WEBVTT - Queer as Folklore (with Open Mike Eagle) 0:00:03.320 --> 0:00:05.760 Maybe I was Sunny Bono. He died in this Yeah, 0:00:05.840 --> 0:00:09.039 I think he died skin he dies all right into 0:00:09.119 --> 0:00:12.600 a tree. Yeah? Oh fuck, yeah, he died silly. That's 0:00:12.640 --> 0:00:17.480 not good. Oh oh no. The reason I remember that 0:00:17.880 --> 0:00:20.080 is because Red Man turned it into a punch line 0:00:21.079 --> 0:00:23.639 very soon after it happened, because you know, he's a 0:00:23.640 --> 0:00:27.120 big we'd smoke. I hit more trees and Sunny Bono fu, 0:00:27.600 --> 0:00:30.960 that's really me. Yeah, that's suing me. But also it's 0:00:31.000 --> 0:00:33.400 a good bar. It's a good line, good for red men. 0:00:39.960 --> 0:00:54.720 Chips in your racists money stuff. I can't tell me. 0:00:56.840 --> 0:01:01.560 M m m. There is the ed is there is? 0:01:01.680 --> 0:01:06.080 Ladies and gentlemen, Welcome to another spectacular episode of My 0:01:06.160 --> 0:01:10.800 Mama Told Me the podcast. But we dive deep, deep 0:01:10.840 --> 0:01:14.480 into the world of black conspiracy theories, and we finally 0:01:14.520 --> 0:01:17.880 work to prove that Ty Dollar Sign is the devil. 0:01:18.200 --> 0:01:21.000 You can't trust the black man with eyes like a 0:01:21.160 --> 0:01:26.280 rare yugiokard. They're too late, they're too light. There's no 0:01:26.360 --> 0:01:29.039 reason for that giant black man to have them blue. 0:01:29.160 --> 0:01:32.119 Evil wise, he's the devil, and I know it. Ty 0:01:32.200 --> 0:01:36.280 dollar Sign, that money symbol can't fool me. You are evil. Sir, 0:01:37.240 --> 0:01:40.520 h I am your hosts like Stan Kerman as always. 0:01:40.640 --> 0:01:44.080 I'm excited to be here. My guest today. Oh, we 0:01:44.160 --> 0:01:47.840 have a great guest today. He's he's hilarious, he's talented, 0:01:48.120 --> 0:01:50.960 he's exceptional. We were just talking about how good he 0:01:51.120 --> 0:01:54.240 is the fucking pad like a sound pad, and how 0:01:54.360 --> 0:01:57.360 terrible I am. But that doesn't matter. You know him 0:01:57.400 --> 0:02:00.760 from the New Negroes on Comedy Central or Wonderful Show. 0:02:01.040 --> 0:02:05.280 You know him from his brand new album Anime Trauma 0:02:05.440 --> 0:02:08.960 and Divorce. He's an exceptional artist. You're gonna love him. 0:02:09.000 --> 0:02:11.960 Please give it up for my guest, Mr Open Mike Ego. 0:02:14.560 --> 0:02:17.680 That was probably the best introduction I've had all all pandemic. 0:02:17.960 --> 0:02:22.120 Hell yeah great. You mean when the period when no 0:02:22.160 --> 0:02:27.000 one's introducing you to anything. I love that. Usually usually 0:02:27.080 --> 0:02:31.080 the attempts are just they're just sad, you know, they're 0:02:31.120 --> 0:02:33.639 just like, I don't even know if this is his 0:02:33.760 --> 0:02:40.120 real name. I guess his name is Open. I'm excited 0:02:40.160 --> 0:02:43.560 you're here, man, Let's let's get into it. Let's just 0:02:43.639 --> 0:02:45.760 real quick. I saw your TV the other day on 0:02:45.800 --> 0:02:51.880 the Boys and I love an audible Yale. Oh it's great. 0:02:52.080 --> 0:02:54.120 They made me get buff for that role. And then 0:02:54.160 --> 0:02:57.240 I just sat there and you and you really acting too. 0:02:57.280 --> 0:03:01.160 It's great, man. I had to be a creepy dude 0:03:01.200 --> 0:03:04.120 with muscles. It was nice. It's a fun time. But 0:03:04.200 --> 0:03:06.840 we don't have time for that. We gotta get into 0:03:06.880 --> 0:03:10.720 this goddamn conspiracy because you came to me with one 0:03:10.800 --> 0:03:13.800 that I guess sort of connects even to the question 0:03:13.880 --> 0:03:18.400 of a person acting on television. The conspiracy theory you 0:03:18.520 --> 0:03:29.360 brought was my mama told me Hollywood has a gay agenda. Yeah, 0:03:30.040 --> 0:03:33.040 talk to me about it. Tell me my mama didn't 0:03:33.080 --> 0:03:36.240 tell me. But every barber I've ever had, I mean 0:03:37.000 --> 0:03:41.760 Chicago to l a different