I'm gonna start advertising again, and I think while 843 00:48:10,080 --> 00:48:12,000 Speaker 1: I'm at it all, start making sneak coil and all 844 00:48:12,040 --> 00:48:14,400 Speaker 1: that stuff. Um. But he was of the school where 845 00:48:14,600 --> 00:48:19,160 Speaker 1: you would just like fill a tooth um with a 846 00:48:19,320 --> 00:48:23,600 Speaker 1: like like amalgam, say mercury or something like that. And um, 847 00:48:23,680 --> 00:48:25,879 Speaker 1: you wouldn't get rid of any of the decay, well 848 00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:28,799 Speaker 1: you would, your face would still rot off regardless. But yes, 849 00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:32,040 Speaker 1: your dental visit was painless because they didn't they didn't 850 00:48:32,080 --> 00:48:35,279 Speaker 1: scrape out any of the cavity to start. Um, that's 851 00:48:35,280 --> 00:48:37,439 Speaker 1: who they were competing against. So they used this guy 852 00:48:37,520 --> 00:48:40,319 Speaker 1: to basically say all this stuff. This guy is doing. 853 00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:43,640 Speaker 1: This guy right here, that's not dentistry. Come over here. 854 00:48:43,840 --> 00:48:46,440 Speaker 1: What we're doing is actual dentistry. It's going to help 855 00:48:46,480 --> 00:48:50,160 Speaker 1: your health. Yeah, and he like, like you said, he 856 00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:52,880 Speaker 1: went to dental school. He went to the Philadelphia Dental College, 857 00:48:53,400 --> 00:48:56,200 Speaker 1: but apparently he literally did not pass, like he would 858 00:48:56,200 --> 00:48:58,799 Speaker 1: not have earned a degree had he not gone, and 859 00:48:58,880 --> 00:49:02,320 Speaker 1: begged the dan to let him through. And I guess 860 00:49:02,320 --> 00:49:05,160 Speaker 1: he sounds like sort of a squeaky wheel kind and 861 00:49:05,200 --> 00:49:06,880 Speaker 1: I think they just wanted to be rid of him, 862 00:49:06,920 --> 00:49:09,480 Speaker 1: so they said, fine, here's your degree. And so that's 863 00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:11,520 Speaker 1: when he went to Canada and sat in an empty 864 00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:14,960 Speaker 1: office because he couldn't he wasn't losing, like patients were 865 00:49:15,000 --> 00:49:17,319 Speaker 1: coming and leaving, like he didn't have any patients to 866 00:49:17,360 --> 00:49:21,400 Speaker 1: begin with. And um, so yeah, he started doing the 867 00:49:21,400 --> 00:49:23,680 Speaker 1: snake whole thing, and he literally went back in time 868 00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:28,440 Speaker 1: to become like a dental drawer and had these big 869 00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:32,120 Speaker 1: sort of tooth pulling events and parties with the band 870 00:49:32,280 --> 00:49:34,800 Speaker 1: just like they were in the heyday in the early 871 00:49:34,840 --> 00:49:39,640 Speaker 1: eighteenth century, same same exact thing. Unbelievable. He also supposedly 872 00:49:39,640 --> 00:49:42,719 Speaker 1: wore a necklace of three hundred and fifty seven extracted 873 00:49:42,719 --> 00:49:48,600 Speaker 1: teeth that he supposedly pulled all in one day, which 874 00:49:48,640 --> 00:49:51,680 Speaker 1: is what I made for a good live show. Oh well, 875 00:49:51,719 --> 00:49:54,400 Speaker 1: let's save it. I don't think so this is all 876 00:49:54,440 --> 00:49:56,400 Speaker 1: the makings of a great live show. Well, there's a 877 00:49:56,440 --> 00:49:59,000 Speaker 1: whole thing. I agreed. There's a whole thing that we 878 00:49:59,080 --> 00:50:01,720 Speaker 1: didn't even get to talk about called the amalgam Wars, 879 00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:03,440 Speaker 1: which I think we're going to do with short stuff 880 00:50:03,440 --> 00:50:06,480 Speaker 1: on because it was pretty interesting too. All right, Okay, 881 00:50:06,800 --> 00:50:09,520 Speaker 1: I'm up. I'm up for it. So that's if for 882 00:50:09,640 --> 00:50:12,640 Speaker 1: now for the history of dentistry. This may be an 883 00:50:12,640 --> 00:50:15,839 Speaker 1: ongoing thing. Who knows? And uh, since I said this 884 00:50:15,880 --> 00:50:18,400 Speaker 1: may be an ongoing thing, who knows? It's time of 885 00:50:18,440 --> 00:50:26,520 Speaker 1: course for listener mail, I'm gonna call this I missed 886 00:50:26,560 --> 00:50:30,040 Speaker 1: opportunity for a pavement reference. Oh yeah, I saw this one. 887 