1
00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:04,360
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast Catch us

2
00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:07,560
Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the

3
00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:10,760
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app and the Bloomberg Business app, or listening on

4
00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:12,800
Speaker 1: demand wherever you get your podcasts.

5
00:00:13,760 --> 00:00:16,000
Speaker 2: You've been robbing elbows with lawmakers all day, none of

6
00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:17,479
Speaker 2: whom seem to know what's going to happen.

7
00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:20,320
Speaker 3: Next, although they all seem to think that more than

8
00:00:20,400 --> 00:00:23,279
Speaker 3: likely the government will shut down come that deadline of

9
00:00:23,400 --> 00:00:24,040
Speaker 3: midnight SAT.

10
00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:26,600
Speaker 2: So are we beyond likely? Can we start saying that

11
00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:28,160
Speaker 2: the government shuts down in four days?

12
00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:30,360
Speaker 3: Well, there were still a few. I talked to Congressman

13
00:00:30,400 --> 00:00:32,800
Speaker 3: Brian Style being one. He said something similar to what

14
00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:34,960
Speaker 3: he told us on this show earlier this week, which

15
00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:37,479
Speaker 3: is that it's always darkest before the dawn, and it

16
00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:40,239
Speaker 3: ain't done yet. It's just true, not yet down. We

17
00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:42,519
Speaker 3: still have a few days to go. But it's just

18
00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:45,200
Speaker 3: looking really, really difficult at this point.

19
00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:48,360
Speaker 2: Show it is, and it's interesting that Speaker McCarthy is

20
00:00:48,400 --> 00:00:51,320
Speaker 2: talking about a way forward. It says that they will

21
00:00:51,360 --> 00:00:53,640
Speaker 2: avoid a government shutdown. First the spending bills, then they

22
00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:55,640
Speaker 2: got a CR. But nobody can agree on the CR

23
00:00:56,640 --> 00:00:58,360
Speaker 2: even in the House. Never mind the one that is

24
00:00:58,440 --> 00:01:00,680
Speaker 2: moving in the Senate right now, the way he did

25
00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:03,400
Speaker 2: react to that procedural vote in the Senate that sets

26
00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:06,240
Speaker 2: up passage of a continuing resolution that would keep the

27
00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:10,000
Speaker 2: government open. The Speaker doesn't want to do it the

28
00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:10,640
Speaker 2: Senate's way.

29
00:01:10,720 --> 00:01:14,600
Speaker 4: They're picking Ukraine over Americans. Look, I know there's problems

30
00:01:14,600 --> 00:01:18,959
Speaker 4: out there. What Russia has done is wrong, and we

31
00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:23,200
Speaker 4: can defend that. But we also watching happen right here

32
00:01:23,200 --> 00:01:28,080
Speaker 4: in America right now. Why can't we deal with the

33
00:01:28,080 --> 00:01:30,440
Speaker 4: border in our emergencies too?

34
00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:33,520
Speaker 2: Getting back to the border, this is the new theme

35
00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:35,800
Speaker 2: now that if you want to keep the government open,

36
00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:37,800
Speaker 2: Joe Biden, you've got to deal with border security, even

37
00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:40,320
Speaker 2: though this really hadn't been mentioned until twenty four hours ago.

38
00:01:40,560 --> 00:01:43,319
Speaker 3: Yeah, and this is something that came up recurringly in

39
00:01:43,319 --> 00:01:45,680
Speaker 3: my conversations with the Republicans in the House on the

40
00:01:45,760 --> 00:01:48,760
Speaker 3: Hill today. Brian Style brought this up. Congressman French Hill

41
00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:51,200
Speaker 3: of Arkansas brought up border as well, the idea that

42
00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:53,680
Speaker 3: they can do a cr that has border security measures

43
00:01:53,720 --> 00:01:56,000
Speaker 3: in it, and both of them suggested to me they

44
00:01:56,080 --> 00:01:58,240
Speaker 3: might find support for that in the Senate, because when

45
00:01:58,280 --> 00:02:00,800
Speaker 3: you have the likes of New York City Mayor Eric

46
00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:03,520
Speaker 3: Adams talking about some of these issues with migrants. They said,

47
00:02:03,560 --> 00:02:05,680
Speaker 3: Democrats may want to deal with this too. It seems

48
00:02:05,720 --> 00:02:08,680
Speaker 3: like they think the Senate wouldn't necessarily consider a measure

49
00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:11,079
Speaker 3: like that debt on arrival. But as you say, Joe,

50
00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:12,959
Speaker 3: the Senate's got its own thing in the works, and

51
00:02:13,000 --> 00:02:14,360
Speaker 3: the House doesn't seem very into that.

52
00:02:14,560 --> 00:02:16,760
Speaker 2: We're talking about this like it matters with four days

53
00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:18,440
Speaker 2: to go. I mean, at some point we're going to

54
00:02:18,520 --> 00:02:22,120
Speaker 2: have to come to terms with reality here. I look,

55
00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:24,360
Speaker 2: I don't know exactly how this is going to end,

56
00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:27,639
Speaker 2: but it's starting to be inevitable. I guess that's why

57
00:02:27,639 --> 00:02:29,440
Speaker 2: we wanted to talk to Michael Lindon because the next

58
00:02:29,520 --> 00:02:33,040
Speaker 2: days here is the administration making decisions on what checks

59
00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:35,760
Speaker 2: to cut. Before we get that Fartherugh, you've got some

60
00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:39,560
Speaker 2: breaking news on the union in Detroit, and I just

61
00:02:39,600 --> 00:02:41,680
Speaker 2: want to make sure that everybody hears about this because

62
00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:43,840
Speaker 2: we're going to be seeing a visit from former President

63
00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:46,120
Speaker 2: Donald Trump tonight speaking to these workers. We have a

64
00:02:46,120 --> 00:02:46,760
Speaker 2: new deadline.

65
00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:49,359
Speaker 3: Yeah, and this comes after Biden was with them on

66
00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:52,160
Speaker 3: the picket line yesterday. Sean Fain once again the second

67
00:02:52,200 --> 00:02:54,720
Speaker 3: week in a row. On Friday at ten am is

68
00:02:54,760 --> 00:02:58,119
Speaker 3: going to hold a Facebook live stream and the UAW

69
00:02:58,200 --> 00:03:02,800
Speaker 3: we understand, does intend to expand strikes on Friday barring

70
00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:06,239
Speaker 3: major progress at the negotiating table. I'm not sure we've

71
00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:08,639
Speaker 3: seen signs of major progress to this point, Joe, And

72
00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:10,800
Speaker 3: the idea is we could see another escalation for the

73
00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:13,760
Speaker 3: second week in a row with an announcement over Facebook.

74
00:03:13,760 --> 00:03:15,840
Speaker 2: You know, it's been strangely quiet, even with the visits

75
00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:19,360
Speaker 2: of Trump and Biden this week on negotiations. I wonder

76
00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:21,240
Speaker 2: if Ford gets back on the list, if there's no

77
00:03:21,280 --> 00:03:23,880
Speaker 2: further progress with Ford, if they're back in the doghouse

78
00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:25,799
Speaker 2: last time, they were spared last time, and we could

79
00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:29,040
Speaker 2: have another scaling up, as they say, of the stand

80
00:03:29,080 --> 00:03:31,600
Speaker 2: ups this weekend agamp Boy Friday. So we're going to

81
00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:34,000
Speaker 2: have another deadline to look forward to.

82
00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:37,360
Speaker 3: Right, first, you expand the auto strike, huh, then you

83
00:03:37,400 --> 00:03:41,160
Speaker 3: shut down the government, then everyone starts paying back student

84
00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:43,680
Speaker 3: loans again. It's a triple whammie.

85
00:03:44,200 --> 00:03:46,960
Speaker 2: Well, at least two of those we know are coming. Yeah.

86
00:03:47,040 --> 00:03:50,280
Speaker 2: Michael Lindon, the former Senior Advisor of the President, executive

87
00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:54,040
Speaker 2: Associate director of the Office of Management and Budget in

88
00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:56,360
Speaker 2: the Biden administration, those are just like to have to

89
00:03:56,360 --> 00:04:00,120
Speaker 2: make decisions when not all the money is available. Mike, Well,

90
00:04:00,160 --> 00:04:01,960
Speaker 2: it's great to have you on Bloomberg. Thanks for being

91
00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:05,480
Speaker 2: with us. They must be modeling or making decisions already

92
00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:10,320
Speaker 2: inside OMB in advance of a potential shutdown. What's the

93
00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:12,520
Speaker 2: conversation like behind closed doors right now?

