1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,119 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:24,800 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hello, welcome 5 00:00:24,840 --> 00:00:26,440 Speaker 1: back to the show. My name is Matt, my name 6 00:00:26,480 --> 00:00:28,680 Speaker 1: is Noel. They call me Ben. We are joined, as 7 00:00:28,720 --> 00:00:32,559 Speaker 1: always with our super producer Paul mission controlled decand in spirit. 8 00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 1: Today we are joined in reality with our super producer 9 00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:39,920 Speaker 1: Maya Cole. So do say hello to her on the web. 10 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:43,040 Speaker 1: Most importantly, you are you. You are here, and that 11 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:47,560 Speaker 1: makes this stuff they don't want you to know. This 12 00:00:47,800 --> 00:00:50,120 Speaker 1: is uh an episode that I don't know about. You guys, 13 00:00:50,120 --> 00:00:52,360 Speaker 1: It's been on my mind for a long time. For 14 00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:56,959 Speaker 1: a number of years. Yeah, five five years to be exact. Matt, right, 15 00:00:57,120 --> 00:01:00,360 Speaker 1: has it been that long? It has? Indeed. The first 16 00:01:00,440 --> 00:01:04,959 Speaker 1: season of True Detective premiered in fourteen. This series, written 17 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 1: by an author named Nick Pizolatto, seemed set to change 18 00:01:09,280 --> 00:01:12,560 Speaker 1: the face of television as we knew. It's one of 19 00:01:12,560 --> 00:01:16,560 Speaker 1: those prestige programs that's kind of like a very long 20 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:21,600 Speaker 1: serialized film, like The Wire Right or Breaking Bad. Maybe 21 00:01:21,640 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 1: the Sopranos would be another one sure, and then of 22 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:28,880 Speaker 1: course lost right, all these things that change the way 23 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:32,319 Speaker 1: we look at formats and the way we look at storytelling. 24 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:35,920 Speaker 1: True Detective made this enormous impact on the zeitgeist, the 25 00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:38,800 Speaker 1: spirit of our age, and a lot of people said, 26 00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:45,360 Speaker 1: where do these ideas come from? What possessed you, Nick 27 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 1: Nicholas to create something this dark and deranged and gritty 28 00:01:51,920 --> 00:01:55,360 Speaker 1: and horrifying? Can I do a shameless plug really quick? 29 00:01:55,840 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 1: Nick Pisolato actually wrote an episode for a series that's 30 00:01:59,680 --> 00:02:02,440 Speaker 1: coming out that I worked on called baron a Banjo. 31 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:06,800 Speaker 1: He wrote the the ultimate episode, the finale. Really yeah, 32 00:02:07,120 --> 00:02:10,440 Speaker 1: they wrote the story. Yeah, well it's not horrifying at all. 33 00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:12,200 Speaker 1: It's a little bit of a ghost story, honestly, but 34 00:02:12,240 --> 00:02:15,400 Speaker 1: it's definitely lighter fair than when he wrote and True Detective. 35 00:02:15,520 --> 00:02:18,000 Speaker 1: But check it out in the first episode of the 36 00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:22,079 Speaker 1: show drops tomorrow, in fact, which is the the second 37 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:23,880 Speaker 1: of October, so this will be in the past by then, 38 00:02:23,880 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: but check it out. That's fantastic. True Detective was really 39 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:30,960 Speaker 1: one of those shows that had the tone somewhere between 40 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:32,920 Speaker 1: a film noir and a weird fiction, right, And I 41 00:02:32,960 --> 00:02:35,680 Speaker 1: think that's why a lot of people latched onto it, 42 00:02:36,080 --> 00:02:39,080 Speaker 1: and it felt kind of like you're saying, Ben, it 43 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:44,359 Speaker 1: felt so out there the main storyline where there was 44 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:50,000 Speaker 1: corruption and terrible things happening to children. Um, at least 45 00:02:50,120 --> 00:02:54,200 Speaker 1: it didn't feel real, right, But as we found out, 46 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:57,880 Speaker 1: maybe there's something else to it. That's that's correct that 47 00:02:58,120 --> 00:03:01,400 Speaker 1: we do want to issue this disclaimer at the top 48 00:03:01,520 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 1: of today's episode. Uh. This episode contains not only spoilers 49 00:03:06,600 --> 00:03:09,120 Speaker 1: for True Detective season one and probably a little bit 50 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 1: of trash talking about True Detective season two. For being honest, 51 00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:21,079 Speaker 1: this also contains discussion of graphic crimes of a sexual nature. UH. 52 00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:27,400 Speaker 1: The discussion of animal cruelty abuse very very heavy, disturbing, 53 00:03:27,480 --> 00:03:33,079 Speaker 1: potentially triggering things, so listener discretion is advised. Here are 54 00:03:33,120 --> 00:03:38,040 Speaker 1: the facts True Detective, the peak behind the Curtain. The 55 00:03:38,120 --> 00:03:40,920 Speaker 1: three of us really love this show when it came 56 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:43,839 Speaker 1: out in it In a way, True Detective could be 57 00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:47,320 Speaker 1: described as an anthology. Each season their three seasons so 58 00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:51,920 Speaker 1: far takes place in this It's its own self contained 59 00:03:52,480 --> 00:03:56,640 Speaker 1: narrative that maybe exists in the same universe. Each season 60 00:03:56,680 --> 00:03:59,160 Speaker 1: will follow a different set of characters as the attempt 61 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 1: to unravel UH. The twisted story of a crime right 62 00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: or as you noted in some cases, high that story. 63 00:04:06,600 --> 00:04:12,560 Speaker 1: True Detective Season one takes this just wonderful nonlinear approach. 64 00:04:12,600 --> 00:04:16,760 Speaker 1: It follows two homicide detectives in Louisiana from their initial 65 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:19,720 Speaker 1: investigation of the murder of a sex worker in the 66 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 1: mid nineties to their very problematic reunion and their relaunch 67 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 1: of the investigation almost twenty years later. Here are the spoilers. 68 00:04:31,360 --> 00:04:34,080 Speaker 1: Spoiler alert if you do not want to be spoiled. 69 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:36,960 Speaker 1: If you haven't seen True Detective and you're gonna get 70 00:04:37,040 --> 00:04:41,719 Speaker 1: angry about spoilers, fast forward past this part. It gets 71 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:45,160 Speaker 1: It gets very strange, very quickly. Interestingly enough, True Detective 72 00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 1: is actually a one of the very first true crime magazines. 73 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:52,840 Speaker 1: Is kind of a pulpy, trashy true crime rag that published, 74 00:04:52,880 --> 00:04:55,400 Speaker 1: i think from the forties up until the seventies, and 75 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:59,560 Speaker 1: it was all of these gritty, grizzly details about actual murders. 76 00:04:59,560 --> 00:05:04,279 Speaker 1: So in this series the first season, our detectives are heroes, 77 00:05:04,360 --> 00:05:06,840 Speaker 1: are sort of anti heroes in certain ways. It's interesting 78 00:05:06,880 --> 00:05:09,400 Speaker 1: that the dynamic there between them will get more into 79 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:17,159 Speaker 1: They come across a very deep, uh running intergenerational conspiracy um, 80 00:05:17,200 --> 00:05:21,240 Speaker 1: a secret cult with members across Louisiana society UM that 81 00:05:21,360 --> 00:05:25,360 Speaker 1: ritualizes sexual assault and murder, and members of the cults 82 00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 1: are prominent figures in the community, politicians, religious figures, pastors, 83 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:34,200 Speaker 1: drug dealers, high level drug dealers, and more. Um there's 84 00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:40,719 Speaker 1: a absolutely insidious use of smoke screens, using thing places 85 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:44,600 Speaker 1: like youth centers and churches and other spots that are 86 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:49,680 Speaker 1: sort of unimpeachable in their sanctity right, trustworthy institutions used 87 00:05:49,680 --> 00:05:54,840 Speaker 1: to cover up these horrific crimes. And while the detectives 88 00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:59,599 Speaker 1: Marty and Rust do manage to eventually solve the immediate 89 00:05:59,640 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 1: cry which set them off on this this deranged journey, 90 00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:07,520 Speaker 1: they are not able to get complete justice. They are 91 00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:11,080 Speaker 1: not able to arrest the entire cult. And it's strongly 92 00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:14,279 Speaker 1: implied that this cult continues on in some form and 93 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:17,640 Speaker 1: even worse, some of the members of the cult, the 94 00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:21,120 Speaker 1: prominent ones you mentioned earlier, all retain their positions in society. 95 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:23,840 Speaker 1: They get away, nothing bad happens to them. Yeah, that's 96 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:27,559 Speaker 1: the worst part of the thought that they that it's over. 97 00:06:28,520 --> 00:06:31,040 Speaker 1: It's over for those detectives because the case is over, 98 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:34,919 Speaker 1: but they will never be able to bring the actual 99 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:40,120 Speaker 1: or even no the like true extent of that operating conspiracy, right, 100 00:06:40,760 --> 00:06:43,440 Speaker 1: nor the history of it or how far back it goes. 101 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 1: This work draws inspiration from a lot of places. First 102 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:55,040 Speaker 1: would be The King in Yellow, Delightful disturbing book by 103 00:06:55,240 --> 00:07:00,480 Speaker 1: Robert W. Chambers. It's an anthology of semi links stories, 104 00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 1: and four of these stories reference a mysterious work, a 105 00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:09,280 Speaker 1: play called The King and Yellow that is about this 106 00:07:09,400 --> 00:07:12,920 Speaker 1: same figure, the supernatural character called the King and Yellow 107 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 1: or the Yellow King. And you never read the play 108 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:20,120 Speaker 1: in full. You only see it alluded to because when 109 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:22,560 Speaker 1: people read this play or when they see it performed, 110 00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:28,280 Speaker 1: drives them insane. You can see some excerpts in it. Uh, 111 00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:33,360 Speaker 1: there was in the story Casilda's Song. There's a line 112 00:07:33,400 --> 00:07:36,640 Speaker 1: from act one, scene two of the play, and I'll 113 00:07:36,680 --> 00:07:40,080 Speaker 1: just read this part song of my soul. My voice 114 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:43,480 Speaker 1: is dead, die out, unsung as tears on shed, shall 115 00:07:43,560 --> 00:07:48,360 Speaker 1: dry and die in lost Carcosa, Carcosa ringing any bells? Right? 