1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:03,480 Speaker 1: Well, fellow conspiracy realist. If you've been with us for 2 00:00:03,520 --> 00:00:06,400 Speaker 1: a while now, or if you're tuning into the show 3 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:09,680 Speaker 1: for the first time ever, we're pretty confident you've heard 4 00:00:09,680 --> 00:00:14,080 Speaker 1: of the Bermuda Triangle, right, But have you heard of 5 00:00:14,160 --> 00:00:18,040 Speaker 1: the counterpart in the Pacific Ocean. That's what we talked 6 00:00:18,079 --> 00:00:21,400 Speaker 1: about in our classic episode this week, the so called 7 00:00:21,680 --> 00:00:25,360 Speaker 1: Dragons Triangle. Do you guys remember this one? Most definitely 8 00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:28,800 Speaker 1: the same kind of things that happened in the Bermuda Triangle, 9 00:00:29,240 --> 00:00:31,800 Speaker 1: but just in a different part of the world. Come on, 10 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:35,479 Speaker 1: what could you not like about this? Let's dive in 11 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:40,640 Speaker 1: from UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 12 00:00:40,720 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 13 00:00:45,159 --> 00:01:00,640 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. Hello, 14 00:01:00,680 --> 00:01:02,960 Speaker 1: welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my 15 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:05,800 Speaker 1: name is Noel. They call me Ben. You are you? 16 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:08,480 Speaker 1: And that makes this stuff they don't want you to know. 17 00:01:08,600 --> 00:01:11,800 Speaker 1: We are joined by our super producer Alex Williams in 18 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:14,959 Speaker 1: on the ones and twos today in the booth. Are 19 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:17,640 Speaker 1: there more than one? Yeah, we have a we have 20 00:01:17,680 --> 00:01:20,680 Speaker 1: a We've expanded two and threes by my account, that's 21 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:25,560 Speaker 1: fair oh, you meant more than one whatever stereo channels, 22 00:01:25,640 --> 00:01:27,080 Speaker 1: It's true. There you go. That's the ones in the 23 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:30,640 Speaker 1: twos except our m P three's are mono. So we're 24 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:33,400 Speaker 1: working on changing there. Yeah, we're working on all sorts 25 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:36,680 Speaker 1: of things today. And if we don't take a if 26 00:01:36,720 --> 00:01:39,280 Speaker 1: we don't take an ill fated trip, all of those 27 00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:42,720 Speaker 1: things would come true. Just a bit of a bureaucratic 28 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 1: notation here. Before we begin today's episode, you're going to 29 00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:51,600 Speaker 1: see some some big changes coming up with the stuff 30 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 1: they'll want you to know. Should we give them the 31 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:57,680 Speaker 1: full scoop I don't know, I don't know two inside baseball, 32 00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:00,440 Speaker 1: or should we do like a dippin dot kind of thing. 33 00:02:00,600 --> 00:02:05,560 Speaker 1: We could just say we've been hashtag blessed with funding 34 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:11,520 Speaker 1: from on high, which could mean more and more shows expansions. 35 00:02:11,520 --> 00:02:13,919 Speaker 1: There's a tech Yeah, there's a tech Crunch article you 36 00:02:13,960 --> 00:02:16,160 Speaker 1: can find if you wish to learn all about it. 37 00:02:17,000 --> 00:02:21,000 Speaker 1: M Yeah, and we are you know, we have our 38 00:02:21,880 --> 00:02:26,240 Speaker 1: parent company How Stuff Works. We are now officially our 39 00:02:26,360 --> 00:02:30,919 Speaker 1: own thing with how Stuff Works. So now if now, 40 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:34,320 Speaker 1: if Matt Nolan I say this goes all the way 41 00:02:34,360 --> 00:02:37,520 Speaker 1: to the top. We're talking about the guy who works 42 00:02:37,600 --> 00:02:43,440 Speaker 1: next next to us. Okay, in our previous episode, well, 43 00:02:43,560 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: the episode we previously recorded, we mentioned some maritime adventures, right, 44 00:02:49,360 --> 00:02:53,000 Speaker 1: and Noel, you and I have not been on cruises, 45 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:58,640 Speaker 1: however our compatriot has. Yes, do we want to rehash 46 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:01,760 Speaker 1: the cruises again? Boys? Don't have to? You were you? 47 00:03:01,760 --> 00:03:03,880 Speaker 1: Weren't You didn't hate it, right, I didn't hate it? 48 00:03:04,520 --> 00:03:06,880 Speaker 1: And uh, it was a thing. It was a thing 49 00:03:06,919 --> 00:03:11,440 Speaker 1: that happened, yes, and it was a creepy and cruise right, 50 00:03:12,840 --> 00:03:17,240 Speaker 1: which brought us to brought you perhaps to something that 51 00:03:17,680 --> 00:03:22,160 Speaker 1: many people have heard of, the Bermuda Triangle. Yes, I 52 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:24,440 Speaker 1: was near it, but not in it. And yet here 53 00:03:24,480 --> 00:03:28,120 Speaker 1: you sit, right, I made it through you guys reporting back. 54 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:31,480 Speaker 1: It was it was a little weird, but it was cool. 55 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:34,880 Speaker 1: And that is the as you know that as the 56 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:44,600 Speaker 1: alleged side of numerous plane crashes, boat sinkings, and disappearances. Yeah, yeah, 57 00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 1: But today we're going to examine the alleged eastern version 58 00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:55,480 Speaker 1: of this, the so called Devil's Triangle. According to legends, 59 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:58,200 Speaker 1: there have been tens of thousands of people who've tried 60 00:03:58,240 --> 00:04:01,560 Speaker 1: to cross this stretch of ocean, only to perish or 61 00:04:01,640 --> 00:04:05,720 Speaker 1: disappear in the attempt in the modern era, so it 62 00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:08,800 Speaker 1: goes to the story. Several Japanese research and military vessels 63 00:04:08,800 --> 00:04:11,960 Speaker 1: have also gone missing in this triangle, leading to a 64 00:04:12,040 --> 00:04:16,440 Speaker 1: number of dead and disappeared estimated to be over seven 65 00:04:16,520 --> 00:04:22,320 Speaker 1: hundred people. Pretty pretty hefty stuff. We'll get those claims 66 00:04:22,320 --> 00:04:25,080 Speaker 1: in a bit. First, let's let's look at the facts. 67 00:04:25,120 --> 00:04:28,760 Speaker 1: What are we talking about when we say Devil's Triangle. Well, 68 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:30,880 Speaker 1: it's not only known at the Devil's Triangle. It's also 69 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:35,719 Speaker 1: called the Devil's c the Dragon's Triangle, and the Taiwan Triangle, 70 00:04:35,960 --> 00:04:40,160 Speaker 1: And just as with the Bermuda Triangle, it's even sometimes 71 00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 1: called the Devil's triangle Don Don doung. Yeah, so it 72 00:04:46,440 --> 00:04:49,679 Speaker 1: gets weird when we ask each other, you know, well, 73 00:04:49,680 --> 00:04:54,880 Speaker 1: where is this? What was devil c Dragon's Triangle, Taiwan triangle, 74 00:04:57,120 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 1: because there's no official world map that plots this. Yeah, 75 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:04,960 Speaker 1: it's written all over the place online where it's supposed 76 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:08,200 Speaker 1: to run from. You know, it's a triangle, so in 77 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:11,640 Speaker 1: theory it should have some pretty defined areas in which 78 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:16,159 Speaker 1: it is affecting the world around it. Usually it's said 79 00:05:16,160 --> 00:05:18,680 Speaker 1: to run from Taiwan up to the volcanic island of 80 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 1: miyake Jima that's just south of Tokyo, and then to 81 00:05:22,120 --> 00:05:27,440 Speaker 1: about Iwajima or somewhere in that vicinity pretty close. Both 82 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 1: of those locations are along something called the Ezu Mooning 83 00:05:31,839 --> 00:05:36,799 Speaker 1: Volcanic Arc. That's a line of underwater volcanoes and islands 84 00:05:36,880 --> 00:05:39,839 Speaker 1: that stretch, well, they're part of a larger system that 85 00:05:39,920 --> 00:05:44,000 Speaker 1: stretches twenty five hundred kilometers all the way from Japan 86 00:05:44,080 --> 00:05:48,720 Speaker 1: to Guam. And some people, like the author Charles Berlitz, 87 00:05:49,120 --> 00:05:52,039 Speaker 1: say that the Devil's Sea, which I think is my 88 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:54,240 Speaker 1: favorite name so far, what do you think I think 89 00:05:54,320 --> 00:05:57,080 Speaker 1: Devil's c is quite I like ascribing a shape to it, 90 00:05:57,320 --> 00:06:00,680 Speaker 1: implying that it's sort of a zone. See, yeah, it's 91 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:03,760 Speaker 1: pretty is like the whole sea, right, Yeah, it's a 92 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:06,920 Speaker 1: sea that exists in itself within park the ocean. Yeah, 93 00:06:06,960 --> 00:06:09,280 Speaker 1: I don't know. That's a good point. We didn't need 94 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:13,479 Speaker 1: to have parameters. Well, according to this author, Charles Burlet's, 95 00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:17,760 Speaker 1: the Devil's Triangle is every bit as dangerous and mysterious 96 00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:22,080 Speaker 1: as the Bermuda Triangle. And we can imagine right now 97 00:06:22,080 --> 00:06:27,000 Speaker 1: how the people who are very dismissive of the Bermuda 98 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:31,680 Speaker 1: Triangle might find this hilarious. Somebody is actually in their 99 00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:38,039 Speaker 1: car right now going that is true, oh me, oh my, 100 00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:40,000 Speaker 1: for sure. But then there are other people in the 101 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:44,240 Speaker 1: audiences who, as soon as they hear Devil's triangle, they 102 00:06:44,279 --> 00:06:48,400 Speaker 1: think of the vile vortices, which is something that has 103 00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:54,080 Speaker 1: been traded around amongst the mysteriously minded for quite a while. 