WEBVTT - Zohran Mamdani, the Socialist Who Could Be NYC's New Mayor (Rerelease) 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:03.920 Hello, Adlots listeners. We are re releasing an episode that 0:00:03.960 --> 0:00:08.000 we recorded on May twenty third with Zorin Mumdanie. 0:00:08.440 --> 0:00:08.960 That's right. 0:00:09.160 --> 0:00:12.960 Just last night, Zoron won the Democratic nomination to be 0:00:13.039 --> 0:00:15.680 the new mayor of New York City. He is the 0:00:15.800 --> 0:00:18.880 massive favorite going into the general election, although of course 0:00:18.960 --> 0:00:22.320 Cuomo is the favorite going into the nomination, so anything 0:00:22.360 --> 0:00:25.239 could still happen. But probably a lot of people are 0:00:25.239 --> 0:00:27.600 tuning into this race now for the first time and 0:00:27.720 --> 0:00:30.120 want to know what the Democratic nominee is all about. 0:00:30.240 --> 0:00:32.479 Yep, and we asked him a lot of questions about 0:00:32.520 --> 0:00:34.360 exactly that, So take a listen. 0:00:37.240 --> 0:00:51.120 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News. 0:00:53.080 --> 0:00:56.640 Hello and welcome to another episode of the Odd Lots podcast. 0:00:56.680 --> 0:00:59.920 I'm Joe Wisenthal and I'm Tracy Alloway. Tracy, we might 0:01:00.000 --> 0:01:01.840 we had a socialist mayor here in New York City. 0:01:02.320 --> 0:01:05.559 Can I tell you something please? It's slightly weird. Last night, 0:01:06.040 --> 0:01:08.360 the night before we're recording this episode, I had a 0:01:08.480 --> 0:01:11.440 dream that I was in a shared uber with Adrian 0:01:11.520 --> 0:01:16.320 Adams and she was the driver. So she's another mayoral candidate. 0:01:16.680 --> 0:01:19.600 She was driving and I told her we were going 0:01:19.640 --> 0:01:22.240 to interview this particular candidate. 0:01:22.280 --> 0:01:23.319 And I was amazing. 0:01:23.400 --> 0:01:25.160 I was asking her for good questions. 0:01:25.120 --> 0:01:27.440 This is an amazing dream you're not making, Lissa. 0:01:27.680 --> 0:01:31.120 No, my dreams are very literal. And everyone in the 0:01:31.200 --> 0:01:34.600 uber was giving me ideas for questions and had opinions 0:01:34.680 --> 0:01:36.600 and stuff like that. But now I can't remember any 0:01:36.600 --> 0:01:36.760 of the. 0:01:36.880 --> 0:01:41.160 Oh, that's really disappointing anyway. You know, we don't really 0:01:41.160 --> 0:01:43.560 cover a lot of New York City politics. We don't 0:01:43.600 --> 0:01:46.360 cover a lot of politics in general. We hardly ever 0:01:46.400 --> 0:01:49.120 talked about New York City politics. Who really cares about 0:01:49.280 --> 0:01:51.120 New York and the broad audience. We don't like to 0:01:51.160 --> 0:01:54.120 be too navel gazing, but you know, this is a 0:01:54.160 --> 0:01:57.080 city with a lot of people who, needless to say, 0:01:57.320 --> 0:02:00.840 work in finance. Potentially, if Door Maine your changes to 0:02:01.080 --> 0:02:04.120 tax rates here, et cetera, then that could have an 0:02:04.120 --> 0:02:07.600 impact on the industry that we cover a lot. There 0:02:07.600 --> 0:02:09.960 are a lot of economics stories that are sort of 0:02:10.120 --> 0:02:14.440 New York centric, particularly relating to housing, that are very universal, 0:02:14.560 --> 0:02:17.400 et cetera. So it's not a crime to every once 0:02:17.400 --> 0:02:19.919 in a while to a New York City focused episode. 0:02:19.960 --> 0:02:22.720 No, and this also relates directly to a previous all 0:02:22.800 --> 0:02:25.519 Balts episode we did all about how New York gets 0:02:25.560 --> 0:02:26.359 its groceries. 0:02:26.760 --> 0:02:30.080 That's right, that's the connection. Let's jump right into it. 0:02:30.160 --> 0:02:33.200 I'm very excited to say we have a state assemblyman 0:02:33.560 --> 0:02:37.560 and candidate for the Democratic nomination for mayor, Zoron, Mumdanie 0:02:37.600 --> 0:02:38.440 coming on the show. 0:02:38.800 --> 0:02:40.720 Zoron, Thank you so much for coming on. 0:02:40.880 --> 0:02:42.440 Thank you so much for having me. It's a pleasure. 