1 00:00:01,200 --> 00:00:04,640 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works 2 00:00:04,640 --> 00:00:13,840 Speaker 1: dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. 3 00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:20,119 Speaker 1: There's Charles W. Cloak and Dagger Dabby Coleman Bryant. You 4 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:22,959 Speaker 1: remember that movie, Yeah, man, that was so good. It 5 00:00:23,120 --> 00:00:25,160 Speaker 1: was that was a good movie for boys our age. 6 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:27,840 Speaker 1: I think, yeah, it was so good. It managed to 7 00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:32,640 Speaker 1: make the San Antonio Riverwalk look interesting. You've been bagging 8 00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:36,400 Speaker 1: on that since you walked it. Well, I had. I 9 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:38,760 Speaker 1: think it was built up in my mind by that movie, 10 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:41,200 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. I don't remember that being 11 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:42,599 Speaker 1: in the movie, but I haven't. I don't think I've 12 00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:45,720 Speaker 1: seen that since I was there's a big chase scene 13 00:00:45,760 --> 00:00:49,400 Speaker 1: that involved the river walk. Well maybe that was a problem. 14 00:00:49,440 --> 00:00:57,120 Speaker 1: And also, um, there's Jerry Leslie Nielsen Rowland from Spy Heart. Uh. 15 00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:01,960 Speaker 1: And this is stuff you should know. Yes, this is 16 00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:05,759 Speaker 1: a This could be a good one. You could also 17 00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:11,000 Speaker 1: be extraordinarily confusing. Uh huh. Maybe a little dry maybe, 18 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:15,720 Speaker 1: um and uh but brother, if you love bureaucracies, you're 19 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:19,800 Speaker 1: gonna love this one. Yeah, boy, that really came through. Huh. Yeah. 20 00:01:19,959 --> 00:01:24,240 Speaker 1: If you're into organs and flow charts and directors but 21 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 1: not director. It's you're gonna just love this kind of stuff. Yeah, 22 00:01:28,280 --> 00:01:32,800 Speaker 1: and I apologize about my squinting. Uh I lost my glasses. 23 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:36,520 Speaker 1: Oh no, and it takes and it had become you know, 24 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:38,560 Speaker 1: had grown to depend on them. To be honest, you're 25 00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:42,600 Speaker 1: like velma, I am. That's terrible. I mean like like 26 00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:45,080 Speaker 1: lost him, lost him, or they're just like on your bedside, 27 00:01:45,120 --> 00:01:48,000 Speaker 1: you forgot them. You want to know what happened. I 28 00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:50,960 Speaker 1: was on in my bed on my laptop, wearing my 29 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:54,440 Speaker 1: glasses last week. I said I gotta go get something 30 00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:56,760 Speaker 1: out of the car. I put the laptop down and 31 00:01:56,800 --> 00:01:59,080 Speaker 1: the glasses down on the bed and went and got 32 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:03,000 Speaker 1: something out of my car. Came back and they were gone. Wow, 33 00:02:03,040 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 1: that's bizarre. And I think my new puppy like grabbed 34 00:02:06,800 --> 00:02:09,080 Speaker 1: them and did something with them. Oh, that's gonna be 35 00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:12,320 Speaker 1: a treat defined later on. I mean, dude, I've looked 36 00:02:12,360 --> 00:02:20,160 Speaker 1: everywhere and literally vanished, but the puppy left your laptop. Yeah, 37 00:02:20,680 --> 00:02:24,120 Speaker 1: well that's weird. I know. Well anyway, I'm waiting, are 38 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:26,440 Speaker 1: you getting some new ones? Did you go to Eckard 39 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:30,040 Speaker 1: or CVS or Dwayne Read or whatever. I probably should 40 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:32,160 Speaker 1: have just gotten some little cheapy readers, because that's kind 41 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:34,600 Speaker 1: of all I need them for, you know, or did 42 00:02:34,600 --> 00:02:37,440 Speaker 1: you use your monocle? Oh? Man, I should have brought 43 00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:42,320 Speaker 1: my monocle. That's a great idea. All right, well, I'm 44 00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 1: full of them. I did not, so I'm just waiting 45 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:46,920 Speaker 1: for new glasses. And they don't even they don't have 46 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:49,120 Speaker 1: the frames that I've had, so I had to pick 47 00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:52,960 Speaker 1: up new ones, which always thinks because I did just 48 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:56,480 Speaker 1: none of them look you know, good? Well, if you 49 00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 1: can kind of recreate the last ones, they look good. Well. 50 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:02,320 Speaker 1: I'm trying. Well, I guess one more quick question on this. 51 00:03:02,639 --> 00:03:08,080 Speaker 1: How is driving here? Uh reckless dangerous? Oh no, no no, no, 52 00:03:08,200 --> 00:03:11,440 Speaker 1: I just need him for reading. I'm okay, okay, good, good, good. 53 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:14,320 Speaker 1: I don't read while I drive anymore. That's smart too, 54 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 1: even though you could with your glasses. That's correct. Uh So, Chuck, 55 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:23,799 Speaker 1: we're talking today about the National Security Council, and uh, 56 00:03:23,880 --> 00:03:26,200 Speaker 1: up until I started researching this, I thought that that 57 00:03:26,280 --> 00:03:28,799 Speaker 1: was specifically an American thing, But it turns out most 58 00:03:28,880 --> 00:03:32,920 Speaker 1: countries have their own National Security Council and they fairly 59 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:36,040 Speaker 1: closely resemble this kind of thing. I would I would 60 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 1: guess that, but I also realized I really had no 61 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:42,320 Speaker 1: idea what the National Security Council did. But it's like 62 00:03:42,480 --> 00:03:46,320 Speaker 1: it's a pretty it's a pretty genius idea, UM. And 63 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:48,920 Speaker 1: it was one that was implemented by the US Congress, 64 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:52,640 Speaker 1: I should say. The American one was back in nine seven, 65 00:03:52,680 --> 00:03:57,320 Speaker 1: and it was basically like, hey, you've got competing groups 66 00:03:57,360 --> 00:04:02,920 Speaker 1: here that are all trying to shape um American foreign policy, 67 00:04:03,200 --> 00:04:06,560 Speaker 1: whether it's through diplomacy with the State Department, or through 68 00:04:06,600 --> 00:04:10,640 Speaker 1: military with the Department of Defense, or the military itself UM, 69 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:15,120 Speaker 1: or you know by UM yeah, the CIA by snooping 70 00:04:15,720 --> 00:04:20,680 Speaker 1: UM or even groups as desparate as like the Department 71 00:04:20,760 --> 00:04:23,800 Speaker 1: of Energy or the Department of the Treasury. All of 72 00:04:23,839 --> 00:04:27,560 Speaker 1: these groups have their own objectives in shaping policy or 73 00:04:27,720 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 1: responding to a crisis as far as foreign policy goes, right, 74 00:04:32,400 --> 00:04:35,040 Speaker 1: And if you take all these people and put them 75 00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:38,400 Speaker 1: in a room together and say fight it out, and 76 00:04:38,480 --> 00:04:42,440 Speaker 1: the President gets to watch and laugh and then pick 77 00:04:42,520 --> 00:04:47,920 Speaker 1: what he or eventually she thinks is the best the 78 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:53,440 Speaker 1: best option, then you have basically, uh, the best ideal 79 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:59,359 Speaker 1: version of UM hashing something out through a group that 80 00:04:59,360 --> 00:05:01,800 Speaker 1: you could POSSI we hoped for. And that's the point 81 00:05:01,839 --> 00:05:04,720 Speaker 1: of the National Security Council. Yeah, but one thing, and 82 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:07,800 Speaker 1: we're going to talk about the Situation Room specifically, But 83 00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:11,480 Speaker 1: one thing I learned in researching that part of it 84 00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:15,640 Speaker 1: was this kind of we'll not chilling quote very sensible quote, 85 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:19,080 Speaker 1: but still a little chilling. Is there's always more intelligence 86 00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:24,760 Speaker 1: information available than there is time for senior decision makers 87 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:29,840 Speaker 1: to read. Right, So basically, like you know, there there's 88 00:05:29,880 --> 00:05:33,720 Speaker 1: more than they even have, so that you need committees 89 00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:37,360 Speaker 1: and staffs of people that can distill the most important 90 00:05:37,400 --> 00:05:41,000 Speaker 1: stuff down to its most important core right and and 91 00:05:41,040 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 1: the way to do this they the way that it 92 00:05:43,040 --> 00:05:47,040 Speaker 1: has generally been done through the National Security Council is 93 00:05:47,160 --> 00:05:54,120 Speaker 1: by decentralizing UM responsibility for watching over these different things, 94 00:05:54,120 --> 00:05:57,320 Speaker 1: whether it be like a specific policy like energy policy, 95 00:05:57,400 --> 00:06:00,400 Speaker 1: and the way it relates to foreign foreign kind trees 96 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:06,240 Speaker 1: or UM like territories like say some some groups responsible 97 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:08,719 Speaker 1: for the Middle East. You have all these different groups 98 00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:11,320 Speaker 1: that are responsible for keeping an eye on this stuff. 99 00:06:11,400 --> 00:06:15,240 Speaker 1: Thinking about American policy, thinking about how state in American 100 00:06:15,279 --> 00:06:19,479 Speaker 1: policy is changing or evolving as say a situation or 101 00:06:19,520 --> 00:06:23,840 Speaker 1: a new leader UM emerges in a different area UM 102 00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:29,520 Speaker 1: and then as crises or needs for decisions arise, then 103 00:06:29,800 --> 00:06:33,000 Speaker 1: the need to talk about this policy. It bubbles up 104 00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:35,279 Speaker 1: and up and up through the hierarchy until finally it 105 00:06:35,279 --> 00:06:39,560 Speaker 1: gets to the point where there's like secretaries, cabinet level 106 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:45,520 Speaker 1: secretaries who are saying Mr Again or eventually Madam President, Uh, 107 00:06:45,680 --> 00:06:49,080 Speaker 1: we need a decision on this. Here are options. It 108 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:54,640 Speaker 1: is incredibly complex, Like you said, it's not just like, um, 109 00:06:54,680 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 1: you know what what bad leader in the world is 110 00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:00,800 Speaker 1: doing something today. It's that plus about a thousand other 111 00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:05,240 Speaker 1: things from like you know, like you said, it could 112 00:07:05,279 --> 00:07:07,960 Speaker 1: be is is something as simple as uh, or not 113 00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:11,080 Speaker 1: as simple but as like non threatening as you know, 114 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:15,720 Speaker 1: an energy policy with a country with a new leader. 