104 00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:59,360 Speaker 1: Vile vortices. Okay, what's a vile vortices? Oh wait, that's 105 00:06:59,400 --> 00:07:03,240 Speaker 1: the plural, m What are vile vortices? Man? Well, a 106 00:07:03,360 --> 00:07:09,080 Speaker 1: vile vortex is a concept, really, it's the idea that 107 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:13,800 Speaker 1: there's perhaps something strange going on with either the Earth's 108 00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:18,440 Speaker 1: electromagnetic system. It's the way it functions. Maybe it's a 109 00:07:18,480 --> 00:07:22,200 Speaker 1: little stronger in this place than anywhere else, and odd 110 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:28,320 Speaker 1: things tend to happen with metal objects and living beings. Okay, 111 00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:32,760 Speaker 1: all right. So the idea then is that these are 112 00:07:32,840 --> 00:07:38,120 Speaker 1: distributed across the planet. Yes, precisely, there are. There is 113 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:42,280 Speaker 1: a map of sorts that you can find and it 114 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:44,200 Speaker 1: shows you where there's one at the north pole and 115 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:45,960 Speaker 1: there's one at the South pole, and then the rest 116 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:49,360 Speaker 1: of them are kind of polka dotted in a pattern, 117 00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:53,080 Speaker 1: albeit across the Earth and we can trace this idea 118 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:58,200 Speaker 1: specifically to the author Ivan T. Sanderson, and he is 119 00:07:59,480 --> 00:08:01,640 Speaker 1: the sort of a lot of these claims. When he 120 00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 1: first proposed this concept, other authors took it up and 121 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:12,360 Speaker 1: they attributed different causes as the source of the alleged disruption. Right, So, 122 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 1: like you said, Matt, electromagnetic stuff gateway to hell, paranormal 123 00:08:19,160 --> 00:08:23,239 Speaker 1: things portal to another dimension maybe extra dimensional, yeah, extra 124 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:28,960 Speaker 1: dimensional portals. And we have a rundown of the of 125 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:32,600 Speaker 1: the vortices that you mentioned, Matt, that are distributed across 126 00:08:32,640 --> 00:08:35,480 Speaker 1: the planet. Ladies and gentlemen, would you like to know 127 00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:38,880 Speaker 1: where they are? Okay, let's start at the North and 128 00:08:38,960 --> 00:08:42,360 Speaker 1: South pole, if that's okay, just because that's kind of obvious. 129 00:08:42,360 --> 00:08:46,120 Speaker 1: If you're talking about electromagnetic strangeness, you're going to have 130 00:08:46,280 --> 00:08:48,959 Speaker 1: perhaps some things going on at the North and South pole. 131 00:08:49,640 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 1: Then you move on to the Bermuda triangle that's the 132 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:56,959 Speaker 1: you know, the granddaddy of these vortices. Then you got 133 00:08:56,960 --> 00:09:00,400 Speaker 1: the Algerian megaliths. This is just south of tim book too, 134 00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:03,920 Speaker 1: and there you can find this stuff online if you 135 00:09:03,960 --> 00:09:07,680 Speaker 1: want to learn more about these other specific vorticase and 136 00:09:07,800 --> 00:09:09,960 Speaker 1: perhaps you know, we can pick some of these up later. 137 00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:15,760 Speaker 1: The Indus Valley over in Pakistan. There's oh, there's a 138 00:09:15,840 --> 00:09:20,240 Speaker 1: volcano just east of Hawaii. That's a pretty interesting place. 139 00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:25,000 Speaker 1: We got the Devil c the one we're talking about today, 140 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:27,719 Speaker 1: the Triangle, whatever you want to call it. There's a 141 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:31,080 Speaker 1: oh well, I'm gonna save this one for last, the 142 00:09:31,280 --> 00:09:34,959 Speaker 1: Wharton Basin, and you can you can find a link 143 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:37,520 Speaker 1: to that on Wikipedia and check that out. The Eastern 144 00:09:37,559 --> 00:09:41,959 Speaker 1: Island megalist the statues, the just east of Rio de Janeiro. 145 00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:46,080 Speaker 1: There's a section an area over there that's said to 146 00:09:46,120 --> 00:09:49,800 Speaker 1: be part of this. The Loyalty Islands, which are I 147 00:09:49,840 --> 00:09:54,640 Speaker 1: believe between just north of the intersection, or I guess 148 00:09:54,640 --> 00:09:58,960 Speaker 1: the area between New Zealand and Australia. Okay, then my 149 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:02,840 Speaker 1: favorite one by are the South Atlantic Anomaly, which perhaps 150 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:05,720 Speaker 1: is a whole separate episode on its own. It's this 151 00:10:05,800 --> 00:10:09,280 Speaker 1: place where the Van Allen Belts dip a little bit 152 00:10:09,280 --> 00:10:11,480 Speaker 1: closer to Earth than the rest of the belts, So 153 00:10:11,520 --> 00:10:16,240 Speaker 1: you have this radiation at x miles above the Earth 154 00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:19,120 Speaker 1: that's much higher than it should be and is in 155 00:10:19,280 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 1: any other part of the Earth and can interfere with 156 00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:26,920 Speaker 1: high altitude orbital craft as well as spacecraft. Right. Yeah. 157 00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:30,960 Speaker 1: Even astronauts have reported specifically those above on the Space 158 00:10:30,960 --> 00:10:33,839 Speaker 1: Shuttle when they would orbit, that they would get the 159 00:10:35,520 --> 00:10:38,120 Speaker 1: shooting stars in their eyes when they would go near 160 00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:40,360 Speaker 1: that area. So then later on down the road they 161 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:43,880 Speaker 1: had to improve the radiation shielding for any other vessels, 162 00:10:43,880 --> 00:10:48,079 Speaker 1: specifically the International Space Station post. They don't know. The 163 00:10:48,120 --> 00:10:51,080 Speaker 1: Van Allen Belts are like, it's like a charged area 164 00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:56,560 Speaker 1: in the atmosphere, the ring, Yeah, it's it's things. These 165 00:10:56,559 --> 00:10:59,080 Speaker 1: are the major reason that people one of the major 166 00:10:59,120 --> 00:11:01,280 Speaker 1: reasons that people believe we never went to the Moon 167 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:06,120 Speaker 1: because you couldn't get through that in theory, right right, yeah, 168 00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:12,800 Speaker 1: And these can they fluctuate, right, but this specific area 169 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:17,680 Speaker 1: has a higher rate. So Van Allen beltsa wax wayne 170 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:23,920 Speaker 1: and depending on solar energy, and sometimes they can damage satellites. 171 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:26,120 Speaker 1: And I think you are correct. We do have a 172 00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:31,640 Speaker 1: South Atlantic anomaly episode in our future. Today, most oceanographers 173 00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:35,520 Speaker 1: or naval experts and scholars and related disciplines are going 174 00:11:35,559 --> 00:11:40,079 Speaker 1: to dismiss the vast majority of claims made by Ivan 175 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:44,280 Speaker 1: Sanderson and his supporters, and they're gonna say that's malarkey, 176 00:11:44,440 --> 00:11:47,920 Speaker 1: don't believe it. Via vortices, or a whole nother other 177 00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:52,640 Speaker 1: realm of the made up. And you know, we see this, 178 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:56,600 Speaker 1: we see similar things happen with theories about lay lines 179 00:11:56,720 --> 00:11:59,160 Speaker 1: or something where they say people are just drawing lines 180 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:05,280 Speaker 1: random and ascribing meaning to them. But what exactly is 181 00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:09,720 Speaker 1: supposed to be going on here? So in his book 182 00:12:10,280 --> 00:12:12,840 Speaker 1: which was published in nineteen eighty nine called The Dragon's Triangle, 183 00:12:13,160 --> 00:12:17,520 Speaker 1: this author of Berlitz said that Japan lost five military 184 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:21,600 Speaker 1: vessels in the area that we're talking about between nineteen 185 00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:25,440 Speaker 1: fifty two and nineteen fifty four, and that accounts for 186 00:12:25,480 --> 00:12:28,920 Speaker 1: a loss of somewhere in the neighborhood of seven hundred sailors. 187 00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:32,839 Speaker 1: Another author by the name of Dan Cohen wrote a 188 00:12:32,880 --> 00:12:36,160 Speaker 1: book in nineteen seventy four called Curses, Hexes and Spells, 189 00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:42,000 Speaker 1: in which he reported that legends of the Danger of 190 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:46,400 Speaker 1: the Devil, c Devil's Triangle, what have you, are centuries 191 00:12:46,440 --> 00:12:51,319 Speaker 1: old as far as Japanese lore goes. So it's most 192 00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:56,920 Speaker 1: famous modern casualty was the number five Kyo Maru, which 193 00:12:56,960 --> 00:13:00,360 Speaker 1: was a scientific research vessel that disappeared with the loss 194 00:13:00,440 --> 00:13:05,280 Speaker 1: of everyone on board on September twenty fourth, nineteen fifty three, 195 00:13:05,760 --> 00:13:11,040 Speaker 1: and that's a date that's wrongly reported often then yeah, yeah, yeah, 196 00:13:11,440 --> 00:13:14,760 Speaker 1: sometimes nineteen fifty two, nineteen fifty eight, but the actual 197 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:20,920 Speaker 1: date is in nineteen fifty three. And by any any 198 00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:24,720 Speaker 1: single person's measurement, it is it is an enormous tragedy 199 00:13:24,840 --> 00:13:28,280 Speaker 1: to lose people. Let see, but let's let's look at 200 00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:31,319 Speaker 1: some of these other claims. There's stories and allegations. That's 201 00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:35,360 Speaker 1: number five, Kyo Maru. That's the most well known modern 202 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:40,800 Speaker 1: one according to other proponents of the idea. As Noel 203 00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:44,760 Speaker 1: mentioned just a second ago, the story dates back for centuries. 