1
00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:08,799
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg PI and L Podcast. I'm pim Fox.

2
00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:11,640
Speaker 1: Along with my co host Lisa Abramowitz. Each day we

3
00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:15,200
Speaker 1: bring you the most important, noteworthy, and useful interviews for

4
00:00:15,280 --> 00:00:17,920
Speaker 1: you and your money, whether you're at the grocery store

5
00:00:18,040 --> 00:00:20,800
Speaker 1: or the trading floor. Find the Bloomberg P and L

6
00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:33,800
Speaker 1: Podcast on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, and Bloomberg dot com. Get

7
00:00:33,840 --> 00:00:37,360
Speaker 1: ready for the election season. Yes, there are seven presidential

8
00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:42,640
Speaker 1: elections scheduled for Costa Rica, Cuba, Columbia, Paraguay, Mexico, Brazil,

9
00:00:42,720 --> 00:00:46,440
Speaker 1: and Venezuela. Let's find out what they mean for investors.

10
00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:49,640
Speaker 1: My guest Alejandro Werner. He is the director for Western

11
00:00:49,680 --> 00:00:53,320
Speaker 1: Hemisphere Department for the International Monetary Fund and he joins

12
00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:55,760
Speaker 1: us here in our eleven three oh studios. Alejandra, thank

13
00:00:55,800 --> 00:00:57,600
Speaker 1: you very much for being here. All right, so we

14
00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:01,760
Speaker 1: have these presidential elections. You can really select which one

15
00:01:01,800 --> 00:01:04,959
Speaker 1: you want to begin with, maybe Mexico or Brazil or

16
00:01:04,959 --> 00:01:07,000
Speaker 1: so on. But what do you think is the most

17
00:01:07,040 --> 00:01:11,120
Speaker 1: important theme that we need to understand? Thanks for having me,

18
00:01:11,160 --> 00:01:13,399
Speaker 1: and you're right, I mean, Latin America is going through

19
00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:16,720
Speaker 1: a very interesting period on the one hand, and a

20
00:01:16,880 --> 00:01:20,560
Speaker 1: world economy that it's just at the right point. I mean,

21
00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:24,640
Speaker 1: with growth almost touching four percent for the year, commodity

22
00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:29,679
Speaker 1: prices going up, very lax, financial markets are abandoned financing

23
00:01:29,720 --> 00:01:32,880
Speaker 1: but on the other hand, some risk coming from outside

24
00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:36,000
Speaker 1: but domestically a lot of political uncertainty. And if we

25
00:01:36,080 --> 00:01:39,240
Speaker 1: move to the two largest economies in the region, Mexico Umbrassil,

26
00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:43,160
Speaker 1: both of them having very competitive election process. In the

27
00:01:43,160 --> 00:01:45,360
Speaker 1: case of Mexico, you have I mean one of the

28
00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:48,800
Speaker 1: candidates Andres Manuel Lopez Aloro maybe showing up in the

29
00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:52,000
Speaker 1: post with thirty percent of the voter's intentions, and the

30
00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:55,120
Speaker 1: other two candidates Jos Antonio Meat from the p R

31
00:01:55,160 --> 00:01:58,440
Speaker 1: I that it's in government that party now with twenty

32
00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:01,960
Speaker 1: percent of the vote, and Anaya from the Band with

33
00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:08,280
Speaker 1: another of the vote. Very widespread differences in terms of

34
00:02:08,320 --> 00:02:11,560
Speaker 1: their policy policy proposals, I mean Mead and an Aya

35
00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:15,480
Speaker 1: much more continuity, a lopes over a lot, much more

36
00:02:15,720 --> 00:02:20,760
Speaker 1: let's say, critical of what has been done in the

37
00:02:20,800 --> 00:02:23,359
Speaker 1: last few years, and that opening up some degree of

38
00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:27,760
Speaker 1: uncertainty that is weighing on investment. An important element to

39
00:02:27,840 --> 00:02:31,760
Speaker 1: highlight the Mexican election is only one round election. Whoever

40
00:02:31,800 --> 00:02:35,679
Speaker 1: gets a simple majority becomes the president. Then we turned

41
00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:38,679
Speaker 1: to Brazilia, I mean Brazili also having elections in October.

42
00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:43,200
Speaker 1: This is a two round election, but still the Brazilian

43
00:02:43,240 --> 00:02:46,680
Speaker 1: election is also very very wide. You have one candidate

44
00:02:46,720 --> 00:02:49,160
Speaker 1: that it's running ahead in the polls, that is a

45
00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:52,840
Speaker 1: former president, Lula da Silva, who's also going through a

46
00:02:52,880 --> 00:02:56,720
Speaker 1: process and he has been found guilty by two levels

47
00:02:56,800 --> 00:03:01,240
Speaker 1: of their judicial system or of corruption in in the past,

48
00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:04,560
Speaker 1: so there's a legal discussion of whether he will be

49
00:03:04,639 --> 00:03:09,280
Speaker 1: able to run or not. Then you have another right

50
00:03:09,320 --> 00:03:12,440
Speaker 1: wing candidate, Bolsonaro, that is running second, and then a

51
00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:16,040
Speaker 1: very open field of candidates with a smaller percentage of

52
00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:19,440
Speaker 1: the vote. And what makes it the Brasilian elections so

53
00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:25,160
Speaker 1: important is that Brazil it's still facing significant economic challenges