shops, it don't matter. They 0:03:42.000 --> 0:03:45.040 always believe that because they always have something on TV, 0:03:45.680 --> 0:03:49.560 either the news or BT and and they are commenting 0:03:49.600 --> 0:03:54.520 on what's happening. And once anything even like I won't 0:03:54.520 --> 0:03:58.200 say slightly homosexual, was just like anything that's not a 0:03:58.440 --> 0:04:03.400 traditional manly man Madrid. Yeah, hetero normative ship that's a 0:04:03.560 --> 0:04:09.040 better word. Oh my god, thank you. Once anything slightly 0:04:09.120 --> 0:04:13.400 less than hetero normative happens, then um, you know than 0:04:13.520 --> 0:04:16.600 outcomes to you know, they only want to show us 0:04:17.000 --> 0:04:22.159 in certain ways because you know, they tried to emasculate 0:04:22.839 --> 0:04:29.120 the black man, and but two thousand years right. Yeah, 0:04:29.560 --> 0:04:32.719 it's always and for our our listeners at home, who 0:04:32.720 --> 0:04:36.400 have not yet been privy to the wisdom of a barber, 0:04:37.120 --> 0:04:41.280 it is always rooted in this conspiracy that by making 0:04:41.360 --> 0:04:45.839 black men gay or we are somehow undermining the black community, 0:04:45.880 --> 0:04:49.159 that it is like the destruction of the nuclear family, 0:04:49.400 --> 0:04:53.240 as it were, and and that gay images are intentionally 0:04:53.400 --> 0:04:55.640 reflected back to us in order to make us more 0:04:55.680 --> 0:05:01.080 gay over time. Is the other other part of the theory, guess, 0:05:01.120 --> 0:05:03.839 So we become more gay and then subsequently and I 0:05:03.920 --> 0:05:06.159 know this is always a part of it is and 0:05:06.400 --> 0:05:09.000 it's not always a part that maybe is articulated. It's 0:05:09.080 --> 0:05:11.599 that we become more gay and then we become weaker 0:05:11.920 --> 0:05:14.560 because of that gay. Of course, it's it's all. It's 0:05:14.560 --> 0:05:19.599 all very negative perspective. So it's very They very much 0:05:19.720 --> 0:05:23.640 believe that hetero is the way to be sure, and 0:05:24.480 --> 0:05:28.560 that anything else is a programming error and it needs 0:05:28.600 --> 0:05:31.320 to be fought against. That's fair. Yeah, it's never like 0:05:31.400 --> 0:05:33.960 a good thing. They're not like, you become more gay 0:05:34.000 --> 0:05:36.159 and then your apartment is going to be real clean 0:05:36.440 --> 0:05:41.560 and smell a little better. You know none of that. Yeah, 0:05:41.560 --> 0:05:44.200 they don't. They don't see anything but what they consider 0:05:44.279 --> 0:05:46.520 to be the dark side. You're gonna become more gay 0:05:46.520 --> 0:05:48.560 and then you're gonna get some of those sweet abs 0:05:48.640 --> 0:05:50.960 that all the gay men have. And that's pretty cool. 0:05:51.680 --> 0:05:56.760 I hope you like it now. It's it's a fascinating 0:05:57.400 --> 0:06:01.919 I think conversation almost like a checkpoint that every black 0:06:01.960 --> 0:06:04.960 man goes through in their experience of like, you're gonna 0:06:05.000 --> 0:06:07.760 have an older black dude at some point sell you 0:06:07.839 --> 0:06:11.039 on this idea, and the question really becomes how bought 0:06:11.120 --> 0:06:13.479 in do you do you want to be to the 0:06:13.520 --> 0:06:16.120 premise that Hollywood is trying to make you gay? I 0:06:16.160 --> 0:06:20.080 guess my question for you is how bought in were 0:06:20.240 --> 0:06:23.560 you the first time you heard this? How much were 0:06:23.640 --> 0:06:26.839 you believing this to be true? I mean, I've always 0:06:26.880 --> 0:06:30.000 known a lot of gay people like and and I've 0:06:30.080 --> 0:06:34.839 never um never been like judgementel or never thought that 0:06:34.920 --> 0:06:39.839 it was somehow lesser than so this always sounded ridiculous 0:06:39.880 --> 0:06:43.560 to me. And the other thing is, I mean I 0:06:43.600 --> 0:06:47.080 feel like this conspiracy theory, like most of them, also 0:06:47.160 --> 0:06:50.760 kind of reflects my brain wants to say education level, 