Speaker 1: The Indiana Pacers get a shot at the in season
Speaker 1: tournament title against Lebron James and the Lakers. We're gonna
Speaker 1: talk about the two teams that made it to the
Speaker 1: IST title game. We're gonna talk about the two teams
Speaker 1: that lost in the semifinals. What is going on with
Speaker 1: the Milwaukee Bucks, and what is going on with Zion
Speaker 1: Williamson and the New Orleans Pelicans. Should the IST champion
Speaker 1: hoist up banner? We get into all of that next
Speaker 1: here on the latest edition of This League Uncut. Welcome
Speaker 1: to this League Uncut in the world of twenty four
Speaker 1: hour NBA News. This's you love, Chris Hans. Let's go,
Speaker 1: time works time, It's so time. This League Uncut is
Speaker 1: underway in on fire. This should be a good one. Hei, everyone,
Speaker 1: Welcome in to the latest edition of This League Uncut.
Speaker 1: It's a jealousy tinged edition of This League Uncut because
Speaker 1: we are taping this on Friday evening. It's still afternoon
Speaker 1: time in the desert where Chris Haynes is. Yes, Chris
Speaker 1: Haynes is at the nd season Tournament. He got to
Speaker 1: see both games Thursday, saw him all over NBA TV.
Speaker 1: On Friday he'll be there Saturday when the Pacers and
Speaker 1: the Lakers play for the first Ist crown. I am
Speaker 1: jealous because I am not there. I hate missing out
Speaker 1: on Vegas, but due to a number of reasons that
Speaker 1: I don't want to bore you with. Despite our best
Speaker 1: attempts to reunite in Vegas, like we did in July
Speaker 1: when we did a live edition of this podcast with
Speaker 1: Lakers coach Darvin Ham at a very well known sports
Speaker 1: book on the Strip, we couldn't quite make that happen
Speaker 1: this time. It's my fault. That's my those are that's
Speaker 1: supposed to be my department. I couldn't get it done.
Speaker 1: And so Haynes is there amid all the glitz and glamour,
Speaker 1: and I'm just fifteen hundred miles away. No, not fifteen hundred,
Speaker 1: I'm a thousand plus miles away and very envious, very envious.
Speaker 2: But so you felt the need style style, You felt
Speaker 2: the need to correct yourself right there. You went from
Speaker 2: fifteen hundred miles away to a thousand As if anybody
Speaker 2: would have called you out on that.
Speaker 1: I just like to I have to be accurate at
Speaker 1: all times. I mean, it's Dallas to Vegas. Is not
Speaker 1: fifteen hundred miles Dallas to Dallas to Cali or Dallas
Speaker 1: to New York, is you know, in the fifteen hundred ballpark.
Speaker 1: But it's more like it's a thousand plus.
Speaker 2: Okay, I think it would have been fine.
Speaker 1: But striving for accuracy. How is how is the strip
Speaker 1: treating you? Rub it in? Tell me what's going on?
Speaker 1: How's it been so far?
Speaker 2: Well? This is? You said it that the Vegas is
Speaker 2: the desert, and I don't know what desert is. Fifty
Speaker 2: degrees it's cold, stein you know, I've never been to
Speaker 2: Vegas and it's been this cold. This is the first
Speaker 2: I haven't been on the strip. I haven't walked. The
Speaker 2: only time I've walked. I've walked a few times back
Speaker 2: and forth to the arena. I'm staying at the Aria
Speaker 2: and the hotel is like a block away. It's about
Speaker 2: a seven minute walk if that. So, I've been doing that.
Speaker 2: But stiin this cold man.
Speaker 1: Cold Vegas is wonderful? How could what you like it better?
Speaker 1: When it's one hundred and ten? I mean, what's wrong?
Speaker 1: Throw on a fancy TNT jacket and you're good.
Speaker 2: I didn't bring a jacket. I didn't bring. I have
Speaker 2: one sweater. I have a hood hooded sweater, but it
Speaker 2: doesn't go with all my outfits, so I can't be
Speaker 2: wearing it all the time. But no, Star, I mean,
Speaker 2: this is this is the desert, right, So in December,
Speaker 2: I expect it to be seventy five plus give me
Speaker 2: seventy five to eighty eighty five. That sounds about right cold.
Speaker 1: But man, cold Vegas. Like I said, cold Vegas sounds
Speaker 1: wonderful to me.