54
00:03:25,320 --> 00:03:28,440
Speaker 1: in the next few years. Brasili just went through two

55
00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:31,520
Speaker 1: years of recession in which the economy contracted in each

56
00:03:31,600 --> 00:03:35,040
Speaker 1: year by three and a half percent. It's recently coming

57
00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:38,640
Speaker 1: out of that process, but still need significant changes in

58
00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:43,680
Speaker 1: its fiscal policy, in its trade policies, in its tax policies,

59
00:03:43,880 --> 00:03:46,600
Speaker 1: and make the economy much more efficient. So Brazil really

60
00:03:46,640 --> 00:03:49,840
Speaker 1: needs a president with a strong mandate to be able

61
00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:54,240
Speaker 1: to implement a very important reform agenda. Will the voters,

62
00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:58,000
Speaker 1: do you believe in Brazil offers someone that mandate to

63
00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:00,840
Speaker 1: get these things accomplished, or it's too early in the

64
00:04:01,160 --> 00:04:03,720
Speaker 1: in the campaign season, I mean, the campaign has not

65
00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:07,400
Speaker 1: even started yet, so we will see how things shape

66
00:04:07,440 --> 00:04:11,080
Speaker 1: shape up. But I think one has to remember also

67
00:04:11,200 --> 00:04:15,120
Speaker 1: that there's a huge anti establishment sentiment in Brazil coming

68
00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:20,440
Speaker 1: through out of the largest corruption scandal in the country's history,

69
00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:26,920
Speaker 1: first affecting the state own oil company Petrogras, then affecting

70
00:04:27,000 --> 00:04:31,239
Speaker 1: one of its major construction companies or the Breck. So

71
00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:35,640
Speaker 1: I mean the population is looking for new alternatives. So

72
00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:40,400
Speaker 1: so that opens the door for a Macron type consensus,

73
00:04:40,560 --> 00:04:43,520
Speaker 1: but it also opens up the door for risks that

74
00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:47,039
Speaker 1: catch the popular attention in the election season but then

75
00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:52,960
Speaker 1: gives us very weak governments when they reach office now,

76
00:04:52,960 --> 00:04:57,159
Speaker 1: and that's why those elections are so important. In other countries.

77
00:04:57,160 --> 00:05:01,080
Speaker 1: In Latin America, I would say the election process generates

78
00:05:01,160 --> 00:05:04,160
Speaker 1: much less uncertain t v s have the economic policies

79
00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:06,000
Speaker 1: the case of Columbia, the case of Paract, by the

80
00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:09,640
Speaker 1: case of Costa Rica, I think people are expecting are

81
00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:13,880
Speaker 1: seen much more continuity in the economic framework, and on

82
00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:17,240
Speaker 1: the back as I was saying, of recovery of copper prices,

83
00:05:17,279 --> 00:05:21,919
Speaker 1: oil prices, agricultural goods prices, where these countries are major

84
00:05:21,960 --> 00:05:26,279
Speaker 1: exporters of that, that paints a relatively good picture for

85
00:05:26,360 --> 00:05:30,320
Speaker 1: Latin American. So if you were a foreign investor and

86
00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:33,880
Speaker 1: you were looking to deploy some capital in Latin America,

87
00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:35,560
Speaker 1: and of course, you know, just to sort of say

88
00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:38,400
Speaker 1: it as a geographic region doesn't really do it justice

89
00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:42,920
Speaker 1: because you're focusing on specific industries or specific types of investments.

90
00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:46,960
Speaker 1: But where do you see the risk reward profile that

91
00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:51,200
Speaker 1: you believe a foreign investor would accept in Latin America

92
00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:54,320
Speaker 1: to actually put some capital work would highlight? I mean,

93
00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:57,960
Speaker 1: obviously the case of Argentina. Argentina went through an important

94
00:05:58,480 --> 00:06:02,840
Speaker 1: political change two years ago. The Macri administration just got

95
00:06:03,880 --> 00:06:07,440
Speaker 1: a significant vote of confidence in a midterm election, and

96
00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:13,240
Speaker 1: this government is trying to reach macroeconomic stability in in

97
00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:18,200
Speaker 1: this country and also implement significant structural reforms in energy, telecom, infrastructure.

98
00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:20,599
Speaker 1: So I think a lot of pent up demand for

99
00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:24,880
Speaker 1: investment in this country, a lot of opportunities. Secondly, I

100
00:06:24,880 --> 00:06:28,839
Speaker 1: would say, I mean Chile, Peru, Colombia countries that had

101
00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:32,359
Speaker 1: to adjust when commodity prices fell. But now that commodity

102
00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:34,479
Speaker 1: prices are going back up, I think they're entering in

103
00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:37,600
Speaker 1: the right phase of the cycle. And I would highlight

104
00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:40,279
Speaker 1: I mean the energy sector in Mexico. Mexico went through

105
00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:44,760
Speaker 1: a very important energy reform three years ago. Now it's

106
00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:47,760
Speaker 1: being implemented. Mexico used to be the country that was

107
00:06:49,800 --> 00:06:55,000
Speaker 1: more close to local to private both domestic and international

108
00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:58,359
Speaker 1: investment in the oil sector. Now it has changed that.