204 00:13:45,160 --> 00:13:49,400 Speaker 1: So you'll hear tales of fleets from China and Kublai 205 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:53,400 Speaker 1: Khan going missing in the area. The specific legend that 206 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:55,920 Speaker 1: we're digging around in is one that says in the 207 00:13:55,960 --> 00:13:59,480 Speaker 1: twelve hundreds, Kubla Khan tried several times to invade Japan, 208 00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:04,920 Speaker 1: crossing the Devil's Triangle. In this process, according to his story, 209 00:14:05,040 --> 00:14:08,400 Speaker 1: he lost his vessels and he lost forty thousand men, 210 00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:17,559 Speaker 1: especially at the time. Yes, it is um and we mentioned, 211 00:14:17,679 --> 00:14:20,680 Speaker 1: you know, we we mentioned that they've wrongly reported the 212 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:23,960 Speaker 1: date of that modern tragedies nineteen fifty two or nineteen 213 00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:25,880 Speaker 1: fifty eight, which lets us know that things slip a 214 00:14:25,880 --> 00:14:33,240 Speaker 1: little um with the Cayu Maru. Oftentimes, the authors who 215 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:36,280 Speaker 1: say that this is an example of somebody being lost 216 00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:42,560 Speaker 1: in Japan's Bermuda Triangle, they often make increasing the unsubstantiated claims, 217 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:46,920 Speaker 1: and they say that everything from a visiting UFO to 218 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:51,680 Speaker 1: some sort of lost style electromagnetic Fluke response, I didn't 219 00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:55,280 Speaker 1: say what happened. I knew you were going to say 220 00:14:55,320 --> 00:15:00,520 Speaker 1: that I didn't. Oh man, there's an entire wiki dedicated 221 00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:05,640 Speaker 1: to lost. That's true. I'm not Yeah, I'm not standing 222 00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:08,920 Speaker 1: down on that one. The other examples that we hear 223 00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 1: cited are often going to be portrayed as military vessels 224 00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:18,600 Speaker 1: or large commercial vessels disappearing in calm weather with no 225 00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:23,160 Speaker 1: clear explanation. That's the thing where it gets weird for 226 00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:25,360 Speaker 1: me is like, you know, you've got these giant vessels 227 00:15:25,880 --> 00:15:29,000 Speaker 1: where there's meticulous bookkeeping. They know exactly who's on board, 228 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:31,800 Speaker 1: what's on board, and there is you know, protocol of 229 00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:35,320 Speaker 1: keeping in touch with home base. That's the stuff that 230 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:37,960 Speaker 1: really makes me kind of like think, huh, is this 231 00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:42,360 Speaker 1: a thing? You know? Yeah, I absolutely absolutely agree. That's 232 00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 1: the The ocean is vast and deep. Right, but we 233 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:50,840 Speaker 1: also have technology even the fifties that would allow people 234 00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:57,200 Speaker 1: to be in if not continual, incredibly frequent communication with 235 00:15:57,320 --> 00:16:01,480 Speaker 1: someone else, you know what I mean, radio existed. You know. 236 00:16:01,560 --> 00:16:05,120 Speaker 1: There's one thing. One of the pieces of research that 237 00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:06,760 Speaker 1: we looked at in this I think we should just 238 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:09,800 Speaker 1: mentioned at this point was Skept Away, who did an 239 00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 1: episode on this and mentions that a lot of the 240 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:16,720 Speaker 1: times the large military vessels from way back in the 241 00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:20,920 Speaker 1: day that were reported being missing, we're actually fishing vessels. 242 00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 1: Just just point that out right, I'm glad you mentioned that. Well, 243 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:30,240 Speaker 1: we'll see that coming up again later on in the show. 244 00:16:30,320 --> 00:16:32,640 Speaker 1: For now, we've I think we've painted some of the 245 00:16:32,760 --> 00:16:37,040 Speaker 1: lore and some of the legends and the claims here. 246 00:16:37,720 --> 00:16:41,080 Speaker 1: Let's take a look at the evidence evidence after a 247 00:16:41,160 --> 00:16:54,720 Speaker 1: word from our sponsor. Unfortunately, evidence of this Devil's triangle 248 00:16:54,840 --> 00:17:00,280 Speaker 1: or see in action is extremely hard to come by, right, sure, sure, 249 00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:04,560 Speaker 1: of course, there are historical records of fishing boats going missing, sinking, 250 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:08,560 Speaker 1: or wrecking throughout regional history, throughout global history, from the 251 00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:12,360 Speaker 1: ancient past to the modern day. However, in this instance, 252 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:15,600 Speaker 1: there are no cases of scholars at the time citing 253 00:17:15,640 --> 00:17:20,920 Speaker 1: a Dragon's triangle or attributing widespread paranormal causes to these tragedies. 254 00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:24,000 Speaker 1: It was enough for most of human history to just 255 00:17:24,119 --> 00:17:27,320 Speaker 1: acknowledge that, you know, the ocean is a very dangerous 256 00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:31,280 Speaker 1: and deadly place, and people are not built for it. 257 00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:34,560 Speaker 1: To be fair, there were also numerous spiritual explanations for 258 00:17:34,560 --> 00:17:37,359 Speaker 1: the tragedy, but I think we can agree that's a 259 00:17:37,480 --> 00:17:41,480 Speaker 1: very different thing. Maybe it's more of a belief system, 260 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:44,680 Speaker 1: maybe even on some level coping mechanism. But we would 261 00:17:44,680 --> 00:17:47,480 Speaker 1: be remiss if we did not talk about the Kubla 262 00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:52,040 Speaker 1: Khan adventure. Because first things first, there really was an 263 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:55,840 Speaker 1: attempted invasion of Japan by the Mongol forces in the 264 00:17:55,880 --> 00:17:58,560 Speaker 1: twelve hundreds. Not only was there one, there was more 265 00:17:58,600 --> 00:18:02,360 Speaker 1: than one. I guess anything that isn't one is more 266 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:07,000 Speaker 1: than one. Cresson zero. Somebody saved me here, right. So 267 00:18:07,200 --> 00:18:10,920 Speaker 1: in twelve to seventy four, the Yuon Fleet set out 268 00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:14,600 Speaker 1: with an estimated fifteen thousand Mongol and Chinese soldiers and 269 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:18,760 Speaker 1: eight thousand Korean soldiers in three hundred large vessels, and 270 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:22,880 Speaker 1: they also had four hundred to five hundred smaller craft, 271 00:18:24,240 --> 00:18:27,199 Speaker 1: although figures vary widely as to healthen do with these 272 00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:30,000 Speaker 1: things depending on the source. Man, that is a massive fleet. 273 00:18:30,240 --> 00:18:33,600 Speaker 1: It's a pretty pretty mega fleet. So they initially made 274 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:38,440 Speaker 1: significant progress into the area, but then around nightfall, a 275 00:18:38,600 --> 00:18:42,800 Speaker 1: typhoon caused the Mongol ship captains to suggest the land 276 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:46,320 Speaker 1: force re embark in order to avoid the risk of 277 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:52,440 Speaker 1: being shipwrecked marooned on Japanese soil, which would be bad times. Right, 278 00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:56,520 Speaker 1: So they were saying, Okay, the weather is clearly sourines, 279 00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:59,480 Speaker 1: we need to hop on the boats here and get 280 00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:02,160 Speaker 1: back for we are stuck. And who knows what would 281 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:05,920 Speaker 1: have happened, you know, maybe other supporting Japanese forces could 282 00:19:05,920 --> 00:19:07,680 Speaker 1: have come to the area. Can we just set the 283 00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:10,440 Speaker 1: scene here bends a little bit, or if you would 284 00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:12,879 Speaker 1: maybe help. What's what's at stake here? What is the 285 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:19,720 Speaker 1: kind of like the surrounding reason before this of this event? Well, 286 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:25,280 Speaker 1: if we were painting with broad brush strokes, the typical say, 287 00:19:25,320 --> 00:19:29,920 Speaker 1: the typical line would be that the Mongol empire depended 288 00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:36,640 Speaker 1: upon expansion, so sort of like unrestricted capitalism, it didn't 289 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:40,439 Speaker 1: it couldn't exist without things to consume, you know what 290 00:19:40,480 --> 00:19:47,639 Speaker 1: I mean. And also the Mongol forces of the time 291 00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:54,000 Speaker 1: were not well known seafaring fighters. They were. They were 292 00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:56,440 Speaker 1: you know, they didn't have an awesome navy. They were 293 00:19:56,520 --> 00:20:01,280 Speaker 1: much more well known for their ability wage one horses, 294 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:07,000 Speaker 1: for their specialized bows, which were some real, real fascinating stuff. 