94
00:04:13,320 --> 00:04:15,520
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's right, and thanks for having me. Really appreciate

95
00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:20,760
Speaker 5: being here. You're absolutely right. Whenever you approach the potential

96
00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:23,000
Speaker 5: lapse in funding at the end of a fiscal year,

97
00:04:23,040 --> 00:04:26,280
Speaker 5: at the end of a continuing resolution, OMB has to

98
00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:29,640
Speaker 5: start going through the process of figuring out exactly what

99
00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:33,480
Speaker 5: will actually shut down, what will continue at a reduced level,

100
00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:37,880
Speaker 5: and what will continue sort of quasi normally. But it's

101
00:04:37,920 --> 00:04:40,120
Speaker 5: really important to understand that a shutdown is going to

102
00:04:40,120 --> 00:04:43,760
Speaker 5: be painful no matter what, no matter what decisions OMB makes,

103
00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:48,360
Speaker 5: no matter how the administration chooses to interpret of some

104
00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:52,640
Speaker 5: of its authorities. The government does an enormous amount of

105
00:04:52,720 --> 00:04:55,719
Speaker 5: behind the scenes, under the radar, day to day kinds

106
00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:59,760
Speaker 5: of activities and protections and programs that American people rely

107
00:04:59,880 --> 00:05:02,240
Speaker 5: on every day. Maybe maybe they don't even realize they're

108
00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:04,960
Speaker 5: relying on it, and they're going to realize when it's

109
00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:07,520
Speaker 5: not there, or when it's way slower than they expect.

110
00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:08,000
Speaker 6: It's going to.

111
00:05:08,080 --> 00:05:11,520
Speaker 5: Hurt a lot of people. But you're absolutely right that

112
00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:15,120
Speaker 5: the process of figuring that out begins well in advance

113
00:05:15,160 --> 00:05:16,240
Speaker 5: of a potential lapse.

114
00:05:17,920 --> 00:05:20,440
Speaker 3: So you say, Michael, that it is going to hurt

115
00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:23,880
Speaker 3: a lot of people. And what I've heard continuously on

116
00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:26,280
Speaker 3: Capitol Hill is that a shutdown is far less consequential

117
00:05:26,320 --> 00:05:28,720
Speaker 3: than say, a default on the debt, a failure of

118
00:05:28,760 --> 00:05:31,719
Speaker 3: the US government to meet its obligations, because the money

119
00:05:31,720 --> 00:05:34,640
Speaker 3: comes back right as soon as the appropriation bills actually pass.

120
00:05:35,040 --> 00:05:38,039
Speaker 3: Everybody gets their back pay. No harm, no foul. But

121
00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:40,360
Speaker 3: are you saying they're actually there is a foul here.

122
00:05:40,960 --> 00:05:43,599
Speaker 5: Well, well, they're definitely gonna be harm and foul, don't.

123
00:05:44,480 --> 00:05:47,000
Speaker 5: I don't think it's the same as a default. That's true,

124
00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:50,080
Speaker 5: but that doesn't There's a lot of things between apocalypse

125
00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:53,599
Speaker 5: and no harm at all, and this is somewhere in

126
00:05:54,040 --> 00:05:58,080
Speaker 5: those things. So it's not no harm, no foul. Some

127
00:05:58,120 --> 00:06:01,640
Speaker 5: people will get back pay. Federal employees will get back

128
00:06:01,720 --> 00:06:05,919
Speaker 5: put back pay after the shutdown presumably ends, but in

129
00:06:05,960 --> 00:06:07,919
Speaker 5: the meantime, if it goes on a long time and

130
00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:10,880
Speaker 5: you're a federal employee or you're a service member and

131
00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:13,880
Speaker 5: you're you know, operating paycheck to paycheck and you don't

132
00:06:13,880 --> 00:06:17,840
Speaker 5: get a paycheck one time, that that's going to affect you.

133
00:06:17,880 --> 00:06:20,200
Speaker 5: That's going to affect how you you know, how you

134
00:06:20,240 --> 00:06:22,559
Speaker 5: live your life. It may mean you miss a mortgage payment,

135
00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:25,000
Speaker 5: or you miss a rent payment, or you have to

136
00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:27,920
Speaker 5: call your kids childcare and say I'm sorry, I can't

137
00:06:27,920 --> 00:06:30,240
Speaker 5: make I can't make the payments this month, and that

138
00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:34,160
Speaker 5: has ripple effects. I will also say that contractors, federal

139
00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:37,760
Speaker 5: contractors are not guaranteed back pay. That's not something that

140
00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:41,640
Speaker 5: will necessarily happen. And there's all sorts of other consequences

141
00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:46,159
Speaker 5: that are beyond pay. So, for example, the Small Business

142
00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:49,880
Speaker 5: Administration is making loans every day to small businesses who

143
00:06:49,960 --> 00:06:53,960
Speaker 5: need that assistance to make payroll or to expand or

144
00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:56,320
Speaker 5: to make investments. They're not going to be able to

145
00:06:56,320 --> 00:07:00,279
Speaker 5: process those loans during your shutdown. There those you know

146
00:07:00,320 --> 00:07:02,440
Speaker 5: that small business owner is going to call up at

147
00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:04,960
Speaker 5: its local SBA office and going to get a busy

148
00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:06,800
Speaker 5: signal or going to get a message that's sorry, we

149
00:07:07,400 --> 00:07:10,520
Speaker 5: can't answer the phone right now. That has broader implications

150
00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:14,000
Speaker 5: for the economy as well. The truth is that the

151
00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:17,520
Speaker 5: government shutdown will have consequences that are far reaching and

152
00:07:17,640 --> 00:07:19,960
Speaker 5: sometimes in ways that we won't be able to predict

153
00:07:20,240 --> 00:07:22,880
Speaker 5: until they happen, and when when they happen, people are

154
00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:23,920
Speaker 5: going to be very unhappy.

155
00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:27,160
Speaker 2: Well, i'll tell you this whole conversation has brought us

156
00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:31,160
Speaker 2: a warning from Moody's this week, Michael. We talked to

157
00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:33,840
Speaker 2: Mick mulvaney here on the program a couple of days ago,

158
00:07:33,880 --> 00:07:38,200
Speaker 2: and he found that to be inappropriate, suggesting that even

159
00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:41,200
Speaker 2: in a shutdown, we continue to pay our debt. What

160
00:07:41,360 --> 00:07:44,640
Speaker 2: is the conversation like around that inside the administration.

161
00:07:45,760 --> 00:07:49,280
Speaker 5: Well, the good news, there's good and bad news here.

162
00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:52,560
Speaker 5: As is always the case, there are some requirements that

163
00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:56,120
Speaker 5: the government will continue to pay under any circumstances, either

164
00:07:56,240 --> 00:07:59,440
Speaker 5: because it's using a different form of funding. So we're

165
00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:01,840
Speaker 5: talking about a government shutdown here, we're talking about the

166
00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:05,960
Speaker 5: annual appropriations process, which funds a lot of the basic

167
00:08:06,320 --> 00:08:10,200
Speaker 5: systems and protections and services that the American people rely on.

168
00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:14,160
Speaker 5: But it doesn't fund things like Social Security benefits or

169
00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:17,600
Speaker 5: Medicare benefits or interest payments on the debt, so those

170
00:08:17,680 --> 00:08:22,160
Speaker 5: things would continue. There are some consequences, however, that are

171
00:08:22,200 --> 00:08:26,240
Speaker 5: really important to remember. The Social Security benefits are funded

172
00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:30,400
Speaker 5: by separate funding streams that are not affected by a shutdown.

173
00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:36,000
Speaker 5: But the people who process those Social Security benefits, the

174
00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:42,640
Speaker 5: Social Security Administration is funded by normal appropriations, process normal appropriations.

175
00:08:43,040 --> 00:08:45,480
Speaker 5: And so those folks are going to go without a paycheck.

176
00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:49,079
Speaker 5: Now they will continue processing those payments. But will there

177
00:08:49,120 --> 00:08:53,040
Speaker 5: be consequences for morale, or for speed, or for efficiency. Yes,

178
00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:56,199
Speaker 5: there will be, and it's should we shouldn't pretend that

179
00:08:56,240 --> 00:08:59,160
Speaker 5: there won't be. Now, there won't be consequences on pay

180
00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:02,360
Speaker 5: interest payments on our debt, but there will be these

181
00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:05,880
Speaker 5: broad other consequences that it's very hard to predict exactly

182
00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:07,000
Speaker 5: how they're going to turn out.

183
00:09:08,520 --> 00:09:10,560
Speaker 3: Well, And it isn't a consequence as well, Michael, that

184
00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:13,959
Speaker 3: all of this implementing the shutdown. Bringing the government out

185
00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:17,160
Speaker 3: of a shutdown costs money too. This is something Congressman

186
00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:19,040
Speaker 3: Mike Lawler, who is a Republican, one of the most

187
00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:21,960
Speaker 3: vocal Republicans against a shutdown, one who says he would

188
00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:25,080
Speaker 3: sign on to a discharge petition along with Democrats in

189
00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:27,400
Speaker 3: order to get the government funded.