109
00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:00,520
Speaker 1: So I think there's a lot of opport unities in

110
00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:06,640
Speaker 1: the energy sector in Mexico to undertake important investment. Highlighting

111
00:07:06,720 --> 00:07:09,040
Speaker 1: some regions in Latin America and let me just highlight

112
00:07:09,080 --> 00:07:11,560
Speaker 1: I mean when you look at Panama and the Dominican Republic,

113
00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:14,440
Speaker 1: these are countries that have been growing at five six

114
00:07:14,880 --> 00:07:18,840
Speaker 1: for the last seven years, and I think this damis

115
00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:22,120
Speaker 1: m will continue. I mean Panama also as a logistic

116
00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:25,800
Speaker 1: hub with a very important e airport and obviously with

117
00:07:25,840 --> 00:07:29,520
Speaker 1: the canal and the d R with very important investment

118
00:07:29,600 --> 00:07:31,840
Speaker 1: in the tourism sector. I want to thank you very

119
00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:34,080
Speaker 1: much for spending time with the sale. Hundre Verner is

120
00:07:34,120 --> 00:07:38,080
Speaker 1: the director of Western Hemisphere Department for the International Monetary Fund.

121
00:07:38,400 --> 00:07:40,520
Speaker 1: Thank you very much for your views on Latin America.

122
00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:42,760
Speaker 1: Look forward to having you in the future. Much appreciate

123
00:07:42,880 --> 00:08:00,960
Speaker 1: it coming. Japan's central bank governor said today that the

124
00:08:00,960 --> 00:08:04,680
Speaker 1: country's economy is finally close to its target inflation rate

125
00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:08,120
Speaker 1: of around two per cent. Let's find out what this

126
00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:11,360
Speaker 1: means with our own Vincent Signarella. He is our global

127
00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:15,360
Speaker 1: macro strategist for Bloomberg Intelligence. He joins me here in

128
00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:18,040
Speaker 1: our eleven three oh studios. All right, Vincent, so what

129
00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:21,200
Speaker 1: about these comments? He was speaking at Davos, and he

130
00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:25,800
Speaker 1: also mentioned not only the economic the economics of the country,

131
00:08:25,840 --> 00:08:28,480
Speaker 1: but the inflation target of two percent and the unemployment

132
00:08:28,600 --> 00:08:32,640
Speaker 1: rate of two point seven percent. Well, Japan's economy is

133
00:08:32,679 --> 00:08:36,440
Speaker 1: definitely improving, but hitting the inflation target unless you measure

134
00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:38,600
Speaker 1: it in football fields. They know where close. I mean

135
00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:42,760
Speaker 1: the the cp I X food X fresh food. One

136
00:08:42,800 --> 00:08:47,280
Speaker 1: of the um marks to mark that the Bank of

137
00:08:47,360 --> 00:08:50,080
Speaker 1: Japan uses for an inflation target on a year over

138
00:08:50,200 --> 00:08:53,720
Speaker 1: year basis zero point three percent. Their target is two percent.

139
00:08:54,120 --> 00:08:57,200
Speaker 1: So I think we have a ways to go before

140
00:08:57,240 --> 00:09:00,720
Speaker 1: we hit Japan's inflation target. Okay, but you were telling

141
00:09:00,760 --> 00:09:02,400
Speaker 1: me earlier and there was a lot of movement. I

142
00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:04,800
Speaker 1: was watching the Japanese yen and we're trading right now

143
00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:10,319
Speaker 1: one O eight seventy eight were his comments? Uh, I

144
00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:14,280
Speaker 1: don't want to say misconstrued, but what was he trying

145
00:09:14,320 --> 00:09:17,360
Speaker 1: to get at? What traders felt like that his comments

146
00:09:17,400 --> 00:09:20,200
Speaker 1: were taken out of context. And what we understand is

147
00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:22,240
Speaker 1: that he said what he said was exactly what he said,

148
00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:24,080
Speaker 1: but he kind of chuckled after he said it. So

149
00:09:24,840 --> 00:09:26,840
Speaker 1: if unless we have a central banker all of a

150
00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:29,760
Speaker 1: sudden developing a sense of humor so he was doing

151
00:09:29,800 --> 00:09:31,880
Speaker 1: maybe like a stand up routine in Dava, Well, I

152
00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:33,200
Speaker 1: don't think it was that. I think what he was

153
00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:37,160
Speaker 1: really addressing was the longer term prospects of Japanese inflation

154
00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:39,400
Speaker 1: are approaching target. And I think you hear that from

155
00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:42,520
Speaker 1: every central banker, and unfortunately we've heard that from every

156
00:09:42,520 --> 00:09:44,600
Speaker 1: central banker for the better part of the last five years.

157
00:09:44,920 --> 00:09:49,160
Speaker 1: So putting things into context, you can see that the

158
00:09:49,320 --> 00:09:52,040
Speaker 1: eventually the goal is for Japan to reach the two

159
00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:54,720
Speaker 1: percent target, as is the United States, as in Germany,

160
00:09:54,760 --> 00:09:57,720
Speaker 1: the Eurozone, etcetera, etcetera. Well, everybody wants to reach whatever

161
00:09:57,760 --> 00:10:00,599
Speaker 1: target there. Everybody wants to reach the change. Yes, But

162
00:10:00,720 --> 00:10:02,880
Speaker 1: one of the things that really strikes me as odd

163
00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:04,920
Speaker 1: to be honest with central bankers in this in this

164
00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:08,040
Speaker 1: day and age, especially dragging with the Eurozone, is is

165
00:10:08,080 --> 00:10:11,320
Speaker 1: in a real sweet spot. He's got unemployment falling, the

166
00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:15,400
Speaker 1: economy is growing. So what that inflation isn't going up?

