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Speaker 1: Pushkin.

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Speaker 2: Modern parenting has its challenges, lunches to prep laundry, to

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Speaker 2: do homework, to help with soccer drop offs, to shuttle

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Speaker 2: There's just a baseline level of stress and busyness that

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Speaker 2: comes with being a mom or dad today. But life

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Speaker 2: sometimes turns in ways that sends these usual parental burdens

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Speaker 2: into stress overdrive, like when there's a scary health diagnosis,

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Speaker 2: or a death in the family, or a job loss.

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Speaker 2: What wisdom can moms and dads turn to during these

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Speaker 2: extra difficult parenting moments? What can you do to find

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Speaker 2: solace as a caregiver when it feels like you're the

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Speaker 2: one that needs care Well, today's two guests have some answers.

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Speaker 2: As the power couple hosts of the hit podcast We

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Speaker 2: Can Do Hard Things, best selling author Glennon Doyle and

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Speaker 2: soccer legend Abby Wambach are used to handling tough family situations.

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Speaker 2: Since getting married years ago, the pair have navigated the

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Speaker 2: typical challenges of raising three teenagers, but recently, as Glennon explains,

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Speaker 2: life decided to hurl a series of nasty plot twists

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Speaker 2: their way.

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Speaker 3: A couple of years ago, all within like a six

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Speaker 3: month period. I was diagnosed with anorexia. Abby lost her

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Speaker 3: beloved brother Peter, and our sister Amanda was diagnosed with

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Speaker 3: breast cancer. And this weird thing happened was you know

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Speaker 3: how in your friend groups or in your family, there's

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Speaker 3: usually like one person who is okay, And so when

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Speaker 3: you lose your shit, you like you can go to

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Speaker 3: somebody to remind you of who you are or of

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Speaker 3: what it's true. And so I think for the first time,

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Speaker 3: everybody was unmoored.

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Speaker 2: How do you cope when your entire family support system

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Speaker 2: is falling apart, when everybody is unmoored? Well, Glennon and

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Speaker 2: Abby decided to turn to what they do best on

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Speaker 2: their show, sharing short bursts of wisdom with one another.

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Speaker 3: Like for Abby, I was writing things down for her

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Speaker 3: about grief. A lot of the things that we had

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Speaker 3: talked about on the pod, like moment that were anchoring

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Speaker 3: and grounding to remember Abby was doing for my sister

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Speaker 3: in terms of like health and recovery and resilience. And

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Speaker 3: I and Abby were collecting moments of wisdom about body

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Speaker 3: peace and all of this stuff I was going through.

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Speaker 3: I think, when I think about it now, I think

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Speaker 3: we couldn't find the hope and wisdom inside of ourselves,

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Speaker 3: so we were externalizing it and they became these like

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Speaker 3: little treasure chests that we just kept returning to over

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Speaker 3: and over again. I ended up sending it to a

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Speaker 3: friend who said, well, this is the most helpful thing

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Speaker 3: that anyone's ever sent me. And she was joking, but

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Speaker 3: she said, can you make something like this for every

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Speaker 3: category of life? And so we laughed, and then I said, wait,

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Speaker 3: we should do that because I've always wondered why in

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Speaker 3: moments of like challenging moments in life, the times when

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Speaker 3: you most need to access what you know and your wisdom,

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Speaker 3: you lose it. So we just thought, why not have

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Speaker 3: an answer to that where you can go to this

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Speaker 3: one place and remember everything that you have learned and

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Speaker 3: what other people have learned by walking these paths will

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Speaker 3: light your way.

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Speaker 2: That one place where Glennon and Abbie can remember everything

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Speaker 2: they've learned, They've decided to share it with their fans

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Speaker 2: in the form of a new book, co authored with

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Speaker 2: Glennon's sister Amanda Doyle. Like their podcast, it's called We

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Speaker 2: Can Do Hard Things. And this little treasure chest of

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Speaker 2: advice in book form wind up becoming much larger than

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Speaker 2: at least Abbey expected.

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Speaker 3: Actually, le let me tell you what she said when

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Speaker 3: she opened the package with the book in it. Yesterday

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Speaker 3: we got the book. She opens it up, she holds

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Speaker 3: it up, and she goes, I cannot believe that I

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Speaker 3: wrote a book that's four hundred and ninety six pages

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Speaker 3: ninety seven, And I was like, why is that the

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Speaker 3: thing you're It's so weird.

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Speaker 4: It's just so uncommon for a former athlete to produce

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Speaker 4: and publish a lot Like my books are shortish.

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Speaker 2: The new book is a very long book, and it's

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Speaker 2: incredible for so many topics, especially the one that we're

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Speaker 2: talking about here today, which is parenting. Is an apt

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Speaker 2: way to put it, because Glennon and Abbey's book tackles

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Speaker 2: at least two hard topics that I wanted to dive

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Speaker 2: into during this special series on Happier Parenting. First, how

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Speaker 2: can we parent our own kids in ways that don't

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Speaker 2: repeat the mistakes our parents made? And second, how can

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Speaker 2: we reparent ourselves in order to fix what our.

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Speaker 1: Own caregivers got wrong?

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Speaker 2: Take, for example, the challenge of understanding what we really

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Speaker 2: want out of life.

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Speaker 1: Even as adults, many.

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Speaker 2: Of us are walking around with a set of outdated

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Speaker 2: scripts about the way we should be living, scripts that

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Speaker 2: our parents wrote for us many years ago, and that

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Speaker 2: simply may not fit with our current goals or identities.

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Speaker 2: If we're not careful, these outdated narratives can keep us

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Speaker 2: from becoming the people we want to be. And this

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Speaker 2: is one reparenting challenge that Glennon and Abbey talk about

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Speaker 2: a lot.

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Speaker 3: We are a lesbian couple. We talk about this all day,

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Speaker 3: every night. We don't we don't need to just understand

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Speaker 3: each other. We need to overstand each other sory. This

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Speaker 3: is something that we spin around constantly because I think

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Speaker 3: we do have a moment where we kind of wake

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Speaker 3: up and we go, wait, is this who I really am?

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Speaker 3: I've developed a certain facade personality. I mean, in my

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Speaker 3: childhood home, what was important was that I was like

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Speaker 3: sweet and polite and small and controlled and disciplined, that

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Speaker 3: I was always achieving. My dad used to say, you

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Speaker 3: can rest when you're dead. He's a football coach.

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Speaker 1: Wow.

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Speaker 3: So I think all of us, everyone listening, can probably

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Speaker 3: relate to the moment where you look at yourself in

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Speaker 3: the mirror and you're like, have I met you yet?

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Speaker 3: And besides that, there's a family role that we all

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Speaker 3: get put into. I have a sister who was the

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Speaker 3: hero of the family. I was an addict and had

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Speaker 3: a lot of mental health challenges. I was kind of

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Speaker 3: like the designated patient, and she had to be perfect.

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Speaker 3: And now she's still trying to have a life where

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Speaker 3: she doesn't have to be perfect. I mean, you Abby,

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Speaker 3: you talk about the facade that you had to create.

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Speaker 4: I'm the youngest of seven, so the particular family system

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Speaker 4: that I came from was of fend for yourself. You

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Speaker 4: got to get what you get, whether it was a

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Speaker 4: second helping of food at dinner or the true, unbridled

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Speaker 4: attention that I was longing for from my parents. It's

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Speaker 4: virtually impossible with that many human beings in one space,

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Speaker 4: and that projected onto me in a way that made

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Speaker 4: me make decisions as a person, as a kid, as

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Speaker 4: a young adult, that got me pretty far down the

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Speaker 4: sports route.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 4: I played for the United States and I won gold medals. Literally,

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Speaker 4: they handed me a trophy that said I was the

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Speaker 4: best player in the world, which is insanity when you

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Speaker 4: think about it, like that's impossible. And then when I

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Speaker 4: look at myself in the mirror, the night after I

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Speaker 4: get that award, I'm assuming, I'm thinking that this is

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Speaker 4: going to finally make me feel the thing that I

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Speaker 4: have been in search of, right, the worthiness, the love, roughness.