Speaker 2: I'm not feeling it. And in the arena stein t
Speaker 2: Mobile Arena, it is super cold in that arena, super cold.
Speaker 2: You know they got that ice under there for hockey. Man,
Speaker 2: So god, I hate freezing. I hate freezing. But look,
Speaker 2: I'm in Vegas. I'm enjoying getting to see my comrades
Speaker 2: out here. Miss you out here. Stein.
Speaker 1: But uh, it sounds like a big media contingent is
Speaker 1: on the scene.
Speaker 2: You know what. I wouldn't say. No, I wouldn't I
Speaker 2: wouldn't call it big. It's not that, it's not that,
Speaker 2: it's not that many. You know, I would probably say
Speaker 2: there's probably the same amount of foreign media here than
Speaker 2: American media. I'll say it's probably more forim media than
Speaker 2: American media. There's not there's not a large contingency here, Stean, there's.
Speaker 1: Not bad info apparently.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well it doesn't from from my eye, you know,
Speaker 2: from the naked eye, doesn't look that way.
Speaker 1: Well, look, before we get into the Pacers and the Lakers,
Speaker 1: and of course we're going to talk about the Bucks
Speaker 1: and the Pelicans too, before we get into all that,
Speaker 1: just tell me your impressions of being in the building
Speaker 1: last night. Again, we're taping this Friday, almost seven pm
Speaker 1: Eastern time.
Speaker 2: So.
Speaker 1: It was last night, you know, the Bucks, especially that
Speaker 1: Bucks Pacers game five pm Eastern tip off, two pm
Speaker 1: local tip off. And I can't imagine that a slew
Speaker 1: of Bucks and or Pacers fans made their way from
Speaker 1: the Midwest all the way to Vegas on short notice.
Speaker 1: So I saw Damian Lillard said something like neutral was
Speaker 1: a good word because it had a neutral atmosphere in there.
Speaker 1: I mean, what was the noise like.
Speaker 2: Noise? The PA announcer was making a lot of noise.
Speaker 2: He probably made the most noise. You know during that
Speaker 2: Pacers Bucks game, there was a lot of seats available.
Speaker 2: I say that you could have grabbed the seat last
Speaker 2: minute and probably had you a really good seat, A
Speaker 2: lot of seats available for that two o'clock local time
Speaker 2: start between the Pacers and Bucks. The wasn't really an atmosphere.
Speaker 2: There wasn't really a Pacers fan contingent or Bucks fans contingent.
Speaker 2: You know, obviously there were some of those fans there,
Speaker 2: but nah, it was pretty Yeah, it was. It was neutral,
Speaker 2: but it didn't have much of an atmosphere. Really.
Speaker 1: It was a good game, though, so I mean, it
Speaker 1: looks like it didn't have any real impact on the game.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, the players are playing art because everybody's trying
Speaker 2: to get that money, so you know, the product didn't suffer.
Speaker 2: But that was my concern starting a having a two
Speaker 2: o'clock game start at start on a SAT on a Thursday.
Speaker 2: So that was my my, my baby, excuse me, stein
Speaker 2: my baby. She is facetiming me right now. Jada cannot
Speaker 2: call you back, baby. Your hair looks nice. I love
Speaker 2: your baby. Hear my daughter's Styn She said, hy Mark
Speaker 2: sty always said bye my bad okay, bye bye baby,
Speaker 2: love you. That's my third youngest daughter right there. She
Speaker 2: is thirteen. She just got a new hair. Deuces. She
Speaker 2: facetimed me right now avid podlistener, Yes, big blistener subscribes
Speaker 2: and everything to this league uncut but no, yes, Stein,
Speaker 2: so she would show me her hair, her new hair, dude.
Speaker 2: But Stein, Yeah, it was like it was, you know,
Speaker 2: it wasn't really an atmosphere now, the six o'clock game,
Speaker 2: the six thirty game or whatever. It was, Lakers Pelicans,
Speaker 2: definitely Lakers fans all in the building much more. The
Speaker 2: arena was much more packed, much more of an atmosphere,
Speaker 2: an environment. I would have liked to have seen a
Speaker 2: more competitive game, but yeah, it was night and day
Speaker 2: were talking about the atmosphere and the environment from the
Speaker 2: two o'clock game to the six o'clock game.
Speaker 1: Well, I think we knew that was gonna happen. Vegas,
Speaker 1: of course, well known as a Laker town, so we
Speaker 1: knew there were gonna be no issues in the night game.