115 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 1: Like you said, you know, there's something that needs attention 116 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:24,240 Speaker 1: outside of our borders. And and by making it bubble 117 00:07:24,400 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 1: up through these levels of hierarchy, you have people who 118 00:07:28,480 --> 00:07:33,600 Speaker 1: have increasing levels of responsibility. And as each level of 119 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:37,000 Speaker 1: responsibility starts saying, yeah, this is worth kicking up to 120 00:07:37,080 --> 00:07:39,360 Speaker 1: the next higher level because we really do need some 121 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:41,920 Speaker 1: sort of decision on this, it takes on further and 122 00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 1: further credence right until it reaches that highest level, the 123 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:50,360 Speaker 1: actual what's actually called the National Security Council UM and 124 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:53,760 Speaker 1: when when it reaches that level, hopefully a decision will 125 00:07:53,800 --> 00:07:56,000 Speaker 1: be made. But that's not necessarily the cases we'll see. 126 00:07:56,920 --> 00:07:59,720 Speaker 1: Should we talk about history. Let's talk history, man, you know. 127 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 1: Uh so our article and this was okay, um, and 128 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:09,760 Speaker 1: once supple supplemented with other supplemented, I'm gonna I like that. 129 00:08:10,520 --> 00:08:14,120 Speaker 1: I like it to gonna keep that, once supplemented with 130 00:08:14,200 --> 00:08:21,280 Speaker 1: other things. I had a friend grown up. He said that, um. 131 00:08:21,320 --> 00:08:22,840 Speaker 1: And it was one of those things where I would 132 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:26,200 Speaker 1: say say spa getty and he would say spuck getty. 133 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:30,080 Speaker 1: I would say spaghetti, he'd say basketty. You'd just like 134 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:32,520 Speaker 1: pinch the bridge of your nose and shake your hand 135 00:08:32,640 --> 00:08:35,960 Speaker 1: basically as a four year old. Uh no, was this 136 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:39,280 Speaker 1: is like early teens. Um, it's not good. Alright. So 137 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:43,079 Speaker 1: throughout history we had not we have not historically had 138 00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:47,360 Speaker 1: the National Security Council, um, because I think in the 139 00:08:47,400 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 1: earlier days, presidents had their sort of inner circle that 140 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 1: kind of acted like what eventually the National Security Council 141 00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:58,439 Speaker 1: how how they would counsel and advise, but they were 142 00:08:58,480 --> 00:09:01,880 Speaker 1: just known as sort of like you know, the bros 143 00:09:01,920 --> 00:09:05,960 Speaker 1: of the president pretty much, you know. Yeah, it was 144 00:09:06,000 --> 00:09:08,720 Speaker 1: it was like who do you trust or specifically who 145 00:09:08,760 --> 00:09:11,960 Speaker 1: who has the expertise needed to help guide your decision 146 00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:14,600 Speaker 1: on this right. And I think one of the reasons 147 00:09:14,640 --> 00:09:17,160 Speaker 1: why there wasn't a National Security Council for most of 148 00:09:17,240 --> 00:09:20,360 Speaker 1: histories because most presidents kind of bristle at the idea 149 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:25,040 Speaker 1: of having a bureaucracy hoisted or foisted on them, where 150 00:09:25,080 --> 00:09:26,760 Speaker 1: they're just like, no, no, no, I got this. I 151 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:28,720 Speaker 1: just I need to ask who I need to ask 152 00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 1: at any given point in time. And some presidents were 153 00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:36,680 Speaker 1: historically known for even even the people that they asked 154 00:09:36,720 --> 00:09:39,280 Speaker 1: advice from, they'd be like, thank you for your advice, 155 00:09:39,640 --> 00:09:43,440 Speaker 1: I'm rejecting it outright, like like Lincoln was apparently famous 156 00:09:43,480 --> 00:09:45,480 Speaker 1: for that. Yeah, I mean Lincoln was a smart fellow. 157 00:09:45,480 --> 00:09:49,320 Speaker 1: He probably had good ideas on his own, well he did. 158 00:09:49,720 --> 00:09:52,120 Speaker 1: He also had he was He was famous for having 159 00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:55,439 Speaker 1: that team of rivals right where not only were people 160 00:09:55,480 --> 00:09:58,040 Speaker 1: in his cabinet rivals with one another, they were rivals 161 00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:01,199 Speaker 1: with him as well and really challenged him to keep 162 00:10:01,240 --> 00:10:05,160 Speaker 1: people in check. Like his Secretary of State Seward, William Seward, 163 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:09,040 Speaker 1: he was big time against the Civil War from happening. 164 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:10,839 Speaker 1: He did not he didn't want to happen. He was 165 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:13,120 Speaker 1: just like, okay, south Sea, it was nice you guys 166 00:10:13,160 --> 00:10:15,640 Speaker 1: being a part of the Union, but we'll figure it out. 167 00:10:15,720 --> 00:10:18,679 Speaker 1: We we shouldn't, we shouldn't go to war. And he 168 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:22,120 Speaker 1: was like opening lines of communication with the Confederacy, going 169 00:10:22,160 --> 00:10:26,920 Speaker 1: around Lincoln and trying to subvert Lincoln's basically wishes that 170 00:10:26,920 --> 00:10:30,320 Speaker 1: that the South not succeed. And Lincoln said, you better 171 00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:35,920 Speaker 1: watch your step. Yeah, that was a good Daniel Dave Lewis, 172 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:38,800 Speaker 1: It wasn't at all. Uh no, but you're right. He 173 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 1: famously um kind of you know, would listen to a device, 174 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:46,920 Speaker 1: even if seward and and say no, you know, on 175 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:49,720 Speaker 1: the president, this is my choice. Yeah, he said, quote 176 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:53,320 Speaker 1: if this must be done, I must do it. And 177 00:10:53,320 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 1: and that was kind of the way that the president's 178 00:10:55,960 --> 00:10:57,600 Speaker 1: I mean, it takes a certain kind of person to 179 00:10:57,640 --> 00:11:01,360 Speaker 1: be a president, right, and usually if you are elected president, 180 00:11:01,600 --> 00:11:03,040 Speaker 1: you're not the kind of person who's like, what do 181 00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:06,520 Speaker 1: you guys think? Hey over there, what's your what's your opinion? 182 00:11:06,640 --> 00:11:09,040 Speaker 1: What should I do? It's it's like, go do this. 183 00:11:09,679 --> 00:11:13,520 Speaker 1: I'm the president the end, do it, right. But as 184 00:11:13,640 --> 00:11:16,920 Speaker 1: the United States grew and the world grew a little 185 00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:21,640 Speaker 1: more complexities, uh were brought out obviously, especially with in 186 00:11:21,720 --> 00:11:25,720 Speaker 1: terms of foreign policy and um, especially after World War Two, 187 00:11:25,760 --> 00:11:29,120 Speaker 1: there were you know, Congress was not thrilled with the 188 00:11:29,120 --> 00:11:31,480 Speaker 1: way FDR kind of ran things, and they said, you 189 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:35,040 Speaker 1: know what I think we need and the president needs help, 190 00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:38,319 Speaker 1: uh in the form of you know, a body, an 191 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:43,400 Speaker 1: official body, sanctioned body surrounding him to help him make decisions. Uh. 192 00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:47,760 Speaker 1: And so eventually in nine is when the National Security 193 00:11:47,800 --> 00:11:51,960 Speaker 1: Act was passed and this council was created to quote 194 00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:55,720 Speaker 1: advise the President with respect to the integration of domestic 195 00:11:55,760 --> 00:12:00,559 Speaker 1: foreign military policies relating to national security and other off 196 00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:04,000 Speaker 1: and it's it's again, this is a significant act because 197 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:08,560 Speaker 1: it's saying, uh, Mr President, here's the bureaucracy that you 198 00:12:08,600 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 1: didn't ask for and you don't want, but we're putting 199 00:12:11,320 --> 00:12:14,080 Speaker 1: on you on your shoulders because this stuff is just 200 00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:18,160 Speaker 1: too big now, Like we're a superpower and we can't 201 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:21,280 Speaker 1: just leave it up to you and your formal informal 202 00:12:21,360 --> 00:12:24,800 Speaker 1: management style of ad hoc working groups that you just 203 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:27,320 Speaker 1: pull into the Oval office whenever you need some advice. 204 00:12:27,400 --> 00:12:30,319 Speaker 1: We need something far more structured than that. So we're 205 00:12:30,360 --> 00:12:32,640 Speaker 1: going to pass a Congressional Act that we're going to 206 00:12:32,760 --> 00:12:35,800 Speaker 1: force you to sign into law. And Truman actually signed 207 00:12:35,800 --> 00:12:38,920 Speaker 1: it into law in ninety seven, and from that point 208 00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:41,680 Speaker 1: on there was a structure that the president was expected 209 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:44,600 Speaker 1: to use when making foreign policy decisions, so that he 210 00:12:44,640 --> 00:12:48,040 Speaker 1: would have all of the um, all of the options, 211 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:52,360 Speaker 1: all of the opinions, all of the varying um factors 212 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:55,640 Speaker 1: in any any given situation before him, so that he 213 00:12:55,679 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 1: can say option D, I like it. Yeah, And like 214 00:12:59,520 --> 00:13:03,440 Speaker 1: you said before, you know, different presidents over the years 215 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:06,680 Speaker 1: have had different Uh, there's a lot of leeway within 216 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:09,560 Speaker 1: how you want to run your National Security Council, how 217 00:13:09,559 --> 00:13:12,760 Speaker 1: it structured. It's not completely set in stone, as we've 218 00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:14,720 Speaker 1: seen recently. And we'll we'll talk a little bit about 219 00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:18,600 Speaker 1: what's going on now, but you know, throughout since ninety seven, 220 00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:23,920 Speaker 1: basically each president has sort of had their own reasons 221 00:13:23,960 --> 00:13:27,240 Speaker 1: for leaning on it a lot or not leaning on 222 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:30,400 Speaker 1: it that much. Initially, Truman, after kind of right after 223 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:33,600 Speaker 1: it was passed through, was kind of uh, you know, 224 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:36,520 Speaker 1: he didn't go to meetings a lot until after the 225 00:13:36,600 --> 00:13:38,640 Speaker 1: Korean War, and then he was like, oh, wait a minute, 226 00:13:38,920 --> 00:13:42,679 Speaker 1: I think there's a lot of value here. Um, Eisenhower, 227 00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 