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Speaker 1: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome to the Bob Left Sets Podcast. We're

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Speaker 1: just back from Santa Barbara, the second Annual Music Media Summit.

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Speaker 1: My good friend Jake Gold is here to review the Shenanigans. There. Jake,

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Speaker 1: good to have you here. Good to be back, Bob.

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Speaker 1: I think we should call it the Bob Cast, not

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Speaker 1: the podcast. I think it should be the Left Sets

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Speaker 1: Bob Cast. That's a good idea. I'm open to change,

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Speaker 1: right I Actually, Jeremiah and I were looking that up

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Speaker 1: in Santa Barbara and we saw that there were some

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Speaker 1: other Bobs that say Bob cat Cast, which means it's

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Speaker 1: totally legit. It's wide open. So I don't see why

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Speaker 1: we don't call it the Bob Cast. That's a good idea.

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Speaker 1: I have to contemplate that, have to run that through

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Speaker 1: the mental filtrations. I know, I know he likes it.

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Speaker 1: I know he likes the idea of it. So, Jake

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Speaker 1: as a manager, and once he gets on something, he's

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Speaker 1: covered all three hundred sixty degrees, he's closing on you.

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Speaker 1: I'm trying to trying to maintain a little bit of

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Speaker 1: my own independence before I make a decision. Okay, Well,

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Speaker 1: you know that's what that's what we do. We we

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Speaker 1: surround the the artist with all the yes is before

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Speaker 1: we actually approached the artist. That's all they can do

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Speaker 1: is say yes. Correct, they'll because they'll have the what about?

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Speaker 1: What about? And you already have the answers. That's your job.

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Speaker 1: That's what experiences teaches you. That's correct, amundo um Santa Barbara.

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Speaker 1: I had never been there before, So what do you

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Speaker 1: think you want to move there? Uh? It may be

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Speaker 1: a little sleepy for me, right, I sleeping for me too,

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Speaker 1: But people really become infatuated with Santa Barbara and they

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Speaker 1: want to move there. There are even some people. The

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Speaker 1: guy ran Universal Studios for a long time, he used

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Speaker 1: to commute to Universal City from Santa Barbara. Well, we

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Speaker 1: left Wednesday morning and it took us maybe an hour

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Speaker 1: and a half to get into West Hollywood. So it

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Speaker 1: wasn't bad. I mean, people commute longer and living in

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Speaker 1: New York. Let's be clear, if you go a typical

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Speaker 1: commute time, you're never gonna be able to match that. No, no, not.

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Speaker 1: If you're leaving at seven am, you're dealing with rush

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Speaker 1: hour and the same on the way out. I remember

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Speaker 1: I was mapping it from Toronto to see how long

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Speaker 1: it was going to take. And at the time I

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Speaker 1: was mapping it, it was five o'clock here. It was

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Speaker 1: the last Friday I mapped it, and it said two

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Speaker 1: hours and twenty minutes exactly. Yeah, so it could take

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Speaker 1: a lot longer. But there is a train too that

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Speaker 1: goes like Jeremiah producer podcast took the train. But uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, we live in Los Angeles. Were addicted to

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Speaker 1: our cars, I know, I know, although as you know,

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Speaker 1: more and more people are getting into the car. Well

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Speaker 1: that's another thing. I mean, we're not really discussing the

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Speaker 1: conference here, but your car was unfortunately totaled. And you're

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Speaker 1: a uber guy. We talked about that in the last party. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: doing it all the time, you know, I love it.

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Speaker 1: It's great, no responsibilities of a vehicle. I'm shirking all

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Speaker 1: my responsibilities. It's wonderful at sixty. So we've you doing

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Speaker 1: what happened in Santa Barbara. Well, I mean, it's it's

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Speaker 1: interesting that there was yet great speakers. First of all, um, uh,

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Speaker 1: high level people, all at the top of their game. Um,

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Speaker 1: I'm curious as to what do you think was the

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Speaker 1: common thread amongst the five speakers that we had, they

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Speaker 1: were available. No. Uh, the common thread was the personality.

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Speaker 1: Someone else said that they were talking about the hustle.

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Speaker 1: But um, music business is a very fluid business where

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Speaker 1: your education and the typical uh notches in your belt

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Speaker 1: don't really apply. So all of these people to a

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Speaker 1: degree were self starters, and they found their way to

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Speaker 1: the music business and had achieved success based on their

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Speaker 1: personality and their smarts as opposed to coming up through

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Speaker 1: the ranks of business or something else. I would agree

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Speaker 1: with you, except in the case of Steve Boom from

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Speaker 1: Amazon and Rob Glazer, who were academics, I mean Steve

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Speaker 1: Booms and a lawyer, right and and and they all

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Speaker 1: had jobs until until you know, as I say, in

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Speaker 1: in the case of Rob Glazer whose chairman of Real Networks,

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Speaker 1: he left college and he went to work for Microsoft. Okay,

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Speaker 1: and that was before Microsoft was the monolith and it

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Speaker 1: ultimately became. But then he went on his own and

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Speaker 1: he started a business, and he ultimately bought the Pro

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Speaker 1: Bowlers Association and he became a VC so he was

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Speaker 1: really doing his own thing. And Steve Boom was a lawyer,

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Speaker 1: but then he went to work for Yahoo and he

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Speaker 1: ran looped. So these were people who were finding their

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Speaker 1: own way, as opposed to someone working for Ge or Xerox,

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Speaker 1: who just keeps on going up the ladder. I don't

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Speaker 1: doubt that for a second, But I think those two

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Speaker 1: chose Academia UM as their fallback because Boom was a lawyer,

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Speaker 1: like he was a practicing lawyer. Well, let's start with raw.

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Speaker 1: I mean, Rob is highly educated in computer reach. Even

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Speaker 1: though he was not a coder at Microsoft or Real Networks,

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Speaker 1: he was into computer programming against in high school and

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Speaker 1: then he learned how to do that. You know, that's

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Speaker 1: one of the great things about today's society. You know.

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Speaker 1: They call the guy who just wrote what color is

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Speaker 1: Your Parachute? Recently died? The Ultimate job Seekers Bible, and

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Speaker 1: he talks about transferable skills. It's like even myself, I'm

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Speaker 1: an attorney. I practice law very briefly, and then when

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Speaker 1: the Naster thing came up in the year two thousand,

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Speaker 1: I knew all the law. Suddenly my law background was relevant.

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Speaker 1: So a lot of these people, their training comes back

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Speaker 1: in certain ways they understand even though they don't use

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Speaker 1: it directly. Like Rob Glazer, I found it interesting because uh,

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Speaker 1: in the case of Daniel Glass, where he he wants

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Speaker 1: everybody to have at least finished college to work for him,

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Speaker 1: and and uh, and then you segue to someone like

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Speaker 1: like Ethiopia who is president of Motown, who came from

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Speaker 1: an academia family, uh, and didn't go to college. And

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Speaker 1: it was interesting because Daniel Glass came up to me

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Speaker 1: after that, that's Ethiopia have to have to marry him?

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Speaker 1: Of whose head of Motown? And uh, he said, if

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Speaker 1: you remember what she said, she said she was offered

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Speaker 1: a gig at u M at Universal Music Publishing and

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Speaker 1: she turned it down and stayed for two years with

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Speaker 1: the publishing companies. Who was out in Atlanta, and he said,

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Speaker 1: that was kind of like going to school. It's a

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Speaker 1: little bit of a fudging of the concept. And you know,

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Speaker 1: we both we both love Daniel and we both think

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Speaker 1: the world of him. And he really is you know,

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Speaker 1: you you had um, you had uh uh you had

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Speaker 1: Superman schon a while back and and um, but Daniel

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Speaker 1: Glass is as much Superman as anybody else. Like, the

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Speaker 1: guy's a wonderful guy and you know, totally accommodating. He

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Speaker 1: returns every email, he's that kind a guy, and I

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Speaker 1: just find it funny that he'll fudget to fit his

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Speaker 1: That may be true, But the interesting thing. The interesting

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Speaker 1: thing about Daniel Glass is he trains all his people.

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Speaker 1: He doesn't want anybody with bad habits. So I remember

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Speaker 1: going the early days to Glass Note Records office in

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Speaker 1: Manhattan and there's one big room with like fifteen He's

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Speaker 1: got more people. Now he's got forty people. But fifteen

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Speaker 1: people are not one over thirty, Okay, So he teaches

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Speaker 1: them his style. He does have a couple of people

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Speaker 1: who come from somewhere else. This is what people don't

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Speaker 1: understand about the entertainment business, is you are working seven

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Speaker 1: He has a couple of people in Los Angeles. These

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Speaker 1: people are working around the clock. One of them came

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Speaker 1: to the conference, and it takes that to make it,

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Speaker 1: along with a lot of insights. I mean, Daniel Glass

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Speaker 1: is very successful with his own company right now, but

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Speaker 1: he had bumps in the road getting there. Yeah, but

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Speaker 1: everybody does. I mean, that's the nature of entrepreneurship. I agree.

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Speaker 1: But you know, it's a funny era in the music

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Speaker 1: business because most of the people running the giant operations

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Speaker 1: never had skin in the game. Now, if you look

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Speaker 1: on the promotion side at a g J. Marciano was

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Speaker 1: an independent promoter and Michael Ruppino had a limited amount

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Speaker 1: of time as a promoter. But everybody running the record

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Speaker 1: companies never had an independent company as a promoter. I know,

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Speaker 1: a club promoter boss says, you've never really a promoter

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Speaker 1: until you've gone to the A T M At two

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Speaker 1: in the morning to withdraw cash to pay the act. Well,

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Speaker 1: it's an interesting thing because I I personally have a

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Speaker 1: bit of an issue. Maybe it's you know, because I've

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Speaker 1: only ever done it on my own, never had a

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Speaker 1: real job, like a job job, like with a paycheck.

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Speaker 1: But you always see that most of these record company

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Speaker 1: guys that have been at record companies all their lives,

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Speaker 1: that go to try and become a manager, because you know,

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Speaker 1: at some point there's attrition at all these record companies

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Speaker 1: and they all lose their jobs because they're the staffs

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Speaker 1: are shrinking, and they go, well, I'll guess I'll be

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Speaker 1: a manager because they say they know artists or whatever

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Speaker 1: they think they know, and then they have to pay

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Speaker 1: their first career bill because they've never even seen one.

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Speaker 1: They didn't even know what it looks like before. Uh,

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Speaker 1: they've they've never you know, paid their own phone bill

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Speaker 1: because it's been paid for like everything else has been

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Speaker 1: paid for. And then they have to run a business

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Speaker 1: and generate revenue at the same time, um, which they

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Speaker 1: never had to do before, and most of them fail. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: And and some of them go to work for management companies.

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Speaker 1: And I've encountered a few of those people, you know,

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Speaker 1: with dealing with other acts when your Access Support Act

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Speaker 1: or their Access Support Act whatever. And most of them

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Speaker 1: have no concept of management. They're they're just like their

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Speaker 1: their job at a management company is almost like their

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Speaker 1: job was at a record company. They're not real managers,

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Speaker 1: They're just another person that works there. Well, that speaks

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Speaker 1: to another issue which started having by ten years ago,

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Speaker 1: which is the roll up of management companies. Do you

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Speaker 1: believe managers should be independent? Well, I I think that

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Speaker 1: it's a little different um in the United States than

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Speaker 1: it is everywhere else. From talking to some of these

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Speaker 1: managers that I know that became part of the bigger companies,

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Speaker 1: a lot of them are basically running their own fiefdoms

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Speaker 1: with a healthcare package. And and they they've kind of

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Speaker 1: said to me, look, I take this I take. I

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Speaker 1: become part of a bigger thing. There's a good healthcare package.

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Speaker 1: I have a family and I want to make sure

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Speaker 1: I'm covered just in case the ship goes down. And

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Speaker 1: at the same time, I have an infrastructure and have

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Speaker 1: to worry about an infrastructure. But I still run my

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Speaker 1: own company and I just do a split on the

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Speaker 1: revenue that comes in. Do you think it hobbles them

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Speaker 1: in some way having that that as opposed to being

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Speaker 1: completely independent, Well, I I think there's I think there's

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Speaker 1: something for everybody. I think if you're a hustler, you're

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Speaker 1: a hustler. Um, Chris ru Is, He's He's the one

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Speaker 1: that that became part of Chris was totally independent, it

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Speaker 1: was motional easiest became part of red Light. I think

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Speaker 1: I think probably you never know, and maybe down the

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Speaker 1: road he'll either you know, moved to a higher position

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Speaker 1: at red Light, or he may end up leaving on

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Speaker 1: his own. Because at some point, I don't know what

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Speaker 1: their their deals are, and I think some of them

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Speaker 1: are doing probably really small deals back to the mother Ship. UM,

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't know, but I think for a while there,

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Speaker 1: I think some of the companies were doing seventy thirty

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Speaker 1: splits with with managers. Am I not right? You know

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Speaker 1: most of these deals and I'm not privy to all

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Speaker 1: of them. Certainly in the initial incarnation was they paid

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Speaker 1: you a fee and then it was fifty fifty and

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Speaker 1: you had to earn back against It was a versus commission,

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Speaker 1: which is kind of like an agency deal. Right. But

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Speaker 1: the interesting thing you reference, and this is a political

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Speaker 1: football in the United States. I remember I was, you know,

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Speaker 1: I was in Canada talking to a woman who was

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Speaker 1: thinking of leaving her major label job to go with

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Speaker 1: an independent and using my US lens, I was, you know,

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Speaker 1: saying that that may not be a good idea because

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Speaker 1: I'm thinking about healthcare. Where in this particular case, she

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Speaker 1: goes to work for the independent, doesn't work out, She's

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Speaker 1: still got her healthcare. That's always a concern in the

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Speaker 1: United States. Yeah, if you know, if I'm gonna leave,

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Speaker 1: what am I gonna do about my health care? You know,

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Speaker 1: there's extended packages. I mean, we can get into that

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Speaker 1: whole thing. Cobra is a limited time Ian healthcare is

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Speaker 1: really a big thing. Certainly with Obamacare it was less threatening.

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Speaker 1: That's being undercut at this particular point in time. But

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Speaker 1: the real question is are you a self starter or

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Speaker 1: are you someone who needs the team to function? Well?

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Speaker 1: I think you you you're building your own team. Anyways,

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Speaker 1: from my experience from talking to dealing with some of

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Speaker 1: these managers that work within these these bigger management firms,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't seem like, you know, they're getting all that

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Speaker 1: extra stuff that they're really still running their own things

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Speaker 1: with not being a specific about different ones, uh, some

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Speaker 1: are different. Some give you a lot more autonomy and

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Speaker 1: less support than others. And by the I guess for me,

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Speaker 1: when there's no net, you have a heightened anxiety, whereas

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Speaker 1: if you have a contract with the management company, you

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Speaker 1: might at least say, well, things are not working. I

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Speaker 1: got six months and it's always in the distance. Where

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Speaker 1: if you're working for yourself every day you're waking up

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Speaker 1: and you're thinking, okay, what's next. Is this gonna work? Well?

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Speaker 1: In fact, I think that's kind of how it works.

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Speaker 1: And if let's go back to to Santa Barbara is

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Speaker 1: most of the people that um that we're there, I

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Speaker 1: think have that attitude. It's like you you live and

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Speaker 1: breathe what you're doing because it's all yours. Well. I

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Speaker 1: mean one of the great stories was Troy Carter who

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Speaker 1: said before he signed uh Lady Gaga, he was Rooke

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Speaker 1: and he was you know, uh, you know, selling or

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Speaker 1: painting his wife's engagement ring in order to make the bills.

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Speaker 1: And he took Lady Gaga out of the spaghetti warehouse

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Speaker 1: to celebrate. People have no that's where they met. That

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Speaker 1: was their big meeting, he said. He took her out

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Speaker 1: to meet at I thought it was a celebration. But

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Speaker 1: but in any event, the point being, people have the

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Speaker 1: impression that it's a constant upward trend and that is

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Speaker 1: not true. No, And I've been doing it now. I

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Speaker 1: started full time November eighty one, so I'm like thirty. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So now is it easier or less easy? It's the same.

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Speaker 1: It's like it's a funny thing. You know. People talk

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Speaker 1: about about how much the business has changed, and for

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Speaker 1: everything that has changed, nothing has changed. You know. Um,

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Speaker 1: we had to talk, uh, And I've been thinking about

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Speaker 1: this because I knew, you know, we were going to

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Speaker 1: be sitting down doing this. But people were talking about,

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Speaker 1: you know, you continually bring up um and by Spotify

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Speaker 1: standards rightly, so hip hop strive is the dominant force,

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Speaker 1: and pop is the dominant force. Um. But you know,

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Speaker 1: if you think back to when um, you know, we

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Speaker 1: had pop radio and rock radio. Uh if it it

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Speaker 1: just went strictly on plays. Pop records were spun fifty

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Speaker 1: sixty times a week and rock records were spun times

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Speaker 1: a week, and so pop and those kind of that

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Speaker 1: kind of music was always sort of more popular, which

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Speaker 1: is why it was called pop. You know, we're all

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Speaker 1: victims of our own experience, did you may we grew

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Speaker 1: up in a major market with multiple stations. You grew

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Speaker 1: up in the hinterlands with only one station, But certainly

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Speaker 1: if you grew up in the metropolis, and you know,

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Speaker 1: and you're but at my age, baby boomer, Um, there

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Speaker 1: was a switch certainly in sixty eight in the New

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Speaker 1: York radio market, which was my radio market, uh, to

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Speaker 1: the FM band. And it wasn't until seventy three that

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Speaker 1: Lie Abrahams came along and codified and turned FM into

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Speaker 1: a kind of top forty format and then tracks with

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Speaker 1: then crossover in the early seventies to AM four people

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Speaker 1: at FM and the cars at FM ruled and then

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Speaker 1: all of a sudden, MTV came in and it was

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Speaker 1: what MTV played, and there was a resurgence of Top

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Speaker 1: forty radio. So in Top forty moved to FM at

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Speaker 1: that point to excellent point. I remember, you know, uh

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Speaker 1: one point one Here in Los Angeles, they used to

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Speaker 1: be they used to be a divide. And I had

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Speaker 1: a very funny story about that that happened to me

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Speaker 1: when I was about fourteen, fifteen years old, as I

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Speaker 1: had been at one of these ben are retreat things

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Speaker 1: and I met this girl and and um, she was

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Speaker 1: a year older than me, and she lived in St.