Speaker 1: And look, the league, honestly to me, has gotten everything
Speaker 1: it could have hoped for with this championship game matchup
Speaker 1: Saturday night because the Pacers and you know, you've had
Speaker 1: to hear these lectures for me about how the league
Speaker 1: is trying to make this. You know, the league has
Speaker 1: used soccer tournaments abroad as the guide for this, but
Speaker 1: there are so few soccer elements to it, and that's
Speaker 1: something that has bothered me from the start. But this
Speaker 1: is the Indiana Pacers have made a classic Soccer Cup run,
Speaker 1: exactly what the NBA would have hoped, because you know,
Speaker 1: they're beating Boston in the quarterfinals at home. They're beating
Speaker 1: Milwaukee in the semifinals in Vegas. If it's a seven
Speaker 1: game series, the Pacers are obviously not going to be
Speaker 1: favored against either one of those teams. And you'd struggle
Speaker 1: to imagine a scenario where the Pacers won a seven
Speaker 1: game series against the Celtics or the Bucks. But this
Speaker 1: is supposed to be a knockout competition, a cup competition.
Speaker 1: Mama said, knock you out, and that's what the Pacers
Speaker 1: have done. They're six and oh in these knockout you know,
Speaker 1: they went four and oh in the group. They won
Speaker 1: their two knockout games. They beat two of the Eastern
Speaker 1: Conference powers in Milwaukee and Boston. And that is what's
Speaker 1: supposed to happen in a cup. Those are the kind
Speaker 1: of magical things where a team gets hot and catches
Speaker 1: fire and goes farther than it normally might have because
Speaker 1: they've only got to win. You know, anybody can beat
Speaker 1: anybody in one game. And then on the other side
Speaker 1: of it, it's the Lakers, and of course this is
Speaker 1: the NBA's dream, this is what Adam Silver wanted. Unfortunately,
Speaker 1: it comes with the assist of a very disputed ending
Speaker 1: in the quarterfinals against Phoenix, when a call was clearly
Speaker 1: missed and the Lakers got a timeout they shouldn't have.
Speaker 1: But obviously the Lakers left no doubt with the way
Speaker 1: they destroyed New Orleans in the Semis, and Lebron James
Speaker 1: is on the final stage, and you know, for the
Speaker 1: league office, that is huge beyond words, because again you've
Speaker 1: got the Cinderella Pacers on one side, and you've got
Speaker 1: Lebron to attract the national TV audience and legitimize this
Speaker 1: thing because he clearly wants to win it. It's something
Speaker 1: that means something to him. So honestly, to me, the
Speaker 1: NBA couldn't have drawn it up better had they tried.
Speaker 1: Although again, there will be cynics out there who will
Speaker 1: point to the way that Lakers Suns game ended and
Speaker 1: say that, you know, the league, the league did have
Speaker 1: a role here. Although look, I'm I'm by no means
Speaker 1: suggesting that there was league intervention. It was a bad call.
Speaker 1: It shouldn't have happened. It was a missed call. It
Speaker 1: was it was a mistake, but it did help the
Speaker 1: Lakers on this path. And again, full credit to the
Speaker 1: Lakers for taking advantage of that and blowing New Orleans
Speaker 1: out in the semis Stein, I'm slow.
Speaker 2: I'm slow, and I probably shouldn't be acknowledging this or
Speaker 2: saying this, but I'm gonna say it because this is
Speaker 2: this league uncut Starn, I'm slow. I'm listening to you,
Speaker 2: and you're saying, this is exactly what the NBA wanted.
Speaker 2: You know what single game elimination knockout scenario. When you
Speaker 2: said that, Stime, I've came to the rezation. I understood now.
Speaker 2: That's why they played that ll COOJ song. Mama said
Speaker 2: knock you out, the knockout round. That's why I never
Speaker 2: knew exactly why.
Speaker 1: I thought, you remember my big rant when we got
Speaker 1: the news that the league had convinced LL COOLJ to
Speaker 1: do a freshened up version of Mama said knock you out.
Speaker 1: And I thought that was a great idea. But what
Speaker 1: bothered me so much was that was the anthem that
Speaker 1: is the NBA's official anthem for the nd season tournament.