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Speaker 1: Right, you will be enough finally with this trophy.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 4: And so I looked in the mirror and I thought,

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Speaker 4: you are the same. You still have that same weird acne.

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Speaker 4: You just look the same, you feel the same. And

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Speaker 4: so I mean, the way that we both were brought

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Speaker 4: up has shaped so much of the people we now

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Speaker 4: know ourselves to be. But when have we ever given

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Speaker 4: ourselves a space to really analyze, like why, actually am

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Speaker 4: I like this? How did I become the person that

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Speaker 4: thinks the way that this person thinks, so the person

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Speaker 4: that reacts in the way that this person reacts.

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Speaker 2: And this is the problem, right, is these incredibly loving,

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Speaker 2: well intentioned parents who are trying to protect you, who

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Speaker 2: are trying to do right by you, wind up pushing

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Speaker 2: this kind of thing that's not you, it's not your

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Speaker 2: real self, and it becomes this facade. But the sad

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Speaker 2: thing is that I feel like often parents do this

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Speaker 2: out of care and love. There's something that they're scared about.

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Speaker 2: They're worried that you're going to be rejected for some

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Speaker 2: aspect of your identity, and they're like, don't be like that,

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Speaker 2: Like it's just this misguided attempt to protect and Abby.

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Speaker 2: I know you've talked about how that played out out

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Speaker 2: in the context of your queer identity, especially too, right.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, And I think our parents really were trying.

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Speaker 4: The best that they could and doing the best that

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Speaker 4: they knew how and making decisions in the way that

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Speaker 4: was best for them at the time. I want to

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Speaker 4: give them the most compassion and put them in the

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Speaker 4: light most favorable and also say that it wasn't what I,

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Speaker 4: in my particular personhood needed, and I was able to

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Speaker 4: do some really awesome stuff with it. So the paradox

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Speaker 4: of it all blows my mind on a consistent basis,

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Speaker 4: the paradox of wondering what if things were different, how

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Speaker 4: would I have turned out? And I wouldn't change a thing.

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Speaker 4: Some of the stuff that I experienced fortified me. And

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Speaker 4: I was explaining this to Glennon there's a part of

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Speaker 4: me that feels so grateful to my parents for in

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Speaker 4: some ways not really accepting my sexuality at a young age.

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Speaker 1: Wow, that for.

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Speaker 4: Putting me in a position to like, really be striving

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Speaker 4: towards this love and worthiness and acceptance because I created

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Speaker 4: my life in a lot of ways off of the

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Speaker 4: foundation of that. And she just said, yeah, honey, I

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Speaker 4: get that. And also I wonder what could have happened

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Speaker 4: if love took that place, if acceptance took that place.

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Speaker 4: I wonder how much more you might have been able

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Speaker 4: to grow and to become. And that was tough to

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Speaker 4: hear because there's so much truth in that. And I've

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Speaker 4: got what I've got. I had what I had, and

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Speaker 4: so I feel like I made the best of it.

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Speaker 2: You know. Yeah, if this is what like terrible trauma

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Speaker 2: and your parent's not accepting you, looks like, you know,

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Speaker 2: it's not so bad in your case, Abby.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, the best in the world.

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Speaker 2: This gets to another blueprint that parents inadvertently give kids.

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Speaker 2: It's this idea of like what love looks like. It's

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Speaker 2: not always the healthiest version.

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Speaker 5: Abby.

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Speaker 2: You had a story from the book about learning that

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Speaker 2: love was transaction that I think point out with your.

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Speaker 1: Kids if you wouldn't mind sharing it.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: When I was younger, my dad paid me for scoring goals.

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Speaker 4: The better I did on the field, the more quote

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Speaker 4: unquote pride they would have for me. And then the

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Speaker 4: story in the book I think that we talked about

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Speaker 4: was at the cake pop story.

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Speaker 3: Oh gosh, yes, she tried to buy their love for life.

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Speaker 5: So I'm very new to the family.

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Speaker 4: I'm still like getting to know the kids, and I

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Speaker 4: just thought, okay, I'm going to really try to court them.

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Speaker 4: So we were in line to get a coffee and

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Speaker 4: I see that they have got cake pops in the

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Speaker 4: menu in it, and I turned back and I was.

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Speaker 5: Like, hey, girls, you guys want a cake pop?

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Speaker 4: And they said yes, and so I ordered the cake

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Speaker 4: pop At the drive through. They said, yeah, how many

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Speaker 4: do you like? And I said, I'll take all of them.

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Speaker 4: And Glennen was like, wait, no, no, no, that's not parenting.

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Speaker 4: And I'm like, oh really, Now it's like a family

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Speaker 4: joke because I'm like, what do you guys want and

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Speaker 4: they're like, oh, like all of them, all the everything.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. But it's so easy to fall into, right, because

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Speaker 2: you want to kind of get your kids to think

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Speaker 2: that something's rewarding.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 2: Your dad maybe not the best strategy, but he wanted

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Speaker 2: you to think that, like scoring goals was rewarding. So

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Speaker 2: it's like, I'll slap this other external thing on you.

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Speaker 2: I'll pay you to do it. And what we forget

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Speaker 2: is that our psychology is set up that when you

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Speaker 2: add an extrinsic reward to something, you pay somebody, or

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Speaker 2: you give love and cake pops, then that makes you

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Speaker 2: kind of feel completely empty when it comes to the

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Speaker 2: intrinsic rewards, Like that's the quickest way to make your

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Speaker 2: kid hate soccer or feel like the only goal of

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Speaker 2: soccer is just so you can get the money afterwards

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Speaker 2: or something.

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Speaker 3: Even the pride I do try to think about the

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Speaker 3: thing that I'm saying feels like a gift. I'm proud

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Speaker 3: of you feels like a gift. But what is the

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Speaker 3: shadow side of saying that? Like I'm proud of you

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Speaker 3: because you did well in a game. Implicit in that

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Speaker 3: is I am less proud of you when you do

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Speaker 3: not do well anything.

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Speaker 2: There's a because in there. I'm proud of you because

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Speaker 2: dot dot dot right.

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Speaker 4: One of the things I'm very con of now we

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Speaker 4: have a young daughter, our youngest She plays soccer. One

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Speaker 4: of the things that's the most important to me is

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Speaker 4: to not get too high or low about any kind

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Speaker 4: of performance that she has because I want her to

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Speaker 4: know that, whether she does well or doesn't do well,

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Speaker 4: that I just love her period.

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Speaker 3: Right, So that's just another form of what we were

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Speaker 3: talking about in the beginning, Like you learn what makes

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Speaker 3: people happy, and then you amplify those parts of your personality,

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Speaker 3: and you find out what makes your parents are family uncomfortable,

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Speaker 3: and you knew those parts of your personality and then

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Speaker 3: you turn forwarding and you want to while you're half

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Speaker 3: a person, right, So asking these questions, like even saying

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Speaker 3: why am I like this is the beginning because inherent

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Speaker 3: in the question is the moment where you start to

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Speaker 3: notice the water you're swimming in, which is being conscious.