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Speaker 1: Catharine's and she invited me to come spend the weekend

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Speaker 1: in St. Catherine's with her and her family, which was,

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Speaker 1: when you think back on it now, kind of weird.

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Speaker 1: Your fourteen, you're four you're fourteen years old, and you know,

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Speaker 1: and and so I took the bus to St. Catherine.

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Speaker 1: It's like an hour an hour and a half by bus,

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Speaker 1: probably about an hour and a half two hours depending

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Speaker 1: on the stops. St. Catherine's near Niagara Falls, so it's

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Speaker 1: and if you drive it, it's like an hour fifteen

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Speaker 1: with no traffic back to traffic. And I remember it

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Speaker 1: was the it was a Saturday night, and we were

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Speaker 1: listening to the radio and I hadn't crossed over into

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Speaker 1: FM yet and I was still listening to pop music

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Speaker 1: on AM. But she was a year older and she

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Speaker 1: was already listening to FM, and and it was like

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Speaker 1: a moment where she kind of realized that I was

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Speaker 1: too young for her because I wasn't cool because I

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Speaker 1: wasn't listening to FM and she was listening to FM.

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Speaker 1: And then you know, within six months, I was now

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Speaker 1: listening to FM and listening too much cooler music as

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Speaker 1: a result. But after that weekend, she was like, she

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Speaker 1: basically said, oh yeah, like we can't. We can't hang

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Speaker 1: out anymore because I wasn't cool enough because I was

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Speaker 1: like still listening to a M music. Well, the funny

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Speaker 1: thing is, I don't think today your friends would be

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Speaker 1: decided Capulli on music. That just illustrates how important music

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Speaker 1: was back then. We'll take a quick break and come

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Speaker 1: back with more of my conversation with Jake Gold, recorded

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Speaker 1: live at the tune In Studios in Venice Beach as

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Speaker 1: we recap the Music Media Summit in Santa Barbara, California.

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Speaker 1: This week. I'm speaking with Jake Gold in the last

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Speaker 1: couple of months, Paul Rodgers from Free and Bad Company

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Speaker 1: joined me in the studio, as well as Oscar winner

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Speaker 1: Brian Fogel created the documentary Chorus here next week's episode.

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Speaker 1: First by subscribing to the podcast on tune in, Apple

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Speaker 1: Podcast or your podcast player of choice. Check out the

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Speaker 1: first thirty interviews, and please rate and review the podcast. Okay,

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Speaker 1: let's get back to my conversation with Jake Gold getting

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Speaker 1: back to the dominant and you make you bring up

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Speaker 1: an excellent point with the analogy of uh Spotify streams

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Speaker 1: to radio spins. But for those of us who investigate

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Speaker 1: the market, whether it be media base which is the

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Speaker 1: radio charts or the varying charts on Spotify, I'm a

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Speaker 1: huge rock fan and I cannot sit here and champion

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Speaker 1: all these rock acts that are deserve attention or not

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Speaker 1: getting it. But some of them are doing okay. You know,

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Speaker 1: the War on Drugs is doing well, and there's a

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Speaker 1: bunch of rock acts that are actually doing well. And

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Speaker 1: you know, I brought it up at the conference and

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Speaker 1: even when when you were talking to Ethiopia and she agreed,

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Speaker 1: is that Spotify doesn't do an album chart, and if

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Speaker 1: they did an album chart maybe be different because all

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Speaker 1: we see is is a song consumption chart, and by

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Speaker 1: seeing a song consumption consumption chart, what we're getting is

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Speaker 1: we're getting And because the chart kind of and the

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Speaker 1: way they're algorithm works, it kind of becomes a self

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Speaker 1: fulfilling prophecy, so one begets the other. I think that

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Speaker 1: will drive more plays over and over and again again

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Speaker 1: and being put on more playlists. Plus, you know, it's

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Speaker 1: an interesting thing. I have this band Common Deary. We've

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Speaker 1: brought it up before. Um they got on to CBC

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Speaker 1: Radio two. Now CBC Radio two has their own playlists

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Speaker 1: on Spotify and it's got a decent amount of followers. Now.

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Speaker 1: I saw our plays go up on those tracks because

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Speaker 1: partly was on some other playlists, but also because it

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Speaker 1: was on the radio to play. One of the things

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Speaker 1: I you know, which I wish, which I wish is

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Speaker 1: that they had the media based charts, which are radio

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Speaker 1: charts on Spotify. So far, none of the main streaming

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Speaker 1: outlets Apple, Spotify, etcetera. Have put the radio charts on that.

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Speaker 1: I would like that. It's great that they have that Canada.

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Speaker 1: But you can put your own chart up. There's nothing

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Speaker 1: to stop few a station can actually create their own

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Speaker 1: playlist and put it up there, just like there can

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Speaker 1: be a Bob Left Sets playlist. But I asked about

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Speaker 1: the you know I have. We'd have to get Troy

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Speaker 1: here to find out what the real stories. In any event,

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Speaker 1: they're not dominant there, and there's the lag. But you know,

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Speaker 1: you bring up a lot of things. Although the acts

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Speaker 1: you mentioned, the rock acts are successful, they're not culturally

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Speaker 1: dominant the way the hip hop acts are. But I

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Speaker 1: don't think we're in a heyday of rock music. Okay,

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't say we're I don't think. The fact is

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Speaker 1: is that, you know, knowing, look, I managed the biggest

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Speaker 1: rock rock act in the country for many many years,

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Speaker 1: and you know we got we never got played on

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Speaker 1: pop radio. We only got played on rock radio. And

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Speaker 1: I can only tell you that our our check royalty

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Speaker 1: checks for airplay, compared to some of the pop acts

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Speaker 1: who weren't selling nearly the amount of ticket and doing

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Speaker 1: nearly the amount of business, or even for that matter,

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Speaker 1: selling nearly amount of records. We were selling um albums, um.

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Speaker 1: Their checks were probably bigger than ours because of airplay. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but that was a different era and a different paradigm.

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Speaker 1: Everything is different now. Now you bring up a number

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Speaker 1: of things. One thing that some of the label people

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Speaker 1: brought up in Santa Barbara that I've patently disagree with

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Speaker 1: is the concept of the album. Okay, I believe that

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Speaker 1: fans want a body of work. If I find a

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Speaker 1: track I like on Spotify, immediately go on and see

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Speaker 1: what else has got the most streams on Spotify. I

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Speaker 1: don't care what album it is. I might check whether

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Speaker 1: it's from the most recent album. I might triangulate that way,

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Speaker 1: but you know, I'm getting it. On a business level,

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Speaker 1: I want to hear good music. You need a continuous,

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Speaker 1: uh drip of product. Now, maybe you record it all

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Speaker 1: at once and you drip it out. I mean, but

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Speaker 1: the concept of a once you know, once a year,

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Speaker 1: once every couple of years, and then I think it's

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Speaker 1: incredibly dequated and based on issues that people say, well,

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Speaker 1: it has to be an album so we get publicity, right, Okay,

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Speaker 1: So so let's let's back up. Let's back up fifty years. Okay,

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Speaker 1: that's how the Beatles put out records exactly. Well, so

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Speaker 1: what has changed is what I'm trying to say now.

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Speaker 1: But the irony here is the public is leading and

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Speaker 1: it is the producers and the business infrastructure who are behind. Okay,

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Speaker 1: the public is jumping genres and listening to singles. So

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Speaker 1: so what happened when the when the Beatles put out records,

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Speaker 1: they put out a bunch of singles, and then they

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Speaker 1: put out an album, and then they put out another

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Speaker 1: bunch of singles, and then they put on an album,

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Speaker 1: and they were putting them out every six months. Well,

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Speaker 1: the interesting thing is, like any business, it's like the

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Speaker 1: computer business in the last twenty years and music business

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Speaker 1: then they were constantly pushing the envelope. And when you

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Speaker 1: when before a business is mature, it's very exciting. Like

428
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,320
Speaker 1: ten years ago, we'd be sitting here talk it about

429
00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:03,080
Speaker 1: our devices. Did you get the iPod? What size you have,

430
00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:06,239
Speaker 1: flash memory, etcetera. People don't talk. People don't even talk

431
00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:09,919
Speaker 1: about their phones that way at this particular know, they

432
00:24:09,960 --> 00:24:12,760
Speaker 1: may be talking about the cameras. That's the biggest thing

433
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:14,600
Speaker 1: on the So so the point and then you saw,

434
00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:16,399
Speaker 1: because I know, Jake, you're not gonna be able the

435
00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:18,560
Speaker 1: next year. The camera's gonna have three lenses, so you

436
00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:22,000
Speaker 1: may have to get a new one. Contract to be

437
00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:23,960
Speaker 1: up in another year and I'll get anot of you

438
00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:28,399
Speaker 1: get another photo. So in any event, Uh, the problem

439
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:31,600
Speaker 1: is we don't have enough innovation in the non hip

440
00:24:31,640 --> 00:24:34,520
Speaker 1: hop world. I remember when you got a vinyl record.

441
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:39,160
Speaker 1: Vinyl record held between eight and thirty six minutes of music.

442
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,159
Speaker 1: Once you got below beyond like four, you had a

443
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:45,480
Speaker 1: sound degradation issue. You can push the forty. These days

444
00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:49,880
Speaker 1: you can push. Most people don't because of the high

445
00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:52,080
Speaker 1: quality pressings. I'll put it on two discs, but that's

446
00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:56,080
Speaker 1: not even my point. People stretched to fill that limit.

447
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,920
Speaker 1: And on vinyl records there were essentially four key cuts. Oh,

448
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:02,320
Speaker 1: putting track on each side, closing track on each side.

449
00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:05,239
Speaker 1: You knew that acts put their best stuff there, and

450
00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:07,600
Speaker 1: you checked it out. When we went to the CD.

451
00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:10,280
Speaker 1: It was every It was too much to begin when

452
00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:11,960
Speaker 1: you knew the opening track was supposed to be good,

453
00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:14,199
Speaker 1: and at the end of the CD era they would say,

454
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:15,919
Speaker 1: well what about the fourth track? Fourtra I didn't even

455
00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:18,800
Speaker 1: get there. But at this point in time and for

456
00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:24,720
Speaker 1: a long time, UH CD holds almost eighty minutes, So artistically,

457
00:25:25,520 --> 00:25:29,480
Speaker 1: an album which was under forty minutes suddenly jumped to

458
00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:33,760
Speaker 1: sixty minutes because of the format, not because anybody had

459
00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:36,480
Speaker 1: anything specially new to say. And I think we have

460
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:39,840
Speaker 1: this new format of streaming, but the artists or lunites

461
00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:43,760
Speaker 1: and kept in the old paradigm. As I say, not

462
00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:46,520
Speaker 1: the hip hop acts, not Drake putting up missed mix tapes,

463
00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:49,800
Speaker 1: you know, other people starting with mixed tapes and SoundCloud, etcetera.

464
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:53,080
Speaker 1: But all the other acts can't stop complaining that we

465
00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:55,280
Speaker 1: will not go back to where we once were. So

466
00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:58,679
Speaker 1: even my own acts and I any act I talked to,

467
00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:00,639
Speaker 1: when they asked me about, oh, we're gonna make an

468
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:02,800
Speaker 1: album and we're gonna do this, I say, fine, you

469
00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 1: can go in and record an album, but don't release

470
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 1: it that way. There's no reason to release three tracks

471
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:10,919
Speaker 1: at a time. Release two tracks at a time and

472
00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:13,960
Speaker 1: keep the flow going. Part of it is also that

473
00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:17,399
Speaker 1: you know, every time you release a new track, you

474
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:19,800
Speaker 1: can get another hit from the blogs, you can get

475
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:22,600
Speaker 1: more media attention. You put out ten songs, you get

476
00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:26,399
Speaker 1: your media attention once and then it disappears. If you

477
00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:28,720
Speaker 1: if you put out a track a month, you're gonna

478
00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:31,800
Speaker 1: get media attention every month, and there's more to talk

479
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:34,000
Speaker 1: about because there's something new all the time. This is

480
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:36,400
Speaker 1: interesting to what degree it will affect the visual business.

481
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:38,560
Speaker 1: Like I'm reading the newspaper before I come here, and

482
00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 1: it happens to be a Friday. They must have reviewed

483
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,640
Speaker 1: in excess of twenty movies. Yes, and I'm laughing. I said,

484
00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:48,159
Speaker 1: some of these movies are interesting. I'm never going to

485
00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:50,800
Speaker 1: the theater to see these movies. And when they hit

486
00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:55,040
Speaker 1: UH TV services, I'll forget they existed. First of all,

487
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:59,280
Speaker 1: the newspapers out of touch. They should be reviewing television. Secondly,

488
00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:01,399
Speaker 1: there should be day and date so there could be

489
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:05,640
Speaker 1: ongoing word of mouth. Get this publicity on television shows. Well,

490
00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:07,919
Speaker 1: it's a funny thing. I was. I knew you were

491
00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:10,439
Speaker 1: going to bring up movies and culture, but you know,

492
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,440
Speaker 1: May the fourth be with you Today is May the

493
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,400
Speaker 1: fourth when we're recording this and Star Wars is out

494
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:20,000
Speaker 1: and they they finally timed it to put out the

495
00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:24,439
Speaker 1: new Star Wars with UH with UM with May the

496
00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:27,640
Speaker 1: fourth and last year. Right, No, it's there's a new

497
00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:31,359
Speaker 1: Solo Star Wars today. Solo. Isn't that the new Solo movie?

498
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:35,040
Speaker 1: I can't even And it's actually it's my brother's birthday

499
00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:37,560
Speaker 1: and he's like a big girlfriend's I know it is

500
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:40,320
Speaker 1: and and and he's a big tech nerd, and and

501
00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:43,399
Speaker 1: he loves Star Wars. It's just so happening. Born on

502
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:47,000
Speaker 1: May the fourth, it's so weird and uh and uh

503
00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:49,440
Speaker 1: because he's you want to talk about technology, He got

504
00:27:49,440 --> 00:27:54,960
Speaker 1: a new sixty five inch four K TV and he

505
00:27:55,080 --> 00:27:57,840
Speaker 1: loves it. He just can't stop talking about the only thing.

506
00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:01,439
Speaker 1: I have a five K Mac. And it used to

507
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:06,560
Speaker 1: be YouTube showed four K videos on all browsers. Now

508
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:09,959
Speaker 1: they switched it only to their own browser, which is Chrome.

509
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:15,040
Speaker 1: And I was watching a video yesterday and granted only

510
00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:17,159
Speaker 1: like you know, eight inches from the screen, and I

511
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:19,600
Speaker 1: was watching in four K's just great. Yeah, well he's

512
00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 1: watching sports and he's upgraded his Netflix to four K

513
00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:27,480
Speaker 1: and Amazon Prime and like you know, he literally has

514
00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:30,440
Speaker 1: his house set up like he's he's uh Captain Kirk

515
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,159
Speaker 1: and he's running the Starship Enterprise. You know, where was

516
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:35,439
Speaker 1: I and somewhere and we're talking about no, no, But

517
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:37,880
Speaker 1: I was somewhere in the in the last week, maybe

518
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:40,760
Speaker 1: in a hotel where they had a TV so big

519
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:44,160
Speaker 1: that I said, this is almost as big as some

520
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:47,000
Speaker 1: of the small theaters of the seventies. Well, but but

521
00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:49,480
Speaker 1: that's what it feels like. Um, the hotel I'm in

522
00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:52,840
Speaker 1: has two giant TVs, one in the living room area

523
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,120
Speaker 1: and one in the bedroom area. And when you think

524
00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 1: about the distance you are away from the TV in

525
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:02,360
Speaker 1: in in in comparison to being in a theater, it's

526
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:05,360
Speaker 1: it's probably almost as big. And I was at a

527
00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:09,120
Speaker 1: hotel in Vancouver, was the first time I've ever experienced

528
00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:12,560
Speaker 1: this for the junos, and they had Netflix on the

529
00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:15,640
Speaker 1: TV and you just logged in your account. I've heard

530
00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:18,240
Speaker 1: about that. I know a lot of people travel with

531
00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:21,600
Speaker 1: a firestick. Not to get in legal issues here, but

532
00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 1: I know a lot of people travel with a jail

533
00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:26,560
Speaker 1: broken firestick, and you know, they watched their own things.

534
00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 1: The other thing you can do is we're getting to

535
00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:30,160
Speaker 1: this technical stuff. I had a flatter rio a little

536
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:34,880
Speaker 1: while back, and now Netflix is downloadable, so I downloaded

537
00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:37,479
Speaker 1: to my iPad like twenty hours worth of stuff, so

538
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:40,440
Speaker 1: you're never shut Now. They really upgraded the plane, especially

539
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:43,720
Speaker 1: the one to Miami. We're really deep into this travel talk.

