WEBVTT - Amazon Part 3: The Bumpy Road to Hollywood 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:03.240 Even among other CEOs, Jeff Bezos has known for being 0:00:03.279 --> 0:00:07.560 an especially aggressive businessman. He's really good at playing the 0:00:07.560 --> 0:00:11.000 game of capitalism, where the imperative for any company is 0:00:11.039 --> 0:00:14.440 to grow and keep growing. So Bezos wants to have 0:00:14.480 --> 0:00:17.799 a hand in almost every aspect of his customers daily lives. 0:00:18.360 --> 0:00:20.919 And when he hits the wall, he's known for buying 0:00:20.960 --> 0:00:24.640 his way in. When Amazon struggled to sell shoes, they 0:00:24.640 --> 0:00:27.880 bought Zappos for about a billion dollars. When they were 0:00:27.920 --> 0:00:31.440 flailing around with their grocery delivery business, they bought Whole Foods, 0:00:31.960 --> 0:00:36.680 and then in May, Jeff Bezos did it again. Amazon 0:00:36.720 --> 0:00:39.839 today just did some shopping of its own, buying MGM 0:00:39.920 --> 0:00:43.279 for nearly eight and a half billion dollars. But this 0:00:43.360 --> 0:00:45.960 is coming as Amazon continues it's push to try and 0:00:46.000 --> 0:00:48.280 figure out Hollywood, try and figure out how to make 0:00:48.320 --> 0:00:50.839 this work with streaming that's kind of been all over 0:00:50.840 --> 0:00:53.120 the map. This is so fascinating. You have this company 0:00:53.159 --> 0:00:56.160 that's really the epitome of the modern company buying a 0:00:56.240 --> 0:01:00.560 film studio that was founded in the silent era. Amazon 0:01:00.680 --> 0:01:02.840 said it was buying one of the most storied names 0:01:02.840 --> 0:01:07.160 in Hollywood. MGM is home to movies like Rocky and RoboCop, 0:01:07.560 --> 0:01:12.720 Fargo and the Survivor TV series, and of course Bond 0:01:14.959 --> 0:01:20.160 James Bond, Mr Bond. The deal surprised even obsessive Amazon 0:01:20.240 --> 0:01:23.960 and Hollywood watchers. Here's my colleague Lucas Shaw, who covers 0:01:24.000 --> 0:01:29.000 the entertainment industry. The response was at first shock at 0:01:29.000 --> 0:01:32.200 the number Amazon was paying almost nine billion dollars from GM, 0:01:32.280 --> 0:01:34.880 which far exceeded what anybody really thought it was worth 0:01:34.920 --> 0:01:38.080 on paper. And the other reason the deal surprised Hollywood 0:01:38.280 --> 0:01:42.720 was what it said about Amazon's and Jeff Bezos's overweening ambition. 0:01:43.440 --> 0:01:46.360 For ten years, Amazon had offered TV shows and movies 0:01:46.400 --> 0:01:49.760 as a free perk to Prime members, but Amazon streaming 0:01:49.800 --> 0:01:53.720 service was seen as trailing Netflix. Making original TV shows 0:01:53.720 --> 0:01:56.680 and films was even considered something of a vanity project 0:01:56.680 --> 0:02:00.320 for Jeff Bezos. He seemed to love attending award shows 0:02:00.640 --> 0:02:03.360 and throwing parties for big name actors at his home 0:02:03.400 --> 0:02:06.880 in Beverly Hills. But the purchase of MGM suggested that 0:02:06.920 --> 0:02:10.720 Bezos was far more serious, that owning content was a 0:02:10.800 --> 0:02:14.120 vital piece of Amazon's future. The deal is the clearest 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:18.239 indicator yet that that Amazon is not just fooling around 0:02:18.240 --> 0:02:20.960 in Hollywood. It's not just some other kind of interloper 0:02:21.000 --> 0:02:23.320 from another industry that thinks it's cool to go to parties. 0:02:23.360 --> 0:02:26.119 They want to play to win. The day of the announcement, 0:02:26.360 --> 0:02:29.800 Beazos talked about it during the company's annual meeting with shareholders. 0:02:30.120 --> 0:02:35.760 We're really excited about MGM. The acquisitions thesis here is 0:02:35.800 --> 0:02:40.400 really very simple. MGM has a vast, deep catalog of 0:02:40.560 --> 0:02:44.520 much beloved intellectual property, and with the talented people at 0:02:44.600 --> 0:02:48.040 MGM and the talented people at ms On Studios, we 0:02:48.120 --> 0:02:51.840 can reimagine and develop that i P for the twenty 0:02:51.840 --> 0:02:54.560 one century. It's gonna be a lot of fun work 0:02:54.720 --> 0:02:57.040 and people who love stories are going to be the 0:02:57.040 --> 0:03:00.480 big beneficiaries. But this was more than a busines and steal. 