116 00:07:49,600 --> 00:07:54,760 Speaker 1: And this so this was like atmospheric tone, right, cosmic horror, 117 00:07:54,840 --> 00:07:59,640 Speaker 1: which is explored, you know, in in True Detective. But 118 00:07:59,680 --> 00:08:03,920 Speaker 1: it's not it's not a supernatural monster film, right, It's 119 00:08:03,960 --> 00:08:07,000 Speaker 1: not a supernatural monster story, there's this it feels like 120 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:09,840 Speaker 1: it's teetering on the edge of it. It is always yeah, 121 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:12,320 Speaker 1: never really gets there. I think that's one thing that 122 00:08:12,360 --> 00:08:14,240 Speaker 1: maybe was a little bit of a letdown for some 123 00:08:14,280 --> 00:08:16,280 Speaker 1: folks near the mirroring the end of the season is 124 00:08:16,440 --> 00:08:18,520 Speaker 1: I think there was an expectation there was gonna be 125 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:22,200 Speaker 1: some supernatural qualities and that spoiler alert didn't really pan 126 00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 1: out that way. There's some interesting fan theories which cannot 127 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:29,640 Speaker 1: be cannot be proven or disproven without you know, talking 128 00:08:29,680 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 1: to Nick. But but if you want to lose an afternoon, 129 00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:37,120 Speaker 1: it's a great way to spend it. The one the 130 00:08:37,160 --> 00:08:43,560 Speaker 1: other literary influence that Pizolatto sites is called The Conspiracy 131 00:08:43,559 --> 00:08:47,040 Speaker 1: against the Human Race. It's nonfiction essays by a horror 132 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:51,680 Speaker 1: writer named Thomas Logatti who was an amazing, very unhappy writer. 133 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:55,560 Speaker 1: Bad things happened in his stories, so as we know. 134 00:08:56,080 --> 00:08:58,959 Speaker 1: In the in the story True Detective season one, there's 135 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:04,120 Speaker 1: the detective Us Cole, played uh pitch perfectly by Matthew McConaughey, 136 00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:07,000 Speaker 1: and Rust Cole is just over the idea of people. 137 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:12,000 Speaker 1: He has a pessimistic of philosophy that he expounds upon 138 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:15,719 Speaker 1: apparently every time they're in a car kind of and 139 00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:19,920 Speaker 1: he is also what we would call an anti natalist, 140 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:23,480 Speaker 1: someone who thinks that, uh, people are born and that's 141 00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: a negative thing. And it gets worse from there. Absolutely, 142 00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:29,360 Speaker 1: I mean, it's definitely a philosophy that is much more 143 00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:33,560 Speaker 1: prominent in his grizzled older version of the character. The 144 00:09:33,640 --> 00:09:36,520 Speaker 1: younger one he sees definitely still got that vibe and 145 00:09:36,559 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 1: he's constantly pissing off his partner played by Woody Harrelson 146 00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:42,880 Speaker 1: for being a bit of a pill and and well 147 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:47,079 Speaker 1: that's that happens later. But yeah, absolutely, But the uh, 148 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:50,680 Speaker 1: the story is framed in like a past and future 149 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:54,520 Speaker 1: kind of cross cutting, and the future Russ Cole is 150 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:57,880 Speaker 1: in a not a deposition, but he's being interrogated by 151 00:09:58,360 --> 00:10:01,880 Speaker 1: police officers from I guess would be modern day and 152 00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:06,440 Speaker 1: he's clearly been through some oh yeah, and this is 153 00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:09,320 Speaker 1: where a lot of his his statements come out, you know, 154 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:13,200 Speaker 1: not not a deposition, but that interview, right, and in 155 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:17,439 Speaker 1: earlier interviews outside of the universe of the show, as 156 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:21,719 Speaker 1: we said, Nick Pizolato said, well this did influence me. 157 00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:25,360 Speaker 1: This is an amazing piece of literature. But he was 158 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:28,960 Speaker 1: initially accused of plagiarism because of the similarity between Cole's 159 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:32,680 Speaker 1: dialogue and Legati's writing, And he does say there's an influence, 160 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:35,000 Speaker 1: but he does deny that he was in any way 161 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 1: of plagiaris. But these are just two atmospheric philosophical things. 162 00:10:40,679 --> 00:10:42,839 Speaker 1: They are the side, They are the sauce. They are 163 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:45,880 Speaker 1: not the main dish. The main dish, as you mentioned earlier, 164 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:50,600 Speaker 1: Matt is the terrible, terrible unfolding of events in the 165 00:10:50,640 --> 00:10:53,240 Speaker 1: course of the plot. And that leads us to today's question, 166 00:10:53,600 --> 00:10:56,439 Speaker 1: what if there is more to the story. What if 167 00:10:56,520 --> 00:11:00,840 Speaker 1: True Detective doesn't just take inspiration from works of fiction. 168 00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:06,840 Speaker 1: What if there is a real story behind this television show. 169 00:11:06,880 --> 00:11:08,680 Speaker 1: What if there is, for lack of a better phrase, 170 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 1: a true true Detective. We'll learn more afterward from our sponsor. 171 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:24,400 Speaker 1: Here's where it gets crazy. So all the you know, 172 00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:28,040 Speaker 1: the things that we see on screen, the overall characters, 173 00:11:28,360 --> 00:11:31,720 Speaker 1: and you know roughly the place and all of these things. 174 00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:36,000 Speaker 1: The details in True Detective are fictional, right, I mean 175 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:39,200 Speaker 1: that we can all agree on that it's a fictional 176 00:11:39,240 --> 00:11:45,280 Speaker 1: show about a fictional thing. However, there appears to be 177 00:11:45,400 --> 00:11:49,800 Speaker 1: at least one particular occurrence that you know, really was 178 00:11:49,840 --> 00:11:53,720 Speaker 1: a decade that it really hits troublingly close to what 179 00:11:53,920 --> 00:11:57,640 Speaker 1: is explored, at least within the television show. Right right, 180 00:11:57,800 --> 00:12:04,199 Speaker 1: we'll travel to poncha Tula, Louisiana. Now off air. The 181 00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:08,360 Speaker 1: three of us were flexing our or Southern accent muscles. 182 00:12:08,840 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 1: We we love a good we love a good down 183 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:14,880 Speaker 1: South voice. I'm gonna try not to fall into it 184 00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:18,199 Speaker 1: because this is serious stuff, but it might happen. There 185 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:20,800 Speaker 1: is a place where there was a place in Ponchatoula, 186 00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:25,079 Speaker 1: Louisiana called Hosanna Church was founded by a pastor named 187 00:12:25,280 --> 00:12:29,680 Speaker 1: Louis Lamonica. And originally when they started, they had less 188 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:32,760 Speaker 1: than twenty four people, less than twenty four congregates. It's 189 00:12:32,800 --> 00:12:35,440 Speaker 1: a very small church, but it's not unusual for churches 190 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:38,680 Speaker 1: to start small, right, yes, true, And in the seventies 191 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:42,520 Speaker 1: this church was attended regularly by around a thousand people. 192 00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:45,959 Speaker 1: I wonder what changed. The facilities of Hosanna Church had 193 00:12:46,040 --> 00:12:49,320 Speaker 1: a sanctuary and behind that there was eight children's school 194 00:12:49,679 --> 00:12:52,959 Speaker 1: and um Louis Lamonica, the founder and had pastor like 195 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:56,640 Speaker 1: you mentioned men passed away in ninety four and the 196 00:12:56,720 --> 00:13:00,360 Speaker 1: church went through about a decade of various temporary leaders 197 00:13:00,440 --> 00:13:05,600 Speaker 1: until Louis Lemonica's son, Louis Lemonica Jr. Took the reins. 198 00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:09,720 Speaker 1: It should be noted here that the original Louis Lemonica Sr. 199 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:12,599 Speaker 1: Was seen as kind of a paragon of the community. 200 00:13:13,160 --> 00:13:16,319 Speaker 1: He was beloved by both people that went to the 201 00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:19,720 Speaker 1: church and known by people who just lived in the parish. 202 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:22,040 Speaker 1: At least that's the story. And he was kind of 203 00:13:22,040 --> 00:13:24,720 Speaker 1: a ned Flanders. You get the vibe when you read 204 00:13:24,920 --> 00:13:28,280 Speaker 1: people read people's accounts of meeting him and living with him. 205 00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:33,120 Speaker 1: Not so for junior uh Louis Lamonica Jr. When he 206 00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 1: took the When he took leadership of the church began 207 00:13:37,760 --> 00:13:41,520 Speaker 1: circling the wagons, things started to look strange for people 208 00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:44,800 Speaker 1: on the outside of the church walls. He started excommunicating 209 00:13:44,880 --> 00:13:48,880 Speaker 1: church members for various perceived slights or sins or missteps. 210 00:13:49,600 --> 00:13:52,640 Speaker 1: It could be a disagreement over doctrine, sure, but if 211 00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:56,560 Speaker 1: they attended another church even once, they would be excommunicated. 212 00:13:57,120 --> 00:14:02,199 Speaker 1: One popular competitor was Harvest World Reach Ministries, started by 213 00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:07,640 Speaker 1: the former youth minister of Hasana Church. This is troubling. 214 00:14:07,760 --> 00:14:11,160 Speaker 1: A few years back we did um We did a 215 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:16,080 Speaker 1: video in which we broke down the ways that cults 216 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:19,880 Speaker 1: operate on the human mind. And one of the first, 217 00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:22,600 Speaker 1: one of the very first things a lot of cults 218 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:25,440 Speaker 1: will do when they're moving from being, you know, a 219 00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:29,360 Speaker 1: religion to an actual cult of some sort is they 220 00:14:29,360 --> 00:14:34,680 Speaker 1: will isolate the members, They'll isolate the followers. This you 221 00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:37,040 Speaker 1: can see the video if you want, but this, this 222 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:40,200 Speaker 1: isolation itself. It's important to note this is not a crime. 