Speaker 1: But because there are sixty group games only seven games
Speaker 1: in this tournament, can you actually get knocked out? That
Speaker 1: was my issue. The song is awesome, but like, yeah,
Speaker 1: and you've always you've seen this week when they're when
Speaker 1: they're when when there is a knockout, We've seen great
Speaker 1: We've seen great stuff. You know, the indie crowd was
Speaker 1: great when the Pacers beat the Celtics, and then obviously
Speaker 1: that was you know, Pacers Bucks went went all the
Speaker 1: way down to the wire. I mean that that's what
Speaker 1: we want. That's that's the the novelty and the newness here,
Speaker 1: because nothing in the NBA is single elimination, nor you know,
Speaker 1: obviously in the playoffs there shouldn't be single elimination. I
Speaker 1: remember being a kid, and you know, in the first
Speaker 1: round of the playoffs, they used to have the mini series,
Speaker 1: which was two out of three, and that was considered
Speaker 1: too short, and then we had three out of five
Speaker 1: in the first round and they even did away with that.
Speaker 1: And I think there are some people who do miss
Speaker 1: the playoffs when the first round was just best of five.
Speaker 1: But obviously now in the playoffs it's best of seven,
Speaker 1: all four rounds. So if the playoffs are gonna be
Speaker 1: best of seven, all four rounds, let's make the end
Speaker 1: season toment. Let's have even more single elimination games. Let's
Speaker 1: get crazy.
Speaker 2: Yeah that I'm down for that. I'm not opposed to that. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm just slow. So I had I had to admit
Speaker 2: that I'm slow. It makes sense now.
Speaker 1: Well it was a bold admission, because yeah, it makes sense.
Speaker 1: You know, I've been I've been harping on that one.
Speaker 1: But I think it also just proves that you're not
Speaker 1: you're not reading. You're not reading my substock as close.
Speaker 2: I on the other, hold on, I got a question
Speaker 2: for your style. First of all, I do read. Second
Speaker 2: of all, I got let me ask you this. Would
Speaker 2: you rather I read all your work or would you
Speaker 2: rather I subscribe and pay for a subscription? You pick one?
Speaker 1: Sty Oh, I'd much rather you pay for the subscribe.
Speaker 2: Okay, thank you, all right, because I do pay.
Speaker 1: But difference is Last night, when Chris Haynes posts a
Speaker 1: story for Bleacher Report about some post game tensions in
Speaker 1: the Bucks locker room, I click on it instantly and
Speaker 1: read every single word of it.
Speaker 2: I do. I do the same as well. Most of
Speaker 2: the time I do. They're reciprocated.
Speaker 1: Most It's fine. All I want. All I want is
Speaker 1: to sum it's fine.
Speaker 2: You got that check out, let's check it.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about your Buck story. I don't want to.
Speaker 1: I don't want to make a huge deal of it
Speaker 1: unless you tell me I should. But I mean, I
Speaker 1: do think it's worrisome. Now. Look, the Bucks, even after
Speaker 1: losing the Semis to Indiana, they woke up on this
Speaker 1: Friday at fifteen and seven. They've got the second best
Speaker 1: record in the East. They've been, you know, very good
Speaker 1: lately when Dame's been in the lineup. So I mean,
Speaker 1: it's you know, it'd be overstatement to suggest that there's
Speaker 1: some kind of crisis going on, but there has just
Speaker 1: been you know, Adrian Griffin is basically a quarter of
Speaker 1: the way through his first season with the Bucks, and
Speaker 1: there's been a lot. I mean, it's been you know,
Speaker 1: Terry Stotts leaves the coaching staff before the regular season
Speaker 1: even starts. You reported how various Bucks players went to
Speaker 1: Adrian Griffin lobbied him to reinstate more of last season's
Speaker 1: drop coverage schemes on defense, and the Bucks did that.
Speaker 1: There was the game against Boston recently where Jannis did
Speaker 1: not look thrilled about being taken out of the game,
Speaker 1: and there was some back and forth between Giannis and
Speaker 1: the rookie coach. And now this story that you reported
Speaker 1: last night, and I should probably let you expound on
Speaker 1: what you actually reported instead of assuming that everyone read
Speaker 1: it as closely as me.
Speaker 2: Well, if you look at the game, look at how
Speaker 2: it and it was it was a collapse on the
Speaker 2: offensive end. You really didn't see any structure, You didn't
Speaker 2: see any plays being called, and it definitely were not executed.