190
00:09:27,679 --> 00:09:28,240
Speaker 1: If need Be.

191
00:09:28,480 --> 00:09:31,960
Speaker 3: Says it's a myth that a shutdown saves money. It

192
00:09:32,080 --> 00:09:33,760
Speaker 3: costs money. Can you just walk us through that.

193
00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:38,400
Speaker 5: He's absolutely right. It absolutely costs money. You end up

194
00:09:38,440 --> 00:09:41,200
Speaker 5: having to incur costs that you wouldn't otherwise have to,

195
00:09:41,360 --> 00:09:44,680
Speaker 5: You have to put off payments that might incur interest payments,

196
00:09:44,720 --> 00:09:46,920
Speaker 5: you might there's all sorts of ways that, you know,

197
00:09:47,040 --> 00:09:49,040
Speaker 5: you end up the government ends up being much less

198
00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:52,040
Speaker 5: efficient if it's operating on a skeleton crew or having

199
00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:54,440
Speaker 5: to decide which things to do it and put off

200
00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:56,839
Speaker 5: and put off till later. There's certain things that the

201
00:09:56,880 --> 00:10:00,880
Speaker 5: government does that save money, things like you know, investigating

202
00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:07,040
Speaker 5: fraud and investigating waste that won't happen during a government shutdown.

203
00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:09,800
Speaker 5: So he's absolutely right. It's going to cost money. It

204
00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:13,840
Speaker 5: costs the economy, it costs individual families, and we should

205
00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:17,760
Speaker 5: really be clear here that a shutdown is entirely avoidable here.

206
00:10:18,240 --> 00:10:22,439
Speaker 5: Senate Republicans, Senate Democrats on board with a simple cr

207
00:10:22,480 --> 00:10:25,080
Speaker 5: that would keep the government open. If that CR is

208
00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:27,839
Speaker 5: on the floor of the House, it passes. The question

209
00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:30,040
Speaker 5: is whether Speaker McCarthy will put that on the floor

210
00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:33,640
Speaker 5: of the House or simply say no, my caucus doesn't

211
00:10:33,640 --> 00:10:35,680
Speaker 5: want to do that, and so we end up with

212
00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:36,280
Speaker 5: a shutdown.

213
00:10:37,280 --> 00:10:39,680
Speaker 2: You know, Michael, we still remember the deal that was struck.

214
00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:42,920
Speaker 2: You mentioned the debt ceiling and the avoidance of default.

215
00:10:42,920 --> 00:10:46,160
Speaker 2: There was a big deal, a grand deal that involved

216
00:10:46,280 --> 00:10:49,880
Speaker 2: weeks of agonizing negotiations, and you were in the room

217
00:10:50,600 --> 00:10:54,679
Speaker 2: for some of them. President Biden was asked just yesterday

218
00:10:55,640 --> 00:10:59,720
Speaker 2: about Speaker McCarthy as a trusted player here. He said,

219
00:10:59,760 --> 00:11:04,520
Speaker 2: we made a deal, we shook hands. How come nobody

220
00:11:04,559 --> 00:11:09,160
Speaker 2: remembers this orchestration around the debt ceiling limit. I wonder

221
00:11:09,200 --> 00:11:12,800
Speaker 2: your thoughts on that, because that was the whole plan

222
00:11:12,880 --> 00:11:14,520
Speaker 2: to prevent what we're going through now.

223
00:11:15,679 --> 00:11:19,720
Speaker 5: That's absolutely right, and I appreciate you bringing that up

224
00:11:19,760 --> 00:11:21,880
Speaker 5: because I was in the room. I was part of

225
00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:24,400
Speaker 5: those negotiations, and I can tell you that part of

226
00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:28,000
Speaker 5: that agreement was that we would avoid a government shutdown,

227
00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:31,079
Speaker 5: that we would be able to have an appropriations process

228
00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:34,360
Speaker 5: that precedes something close to normal. And the good news

229
00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:36,600
Speaker 5: is that the Senate has actually been doing that right.

230
00:11:36,640 --> 00:11:40,000
Speaker 5: They have been passing appropriations bills out of committee on

231
00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:44,880
Speaker 5: a bipartisan basis. That align with that, with that agreement,

232
00:11:45,320 --> 00:11:48,079
Speaker 5: and the Speaker and the House Republicans did more than

233
00:11:48,120 --> 00:11:50,520
Speaker 5: just shake hands. They voted for it. One hundred and

234
00:11:50,559 --> 00:11:53,760
Speaker 5: fifty Republicans in the House voted for that deal. It

235
00:11:53,920 --> 00:11:56,680
Speaker 5: set top line levels, and then they proceeded to pass

236
00:11:56,720 --> 00:11:59,679
Speaker 5: appropriation bills that completely ignore that.

237
00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:03,480
Speaker 2: And now they're going to Kevin McCarthy cannot be trusted them.

238
00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:06,720
Speaker 5: I think it's a I think my own view, and

239
00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:08,320
Speaker 5: I was, like I said I was in the room,

240
00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:10,920
Speaker 5: is that they were absolutely negotiating in good faith. I

241
00:12:10,960 --> 00:12:14,280
Speaker 5: really do believe that. I think they intended to stick

242
00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:16,840
Speaker 5: to that deal. And whether the tail is now just

243
00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:19,600
Speaker 5: wagging the dog in the House Caucus and the Speaker

244
00:12:19,640 --> 00:12:22,400
Speaker 5: can't get control of his most extreme elements or is

245
00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:26,440
Speaker 5: unwilling to confront them, that may have changed. But I

246
00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:28,880
Speaker 5: think that the Speaker was negotiating in good faith. I

247
00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:32,400
Speaker 5: think the Speaker still has a chance to make good

248
00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:34,360
Speaker 5: on that. We don't need a shut down here. They

249
00:12:34,360 --> 00:12:37,320
Speaker 5: can give themselves more time, and they should do that.

250
00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:38,440
Speaker 5: He should take that chance.

251
00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:43,240
Speaker 3: Michael I caught up with Congressman french Hill up earlier

252
00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:45,400
Speaker 3: today and he was talking about how the fact that

253
00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:47,360
Speaker 3: we had a deal, we agreed to it. His direct

254
00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:51,840
Speaker 3: quote was, and now we're relitigating it here with some

255
00:12:52,080 --> 00:12:55,720
Speaker 3: in the Republican Party the operative word there being some. Realistically,

256
00:12:55,720 --> 00:12:58,080
Speaker 3: we're talking about just a few members that are holding

257
00:12:58,120 --> 00:13:00,600
Speaker 3: this up. Another Republican I spoke with Brian's Sisle said

258
00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:03,200
Speaker 3: that this just shows that the spending process in the

259
00:13:03,280 --> 00:13:06,520
Speaker 3: US is broken. How should it be fixed if this

260
00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:07,800
Speaker 3: happens time and again?

261
00:13:08,679 --> 00:13:11,640
Speaker 5: Well, it's an interesting point, and I couldn't agree more

262
00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:13,680
Speaker 5: that what we have here is a problem with one

263
00:13:13,679 --> 00:13:18,160
Speaker 5: faction in one party, in one chamber, and the Speaker

264
00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:22,040
Speaker 5: is allowing that one faction to control whether or not

265
00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:24,760
Speaker 5: we get to shut down, whether we have a shutdown

266
00:13:24,840 --> 00:13:27,199
Speaker 5: or not, or get to keep the government open. And

267
00:13:27,600 --> 00:13:31,120
Speaker 5: it's interesting that this year we did agree to a

268
00:13:31,160 --> 00:13:33,920
Speaker 5: top line agreement. Well in advance of the deadline. The

269
00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:37,840
Speaker 5: Senate has been proceeding according to the sort of normal

270
00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:41,400
Speaker 5: appropriations process, passing individual bills out of committee on a

271
00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:45,240
Speaker 5: bipartisan basis. It's the House has decided to go a

272
00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:48,040
Speaker 5: different direction. I don't know that there's any process or

273
00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:54,280
Speaker 5: deals that can fix something that's rotten inside one caucus.

274
00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:56,920
Speaker 5: If the Speaker is not willing to confront that caucus

275
00:13:56,960 --> 00:13:58,680
Speaker 5: and say I'm just not going to.

276
00:13:58,720 --> 00:13:59,200
Speaker 6: Listen to you.

277
00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:03,400
Speaker 5: There's a odd by partisan majority for appropriations bills that

278
00:14:03,679 --> 00:14:06,400
Speaker 5: meet the terms of the deal that we all agreed to.