1: being former military, was sort of used to that, uh 228 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:52,120 Speaker 1: that system of committees and bureaucracy, and uh he he 229 00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:53,559 Speaker 1: kind of took to it right away and was like, no, 230 00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:55,800 Speaker 1: this is great. I'm gonna even kind of expand the 231 00:13:55,880 --> 00:14:00,559 Speaker 1: NFC and create you know, these uh these special or boards, 232 00:14:00,600 --> 00:14:02,920 Speaker 1: and I'm actually going to create someone called the National 233 00:14:02,920 --> 00:14:07,360 Speaker 1: Security Advisor. Yeah, which is a huge thing, huge contribution 234 00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:11,079 Speaker 1: to the National Security Council that Eisenhower made. And yeah, 235 00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:12,719 Speaker 1: since he was used to the military, he's like, yeah, 236 00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:16,400 Speaker 1: let's make this even more regimented than Congress wanted. And 237 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:18,600 Speaker 1: he put it to good work. But since then it's been, 238 00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 1: um typically more pared down than what Eisenhower had. I 239 00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:27,440 Speaker 1: think he had like probably the most hierarchical and decentralized 240 00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:31,240 Speaker 1: and spread out National Security Council of any president ethan 241 00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:35,520 Speaker 1: more than Obama even Yeah, Obama had I think a 242 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:38,880 Speaker 1: huge bloated one, but I think it didn't have as 243 00:14:38,920 --> 00:14:42,760 Speaker 1: many say like departments or committees or um. That kind 244 00:14:42,760 --> 00:14:45,600 Speaker 1: of thing is Eisenhower's. Because Obama received a lot of 245 00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:49,720 Speaker 1: criticism for that, and from what I read right rightly 246 00:14:49,760 --> 00:14:52,800 Speaker 1: so that that it was basically a it was a 247 00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:59,160 Speaker 1: huge stalling mechanism that Obama used to to put off 248 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:03,880 Speaker 1: form policy decisions or to make them outside of his 249 00:15:03,960 --> 00:15:08,240 Speaker 1: own cabinet. Well, and even if it wasn't purposeful, it's just, 250 00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:12,000 Speaker 1: you know how it is with bureaucracy. The more bloated 251 00:15:12,160 --> 00:15:15,040 Speaker 1: an organization gets, just the slower everything is gonna move, 252 00:15:15,600 --> 00:15:17,240 Speaker 1: and the harder it's gonna be to get anything done. 253 00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:21,160 Speaker 1: Uh that's just kind of how it works. Um So, 254 00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:25,600 Speaker 1: Kennedy comes along and uh had a had a kind 255 00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:27,880 Speaker 1: of a disaster on his hands with the Bay of Pigs, 256 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:30,440 Speaker 1: kind of which we should do a show on at 257 00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:33,040 Speaker 1: some point. And uh so he he looked to his 258 00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:37,120 Speaker 1: um national Security adviser, MC George Bundy, the man with 259 00:15:37,320 --> 00:15:43,200 Speaker 1: two last names, and said, uh, we need a chill 260 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:48,720 Speaker 1: room to hang out and make decisions. And how about 261 00:15:48,800 --> 00:15:53,280 Speaker 1: that bowling alley? Yeah it was FDRs bowling alley, and 262 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:55,880 Speaker 1: FDR side up from his grave and said, not my 263 00:15:55,960 --> 00:16:02,360 Speaker 1: bowling alley, right, And that's when the situation Room was created, which, um, 264 00:16:02,400 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 1: I thought this was really neat. I didn't know much 265 00:16:04,280 --> 00:16:07,040 Speaker 1: about the situation Room. I thought it was the room. 266 00:16:07,160 --> 00:16:10,040 Speaker 1: Um I didn't know that it was five thousand square 267 00:16:10,040 --> 00:16:14,360 Speaker 1: feet of different rooms on the ground floor of the 268 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:18,760 Speaker 1: west wing. Yeah. The wood shed. Yeah, that's the nickname 269 00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:21,080 Speaker 1: for which I didn't get why they call it that, 270 00:16:21,240 --> 00:16:25,000 Speaker 1: because you know here in the States the woodsheds typically 271 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:28,480 Speaker 1: used and take them out behind the wood shed. Usually 272 00:16:28,560 --> 00:16:32,320 Speaker 1: that means getting a spanking. Well maybe that's you know 273 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:38,080 Speaker 1: what happens in the woods In the situation room, they 274 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:41,160 Speaker 1: watched they watched people get spanked. I guess on closed 275 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:45,880 Speaker 1: circuit TV. I guarantee they do. Uh. Should we take 276 00:16:45,880 --> 00:16:47,600 Speaker 1: a break and then talk about the situation room a 277 00:16:47,600 --> 00:17:15,560 Speaker 1: little more? Yeah? Yeahs So Chuck, we're talking about situation room. 278 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:20,840 Speaker 1: Uh and not with Wolf Flitzer, No, never, And um, 279 00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:25,879 Speaker 1: it was started with Kennedy, right, And uh, did you 280 00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:28,119 Speaker 1: see the picture in that one of the articles you 281 00:17:28,160 --> 00:17:30,240 Speaker 1: sent me of the situation where I think it was 282 00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:32,960 Speaker 1: the wood shed One one of them had like dozens 283 00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:35,440 Speaker 1: and dozens of pictures, which kind of surprised me that one, 284 00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:37,119 Speaker 1: that one, But there was a picture in there, and 285 00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:40,000 Speaker 1: I think it was the original situation room that they 286 00:17:40,040 --> 00:17:42,240 Speaker 1: that Kennedy had set up. And basically it was a 287 00:17:42,280 --> 00:17:44,760 Speaker 1: bunch of chairs and like a huge map of the 288 00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:48,600 Speaker 1: world on the wall. There was some situation room like 289 00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:51,760 Speaker 1: the war room from Strange Love. They call in like 290 00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:54,159 Speaker 1: a nine year old civil servant to come in and 291 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:59,480 Speaker 1: move attack from you know, Ecuador to Guatemala, and then 292 00:17:59,480 --> 00:18:05,200 Speaker 1: he just show full back out. Uh. This thing apparently 293 00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:07,000 Speaker 1: used to be I mean, it went under a big 294 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:09,520 Speaker 1: renovation in two thousand six, and apparently before that was 295 00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:13,119 Speaker 1: a UM. I don't get the idea that it was 296 00:18:13,560 --> 00:18:19,360 Speaker 1: necessarily um antiquated, but it wasn't certainly up to the 297 00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:23,679 Speaker 1: kind of modern technological uh level that it needed to be. 298 00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:26,440 Speaker 1: Let's just say that. Yeah. I also have the impression 299 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:31,800 Speaker 1: that it was um a lot more luxurious originally, but 300 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:34,800 Speaker 1: that things like the mahogany paneling actually made it hard 301 00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:38,320 Speaker 1: to hear people on speaker phone, right. Um, So they 302 00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 1: kind of just updated it to probably much more in 303 00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:46,200 Speaker 1: line of what people thought it looked like all along. Yeah. 304 00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:48,280 Speaker 1: That that main room, where you know you've probably seen 305 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:52,440 Speaker 1: the most photos of, has six flat screens. UM. Very 306 00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:56,080 Speaker 1: secure obviously for video conferencing with whoever you want around 307 00:18:56,080 --> 00:18:59,640 Speaker 1: the world. Uh. Links directly to Air Force one, which 308 00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:02,520 Speaker 1: is kind a neat. Uh. They have you know, private 309 00:19:03,320 --> 00:19:08,800 Speaker 1: meeting rooms, private phone booth rooms. Uh. Secure video rooms. 310 00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:11,480 Speaker 1: It's like, you know, it's kind of like what you 311 00:19:11,520 --> 00:19:15,720 Speaker 1: would expect. Um, you can't text from there, you can't 312 00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:18,320 Speaker 1: like you know, they don't want things leaking out of there. 313 00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:21,159 Speaker 1: So it's just and it is not a bunker like 314 00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:23,159 Speaker 1: a lot of people might think. But yeah, there's some 315 00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:25,840 Speaker 1: windows to the exterior of the White House. Yeah, but 316 00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:29,239 Speaker 1: it feels like a bunker and that all these you know, 317 00:19:29,359 --> 00:19:31,479 Speaker 1: kind of very private and secure areas, but it's not 318 00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:33,800 Speaker 1: like deep underground or anything like that, right right. Yeah. 319 00:19:33,840 --> 00:19:37,080 Speaker 1: I think the room where there's that famous photo of 320 00:19:37,119 --> 00:19:41,560 Speaker 1: everybody in the Obama National Security Council watching the ben 321 00:19:41,640 --> 00:19:45,200 Speaker 1: Laden raid ben Laden spanking. Yeah, yeah, behind the wood shed, 322 00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:49,520 Speaker 1: um and they that that, I think that that is 323 00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:53,080 Speaker 1: a it's an enclosed, windowless room that's that is cut off, 324 00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:57,280 Speaker 1: has kind of bunker like qualities, but it's the the 325 00:19:57,320 --> 00:20:01,120 Speaker 1: whole the whole interior itself is not a bunker. It's 326 00:20:01,119 --> 00:20:04,879 Speaker 1: not underground like you said. Correct. Uh. They have a staff, 327 00:20:04,920 --> 00:20:08,160 Speaker 1: the situation room staff. It's about thirty people in general, 328 00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:10,840 Speaker 1: and there are they're organized into what's called watch teams. 329 00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:15,000 Speaker 1: And these watch teams do uh well, they don't take 330 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:20,919 Speaker 1: the night off seven monitoring of everything basically. Um. And 331 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:24,040 Speaker 1: it says there's usually three duty officers, a communications assistant, 332 00:20:24,400 --> 00:20:30,200 Speaker 1: and an intelligence analyst on each watch team. And um, 333 00:20:30,240 --> 00:20:32,600 Speaker 1: you know, presidents throughout the years have used the situation 334 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:36,600 Speaker 1: room sparingly sometimes. Uh. I think in the case of Kennedy, 335 00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:39,520 Speaker 1: he liked to be in the Oval office a little more. Um. 336 00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:42,320 Speaker 1: And they say Lyndon Johnson was in the situation room 337 00:20:42,400 --> 00:20:44,840 Speaker 1: so much that he even moved his Oval office chair 338 00:20:44,840 --> 00:20:49,240 Speaker 1: down there. Yeah. Nixon and Ford apparently never used the room. 339 00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:54,840 Speaker 1: Uh h w Bush and Clinton use it a lot. Uh. 340 00:20:54,880 --> 00:20:58,879 Speaker 1: And in that two thousand six expansion they included UM 341 00:20:59,320 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 1: offices for Homeland Security Council now in the White House 342 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:06,440 Speaker 1: Chief of Staffs offices down there now, which is pretty interesting. 