WEBVTT - 5 | Bully 0:00:09.959 --> 0:00:13.880 If you're listening to a tenor foot TV podcast, Girls. 0:00:17.239 --> 0:00:20.639 Krook County is released weekly and brought to you absolutely free. 0:00:20.840 --> 0:00:23.079 But if you want to hear the whole season right now, 0:00:23.200 --> 0:00:26.840 it's available ad free on tenderfoot Plus. For more information, 0:00:27.080 --> 0:00:35.560 check out the show notes. Enjoy the episode. 0:00:34.480 --> 0:00:38.120 You're listening to Krook County. The views and opinions expressed 0:00:38.120 --> 0:00:41.560 in this podcast are solely those of the individuals participating 0:00:41.600 --> 0:00:45.360 in the podcast. This episode also contains subject matter, including 0:00:45.400 --> 0:00:49.800 graphic depictions of violence, which may not be suitable for everyone. Listener. 0:00:49.839 --> 0:00:51.280 Discretion is advised. 0:00:54.760 --> 0:00:56.840 Previously on Crook. 0:00:56.680 --> 0:00:59.920 County for six months, he proposed to me. 0:01:00.280 --> 0:01:03.560 Kenny, got engaged, called it off only a few months later. 0:01:03.720 --> 0:01:07.359 He realized, at nineteen years old, what am I doing? 0:01:07.560 --> 0:01:11.800 Being a gain aged? The cops organized a few phony busts. 0:01:11.720 --> 0:01:13.320 So I took two of those and the girls would 0:01:13.319 --> 0:01:15.600 come with me and you know, a little party. 0:01:15.639 --> 0:01:18.120 Everybody be laughing, having a good time. And a robbery 0:01:18.160 --> 0:01:20.399 at the club turned out to be an inside job. 0:01:20.600 --> 0:01:24.039 Why Danny was working, He had someone come in and 0:01:24.359 --> 0:01:26.399 robbed the place, so of course Dan's gotta put up 0:01:26.400 --> 0:01:27.679 his arms, take the money and leave. 0:01:28.000 --> 0:01:31.439 Danny had to go, and Kenny was asked to step in. 0:01:31.720 --> 0:01:34.240 Got him in the car and drove him to one 0:01:34.280 --> 0:01:36.800 of the chop shops, dropped him off there, and whatever 0:01:36.840 --> 0:01:37.559 I did with him from. 0:01:37.440 --> 0:01:37.959 There, I don't know. 0:01:40.800 --> 0:01:57.719 I'm your host, Kyle Tequila, Welcome to Crook County. 0:01:58.240 --> 0:02:01.040 When we were growing up, Dad was the coolest guy 0:02:01.120 --> 0:02:05.040 in the whole town. Everybody wanted Dad as their dad, 0:02:05.280 --> 0:02:07.320 but they didn't know what was going on at home. 0:02:07.680 --> 0:02:10.040 The game that they played for me and Ken was 0:02:10.080 --> 0:02:12.239 really bad. There was a loud violence. 0:02:22.600 --> 0:02:24.960 Episode five, Bully. 0:02:27.359 --> 0:02:28.880 You can begin to listen to that crowd. 0:02:28.919 --> 0:02:30.119 They know they can tell. 0:02:30.560 --> 0:02:34.159 Slowly, but surely, the nineteen seventies are disappearing. 0:02:35.519 --> 0:02:54.960 The nineteen eighties will be upon us. He first nineteen 0:02:55.760 --> 0:02:56.519 in America. 0:02:57.000 --> 0:03:00.600 We have a brand new decade. 0:03:00.799 --> 0:03:04.720 It's a whole new beginning. Everybody, please kiss your loved one, Come. 0:03:04.600 --> 0:03:09.000 On, fish, your loved one, your husband, your sweetheart. 