279
00:14:06,520 --> 00:14:08,920
Speaker 5: He could still do that. There is a majority in

280
00:14:08,960 --> 00:14:11,360
Speaker 5: the House to keep the government open and to pass

281
00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:12,400
Speaker 5: appropriations bills.

282
00:14:13,360 --> 00:14:16,120
Speaker 2: There's still a chance, says Michael Lindon, but it's not

283
00:14:16,160 --> 00:14:19,000
Speaker 2: looking good. Many thanks Michael for your insights. We appreciate

284
00:14:19,080 --> 00:14:22,360
Speaker 2: you bringing your first hand experience to us here on

285
00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:24,760
Speaker 2: sound On with Kaylee Lines, I'm Joe Matthew.

286
00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:29,680
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg. You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound On podcast.

287
00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:34,080
Speaker 1: Catch the program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio,

288
00:14:34,240 --> 00:14:37,000
Speaker 1: the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg

289
00:14:37,080 --> 00:14:40,360
Speaker 1: Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa

290
00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:43,800
Speaker 1: from our flagship New York station. Just say Alexa play

291
00:14:43,920 --> 00:14:45,200
Speaker 1: Bloomberg eleven thirty.

292
00:14:46,360 --> 00:14:49,760
Speaker 2: We add the voice now with Congressman Seth Moulton. Always

293
00:14:49,760 --> 00:14:53,160
Speaker 2: a pleasure to have the Congressman from Massachusetts with us,

294
00:14:53,560 --> 00:14:57,320
Speaker 2: of course, the Congressman Moulton, a Democrat from Massachusetts who

295
00:14:57,320 --> 00:15:01,840
Speaker 2: served for combat tours in Iraq, a marine combat veteran

296
00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:03,920
Speaker 2: who brings a unique perspective here from the hill, and

297
00:15:03,960 --> 00:15:06,400
Speaker 2: it's good to have you back. Congressman. I feel like

298
00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:08,800
Speaker 2: maybe we've seen this movie before, although this one might

299
00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:12,280
Speaker 2: be scarier than past episodes. What are you feeling. Are

300
00:15:12,280 --> 00:15:13,800
Speaker 2: we shutting down in four days?

301
00:15:15,080 --> 00:15:18,000
Speaker 6: Yes? I think we are. And I say that just

302
00:15:18,040 --> 00:15:21,800
Speaker 6: because that's what my Republican colleagues tell me. And as

303
00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:24,480
Speaker 6: you know, as you've just explained, it's all up to them.

304
00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:27,200
Speaker 6: I mean, when you have the majority in the House,

305
00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:30,640
Speaker 6: as Republicans do, and you elect the speaker who determines

306
00:15:30,760 --> 00:15:33,480
Speaker 6: what we vote on, what bills actually come to the floor,

307
00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:36,440
Speaker 6: including whether or not they're going to vote on bills

308
00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:39,920
Speaker 6: to actually get out of this shutdown, then it really

309
00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:42,520
Speaker 6: is dependent on them. That's where we are right now.

310
00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:45,480
Speaker 6: And I thought your analysis of what's going on with

311
00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:49,720
Speaker 6: Speaker McCarthy is is pretty accurate. You know, he could

312
00:15:50,240 --> 00:15:54,360
Speaker 6: understand this, He could tell these extremists in his party.

313
00:15:54,520 --> 00:15:56,520
Speaker 6: You know what, for the first time, I'm not going

314
00:15:56,600 --> 00:15:58,920
Speaker 6: to listen to you. I'm not going to listen to you.

315
00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:00,960
Speaker 6: I'm going to do the right thing for the country

316
00:16:00,960 --> 00:16:04,480
Speaker 6: by bringing a compromised bill to the floor that both

317
00:16:04,520 --> 00:16:08,000
Speaker 6: Republicans and Democrats can vote for to get us out

318
00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:11,280
Speaker 6: of this mess, the same compromise bill that's already passed

319
00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:15,280
Speaker 6: the Senate with both Democratic and Republican votes, and we'll

320
00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:17,640
Speaker 6: do the right thing for the country. But he's not

321
00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:19,600
Speaker 6: going to do the right thing for the country. He's

322
00:16:19,640 --> 00:16:22,520
Speaker 6: going to do the right thing for himself to keep

323
00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:26,080
Speaker 6: the gavel as speaker by putting us into a shutdown.

324
00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:31,120
Speaker 2: The Speaker says, now that the border is the issue,

325
00:16:31,800 --> 00:16:35,320
Speaker 2: It's interesting how the storyline has evolved over this course

326
00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:37,360
Speaker 2: of time. He says that he needs to meet with

327
00:16:37,440 --> 00:16:40,400
Speaker 2: Joe Biden and that if Joe Biden wants to keep

328
00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:43,080
Speaker 2: the government open, he needs to shut down the border.

329
00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:47,560
Speaker 2: How frequently are we going to hear the storyline change

330
00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:49,920
Speaker 2: as we get closer to midnight on Saturday.

331
00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:54,920
Speaker 6: I've a wild guess maybe twice a day with his character.

332
00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:57,080
Speaker 2: Is that how you feel, though? I mean, are you

333
00:16:57,120 --> 00:17:00,160
Speaker 2: getting these signals from the Speaker's office?

334
00:17:00,360 --> 00:17:05,320
Speaker 6: Speaker McCarthy is completely out of control of his own conference,

335
00:17:05,640 --> 00:17:10,000
Speaker 6: of his own Republican majority, and so what he's trying

336
00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:13,840
Speaker 6: to do is come up with a different excuse a

337
00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:19,520
Speaker 6: different reason why this hasn't happened to justify his continued

338
00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:23,440
Speaker 6: effort to try to find some compromise that the extremists

339
00:17:23,440 --> 00:17:26,920
Speaker 6: have already said they're not willing to accept. He's trying

340
00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:29,239
Speaker 6: to drag it out by changing the story by saying, well,

341
00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:30,800
Speaker 6: now I need to meet with the president over this.

342
00:17:30,920 --> 00:17:34,080
Speaker 6: Now I need to meet with who knows, Maybe he'll

343
00:17:34,119 --> 00:17:37,000
Speaker 6: say he needs to meet with one of the secretaries

344
00:17:37,040 --> 00:17:41,119
Speaker 6: over that. He's just trying to drag this out to

345
00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:42,440
Speaker 6: save his position.

346
00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:47,000
Speaker 2: I've heard a couple of things over the past couple

347
00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:48,800
Speaker 2: of days. You can tell me if they are true.

348
00:17:48,880 --> 00:17:52,920
Speaker 2: Jim Clyburn, the congressman from South Carolina, told us yesterday

349
00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:56,560
Speaker 2: here on Bloomberg that if Speaker McCarthy decided to work

350
00:17:56,600 --> 00:18:00,000
Speaker 2: with Hakeem Jeffries that you're Democratic leader in the House

351
00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:02,400
Speaker 2: would just have to say the word you guys would

352
00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:06,480
Speaker 2: back a continuing resolution that is moving its way through

353
00:18:06,600 --> 00:18:09,080
Speaker 2: the Senate or fine votes to come up with your

354
00:18:09,119 --> 00:18:13,920
Speaker 2: own in the House. We also heard from another lawmaker

355
00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:18,560
Speaker 2: who was with us yesterday who said Speaker McCarthy could

356
00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:21,040
Speaker 2: pick up the phone right now and get this done

357
00:18:21,960 --> 00:18:25,840
Speaker 2: if he's simply engaged with Haakim Jeffries. Is that true

358
00:18:25,880 --> 00:18:28,880
Speaker 2: that Democrats are actually standing by to help him solve this?

359
00:18:29,359 --> 00:18:31,560
Speaker 2: Even if this goes to a motion to vacate Matt

360
00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:34,840
Speaker 2: Gates is still threatening to fire the speaker, Democrats could

361
00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:37,199
Speaker 2: also be there to help him get through that. Is

362
00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:39,480
Speaker 2: this a matter of simply reaching across the aisle Your

363
00:18:39,520 --> 00:18:40,680
Speaker 2: party is ready to help.

364
00:18:41,720 --> 00:18:45,800
Speaker 6: Yes, yes it is. That's a simple answer. Yes. Now

365
00:18:45,880 --> 00:18:47,720
Speaker 6: let's pull it apart a little bit in terms of

366
00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:53,000
Speaker 6: actually funding the government. Not only is what Jim Cliburn

367
00:18:53,119 --> 00:18:55,720
Speaker 6: said true, but it's the way that these problems have

368
00:18:55,920 --> 00:18:59,600
Speaker 6: always come to an end when Republicans control the House.