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Speaker 3: Like if you don't notice the water you're swimming in,

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Speaker 3: you just think that's the way it is. But if

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Speaker 3: you can figure out what parts of your personality you

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Speaker 3: amplified and muted, then there's a bit of a hero's journey.

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Speaker 3: You can go on to like explore the parts you

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Speaker 3: muted and start to amplify those so that you can

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Speaker 3: become more fully human and you're not just like playing

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Speaker 3: a role your whole life.

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Speaker 4: I just want to say one thing really quick about

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Speaker 4: the pride thing, because I just had this like aha

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Speaker 4: moment in my body. I think parenting what it comes

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Speaker 4: down to is if we can control the centering of ourselves,

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Speaker 4: then I think that a lot of parenting issues would

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Speaker 4: get solved because when I say that I'm proud of you,

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Speaker 4: I am now centering my opinion of you more than

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Speaker 4: you your life and your experience.

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Speaker 5: So what we say is I'm.

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Speaker 4: So happy for you because that is how I feel.

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Speaker 4: I feel so happy for you, and it gives them

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Speaker 4: the autonomy of the experience, and it also takes my

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Speaker 4: experience and what matters to me out.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I love that because there's so much science that backs

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Speaker 2: up that. If you're allowing it to be their intrinsic

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Speaker 2: reward that's about them, that's not about the idea that

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Speaker 2: you want for them as a parent, then that's going

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Speaker 2: to be the thing that drives them into the future. Right,

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Speaker 2: You're helping them develop their real self as opposed to

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Speaker 2: whatever facade you want for them. That's good, but it's

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Speaker 2: very hard.

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Speaker 3: Yes.

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Speaker 2: Yes, when I get back from the break, we're going

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Speaker 2: to hear what you learned about how to do this

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Speaker 2: better for your own kids, and also what the science

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Speaker 2: shows about healthier strategies we can do to kind of

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Speaker 2: reparent ourselves if we didn't get that from our own parents.

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Speaker 1: So the Happiness Lab We'll be right back.

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Speaker 2: In their new book, We Can Do Hard Things, podcasters

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Speaker 2: Glennon Doyle and Abby Wombach explore the complex experience of

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Speaker 2: raising three children while trying to come to terms with

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Speaker 2: their own complicated childhoods. For Glennan, the process of truly

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Speaker 2: confronting the past began at the start of her parenting journey,

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Speaker 2: when she was forced to really start thinking about her future.

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Speaker 3: When I found out I was pregnant with Chase and

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Speaker 3: I was twenty five, I had been lost to addiction

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Speaker 3: from the time I was ten, like, believing in alcoholism, drugs,

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Speaker 3: the whole thing. So when I found out I was pregnant,

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Speaker 3: I think I just really had a moment of Oh,

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Speaker 3: this is it. I felt very close to debt, Like

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Speaker 3: I felt like either I clean it up now or

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Speaker 3: I don't ever clean it up. And I largely became sober,

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Speaker 3: became a human being by figuring out what would this

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Speaker 3: kid's mom do? Like I formed a personality completely based

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Speaker 3: on mom because I didn't have a developmental track like

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Speaker 3: most people. Because I was last to addiction for so long,

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Speaker 3: so I really didn't go through all the things that

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Speaker 3: one is supposed to go through, which has made the

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Speaker 3: kids growing up, I think harder for me than the

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Speaker 3: average bear. I've really been struggling a lot with them

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Speaker 3: growing up and growing away because my only identity, not

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Speaker 3: only my only identity, but my only feeling of belonging.

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Speaker 3: And I think that's what I've really noticed about this time,

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Speaker 3: which is that I am a person who struggle mightily

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Speaker 3: to feel like she belongs anywhere, and the little microcosm

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Speaker 3: in this family has been the only environment I've ever

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Speaker 3: felt belonging. So to lose that now sending all my

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Speaker 3: love to all the people who are losing their belonging

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Speaker 3: in identity.

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Speaker 4: Because we're coming up we and a year and a

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Speaker 4: little bit, we are going to be empty nesters. We

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Speaker 4: also have artists, so likely they will be back in

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Speaker 4: living in our house.

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Speaker 2: But I think this is something that so many parents

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Speaker 2: go through. You know, the parents that I work with

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Speaker 2: most closely, our parents whose kids are going off to college,

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Speaker 2: and you have parents who set up their whole identity

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Speaker 2: like I am a mom or I am a dad,

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Speaker 2: and then a lot of kids are needing you less

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Speaker 2: or less in the ways that you got used to.

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Speaker 2: And I think this can be incredibly hard as an

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Speaker 2: identity change for parents, And so how do you navigate

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Speaker 2: that while doing what we suggested before the break of

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Speaker 2: not centering yourself.

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Speaker 3: I've found that every phase of parenting just requires a

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Speaker 3: completely different self because it feels like what they need

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Speaker 3: from me is so different. I think if I could

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Speaker 3: go back and do anything different, I think that I

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Speaker 3: a little bit too much created in every scenario this

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Speaker 3: feeling in them of Mom's got me. And I thought

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Speaker 3: that that was good parenting. What I'm trying to do

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Speaker 3: now is more of like responses that say, oh, you've

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Speaker 3: got you, You've got you. That is a big frickin difference.

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Speaker 3: Like I had this weird moment recently where I was

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Speaker 3: thinking about okay, me on my deathbed, the kids all

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Speaker 3: around me, and I've always thought that what I wanted

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Speaker 3: in that moment was for them to think she was

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Speaker 3: the best mom that ever lived. And then I thought,

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Speaker 3: oh my god, that's not what I want them thinking.

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Speaker 3: What I want them thinking is I've got this, I'm okay,

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Speaker 3: not I'm not okay now because my guide my life

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Speaker 3: my everything is leaving, But I want to have parented

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Speaker 3: them in a way where in that moment they think, oh, yeah,

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Speaker 3: I'm good, which is two different things, right.

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Speaker 2: And I think parents can again, loving parents who have

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Speaker 2: incredibly good intentions can like mess this up. You made

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Speaker 2: this claim that it's worth pushing back on this idea

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Speaker 2: that we need to mold our children like that. That's

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Speaker 2: not the right metaphor. What's a better metaphor for parents

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Speaker 2: to think about.

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Speaker 3: I think that there is this idea that goes back

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Speaker 3: to what we were talking about in the beginning, that

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Speaker 3: there's a world out there and that we have to

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Speaker 3: prepare our kids for that world, which really means that

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Speaker 3: whatever your world view is based on your childhood trauma,

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Speaker 3: your own your kid's this poor Bonzie tree, and you're

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Speaker 3: just like cutting parts off and you're doing it out

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Speaker 3: of love because you think, well, like in an Abbey's situation,

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Speaker 3: bless her mom's heart, she's Catholic, she thought the world

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Speaker 3: was going to crush Abby yeah, with her queerness, so

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Speaker 3: she crushed it first. Yeah, But what we forget is

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Speaker 3: like we are the world for our kids, so we

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Speaker 3: bring them the rejection that we're afraid they're going going

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Speaker 3: to experience outside because we think we have to prune

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Speaker 3: them to make them able to grow out there. But

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Speaker 3: that doesn't work. I guess the metaphor because I'm obsessed

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Speaker 3: with metaphors and can't do anything literally would be. It

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Speaker 3: feels more to me like they're not lumps of clay

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Speaker 3: to mold, because the last thing I want to do

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Speaker 3: is mold anybody in my own image. Like, good God,

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Speaker 3: I'm working hard enough to change my own situation, right,

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Speaker 3: and they know more than we do, Like that is

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Speaker 3: almost like moving backwards. I always think about that line

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Speaker 3: from the Khalil Lebron poem about like they are life's

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Speaker 3: longing for itself, like they belong to the future where

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Speaker 3: we can't even go in our dreams. I think they're

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Speaker 3: more like seeds. They have everything in them when they're

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Speaker 3: born that they need to become, and so our job

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Speaker 3: is not to touch it. Actually, our job is just

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Speaker 3: to create a fertile soil that allows them to grow

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Speaker 3: into whatever they were meant to be without pruning too much.