0:06:50.800 --> 0:06:55.640 but that's not it. It's it's more like how much information, 0:06:56.120 --> 0:07:01.200 like real information, somebody has at hand or somebody has consumed. Yeah, 0:07:01.279 --> 0:07:04.080 it's like it comes from a place of like, oh, 0:07:04.200 --> 0:07:05.800 I don't really know what's going on, but I'm gonna 0:07:05.800 --> 0:07:08.120 stay here in this barbershop and make shut up. And 0:07:08.160 --> 0:07:10.040 then when people come in here saying some ship it 0:07:10.080 --> 0:07:11.880 sounds interesting, I'm just gonna stick with that. But I'm 0:07:11.920 --> 0:07:15.080 not gonna really read anything, and I'm not gonna go 0:07:15.360 --> 0:07:18.720 have other experiences other places. I'm just gonna perpetuate this 0:07:18.760 --> 0:07:22.200 ship because it sounds cool. It makes me feel smarter, Yeah, 0:07:22.440 --> 0:07:25.520 I do. And to that point, some of it also 0:07:25.760 --> 0:07:29.240 feels like a lack of control. Do you know what 0:07:29.240 --> 0:07:32.360 I mean? That? Like you don't have control in certain 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:36.360 parts of your life because the government and poverty and 0:07:36.400 --> 0:07:39.440 all the reasons why we often feel like we don't 0:07:39.440 --> 0:07:43.120 have control. And so subsequently you go, well, where do 0:07:43.200 --> 0:07:46.000 I have control? And part of that is just making 0:07:46.080 --> 0:07:48.760 up your own truth. You go like, well, if I 0:07:48.760 --> 0:07:51.240 can make this true, and if I can convince other 0:07:51.280 --> 0:07:53.960 people that it's true, then I have a power that 0:07:54.000 --> 0:07:57.240 I otherwise wouldn't have, because you know, I'm broke and 0:07:57.640 --> 0:08:00.520 I don't know how to fix that, right, And and 0:08:00.560 --> 0:08:02.920 it's yeah, you're right, because it's it's reflective of of 0:08:03.040 --> 0:08:06.040 not understanding how systems work. You don't understand how systems work, 0:08:06.440 --> 0:08:10.840 then it just looks as if everything is being puppeteered 0:08:10.880 --> 0:08:14.200 by some force that's just right outside of your grasp. 0:08:14.640 --> 0:08:18.080 And if somebody comes along saying something that checks the 0:08:18.160 --> 0:08:22.080 box of explaining that somehow, but also aligns with any 0:08:22.120 --> 0:08:25.320 other beliefs you have, Like if you happen to believe, uh, 0:08:25.400 --> 0:08:28.000 somehow that that being gay is also bad, and also 0:08:28.400 --> 0:08:31.560 you were told that these forces who you can't see 0:08:31.800 --> 0:08:34.000 are pushing that on you, well, then that checks a 0:08:34.000 --> 0:08:36.840 couple of boxes. And you know like, okay, yeah, that 0:08:36.920 --> 0:08:40.480 makes sense. That's how the world works, you know, right, 0:08:40.559 --> 0:08:44.200 And I think there are also those weird to your point, 0:08:44.200 --> 0:08:48.479 there are those weird affirming moments that make your ideas 0:08:48.520 --> 0:08:51.520 feel at least somewhat valid, that then force you to 0:08:51.640 --> 0:08:56.040 go even further down that tunnel of your belief right. Yeah, 0:08:56.280 --> 0:09:00.319 I got a haircut, um right after uh it had 0:09:00.360 --> 0:09:06.199 to be the week that Moonlight won that oscar. That 0:09:06.320 --> 0:09:12.520 was a bad bad shop man, bad bad day. Because 0:09:12.559 --> 0:09:15.199 I'm sitting there and they're saying that ship and I'm 0:09:15.240 --> 0:09:19.680 just like, Yo, that movie is amazing though, it's so good, 0:09:19.880 --> 0:09:23.120 Like it's really good. And the whole time that I 0:09:23.160 --> 0:09:25.920 saw the movie and I'm and I'm reveling and celebrating 0:09:25.920 --> 0:09:28.760 and its accomplishments, I'm thinking, how awesome it is that 0:09:28.800 --> 0:09:31.520 we have a black gay story with that sort of 0:09:31.600 --> 0:09:36.240 representation and it's getting that sort of recognition. Yeah, And 0:09:36.320 --> 0:09:38.760 I'm in the barbershop and they just think this is 0:09:38.800 --> 0:09:40.920 the end of the world to them, you know what 0:09:40.920 --> 0:09:43.960 I'm saying. And I know I have to believe they 0:09:43.960 --> 0:09:47.080 were going down the train of like you know, they 0:09:47.200 --> 0:09:49.719 wasn't even supposed to win. They didn't even call out 0:09:49.760 --> 0:09:53.080 their name, but somebody got in the earpiece and was like, no, 0:09:53.200 --> 0:09:55.240 give it to the gay people, so we could make 0:09:55.240 --> 0:10:01.320 the niggas gays like, oh, you know, it's wild. And 0:10:01.360 --> 0:10:04.880 then I remember, and maybe you similarly have this memory. 