0:03:09.480 --> 0:03:12.200 I don't want the last next years, everybody, let's hear it. 0:03:12.919 --> 0:03:18.639 Everybody seen Nixon, Watergate, the end of the Vietnam War, 0:03:19.359 --> 0:03:26.320 a global recession, gas shortages, rolling blackouts, crime waves, record unemployment, 0:03:26.840 --> 0:03:32.079 and the ominous shadow of the Cold War, the nineteen 0:03:32.120 --> 0:03:35.640 seventies was a decade steeped in anxiety and uncertainty, and 0:03:35.680 --> 0:03:41.719 the curtain had been pulled back on the American dream. Hell, 0:03:42.600 --> 0:03:47.720 even Disco was dead. History may label this decade the 0:03:47.840 --> 0:03:51.640 Great Awakening, but for Ken, now in his mid twenties, 0:03:52.080 --> 0:03:55.640 it felt more like some terrible dream. And while the 0:03:55.680 --> 0:03:59.000 world was racing toward the glimmering promise of the nineteen eighties, 0:03:59.560 --> 0:04:05.800 Ken stood still feeling nothing at all, no comfort, no hope. 0:04:05.880 --> 0:04:14.520 He was simply numb. After they hit on Danny, the 0:04:14.560 --> 0:04:17.120 bosses knew they could count on Kenny for heavy work, 0:04:17.960 --> 0:04:20.680 and when the calls came, there wasn't so much of 0:04:20.720 --> 0:04:24.880 a question as a demand, and Kenny had no choice 0:04:24.960 --> 0:04:29.000 but to comply. As the pressures of his new reality mounted, 0:04:29.760 --> 0:04:33.120 he withdrew further and turned a cocaine to numbs pain. 0:04:34.520 --> 0:04:38.480 In this world, emotion was a weakness, and sympathy could 0:04:38.480 --> 0:04:42.080 get you killed. If he wanted to stay alive in 0:04:42.120 --> 0:04:44.600 his new role within the Outfit, he would need to 0:04:44.640 --> 0:04:47.000 dig deep down to the darkest part of his soul 0:04:47.880 --> 0:04:49.920 and abandon the light forever. 0:04:52.040 --> 0:04:54.640 I could be a pretty nasty for anyway, I was 0:04:54.680 --> 0:04:58.680 recruited into doing some hits. Okay, so there was another 0:04:58.720 --> 0:05:01.800 part of that. So not only working and running whorehouses, 0:05:02.200 --> 0:05:05.960 I'm doing occasional hits on the site, all right, ordered 0:05:06.040 --> 0:05:07.680 hits our own people. 0:05:08.320 --> 0:05:12.320 Rogue. I asked him what he means by going rogue? 0:05:12.960 --> 0:05:14.960 So what these guys would do. These guys are the 0:05:15.000 --> 0:05:20.640 guys that would fuck up. They'd steal, they'd rat, they 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:23.200 were just bad seats, or they were or they were 0:05:23.520 --> 0:05:27.640 overly aggressive, or they became dangerous. They became rogue, meaning 0:05:27.680 --> 0:05:30.440 they lost control of what they were doing. They just 0:05:30.440 --> 0:05:33.560 started getting violent and you know, could start bringing the 0:05:33.640 --> 0:05:38.360 heat down on this particular outfit that I worked for. 0:05:38.640 --> 0:05:40.240 So we wanted to keep the heat away. So if 0:05:40.280 --> 0:05:44.040 somebody became rogue, somebody needed to do something about these people. 0:05:44.400 --> 0:05:47.640 My job was to be the heat, be the heat 0:05:47.680 --> 0:05:52.080 for my particular outfit. You know, I got a reputation 0:05:52.160 --> 0:05:54.640 though after a while, where you know, if they knew 0:05:54.640 --> 0:05:55.839 I was coming, he were running. 0:06:01.840 --> 0:06:04.080 I remembered something he used to tell my brother and 0:06:04.120 --> 0:06:07.400 I when we were kids. He would say when he 0:06:07.480 --> 0:06:10.400 was young that he was the bully of the bullies 0:06:10.440 --> 0:06:14.080 at his school and if we ever saw someone getting 0:06:14.120 --> 0:06:17.360 bullied at our school, that we should step in and 0:06:17.440 --> 0:06:20.320 stop it. He was quite proud of this bit of 0:06:20.400 --> 0:06:23.760 parenting advice, and to be honest, I was quite proud 0:06:23.760 --> 0:06:26.680 of him too. I always admired him for it, and 0:06:26.800 --> 0:06:30.000 to this day I think about those very words. I 0:06:30.040 --> 0:06:32.960 even taught that same lesson to my own