0:02:42.720 --> 0:02:47.640 I mentioned your socialist. What specific strand of socialism are you? 0:02:47.720 --> 0:02:52.200 And are the other socialists revisionists and deviationists of various flavors. 0:02:52.200 --> 0:02:55.440 We need to know your exact the exact category here. 0:02:55.960 --> 0:02:58.160 I will leave that to the internet. I will. I 0:02:58.200 --> 0:03:01.160 will tell you that I am a dem cutic socialist. Yes, 0:03:01.200 --> 0:03:04.400 and I started to call myself that after Bernie Sanders' 0:03:04.440 --> 0:03:08.200 twenty sixteen run for president, when I finally had a 0:03:08.280 --> 0:03:10.639 language described the way that I saw the world and 0:03:11.080 --> 0:03:12.639 the way that I believe the world should be, which 0:03:12.720 --> 0:03:15.160 is one where every person has the dignity they need 0:03:15.200 --> 0:03:16.480 to live a decent life. 0:03:16.720 --> 0:03:18.640 By the way, you know, now that I am a 0:03:18.880 --> 0:03:21.960 journalist at a mainstream news organization, I do not personally 0:03:21.960 --> 0:03:24.480 have political opinions, but I can say that I didn't. 0:03:24.560 --> 0:03:26.680 Wasn't always the case. And I went to high school 0:03:26.720 --> 0:03:29.760 in Vermont, and I was a volunteer on Bernie's nineteen 0:03:29.840 --> 0:03:32.600 ninety six house campaign and wants a picture of me 0:03:32.760 --> 0:03:36.040 with Bernie. So I was a very early you too. 0:03:36.240 --> 0:03:39.640 I was a Bernard Brother before it became cool. 0:03:39.760 --> 0:03:41.440 Yes, you got in early. 0:03:41.560 --> 0:03:42.400 Yeah, all right. 0:03:42.440 --> 0:03:45.800 So how would you describe your platform? Is it the 0:03:45.840 --> 0:03:47.440 New York version of Sanders. 0:03:47.680 --> 0:03:51.040 It's heavily inspired by that same focus on income inequality 0:03:51.120 --> 0:03:53.680 and a recognition of the fact that one in four 0:03:53.680 --> 0:03:56.240 New Yorkers are currently living in poverty in what has 0:03:56.280 --> 0:03:58.960 now been described as the most expensive city in the country. 0:03:59.480 --> 0:04:02.360 And it is a platform at its core to make 0:04:02.400 --> 0:04:04.920 this city affordable and to use every tool at city 0:04:04.960 --> 0:04:08.040 government's disposal to do so, because for too long we've 0:04:08.080 --> 0:04:11.280 had politicians pretend that we are just bystanders to a 0:04:11.320 --> 0:04:13.640 suffocating cost of living crisis, when in fact, we have 0:04:13.960 --> 0:04:16.120 two choices, whether to exacerbate it or put an end 0:04:16.160 --> 0:04:18.640 to it. And we've seen Eric Adams do the former. 0:04:18.760 --> 0:04:19.960 We're running to do the latter. 0:04:20.040 --> 0:04:22.200 What did Eric Adams do when you said he did 0:04:22.200 --> 0:04:23.760 the former, what did he do in your view to 0:04:23.839 --> 0:04:24.520 exacerbate it. 0:04:25.000 --> 0:04:27.040 You know, the first issue that you hear from most 0:04:27.080 --> 0:04:29.200 New Yorkers when it comes to cost of living is housing, 0:04:29.600 --> 0:04:32.320 and the mayor sets the rent increases for more than 0:04:32.360 --> 0:04:34.599 two million New Yorkers to live in rent stabilized housing. 0:04:34.920 --> 0:04:37.479 And he came in as a self described real estate 0:04:37.800 --> 0:04:40.240 That's how he described himself coming into the office. And 0:04:40.320 --> 0:04:43.600 he's raised rents accordingly. He's raised them more than nine percent. 