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Speaker 1: Welcome back to our next episode of I Have Some Thoughts,

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Speaker 1: our weekly pop culture mental health mashup chat. I am

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Speaker 1: joined today again by Elise Ellis, who is our director

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Speaker 1: of podcast in Digital Programs.

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Speaker 2: Hey, Elise, Hey, very excited to hear what we're gonna

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Speaker 2: chat about today, Elise.

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Speaker 3: Of course, of course, of course, So first we definitely

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Speaker 3: have to start with all things HOVE. This weekend, jay

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Speaker 3: Z headlined the Roots Picnic in Philadelphia. The performance drove

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Speaker 3: a lot of conversation online, with many fans reflecting on

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Speaker 3: where they were in life when those songs first came

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Speaker 3: out and celebrating jay Z's continued presence as one of

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Speaker 3: hip hop's most influential figures. When it comes to like

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Speaker 3: reunion tours and anniversary shows, I'm always curious, like, are

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Speaker 3: we missing the music or the version of ourselves that

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Speaker 3: existed when we first heard it? So my question for

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Speaker 3: you is why can hearing music from a particular era

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Speaker 3: bring up such powerful emotions and memories?

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Speaker 1: Ooh, I have been seeing this chatter to what I

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Speaker 1: wasn't there, of course, but I have been paying attention

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Speaker 1: to like some of the video clips and the excitement

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Speaker 1: that people have had and I don't know that it's

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Speaker 1: like that we're missing like a younger version of ourselves

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Speaker 1: or the music. I think that it is just a

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Speaker 1: perfect combination of like nostalgia and like remembering where you

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Speaker 1: were when this song hit, or like memories with your

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Speaker 1: friends or experiences that you had and that music was

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Speaker 1: the background of it, and so I think it is

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Speaker 1: just a really cool thing to relive those moments and

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Speaker 1: kind of bring those into your present life. I remember

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Speaker 1: when we talked to the dance and movement therapists on

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Speaker 1: the podcast, and she talked about like how concerts and

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Speaker 1: like live music experiences can often serve as like a

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Speaker 1: co regulating experience for us, which is why I think,

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Speaker 1: you know, so many of us really enjoy going to

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Speaker 1: kinds not only to hear our favorite artists, but also

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Speaker 1: there's something very communal and powerful I think about experiencing

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Speaker 1: those things together that I think is really healing for

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Speaker 1: a lot of people.

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Speaker 2: I love that.

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Speaker 3: I was very jealous that I wasn't able to.

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Speaker 2: Go, wondering because you've been in the past right to

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Speaker 2: that I have.

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Speaker 3: I've been to the Roots Picnic probably six times. So yeah,

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Speaker 3: ever since I was in high school, being from the

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Speaker 3: East Coast. I'm from DC, so it was just right

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Speaker 3: up the street for me.

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Speaker 2: Right right.

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Speaker 1: The only part of that conversation has also been combed

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Speaker 1: out his lots lot.

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Speaker 3: You know, I was getting you know, I was getting there.

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Speaker 3: So jay Z definitely combed out his lots. There was

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Speaker 3: a lot of chatter like why is he in blues? Nachos,

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Speaker 3: all of these things, But I definitely would love to

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Speaker 3: hear from you what it means to see larger cultural

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Speaker 3: figures Black figures wear and embrace their natural hair. He

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Speaker 3: already was with his lots, but we're seeing a new

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Speaker 3: style which I think is really cool.

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Speaker 2: Mm hmm, yeah.

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Speaker 1: I mean I think we've had some version of this

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Speaker 1: conversation on the podcast right just talking about like how

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Speaker 1: hair shapes our identity and how you know, it's experimental,

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Speaker 1: especially as black women to kind of, you know, do

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Speaker 1: different things.

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Speaker 2: With our hair.

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Speaker 1: And I always think, you know, we've come a long

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Speaker 1: way in that conversation, but I still don't think we

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Speaker 1: are like arrived in terms of feeling like your hair

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Speaker 1: needs to be straight for special occasions, or like what

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Speaker 1: kind of messaging.

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Speaker 2: Are we giving young people?

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Speaker 1: As I always think it's cool when somebody with a

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Speaker 1: large platform embraces their natural hair. Now, I do, though,

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Speaker 1: still think there's a conversation around like texturism, right, Like,

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Speaker 1: I think that is often missed in this conversation that

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Speaker 1: most times we are celebrating a particular type of natural hair.