343 00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:10,960 Speaker 1: But um, apparently you get nominated to be part of 344 00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:14,400 Speaker 1: the personnel. Oh yeah, I'm quite sure. It is a 345 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:18,879 Speaker 1: highly prestigious tour, their two year tours, and I'm sure 346 00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:22,920 Speaker 1: it's just absolutely grueling because basically, they make you watch 347 00:21:23,040 --> 00:21:26,600 Speaker 1: cable news from around the world all day long. There's 348 00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:31,320 Speaker 1: also tons of cables coming in from the from various 349 00:21:31,359 --> 00:21:35,720 Speaker 1: embassies around the country. All of the intelligence, raw intelligence 350 00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 1: gets coming through um this room. Right. So apparently after 351 00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:43,480 Speaker 1: the Bay of Pigs, Kennedy was like, I think he 352 00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:46,640 Speaker 1: felt cut off from actual raw intelligence and he hadn't 353 00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:51,920 Speaker 1: been presented with the correct actual intelligence. So he created 354 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:58,760 Speaker 1: this Situation Room to basically circumvent the the intelligence community 355 00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:04,439 Speaker 1: and to have his ends on raw intelligence. Right. So 356 00:22:04,520 --> 00:22:06,679 Speaker 1: you've got intelligence coming from around the world going to 357 00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:10,440 Speaker 1: the various intelligence agencies, but each intelligence agency is also 358 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:15,400 Speaker 1: commanded to send their raw intelligence to the Situation Room, 359 00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:19,640 Speaker 1: and then it's up to this Situation Room staff to say, uh, 360 00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:24,000 Speaker 1: this seems important, This isn't the important, this is pretty important, 361 00:22:24,119 --> 00:22:26,840 Speaker 1: and they compile it all into different briefings that the 362 00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:30,199 Speaker 1: president gets daily, usually in the morning and in the 363 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 1: evening as well. Yeah, and if you're part of this staff, 364 00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:36,320 Speaker 1: you're you're like, we said, handpicked for that to year thing, 365 00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:39,600 Speaker 1: and you're they said, you know, it's it's a very 366 00:22:39,600 --> 00:22:41,600 Speaker 1: big deal. You have to have an even temperament um. 367 00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:44,040 Speaker 1: You have to be cool under pressure. You have to 368 00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:46,920 Speaker 1: be able to have these spur of the moment coherent 369 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:50,680 Speaker 1: intelligent conversations like with the President on a moment's notice. 370 00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:55,840 Speaker 1: You can't be like President I can believe it's you. Uh. 371 00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:58,480 Speaker 1: And apparently, um, this article said you know, I think 372 00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:00,239 Speaker 1: this from the CIA had said, you know, you need 373 00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:01,840 Speaker 1: to check your ego at the door at this job. 374 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:06,800 Speaker 1: One director situation room director said to an incoming duty officer, 375 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:09,600 Speaker 1: just remember there are many important people who work in 376 00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:12,240 Speaker 1: the White House, and you're not one of them. I 377 00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:16,800 Speaker 1: love that quote. Uh. So you know, the it varies 378 00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:20,880 Speaker 1: with the presidents. But basically every day the watch team 379 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 1: puts together something called the morning Book, uh for the President, 380 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:27,920 Speaker 1: the Vice president and you know whoever on the White 381 00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:31,800 Speaker 1: House staff is I guess authorized to get this. Uh. 382 00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:36,159 Speaker 1: And in this morning book is the well, it's a 383 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:42,720 Speaker 1: daily affirmation. That's the first thing. The National Intelligence Daily 384 00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:45,000 Speaker 1: is in there. The State Department's Morning Summary is in there, 385 00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:50,320 Speaker 1: any kind of intelligence reports, um. And then I think 386 00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:53,600 Speaker 1: a family circus cartoon, right, just to keep things light 387 00:23:53,680 --> 00:23:59,239 Speaker 1: right and in it in it pgs, says PASQUETI. Uh. 388 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:01,280 Speaker 1: And then the morning book is this is in the 389 00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:04,400 Speaker 1: car the National Security Advisor when they're picked up. And 390 00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:07,240 Speaker 1: they also had the President's Daily brief that's the CIA's 391 00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:12,760 Speaker 1: daily prepared briefing basically, and like this is every day. 392 00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:17,160 Speaker 1: These are these briefs and reports that these senior people 393 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:21,800 Speaker 1: and staff get every single morning of every single day 394 00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:24,520 Speaker 1: of every year, right and and just to give you 395 00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:28,680 Speaker 1: kind of in an an idea of how how much 396 00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:32,639 Speaker 1: information is coming into these poor SAPs twenty four hours 397 00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:35,600 Speaker 1: a day. If something does happen, right, if there's like 398 00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:38,919 Speaker 1: a crisis somewhere around the world, there's like a revolution 399 00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:42,879 Speaker 1: breaking out, um, you would have all of the people 400 00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:47,359 Speaker 1: who are involved in that crisis, say that area or 401 00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,159 Speaker 1: it's related to again energy, or say it's like an 402 00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 1: a bola outbreak that's suddenly like sweeping. So you'd have 403 00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:56,840 Speaker 1: all the people involved in that coming into the situation room, 404 00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:00,400 Speaker 1: right and just being like, we give us all the information. 405 00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:02,440 Speaker 1: You gotta keep us updated, tell us what's going on, 406 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:06,080 Speaker 1: like every five seconds. But if you're the situation room staff, 407 00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:09,359 Speaker 1: you're like, that's great, I understand you're having a crisis 408 00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:11,520 Speaker 1: right now, but we're still trying to pay attention to 409 00:25:11,560 --> 00:25:14,720 Speaker 1: the rest of the world to like a crisis is 410 00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:18,360 Speaker 1: it's obviously it's not meaningless to these people, but it's 411 00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,320 Speaker 1: all it's all relative because they can't just stop paying 412 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:26,560 Speaker 1: attention to China because there's an Ambola outbreak in Africa, correct, 413 00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:31,280 Speaker 1: you know, yeah, so that they I my hats off 414 00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:33,480 Speaker 1: to them for being able to keep up with all 415 00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:36,800 Speaker 1: of this stuff. Yeah, and and you know, obviously certain 416 00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:41,879 Speaker 1: times are a little more calm relatively speaking than others. 417 00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:44,040 Speaker 1: But yeah, I don't think I'd be very good at that. 418 00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:48,600 Speaker 1: But there's never a day where there's not something going 419 00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:52,680 Speaker 1: on in the world that at least whoever in that 420 00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:56,240 Speaker 1: region is going to feel is super important to catch 421 00:25:56,280 --> 00:25:59,359 Speaker 1: the President's eye. You know, you gotta put something in 422 00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:03,040 Speaker 1: those into telligence briefings, like you know, there's a Russian 423 00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:07,479 Speaker 1: plane in this airspace and we don't know why, right. 424 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:10,280 Speaker 1: You know. If there's one thing I've learned from researching 425 00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:17,720 Speaker 1: this episode, Chuck, it's that the United States is very nosy. Yeah. Yeah, 426 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:20,720 Speaker 1: so that's the situation room, Chucking. It's almost kind of 427 00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:23,960 Speaker 1: like its own thing, right. It's like one of those 428 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:28,639 Speaker 1: old timey tenement clotheslines directly between and the president if 429 00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:31,400 Speaker 1: the President so chooses, or at least the National Security 430 00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:35,520 Speaker 1: Council staff, which makes the National Security Council kind of 431 00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:38,359 Speaker 1: its own thing, you know what I mean, Like it's 432 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:41,080 Speaker 1: its own It definitely is its own agency. But if 433 00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:45,119 Speaker 1: you look back at the original congressional mandate, the the 434 00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:47,840 Speaker 1: the point of it was it was supposed to be 435 00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:52,040 Speaker 1: a forum, a place where the different um heads of 436 00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:55,119 Speaker 1: departments and cabinet members came together and said, this is 437 00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:56,560 Speaker 1: what we need to do. No, this is what we 438 00:26:56,640 --> 00:27:01,000 Speaker 1: need to do. Mr President choose right. But with this, this, 439 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:04,119 Speaker 1: the addition of the Situation Room and some other, um, 440 00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:06,840 Speaker 1: some other moves that presidents have made, like creating the 441 00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:09,879 Speaker 1: position of the National Security Advisor, it has become its 442 00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:13,959 Speaker 1: own party, its own thing to where yes, it's responsible 443 00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:17,359 Speaker 1: for coordinating policy and calling meetings and getting everybody to 444 00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:21,320 Speaker 1: the table, but it also it's bringing its own views 445 00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:24,879 Speaker 1: and policies on policies now, whereas before it was just 446 00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:29,520 Speaker 1: supposed to be a place where the existing cabinet members 447 00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:32,440 Speaker 1: came and talked about policy. So that was a big change. 