223 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:44,120 Speaker 1: This is just people deciding to live together in a 224 00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:46,640 Speaker 1: like minded way, and there is not a law against it. 225 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:49,960 Speaker 1: You can't really write a law against it, because you know, 226 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:51,920 Speaker 1: if people want to do things that other people think 227 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:54,320 Speaker 1: are weird, more power to them, so long as they're 228 00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:58,200 Speaker 1: not hurting anyone. Yeah, yeah, you're right. I just want 229 00:14:58,240 --> 00:15:00,120 Speaker 1: to point out here really quickly that I've been a 230 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:05,720 Speaker 1: part of several church movements where um, my family and 231 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 1: I followed a pastor to a different church, and it 232 00:15:10,040 --> 00:15:12,880 Speaker 1: wasn't so much about the church itself. It was a 233 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:15,440 Speaker 1: lot about the people that were there, the congregation, but 234 00:15:15,560 --> 00:15:18,680 Speaker 1: it was more about the experience you get when you're 235 00:15:18,760 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 1: you know, sitting in a pew listening to a pastor speak, right, 236 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:23,720 Speaker 1: because it really is in a lot of ways of 237 00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:26,600 Speaker 1: performance and do I like this performance doesn't resonate with me. 238 00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:31,320 Speaker 1: That's how it goes. And that's not inherently insidious, right, 239 00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:33,920 Speaker 1: And it's just a personal preference where it's like, I 240 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 1: like this guy versus others, And why would I, you know, 241 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:39,160 Speaker 1: why would I get something different at the dinner? You know, 242 00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:41,920 Speaker 1: I like my corn beef sandwich. Well, yeah, And it 243 00:15:41,960 --> 00:15:43,560 Speaker 1: hits in the nature of this and and just to 244 00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:46,560 Speaker 1: get into that background a little bit, having this this 245 00:15:46,680 --> 00:15:49,120 Speaker 1: person that you trust and have grown up with. Ostensibly 246 00:15:49,160 --> 00:15:52,280 Speaker 1: you probably had maybe had kids while this pastor was 247 00:15:52,360 --> 00:15:55,720 Speaker 1: the head of your church, and whatever occurred in your life, 248 00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:58,680 Speaker 1: you went through high school, whatever it is. Um then 249 00:15:58,720 --> 00:16:01,120 Speaker 1: he passes away. They you go through all these temporary 250 00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:03,000 Speaker 1: things and this new guy comes through. And I'm just 251 00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:07,120 Speaker 1: imagining being in the mindset of one of his congregation, 252 00:16:07,560 --> 00:16:10,200 Speaker 1: what you're what you're feeling as all of this stuff 253 00:16:10,200 --> 00:16:13,120 Speaker 1: starts to happen that you're describing then where he seems 254 00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:15,960 Speaker 1: to be either going off the rails or at least 255 00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:19,440 Speaker 1: uh handling the reins in a very different way. So 256 00:16:19,520 --> 00:16:22,640 Speaker 1: you think he was calling the members of the congregation 257 00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:26,640 Speaker 1: that would not be susceptible to this new regime that 258 00:16:26,680 --> 00:16:29,080 Speaker 1: he was trying to bring about, right, I think someone 259 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:36,960 Speaker 1: was that's yeah, well there's a twist to that. Uh so, Lamonica. Also, 260 00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:39,280 Speaker 1: just like you said, I love that you put out culling. 261 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:41,520 Speaker 1: That's a good way to describe it. He also fought 262 00:16:41,520 --> 00:16:44,000 Speaker 1: with the church's staff, other people who would be in 263 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:48,320 Speaker 1: the power structure, and he ordered multiple staff members to 264 00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:51,760 Speaker 1: skedattle to leave the church and never returned, including the 265 00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:55,120 Speaker 1: church's secretary, who is his mother. He kicked his mom 266 00:16:55,280 --> 00:16:59,240 Speaker 1: out of the church. Yeah, and it really doesn't make 267 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:02,720 Speaker 1: sense to me unless it is something a little off handed, 268 00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:05,080 Speaker 1: if they we're dealing with here, Because a church like that, 269 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:08,160 Speaker 1: especially as smaller church, even if you've got a thousand members, 270 00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:14,320 Speaker 1: you you exist because every Sunday and whatever other fundraiser, 271 00:17:14,359 --> 00:17:17,200 Speaker 1: you're having people put money into a plate and that 272 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:20,719 Speaker 1: goes into the church fund, right, and no matter how many, 273 00:17:20,960 --> 00:17:23,320 Speaker 1: no matter how small of a contribution. Let's say it's 274 00:17:23,400 --> 00:17:28,199 Speaker 1: just ten dollars every Sunday, maybe five dollars, maybe up 275 00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:31,320 Speaker 1: to twenty or more. Getting rid of that on a 276 00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 1: monthly basis. If you think about it like a Netflix 277 00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 1: subscription or something that, uh, that's going to ruin a 278 00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:42,840 Speaker 1: church really fast. Absolutely, And speaking of scandal, it was 279 00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:46,400 Speaker 1: during this time, by their own confession, it was during 280 00:17:46,440 --> 00:17:49,600 Speaker 1: this time that members of the Hosanna Church were routinely 281 00:17:49,840 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 1: ritualistically assaulting children and animals. The following information may not 282 00:17:57,400 --> 00:18:01,080 Speaker 1: be suitable for all listeners. This come from the New 283 00:18:01,160 --> 00:18:03,879 Speaker 1: York Times. We have an excerpt here and we're using 284 00:18:03,920 --> 00:18:07,080 Speaker 1: it to summarize some of the events, but also to 285 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:10,439 Speaker 1: underline to emphasize that this was not something that was 286 00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:13,840 Speaker 1: reported in fringe sources. This was in papers of note. 287 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:18,240 Speaker 1: This was huge news New York Times, says. Sheriff Daniel H. 288 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:21,880 Speaker 1: Edwards of Tangitpota said that as many as twenty five children, 289 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:25,280 Speaker 1: about evenly split between boys and girls, might have been 290 00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:28,360 Speaker 1: involved in sex acts at the youth center there in Hosanna, 291 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:30,960 Speaker 1: in cars and in the homes of at least two 292 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:34,480 Speaker 1: of those charged. The abuse, according to Edwards, seems to 293 00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 1: have begun in and stopped occurring on church grounds after 294 00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:42,399 Speaker 1: two thousand and three. However, Edwards went on to say, 295 00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 1: nobody really believes they just stopped abusing children. Yeah, it's true. 296 00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:51,119 Speaker 1: Edwards said that the group apparently had a pretty effective 297 00:18:51,160 --> 00:18:55,160 Speaker 1: formula for going under the radar. And that was, as 298 00:18:55,200 --> 00:18:58,920 Speaker 1: we mentioned the same in Tree Detective, using the church 299 00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:03,159 Speaker 1: um and that close knit relationship between the members and 300 00:19:03,320 --> 00:19:07,000 Speaker 1: victims who would very likely look the other way when 301 00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:11,560 Speaker 1: it came to reporting these abuses to authorities, for sure. 302 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:15,000 Speaker 1: And he didn't actually say, hey, look guys, everybody, we've 303 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:18,080 Speaker 1: got devil worshiping going on here and it's a cult 304 00:19:18,119 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 1: they never do well. You Yeah, that's a pretty heavy claim, right. 305 00:19:22,920 --> 00:19:25,760 Speaker 1: It almost feels you wouldn't be able to really print 306 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:30,760 Speaker 1: that necessarily because that is such an accusation. But it's, uh, 307 00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:34,359 Speaker 1: what they were doing there? What what? At least some 308 00:19:34,400 --> 00:19:36,119 Speaker 1: of the defendants who were involved in some of the 309 00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:40,080 Speaker 1: cases that came out of this um, they told investigators 310 00:19:40,080 --> 00:19:43,560 Speaker 1: that quote devil worship was the reason for their participation 311 00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:47,320 Speaker 1: in doing these atrocities to children and animals. I guess 312 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:49,640 Speaker 1: what I was getting at is like, it's a slippery 313 00:19:49,680 --> 00:19:52,440 Speaker 1: slope kind of situation when you're indoctrinated into a cult. 314 00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:54,639 Speaker 1: No one says, hey, I want to join my cult. 315 00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:58,879 Speaker 1: It's kind of like that mission creep, right, you know. 316 00:19:59,160 --> 00:20:01,399 Speaker 1: It happens a little over time and then before you 317 00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:04,760 Speaker 1: know it, it's like the boiling frog kind of situation. 318 00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:07,200 Speaker 1: You know, it takes a little while and then before 319 00:20:07,240 --> 00:20:09,240 Speaker 1: you know it. This is just the situation you find 320 00:20:09,240 --> 00:20:11,400 Speaker 1: yourself in and you don't know how to get out. 321 00:20:11,520 --> 00:20:13,960 Speaker 1: But in this case, they're saying like, yeah, we joined 322 00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:16,480 Speaker 1: this thing that I guess could be considered a cult 323 00:20:16,560 --> 00:20:19,680 Speaker 1: because we wanted to be a part of the devil worship, right, 324 00:20:19,840 --> 00:20:23,760 Speaker 1: And I'm just laughing a little bit because when you said, 325 00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:26,480 Speaker 1: nobody comes up and says, hey, we joined my cult 326 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:30,600 Speaker 1: because we did a little bit of sketch comedy and 327 00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:34,399 Speaker 1: in that cult video, that's exactly what you said. And 328 00:20:34,600 --> 00:20:39,359 Speaker 1: that's exactly Yeah, with Matt as our as our dear leader, 329 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:43,840 Speaker 1: our spiritual guru, still ready to you know, kick that 330 00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:46,080 Speaker 1: thing back up in action whenever you guys, are I 331 00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:49,120 Speaker 1: miss being a deity? So you know, I you had 332 00:20:49,160 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 1: a gift for it. Let's see, Chuck was on board, 333 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:56,280 Speaker 1: we had a lot of Jonathan Strickland was on board. Yes. Yeah. 334 00:20:56,480 --> 00:21:01,640 Speaker 1: So in this case, at the point the events occurring 335 00:21:02,440 --> 00:21:06,040 Speaker 1: in the Hasannah Church community appeared to be a genuine 336 00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:09,760 Speaker 1: case of devil worship. La Monica and his inner circles 337 00:21:09,800 --> 00:21:13,359 Speaker 1: said that they murdered and defiled animals. They sacrificed cats, 338 00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:17,960 Speaker 1: They sexually assaulted at least one dog, while irreparably damaging 339 00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:21,840 Speaker 1: the lives and the minds of multiple child victims. The 340 00:21:21,920 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 1: criminals evolved apparently used pentagrams, they wore robes and other 341 00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:30,000 Speaker 1: props in the course of their crimes, and some of 342 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:34,160 Speaker 1: their victims were their very own children, their own biological offspring. 