369
00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:03,040
Speaker 6: They've shut down the government before, and it's always been

370
00:19:03,080 --> 00:19:08,280
Speaker 6: Democrats who bail them out, who joined together with moderate Republicans,

371
00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:12,240
Speaker 6: reasonable Republicans to support a compromise bill, just like the

372
00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:15,240
Speaker 6: one that has already passed the Senate this week to

373
00:19:15,280 --> 00:19:17,760
Speaker 6: get us out of this mess. So not only are

374
00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:21,639
Speaker 6: Democrats standing here today, myself included, ready and willing to

375
00:19:21,720 --> 00:19:24,320
Speaker 6: help to work together to do the right thing for

376
00:19:24,400 --> 00:19:26,800
Speaker 6: the country, but that's what we've always done in the

377
00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:30,080
Speaker 6: past when Republicans put us in this situation. It's only

378
00:19:30,160 --> 00:19:32,639
Speaker 6: Republicans who threatened to shut down the government like this,

379
00:19:32,760 --> 00:19:36,439
Speaker 6: and it's always Democrats who give the Republican majority the

380
00:19:36,520 --> 00:19:38,359
Speaker 6: votes that they need to get.

381
00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:38,560
Speaker 1: Out of it.

382
00:19:39,119 --> 00:19:41,080
Speaker 6: Now on the second question, The second question is more

383
00:19:41,119 --> 00:19:45,399
Speaker 6: interesting because this would be largely unprecedent for a Republican

384
00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,880
Speaker 6: Speaker who got elected just with Republican votes to say,

385
00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:51,639
Speaker 6: the only way I can keep my job is to

386
00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:55,200
Speaker 6: get Democrats to help support me. Right, and if McCarthy

387
00:19:55,200 --> 00:19:58,800
Speaker 6: want us to do that, Democrats are open to the conversation.

388
00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:01,080
Speaker 6: But we're not just going to support him and his

389
00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:03,760
Speaker 6: extremists agenda. We're not just going to say, go back

390
00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:06,280
Speaker 6: to being Speaker with the help of our votes and

391
00:20:06,359 --> 00:20:11,560
Speaker 6: continue being subservient to these dangerous extremists in your party.

392
00:20:12,119 --> 00:20:14,879
Speaker 6: What Speaker McCarthy would have to do is make a

393
00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:18,399
Speaker 6: genuine deal with Democrats and say, no, I'm going to

394
00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:21,520
Speaker 6: stop listening to the extremists. I'm actually going to govern

395
00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:24,200
Speaker 6: from the center. I'm going to work to get things

396
00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:28,000
Speaker 6: through the House in a bipartisan manner, rather than continuing

397
00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:33,080
Speaker 6: to make bills more and more extreme to satisfy these

398
00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:36,919
Speaker 6: crazy members on the far right. Now, that would make

399
00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:41,360
Speaker 6: Speaker McCarthy a truly historic speaker. He could fund the government,

400
00:20:41,960 --> 00:20:43,840
Speaker 6: He could lead us through the rest of his term

401
00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:46,920
Speaker 6: as Speaker by doing a lot of good things, bipartisan

402
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:50,600
Speaker 6: things for the country, and Speaker McCarthy would even gain

403
00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:54,080
Speaker 6: the one thing that he doesn't have, which is a

404
00:20:54,119 --> 00:20:58,440
Speaker 6: good reputation. Sadly, I just don't know that he has

405
00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:02,280
Speaker 6: the political courage or the wherewithal to actually do.

406
00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:05,960
Speaker 2: All of that. Is that message being delivered, It must

407
00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:06,800
Speaker 2: be to him.

408
00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:13,119
Speaker 6: It is absolutely he understands this loud and clear. And

409
00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:15,440
Speaker 6: there are even some people at the very beginning who

410
00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:19,960
Speaker 6: knew Speaker McCarthy a lot longer than I have, even

411
00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:22,760
Speaker 6: back in his days in the California Legislature, and have

412
00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:26,359
Speaker 6: said he's fundamentally, or at least historically, a more moderate,

413
00:21:26,400 --> 00:21:30,040
Speaker 6: reasonable person. He's always been pretty transactional, you know, not

414
00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:33,400
Speaker 6: a transformative leader, not the most principled person on earth,

415
00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:36,520
Speaker 6: but someone who's willing to work to get things done.

416
00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:39,400
Speaker 6: But that's not the kind of speaker that he's been.

417
00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:42,200
Speaker 6: He's been a speaker who's just trying to hold on

418
00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:46,280
Speaker 6: to his job for dear life by doing whatever these extremists,

419
00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:50,639
Speaker 6: these you know, people like Matt Gays ask of him.

420
00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:54,720
Speaker 2: We're spending time with Congressman Seth Moulton, the Democrat from Massachusetts,

421
00:21:54,760 --> 00:21:57,600
Speaker 2: of course, has taken a strong stand against the blockade

422
00:21:57,600 --> 00:22:01,680
Speaker 2: of military promotions that's still in place by Senator Tommy Tuberville,

423
00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:05,119
Speaker 2: the Republican from Alabama, joined us yesterday here on Bloomberg

424
00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:06,800
Speaker 2: to talk about it. Congressman, I don't want to waste

425
00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:08,520
Speaker 2: your time with a lot of soundbites, but it's important

426
00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:11,560
Speaker 2: you hear what he said because it's been echoing around

427
00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:15,280
Speaker 2: the capital ever since. I specifically asked him about his

428
00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:19,159
Speaker 2: decision to vote against the confirmation of the new Chairman

429
00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:21,680
Speaker 2: of the Joint Chief's Staff, C. Q. Brown. Of course,

430
00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:23,760
Speaker 2: that vote went to the floor of the Senate because

431
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:27,160
Speaker 2: of his blockade, and that's an important appointment. If you're

432
00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:31,840
Speaker 2: not familiar with General Brown, he's an African American and

433
00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:35,879
Speaker 2: obviously the most powerful position here in the United States military.

434
00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:41,480
Speaker 2: And I asked Senator Tuberville why he voted against the

435
00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:45,040
Speaker 2: now Chairman of the Joint Chiefs, who he has suggested

436
00:22:45,160 --> 00:22:47,560
Speaker 2: is quote unquote woke. Here's what he said.

437
00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:49,399
Speaker 7: I think you'll do a good job. But I heard

438
00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:52,040
Speaker 7: him say a few things that really didn't fit with

439
00:22:52,119 --> 00:22:54,480
Speaker 7: me in terms of making our military better and better.

440
00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:55,680
Speaker 7: You got to remember, you.

441
00:22:55,640 --> 00:22:58,480
Speaker 2: Know, we have a free though specifically Senator.

442
00:22:58,359 --> 00:23:00,359
Speaker 7: Well, we have a free country. We have things that

443
00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:03,720
Speaker 7: we need to do to make sure that we can

444
00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:07,280
Speaker 7: uphold and we can't do that without a great, hard,

445
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:11,160
Speaker 7: strong military. Now, I heard some things that he talked

446
00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:13,880
Speaker 7: about about race and things that he wanted to mix

447
00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:16,399
Speaker 7: into the military. Let me tell you something, our military

448
00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:19,679
Speaker 7: is not an equal opportunity employer. We're looking for the

449
00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:20,520
Speaker 7: best of best.

450
00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,240
Speaker 2: I did oppress him a bit on that Congressman to

451
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:26,760
Speaker 2: put a finer point on what he means by race

452
00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:32,199
Speaker 2: mixing into the military. I think he means diversity programs.

453
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:35,399
Speaker 2: You don't have to talk about Senator Tuberville, but I

454
00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:38,400
Speaker 2: wondered if you could reflect on what you know about

455
00:23:38,760 --> 00:23:41,160
Speaker 2: the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs, General c Q. Brown.

456
00:23:43,000 --> 00:23:45,200
Speaker 6: Chairman c Q. Brown is one of the most impressive

457
00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:49,600
Speaker 6: military officers of his generation. I personally wrote a letter

458
00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:52,520
Speaker 6: to the President of the United States recommending him for

459
00:23:52,560 --> 00:23:56,040
Speaker 6: this job because I've been so impressed by him and

460
00:23:56,119 --> 00:23:59,159
Speaker 6: by the way I've been impressed by him in the

461
00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:03,080
Speaker 6: midst of a lot of other incredibly impressive officers, like

462
00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:05,720
Speaker 6: the former commonat of the Marine Corps, David Berger, who

463
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:09,680
Speaker 6: has pioneered Force Designed twenty thirty, the modernization of the

464
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:12,120
Speaker 6: of the Marine Corps to meet the China threat that's

465
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:16,000
Speaker 6: led all the other services now. He actually worked very

466
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:19,800
Speaker 6: closely with a General Brown of the Air Force and

467
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:24,920
Speaker 6: have advocated for these modernization efforts together. But these are

468
00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:28,520
Speaker 6: some of the best military officers that I've ever seen,

469
00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:31,680
Speaker 6: and I think c Q. Brown is truly the best

470
00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:34,680
Speaker 6: of the best. And I say that as a United

471
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:39,280
Speaker 6: States Marine veteran with four combat tours in Iraq. You

472
00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:44,359
Speaker 6: just played audio from a senator from Alabama who was

473
00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:46,880
Speaker 6: once a football coach. Apparently knows a bit about football,

474
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,720
Speaker 6: but does not know anything about serving in the military.