295 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:12,040 Speaker 1: We're talking about explosives, we're talking about rockets. But can 296 00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:15,280 Speaker 1: I just pause the conversation here for one second, everybody 297 00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:17,800 Speaker 1: take one step back. As we're recording this, we're in 298 00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:20,879 Speaker 1: the aftermath of Harvey here in the United States, and 299 00:20:20,920 --> 00:20:25,080 Speaker 1: then Hurricane Irma is on its way, possibly to striking Florida, 300 00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:27,560 Speaker 1: definitely going to hit the Caribbean islands, and it's even 301 00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 1: coming through Atlanta. Yeah, imagine in the twelve hundreds, you're, 302 00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:35,320 Speaker 1: you know, you were experts at the sea, if you're 303 00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:37,560 Speaker 1: you know, the captain of a naval ship back then, 304 00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:41,960 Speaker 1: especially in a military capacity. Still, you don't have Doppler 305 00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:44,960 Speaker 1: radar from across, you know, the other side of the 306 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:48,240 Speaker 1: ocean to see as a typhoon is forming and like 307 00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:50,560 Speaker 1: to really get an understanding of where it's headed or 308 00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:54,439 Speaker 1: what's going on. That's that's an intense situation because you know, 309 00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:57,840 Speaker 1: it has to be pretty close just to even see it. 310 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:03,640 Speaker 1: You know, I would I completely agree I also would 311 00:21:03,640 --> 00:21:08,200 Speaker 1: be quick not to underestimate the knowledgies folks have, because 312 00:21:08,200 --> 00:21:12,520 Speaker 1: they're probably reading the migratory patterns of birds. They're probably 313 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:18,040 Speaker 1: noticing little things that would pass most of us completely by, 314 00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:20,960 Speaker 1: you know, but it's act. But still it's not. But 315 00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:23,439 Speaker 1: still you make a great point. It's not comparable to 316 00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:30,439 Speaker 1: having Doppler radar or something. By daybreak, only of almost 317 00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:33,679 Speaker 1: all the ships had set out to sail back to 318 00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:38,760 Speaker 1: mainland China, and those that had This is where the 319 00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:41,840 Speaker 1: Devil's dragons triangle stuff comes in, because those that had 320 00:21:41,880 --> 00:21:47,720 Speaker 1: were destroyed by the storm. We're talking about around two 321 00:21:47,800 --> 00:21:54,320 Speaker 1: hundred Mongol ships lost at sea. The small Japanese boats 322 00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:58,160 Speaker 1: were much more maneuverable than the Mongol ships, and so 323 00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:02,400 Speaker 1: the remaining ships were on the Mongols I were boarded 324 00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:08,240 Speaker 1: by the Japanese and cripple took over. Very un goood, 325 00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:12,960 Speaker 1: double plus bad day for everybody, or double unplus. I mean, 326 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:15,639 Speaker 1: I'm not caught up in my nineteen eighty four. The 327 00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:19,800 Speaker 1: Mongols would attempt another invasion just a few years later 328 00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:24,800 Speaker 1: in twelve eighty one. So that is as we can see, 329 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:30,240 Speaker 1: that is like the root of the cryptic references you'll 330 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:34,280 Speaker 1: hear in these vile vortices or Dragon's Triangle books about 331 00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:40,880 Speaker 1: the Great CON's hoards were lost in the Devil's Sea well, 332 00:22:40,920 --> 00:22:45,000 Speaker 1: and as as intense and horrifying as being caught in 333 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:49,159 Speaker 1: a typhoon. I'm assuming is I have never experienced it, 334 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:52,679 Speaker 1: but I'm assuming it's intense. Especially then it would have 335 00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:57,640 Speaker 1: been considered not such a strange thing, right, I mean, yeah, 336 00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:00,359 Speaker 1: when people are aware of weather patterns and the force 337 00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:03,960 Speaker 1: of nature at that time, and you attribute it to, 338 00:23:04,280 --> 00:23:07,359 Speaker 1: you know, whatever you attribute it to, but generally it's 339 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:09,879 Speaker 1: kind of mundane. Was there may be a sense that, 340 00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:12,080 Speaker 1: like the Bermuda Triangle, in some of these areas of 341 00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:17,000 Speaker 1: you know, disturbance, shall we say, are maybe more prone 342 00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:22,800 Speaker 1: to extreme weather conditions, and that's sort of what gives 343 00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:26,520 Speaker 1: them this reputation because there's just you know, that far 344 00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:30,040 Speaker 1: out to see you're going to get bigger storms than 345 00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:32,000 Speaker 1: you are closer to the mainland. I don't know, that's 346 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:34,040 Speaker 1: a great question. One of the things that we run 347 00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:36,880 Speaker 1: into a lot here in the modern day is that 348 00:23:38,720 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 1: authors and critics, opponents and proponents of different ideas will 349 00:23:43,359 --> 00:23:48,040 Speaker 1: accuse each other of misleading the audience. So Charles Berlitz 350 00:23:48,160 --> 00:23:54,080 Speaker 1: gets accused of sort of editorializing this thing, this instance 351 00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:58,800 Speaker 1: of a failed invasion, and taking a as Matt said, 352 00:23:58,800 --> 00:24:03,199 Speaker 1: completely explicable sort of series of events and reframing it 353 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:06,840 Speaker 1: as something in a poorly written reality TV show. And 354 00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:12,040 Speaker 1: you know, that's the thing about reality television that just 355 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:15,840 Speaker 1: to go a little bit off air here. I was 356 00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:18,800 Speaker 1: never the biggest fan, but I had no idea how 357 00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:22,760 Speaker 1: much of that stuff is scripted? And carefully will they 358 00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:26,040 Speaker 1: call it produce? Which is funny though, because the like 359 00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:31,200 Speaker 1: industry term for that stuff is unscripted. Yeah, exactly right, 360 00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:34,400 Speaker 1: And I think, yeah, I think off air. The three 361 00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:37,560 Speaker 1: of us at least of all run into what that 362 00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:39,639 Speaker 1: looks like a little bit behind the curtain, you know. 363 00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:43,200 Speaker 1: And I guarantee you if you if you watch reality television, 364 00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:45,760 Speaker 1: I wish you the best and I hope you have 365 00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,520 Speaker 1: a good time with it. But do be aware that, 366 00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:52,000 Speaker 1: I'm sure most people know that every time the camera 367 00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:55,280 Speaker 1: is not directly on somebody who is making a big 368 00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:59,360 Speaker 1: deal out of an incredibly insignificant problem, there is a 369 00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:02,720 Speaker 1: producer or an assistant producer who's sort of grooming them 370 00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:05,200 Speaker 1: and coaxing them. Man in some cases trying to get 371 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,480 Speaker 1: them drunk. And this is sort of like that, only 372 00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:13,000 Speaker 1: the individuals being described didn't really have a say in 373 00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:15,600 Speaker 1: it at all. It's just kind of one guy sort 374 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:19,360 Speaker 1: of painting with a broad brush, I guess, and deciding 375 00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:21,280 Speaker 1: with the narrative. Actually, and I mean we see that 376 00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:23,040 Speaker 1: all the time with history. I mean they say history 377 00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:24,800 Speaker 1: is written by the by the victors, and this is 378 00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:26,840 Speaker 1: a little bit different than that. But I will never 379 00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:30,280 Speaker 1: forget the end of the Ozzy Osbourne reality TV show 380 00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:32,720 Speaker 1: where they show you the behind the scenes of the 381 00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:36,600 Speaker 1: scripted parts. Oh really, yeah, I never said ruin it 382 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:40,320 Speaker 1: blew my mind, blew my mind. Ozzy Osbourne can read 383 00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 1: it well. I said it was a long time ago. 384 00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:49,439 Speaker 1: When you imagine that was I guess high school for me. 385 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:51,879 Speaker 1: I can't even remember exactly when it was, but you know, 386 00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:55,200 Speaker 1: only mackerel. I don't remember where this came from, and 387 00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:56,600 Speaker 1: I will try to find it and put it on 388 00:25:56,600 --> 00:26:01,280 Speaker 1: our social media. I read somewhere that there was a 389 00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:08,000 Speaker 1: study being conducted, a genetic study being conducted on Ozzy Osbourne. 390 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,600 Speaker 1: I don't know if this was a hoax, because they 391 00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:12,639 Speaker 1: were trying to figure out how he could have done 392 00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:18,280 Speaker 1: so many drugs and still you know, not had debilitating 393 00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:22,000 Speaker 1: disease and still be relatively all there. I certainly hope 394 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:24,680 Speaker 1: they included Keith Richards in that study, right, Yeah, he 395 00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:27,960 Speaker 1: should be in there too. We've got to well, let's see, 396 00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:29,679 Speaker 1: let's give the show a little bit and see if 397 00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:32,399 Speaker 1: we can. We can dig that up as we proceed. 