1 00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:03,000 Speaker 1: Welcome to five hundred Greatest Songs, a podcast based on 2 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:08,520 Speaker 1: Rolling Stones, hugely popular, influential and sometimes controversialist. I'm Britney 3 00:00:08,520 --> 00:00:09,520 Speaker 1: Spanis and. 4 00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:12,080 Speaker 2: I'm Rob Sheffield. We're here to shed light on the 5 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:15,680 Speaker 2: greatest songs ever made and discover what makes them so great. 6 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:18,640 Speaker 1: Today we are going to talk about Midnight Train to 7 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:21,560 Speaker 1: Georgia by Gladys Knight and the Pips. Tell me a 8 00:00:21,560 --> 00:00:23,520 Speaker 1: little bit of your history with this song and how 9 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:24,400 Speaker 1: much you love it. 10 00:00:24,400 --> 00:00:27,520 Speaker 2: It's not just one of my favorite songs. It's arguably 11 00:00:27,520 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 2: the song I've listened to most times in my life. 12 00:00:30,280 --> 00:00:32,159 Speaker 2: Not once in my life have I listened to it 13 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:34,839 Speaker 2: once and not wanted to hear it again. I'm always 14 00:00:34,880 --> 00:00:37,800 Speaker 2: sad when it's over. If I'm listening to it on 15 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:40,960 Speaker 2: the radio and the DJ fades it out one tiny 16 00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:43,760 Speaker 2: bit early, I take it so personally, I'm like, I 17 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:46,360 Speaker 2: want every single one of those fade out like his world, 18 00:00:46,400 --> 00:00:49,760 Speaker 2: My worldli yea. It is a song so universal. Yeah, 19 00:00:50,040 --> 00:00:51,479 Speaker 2: if you knew somebody and they didn't think this was 20 00:00:51,520 --> 00:00:53,360 Speaker 2: a particularly good song, you'd think of them as just 21 00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:54,840 Speaker 2: a lesser. 22 00:00:54,520 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 1: Person, right, Yeah, it should be illegal to fade out 23 00:00:57,080 --> 00:01:00,160 Speaker 1: before that I've got to go at the end. You're 24 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:02,840 Speaker 1: not listening to that for the full song, it's not 25 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:03,920 Speaker 1: it doesn't count. 26 00:01:04,280 --> 00:01:07,400 Speaker 2: Yes, it's a song where every time you hear it, 27 00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:09,839 Speaker 2: you're following the story all the way through, even though 28 00:01:09,959 --> 00:01:11,360 Speaker 2: you know the story of the song, you know the 29 00:01:11,360 --> 00:01:13,440 Speaker 2: plot of the song that you're hanging on till the 30 00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:14,360 Speaker 2: very final seconds. 31 00:01:14,440 --> 00:01:16,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's riveting from start to finish. 32 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:19,600 Speaker 2: Unbelievable. Yeah, Gladys Night and the Pips one of the 33 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:22,959 Speaker 2: all time great careers from beginning to end, so many 34 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:26,200 Speaker 2: amazing songs along the way, and it's wild how this 35 00:01:26,240 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 2: one just stands out like a skyscraper. 36 00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:29,680 Speaker 3: Yeah. 37 00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:31,760 Speaker 1: So this song was on the two thousand and four 38 00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:34,280 Speaker 1: list at four thirty two, and it remains on the 39 00:01:34,319 --> 00:01:37,440 Speaker 1: list now at four seventy. And I mean it is 40 00:01:37,840 --> 00:01:40,920 Speaker 1: a song that has become the signature song in the 41 00:01:40,959 --> 00:01:43,480 Speaker 1: Glass Night and the Pips catalog. And it came two 42 00:01:43,520 --> 00:01:46,920 Speaker 1: decades after they first formed. Of course, they were just 43 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 1: known as the Pips at first. They were a family band. 44 00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:51,240 Speaker 1: It was a lot of sort of them sort of 45 00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 1: reading the line up for a few years of people 46 00:01:53,800 --> 00:01:57,080 Speaker 1: starting families. There's more cousins in the band originally, and 47 00:01:57,280 --> 00:02:00,080 Speaker 1: you know, Gladys left for a little bit, but the 48 00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:02,480 Speaker 1: the Pips as we know it, the popular lineup includes 49 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:06,160 Speaker 1: Glass's brother, Bubba Knight, and the cousins William Guest and 50 00:02:06,280 --> 00:02:08,960 Speaker 1: Edward Patten, who comprised the Pips as we know them 51 00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:11,320 Speaker 1: and love them, and they would sign to Motwan in 52 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty six, and this was kind of a worrying 53 00:02:15,520 --> 00:02:16,600 Speaker 1: signing for Gladys. 54 00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:17,920 Speaker 3: She's very, very. 55 00:02:17,840 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 1: Worried and had a right to be worried that they 56 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:22,720 Speaker 1: would become sort of second string on Barry Gordy's list 57 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:25,320 Speaker 1: of acts on the roster. Of course, you know Diana 58 00:02:25,400 --> 00:02:29,000 Speaker 1: Ross and the Supremes and Marvin Gay huge huge acts 59 00:02:29,040 --> 00:02:31,960 Speaker 1: in the sixties, and Gladys was super concerned that they 60 00:02:32,000 --> 00:02:34,480 Speaker 1: would kind of be secondary and for a while it 61 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:36,560 Speaker 1: did seem to kind of be true. They felt like 62 00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:38,440 Speaker 1: they were losing a lot of songs to Marvin and 63 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:41,680 Speaker 1: Diana particularly, who were kind of the breadwinners of this 64 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:43,520 Speaker 1: label at the time. But they would have their first 65 00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 1: hit with I Heard through the grape Vine, which was 66 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 1: their fourth single, and that song would end up being 67 00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:50,359 Speaker 1: the first big hit for Glass Night in the Pips, 68 00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:53,480 Speaker 1: and of course though it would be given as a 69 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:55,440 Speaker 1: cover to Marvin Gay a few years later, and that'd 70 00:02:55,440 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 1: become the version that everyone kind of has come to 71 00:02:57,600 --> 00:02:59,680 Speaker 1: know and sort of the version that would outsell a 72 00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:02,600 Speaker 1: lot of that, and eventually the band would would leave 73 00:03:02,639 --> 00:03:06,200 Speaker 1: Motown altogether, not before, of course, they would bring the 74 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:09,600 Speaker 1: Jackson five onto the label. They're actually very responsible for 75 00:03:09,880 --> 00:03:12,480 Speaker 1: helping bring the Jackson five onto Motown because the Jackson 76 00:03:12,520 --> 00:03:14,360 Speaker 1: five would open for Glass Night and the Pips and 77 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 1: Gladys was so taken by this boy band that had 78 00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:21,359 Speaker 1: opened for them. But when it came to contract negotiations, 79 00:03:21,520 --> 00:03:24,200 Speaker 1: they decided that they need to go elsewhere. They went 80 00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:26,560 Speaker 1: to Buddha Records, and their very first hit off of 81 00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:29,359 Speaker 1: Buddha Records is none other than Midnight Train to Georgia. 