343 00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:36,960 Speaker 1: There's no other way to say it. If this is true, 344 00:21:37,000 --> 00:21:40,760 Speaker 1: it's a genuine case of ritualized satanic abuse. And we've 345 00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:43,800 Speaker 1: talked about it before the outbreak of hysteria that is 346 00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:47,680 Speaker 1: now called the Satanic Panic, which gripped American waves throughout 347 00:21:47,720 --> 00:21:51,919 Speaker 1: the late eighties and the nineties. Most of the things, 348 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:56,040 Speaker 1: most of the stories we heard about Satanic panic cases 349 00:21:56,359 --> 00:21:58,920 Speaker 1: later turned out to be groundless. We're not saying none 350 00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:01,000 Speaker 1: of them were true. We're saying that there was very 351 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:05,400 Speaker 1: little actual proof, but the media didn't really care. This 352 00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:11,000 Speaker 1: was fantastic fodder for sixty minutes type investigations and grizzly 353 00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:13,639 Speaker 1: segments on the evening news. There just didn't seem to 354 00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:18,080 Speaker 1: be too much reality to many of these stories. This case, however, 355 00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:21,960 Speaker 1: at least at the at first appears to be an 356 00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:26,000 Speaker 1: exception and one that almost went undiscovered. Authorities didn't learn 357 00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:29,719 Speaker 1: about the crimes until two thousand and five, right, And 358 00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:33,879 Speaker 1: it started in the nineties. And that's when Nicole Bernard, 359 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:36,160 Speaker 1: who was thirty six years old at the time, called 360 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:40,280 Speaker 1: the Sheriff's office there in Louisiana from Black Lick, Ohio 361 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:43,080 Speaker 1: to say she had fled town to save her child 362 00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 1: from abuse. And then the authorities learned that members of 363 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:51,159 Speaker 1: the town knew something was rotten much much earlier. So 364 00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:55,240 Speaker 1: the Telegraph actually reported the church had attempted to intimidate 365 00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:59,080 Speaker 1: some of the other residents of the area. They cited 366 00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:03,440 Speaker 1: Tim Norman, who was a property developer, retired property developer UM, 367 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:06,000 Speaker 1: who was a resident who lived very close by to 368 00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:09,560 Speaker 1: the church. UM. He was quoted as saying that Lamonica 369 00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:14,960 Speaker 1: and his congregation UM had essentially waged war against him, 370 00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:19,879 Speaker 1: a war of intimidation, a campaign to try to force 371 00:23:20,040 --> 00:23:23,440 Speaker 1: him out of the community. Yeah. When he he made 372 00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:26,679 Speaker 1: a lot of accusations about what was going on. Some 373 00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:30,200 Speaker 1: of them were again a little more colorful than others. UM. 374 00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:34,879 Speaker 1: One thing he references is some kind of Native American 375 00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:40,119 Speaker 1: chanting or you know, vocalizations that he characterizes them a 376 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:45,480 Speaker 1: little differently. Um, but like whooping noises perhaps, Yeah, that 377 00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:49,160 Speaker 1: that that would occur by the congregation in his garden 378 00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:51,760 Speaker 1: or you know, out near his property, or perhaps even 379 00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:55,320 Speaker 1: on his property, and that their behavior would just increasingly 380 00:23:55,359 --> 00:23:59,800 Speaker 1: get stranger and stranger. My favorite lines still from it 381 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:03,920 Speaker 1: is just it's stuck out to me reading this guy's accounts. 382 00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:06,960 Speaker 1: I'm not going to do a voice out of respect. 383 00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:09,760 Speaker 1: But they wanted to baptize their children in my creek, 384 00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:13,040 Speaker 1: which isn't that crazy on the surface, Like we got 385 00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:15,200 Speaker 1: a body of water, we want to baptize somebody. Hey, 386 00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:18,200 Speaker 1: that's not too bad. But I said, you can't do 387 00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:21,800 Speaker 1: that here. There's gators in there. Yeah, which is also 388 00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:24,399 Speaker 1: probably true. Checks out, Probably it's true. But at the 389 00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:27,199 Speaker 1: same time, what does that imply like that wouldn't have 390 00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:30,040 Speaker 1: been part of the ritual? I mean, what the fact 391 00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:31,680 Speaker 1: that there are gators in there, like they don't want 392 00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:34,760 Speaker 1: to die? Oh no, he's just he's giving us a 393 00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 1: contrast as the non member who lives in the area. 394 00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:40,879 Speaker 1: But did this guy not sound like a bit of 395 00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:45,560 Speaker 1: a kuku? Yeah, a little bit, certainly a little bit, 396 00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:49,600 Speaker 1: but he also is referencing and maybe he's just mischaracterizing 397 00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:52,240 Speaker 1: some of the noises that he's hearing because his his 398 00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:56,520 Speaker 1: property really was in in close proximity to the buildings 399 00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:59,320 Speaker 1: where things were allegedly occurring. Well, it reminds me of 400 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:02,520 Speaker 1: the Georgia Guidestone story where we we did a little 401 00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:05,199 Speaker 1: film for Amazon about that, and we've talked about it 402 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,720 Speaker 1: on the show. And when I did a senior thesis 403 00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:12,320 Speaker 1: film on that years ago, UM I interviewed a pastor 404 00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:14,480 Speaker 1: at a church that was nearby and just really quick 405 00:25:14,520 --> 00:25:17,240 Speaker 1: the Georgia guide stones just like stone Granite monument in 406 00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:19,720 Speaker 1: a rural part of Georgia that have been associated with 407 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:21,800 Speaker 1: things like the New World Order in the Illuminati, and 408 00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:25,600 Speaker 1: occasionally Satanic rituals. And the pastor that I spoke to 409 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:31,000 Speaker 1: swore up and down that he saw blood rituals being done. 410 00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:34,080 Speaker 1: They're absolutely no evidence of that ever having taken place. 411 00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:38,560 Speaker 1: Um Or maybe what he saw was perhaps some pagans 412 00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:41,720 Speaker 1: in robes doing some sort of solstice ritual, but I 413 00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:45,640 Speaker 1: feel as though in his mind, being a particularly god 414 00:25:45,720 --> 00:25:49,639 Speaker 1: fearing type of man, inserted some detail and that maybe 415 00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:51,520 Speaker 1: wasn't there. And it occurs to me, maybe some of 416 00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:53,640 Speaker 1: that's going on here. I don't know. We all see 417 00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:55,639 Speaker 1: through the lenses that we put up in front of Um. 418 00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:58,479 Speaker 1: That's right, that's right. And everybody's the protagonists of their 419 00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:01,160 Speaker 1: own story. So they very well may have just been 420 00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:05,560 Speaker 1: doing something in their community or in their movement and 421 00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:08,280 Speaker 1: he decided it was about him, you know what I mean, 422 00:26:08,359 --> 00:26:12,399 Speaker 1: it's possible or he felt left out, maybe it actually was, 423 00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:17,640 Speaker 1: or maybe it's just the truth exactly. Well, and that's 424 00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:20,240 Speaker 1: the way these kinds of stories, in particular, this one 425 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:24,720 Speaker 1: feels like could all of this really have been happening? Right? 426 00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:28,480 Speaker 1: And there's so much more? Yeah? Yeah, So in two 427 00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:31,280 Speaker 1: thousand and three, that's when we see the first confession. 428 00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:34,680 Speaker 1: Law enforcement is not involved. Some members of the church 429 00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:39,520 Speaker 1: confess to other congregates, disclosing their crime and asking according 430 00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:43,919 Speaker 1: to authorities, and later investigation for forgiveness. This led to 431 00:26:44,080 --> 00:26:48,399 Speaker 1: a schism, a final mass departure from the church. Hosanna's 432 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:52,360 Speaker 1: membership dwindled. And you can imagine why that would occur, Right, 433 00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:54,840 Speaker 1: some people go up in front of church, or you 434 00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:59,240 Speaker 1: hear about people going up and confessing to doing those things. Yeah, 435 00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:02,440 Speaker 1: it would be Yeah, the you know, God may forgive, 436 00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:05,280 Speaker 1: but it's it's a tall order for a lot of people, 437 00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:09,160 Speaker 1: especially given them just the perverse nature of these crimes. 438 00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:13,840 Speaker 1: Back to Nicole Bernard, she was the former spouse of 439 00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:18,560 Speaker 1: Hassanna's youth minister, a guy named Austin Tree Bernard the third. 