475
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:53,679
Speaker 6: He's never served himself, He's never made any sorts of

476
00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:57,760
Speaker 6: sacrifices like that in his life. He doesn't understand the troops.

477
00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:00,960
Speaker 6: He certainly doesn't understand what they go through, and he

478
00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:05,040
Speaker 6: obviously doesn't understand what it takes to make the best

479
00:25:05,440 --> 00:25:11,000
Speaker 6: military fighting force on Earth, which fundamentally is equal opportunity,

480
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:13,600
Speaker 6: because if we are going to get the best of

481
00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:17,560
Speaker 6: the best, then we have to have an organization that

482
00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:23,080
Speaker 6: gives equal opportunity to all applicants. If you didn't have that,

483
00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:26,440
Speaker 6: then you would immediately be saying no, this segment of

484
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:30,000
Speaker 6: the population, they don't have the same opportunity to join

485
00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:33,040
Speaker 6: the military. So if there are great women out there,

486
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:36,520
Speaker 6: or there are great Black Americans or whatever group this

487
00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:40,960
Speaker 6: senator doesn't like, well, need not apply. We're not going

488
00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:44,960
Speaker 6: to benefit from your talent in the United States military,

489
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:49,920
Speaker 6: and that will make the military a weaker force. So

490
00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:55,320
Speaker 6: to me, this senator is very soft on national security,

491
00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:59,840
Speaker 6: he's very weak on patriotism. And you know, maybe we're

492
00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:01,359
Speaker 6: not supposed to say this, but he sounds like a

493
00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:04,280
Speaker 6: racist to me. Hard to imagine this guy from Alabama

494
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:06,479
Speaker 6: being a racist, but that's certainly what it sounds like

495
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:07,719
Speaker 6: to this marine.

496
00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:14,280
Speaker 2: I'm just going to leave that right there. Congressman Seth Moulton,

497
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:16,760
Speaker 2: we appreciate the time as always, Thanks for joining us

498
00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:18,760
Speaker 2: today on what I know is a busy time on

499
00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:21,640
Speaker 2: the hill, in a conversation you won't hear or see

500
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:25,080
Speaker 2: anywhere else. Thanks for being with us here on Bloomberg Radio,

501
00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:28,639
Speaker 2: on satellite radio, and on YouTube. As we assemble our panel,

502
00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:30,760
Speaker 2: Rick Davis and Jeanie Shanzano, I'm glad to say are

503
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:34,359
Speaker 2: back together Bloomberg Politics contributors, and I say we start

504
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:38,439
Speaker 2: right here. I also spoke, as I referenced earlier, with

505
00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:41,159
Speaker 2: Congressman Jim Kleiber, and Marie and I both talked to

506
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:44,960
Speaker 2: him on balance of power. Immediately after our conversation with

507
00:26:45,040 --> 00:26:49,560
Speaker 2: Senator Tuberville. We played that same remark for him, and

508
00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:50,480
Speaker 2: here's what he said.

509
00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:54,560
Speaker 8: He is the worst of the worst. I have never

510
00:26:55,840 --> 00:27:02,440
Speaker 8: said anything like that before publicly anyway. Turberville, to me,

511
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:05,240
Speaker 8: it's just the worst of the worst. The people of

512
00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:07,800
Speaker 8: Alabama ought to be embarrassed by that.

513
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:13,199
Speaker 2: That's the gentleman from South Carolina, of course, formerly in

514
00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:17,639
Speaker 2: the Democratic leadership in the House, Rick Davis, where do

515
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:20,640
Speaker 2: we start here? We've talked a lot about Tommy Turberville,

516
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:24,840
Speaker 2: and he's clearly showing no signs of backing down. The

517
00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:29,320
Speaker 2: chorus is getting louder urging him to do so. But

518
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,600
Speaker 2: if Chuck Schumer keeps bringing confirmation votes like this to

519
00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:35,199
Speaker 2: the floor, what motivates him to stop?

520
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:39,280
Speaker 9: Well, look, I mean, there's no way to clean up

521
00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:44,200
Speaker 9: the backlog because of Coach Tuberville. You have almost three

522
00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:48,040
Speaker 9: hundred and fifty officers in the US military who have

523
00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:50,360
Speaker 9: not been confirmed by the United States Senate. I mean,

524
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:52,880
Speaker 9: it's a ghastly number that's only going up every month

525
00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:56,320
Speaker 9: when these promotions come due, and there's no ability for

526
00:27:56,359 --> 00:27:57,920
Speaker 9: the Senate to act because of him.

527
00:27:58,320 --> 00:27:59,240
Speaker 6: So let's be clear.

528
00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:02,920
Speaker 9: The Senate is trying to confirm these on a case

529
00:28:02,960 --> 00:28:05,920
Speaker 9: by case basis, But if they tried to confirm all

530
00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:09,000
Speaker 9: of them this way, it'd be other six hundred days.

531
00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:13,000
Speaker 9: It would take of legislative action with virtually nothing other happening.

532
00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:16,560
Speaker 9: So that's not a trade anybody's willing to make. You know,

533
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:20,199
Speaker 9: the senator from Alabama has a lot to learn, as

534
00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:23,640
Speaker 9: we've heard from Seth Moulton about the military, and if

535
00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 9: I were him, I would start to learn more than

536
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:29,199
Speaker 9: I talk because every time he has a conversation on

537
00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:32,320
Speaker 9: this topic, he gets himself into trouble. It wasn't long

538
00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:35,840
Speaker 9: ago we were reeling from his comments about why, you know,

539
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:40,240
Speaker 9: white nationalists should be given priority in the military. So

540
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:43,320
Speaker 9: I mean, if I were him, I would listen to

541
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:46,120
Speaker 9: the people of Alabama. He claims that that's what he

542
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:48,640
Speaker 9: puts is his top priority. Because I don't think the

543
00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:53,080
Speaker 9: people of Alabama have these attitudes, Jeanie.

544
00:28:53,360 --> 00:28:56,200
Speaker 2: I've seen a lot of comments on Twitter about this interview.

545
00:28:56,720 --> 00:28:58,640
Speaker 2: You're going to see a lot more on cable news

546
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:01,760
Speaker 2: later because everybody's been grabbed a piece of this. And

547
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:07,840
Speaker 2: the most common remark I've seen is about saying something

548
00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:10,400
Speaker 2: out loud? Did he just say the truth out loud

549
00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:14,960
Speaker 2: without realizing it here about race in the military.

550
00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:19,280
Speaker 10: He You know, I was so struck by this interview

551
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:24,280
Speaker 10: because what the senator said is that equal opportunity threatens

552
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:28,960
Speaker 10: our military. Our military is not an equal opportunity employer.

553
00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:32,320
Speaker 10: I mean, just let that sink in for a moment,

554
00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:35,880
Speaker 10: and maybe he should have a conversation with the Chief

555
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:40,280
Speaker 10: Justice of the Supreme Court, who, even when they overthrew

556
00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:46,440
Speaker 10: affirmative Action to many people's dismay last term, exempted our

557
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:51,680
Speaker 10: military institutions. All of this while the military struggles to

558
00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:55,720
Speaker 10: recruit young men and young women. So this is where

559
00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:59,200
Speaker 10: we stand, and he is holding up these nominees and

560
00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:02,400
Speaker 10: saying that the the Senate, at this point facing a shutdown,

561
00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:06,440
Speaker 10: should take seven hundred hours, as your interview talked about,

562
00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:10,320
Speaker 10: so that they can one by one hold these families

563
00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:14,600
Speaker 10: and everyone else hostage while they debate each of these

564
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:18,400
Speaker 10: individual promotions. That is what the senator is talking about.

565
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:22,000
Speaker 10: And I think Representative Multon was very clear in his

566
00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:25,880
Speaker 10: language and rightly so, about what this suggests about the

567
00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:28,320
Speaker 10: Senator's views. And it is a shame not just for

568
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:30,920
Speaker 10: the people of Alabama, but for the people across the

569
00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 10: United States and our US military. You guys talked about

570
00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:37,480
Speaker 10: that op ed in the Washington Post. Everyone should go

571
00:30:37,560 --> 00:30:39,240
Speaker 10: back and read it. This is dismal.