82 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:32,040 Speaker 3: Kind of a cosmic sign that they got to go. 83 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 2: They got to go and the family connection that you mentioned, 84 00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:38,640 Speaker 2: it's so crucial in this song that you can hear 85 00:03:38,680 --> 00:03:41,000 Speaker 2: it in their voices. These are people who have been 86 00:03:41,000 --> 00:03:44,760 Speaker 2: through thick and thin together. They have one big lost 87 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:47,480 Speaker 2: big together. They will stick with each other through thick 88 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:50,120 Speaker 2: and thin. This is not just a group who formed 89 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:52,480 Speaker 2: in a talent show or something like that, and you 90 00:03:52,520 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 2: can hear that connection between their voices and that you 91 00:03:55,840 --> 00:03:59,600 Speaker 2: know they had been at the absolute bottom together, and 92 00:03:59,600 --> 00:04:03,040 Speaker 2: they had and through really hungry, scary times together. And 93 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 2: you can hear that in all their voices, especially hers 94 00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 2: because she's the lead singer, but you hear so much 95 00:04:09,000 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 2: lifelong adult resilience and loyalty and their voices. Here famous 96 00:04:12,600 --> 00:04:15,520 Speaker 2: story when they signed to Motown. They were in New York. 97 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:18,760 Speaker 2: They were scared. They were out of towners. They were nice, 98 00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:21,360 Speaker 2: well brought up Southern kids. They were in the big city. 99 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:24,239 Speaker 2: They got a call that Motown would give them an audition, 100 00:04:24,680 --> 00:04:27,520 Speaker 2: not a gig, but an audition. But the catch was 101 00:04:27,839 --> 00:04:31,560 Speaker 2: they had to pay their own way to Detroit from 102 00:04:31,640 --> 00:04:35,080 Speaker 2: New York. They have no money, they're broke. It's before them. 103 00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:36,520 Speaker 2: They're in the city where they don't know any but 104 00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 2: don't know any other family or friends. The guitarist decides 105 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:41,600 Speaker 2: to pawn his guitar. That's the only way that they 106 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:45,240 Speaker 2: can make the bus tickets to get to Detroit for 107 00:04:45,400 --> 00:04:48,719 Speaker 2: this audition. That they have no assurance that anything would 108 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 2: come from this audition, and his guitar is pride and joy. 109 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:53,640 Speaker 2: That's where their music comes from. And he pawns that 110 00:04:53,720 --> 00:04:57,160 Speaker 2: guitar and that gets them to Detroit. Everything from their 111 00:04:57,200 --> 00:04:59,920 Speaker 2: career follows from that. And you can hear so much 112 00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:03,159 Speaker 2: that Midnight trainto Georgia, Right, It's like it's that trip 113 00:05:03,240 --> 00:05:07,360 Speaker 2: where there's this absolute loyalty, this absolute certainty, but I 114 00:05:07,360 --> 00:05:09,000 Speaker 2: always love. You can hear that in so many of 115 00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 2: the Glass Landed Pip songs, just that bond between them. 116 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:11,920 Speaker 4: Yeah. 117 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:14,520 Speaker 1: And also the song itself has such like a fascinating history. 118 00:05:14,520 --> 00:05:17,160 Speaker 1: I did not even realize until starting to look into it. 119 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:19,680 Speaker 1: The song was originally is written by and was originally 120 00:05:19,720 --> 00:05:22,400 Speaker 1: recorded by Jim Weatherley, And I mean it's originally called 121 00:05:22,440 --> 00:05:25,720 Speaker 1: Midnight Playing to Houston, and it sounds completely different. I mean, 122 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:28,200 Speaker 1: just the way that Glass Night and the Pips reinvented 123 00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:30,880 Speaker 1: the song for their own version is completely different. Of course, 124 00:05:30,960 --> 00:05:34,120 Speaker 1: Jim Weatherley's version is much more kind of like folky, 125 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:37,320 Speaker 1: you know, feels very like seventies folk of that time. 126 00:05:37,440 --> 00:05:41,000 Speaker 1: And also really loved the story behind writing that song, 127 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:43,880 Speaker 1: which was actually inspired by Farah Flawcett and her saying 128 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:46,080 Speaker 1: that she was taking a midnight playing to Houston to 129 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:48,400 Speaker 1: go visit her family. She had picked up the phone 130 00:05:48,440 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 1: when Jim Weatherley was calling his friend Lee Majors, and 131 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:53,159 Speaker 1: Far and Lee were dating at the time, and she 132 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:56,080 Speaker 1: just happened to mention that she was taking a midnight 133 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:58,400 Speaker 1: midnight playing to Houston. And he loved that phrase and 134 00:05:58,400 --> 00:06:01,240 Speaker 1: wrote an entire song based off it and inspired by 135 00:06:01,240 --> 00:06:04,960 Speaker 1: his own experiences as a sort of failed NFL player 136 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:05,480 Speaker 1: who then. 137 00:06:05,440 --> 00:06:06,359 Speaker 3: Would get into music. 138 00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:08,440 Speaker 1: And then the song would end up being recorded by 139 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:11,760 Speaker 1: Winnie Houston's mom, Sissy Houston, and she did her own 140 00:06:11,839 --> 00:06:13,679 Speaker 1: version and was the one to change it to Midnight 141 00:06:13,720 --> 00:06:16,960 Speaker 1: Train to Georgia. But her version, it's like not totally 142 00:06:16,960 --> 00:06:20,039 Speaker 1: what would become Glass Knight's version. Of course, the Sissy 143 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:22,040 Speaker 1: Houston version is a little bit more of the gospel 144 00:06:22,080 --> 00:06:25,000 Speaker 1: infused kind of slower, still kind of the same sort 145 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:28,000 Speaker 1: of cadence of the Jim Weatherly version, but sort of 146 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:30,240 Speaker 1: moving it more into the R and B sphere. And 147 00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:32,560 Speaker 1: then we get this kind of really upbeat version as 148 00:06:32,600 --> 00:06:34,760 Speaker 1: opposed to the almost kind of sadder tone that the 149 00:06:34,760 --> 00:06:37,520 Speaker 1: previous two versions had. So like last Night and the 150 00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:39,680 Speaker 1: Pips end up kind of taking it to this kind 151 00:06:39,720 --> 00:06:42,560 Speaker 1: of kind of more a more of a step in 152 00:06:42,600 --> 00:06:45,040 Speaker 1: the in the beat in everything that they end up 153 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:46,239 Speaker 1: infusing a song. 154 00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:49,080 Speaker 2: With absolutely and so much to that is Gladys Knight's voice. 