540
00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:45,760
Speaker 1: And it used to be that was the old seven

541
00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:47,880
Speaker 1: thirties seven and you know, with the old seats, and

542
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:50,560
Speaker 1: you know you couldn't see anything. But it's better now. Yeah. No,

543
00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:53,520
Speaker 1: I mean, and all the airlines have their own thing,

544
00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:57,040
Speaker 1: but but they're gonna take out all the visual entertainment

545
00:29:57,080 --> 00:29:59,520
Speaker 1: because they think people. I mean, I would rather not

546
00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:03,640
Speaker 1: travel with the iPad because I'm traveling with so much

547
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:06,719
Speaker 1: crapple already. And I got the laptop, I got the Kindle,

548
00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:09,560
Speaker 1: I got the bows, headphones, etcetera. I don't really want

549
00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 1: to add something to the pile. But by the same token,

550
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:15,000
Speaker 1: I tend not to watch the movies on the plane anyway.

551
00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 1: That's where I watched the movies that you're talking about

552
00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:22,160
Speaker 1: that you'll never watch those that I call them plane movies.

553
00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:24,880
Speaker 1: That's a good plane movie. Yeah, Like when you see

554
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:26,720
Speaker 1: the ad for do you read the review, Oh, that

555
00:30:26,760 --> 00:30:29,520
Speaker 1: will be on a plane soon, and that's a plane movie.

556
00:30:29,560 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 1: To me. Those are there's certain movies there it's like, oh, yeah,

557
00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:34,440
Speaker 1: I'll watch that on the plane. But when you're flying here, Cannon,

558
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:37,720
Speaker 1: if you're upfront, it's it's a nineteen inch screen. Wow.

559
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:41,200
Speaker 1: Like especially this flight Toronto l A. It's it's uh,

560
00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 1: it's life flats, it's it's a whole other thing. So

561
00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:49,080
Speaker 1: I did that flight to Sydney. UM from Toronto. You

562
00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 1: flight Toronto Vancouver, Vancouver City. That's sixteen hours. You're up front,

563
00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:56,440
Speaker 1: you're you're in your own pod, and there's like it's

564
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:58,560
Speaker 1: a nice way to let's not get too class oriented.

565
00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 1: Not everybody listening to but listen, listen. Like I I

566
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:04,160
Speaker 1: paid for that ticket, and it was like I was

567
00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:07,120
Speaker 1: treating myself. It was like I'm gonna do this, Like, um,

568
00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:09,680
Speaker 1: if you're flying for sixteen hours and I'm a big guy,

569
00:31:09,720 --> 00:31:13,200
Speaker 1: I'm not. And I was with a manager for dinner

570
00:31:13,320 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 1: last Friday night, and he travels an unbelievable amount. If

571
00:31:16,920 --> 00:31:18,640
Speaker 1: I mentioned the acts, you'd know who he is, and

572
00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 1: I'd rather not do that. UH. But he got deep

573
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:26,080
Speaker 1: vein thrombosis, and he suddenly realized that's what Richard Nixon had,

574
00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:28,560
Speaker 1: where you get a blood clot from flying so much

575
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:32,480
Speaker 1: and not moving. And he was supposed to fly to

576
00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:35,840
Speaker 1: UH on a one hour flight. He said, I'm just

577
00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:37,920
Speaker 1: gonna cancel. Went to the doctor said, if you've taken

578
00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:39,880
Speaker 1: that flight, you would have died. Is that you would

579
00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 1: have been fine on the flight, but walking around thereafter

580
00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:44,080
Speaker 1: it would have gone to your heart. At the blood

581
00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:47,080
Speaker 1: clot that would have been it. So now he has to.

582
00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:49,680
Speaker 1: Now he's on blood thinners and he has to get

583
00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:51,800
Speaker 1: up on the plane and walk every four hours. And

584
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:54,360
Speaker 1: I'm always thinking about that myself walking on the plane.

585
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:58,600
Speaker 1: Well that if you're flying big enough planes, his plenty room. Yeah,

586
00:31:58,600 --> 00:31:59,959
Speaker 1: but usually you don't want to get to be if

587
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:01,360
Speaker 1: you're sleeping on the plane, you don't want to the

588
00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:03,280
Speaker 1: guy I want to get up every four hours. Yeah,

589
00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:05,880
Speaker 1: well we're on a sixteen hour flight. You're sleeping like

590
00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:08,880
Speaker 1: you would at home anyway, So you you do, you're sleeping.

591
00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:15,440
Speaker 1: We'll pause here for a brief moment and come back

592
00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:20,360
Speaker 1: with more of my conversation with Jake Cole. For those

593
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:23,160
Speaker 1: who attended the Music Media Summit in Santa Barbara, where

594
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,160
Speaker 1: a conversation with leaders in their industries. We have Jake

595
00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 1: Gold here this week, Canadian manager extraordinaire, to help put

596
00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:33,240
Speaker 1: all the conversations into context. But if you missed any

597
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:36,680
Speaker 1: of them from Troy Carter at Spotify or Ethiope at

598
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:40,479
Speaker 1: Motown or Steve at Amazon Music, listen to them all

599
00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:43,320
Speaker 1: on the Bob Left Sets podcast and please join us

600
00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:48,400
Speaker 1: next year in Santa Barbara. Now we're with Jake gold. Okay,

601
00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:54,400
Speaker 1: let's go back Amazon. Amazon. Do you think it really

602
00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:59,280
Speaker 1: is the sleeping giant? That? Absolutely? I mean, just like

603
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:02,880
Speaker 1: people to this date don't know that you can sink

604
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:06,560
Speaker 1: tracks to your phone via Spotify, such that if you're

605
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:08,760
Speaker 1: out of cell range, you will have music as long

606
00:33:08,800 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 1: as your device has juice. Uh. You know. I've discussed

607
00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:16,680
Speaker 1: this with Steve Boom ahead of Amazon Music previously, but

608
00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:19,000
Speaker 1: he went into further depth in Santa Barbara. How they

609
00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:23,320
Speaker 1: do it, there's what's called metadata, metadata, or the identifying

610
00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 1: factors about a record. A track, you know what label,

611
00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:29,680
Speaker 1: who the artist is, and you know who wrote it.

612
00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 1: But they have developed much more or have entered much

613
00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:37,120
Speaker 1: more metadata at Amazon. And what this allows you to

614
00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:43,240
Speaker 1: do is ask your Echo to play playlists, which it

615
00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:45,920
Speaker 1: then creates on the fly, which is much more granular.

616
00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 1: You can say, uh, Alexa, hopefully it's not Alexa. This

617
00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:53,440
Speaker 1: room is going to go off. Alexa play rock tracks

618
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:57,800
Speaker 1: from nineteen. It can do that so on other services

619
00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:00,800
Speaker 1: where the playlists already has to exist. List here it

620
00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:03,720
Speaker 1: is making the playlist on the fly. I like to

621
00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:07,080
Speaker 1: I like when you when he said play sad songs,

622
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:13,239
Speaker 1: sad rock songs from x Y specific. I mean, uh,

623
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:16,160
Speaker 1: you know, there's this sounds complicated, but if you're in

624
00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:20,160
Speaker 1: the ecosystem, it's not. If you have Amazon Prime, which

625
00:34:20,160 --> 00:34:22,680
Speaker 1: over a hundred million people have, and you have an

626
00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:27,799
Speaker 1: electa device, you can you have music built in. It's

627
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:30,600
Speaker 1: just you can't call out the specific track. And if

628
00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:34,200
Speaker 1: you pay three echo you can call out the specific track.

629
00:34:34,200 --> 00:34:36,319
Speaker 1: And if you pay ten bucks a month, you can

630
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:39,719
Speaker 1: have an app, just like Apple Music and Spotify, and

631
00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:42,279
Speaker 1: I have all those apps. And I noticed in the

632
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:46,680
Speaker 1: past week that Spotify went to voice control, but Amazon

633
00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:49,440
Speaker 1: has electra control on their app on the phone. So

634
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:53,520
Speaker 1: I'm there with the engineer from Amazon Music and I say,

635
00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:56,560
Speaker 1: he says, play happy fun music from the sixties, and

636
00:34:56,640 --> 00:35:00,960
Speaker 1: it did. So then I say, play the pressed songs

637
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:03,719
Speaker 1: from the eighties and and then of course you know,

638
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:05,360
Speaker 1: and you don't have to tell Morrissey. It was just

639
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:07,839
Speaker 1: a list. But the funny thing was two things. You're

640
00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:09,839
Speaker 1: not say ALEXA to the app. You can just say it,

641
00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:12,600
Speaker 1: and although you push the button and you can see

642
00:35:12,600 --> 00:35:14,919
Speaker 1: the little circles, you know it's ready. But the other

643
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:17,680
Speaker 1: thing is it said, you know, I forget the exact lingo.

644
00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:20,000
Speaker 1: What it does you know, Sorry, we don't have that yet,

645
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:23,799
Speaker 1: and he said, say depressing. Then it came up and

646
00:35:23,840 --> 00:35:28,239
Speaker 1: not depressed. They're still working, but they're doing all these things.

647
00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:31,400
Speaker 1: I mean, I have not heard that Apple and the

648
00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:34,440
Speaker 1: Amazon are doing. But just last night for this morning,

649
00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:37,719
Speaker 1: I got this song stuck in my head and I

650
00:35:37,800 --> 00:35:40,680
Speaker 1: called out to the Echo show to play it, and

651
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:43,360
Speaker 1: I was thinking, how I've listened to that song a

652
00:35:43,400 --> 00:35:45,560
Speaker 1: lot recently. It's an old song called back where I've

653
00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:49,040
Speaker 1: Come From by mac Mcinally there's a famous hit version

654
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:52,279
Speaker 1: by Kenny Chesney. I even liked the live version even better.

655
00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:55,719
Speaker 1: And so I've listened a lot on Disraeli, which is

656
00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:59,319
Speaker 1: you know, CD quality, And so I'm listening on the

657
00:35:59,360 --> 00:36:01,719
Speaker 1: Echo and a good enough for me even though I

658
00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:04,839
Speaker 1: have all the high end equipment. It's just amazing. It's

659
00:36:04,880 --> 00:36:07,880
Speaker 1: just the convenience of it, like you're already there and okay,

660
00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:10,080
Speaker 1: so let's let's talk about because you and I have

661
00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:13,680
Speaker 1: had this conversation a couple of times and and I'm

662
00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:19,279
Speaker 1: I'm I'm not sure what my stances on it yet,

663
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:21,440
Speaker 1: but i'd like to get your opinion on it. Is

664
00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:25,680
Speaker 1: the only one that offers a free tier is Spotify,

665
00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:34,080
Speaker 1: and Spotify is the predominant um streaming service right now

666
00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:40,359
Speaker 1: and half of their half of their subscribers are free tier.

667
00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:45,640
Speaker 1: So do you think, first of all, that's skewing the

668
00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:50,480
Speaker 1: data data on on the most streams. So no, I

669
00:36:50,480 --> 00:36:52,080
Speaker 1: mean at this point in time, they just released their

670
00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:55,959
Speaker 1: numbers a couple of days ago and they added four

671
00:36:56,080 --> 00:37:00,880
Speaker 1: million subscribers since they paid or free paid. So the

672
00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:04,120
Speaker 1: paid subscribers as we speak here is bubbling under eighty

673
00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:09,240
Speaker 1: million that's paid, whereas Apple has forty million and Amazon

674
00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:13,040
Speaker 1: doesn't tell you, so there's another fifty plus million there

675
00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:15,040
Speaker 1: were free, but they break it down. No, but there

676
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:18,040
Speaker 1: I think as many free on Spotify as there is.

677
00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:21,240
Speaker 1: There may be, but I thought I read like hundred

678
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:24,719
Speaker 1: and sixty millions. I don't know. But the thing is

679
00:37:24,719 --> 00:37:28,640
Speaker 1: they're the only ones that offer free and now they've

680
00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 1: they've they've done all these upgrades to the to the

681
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:37,719
Speaker 1: mobile app to allow you more access on the free

682
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:41,480
Speaker 1: tier than they did before. So is the movement because

683
00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:44,640
Speaker 1: they've gone public to go to drive more revenue on

684
00:37:44,680 --> 00:37:47,560
Speaker 1: the ad side, or they trying to get more conversion.

685
00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:50,440
Speaker 1: I mean, they're obviously conversion. There's a lot of issues.

686
00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:53,719
Speaker 1: They're starting with the ad side. Historically, the ad side

687
00:37:53,760 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 1: has not generated that much revenue. One might argue that

688
00:37:57,120 --> 00:38:00,279
Speaker 1: they're not sophisticated enough in that area. Spotify, and they're

689
00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:04,239
Speaker 1: making progress. Let's go back to the history of Spotify.

690
00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:07,319
Speaker 1: When Spotify originally came to this country, even when it

691
00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:10,080
Speaker 1: was in other countries, it was free on the desktop

692
00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:13,320
Speaker 1: and you had to pay on the mobile. Correct. And

693
00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:15,680
Speaker 1: I try to be fear in my assessments. I haven't

694
00:38:15,719 --> 00:38:17,440
Speaker 1: written any songs. I'm not getting paid at all. I

695
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:19,880
Speaker 1: don't have the stock at any of these companies. But

696
00:38:20,040 --> 00:38:24,239
Speaker 1: that seemed a fair demarcation. And then Daniel X said

697
00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:26,640
Speaker 1: it was going they were gonna have a free tier

698
00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:30,480
Speaker 1: on the mobile device. That seemed to step over the

699
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:34,279
Speaker 1: line to me, but he showed me the statistics that

700
00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:38,759
Speaker 1: it caused conversion. Okay, which is the ultimate goal. Going

701
00:38:39,320 --> 00:38:43,840
Speaker 1: back to the beginning more, let me stay there. Unfortunately,

702
00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:46,680
Speaker 1: have to go back in time. One cannot forget how

703
00:38:46,719 --> 00:38:50,960
Speaker 1: big a problem piracy was before Spotify, and the free

704
00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:55,719
Speaker 1: tier essentially eradicates piracy. Is Michael Eisner one said ten

705
00:38:55,760 --> 00:38:57,840
Speaker 1: percent of the people will never pay forget about that

706
00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:00,640
Speaker 1: ten percent, But other people because I can venience, they

707
00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:03,520
Speaker 1: won't do that. So this is pretty much eradicated piracy

708
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:08,160
Speaker 1: along with YouTube. And I believe the free tier Spotify

709
00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:11,040
Speaker 1: would have had even greater penetration if it had launched

710
00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:14,719
Speaker 1: two years previous when it did in America. It didn't

711
00:39:14,800 --> 00:39:17,120
Speaker 1: launch the two thousand eleven and wanted to launch earlier,

712
00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:19,000
Speaker 1: but one of the major companies would not get on board,

713
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:21,759
Speaker 1: and it was in that window that YouTube became so

714
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:24,560
Speaker 1: popular for music. However, at this point in time, a

715
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:27,560
Speaker 1: lot of tracks have more streams on Spotify than they

716
00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:30,520
Speaker 1: do on YouTube. But if you go now, so what

717
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:36,120
Speaker 1: people don't realize is the free tier on Spotify is hobbled.

718
00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:39,399
Speaker 1: You can't go in and pick one track. You might

719
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:41,840
Speaker 1: be able to pick an album, you might be able

720
00:39:41,880 --> 00:39:45,520
Speaker 1: to pick a playlist. It's ultimately frustrating. So you have

721
00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:48,719
Speaker 1: the ability, but it's also an incentive to pay well.

722
00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:53,239
Speaker 1: This announcement recently about enhanced free tier stuff, I mean

723
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:56,759
Speaker 1: on the mobile. I think at the conference Troy put

724
00:39:56,760 --> 00:40:00,040
Speaker 1: it well, they want to personalize as such, the you

725
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:03,200
Speaker 1: feel welcome, so that when you turn on the app,

726
00:40:03,840 --> 00:40:06,520
Speaker 1: the songs and the identity you have you want to

727
00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:09,520
Speaker 1: hear this is deep into the Spotify ecosystem, which most

728
00:40:09,520 --> 00:40:12,720
Speaker 1: people are aware of this point, but having brought a company,

729
00:40:12,760 --> 00:40:15,439
Speaker 1: I think it's driven by the echo nest. Every week

730
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:19,400
Speaker 1: they put out these personalized playlists, and they want the

731
00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:23,000
Speaker 1: people who are non paying customers get a taste of

732
00:40:23,040 --> 00:40:25,920
Speaker 1: that so they'll feel comfortab when they want to pay.

733
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:29,640
Speaker 1: You know, we can't say what the results are of

734
00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:32,480
Speaker 1: this latest change because it's too new, but everything they

735
00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 1: have done has increased conversion. It's just like Steve Boom

736
00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:40,520
Speaker 1: talking about Amazon. Once they get people using the product

737
00:40:40,760 --> 00:40:44,480
Speaker 1: and they hit up against the wall, they then pay well.

738
00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:48,279
Speaker 1: But their first earnings came out Spotify, and everyone took

739
00:40:48,280 --> 00:40:53,200
Speaker 1: a look at it and to stop drop ten that day,

740
00:40:53,239 --> 00:40:56,080
Speaker 1: And I think partially because now everyone's seeing how this

741
00:40:56,200 --> 00:40:59,560
Speaker 1: company's run and they're still losing losing money. Now revenues up,

742
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:02,000
Speaker 1: but they're still losing money. And you know, and you've

743
00:41:02,040 --> 00:41:05,440
Speaker 1: written about this, that the more subscribers they get because

744
00:41:05,440 --> 00:41:09,439
Speaker 1: of the payout, the more money they lose. And and

745
00:41:09,560 --> 00:41:11,560
Speaker 1: I guess we even had to talk about it in

746
00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:16,279
Speaker 1: Santa Barbara. At what point does that turn? What's the

747
00:41:16,400 --> 00:41:20,719
Speaker 1: line where they go from paid subscribers actually pay for

748
00:41:20,760 --> 00:41:25,759
Speaker 1: the business to run or or or is are they

749
00:41:25,800 --> 00:41:29,040
Speaker 1: getting so big that eventually they're gonna have way more

750
00:41:29,120 --> 00:41:32,360
Speaker 1: leverage with the labels and the label they're gonna end

751
00:41:32,440 --> 00:41:34,640
Speaker 1: up paying less because the labels are gonna need them

752
00:41:34,680 --> 00:41:37,000
Speaker 1: more than ever. You've got a lot of things going

753
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:41,480
Speaker 1: on there. Let's start with Uh. The issue is that

754
00:41:41,600 --> 00:41:45,520
Speaker 1: if you listen to Spotify, they are in a lost

755
00:41:45,600 --> 00:41:49,200
Speaker 1: position because they're investing so much in growth. That is

756
00:41:49,239 --> 00:41:53,360
Speaker 1: a kin to Netflix, Okay, because you want to double

757
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:56,160
Speaker 1: down now to win the war at the end, and

758
00:41:56,160 --> 00:41:59,120
Speaker 1: there's certainly a war and streaming although an Amazon did

759
00:41:59,160 --> 00:42:05,239
Speaker 1: that too exactly and then but in the sales earnings call,

760
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:08,319
Speaker 1: Daniel lex said it was not a zero sum game.