0:03:00.960 --> 0:03:04.760 It seemed like another inevitable step in Bezos's own remarkable 0:03:04.760 --> 0:03:09.120 reinvention into something of a celebrity himself. And this company, 0:03:09.360 --> 0:03:12.400 which started as an online store then became a cloud 0:03:12.400 --> 0:03:16.040 provider than an AI company with Alexa, now had a 0:03:16.040 --> 0:03:24.359 new target. Hollywood. You're listening to Foundering. I'm your host 0:03:24.440 --> 0:03:27.720 brad Stone. In this episode, we're going to tell the 0:03:27.760 --> 0:03:31.480 story of Prime Video and Amazon's beleaguered path into the 0:03:31.600 --> 0:03:35.040 entertainment industry. It's a story that starts with a strange 0:03:35.120 --> 0:03:40.360 choice by Jeff Bezos to create original content. Amazon Studios 0:03:40.400 --> 0:03:44.280 launches a few celebrated shows, a few more notorious bombs, 0:03:44.720 --> 0:03:47.760 and then gets consumed by a me too controversy that 0:03:47.840 --> 0:03:52.160 shook the company to its core. Bezos's decisions in Hollywood 0:03:52.320 --> 0:03:56.000 would end up changing the company and himself in ways 0:03:56.000 --> 0:03:59.000 that no one predicted. We'll tell you more after a 0:03:59.080 --> 0:04:15.120 quick break. Let's go back a decade and a half 0:04:15.480 --> 0:04:19.239 before Amazon came to buy MGM, before they were investing 0:04:19.279 --> 0:04:22.599 billions of dollars in making movies every year, The mid 0:04:22.600 --> 0:04:26.160 odds were a fertile period for Amazon. This is around 0:04:26.160 --> 0:04:29.640 the time that Jeff Bezos was conceiving the Kindle and Aws, 0:04:30.040 --> 0:04:34.080 and when Amazon was furiously entering new industries and new countries. 0:04:34.720 --> 0:04:37.880 Back then, Netflix was a company that sent their customers 0:04:37.960 --> 0:04:41.600 DVDs in the mail. But then in two thousand seven, 0:04:42.040 --> 0:04:46.400 Netflix introduced a streaming service called watch Now at no 0:04:46.480 --> 0:04:50.400 additional church. It was the official start of the streaming revolution. 0:04:51.040 --> 0:04:53.479 Piso saw what Netflix was doing as the future of 0:04:53.520 --> 0:04:56.640 home entertainment, and he wanted to join the race, but 0:04:56.720 --> 0:05:00.400 Amazon didn't have a vast streaming content library. They didn't 0:05:00.440 --> 0:05:05.120 feel comfortable charging customers for an inferior product. Bezos himself 0:05:05.200 --> 0:05:08.520 came up with the answer that Amazon would give away 0:05:08.520 --> 0:05:11.320 its content for free as well two members of its 0:05:11.360 --> 0:05:14.599 Prime Shipping club. He argued that making TV shows and 0:05:14.640 --> 0:05:19.400 winning awards would help with Amazon's core business. Here's Bezos 0:05:19.440 --> 0:05:22.279 speaking a few years later at the Recode Conference in 0:05:22.279 --> 0:05:26.960 two thousand sixteen. So, uh, from a business point of view, 0:05:27.000 --> 0:05:30.200 for us, when we win a Golden Globe, it helps 0:05:30.279 --> 0:05:32.599 us sell more shoes. And it does that in a 0:05:32.720 --> 0:05:36.240 very direct way because when people if you look at 0:05:36.400 --> 0:05:41.040 Prime members, they buy more on Amazon than non Prime members. 0:05:41.080 --> 0:05:42.719 And one of the reasons they do that is once 0:05:42.760 --> 0:05:44.880 they've paid their in your fee, they're looking around to 0:05:44.880 --> 0:05:47.080 see how can I get more value out of the program, 0:05:47.400 --> 0:05:50.000 and so they look across more categories, they shop more, 0:05:50.080 --> 0:05:52.080 they do they there are a lot of their behaviors 0:05:52.120 --> 0:05:54.080 change in ways that are very attractive to us as 0:05:54.120 --> 0:05:57.200 a business. Bazos saw the Prime video could get more 0:05:57.240 --> 0:06:00.599 people to buy Prime memberships, get people to interact with 0:06:00.680 --> 0:06:05.159 Amazon dot Com every day, and if a competitor like Walmart, 0:06:05.279 --> 0:06:08.320 also geared up to deliver in two days. Amazon Prime 0:06:08.320 --> 0:06:13.080 would already be offering something more. Years later, when antitrust 0:06:13.080 --> 0:06:17.640 authorities were investigating the Amazon MGM deal, critics would point 0:06:17.640 --> 0:06:21.640 to this moment as an example of Amazon behaving anti competitively. 