kid, defend 0:06:33.000 --> 0:06:35.320 the weak and have the courage to fight against those 0:06:35.360 --> 0:06:39.440 who would fight against you. And now, more than twenty 0:06:39.560 --> 0:06:41.960 years later, here is my dad telling me that he 0:06:42.080 --> 0:06:44.800 was hired to apply a version of that logic to 0:06:44.880 --> 0:06:50.000 the metaphorical bullies of the outfit. At least that's what 0:06:50.080 --> 0:06:53.240 he's telling me. It is very possible that he's just 0:06:53.320 --> 0:06:55.440 softening the blow about the kind of people that were 0:06:55.440 --> 0:06:58.800 in his crosshairs. I mean, does it really make me 0:06:58.840 --> 0:07:01.120 feel any better that the only people he killed were 0:07:01.120 --> 0:07:06.880 bad guys? Honestly, the answer is yes, it does. But 0:07:06.920 --> 0:07:09.760 the simple fact is I will never really know if 0:07:09.800 --> 0:07:12.840 any of this stuff is true. All I can do 0:07:13.400 --> 0:07:14.400 is take him at his word. 0:07:18.600 --> 0:07:21.520 Whether it was a hit, whether it was a beating, 0:07:22.120 --> 0:07:24.080 just depend on what the punishment was called. Now, I 0:07:24.120 --> 0:07:27.200 never decided what the punishment was. I was always given 0:07:27.240 --> 0:07:31.000 the punishment on a little piece of paper by a 0:07:31.000 --> 0:07:35.280 guy named He always gave me my assignment big fat. 0:07:39.160 --> 0:07:42.080 And now let me introduce you to the next character 0:07:42.160 --> 0:07:45.840 in our story, a feared boss within the outfit and 0:07:45.920 --> 0:07:48.280 a man who would make an enormous impact on the 0:07:48.320 --> 0:07:53.360 life of young Kenny. Paul Taglia, which I will remind 0:07:53.400 --> 0:07:56.240 you for the safety of everyone involved, is not his 0:07:56.280 --> 0:07:56.800 real name. 0:07:58.120 --> 0:08:01.680 I would get a phone call, get on the phone, 0:08:02.520 --> 0:08:04.400 meet me, and I knew exactly where. 0:08:04.280 --> 0:08:05.480 To meet him. 0:08:05.880 --> 0:08:09.560 And I'd meet him in a parking lot and one 0:08:09.600 --> 0:08:11.680 of the houses were there, one of the whorehouses were there. 0:08:11.720 --> 0:08:14.160 I meet him at a parking lot. I'd walk up 0:08:14.160 --> 0:08:19.960 to his big fucking Cadillac and he'd rolled on his window, 0:08:20.000 --> 0:08:21.520 hand me a little piece of paper, and then he'd 0:08:21.560 --> 0:08:25.280 drive away. And on a piece of paper was where 0:08:25.360 --> 0:08:29.760 the person was going to be, the type of car 0:08:29.880 --> 0:08:34.360 he drove, and license plates, and that would and that 0:08:34.559 --> 0:08:37.440 What all that did was made me do more work. 0:08:37.480 --> 0:08:40.960 But it kept them even, kept them more and kept 0:08:40.959 --> 0:08:44.000 them further away from the hit. So because now I 0:08:44.000 --> 0:08:45.480 had to do all the leg work, So I'd have 0:08:45.559 --> 0:08:48.720 to go look for the car, look for the license plate, 0:08:48.760 --> 0:08:52.040 wait for the person, get in there, scope them, watch them. Okay, 0:08:52.079 --> 0:08:53.440 that's so I got to hit. I gotta hit that 0:08:53.480 --> 0:08:57.000 guy right there, based on the license plate and the 0:08:57.079 --> 0:08:59.839 car description. Okay, so I know I got a description 0:08:59.920 --> 0:09:02.679 a guy I have to hit, and then I would 0:09:03.439 --> 0:09:06.840 do my due diligence for about two weeks, follow him around, 0:09:06.880 --> 0:09:11.360 get a pattern, and then after I figured out how 0:09:11.400 --> 0:09:12.879 I was going to do it, and I always did 0:09:12.880 --> 0:09:17.280 it one way. I would uh, I would do it. 0:09:17.240 --> 0:09:18.839 It's all that was to it. It didn't happen a lot, 0:09:18.880 --> 0:09:20.520 but it happened to people. It happened enough for it 0:09:20.719 --> 0:09:24.240 and or it really bothers me. It really bothers me 0:09:24.280 --> 0:09:24.520 a lot. 0:09:27.839 --> 0:09:29.439 I don't like to talk about this. I don't want 0:09:29.439 --> 0:09:30.800 to talk about that shit. Man. 0:09:35.480 --> 0:09:37.800 First of all, I'm trying desperately to forget all this stuff. 