761
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:11,360
Speaker 1: I don't really agree with him. I believe one force

762
00:42:11,400 --> 00:42:14,520
Speaker 1: will one of the streaming services will be dominant. Your

763
00:42:14,560 --> 00:42:19,359
Speaker 1: point about scale is a huge one. The more people subscribe,

764
00:42:19,760 --> 00:42:23,360
Speaker 1: the more costs go up. That is why I believe

765
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:28,759
Speaker 1: that Spotify is best as part of another company. Who

766
00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:31,160
Speaker 1: might that company be? Amazon does not have a long

767
00:42:31,239 --> 00:42:34,560
Speaker 1: history of buying other companies. Apple should have bought Spotify

768
00:42:34,680 --> 00:42:38,000
Speaker 1: long ago. The only one who can really afford it

769
00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:41,839
Speaker 1: is Google, and Google has had one after another non

770
00:42:41,920 --> 00:42:45,319
Speaker 1: starting streaming services. They're just starting a new one that

771
00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:47,759
Speaker 1: they will always talk about the telcost with telcos have

772
00:42:47,840 --> 00:42:50,400
Speaker 1: hit a wall. I don't really see that now. The

773
00:42:50,440 --> 00:42:53,960
Speaker 1: other thing they have said in the investor Day and

774
00:42:54,000 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 1: Troy did say in Santa Barbara, okay, if you follow this, uh,

775
00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:05,160
Speaker 1: when Spotify launch, essentially seventy page really sixty nine points

776
00:43:05,239 --> 00:43:10,120
Speaker 1: something of revenues went to rights soldiers in renegotiations over

777
00:43:10,160 --> 00:43:13,680
Speaker 1: the last two years, most of them were completed about

778
00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:18,479
Speaker 1: a year ago. UM, they have lowered the percentage they

779
00:43:18,560 --> 00:43:23,680
Speaker 1: pay to the labels. They labels are agreeing to that

780
00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:26,000
Speaker 1: because they want Spotify to succeed. As we've seen in

781
00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:29,080
Speaker 1: the last two years. At this point, the majority of

782
00:43:29,120 --> 00:43:32,120
Speaker 1: revenue comes from streaming services. So if you hurt your

783
00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:36,120
Speaker 1: number one distributor in trouble now, Spotify will also say

784
00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:40,120
Speaker 1: they will gain advantage by being such a large distributor.

785
00:43:40,239 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 1: Just like anybody, whether it be Best Buyer, Amazon or Walmart,

786
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:47,160
Speaker 1: you can drive down costs because of your volume. But

787
00:43:47,600 --> 00:43:53,880
Speaker 1: baked into all the statements is they put it in English.

788
00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:55,799
Speaker 1: They don't necessarily say in English. I don't mean not

789
00:43:55,800 --> 00:43:59,960
Speaker 1: in Swedish, but in a comprehensible fashion. They are anticipate

790
00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:04,280
Speaker 1: painting there will be a growth of independent unaffiliated acts.

791
00:44:05,239 --> 00:44:08,680
Speaker 1: Those acts get all of the revenue. So if you

792
00:44:08,800 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 1: sign a deal with a major label of the sixty

793
00:44:11,560 --> 00:44:14,840
Speaker 1: odd percent, you might be getting ten, which is on

794
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:17,279
Speaker 1: a dollar six cents. So are you well, let me

795
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:19,600
Speaker 1: let me just fens one second. Whereas if you're an

796
00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:22,600
Speaker 1: independent act, you're essentially getting all sixty. You know, you

797
00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:24,640
Speaker 1: have to pay a small fee of tune Core CD

798
00:44:24,719 --> 00:44:28,800
Speaker 1: baby to get up there an aggregator, right, but they want,

799
00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:31,400
Speaker 1: they expect and they want to drive more of that

800
00:44:31,520 --> 00:44:33,880
Speaker 1: business and pay them less. They haven't made it a

801
00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:37,840
Speaker 1: put on an exact number. Whereas right now they're paying

802
00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:40,600
Speaker 1: sixty percent to the independent act. They'd like to pay

803
00:44:40,719 --> 00:44:44,120
Speaker 1: less of that, increasing their margin, and they are thinking

804
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:47,000
Speaker 1: there's going to be more chance the rapper type acts.

805
00:44:47,600 --> 00:44:51,280
Speaker 1: I don't disagree. I think that's that's already starting to happen.

806
00:44:51,320 --> 00:44:53,880
Speaker 1: You're seeing that all the time. There's tons of people

807
00:44:53,960 --> 00:44:57,120
Speaker 1: like me who are working with with young bands who

808
00:44:57,160 --> 00:44:59,440
Speaker 1: don't want to do a deal or don't think the

809
00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:01,920
Speaker 1: deal is to right time because there's no leverage and

810
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:04,680
Speaker 1: we're able to get our stuff out there and hiring.

811
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:08,160
Speaker 1: But if they're paying you sixty five now and they

812
00:45:08,200 --> 00:45:10,960
Speaker 1: start paying you sixty, which is huge on their end,

813
00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:14,600
Speaker 1: I don't think you're gonna be freaking out. Probably not.

814
00:45:15,040 --> 00:45:17,600
Speaker 1: But as I say, so, that's all the margin they

815
00:45:17,600 --> 00:45:19,360
Speaker 1: have to deal with. As I say, five percent on

816
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:23,040
Speaker 1: their end is gigantius right right now. And I agree,

817
00:45:23,040 --> 00:45:27,000
Speaker 1: But I also think that that um so, maybe there's

818
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:29,160
Speaker 1: an argument that says we should all be investing in

819
00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:32,799
Speaker 1: the CD babies and the aggregators because you know, if

820
00:45:32,840 --> 00:45:35,879
Speaker 1: the independence is moving in that direction. I mean, there's

821
00:45:35,880 --> 00:45:37,960
Speaker 1: a whole bunch of someone I know sent out an

822
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:41,279
Speaker 1: email to a list of other managers um and said

823
00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:43,960
Speaker 1: I'm about to do something digital. Who's who's your best

824
00:45:44,000 --> 00:45:48,239
Speaker 1: digital distributor? And every single one of us on the list,

825
00:45:48,280 --> 00:45:50,560
Speaker 1: it was ten of us responded and we all named

826
00:45:50,560 --> 00:45:55,000
Speaker 1: a different company. Yeah, that's also a business doesn't scale

827
00:45:55,040 --> 00:45:58,000
Speaker 1: that well. I mean, it's just distribution and it's a

828
00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:01,200
Speaker 1: small piece. And say, but you know, don't if those

829
00:46:01,239 --> 00:46:04,719
Speaker 1: people don't know. With aggregators, they charge at one time

830
00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:06,480
Speaker 1: fee or an the annual fee as opposed to the

831
00:46:06,560 --> 00:46:10,560
Speaker 1: number of times there are some that charge of Some

832
00:46:10,640 --> 00:46:13,080
Speaker 1: of those offer more services though, so they offer they

833
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:15,760
Speaker 1: charge a percentage, and then maybe they'll offer some marketing

834
00:46:15,880 --> 00:46:17,960
Speaker 1: or whatever. But most of them, you're right, it's a

835
00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:20,160
Speaker 1: flat fee and it's an easy access and they get

836
00:46:20,200 --> 00:46:23,080
Speaker 1: it up fast. You used to Ingestion used to take forever,

837
00:46:23,719 --> 00:46:25,560
Speaker 1: you know, when you were with the label, it was like, oh,

838
00:46:25,560 --> 00:46:27,799
Speaker 1: we need all the metadata three months in advance, and

839
00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:29,960
Speaker 1: blah blah blah blah blah. Now you go on to

840
00:46:30,120 --> 00:46:32,239
Speaker 1: c D Baby or tune Car and it's like in

841
00:46:32,320 --> 00:46:34,680
Speaker 1: two weeks, less than two weeks, I've had stuff up

842
00:46:34,719 --> 00:46:37,200
Speaker 1: in five days. Well, I had this experience last week.

843
00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:39,680
Speaker 1: I was writing about an album, Open Skies, which came

844
00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:43,560
Speaker 1: out r c A, was not on any streaming service.

845
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:47,520
Speaker 1: You know. Two days later, somebody emails me it's on

846
00:46:47,600 --> 00:46:49,960
Speaker 1: Apple Music. You know. It just just blew my mind.

847
00:46:50,239 --> 00:46:51,680
Speaker 1: And then I heard from the label they added it

848
00:46:51,800 --> 00:46:54,920
Speaker 1: just that fast. Well, it's it's interesting you say that,

849
00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:57,560
Speaker 1: because I was looking for a record the other day

850
00:46:57,800 --> 00:47:00,839
Speaker 1: on Spotify and on Deezer and it wasn't on either

851
00:47:00,920 --> 00:47:03,200
Speaker 1: of them. What record was it? Mad Man Across the Water?

852
00:47:03,320 --> 00:47:05,560
Speaker 1: I could not find it on Spotify, and there it

853
00:47:05,680 --> 00:47:11,040
Speaker 1: was on Apple Music. Unfortunately, when you can't find something,

854
00:47:11,160 --> 00:47:15,800
Speaker 1: especially on Spotify, the search is not fantastic, and maybe

855
00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:17,719
Speaker 1: that was you have to search in a different way.

856
00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:20,120
Speaker 1: I've had this happen again and again. I have this

857
00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:22,960
Speaker 1: happen with open Skies on Apple. Somebody send me the link.

858
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 1: I click the link. I could listen on Apple, okay,

859
00:47:25,640 --> 00:47:27,960
Speaker 1: but if I searched on Apple, it wasn't there. Well,

860
00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:31,640
Speaker 1: I searched on Spotify and and every other out in

861
00:47:31,719 --> 00:47:33,600
Speaker 1: John record was there. And in fact, they had the

862
00:47:33,640 --> 00:47:37,759
Speaker 1: track Madman Across the Water on another record. Well, I

863
00:47:37,840 --> 00:47:40,040
Speaker 1: might say, without pulling my Modify, without pull him up

864
00:47:40,040 --> 00:47:42,200
Speaker 1: my device. Right now, I think that's probably a search issue.

865
00:47:42,239 --> 00:47:44,200
Speaker 1: I run into that all the time. Where did I

866
00:47:44,200 --> 00:47:46,280
Speaker 1: search on a track and I don't get it? Searching

867
00:47:46,320 --> 00:47:48,239
Speaker 1: on the band's name, I don't get it. And then

868
00:47:48,239 --> 00:47:50,839
Speaker 1: I put the two together. It's is. It's better than

869
00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:52,440
Speaker 1: it used to be, but it ain't perfect. But it

870
00:47:52,520 --> 00:47:54,480
Speaker 1: was right there on Apple Music. It was. It was

871
00:47:54,520 --> 00:47:57,080
Speaker 1: a weird to Apple Music. The other thing that they're

872
00:47:57,120 --> 00:48:00,720
Speaker 1: doing is they've just rolled out in beta the Apple

873
00:48:00,840 --> 00:48:03,759
Speaker 1: Music for Artists, which is what Spotify has had for

874
00:48:03,800 --> 00:48:05,960
Speaker 1: a while. That is a data program just just for

875
00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:09,360
Speaker 1: the audience is not that sophisticated. So so one of

876
00:48:09,400 --> 00:48:12,880
Speaker 1: the bigger complaints that the business side had, the artists

877
00:48:12,880 --> 00:48:17,000
Speaker 1: and the labels, was that Spotify was wonderful in supplying

878
00:48:17,080 --> 00:48:20,120
Speaker 1: us with back end data. And it was the agents

879
00:48:20,200 --> 00:48:22,160
Speaker 1: love that you could see where your spins, where you

880
00:48:22,160 --> 00:48:25,760
Speaker 1: could look at the different markets city by city, country

881
00:48:25,800 --> 00:48:28,440
Speaker 1: by country, You could look in the twenty four hour basis,

882
00:48:28,440 --> 00:48:31,160
Speaker 1: a seven day basis, a twenty eight day basis, and

883
00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:35,000
Speaker 1: a since inception basis, and you could get all this

884
00:48:35,120 --> 00:48:40,200
Speaker 1: information from them. Apple gave you no information. And I

885
00:48:40,239 --> 00:48:43,800
Speaker 1: think one of the reasons that the labels were really,

886
00:48:43,960 --> 00:48:46,920
Speaker 1: you know, gearing towards Spotify so much, is because they

887
00:48:46,920 --> 00:48:50,319
Speaker 1: were providing back marketing data that that everyone could use.

888
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:54,480
Speaker 1: Apples decided um, and I think I saw it at

889
00:48:54,480 --> 00:48:56,680
Speaker 1: Pole Star. In fact, was the last time I was

890
00:48:56,719 --> 00:48:58,320
Speaker 1: here where Apples said they were going to roll it

891
00:48:58,360 --> 00:49:00,480
Speaker 1: out in April, and now they were going it out

892
00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:04,040
Speaker 1: in data for artists to be able to access their data,

893
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:05,960
Speaker 1: and the labels are going to be able to access

894
00:49:06,160 --> 00:49:09,759
Speaker 1: the data, which Apple never gave us before ever. On

895
00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:14,400
Speaker 1: sales on CD sales or downloads of of albums and

896
00:49:14,680 --> 00:49:17,440
Speaker 1: we never got that information. They would report it to

897
00:49:17,560 --> 00:49:20,080
Speaker 1: sound scan and you could sort of extrapulate it at

898
00:49:20,080 --> 00:49:23,200
Speaker 1: a sound scan, but you couldn't get that granular, granular

899
00:49:23,320 --> 00:49:26,520
Speaker 1: data that Spotify has, and I think they're trying. They're

900
00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:29,560
Speaker 1: basically saying, Okay, if we're gonna play this game, the

901
00:49:29,640 --> 00:49:33,000
Speaker 1: streaming game, and work with our partners, meaning the people

902
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:35,880
Speaker 1: that are supplying us the content, we're gonna have to

903
00:49:36,160 --> 00:49:40,279
Speaker 1: uh start supplying the data and uh we'll see. I mean,

904
00:49:40,360 --> 00:49:43,480
Speaker 1: I it's funny because they gave me, uh for for

905
00:49:43,560 --> 00:49:46,799
Speaker 1: my tune two acts. They gave me uh log in,

906
00:49:46,880 --> 00:49:49,760
Speaker 1: and I logged in and looked at everything and nothing

907
00:49:49,800 --> 00:49:53,040
Speaker 1: came up. It was like page So it's still in

908
00:49:53,160 --> 00:49:57,000
Speaker 1: data and it'll probably they're probably working all the bugs out,

909
00:49:57,080 --> 00:50:01,280
Speaker 1: but when that data starts to come through, it'll be interesting.

910
00:50:02,120 --> 00:50:05,600
Speaker 1: On another note, Um, there was a bit of discussion

911
00:50:05,640 --> 00:50:08,319
Speaker 1: about it. I forget who you were talking to. Wasn't Boom.

912
00:50:08,440 --> 00:50:11,200
Speaker 1: You were talking to Boom about this, Steve Boom about

913
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:17,319
Speaker 1: how different genres are doing different services. That's an interesting thing.