572
00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:47,440
Speaker 2: Three military service branch secretaries calling on Senator Tubberville to

573
00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 2: drop his blockade. Rick, you know General c Q. Brown.

574
00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:56,520
Speaker 2: I wonder if you follow on Congressman Moulton's remarks, because

575
00:30:56,560 --> 00:31:00,360
Speaker 2: this is a Trump appointed Secretary of the Air Force

576
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 2: now Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, with a

577
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:07,480
Speaker 2: decorated career, a fighter pilot flew F sixteen's what else

578
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:08,000
Speaker 2: should we know?

579
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:11,959
Speaker 9: Yeah, as chief of the Air Force, he distinguished himself.

580
00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:15,360
Speaker 9: There's absolutely nothing that I could add to the distinguished SETH.

581
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:21,640
Speaker 9: Molton in his evaluation of CQ. Brown's incredible career in

582
00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:24,920
Speaker 9: the military. And we should all be proud of the

583
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:29,280
Speaker 9: fact that the military can take someone like CQ. Brown,

584
00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:32,000
Speaker 9: mold them into the leader that he is, and have

585
00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 9: the wherewithal to be able to supply the president with

586
00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 9: a number of people who all are high quality and

587
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:41,080
Speaker 9: incredibly experienced and incredibly committed to the safety of our

588
00:31:41,160 --> 00:31:44,400
Speaker 9: nation in the world as a choice for the Chief

589
00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:47,520
Speaker 9: of the Joint Chiefs, and to actually to mean the

590
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:50,600
Speaker 9: job by saying, well, his only job is to advise

591
00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:55,480
Speaker 9: the president, as if that's not an important job. And again,

592
00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:59,080
Speaker 9: I mean, it's almost hard to even respond to some

593
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:04,480
Speaker 9: of the really foolish things that coach Tuberville has to say.

594
00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:07,760
Speaker 9: I mean, maybe if he feels more comfortable with football analogies,

595
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:10,680
Speaker 9: there are lots of jobs for coaches in the NFL,

596
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:12,560
Speaker 9: maybe that's his next employment.

597
00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:17,680
Speaker 2: Boy, Gdi Shanzey. No, there's another lawmaker on Capitol Hill

598
00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 2: staging a single man's stage against something. I don't even

599
00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:27,720
Speaker 2: know how to say it, a lone lawmaker's blockade. In

600
00:32:27,760 --> 00:32:31,480
Speaker 2: this case, it's Matt Gates, the congressman from Florida who's

601
00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:34,680
Speaker 2: holding up the budget process. I actually asked Tommy Tubberville

602
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:37,440
Speaker 2: about him last night. Says he supports what Matt Gates

603
00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:41,600
Speaker 2: is doing. Gates took to the floor to talk about

604
00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:45,960
Speaker 2: the most recent I guess lack of negotiation in the

605
00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:48,880
Speaker 2: House and the idea that Speaker McCarthy and other Republicans

606
00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:53,880
Speaker 2: might consider a continuing resolution. He's looking to fire the Speaker,

607
00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:55,160
Speaker 2: as we know. Here's what he said.

608
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:57,760
Speaker 11: The one thing I'd agree with my Democrat colleagues on

609
00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:00,960
Speaker 11: is that for the last eight months, this House has

610
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 11: been poorly led and we own that, and we have

611
00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:07,000
Speaker 11: to do something about it. And you know what, my

612
00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:09,680
Speaker 11: Democrat colleagues will have an opportunity to do something about

613
00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:12,800
Speaker 11: that too, and we will see if they bail out

614
00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:15,080
Speaker 11: our failed speaker I yielded back.

615
00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:18,400
Speaker 2: We will see. We talked to Congressman Malton about that,

616
00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:20,600
Speaker 2: and we got an instant reaction, by the way, from

617
00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:23,560
Speaker 2: Speaker McCarthy about what he's been hearing recently from the

618
00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:25,320
Speaker 2: gentleman from Florida.

619
00:33:25,440 --> 00:33:26,920
Speaker 4: Have you seen Matt and what he said about me

620
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:29,920
Speaker 4: when we first started this look at people have got

621
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:34,360
Speaker 4: to get over personal differences. I'm focused on America. I

622
00:33:34,360 --> 00:33:37,600
Speaker 4: think that's where America's looking right now as well. He

623
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:39,560
Speaker 4: never voted for me to start out with. I don't know, zoo,

624
00:33:39,600 --> 00:33:41,800
Speaker 4: he's changing his position. He said a lot of things,

625
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 4: and we waded through. The one thing I will always

626
00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:45,520
Speaker 4: tell you is I'm never going to give up on

627
00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 4: America and that's where my focus is going to be.

628
00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:50,640
Speaker 2: My goodness, Genie, just imagine where we're going to be

629
00:33:50,680 --> 00:33:54,320
Speaker 2: by the time Friday night arrives. And it's clearly inevitable

630
00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:56,720
Speaker 2: that the government will be shutting down. Matt Gates can't

631
00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:59,360
Speaker 2: wait to drop that motion to vacate is going to happen.

632
00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:02,960
Speaker 10: You know, I think it's not a question of if.

633
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:05,960
Speaker 10: It's a question of when. I mean, similar to the shutdown,

634
00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:09,560
Speaker 10: it's not if anymore. It is when and if Democrats

635
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:14,080
Speaker 10: table it, if they help the speaker survive. And we

636
00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:17,520
Speaker 10: heard Representative Multon tell you that that may be a

637
00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:21,839
Speaker 10: good thing for Kevin McCarthy. But imagine this, he survives,

638
00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:26,640
Speaker 10: let's go beyond this shutdown. What happens then? How could

639
00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 10: he manage a Republican caucus if his survival is dependent

640
00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:34,880
Speaker 10: on the Democrats. I think the House at that point

641
00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:37,600
Speaker 10: would grind to a halt. So it is going to

642
00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:41,640
Speaker 10: be a very very interesting few months, let alone just

643
00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:44,720
Speaker 10: the next week. And I disagree with my friend Rick Davis.

644
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:48,840
Speaker 10: Please Rick, do not send Tommy Tupperville to the NFL jeepers.

645
00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:51,480
Speaker 10: Let's put him someplace else, but don't have him in

646
00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:52,120
Speaker 10: the NFL.

647
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:55,600
Speaker 2: I'm not sure that would have happened anyway, But I'll

648
00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:58,080
Speaker 2: tell you what, Rick, I I'd love to know where

649
00:34:58,120 --> 00:35:00,760
Speaker 2: your head is, what you're hearing from you of friends

650
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:05,080
Speaker 2: and appropriations on the Hill. Because the Senate is advancing

651
00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:08,040
Speaker 2: a continuing resolution, it does appear dead in the House.

652
00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:14,680
Speaker 2: But I find it just amazing and ironic that as

653
00:35:14,719 --> 00:35:17,680
Speaker 2: we now connect this to a border dispute, Speaker McCarthy says,

654
00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:20,279
Speaker 2: this is about border security. If the President wants to

655
00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:22,800
Speaker 2: keep the government open, he's got to come to terms

656
00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 2: with this. But the Republican Homeland Security Appropriations Bill actually

657
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:34,080
Speaker 2: cuts funding for the agencies that secure the border. So

658
00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:38,520
Speaker 2: if those Republican members who are blocking all of this

659
00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:41,000
Speaker 2: got what they wanted, there'd be less money at the border.

660
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:42,520
Speaker 2: Can you help me make sense of it?

661
00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:46,239
Speaker 9: Yeah, Sadly, I think it's got a lot more to

662
00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:48,680
Speaker 9: do with polling than it does to do with policy.

663
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:54,160
Speaker 9: The reality is Kevin McCarthy started this entire shutdown sequence

664
00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:56,839
Speaker 9: by saying the government's spending too much and it is

665
00:35:57,040 --> 00:36:00,399
Speaker 9: I mean, there's no doubt about that, and he's been

666
00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:04,440
Speaker 9: successful in negotiating deals with the President to rein in

667
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 9: some of that spending, and of course the President thought

668
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 9: he had a deal, and none of this should be

669
00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 9: happening because we should be basically marking up all these

670
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:15,160
Speaker 9: appropriation spills to the number that they agreed to and

671
00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:18,000
Speaker 9: passed in the United States House of Representatives. But then

672
00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:20,600
Speaker 9: an ABC poll comes out and it shows that most

673
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:24,640
Speaker 9: Americans actually think that a shutdown is on the backs

674
00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:28,400
Speaker 9: of the Democrats, not the Republicans, and that immigration is

675
00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:32,360
Speaker 9: creeping up in the importance of the American public because

676
00:36:32,680 --> 00:36:34,680
Speaker 9: you have a crisis at the border again.

677
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:35,560
Speaker 12: So what do they do.