155 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:52,040 Speaker 2: Because the song is so famous sometimes it overshadows what 156 00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:56,960 Speaker 2: they did before. Their sixties motown runs so legendary just 157 00:06:57,080 --> 00:06:59,279 Speaker 2: in terms of like the power of Gladys's voice and 158 00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:01,279 Speaker 2: that when she was very young and hits like every 159 00:07:01,320 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 2: beat of my Heart, she's got almost a girlish tone 160 00:07:04,160 --> 00:07:08,080 Speaker 2: in her voice. But her really legendary motown recordings from 161 00:07:08,080 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 2: like later in the sixties and early seventies are she's 162 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:14,440 Speaker 2: absolutely an adult in a way that it's really kind 163 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:17,160 Speaker 2: of breathtaking. And you listen to like some for huge 164 00:07:17,200 --> 00:07:19,760 Speaker 2: motown songs from before Midnight Train, like If I Were 165 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:22,400 Speaker 2: Your Woman, which is just like a song that completely 166 00:07:22,440 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 2: shuts down everything else that happened to you that day 167 00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:28,880 Speaker 2: and you're just alone with that. It's such a terrifying 168 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:31,240 Speaker 2: story in this song, and it's all just there in 169 00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 2: her voice and in the way that the Pips in 170 00:07:33,840 --> 00:07:36,360 Speaker 2: Colin responds with her, and that's something that they were 171 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:40,920 Speaker 2: so amazing at. Yet they were considered washed up at 172 00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:42,720 Speaker 2: the time that they did this song. They just weren't 173 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:45,320 Speaker 2: on motown anymore. They had been through all these highs 174 00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:47,280 Speaker 2: and lows together and now they were on the skids. 175 00:07:47,440 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 2: They were starting over on Buddha Records, not Buddha as 176 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:54,560 Speaker 2: inspelled correctly, like the Buddha Buddha spelled wrong because it's 177 00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:59,080 Speaker 2: a bubblegum label. It's not a taken seriously kind of label. 178 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:02,800 Speaker 2: It's seventy these bubblegum hits and brilliant ones. Nobody's knocking 179 00:08:02,840 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 2: the legacy of you know, nineteen ten Fruit Gum Company 180 00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:09,560 Speaker 2: and the other big hits of Buddha Records. But this 181 00:08:09,720 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 2: is a group that we're famous on motown. They're not 182 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:15,160 Speaker 2: wanting on moten anymore. They're washed up. They're starting over, 183 00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:18,000 Speaker 2: and that's so perfect for them, perfect for their voices. 184 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:20,400 Speaker 2: And that's there right in the beginning of the song 185 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:22,880 Speaker 2: and the way that she sings one of the great 186 00:08:22,880 --> 00:08:26,520 Speaker 2: opening lines. And all the pop music la proved too 187 00:08:26,600 --> 00:08:27,280 Speaker 2: much for the man. 188 00:08:27,480 --> 00:08:30,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean also, like the Pips are I feel 189 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:33,920 Speaker 1: like very still underrated as just kind of this like 190 00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:36,599 Speaker 1: vocal unit that is, like you mentioned the cal and 191 00:08:36,679 --> 00:08:39,600 Speaker 1: response and kind of the way that they are singing 192 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:44,160 Speaker 1: with Gladys and kind of against Gladys and kind of 193 00:08:44,200 --> 00:08:46,840 Speaker 1: adding in so much to the song. I mean, the 194 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:51,160 Speaker 1: song is nothing without that combination of Gladys with the Pips. 195 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:52,480 Speaker 3: It's a totally different thing. 196 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:54,600 Speaker 1: If it's like, and you hear this in both the 197 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:57,120 Speaker 1: I mean, the Jim Weatherley and Cucy Houston versions are 198 00:08:57,240 --> 00:08:59,280 Speaker 1: amazing in their own right. But the reason why this 199 00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:00,960 Speaker 1: song took off the way it did is because that 200 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:05,320 Speaker 1: combination of kind of Gladys telling the story about a 201 00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 1: man who's kind of failing at his superstar career and 202 00:09:09,400 --> 00:09:11,160 Speaker 1: the Pip's kind of adding in this kind of Greek 203 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:14,720 Speaker 1: chorus to it. And you know, it's such a perfect combination. 204 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:17,640 Speaker 2: Honestly, I can't. It's unlike anything else in pop music 205 00:09:17,880 --> 00:09:20,920 Speaker 2: that they're telling the story together. And that's why it's funny. 206 00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:23,360 Speaker 2: Like you said, to listen to the earlier versions by 207 00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:26,360 Speaker 2: Jim Weatherley and Sissy Houston, which are so great, but 208 00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:29,600 Speaker 2: they're a lead singer telling a story. Yeah, and this 209 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:32,360 Speaker 2: is Gladys Knight telling her story. The Pips are telling 210 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:35,120 Speaker 2: the story along with her. They're rooting for her, they're 211 00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:37,480 Speaker 2: speaking to the audience, they're like, yeah, she does this 212 00:09:37,559 --> 00:09:39,480 Speaker 2: a lot, you know, like which she says, you know, 213 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:41,920 Speaker 2: I'm got to be with him, and they're like, I 214 00:09:42,000 --> 00:09:45,079 Speaker 2: know you will. Yeah, And you can hear all those 215 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:47,400 Speaker 2: times they've been through in the way that the Pips 216 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:51,600 Speaker 2: are there telling the story, sometimes interrupting her, sometimes adding glasses, 217 00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:53,440 Speaker 2: you know, and she's like, yeah, he kept dreaming that 218 00:09:53,480 --> 00:09:56,360 Speaker 2: he was going to be a star. They're like a superstar, 219 00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:57,560 Speaker 2: but he didn't get fun. 220 00:09:57,600 --> 00:09:59,480 Speaker 1: I always love that line because it just sounds like 221 00:10:00,080 --> 00:10:01,839 Speaker 1: take it just a little like a little extra job 222 00:10:01,920 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 1: at him. It's like, if I were him, I'd be 223 00:10:03,440 --> 00:10:05,240 Speaker 1: really upset if I heard the pipsing it that way. 224 00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:08,920 Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely. And sometimes they're singing to her. Sometimes they're 225 00:10:08,920 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 2: singing to the audience, you know, when she's like, I'd 226 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:13,640 Speaker 2: rather live in his world than live without him in mind, 227 00:10:14,080 --> 00:10:16,000 Speaker 2: and you know, they turn to the audience and they're 228 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:18,360 Speaker 2: in third person out they're like, her world is his world, 229 00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:21,640 Speaker 2: his and hers alone, and this colm response between them. 230 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:23,839 Speaker 2: It's not like any other song, and it goes all 231 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:26,840 Speaker 2: the way through the song. Yeah, and it's amazing. You know, 232 00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:29,640 Speaker 2: you decide early in your life listening to the car 233 00:10:29,720 --> 00:10:31,880 Speaker 2: radio when you sing along with this song are you 234 00:10:31,920 --> 00:10:34,840 Speaker 2: gladys or are you a pip? And it is a 235 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:37,440 Speaker 2: lifelong commitment yea, to be one of them. 236 00:10:38,440 --> 00:10:40,959 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean the way that they change the tone 237 00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:42,280 Speaker 1: of the song and the way that they tell the 238 00:10:42,320 --> 00:10:45,000 Speaker 1: story versus like this kind of a story that could 239 00:10:45,040 --> 00:10:47,480 Speaker 1: come off very sad. It's there is so much of that, 240 00:10:47,559 --> 00:10:49,920 Speaker 1: like that kind of excitement about taking the midnight train 241 00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:51,880 Speaker 1: to Georgia. They're kind of making such a case for 242 