0:04:43.800 --> 0:04:46.680 And this year, when the Rent Guidelines Board, which is 0:04:46.839 --> 0:04:50.599 entirely composed of his appointees, found that the landlords of 0:04:50.760 --> 0:04:53.400 those million or so units that have close to two 0:04:53.400 --> 0:04:56.840 and a half million tenants had seen a increase in 0:04:56.920 --> 0:05:00.240 their revenues by twelve percent, he wanted to raise the 0:05:00.240 --> 0:05:03.160 rent once again to close to eight percent. And that 0:05:03.320 --> 0:05:06.160 is one example. Another I would say is his relationship 0:05:06.160 --> 0:05:09.279 to Connetison. Connettison can only raise the rates of gas 0:05:09.360 --> 0:05:11.600 and electric with the permission of the state, and they 0:05:11.600 --> 0:05:14.239 do so through something called a rate case. The City 0:05:14.240 --> 0:05:18.000 of New York under Eric Adams administration sided with Walmart 0:05:18.080 --> 0:05:21.160 in support of Connetison's requests to raise those rates by 0:05:21.160 --> 0:05:23.120 sixty five dollars a month on average. And I know 0:05:23.160 --> 0:05:25.120 that because I was also a part of that rate case, 0:05:25.400 --> 0:05:27.840 one of the few elected officials who signed an opposition 0:05:27.920 --> 0:05:29.479 to it, And I think that you can see this 0:05:29.560 --> 0:05:31.360 again and again and again in the way that he 0:05:31.400 --> 0:05:34.000 has intervened in the major costs that are driving New 0:05:34.040 --> 0:05:34.920 Yorkers out of the city. 0:05:35.320 --> 0:05:38.480 So, since you mentioned housing and the rent freeze, you 0:05:38.520 --> 0:05:42.360 support rent freeze, lower rents. What do you say to 0:05:42.400 --> 0:05:46.560 people who think that you need to incentivize landlords to 0:05:46.640 --> 0:05:50.120 maintain their buildings to build new ones. There are also 0:05:50.120 --> 0:05:52.919 people out there who think that regulatory reform is the 0:05:53.000 --> 0:05:56.960 key to the supply problem in New York why rent 0:05:57.000 --> 0:06:01.240 freezes particularly versus you know, maybe lou some of the regulations. 0:06:01.839 --> 0:06:03.839 I think that many of these things can actually be 0:06:04.000 --> 0:06:07.240 achieved in tandem. I am both a candidate who believes 0:06:07.240 --> 0:06:09.360 we need to freeze the rent for rent stabilized tenants 0:06:09.640 --> 0:06:12.120 and one who believes that we need to end the 0:06:12.160 --> 0:06:15.359 requirement to build parking lots when reconstruct housing, who believes 0:06:15.400 --> 0:06:18.159 we need to increase densitery around mass transit hubs, that 0:06:18.160 --> 0:06:20.640 we need to upzone wealthier neighborhoods that have historically not 0:06:20.920 --> 0:06:24.120 contributed to affordable housing production. And we need to interrogate 0:06:24.200 --> 0:06:27.040 why Tokyo is building ten homes for every thousand people, 0:06:27.200 --> 0:06:29.640 Jersey cities at seven and New York is barely at four. 0:06:30.040 --> 0:06:32.120 And some of that also has to do with what 0:06:32.240 --> 0:06:34.920 is often described as the mundane details of housing law, 0:06:34.960 --> 0:06:37.360 but can have massive impacts on whether or not it's 0:06:37.800 --> 0:06:41.039 affordable or expensive to construct that housing, be it single 0:06:41.040 --> 0:06:44.640 staircase versus dual staircase, or the regulations that have effectively 0:06:44.640 --> 0:06:47.400 made it illegal to build SROs in this city, and 0:06:47.520 --> 0:06:49.800 the need for us to have a true diversity of 0:06:49.839 --> 0:06:53.479 housing stock. And I think the reason for the focus 0:06:53.800 --> 0:06:56.720 on our rent freeze is that that is the clearest 0:06:56.720 --> 0:06:59.520 and most direct way that you start your housing platform 0:06:59.520 --> 0:07:02.120 as the mayor of this city, given your appointing of 0:07:02.160 --> 0:07:04.279 all nine members of that Rent Guidelines Board. But it 0:07:04.320 --> 0:07:07.279 cannot be the extent of it, because a city of 0:07:07.320 --> 0:07:09.520 eight point four eight million people deserves a mayor with 0:07:09.560 --> 0:07:12.080 a housing platform for eight point four eight million people, 0:07:12.160 --> 0:07:14.040 not just the closest two and a half million that 0:07:14.080 --> 0:07:16.280 live in those units. And the other point I would 0:07:16.280 --> 0:07:18.560 make is that I have served in Albany, I'm now 0:07:18.600 --> 0:07:21.280 in my third term, and I've seen in Albany, while 0:07:21.280 --> 0:07:25.920 I have opposed it, we have passed legislation that allowed 0:07:26.040 --> 0:07:28.400 landlords to double the amount of money they can receive 0:07:28.560 --> 0:07:32.400 for iais, which are otherwise known as individual apartment improvements. 