440 00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:22,040 Speaker 1: He had sometimes been described as the mastermind or the 441 00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:25,840 Speaker 1: ringleader of this group. Bernard claimed that she had tapes 442 00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:30,639 Speaker 1: and videos that belonged to the church that substantiated what 443 00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:33,040 Speaker 1: she was saying, because she was saying, you know there's 444 00:27:33,080 --> 00:27:37,719 Speaker 1: an abuse cult out there children or in danger. I 445 00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:41,960 Speaker 1: have proof, and you just remind everybody she's the one 446 00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:45,840 Speaker 1: who called in from Ohio, yes to like begin reporting 447 00:27:45,880 --> 00:27:48,679 Speaker 1: on this or to begin telling people the story. And 448 00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:52,800 Speaker 1: she was later arrested along with some of the people 449 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:56,960 Speaker 1: that she named, and along with her ex husband, the 450 00:27:57,040 --> 00:28:01,600 Speaker 1: youth pastor, Austin Bernard. That is just the first of 451 00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:04,440 Speaker 1: the confessions. So a law enforcement officer in the name 452 00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:09,080 Speaker 1: of Stan Carpenter and his colleagues were absolutely astonished when 453 00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:13,920 Speaker 1: Louis Lamonica Jr. Came by the station nearby Sheriff's office 454 00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:16,480 Speaker 1: in two thousand five and he said that he wanted 455 00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:21,720 Speaker 1: to talk about the dedication of a baby to Satan 456 00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:24,960 Speaker 1: that was held of the church upstairs, and what he 457 00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:28,399 Speaker 1: referred to as the youth room. Um, and he this 458 00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:30,840 Speaker 1: sounds like he's like turning himself in. This is bizarre. 459 00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:32,720 Speaker 1: He went on to describe a room where all the 460 00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:36,160 Speaker 1: windows were blacked out. He was quoted as same quote, 461 00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:38,760 Speaker 1: like black paper, keep it dark. Uh. There was a 462 00:28:38,760 --> 00:28:41,520 Speaker 1: pentagram in the middle of the floor, he said, and 463 00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:45,520 Speaker 1: a book of quote spells and temptations, which sounds like 464 00:28:45,560 --> 00:28:49,560 Speaker 1: the most Southern. It sounds like it's it's a thing 465 00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:55,520 Speaker 1: purposefully made to scare people who are participating in like 466 00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 1: Christianity in the South. I saw a book of spells 467 00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:02,320 Speaker 1: and temptations exactly. Or did you guys ever, Matt at 468 00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:05,840 Speaker 1: your church, do they ever do those hell plays? I 469 00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:10,280 Speaker 1: have been to those at other tribulation trail, like the 470 00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:13,640 Speaker 1: Halloween stuff. I love it. Yeah. To me, it's like 471 00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:16,040 Speaker 1: an excuse for them to like while out and do 472 00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:19,680 Speaker 1: the most offensive, creepy, you know, satanic stuff. But it 473 00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:21,160 Speaker 1: was all with the purpose of like it was like 474 00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:23,960 Speaker 1: scared straight, like scaring you two into the arms of 475 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:26,680 Speaker 1: the Lord. I'm probably going to one this month. This 476 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:28,920 Speaker 1: is my favorite time. It's a good time of the year. 477 00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:31,240 Speaker 1: I remember the one they had in my church, your 478 00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:34,400 Speaker 1: church near bund my house. They had a a crashed 479 00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:37,720 Speaker 1: car that they would park outside and it was like 480 00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:40,000 Speaker 1: they had like a fake dead body in it who 481 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:44,760 Speaker 1: would be presumably done drugs or something, you know, unholy. 482 00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:48,080 Speaker 1: See that sounds like my high school. The tribulation trail. 483 00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:54,000 Speaker 1: Things were squarely aimed at abortion where and then there's 484 00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:57,720 Speaker 1: like the final act where someone saying, well you could 485 00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:00,520 Speaker 1: have repented, And then there's the crew of people at 486 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:02,760 Speaker 1: the end of the thing. That's my least favorite part. 487 00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:04,960 Speaker 1: I tried to skip the talk after I'm there for 488 00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:07,840 Speaker 1: the show. Oh yeah, give me the action. Um so 489 00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:10,280 Speaker 1: a little little bit of lighthearted in their heartedness there 490 00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:13,960 Speaker 1: for everybody. Lightheartedness. Now, we do want to say before 491 00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:19,880 Speaker 1: we continue that Lamonica here is speaking in a very casual, 492 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:23,959 Speaker 1: disaffected and calm way. He doesn't he's not you know, 493 00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:27,880 Speaker 1: like on the edge of death or well, and he's 494 00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:31,800 Speaker 1: not necessarily worried that he's about to get arrested. Well like, 495 00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:35,880 Speaker 1: at least that's what what the reporting says reminds me 496 00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:39,640 Speaker 1: of the character from seven No spoilers for seven when 497 00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:42,440 Speaker 1: he turns himself in a very matter of factly speaks 498 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:44,719 Speaker 1: to the authorities in a way where it's like this 499 00:30:44,760 --> 00:30:49,400 Speaker 1: guy doesn't care what happens to him, he says, detective detector. 500 00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:53,720 Speaker 1: I guess he does get a little upset. He's just emphatic, right, 501 00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:55,920 Speaker 1: he had a plan he was working on, you know 502 00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:59,800 Speaker 1: what I mean. But Lamonica apparently had some kind of 503 00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:04,160 Speaker 1: in because he confesses this and more without any prompting, right, 504 00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:06,800 Speaker 1: and he goes into detail. Yeah, he says he's been 505 00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:09,560 Speaker 1: having sex with at least two young boys from the 506 00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:12,280 Speaker 1: time they were four years old until they were twelve 507 00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:17,840 Speaker 1: or thirteen. Um. He named names, including Christopher Lobat, who 508 00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 1: was twenty four, a deputy sheriff of give it to me, Matt, 509 00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:24,480 Speaker 1: I call it Tangerboho Tanjeboe. But but we've been calling 510 00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:29,040 Speaker 1: it Tanga tan. Look, we don't write us right in. 511 00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:32,760 Speaker 1: Let us know if you're from t T Town, t parish, 512 00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:35,200 Speaker 1: let us know how to pronounce it. He implicated. This person, 513 00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:40,040 Speaker 1: Christopher Labat, who was a law enforcement official who apparently 514 00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:43,920 Speaker 1: for a while lived on the church grounds and was 515 00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:48,600 Speaker 1: a co conspirator. According to La Monica's very early even 516 00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:53,600 Speaker 1: handed testimony. Yeah. He said that they had abused boys 517 00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:56,880 Speaker 1: and girls between the age of one and sixteen, taught 518 00:31:56,920 --> 00:31:59,760 Speaker 1: them to have sexual relations with each other as well 519 00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:02,719 Speaker 1: as with the canine. He said to your drunk cat's blood. 520 00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:05,560 Speaker 1: They poured it over the bodies of victims, some of 521 00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:10,600 Speaker 1: them were his biological children, and it goes into very 522 00:32:11,680 --> 00:32:16,560 Speaker 1: very disturbing graphic detail. We found an excerpt from the 523 00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:19,840 Speaker 1: Daily Mail reporting on this. This is the kind of 524 00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:23,200 Speaker 1: stuff the Daily Mail likes to report on, and they 525 00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:27,520 Speaker 1: are rightly not seen as the best of all possible sources. 526 00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:31,800 Speaker 1: This is mainly to give give everyone a sense of 527 00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:36,000 Speaker 1: what kind of stuff was being reported here. Lamonica describes 528 00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:40,520 Speaker 1: one of the rituals that allegedly occurs. He says, they 529 00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:42,560 Speaker 1: would start off like a church service, but it was 530 00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:46,520 Speaker 1: Satanic music. There were candles burning, dark red candle holders 531 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,960 Speaker 1: and the dedication of baby A. That's probably because the 532 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:53,040 Speaker 1: kid's name is is you know, kept out of public records. 533 00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:56,520 Speaker 1: The dedication of baby A into Satan with his pentagram. 534 00:32:56,560 --> 00:32:58,400 Speaker 1: She was put in the middle in a black dress. 