00:10:52,320 --> 00:10:55,520 Speaker 1: this being a great decision for her to really like 243 00:10:55,600 --> 00:10:57,800 Speaker 1: kind of follow follow him to Georgia and kind of 244 00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 1: go there and like take this big risk. I mean 245 00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:03,679 Speaker 1: just again, like in that combination of how Gladys sings 246 00:11:03,679 --> 00:11:05,800 Speaker 1: it and kind of all this like life force that 247 00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:08,120 Speaker 1: she puts into it, and kind of the determination towards 248 00:11:08,160 --> 00:11:10,520 Speaker 1: the end like my man his girl, Like the way 249 00:11:10,559 --> 00:11:13,000 Speaker 1: she's like singing that part. I mean, there's so much 250 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:15,560 Speaker 1: of that in throughout the song, and the Pips kind 251 00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:17,760 Speaker 1: of being like, you know, we can't argue that with that. 252 00:11:18,920 --> 00:11:21,680 Speaker 2: Yes, they're not trying to change her mind. Something I 253 00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:23,079 Speaker 2: love about this song. I mean, you listen to this 254 00:11:23,160 --> 00:11:26,480 Speaker 2: song your whole life. Yeah, year after year, decade after decade, 255 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:30,280 Speaker 2: and it's amazing how how the story keeps deepening, how 256 00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:32,959 Speaker 2: so much there's more. I mean, she's not asking this 257 00:11:33,000 --> 00:11:35,839 Speaker 2: guy if he wants her to come along on the 258 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:37,880 Speaker 2: midnight train to Georgia with him. Yeah, we don't even 259 00:11:37,880 --> 00:11:39,840 Speaker 2: know if he knows that she's going to be on 260 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:42,640 Speaker 2: that train. You know. She's like, yeah, he came to 261 00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:46,520 Speaker 2: La from Georgia and didn't work out from here, he 262 00:11:46,640 --> 00:11:49,080 Speaker 2: bombed out. He's going back home. Yeah, he's not going 263 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:51,920 Speaker 2: back home in triumphant circumstances. He's taking the midnight train. 264 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:55,800 Speaker 2: He's going home and defeat and me, I'm going home 265 00:11:55,840 --> 00:11:59,120 Speaker 2: with him. And Georgia is not her place, you know, 266 00:11:59,280 --> 00:12:01,760 Speaker 2: like she doesn't know anybody there. It's very different for 267 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:03,760 Speaker 2: her to be taking that train. And it's like the 268 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:06,679 Speaker 2: Book of Ruth or something, you know, like and it's 269 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:09,120 Speaker 2: funny how little of his voice or any is in 270 00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 2: the song. We don't know if he needs her to 271 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:12,680 Speaker 2: come back with him. I didn't even know if he 272 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 2: wants her to come back with him. Maybe she's just 273 00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:17,560 Speaker 2: like a girl that he met in La and he's like, yeah, 274 00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 2: I'm going home, going to start over, you know, like 275 00:12:20,160 --> 00:12:22,679 Speaker 2: marry my high school sweetheart. You know, the road not 276 00:12:22,760 --> 00:12:24,960 Speaker 2: taken looks real good. Now She's like nope. You know 277 00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 2: where he goes I go and his world is my world. 278 00:12:27,920 --> 00:12:29,360 Speaker 2: Unbelievable determination, Like you. 279 00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:32,120 Speaker 1: Said, suddenly you're on a really depressing train back to 280 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:34,439 Speaker 1: Georgia at midnight and there's none of them in glass 281 00:12:34,520 --> 00:12:36,160 Speaker 1: night and the Pips just waiting for you on the train. 282 00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:40,400 Speaker 2: Yes, and she's going to be with him, and just 283 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:42,280 Speaker 2: that determination when she's like, I'm going to be with 284 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:44,720 Speaker 2: him and the Pips say, I know you will. It's 285 00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:47,439 Speaker 2: really kind of beautiful that they are absolutely cheering her 286 00:12:47,480 --> 00:12:50,240 Speaker 2: on and at the end when she's like on the 287 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:52,680 Speaker 2: train platform and like is she really going to do it? 288 00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:54,800 Speaker 2: Is she going to go through with it? And you know, 289 00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:57,000 Speaker 2: and the Pips are, you know, saying like you can 290 00:12:57,040 --> 00:12:59,640 Speaker 2: do this. You got this really kind of beautiful. 291 00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:01,839 Speaker 1: And so much of the construction of the song and 292 00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:04,000 Speaker 1: the way that Gladys and the Pips are kind of 293 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:06,800 Speaker 1: having that dialogue with each other and alongside each other 294 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 1: reminds me so much of like a lot of like 295 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:13,280 Speaker 1: Alan Mankin's music for Disney, you know, reminds me of 296 00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:16,520 Speaker 1: just like in Hercules, you know, like the songs with 297 00:13:16,559 --> 00:13:18,520 Speaker 1: the Muses in there, and kind of the even like 298 00:13:18,520 --> 00:13:21,360 Speaker 1: Low Mermaid and all those kind of early nineties Disney 299 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:24,960 Speaker 1: movies that you know, created these massive hits for Disney 300 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:27,000 Speaker 1: and the kind of that new revival for Disney. So 301 00:13:27,120 --> 00:13:30,600 Speaker 1: much of them seemed owe a lot to Last Night 302 00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:32,840 Speaker 1: the Pips, and in particular a song like Midnight Training 303 00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:35,160 Speaker 1: to Georgia and that kind of conversation that these like 304 00:13:35,200 --> 00:13:39,000 Speaker 1: secondary kind of scening characters can have and kind of 305 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:41,040 Speaker 1: make such a big part of these songs. 306 00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:44,960 Speaker 2: You are absolutely blowing. That is so true. 307 00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:46,800 Speaker 1: I feel like it did reminds me so much of 308 00:13:46,800 --> 00:13:51,240 Speaker 1: the Muses, and like you know, in Hercules particularly, it's. 309 00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:54,640 Speaker 2: Beautiful when you know that the family, the family connection. 310 00:13:54,760 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 2: Gladys is often told the story she's very embarrassed. She's 311 00:13:57,080 --> 00:14:00,320 Speaker 2: a very shy person. She's very shy about improvising on mic. 312 00:14:00,640 --> 00:14:03,160 Speaker 2: The ad libbing is very difficult for her. She talked 313 00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:05,760 Speaker 2: about when she was recording this that her brother was 314 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:07,959 Speaker 2: there in the studio right standing right next to her 315 00:14:07,960 --> 00:14:10,720 Speaker 2: mic whispering into her ear because she was too shy 316 00:14:10,760 --> 00:14:13,240 Speaker 2: to sing all those his world, my world, as long 317 00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:16,040 Speaker 2: as he's alone, and she was really shy about doing it, 318 00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:18,760 Speaker 2: and she needed him to be standing there and whispering 319 00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:22,120 Speaker 2: into her ear what the next line was, and just 320 00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:24,480 Speaker 2: really kind of amazing that that's how she recorded it, 321 00:14:24,560 --> 00:14:27,160 Speaker 2: was her brother's standing right next to her for moral support, 322 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:30,800 Speaker 2: whispering the lines into her ear, and you can hear 323 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:33,360 Speaker 2: so much of that in the final version of the song. 324 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:35,760 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, definitely. The ad libs at the end are 325 00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:37,400 Speaker 3: the best part for me. 326 00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:37,720 Speaker 4: Like that. 327 00:14:37,880 --> 00:14:41,040 Speaker 1: Those ad libs are like the just the cherry on 328 00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:43,359 Speaker 1: top of a great popcake. 