398 00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:37,399 Speaker 1: But yes, also, to be fair to mister Burlet's we 399 00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:46,320 Speaker 1: have not spoken with him directly, and to be even 400 00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:52,880 Speaker 1: to be even more fair, this typhoon, this historic typhoon, 401 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:56,760 Speaker 1: did occur at an abnormal time. The invasion took place 402 00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:00,480 Speaker 1: in November, but the typical typhoon season runs from May 403 00:27:00,560 --> 00:27:06,000 Speaker 1: to October. We've already started talking about some of the 404 00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:12,720 Speaker 1: problems with this story and this legend. In nineteen ninety five, 405 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:17,400 Speaker 1: an American author named Larry Cush published The Bermuda Triangle 406 00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:22,720 Speaker 1: Mystery Solved Who I Know. Along the way, he debunked 407 00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:26,840 Speaker 1: or for many people, he debunked Burlitz's claims about the 408 00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:32,840 Speaker 1: Bermuda Triangle and the Dragon's Triangle. He says that the 409 00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:36,200 Speaker 1: military vessels that were mentioned that as we allude to earlier, 410 00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:41,120 Speaker 1: were actually just fishing vessels. Now Why does that matter, Well, 411 00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:45,960 Speaker 1: it matters because fishing vessels are easily lost, and they're 412 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:50,360 Speaker 1: extremely common, right, and they're probably a little bit smaller, 413 00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:54,560 Speaker 1: and they're yeah, they're going to be in many cases, 414 00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:58,040 Speaker 1: they're gonna be much much smaller, and for those to 415 00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:02,120 Speaker 1: get lost is an unfortunate reality of life at sea, 416 00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:06,920 Speaker 1: especially if we're considering also that many of the fishing 417 00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:11,440 Speaker 1: military vessels have the ability for their story to be known. 418 00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:15,040 Speaker 1: They probably have better communications systems, you know, might not 419 00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:19,120 Speaker 1: be the case with a lot of smaller fishing vessels, 420 00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:22,080 Speaker 1: you know, anywhere from mom and pop operations to like 421 00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:27,840 Speaker 1: local businesses or local regional businesses. But there's more, yes, yes, 422 00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:31,120 Speaker 1: as Billy Mays was wont to say, there is indeed more. 423 00:28:31,880 --> 00:28:36,320 Speaker 1: Some of those crashes listed by Charles Burletts sank outside 424 00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:40,440 Speaker 1: the area that's defined as the Dragons triangle. Now, is 425 00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:44,160 Speaker 1: that a problem with where they sank or you know, 426 00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:46,719 Speaker 1: the boundaries of the Dragons triangle. Maybe it's bigger than 427 00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:50,440 Speaker 1: we think, Maybe it is, Maybe it is. Kush also 428 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:55,600 Speaker 1: wrote that the Japanese vessel carried not a hundred personnel, 429 00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:58,560 Speaker 1: as burlets a claim, but only thirty one, and that 430 00:28:58,680 --> 00:29:03,000 Speaker 1: an undersea volcane, know is what destroyed it. M Now 431 00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:06,520 Speaker 1: that's peculiar on its in its own right in my mind. Yeah, 432 00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,840 Speaker 1: and your ce volcano has sound weird. And then okay, 433 00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:12,400 Speaker 1: another another problem with this idea. If the legend really 434 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:15,720 Speaker 1: does go back for centuries and centuries, then why isn't 435 00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:20,120 Speaker 1: there more scratch that, any information about it in the 436 00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:28,040 Speaker 1: historical record from any of the countries lining the place 437 00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:31,720 Speaker 1: where this this triangle is supposed to exist. And then 438 00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:37,320 Speaker 1: enters the skeptoids. Brian Dunning he did, or supposedly did 439 00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:41,960 Speaker 1: a large search for any type of newspaper, magazine, articles, books, 440 00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:47,280 Speaker 1: really anything written down specifically about the dragons see Triangle, 441 00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,840 Speaker 1: Devil's Triangle, all that stuff, and he came up empty 442 00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:56,680 Speaker 1: handed until twenty years after the loss of the Cayumaru. 443 00:29:56,800 --> 00:30:02,560 Speaker 1: Apparently the story then just be came, It was breathed 444 00:30:02,640 --> 00:30:07,920 Speaker 1: into existence. So yeah, apparently this legend of things going 445 00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:13,000 Speaker 1: back for centuries was fairly recent invention, at least according 446 00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:15,880 Speaker 1: to Brian Dunning and the research she conducted. The first 447 00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:17,840 Speaker 1: written records of the trying will only show up in 448 00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:20,120 Speaker 1: the nineteen seventies, and then when they blew up in 449 00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:23,479 Speaker 1: the fringe scene. The literature became flooded with accounts of 450 00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:27,240 Speaker 1: this new mysterious region, with tales that had been feared 451 00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:32,600 Speaker 1: for centuries. Nearly all published references again, Dunning sites this 452 00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:34,680 Speaker 1: as well do as well as a couple of others. 453 00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:37,680 Speaker 1: Nearly all published references are from the early seventies, and 454 00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:41,800 Speaker 1: they're immediately upon the heels of Ivan Sanderson's articles from 455 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:46,320 Speaker 1: nineteen seventy one nineteen seventy two, and all of that 456 00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:50,760 Speaker 1: stuff led Dunning to conclude that quote, in short, there 457 00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:53,640 Speaker 1: is no devil cy and there never was outside the 458 00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:57,920 Speaker 1: imagination of Ivan Sanderson and the authors who wrote about 459 00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:04,440 Speaker 1: his vile vortices. But it sounds so great. Vile vortices. 460 00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:10,120 Speaker 1: They're just really like disgusting. Yes, yeah, they don't tip, 461 00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:14,880 Speaker 1: they squeeze toothpaste from the middle. They picked their noses 462 00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:19,560 Speaker 1: forgot to shower for about a month. So uh. Personally, 463 00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:24,840 Speaker 1: I think the phrase vild vortices sounds um like a 464 00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:30,280 Speaker 1: super villain weapon, like something Cobra Commander would use. Yeah, 465 00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:34,160 Speaker 1: or a team. It's like a team of somebody really 466 00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:38,040 Speaker 1: really dastardly. It's just a it's like a biker gang 467 00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:40,480 Speaker 1: that got whole a hold of a thesaurus but didn't 468 00:31:40,520 --> 00:31:44,600 Speaker 1: read the whole entry. What is a team rocket from 469 00:31:44,800 --> 00:31:49,640 Speaker 1: from Pokemon? So we we do, you know, we do 470 00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:55,160 Speaker 1: hate to look. We all want to believe in these 471 00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:59,000 Speaker 1: amazing extraordinary things. And the long and short of it 472 00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:03,640 Speaker 1: is in the research that we found, in primary historical 473 00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:10,040 Speaker 1: sources and in common parlance in the area, this is 474 00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 1: largely considered a myth, and it's not treated with near 475 00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:22,880 Speaker 1: as much prominence as several other local or regional extraordinary 476 00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:27,000 Speaker 1: events or beliefs. This is in many ways kind of 477 00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:30,640 Speaker 1: a Western thing, strangely, right, Yeah, it's a It's a 478 00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:33,720 Speaker 1: thing that people in the coast of China and in 479 00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:37,760 Speaker 1: the coast of Japan don't really think about or give 480 00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:40,760 Speaker 1: near as much credence to feel like a tale of 481 00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:46,239 Speaker 1: the other. Yeah, yeah, and haven't for certainly haven't been 482 00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:49,800 Speaker 1: worrying about it for centuries. Most people are you know, 483 00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:54,960 Speaker 1: families or friends on the coast just hoping they're loved 484 00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:58,520 Speaker 1: ones make it back. Before you know, a storm hits 485 00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:04,479 Speaker 1: or disaster occur, which are real dangers. But we're not 486 00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:09,920 Speaker 1: ending the tail there yet. We do have some explanations 487 00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:13,720 Speaker 1: a peak if you will, behind the curtain. After a 488 00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:23,480 Speaker 1: word from our sponsors, welcome back, ladies and gentlemen. As 489 00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:27,440 Speaker 1: we promised before the break, we have some possible explanations 490 00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:33,520 Speaker 1: for some of these bizarre occurrences in the Devil's Sea. Um. 491 00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:37,640 Speaker 1: Starting off, there's pretty much no way around it. But 492 00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:43,280 Speaker 1: U boats and ships and vessels you know what, float uh? 493 00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:45,760 Speaker 1: They really have disappeared in this area of the Pacific, 494 00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:49,320 Speaker 1: you know quite a bit in fact um that much 495 00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:52,760 Speaker 1: is true. But what's the deal with the triangle or 496 00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:55,960 Speaker 1: with all of the triangles? You know what? Why y 497 00:33:56,360 --> 00:33:59,920 Speaker 1: Rooney there for a second like it? What's the deal 498 00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:07,960 Speaker 1: is that? Any seld seinfeld E Rooney? Too interesting? But really, 499 00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:13,960 Speaker 1: really really really yes, what's going on the triangle? Why 500 00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:17,799 Speaker 1: aren't there more Devil's squares or Devil's octagons? Obviously? You 501 00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:22,080 Speaker 1: know you gotta have the angs and angles, Devil's pentagram. 