914
00:50:17,520 --> 00:50:19,560
Speaker 1: The manager of Garth Brooks was at the conference, and

915
00:50:19,600 --> 00:50:23,680
Speaker 1: I know him, and I've previously discussed you know why

916
00:50:24,000 --> 00:50:26,920
Speaker 1: is in Garth brook On Garth Brooks on other streaming

917
00:50:26,960 --> 00:50:30,600
Speaker 1: services and they have an overall deal with the Amazon

918
00:50:30,680 --> 00:50:32,959
Speaker 1: which benefits Garth and Garth has been on the road

919
00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:38,839
Speaker 1: and uh, but they alerted me to the number of

920
00:50:38,920 --> 00:50:41,160
Speaker 1: streams they were getting. And then it begs the question

921
00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:44,800
Speaker 1: what is the audience for these varying services? Once again,

922
00:50:45,239 --> 00:50:48,239
Speaker 1: there's a free if you have Prime, there's essentially a

923
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:54,719
Speaker 1: free tier for Amazon, so certainly prior to Apple Music's

924
00:50:55,239 --> 00:50:58,359
Speaker 1: getting the king for Prime. Yeah, but it's it doesn't feel,

925
00:50:58,360 --> 00:51:01,640
Speaker 1: you know, the old cliche, doesn't feel like you're pick okay,

926
00:51:01,800 --> 00:51:05,800
Speaker 1: And is Spotify for at one point early adopters in

927
00:51:05,960 --> 00:51:09,200
Speaker 1: hardcore music fans and as Steve mentioned, you know all

928
00:51:09,280 --> 00:51:11,480
Speaker 1: as we sit here, he didn't say that hip hop

929
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:14,759
Speaker 1: was strong there, but a lot of other genres are

930
00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:18,960
Speaker 1: much stronger on Amazon. That's an interesting question. Is it

931
00:51:19,040 --> 00:51:22,160
Speaker 1: a self selecting slice of the populace? It is a

932
00:51:22,520 --> 00:51:26,320
Speaker 1: is it a better representation of the populace. I don't

933
00:51:26,400 --> 00:51:29,239
Speaker 1: really know, but I do know we are going to

934
00:51:29,360 --> 00:51:32,880
Speaker 1: an era where all your music will be voice controlled

935
00:51:33,640 --> 00:51:36,240
Speaker 1: and they are the leaders on this now The interesting

936
00:51:36,320 --> 00:51:39,000
Speaker 1: thing is they do not have a closed door policy

937
00:51:39,040 --> 00:51:42,680
Speaker 1: like Apple. If you have an Echo, you can make

938
00:51:42,760 --> 00:51:47,560
Speaker 1: Spotify the default service. It doesn't have to be Amazon Music, okay,

939
00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:50,520
Speaker 1: And they allow Sonos to bake in the Alexa chip

940
00:51:50,960 --> 00:51:55,360
Speaker 1: into their one product. I mean that's the son has

941
00:51:55,400 --> 00:51:59,839
Speaker 1: a speaker there, they have they have a speaker right,

942
00:52:00,040 --> 00:52:04,719
Speaker 1: and Apples coming out with their speaker Apple speakers here,

943
00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:08,640
Speaker 1: but it does not work with any other music format

944
00:52:09,040 --> 00:52:14,600
Speaker 1: other than Apple Music. Now. Uh so nos wants to

945
00:52:14,640 --> 00:52:17,840
Speaker 1: be flatform independent, and they will also get to the

946
00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:21,080
Speaker 1: point where they'll speak with Apple Music, but the services don't.

947
00:52:21,560 --> 00:52:25,239
Speaker 1: I mean, it ultimately comes down to who's got the

948
00:52:25,239 --> 00:52:27,279
Speaker 1: most stuff. We get an email every Friday if you

949
00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:30,680
Speaker 1: have an Alexa talking about all the new things that

950
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:35,239
Speaker 1: you can say or ask ask Alexa. Whereas I don't

951
00:52:35,320 --> 00:52:38,440
Speaker 1: use Syria on my phone. Do you use Siri? I

952
00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:40,839
Speaker 1: have by have friends that use it when you when

953
00:52:40,840 --> 00:52:43,640
Speaker 1: they're driving. Right, it's just too inaccurate. I mean, I

954
00:52:43,680 --> 00:52:46,680
Speaker 1: don't want to retype every email. And everyone who's got

955
00:52:46,719 --> 00:52:51,200
Speaker 1: a home pod says the same thing. There's been a

956
00:52:51,239 --> 00:52:54,120
Speaker 1: lot of reviews of the home Pod. The initial reviews

957
00:52:54,120 --> 00:52:56,720
Speaker 1: of the home pod said it was the best device.

958
00:52:57,239 --> 00:53:00,000
Speaker 1: Then there were issues of weather in terms of audio quality.

959
00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:03,960
Speaker 1: Then there were issues of what was the test set up,

960
00:53:03,960 --> 00:53:06,040
Speaker 1: and a lot of people read other tests where they

961
00:53:06,040 --> 00:53:11,200
Speaker 1: said the Sons product, which is significantly cheaper, UH, sounded better.

962
00:53:11,760 --> 00:53:14,399
Speaker 1: And I don't think that, you know, none of these

963
00:53:14,440 --> 00:53:18,920
Speaker 1: devices sound so good. It's not like a BMW Zeppelin

964
00:53:19,040 --> 00:53:21,480
Speaker 1: or anything. No one's gonna pay that price. I think

965
00:53:21,520 --> 00:53:24,160
Speaker 1: Apple has missed the market here. I always go back

966
00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:27,480
Speaker 1: to the UH, the example of the nineties when a

967
00:53:27,680 --> 00:53:30,520
Speaker 1: well was burgeoning. Microsoft said they were gonna have a

968
00:53:30,560 --> 00:53:33,520
Speaker 1: new product call the MSN network, and everyone said, oh,

969
00:53:33,560 --> 00:53:35,960
Speaker 1: it's gonna come kill a O L didn't at all.

970
00:53:36,760 --> 00:53:39,520
Speaker 1: So Apple where it's been late to the market, certainly

971
00:53:39,520 --> 00:53:42,560
Speaker 1: with products that are not significantly better, also at a

972
00:53:42,640 --> 00:53:48,360
Speaker 1: higher price, they're nonstarters. Well, I don't think you know,

973
00:53:48,400 --> 00:53:50,319
Speaker 1: you talked about who would buy Spotify. I don't think

974
00:53:50,360 --> 00:53:53,239
Speaker 1: Apple will ever will because because I don't think, I

975
00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:56,560
Speaker 1: don't think, and I trust certainly in Europel. I also

976
00:53:56,680 --> 00:53:59,120
Speaker 1: think that you know, in light of you know how

977
00:53:59,160 --> 00:54:03,439
Speaker 1: they operate. You know, Spotify operates where everyone has can

978
00:54:03,840 --> 00:54:08,040
Speaker 1: can access Spotify, So nos controller, all of those other things.

979
00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:10,640
Speaker 1: If Apple gets to the point where they buy Spotify

980
00:54:10,719 --> 00:54:14,200
Speaker 1: and try and mold you know, blend it in with

981
00:54:14,280 --> 00:54:18,520
Speaker 1: and folded into Apple Music, They're gonna have subscribers. But

982
00:54:18,960 --> 00:54:21,640
Speaker 1: because the way they operate, where it's like, you know,

983
00:54:21,719 --> 00:54:25,200
Speaker 1: everything has to be through Apple, it would hurt them,

984
00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:27,279
Speaker 1: I think. I don't think they get the benefit of

985
00:54:27,280 --> 00:54:30,760
Speaker 1: it the same way. I'm not exactly sure where you're going,

986
00:54:30,880 --> 00:54:34,480
Speaker 1: But at this point in time, if a pre existing

987
00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:37,080
Speaker 1: service were to buy Spotify, it would be less for

988
00:54:37,160 --> 00:54:40,520
Speaker 1: technology and more for the raw subscribers. Would it would

989
00:54:40,520 --> 00:54:44,640
Speaker 1: be strictly for the subscribers, you know. Um, but let's

990
00:54:44,640 --> 00:54:48,640
Speaker 1: go back to Santa Barbara for a second. Um do

991
00:54:48,680 --> 00:54:56,120
Speaker 1: you think that, um that Real Networks? I mean I

992
00:54:56,320 --> 00:55:00,479
Speaker 1: use Neil Real Networks sometimes because I'm have a PC,

993
00:55:00,719 --> 00:55:06,400
Speaker 1: a desktop PC, but everything else I have as Apple. Um.

994
00:55:06,440 --> 00:55:09,080
Speaker 1: I don't know where that's going. Like, what what is

995
00:55:09,160 --> 00:55:11,520
Speaker 1: the for those people who have not listened to Rob

996
00:55:11,520 --> 00:55:16,040
Speaker 1: Glazer's podcast? Uh, you know, yes, he admits in the

997
00:55:16,120 --> 00:55:20,960
Speaker 1: late nineties, Uh, real Player was the default player on

998
00:55:21,120 --> 00:55:26,239
Speaker 1: audio and video for your desktop computer. They were ultimately

999
00:55:26,360 --> 00:55:31,520
Speaker 1: undercut by Microsoft and Apple and ultimately Adobe et cetera

1000
00:55:31,680 --> 00:55:35,239
Speaker 1: now and we're going to a new generation. But he

1001
00:55:35,320 --> 00:55:38,000
Speaker 1: did say they have a very strong presence in China

1002
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:41,960
Speaker 1: and they do have other products. Okay, So to sit

1003
00:55:42,040 --> 00:55:46,200
Speaker 1: here and evaluate the value and the road map of

1004
00:55:46,320 --> 00:55:49,520
Speaker 1: real networks, I don't think I'm qualified without having Robb

1005
00:55:49,640 --> 00:55:52,960
Speaker 1: here to literally say every product, which I knew you

1006
00:55:52,960 --> 00:55:56,319
Speaker 1: were gonna say, which is why I'm gonna let's talk

1007
00:55:56,360 --> 00:55:58,920
Speaker 1: about China. Okay. I knew you were gonna talk. I

1008
00:55:58,960 --> 00:56:01,160
Speaker 1: knew you were going to mention and I actually sent

1009
00:56:01,200 --> 00:56:06,040
Speaker 1: you an email today about the biggest app being downloaded

1010
00:56:06,040 --> 00:56:09,040
Speaker 1: off the app store form, which is a music driven

1011
00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:13,000
Speaker 1: app called TikTok is that what it's called. And that's China,

1012
00:56:13,160 --> 00:56:16,040
Speaker 1: and and it's it's got more downloads off the App

1013
00:56:16,040 --> 00:56:19,560
Speaker 1: Store than any other app. And it's a music based app,

1014
00:56:19,719 --> 00:56:23,040
Speaker 1: music and video based app. And that's the company that

1015
00:56:23,080 --> 00:56:26,279
Speaker 1: owns that is the same company that bought Musically And

1016
00:56:26,360 --> 00:56:29,919
Speaker 1: so are we all just pretending right now that they're

1017
00:56:29,960 --> 00:56:32,200
Speaker 1: all gonna be this dominant, But you know this one's

1018
00:56:32,200 --> 00:56:34,440
Speaker 1: gonna be dominant in Amazon is gonna be dominant, and

1019
00:56:34,480 --> 00:56:36,960
Speaker 1: then someone from China is just gonna come in and

1020
00:56:37,080 --> 00:56:39,719
Speaker 1: just just gonna be this tidal wave, excuse the pun,

1021
00:56:40,440 --> 00:56:42,960
Speaker 1: that's gonna just take it all over at some point.

1022
00:56:43,560 --> 00:56:45,680
Speaker 1: This is a much larger issue. You know, you have

1023
00:56:45,800 --> 00:56:50,400
Speaker 1: the benefit of living in Canada, but we have turmoil

1024
00:56:50,440 --> 00:56:53,080
Speaker 1: in the United States. And I was watching Bill Maher

1025
00:56:53,239 --> 00:56:57,160
Speaker 1: show on HBO last night and they were discussing the

1026
00:56:57,200 --> 00:57:00,840
Speaker 1: fact that Germany is the most respect acted country in

1027
00:57:00,840 --> 00:57:04,279
Speaker 1: the world right now. We can argue about that, but

1028
00:57:04,400 --> 00:57:06,880
Speaker 1: what do we know about China. China makes all our products.

1029
00:57:07,040 --> 00:57:09,400
Speaker 1: If you've got an Apple, aptops made in China, maybe

1030
00:57:09,400 --> 00:57:13,680
Speaker 1: made in Taiwan. Is most of the clothes you're wearing.

1031
00:57:13,719 --> 00:57:20,360
Speaker 1: And they have a vast population. And if you look

1032
00:57:20,400 --> 00:57:22,840
Speaker 1: at what's going on and the days of dominance in

1033
00:57:22,880 --> 00:57:26,720
Speaker 1: the United States seem to be in the rear view mirror, okay,

1034
00:57:26,840 --> 00:57:32,200
Speaker 1: and we don't attack the underlying problems. Yes, we have

1035
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:36,440
Speaker 1: innovation in Silicon Valley and it's about intellectual property. By

1036
00:57:36,480 --> 00:57:39,200
Speaker 1: the same token, we have visa issues where we don't

1037
00:57:39,240 --> 00:57:42,040
Speaker 1: allow foreign engineers to come here and live such that

1038
00:57:42,200 --> 00:57:46,959
Speaker 1: India is becoming a hotbed of technology. Uh, innovation. This

1039
00:57:47,040 --> 00:57:51,320
Speaker 1: is dangerous stuff to talk about in America, especially since

1040
00:57:51,360 --> 00:57:54,000
Speaker 1: the culture changed. Are you saying we can't talk about

1041
00:57:54,000 --> 00:57:56,480
Speaker 1: this today. No no, no, no no, we can definitely

1042
00:57:56,520 --> 00:58:01,120
Speaker 1: talk No. Nine with the Iranian says bom bomb I ran.

1043
00:58:01,480 --> 00:58:04,400
Speaker 1: Now it's like the sixties, but it's flipped. Are you

1044
00:58:04,480 --> 00:58:07,520
Speaker 1: with us or you against us? So we have a

1045
00:58:07,560 --> 00:58:12,560
Speaker 1: great divide in America economically and people wanting to jet

1046
00:58:12,680 --> 00:58:16,320
Speaker 1: back to a past that doesn't exist, whereas China is

1047
00:58:16,360 --> 00:58:19,440
Speaker 1: all about pushing the envelope of the future. So the

1048
00:58:19,520 --> 00:58:24,080
Speaker 1: question is is they're gonna be a music service coming

1049
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:26,080
Speaker 1: in there is? I mean this did come up. John

1050
00:58:26,120 --> 00:58:27,880
Speaker 1: Boil did bring this up. But if you've been following

1051
00:58:28,240 --> 00:58:31,600
Speaker 1: ten Cent, which is the biggest music service, ten percent

1052
00:58:31,720 --> 00:58:36,000
Speaker 1: of off Spotify, they that is on the verge of

1053
00:58:36,040 --> 00:58:41,040
Speaker 1: going public and evaluation approximately the same as Spotify. That

1054
00:58:41,240 --> 00:58:44,840
Speaker 1: is something to watch for. That is not a short

1055
00:58:45,000 --> 00:58:50,200
Speaker 1: term thing. It's like Ali Baba versus Amazon. Okay, Ali

1056
00:58:50,280 --> 00:58:54,160
Speaker 1: Baba when public, Ali Baba is much vaster than Amazon,

1057
00:58:54,200 --> 00:58:57,520
Speaker 1: although Amazon makes a very significant proportion of their profits

1058
00:58:57,800 --> 00:59:00,400
Speaker 1: from their web services division, which is not something they're

1059
00:59:00,440 --> 00:59:03,680
Speaker 1: selling to the you know, not something the average cloud

1060
00:59:03,760 --> 00:59:08,680
Speaker 1: stories and uh, this is going to play out. I

1061
00:59:08,680 --> 00:59:13,760
Speaker 1: mean you have to ask Americans Okay, are you willing

1062
00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:19,439
Speaker 1: to pay more for a flat screen? Okay, so at

1063
00:59:19,480 --> 00:59:22,440
Speaker 1: this point in time, because if terrorists they're talking ten

1064
00:59:22,560 --> 00:59:25,880
Speaker 1: or fifteen dollars to fIF no hanging here, hanging fifty

1065
00:59:25,920 --> 00:59:30,840
Speaker 1: dollars more for American I'm just talking in general the

1066
00:59:30,880 --> 00:59:36,280
Speaker 1: American mentality, which then impacts Spotify to the point being,

1067
00:59:36,360 --> 00:59:39,520
Speaker 1: are we going to play for the future. It is

1068
00:59:39,560 --> 00:59:45,360
Speaker 1: a globally economy, and therefore if we pull back from

1069
00:59:45,360 --> 00:59:47,919
Speaker 1: a global economy, it's only going to hurt us. One

1070
00:59:47,920 --> 00:59:50,880
Speaker 1: of the benefits of Spotify and one of the reasons

1071
00:59:50,920 --> 00:59:53,120
Speaker 1: why they've been in a negative position all these years,

1072
00:59:53,120 --> 00:59:55,360
Speaker 1: and Daniel like has told me, is they're so busy

1073
00:59:55,360 --> 00:59:59,480
Speaker 1: investing around the world at this point in time. China

1074
00:59:59,840 --> 01:00:03,560
Speaker 1: is still dealing with piracy. Okay, for a long time.

1075
01:00:03,640 --> 01:00:06,120
Speaker 1: China is the new performance market. We're all gonna go

1076
01:00:06,160 --> 01:00:10,000
Speaker 1: to China. Then the government seemed to crack down on

1077
01:00:10,320 --> 01:00:13,680
Speaker 1: what could be sung and needing playlists in advance, and

1078
01:00:13,760 --> 01:00:16,840
Speaker 1: people kind of backed off from that, just like investment

1079
01:00:16,920 --> 01:00:19,920
Speaker 1: from China. Okay, they were they were gonna be sales

1080
01:00:19,920 --> 01:00:23,600
Speaker 1: of movie theaters. Now China said no. So China maybe

1081
01:00:23,640 --> 01:00:28,160
Speaker 1: a self contained market with a vast population. But whether

1082
01:00:28,320 --> 01:00:31,800
Speaker 1: ten cents or Ali Baba expand to the rest of

1083
01:00:31,880 --> 01:00:35,360
Speaker 1: the world, I'm not sure that's going to happen. Well,

1084
01:00:35,840 --> 01:00:38,600
Speaker 1: and remember no I said it earlier while you were talking.