329 00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:46,520 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, It's like half the song and it's just 330 00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:50,960 Speaker 2: unbelievably dramatic, and the whole song is building up to that, 331 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:53,640 Speaker 2: and you still you still want it to go on. 332 00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:54,280 Speaker 4: Yeah. 333 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 3: Are you a gladys or a pip? 334 00:14:55,760 --> 00:14:57,960 Speaker 2: I'm always a bit you know. I had three sisters, 335 00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:00,080 Speaker 2: so like, you know, they were glad as sing I 336 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:02,280 Speaker 2: was pipping. I was like and that was the way 337 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:05,920 Speaker 2: it was. And there's something it's such a long and 338 00:15:06,200 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 2: fantastic R and B tradition that you know, the female 339 00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 2: singer and the male backup singers who are kind of 340 00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:14,840 Speaker 2: telling the story with her but also kind of you know, 341 00:15:15,320 --> 00:15:17,520 Speaker 2: rooting for her, cheering her on. I always think of 342 00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:20,120 Speaker 2: one of the one of the great examples, Aliyah, Are 343 00:15:20,160 --> 00:15:22,440 Speaker 2: you that somebody where she's like telling us her in 344 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:25,920 Speaker 2: Timbaland's there and he's like, it's a Leah's song. Timb 345 00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:27,960 Speaker 2: Bland is like you got this, you could do this, 346 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:31,120 Speaker 2: don't be scared like you are that somebody, and he's like, 347 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:33,040 Speaker 2: you know, beb a girl, you know, like and that 348 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:37,080 Speaker 2: kind of commonresponse that's absolutely like another perfect example. 349 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:39,320 Speaker 1: It is, Yeah, yeah, I wonder how much of that, like, 350 00:15:39,560 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 1: how much of those kind of moments in pop because 351 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:43,720 Speaker 1: I made me kind of think of like the ODB 352 00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:46,040 Speaker 1: version of like Fantasy right where he's kind of like 353 00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:48,680 Speaker 1: totally like, I wonder how much of that is owed 354 00:15:48,760 --> 00:15:53,680 Speaker 1: to the very specific and particular type of relationship the 355 00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:57,480 Speaker 1: Pips and Gladys have in their music and in their discography. 356 00:15:57,760 --> 00:15:59,920 Speaker 2: You know, you think about something like another great exam 357 00:16:00,160 --> 00:16:02,800 Speaker 2: that I Love is another one of the greatest songs 358 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:05,600 Speaker 2: of the twenty first century family affair Mary J. Blige, 359 00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:09,480 Speaker 2: and just the way that Drey's presence in the song 360 00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:13,600 Speaker 2: is an enabler and that sort of like beautiful column 361 00:16:13,640 --> 00:16:17,480 Speaker 2: response in Midnight Training to Georgia is so specific to 362 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:19,320 Speaker 2: this song. Though, It's funny that the other song I 363 00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:22,480 Speaker 2: really think of is having A similar kind of approach 364 00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:24,920 Speaker 2: and similar kind of emotional impact is that the Beatles 365 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:27,760 Speaker 2: song Help, Yeah, and it's well because you know, John 366 00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:30,000 Speaker 2: Lennon is telling that story and it's very personal, you know, 367 00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:32,120 Speaker 2: like I used to think I knew what I was 368 00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 2: doing in life. I had no idea. I'm really scared. 369 00:16:34,600 --> 00:16:37,360 Speaker 2: I have no idea what's coming next. And it's amazing 370 00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:39,520 Speaker 2: when you listen to it, and the way it'd be 371 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:42,040 Speaker 2: very differentive or John just singing the song, but he's 372 00:16:42,040 --> 00:16:44,840 Speaker 2: telling the story with Paul and George and they're singing 373 00:16:44,880 --> 00:16:46,720 Speaker 2: along with him in very much a Gladys and Pips 374 00:16:46,800 --> 00:16:48,640 Speaker 2: kind of way. Yeah, And they're telling the story along 375 00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:50,840 Speaker 2: with him, they're cheering him on, they're not entering the 376 00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 2: story themselves. And that is a kind of similar impact 377 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:56,560 Speaker 2: for me in terms of listening to those songs over 378 00:16:56,600 --> 00:16:58,960 Speaker 2: the years. I think of how different Help would be 379 00:16:58,960 --> 00:17:01,320 Speaker 2: if it were just John singing the song yeah, and 380 00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:04,280 Speaker 2: how different Midnight Train would be if it were just 381 00:17:04,280 --> 00:17:07,560 Speaker 2: Gladys even with her amazing powerful one time in human 382 00:17:07,600 --> 00:17:09,600 Speaker 2: history voice, but Gladys Knight has Yeah. 383 00:17:09,600 --> 00:17:11,200 Speaker 1: I guess Hey, I feel like now I'm thinking of 384 00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:12,800 Speaker 1: like the lyrics of Help and like how that song 385 00:17:12,840 --> 00:17:15,760 Speaker 1: always sounds so like like uplifting, you know, like yeah, 386 00:17:15,840 --> 00:17:17,800 Speaker 1: kind of like me, like here's me and my buddy. 387 00:17:17,840 --> 00:17:20,119 Speaker 1: Isn't like they're helping me, Like like when you think 388 00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:21,560 Speaker 1: of it like stripped down, and the same way with 389 00:17:21,560 --> 00:17:23,240 Speaker 1: Midnight Train to Georgia, Like when you strip it down 390 00:17:23,240 --> 00:17:25,760 Speaker 1: and it's like the lyrics are actually like kind of sad, 391 00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:28,159 Speaker 1: and like the tone totally shifts with that style of 392 00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:31,439 Speaker 1: storytelling and like with kind of just like that just 393 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:34,360 Speaker 1: a little like tweak to how you it's actually delivered 394 00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:36,480 Speaker 1: and how it's kind of like put in the context 395 00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:38,159 Speaker 1: of all the vocalists together, it's. 396 00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:40,240 Speaker 2: Really kind of beautiful their way almost like the background 397 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:42,720 Speaker 2: singers are sort of like the angel on the shoulder saying, 398 00:17:42,760 --> 00:17:44,800 Speaker 2: you know, like don't worry dot where you could do this. 399 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:47,280 Speaker 2: I hear a lot of Midnight Training to Georgia in 400 00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:51,760 Speaker 2: Outcasts and especially in Andred three thousand, but that beautiful 401 00:17:51,760 --> 00:17:55,119 Speaker 2: moment in international plays Anthem and the UGK song, I 402 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:58,720 Speaker 2: think is a quintessential Midnight Train to Georgia. Yeah moment. 