535 00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:01,880 Speaker 1: He describes chanting around the child, who is barely one 536 00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:04,920 Speaker 1: years old at the time, before killing a cat, draining 537 00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:07,760 Speaker 1: its blood, drinking it. Uh. They said they didn't make 538 00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:10,000 Speaker 1: the child drink the cat blood because she was too young, 539 00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:14,480 Speaker 1: so instead they sprinkled the blood over her. And Lamonica 540 00:33:14,560 --> 00:33:18,280 Speaker 1: said these meetings took place once every two or three months, 541 00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:21,880 Speaker 1: and we we should stayed here that according to the 542 00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:25,920 Speaker 1: Daily Mail, that child that is being described there is 543 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:29,480 Speaker 1: the baby of Nicole Bernard, the person that we heard 544 00:33:29,520 --> 00:33:32,720 Speaker 1: about again who kind of blew the whistle on this 545 00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:37,840 Speaker 1: whole thing, and then he goes into detail about how 546 00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:41,720 Speaker 1: they would pursue the sexual abuse. Let's just call back 547 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:45,040 Speaker 1: real quick to our Black Metal episode. This is what 548 00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:49,200 Speaker 1: you would consider theistic Satanism, right where it's like worshiping 549 00:33:49,480 --> 00:33:52,840 Speaker 1: Satan Lucifer as a deity in the way you would 550 00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:55,440 Speaker 1: worship any other god. And I think I had a 551 00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:58,200 Speaker 1: boo boo in the and the Death Metal episode Black 552 00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:00,440 Speaker 1: met episode RRI I said something about, how you know, 553 00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:03,040 Speaker 1: I equated paganism to Satanism, and I know that's not 554 00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:06,720 Speaker 1: the case. But there is something called dark paganism or 555 00:34:06,760 --> 00:34:10,480 Speaker 1: the left hand path, or the idea of black magic 556 00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:14,680 Speaker 1: rituals or occultism that is can be folded into the 557 00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:18,800 Speaker 1: idea of theistic Satanism. So back to the description of 558 00:34:18,840 --> 00:34:25,880 Speaker 1: these um what La Monica UH describes as these sexual 559 00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:29,479 Speaker 1: abuse rituals and how they carried her round. You can 560 00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:34,319 Speaker 1: find the details online if if you must, if you 561 00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:38,759 Speaker 1: need to know, but it is disturbing, it is I 562 00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:43,600 Speaker 1: would I do not use this word lightly. It is unclean, uh, 563 00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:49,600 Speaker 1: and it is not something that we we off off air. 564 00:34:49,680 --> 00:34:53,239 Speaker 1: Decided not to present this in graphic detail on air, 565 00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:57,720 Speaker 1: both out of respect for the victims, respect for everyone's sanity, 566 00:34:57,840 --> 00:35:00,080 Speaker 1: and the fact that if you want to know, you 567 00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:03,080 Speaker 1: could find it. But he walked into the sheriff's office 568 00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:08,759 Speaker 1: and he laid this out. You know, he had a disgusting, 569 00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:13,759 Speaker 1: evil ted talk of sorts. He claimed that they laid 570 00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:16,799 Speaker 1: feces and urine around while this stuff was happening. And 571 00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:19,560 Speaker 1: then he said, during these Satanic rituals, who would become 572 00:35:19,719 --> 00:35:23,279 Speaker 1: quote distorted by the devil demons would change him into 573 00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:27,440 Speaker 1: an animal, a snake, a fox, wolf, spiders and like 574 00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:30,359 Speaker 1: you said, no, he named all of his accomplices and 575 00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:34,200 Speaker 1: it was men and women involved at yes, absolutely men 576 00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:38,200 Speaker 1: and women, And later interviews with victims appeared to confirm 577 00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:42,680 Speaker 1: the veracity of his account, and Lamonica said the abuse 578 00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:46,360 Speaker 1: started in stopped in two thousand three, but law enforcement 579 00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:50,480 Speaker 1: officials like Edwards believe it probably continue to members homes 580 00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:54,200 Speaker 1: for some unknown period of time after the church shuddered 581 00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:57,800 Speaker 1: its doors. Astute listeners, you'll notice that we've been using 582 00:35:57,920 --> 00:36:01,920 Speaker 1: the word claim or a allegedly pretty often. Here there 583 00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:06,000 Speaker 1: are a single person stated this in Um. What we're 584 00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:08,680 Speaker 1: gonna do after this short break is look at the 585 00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:12,040 Speaker 1: evidence of what could be proven. So if this was 586 00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:14,640 Speaker 1: going to go to court and you had to have 587 00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:18,920 Speaker 1: some kind of material evidence, what would it be, um? 588 00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:22,440 Speaker 1: And it may be surprising to you. So we'll see 589 00:36:22,440 --> 00:36:31,920 Speaker 1: you right after this we're back. So how much of 590 00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:35,799 Speaker 1: it is true? Yeah, I mean, you know, it's it's 591 00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:38,560 Speaker 1: all hearsay, honestly at this point. I mean, there's some corroboration, 592 00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:41,800 Speaker 1: there's some similaritias between these stories. But inside the closed 593 00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:45,080 Speaker 1: youth haul behind the sanctuary that we've been talking about, 594 00:36:45,239 --> 00:36:49,400 Speaker 1: the cops did find a faint imprint of some pentagrams 595 00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:53,280 Speaker 1: drawn on the floor that someone had tried to scrub um. 596 00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:57,279 Speaker 1: They seized computers, as well as dozens of videotapes and 597 00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:01,400 Speaker 1: hundreds of computer disks and eight back says of documents 598 00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:04,560 Speaker 1: and photographs. Um I Deputy Shriff of Name with Charles Reid, 599 00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:11,200 Speaker 1: said that included videos of morality plays performed to confuse 600 00:37:11,239 --> 00:37:15,759 Speaker 1: the victims and in some cases, uh, there under educated parents. Now, 601 00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:20,480 Speaker 1: so there's a lot of playing on people's um fears 602 00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:26,200 Speaker 1: and perhaps ignorance. Yeah. Well, it's it's a problem of authority, right. 603 00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:31,439 Speaker 1: We trust certain people who wear certain clothes because they're 604 00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:34,399 Speaker 1: in certain roles. Right. We've talked about that a lot 605 00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:39,320 Speaker 1: before on this show. And if you've got someone of 606 00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:43,600 Speaker 1: authority explaining to you why this is right and this 607 00:37:43,719 --> 00:37:48,040 Speaker 1: is good. Um, unless you have the ammunition to back up, 608 00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:52,839 Speaker 1: you know, either philosophically or morally or whatever, that this 609 00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:58,280 Speaker 1: is wrong, then you may be easily manipulated. Yeah, yeah, 610 00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:01,400 Speaker 1: it's it's true. And we want to emphasize again that 611 00:38:01,719 --> 00:38:05,719 Speaker 1: these were initial reports. The initial reports seemed to change 612 00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:09,360 Speaker 1: and the immediate aftermath, nine people are arrested on charges 613 00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:14,560 Speaker 1: of sexual abuse, cruelty to animals, these related things, including 614 00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:18,520 Speaker 1: the original person who called from Ohio, Nicole Bernard, so 615 00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:23,040 Speaker 1: Louis Lamonica Jr. Austin Tree Bernard, the third, Alan R. Pearson, 616 00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:27,880 Speaker 1: his wife, Patricia Pearson, Robin Lamonica, Paul Fontineaux, uh, and 617 00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:30,440 Speaker 1: then Louis Mowbray, who will become more important as the 618 00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:33,920 Speaker 1: story continues. It's interesting that Charles read that that investigator, 619 00:38:33,920 --> 00:38:37,520 Speaker 1: that deputy sheriff said that based on the interrogations of 620 00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:40,319 Speaker 1: some of these folks, it wasn't super clear whether they 621 00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:43,400 Speaker 1: truly believed they were worshiping the devil or whether this 622 00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:48,160 Speaker 1: was just kind of an excuse to participate in pedophilia. 623 00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:53,440 Speaker 1: Rampant pedophilia right exactly. And this is where we run 624 00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:59,920 Speaker 1: into some uh contradicting narratives or different takes. So, writing 625 00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:03,359 Speaker 1: for an outfit called Theistic Satanism dot Com in two 626 00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:07,920 Speaker 1: thousand six, Diana Vera notes the initial accusations seemed to 627 00:39:07,960 --> 00:39:11,280 Speaker 1: quickly narrow and scope over the course of the investigation. 628 00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:15,720 Speaker 1: So he said that there were allegedly more than twenty 629 00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:19,239 Speaker 1: children who were victimized by the circle, but by the 630 00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:22,040 Speaker 1: end of July two thousand five, the number of alleged 631 00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:25,800 Speaker 1: victims have been whittled down to three per Vera's writing, 632 00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:29,799 Speaker 1: and the prosecutors decided eventually after a certain hearing, to 633 00:39:29,880 --> 00:39:33,200 Speaker 1: drop any claims involving satanism or occultism, and this was 634 00:39:33,280 --> 00:39:37,480 Speaker 1: victims of abuse, child abuse, right, not they don't have 635 00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:41,680 Speaker 1: bodies there. There's no evidence of DNA of murdering, right 636 00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:46,680 Speaker 1: right right. That's another that's another thing that Diana Vera 637 00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:50,600 Speaker 1: brings up, and she says, there's not physical evidence that 638 00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:56,200 Speaker 1: the children endure or that all these children endured. Uh discusion. Abuse, Yeah, yeah, 639 00:39:56,280 --> 00:39:59,000 Speaker 1: Torture is a good word, especially when you're considering something 640 00:39:59,040 --> 00:40:02,719 Speaker 1: like an infant, you know what I mean. So these 641 00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:07,799 Speaker 1: charges still included the abuse, but other theories alleged this 642 00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:10,759 Speaker 1: was a different sort of conspiracy, less a case of 643 00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:14,839 Speaker 1: satanic abuse and more a case of brainwashing. That it 644 00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:20,239 Speaker 1: was Louis Mowbray, not Trey Bernard, who was the ringleader. 645 00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:22,680 Speaker 1: And this is where we found an interesting tale from 646 00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:25,640 Speaker 1: Religion News blog. Yes, and it states that back in 647 00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:29,560 Speaker 1: two thousand eight, Lamonica Jr. That's the again, the pastor 648 00:40:29,600 --> 00:40:33,160 Speaker 1: we've been talking about this whole time is Lamonica Jr. Um. 649 00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:36,680 Speaker 1: He told a jury there in the parish where where 650 00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:41,080 Speaker 1: the church was, that his confession was in fact false 651 00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:46,719 Speaker 1: and for everything that he was confessing, um, including the 652 00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:50,799 Speaker 1: abuse of children, because in his mind it was the 653 00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:53,840 Speaker 1: only way listen to this to get his wife back 654 00:40:54,400 --> 00:41:01,320 Speaker 1: and to get his children back. Now that sounds insane. 