0:06:22.440 --> 0:06:25.800 They were using their dominance in online shopping to give 0:06:25.839 --> 0:06:30.760 themselves a big head start in online video. Amazon introduced 0:06:30.839 --> 0:06:34.680 Prime Video. In February two eleven, we saw Amazon dot 0:06:34.760 --> 0:06:38.520 Com take on Netflix directly, Amazon starting an unlimited streaming 0:06:38.600 --> 0:06:41.720 video service with five thousand movies and TV shows. It's 0:06:41.720 --> 0:06:44.760 for its existing Prime customers, are already pay seventy nine 0:06:44.760 --> 0:06:48.320 dollars per year. The selection was thin, old episodes of 0:06:48.320 --> 0:06:52.200 The Dick Van Dyke Show, PBS documentaries, and old films 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:55.520 like Stanley Kubrick's two thousand one Open the Pod Bay 0:06:55.640 --> 0:07:01.320 Doors Help. I'm sorry, Dave, I'm afraid I can do that. 0:07:02.680 --> 0:07:06.600 But slowly Amazon started licensing more TV shows and movies 0:07:07.080 --> 0:07:11.000 for media companies like Viacom and Epics, which added stuff 0:07:11.040 --> 0:07:16.440 like Jersey Shore, SpongeBob SquarePants, All Right, pin Head, Your 0:07:16.520 --> 0:07:20.160 Time is up, The Hunger Games movies, and The First 0:07:20.160 --> 0:07:24.520 Avengers such better that might be a really good time 0:07:24.520 --> 0:07:28.680 for you to get angry. That's my secret, Jetty. I'm 0:07:28.680 --> 0:07:33.160 always angry. And because paying for rights to stream blockbusters 0:07:33.200 --> 0:07:36.640 and popular TV shows was so expensive, because they were 0:07:36.640 --> 0:07:40.440 getting into bidding wars with Netflix and Hulu, Amazon decided 0:07:40.440 --> 0:07:43.480 they wanted to control their own destiny. They would create 0:07:43.560 --> 0:07:47.520 their own TV shows. But at the time, you know, 0:07:47.600 --> 0:07:50.640 people were skeptical. They were like, wait, you guys are 0:07:50.680 --> 0:07:53.960 an online bookstore or something, and now you're gonna try 0:07:54.000 --> 0:07:57.520 to be you know, NBC or some or whatever. You're 0:07:57.520 --> 0:07:59.440 gonna try to be a real network. Like I'm not 0:07:59.480 --> 0:08:01.120 sure I believe of you. You know, I'll come back 0:08:01.120 --> 0:08:05.400 in a few years um, And so you have to 0:08:05.400 --> 0:08:10.720 to some extent earn credibility. That's Roy Price, the first 0:08:10.760 --> 0:08:14.160 head of Amazon Studios, as we'll get too later in 0:08:14.160 --> 0:08:18.560 this episode. Roy was later outsted for sexual harassment allegations, 0:08:19.080 --> 0:08:22.720 but he was also responsible for some of Amazon's early successes. 0:08:23.880 --> 0:08:27.520 When Roy started creating TV shows was a really big leap. 0:08:28.280 --> 0:08:31.080 Bezos and his fellow geeks in Seattle thought that they 0:08:31.120 --> 0:08:33.680 could come down to Hollywood and swim in their pool. 0:08:34.400 --> 0:08:39.199 The plan was audacious, maybe even arrogant Bezos believed that 0:08:39.320 --> 0:08:43.360 Hollywood had such a low successory and stumbled so frequently 0:08:43.400 --> 0:08:47.400 with expensive movies that bombed, that Amazon could do things 0:08:47.440 --> 0:08:52.520 differently and better. In two thousand twelve, Amazon Studios opened 0:08:52.559 --> 0:08:55.280 up their first office in Sherman Oaks, above a food 0:08:55.360 --> 0:09:01.400 Ruckers restaurant. Bezos informally dubbed it the Scientific Studio. The 0:09:01.440 --> 0:09:04.760 idea was that Amazon would be methodical about only making 0:09:04.760 --> 0:09:08.000 shows that people wanted to watch. They gave their customers 0:09:08.000 --> 0:09:11.040 a set of pilots and let viewers vote online about 0:09:11.040 --> 0:09:13.600 which shows they wanted to expand in the full series. 