403 00:17:58,760 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 1: For me, it is making me think of Roses by Outcasts, 404 00:18:01,600 --> 00:18:04,119 Speaker 1: which is one of my maybe maybe my number one 405 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:08,480 Speaker 1: Outcast song actually, but yeah, that that sort of Andre 406 00:18:08,680 --> 00:18:11,359 Speaker 1: being like his own but being both Gladys and the 407 00:18:11,359 --> 00:18:15,120 Speaker 1: Pips on his part of the song totally. Like even 408 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:17,040 Speaker 1: the way he sings like Caroline, you know, like it's 409 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:20,080 Speaker 1: just kind of like adding that call and response for himself. 410 00:18:20,400 --> 00:18:23,200 Speaker 2: Totally. We all need to be our own pip. I mean, 411 00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:24,000 Speaker 2: like it's hard to do. 412 00:18:24,200 --> 00:18:25,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean even think just like a lot of 413 00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:30,439 Speaker 1: Georgia born Atlanta, specifically rap artists who have come out 414 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:32,560 Speaker 1: in the last like two decades, I feel like there 415 00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:34,920 Speaker 1: is so much of that, like you know, like the Migos, 416 00:18:34,960 --> 00:18:37,000 Speaker 1: you know, like it's just like that col and response 417 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:39,159 Speaker 1: element of it and kind of the family band and 418 00:18:39,200 --> 00:18:42,000 Speaker 1: sort of that that interaction together feels like it owes 419 00:18:42,080 --> 00:18:44,640 Speaker 1: so much to Last Night and the Pips, And they 420 00:18:44,680 --> 00:18:46,520 Speaker 1: probably do pull directly from. 421 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:47,160 Speaker 3: Glass and the Pips. 422 00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:50,080 Speaker 1: They are such like fans of that era of music 423 00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:53,119 Speaker 1: and such fans of kind of classic motown music. 424 00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:55,560 Speaker 3: So I wouldn't I wouldn't. 425 00:18:55,200 --> 00:18:57,840 Speaker 1: Doubt that that's like a big part of what's inspire 426 00:18:57,880 --> 00:18:58,800 Speaker 1: them totally. 427 00:18:59,080 --> 00:19:00,760 Speaker 2: I think I think of a lot of Wu Tang 428 00:19:00,800 --> 00:19:03,719 Speaker 2: songs have a lot of connection to Midnight Training to Georgia, 429 00:19:04,040 --> 00:19:05,920 Speaker 2: like again, like just because of that, like that sense 430 00:19:05,960 --> 00:19:08,360 Speaker 2: of like people have known each other and been through 431 00:19:08,359 --> 00:19:11,480 Speaker 2: stuff together. Specifically the ghost Face song All That All 432 00:19:11,520 --> 00:19:13,800 Speaker 2: That I Got Is You Yeah from Iron Man, one 433 00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:15,960 Speaker 2: of the greatest songs ever and Mary J. Blige in 434 00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:18,560 Speaker 2: that song and the way that they're telling that story 435 00:19:18,560 --> 00:19:21,360 Speaker 2: together and it's a very different kind of story. It's 436 00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:23,960 Speaker 2: very sad childhood story, but the way that the different 437 00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:27,600 Speaker 2: voices in the song are telling the story together very 438 00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:30,320 Speaker 2: much part of that tradition for sure, Georgia connection. But 439 00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:33,960 Speaker 2: the Indigo Girls have a fantastic version of mind Night 440 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:38,399 Speaker 2: Training to Georgia, And because they're folk duo, it's you know, 441 00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:41,919 Speaker 2: one voice is Gladys and one voice is the Pips, 442 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:44,359 Speaker 2: and it's the only version of the song I know 443 00:19:44,520 --> 00:19:46,920 Speaker 2: like that where and it's just like the two voices 444 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:50,399 Speaker 2: acoustic guitars and they strip it down and it's funny 445 00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:52,119 Speaker 2: and it's a live it's something they did live for 446 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:54,120 Speaker 2: a while. And the live version is so interesting because 447 00:19:54,119 --> 00:19:55,959 Speaker 2: when they do it at the beginning, you can hear 448 00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:57,920 Speaker 2: the audience laugh a little bit and they think, like, oh, 449 00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:00,480 Speaker 2: this is gonna be funny. This is like a beloved 450 00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:03,080 Speaker 2: seventies old and they're doing like sort of a you know, 451 00:20:03,240 --> 00:20:05,520 Speaker 2: quasi camp version of it. Yeah, and it's funny that 452 00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:08,000 Speaker 2: you hear that reaction at first, that that's what people expect, 453 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:10,959 Speaker 2: and as they're telling the story together, you can hear 454 00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:13,200 Speaker 2: how it transforms them, Like no, it like the singers 455 00:20:13,320 --> 00:20:15,239 Speaker 2: know like what kind of story this is, and they 456 00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:16,680 Speaker 2: know it's a story that has to be told together 457 00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:18,680 Speaker 2: and that they deal with just those two voices. It's 458 00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:20,280 Speaker 2: unlike any other version of the song that I know, 459 00:20:20,480 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 2: But it's just it's so moving and so powerful and 460 00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:24,359 Speaker 2: so clever. 461 00:20:24,520 --> 00:20:24,720 Speaker 5: Yeah. 462 00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:27,320 Speaker 1: The furthest I could I could think of was a 463 00:20:27,359 --> 00:20:30,399 Speaker 1: great thirty rock scene. Where do you tell there's some 464 00:20:30,600 --> 00:20:34,760 Speaker 1: where Kenneth is going back to Georgia and he the 465 00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:37,159 Speaker 1: cast starts singing Midnight Train, which is fun. It's a 466 00:20:37,160 --> 00:20:40,040 Speaker 1: good time last night's in the episode. You know, it's cute, 467 00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:41,120 Speaker 1: it's storing thirty rock. 468 00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:41,560 Speaker 5: Yes. 469 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:43,880 Speaker 1: After the break, we will be joined by Ed Stacium, 470 00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:46,119 Speaker 1: who was the engineer and mixer on Midnight Train to Georgia. 471 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:52,840 Speaker 2: We are here with the production legend and stays you, 472 00:20:53,760 --> 00:20:59,400 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that's you man. 473 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:01,840 Speaker 3: Thanks Rob I want to know how. 474 00:21:01,840 --> 00:21:04,119 Speaker 1: I know this was very early in your career, and 475 00:21:04,160 --> 00:21:07,359 Speaker 1: I'm curious how you connected with Glass Night and the 476 00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:10,560 Speaker 1: Pips and got attached to this record. 477 00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:14,360 Speaker 4: Tony Caamello, who was the producer of Midnight Train Camello 478 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 4: had a partner, Tony bon Jovi, the Great Tony bon Jovi. 479 00:21:18,840 --> 00:21:22,960 Speaker 4: So when I first got there, Tony was Camello's engineer. 