0:09:38.800 --> 0:09:40.520 A therapist is probably gonna tell me, no, you need 0:09:40.559 --> 0:09:42.719 to spit it out and then deal with it. Well, 0:09:42.760 --> 0:09:44.520 I think I've already dealt with it, but I'm still 0:09:44.520 --> 0:09:47.719 trying to bury it because it because it's not a 0:09:47.719 --> 0:09:50.000 pleasant thought. It's not something that I'm very proud of 0:09:50.040 --> 0:09:52.599 at all. And I got don't take a quick break. 0:09:52.719 --> 0:09:53.359 Yeah, I gotta. 0:09:54.360 --> 0:10:00.160 Swallow over so stupid, we decided to break for the day. 0:10:00.959 --> 0:10:06.160 He's exhausted, and honestly so am I. There's so much 0:10:06.199 --> 0:10:08.839 to unpack here and I don't even nowhere to begin. 0:10:10.000 --> 0:10:13.400 I started recording these interviews back in twenty seventeen, and 0:10:13.559 --> 0:10:16.319 it was apparent then that his health was failing him. 0:10:17.120 --> 0:10:20.640 Since then, he's continued to decline, and I honestly don't 0:10:20.679 --> 0:10:24.280 know how long he has left. He recently showed me 0:10:24.319 --> 0:10:27.000 an entire backpack full of prescriptions he's taken for a 0:10:27.040 --> 0:10:33.920 dozen or so conditions. He's pale, swollen, shakes uncontrollably. His 0:10:34.040 --> 0:10:37.239 legs are covered in red marks and bruises, and he's 0:10:37.280 --> 0:10:40.720 a hard time walking. He's about the furthest thing you 0:10:40.760 --> 0:10:43.280 can get from the Fearless Mafia, heavy of his youth. 0:10:45.240 --> 0:10:48.840 What the hell happened to this man? How was he 0:10:48.880 --> 0:10:52.560 able to do the things he did? What kind of 0:10:52.599 --> 0:10:57.680 person is my father? And what kind of person does 0:10:57.719 --> 0:10:58.240 that make me? 0:11:15.000 --> 0:11:15.920 Look at this guy? 0:11:16.199 --> 0:11:16.400 Man? 0:11:16.959 --> 0:11:18.400 How are you doing? 0:11:18.439 --> 0:11:18.559 Bud? 0:11:19.640 --> 0:11:22.520 Goodness to you? All right, it's been way, way too long. 0:11:22.880 --> 0:11:27.880 I'm back in Chicago visiting my uncle, rich Ken's twin brother. 0:11:28.920 --> 0:11:29.239 Long ago. 0:11:29.559 --> 0:11:31.679 Yeah, I got married and well I left school in 0:11:32.000 --> 0:11:34.839 oh seven, and I moved to Atlanta all right, pretty. 0:11:34.599 --> 0:11:37.960 Much came back like maybe once and there was too 0:11:38.040 --> 0:11:39.520 much shrama, and so I never came back. 0:11:41.480 --> 0:11:44.880 I left high school, never even looked over my shoulder. 0:11:45.199 --> 0:11:46.800 It's like, fuck you, I'm out. 0:11:47.079 --> 0:11:51.280 It's his birthday, that's right, Yeah, you remember that. What 0:11:51.360 --> 0:11:52.160 it's like in two days? 0:11:52.199 --> 0:11:58.119 Isn't it today? 0:11:54.559 --> 0:12:01.120 You probably should? 0:12:02.319 --> 0:12:08.400 Oh? My god, nice going, Kyle boy. 0:12:08.439 --> 0:12:10.959 You look like your dad. 0:12:11.040 --> 0:12:11.719 That look? 0:12:12.120 --> 0:12:14.280 That look? Did I just give you the Ken look? 0:12:15.199 --> 0:12:15.439 Look? 0:12:15.520 --> 0:12:17.439 Holy shit? Is it going to give you the chills? 