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Speaker 5: That's really good.

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Speaker 4: It's kind of a faulty system too, because it's like

404
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Speaker 4: this thing that we do by creating this big identity

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Speaker 4: around parent mother, rather than creating the mindset that I

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Speaker 4: am raising this child, I'm guiding this child through all

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Speaker 4: the different phases of their life so that I can

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Speaker 4: leave them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's like the point. That's the goal eventually, is

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Speaker 2: they can do it on their own, right.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly, And bless our hearts.

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Speaker 3: It's a heartbreaking, terrible sirstem. No, I'm not giving five

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Speaker 3: stars to the system. I think it's awful, but it

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Speaker 3: is in fact the situation, that's all I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: And it winds up helping you because if your child

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Speaker 2: wasn't a seed, if it was really up to you

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Speaker 2: to mold them, then you'd have to do that perfectly, right,

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Speaker 2: Your every mistake as a parent would be deeply messing

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Speaker 2: them up. And this is something I know you've both

420
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Speaker 2: talked about a lot in the book, right, is that

421
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Speaker 2: striving to be the perfect parent is actually incredibly dangerous

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Speaker 2: and probably really harmful for your child. Part of what

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Speaker 2: you need to do as a parent is that you

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Speaker 2: have to show your humanness, right.

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Speaker 3: Yes, what I've been playing with lately is becoming aware

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Speaker 3: of your repetitive behaviors and how those affect your children

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Speaker 3: and I'll give you an example, because this was like

428
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Speaker 3: a breakthrough for me that just happened. I am doing

429
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Speaker 3: a lot of work on myself with eating disorder stuff

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Speaker 3: and yadiyada. I have like one song. I've learned that

431
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Speaker 3: huntback whales have like one song. They sing their whole lives.

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Speaker 3: I just have one song, and it's this eating shit,

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Speaker 3: and I just will keep spinning around it forever. Anyway,

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Speaker 3: in therapy, I have learned that I am very judgmental. Okay,

435
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Speaker 3: I use judgment as a way of keeping people away.

436
00:21:52,076 --> 00:21:55,036
Speaker 3: I'm scared of people. I use judgment to keep myself

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Speaker 3: safe and my family safe. So my family has experienced

438
00:21:58,356 --> 00:22:01,396
Speaker 3: that for me many hundreds of times. Meaning they will

439
00:22:01,396 --> 00:22:03,276
Speaker 3: bring someone up or something up, and they will hear

440
00:22:03,316 --> 00:22:05,316
Speaker 3: Mom go into a list of the reasons why this

441
00:22:05,356 --> 00:22:07,556
Speaker 3: person is bad, why they should stay away from this person,

442
00:22:07,556 --> 00:22:10,116
Speaker 3: et cetera, et cetera. Recently, I was doing that at

443
00:22:10,116 --> 00:22:12,556
Speaker 3: the dinner table. I saw my little one kind of

444
00:22:12,596 --> 00:22:15,476
Speaker 3: dim I saw it in real time, A mean I

445
00:22:15,516 --> 00:22:18,236
Speaker 3: talked about it. We took her to dinner and I

446
00:22:18,276 --> 00:22:22,516
Speaker 3: said to her, here's the thing. I learned some strategies

447
00:22:22,556 --> 00:22:25,196
Speaker 3: when I was young because I am scared of people.

448
00:22:25,876 --> 00:22:28,236
Speaker 3: One of the strategies I've learned is judgment. So when

449
00:22:28,276 --> 00:22:31,156
Speaker 3: you hear me going through a list of reasons why

450
00:22:31,196 --> 00:22:32,956
Speaker 3: someone is bad and you should stay away from them,

451
00:22:32,996 --> 00:22:36,476
Speaker 3: that is my very unhelpful attempt to keep you safe,

452
00:22:36,516 --> 00:22:39,236
Speaker 3: and it has nothing to do with the person I'm

453
00:22:39,276 --> 00:22:42,516
Speaker 3: talking about. So when you see your mom doing that,

454
00:22:42,716 --> 00:22:44,876
Speaker 3: I want you to not look at the person I'm

455
00:22:44,916 --> 00:22:47,076
Speaker 3: talking about. I want you to only look at your

456
00:22:47,076 --> 00:22:53,116
Speaker 3: mom and think, oh, she's doing that thing again. Because Laurie, like,

457
00:22:53,796 --> 00:22:55,876
Speaker 3: I don't know what to do with the gap, Like,

458
00:22:56,076 --> 00:22:58,196
Speaker 3: I know this isn't what I want to teach my kids.

459
00:22:58,276 --> 00:22:59,836
Speaker 3: I know I don't want to be doing this, but

460
00:22:59,876 --> 00:23:03,276
Speaker 3: I have this gap where my body keeps doing the thing.

461
00:23:04,596 --> 00:23:07,676
Speaker 3: So how we deal with the gap is we just

462
00:23:07,756 --> 00:23:10,516
Speaker 3: point out the gap, because what we do to our

463
00:23:10,636 --> 00:23:13,396
Speaker 3: kids is we put our dirty lens over their eyes

464
00:23:14,236 --> 00:23:16,516
Speaker 3: and they don't know that that's the water they're swimming in.

465
00:23:17,036 --> 00:23:19,076
Speaker 3: They just think that's the way it is. But I

466
00:23:19,196 --> 00:23:22,236
Speaker 3: want her to not put my dirty lens on. I

467
00:23:22,276 --> 00:23:24,556
Speaker 3: want her to see the world with her lens, which

468
00:23:24,596 --> 00:23:28,036
Speaker 3: is better than mine. It's more open, it's more trusting,

469
00:23:28,356 --> 00:23:31,076
Speaker 3: So that is I think a way that's like the

470
00:23:31,116 --> 00:23:34,996
Speaker 3: next step. It's identifying the patterns that we don't want

471
00:23:34,996 --> 00:23:38,116
Speaker 3: to pass on completely, and even when we can't stop them,

472
00:23:38,156 --> 00:23:41,196
Speaker 3: at least pointing them out to our kids so that

473
00:23:41,236 --> 00:23:42,676
Speaker 3: they see it as our worldview.

474
00:23:43,036 --> 00:23:45,196
Speaker 2: You also on the book talk about these cases where

475
00:23:45,676 --> 00:23:49,196
Speaker 2: you really encourage kids to push back against adults, whether

476
00:23:49,236 --> 00:23:52,156
Speaker 2: those adults are you know, their parents, or other authority

477
00:23:52,156 --> 00:23:54,036
Speaker 2: figures of their life, so that they can develop their

478
00:23:54,076 --> 00:23:56,436
Speaker 2: own views and their own story. Glenn, I think you

479
00:23:56,476 --> 00:23:58,956
Speaker 2: had a version of this with your daughter and her

480
00:23:59,156 --> 00:24:00,836
Speaker 2: high school guidance counselor recently.

481
00:24:00,916 --> 00:24:01,836
Speaker 1: Could you share that one.