448 00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:36,119 Speaker 1: And um, I think that that took place beginning with 449 00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:40,840 Speaker 1: Eisenhower and the the creation of the National Security Advisor, 450 00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:44,040 Speaker 1: but definitely also the creation of the Situation Room and 451 00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:48,600 Speaker 1: this direct pipeline to the president for raw intelligence as well. Yeah, 452 00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:50,800 Speaker 1: and like we said earlier, like each president can kind 453 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:54,359 Speaker 1: of organize things how they like, you know, how they 454 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:58,480 Speaker 1: prefer to have things organized and um, you know, Johnson, 455 00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:02,200 Speaker 1: he would have Lyndon john and apparently had regular Tuesday 456 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:06,680 Speaker 1: working lunches where he brought together the CIA director, Chairman 457 00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:09,080 Speaker 1: of Joint Chiefs of Staff, Secretary of State in Defense 458 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:13,480 Speaker 1: and they all had you know, uh, salad wraps every 459 00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:17,760 Speaker 1: Tuesday and chatted about what was going on. Tid Basil 460 00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:22,800 Speaker 1: was Johnson's favorite under Nixon. Apparently he you know, he 461 00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:27,080 Speaker 1: obviously worked so closely with Kissinger that I get the 462 00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:30,320 Speaker 1: feeling that he didn't he didn't like meetings with a 463 00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:33,600 Speaker 1: large amount of people. I don't think he trusted very 464 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:35,399 Speaker 1: many people. That NIXT is probably a good way to 465 00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:38,240 Speaker 1: say it. And then of course Ford did exactly what 466 00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:42,520 Speaker 1: Nixon did. Surprise. Uh. And then I don't I think 467 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:45,440 Speaker 1: you said Carter didn't use it very much. Uh, Well, 468 00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:47,600 Speaker 1: this art, I mean, our article at least says um 469 00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:51,560 Speaker 1: that Carter. It said that he kind of had his 470 00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:55,680 Speaker 1: own ideas and the um the NFC was not as 471 00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 1: much of behind the scenes managers what they called it 472 00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:02,480 Speaker 1: is maybe with other administrations. Yeah, he used the National 473 00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:07,160 Speaker 1: Security Advisors kind of uh policy mouthpiece to the country 474 00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:10,000 Speaker 1: and said there this is the way the president feels. 475 00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:14,000 Speaker 1: It was like a spokesperson, um. And that that that 476 00:29:14,160 --> 00:29:18,240 Speaker 1: kind of made the National Security Advisor a lot more prominent, 477 00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:21,520 Speaker 1: which is actually something that had been started under the 478 00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:25,840 Speaker 1: Nixon administration when he appointed Henry Kissinger or when he 479 00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:30,240 Speaker 1: had Henry Kissinger's his National Security advisor. UM. Because Kissener 480 00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:34,520 Speaker 1: Kissinger buck the trend and that the National Security Advisor 481 00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:38,120 Speaker 1: went from somebody who's in charge of coordinating policy, getting 482 00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:40,960 Speaker 1: everybody at the table figuring out, you know, what the 483 00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:45,880 Speaker 1: president needed to know to actually formulating foreign policy, UM, 484 00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:49,680 Speaker 1: which I think is another thing that some presidents have 485 00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:54,560 Speaker 1: tasked or if not tasked successive national security advisors with. 486 00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:57,240 Speaker 1: But that was a big change because that you know, 487 00:29:57,360 --> 00:29:59,960 Speaker 1: Kissinger was saying, this is this is how the US 488 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:03,200 Speaker 1: needs to um respond to this kind of thing, or 489 00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:05,480 Speaker 1: this this is the way our energy policy should be. 490 00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:07,480 Speaker 1: I keep going back to that. Well, but it's a 491 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 1: it's a great well. Yeah, um, you know Reagan comes 492 00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:16,760 Speaker 1: along and uh after Carter and really changes things with 493 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:19,800 Speaker 1: the n s c uh to the point where we 494 00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:22,640 Speaker 1: decided just to do an entirely new podcast and not 495 00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:25,840 Speaker 1: talk about this much on Iran Contra. Yeah, but to 496 00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:28,280 Speaker 1: say that there was overreach going on under his n 497 00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:30,960 Speaker 1: sc IS is probably a bit of an understatement. Yeah, 498 00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:34,360 Speaker 1: he turned it into like a clandestine covert operations agency. 499 00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:37,280 Speaker 1: It's nuts what he did with it. It is um. 500 00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:40,240 Speaker 1: H W. Bish came along and kind of restored order 501 00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:43,360 Speaker 1: a bit and apparently set up a really good system, 502 00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:47,880 Speaker 1: like a good a working system, um with his his 503 00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:50,000 Speaker 1: flow chart and all these committees that were going on, 504 00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:53,560 Speaker 1: and apparently he was so successful and sort of just 505 00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:58,120 Speaker 1: kind of making it a um, a truly functioning body. 506 00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:03,560 Speaker 1: That uh, that Bill Clinton, his his little uh, his 507 00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:07,040 Speaker 1: little buddy, almost said, a little buddy, George W. Bush. 508 00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:10,840 Speaker 1: I guess his son. I guess there were buddies. They're 509 00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:14,120 Speaker 1: buddies at Davos and stuff like that. Uh. And then 510 00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:17,040 Speaker 1: together and then Obama they all kind of followed suit 511 00:31:17,160 --> 00:31:22,400 Speaker 1: following H. W. Bush's um uh sort of organization organizational 512 00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:28,600 Speaker 1: flow yeah, because it works so well. Yeah, and it's basically, um, well, 513 00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:31,160 Speaker 1: I guess we should talk about it. Huh. You want 514 00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:33,280 Speaker 1: to take a break first, yeah, and talk about these 515 00:31:33,280 --> 00:32:01,440 Speaker 1: committees yeah or charts coming up right after this, So chuck, um, 516 00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:06,000 Speaker 1: let's break down the National Security Council. All right, let's 517 00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:09,640 Speaker 1: break it down for him, fella. They're committees now, um, 518 00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:15,720 Speaker 1: within the NFC. Are we going from bottom to top? Sure? Okay, 519 00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:19,680 Speaker 1: go ahead, start at the bottom. Okay, Fine, So you've 520 00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:25,080 Speaker 1: got policy coordinating Committees the PCC. So the policy coordinating committees, right, 521 00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:30,040 Speaker 1: They basically are they have a focus of specific focus, 522 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:35,760 Speaker 1: whether it's on a region or a a a particular 523 00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:42,520 Speaker 1: interest maybe energy and Um. These these committees are made 524 00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:46,080 Speaker 1: up of people from different agencies, whether it's you know, 525 00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:50,320 Speaker 1: the Intelligence community or the Department of Energy or who 526 00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:55,680 Speaker 1: whoever has a stake in that region or that particular policy. 527 00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:58,280 Speaker 1: And they're made up of experts on them. But you know, 528 00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:00,120 Speaker 1: they're I don't want to say the low level well 529 00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:04,840 Speaker 1: there within their actual agency, they're they're probably pretty high up, um. 530 00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:07,520 Speaker 1: And they come together and they're keeping an eye on 531 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:12,000 Speaker 1: stuff right there, monitoring changes. There may be saying we're bored, 532 00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:14,360 Speaker 1: we need to come up with a brand new policy 533 00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:18,200 Speaker 1: for America to undertake in this regard or in this region. Right. 