0:10:04.920 --> 0:10:07.960 I think my first sense of this quote unquote gay 0:10:08.000 --> 0:10:11.840 agenda came out of like the conversation about black men 0:10:11.840 --> 0:10:15.200 and dresses. That like, there was that whole theory that 0:10:15.280 --> 0:10:18.679 anytime they put a black man on TV in address 0:10:19.160 --> 0:10:23.160 it was sort of like a transition in his career, Uh, 0:10:23.200 --> 0:10:26.960 Martin Lawrence, the you know, the Eddie Murphy's whoever. It 0:10:27.160 --> 0:10:30.640 was that they stopped being connected with the black community 0:10:30.920 --> 0:10:34.120 and we're suddenly now like Hollywood elites who were being 0:10:34.160 --> 0:10:36.840 puppeted by the white man, right, and they were willing 0:10:36.880 --> 0:10:39.280 to like they were basically showing they were willing to 0:10:39.320 --> 0:10:43.360 do whatever it takes yes to be you know, to 0:10:43.480 --> 0:10:45.800 be rich, to be positioned that way. And and and that 0:10:46.240 --> 0:10:49.080 was a signal that they were willing to turn away from, 0:10:49.920 --> 0:10:53.000 you know, the traditional idea of of black manhood in 0:10:53.080 --> 0:10:56.920 order to do what the white man thinks it's funny, 0:10:58.040 --> 0:11:02.040 which those people also think is by self detegration, you know, 0:11:03.320 --> 0:11:06.040 making fun of yourself to that degree, right, And I 0:11:06.080 --> 0:11:09.280 guess I wonder the question I have for you is 0:11:09.360 --> 0:11:13.000 how much of that? Because I found myself, and this 0:11:13.040 --> 0:11:15.280 is a better way of framing it, I found myself 0:11:15.320 --> 0:11:18.280 even as a kid being like, I don't hate gay people. 0:11:18.520 --> 0:11:21.040 I like gay people. I don't or certainly don't have 0:11:21.080 --> 0:11:24.480 any you know, hard feelings in any direction about like 0:11:24.720 --> 0:11:27.920 them based on the fact that they like kissing somebody 0:11:27.920 --> 0:11:30.640 of the same sex. But I also don't want to 0:11:30.640 --> 0:11:32.640 be a sellout. I don't want to be like a 0:11:32.679 --> 0:11:36.160 person who, like my peers, would view that way. So yeah, 0:11:36.200 --> 0:11:39.840 I'll never wear a dress, I'll never commit to any 0:11:39.880 --> 0:11:45.000 of these homo erotic images so that nobody could ever 0:11:45.080 --> 0:11:48.720 question my commitment to the black man and black community 0:11:48.800 --> 0:11:51.839 and all that stuff. I think. Yeah, I think, and 0:11:51.840 --> 0:11:53.679 and if you're getting at what I think you're getting that, 0:11:53.800 --> 0:11:57.199 I do think there's that kernel of something that resonates 0:11:57.200 --> 0:12:01.120 in that um about when you are a black man 0:12:01.240 --> 0:12:05.000 entering the entertainment industry, you do feel, especially if you're 0:12:05.000 --> 0:12:09.679 not doing you know, shows with black writers, black producers, 0:12:10.040 --> 0:12:15.120 you know, black showrunners, you're on guard to make sure 0:12:15.480 --> 0:12:18.800 that you're not being put in a position that's gonna 0:12:18.880 --> 0:12:24.400 cost you your credibility. So like, even though you're not 0:12:24.520 --> 0:12:28.280 bringing a homophobia to it or transphobia to it, you 0:12:28.360 --> 0:12:31.960 do feel a certain sense of needing to protect your image, 0:12:32.559 --> 0:12:34.720 and so you're kind of on the lookout for stuff 0:12:34.760 --> 0:12:39.000 like that, right, Yeah, you're constantly sort of on edge 0:12:39.559 --> 0:12:41.880 for this thing that, even though it's not coming from 0:12:41.960 --> 0:12:45.559 your own hatred, is coming from someone else's hatred and 0:12:45.640 --> 0:12:50.680 yourself like trying to not articulate it, but it's coming 0:12:50.720 --> 0:12:53.160 out either way. It's yeah, it's a fun up dance 0:12:53.200 --> 0:12:57.120 that we find and that you know, And that's the thing. 