482
00:24:02,156 --> 00:24:04,596
Speaker 3: I mean, look, everybody out there trying to teach their

483
00:24:04,636 --> 00:24:06,836
Speaker 3: kids to be brave and stand up to authority figures

484
00:24:06,876 --> 00:24:08,716
Speaker 3: like just look out, because we did that and now

485
00:24:08,756 --> 00:24:10,316
Speaker 3: our kids are just really.

486
00:24:12,676 --> 00:24:14,556
Speaker 1: Buyer beware I guess on this one, but.

487
00:24:14,636 --> 00:24:18,396
Speaker 3: Yeah, wow, I mean we're so proud but also constantly terrified.

488
00:24:18,516 --> 00:24:20,796
Speaker 3: So I think the moment you're talking about is when

489
00:24:20,836 --> 00:24:23,596
Speaker 3: our middle child came home and she said, look, my

490
00:24:23,796 --> 00:24:27,276
Speaker 3: counselor wants me to join all these clubs, and I

491
00:24:27,316 --> 00:24:29,236
Speaker 3: don't want to join the clubs. I'm not like a

492
00:24:29,276 --> 00:24:31,916
Speaker 3: club person and I said, okay, well, what's the big deal,

493
00:24:31,956 --> 00:24:34,396
Speaker 3: just don't join the clubs and she said, I don't

494
00:24:34,396 --> 00:24:37,476
Speaker 3: want to disappoint him. And that was a big moment

495
00:24:37,516 --> 00:24:41,596
Speaker 3: for me because I really think that our job, and

496
00:24:41,596 --> 00:24:43,396
Speaker 3: what I told her is like we need to just

497
00:24:43,516 --> 00:24:47,676
Speaker 3: walk around every day with the express goal of disappointing everyone.

498
00:24:47,916 --> 00:24:51,116
Speaker 3: That should be not something we avoid, something we strive

499
00:24:51,196 --> 00:24:55,396
Speaker 3: for because even that word disappoint think about it, it's

500
00:24:55,436 --> 00:24:59,036
Speaker 3: like disappointing someone else as the decision maker of your

501
00:24:59,076 --> 00:25:02,516
Speaker 3: life and reappointing yourself. So I said, oh, honey, you

502
00:25:02,556 --> 00:25:05,396
Speaker 3: got to disappoint your counselor you got to disappoint everybody,

503
00:25:05,676 --> 00:25:08,076
Speaker 3: so you don't have to disappoint yourself. And she said, oh,

504
00:25:08,156 --> 00:25:13,276
Speaker 3: even you, And I said, oh, especially me. Like I

505
00:25:13,316 --> 00:25:16,596
Speaker 3: know people who are doing like the biggest, huge lives

506
00:25:17,116 --> 00:25:19,396
Speaker 3: and they're all still just living, not to disappoint their parents.

507
00:25:19,396 --> 00:25:22,876
Speaker 3: Their parents aren't even alive anymore. It's the most important

508
00:25:22,916 --> 00:25:26,396
Speaker 3: thing we can do in our entire lives is to

509
00:25:26,436 --> 00:25:29,436
Speaker 3: stop recreating what we think our parents would have wanted

510
00:25:29,516 --> 00:25:31,956
Speaker 3: us to and create what we want to.

511
00:25:31,876 --> 00:25:35,556
Speaker 2: Create, creating the life we want to create. It's such

512
00:25:35,596 --> 00:25:37,996
Speaker 2: an important goal, but it can be surprisingly hard to

513
00:25:38,036 --> 00:25:38,636
Speaker 2: actually do.

514
00:25:39,076 --> 00:25:39,156
Speaker 3: So.

515
00:25:39,196 --> 00:25:41,116
Speaker 2: When we get back from the break, we'll look at

516
00:25:41,156 --> 00:25:43,476
Speaker 2: strategies we can use to become the people that we

517
00:25:43,556 --> 00:25:45,836
Speaker 2: really want to be in spite of what our parents

518
00:25:45,836 --> 00:25:46,476
Speaker 2: may have wanted.

519
00:25:46,836 --> 00:25:47,036
Speaker 5: Well.

520
00:25:47,036 --> 00:25:50,476
Speaker 2: Here Glennon and Abbey's tips on successfully reparenting ourselves and

521
00:25:50,516 --> 00:25:53,156
Speaker 2: not making the same mistakes with the next generation when

522
00:25:53,156 --> 00:26:04,276
Speaker 2: the Happiness Lab returns in a moment. It's no secret

523
00:26:04,316 --> 00:26:07,276
Speaker 2: that parenting can bring up lots of unresolved experiences from

524
00:26:07,316 --> 00:26:10,516
Speaker 2: your own childhood. Watching your child mess up might trigger

525
00:26:10,556 --> 00:26:13,476
Speaker 2: your own memories of feeling criticized. A big move or

526
00:26:13,516 --> 00:26:16,116
Speaker 2: divorce may lead you to reflect on how your parents

527
00:26:16,236 --> 00:26:19,276
Speaker 2: navigated big life transitions. In their new book We Can

528
00:26:19,316 --> 00:26:22,436
Speaker 2: Do Hard Things, Glennon Doyle and Abby Wombach explain that

529
00:26:22,436 --> 00:26:25,636
Speaker 2: we can embrace these moments as opportunities not just to

530
00:26:25,676 --> 00:26:28,996
Speaker 2: do better for our own kids, but also to reparent ourselves.

531
00:26:29,396 --> 00:26:32,676
Speaker 4: I had this experience with my kid early on when

532
00:26:32,676 --> 00:26:36,436
Speaker 4: I got into the family. We do kind of nightly

533
00:26:36,876 --> 00:26:38,996
Speaker 4: ritual where we lay in bed and we'll take a

534
00:26:39,036 --> 00:26:41,556
Speaker 4: moral inventory of the day and things that didn't sit

535
00:26:41,676 --> 00:26:43,356
Speaker 4: right with us. And one of the things that wasn't

536
00:26:43,356 --> 00:26:46,316
Speaker 4: sitting right. Was the way that I responded to our

537
00:26:46,356 --> 00:26:50,276
Speaker 4: youngest who came to me and said, my knee hurts,

538
00:26:50,316 --> 00:26:52,876
Speaker 4: and I just went into the way I was parented.

539
00:26:53,476 --> 00:26:56,556
Speaker 4: I basically said, you know, you'll be fine in not

540
00:26:56,636 --> 00:26:57,316
Speaker 4: so many.

541
00:26:57,076 --> 00:26:58,636
Speaker 3: Words, deffin up buttercup.

542
00:26:58,836 --> 00:27:03,276
Speaker 4: Yeah, And it felt very like I was pushing her away,

543
00:27:03,836 --> 00:27:05,676
Speaker 4: And that was kind of the way that I was raised.

544
00:27:05,716 --> 00:27:08,356
Speaker 4: And I think in this moment when I was telling

545
00:27:08,396 --> 00:27:12,716
Speaker 4: Glennon just said, well, you can apologize to her. And

546
00:27:12,796 --> 00:27:17,476
Speaker 4: I was like, I'm sorry, excuse me, and yes, I'm like,

547
00:27:17,636 --> 00:27:22,996
Speaker 4: but parents don't do that. Parents don't apologize. That had

548
00:27:23,036 --> 00:27:26,676
Speaker 4: never happened in my whole life. So the next morning,

549
00:27:26,716 --> 00:27:29,836
Speaker 4: I wake up and Amma's eating her cereal and I

550
00:27:29,916 --> 00:27:33,316
Speaker 4: kind of explained the story, like, this thing happened last

551
00:27:33,356 --> 00:27:35,476
Speaker 4: night and you came to me with your injury and

552
00:27:35,996 --> 00:27:38,196
Speaker 4: I didn't handle it right, and I'm so sorry, and

553
00:27:38,236 --> 00:27:40,956
Speaker 4: I want you to always feel confident and comfortable coming

554
00:27:40,996 --> 00:27:43,996
Speaker 4: to me with anything, even if it's a toenail that

555
00:27:44,036 --> 00:27:45,836
Speaker 4: you're feeling uncomfortable about.