0:09:14.520 --> 0:09:17.680 It was a very silicon value approach. Let's tap into 0:09:17.679 --> 0:09:20.920 the wisdom of the crowd, and most Hollywood veterans rolled 0:09:20.960 --> 0:09:25.080 their eyes. There was a lot of experimentation and and 0:09:25.240 --> 0:09:28.520 it was actually a somewhat amateur on them. We said, 0:09:28.520 --> 0:09:31.800 all right, but we really do need some real professional 0:09:31.800 --> 0:09:34.920 shows on the site. Among the first shows that viewers 0:09:35.000 --> 0:09:38.320 chose were the political comedy Alpha House, which was like 0:09:38.360 --> 0:09:41.560 a watered down version of Veep, and a tech industry 0:09:41.559 --> 0:09:44.840 spoof called Beta's, which was a poor version of the 0:09:45.000 --> 0:09:49.120 HBO comedy Silicon Valley that debuted the next year. They 0:09:49.120 --> 0:09:53.800 weren't exactly hits. Around this time, the Netflix original show 0:09:53.840 --> 0:09:57.680 House of Cards was a huge success, so Amazon was 0:09:57.720 --> 0:10:01.000 playing catch up. So we had to sort of convinced 0:10:01.040 --> 0:10:05.319 people that you know, this is this is actually adding 0:10:05.440 --> 0:10:09.160 value over and above all the TV you already have. 0:10:10.000 --> 0:10:14.640 So you've you've got to be distinctive and bringing something 0:10:15.400 --> 0:10:19.840 that is it's it's like film on TV and it's 0:10:19.920 --> 0:10:23.079 great and it's setting a high bar. So Roy decided 0:10:23.120 --> 0:10:27.000 to seek out prestigious projects. He wanted Amazon Studios to 0:10:27.080 --> 0:10:29.440 look like a place that was friendly to artists and 0:10:29.440 --> 0:10:33.360 where audiences could find shows that weren't on mainstream TV networks. 0:10:33.679 --> 0:10:37.480 Amazon's original programming when it first started to really roll out, 0:10:37.720 --> 0:10:42.240 was notably quirkier. That's Danny Gabby. Danny used to be 0:10:42.240 --> 0:10:45.480 a Hollywood agent, and he remembered having a terrible time 0:10:45.559 --> 0:10:48.600 trying to sell a project called Mozart in the Jungle 0:10:49.000 --> 0:10:53.600 about hijinks in a fictional New York City symphony. It 0:10:53.760 --> 0:11:00.319 is my honor to introduce to you someone special. At 0:11:00.360 --> 0:11:03.520 twelve years old, he was the youngest person to ever 0:11:03.600 --> 0:11:07.360 win the Maler Award for Young Conductors. That thing died 0:11:07.360 --> 0:11:09.760 on the vine. It wasn't really going anywhere. And then 0:11:09.800 --> 0:11:11.880 a couple of years later, I remember seeing it turning 0:11:12.000 --> 0:11:15.480 up on Amazon and I thought, oh, wow, they're really 0:11:15.480 --> 0:11:17.680 taking a chance for such a for such a unique, 0:11:17.720 --> 0:11:19.600 quirky show. And I always really loved that show and 0:11:19.640 --> 0:11:22.719 really loved That's loved that pilot script. Mozart in the 0:11:22.800 --> 0:11:26.559 Jungle was Amazon's first modest hit, but their next show 0:11:26.880 --> 0:11:30.880 made Amazon a serious player in Hollywood. Here's Roy. When 0:11:30.920 --> 0:11:34.520 I read the script for Transparent, it was it was 0:11:34.600 --> 0:11:37.920 so moving, and it was so great and it was 0:11:38.000 --> 0:11:41.880 so real that you know, we had to make that show. 0:11:42.240 --> 0:11:45.360 It's a show about a fictional Los Angeles family where 0:11:45.400 --> 0:11:49.560 the father played by Jeffrey Tambor, decides the transition later 0:11:49.559 --> 0:11:52.000 in life. Are you saying that you're gonna start dressing 0:11:52.080 --> 0:11:57.960 up like a lady? All of them? My whole life, 0:11:57.960 --> 0:12:03.480 I've been dressing up like a man. This is Transparent 0:12:03.600 --> 0:12:06.880 was a critical hit. Activists praised it for a sensitive 0:12:06.920 --> 0:12:11.720 portrayal of transgender issues. The show made Amazon seemed progressive 0:12:12.040 --> 0:12:17.840 and forward thinking, and in January, Transparent won a Golden Globe, 0:12:18.280 --> 0:12:21.559 making Amazon the first streaming service to win a major award. 