502 00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:24,800 Speaker 1: Come on, that's what I'm saying, you know you Devil's 503 00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:27,239 Speaker 1: not a square, Devil's not a circle, all right. The 504 00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:29,960 Speaker 1: devil is clearly a triangle or a series of triangles. 505 00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:34,200 Speaker 1: It shaped like a goat's head. Okay, literally edgy, okay, 506 00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:37,799 Speaker 1: boys too too much by that's fine? Um, But yeah, 507 00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:40,560 Speaker 1: like that's true. But what's what why? So you know, 508 00:34:40,640 --> 00:34:43,840 Speaker 1: we there there is research that explores some of these 509 00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:49,600 Speaker 1: environmental changes UM as the cause of such anomalies as 510 00:34:49,680 --> 00:34:55,800 Speaker 1: said triangle triangles. Um. One of these explanations is that 511 00:34:55,960 --> 00:35:01,960 Speaker 1: the vast field of methane hydrate that exist at the 512 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:06,640 Speaker 1: bottom of the ocean in that area could potentially have 513 00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:10,520 Speaker 1: something to do with these disturbances that we talked about 514 00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:14,720 Speaker 1: that originally of some people attributed to an electromagnetic lost 515 00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:20,320 Speaker 1: kind of situation. Yeah, these are the existence of these 516 00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:26,520 Speaker 1: So yeah, this is this is very unfair. Nature's brutal 517 00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:30,280 Speaker 1: and unfair. This is one example nature doesn't care about you. No, 518 00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:38,560 Speaker 1: not at all. There are these deposits of methane hydrates 519 00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:43,440 Speaker 1: gas methane class rates, and when they reach a certain 520 00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:48,120 Speaker 1: temperature they will quote unquote explode. That temperature just so 521 00:35:48,239 --> 00:35:51,880 Speaker 1: you know, is not very insane. It's sixty four degrees. 522 00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:55,120 Speaker 1: Thankfully there are you know the bottom of the ocean. 523 00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:59,000 Speaker 1: M Yeah, there are these ice like deposits that break 524 00:35:59,000 --> 00:36:01,840 Speaker 1: off from the bottom and they can rise, forming bubbles 525 00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:06,440 Speaker 1: on the surface of the water. And again this is 526 00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:10,000 Speaker 1: just like this is the scary part. This theoretical, Uh, 527 00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:13,120 Speaker 1: these gas eruptions could interrupt buoyancy. What this means is 528 00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:16,680 Speaker 1: they could easily sink a ship, leaving no trace of debris. 529 00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:21,960 Speaker 1: You would just be sailing along and then like it 530 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:26,400 Speaker 1: would suck you down. Essentially, you almost you lose buoyancy, 531 00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:29,279 Speaker 1: so you would just you're the ship would just go. 532 00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:33,160 Speaker 1: When I picture your Bermuda triangle, that's kind of what 533 00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:36,320 Speaker 1: I've always pictured is something like that. So that's pretty wild. 534 00:36:36,320 --> 00:36:43,000 Speaker 1: See in my head, it's it's a vortex essentially. So 535 00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:46,600 Speaker 1: you're saying it literally just disrupts the ability of your 536 00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:49,480 Speaker 1: vessel to float. It would be like a bunch of 537 00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:53,279 Speaker 1: air bubbles down below your ship that you're going over 538 00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:55,880 Speaker 1: and you just kind of and it's not exactly that. 539 00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:58,080 Speaker 1: I picture like the water just opening up in like 540 00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:03,960 Speaker 1: a hole and then you just fall down. And I 541 00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:09,160 Speaker 1: always pictured, you know, I remember so many films or older, 542 00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:12,279 Speaker 1: older things like episodes of the Twilight Zone, where there 543 00:37:12,320 --> 00:37:17,319 Speaker 1: would be this gray, all enveloping fall rolling in and 544 00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:21,440 Speaker 1: then you know, the captain or the pilot of a plane, 545 00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:23,879 Speaker 1: for instance, they do the thing where they tap their 546 00:37:24,239 --> 00:37:28,960 Speaker 1: their yeah, their compass and stuff and the altimeter and 547 00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:31,800 Speaker 1: everything's going crazy and next thing you know, it opens 548 00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:35,520 Speaker 1: up in there in a weird unknown land. But then 549 00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:37,640 Speaker 1: they crash or they're like on top of the mountain 550 00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:40,680 Speaker 1: or something. Yeah, I'm really I gotta I gotta harp 551 00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:44,319 Speaker 1: on this. So the water is affected in such a 552 00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:46,640 Speaker 1: way that it will not support the weight of the ship. 553 00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:53,720 Speaker 1: So here's here's the problem. No one has ever seen 554 00:37:54,760 --> 00:37:57,440 Speaker 1: an actual eruption like this, and you wouldn't. No one 555 00:37:57,480 --> 00:37:59,640 Speaker 1: would be left to tell the tale. No one knows 556 00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:03,160 Speaker 1: how large the bubbles coming off the methane deposit would be. 557 00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:06,200 Speaker 1: But in theory give it. Yeah, but the scientists who 558 00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:10,920 Speaker 1: pump your break, we're getting right. But the jazz. But 559 00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:14,680 Speaker 1: there are scientists who have conducted research on this, and 560 00:38:14,680 --> 00:38:17,680 Speaker 1: they found that they made a model of a single 561 00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:20,000 Speaker 1: large bubble coming up under a ship, and they trapp 562 00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:24,280 Speaker 1: trapped water between vertical glass plates. They launched gas bubbles 563 00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:26,280 Speaker 1: from the bottom right, and they used a video camera 564 00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:29,440 Speaker 1: to record what happened to this whole they have floating 565 00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:34,040 Speaker 1: on the surface. If the thing is exactly above the bubble, 566 00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:39,480 Speaker 1: then it's safe. But if it's far enough way it safe. 567 00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:41,920 Speaker 1: It's where it's toward the edge that it just sinks 568 00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:46,400 Speaker 1: in so it doesn't explode. The bubble sort of swallows it, 569 00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:49,279 Speaker 1: for lack of a better word, which to me is 570 00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:52,319 Speaker 1: more frightening than an explosion. No, you're helping me out 571 00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:56,160 Speaker 1: real big with my mental image of this phenomenon. It's 572 00:38:56,200 --> 00:39:01,960 Speaker 1: freaking me out. This is this the best advertisement for 573 00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:04,880 Speaker 1: cruise ever? I don't really, I don't want to be 574 00:39:05,000 --> 00:39:07,560 Speaker 1: that far out in the man. You know, we just 575 00:39:07,600 --> 00:39:10,600 Speaker 1: did the Titanic. I mean, like, come on, we really 576 00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:13,759 Speaker 1: are scaring people away from you know, being on the 577 00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:17,880 Speaker 1: ocean right now. Well, no reason to stop yet because 578 00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:20,839 Speaker 1: there's a different explanation, right, Should we get into Great 579 00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:24,240 Speaker 1: White sharks instead? No? Because yeah, what's up with sars? 580 00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:26,400 Speaker 1: Save that for another day. I'm just saying, like, another 581 00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:28,000 Speaker 1: reason why I don't like to swim in the ocean. 