167
00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:18,400
Speaker 1: We're not if this were two thousand eleven or two thousand,

168
00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:21,719
Speaker 1: two thousand nine, where there people were talking about the

169
00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:25,600
Speaker 1: potential for an actual depression. When you see inflation dropping

170
00:10:25,679 --> 00:10:27,960
Speaker 1: and you think, oh my god, depression could be around

171
00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:30,800
Speaker 1: the corner. That's when you worry about the lack of

172
00:10:30,840 --> 00:10:33,720
Speaker 1: inflation and prices dropping. But when your economy is growing

173
00:10:33,840 --> 00:10:36,760
Speaker 1: and your employment rate is falling and you don't have

174
00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:40,200
Speaker 1: price pressure, that's to me time for a party, not

175
00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:43,120
Speaker 1: for for worrying. So why do you believe they say this?

176
00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:46,400
Speaker 1: I think they're concerned that there is always you know,

177
00:10:46,440 --> 00:10:49,280
Speaker 1: we're at the long end of the growth cycle. This

178
00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:51,440
Speaker 1: has been a very very long run. A lot of

179
00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:54,080
Speaker 1: economists see this as a long in the tooth and

180
00:10:54,120 --> 00:10:58,199
Speaker 1: that a recession is somewhere, perhaps around the corner, and

181
00:10:58,360 --> 00:11:00,480
Speaker 1: if they don't get prices up and they don't get

182
00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:05,360
Speaker 1: inflation up. The opportunity for them to address a recession,

183
00:11:05,400 --> 00:11:08,959
Speaker 1: which could make prices decline further limits them. I mean,

184
00:11:09,040 --> 00:11:11,040
Speaker 1: there's only so far they can lower rates, so in

185
00:11:11,080 --> 00:11:13,320
Speaker 1: other words, they will not have the cover to raise

186
00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:15,720
Speaker 1: rates to then lower them in the future when they

187
00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:19,040
Speaker 1: need to. Was shocked. Sometime last year rosen Grin, the

188
00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:21,280
Speaker 1: FED rosen Grin on a panel said we're raising rates

189
00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:22,920
Speaker 1: because we need to get them to a level so

190
00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:25,240
Speaker 1: that when the next recession comes, we can lower them again,

191
00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:28,560
Speaker 1: which to me sounded like the Marx Brothers when they

192
00:11:28,559 --> 00:11:30,680
Speaker 1: talk about a contract. You know, it's like, I don't

193
00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:32,400
Speaker 1: like the first close, you know, that kind of thing.

194
00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:36,680
Speaker 1: It it makes sense when you think about the idea

195
00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:39,680
Speaker 1: that we need to get economic growth and economic pricing

196
00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:42,400
Speaker 1: to a level so that if things retrench we have

197
00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:45,120
Speaker 1: tools to fight it. But it doesn't make sense that

198
00:11:45,200 --> 00:11:47,360
Speaker 1: you think, if we don't have inflation, we need to

199
00:11:47,360 --> 00:11:49,440
Speaker 1: try to get ahead of something that just isn't there.

200
00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:51,679
Speaker 1: Is it Also because I don't seem to live in

201
00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:54,720
Speaker 1: the real world. I mean, because you're the scenario you're describing,

202
00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:58,720
Speaker 1: I would imagine is pretty sympathetic to just about everybody

203
00:11:58,760 --> 00:12:00,880
Speaker 1: that has to go out and pay for stuff. The

204
00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:05,680
Speaker 1: the average bear doesn't look at cp I X food

205
00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:11,400
Speaker 1: and energy. We look at food and energy market as

206
00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:14,640
Speaker 1: in Yogi. I mean the average individual, they do eat

207
00:12:14,679 --> 00:12:17,960
Speaker 1: food and they probably use some form of fossil fuel. Yeah.

208
00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:20,760
Speaker 1: And when you say, oh it, there's no inflation in clothing, well,

209
00:12:20,800 --> 00:12:26,880
Speaker 1: we're not actually close. Horses and changing are something after uh.

210
00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:30,240
Speaker 1: And one of the things about there about the Fed's

211
00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:34,720
Speaker 1: inflation um factor is the the housing component of the

212
00:12:34,760 --> 00:12:37,640
Speaker 1: inflation is not about housing prices. It's about rent rental

213
00:12:37,679 --> 00:12:41,280
Speaker 1: equivalenc rental equivalency. So when the housing prices were off

214
00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:44,480
Speaker 1: the charts, that wasn't showing up in the inflation data.

215
00:12:44,520 --> 00:12:46,839
Speaker 1: When you and I and everyone else realized when we

216
00:12:46,880 --> 00:12:50,200
Speaker 1: look to go from our home to perhaps another, that

217
00:12:50,240 --> 00:12:53,120
Speaker 1: was real inflation. And that was that stings when it

218
00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:54,840
Speaker 1: looks and it's not as if you do that on

219
00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:57,000
Speaker 1: a regular basis. It's not as if you go, oh

220
00:12:57,120 --> 00:12:59,520
Speaker 1: g it's so much less expensive. I think I'll move

221
00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:02,520
Speaker 1: down the the The The average mortgage, the average thirty year

222
00:13:02,520 --> 00:13:05,280
Speaker 1: mortgage gets turned over every seven years. So let's assume

223
00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:08,800
Speaker 1: that's a five to ten year decision. It stings, you

224
00:13:08,800 --> 00:13:11,360
Speaker 1: know when when rates go from four to six or whatever,

225
00:13:11,400 --> 00:13:16,160
Speaker 1: that that's painful. Quickly, Secretary of the Treasury Stephen Minuchen,

226
00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:19,000
Speaker 1: do you buy this idea that he's trying to walk

227
00:13:19,160 --> 00:13:21,960
Speaker 1: back some of his comments about the dollar, and that,

228
00:13:22,160 --> 00:13:24,760
Speaker 1: as he says, they were also taken out of context.