0:12:22.400 --> 0:12:26.800 They beat Netflix at something for the first time Transparence 0:12:26.880 --> 0:12:31.199 producer and writer Choe Soloway stood on stage and accepted 0:12:31.240 --> 0:12:34.959 the award and thanked Jeff Bezos. I want to thank Amazon, 0:12:35.080 --> 0:12:41.200 Jeff Bezos. I want to thank the trans community. They 0:12:41.200 --> 0:12:44.599 are our family. They make this possible. This award is 0:12:44.640 --> 0:12:47.000 dedicated to the memory of Lead. It was a tremendous 0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:50.840 validation of Amazon's efforts in Hollywood and if Roy Price's 0:12:50.840 --> 0:12:53.960 initial strategy, and it was a sign of the times 0:12:54.600 --> 0:12:57.320 viewers were beginning to pull away from cable to look 0:12:57.320 --> 0:13:00.760 for high quality shows online. How after their big win 0:13:00.800 --> 0:13:04.559 at the Golden Globes, the Transparent team Joey Salaway and 0:13:04.640 --> 0:13:08.480 Jeffrey Tambor appeared on CBS this morning for a victory lap, 0:13:09.040 --> 0:13:12.640 and they brought along Jeff Bezos. He pledged that Amazon's 0:13:12.640 --> 0:13:15.880 approach with TV shows and movies was different. There are 0:13:15.880 --> 0:13:18.200 two ways to go about deciding whether to make a show. 0:13:18.240 --> 0:13:20.800 You can ask yourself how many millions of people are 0:13:20.800 --> 0:13:23.240 going to watch this show? I think that leads you 0:13:23.400 --> 0:13:27.720 into corners that aren't interesting. Or you can say, you know, 0:13:28.200 --> 0:13:31.480 is the creator of this show incredibly passionate about this topic? 0:13:32.320 --> 0:13:34.200 Is the creator of this show one of the world's 0:13:34.200 --> 0:13:37.640 great storytellers. Can they assemble a cast to make this 0:13:37.720 --> 0:13:40.040 thing come to life? You know? And so if you're 0:13:40.080 --> 0:13:42.720 asking that, if you're saying, you know, can we build 0:13:42.760 --> 0:13:48.040 something truly remarkable? I think remarkable storytelling always finds an audience. 0:13:49.080 --> 0:13:52.760 Bezos is saying here that Amazon would keep making more transparence, 0:13:53.120 --> 0:13:57.480 that he would choose passion and artistry over popularity, that 0:13:57.679 --> 0:14:01.480 streaming would offer an alternative to the Hollywood formula. This 0:14:01.559 --> 0:14:04.080 approach would lead to a few more critical hits for 0:14:04.160 --> 0:14:08.320 Amazon Studios, like the marvelous Mrs Masal I would like 0:14:08.440 --> 0:14:12.280 to repeatedly kick every man in here in the ball 0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:16.520 the next several hours. I won't so. I am still 0:14:16.559 --> 0:14:20.200 a lady. Your wife must have a sense of humor. 0:14:20.720 --> 0:14:25.800 She's seeing you naked. And the wonderful Phoebe waller Bridge 0:14:25.840 --> 0:14:30.840 comedy Fleabag Tell the Truth. It's horrendous. It's horrendous, It's modern. 0:14:31.040 --> 0:14:36.400 Don't lie, I'm not look like a pencil. Both were 0:14:36.440 --> 0:14:40.440 projects with messy feminist heroines. They made Amazon seem to 0:14:40.480 --> 0:14:44.320 stand apart from the rest of Hollywood. Here's Roy. One 0:14:44.360 --> 0:14:48.040 of the ways that the studio record was truly distinctive 0:14:48.440 --> 0:14:55.920 is we I think led the league in shows created 0:14:55.960 --> 0:15:01.120 and led by women, winning Emmy's and sort of going 0:15:01.520 --> 0:15:07.680 from nowhere to being, you know, internationally famous and from 0:15:07.720 --> 0:15:12.960 you know, Transparent, you know, Fleabag and Mazel and many 0:15:13.000 --> 0:15:16.880 many in between. And I'm glad to say that a 0:15:16.920 --> 0:15:21.640 lot of the shows really stood out. And you know, 0:15:21.720 --> 0:15:25.200 we won the Globe for Best Comedy four years out 0:15:25.200 --> 0:15:29.320 of six. We won the Best Comedy Director at the 0:15:29.320 --> 0:15:33.240 Emmy's four years out of five. But as Netflix also 0:15:33.360 --> 0:15:36.960 started to mint even bigger streaming hits like Stranger Things, 0:15:37.320 --> 0:15:41.440 that approach wouldn't last. After a few years, Amazon retired 0:15:41.480 --> 0:15:46.040 its quirky pilot voting system. Bezos wanted larger audiences. He 0:15:46.160 --> 0:15:51.200 sought it experienced tastemakers and storytellers Hollywood. It turned out 0:15:51.440 --> 0:15:54.280 was changing the company instead of the other way around. 