1085
01:00:38,640 --> 01:00:41,800
Speaker 1: But you know, Spotify is a Swedish company. It's not

1086
01:00:41,840 --> 01:00:46,440
Speaker 1: an American company. So you want to talk about um,

1087
01:00:46,480 --> 01:00:50,920
Speaker 1: you know, American companies and and you know, you know what,

1088
01:00:51,080 --> 01:00:55,960
Speaker 1: what's happening in America that's not an American company. And

1089
01:00:56,120 --> 01:00:57,800
Speaker 1: then wait a second. It was in a lot of

1090
01:00:57,800 --> 01:01:00,400
Speaker 1: other markets before it came into the United Eights. Like

1091
01:01:00,440 --> 01:01:03,320
Speaker 1: I was dealing with Spotify in the UK and in

1092
01:01:03,400 --> 01:01:05,800
Speaker 1: Europe with clients before it was even launched in the

1093
01:01:05,840 --> 01:01:08,480
Speaker 1: United stuff. But they listed in on the stock market

1094
01:01:08,480 --> 01:01:12,280
Speaker 1: in New York. So yes, there's still the majority of

1095
01:01:12,280 --> 01:01:15,080
Speaker 1: technological innovation in the United States, but it's not the

1096
01:01:15,160 --> 01:01:18,480
Speaker 1: only place, right So back to Glacier. Maybe he knows

1097
01:01:18,520 --> 01:01:22,680
Speaker 1: something we don't know. Maybe there's something going on where

1098
01:01:22,680 --> 01:01:25,080
Speaker 1: but China. You know, this is like you talked to

1099
01:01:25,120 --> 01:01:28,360
Speaker 1: certain acts. It is not glamorous to go to a

1100
01:01:28,440 --> 01:01:32,400
Speaker 1: lot of these countries, but it pays huge economic dividends. Yeah,

1101
01:01:32,480 --> 01:01:34,640
Speaker 1: I had a client. I had a client go to China.

1102
01:01:34,920 --> 01:01:37,520
Speaker 1: He was fortunate because they asked for lyrics and he did.

1103
01:01:37,600 --> 01:01:41,560
Speaker 1: He did instrumental music, so he had no issues with lyrics. Um.

1104
01:01:41,600 --> 01:01:43,160
Speaker 1: And he had a great time and he said the

1105
01:01:43,160 --> 01:01:48,160
Speaker 1: audiences were amazing, like amazing um. And you know, but

1106
01:01:48,200 --> 01:01:50,480
Speaker 1: you know, forgetting China, which is a market onto itself,

1107
01:01:50,640 --> 01:01:54,960
Speaker 1: just going to Europe, Okay, it's costly South America and

1108
01:01:55,000 --> 01:01:57,760
Speaker 1: you have to go multiple times to establish a beach

1109
01:01:57,800 --> 01:02:01,560
Speaker 1: chat it you can say it's costly, Okay. The difference

1110
01:02:01,640 --> 01:02:06,160
Speaker 1: between you know, okay, let's look at geography. You live

1111
01:02:06,200 --> 01:02:08,360
Speaker 1: in New York or Toronto where I live on the

1112
01:02:08,400 --> 01:02:11,560
Speaker 1: East Coast. You know, it's takes almost as long to

1113
01:02:11,680 --> 01:02:15,520
Speaker 1: fly to l A as it does to London. Yes, okay,

1114
01:02:15,560 --> 01:02:20,640
Speaker 1: so once you're there, then touring through Europe, you can

1115
01:02:20,640 --> 01:02:23,360
Speaker 1: go to a lot of countries the same as you

1116
01:02:23,400 --> 01:02:27,440
Speaker 1: can tour America. And so the the initial cost is

1117
01:02:27,480 --> 01:02:32,080
Speaker 1: the flight, but after that the concert. You know, it's

1118
01:02:32,120 --> 01:02:34,400
Speaker 1: it's not cheaper, it's I wouldn't say it's cheaper, but

1119
01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:37,880
Speaker 1: you're also earning euros as opposed to you know, you

1120
01:02:37,880 --> 01:02:40,000
Speaker 1: you're more familiar with this. I certainly know talking to

1121
01:02:40,080 --> 01:02:43,480
Speaker 1: major acts that they talk about the cost relative to

1122
01:02:43,720 --> 01:02:46,600
Speaker 1: income that you can take home is less, but that's

1123
01:02:46,840 --> 01:02:50,000
Speaker 1: also there's a human cost. The act actually has to

1124
01:02:50,040 --> 01:02:53,680
Speaker 1: go there, Okay, and especially when you're an established act

1125
01:02:53,720 --> 01:02:58,800
Speaker 1: in America, we're already too busy with your recording, live dates, etcetera.

1126
01:02:59,040 --> 01:03:03,520
Speaker 1: To go develop these markets where you're essentially nobody is.

1127
01:03:03,560 --> 01:03:06,680
Speaker 1: Although now because of these worldwide services you can have

1128
01:03:06,720 --> 01:03:10,040
Speaker 1: a greater chance, but you're really building from a small base.

1129
01:03:10,440 --> 01:03:12,320
Speaker 1: A lot of them don't want to do it well,

1130
01:03:12,320 --> 01:03:15,040
Speaker 1: but you're always building from a small base. And the

1131
01:03:15,080 --> 01:03:17,080
Speaker 1: fact is is what happens is is a lot of

1132
01:03:17,080 --> 01:03:19,040
Speaker 1: them don't want to do it because they're fucking lazy.

1133
01:03:19,320 --> 01:03:22,280
Speaker 1: And here's what happens is they forgot that if you

1134
01:03:22,320 --> 01:03:25,760
Speaker 1: were a band from upstate New York, you worked Rochester

1135
01:03:25,960 --> 01:03:29,800
Speaker 1: and Buffalo and Albany and in those places, and then

1136
01:03:29,840 --> 01:03:32,600
Speaker 1: you gradually spread your base out and then you were

1137
01:03:32,600 --> 01:03:35,240
Speaker 1: a Northeast band, and then you were a Northeast and

1138
01:03:35,280 --> 01:03:37,960
Speaker 1: a Southeast band, and then you moved into the Midwest,

1139
01:03:37,960 --> 01:03:40,640
Speaker 1: and gradually you work your way across the country. And

1140
01:03:40,680 --> 01:03:42,800
Speaker 1: if you did it right, it took you a certain

1141
01:03:42,840 --> 01:03:45,840
Speaker 1: amount of time to get there. It's no different than

1142
01:03:46,560 --> 01:03:49,360
Speaker 1: the manager. We're not sitting here the act. You have

1143
01:03:49,400 --> 01:03:51,480
Speaker 1: to convince the act. I mean, I I know, And

1144
01:03:51,560 --> 01:03:53,840
Speaker 1: let me tell you something. I had plenty of acts

1145
01:03:53,840 --> 01:03:59,919
Speaker 1: that said they'd rather be in Brussels then in cans

1146
01:04:00,040 --> 01:04:04,040
Speaker 1: A city. And anybody who's gone to Europe and spend

1147
01:04:04,160 --> 01:04:06,480
Speaker 1: time in some of the most beautiful places in the

1148
01:04:06,520 --> 01:04:11,280
Speaker 1: world and culture and people and how how people, how

1149
01:04:11,320 --> 01:04:14,520
Speaker 1: people love music there and it's way different than sort

1150
01:04:14,520 --> 01:04:18,520
Speaker 1: of this. It's it's not necessarily the glam thing. But

1151
01:04:19,120 --> 01:04:21,800
Speaker 1: when you go to those places and you experience that

1152
01:04:21,920 --> 01:04:24,640
Speaker 1: kind of life, at some point you say, well, I'd

1153
01:04:24,720 --> 01:04:27,760
Speaker 1: much rather build my audience in Europe than than go

1154
01:04:27,920 --> 01:04:30,920
Speaker 1: through certain parts of Well you're not. You're although you're

1155
01:04:30,920 --> 01:04:33,400
Speaker 1: a dual passport holder holder, you're living in Toronto with

1156
01:04:33,440 --> 01:04:40,680
Speaker 1: a much more worldwide view. You're listening to my conversation

1157
01:04:40,760 --> 01:04:44,680
Speaker 1: with Jake Gold, manager The Tragically Him and former judge

1158
01:04:44,680 --> 01:04:48,360
Speaker 1: on Canadian Idol, recorded live in the tune in studios

1159
01:04:48,400 --> 01:04:53,160
Speaker 1: in Venice, California. I hope you're enjoying listening to this

1160
01:04:53,200 --> 01:04:55,800
Speaker 1: episode of the Bob Left Sets podcast. If you want

1161
01:04:55,800 --> 01:04:58,160
Speaker 1: to hear sound bites, you check out videos and photos

1162
01:04:58,200 --> 01:05:01,560
Speaker 1: of our guests go to at tune in on Twitter, Facebook,

1163
01:05:01,560 --> 01:05:05,280
Speaker 1: and Instagram. Now more of Jake Gold as we discussed

1164
01:05:05,280 --> 01:05:10,800
Speaker 1: the music industry today on the Bob Left Sets podcast. Okay,

1165
01:05:10,840 --> 01:05:12,360
Speaker 1: before we get to the end, any more things you

1166
01:05:12,400 --> 01:05:18,919
Speaker 1: want to bring up about Santa Barbara? Well, um, did

1167
01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:22,160
Speaker 1: you did you feel that you got to ask all

1168
01:05:22,240 --> 01:05:25,480
Speaker 1: the questions that you wanted to evolved a lot of

1169
01:05:25,480 --> 01:05:28,800
Speaker 1: these people. These interviews were very lengthy, but I still

1170
01:05:28,880 --> 01:05:31,120
Speaker 1: had questions, not because I was afraid to ask him,

1171
01:05:31,160 --> 01:05:34,040
Speaker 1: but just because you can't ask everybody everything. It's very important.

1172
01:05:34,520 --> 01:05:36,480
Speaker 1: Give me give me a question for each of them

1173
01:05:36,480 --> 01:05:38,120
Speaker 1: that you oh god, I mean, I don't want to

1174
01:05:38,120 --> 01:05:40,280
Speaker 1: go through each of them, but give me give me

1175
01:05:40,320 --> 01:05:43,200
Speaker 1: a couple that you felt. I mean, I really don't,

1176
01:05:43,240 --> 01:05:44,960
Speaker 1: just because I don't want to tax my brain at

1177
01:05:44,960 --> 01:05:47,200
Speaker 1: this particular point, because I don't think the information will

1178
01:05:47,240 --> 01:05:50,000
Speaker 1: be that relevant when you get down deep into the

1179
01:05:50,040 --> 01:05:51,840
Speaker 1: rabbit hole. The most of the questions I wanted to

1180
01:05:51,920 --> 01:05:55,600
Speaker 1: ask these people were more technical questions. I don't mean

1181
01:05:55,640 --> 01:06:00,439
Speaker 1: literally technology, but they're enterprises. How do things work? They

1182
01:06:00,480 --> 01:06:03,120
Speaker 1: talk and you get stimulated and go, okay, well, if

1183
01:06:03,120 --> 01:06:05,280
Speaker 1: I'm in this situation, what about this and one of

1184
01:06:05,040 --> 01:06:07,800
Speaker 1: the number as opposed to the essence. I believe I

1185
01:06:07,840 --> 01:06:10,160
Speaker 1: got to the essence of all these people. I think

1186
01:06:10,200 --> 01:06:12,400
Speaker 1: you got to the essence of all the people. I'll

1187
01:06:12,400 --> 01:06:15,960
Speaker 1: tell you what I missed. Okay, what I missed is

1188
01:06:16,840 --> 01:06:21,440
Speaker 1: um and less less the Steve and Rob, but more Daniel,

1189
01:06:21,640 --> 01:06:28,960
Speaker 1: Ethiopia and Troy is the now. It's like, you know, Ethiopia,

1190
01:06:29,040 --> 01:06:33,040
Speaker 1: if you're gonna launch an act today, what's your what

1191
01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:34,560
Speaker 1: do you do? How do you roll it out? What

1192
01:06:34,600 --> 01:06:36,520
Speaker 1: do you do? Saying with Daniel, what are you looking for?

1193
01:06:36,640 --> 01:06:38,440
Speaker 1: He touched on it here and there what we try

1194
01:06:38,480 --> 01:06:41,280
Speaker 1: to build with these players, But there wasn't any kind

1195
01:06:41,360 --> 01:06:44,960
Speaker 1: of if I'm gonna launch an act today, these are

1196
01:06:45,000 --> 01:06:47,080
Speaker 1: the steps we take. These are the people on the

1197
01:06:47,080 --> 01:06:50,520
Speaker 1: team that I think are the most important. UM questions

1198
01:06:50,520 --> 01:06:53,800
Speaker 1: like how important is pressed these days? Is it that important?

1199
01:06:53,800 --> 01:06:56,120
Speaker 1: Are the blogs more important than the press? Are blogs?

1200
01:06:56,360 --> 01:06:58,280
Speaker 1: You know? I read a piece the other day that said,

1201
01:06:58,560 --> 01:07:01,880
Speaker 1: you know, blogs are less important than ever because the

1202
01:07:01,920 --> 01:07:05,600
Speaker 1: playlists are the new blogs. Um, those are the kind

1203
01:07:05,640 --> 01:07:08,000
Speaker 1: of things I think all those are excellent questions. I

1204
01:07:08,000 --> 01:07:11,040
Speaker 1: wanted I wanted to learn those kinds of things and

1205
01:07:11,040 --> 01:07:13,600
Speaker 1: then when it came time to ask the questions, and

1206
01:07:13,640 --> 01:07:15,840
Speaker 1: you know, I asked a question to every single one

1207
01:07:15,840 --> 01:07:20,320
Speaker 1: of them because I'm definitely not shy um uh. When

1208
01:07:20,360 --> 01:07:22,240
Speaker 1: I was asking those questions, there was I could have

1209
01:07:22,280 --> 01:07:25,480
Speaker 1: sat there and asked them five more questions, um. But

1210
01:07:25,560 --> 01:07:29,560
Speaker 1: nobody asked those questions in the room. Nobody asked like, well,

1211
01:07:29,720 --> 01:07:31,720
Speaker 1: how are you going to roll an act out today?

1212
01:07:31,960 --> 01:07:35,400
Speaker 1: When I asked Ethiopia about would you rather have an

1213
01:07:35,400 --> 01:07:39,360
Speaker 1: act like um, a logic that's already something happening, or

1214
01:07:39,440 --> 01:07:43,040
Speaker 1: a chance to rapper then starting from scratch, she didn't

1215
01:07:43,120 --> 01:07:46,320
Speaker 1: really give me a good answer. I think she said, well,

1216
01:07:46,360 --> 01:07:47,960
Speaker 1: it would be good to have both like it was.

1217
01:07:48,040 --> 01:07:51,720
Speaker 1: That also usually depends on economics. You know, sometimes the

1218
01:07:51,760 --> 01:07:55,800
Speaker 1: acts already established, they want deals. But on the side,

1219
01:07:55,800 --> 01:07:57,960
Speaker 1: when I was talking to Daniel about a couple of

1220
01:07:58,000 --> 01:08:01,560
Speaker 1: acts out there that we're indie that we're now being

1221
01:08:01,600 --> 01:08:03,440
Speaker 1: trying to be signed, he mentioned me, he goes, now

1222
01:08:03,480 --> 01:08:05,440
Speaker 1: there's bidding wars for those acts, and he goes and

1223
01:08:05,480 --> 01:08:07,320
Speaker 1: some of them have gone up to like six and

1224
01:08:07,440 --> 01:08:10,640
Speaker 1: eight and ten million and fifteen million dollar deals. Now

1225
01:08:10,840 --> 01:08:14,400
Speaker 1: he said, the bidding wars are back in again because

1226
01:08:14,480 --> 01:08:17,280
Speaker 1: of the ability for artists to do it on their

1227
01:08:17,320 --> 01:08:21,519
Speaker 1: own now, which is a really interesting dynamic, very much so.

1228
01:08:22,280 --> 01:08:25,280
Speaker 1: But the other thing about it is it is harder

1229
01:08:25,320 --> 01:08:28,760
Speaker 1: to break an act than ever. So Daniel touched upon

1230
01:08:28,840 --> 01:08:32,120
Speaker 1: this in his presentation. We've discussed it previously. If the

1231
01:08:32,320 --> 01:08:35,559
Speaker 1: act delivers a record without a hit, and I don't

1232
01:08:35,600 --> 01:08:37,920
Speaker 1: mean a hit that's necessarily something's gonna run up the

1233
01:08:37,960 --> 01:08:41,120
Speaker 1: top forty chart, but something that's reacting in the marketplace.

1234
01:08:41,520 --> 01:08:43,640
Speaker 1: If they don't give him something to work with, he

1235
01:08:43,720 --> 01:08:46,160
Speaker 1: sends them back to the studio, and if it gets

1236
01:08:46,240 --> 01:08:48,120
Speaker 1: to the point where the act is frustrated, he says,

1237
01:08:48,200 --> 01:08:51,679
Speaker 1: you can walk. I'll release you because it's so much

1238
01:08:51,720 --> 01:08:55,080
Speaker 1: effort on behalf of my team that I cannot work

1239
01:08:55,120 --> 01:08:58,040
Speaker 1: with something that won't make it right. So everyone needs

1240
01:08:58,720 --> 01:09:04,280
Speaker 1: needs that one track, that um is a traveler that

1241
01:09:04,520 --> 01:09:08,000
Speaker 1: travels the world on their behalf without them and that.