00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:33,520 Speaker 1: Did you see this? This is from Alan Coleman, and 888 00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:35,279 Speaker 1: this is about the Salem witch Trials. And I can't 889 00:50:35,280 --> 00:50:37,920 Speaker 1: believe I walked right past this because this this is 890 00:50:37,960 --> 00:50:39,759 Speaker 1: one of my favorite Pavement songs. He said, Hey, guys, 891 00:50:39,800 --> 00:50:42,040 Speaker 1: love the podcast. I'm not one of those the chairs 892 00:50:42,120 --> 00:50:43,920 Speaker 1: being able to send into correction, so this isn't one 893 00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:46,600 Speaker 1: of those. I listened to Salem Witchcraft Trials and notice 894 00:50:46,640 --> 00:50:50,439 Speaker 1: an unexpected omission being a big pavement in Silver Jeice Fan. 895 00:50:51,040 --> 00:50:52,759 Speaker 1: For the majority of my life, I enjoy hearing your 896 00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:55,040 Speaker 1: references occasionally. So I saw the title and I knew 897 00:50:55,520 --> 00:50:57,880 Speaker 1: that you had mentioned the Pavement song Give It a Day, 898 00:50:57,920 --> 00:51:01,040 Speaker 1: which is about Increase and Cotton Mather. Uh good work. 899 00:51:01,320 --> 00:51:04,839 Speaker 1: Stay alert for those possible Pavement references. And I'm gonna 900 00:51:04,840 --> 00:51:07,480 Speaker 1: read the first verse of that song because I know 901 00:51:07,560 --> 00:51:09,960 Speaker 1: this song and it never really occurred to me. That's 902 00:51:09,960 --> 00:51:12,920 Speaker 1: why I didn't get the ref in the episode. But 903 00:51:13,000 --> 00:51:16,879 Speaker 1: it's kind of the most pavement of all Pavement songs, Uh. 904 00:51:17,000 --> 00:51:19,480 Speaker 1: Increased mother told her dad. By the way he says 905 00:51:19,520 --> 00:51:23,600 Speaker 1: her dad, I roundly disagree with you. Your vocals styles 906 00:51:23,640 --> 00:51:27,160 Speaker 1: too preachy, and the yokels mock your teaching, but Cotton 907 00:51:27,239 --> 00:51:30,200 Speaker 1: he was just so oblivious to all their cutting. Please. 908 00:51:30,600 --> 00:51:32,960 Speaker 1: Soon the town folk took to it, and every pew 909 00:51:32,960 --> 00:51:35,480 Speaker 1: they looked to him for guidance, just like eyeless lambs 910 00:51:35,800 --> 00:51:40,239 Speaker 1: awaiting that old kebab. Stand the skeptics formed the nation's born. 911 00:51:40,719 --> 00:51:43,440 Speaker 1: They want to have it Cotton's dream, but Increase had 912 00:51:43,480 --> 00:51:46,400 Speaker 1: them mounted and they burned on open fires. So the 913 00:51:46,400 --> 00:51:49,719 Speaker 1: words spread, just like smallpox in the Sudan, and the 914 00:51:49,760 --> 00:51:53,000 Speaker 1: gentry cried, give it a day, Give it a day, 915 00:51:53,280 --> 00:51:57,160 Speaker 1: Give it a day. That sounds pretty pavement. You're You're right, 916 00:51:57,760 --> 00:52:00,399 Speaker 1: it's even when you listen to it, it's like it's 917 00:52:00,440 --> 00:52:04,080 Speaker 1: like Steve Malcomus. It is most words, smithy working all 918 00:52:04,160 --> 00:52:10,080 Speaker 1: those words in there album. Uh. I think that was 919 00:52:10,120 --> 00:52:12,200 Speaker 1: from an EP If I'm not mistaken, it wasn't on 920 00:52:12,480 --> 00:52:15,120 Speaker 1: a regular LP. I've definitely not heard that one, but 921 00:52:15,200 --> 00:52:17,280 Speaker 1: thanks to Alan Coleman for that. I walked right past 922 00:52:17,320 --> 00:52:19,279 Speaker 1: that way to go to Bob in Nostanovitch. If you're 923 00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:21,719 Speaker 1: listening there, you go, uh, Well, if you want to 924 00:52:21,719 --> 00:52:23,640 Speaker 1: get in touch with this like Alan did, or if 925 00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:26,200 Speaker 1: you want to say hi and you're Bob Nostandovitch Chuck 926 00:52:26,239 --> 00:52:30,480 Speaker 1: always likes hearing from you, Bob, Please right in. You 927 00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:33,240 Speaker 1: can get in touch with this via email at stuff 928 00:52:33,280 --> 00:52:39,520 Speaker 1: podcast at iHeart radio dot com. Stuff you Should Know 929 00:52:39,640 --> 00:52:42,560 Speaker 1: is a production of iHeart Radio. For more podcasts my 930 00:52:42,600 --> 00:52:46,040 Speaker 1: heart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or 931 00:52:46,040 --> 00:52:47,840 Speaker 1: wherever you listen to your favorite shows.