0:15:55.120 --> 0:16:06.280 We'll tell you more after the break. On December three, 0:16:06.280 --> 0:16:10.280 two thousand sixteen, Jeff Bezos through the buzziest party at 0:16:10.360 --> 0:16:14.520 Hollywood at as Beverly Hills Estate. Tons of famous people 0:16:14.560 --> 0:16:18.240 were there, Matt Damon and Ben Affleck, Diane Keaton and 0:16:18.280 --> 0:16:22.560 Ben Kingsley, t Bone, Burnett and Beck and many more. 0:16:22.600 --> 0:16:25.560 They were there to celebrate Manchester by the Seat. It 0:16:25.680 --> 0:16:29.320 was Amazon Studio's biggest movie hit yet. It's a very 0:16:29.360 --> 0:16:33.600 depressing family drama starring Casey Affleck. The movie was up 0:16:33.640 --> 0:16:38.000 for several major awards, continuing a winning streak for Amazon Studios. 0:16:38.760 --> 0:16:41.840 At the center of attention was Bezos. He seemed to 0:16:41.840 --> 0:16:45.520 be loving it. His wife, Mackenzie, was nowhere in sight. 0:16:46.000 --> 0:16:48.640 Friends of the couple told me she disliked these kinds 0:16:48.640 --> 0:16:51.560 of parties. It looked like Bezos was at the start 0:16:51.600 --> 0:16:55.080 of a major personality shift. He used to be content 0:16:55.160 --> 0:16:57.720 to stay out of the limelight, focused on the business 0:16:57.920 --> 0:17:02.200 and on a secret technology projects. But now, with Amazon 0:17:02.280 --> 0:17:05.439 stock price tripling over the previous five years, he was 0:17:05.520 --> 0:17:08.280 one of the richest men in the world, and that 0:17:08.440 --> 0:17:13.159 status came with adulation and social opportunity. Bezos seemed to 0:17:13.200 --> 0:17:16.639 relish it. At the Golden Globes, he sat near the 0:17:16.720 --> 0:17:22.000 stage and laughed uproariously as Jimmy Fallon made jokes about him. 0:17:22.160 --> 0:17:29.959 Amazon did pretty well tonight, eleven nominations for Amazon. So 0:17:30.119 --> 0:17:34.000 Jeff Bezos is here tonight. He actually arrived yesterday, but 0:17:34.040 --> 0:17:36.400 there was no one around a sign for him. Uh 0:17:36.520 --> 0:17:40.080 that night. Manchester by the Sea won five Golden Globes, 0:17:40.240 --> 0:17:44.840 including Best Drama Motion Picture. But behind the scenes, Bezos 0:17:44.880 --> 0:17:48.400 wanted big changes. He was no longer content with Roy 0:17:48.480 --> 0:17:53.119 Price's niche artists driven shows. He wanted Prime Video to grow, 0:17:53.720 --> 0:17:57.400 to drive customers to Amazon Prime in hundreds of countries 0:17:57.440 --> 0:18:02.119 around the world. Here's Roy, you know, over time, uh, 0:18:02.320 --> 0:18:06.200 your audience gets bigger. I mean, as your service grows, 0:18:06.440 --> 0:18:11.280 as you grow around the world, you really need some 0:18:11.880 --> 0:18:15.960 tent pole shows. So you've got to have your um 0:18:16.080 --> 0:18:17.919 whatever it is, you know, a Lord of the Rings 0:18:18.040 --> 0:18:21.719 or what have you, um, Game of Thrones, you know, 0:18:21.800 --> 0:18:25.119 whatever it is. So Bazos tells Roy at a meeting, 0:18:25.560 --> 0:18:29.119 bring me my Game of Thrones. That's a direct quote. 0:18:29.720 --> 0:18:32.880 He was frustrated that he didn't have a blockbuster franchise. 0:18:33.480 --> 0:18:36.959 At another meeting, Basis gave Roy a sort of ingredients 0:18:37.000 --> 0:18:40.040 list of what he believed was essential for every huge show. 0:18:40.840 --> 0:18:45.439 His list includes stuff like a heroic protagonist and compelling antagonist, 0:18:45.840 --> 0:18:50.919 positive emotions, negative emotions, wish fulfillment, and diverse world building. 0:18:51.720 --> 0:18:56.520 Those last, to her common tropes in science fiction and fantasy. Anyway, 0:18:56.720 --> 0:18:59.360 Basos came up with this on the spot and from 0:18:59.359 --> 0:19:02.480 that point on, every time an Amazon executive wanted to 0:19:02.560 --> 0:19:05.880 greenlight a show, they had to explain how the project 0:19:05.960 --> 0:19:10.080 contained all thirteen of Bezos's storytelling elements. And I gotta 0:19:10.160 --> 0:19:12.399 tell you, when I first wrote about this list and 0:19:12.440 --> 0:19:15.560 it came out, people were really upset about it that 0:19:15.720 --> 0:19:19.040 this billionaire founder thought he could boil down creativity into 0:19:19.080 --> 0:19:22.960 some formula of his own making. It was weird, but 0:19:23.000 --> 0:19:26.800 