480 00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:27,399 Speaker 4: Tony was tight with Neil Bogart at Buddha Records. Tony, 481 00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:30,679 Speaker 4: they had finished up their contract. They didn't want to 482 00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:33,320 Speaker 4: sign back with Motown. They just had a big hit 483 00:21:33,359 --> 00:21:35,920 Speaker 4: with neither one of us. And you know, of course 484 00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:40,000 Speaker 4: earlier had heard through the grapevine. So Neil, Neil Bogart 485 00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:42,440 Speaker 4: loved Tony and I went into Neil's office with him 486 00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:45,840 Speaker 4: several times at the Buddha offices and he would always 487 00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:49,200 Speaker 4: like be pouring Kanyac and heaven knows what else happened, 488 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:53,320 Speaker 4: and he wanted to he said, He called up Tony. 489 00:21:53,359 --> 00:21:55,640 Speaker 4: He says, Tony, I want you to work on some 490 00:21:55,680 --> 00:21:59,159 Speaker 4: of these Gladyson Night tracks. Boom, there we go. So 491 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:02,040 Speaker 4: we cut some track. We cut it twice before we 492 00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:06,520 Speaker 4: ended up the final take. So it's Neil Bogart, loving 493 00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:10,080 Speaker 4: Tony's work, thought Tony had a vibe and which he did. 494 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:13,160 Speaker 4: He was a great producer, a musical genius. 495 00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:16,439 Speaker 2: Did Gladys Knight have the song Midnight Train when she 496 00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:16,920 Speaker 2: came in. 497 00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:20,000 Speaker 4: I think the song came through Neil and Tony. You know, 498 00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:23,040 Speaker 4: I'm not privy to some of the dealings that went 499 00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:25,840 Speaker 4: on with the record company. I do know some things. 500 00:22:25,920 --> 00:22:26,640 Speaker 3: Anyway, there was a. 501 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:29,119 Speaker 4: Publisher, I don't know who it was, pushing the song, 502 00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:38,080 Speaker 4: and Sissy Houston, Whitney's mom, who used to come down 503 00:22:38,080 --> 00:22:40,360 Speaker 4: and sing backing vocals on some of the I think 504 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:44,400 Speaker 4: she sang on those Cecil Home Sulful Sounds records Sissy did. 505 00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 4: She was a studio backup singer in New York at 506 00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:53,040 Speaker 4: that time, so she had a record deal and her 507 00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:57,560 Speaker 4: and Sissy and her manager wanted to change the lyric 508 00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:00,960 Speaker 4: from Midnight Playing to Houston to Midnight Trained to Georgia, 509 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:05,520 Speaker 4: which was a great idea. So I saw the sheet 510 00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:08,439 Speaker 4: news that that Tony had still had Midnight Playing Houston 511 00:23:08,440 --> 00:23:11,199 Speaker 4: written on it. But by the time we got the 512 00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:15,960 Speaker 4: demos and somebody had, you know, told Gladys that they 513 00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:19,439 Speaker 4: should do the song. It was already changed to Midnight 514 00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:22,879 Speaker 4: Train to Georgia, changed by Sissy Houston. That's who requested 515 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:23,800 Speaker 4: that they changed the lyric. 516 00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:27,840 Speaker 2: So Gladys Knight is the song. How did the session happen? 517 00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:30,320 Speaker 4: Right? We three sessions. I don't have a copy of 518 00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:32,520 Speaker 4: the very first one, but I have a copy of 519 00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:34,560 Speaker 4: the second one that would you like to hear a 520 00:23:34,560 --> 00:24:06,280 Speaker 4: little bit of it? And this is take one. 521 00:23:52,920 --> 00:24:06,600 Speaker 5: Lao, you must follow the man. So he's leaving the 522 00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:19,680 Speaker 5: life he's come to know, he said, he's going back 523 00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:26,959 Speaker 5: to part Yeah, who what's left off his world? 524 00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:33,560 Speaker 4: So as you can hear, it's a much slower version. 525 00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:36,720 Speaker 4: We don't there's no there's no strings on it yet. 526 00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:39,159 Speaker 4: Tony would have put strings and horns on it. But 527 00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:42,439 Speaker 4: this is interesting. A couple of spots here she sings 528 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:43,720 Speaker 4: midnight Train to Atlanta. 529 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:47,680 Speaker 5: Check it out on that midnight train to it better? 530 00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 4: Pretty cool, right, yeah? 531 00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:56,200 Speaker 2: Totally different thought. 532 00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:58,760 Speaker 4: Yeah, oh yeah yeah. And here's a cool little there's 533 00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:03,120 Speaker 4: a scratch trap that Tony did which is emulating backing vocals. 534 00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:04,520 Speaker 4: We'll play that with Gladys. 535 00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:05,399 Speaker 2: That's for fun. 536 00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:26,360 Speaker 6: It's pretty cool, you know, yes, like train Jolter. 537 00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:29,119 Speaker 5: And you'll be gone, he's going back to bun Long 538 00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:31,040 Speaker 5: go oh. 539 00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:33,120 Speaker 4: Some time. 540 00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:48,840 Speaker 5: Yes with him, I'm going with train John Train your. 541 00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:51,520 Speaker 4: Wow. 542 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:53,640 Speaker 3: He said, that was the second session. 543 00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:54,440 Speaker 5: That you worked with. 544 00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:56,879 Speaker 4: Yeah, there was one before this. I don't have the 545 00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:00,800 Speaker 4: y track. So we sent this to glad As I 546 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:04,320 Speaker 4: recall sent a multi track to Gladys and then she 547 00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:06,760 Speaker 4: put a vocal on it. She says, I don't like this. 548 00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:09,520 Speaker 4: I don't like this version. It's too slow, and I 549 00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:12,760 Speaker 4: believe that. Bubba also said, we need something that's happening. 550 00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:15,600 Speaker 4: We need something that's more in the al green kind 551 00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:20,000 Speaker 4: of vibe, you know, down home southern, you know, a 552 00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:24,359 Speaker 4: little dirty. So that's how they suggested it. So Tony 553 00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:27,639 Speaker 4: was actually at this time he was he's getting a 554 00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:29,959 Speaker 4: little nervous because you know, he really wanted to get 555 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:31,679 Speaker 4: this record done. We had to get it out there, 556 00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:36,920 Speaker 4: and so Gladys. He talked to Gladys and she's like, 557 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:38,399 Speaker 4: we gotta get we got to make something better. We 558 00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:42,040 Speaker 4: gotta have an al green feel. Okay, you can kind 559 00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:44,639 Speaker 4: of relate to the final version and how that is. 560 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:49,439 Speaker 2: What was it like recording Gladys's vocal, But the final session, 561 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:51,200 Speaker 2: Gladys's vocal is so great. 