0:07:32.480 --> 0:07:36.320 So to your concern around incentivizing repairs and things of 0:07:36.360 --> 0:07:39.360 that nature, landlords have already just won the right to 0:07:39.800 --> 0:07:42.320 double the amount of money they can receive for those improvements. 0:07:42.680 --> 0:07:45.880 And I was in opposition to that doubling because of 0:07:46.120 --> 0:07:48.400 the immense amount of fraud that we've seen in that 0:07:48.520 --> 0:07:52.080 kind of program, where expenses are not actually what they 0:07:52.080 --> 0:07:54.920 are represented to be. And the final thing I would 0:07:54.920 --> 0:07:57.680 say is the rent guidelines had that findings of the 0:07:57.720 --> 0:08:00.880 twelve percent increase in revenue for those landlords. If there 0:08:00.880 --> 0:08:03.840 are landlords for whom that picture is not an accurate representation, 0:08:04.160 --> 0:08:06.800 there is a program where they can apply a hardship 0:08:06.800 --> 0:08:09.600 program for relief when they show that their income from 0:08:09.600 --> 0:08:11.520 rents is not matching up to their costs at a 0:08:11.600 --> 0:08:15.440 ratio that is allowing them to continue to operate that building. 0:08:15.760 --> 0:08:17.680 And that is a program that I will intend to 0:08:17.720 --> 0:08:20.280 continue to support because I believe it is important to 0:08:20.400 --> 0:08:23.080 ensure that we can keep all of these buildings in operation. 0:08:23.600 --> 0:08:26.480 I've heard that about Jersey City, that they've actually done 0:08:26.560 --> 0:08:29.520 a fairly good job of expanding housing supply. What is 0:08:29.600 --> 0:08:33.920 the role in your vision for more affordable housing for 0:08:34.200 --> 0:08:38.600 the private developers and the for profit developers and so forth, 0:08:38.760 --> 0:08:41.280 and you know, in your view, how can we actually 0:08:41.320 --> 0:08:44.319 move the dial in terms of housing production of we'll 0:08:44.360 --> 0:08:45.920 get into some of the stuff about I want to 0:08:45.920 --> 0:08:48.880 talk about the public housing too, or quote affordable housing, 0:08:49.000 --> 0:08:52.240 but for the private landlords, what can actually in your 0:08:52.320 --> 0:08:53.439 view move the dial on that. 0:08:53.960 --> 0:08:55.880 I think some of it has to do with the regulations. 0:08:55.920 --> 0:08:58.040 I was speaking of the fact that we continue to 0:08:58.080 --> 0:09:00.959 have this requirement to build parking and you build housing. 0:09:01.000 --> 0:09:03.360 That's not a requirement we should have any longer. The 0:09:03.480 --> 0:09:07.200 need for us to take advantage of our unique place 0:09:07.240 --> 0:09:09.640 in this country, and that we have mass transit hubs 0:09:09.679 --> 0:09:12.000 across the city and that should be a site of 0:09:12.280 --> 0:09:15.920 more housing density, and the fact that housing production has 0:09:15.960 --> 0:09:20.679 not been evenly distributed across this city, especially in wealthier neighborhoods. 0:09:21.000 --> 0:09:24.240 But I think even beyond that question of zoning, which 0:09:24.280 --> 0:09:26.000 is what a lot of this comes back to, there's 0:09:26.000 --> 0:09:28.560 also the question of process. We need to make it 0:09:28.679 --> 0:09:31.600 faster to build this housing and ensure that we don't 0:09:31.640 --> 0:09:34.240 see delay after delay after delay. And so one of 0:09:34.240 --> 0:09:37.000 the points of our housing plan is also to move 0:09:37.040 --> 0:09:40.080 away from the piecemeal process that is the one you 0:09:40.080 --> 0:09:42.760 can describe today as being where you have something known 0:09:42.800 --> 0:09:46.160 as member deference, where every city council member has the 0:09:46.240 --> 0:09:49.720 ultimate vote on whether or not a development goes up 0:09:49.800 --> 0:09:52.680 or down. We need to have a citywide approach, one 