it's just another part of Bezos's analytical mind, sort of 0:19:26.840 --> 0:19:30.960 like the pilot voting scheme. Bezos wanted to systematize the 0:19:31.000 --> 0:19:34.560 process of creating hits. He believed you can impose a 0:19:34.680 --> 0:19:39.159 rigorous process around the very act of imagination. The quest 0:19:39.240 --> 0:19:41.400 to find the next Game of Thrones put a ton 0:19:41.400 --> 0:19:44.320 of pressure on Roy Price because those big shows and 0:19:44.359 --> 0:19:47.959 movies that Bezos wanted they take time to make, and 0:19:48.080 --> 0:19:51.320 Roy was about to run out of time because in 0:19:51.400 --> 0:19:55.639 two thousand seventeen, and entertainment journalists named Kim Masters was 0:19:55.760 --> 0:20:00.880 hearing things, bad things about life at Amazon Studios. Kim 0:20:00.920 --> 0:20:03.919 says she got a call from a source. This source 0:20:04.000 --> 0:20:09.879 painted a picture of cultural dysfunction, a sexist work environment. 0:20:10.280 --> 0:20:15.080 It was kind of a bro environment. Um the upper 0:20:15.240 --> 0:20:19.080 ranks Roy's people that he had brought in. Let's just 0:20:19.160 --> 0:20:22.840 say the source felt that they were not doing great 0:20:22.920 --> 0:20:27.600 job and dubiously qualified. And that's not all. Kim source 0:20:27.680 --> 0:20:31.320 also intimated something more serious, that Roy Price had been 0:20:31.359 --> 0:20:36.560 accused of sexual harassment back in by Issa Dick Hackett. 0:20:37.160 --> 0:20:40.439 She's the executive producer of the Amazon show Man in 0:20:40.440 --> 0:20:43.960 the High Castle and the daughter of the writer Philip K. Dick. 0:20:44.640 --> 0:20:46.720 There was an incident at Comic Con I think in 0:20:46.760 --> 0:20:49.480 San Diego. They were there. There was a dinner where 0:20:49.840 --> 0:20:52.520 Lisa and Roy were in proximity to each other. He 0:20:52.600 --> 0:20:57.360 was being, in her mind, very harassing, which ultimately led 0:20:57.400 --> 0:21:01.919 to a car ride where he re inappropriately started talking 0:21:01.960 --> 0:21:08.320 about his genitalia and um. There were other people in 0:21:08.359 --> 0:21:12.280 the car who were witnessed to this and tried to 0:21:12.320 --> 0:21:17.480 get help her fend him off, and he was aggressively 0:21:17.560 --> 0:21:21.119 pursuing this. And then they arrived at this after party 0:21:21.240 --> 0:21:24.320 and he walks up to her and whispers something the 0:21:24.880 --> 0:21:30.119 very graphic sex act in her ear, just randomly, very odd, 0:21:30.840 --> 0:21:40.120 and she was very upset about it. Kim's article alleges 0:21:40.160 --> 0:21:43.840 that Roy Price set outrageously explicit things to Issa Dick Hacket, 0:21:44.240 --> 0:21:47.280 such as you will love my dick and anal sex. 0:21:48.160 --> 0:21:50.679 I reached out to Issa Hackett for this episode and 0:21:50.720 --> 0:21:54.800 she did not want to rehash the incident, but back 0:21:54.800 --> 0:21:58.399 in she told Kim that Roy's comments in the car 0:21:58.800 --> 0:22:02.920 and at the Amazon studio after party were quote shocking 0:22:02.920 --> 0:22:05.440 and surreal that he did not relent when she told 0:22:05.520 --> 0:22:08.240 him that she was not interested, that she was married 0:22:08.600 --> 0:22:11.640 and had a wife and children. And here's Roy Price's 0:22:11.760 --> 0:22:15.120 version of the same event. He denies the specific comments 0:22:15.119 --> 0:22:18.200 attributed to him in the article, but concedes the incident 0:22:18.280 --> 0:22:22.399 happened and that a sexually explicit remarks were failed jokes. 0:22:23.080 --> 0:22:28.520 Well it, you know, it was obviously unfortunate and unintended. 