0:12:57.320 --> 0:13:01.240 You know, people argue against the idea of privilege, like 0:13:01.360 --> 0:13:03.840 that's one of the perfect examples. It's not like privileged 0:13:03.920 --> 0:13:08.120 means you automatically have it easier. Privileged means there's just 0:13:08.240 --> 0:13:11.920 certain inner conversations you don't have to have. You get 0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:15.880 to devote that brain power in brain space into something 0:13:15.960 --> 0:13:19.920 else you don't have to worry about, like wearing the 0:13:20.040 --> 0:13:24.079 whole weight of a culture shoulders every time you get 0:13:24.080 --> 0:13:26.640 an opportunity like that sort of thing. I mean, it's 0:13:26.760 --> 0:13:29.920 and that's you know, in some sense it is what 0:13:30.080 --> 0:13:34.040 makes those artists who are able to escape that so groundbreaking. 0:13:34.480 --> 0:13:39.280 But right like like young Thug wearing a fucking, you know, 0:13:39.440 --> 0:13:44.319 beautiful gown on his album cover is a groundbreaking decision 0:13:44.400 --> 0:13:46.679 no matter how you want to spin it. But then 0:13:46.760 --> 0:13:50.120 the danger of that goes back to that same question 0:13:50.200 --> 0:13:54.680 of like how much responsibility does he still have to 0:13:54.760 --> 0:13:58.080 the community that then judges him or wants him to 0:13:58.160 --> 0:14:02.080 do something different than the choices that he made. Yeah, 0:14:02.120 --> 0:14:06.000 I mean, you know what goes on in mainstream rap 0:14:06.120 --> 0:14:10.080 now is really interesting on that level because you know, 0:14:10.200 --> 0:14:12.240 ten fifteen years ago, I guess you just have to 0:14:12.240 --> 0:14:16.360 say fifteen now, it was just unheard of for somebody 0:14:16.440 --> 0:14:21.000 to be positioned or depicted in any way other than 0:14:21.120 --> 0:14:23.920 just like the hardest to hard dude. I mean, in 0:14:23.960 --> 0:14:27.320 the nineties you had rappers who were positioned to be 0:14:27.360 --> 0:14:31.240 a little lighter like a mc hammer or fresh prints 0:14:31.240 --> 0:14:34.440 like where they weren't super street. But then you know, 0:14:34.480 --> 0:14:39.880 after like two thousands, it got so homogenized that everybody 0:14:39.960 --> 0:14:42.480 was really leaning into that. And so if you look 0:14:42.520 --> 0:14:48.800 at that versus now and how much room mainstream rappers 0:14:48.880 --> 0:14:51.800 have to express themselves visually all these different ways, it's 0:14:51.800 --> 0:14:55.640 really interesting. But it does feedback into that conversation. We're 0:14:55.680 --> 0:14:58.480 like the dudes in the barbershop were like, wait a minute, 0:14:58.520 --> 0:15:02.680 can I still like this? You know what I'm saying. Yeah, 0:15:02.800 --> 0:15:06.240 it's it's I think they're asking themselves, can I still 0:15:06.320 --> 0:15:08.960 like this? And the even scarier part is out loud, 0:15:09.280 --> 0:15:13.120 they're definitively going nobody should like this. This is it's 0:15:13.200 --> 0:15:16.480 and you know that's the old headship where they go like, Nope, 0:15:16.760 --> 0:15:18.840 I don't funk with it. That's some new ship. That's 0:15:18.960 --> 0:15:22.240 these young kids they are they're the product of the 0:15:22.280 --> 0:15:25.840 gay agenda that sort of was already at play during 0:15:26.000 --> 0:15:29.080 the the younger hip hop era or the older rather 0:15:29.200 --> 0:15:32.440 hip hop era, and now you're just letting the gay 0:15:32.440 --> 0:15:36.360 agenda live live out. It's you know, it's worse our 0:15:36.360 --> 0:15:38.880 worst