582 00:39:28,040 --> 00:39:31,240 Speaker 1: But okay, let's keep going. Oh okay. Well, another reason 583 00:39:33,120 --> 00:39:37,720 Speaker 1: that ships could disappear more frequently in this area would 584 00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:41,840 Speaker 1: be that small islands in this triangle in the Dragons 585 00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:48,200 Speaker 1: triangle frequently disappear in New islands frequently up here due 586 00:39:48,239 --> 00:39:53,960 Speaker 1: to volcanoes and seismic activity. We cannot forget, ladies and 587 00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:56,920 Speaker 1: gentlemen about the Ring of Fire. The Ring of Fire 588 00:39:57,040 --> 00:40:01,080 Speaker 1: is this huge twenty five thousand mile shoe shaped area 589 00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:03,920 Speaker 1: in the basin of the Pacific Ocean down there at 590 00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:07,480 Speaker 1: the bottom, including in the area that we consider to 591 00:40:07,520 --> 00:40:11,879 Speaker 1: be the Devil's Seas. It's home to just a ton 592 00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:15,839 Speaker 1: of earthquakes and volcanic activity down there. It's associated with 593 00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:22,560 Speaker 1: almost a continuous creation of trenches, oceanic trenches, of volcanic arcs, 594 00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:27,160 Speaker 1: volcanic belts, plate movements, and it has over four hundred 595 00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:30,600 Speaker 1: and fifty volcanoes. That's over seventy five percent of the 596 00:40:30,640 --> 00:40:34,520 Speaker 1: world's active and dormant volcanoes exist in this Ring of 597 00:40:34,520 --> 00:40:39,080 Speaker 1: fire down at the bottom of the ocean. So is 598 00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:43,120 Speaker 1: it possible that a volcanic eruption on the ocean floor 599 00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:47,279 Speaker 1: could reach a ship? Well, yeah, you're just talking about 600 00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:50,960 Speaker 1: the release of gases again as the you know, the 601 00:40:51,000 --> 00:40:54,000 Speaker 1: immense heat that's being generated right below where the water 602 00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:56,000 Speaker 1: is and then coming up and meeting with that water, 603 00:40:56,160 --> 00:40:59,359 Speaker 1: creating steam that has to get pushed up. Again, you're 604 00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:05,120 Speaker 1: talking about following ships potentially. I know that, Um, this 605 00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:08,480 Speaker 1: is this kind of ridiculous. Twenty fifteen, there was an 606 00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:13,680 Speaker 1: active underwater volcano that was that came to life off 607 00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:18,080 Speaker 1: of Granada and you guys will really enjoy the name. 608 00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:22,799 Speaker 1: Are you ready? It was called the Kick Him Jenny Volcano. Yeah, 609 00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:25,640 Speaker 1: kick him Jenny? Yeah, yeah, like that like three words. 610 00:41:25,920 --> 00:41:30,760 Speaker 1: If it's New Zealand, uh, kick him, kick him Jimmy 611 00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:39,960 Speaker 1: Jimmy or Jenny Jeni. Yeah, oh boy, everybody and everybody 612 00:41:39,960 --> 00:41:43,480 Speaker 1: in New Zealand. We apologize. We've been practicing this accent. 613 00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:45,560 Speaker 1: I don't think we have any New Zealand listeners left 614 00:41:45,560 --> 00:41:49,680 Speaker 1: at this point. Every's gone no right in and let 615 00:41:49,719 --> 00:41:53,719 Speaker 1: us know. Actually, let us know about keyweek conspiracies too. 616 00:41:53,760 --> 00:41:57,359 Speaker 1: We'd love to hear those. Um. So, the problem with 617 00:41:57,400 --> 00:41:59,799 Speaker 1: this is I'm bringing this up because this is a 618 00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:05,359 Speaker 1: good it is a good specific example of the problems here, 619 00:42:05,680 --> 00:42:10,759 Speaker 1: because not only is a underwater volcano powerful enough, as 620 00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:14,560 Speaker 1: as Matt said, to affect the surface, but it could 621 00:42:14,680 --> 00:42:21,800 Speaker 1: even shoot hot rocks into the air. These can be massive. 622 00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:26,239 Speaker 1: In the case of Kickum Jenny, scientists set up an 623 00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:30,920 Speaker 1: exclusion zone for ships around the volcano. Recreational ships had 624 00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:33,879 Speaker 1: to stay three miles away from it, and I think 625 00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:38,080 Speaker 1: commercial ships had to stay a mile or two away. Yeah, 626 00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:42,200 Speaker 1: just in case so it is completely possible that some 627 00:42:42,280 --> 00:42:45,280 Speaker 1: of these ships, maybe even the Maru that we mentioned 628 00:42:45,280 --> 00:42:48,680 Speaker 1: earlier number five, it is possible that these ships were 629 00:42:48,760 --> 00:42:54,719 Speaker 1: instead the victims of volcanoes. Wow. That's terrifying for me, 630 00:42:55,040 --> 00:43:00,080 Speaker 1: much more terrifying than a mysterious devil's area. Yeah, what 631 00:43:00,120 --> 00:43:03,440 Speaker 1: about mysterious gas bubbles? That's that's that's the one that 632 00:43:03,600 --> 00:43:06,399 Speaker 1: gives me pause. Yeah, I feel like a fiery death 633 00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:11,360 Speaker 1: at c is um more understandable than just all this 634 00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:15,160 Speaker 1: sudden saying, oh, we're on the water, now we're in it. 635 00:43:15,560 --> 00:43:18,319 Speaker 1: Why can't I breathe? Yeah? Yeah, that's the thing though, 636 00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:19,879 Speaker 1: I mean, like a fiery death at sea, it seems 637 00:43:19,880 --> 00:43:23,040 Speaker 1: like it would leave behind more flotsam and jetsam and whatnot. 638 00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:27,040 Speaker 1: Like the whole you know, kicker of these of these 639 00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:30,799 Speaker 1: places usually tends to be gone without a trace, right, 640 00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:36,080 Speaker 1: that's sort of like the the calling cards. Yeah, and 641 00:43:36,120 --> 00:43:38,200 Speaker 1: then if you do find them, it's, you know, fifty 642 00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:41,640 Speaker 1: two hundreds of years later at the bottom of the sea. Weird. 643 00:43:42,480 --> 00:43:45,920 Speaker 1: And we'd like to know what We'd like to know 644 00:43:45,960 --> 00:43:50,480 Speaker 1: what your experiences are, your maritime experiences, and most importantly, 645 00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:56,040 Speaker 1: what your take is on these ideas. Of the Bermuda triangle, 646 00:43:56,160 --> 00:44:02,120 Speaker 1: the Dragons triangle. Also, you know, I want to ask people, well, 647 00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:05,880 Speaker 1: which idea about this vile vortices thing in general, because 648 00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:10,560 Speaker 1: we would love to hear about a source that comes 649 00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:16,200 Speaker 1: from before the nineteen fifties. Let's say, you know, I 650 00:44:16,239 --> 00:44:19,480 Speaker 1: do you live near one right? Could you go check 651 00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:22,399 Speaker 1: it out? Or have you had any experiences there? It's 652 00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:24,239 Speaker 1: how we find out if we have any friends in 653 00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:28,000 Speaker 1: the Eastern Islands. If so, we may be coming to 654 00:44:28,280 --> 00:44:31,400 Speaker 1: your house to crash. Will be there in two weeks? 655 00:44:32,920 --> 00:44:36,239 Speaker 1: And is it? Will it take us two weeks? Well, 656 00:44:36,239 --> 00:44:37,879 Speaker 1: it's just there's a lot of planning that goes into 657 00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:42,960 Speaker 1: that's probably true. Yeah, so unfortunately, Yeah, a lot of 658 00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:45,200 Speaker 1: the stuff about this seems to have sprung up after 659 00:44:45,239 --> 00:44:49,200 Speaker 1: the fact, with a little supporting evidence in the preceding literature. However, 660 00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:55,920 Speaker 1: we do know that there is absolutely nothing fictitious about 661 00:44:56,120 --> 00:45:00,440 Speaker 1: losing ships at sea. According to a maritime assurer named Leon's, 662 00:45:00,760 --> 00:45:04,279 Speaker 1: losses at sea continue in the modern day. Yeah, I mean, 663 00:45:04,320 --> 00:45:07,879 Speaker 1: this is still clearly happening. We've got stats from two 664 00:45:07,960 --> 00:45:11,200 Speaker 1: thousand and seven to twenty sixteen indicating that the area 665 00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:18,640 Speaker 1: comprising South China Indonesia and the Philippines counted two hundred 666 00:45:18,640 --> 00:45:22,600 Speaker 1: and forty nine lost ships, while the area north of that, 667 00:45:23,280 --> 00:45:27,120 Speaker 1: think Japan the Korean Peninsula in the like, counted one 668 00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:31,120 Speaker 1: hundred and thirty three lost vessels. And these numbers are 669 00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:37,520 Speaker 1: actually only decline thankfully. Yeah, the maritime industry on the 670 00:45:37,560 --> 00:45:43,880 Speaker 1: whole has seen the total number of losses decrease during 671 00:45:43,880 --> 00:45:47,480 Speaker 1: twenty sixteen to eighty five, and then the number of 672 00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:54,560 Speaker 1: incidents or casualties also is on a year over year downturn. 673 00:45:55,640 --> 00:46:00,960 Speaker 1: And according to another report from Alians, one of the 674 00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:04,719 Speaker 1: big questions would be how many ships disappeared without a 675 00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:11,200 Speaker 1: trace right overall from two thousand and twenty thirteen, there 676 00:46:11,200 --> 00:46:15,280 Speaker 1: were only seven that were considered what they call missing 677 00:46:15,400 --> 00:46:19,359 Speaker 1: slash overdue. So you can still be missing for two 678 00:46:19,440 --> 00:46:25,120 Speaker 1: years and be overdue. Wow, missing for two years at sea. 679 00:46:25,440 --> 00:46:28,920 Speaker 1: It's not a fate I want to experience. And so 680 00:46:29,239 --> 00:46:31,480 Speaker 1: concludes our show. You know what we haven't done in 681 00:46:31,520 --> 00:46:38,520 Speaker 1: a little while? Is it a jot Gona? Our first 682 00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:42,760 Speaker 1: shout out goes to Nick says high gang, love your show. 683 00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:47,480 Speaker 1: In the effervescent episode three hundred, you mentioned blood donations. 684 00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:50,920 Speaker 1: I think it was a ninety nine Pie podcast or 685 00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:53,880 Speaker 1: maybe Radio Lab where I first heard that donated blood 686 00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:56,799 Speaker 1: is a big business and that hospitals seek out more 687 00:46:56,800 --> 00:46:59,400 Speaker 1: blood than they need to sell it to other hospitals. 688 00:46:59,520 --> 00:47:01,399 Speaker 1: It might even have been stuff to blow your mind 689 00:47:01,440 --> 00:47:02,920 Speaker 1: to come to think of it. Well, you need to 690 00:47:02,960 --> 00:47:06,000 Speaker 1: get your podcast straight, Nick, come on. In the process. 