0:22:28.760 --> 0:22:31.639 And I went down to San Diego to look at 0:22:31.640 --> 0:22:36.320 a pilot screening at Comic Con of Man in high Castle, 0:22:36.400 --> 0:22:39.800 and uh, we had a dinner party. I got an 0:22:39.880 --> 0:22:42.639 uber to go to an after party afterwards. I had 0:22:42.720 --> 0:22:47.040 never met kak It, and she hopped in my uber 0:22:47.119 --> 0:22:50.679 along with the guy from Amazon, and you know, there 0:22:50.720 --> 0:22:59.040 was banter in the uber and I deeply apologize. I'm 0:22:59.119 --> 0:23:03.760 sorry if the band enter was you know, overboard. Um, 0:23:03.800 --> 0:23:05.639 and we get to the after part. I mean it 0:23:05.680 --> 0:23:08.239 was very short. It was like whatever, ten blocks at 0:23:08.240 --> 0:23:10.879 one in the morning. Anyway, So I don't know, we 0:23:11.040 --> 0:23:13.400 get out, we take a self I thought everything was copasetic, 0:23:13.560 --> 0:23:19.880 and but obviously, you know, one person's copsetic is it's 0:23:19.960 --> 0:23:23.920 everyone has the right to define their own line of 0:23:24.000 --> 0:23:30.040 humor and copestic and not copessetic. And I'm not objecting 0:23:30.080 --> 0:23:33.240 to that, and again I'm I'm sorry for it. Two 0:23:33.359 --> 0:23:36.639 years after all this happened, Kim Masters published her article 0:23:36.680 --> 0:23:39.840 in The Hollywood Reporter. Her piece came out in October. 0:23:41.400 --> 0:23:44.080 The Roy Price story went public the same week that 0:23:44.160 --> 0:23:47.080 the New York Times and New Yorker published their bombshell 0:23:47.160 --> 0:23:51.440 stories about Harvey Weinstein and pervasive sexual harassment in Hollywood. 0:23:51.960 --> 0:23:54.840 And but that was it. You know, that was not 0:23:54.880 --> 0:23:58.639 a good week to have a bad article, and so 0:23:58.880 --> 0:24:02.560 it was not really kind of to stay under the circumstances, 0:24:03.520 --> 0:24:07.320 and so that was it. Says a Fox's alert. This 0:24:07.480 --> 0:24:11.399 is just breaking Roy Price, Amazon's entertainment chief is taking 0:24:11.440 --> 0:24:15.320 a leave of absence following a sexual harassment claim. Now 0:24:15.359 --> 0:24:19.080 this comes as the massive Harvey Weinstein scandal is now expanding. 0:24:19.600 --> 0:24:23.119 Roy's career in Hollywood. Never recovered and What's more, some 0:24:23.200 --> 0:24:26.440 of the most prestigious projects he brought into Amazon Studios, 0:24:26.840 --> 0:24:30.760 including Manchester by the Sea, Transparent, and a four movie 0:24:30.760 --> 0:24:33.600 deal with Woody Allen, all got clouded by their own 0:24:33.680 --> 0:24:39.000 sexual harassment and assault scandals. With Roy gone, Bezos needed 0:24:39.000 --> 0:24:41.720 a new leader for Amazon Studios. He was at a 0:24:41.800 --> 0:24:44.600 turning point. He wanted a huge hit, and at the 0:24:44.640 --> 0:24:48.280 same time he was getting personally interested in expanding his 0:24:48.400 --> 0:25:06.320 profile in Hollywood. That's next. About three months after Roy 0:25:06.359 --> 0:25:10.920 Price resigned, Amazon Studio's got a new boss. Here's my colleague, 0:25:10.960 --> 0:25:15.840 Lucashaw Jen Sulky. Is you know a Hollywood veteran, at 0:25:15.920 --> 0:25:21.080 tried and true person. Uh. She was at the time 0:25:21.400 --> 0:25:25.440 one of the top executives that at NBC UM someone 0:25:25.480 --> 0:25:28.600 who had relationships with people all over town. I don't 0:25:28.640 --> 0:25:31.720 know that she was seen as kind of the pinnacle 0:25:31.800 --> 0:25:34.400 of great taste, but she had a very good sensibility 0:25:34.440 --> 0:25:37.359 for what people wanted to watch. Amazon was sending a 0:25:37.359 --> 0:25:40.200 clear message by hiring a prominent woman to head the 0:25:40.240 --> 0:25:43.640 studio at a time of me too controversy. Here's Jen 0:25:43.760 --> 0:25:48.200 Sulky at a panel held by Vanity Fair. I've never 0:25:48.240 --> 0:25:51.120 met Roy Price and UM so I don't I can't 0:25:51.119 --> 0:25:54.080 speak about him personally, but what I can say is 0:25:54.119 --> 0:25:58.679 that there had been a lot of um negativity and trauma, 0:25:58.720 --> 0:26:02.639 a little bit of trauma around the company, understandably, and 0:26:02.680 --> 0:26:04.479 then there had been a lot of healing that had 0:26:04.480 --> 0:26:07.880 already started, which I was really happy about. Chen Sulky's 0:26:07.960 --> 0:26:12.560 arrival signal something more subtle. Amazon's tastes were changing, and 0:26:12.560 --> 0:26:14.280 I think to a lot of people as symboled a 0:26:14.320 --> 0:26:18.600 clear departure from the Roy Price era, in both in 0:26:18.640 --> 0:26:22.640 that they brought in someone who was the consummate Hollywood insider, 0:26:23.000 --> 0:26:27.760