229
00:13:24,880 --> 00:13:28,360
Speaker 1: I don't think that when someone says to you as

230
00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:33,560
Speaker 1: bluntly and as uh concisely as that question was asked,

231
00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:36,360
Speaker 1: that he was taking out of context. Okay, so you

232
00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:39,280
Speaker 1: don't think anybody that that the president's now effort to

233
00:13:39,280 --> 00:13:41,480
Speaker 1: say well, no, no, no, that we really do want

234
00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:45,439
Speaker 1: a strong dollar could have been negotiating tactic. It's very

235
00:13:45,440 --> 00:13:48,640
Speaker 1: possible because he's at Davos and he's face to face

236
00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:50,320
Speaker 1: with a lot of officials that this could have been

237
00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:52,640
Speaker 1: a little bit of an embarrassing moment for him. But

238
00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:54,760
Speaker 1: I think once he gets back home will probably hear

239
00:13:54,800 --> 00:13:57,360
Speaker 1: how they really feel well done. Thanks very much. He's

240
00:13:57,360 --> 00:14:00,079
Speaker 1: a pleasure. I have a great weekends. Cinnerella is our

241
00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:05,360
Speaker 1: global macro strategist for Bloomberg Intelligence and giving us a

242
00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:09,679
Speaker 1: little bit of a detail on the Bank of Japan's president.

243
00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:27,720
Speaker 1: There were just two hundred and thirty seven initial public

244
00:14:27,800 --> 00:14:32,520
Speaker 1: offerings in TWEEN in the United States. Now that compares

245
00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:36,880
Speaker 1: to more than two thousand listings on foreign markets. Could

246
00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:40,000
Speaker 1: that actually change as a result of a change in

247
00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:43,200
Speaker 1: policy at the Securities and Exchange Commission. Here to help

248
00:14:43,280 --> 00:14:47,239
Speaker 1: us understand the situation is Ben bain our financial regulations

249
00:14:47,240 --> 00:14:50,840
Speaker 1: reporter for Bloomberg. He joins us from our Washington d

250
00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:54,160
Speaker 1: C Bureau and Ben can be followed on Twitter at

251
00:14:54,440 --> 00:14:58,920
Speaker 1: Ben bain Well. Ben, maybe just describe the current situation

252
00:14:59,040 --> 00:15:03,680
Speaker 1: about share holders in companies and their ability to bring

253
00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:07,320
Speaker 1: lawsuits to sue those companies and what kind of a

254
00:15:07,320 --> 00:15:11,600
Speaker 1: tool that has been for shareholders in the past. Sure,

255
00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:14,840
Speaker 1: good morning, thanks a lot. So. I mean, as you mentioned,

256
00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:16,920
Speaker 1: just two hundred and thirty seven I p o s

257
00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:21,440
Speaker 1: in the us UH last year that compares with almost

258
00:15:21,440 --> 00:15:25,640
Speaker 1: a thousand. So kind of going back to when SEC

259
00:15:25,760 --> 00:15:29,120
Speaker 1: Chairman J. Clayton was was picked by by by Donald

260
00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:31,280
Speaker 1: Trump to to take the job in and in his

261
00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:33,680
Speaker 1: initial kind of eight months or so on the job,

262
00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:36,400
Speaker 1: he's highlighted this is something that he's going to be

263
00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:40,000
Speaker 1: focused on. He wants to increase public markets. One issue

264
00:15:40,080 --> 00:15:42,960
Speaker 1: that for the longest time, business groups, particularly the US

265
00:15:43,040 --> 00:15:45,640
Speaker 1: Chamber of Commerce, have have really hammered on as a

266
00:15:45,680 --> 00:15:49,720
Speaker 1: deterrent UM two companies going public is the ability for

267
00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:53,240
Speaker 1: UM for plaintiff shareholders UM, you know in this case,

268
00:15:53,280 --> 00:15:58,400
Speaker 1: to band together UH in class action suits and sue companies. UM.

269
00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:01,360
Speaker 1: From the Chamber of Commerce perspective and other business groups,

270
00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:03,760
Speaker 1: they say a lot of times these are frivolous lawsuits

271
00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:06,440
Speaker 1: and they really end up UH you know, dragging on

272
00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:08,920
Speaker 1: the economy. On the other side of the coin, investor

273
00:16:08,960 --> 00:16:12,040
Speaker 1: advocate groups UM you know, some of the big groups

274
00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:15,360
Speaker 1: that represent state pension funds for example, to see these

275
00:16:15,400 --> 00:16:17,720
Speaker 1: class action suits is one of the key checks they

276
00:16:17,760 --> 00:16:20,840
Speaker 1: have and the key ways they have UH to push

277
00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:24,400
Speaker 1: back against against companies. So so this was something that

278
00:16:24,440 --> 00:16:26,600
Speaker 1: all kind of came to a head. UM Back in