Speaker 2: So I went, you know, I'm waiting by the Bucks
Speaker 2: locker room and I just I noticed it. You know,
Speaker 2: it's taking a little bit more time than usual to
Speaker 2: get out, and you know, usually when that's the case,
Speaker 2: you know, okay, something might be going on. And you know,
Speaker 2: I got word, you know, numerous people. I got word
Speaker 2: that Adrian Griffin went in and you know, he started
Speaker 2: harping on rebounding, on their lack of aggressiveness and losing
Speaker 2: the rebounding battle, and you know, Bobby Portis I heard
Speaker 2: interrupted and was like, nah, we got to you know,
Speaker 2: we got to have more structure on offense. We got
Speaker 2: to have more sets called. You need to called more
Speaker 2: sets to get us, you know, running the right offensive sets.
Speaker 2: We're out there, not not doing anything, We're just going.
Speaker 2: And you know, there's one play that sticks out the
Speaker 2: last two minutes of the game where where Giannis imbounds
Speaker 2: the ball but he inbounds it to he inmbounded it
Speaker 2: to Chris Middleton. Damian Little was coming over to bring
Speaker 2: the ball up, but Chris Milton kept the ball to
Speaker 2: bring up, bring it up the court, and emotion for
Speaker 2: Dame to go opposite. So Dame goes. You could tell
Speaker 2: Dame's a little bit confused. So Dame goes, and then Chris,
Speaker 2: once he passes half court, he starts looking for Dame
Speaker 2: and Bruce Brown is just hovering Damon and Chris throws
Speaker 2: it and Bruce Brown picks it off and Dame stops
Speaker 2: him from scoring. But nobody got back and Buddy Hill
Speaker 2: was able to get the offense rebound and put it
Speaker 2: back in. And so there was a couple of plays
Speaker 2: just down the stretch where there was really no plays called.
Speaker 2: They were just they just going freely. And so what
Speaker 2: you have to understand not you, Stein, but I'm talking
Speaker 2: about people have to understand about the Bucks is that
Speaker 2: they're in win now mode. You know, the stakes are high.
Speaker 2: And yes, Adrian Griffin is a rookie head coach. Yes
Speaker 2: there's going to be it's going to take time. But
Speaker 2: you know, this is the situation, this is it. You know,
Speaker 2: there's pressure, there's a miss pressure. Players feel it. And
Speaker 2: their record is good Stein for fifteen and six you said,
Speaker 2: or fifteen and seven. Really they have a good record,
Speaker 2: but they haven't been winning games by large margins. You know,
Speaker 2: a lot of these games have gone you know, I've
Speaker 2: been going down the stretch and they they're closing based
Speaker 2: off of their talent. Dame has heroic plays, or Giannis
Speaker 2: has hero plays or Chris Middleton lately, you know, they
Speaker 2: continue to struggle in the first half. They start games
Speaker 2: off slow. They're always like finding their way back, you know,
Speaker 2: climbing out of large deficits. Like so they haven't been
Speaker 2: playing good, you know, so that the standings can be misleading.
Speaker 2: So I think what it was, you know, but it
Speaker 2: look and so in my report as well. Excuse me,
Speaker 2: you know, Bobby Porter's harped on that and then Adrian
Speaker 2: Griffin I was told, was like, you know, I can
Speaker 2: take that criticism. I'll accept it. I'll embrace that. So,
Speaker 2: you know, Griffin has been receptive to listening to his
Speaker 2: players to hear what they have to say, and he's
Speaker 2: changed some things because of it. But Bobby Porters, you
Speaker 2: have to remember, he's one of the leaders of the team,
Speaker 2: one of the vocal leaders of the team. You know,
Speaker 2: he he has huge respect in that locker room and
Speaker 2: around the league. So if anybody is going to say something,
Speaker 2: or if anybody sees something, you know, he's well within
Speaker 2: his right to do so. And so you know, not
Speaker 2: only did he Chinese Griff, but he challenge the players
Speaker 2: to be able to execute. So but yeah, uh, nothing
Speaker 2: to get too big off of it. I wouldn't you know,
Speaker 2: I wouldn't jump over a cliff if I'm a Bucks fan.
Speaker 2: But you know, I think what it points to is
Speaker 2: just the urgency that players feel about having, you know,
Speaker 2: trying to get this season right and trying to make
Speaker 2: the most of it even though they're only in December.