0:12:24.760 --> 0:12:25.959 And that's a Ken look too. 0:12:28.160 --> 0:12:31.840 I am my father's son. We spent some time catching 0:12:31.920 --> 0:12:33.960 up and cracking jokes about my old man. 0:12:34.240 --> 0:12:37.360 What's the project again? So what's a podcast? So what's 0:12:37.400 --> 0:12:37.800 the deal? 0:12:38.719 --> 0:12:40.520 I can tell Rich is a bit hesitant to dig 0:12:40.599 --> 0:12:43.239 up the past like this, and I get it from 0:12:43.280 --> 0:12:45.280 what I've been hearing. It's not like they had the 0:12:45.319 --> 0:12:46.359 happiest childhood. 0:12:48.480 --> 0:12:49.200 My name's Rich. 0:12:49.880 --> 0:12:56.959 I'm the oldest twin Ken's fraternal twin brother by how long. 0:12:59.319 --> 0:13:00.640 Six minutes? I believe it is. 0:13:01.000 --> 0:13:04.040 And since I came out first, I've always said that 0:13:04.120 --> 0:13:05.880 the problems I have with my my back of my 0:13:05.920 --> 0:13:08.560 neck and stuff for your dad's fault, because you know 0:13:08.599 --> 0:13:10.720 he was stepping on me that whole time. 0:13:10.760 --> 0:13:11.320 In the womb. 0:13:12.920 --> 0:13:15.920 They were the firstborns of the family, followed by younger 0:13:15.959 --> 0:13:17.319 brothers Stan and. 0:13:17.280 --> 0:13:21.520 Matt Stands five years younger than myself and your dad, 0:13:21.640 --> 0:13:24.000 and then eleven years for Matt. 0:13:24.360 --> 0:13:26.160 He tells me there was a joke in the family 0:13:26.240 --> 0:13:28.359 that Ken must have had a different father. 0:13:30.360 --> 0:13:35.040 Because Ken and I are so different. We don't look 0:13:35.079 --> 0:13:37.559 the same, we don't act the same. I mean, there 0:13:37.640 --> 0:13:40.079 was nothing about us at that point that was even 0:13:40.120 --> 0:13:44.479 close to being twin material. So yeah, it always pissed 0:13:44.480 --> 0:13:47.880 off Mile though when we would say that, what's a 0:13:47.880 --> 0:13:48.480 family joke? 0:13:48.679 --> 0:13:50.800 So she's probably like, wait today, now. 0:13:53.839 --> 0:13:54.520 There was. 0:13:54.880 --> 0:13:58.119 You know, that's kind of funny because you know there 0:13:58.280 --> 0:14:04.040 was some kind of half truth meaning behind our thought process. 0:14:04.160 --> 0:14:05.280 But you know. 0:14:08.160 --> 0:14:11.439 That's interesting. If you remember from episode one, Kenny was 0:14:11.520 --> 0:14:13.720 kicked out of his house by his mom for accusing 0:14:13.760 --> 0:14:17.280 her of having an affair, which she was and which 0:14:17.319 --> 0:14:19.400 of course started off this whole chain of events that 0:14:19.520 --> 0:14:21.720 led to Ken joining the Outfit in the first place. 0:14:22.360 --> 0:14:25.240 I asked Ritch what he remembers I. 0:14:25.320 --> 0:14:29.120 Was out So when I came home, I walked through 0:14:29.360 --> 0:14:31.720 because I would always come in the basement door. And 0:14:31.760 --> 0:14:35.120 when I walked into the basement door, I heard screaming 0:14:35.160 --> 0:14:38.080 and yelling from the kitchen. So as you walk up 0:14:38.120 --> 0:14:41.440 the stairs, you walk right into the kitchen on you know, 0:14:41.640 --> 0:14:44.840 one end of the kitchen was Mom with Dad's forty five, 0:14:45.640 --> 0:14:49.600 just screaming, bloody murder and pointing to gun, just shaking, 0:14:49.720 --> 0:14:52.440 you know. And Ken was in the ollow corner of 0:14:52.440 --> 0:14:54.720 the kitchen, just you know, in the back. I don't 0:14:54.720 --> 0:14:57.440 remember anything that was said, just a lot of noise 0:14:57.480 --> 0:15:01.200 and stuff. And I walked up to mother and she's 0:15:01.280 --> 0:15:04.040 like this, I just stepped right in front of her. 0:15:04.200 --> 0:15:06.920 So now I got a gun pointing right at my chest. 