655 00:41:01,719 --> 00:41:07,160 Speaker 1: It sounds insane, but it only gets stranger because then 656 00:41:07,600 --> 00:41:10,360 Speaker 1: his attorney comes through, a guy named Michael Field or 657 00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:17,920 Speaker 1: tile feel Um. He He maintains that this guy, Lamonica Jr. 658 00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:22,759 Speaker 1: Actually did falsely confess to this rape because in his mind, 659 00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:25,959 Speaker 1: or at least in his what his belief is his attorney, 660 00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:29,480 Speaker 1: is that this guy was being controlled by someone, by 661 00:41:29,600 --> 00:41:33,400 Speaker 1: a woman who was who believed herself to be a 662 00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:37,600 Speaker 1: prophet of God, and that Lamonica Jr. Then believed that 663 00:41:37,800 --> 00:41:40,839 Speaker 1: she was also the prophet or a prophet of God. 664 00:41:41,600 --> 00:41:45,000 Speaker 1: So it was it was a cult just operating on 665 00:41:45,040 --> 00:41:48,960 Speaker 1: a different level than maybe we fought, or at least 666 00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:51,920 Speaker 1: accorney of this religion news blog. Wait, so it was. 667 00:41:52,280 --> 00:41:54,359 Speaker 1: It was. It was not a Satanic cult at all. 668 00:41:54,440 --> 00:41:59,080 Speaker 1: It was worshiping some sort of false prophet godlike deity 669 00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:03,960 Speaker 1: wheels with and wheels. The idea here is essentially that 670 00:42:04,520 --> 00:42:11,720 Speaker 1: Lois Malbury, the prophet, had created this satanic abuse narrative 671 00:42:11,800 --> 00:42:15,879 Speaker 1: as a way of controlling the congregants. So she took 672 00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:19,839 Speaker 1: control of the church around two thousand and three, apparently, 673 00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:23,279 Speaker 1: but I've been in charge in all of the name 674 00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:26,960 Speaker 1: for a while. Beforehand. It was like and it started. 675 00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:31,640 Speaker 1: One of the people that this prophet Malbury or Malbory 676 00:42:31,719 --> 00:42:35,480 Speaker 1: to control over was was um, the wife of the 677 00:42:35,520 --> 00:42:38,719 Speaker 1: pastor right right, that's correct, and I mean so like 678 00:42:38,760 --> 00:42:41,400 Speaker 1: it started in his own home basically, at least according 679 00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:44,360 Speaker 1: to this story, Yeah, for a while, La Monica said 680 00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:47,320 Speaker 1: he had to wear a dress and to rubber snakes 681 00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:50,799 Speaker 1: representing his mother and his aunts because they were quote pharaohs. 682 00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:55,040 Speaker 1: This is a testimony in court. He said church members 683 00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:58,120 Speaker 1: weren't shaved his head and called him pharaoh as well. Uh. 684 00:42:58,160 --> 00:43:02,360 Speaker 1: He said that. Referring to Lois malbrid he said she 685 00:43:02,400 --> 00:43:05,399 Speaker 1: convinced herself she was like Moses and Tangipahoa was coming 686 00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:08,320 Speaker 1: out of Egypt. La Monica said, referring to the biblical 687 00:43:08,360 --> 00:43:11,720 Speaker 1: story about Moses leading people away from slavery in Egypt 688 00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:14,600 Speaker 1: and that pharaoh was blocking the way. Thus he was 689 00:43:14,719 --> 00:43:17,359 Speaker 1: Pharaoh with a little bit of performance art, and they 690 00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:20,759 Speaker 1: had to get him out of there. And in this environment, 691 00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:24,120 Speaker 1: the wives of La Monica and Bernard, according to this theory, 692 00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:28,440 Speaker 1: realized that they needed to take custody of their children 693 00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:32,400 Speaker 1: and free the way from Malbride to lead Tanjapehoa to 694 00:43:32,520 --> 00:43:37,040 Speaker 1: spiritual fulfillment by making up a story of satanic ritual 695 00:43:37,080 --> 00:43:42,600 Speaker 1: abuse perpetrated by their husbands. And then Lamonica said he 696 00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:45,080 Speaker 1: was told that he had to write down all these 697 00:43:45,120 --> 00:43:48,560 Speaker 1: dirty thoughts. He was forced to do this by the 698 00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:52,280 Speaker 1: church leadership, and this was a fictional diary of abuse. 699 00:43:52,719 --> 00:43:57,359 Speaker 1: But then he was told that having a sinful thought 700 00:43:57,440 --> 00:44:00,120 Speaker 1: is as bad as committing a sinful act. Uh, the 701 00:44:00,200 --> 00:44:02,600 Speaker 1: only way that he would be able to see his 702 00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:05,160 Speaker 1: kids again is if he got back on the right path. 703 00:44:05,239 --> 00:44:06,600 Speaker 1: The only way he could get back on the right 704 00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:09,480 Speaker 1: path was going to the police station and confessing two 705 00:44:09,560 --> 00:44:12,759 Speaker 1: things that never happened. That is, that is one of 706 00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:17,360 Speaker 1: the theories. I mean, it adds up in the most 707 00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:22,000 Speaker 1: Bonker's way possible. And both of the Monica's sons later 708 00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:25,879 Speaker 1: recanted their claims of abuse because they said, remember he 709 00:44:25,960 --> 00:44:28,799 Speaker 1: specifically said that he would he had been abusing them. Well, 710 00:44:28,840 --> 00:44:31,240 Speaker 1: I mean, I guess we we do have the evidence 711 00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:33,880 Speaker 1: that it had been scrubbed the crime scene, you know, 712 00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:37,400 Speaker 1: And yeah, I'm just saying, like, you know, maybe that 713 00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:41,480 Speaker 1: could account for any lack of physical evidence, but it 714 00:44:41,520 --> 00:44:44,759 Speaker 1: didn't seem like it was the most uh, let's say 715 00:44:44,880 --> 00:44:48,359 Speaker 1: methodical outfit, the most kind of you know what I mean, 716 00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:51,040 Speaker 1: like like not a super air tight case. That's what 717 00:44:51,080 --> 00:44:53,840 Speaker 1: I mean in terms of like, I don't know that 718 00:44:53,920 --> 00:44:56,800 Speaker 1: they would have been able to like strike every possible 719 00:44:56,880 --> 00:45:00,160 Speaker 1: scrap of physical evidence from the scene. You know, it 720 00:45:00,239 --> 00:45:03,160 Speaker 1: seems like it maybe would have acted in a panic 721 00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:05,600 Speaker 1: or in some out of desperation, but it doesn't seem 722 00:45:05,640 --> 00:45:08,239 Speaker 1: like it was the most organized or evil genius kind 723 00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:10,759 Speaker 1: of situation. Right, Like, I don't know if I buy that. Well, 724 00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:13,960 Speaker 1: you've also got the pastor the guy who is you know, 725 00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:17,560 Speaker 1: in the beginning of the story allegedly walking in or 726 00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:19,840 Speaker 1: we have an account of him walking into the police 727 00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:22,319 Speaker 1: station and confessing to all this stuff. If he knew 728 00:45:22,320 --> 00:45:25,320 Speaker 1: he was going to do that, then ostensibly you could 729 00:45:25,400 --> 00:45:27,920 Speaker 1: get rid of all of the evidence prior to walking 730 00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:33,040 Speaker 1: into that sheriff's office. Right. Um, there's so many weird 731 00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:36,879 Speaker 1: things going on here. Um, so let's talk about how 732 00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:40,440 Speaker 1: maybe this actually connects up to the show we mentioned 733 00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:43,120 Speaker 1: at the top of True Detective, Like where where what 734 00:45:43,160 --> 00:45:45,360 Speaker 1: are the similarities here? So pits Alto has not come 735 00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:48,040 Speaker 1: out and said, like, this is my inspiration for writing this. 736 00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:51,359 Speaker 1: He has said in interviews he said, you know, you 737 00:45:51,400 --> 00:45:55,800 Speaker 1: can google church crime Louisiana. You'll be surprised what you find. 738 00:45:56,000 --> 00:46:00,239 Speaker 1: So he is aware and too to some degree. And 739 00:46:00,239 --> 00:46:03,040 Speaker 1: this of course doesn't follow the plot of the True 740 00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:07,160 Speaker 1: Detective cult one to one. Uh. This it does seem 741 00:46:07,200 --> 00:46:09,839 Speaker 1: clear though, as you said, Matt, True Detective Season one 742 00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:13,720 Speaker 1: was inspired in part by events alleged to have taken 743 00:46:13,719 --> 00:46:16,919 Speaker 1: place at the Hosannah Church, and we know in real 744 00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:21,440 Speaker 1: life at the Hosannah Church something definitely happened. And now 745 00:46:21,480 --> 00:46:24,280 Speaker 1: the question remains how much of the actual real life 746 00:46:24,280 --> 00:46:27,120 Speaker 1: story is true. From what we can tell, the current 747 00:46:27,120 --> 00:46:32,400 Speaker 1: evidence indicates three possibilities. One, there genuinely was a theistic 748 00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:37,359 Speaker 1: satanic abuse ring in play, and maybe not everybody believed it. 749 00:46:37,400 --> 00:46:40,600 Speaker 1: Maybe there were just some, as you said, predators who 750 00:46:40,640 --> 00:46:43,960 Speaker 1: were taking the trappings and finding an easy way to 751 00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:46,880 Speaker 1: get what they actually wanted to The abuse narrative was 752 00:46:46,920 --> 00:46:49,640 Speaker 1: created by Mowbray as a way to threaten and control 753 00:46:49,760 --> 00:46:53,400 Speaker 1: members of the Hosannah community. And then three, some fuzzy 754 00:46:53,640 --> 00:46:57,680 Speaker 1: version of events did occur but then later became exaggerated 755 00:46:57,840 --> 00:47:02,520 Speaker 1: and then people, uh, several people involved had their self 756 00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:06,120 Speaker 1: defense mechanisms turned on, where then the story just becomes 757 00:47:06,200 --> 00:47:08,920 Speaker 1: muddled because people are trying to save themselves and the 758 00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:11,880 Speaker 1: thing is here too. We say brainwashing, We throw the 759 00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:15,879 Speaker 1: term around, but we know memory is treacherous and that's 760 00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:20,759 Speaker 1: why things like hypnotic regression don't bear out in a 761 00:47:20,760 --> 00:47:25,320 Speaker 1: lot of a lot of scientifically controlled studies. So people's 762 00:47:25,400 --> 00:47:28,960 Speaker 1: memories of things started to change, and then the opinion 763 00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:31,960 Speaker 1: of law enforcement started change. According to a detective for 764 00:47:32,000 --> 00:47:35,719 Speaker 1: the Tangipahoa Parish Sheriff's that was a tough one, Mike 765 00:47:35,880 --> 00:47:39,280 Speaker 1: the Phillips. There was no physical evidence of the occult 766 00:47:39,719 --> 00:47:42,600 Speaker 1: such as pentagram's drawn on the floor or spell books 767 00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:45,600 Speaker 1: that were never found, which is strange because initial reporting 768 00:47:45,719 --> 00:47:49,920 Speaker 1: said they were. After the hearing where the Phillips relay 769 00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:53,600 Speaker 1: this information, that's when prosecutors said, Okay, we're gonna drop 770 00:47:53,719 --> 00:47:58,040 Speaker 1: mentions of the occult from this case. And then going 771 00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:00,640 Speaker 1: back to Religion News blog, the cases mostly based on 772 00:48:00,680 --> 00:48:03,400 Speaker 1: statements made by three children, one girl and two boys, 773 00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:07,720 Speaker 1: who repeatedly were assaulted or forced to engage in sex 774 00:48:07,719 --> 00:48:11,040 Speaker 1: acts of at least twice a week from two thousand 775 00:48:11,120 --> 00:48:13,719 Speaker 1: to two thousand one at Hassanna Church and at a 776 00:48:13,800 --> 00:48:17,040 Speaker 1: home of three of its members. That's according to the Phillips. 