Speaker 1: Well, I think it's something we're gonna have to keep
Speaker 1: our eye on because it's just again there have been,
Speaker 1: I mean, there have just been a slew of these
Speaker 1: kind of stories, headlines, however you want to term it,
Speaker 1: since mid October, and it's a lot for a rookie
Speaker 1: coach to have to deal with. Again, like you said,
Speaker 1: because the Bucks are on that list of teams that
Speaker 1: they are judged by championship or bust if the Bucks
Speaker 1: don't win a championship this season. Obviously, I think we
Speaker 1: all remember Yannis at the podium last year taking issue
Speaker 1: with that kind of championship or bus talk. But that
Speaker 1: is the reality. That is the way that the Bucks
Speaker 1: are going to be analyzed by the outside world, especially
Speaker 1: when you make a trade for someone as good and
Speaker 1: as accomplished as Dame Lillard. So I mean, I think
Speaker 1: that is one of the early stories of the season
Speaker 1: that you know, how is Adrian Griffin as a rookie
Speaker 1: coach adapting to this high pressure situation because there have
Speaker 1: been last night's story from you was not the first.
Speaker 1: Let's shift gears now and focus on the absolutely splashiest
Speaker 1: Morning after headlines because Zion Williamson put under the microscope
Speaker 1: like never before after New Orleans got absolutely trounced by
Speaker 1: the Lakers in Thursday Night semi final, and you know,
Speaker 1: this worked out for the Pelicans in precisely completely opposite
Speaker 1: fashion to what they were hoping. Of course, Zion Williamson
Speaker 1: has never played in a playoff game in the NBA.
Speaker 1: He hasn't even played in a play in game the NBA,
Speaker 1: So this was the foremost stage he has ever been
Speaker 1: on since leaving Duke and coming to the NBA. And
Speaker 1: this game was, you know, the Pelicans against the Lakers,
Speaker 1: the two teams who were at the heart of the
Speaker 1: Anthony Davis trade. And you know, this was probably the
Speaker 1: you know, the most the most the game with the
Speaker 1: most stakes between these teams since the Anthony Davis trade.
Speaker 1: And you know, New Orleans had so impressively gone to
Speaker 1: Sacramento and won in Sacramento to book their spot among
Speaker 1: the four teams in Vegas. And then Zion Williamson just
Speaker 1: absolutely punchless in this game. Lebron James guarded him, sagged
Speaker 1: off him, nothing went right for Zion, and after the game,
Speaker 1: just an absolute torrent of criticism sent Zion's way. And
Speaker 1: we're going to take a listen to some of it.
Speaker 1: We're gonna start with this was Charles Barkley on the
Speaker 1: TNT postgame show talking about Zion and his own career
Speaker 1: and repeating challenges that Barkley has issued to Zion in
Speaker 1: the past. But both both Charles Barkley and Shaquille O'Neil
Speaker 1: were really critical of Zion. And then we have another
Speaker 1: clip from JJ Reddick right after that. JJ Reddick, of
Speaker 1: course he's an ESPN analyst now, but JJ Reddick played
Speaker 1: with Zion Williamson in New Orleans, so really interesting and
Speaker 1: must listen stuff to me to hear Charles Barkley and
Speaker 1: JJ Reddick analyze Zion Williamson in this manner.
Speaker 3: The thing that disturbs me is he's not a young kid.
Speaker 3: When Moses told me I was fat and later I
Speaker 3: was a rookie. He's been in the league long enough.
Speaker 3: He's got two guys a team that a better player
Speaker 3: to him, and they shouldn't be shouldn't be.
Speaker 2: He should be.
Speaker 3: He was the number one pick in the draft. He
Speaker 3: should be a better player to. We like ingram Ovis,
Speaker 3: we love CJ. He should be the best player and
Speaker 3: he's not even close number one. He's got to get
Speaker 3: in shape. I've told you, I've been very disappointed he's
Speaker 3: averaging six rebounds a game. He's only had two double
Speaker 3: doubles all season. Man, if my grandmother was alive, she
Speaker 3: used to call me up to every game OU didn't
Speaker 3: get double faker rebound and just kill me. A big
Speaker 3: guy that talented should never get less than ten rebounding.
Speaker 3: He should be averaging eleven twelve rebounds games easily, but
Speaker 3: he doesn't run.
Speaker 2: The floor at all.