279
00:16:26,640 --> 00:16:31,120
Speaker 1: two thousand twelve, private equity giant Carlyle tried to include

280
00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:34,480
Speaker 1: UM a clause and it's it's registration documents for its

281
00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:37,840
Speaker 1: I p O that basically would have forced UM shareholders

282
00:16:37,880 --> 00:16:40,360
Speaker 1: into arbitration. UM. It would have said they had to

283
00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:43,160
Speaker 1: basically deal with the company outside of court. They couldn't

284
00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:45,720
Speaker 1: go to federal court to bring their grievances. The SEC

285
00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:49,200
Speaker 1: at the time under the Obama administration, UH ended up

286
00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:51,200
Speaker 1: basically saying, you know, we're not gonna we're not getting

287
00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:53,560
Speaker 1: a fast track your registration if you do that. There

288
00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:57,000
Speaker 1: was a lot of pushback. Democratic lawmakers on the hill, UM,

289
00:16:57,040 --> 00:17:00,680
Speaker 1: you know, wrote letters, and eventually Carlisle to off pull

290
00:17:00,760 --> 00:17:03,520
Speaker 1: the clause and ended up I ping without it. We're

291
00:17:03,560 --> 00:17:07,360
Speaker 1: hearing now that um, the SEC is UH is privately

292
00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:10,119
Speaker 1: you know, indicating that that it's open to reconsidering this.

293
00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:12,440
Speaker 1: And this would probably be one of the biggest things

294
00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:15,080
Speaker 1: that they could do. UM, at least if you talked

295
00:17:15,119 --> 00:17:18,119
Speaker 1: to to to kind of business groups to to encourage

296
00:17:18,119 --> 00:17:20,480
Speaker 1: more I P O. S Now, wasn't there a report

297
00:17:20,680 --> 00:17:24,320
Speaker 1: you note in your in your article that the Treasury

298
00:17:24,359 --> 00:17:27,280
Speaker 1: Secretary Stephen Minuchin has weighed in on this. What did

299
00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:29,840
Speaker 1: he say? Yeah? So, I mean, you know, one thing

300
00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:33,760
Speaker 1: that the Treasury Department did last year is they issued

301
00:17:33,840 --> 00:17:36,240
Speaker 1: these reports which are kind of like a high level

302
00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:41,160
Speaker 1: guide for how the Trump administration sees UH financial regulators

303
00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:43,400
Speaker 1: and and where they want them to go. And one

304
00:17:43,400 --> 00:17:45,840
Speaker 1: of the things they did in the report on Capital Markets,

305
00:17:45,920 --> 00:17:48,879
Speaker 1: which focused on the SEC, was they basically encouraged the

306
00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:51,439
Speaker 1: SEC and state regulators to take a look at this

307
00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:53,800
Speaker 1: issue and said that, you know, this could very well

308
00:17:53,840 --> 00:17:57,080
Speaker 1: be a way to uh you know, to encourage more

309
00:17:57,119 --> 00:18:00,400
Speaker 1: public companies. So that certainly the SEC certainly has cover

310
00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:03,840
Speaker 1: politically from the Trump administration to do this. Yeah, the

311
00:18:03,880 --> 00:18:06,720
Speaker 1: Trump administration has already gone in the record and said, well, yeah,

312
00:18:06,760 --> 00:18:08,200
Speaker 1: we you know, we think it's it's a good idea

313
00:18:08,240 --> 00:18:10,440
Speaker 1: to take a look at this again. Now, you interviewed

314
00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:14,640
Speaker 1: a gentleman named Kevin Kennedy, a partner at Simpson Thatcher

315
00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:17,040
Speaker 1: and Palo out to the law from there. What did

316
00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:20,600
Speaker 1: he tell you? He said, I mean, you know, just

317
00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:23,600
Speaker 1: like like you hear from a lot of um, a

318
00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:27,119
Speaker 1: lot of lawyers, uh you know who represent uh you know,

319
00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:29,600
Speaker 1: would the issuers that that this would be kind of

320
00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:32,840
Speaker 1: a major a major change. Um, you know, this is

321
00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:36,520
Speaker 1: something that uh, you know, companies have have for a

322
00:18:36,560 --> 00:18:39,760
Speaker 1: long time, uh complained about and um, you know, and

323
00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:42,439
Speaker 1: he said that, you know, he's heard instances of of

324
00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:47,160
Speaker 1: SEC staff, you know, basically encouraging companies to come forward with,

325
00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:49,840
Speaker 1: uh with some proposals that that would include these type

326
00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:52,680
Speaker 1: of arbitration closets. It's not necessarily a done deal. It's

327
00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:55,159
Speaker 1: not to say that uh the SEC has you know,

328
00:18:55,240 --> 00:18:57,959
Speaker 1: come down one way or another. But but what we

329
00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:01,959
Speaker 1: understand is that, um, you know, there's definitely a willingness

330
00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:04,600
Speaker 1: to to revisit this issue which was which was very

331
00:19:04,640 --> 00:19:07,960
Speaker 1: contentious and very heated back in two thousand twelve. Well,

332
00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:10,680
Speaker 1: the chairman, as you mentioned, Jake Clayton, he's got a

333
00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:13,439
Speaker 1: lot of experience in this particular area because he was

334
00:19:13,480 --> 00:19:17,320
Speaker 1: a lawyer who worked on Ali Baba Group Holdings initial

335
00:19:17,359 --> 00:19:20,080
Speaker 1: public offering. Correct, that's right, that's right. Yeah, he's I mean,