678
00:36:35,680 --> 00:36:36,440
Speaker 1: They pivot and.

679
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:39,120
Speaker 9: Say, hey, look at read the ABC poll. We need

680
00:36:39,160 --> 00:36:42,160
Speaker 9: to be talking about immigration this week, not spending, And

681
00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:44,600
Speaker 9: so the pivot occurs. The reality is none of this

682
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:47,560
Speaker 9: gets us any closer to shut down, And unfortunately, most

683
00:36:47,600 --> 00:36:49,560
Speaker 9: of the people I know on Keppel Hill have told

684
00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:54,680
Speaker 9: me that there's not enough impetus to actually force a

685
00:36:54,840 --> 00:37:00,960
Speaker 9: confrontation with the Freedom Caucus and therefore maybe elicit a

686
00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:04,960
Speaker 9: a recall of the Speaker and then get the Democrat support.

687
00:37:05,040 --> 00:37:09,560
Speaker 9: So I'm afraid we are, like everybody else's commented, headed

688
00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:12,880
Speaker 9: to a shutdown. And maybe then and only that, do

689
00:37:13,000 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 9: these kinds of pressures start to weigh on the leadership

690
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:15,560
Speaker 9: of the House.

691
00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:19,120
Speaker 2: Rick reminds us there was a deal, Genie. I hate

692
00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:21,279
Speaker 2: to keep bringing this back up myself, but the whole

693
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:23,239
Speaker 2: point of the debt ceialing deal was so that we

694
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:26,640
Speaker 2: would avoid all this madness. And the view from the

695
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:30,200
Speaker 2: White House is just that Joe Biden said, we made

696
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:33,000
Speaker 2: a deal, we shook hands, and they're not going to

697
00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:36,640
Speaker 2: cut another deal with Speaker McCarthy. Does the Speaker have

698
00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:39,000
Speaker 2: any credibility with this administration now?

699
00:37:40,239 --> 00:37:40,319
Speaker 4: No.

700
00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:43,360
Speaker 10: It's very tough because that was a hard fought deal,

701
00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:46,800
Speaker 10: and we heard over the weekend the Secretary of Transportation

702
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 10: saying we all gave up a lot in that deal.

703
00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:52,200
Speaker 10: That wasn't a deal the White House wanted, It wasn't

704
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:55,600
Speaker 10: what Democrats wanted, but both sides gave. They shook hands.

705
00:37:55,840 --> 00:37:59,440
Speaker 10: And Kevin McCarthy, because to seth Moulton's point, he cannot

706
00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:03,399
Speaker 10: control these five to ten conservative members, has backed down

707
00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:06,080
Speaker 10: from that in a desperate attempt to save his job.

708
00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:09,279
Speaker 10: And where we are now is that he is trying

709
00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:12,319
Speaker 10: to point fingers at everybody else, from the Senate to

710
00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:15,439
Speaker 10: Senator Schumer to the President. The reality is he needs

711
00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:18,520
Speaker 10: to point fingers where they lie in his own caucus,

712
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:20,960
Speaker 10: and he needs to stand up, and he needs to

713
00:38:21,040 --> 00:38:23,879
Speaker 10: be willing to say I will walk away from his job,

714
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:27,440
Speaker 10: just like his Speaker Bainer and just like Speaker Ryan

715
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:30,840
Speaker 10: before him on the Republican side, because this caucus is

716
00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:34,120
Speaker 10: at this point ungovernable and we are all suffering as

717
00:38:34,120 --> 00:38:34,799
Speaker 10: a result of it.

718
00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:37,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's amazing. We always talk about how we're in

719
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:40,400
Speaker 2: uncharted territory here, but the fact of the matter is

720
00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:42,919
Speaker 2: there's a lot of history repeating itself and that could

721
00:38:42,920 --> 00:38:46,840
Speaker 2: continue for the Speaker. Rick Davis and Geni Shanzino. Glad

722
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:50,480
Speaker 2: we've got both today. Our signature panel on sound on

723
00:38:50,640 --> 00:38:53,000
Speaker 2: it's debate night. We're going to turn to that next.

724
00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:57,399
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound On podcast. Catch us

725
00:38:57,440 --> 00:39:01,680
Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg, the iHeartRadio app

726
00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 1: and the Lower Business app, or listen on demand wherever

727
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:05,960
Speaker 1: you get your podcasts.

728
00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:10,840
Speaker 2: A government shutdown likely in just four days, it's always

729
00:39:10,840 --> 00:39:14,120
Speaker 2: good to know our elected representatives are working on solutions

730
00:39:14,719 --> 00:39:18,440
Speaker 2: on the issues that matter, like chocolate milk in schools.

731
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:23,640
Speaker 2: Enter Congressman Tom Tiffany, the Republican from Wisconsin. I guess

732
00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:26,880
Speaker 2: read the journal of the American Dietetic Association, as he

733
00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:30,560
Speaker 2: referenced on the floor, read that removing flavored milk from

734
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:34,520
Speaker 2: schools results in kids while drinking less milk. And this

735
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:37,400
Speaker 2: member of the Dairy Farmer's Caucus delivered a message from

736
00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:41,439
Speaker 2: the House floor, complete with a sign, come and take it.

737
00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:44,880
Speaker 12: Milk is full of rich nutrients that support bone growth

738
00:39:44,880 --> 00:39:48,799
Speaker 12: and development, and millions of children enjoyed drinking it. We

739
00:39:48,840 --> 00:39:51,360
Speaker 12: should not be funding rules that would limit our children's

740
00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:56,080
Speaker 12: access to delicious and nutritious products like milk. I urge

741
00:39:56,120 --> 00:39:58,719
Speaker 12: my college to vote yes on this bipartisan amendment, and

742
00:39:58,800 --> 00:39:59,400
Speaker 12: I reserve.

743
00:40:01,680 --> 00:40:03,680
Speaker 2: He even had his own version of the come and

744
00:40:03,760 --> 00:40:08,640
Speaker 2: take it flag, which swapped out looking at the picture

745
00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:12,160
Speaker 2: of it here swapped out the cannon for a carton

746
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:15,920
Speaker 2: of milk. Rick and Genie surely want to weigh in

747
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:19,640
Speaker 2: on this, Genie Shanzano. It's the cause of our time,

748
00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:21,640
Speaker 2: I guess, chocolate, milk and schools.

749
00:40:22,160 --> 00:40:24,239
Speaker 10: That's right, Joe and Joe, do you know today is

750
00:40:24,320 --> 00:40:28,080
Speaker 10: National Chocolate Milk Day. So how appropriate that you are

751
00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:31,640
Speaker 10: talking about this drink invented in Jamaica. Although I have

752
00:40:31,719 --> 00:40:34,319
Speaker 10: to say I disagree with the representative. It has a

753
00:40:34,360 --> 00:40:37,160
Speaker 10: lot of sugar. It needs to get out of kids' schools.

754
00:40:37,520 --> 00:40:41,000
Speaker 10: I'm sorry. I'm sorry to disappoint, but you know it's

755
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:41,520
Speaker 10: gotta go.

756
00:40:42,120 --> 00:40:45,920
Speaker 2: Spoken like an educator as you are, Genie. He's introduced

757
00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:49,800
Speaker 2: by the way, Rick, the milk is indisputably liked by kids.

758
00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:53,120
Speaker 2: Act or twenty twenty three, known to some simply as

759
00:40:53,160 --> 00:40:54,400
Speaker 2: the Milk Act. Will it pass?

760
00:40:55,200 --> 00:40:55,360
Speaker 11: You know?

761
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:55,879
Speaker 2: I hope.

762
00:40:55,880 --> 00:40:55,960
Speaker 6: So.

763
00:40:56,520 --> 00:40:58,360
Speaker 9: I know you don't need dairy, and I know that

764
00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:02,399
Speaker 9: sugar's bad for you, but I want momentum. I want

765
00:41:02,440 --> 00:41:04,600
Speaker 9: chocolate milk in the schools. That was a reason I

766
00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:07,160
Speaker 9: went to school was to get a chocolate milk. And

767
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:11,200
Speaker 9: so I mean, yes, disappoint so many school age children.

768
00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:15,759
Speaker 2: Always the best time with Rick Davis and Genie Shanzano,

769
00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:21,000
Speaker 2: even in times like these. Thanks for listening to The

770
00:41:21,080 --> 00:41:24,000
Speaker 2: Sound On podcast. Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already,

771
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:27,000
Speaker 2: at Apple, Spotify and anywhere else you get your podcasts,

772
00:41:27,320 --> 00:41:30,000
Speaker 2: and you can find us live every weekday from Washington

773
00:41:30,080 --> 00:41:35,200
Speaker 2: DC at one pm Eastern Time. At Bloomberg dot Com