1242
01:09:08,160 --> 01:09:10,920
Speaker 1: But it hasn't that always been the case, hasn't it been? Yeah,

1243
01:09:10,960 --> 01:09:14,160
Speaker 1: that band is one hit away from being huge, wasn't

1244
01:09:14,200 --> 01:09:17,880
Speaker 1: That wasn't the used to in the eighties and the nineties,

1245
01:09:18,520 --> 01:09:22,879
Speaker 1: in the seventies, you know, But the problem is before

1246
01:09:22,960 --> 01:09:26,679
Speaker 1: they had that one track. They were somewhere now before

1247
01:09:26,680 --> 01:09:29,320
Speaker 1: that one track, they're kind of nowhere, yes and no,

1248
01:09:29,680 --> 01:09:32,280
Speaker 1: yes and no. I I think nowhere is a is

1249
01:09:32,320 --> 01:09:35,000
Speaker 1: a relative term. You know, you live in Canada. There's

1250
01:09:35,000 --> 01:09:37,920
Speaker 1: a lot of benefits of Canada. Less population makes it

1251
01:09:37,920 --> 01:09:40,160
Speaker 1: easier to spread than the thing you have to We

1252
01:09:40,200 --> 01:09:43,720
Speaker 1: have a huge country. No I'm talking about in terms

1253
01:09:43,720 --> 01:09:46,320
Speaker 1: of mind share. You have government help in the radio

1254
01:09:46,479 --> 01:09:50,080
Speaker 1: and production whatever. That gives a leg of some size up,

1255
01:09:50,439 --> 01:09:52,679
Speaker 1: whereas in the country of three hundred million in America,

1256
01:09:52,800 --> 01:09:55,519
Speaker 1: we have none of that government help. Radio is harder

1257
01:09:55,560 --> 01:09:58,120
Speaker 1: than ever to get on. It is very hard to

1258
01:09:58,160 --> 01:10:00,479
Speaker 1: get started. It's really hard to get on the radio,

1259
01:10:00,479 --> 01:10:02,960
Speaker 1: and Canada these days as hard as anything. And they're

1260
01:10:03,000 --> 01:10:05,200
Speaker 1: all looking to see how you're doing on the streaming

1261
01:10:05,240 --> 01:10:08,680
Speaker 1: services before they take a shot. So now it's like

1262
01:10:08,680 --> 01:10:11,519
Speaker 1: like they're set. You've said it many times where their

1263
01:10:11,560 --> 01:10:14,880
Speaker 1: second Now they're looking at the streaming services because that's

1264
01:10:14,880 --> 01:10:16,920
Speaker 1: their new call out research. They don't need to do

1265
01:10:17,000 --> 01:10:19,760
Speaker 1: call a research anymore, you know, And Chris Ruth said

1266
01:10:19,760 --> 01:10:22,880
Speaker 1: this in the Logic podcast. You know, the Logic was

1267
01:10:22,960 --> 01:10:27,120
Speaker 1: on the Grammy Awards and there was no bounce on

1268
01:10:27,160 --> 01:10:30,879
Speaker 1: streaming services, the audiences on streaming, and it would behoove

1269
01:10:31,120 --> 01:10:33,640
Speaker 1: radio to get closer in time. That's one of the

1270
01:10:33,640 --> 01:10:35,200
Speaker 1: things that's killing it. Who wants to listen to four

1271
01:10:35,200 --> 01:10:37,960
Speaker 1: month old music? I don't think. But that's the other thing.

1272
01:10:38,000 --> 01:10:40,640
Speaker 1: I don't think there would be a bounce on the

1273
01:10:40,720 --> 01:10:44,560
Speaker 1: streaming services after um because most of the people have

1274
01:10:44,600 --> 01:10:47,080
Speaker 1: already heard the songs that used to be. If you

1275
01:10:47,200 --> 01:10:49,439
Speaker 1: play the Grammys, you got a big thing. You've got

1276
01:10:49,439 --> 01:10:53,200
Speaker 1: a sales bounce. But streaming is not the same. And

1277
01:10:53,280 --> 01:10:55,640
Speaker 1: that's a stream is it's a different thing because the

1278
01:10:55,680 --> 01:10:59,200
Speaker 1: stuffs available. So any other topics we haven't covered, I see,

1279
01:10:59,240 --> 01:11:01,599
Speaker 1: I think we're pretty good. I mean, anything you want

1280
01:11:01,600 --> 01:11:03,800
Speaker 1: to talk about that happened there that you felt there

1281
01:11:03,880 --> 01:11:07,040
Speaker 1: was the social aspect that had nothing to do with

1282
01:11:07,120 --> 01:11:10,160
Speaker 1: the speakers, which is, you know, in a world where

1283
01:11:10,320 --> 01:11:14,280
Speaker 1: we can communicate so easily on our devices, people underestimate

1284
01:11:14,640 --> 01:11:18,040
Speaker 1: face to face contact. And one thing I knew describe

1285
01:11:18,200 --> 01:11:22,519
Speaker 1: interviewing these people, a couple of whom I'd only met briefly,

1286
01:11:23,400 --> 01:11:27,160
Speaker 1: and uh that you have a preconception who people are

1287
01:11:27,479 --> 01:11:29,559
Speaker 1: and then you start talking to they're really somebody different.

1288
01:11:30,080 --> 01:11:32,800
Speaker 1: And how many, and I think all of them though

1289
01:11:33,240 --> 01:11:39,479
Speaker 1: was a pleasant surprise. Everybody certainly was was good some

1290
01:11:39,680 --> 01:11:42,040
Speaker 1: of them. You know, as I as I say, you

1291
01:11:42,080 --> 01:11:44,360
Speaker 1: know Rob Glazer, you talked to him for about a

1292
01:11:44,400 --> 01:11:46,839
Speaker 1: minute and a half to say, this is a really

1293
01:11:46,920 --> 01:11:51,240
Speaker 1: smart guy person and you don't talk to Ethiopia along

1294
01:11:51,640 --> 01:11:54,840
Speaker 1: to be in transpire personality. One of the things she said,

1295
01:11:54,840 --> 01:11:56,599
Speaker 1: if you know, we talked about the me too moment

1296
01:11:56,680 --> 01:12:00,320
Speaker 1: shows if a guy you know starts uh pushing the hope,

1297
01:12:00,320 --> 01:12:03,160
Speaker 1: she checks them. And I had to say this, she

1298
01:12:03,200 --> 01:12:05,240
Speaker 1: knows how to be sass. It was funny when she

1299
01:12:05,320 --> 01:12:08,120
Speaker 1: was talking about that time where they're in the hotel

1300
01:12:08,200 --> 01:12:10,080
Speaker 1: room and she started taking all the knives and putting

1301
01:12:10,080 --> 01:12:13,120
Speaker 1: them underneath the pillows just in case, like she's she's

1302
01:12:13,160 --> 01:12:16,719
Speaker 1: a listening to. Really impressive. Thirty eight years old, already

1303
01:12:16,760 --> 01:12:19,960
Speaker 1: been the president of Motown for four years. Um so

1304
01:12:20,000 --> 01:12:22,559
Speaker 1: at thirty four years old being the president of Motown Records,

1305
01:12:22,560 --> 01:12:24,559
Speaker 1: I always wonder where something like that is going now.

1306
01:12:24,600 --> 01:12:27,120
Speaker 1: She very much comes from the creative side. While she

1307
01:12:27,200 --> 01:12:29,519
Speaker 1: was a publisher for a long time, write Jody Gerson

1308
01:12:29,600 --> 01:12:32,560
Speaker 1: came from the creative side. She's now ahead of Universal

1309
01:12:32,680 --> 01:12:36,120
Speaker 1: Music publishing, but you you wonder what the next role

1310
01:12:36,520 --> 01:12:39,360
Speaker 1: is for Ethiopia. You know, they're famous people going back

1311
01:12:39,360 --> 01:12:42,360
Speaker 1: in history. John kalodn Are one of the most famous

1312
01:12:42,360 --> 01:12:45,240
Speaker 1: A and R people, never wanted to be a president.

1313
01:12:45,320 --> 01:12:48,200
Speaker 1: One of his contemporaries, Gary Gersh now works at a

1314
01:12:48,320 --> 01:12:50,920
Speaker 1: G in the promotion game, but he wanted to be president.

1315
01:12:50,920 --> 01:12:54,160
Speaker 1: Became president of Capital Records. So I got into a

1316
01:12:54,200 --> 01:12:57,799
Speaker 1: little bit that with the Ethiopia we didn't really uh

1317
01:12:57,800 --> 01:13:00,519
Speaker 1: plummet too great depths. But you know, what is the

1318
01:13:00,600 --> 01:13:04,880
Speaker 1: upward mobility? Begging the question less about Ethiopia than women

1319
01:13:04,880 --> 01:13:09,640
Speaker 1: in general in that what is the upward mobility of

1320
01:13:09,640 --> 01:13:11,840
Speaker 1: the path for women in the music business which has

1321
01:13:11,880 --> 01:13:16,559
Speaker 1: traditionally been a male dominated business with rough edges. Well,

1322
01:13:16,600 --> 01:13:19,320
Speaker 1: we touched on that the last time, and I don't

1323
01:13:19,320 --> 01:13:20,960
Speaker 1: I don't know if we need to go there again.

1324
01:13:21,320 --> 01:13:23,880
Speaker 1: Um not that I don't want to go there. I

1325
01:13:23,920 --> 01:13:25,920
Speaker 1: just think we already kind of touched on that. And

1326
01:13:25,960 --> 01:13:28,839
Speaker 1: I think, you know, we know that there's big movements

1327
01:13:28,840 --> 01:13:31,880
Speaker 1: in Canada. There's these fifty fifty movements where it's like

1328
01:13:32,240 --> 01:13:37,920
Speaker 1: all boards across across all the different organizations in Canada

1329
01:13:37,960 --> 01:13:42,640
Speaker 1: are being pushed to have women. It is artificial on

1330
01:13:42,680 --> 01:13:46,080
Speaker 1: the surface. But if you go to America to title nine,

1331
01:13:46,640 --> 01:13:50,479
Speaker 1: which is about many things, but primarily in the eye

1332
01:13:50,479 --> 01:13:53,960
Speaker 1: of the public, about sports teams in college. Okay, we

1333
01:13:54,040 --> 01:13:58,400
Speaker 1: have professional women's hockey, we have professional women's basketball. We

1334
01:13:58,520 --> 01:14:01,120
Speaker 1: pay attention all things because the change of the law.

1335
01:14:02,000 --> 01:14:05,080
Speaker 1: So even though people might say, oh, let it be organic,

1336
01:14:05,160 --> 01:14:08,559
Speaker 1: sometimes you need the pressure of the law. You yeah,

1337
01:14:08,600 --> 01:14:11,519
Speaker 1: you need to push well. Um, And remember Bi Billy

1338
01:14:11,640 --> 01:14:14,960
Speaker 1: jen King started in tennis that movie Battle of This

1339
01:14:15,240 --> 01:14:19,240
Speaker 1: of the Sexes. Regardless of the the whole idea of

1340
01:14:19,280 --> 01:14:21,519
Speaker 1: that movie, which was her and Bobby Riggs and that

1341
01:14:21,560 --> 01:14:25,720
Speaker 1: crazy exhibition, the thing about that movie was how she

1342
01:14:25,800 --> 01:14:29,280
Speaker 1: created a w t A and took on That shows

1343
01:14:29,360 --> 01:14:32,479
Speaker 1: the power of the individual. And we see that especially

1344
01:14:32,520 --> 01:14:37,520
Speaker 1: in the arts, but also with Steve Jobs, Elon Musk, Bezos, etcetera.

1345
01:14:38,160 --> 01:14:42,639
Speaker 1: And I'm waiting for that, not only business in business,

1346
01:14:42,640 --> 01:14:45,840
Speaker 1: in music business, but artistically, I'm waiting for someone who's

1347
01:14:45,840 --> 01:14:48,839
Speaker 1: gonna go against the grain, gonna say no as opposed

1348
01:14:48,880 --> 01:14:51,920
Speaker 1: to yes the sponsorship, gonna stand up for their identity,

1349
01:14:52,120 --> 01:14:55,080
Speaker 1: create music that doesn't sound like everybody to say Gaga

1350
01:14:55,160 --> 01:14:59,920
Speaker 1: did that kind of I would say Gaga broke electronics

1351
01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:05,280
Speaker 1: ounds on top forty, but that's already a different era. Okay.

1352
01:15:05,320 --> 01:15:09,160
Speaker 1: So the question becomes, especially now streaming is amped up

1353
01:15:09,720 --> 01:15:14,040
Speaker 1: the importance and popularity of hip hop, what is the

1354
01:15:14,120 --> 01:15:17,360
Speaker 1: new sound? What will it sound like and how will

1355
01:15:17,360 --> 01:15:19,680
Speaker 1: it infiltrate? The other thing which people don't realize with

1356
01:15:19,760 --> 01:15:23,040
Speaker 1: the barrier to entry music so low that the quality

1357
01:15:23,280 --> 01:15:27,040
Speaker 1: has to be increased. So if you are a great

1358
01:15:27,120 --> 01:15:29,960
Speaker 1: lyricist and you're a great player and a bad singer,

1359
01:15:31,240 --> 01:15:33,519
Speaker 1: things are gonna be really tough for you right now.

1360
01:15:33,760 --> 01:15:35,559
Speaker 1: You're gonna have to find some of those things. Well.

1361
01:15:35,760 --> 01:15:38,720
Speaker 1: The barrier to you know, the bearer to success used

1362
01:15:38,720 --> 01:15:41,360
Speaker 1: to be lower. People don't like to hear this. You know,

1363
01:15:42,439 --> 01:15:45,120
Speaker 1: I can't play in the NBA. I'm not tall enough.

1364
01:15:45,200 --> 01:15:48,040
Speaker 1: I accept that. Used to be if you couldn't sing,

1365
01:15:48,080 --> 01:15:49,760
Speaker 1: you had to accept you wouldn't be a singer in

1366
01:15:49,760 --> 01:15:53,040
Speaker 1: the music business. Plenty of plenty of people out there

1367
01:15:53,080 --> 01:15:56,920
Speaker 1: that I wouldn't call them singers that do fairly well well.

1368
01:15:57,080 --> 01:16:00,800
Speaker 1: Most of them, though, broke in a different era. I

1369
01:16:00,800 --> 01:16:03,920
Speaker 1: mean today, I mean this is you know, dicey territory. Okay.

1370
01:16:03,920 --> 01:16:06,639
Speaker 1: One but Bob Dylan, he did make it originally as

1371
01:16:06,680 --> 01:16:09,600
Speaker 1: a writer, but it'd be very hard for him to

1372
01:16:09,720 --> 01:16:12,800
Speaker 1: make it as a singer today. The breakthrough was when

1373
01:16:12,840 --> 01:16:15,160
Speaker 1: they started to play his records on Top forty radio,

1374
01:16:15,400 --> 01:16:20,240
Speaker 1: which was years after he started. Leonard Cohen wins Male

1375
01:16:20,360 --> 01:16:23,679
Speaker 1: Vocalist of the Year at the Juno Awards and says,

1376
01:16:24,000 --> 01:16:26,920
Speaker 1: only in Canada could I win Male Vocalist of the Year.

1377
01:16:27,280 --> 01:16:30,280
Speaker 1: And that kind of says it all. One more thing

1378
01:16:30,320 --> 01:16:32,559
Speaker 1: I want to talk to you about, which was how

1379
01:16:32,600 --> 01:16:35,760
Speaker 1: did you feel? Because I know you like being the spotlight,

1380
01:16:35,760 --> 01:16:39,200
Speaker 1: but you really are reluctant person in the spotlight. About

1381
01:16:39,240 --> 01:16:42,840
Speaker 1: those guys that came from Australia and Sweden and that

1382
01:16:43,160 --> 01:16:46,160
Speaker 1: because they're big time readers and they knew they'd have

1383
01:16:46,200 --> 01:16:50,000
Speaker 1: a chance to actually meet you, they flew thousands of

1384
01:16:50,040 --> 01:16:52,519
Speaker 1: miles to come and have a chance to be one

1385
01:16:52,520 --> 01:16:54,400
Speaker 1: of the guy the guy from Sweden was complained to

1386
01:16:54,439 --> 01:16:56,439
Speaker 1: me that he's written to you so many times, You've

1387
01:16:56,479 --> 01:16:58,840
Speaker 1: never used any of his stuff in mail bag, and

1388
01:16:58,880 --> 01:17:01,559
Speaker 1: he thought, forget it. I'm just gonna show up and

1389
01:17:01,600 --> 01:17:04,040
Speaker 1: I'm gonna talk. And he was the guy that kept

1390
01:17:04,040 --> 01:17:07,400
Speaker 1: asking the question, Peter really nice guy, and I thought

1391
01:17:07,400 --> 01:17:09,599
Speaker 1: it was really funny that these guys had flown in

1392
01:17:09,720 --> 01:17:12,040
Speaker 1: from all kinds of places just to be able to

1393
01:17:12,040 --> 01:17:13,960
Speaker 1: sit there and say they met you and talk to you.

1394
01:17:14,680 --> 01:17:16,400
Speaker 1: How did that make you feel? Well, First, that's the

1395
01:17:16,439 --> 01:17:20,000
Speaker 1: power of the internet. Second, I'm still metabolizing it. I

1396
01:17:20,600 --> 01:17:24,559
Speaker 1: really have a hard time finding a place because my

1397
01:17:24,600 --> 01:17:27,320
Speaker 1: parents always told me I was a ship head. So

1398
01:17:27,400 --> 01:17:30,200
Speaker 1: it's hard to be a ship head and have these

1399
01:17:30,240 --> 01:17:35,759
Speaker 1: people do this spend time, money, devotion. I I'm still

1400
01:17:35,760 --> 01:17:39,360
Speaker 1: trying to figure out how to you know, accept it. Well,

1401
01:17:39,560 --> 01:17:41,880
Speaker 1: remember we went around the room and everyone got to

1402
01:17:41,880 --> 01:17:43,519
Speaker 1: say who they were and where they're from, and how

1403
01:17:43,560 --> 01:17:46,200
Speaker 1: many of them said I'm just a big, big fan

1404
01:17:46,280 --> 01:17:48,120
Speaker 1: of Bob's a big reader, and I thought I needed

1405
01:17:48,160 --> 01:17:50,360
Speaker 1: to be here. Well, the other thing about it is

1406
01:17:50,400 --> 01:17:52,360
Speaker 1: the nature of what you're going to be the next

1407
01:17:52,400 --> 01:17:58,880
Speaker 1: Coachella won't matter who the guests are. I don't like that.