0:15:07.320 --> 0:15:10.600 I grabbed her hand, I lifted them up so her 0:15:10.600 --> 0:15:13.840 hands are now over her head and I'm holding her 0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:17.880 hands on the gun compared to Ken said you should leave, 0:15:18.960 --> 0:15:19.280 and he. 0:15:19.280 --> 0:15:25.080 Left and that was it and he never came back. Wow. Wow, WOWOW. 0:15:28.160 --> 0:15:32.640 I loved my Grandma Adele. She was the sweetest old 0:15:32.640 --> 0:15:36.720 woman you could ever meet. She loved science and history 0:15:36.960 --> 0:15:40.880 and Native American culture. The stories of her younger years 0:15:40.880 --> 0:15:43.960 are full of intrigue and adventure. She moved out to 0:15:44.000 --> 0:15:46.200 California in her late teens and was one of the 0:15:46.240 --> 0:15:49.800 first women ever to work at NASA. She then took 0:15:49.800 --> 0:15:52.320 a job in the FBI and was only one of 0:15:52.360 --> 0:15:56.520 a handful of women there. She was a trailblazer and 0:15:56.600 --> 0:16:00.240 painted beautiful landscapes inspired by all her travels that filled 0:16:00.240 --> 0:16:02.920 the walls of her home. She taught me how to 0:16:02.920 --> 0:16:06.840 play piano and to appreciate the wild beauty of nature, 0:16:08.320 --> 0:16:11.280 and to picture this saint of a woman pointing a 0:16:11.320 --> 0:16:15.120 gun at her teenage son is completely unbelievable to me. 0:16:16.560 --> 0:16:19.200 But if I've learned anything at this point, it's that 0:16:19.480 --> 0:16:24.120 nobody is exactly who you think they are. And apparently 0:16:24.280 --> 0:16:27.960 my sweet old grandma wasn't always so sweet. 0:16:29.160 --> 0:16:32.400 Did she ever tell you the stories about her brawling 0:16:32.760 --> 0:16:35.760 in Chicago and stuff, the street fights everything? 0:16:37.520 --> 0:16:38.320 Never heard about that? 0:16:38.400 --> 0:16:38.560 Huh? 0:16:39.600 --> 0:16:39.759 Yeah? 0:16:39.800 --> 0:16:42.920 I remember my telling me that her and her friend's 0:16:43.040 --> 0:16:46.840 pals whatever would go out for the street fights, and 0:16:47.120 --> 0:16:50.680 the girls would take towels and they would wrap up 0:16:50.720 --> 0:16:53.640 their boobs, I mean, like tape them down, you know, 0:16:53.800 --> 0:16:55.920 so that there was nothing hanging out there, nothing to 0:16:55.920 --> 0:16:58.680 grab on, its nothing to get hurt. Basically before they 0:16:58.720 --> 0:17:00.520 went to their street fights. 0:17:01.280 --> 0:17:02.440 Oh yeah, she. 0:17:02.480 --> 0:17:03.160 Was a badass. 0:17:03.520 --> 0:17:07.199 We're talking knives and clubs and all sorts of stuff, 0:17:08.920 --> 0:17:12.919 you bet, Oh yeah, yeah, sweep my ass. 0:17:13.080 --> 0:17:13.960 You didn't grow up with. 0:17:13.960 --> 0:17:20.159 Her, Okay. So if Grandma was some sort of fearless 0:17:20.280 --> 0:17:23.600 knife fighting street pirate, then I guess you can argue 0:17:23.639 --> 0:17:26.280 that a hot temper is just in our blood, and 0:17:26.520 --> 0:17:28.439 Ken was just to chip off the old block. 0:17:29.280 --> 0:17:35.119 Anything could set him off, anything, blind rage, out of 0:17:35.159 --> 0:17:40.240 control could not stop him temper, And until he got 0:17:40.359 --> 0:17:43.719 past that rage, you couldn't stop him. It's like he 0:17:43.760 --> 0:17:45.320 didn't even know what he was doing. 0:17:45.399 --> 0:17:45.999 Practically. 