534 00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:22,160 Speaker 1: And UM, let's say a crisis comes along, and let's 535 00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:26,560 Speaker 1: say that this is the Middle East Policy Coordinating Committee 536 00:33:26,840 --> 00:33:29,520 Speaker 1: something happens. Oh, I don't know, there's a gas attack 537 00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:35,120 Speaker 1: in Syria right this this Policy Committee is obviously there's 538 00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:37,440 Speaker 1: so there will be some other parallel thing from the 539 00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:42,000 Speaker 1: raw intelligence going through the Situation Room. But this committee 540 00:33:42,040 --> 00:33:46,080 Speaker 1: would also spring into action and it would start bubbling up. Um, 541 00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:50,640 Speaker 1: it would start writing policy papers. They would um dust 542 00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:53,440 Speaker 1: off old theories and hypotheses, and they would go to 543 00:33:53,560 --> 00:33:57,680 Speaker 1: the people directly above them, the Deputies Committee, and they 544 00:33:57,720 --> 00:34:00,640 Speaker 1: would say, we need to get the President moving on 545 00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:04,400 Speaker 1: this whatever this is. Yeah, And the Deputies Committee is 546 00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:08,560 Speaker 1: headed by the Deputy National Security Advisor, and um, things 547 00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:11,960 Speaker 1: are getting kind of serious at this point. Um. All 548 00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:15,480 Speaker 1: the deputy heads of the departments, um are included on 549 00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:20,040 Speaker 1: this committee. And I get the feeling that I get 550 00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:22,560 Speaker 1: the feeling that this is just the next level of 551 00:34:23,239 --> 00:34:27,399 Speaker 1: of weeding out things. And um, eventually if it makes 552 00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:30,800 Speaker 1: it way to the Principles Committee that's just below the 553 00:34:31,120 --> 00:34:34,759 Speaker 1: actual NSC and that is headed by the National or 554 00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:37,080 Speaker 1: I guess convened is what they say, by the National 555 00:34:37,160 --> 00:34:42,520 Speaker 1: Security Advisor him or herself. And the National Security Council 556 00:34:42,680 --> 00:34:45,120 Speaker 1: is actually made up of the President, the Vice President, 557 00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:49,600 Speaker 1: the Secretary of State, Secretary of Defense, Secretary of Energy, 558 00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:54,799 Speaker 1: I believe, uh, and the National Security Advisor. And then 559 00:34:54,840 --> 00:35:00,920 Speaker 1: there's other what are called observers or advisors, specifically the 560 00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:05,239 Speaker 1: Director of National Intelligence, who is the person who's in 561 00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:08,840 Speaker 1: charge of the entire intelligence community, from the n s 562 00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:11,719 Speaker 1: A and the c i A to Coast Guard intelligence, 563 00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:14,840 Speaker 1: everybody who's snooping on behalf of the United States. This 564 00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:18,360 Speaker 1: person is the top of that whole community. And the 565 00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:21,800 Speaker 1: Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, who is the 566 00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:27,440 Speaker 1: um representative of the all armed forces of the military, 567 00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:30,920 Speaker 1: so it's the military's voice in the National Security Council. 568 00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:35,400 Speaker 1: And once these these people are talking about an issue 569 00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:39,000 Speaker 1: or a policy, it's a that's about as high level 570 00:35:39,080 --> 00:35:41,600 Speaker 1: as it gets. And and the point of it reaching 571 00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:45,239 Speaker 1: this committee is that these people are all saying, this 572 00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:48,000 Speaker 1: is the best option. No, no, this is the best option. 573 00:35:48,239 --> 00:35:49,960 Speaker 1: We need to talk some more. No, we need to 574 00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:54,719 Speaker 1: shoot some missiles off, and then the president has to decide. Yeah. 575 00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:57,040 Speaker 1: And um, you know, like we said that it can 576 00:35:57,080 --> 00:36:00,480 Speaker 1: be organized within certain bounds of the law as the 577 00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:04,600 Speaker 1: presidency's fit. And um, you know, anyone who follows the 578 00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:07,960 Speaker 1: news in the United States um or abroad about the 579 00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:11,480 Speaker 1: United States. Um, there was quite a shakeup. And you 580 00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:16,160 Speaker 1: know earlier this year when our current president excluded the 581 00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:18,240 Speaker 1: chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the Director 582 00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:22,120 Speaker 1: of National Intelligence from UM. They weren't like banned from 583 00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:25,239 Speaker 1: the NSC, but they weren't on the list of like, hey, 584 00:36:25,480 --> 00:36:27,319 Speaker 1: you you need to be at all these meetings all 585 00:36:27,360 --> 00:36:30,440 Speaker 1: the time. It was more like you uh, I think 586 00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:33,280 Speaker 1: the direct quote was you shell attend where issues pertaining 587 00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:37,160 Speaker 1: to your responsibilities and expertise are to be discussed. And UM. 588 00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:39,840 Speaker 1: There was a big uproar in the press, and the 589 00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:41,520 Speaker 1: White House down played it and said, you know, this 590 00:36:41,719 --> 00:36:46,440 Speaker 1: is not a real change Like in past administrations, the Chairman, 591 00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:48,640 Speaker 1: the Joint chiefs of Staff and Director of National Intelligence 592 00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:51,239 Speaker 1: aren't at all the meetings either. They're usually at the 593 00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:55,320 Speaker 1: ones that pertained to them. So, UM, what's what gives? 594 00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:57,640 Speaker 1: What's the deal? Yeah, like, quit making a big deal 595 00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:01,400 Speaker 1: about this. And also this, UM, this guy Steve Bannon, 596 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:06,279 Speaker 1: my my political strategist, is a is a full fledged member. 597 00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:10,720 Speaker 1: That was a big deal for a little while because 598 00:37:10,920 --> 00:37:14,920 Speaker 1: just this week, as we're recording in real time, Mr 599 00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:18,279 Speaker 1: Bannon has been excused and of course he UM, the 600 00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:20,239 Speaker 1: White House, and Bannon tried to play it up like, 601 00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:21,600 Speaker 1: you know what, he was never going to be on 602 00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:24,719 Speaker 1: there permanently. He was in there too undo the work 603 00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:28,120 Speaker 1: of Susan Rice, who was Obama's National security advisor. Um, 604 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:31,920 Speaker 1: is what Bannon said, And then officials said no, he 605 00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:35,120 Speaker 1: was actually there to monitor Michael Flynn, the first national 606 00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:38,479 Speaker 1: security advisor, who is already gone. And now that he's gone, 607 00:37:38,960 --> 00:37:41,520 Speaker 1: we don't really need Bannon. His work has done. That's 608 00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:43,239 Speaker 1: really all we kind of wanted him in there for 609 00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:48,440 Speaker 1: to begin with. Just crazy to watch this. Yeah, and um, 610 00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:51,520 Speaker 1: I don't think anyone bought that. I don't even think 611 00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:56,640 Speaker 1: Republicans bought that's been Um, there was clearly a and 612 00:37:57,040 --> 00:38:01,200 Speaker 1: is currently clearly there's an internal struggle going on with 613 00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:05,799 Speaker 1: with apparently Steve Bannon and the President's son in law, 614 00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:09,360 Speaker 1: Jared Kushner, and um, to the point where the President 615 00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:12,319 Speaker 1: was like, you know, you guys worked this stuff out, 616 00:38:12,520 --> 00:38:17,080 Speaker 1: or I'm gonna solve it and family matters to Donald Trump, 617 00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:21,719 Speaker 1: and I think Bannon understands that. Yeah, it definitely looks 618 00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:23,719 Speaker 1: like the knives are out for Bannon. He doesn't have 619 00:38:23,800 --> 00:38:26,960 Speaker 1: a lot of friends elsewhere in the White House. So 620 00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:31,319 Speaker 1: if the president is turning on him, then it's that's 621 00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:33,160 Speaker 1: not good news for Steve Bannon. Yeah. I mean, we'll 622 00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:35,880 Speaker 1: see how this plays out. But just today where you know, um, 623 00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:39,880 Speaker 1: Donald Trump was quoted as kind of the quotes were 624 00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:44,120 Speaker 1: very cool on his support for Bannon today. Cool cool 625 00:38:44,200 --> 00:38:47,759 Speaker 1: as in um, he was kind of like, Hey, I 626 00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:49,520 Speaker 1: think the quote was something like, you know, he's a 627 00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:51,120 Speaker 1: good guy, but you know he didn't hook up with 628 00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:54,279 Speaker 1: me until kind of recently. Yeah, I saw that that 629 00:38:54,520 --> 00:38:57,920 Speaker 1: that's that's not a ringing endorsement, you know. So so 630 00:38:58,080 --> 00:39:00,840 Speaker 1: when he put Bannon on, like he gave him a 631 00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:03,680 Speaker 1: permanent seat on the National Security Council, that was a 632 00:39:03,760 --> 00:39:08,520 Speaker 1: big deal because presidents have had political advisors on their 633 00:39:08,840 --> 00:39:13,160 Speaker 1: National Security Council. That's been done before, but never like 634 00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:16,600 Speaker 1: a permanent reserve seat at all the meetings, and it 635 00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:19,120 Speaker 1: sent like a really big message, And the message was 636 00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:25,160 Speaker 1: the political ramifications of a decision or a policy outcome 637 00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:29,000 Speaker 1: are just as important as say, like the military or 638 00:39:29,120 --> 00:39:32,480 Speaker 1: diplomatic ramifications of they're gonna be it's gonna be taken 639 00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:34,879 Speaker 1: into account just as much. And I think that's why 640 00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:37,279 Speaker 1: a lot of people were chilled by that because you 641 00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:39,640 Speaker 1: you don't want it to be political. You don't want 642 00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:42,839 Speaker 1: your decisions to be you know, well, what how will 643 00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:45,120 Speaker 1: this affect my vote or something like that down the road. 644 00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:47,759 Speaker 1: And that's how a lot of people took Bannon's appointment 645 00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:51,799 Speaker 1: to the National Security Council. This new guy who came 646 00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:58,399 