0:09:52.760 --> 0:09:56.000 that also fast tracks developments that are in line with 0:09:56.120 --> 0:09:59.680 the very priorities we've laid out with regards to housing production, 0:10:00.200 --> 0:10:03.760 labor standards, affordability, because it's been too long where we've 0:10:03.800 --> 0:10:08.120 seen proposals to build affordable housing for low income seniors 0:10:08.280 --> 0:10:12.760 languish for years in delays, and those delays all cost money, 0:10:12.920 --> 0:10:16.000 and that's also what drives up the cost of this production, 0:10:16.200 --> 0:10:18.200 and I think we need to streamline those processes. 0:10:18.240 --> 0:10:20.920 Actually, let's talk about that a little bit further. Because 0:10:21.000 --> 0:10:25.640 public housing, which you want to expand significantly, is very 0:10:25.679 --> 0:10:29.800 costly to build, and you know, there are certain standards 0:10:29.800 --> 0:10:32.199 of public housing. We expect it to last a very 0:10:32.240 --> 0:10:36.320 long time. There's priorities that it be carbon friendly, et cetera. 0:10:36.679 --> 0:10:40.920 But like public housing, production in New York City has 0:10:40.960 --> 0:10:43.760 been on parer cost wise, with even some very high 0:10:43.840 --> 0:10:48.120 end private construction. Hudson Yards on a per unit basis 0:10:48.320 --> 0:10:52.720 came in pretty similarly. This would be important regardless of 0:10:52.720 --> 0:10:55.280 how it's financed. How do you actually get the cost 0:10:55.400 --> 0:10:58.000 down in your view of public housing production. 0:10:58.400 --> 0:11:00.560 So the first thing I would do is just distinguish 0:11:00.640 --> 0:11:02.800 between what kind of housing we're speaking of when we 0:11:02.840 --> 0:11:05.280 say public housing, A lot of times we're referring to 0:11:06.040 --> 0:11:08.080 Nischa developments. Yeah, across the fire. 0:11:08.160 --> 0:11:10.760 That's when I said it. I was thinking Nische, Okay. 0:11:10.559 --> 0:11:12.640 Just to be clear, and I think that you know, 0:11:12.679 --> 0:11:16.959 what we've seen in Nischa is in many ways emblematic 0:11:17.040 --> 0:11:20.400 of a larger betrayal of working class New Yorkers. Nischa 0:11:20.559 --> 0:11:24.080 is technically underneath the auspices of the federal government, but 0:11:24.160 --> 0:11:26.440 the city and the state have an immense role to play, 0:11:26.960 --> 0:11:30.280 and we've seen over time, while the federal government has 0:11:30.320 --> 0:11:33.960 refused to fund the plan to put at least forty 0:11:34.000 --> 0:11:37.520 billion dollars towards Nischa to deal with an ever expanding 0:11:37.520 --> 0:11:40.959 amount of capital needs, the city since the time of Bloomberg, 0:11:41.080 --> 0:11:44.680 has started to narrow the amount of funding that it provides, 0:11:44.720 --> 0:11:46.679 and the state is not stepping up in the way 0:11:46.679 --> 0:11:49.840 that it should. Now in our housing plan, we propose 0:11:50.000 --> 0:11:53.800 doubling the amount of money we spend on preserving Nischa housing, 0:11:53.960 --> 0:11:56.960 because what we've seen is that, oftentimes it's easy to 0:11:57.000 --> 0:11:59.840 describe this housing crisis in New York City is solely 0:12:00.200 --> 0:12:03.600 of affordability, it's also a crisis of having a safe 0:12:03.600 --> 0:12:05.840 and habitable place to call your home. And as someone 0:12:05.840 --> 0:12:08.480 who represents the largest public housing development in North America, 0:12:08.559 --> 0:12:11.600 Queensbridge Houses, as well as the story of Houses Ravenswood Houses, 0:12:11.920 --> 0:12:15.200 I have seen so many of my constituents, seniors who 0:12:15.880 --> 0:12:18.080 are forced to walk up many flights of stairs because 0:12:18.120 --> 0:12:21.320 their elevator isn't working, who are waiting for months to 0:12:21.440 --> 0:12:23.840 have repairs be conducted, and who in a moment of 0:12:23.920 --> 0:12:27.080 housing crisis. Under Eric Adams, we've actually seen the time 0:12:27.080 --> 0:12:31.079 it takes to fill a vacant unit in Nische now 0:12:31.160 --> 0:12:33.400 exceed more than a year, which should be the easiest 0:12:33.400 --> 0:12:34.679 thing for city government to do. 0:12:50.400 --> 0:12:53.439 I want to talk about another plank of your platform 0:12:53.440 --> 0:12:56.920 that is of particular interest to us, and that is groceries. 