0:17:47.040 --> 0:17:49.600 He tells me a few old stories, like Ken punching 0:17:49.639 --> 0:17:52.840 out a gym teacher in high school, or stealing Rich's 0:17:52.960 --> 0:17:56.800 car at sixteen and disappearing for a week, apparently driving 0:17:56.800 --> 0:17:58.600 it all the way to California, and. 0:17:58.639 --> 0:18:02.480 I was gonna have him arrested for car theft, you know. 0:18:02.840 --> 0:18:04.720 And then showing up like nothing happened. 0:18:04.879 --> 0:18:08.000 Hey kids, Hot, eh raight, what's going on, buddy? 0:18:08.200 --> 0:18:11.800 Thing's fine. I'm like, fucking an asshole, you stole my 0:18:11.840 --> 0:18:12.639 fucking car. 0:18:13.200 --> 0:18:15.000 And stories of cruel violence. 0:18:15.520 --> 0:18:17.520 He shot me once, he stabbed me once. 0:18:18.359 --> 0:18:20.560 That was fun. He just stopped there. You have to 0:18:20.600 --> 0:18:22.240 tell me the story. 0:18:22.320 --> 0:18:23.880 It was a BB gun, but it was a BB 0:18:23.960 --> 0:18:25.880 gun that could go halfway through a two by four. 0:18:27.040 --> 0:18:29.959 I still have that BB gun, by the way, it's downstairs. 0:18:30.080 --> 0:18:33.160 You still have the BB in your flash. And all 0:18:33.280 --> 0:18:35.520 that we dug out is that way. 0:18:35.639 --> 0:18:37.600 So did the stabb income because he did. 0:18:37.680 --> 0:18:39.480 That was a different That was a different time. 0:18:39.680 --> 0:18:39.840 No. 0:18:39.960 --> 0:18:42.960 He he stabbed me with a needle. The needle was 0:18:43.000 --> 0:18:47.560 probably about eight inches long, and he just, you know, 0:18:47.680 --> 0:18:52.719 in his blank rage wisdom. I was walking up the 0:18:52.720 --> 0:18:55.239 stairs and he just came up behind me and just 0:18:55.280 --> 0:18:55.879 stabbed me right. 0:18:55.920 --> 0:18:56.840 And he asked, what. 0:18:58.359 --> 0:19:01.719 I'm beginning to doubt my dad's bully of the bullies claim. 0:19:02.200 --> 0:19:04.080 The story has always been he was the bully of 0:19:04.080 --> 0:19:05.920 the bullies, and you would beat up like the bullies 0:19:05.920 --> 0:19:08.119 at school. And as you know, he's the protector of 0:19:08.159 --> 0:19:09.239 the innocent at school, he. 0:19:09.359 --> 0:19:12.960 Particular through the innocent. He was a freaking cycle. 0:19:15.040 --> 0:19:18.719 Protector of the innocent. Did he tell you that the. 0:19:18.720 --> 0:19:21.840 Bully he was the bully? Yeah, he was a bully. 0:19:22.960 --> 0:19:25.919 Yeah, this one hurt. I know it may sound silly 0:19:25.920 --> 0:19:29.639 after everything else we've heard, but this one positive character. 0:19:29.680 --> 0:19:33.040 Trait was something I held onto my whole life. It 0:19:33.119 --> 0:19:35.520 was foundational to the image I had of my father, 0:19:36.399 --> 0:19:39.199 and to learn it was complete bullshit. It's a fucking 0:19:39.320 --> 0:19:41.720 hard pill to swallow. 0:19:43.560 --> 0:19:43.760 You know. 0:19:43.800 --> 0:19:45.720 As he got older, I'm sure he learned how to 0:19:45.800 --> 0:19:48.439 control it and use it to his advantage. But you know, 0:19:48.480 --> 0:19:51.800 as we were growing up, just totally out of control. 0:19:52.480 --> 0:19:54.640 There was a lot of pain in agony, and yeah, 0:19:54.760 --> 0:19:55.800 there was a lot of violence. 0:19:57.480 --> 0:20:02.040 Violence, both physical and emotional, was a constant part of 0:20:02.080 --> 0:20:06.639 their daily lives. The father would beat the kid's bloody wap. 0:20:06.600 --> 0:20:10.199 Right across the head against the wall, knock me up. 0:20:10.560 --> 0:20:14.120 And their mother, as we've learned, was just as cruel, and. 0:20:14.119 --> 0:20:16.239 She picked up a kitchen chair and she was going 0:20:16.320 --> 0:20:17.760 to crack me over the head with it. 0:20:18.280 --> 0:20:21.399 They would starve their kids while mom and dad ate 0:20:21.440 --> 0:20:22.159 a nice meal. 0:20:22.680 --> 0:20:25.159 I remember eating dog food because I was so damn hungry, 0:20:25.840 --> 0:20:28.439 Or when i'd give the dog a treat, I would. 