fears is living out in front of us through 0:15:39.360 --> 0:15:42.600 an oozy, through a young thug, through a Frank Ocean 0:15:42.680 --> 0:15:45.520 whoever the funk it is. That sort of is kind 0:15:45.560 --> 0:15:48.240 of just being themselves or at least the Yeah, it's 0:15:48.280 --> 0:15:51.520 just really but really reflecting, because the interesting thing is 0:15:51.560 --> 0:15:55.480 to they're reflecting the street culture of now to like, 0:15:55.520 --> 0:15:59.440 the street culture of now isn't super baggy pans and 0:15:59.560 --> 0:16:03.320 big hoodies or even long white tease like it's like 0:16:03.840 --> 0:16:09.240 fitted clothes and really expensive belts. Right, It's a it's 0:16:09.240 --> 0:16:12.360 a different vibe in the streets now, and of course 0:16:12.800 --> 0:16:14.800 you know mainstream map is going to reflect that too. 0:16:14.880 --> 0:16:17.520 But then, you know, I do wonder for people who 0:16:17.520 --> 0:16:21.120 believe that stuff, how do they bridge that? You know? 0:16:21.200 --> 0:16:23.560 How do they bridge I guess, but I guess it 0:16:23.600 --> 0:16:25.560 kind of leads into what you're saying, where like they 0:16:25.600 --> 0:16:28.400 look at it, they look at the tight pants and 0:16:28.400 --> 0:16:36.040 they're like, oh, there you go, Agenda. Um. It's funny 0:16:36.040 --> 0:16:38.080 too that you mentioned old heads because it makes me 0:16:38.120 --> 0:16:42.520 think about Lord Jamar from Brand Nuby and who is 0:16:42.560 --> 0:16:47.600 like the mascot. He's like the quintessential old head and 0:16:47.640 --> 0:16:50.360 he's one of the main ones that are always using 0:16:50.360 --> 0:16:53.360 their social media, using their their YouTube, you know, doing 0:16:53.440 --> 0:16:57.120 dj vlad interviews, tearing down things that seemed to from 0:16:57.160 --> 0:17:00.520 their perspective, come from that place. But lordam was on 0:17:00.640 --> 0:17:06.160 odds M. If I'm not mistaken, Laura mars Entire, Penis 0:17:06.240 --> 0:17:09.719 was out when he was walking around to jail, and 0:17:09.760 --> 0:17:13.200 it's like, if you wasn't part of the gag in, 0:17:14.200 --> 0:17:17.160 how are you so sure that everybody else is now? 0:17:17.600 --> 0:17:20.240 You don't think having your dick meat out on HBO 0:17:20.520 --> 0:17:26.200 attempted If the presumption is that literally seeing dicks, seeing 0:17:26.240 --> 0:17:29.280 anything that is homo erotic is going to tempt me 0:17:29.720 --> 0:17:33.399 into homosexuality, you having your dick meat out had to 0:17:33.440 --> 0:17:35.720 do something for me. It had to give me in 0:17:35.880 --> 0:17:39.240 some direction and right. And on the same episode there's 0:17:39.440 --> 0:17:43.880 you know, all sorts of stuff stepping, you know, with 0:17:43.880 --> 0:17:47.520 with with men on men um touching, so you know 0:17:47.800 --> 0:17:51.320 it's It's just it's always struck me as hilarious. He's 0:17:51.400 --> 0:17:56.760 out there finger wagon against people doing the slightest bit 0:17:56.800 --> 0:18:01.359 of you know, gender expression. He was on he was 0:18:01.440 --> 0:18:05.440 on the gay Show on television as time, right, And 0:18:05.560 --> 0:18:09.600 I will say there's a there's another layer of irony 0:18:09.680 --> 0:18:14.280 in going on a lad TV to to complain about 0:18:14.320 --> 0:18:17.639 the gay agenda when you're talking to a white dude 0:18:17.920 --> 0:18:21.960 who is essentially like appropriating black culture and hip hop 0:18:22.000 --> 0:18:26.040 culture for his own benefit, like you're complaining to in theory, 0:18:26.119 --> 0:18:31.359 the oppressor while about his oppression about what you're seeing 0:18:31.400 --> 0:18:35.119 as like something oppressive in your community, right, and using 0:18:35.160 --> 0:18:37.000 his platform to do it when he don't give a 0:18:37.080 --> 0:18:40.320 damn about what happens to none of us. Right, He's 0:18:40.359 --> 0:18:43.760 not invested in the beef that Nick Cannon started. He's 0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:46.080 