777 00:48:17,120 --> 00:48:19,040 Speaker 1: He says there's at least one other victim who was 778 00:48:19,080 --> 00:48:22,480 Speaker 1: not mentioned in court. He also noted detectives found no 779 00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:27,560 Speaker 1: physical evidence of abuse except for some fluids on betting, 780 00:48:27,920 --> 00:48:31,359 Speaker 1: and that there were no actual videotapes ever found. So 781 00:48:31,440 --> 00:48:36,200 Speaker 1: in this one statement, in this interchange, he is denying 782 00:48:36,640 --> 00:48:40,000 Speaker 1: all the other stuff that initially came out. We listed 783 00:48:40,040 --> 00:48:42,480 Speaker 1: all those items that they found, boxes of docs and 784 00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:46,080 Speaker 1: tapes with morality plays on them. He's recanting that what 785 00:48:46,160 --> 00:48:47,800 Speaker 1: do you say, like that said it didn't happen, It 786 00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:52,799 Speaker 1: doesn't exist. That's according to him. Well, and so here's 787 00:48:52,800 --> 00:48:55,040 Speaker 1: where we kind of tie it back. Right, So if 788 00:48:55,040 --> 00:48:57,360 Speaker 1: you think about the True Detective series, you do have 789 00:48:57,600 --> 00:49:00,680 Speaker 1: that old dilapidated church right that's broken down. You've got 790 00:49:00,719 --> 00:49:03,359 Speaker 1: that school that's separate in this case rather than being 791 00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:07,640 Speaker 1: attached to the church facility. Then you've got that larger 792 00:49:07,680 --> 00:49:12,960 Speaker 1: conspiracy here right where for some people hearing this would think, well, 793 00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:16,520 Speaker 1: maybe to Phillips, and again, this is not a true statement. 794 00:49:16,520 --> 00:49:19,640 Speaker 1: This is a statement of opinion. Some people listening may think, well, 795 00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:23,279 Speaker 1: maybe it's being covered up right when you're hearing there's no, no, 796 00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:26,480 Speaker 1: those videotapes don't exist, those ones that allegedly had the 797 00:49:26,480 --> 00:49:28,960 Speaker 1: stuff on there for brainwashing, right, or maybe they just 798 00:49:29,160 --> 00:49:34,279 Speaker 1: found videos that were mundane that didn't have anything. Maybe 799 00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:36,680 Speaker 1: they did. But you know, people hear that statement there 800 00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:40,239 Speaker 1: are no videos, don't worry about it. Well, even the 801 00:49:40,280 --> 00:49:42,600 Speaker 1: idea of morality plays. I mean, that's more along the 802 00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:45,000 Speaker 1: lines of the stuff we were talking about earlier, right, 803 00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:47,799 Speaker 1: the scared straight kind of stuff like the you know, 804 00:49:47,800 --> 00:49:52,160 Speaker 1: it's not Satanic ritual sacrifice. Well yeah, and the big 805 00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:56,640 Speaker 1: so far stretch from that. So for for me personally, 806 00:49:56,800 --> 00:50:00,799 Speaker 1: it's less about is this is this in some way 807 00:50:00,800 --> 00:50:03,440 Speaker 1: occult are involved with Satanic rituals? Or is this a 808 00:50:03,520 --> 00:50:07,920 Speaker 1: child sex exploitation ring? Right of people that are involved 809 00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:11,239 Speaker 1: beyond just the ones who were accused, Right, Well, maybe 810 00:50:11,239 --> 00:50:13,480 Speaker 1: I'm sorry if I'm if I'm being redundant, but that 811 00:50:13,600 --> 00:50:15,480 Speaker 1: is a big part of true detective is a lot 812 00:50:15,480 --> 00:50:18,359 Speaker 1: of the Satanic trappings were just that it was sort 813 00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:20,440 Speaker 1: of a smoke screen. It was like a subterfuge to 814 00:50:20,600 --> 00:50:22,960 Speaker 1: draw attention away from the fact that it was Actually 815 00:50:23,320 --> 00:50:26,200 Speaker 1: it was almost a red herring, right, I mean, you 816 00:50:26,239 --> 00:50:27,640 Speaker 1: know it was. It was. It was part of the 817 00:50:27,760 --> 00:50:31,680 Speaker 1: ritualized sex abuse, but it didn't really seem like these 818 00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:35,319 Speaker 1: members were in it for much more than flexing some 819 00:50:35,440 --> 00:50:38,839 Speaker 1: weird power thing, you know, and and getting what they want, 820 00:50:38,920 --> 00:50:42,319 Speaker 1: which in this case was young children. You know. I 821 00:50:42,320 --> 00:50:44,960 Speaker 1: mean it's you know I mean in the show, is 822 00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:47,120 Speaker 1: what I'm saying. Yeah, Well, in any case, in this 823 00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:51,759 Speaker 1: real life example, there were ostensibly real children affected by this, 824 00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:58,040 Speaker 1: um perhaps more than we know, UM, or that officially 825 00:50:58,160 --> 00:51:00,680 Speaker 1: got to have their day in court or at least 826 00:51:00,719 --> 00:51:05,360 Speaker 1: be represented in some way. And UM, it's really horrible 827 00:51:06,200 --> 00:51:08,520 Speaker 1: and we're just putting this out here because we have 828 00:51:08,600 --> 00:51:12,520 Speaker 1: had we've done several episodes now at this point where 829 00:51:12,560 --> 00:51:17,080 Speaker 1: young people, including children, have been abused by adults. I 830 00:51:17,120 --> 00:51:20,520 Speaker 1: can't even count the number actually of specific cases that 831 00:51:20,560 --> 00:51:23,040 Speaker 1: we have discussed this on at least four. I want 832 00:51:23,040 --> 00:51:27,040 Speaker 1: to say, UM, I think objectively it's one of the 833 00:51:27,080 --> 00:51:32,560 Speaker 1: most abhorrant things that can occur in reality. And we're 834 00:51:32,640 --> 00:51:38,080 Speaker 1: just we're putting this out there that, UM, if you 835 00:51:38,160 --> 00:51:42,040 Speaker 1: know of anything like this occurring, do not be afraid 836 00:51:42,440 --> 00:51:44,800 Speaker 1: to speak out and do not be afraid to seek 837 00:51:44,800 --> 00:51:47,719 Speaker 1: help because there are people that can help. You. Make 838 00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:50,160 Speaker 1: sure to talk to your kids about always being honest 839 00:51:50,280 --> 00:51:53,640 Speaker 1: with you about if they're putting any kind of uncomfortable situation, 840 00:51:53,640 --> 00:51:55,719 Speaker 1: whether it's at school or wherever. Not that we're trying 841 00:51:55,760 --> 00:51:57,239 Speaker 1: to launch a witch hunt or anything, but it's just 842 00:51:57,280 --> 00:52:00,640 Speaker 1: important to like have that dialogue because that's uslate. How 843 00:52:00,680 --> 00:52:03,839 Speaker 1: these things fall between the cracks is when there's no communication. 844 00:52:04,880 --> 00:52:07,839 Speaker 1: If you know of or suspect that a child may 845 00:52:07,840 --> 00:52:12,000 Speaker 1: be in danger of abuse, do not hesitate to take action. 846 00:52:12,560 --> 00:52:15,799 Speaker 1: You can visit sites like child Welfare dot gov here 847 00:52:15,800 --> 00:52:18,440 Speaker 1: in the States, where you can find a state by 848 00:52:18,480 --> 00:52:23,600 Speaker 1: state list of resources and twenty four seven abuse reporting hotlines. 849 00:52:23,840 --> 00:52:28,080 Speaker 1: You can also report anonymously, so do not We cannot 850 00:52:28,080 --> 00:52:31,480 Speaker 1: emphasize this enough. Do not hesitate if you are capable 851 00:52:31,520 --> 00:52:36,880 Speaker 1: of helping someone, or capable of getting the authorities involved 852 00:52:37,600 --> 00:52:42,959 Speaker 1: and preventing further crimes of this nature. We also want 853 00:52:43,040 --> 00:52:48,200 Speaker 1: to know what other stories are out there, Matt. You 854 00:52:48,200 --> 00:52:51,920 Speaker 1: you mentioned that True Detectives seem to be teetering on 855 00:52:51,960 --> 00:52:55,640 Speaker 1: the edge of cosmic horror for so long. Uh, we 856 00:52:55,680 --> 00:52:57,799 Speaker 1: want to know what else is out there? Just a 857 00:52:57,840 --> 00:53:01,160 Speaker 1: little bit past the light. What are the strange stories 858 00:53:01,239 --> 00:53:04,080 Speaker 1: in your neck of the woods. What are the bizarre 859 00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:08,000 Speaker 1: things that happened that were maybe reported for a weekend 860 00:53:08,160 --> 00:53:12,160 Speaker 1: and then disappeared. You can tell us about these on Facebook. 861 00:53:12,160 --> 00:53:14,000 Speaker 1: You can tell us on Instagram. You can tell us 862 00:53:14,040 --> 00:53:19,200 Speaker 1: on Twitter. We particularly recommend our community page. Here's where 863 00:53:19,239 --> 00:53:22,480 Speaker 1: it gets crazy on Facebook. If you want to give 864 00:53:22,560 --> 00:53:25,120 Speaker 1: us a call, your voice made gun on the air, 865 00:53:25,280 --> 00:53:27,279 Speaker 1: but your voice will at least be heard by us. 866 00:53:27,680 --> 00:53:31,840 Speaker 1: That number is one eight three three S d w 867 00:53:32,239 --> 00:53:34,919 Speaker 1: y t K and really quickly back to the Here's 868 00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:37,120 Speaker 1: where it gets crazy. If you want to join UM, 869 00:53:37,160 --> 00:53:39,480 Speaker 1: it'll ask you a question and all the question is 870 00:53:39,480 --> 00:53:41,759 Speaker 1: his name, one of the hosts of the show. But 871 00:53:41,880 --> 00:53:45,360 Speaker 1: folks often go the extra mile, and our fantastic mods 872 00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:47,520 Speaker 1: send us some of these screenshots. And this one says 873 00:53:47,880 --> 00:53:51,040 Speaker 1: Matt the nice guy who loves phone calls Noel, who 874 00:53:51,120 --> 00:53:53,600 Speaker 1: gets irritated as hell if you call him, and it 875 00:53:53,600 --> 00:53:55,799 Speaker 1: could have been taken care of through text. And then 876 00:53:55,840 --> 00:53:59,440 Speaker 1: there's been who really really hates phone calls. Heaven forbid 877 00:53:59,480 --> 00:54:01,680 Speaker 1: anyone us to talk to him. L O L. People 878 00:54:01,680 --> 00:54:03,200 Speaker 1: who just want to talk to you, Ben, They really 879 00:54:03,239 --> 00:54:07,560 Speaker 1: do have no regrets, but though it is seriously a 880 00:54:07,600 --> 00:54:11,480 Speaker 1: great way to get in touch with us. We when 881 00:54:11,520 --> 00:54:16,200 Speaker 1: I say we, I mean Matt compiles these fantastic recordings 882 00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:19,320 Speaker 1: and we learn a lot. So please feel free always 883 00:54:19,360 --> 00:54:22,440 Speaker 1: to give us a call. Yeah, no pressure, All right, 884 00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:23,840 Speaker 1: here we go. Guys. If you don't want to do 885 00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:25,640 Speaker 1: any of that, you can still get in touch with 886 00:54:25,719 --> 00:54:28,400 Speaker 1: us with a good old fashioned email. We are conspiracy 887 00:54:28,440 --> 00:54:50,160 Speaker 1: at i heart radio dot com. Stuff they Don't Want 888 00:54:50,160 --> 00:54:52,120 Speaker 1: You to Know is a production of I Heart Radio's 889 00:54:52,160 --> 00:54:54,840 Speaker 1: How Stuff Works. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, 890 00:54:55,000 --> 00:54:57,840 Speaker 1: visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 891 00:54:57,920 --> 00:54:59,200 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.