0:20:28.240 --> 0:20:31.040 Bite the ends off and I would eat it before 0:20:31.080 --> 0:20:32.200 I would give it to the dog. 0:20:33.399 --> 0:20:37.800 I was hungry, and at times two things so horrible 0:20:38.440 --> 0:20:40.639 my uncle won't even speak of them. 0:20:40.760 --> 0:20:40.919 You know. 0:20:40.960 --> 0:20:44.679 Some of the torture stuff I wouldn't. I'd never speak 0:20:44.720 --> 0:20:49.359 of it ever, Yeah, because I don't really want, you know, 0:20:49.480 --> 0:20:53.040 mom and Dad to be portrayed as you know, animal 0:20:54.080 --> 0:20:55.080 child abusers. 0:20:55.119 --> 0:20:57.120 Even though it was kind of like. 0:20:57.119 --> 0:20:59.679 That, you know, we probably would have been taken away, 0:21:00.280 --> 0:21:03.080 you know, in today's day and age. You know, I'm 0:21:03.119 --> 0:21:05.359 sure we would have taken away if somebody had said something. 0:21:06.920 --> 0:21:08.560 But that's not how it was back then. 0:21:11.240 --> 0:21:11.560 I Mean, the. 0:21:11.560 --> 0:21:14.399 Amazing thing is is I don't I don't see you 0:21:14.440 --> 0:21:19.920 as having any of this volatility and in his violence. 0:21:19.720 --> 0:21:20.840 And like that. 0:21:22.359 --> 0:21:23.759 D he never struck us. 0:21:24.920 --> 0:21:25.600 That's amazing. 0:21:25.680 --> 0:21:26.600 He never struck us. 0:21:26.680 --> 0:21:28.800 Yeah, he made And that's another thing that so bizarre 0:21:28.840 --> 0:21:29.159 about this. 0:21:29.200 --> 0:21:32.639 It's like, why again, why we never even like, you know, 0:21:32.639 --> 0:21:35.000 I've seen him beat up a guy or two or 0:21:35.080 --> 0:21:36.520 three or five, But. 0:21:37.920 --> 0:21:39.479 Did he tell you about beat the guy up and 0:21:39.520 --> 0:21:40.640 left him on the hood of his car? 0:21:40.720 --> 0:21:41.160 Do you know why? 0:21:41.200 --> 0:21:41.639 That one? 0:21:42.080 --> 0:21:43.879 This was when we were working at the bar up 0:21:43.879 --> 0:21:46.520 in Northbrook at the hotel. Ken and I were both 0:21:46.560 --> 0:21:48.720 working there, and you know, they had cops that would 0:21:48.720 --> 0:21:51.879 come in and they would be the security, you know, 0:21:51.960 --> 0:21:54.720 part time job stuff. And he was telling me about 0:21:54.760 --> 0:21:58.680 this quality had that there was a guy passed out 0:21:58.720 --> 0:22:00.359 on the hood of his car in the middle of 0:22:00.399 --> 0:22:04.800 an intersection, and oh, okay, fine. Well the next day 0:22:05.080 --> 0:22:07.159 I'm talking to Ken and he's telling me about this 0:22:07.200 --> 0:22:10.080 guy who he dragged out of the window of his car, 0:22:10.320 --> 0:22:12.119 beat the shit out of him, and left him on 0:22:12.119 --> 0:22:13.560 the hood of his car in the intersection. 0:22:14.399 --> 0:22:15.639 I'm like, oh, that was you. 0:22:20.040 --> 0:22:22.919 What's interesting about this incident is it would have been 0:22:22.920 --> 0:22:25.679 in those early years after Ken joined the outfit, so 0:22:25.760 --> 0:22:29.600 it's very possible it was mob related. I asked him 0:22:29.680 --> 0:22:32.040 if he knew what his brother was into at that time. 0:22:33.520 --> 0:22:37.480 I knew that he was definitely dealing drugs. I knew 0:22:37.520 --> 0:22:38.280