556
00:27:46,236 --> 00:27:47,916
Speaker 5: And she just was like eating her cereal and she.

557
00:27:47,956 --> 00:27:51,516
Speaker 4: Was like, okay, great, moving on, And it was this

558
00:27:51,596 --> 00:27:54,676
Speaker 4: really important moment for me that not only did it

559
00:27:55,276 --> 00:28:00,196
Speaker 4: feel unnatural to apologize to a child, my own child,

560
00:28:00,676 --> 00:28:04,316
Speaker 4: but it also felt very healing. Like I think that

561
00:28:04,356 --> 00:28:06,556
Speaker 4: what we get wrong is that we think that we

562
00:28:06,636 --> 00:28:08,636
Speaker 4: are just the way that we are and this is

563
00:28:08,676 --> 00:28:11,796
Speaker 4: the way that it will be. But parenting is this beautiful,

564
00:28:11,916 --> 00:28:16,836
Speaker 4: unique opportunity to reparent ourselves. And so in this apology

565
00:28:16,876 --> 00:28:20,636
Speaker 4: with my child, I was having this experience. I felt uncomfortable,

566
00:28:20,676 --> 00:28:23,516
Speaker 4: I felt scared, and then it happened, and she was

567
00:28:23,556 --> 00:28:27,956
Speaker 4: so great about it and loving that I just thought, Oh,

568
00:28:28,436 --> 00:28:30,036
Speaker 4: I bet you there were probably a lot of things

569
00:28:30,156 --> 00:28:33,156
Speaker 4: my mom wanted to apologize for and maybe she can't

570
00:28:33,196 --> 00:28:34,316
Speaker 4: find the words for it.

571
00:28:34,636 --> 00:28:38,036
Speaker 2: Abby, you brought up the idea specifically of parenting ourselves,

572
00:28:38,316 --> 00:28:41,356
Speaker 2: like reparenting ourselves, why is it so important?

573
00:28:41,796 --> 00:28:43,916
Speaker 4: Being the youngest of seven, I was always watching my

574
00:28:44,036 --> 00:28:46,516
Speaker 4: parents and my brothers and sisters and trying to like

575
00:28:46,876 --> 00:28:49,156
Speaker 4: figure out what what worked for me, what I would

576
00:28:49,196 --> 00:28:51,916
Speaker 4: do different, And then you get to do that with

577
00:28:51,996 --> 00:28:54,916
Speaker 4: your kids. You get to then express your own idea

578
00:28:54,996 --> 00:28:58,876
Speaker 4: of parenting on your children. But I didn't know that

579
00:28:59,396 --> 00:29:01,996
Speaker 4: there was so much possible healing in it for me.

580
00:29:02,716 --> 00:29:05,956
Speaker 4: In the ways that I wasn't parented that I might

581
00:29:05,956 --> 00:29:09,876
Speaker 4: have needed. And we do have to analyze and think

582
00:29:09,916 --> 00:29:13,396
Speaker 4: about really from the beginning, like why am I so

583
00:29:13,556 --> 00:29:18,396
Speaker 4: anxiously attached? Oh, probably because my mom didn't hold me

584
00:29:18,636 --> 00:29:20,756
Speaker 4: as much as I needed to be held, because there

585
00:29:20,756 --> 00:29:23,516
Speaker 4: were six other people that she was having to fend

586
00:29:23,516 --> 00:29:26,876
Speaker 4: off of her body. Probably because every single one of

587
00:29:26,876 --> 00:29:29,756
Speaker 4: my brothers and sisters left to go to college. In fact,

588
00:29:29,916 --> 00:29:33,036
Speaker 4: when my sister, when the oldest, went to college, she

589
00:29:33,236 --> 00:29:35,876
Speaker 4: was kind of my second mom. She was the one

590
00:29:35,916 --> 00:29:38,396
Speaker 4: that was holding me and changing my diapers. And when

591
00:29:38,396 --> 00:29:40,356
Speaker 4: she went to college, I was starting to act out.

592
00:29:40,396 --> 00:29:43,876
Speaker 4: Said they brought me to a therapist like a school counselor,

593
00:29:44,396 --> 00:29:47,516
Speaker 4: and I said, like, I think that my sister Beth

594
00:29:47,596 --> 00:29:50,556
Speaker 4: died and nobody is telling me about it. And so

595
00:29:51,276 --> 00:29:55,876
Speaker 4: parenting and reparenting has to begin with actually really doing

596
00:29:55,876 --> 00:29:58,476
Speaker 4: a deep dive on the environment that you grew up with.

597
00:29:58,996 --> 00:29:59,636
Speaker 5: And if we're.

598
00:29:59,516 --> 00:30:03,316
Speaker 4: Really present and really awake with this idea of what

599
00:30:03,436 --> 00:30:07,116
Speaker 4: parenting can be, what it was for us as children,

600
00:30:07,476 --> 00:30:10,236
Speaker 4: what it might currently be for you as a person

601
00:30:10,356 --> 00:30:14,116
Speaker 4: right now in your parenting life, Like there are ways

602
00:30:14,156 --> 00:30:19,556
Speaker 4: for healing Honestly, I've never felt more happy in my

603
00:30:19,756 --> 00:30:24,676
Speaker 4: life in just watching these children experience the lives that

604
00:30:24,676 --> 00:30:26,076
Speaker 4: they're creating for themselves.

605
00:30:26,476 --> 00:30:29,396
Speaker 2: Yeah, and this idea of kind of mindfully noticing what

606
00:30:29,476 --> 00:30:32,396
Speaker 2: you missed, mindfully noticing what you need, it kind of

607
00:30:32,396 --> 00:30:34,236
Speaker 2: fits with something that we talk about a lot on

608
00:30:34,276 --> 00:30:37,276
Speaker 2: the Happiness Lab, this idea of giving yourself self compassion,

609
00:30:37,356 --> 00:30:39,596
Speaker 2: which I think is one of the fastest ways to

610
00:30:39,676 --> 00:30:43,836
Speaker 2: kind of parent yourself, like mindfully noticing I'm struggling right now,

611
00:30:43,876 --> 00:30:46,636
Speaker 2: this is not feeling good, I'm sucking. But then it

612
00:30:46,676 --> 00:30:49,316
Speaker 2: comes also with this idea of like, this makes sense.

613
00:30:49,396 --> 00:30:52,636
Speaker 2: No parent is perfect, no childhood is perfect. I'm just dealing.

614
00:30:53,036 --> 00:30:56,396
Speaker 2: But then also treating yourself with kindness, and I know

615
00:30:56,516 --> 00:30:58,436
Speaker 2: that this is something that both of you have struggled

616
00:30:58,436 --> 00:31:02,436
Speaker 2: with at various points. Any strategies for parents or anybody

617
00:31:02,476 --> 00:31:04,956
Speaker 2: who's struggling with this and trying to reparent themselves of

618
00:31:04,996 --> 00:31:06,596
Speaker 2: giving themselves some kindness.

619
00:31:06,956 --> 00:31:11,676
Speaker 3: I feel unable sometimes to figure out what I want

620
00:31:11,716 --> 00:31:14,316
Speaker 3: for myself without seeing it through the lens of what

621
00:31:14,356 --> 00:31:17,636
Speaker 3: I want for my kids first, And I wish I

622
00:31:17,676 --> 00:31:19,876
Speaker 3: could do that, but I'm not yet able to do that.