691 00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:10,880 Speaker 1: In the process, lots of plasma gets thrown away. Apparently 692 00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:14,640 Speaker 1: here are a couple of links that go that take 693 00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:16,520 Speaker 1: us down this rabbit hole. So we send us some 694 00:47:16,560 --> 00:47:19,760 Speaker 1: great stuff from WPTV and then there's a nice little 695 00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:23,080 Speaker 1: reddit today I learned section here. So we're going to 696 00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:26,480 Speaker 1: dive into this, Nick, and we'll report back with what 697 00:47:26,520 --> 00:47:33,320 Speaker 1: we find. Literal blood money, What about plasma money? The 698 00:47:33,440 --> 00:47:35,160 Speaker 1: same ring to it, doesn't It's a wave of the 699 00:47:35,200 --> 00:47:38,120 Speaker 1: future though, right, plasma money, that's where all the money is. 700 00:47:38,160 --> 00:47:43,440 Speaker 1: Let's get in early. Our next shout out comes from Nicole. Hi, Guys, 701 00:47:43,560 --> 00:47:45,680 Speaker 1: what happened to the video podcast in the iTunes store? 702 00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:47,600 Speaker 1: I haven't received any new updates in quite some time? 703 00:47:47,920 --> 00:47:52,560 Speaker 1: Are the podcast audio only now? Thanks Nicole. We mentioned 704 00:47:52,560 --> 00:47:54,960 Speaker 1: the top of the show we had some changes in 705 00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:58,400 Speaker 1: the works in terms of some investment in our company 706 00:47:58,480 --> 00:48:02,280 Speaker 1: and the podcast business. I guess he could say, spinning 707 00:48:02,280 --> 00:48:06,120 Speaker 1: off from the how stuff works in general. With that 708 00:48:06,560 --> 00:48:09,879 Speaker 1: has come kind of an emphasis on the podcasts, and 709 00:48:10,600 --> 00:48:14,280 Speaker 1: that means a less video man and you know, Matt 710 00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:18,800 Speaker 1: and beyond the iTunes store or Apple podcast video store. 711 00:48:19,239 --> 00:48:23,440 Speaker 1: We have put a pause on our video production for 712 00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:26,120 Speaker 1: the stuff they don't want you to know, video series, 713 00:48:26,160 --> 00:48:30,319 Speaker 1: specifically on our YouTube channel and anywhere else that you've 714 00:48:30,320 --> 00:48:33,759 Speaker 1: been watching our show, maybe on Amazon, and we're just 715 00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:36,000 Speaker 1: putting a pause on that. Like Noel said, to focus 716 00:48:36,040 --> 00:48:40,879 Speaker 1: on this show, this thing that people who make more 717 00:48:40,920 --> 00:48:44,200 Speaker 1: money than us and make decisions above us have faith in. 718 00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:45,839 Speaker 1: So we're gonna keep going with it. But there may 719 00:48:45,840 --> 00:48:47,799 Speaker 1: be like opportunities online to supplement some of the stuff 720 00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:50,200 Speaker 1: we do here with some video stuff or so full 721 00:48:50,239 --> 00:48:51,839 Speaker 1: and off, so we'll see. But you know, a lot 722 00:48:51,880 --> 00:48:55,080 Speaker 1: of exciting new stuff coming down the pike, but we're 723 00:48:55,160 --> 00:49:00,040 Speaker 1: not fully aware of all of it yet. Thanks so 724 00:49:00,160 --> 00:49:03,400 Speaker 1: much for writing in Nicole. We have one more shout 725 00:49:03,440 --> 00:49:05,160 Speaker 1: out for today, but it's a it's a bit of 726 00:49:05,160 --> 00:49:07,880 Speaker 1: a doozy, so get comfortable in your seat or scoot 727 00:49:07,920 --> 00:49:09,920 Speaker 1: to the edge of it, you know, wherever you prefer 728 00:49:10,000 --> 00:49:14,640 Speaker 1: to encounter doozy messages. Hey guys, says Laura B. I 729 00:49:14,760 --> 00:49:17,720 Speaker 1: just listened to your podcast about America's Zone of Death, 730 00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:20,719 Speaker 1: and I'm actually a former student of Professor cult. I 731 00:49:20,840 --> 00:49:23,440 Speaker 1: attached the photo of his class syllabus to prove it. 732 00:49:23,600 --> 00:49:25,879 Speaker 1: I really appreciate you guys giving him credit for this 733 00:49:25,920 --> 00:49:28,520 Speaker 1: topic because it's been showing up a lot on social 734 00:49:28,520 --> 00:49:32,239 Speaker 1: media without him being credited at all. That's real. That's 735 00:49:32,239 --> 00:49:36,799 Speaker 1: a real pill, Laura. I find that personally offensive. That 736 00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:40,640 Speaker 1: was me, Ben, that wasn't Laura. Laura continues, You guys 737 00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:43,520 Speaker 1: should give professor call to Google because he has also 738 00:49:43,600 --> 00:49:46,600 Speaker 1: written on a wide variety of other super interesting little 739 00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:49,600 Speaker 1: discuss topics and I'm sure he'd be more than happy 740 00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:52,080 Speaker 1: to talk with you guys. Keep up the good work, 741 00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:57,280 Speaker 1: Laura nice. Thank you so much for writing in Laura. 742 00:49:57,400 --> 00:50:01,840 Speaker 1: And here's the bonus. Here's the du you part. Professor 743 00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:04,680 Speaker 1: Kay did write back to us. He wrote back to 744 00:50:04,800 --> 00:50:12,719 Speaker 1: us yesterday, I think, and his email was very very kind, 745 00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:14,799 Speaker 1: to the point where I was thinking, Man, I wish 746 00:50:14,800 --> 00:50:18,719 Speaker 1: you were my professor. He will just read some some 747 00:50:18,800 --> 00:50:24,919 Speaker 1: brief highlights here. What they really liked was he said 748 00:50:25,000 --> 00:50:28,120 Speaker 1: a few points I heard and enjoyed your podcast about 749 00:50:28,160 --> 00:50:30,480 Speaker 1: my Yellowstone theory, I wanted to reach out offer my 750 00:50:30,600 --> 00:50:33,200 Speaker 1: enthusiastic participation with whatever else you want to do with 751 00:50:33,239 --> 00:50:36,160 Speaker 1: the subject, and also on the pardon power. As you mentioned, 752 00:50:36,360 --> 00:50:38,880 Speaker 1: a few points that came to mind as I listened. One, 753 00:50:38,960 --> 00:50:41,800 Speaker 1: you called me doctor cult, but like so many law professors, 754 00:50:41,800 --> 00:50:45,360 Speaker 1: I'm not a PhD. Also, I pronounced cults like halt 755 00:50:45,480 --> 00:50:49,000 Speaker 1: or as salt, not kilt. No worries, though I've been 756 00:50:49,000 --> 00:50:52,319 Speaker 1: called far worse. I think this guy's it creates. It's 757 00:50:52,320 --> 00:50:55,040 Speaker 1: a humor too. In case you get me feedback on 758 00:50:55,040 --> 00:50:57,520 Speaker 1: the Yellowstone theory, of very common response is that the 759 00:50:57,560 --> 00:51:00,479 Speaker 1: state of Idaho would just prosecute you, and that's true 760 00:51:00,480 --> 00:51:03,080 Speaker 1: of most national parks. If the Feds couldn't prosecute you, 761 00:51:03,160 --> 00:51:05,239 Speaker 1: the state would be able to step in. But in 762 00:51:05,280 --> 00:51:08,840 Speaker 1: a few of them, like Yellowstone, the FEDS have exclusive jurisdictions, 763 00:51:08,840 --> 00:51:12,200 Speaker 1: so that's no go. Three, It's worth mentioning that if 764 00:51:12,200 --> 00:51:14,400 Speaker 1: you tried to use the loophole, you would still be 765 00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:18,600 Speaker 1: subject to get ensued civil liability and prosecuted for misdemeanors 766 00:51:18,640 --> 00:51:20,520 Speaker 1: for which you have no right to a jury trial. 767 00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:22,720 Speaker 1: You also would not be able to use the loophole 768 00:51:22,719 --> 00:51:25,120 Speaker 1: if you did any part of the crime, like forming 769 00:51:25,160 --> 00:51:29,600 Speaker 1: your intent or conspiring outside the zone. Oh man, you 770 00:51:29,640 --> 00:51:33,600 Speaker 1: know what that means. We're already guilty. Our moonshine operation 771 00:51:33,680 --> 00:51:38,160 Speaker 1: already went elbows up. Perhaps most importantly, if you're thinking 772 00:51:38,160 --> 00:51:40,640 Speaker 1: a point something, there's probably someone else there with the 773 00:51:40,719 --> 00:51:46,440 Speaker 1: same idea, and he's bigger than you. All of this 774 00:51:46,520 --> 00:51:49,600 Speaker 1: eliminates much of the loophole's usefulness to would be criminals. 775 00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:52,759 Speaker 1: I still think the loophole is worth fixing, though, even 776 00:51:52,760 --> 00:51:55,160 Speaker 1: with all the reasons why it's limited and why it 777 00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:57,359 Speaker 1: might not work, there really is no good reason not 778 00:51:57,400 --> 00:52:01,000 Speaker 1: to fix it and just color inside the lines. On pardons. 779 00:52:01,320 --> 00:52:04,200 Speaker 1: Number one, you mentioned pardons declaring you guilty. I wrote 780 00:52:04,200 --> 00:52:08,200 Speaker 1: a short piece and attempt to disabuse people of that notion, 781 00:52:08,280 --> 00:52:10,120 Speaker 1: And so he has a piece in the Wall Street 782 00:52:10,200 --> 00:52:13,279 Speaker 1: Journal that he refers as to pardons aren't only for 783 00:52:13,320 --> 00:52:16,840 Speaker 1: the guilty. And two he said self pardoning was the 784 00:52:16,920 --> 00:52:19,640 Speaker 1: subject of my first legal article in nineteen ninety six 785 00:52:19,640 --> 00:52:22,239 Speaker 1: and a chapter of my book in twenty twelve. If 786 00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:24,680 Speaker 1: you're ever interested in doing anything on pardons, I'd love 787 00:52:24,719 --> 00:52:29,120 Speaker 1: to help and he also recommends chapter from a book 788 00:52:29,120 --> 00:52:33,640 Speaker 1: called Constitutional Cliffhangers, a legal guy for presidents and their enemies, 789 00:52:34,920 --> 00:52:37,280 Speaker 1: And it's on the loophole in the twenty second Amendment 790 00:52:37,280 --> 00:52:40,319 Speaker 1: that could allow a two term president to stay in power. Oh, 791 00:52:40,400 --> 00:52:42,680 Speaker 1: I want to do both of those. You want to 792 00:52:42,719 --> 00:52:48,920 Speaker 1: both be president's stay of power? Yeah, that specifically, as 793 00:52:48,920 --> 00:52:51,200 Speaker 1: well as self pardoning and partnering in general. I just 794 00:52:51,239 --> 00:52:53,000 Speaker 1: want to learn more about that, and I think people 795 00:52:53,000 --> 00:52:55,480 Speaker 1: afterre would want to as well. Yeah, let us know 796 00:52:55,520 --> 00:52:58,960 Speaker 1: if you'd like to learn more about legal loopholes. And 797 00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:03,480 Speaker 1: we are going to be following up with our new 798 00:53:03,520 --> 00:53:10,319 Speaker 1: favorite law professor. And for now, this concludes our osh 799 00:53:10,719 --> 00:53:14,560 Speaker 1: but our show, and that's the end of this classic episode. 800 00:53:14,640 --> 00:53:18,480 Speaker 1: If you have any thoughts or questions about this episode, 801 00:53:18,800 --> 00:53:20,919 Speaker 1: you can get into contact with us in a number 802 00:53:20,920 --> 00:53:22,920 Speaker 1: of different ways. One of the best is to give 803 00:53:23,000 --> 00:53:25,520 Speaker 1: us a call. Our number is one eight three three 804 00:53:25,880 --> 00:53:29,440 Speaker 1: stdwy TK. If you don't want to do that, you 805 00:53:29,480 --> 00:53:31,960 Speaker 1: can send us a good old fashioned email. We are 806 00:53:32,200 --> 00:53:36,880 Speaker 1: conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com. Stuff they Don't Want You 807 00:53:36,920 --> 00:53:40,400 Speaker 1: to Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts 808 00:53:40,400 --> 00:53:43,640 Speaker 1: from my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio, app, Apple podcasts, 809 00:53:43,680 --> 00:53:45,560 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.