Speaker 1: in after Flynn, hr McMaster has apparently alleviated a lot 647 00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:00,880 Speaker 1: of worry by a lot of people. He's he's a 648 00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:05,080 Speaker 1: three star general. He's only one of three active duty 649 00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:10,000 Speaker 1: military to serve as National Security Advisor. Um. So he's 650 00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:14,840 Speaker 1: an active duty military guy. And he um, he's apparently 651 00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:18,759 Speaker 1: well respected inside and outside of the military. Didn't he 652 00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:21,239 Speaker 1: I think he didn't restore the Chairman of the Joint 653 00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:24,279 Speaker 1: Chiefs of Staff and uh Director of National Intelligence. Yes 654 00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:27,200 Speaker 1: he did, and and the reason why that was a 655 00:40:27,280 --> 00:40:32,239 Speaker 1: bizarre move, um, And apparently it's it's that's George W. 656 00:40:32,440 --> 00:40:37,040 Speaker 1: Bush did the same thing. But the since two thousand one, 657 00:40:38,360 --> 00:40:43,239 Speaker 1: there's not any American foreign policy issue or crisis that 658 00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:47,800 Speaker 1: doesn't involve the intelligence community and the military. It's just 659 00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:52,880 Speaker 1: the direction America's gone. So, I mean that kind of 660 00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:56,480 Speaker 1: falls in line with trump stated policy of isolationism. Just 661 00:40:56,600 --> 00:40:59,160 Speaker 1: kind of saying, no, we're gonna rein that back in. 662 00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:02,040 Speaker 1: I think that's probably what he was doing, but I 663 00:41:02,120 --> 00:41:05,360 Speaker 1: don't know that a lot of elites in Washington have 664 00:41:05,760 --> 00:41:09,680 Speaker 1: um faith that he has an actual plan rather than 665 00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:14,399 Speaker 1: was just sending a message, you know what I mean. Yeah, 666 00:41:14,920 --> 00:41:17,879 Speaker 1: So this McMaster guy though he um, he actually made 667 00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:23,000 Speaker 1: his name by writing a dissertation criticizing Lyndon Johnson's UM 668 00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:29,200 Speaker 1: military advisors on the National Security Council during Vietnam. He uh. 669 00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:31,719 Speaker 1: He wrote his thesis and it got turned into a 670 00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:35,440 Speaker 1: bestselling book called Dereliction of Duty, and a lot of 671 00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:38,200 Speaker 1: people are like, um, man, this guy is great. He's 672 00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:41,360 Speaker 1: all about being open and upfront and honest with the president. 673 00:41:42,160 --> 00:41:44,520 Speaker 1: And then other people read the book and said, oh, 674 00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:47,920 Speaker 1: this guy is a is a military guy who's who's 675 00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:50,640 Speaker 1: saying that you shouldn't listen to the president's wishes and 676 00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:53,719 Speaker 1: the military should just act on its own. So I 677 00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:57,160 Speaker 1: think most people subscribe to the former reading of it 678 00:41:57,440 --> 00:42:01,120 Speaker 1: that that he actually is a pretty pretty um smart 679 00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:04,680 Speaker 1: guy and is not is not calling for the military 680 00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:08,400 Speaker 1: to act independently of the president's which is more that 681 00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:14,000 Speaker 1: he was indicting UM the president's advisors for not being 682 00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:17,919 Speaker 1: forthright and upfront and clear. Uh, and was just kind 683 00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:20,000 Speaker 1: of going along with Johnson and telling him what he 684 00:42:20,040 --> 00:42:23,200 Speaker 1: wanted to hear as far as Vietnam went. And it's 685 00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:26,919 Speaker 1: interesting stuff. That guy's an interesting dude. McMaster is, Yeah, 686 00:42:27,080 --> 00:42:30,800 Speaker 1: it really is. UM. The the NFC themselves, like you know, 687 00:42:30,840 --> 00:42:33,920 Speaker 1: obviously we've kind of talked to nausea about the meetings 688 00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:39,279 Speaker 1: in the bureaucracy. But aside from this, UM, one of 689 00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:41,360 Speaker 1: the one of the other things that they do is, 690 00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:43,640 Speaker 1: you know, if the president has a call with a 691 00:42:43,719 --> 00:42:46,960 Speaker 1: foreign leader, Um, there's gonna be a senior staff member 692 00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:49,799 Speaker 1: from the NFC there with them. They're gonna brief him 693 00:42:49,840 --> 00:42:53,719 Speaker 1: beforehand and say, hey, you're gonna you're about to get 694 00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:58,160 Speaker 1: on a call with let's say the leader of North Korea, 695 00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:02,319 Speaker 1: and yeah, that's called happened all the time. And they, uh, 696 00:43:02,440 --> 00:43:04,520 Speaker 1: they will probably talk want to talk about this and 697 00:43:04,640 --> 00:43:07,400 Speaker 1: this is sort of the important things that we need 698 00:43:07,480 --> 00:43:11,600 Speaker 1: to cover. And they may mention this and you may 699 00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:14,440 Speaker 1: want to respond this way. Don't talk about how much 700 00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:17,800 Speaker 1: you like that Seth Rogan movie the interview. Avoid that 701 00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:20,480 Speaker 1: at all, call avoid that. Did you see that? Yeah? 702 00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:22,960 Speaker 1: Was it any good. Oh you didn't see it. Nah, 703 00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:27,000 Speaker 1: that's pretty good. That's pretty funny. Yeah, yeah, I was. Um, 704 00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:30,759 Speaker 1: I mean it's a Seth Rogan James Franco taking on 705 00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:36,800 Speaker 1: really pronounced opinion on a specific policy matter. But it 706 00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:39,600 Speaker 1: was pretty funny. I liked it. I was about to say, 707 00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:42,200 Speaker 1: maybe I'll see it, but I know I won't. Uh. 708 00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:46,040 Speaker 1: I I would recommend if you're sitting around watch it 709 00:43:46,280 --> 00:43:49,319 Speaker 1: all right, you know. So, um, you know this phone 710 00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:51,719 Speaker 1: call take place in the and that NFC staffer is 711 00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:54,920 Speaker 1: generally there through the call and taking notes, and then 712 00:43:55,239 --> 00:43:58,560 Speaker 1: that then is super useful information to take back down 713 00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:03,440 Speaker 1: to their minie or subcommittee. Um. So that's just like 714 00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:05,480 Speaker 1: another one of their duties basically is what making sure 715 00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:09,080 Speaker 1: the president as all the information on basically any meeting 716 00:44:09,200 --> 00:44:11,040 Speaker 1: or call that they're going to take with any foreign leader. 717 00:44:12,440 --> 00:44:15,000 Speaker 1: And so what I I think you can sum up 718 00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:19,680 Speaker 1: the National Security Council like this, right, somebody has an idea. 719 00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:23,800 Speaker 1: Let's say that they decided that, um, it would be 720 00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:28,440 Speaker 1: great for America's position in the world if we dedicated 721 00:44:29,160 --> 00:44:34,440 Speaker 1: UM June one as National Flower Power Day. And it 722 00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:36,759 Speaker 1: comes up from a committee and keeps bubbling up and 723 00:44:36,800 --> 00:44:39,920 Speaker 1: bubbling up and bubbling up, and each time that passes 724 00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:42,640 Speaker 1: from one committee another, somebody saying, yes, I think this 725 00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:45,000 Speaker 1: is a good idea, and we're gonna put my reputation 726 00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:46,640 Speaker 1: on the line by saying it should be taken to 727 00:44:46,680 --> 00:44:48,880 Speaker 1: the president. And finally goes all the way of the 728 00:44:48,960 --> 00:44:51,960 Speaker 1: National security advisor, who is the gatekeeper to the president 729 00:44:52,280 --> 00:44:56,040 Speaker 1: on all matters of foreign policy and national security, and 730 00:44:56,800 --> 00:44:59,919 Speaker 1: he or she decides what's worth taking to the PRESI 731 00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:03,640 Speaker 1: in it, and specifically what's worth waking the president up 732 00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:08,560 Speaker 1: at three am? Have you ever heard that story about 733 00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:13,279 Speaker 1: Um Carter, Jimmy Carter's national security advisor? Are you ready 734 00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:18,360 Speaker 1: to hear me? Drone on? Okay? So, back in November 735 00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:25,560 Speaker 1: of nine, at three am around then, Um Big New Brasinski, 736 00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:31,359 Speaker 1: who was the national security advisor to Carter, um got 737 00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:36,040 Speaker 1: a call from NORAD that showed that the Soviet Union 738 00:45:36,120 --> 00:45:39,480 Speaker 1: had launched nuclear missiles at the United States and they 739 00:45:39,520 --> 00:45:42,960 Speaker 1: were on their way. And it was up to Prasinski 740 00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:47,840 Speaker 1: to decide whether this was a fluke and a glitch 741 00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:51,160 Speaker 1: in Norah's system or first just a teenager in the 742 00:45:51,239 --> 00:45:54,800 Speaker 1: Pacific Northwest exactly trying to change his grades right. So 743 00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:56,640 Speaker 1: this guy in the middle of the night had the 744 00:45:57,080 --> 00:46:00,759 Speaker 1: terrible job of do I kick this up to the 745 00:46:00,840 --> 00:46:04,480 Speaker 1: president and let the person who could launch a nuclear 746 00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:08,560 Speaker 1: counter attack on the Soviet Union make that decision? Or 747 00:46:08,719 --> 00:46:12,719 Speaker 1: do I sit on this and say this is not real, 748 00:46:12,880 --> 00:46:16,080 Speaker 1: this is a fluke, this is a Norag glitch. And uh, 749 00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:19,200 Speaker 1: he had to decide it, and he decided, no, it's 750 00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:21,680 Speaker 1: a glitch. And he was right, it was a glitch. 