336
00:19:20,080 --> 00:19:22,639
Speaker 1: he's he's a Wall Street deals lawyer and uh, you know,

337
00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:26,000
Speaker 1: and from the very beginning, UM, you know, he has

338
00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:30,000
Speaker 1: fashioned himself as someone who wanted to use his position

339
00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:33,480
Speaker 1: at the SEC UH to deal with UH to really

340
00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:37,520
Speaker 1: focus on UM public markets. He's a believer and he

341
00:19:37,560 --> 00:19:40,200
Speaker 1: says it over and over again in his public comments

342
00:19:40,240 --> 00:19:45,159
Speaker 1: that UM, if companies go public earlier, they offer people

343
00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:48,479
Speaker 1: opportunities that that they would and otherwise he hasn't come

344
00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:50,760
Speaker 1: out and said, you know, he hasn't. He said he

345
00:19:50,800 --> 00:19:54,919
Speaker 1: doesn't want to UH do anything to to curb private markets,

346
00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:57,119
Speaker 1: but he's obviously looking for carrots he can give to

347
00:19:57,240 --> 00:20:01,159
Speaker 1: companies UH to come to go public. And you know,

348
00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:04,439
Speaker 1: pretty much anyone you talked to either on the side

349
00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:07,639
Speaker 1: of UH, people who think that you know, they really

350
00:20:07,680 --> 00:20:09,840
Speaker 1: want these class action lawsuits. They see them as an

351
00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:13,879
Speaker 1: important check on corporations or business groups like the Chamber

352
00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:16,560
Speaker 1: of Commerce, who who you know, want nothing more than

353
00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:19,280
Speaker 1: than these forced arbitration clauses. They see this is a

354
00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:21,960
Speaker 1: is a real big issue. So if this goes forward,

355
00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:24,159
Speaker 1: it's certainly something that's that you know, that's going to

356
00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:26,400
Speaker 1: play out with a lot of interest here in Washington

357
00:20:26,440 --> 00:20:30,200
Speaker 1: and elsewhere clearly and just quickly he who does he

358
00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:34,160
Speaker 1: is selected to run the SEC unit that oversees corporate disclosures.

359
00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:37,600
Speaker 1: Yeah so he so, so he hired um Um will

360
00:20:37,840 --> 00:20:41,280
Speaker 1: William a hindman um who's also a you know, a

361
00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:44,080
Speaker 1: well known lawyer um out in hell out who's working

362
00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:45,480
Speaker 1: a lot of these deals too. So there's certainly no

363
00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:48,080
Speaker 1: stranger to some of these issues and um and and

364
00:20:48,119 --> 00:20:50,399
Speaker 1: there's certainly something they're looking at. Thanks very much for

365
00:20:50,440 --> 00:20:54,080
Speaker 1: being with us. Ben Bayne is our financial regulations reporter

366
00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:57,399
Speaker 1: for Bloomberg News, joining us from our Washington bureau. You

367
00:20:57,440 --> 00:21:15,480
Speaker 1: can follow him on Twitter at ben Bay. Now time

368
00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:17,840
Speaker 1: to turn to a non public company, and this would

369
00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:22,119
Speaker 1: be Dell Technologies. It is just four years since Michael

370
00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:25,320
Speaker 1: Dell took the company private and here to help us

371
00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:28,119
Speaker 1: understand why they would want to go public again is

372
00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:31,040
Speaker 1: our own on entree of us in our senior semiconductor

373
00:21:31,040 --> 00:21:35,239
Speaker 1: and hardware analyst for Bloomberg Intelligence and on on. Uh,

374
00:21:35,480 --> 00:21:37,920
Speaker 1: you didn't get much sleep last night because the call

375
00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:41,040
Speaker 1: came down that g Maybe Dell is going to consider

376
00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:45,359
Speaker 1: going public yet again. Why would they do this so?

377
00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:50,320
Speaker 1: Multiple reasons, to be quite honest. One is UM. Perhaps

378
00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:53,000
Speaker 1: they want to be leaner and reduce some of their debt.

379
00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:56,320
Speaker 1: Perhaps they want to be more futuristic, pivot the company

380
00:21:56,400 --> 00:22:01,600
Speaker 1: towards UM more of a cloud model UM. Or it

381
00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:05,159
Speaker 1: could be the an old school reason simply to deleverage

382
00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:07,639
Speaker 1: and put a moat around their existing businesses so that

383
00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:11,000
Speaker 1: they can operate better. Now. Each of these goals can

384
00:22:11,040 --> 00:22:14,439
Speaker 1: be fulfilled through one or more large complex transactions, as

385
00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:17,240
Speaker 1: it's always the case when Dell seems to be involved.