562 00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:54,000 Speaker 4: Well one to Detroit. You can hear the ideas that 563 00:26:54,119 --> 00:26:56,720 Speaker 4: Tony had there for some backing vocals, right, Gladys went 564 00:26:56,760 --> 00:26:58,640 Speaker 4: out and did a real quick vocal when I didn't 565 00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:00,399 Speaker 4: you know, I wou'd never met. I had never been 566 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:02,840 Speaker 4: in that studio before. It was my first airplane flight, 567 00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:05,800 Speaker 4: never been in that studio before. Here I go checked 568 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:08,080 Speaker 4: the input level. Okay, I want to sing now, go 569 00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:10,680 Speaker 4: go go saying. Glass did a quick reference vocal. I 570 00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:13,000 Speaker 4: was able to twitter it a little bit. And then 571 00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:15,840 Speaker 4: the Pips went out and did their backing vocals, and 572 00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:18,320 Speaker 4: they pretty much did those backing vocals one line at 573 00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:21,120 Speaker 4: a time, and Tony was guiding them through that. Tony 574 00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:23,200 Speaker 4: and Bubba came up with a few, but like Tony 575 00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:25,200 Speaker 4: Camello came up with that a super. 576 00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:28,000 Speaker 3: Bistar buddy who didn't get FA, which is you. 577 00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:32,359 Speaker 4: Know, classic and the Boo boo. I think Tony came 578 00:27:32,440 --> 00:27:34,720 Speaker 4: up with that as well. I believe you know either 579 00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:38,760 Speaker 4: not drained to Georgia Midnight Drain the Georgia Boo boo. 580 00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:42,359 Speaker 4: So we did that each line pretty much a line 581 00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:45,840 Speaker 4: at a time with Glass's guide vocal. We double tracked 582 00:27:45,880 --> 00:27:48,040 Speaker 4: each one. We would do the line like a super 583 00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:51,560 Speaker 4: bistar buddy didn't get far, and then we would double 584 00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:54,040 Speaker 4: that line and then went on to the next line. 585 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:55,800 Speaker 4: Then we would get it, and they would do it 586 00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:58,240 Speaker 4: several times until I really hit it on. Tony wanted 587 00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:00,879 Speaker 4: it to be very precise and you know, tight, and 588 00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:03,240 Speaker 4: those backing vocals are tight, and they're double tracked. So 589 00:28:03,280 --> 00:28:05,160 Speaker 4: we do each like I said, each line at the time, 590 00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:10,600 Speaker 4: and then we finished the backing vocals and it was Gladys' 591 00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:12,400 Speaker 4: turn to Okay, I want to do a real vocal. 592 00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:12,960 Speaker 5: Now here I go. 593 00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:16,879 Speaker 4: And this is funny. Gladys whould eat a lemon before 594 00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:19,360 Speaker 4: you go into record. She always had a lemono whether 595 00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:21,280 Speaker 4: she cut it and put in her mouth and eat 596 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:23,920 Speaker 4: it like an orange. And she went out there says 597 00:28:24,640 --> 00:28:25,199 Speaker 4: I'm ready to do. 598 00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:25,760 Speaker 2: A vocal now. 599 00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:31,399 Speaker 4: Yes. She did the final vocal, one take, what's what? 600 00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:34,640 Speaker 4: One take all the way through, and there was one 601 00:28:34,760 --> 00:28:38,600 Speaker 4: line in the fade on the somewhere I got to go, 602 00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:41,560 Speaker 4: I got to go, Hey, one of those somewhere I don't. 603 00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:43,760 Speaker 4: And I listened to it in solo because I have 604 00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:45,520 Speaker 4: the multi track of that as well. I could not 605 00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:48,360 Speaker 4: figure which one it was that we went to Bell 606 00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:50,800 Speaker 4: Sound in New York and just punched in one line, 607 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:53,200 Speaker 4: but the whole body of the song is a one 608 00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:56,400 Speaker 4: take vocal. It's amazing. What a singer. There's a thrill, 609 00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:58,200 Speaker 4: there's a real thrill to work with them. Yeah, I 610 00:28:58,280 --> 00:28:59,880 Speaker 4: wanted to play a little bit of the Pips on 611 00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:01,560 Speaker 4: in solo because it sounds so good. 612 00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:04,480 Speaker 1: And yeah, so we can hear a little bit about 613 00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:06,880 Speaker 1: a little bit of the isolated vocals from the Pips. 614 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:07,960 Speaker 1: I know you want to play for us. 615 00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:18,000 Speaker 5: Last bit night Shame George that same. 616 00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:19,440 Speaker 4: It's just great. 617 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:21,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, going back to. 618 00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 5: Fine whenever he takes that ride, I guess it's gonna 619 00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:28,200 Speaker 5: be right by his side. 620 00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:35,880 Speaker 4: I know you will really tight, really really tight and night. 621 00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:42,040 Speaker 5: Trash George Living whoa. 622 00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:48,600 Speaker 3: Whold is his His and hers alone? 623 00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:54,680 Speaker 5: Dream man a superstar. 624 00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:58,600 Speaker 2: But it didn't get far. That's amazing. 625 00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:00,440 Speaker 3: Wow, I wasn't incredible. 626 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:04,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, that sounds amazing. Thank you so much for all 627 00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:08,080 Speaker 2: this music that you've made, especially the one we're talking 628 00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:11,800 Speaker 2: about today, Midnight Train to Georgia, a classic song. 629 00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:14,440 Speaker 4: It was my pleasure great to see both of you. 630 00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:17,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you, Thank you so much for listening to 631 00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:20,720 Speaker 2: Rolling Stone's five hundred Greatest Songs. This podcast is brought 632 00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:24,240 Speaker 2: to you by Rolling Stone and iHeartMedia. Written and hosted 633 00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:26,280 Speaker 2: by me, Rob Sheffield. 634 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:26,840 Speaker 3: And Britney Spanos. 635 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:31,120 Speaker 2: Executive produced by Jason Fine, Alex Dale and Christian Horde, 636 00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:35,040 Speaker 2: and produced by Jesse Cannon, with music supervision by Eric Zeiler. 637 00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:37,040 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening, Thanks for watching.