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Speaker 1: But I think there's room to expand that conversation in

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Speaker 1: that our natural hair is glorious and beautiful in whatever.

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Speaker 2: System we are on that chart or whatever.

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Speaker 1: But I do think it is exciting to see, of course,

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Speaker 1: always the evolving conversation around natural hair in big moments.

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Speaker 3: Now I may get an eye roll from you for

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Speaker 3: this one, but week kicks off Love Island USA, and

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Speaker 3: just for the season eight premiere of Love Island USA,

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Speaker 3: contestant Hasana Montgomery was removed from the cast after old

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Speaker 3: videos resurfaced online showing her using a racial slur. Although

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Speaker 3: the clips weren't recent, they quickly spread across social media

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Speaker 3: after the cast announcement, leading producers to remove her from

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Speaker 3: the show before it even aired. We've seen this on

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Speaker 3: Love Island and countless other reality TV shows, and people

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Speaker 3: are debating the impact of digital footprints, accountability, and what

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Speaker 3: happens when past mistakes resurface years later as people enter

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Speaker 3: new faces of their lives. And I'm like, can people

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Speaker 3: grow beyond their past mistakes when the Internet never forgets?

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Speaker 3: And so we hear so much about the Internet being forever.

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Speaker 3: My question for you is how can people navigate the

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Speaker 3: anxiety of knowing their past mistakes, acknowledging their poor decisions

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Speaker 3: or things they said years ago could resurface at any moment.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, this feels like very timely, right because one of

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Speaker 1: our January Jump Star episodes this year was around like

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Speaker 1: reminding you to eliminate your digital foot print and minimizing your.

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Speaker 2: Digital foot print, And this is what the guests talked.

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Speaker 1: About, right, Like the Internet is forever, and so I

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Speaker 1: think that there is a way to grow past some mistakes.

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Speaker 2: But I do feel like some mistakes are like larger

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Speaker 2: than others.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 2: There is a mistake of.

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Speaker 1: Oh, I accidentally swapped out somebody's order with something else

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Speaker 1: it should have been versus a racial slur. Right, I

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Speaker 1: think that that speaks to a deeper kind of caricter

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Speaker 1: kind of concern than like a silly.

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Speaker 2: Mistake that maybe you made as a child.

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Speaker 1: But I also think it is important for us to

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Speaker 1: then be talking to the young people in our lives

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Speaker 1: and like using these kinds of things as examples of Hey,

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Speaker 1: you may think it's just being kind of silly or

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Speaker 1: having fun with your friends, or like being in the

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Speaker 1: cool crowd saying things online, but look at the impact

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Speaker 1: this can have even ten fifty, twenty years later. Right,

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Speaker 1: And so even when you think, oh, I deleted the

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Speaker 1: video or I took it down, like, it's very likely

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Speaker 1: that somebody already has a copy of it, and so

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Speaker 1: it's really important to always be mindful of what kinds.

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Speaker 2: Of things you're sharing online.

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Speaker 1: Also, it does feel like we have one of these

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Speaker 1: kinds of crises with Love Island every year, and so

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Speaker 1: it's making me wonder if some of this is not

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Speaker 1: a publicity kind of thing, because surely, I mean, I

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Speaker 1: know at least last year there was the same kind

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Speaker 1: of situation, and so sure yeah, so surely somebody is

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Speaker 1: researching contestants to see what kind of digital footprint they

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Speaker 1: have before they're even invited on the show. And so

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Speaker 1: some of this is making me think, like, is this

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Speaker 1: just a way of kind of drumming up publicity for

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Speaker 1: the new season, because surely somebody knew these videos existed anyway.

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Speaker 3: I said the same thing that if random person on

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Speaker 3: the Internet can find these videos, then I would expect

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Speaker 3: a casting producer who is searching through the weeds to

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Speaker 3: find people to be able to source them and then

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Speaker 3: make decisions. To me, it does seem like not necessarily

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Speaker 3: the controversy is manufactured.

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Speaker 2: But hey, we.

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Speaker 3: Chose this problematic person. Let's see how the audience may

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Speaker 3: react to it. Do they care And is that going

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Speaker 3: to drive viewership? Because at the end of the day,

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Speaker 3: it's not like the show is going to get canceled

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Speaker 3: because of it, because they have the power to remove contestants.