386
00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:20,800
Speaker 1: But if you look at their stated goal to become

387
00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:25,600
Speaker 1: the essential infrastructure company as they advertise, is they want

388
00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:28,359
Speaker 1: to keep large pieces of what they already own and

389
00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:30,760
Speaker 1: perhaps to a full company I p O. So if

390
00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:32,720
Speaker 1: you look at the pieces of the pie, they have

391
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:36,480
Speaker 1: a PC segment, they have an infrastructure segment, they have

392
00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:40,040
Speaker 1: a services business which is highly attached to the previous

393
00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:43,840
Speaker 1: two segments, and then they have the software segment. UM. Again,

394
00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,120
Speaker 1: there are two pieces there. One is the pivotal more

395
00:22:46,280 --> 00:22:50,520
Speaker 1: cloud oriented business, and then they have the very popular

396
00:22:50,720 --> 00:22:53,879
Speaker 1: public vm ware business, of which they own roughly about

397
00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:58,320
Speaker 1: an economic contriest of about twenty eight percent. So when

398
00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:01,320
Speaker 1: you put all of this together there this could be

399
00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:05,200
Speaker 1: well in excess of an eighty billion dollar company from

400
00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:08,000
Speaker 1: from a valuation standpoint, well in excess of that. So

401
00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:12,520
Speaker 1: the question is if you want to deleverage that UM,

402
00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:17,399
Speaker 1: how which pieces are you going to try and monetize.

403
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:20,320
Speaker 1: Are you going to sell off a piece of the

404
00:23:20,359 --> 00:23:24,119
Speaker 1: infrastructure business, are you trying to monetize piece of the

405
00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:27,560
Speaker 1: software business that you don't want, and then potentially use

406
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:31,800
Speaker 1: those funds to option a de leverage option B buy

407
00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:34,000
Speaker 1: back more of the pieces of the pie that they

408
00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:37,880
Speaker 1: don't own, so that they become a more holistic quote

409
00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:43,520
Speaker 1: unquote infrastructure UM infrastructure company or essential infrastructure company Okay,

410
00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:48,520
Speaker 1: So you mentioned the vm where steak. They I believe

411
00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:52,399
Speaker 1: that was a sixty seven billion dollar deal. So the

412
00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:55,840
Speaker 1: company Dell Technologies has what about forty six billion dollars

413
00:23:55,880 --> 00:24:00,360
Speaker 1: in debt currently, So if you look at the they

414
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:03,440
Speaker 1: have roughly about fifty three billion dollars or dead part

415
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:08,840
Speaker 1: of about eight eight billions, so roughly about uh six

416
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:13,359
Speaker 1: points seven seven times leverage. So uh, leverage is a

417
00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:16,520
Speaker 1: key question here. If you want to d leverage or

418
00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:20,280
Speaker 1: if you want to UM buy back more of vm Ware,

419
00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:23,200
Speaker 1: for example, you have to find the money somewhere and

420
00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:27,280
Speaker 1: you could potentially monetize a different piece of the pie

421
00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:29,879
Speaker 1: to bring bm Ware back in the house. Is it

422
00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:32,720
Speaker 1: also because they just want to maybe silver Lake, which

423
00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:36,520
Speaker 1: is the private equity firm that helped them go private,

424
00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,600
Speaker 1: they want to get out. They'd like to make their money,

425
00:24:39,640 --> 00:24:45,040
Speaker 1: absolutely so, UM, and that could very well be a reason. UM.

426
00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:49,040
Speaker 1: The question is there's multiple options on the table. So

427
00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:53,520
Speaker 1: option is to punt pieces of the legacy business. Option

428
00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:57,760
Speaker 1: B is to um ip of the whole company. Options

429
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:01,359
Speaker 1: C is to punt pieces of the software business. UM

430
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:03,760
Speaker 1: An option D E n F could be combinations of A,

431
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:07,600
Speaker 1: B and C. So you have multiple different options here.

432
00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:11,359
Speaker 1: The question is what does Dell want to be? Um,

433
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:15,960
Speaker 1: do you want to have a holistic PC infrastructure services

434
00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:19,840
Speaker 1: plus software business, which is quite the opposite route of

435
00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:23,959
Speaker 1: what hp Q and hp have done. Or do you

436
00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:27,520
Speaker 1: want to be a sharper leaner company, keep the infrastructure,

437
00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:32,399
Speaker 1: punt the PCs, punt the software um or monetize pieces

438
00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:35,480
Speaker 1: of different pipes. So you've got a bunch of different options.

439
00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:39,560
Speaker 1: And to be quite honest, um, UM, we don't know

440
00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:41,720
Speaker 1: what Dell wants to be, so we can't really draw

441
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:44,800
Speaker 1: ano conclusions until they tell us exactly what their strategy is.

442
00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:46,840
Speaker 1: Absolutely we know what the pieces of worth. We just

443
00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:48,760
Speaker 1: don't know what pieces are going to stay on the table,

444
00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:50,640
Speaker 1: what pieces are going to be punted. All right, Well,

445
00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:52,600
Speaker 1: thanks very much on intrit of us and I'm sure

446
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:54,359
Speaker 1: they're going to ruin one of your other late nights

447
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:56,919
Speaker 1: by doing it at the very last minute on intried

448
00:25:56,960 --> 00:25:59,640
Speaker 1: of us and as our senior semiconductor and hardware analysts

449
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:04,840
Speaker 1: for Bloomberg Intelligence talking about Dell Technologies and the potential

450
00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:12,119
Speaker 1: for the company to go public. Once again, thanks for

451
00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:14,840
Speaker 1: listening to the Bloomberg P and L podcast. You can

452
00:26:14,880 --> 00:26:18,719
Speaker 1: subscribe and listen to interviews at Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, or

453
00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:22,239
Speaker 1: whatever podcast platform you prefer. I'm pim Fox. I'm on

454
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:26,400
Speaker 1: Twitter at pim Fox. I'm on Twitter at Lisa Abramowits

455
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:29,480
Speaker 1: one before the podcast. You can always catch us worldwide

456
00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:30,440
Speaker 1: on Bloomberg Radio