623
00:31:20,356 --> 00:31:23,796
Speaker 3: So what I would say is I think that when

624
00:31:23,796 --> 00:31:27,396
Speaker 3: we talk to parents about just be kind to yourself,

625
00:31:28,116 --> 00:31:30,916
Speaker 3: we're so obsessed with doing things right or well that

626
00:31:30,916 --> 00:31:35,436
Speaker 3: that feels a little bit like BS until you start

627
00:31:35,476 --> 00:31:38,476
Speaker 3: to think, Okay, then forget about yourself for a minute.

628
00:31:39,076 --> 00:31:41,876
Speaker 3: You think about your kid, and when your kid makes

629
00:31:41,876 --> 00:31:45,276
Speaker 3: a big mistake at school, or your kid feels left out,

630
00:31:45,356 --> 00:31:48,276
Speaker 3: or your kid says something awkward, or your kid loses

631
00:31:48,316 --> 00:31:51,676
Speaker 3: a job, what do you want them to do after that?

632
00:31:52,356 --> 00:31:55,516
Speaker 3: You probably don't want them to feel like I'm such

633
00:31:55,516 --> 00:32:00,076
Speaker 3: an idiot. Guys suck. I just am like, Okay, So

634
00:32:00,276 --> 00:32:02,196
Speaker 3: if that's not what you want for them, because the

635
00:32:02,236 --> 00:32:04,316
Speaker 3: only thing we know about human beings really is that

636
00:32:04,356 --> 00:32:06,876
Speaker 3: they're just going to keep screwing up constantly, like that's

637
00:32:06,956 --> 00:32:10,076
Speaker 3: just what we do. So that's the model we have

638
00:32:10,196 --> 00:32:13,116
Speaker 3: to work with. We know that's going to happen to them.

639
00:32:13,236 --> 00:32:15,436
Speaker 3: The only way that they're going to have a self

640
00:32:15,716 --> 00:32:19,596
Speaker 3: compassionate inner voice is if they've seen that. That's what

641
00:32:19,636 --> 00:32:21,916
Speaker 3: got me. I wish what got me is just like,

642
00:32:22,476 --> 00:32:25,156
Speaker 3: obviously you should be kinder to yourself, but thinking what

643
00:32:25,236 --> 00:32:27,516
Speaker 3: I want my kids to have as their inner voice

644
00:32:27,516 --> 00:32:30,116
Speaker 3: when they screw up is what I have to become

645
00:32:30,316 --> 00:32:32,556
Speaker 3: and model. That's what reparenting is.

646
00:32:32,996 --> 00:32:35,116
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think that's such great advice because there's

647
00:32:35,116 --> 00:32:36,796
Speaker 2: evidence from Kristin neflab Butt U T.

648
00:32:36,956 --> 00:32:37,276
Speaker 1: Austin.

649
00:32:37,916 --> 00:32:40,636
Speaker 2: If you want your kid to develop a self compassionate voice,

650
00:32:40,716 --> 00:32:43,396
Speaker 2: you have to model that self compassionate voice and ideally

651
00:32:43,436 --> 00:32:46,996
Speaker 2: model it out loud, like Abby your story about apologizing

652
00:32:46,996 --> 00:32:48,796
Speaker 2: of like mom messed up. I probably should have been

653
00:32:48,876 --> 00:32:50,716
Speaker 2: nicer to you about not feeling well. I'm going to

654
00:32:50,756 --> 00:32:53,116
Speaker 2: try to do differently in the future when it takes

655
00:32:53,116 --> 00:32:55,716
Speaker 2: some time to think about this. That's so much nicer

656
00:32:55,756 --> 00:32:59,076
Speaker 2: than secretly beating yourself up insideer than watching the consequences

657
00:32:59,076 --> 00:33:02,076
Speaker 2: of you secretly beating yourself up inside. Allowing yourself to

658
00:33:02,076 --> 00:33:04,396
Speaker 2: be vulnerable actually helps your kids because then they get

659
00:33:04,396 --> 00:33:06,116
Speaker 2: to sort of see how you do it, which is

660
00:33:06,676 --> 00:33:09,356
Speaker 2: so important for their own development. Yea.

661
00:33:09,396 --> 00:33:11,476
Speaker 3: Even naming the patterns like I could have gone to

662
00:33:11,516 --> 00:33:14,956
Speaker 3: Amma and said, I suck. I'm just so judgmental, that's

663
00:33:14,956 --> 00:33:18,076
Speaker 3: not the whole story. Like I learned that as a

664
00:33:18,116 --> 00:33:21,396
Speaker 3: coping mechanism, and I said, Amma, like, I'm doing my

665
00:33:21,436 --> 00:33:23,756
Speaker 3: best with this. This is something that I learned to

666
00:33:23,796 --> 00:33:26,636
Speaker 3: keep myself safe. It's not my favorite part of myself,

667
00:33:27,196 --> 00:33:31,196
Speaker 3: but this is how human beings work. So when she's

668
00:33:31,316 --> 00:33:35,156
Speaker 3: forty and she's okay, when she's forty nine and she's

669
00:33:35,196 --> 00:33:38,756
Speaker 3: talking to her kid, I don't want her beating herself

670
00:33:38,836 --> 00:33:42,036
Speaker 3: up about her coping mechanisms. But I do want her

671
00:33:42,076 --> 00:33:45,276
Speaker 3: telling my granddaughter what hers are because I feel like

672
00:33:45,356 --> 00:33:48,516
Speaker 3: all we're trying to do each generation is like you

673
00:33:48,556 --> 00:33:52,036
Speaker 3: get a certain hue of paint from your parents and

674
00:33:52,076 --> 00:33:54,036
Speaker 3: you just add more white to it or whatever. You

675
00:33:54,116 --> 00:33:56,716
Speaker 3: just try to like clear it a little bit each generation.

676
00:33:57,396 --> 00:34:00,876
Speaker 3: So all we're doing is trying to get each other

677
00:34:00,916 --> 00:34:02,556
Speaker 3: to look at our stuff and say, I'm not going

678
00:34:02,636 --> 00:34:03,356
Speaker 3: to take that with me.

679
00:34:03,756 --> 00:34:08,556
Speaker 4: And compassion has been really difficult for me personally. It's

680
00:34:08,556 --> 00:34:13,836
Speaker 4: been my life's journey self love right worthiness, And so

681
00:34:14,676 --> 00:34:18,556
Speaker 4: for the listener who also struggles with this, like I

682
00:34:18,676 --> 00:34:23,076
Speaker 4: totally get it, and it is extraordinarily hard, Like I'm

683
00:34:23,116 --> 00:34:26,076
Speaker 4: my biggest critic, right if I didn't get it perfect,

684
00:34:26,156 --> 00:34:29,596
Speaker 4: if I didn't get it exactly right. There are therapists

685
00:34:29,716 --> 00:34:34,676
Speaker 4: that are really helpful around cultivating a practice of this,

686
00:34:35,276 --> 00:34:37,276
Speaker 4: because it has to be a practice. I mean I'm

687
00:34:37,316 --> 00:34:40,316
Speaker 4: a very optimistic person, and I see the very best

688
00:34:40,356 --> 00:34:43,036
Speaker 4: in so many people around me, and yet when it

689
00:34:43,076 --> 00:34:46,956
Speaker 4: comes to myself, I can be so critical and so unloving.

690
00:34:47,116 --> 00:34:47,956
Speaker 1: You're so not alone.