just gonna get Nick Cannon to say whatever the funk 0:18:46.119 --> 0:18:49.960 he can. M I. I guess one of the parts 0:18:50.000 --> 0:18:53.480 that always fascinated me with this is I do a 0:18:53.520 --> 0:18:58.520 hundred percent believe that there's I don't believe in any way, 0:18:58.560 --> 0:19:01.120 shape or form that there isn't fact they quote unquote 0:19:01.160 --> 0:19:04.359 gay agenda right, that we are by showing us gay 0:19:04.440 --> 0:19:08.560 imagery or or homo erotic imagery we are somehow being 0:19:08.640 --> 0:19:12.199 tempted towards becoming gay people. That's not how that works. 0:19:12.520 --> 0:19:17.040 But I do wonder how much you believe about Hollywood 0:19:17.960 --> 0:19:22.080 undermining black celebrities, Like how much of it do you 0:19:22.119 --> 0:19:24.600 buy in in that way, even if it isn't rooted 0:19:24.600 --> 0:19:27.840 in sort of like gayness, if you will, well, you know, 0:19:27.920 --> 0:19:32.200 I tend to push back against that kind of argument 0:19:32.240 --> 0:19:35.760 because I look at Hollywood for the most part, like 0:19:35.840 --> 0:19:40.359 a giant conglomeration of different corporations, and at the end 0:19:40.400 --> 0:19:45.439 of the day, they want to do what makes money. Uh, 0:19:45.440 --> 0:19:49.560 you know, like if you're if you're Warner Brothers, Universal Parent, whatever, 0:19:49.680 --> 0:19:52.000 whatever company, it is the end of the day, Like 0:19:53.160 --> 0:19:55.680 if you're a higher high level executive, you're trying to 0:19:55.760 --> 0:19:58.440 keep your job, You're trying to get your bonus, You're 0:19:58.440 --> 0:20:01.240 trying to show that quarter earning, whatever it is that 0:20:01.320 --> 0:20:04.760 has to happen. Like, are you really gonna take the 0:20:04.840 --> 0:20:09.280 time out of your day to knock down an entertainer 0:20:09.359 --> 0:20:11.119 or somebody who could be making your money just because 0:20:11.160 --> 0:20:14.640 they're black, Like I don't, I don't, Like I think 0:20:14.640 --> 0:20:17.000 in the past that definitely could have been the case 0:20:17.200 --> 0:20:20.240 in some sense just out of like personal feelings that 0:20:20.240 --> 0:20:22.879 people have about other other races and other cultures. But 0:20:22.960 --> 0:20:27.080 it's like now, I just I can't see I can't 0:20:27.119 --> 0:20:29.639 see them taking the time out. I can't see them 0:20:29.680 --> 0:20:32.280 putting the energy into doing that kind of thing when 0:20:32.320 --> 0:20:34.280 at the end of the day, they're always trying to 0:20:34.320 --> 0:20:36.800 do whatever it takes to to make one more, one 0:20:36.880 --> 0:20:39.600 penny more than the next man. Yeah, I think to 0:20:39.720 --> 0:20:43.280 your point, it probably it's very likely that there are 0:20:43.359 --> 0:20:46.680 individuals in all industries who are like, I don't want 0:20:46.760 --> 0:20:50.240 niggas reading around me. That makes me angry. I'm gonna 0:20:50.280 --> 0:20:53.080 do everything I can to make sure that these motherfuckers 0:20:53.119 --> 0:20:55.879 don't be reading. But in the grand theme of things, 0:20:56.119 --> 0:20:58.679 that doesn't mean that the industry as a whole, like 0:20:58.840 --> 0:21:01.280 had a meeting and a read on that. It just 0:21:01.359 --> 0:21:04.080 means that one dude has a passion for making sure 0:21:04.119 --> 0:21:06.560 black people don't read, and he's gonna do his best 0:21:06.600 --> 0:21:10.239 to work that out however he can, even if that 0:21:10.280 --> 0:21:13.080 means putting a dude in a dress and then making 0:21:13.160 --> 0:21:21.720 him not read. Effective, put that dress on, close that book, motherfucker. 