1408
01:17:58,960 --> 01:18:00,880
Speaker 1: It doesn't have a good ray like anythink. I think

1409
01:18:00,880 --> 01:18:04,880
Speaker 1: there'll be a better one. But when you think about

1410
01:18:04,920 --> 01:18:07,960
Speaker 1: like Glastonbury and Coachell and the festival, I mean, obviously

1411
01:18:08,000 --> 01:18:11,240
Speaker 1: we know Coachella took over, the didn't take over, but

1412
01:18:11,360 --> 01:18:13,880
Speaker 1: took their lead from Glastonbury, where you know, you could

1413
01:18:13,880 --> 01:18:15,920
Speaker 1: go on sale without the acts and it would sell

1414
01:18:15,960 --> 01:18:18,360
Speaker 1: out because of the event. You know, we hope, you

1415
01:18:18,400 --> 01:18:20,960
Speaker 1: hope to get the Music Media Summit to that point

1416
01:18:21,000 --> 01:18:24,240
Speaker 1: and it won't matter who the who the speakers are

1417
01:18:24,640 --> 01:18:27,040
Speaker 1: as long as you're they're doing the d I certainly

1418
01:18:27,120 --> 01:18:29,240
Speaker 1: hope that. I mean, one of the luxuries we have

1419
01:18:29,280 --> 01:18:31,760
Speaker 1: at this point in time is the group is not

1420
01:18:31,960 --> 01:18:35,960
Speaker 1: so large that we all can't connect. But this is

1421
01:18:36,040 --> 01:18:38,960
Speaker 1: kind of like my newsletter. I continue to march in

1422
01:18:39,040 --> 01:18:41,880
Speaker 1: my own direction, even though it's against the grain. I

1423
01:18:41,920 --> 01:18:44,800
Speaker 1: announced the conference, I heard from all the usual suspects.

1424
01:18:45,040 --> 01:18:47,880
Speaker 1: Let me run a panel, and I said, there, you

1425
01:18:47,920 --> 01:18:51,840
Speaker 1: can come, but there are no panels. Okay, I'm interviewing.

1426
01:18:51,880 --> 01:18:56,000
Speaker 1: In addition, I'm interviewing differently from everybody else. I mean,

1427
01:18:56,439 --> 01:19:00,200
Speaker 1: Barbara Walters was classically she had limited time for him.

1428
01:19:00,439 --> 01:19:06,120
Speaker 1: She was classically gotcha, Okay. Other people posit questions based

1429
01:19:06,160 --> 01:19:09,920
Speaker 1: on their research. My goal is a to get the

1430
01:19:09,960 --> 01:19:12,360
Speaker 1: person's story, because I believe unless you know where someone

1431
01:19:12,520 --> 01:19:14,120
Speaker 1: is coming from, you don't really know who they are.

1432
01:19:14,760 --> 01:19:17,679
Speaker 1: And to make them feel comfortable enough that they'll tell stories.

1433
01:19:18,320 --> 01:19:20,120
Speaker 1: This is you know, this is not why I do it,

1434
01:19:20,160 --> 01:19:23,280
Speaker 1: but it's something I've noticed. They'll tell stories that they

1435
01:19:23,320 --> 01:19:27,519
Speaker 1: haven't told previously. It's like, um, Troy Carter saying he

1436
01:19:27,560 --> 01:19:31,000
Speaker 1: was briefly unwelfare the one check and then he realized,

1437
01:19:31,080 --> 01:19:34,400
Speaker 1: I can't do this. This is insane. And those are

1438
01:19:34,400 --> 01:19:37,280
Speaker 1: the things you want as opposed to the usual stuff.

1439
01:19:37,280 --> 01:19:39,760
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm reading the newspaper today and it's all

1440
01:19:39,760 --> 01:19:42,040
Speaker 1: about hype. Oh, the movies coming out, so we'll have

1441
01:19:42,080 --> 01:19:43,760
Speaker 1: a story on the person who acted or made them.

1442
01:19:44,160 --> 01:19:46,759
Speaker 1: Who gives a funk and they're and they're also media

1443
01:19:46,840 --> 01:19:49,240
Speaker 1: trained up the ying yang and then that's all. That's

1444
01:19:49,280 --> 01:19:54,320
Speaker 1: a whole other thing. So I'm with you ad there.

1445
01:19:54,360 --> 01:19:56,000
Speaker 1: I mean, I thought that the stuff you got out

1446
01:19:56,000 --> 01:19:57,720
Speaker 1: of Troy was great. The stuff you got out of

1447
01:19:57,760 --> 01:20:01,479
Speaker 1: Ethiopia was great. I think you got their stories and

1448
01:20:01,520 --> 01:20:03,519
Speaker 1: I think that's why one of the one of my

1449
01:20:03,600 --> 01:20:06,160
Speaker 1: favorite interviews you ever did was an Aspen when you

1450
01:20:06,240 --> 01:20:10,479
Speaker 1: interviewed Rapino. And I've known Michael Rapino since like I've

1451
01:20:10,520 --> 01:20:12,720
Speaker 1: known him a long long time and I've spent time

1452
01:20:12,760 --> 01:20:14,880
Speaker 1: with him and talked to him. But there was stuff

1453
01:20:14,920 --> 01:20:17,360
Speaker 1: that I found out that day that I did not

1454
01:20:17,520 --> 01:20:19,120
Speaker 1: know about the guy. Well, you know, I got an

1455
01:20:19,120 --> 01:20:22,400
Speaker 1: email at the Chef Gordon Post podcast. Same thing. People

1456
01:20:22,400 --> 01:20:24,800
Speaker 1: who work with Sheep said, I never knew that. But

1457
01:20:25,479 --> 01:20:29,680
Speaker 1: as I say, with Rapino, everything is so confrontational. They

1458
01:20:29,680 --> 01:20:31,439
Speaker 1: expect you to go there. What do you know in

1459
01:20:31,479 --> 01:20:35,680
Speaker 1: these conferences, these public company CEOs, they're not going to

1460
01:20:35,800 --> 01:20:39,600
Speaker 1: make news. They literally can't because of all these filings, etcetera, etcetera.

1461
01:20:39,840 --> 01:20:44,000
Speaker 1: So you can't focus on that. So most of these conferences,

1462
01:20:44,520 --> 01:20:48,439
Speaker 1: the foremost thing is how can we make money? I mean,

1463
01:20:48,400 --> 01:20:51,040
Speaker 1: in terms of music conferences outside of America, a lot

1464
01:20:51,080 --> 01:20:54,679
Speaker 1: of them supported by the government. This is something different,

1465
01:20:54,720 --> 01:20:57,840
Speaker 1: you know, the way you're talking, I would certainly like

1466
01:20:58,400 --> 01:21:01,080
Speaker 1: to blow it up bigger. But what I liked about

1467
01:21:01,120 --> 01:21:03,960
Speaker 1: it is, as I say, every day I get email

1468
01:21:04,000 --> 01:21:05,840
Speaker 1: from people. Every day I turn on my computer, I

1469
01:21:05,880 --> 01:21:08,400
Speaker 1: find out I'm God and I'm a ship heead okay,

1470
01:21:09,040 --> 01:21:11,759
Speaker 1: But going to Santa better to be loved and hated

1471
01:21:11,840 --> 01:21:14,519
Speaker 1: than ignored. We know that true. But we're going to

1472
01:21:14,560 --> 01:21:17,840
Speaker 1: Santa Barbara. I'm anxious. I'm in front of the group,

1473
01:21:18,080 --> 01:21:21,080
Speaker 1: I'm interviewing people. I don't get a grade after I'm

1474
01:21:21,120 --> 01:21:23,639
Speaker 1: and I can see in today's era, you're talking, people

1475
01:21:23,640 --> 01:21:26,599
Speaker 1: are on their devices, etcetera. You're worried whether you're getting

1476
01:21:26,600 --> 01:21:30,439
Speaker 1: people's attention. So the last night, when everybody was ultra

1477
01:21:30,640 --> 01:21:34,559
Speaker 1: positive and loving, that shocked me. It really did shock me.

1478
01:21:34,800 --> 01:21:38,240
Speaker 1: And it made me realize that a vast majority of

1479
01:21:38,280 --> 01:21:40,800
Speaker 1: the people who emailed it on the ship head really

1480
01:21:40,840 --> 01:21:42,479
Speaker 1: has nothing to do with me and everything to do

1481
01:21:42,520 --> 01:21:45,080
Speaker 1: with them. But that's always been the case, I know,

1482
01:21:45,160 --> 01:21:48,360
Speaker 1: but it's when it's personalized it is difficult. I mean,

1483
01:21:48,360 --> 01:21:50,160
Speaker 1: I have a guy who emails but that, but that's

1484
01:21:50,200 --> 01:21:53,320
Speaker 1: the Internet in general. I mean, you go on Twitter,

1485
01:21:53,439 --> 01:21:56,160
Speaker 1: you see what Twitter, but you know that this that

1486
01:21:56,320 --> 01:21:58,920
Speaker 1: same person that says you're a ship head wouldn't sit

1487
01:21:58,960 --> 01:22:01,320
Speaker 1: across the desk like we're sitting right here and say

1488
01:22:01,320 --> 01:22:04,600
Speaker 1: you're a ship head. I agree. But if you are insecure,

1489
01:22:05,600 --> 01:22:08,719
Speaker 1: and most people in this world who were playing heavily

1490
01:22:08,960 --> 01:22:12,080
Speaker 1: in terms of visible your age, you're still feeling that

1491
01:22:12,160 --> 01:22:16,240
Speaker 1: way like you haven't. You haven't is not thick enough.

1492
01:22:18,400 --> 01:22:22,360
Speaker 1: But my my skin is thicker than anybody I know

1493
01:22:23,280 --> 01:22:25,600
Speaker 1: in the music business. I can't speak to acts, so

1494
01:22:25,680 --> 01:22:29,000
Speaker 1: the acts are traditionally thin skin. But as you continue

1495
01:22:29,080 --> 01:22:32,360
Speaker 1: to I remember at you know, in the nineties, I

1496
01:22:32,360 --> 01:22:35,040
Speaker 1: would go into the psychiatrist and talk about the bizarre

1497
01:22:35,080 --> 01:22:37,439
Speaker 1: things that happened online. People would have no idea what

1498
01:22:37,439 --> 01:22:43,120
Speaker 1: I'm talking about. Okay, Now, even Jimmy Kimmel does mean tweets. Okay,

1499
01:22:43,160 --> 01:22:46,280
Speaker 1: but there's still stuff at the end of the envelope.

1500
01:22:46,400 --> 01:22:49,080
Speaker 1: And there is stuff, you know, I don't want to

1501
01:22:49,080 --> 01:22:53,040
Speaker 1: say that it's politically incorrect, but you know that you're

1502
01:22:53,040 --> 01:22:55,439
Speaker 1: gonna get pushed back on just from writing. You know,

1503
01:22:55,479 --> 01:22:57,920
Speaker 1: when when you're watching Bill Maher, he immirely shuts the

1504
01:22:57,920 --> 01:23:00,599
Speaker 1: audience stuff. There was some moments in in Anna Barber

1505
01:23:00,680 --> 01:23:03,680
Speaker 1: that I think made a few people uncomfortable, right, And

1506
01:23:03,720 --> 01:23:05,639
Speaker 1: as I say, and it's funny, you know what I'm

1507
01:23:05,640 --> 01:23:07,519
Speaker 1: talking And one of those moments, I said, if we

1508
01:23:07,520 --> 01:23:10,759
Speaker 1: were here across the table, I am I'm not I'm

1509
01:23:10,800 --> 01:23:14,479
Speaker 1: probing to open someone up so they might tell you

1510
01:23:14,560 --> 01:23:17,559
Speaker 1: something you don't know. I'm not looking for an answer

1511
01:23:17,600 --> 01:23:20,680
Speaker 1: that I can be trumpeting on TMZ. It's okay, but

1512
01:23:20,720 --> 01:23:24,040
Speaker 1: if you as you know, to give these specific example,

1513
01:23:24,680 --> 01:23:26,880
Speaker 1: I had a car, this car I still have this

1514
01:23:27,160 --> 01:23:30,000
Speaker 1: relatively new and I was talking to a friend in

1515
01:23:30,040 --> 01:23:32,080
Speaker 1: the car and I pulled a U turn and it

1516
01:23:32,200 --> 01:23:34,920
Speaker 1: hits some branches. Little did I know. I thought it

1517
01:23:34,960 --> 01:23:37,240
Speaker 1: was just a bush, but it was a very They

1518
01:23:37,360 --> 01:23:40,400
Speaker 1: chopped the bush down so that the branches were very stiff,

1519
01:23:40,400 --> 01:23:42,720
Speaker 1: and it scratched my car. Now, let's be care if

1520
01:23:42,720 --> 01:23:44,120
Speaker 1: you get a big clear, if you get a big den,

1521
01:23:44,200 --> 01:23:46,280
Speaker 1: your car gonna get it. Appeared in this case there

1522
01:23:46,280 --> 01:23:48,280
Speaker 1: were a ton of scratches, but they didn't all go

1523
01:23:48,360 --> 01:23:52,280
Speaker 1: through the paint. I was upset b I went to

1524
01:23:52,400 --> 01:23:56,599
Speaker 1: get an estimate twelve dollars. I wasn't gonna get it

1525
01:23:56,760 --> 01:24:01,600
Speaker 1: by that stuff they sell on TV in Okay. I

1526
01:24:01,640 --> 01:24:04,519
Speaker 1: wasn't gonna pay twelve. So I once again, I go

1527
01:24:04,560 --> 01:24:07,639
Speaker 1: to the therapist and I'm upset about this, and he goes,

1528
01:24:08,880 --> 01:24:11,360
Speaker 1: if you don't go up to the edge, up to

1529
01:24:11,400 --> 01:24:14,200
Speaker 1: the line, you'll have no idea where it is. Sometimes

1530
01:24:14,240 --> 01:24:17,280
Speaker 1: you go over. But if you're so anxious that you're

1531
01:24:17,320 --> 01:24:19,120
Speaker 1: not going to go to the line, you're not gonna

1532
01:24:19,120 --> 01:24:21,040
Speaker 1: live your life fully. So that's a great lesson. And

1533
01:24:21,200 --> 01:24:22,840
Speaker 1: my car was scratched. But the same thing when you

1534
01:24:22,880 --> 01:24:26,320
Speaker 1: talk to people, if you don't ask some probing questions,

1535
01:24:26,880 --> 01:24:28,800
Speaker 1: you won't find the good stuff the new guy. And

1536
01:24:28,880 --> 01:24:31,680
Speaker 1: let me ask you a question about the car being scratched.

1537
01:24:33,160 --> 01:24:35,880
Speaker 1: Why does it matter? Do you think people are gonna

1538
01:24:35,880 --> 01:24:38,160
Speaker 1: look at your car and say, oh, Bob left Sets

1539
01:24:38,240 --> 01:24:41,880
Speaker 1: drives a scratched car, Like, does anybody really give? I

1540
01:24:41,920 --> 01:24:44,280
Speaker 1: don't think I ever drove a car that I didn't scratch.

1541
01:24:44,640 --> 01:24:48,360
Speaker 1: Believe me. It has nothing to do with a third

1542
01:24:48,520 --> 01:24:53,040
Speaker 1: party opinion. That's not it. This is a whole another

1543
01:24:53,160 --> 01:24:57,200
Speaker 1: podcast in order to explain it. It has to do

1544
01:24:57,280 --> 01:25:01,280
Speaker 1: with my identity and O C D and you know,

1545
01:25:01,880 --> 01:25:04,760
Speaker 1: and other things. And as I say that that that's

1546
01:25:04,920 --> 01:25:07,600
Speaker 1: very interesting stuff to get into. But and it's not

1547
01:25:07,600 --> 01:25:09,200
Speaker 1: that I'm gonna louctant. We'd have to do at least

1548
01:25:09,200 --> 01:25:12,280
Speaker 1: another twenty minutes. Okay, well then I think we're almost

1549
01:25:12,280 --> 01:25:14,120
Speaker 1: done here. I think, you know, I think we could

1550
01:25:14,160 --> 01:25:17,639
Speaker 1: go on forever. It's been very productive for those people listening.

1551
01:25:17,720 --> 01:25:20,200
Speaker 1: I think you've gotten the full story. But we're off

1552
01:25:20,200 --> 01:25:23,400
Speaker 1: the high of a three day conference in Santa Barbara,

1553
01:25:23,880 --> 01:25:27,240
Speaker 1: reviewing the speakers in the experience. I have to thank

1554
01:25:27,360 --> 01:25:29,280
Speaker 1: Jake who came in for the conference and came in

1555
01:25:29,320 --> 01:25:31,960
Speaker 1: to do this podcast. To an update to do an update.

1556
01:25:32,600 --> 01:25:36,280
Speaker 1: Until next time you're listening to the Bob Left Sets podcast.

1557
01:25:36,360 --> 01:25:39,599
Speaker 1: Thank you Jake, Thank you Bob, the Bob Left Sets

1558
01:25:39,720 --> 01:25:47,160
Speaker 1: Bob Cast. There you have it. That wraps up this

1559
01:25:47,200 --> 01:25:50,479
Speaker 1: week's episode of the Bob Left Sets podcast, recorded live

1560
01:25:50,520 --> 01:25:53,679
Speaker 1: at the tune In Studios in Venice, California. I hope

1561
01:25:53,720 --> 01:25:56,960
Speaker 1: you liked this conversation with Jake Gold. As always, I'm

1562
01:25:57,040 --> 01:26:00,280
Speaker 1: interested in your feedback, positive or negative. You can reach

1563
01:26:00,360 --> 01:26:03,639
Speaker 1: me at Bob at left sense dot com. Until next time,

1564
01:26:04,000 --> 01:26:19,360
Speaker 1: I'm Bob. Left Sense can think of and me reason,

1565
01:26:19,720 --> 01:26:22,480
Speaker 1: and I don't know me exactly