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Speaker 3: And I think something I also think about when a

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Speaker 3: lot of these slurs are racial slurs, but then we

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Speaker 3: also talk about them as childhood or childish mistakes. I

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Speaker 3: think it is a bit concerning that so many people

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Speaker 3: part of their development is using racial slurs, is using

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Speaker 3: the N word, is being derogatory towards black women. And

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Speaker 3: I think about, as a black woman who was online,

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Speaker 3: like especially on Twitter, when I was in middle school

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Speaker 3: and I was in high school, what seeing that can

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Speaker 3: do for a person over time, especially when people say like, hey,

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Speaker 3: that was just who I was as a kid. And

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Speaker 3: it's like, well, someone was on the receipt and just

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Speaker 3: that as a child, and so I wanted to get

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Speaker 3: your thoughts about that as well.

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Speaker 1: And I think we talked about this on the podcast too,

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Speaker 1: like why is that scene as a part of like childhood? Right?

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Speaker 1: That definitely was not a part of my childhood, you know,

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Speaker 1: like there are definitely things you learn as kids, but

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Speaker 1: like what kind of environment are you being raised in

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Speaker 1: that this is kind of seen as like a normal

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Speaker 1: kind of growing pain, so to speak. Right, And so

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Speaker 1: I am concerned just as a society that this feels

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Speaker 1: like a developmental milestone in some ways for some communities

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Speaker 1: when it is You're right, like somebody is on the

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Speaker 1: receiving end is the butt of those jokes? And so

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Speaker 1: what kind of overhaul do we need to have as parents,

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Speaker 1: as loved ones and when we have young people in

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Speaker 1: our lives to make sure that we are monitoring what

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Speaker 1: people are talking about online and what kinds of language

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Speaker 1: are we using at home? Right, Because it's very likely

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Speaker 1: that when younger kids are using this language, they have

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Speaker 1: heard it from somewhere, right, and sometimes that is from parents,

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Speaker 1: And so you have to be careful of what kinds

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Speaker 1: of things you're saying so that you don't influence young

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Speaker 1: people in your life in a way that is negative

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Speaker 1: and harmful to their development and who they become as

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Speaker 1: an adult.

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Speaker 3: Thank you for that.

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Speaker 2: More from our conversation after the break.

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Speaker 3: Last but not lease. This is definitely one for I'd say,

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Speaker 3: like the Tumblr era alternative kids. But Mia is suing

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Speaker 3: kit Cutty for more than two point eight million dollars

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Speaker 3: after he removed her from his Rebel Ragers tour earlier

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Speaker 3: this year. Cuddy dropped her from the lineup following blacklash

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Speaker 3: over a politically charged set of comments she made on

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Speaker 3: stage in Dallas, Texas, including remarks about being a Republican

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Speaker 3: voter and immigration that drew booze from concertoers. The dispute

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Speaker 3: has sparked broader conversations about friendships, professional relationships, and ideological differences.

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Speaker 3: And I'm curious canon relationships survive these major divides. How

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Speaker 3: should people determine which value use our negotiable in which

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Speaker 3: are deal breakers?

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Speaker 1: Ooh, it definitely feels like this has been a larger conversation.

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Speaker 1: I will say, I mean probably all of our lives right,

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Speaker 1: but definitely I think post twenty twenty, it feels like

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Speaker 1: the pandemic and like the political landscape really forced a

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Speaker 1: lot of these conversations in ways that we hadn't seen

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Speaker 1: as publicly I think before then. Right, So lots of

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Speaker 1: friend groups and family members had different ideas around COVID

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Speaker 1: precautions and like it's okay to do this and then

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Speaker 1: not okay, right, And so I think that that forced

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Speaker 1: a lot of conversations that people didn't quite honestly know

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Speaker 1: how to have. In addition to like the political landscape

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Speaker 1: which is coming up in this story, right, So I

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Speaker 1: think that there's a difference between like I like coke

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Speaker 1: and you like pepsi.

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Speaker 2: Right, that is.

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Speaker 1: Something that is not going to fundamentally change anybody's life.

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Speaker 2: It's just a difference of opinion versus I.