0:12:57.040 --> 0:12:59.800 Of course, so a while ago, Joe and I recorded 0:12:59.840 --> 0:13:02.800 an episode on how New York actually gets its produce, 0:13:02.960 --> 0:13:05.960 and we learned about the importance of the Hunt's distribution 0:13:06.160 --> 0:13:09.960 terminal and all of that why grocery stores. 0:13:10.400 --> 0:13:14.560 You know, we are focused on the cost of living crisis, 0:13:14.679 --> 0:13:16.840 and when you ask New Yorkers whether they're making forty 0:13:16.880 --> 0:13:19.200 thousand dollars a year or two hundred thousand dollars a year, 0:13:19.440 --> 0:13:21.959 you will inevitably hear them speak about groceries and the 0:13:22.000 --> 0:13:24.960 sticker shock they feel in going back to the grocery 0:13:24.960 --> 0:13:27.680 store and their sense that that which they could afford 0:13:27.760 --> 0:13:31.199 years ago is now out of reach for them. And ultimately, 0:13:31.720 --> 0:13:35.800 groceries and food are a non negotiable part of being 0:13:35.800 --> 0:13:37.800 a New Yorker and living in any city in the world. 0:13:37.800 --> 0:13:39.280 You need to be able to afford it to build 0:13:39.280 --> 0:13:41.760 any kind of a life. And yet what we're seeing 0:13:41.800 --> 0:13:44.199 is that people are being priced out of produce. And 0:13:44.280 --> 0:13:47.559 when something is critically important to that dignity, I believe 0:13:47.600 --> 0:13:50.560 that there should be a public option for it. And 0:13:50.679 --> 0:13:55.880 what we have proposed is a reasonable policy experimentation in 0:13:55.920 --> 0:13:59.080 our city of a pilot program of a network of 0:13:59.200 --> 0:14:02.520 five municipals own grocery stores, one in each borough, that 0:14:02.559 --> 0:14:05.920 would respond to twin crises, one of affordability and two 0:14:06.080 --> 0:14:08.400 of food deserts, because, as I was saying earlier, as 0:14:08.400 --> 0:14:11.760 the representative of Queensbridge Houses, I will speak to constituents 0:14:11.800 --> 0:14:14.480 who live in the largest public housing development in North America, 0:14:14.559 --> 0:14:16.400 and they will ask me questions for which I don't 0:14:16.400 --> 0:14:19.760 have the answer, Questions like why are there five fast 0:14:19.760 --> 0:14:22.560 food restaurants in a five block radius? But I cannot 0:14:22.640 --> 0:14:25.000 find a place where I can get fresh produce that 0:14:25.040 --> 0:14:28.560 I can afford. And I hear that time and time again. 0:14:28.840 --> 0:14:31.200 And so what this proposal does is it not only 0:14:31.280 --> 0:14:34.480 guarantees cheaper groceries, but it also guarantees that those groceries 0:14:34.520 --> 0:14:36.640 can be in the very neighborhoods of New Yorkers that 0:14:36.680 --> 0:14:38.200 are being denied that service today. 0:14:38.560 --> 0:14:43.119 So some commentators have described this proposal as somewhat unusual 0:14:43.320 --> 0:14:46.520 in America. I actually don't think it's that unusual. I'm 0:14:46.560 --> 0:14:50.960 a former military brat and I vividly remember commissaries and 0:14:51.000 --> 0:14:56.600 bx's on military bases, and those were subsidized. Anyway, how 0:14:56.640 --> 0:14:59.960 do you, I guess, address the fears of critics who 0:15:00.160 --> 0:15:03.120 worry that this is going to devolve into some sort 0:15:03.160 --> 0:15:08.200 of Soviet style market where maybe I can only buy 0:15:08.680 --> 0:15:12.440 one specific brand of tuna fish versus like the five 0:15:12.560 --> 0:15:13.800 that are currently on offer. 