0:21:21.840 --> 0:21:25.840 We've got work to do, all right. We're gonna take 0:21:25.880 --> 0:21:28.080 a break. We'll be back with more hoping Mike Eagle 0:21:28.119 --> 0:21:55.480 and more. My mama told me, are you do you can? You? You? 0:21:55.480 --> 0:21:58.560 You could? You want? You want him to do you 0:21:58.640 --> 0:22:01.200 so much? You could do any Yeah, we're back here 0:22:01.240 --> 0:22:04.080 were more open my giggle and more. My mama told 0:22:04.119 --> 0:22:08.320 me who who does? Who did the intro? Oh? Is 0:22:08.359 --> 0:22:13.000 this amazing? Dude. He's a comedian. He's an artist, much 0:22:13.040 --> 0:22:16.000 like you. He has more talents than I care for. 0:22:16.600 --> 0:22:20.439 I very angry at you, sort of like multi hyphen 0:22:20.520 --> 0:22:23.119 it people. But his name is Nick Chambers. He's very funny, 0:22:23.240 --> 0:22:25.280 very talented. I gotta, I gotta, yeah, I gotta, I 0:22:25.359 --> 0:22:28.080 gotta find out more. Man that that intro is brilliant. 0:22:28.160 --> 0:22:32.560 Oh thanks man, No, he's fucking he's the best. I 0:22:32.600 --> 0:22:35.720 gave him like very little information. I was like, hey, 0:22:35.800 --> 0:22:38.399 I need an intro song and here are five words 0:22:38.480 --> 0:22:42.960 to include that he went crazy. So yeah, he's very dope. 0:22:43.480 --> 0:22:46.280 Um and if you guys are listening, follow Nick Chambers. 0:22:46.520 --> 0:22:49.600 Show him all the love because he's very talented. Anyway, 0:22:49.680 --> 0:22:53.719 funck Nick Chambers. We gotta get into this research, Nick Chambers, 0:22:53.800 --> 0:22:56.520 get stuck, my dick. I got research to talk about 0:22:56.560 --> 0:22:59.520 open my giggles. You're right, you're right, My bad, my bad, 0:23:01.160 --> 0:23:06.720 all right. I really found myself sort of deep diving 0:23:06.840 --> 0:23:12.840 into the history of gayness in television and just sort 0:23:12.840 --> 0:23:15.960 of it's presentation. And one of the things that got 0:23:15.960 --> 0:23:19.679 really interesting for me was the fact that and I 0:23:19.840 --> 0:23:22.159 you know, you don't think about this stuff until you 0:23:22.160 --> 0:23:25.639 actually have to research it, but the first appearance of 0:23:25.680 --> 0:23:30.920 a homosexual person sort of openly homosexual, at least on television, 0:23:31.000 --> 0:23:35.000 was in nineteen seventy three on the Mary Tyler Moore Show. 0:23:35.600 --> 0:23:38.919 Did you know that? Did you know anything about? Nah? 0:23:38.960 --> 0:23:41.480 And I'm trying to I guess I never really saw 0:23:41.520 --> 0:23:43.880 a lot of that show. I considered myself a TV 0:23:44.000 --> 0:23:46.120 head and I grew up watching tons of reruns and stuff. 0:23:46.160 --> 0:23:48.560 But I think, um, I don't think I called but 0:23:48.640 --> 0:23:50.800 a few episodes of Mary Tyler Morris. I'm not sure 0:23:50.840 --> 0:23:53.760 which which character that was. I watched it a lot. 0:23:54.160 --> 0:23:58.280 Nick and Knight was my ship for a while. And uh, yeah, 0:23:58.320 --> 0:24:00.959 I watched the Mary Tyler morrishow And apparently there was 0:24:01.119 --> 0:24:04.439 a character in the show who was the brother of 0:24:04.480 --> 0:24:07.320 one of her friends, who then tried to her friend 0:24:07.359 --> 0:24:10.679 tried to set her up, set Mary up with this brother, 0:24:11.080 --> 0:24:14.119 and then it became it was later revealed that the 0:24:14.160 --> 0:24:16.520 brother was in fact gay and he was holding this 0:24:16.640 --> 0:24:19.679 big secret. And so that was just the arc of 0:24:19.680 --> 0:24:23.840 an episode. But over so over the course from nineteen 0:24:23.880 --> 0:24:27.000 seventy to nineteen eighty, there were only twelve shows that 0:24:27.119 --> 0:24:32.119 at any point introduced a gay character. So twelve in 0:24:32.160 --> 0:24:36.119 an entire decade, right, And then here's where it gets 0:24:36.160 --> 0:24:39.679 crazy because you compare that to two thousand ten to 0:24:39.760 --> 0:24:43.440 two thousand twenty decade the odds? Is this the odds? What? 0:24:43.720 --> 0:24:45.960 What do you call that? The I guess what people 0:24:46.040 --> 0:24:48.200 call it the odds. I try to avoid talking about 0:24:48.200 --> 0:24:50.680 it altogether, just because their names so stupid. But sure 0:24:50.960 --> 0:24:56.360 you're making the right choice. But it goes from twelve shows, 0:24:56.960 --> 0:24:59.960