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Speaker 1: Am supporting a political administration that is against immigration and

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Speaker 1: like against science and like all of these awful things

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Speaker 1: that we have seen this administration kind of back. And

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Speaker 1: so I do think that there has to be space

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Speaker 1: for you to say, you know what, like this was

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Speaker 1: a friendship or relationship that was okay maybe before I

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Speaker 1: knew these things, but you are behaving and supporting in

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Speaker 1: ways or supporting things that I fundamentally disagree with.

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Speaker 2: And it is not just we can agree to disagree.

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Speaker 1: It is like, these are conversations and behaviors that gigantically

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Speaker 1: change people's lives, right, like whether somebody is worth healthcare

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Speaker 1: and safety versus something that is a minuscule kind of

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Speaker 1: difference of opinion. And so I think that is where

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Speaker 1: we are right, and that is okay to have differences

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Speaker 1: of opinion, and like the in friendships and professional relationships

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Speaker 1: because you don't fundamentally believe in the same things.

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Speaker 3: I also think there's this set of disappointment that can

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Speaker 3: happen in grief when someone we respected, whether that is

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Speaker 3: a figure in pop culture or a close friend, and

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Speaker 3: changes in unexpected ways or reveals beliefs that may be

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Speaker 3: different from ours. And I'm curious what advice do you

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Speaker 3: have for people processing that grief. Hey, I was really

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Speaker 3: close to someone and they said something homophobic or even

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Speaker 3: as simple as they you know, may have really a

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Speaker 3: complicated relationship around diet culture that's affecting me in a

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Speaker 3: bad way, and I see the way they talk about

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Speaker 3: other people. How do you process that grief and the

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Speaker 3: changing of the relationship with something like that?

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Speaker 2: Happens.

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Speaker 1: I love that you labeled that as grief, because that's

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Speaker 1: exactly what it is, right. And I don't think we

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Speaker 1: always recognize when we are having a grief experience because

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Speaker 1: we often think grief is just about the loss of

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Speaker 1: a loved one, right, But this is a grief experience, right.

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Speaker 1: This is the loss of the relationship that you thought

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Speaker 1: that you had, the support that you had from this person,

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Speaker 1: maybe the story that you created of who this person

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Speaker 1: was to you, and the life y'all would have together.

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Speaker 2: And so it is a grief experience, right.

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Speaker 1: And so just like anything else that we are grieving,

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Speaker 1: you have to give yourself time to warn the loss

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Speaker 1: of what you thought this was and the memories that

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Speaker 1: were held, and like, how do you kind of come

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Speaker 1: to terms with who you thought this person was versus

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Speaker 1: who the reality of the situation and all of that

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Speaker 1: takes time and it's really complicated. I think we often

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Speaker 1: get stuck in grief experiences when we try to rush

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Speaker 1: past some of the sitting with the sadness and the

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Speaker 1: disappointment and the betrayal and the whatever that comes up after.

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Speaker 2: We are realizing that we're grieving something.

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Speaker 1: We try to rush past to like, oh, okay, I

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Speaker 1: can find a new friendship or oh I'll find a

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Speaker 1: new business relationship. But sometimes you just got to give

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Speaker 1: yourself the timeline of going through.

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Speaker 2: The sucky experience of ouch, this hurts. And so I

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Speaker 2: think that is.

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Speaker 1: A huge part of grieving the loss of who you

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Speaker 1: thought this person was and the disappointment is just allowing

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Speaker 1: yourself to sit with those difficult experiences and then also

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Speaker 1: sharing those thoughts and those experiences with somebody who doesn't

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Speaker 1: make you feel bad about it, because I think that

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of times when we minimize people's grief

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Speaker 1: experiences because it feels silly to us, or like, oh,

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Speaker 1: you can find new friends or oh whatever. You shouldn't

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Speaker 1: idolize pop culture people anyway, But it's a very real experience, right,

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Speaker 1: Like the feelings and the emotions are very real, and

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Speaker 1: so I think getting support from people who don't make

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Speaker 1: you feel silly or you know, like you're crazy for

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Speaker 1: being sad about a laws is something that's really important

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Speaker 1: to managing the grief experience as well.

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Speaker 3: Well. That was such a beautiful and grounding note to

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Speaker 3: end on Doctor Joy. Thank you for that.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, Elise.

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Speaker 1: If there are any pop culture topics that you are

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Speaker 1: paying attention to that you would like us to chime

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Speaker 1: in on, Please send those to us at Therapy for

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Speaker 1: Black Girls dot com, slash

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Speaker 2: Mailbox, and until next time, take good care,