0:15:14.000 --> 0:15:16.560 Well, the beauty of a pilot program is that it 0:15:16.600 --> 0:15:19.360 only expands if it's successful. Now I'm confident that it 0:15:19.400 --> 0:15:21.600 will be successful, and yet we will have to see 0:15:21.600 --> 0:15:24.200 those results themselves. And the reason we even came up 0:15:24.200 --> 0:15:26.640 with this is because of the successes of this model 0:15:26.760 --> 0:15:29.360 in Kansas, as well as what you said in the 0:15:29.400 --> 0:15:32.160 context of military bases across the country. And what we've 0:15:32.160 --> 0:15:34.240 also found is there was a feasibility study done in 0:15:34.320 --> 0:15:36.480 Chicago to see the applicability of this kind of a 0:15:36.480 --> 0:15:38.720 model in an urban setting, and it found it not 0:15:38.760 --> 0:15:43.400 only possible, but urgent and necessary. And that is the 0:15:43.440 --> 0:15:45.320 exact kind of approach we have to take here. And 0:15:45.360 --> 0:15:49.680 I think what's been quite interesting to me is state 0:15:49.720 --> 0:15:52.800 government in the time that I've been there, has had 0:15:52.800 --> 0:15:55.240 a similar recognition, but on a different topic, where it's 0:15:55.240 --> 0:15:57.960 said that gas prices are something that we can only 0:15:58.000 --> 0:15:59.640 allow to get up to a certain point, and when 0:15:59.640 --> 0:16:02.400 they go beyond that, we need to subsidize it to 0:16:02.480 --> 0:16:06.560 ensure that it's affordable. In twenty twenty two, the state 0:16:06.640 --> 0:16:09.880 spent more than six hundred million dollars to suspend portions 0:16:09.880 --> 0:16:13.640 of the gas tax, and yet we are watching as 0:16:13.680 --> 0:16:16.400 New Yorkers are being priced out of bread and milk 0:16:17.120 --> 0:16:20.000 and eggs, and we are saying that this is beyond 0:16:20.080 --> 0:16:22.200 our control. And I think that the last point I 0:16:22.240 --> 0:16:25.920 would make here is that our proposal is one that 0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:29.840 would cost sixty million dollars for all of those five together. 0:16:30.280 --> 0:16:32.160 That is less than half of the money the city 0:16:32.200 --> 0:16:35.920 is already spending on a program called City Fresh, which 0:16:35.960 --> 0:16:39.840 will subsidize corporate supermarkets in the hopes that they provide 0:16:39.880 --> 0:16:42.480 affordable groceries, but with no guarantee to that, and with 0:16:42.600 --> 0:16:45.440 no requirement for them to accept snap or wick, or 0:16:45.480 --> 0:16:48.480 to engage in collective bargaining, or to actually guarantee those 0:16:48.520 --> 0:16:51.480 cheaper groceries. So this is going to save the city 0:16:51.520 --> 0:16:54.640 money while piloting a program that we are confident will 0:16:54.680 --> 0:16:57.040 actually deliver the results that we have been denied in 0:16:57.080 --> 0:16:58.360 that existing program today. 0:16:58.440 --> 0:17:01.360 All right, I have two specifically questions on this. One 0:17:01.440 --> 0:17:07.000 is I understand, and I find intuitively logical, the idea 0:17:07.160 --> 0:17:10.480 that people should be able to afford produce and it's 0:17:10.680 --> 0:17:13.320 food has gotten very expensive at the grocery store. But 0:17:13.440 --> 0:17:18.199 grocery store margins themselves are pretty thin. Yeah, so in 0:17:18.280 --> 0:17:22.040 terms of like actually using the grocery store channel to 0:17:22.119 --> 0:17:26.080 deliver these cost savings, given that the retail stores margins 0:17:26.119 --> 0:17:28.560 are so thin, just three percent, why is that the 0:17:28.640 --> 0:17:32.560 dial rather than I don't know, give people a voucher 0:17:32.640 --> 0:17:35.120 so that they can order fresh direct or something like that. 0:17:35.480 --> 0:17:38.080 You know, I am someone who has been skeptical of 0:17:38.119 --> 0:17:41.959 the efficacy of a voucher based model, and what I 0:17:42.000 --> 0:17:44.879 am proposing with this idea of a network of municipal 0:17:45.000 --> 0:17:47.280 and grocery stores is not a means by which the 0:17:47.320 --> 0:17:49.840 city would make money and be able to increase that 0:17:49.880 --> 0:17:50.880 prosityty is like. 0:17:50.880 --> 0:17:53.199 The grocery level margins seem very thin. Now, I know 0:17:53.240 --> 0:17:54.920 you're not trying to make money. I'm just saying the 0:17:54.960 --> 0:17:57.000 margins seem thin. So if I think, like what moves 0:17:57.000 --> 0:18:03.600 the dial significantly on affordability, the actual retail level grocery 0:18:03.720 --> 0:18:06.880 does not strike me as where the big optional opportunity is. 0:18:06.880 --> 0:18:09.440 I think the opportunity we have with a city run 0:18:09.480 --> 0:18:14.320 model is that we can actually guarantee those cost savings. Right. 