751 00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:25,279 Speaker 1: And apparently that happened a number of times. Uh, we 752 00:46:25,400 --> 00:46:28,800 Speaker 1: came very close to launching a counter attack against a 753 00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:32,040 Speaker 1: phantom strike that hadn't actually been launched during the Cold War, 754 00:46:32,640 --> 00:46:35,719 Speaker 1: and Brazilski apparently had nerves of steel when it came 755 00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:38,080 Speaker 1: to stuff like that. But that's a pretty good example 756 00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:40,440 Speaker 1: of what a national security advisors meant to do. Like 757 00:46:41,200 --> 00:46:43,759 Speaker 1: you're the person, the last person to decide whether to 758 00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:47,480 Speaker 1: take it to the president and escalate it or not. Wow. 759 00:46:48,520 --> 00:46:51,680 Speaker 1: I say wow as well. Well, And uh, because I 760 00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:55,080 Speaker 1: know people the of Keen I of pop culture history 761 00:46:55,120 --> 00:46:57,400 Speaker 1: will point this out, We'll beat you to the punch. 762 00:46:57,560 --> 00:47:00,720 Speaker 1: And note that that is the second Dabney Coleman reference 763 00:47:00,800 --> 00:47:04,360 Speaker 1: in the show. Oh yeah, nice was not expecting that 764 00:47:04,560 --> 00:47:07,319 Speaker 1: I forgot. He was great in both movies. So if 765 00:47:07,360 --> 00:47:09,640 Speaker 1: we can just work in a nine to five reference 766 00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:12,840 Speaker 1: before it's all out, I think he's just man. He 767 00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:18,279 Speaker 1: was great, really loved love Dabney Coleman. Uh is he 768 00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:24,040 Speaker 1: still around? I think he's still alive and doesn't act much? Oh? Well, 769 00:47:24,080 --> 00:47:28,400 Speaker 1: good for him. He's enjoying life unless he's uh, unless 770 00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:32,480 Speaker 1: he's unless he's recently passed on. Yeah, I don't know. 771 00:47:33,400 --> 00:47:35,640 Speaker 1: I could be thinking of that movie Short Time where 772 00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:39,440 Speaker 1: he was dying and tried to get himself killed so 773 00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:42,839 Speaker 1: his family could get his pension. That was a good 774 00:47:42,880 --> 00:47:46,160 Speaker 1: movie too, which one Short Time. I don't think i've 775 00:47:46,160 --> 00:47:48,440 Speaker 1: seen that one either. Oh, check it out. You need 776 00:47:48,520 --> 00:47:50,880 Speaker 1: to do a double feature short Time in the interview, 777 00:47:51,120 --> 00:47:56,279 Speaker 1: Hey he's still alive. Confirmed. Hey Dabney Coleman. Are you 778 00:47:56,320 --> 00:48:02,480 Speaker 1: got anything else? Um? I don't think so. Um. I 779 00:48:02,600 --> 00:48:06,160 Speaker 1: have one more movie recommendation. It's a documentary called The 780 00:48:06,200 --> 00:48:11,080 Speaker 1: Fog of War. That was a good one. Oh, and 781 00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:15,400 Speaker 1: I have a reading recommendation to fortune to anyone, of course, 782 00:48:16,080 --> 00:48:20,160 Speaker 1: But have you ever read have you seen Zero Dark thirty? Okay, 783 00:48:20,200 --> 00:48:24,320 Speaker 1: so apparently as far as um Seymour Hirsch, the great 784 00:48:24,640 --> 00:48:29,720 Speaker 1: investigative journalists, says that is all bs it's government propaganda 785 00:48:30,480 --> 00:48:34,200 Speaker 1: and that whole official Mark Bowden zero Dark thirty account 786 00:48:34,320 --> 00:48:37,640 Speaker 1: of how bin Laden was found not necessarily the rate itself, 787 00:48:37,680 --> 00:48:39,600 Speaker 1: but how he was found in everything leading up to 788 00:48:39,719 --> 00:48:43,040 Speaker 1: the raids is just spin, and that it actually was 789 00:48:43,239 --> 00:48:46,800 Speaker 1: much simpler and less glamorous than that. Um and he 790 00:48:46,920 --> 00:48:50,160 Speaker 1: wrote a series of essays for the London Review of 791 00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:53,440 Speaker 1: Books and specifically the killing of Osama bin Laden. That 792 00:48:53,600 --> 00:48:56,960 Speaker 1: one um kind of lays out the whole thing behind it. 793 00:48:57,040 --> 00:48:59,200 Speaker 1: It's pretty interesting to how it really went down. Was 794 00:48:59,239 --> 00:49:01,080 Speaker 1: they were like, we need to find where Osama bin 795 00:49:01,160 --> 00:49:04,759 Speaker 1: ladnez And someone called in and said he's right over there. 796 00:49:04,760 --> 00:49:07,880 Speaker 1: I see him. He's in a McDonald's. It went almost 797 00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:10,840 Speaker 1: like that, except the first part where they said we 798 00:49:10,920 --> 00:49:13,520 Speaker 1: need to find out where he is didn't happen. Somebody 799 00:49:13,640 --> 00:49:16,239 Speaker 1: just walked in and then said, hey, he's a McDonald's 800 00:49:16,280 --> 00:49:19,120 Speaker 1: and they said we should spank him. Yeah. Remember the 801 00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:22,200 Speaker 1: time I saw John Cryer at McDonald's and Los Angeles. 802 00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:24,879 Speaker 1: You remember that the day after this Charlie Sheen freak 803 00:49:24,920 --> 00:49:28,120 Speaker 1: out was going on. Man, that was what a day 804 00:49:28,200 --> 00:49:32,719 Speaker 1: to see John Cryer. Yeah, is he elated or was 805 00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:37,200 Speaker 1: he he was stress stress eating McDonald's breakfast because his 806 00:49:38,160 --> 00:49:41,839 Speaker 1: hundred thousand dollar Mercedes. Yeah, his um, his cash cow 807 00:49:41,880 --> 00:49:44,800 Speaker 1: of a TV show, was being threatened by his cookie 808 00:49:44,840 --> 00:49:48,440 Speaker 1: co star. Didn't he pay money to go see Charlie Sheen? 809 00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:52,320 Speaker 1: Did I? Yeah? No, no, no, Mike Tyson Okay, no, 810 00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:55,160 Speaker 1: I've never seen remember when he went on tour for 811 00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:57,759 Speaker 1: some reason, I thought you went to that. No, but 812 00:49:58,040 --> 00:49:59,920 Speaker 1: I have more respect for you than to think that 813 00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:01,960 Speaker 1: you actually would have paid money for that. Right, I've 814 00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:06,239 Speaker 1: gotten in free maybe right. Uh, if you want to 815 00:50:06,320 --> 00:50:08,880 Speaker 1: know more about the National Security Council, just go to 816 00:50:08,920 --> 00:50:10,560 Speaker 1: the White House and knock on the front door and 817 00:50:10,600 --> 00:50:14,200 Speaker 1: ask him to give you a tour, right, yep. Uh. 818 00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:17,960 Speaker 1: In the meantime, actually probably shouldn't do that. Uh, it's 819 00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:20,920 Speaker 1: just type national Security Counsel in the search bar how 820 00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:23,319 Speaker 1: stuff works, and it'll bring up this article. And since 821 00:50:23,360 --> 00:50:27,719 Speaker 1: I said that, it's time for listening. Mate. Uh, my 822 00:50:27,840 --> 00:50:32,080 Speaker 1: friend Tracy called Steeve Ann and she said he looks 823 00:50:32,120 --> 00:50:38,480 Speaker 1: like a beach bar drunk. Yeah, yeah, I can see that. Actually, Yeah, 824 00:50:38,680 --> 00:50:41,080 Speaker 1: like he looks like he should be wearing flip flops 825 00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:44,479 Speaker 1: in every photo. Well, he used to. And then somebody said, 826 00:50:44,719 --> 00:50:49,239 Speaker 1: you need to start wearing suits, right, Um, all right, 827 00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:54,040 Speaker 1: I'm gonna call this um empathy response. Hey, guys, listened 828 00:50:54,040 --> 00:50:56,160 Speaker 1: to empathy today. I had a good laugh at Chuck's 829 00:50:56,160 --> 00:50:59,160 Speaker 1: impression of a doctor falling to pieces because something similar 830 00:50:59,160 --> 00:51:01,720 Speaker 1: happened to me when I was routine. I was junior 831 00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:04,480 Speaker 1: in high school. Summer between junior and senior year, my 832 00:51:04,680 --> 00:51:06,880 Speaker 1: parents sent me to scout camp. A few days in 833 00:51:06,920 --> 00:51:08,959 Speaker 1: the trip, when the other kids cast a fishing line 834 00:51:09,400 --> 00:51:12,160 Speaker 1: without any bait, and uh, I walked right behind him, 835 00:51:12,200 --> 00:51:15,279 Speaker 1: and the hook lodged right into my eyeball, not the 836 00:51:15,320 --> 00:51:18,719 Speaker 1: skin around my eye, the eyeball. A few hours later, 837 00:51:18,760 --> 00:51:22,080 Speaker 1: I was at Valley Children's near Fresno and for emergency surgery, 838 00:51:22,520 --> 00:51:24,759 Speaker 1: waiting for them to prepare an operating room, and the 839 00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:28,319 Speaker 1: antistisiologists came in and looked at my eye and shouted, Oh, 840 00:51:28,440 --> 00:51:34,200 Speaker 1: my god, his eye is going to collapse. I'm transgender, 841 00:51:34,280 --> 00:51:36,680 Speaker 1: so calling me he made sense at the time, by 842 00:51:36,719 --> 00:51:39,400 Speaker 1: the way, hearing a doctor say something like that about 843 00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:41,920 Speaker 1: my eyeball would probably have freaked me out in any 844 00:51:41,960 --> 00:51:44,600 Speaker 1: other circumstance, But they had me drugged up pretty good 845 00:51:44,640 --> 00:51:47,360 Speaker 1: at the time. Um Still, I remember thinking that the 846 00:51:47,400 --> 00:51:50,520 Speaker 1: reaction was probably not how a doctor should react the 847 00:51:50,640 --> 00:51:53,239 Speaker 1: things that they want to keep their patients calm. Unfortunately, 848 00:51:53,320 --> 00:51:56,000 Speaker 1: I had a happy ending. The talented surgeon who took 849 00:51:56,040 --> 00:51:57,720 Speaker 1: care of me, got the hook out without any damage 850 00:51:57,760 --> 00:52:01,800 Speaker 1: to my sight, and well married every The only evidence 851 00:52:01,840 --> 00:52:05,080 Speaker 1: that ever happened is a very faint scar on the 852 00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:09,440 Speaker 1: white of my eye. And people that this doesn't close 853 00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:11,919 Speaker 1: quite as much as the one in the other eye, 854 00:52:12,280 --> 00:52:15,719 Speaker 1: aren't your mirror neurons is going preserve right now in 855 00:52:15,840 --> 00:52:19,280 Speaker 1: the worst way. Well it's funny, um because she said 856 00:52:19,840 --> 00:52:21,560 Speaker 1: I didn't read that part, but she said get ready 857 00:52:21,600 --> 00:52:25,160 Speaker 1: for your mirror neurons to fire at the beginning. Anyhow, 858 00:52:25,200 --> 00:52:26,960 Speaker 1: thanks for all the laughs and knowledge you guys drop 859 00:52:27,080 --> 00:52:29,799 Speaker 1: on me during my commute. Started my job new job 860 00:52:29,840 --> 00:52:33,080 Speaker 1: as a science writer for cal Tech last week, and 861 00:52:33,160 --> 00:52:35,040 Speaker 1: I've been recommending stuff you should know to my very 862 00:52:35,080 --> 00:52:38,959 Speaker 1: smart new coworkers. And that is from Emily Blasco. Thanks 863 00:52:39,000 --> 00:52:42,880 Speaker 1: a lot, Emily, great one. That was terrible and horrible, 864 00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:45,279 Speaker 1: but great. Yes, I'm glad it all worked out for you, 865 00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:47,560 Speaker 1: and good luck is a science writer send us all 866 00:52:47,600 --> 00:52:51,840 Speaker 1: of your interesting articles please. If you have some interesting 867 00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:54,160 Speaker 1: articles you want us to read, maybe we'll turn it 868 00:52:54,239 --> 00:52:56,839 Speaker 1: into a Stuff you Should Know episode Who Knows Uh. 869 00:52:57,040 --> 00:52:59,080 Speaker 1: You can tweet them to us at s y s 870 00:52:59,120 --> 00:53:01,440 Speaker 1: K podcast. You can also hang out with me on 871 00:53:01,560 --> 00:53:05,440 Speaker 1: Twitter at Josh Underscore um Underscore Clark. You can hang 872 00:53:05,520 --> 00:53:08,480 Speaker 1: out with Chuck on Facebook at Charles W. Chuck Bryant, 873 00:53:09,040 --> 00:53:11,000 Speaker 1: or you can hang out with us at Stuff you 874 00:53:11,040 --> 00:53:13,640 Speaker 1: Should Know on Facebook two. You can send us both 875 00:53:13,760 --> 00:53:16,920 Speaker 1: and Jerry an email to Stuff Podcast at how stuff 876 00:53:16,920 --> 00:53:19,120 Speaker 1: Works dot com, and as always, you can come hang 877 00:53:19,160 --> 00:53:21,680 Speaker 1: out with us at a luxurious home on the web 878 00:53:22,000 --> 00:53:28,560 Speaker 1: stuff you Should Know dot com. For more on this 879 00:53:28,760 --> 00:53:31,239 Speaker 1: and thousands of other topics, is it how stuff Works 880 00:53:31,280 --> 00:53:31,680 Speaker 1: dot com