691
00:34:47,996 --> 00:34:50,196
Speaker 2: I often joke that if people could hear what we

692
00:34:50,316 --> 00:34:52,916
Speaker 2: say to ourselves, and we'd all get fired because hr

693
00:34:52,956 --> 00:34:54,636
Speaker 2: would be like, you know, would put us all up

694
00:34:54,636 --> 00:34:57,596
Speaker 2: for harassment, unless we're so mean to ourselves.

695
00:34:57,716 --> 00:34:59,516
Speaker 3: Harassment. Oh that's crazy, and.

696
00:34:59,476 --> 00:35:02,196
Speaker 4: So it is difficult. But I think when Glennon told

697
00:35:02,236 --> 00:35:05,636
Speaker 4: me that too, this is early days. She said, you know,

698
00:35:05,716 --> 00:35:08,956
Speaker 4: one of the most important things around parenting that we

699
00:35:09,196 --> 00:35:12,836
Speaker 4: can offer our children is just the modeling of the

700
00:35:12,876 --> 00:35:16,116
Speaker 4: way we live. That really got me thinking, like, oh yeah,

701
00:35:16,116 --> 00:35:18,396
Speaker 4: my dad drank every day and that was something I

702
00:35:18,436 --> 00:35:21,316
Speaker 4: aspired to do. Oh yeah, then I became an alcoholic.

703
00:35:21,836 --> 00:35:24,636
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Like I

704
00:35:24,676 --> 00:35:28,516
Speaker 4: put my dad and his drinking ability on a pedestal.

705
00:35:29,116 --> 00:35:32,356
Speaker 4: That's something that I wanted to become, and the same

706
00:35:32,436 --> 00:35:33,316
Speaker 4: thing happens.

707
00:35:33,356 --> 00:35:34,156
Speaker 5: And it might not be.

708
00:35:34,156 --> 00:35:38,436
Speaker 4: As obvious and as detrimental as alcoholism. It might be snark,

709
00:35:39,036 --> 00:35:42,556
Speaker 4: it might be judgment, judgment. It might be what kind

710
00:35:42,596 --> 00:35:45,116
Speaker 4: of food you choose to eat, like modeling therapy, Like

711
00:35:45,156 --> 00:35:47,996
Speaker 4: if I'm not getting this compassion for myself thing right,

712
00:35:48,676 --> 00:35:51,996
Speaker 4: I'm modeling to my kids. I go to therapy every

713
00:35:52,036 --> 00:35:53,116
Speaker 4: single week and they know it.

714
00:35:53,276 --> 00:35:55,036
Speaker 2: And the modeling is so useful because one of the

715
00:35:55,036 --> 00:35:56,756
Speaker 2: things we know from the research is that a very

716
00:35:56,836 --> 00:36:00,036
Speaker 2: quick emotion that parents go to is guilt. And when

717
00:36:00,036 --> 00:36:03,036
Speaker 2: you start to realize that treating yourself nice, working on yourself,

718
00:36:03,036 --> 00:36:05,836
Speaker 2: putting in that work, that's actually parenting for the future.

719
00:36:05,996 --> 00:36:08,236
Speaker 2: That's so like when your kid's forty nine, they'll talk

720
00:36:08,276 --> 00:36:10,116
Speaker 2: to you know, your grips and daughter in a really

721
00:36:10,236 --> 00:36:12,756
Speaker 2: nice way. I think that can just give parents permission

722
00:36:13,156 --> 00:36:15,076
Speaker 2: to take the time and put in the work to

723
00:36:15,076 --> 00:36:17,436
Speaker 2: take care of themselves, which they wouldn't normally do, but

724
00:36:17,516 --> 00:36:20,516
Speaker 2: when it's for their kids, they do it. There's so

725
00:36:20,636 --> 00:36:22,596
Speaker 2: much good wisdom in this book. I hope all the

726
00:36:22,636 --> 00:36:24,796
Speaker 2: parents listening and all the non parents listening go out

727
00:36:24,836 --> 00:36:26,436
Speaker 2: and check out your book so that they can get

728
00:36:26,476 --> 00:36:29,716
Speaker 2: as many gloomorerous from you as I have. Glenn and Abby,

729
00:36:29,716 --> 00:36:31,636
Speaker 2: thank you so much for coming on the Happiness Lab.

730
00:36:31,836 --> 00:36:34,316
Speaker 3: You're the best. You make us happier. Laurie. We just

731
00:36:34,396 --> 00:36:35,356
Speaker 3: love hanging out with you.

732
00:36:35,676 --> 00:36:37,156
Speaker 5: Thank you, thanks for having us.

733
00:36:38,476 --> 00:36:43,196
Speaker 2: Parenting young children while simultaneously reparenting yourself is tough, but

734
00:36:43,476 --> 00:36:46,316
Speaker 2: as the title of Glennon and Abbey's book suggests, we

735
00:36:46,396 --> 00:36:48,996
Speaker 2: can do hard things, and while reflecting on the past

736
00:36:49,076 --> 00:36:51,876
Speaker 2: may be hard, it often comes with the opportunity to

737
00:36:51,916 --> 00:36:55,316
Speaker 2: shape a more intentional future, both for ourselves and for

738
00:36:55,396 --> 00:36:58,556
Speaker 2: our kids. And showing that you're willing to take care

739
00:36:58,596 --> 00:37:00,916
Speaker 2: of yourself is pretty much the best way to teach

740
00:37:00,916 --> 00:37:03,876
Speaker 2: your kids that they can also navigate life's challenges with

741
00:37:03,916 --> 00:37:07,516
Speaker 2: self compassion. In next week's special episode on Happier Parenting,

742
00:37:07,876 --> 00:37:10,036
Speaker 2: we'll dive into what we can learn from parents who

743
00:37:10,076 --> 00:37:12,916
Speaker 2: live in the happiest countries on the planet. We'll meet

744
00:37:12,916 --> 00:37:15,916
Speaker 2: a mom from Denmark who's found that adopting a Scandinavian

745
00:37:15,956 --> 00:37:18,956
Speaker 2: approach to parenting can lead to way less stress and

746
00:37:18,996 --> 00:37:21,356
Speaker 2: surprising increases in family resilience.

747
00:37:21,756 --> 00:37:23,516
Speaker 6: For a Danish parent, it would be no good if

748
00:37:23,516 --> 00:37:26,116
Speaker 6: your child was top of the class but miserable and

749
00:37:26,156 --> 00:37:28,636
Speaker 6: actually aspect to some parents in Finland, he said, they

750
00:37:28,676 --> 00:37:30,796
Speaker 6: sort of told their children to study a bit less.

751
00:37:30,996 --> 00:37:32,836
Speaker 6: It doesn't matter about being top of the class, it

752
00:37:32,836 --> 00:37:34,356
Speaker 6: matters about being happy.

753
00:37:34,836 --> 00:37:37,476
Speaker 2: Until then, don't forget to check out my new free

754
00:37:37,516 --> 00:37:40,556
Speaker 2: online course, The Science of Well Being for Parents. You

755
00:37:40,596 --> 00:37:43,596
Speaker 2: can learn more by heading to doctor Lauri Santo's dot

756
00:37:43,636 --> 00:37:48,836
Speaker 2: com slash parents. That's dr Lauri Santos dot com slash parents.

757
00:37:49,116 --> 00:37:51,316
Speaker 2: We'll see you back soon for the next installment on

758
00:37:51,396 --> 00:37:54,836
Speaker 2: happier parenting here on the Happiness Lab with me, Doctor

759
00:37:54,876 --> 00:37:55,716
Speaker 2: Lauriy Santos,