0:18:14.359 --> 0:18:17.919 We have heard national chains and executives speak on earning 0:18:17.960 --> 0:18:21.240 calls about how they've been able to blame covid era 0:18:21.359 --> 0:18:24.320 supply chain costs to increase profit margins even further. And 0:18:24.359 --> 0:18:26.439 what this would be as a clear mandate from the 0:18:26.440 --> 0:18:29.600 city that every single dollar we save we pass on. 0:18:29.760 --> 0:18:32.399 But beyond that, given that the mandate is not a 0:18:32.400 --> 0:18:35.159 profit based one, that we can also pass on further 0:18:35.240 --> 0:18:39.359 savings to ensure that things like milk and eggs and 0:18:39.440 --> 0:18:40.879 bread are actually affordable. 0:18:41.119 --> 0:18:44.879 So the other thing, and you sort of anticipated this question, 0:18:45.240 --> 0:18:49.439 which is you mentioned, for example, that in existing Nightscha 0:18:49.520 --> 0:18:52.080 housing people are waiting for a long time to get in, 0:18:52.280 --> 0:18:57.240 elevator repaired, and so forth, how do you ensure operational 0:18:57.440 --> 0:18:59.800 success Because I think people would say, oh, I've seen 0:18:59.800 --> 0:19:02.320 how Nightscha housing works. I guess I'm going to know 0:19:02.359 --> 0:19:04.480 how a city, a New York City run grocery store 0:19:04.640 --> 0:19:06.919 is going to work. And who knows if it's going 0:19:07.000 --> 0:19:09.159 to be open, and who knows if they're gonna, you know, 0:19:09.520 --> 0:19:12.400 keep the refrigerators repaired or if they're going to have 0:19:12.480 --> 0:19:15.440 tomatoes one day. I'm just saying, like you have already 0:19:15.480 --> 0:19:18.879 confirmed the idea that certain city run things are not 0:19:19.119 --> 0:19:22.879 run particularly well. So why should we why should the 0:19:22.920 --> 0:19:26.880 public have confidence that, even setting aside price, that these 0:19:26.920 --> 0:19:29.000 would be like run well, run efficiently. 0:19:29.640 --> 0:19:31.720 I have to earn the public's trust and I will 0:19:31.720 --> 0:19:33.840 do that every single day as the mayor of the city. 0:19:33.880 --> 0:19:37.640 And if you believe in public goods, in public services 0:19:37.640 --> 0:19:39.600 I do, it behooves you to believe in just as 0:19:39.680 --> 0:19:42.560 much in public excellence. And the first charges that you 0:19:42.640 --> 0:19:45.639 must have is to tackle that which has not displayed 0:19:45.640 --> 0:19:47.760 that excellence. I think Nischa is an example of that. 0:19:47.800 --> 0:19:50.080 I also think one of the reasons why I focus 0:19:50.119 --> 0:19:52.159 so much on the MTA in my time in the 0:19:52.160 --> 0:19:54.880 State Assembly has been because that's another example of that 0:19:55.280 --> 0:19:57.520 where we have a world class city and we do 0:19:57.560 --> 0:20:00.520 not have world class public transit. I love our p transit, 0:20:00.600 --> 0:20:03.359 I love our trains, our buses, I love riding a 0:20:03.400 --> 0:20:06.280 city bike, and yet I know that the way in 0:20:06.320 --> 0:20:08.800 which we are running it could be so much better. 0:20:09.240 --> 0:20:12.600 And what has excited me is that we've seen glimpses 0:20:12.880 --> 0:20:14.720 of what that excellence could look like. I mean, I 0:20:14.760 --> 0:20:18.600 remember when I went in to get my vaccine for COVID. 0:20:18.640 --> 0:20:21.199 I was in and out of that facility in fifteen minutes. 0:20:21.480 --> 0:20:24.280 And that to me was an example of the public 0:20:24.320 --> 0:20:26.720