Speaker 4: I was disappointed, and overall I've been disappointed in Zion
Speaker 4: this season. And look, we can certainly point to counting
Speaker 4: stats and say he's having a fine season, but you
Speaker 4: can be in the building, you can watch on TV,
Speaker 4: you can be court side, and you can see he's
Speaker 4: not in shape. He's still not in shape despite everything
Speaker 4: that he's gone through, despite numerous conversations with legends of
Speaker 4: the game about being in shape, he gets called out
Speaker 4: on national television once or twice a year for this thing,
Speaker 4: this very thing. And earlier this season he had a
Speaker 4: press conference where he was talking about trying to buy
Speaker 4: into what the team wanted. And the reality is Zion
Speaker 4: Williamson has not bought into his own career yet and
Speaker 4: that is disappointing.
Speaker 1: So this game that was supposed to be this huge
Speaker 1: opportunity for Zion Williamson to really on a significant stage
Speaker 1: show us what he's got, and it just turns out disastrous.
Speaker 1: And I do wonder though, if this actually somehow becomes
Speaker 1: a blessing for the Pelicans because the organization's attempts to
Speaker 1: urge Zion Williamson to get in better shape, to take
Speaker 1: better care of his body, to address these things. I mean,
Speaker 1: Charles Barkley has told the story so many times, and
Speaker 1: it's such an important story in NBA history when Charles
Speaker 1: talks about Moses Malone, legendary Moses Malone getting on a
Speaker 1: very young Charles Barkley in Philadelphia and basically telling him
Speaker 1: the way you take care of yourself is unacceptable. You've
Speaker 1: got to change to succeed in the NBA. The Pelicans
Speaker 1: as as an organization, they've tried to convey this message
Speaker 1: to Zion Williamson in a variety of different ways over
Speaker 1: the past few seasons. It's never worked. And you know,
Speaker 1: let's see now, let's see if such widespread, loud public
Speaker 1: criticism has a different impact on Zion Williamson. Because I
Speaker 1: have to think from his perspective, it's one thing to
Speaker 1: hear it from guys like you or me. It's a
Speaker 1: whole different thing to hear Charles Barkley, Shaquille O'Neill, and
Speaker 1: a former teammate like JJ Reddick speaks so pointedly.
Speaker 2: Stein, I was talking to my foot well FaceTime and
Speaker 2: my youngest daughter, she's years old as we're FaceTime, and
Speaker 2: I had my laptop on and I was listening to
Speaker 2: people criticizing Zion Wilson basically saying it has to get
Speaker 2: in better shape, just all the things that you you
Speaker 2: know what JJ alluded to, what Charles Barkley, Shack and
Speaker 2: others have said. Right, So it was like this compilation
Speaker 2: I was I was listening to and my daughter heard it.
Speaker 2: And you know, Stein, we live in a different era.
Speaker 2: Things that we were able to say, the terms we
Speaker 2: were able to use, the words we were able to
Speaker 2: say back then was nothing. But you use those words,
Speaker 2: those same words, those same phrases now and it's something
Speaker 2: really negative in today's world. So I'm saying this to
Speaker 2: say this. So she's talking to me, but I'm not
Speaker 2: really knowing. She's picking up on what they're saying about Zion,
Speaker 2: and she said, Dad, are they fat? Sham and Zion
Speaker 2: I said, I said, what said? How they gonna tell
Speaker 2: him he needs to lose weight and get in better shape?
Speaker 2: Maybe he's happy, you know how he is? Stop. So
Speaker 2: I didn't know how to start. I didn't know how
Speaker 2: to explain. I didn't know how to explain this because
Speaker 2: I get in trouble. Could. I have a daughter who
Speaker 2: is just turned twenty, and she is like, she'll always
Speaker 2: correct me on like the proper terms, what you can
Speaker 2: use and cannot use, like according to this new generation.
Speaker 2: And so I told my daughter, my youngest ones, we're
Speaker 2: talking about Zion. I was like, well, I said, baby, like,
Speaker 2: you know, there's just a level of I guess there's
Speaker 2: a level of fit and being a professional athlete that
Speaker 2: you're supposed to uphold, especially if you're like a player
Speaker 2: that's the face of a franchise. And she didn't get it.
Speaker 2: She was like, it still doesn't matter. She's like he
Speaker 2: made it there like that, why is he being fat shame?
Speaker 2: And I couldn't tell her it wasn't fat shaven. Well,
Speaker 2: I can't say. I couldn't tell her. I just didn't
Speaker 2: want to go down that role. I didn't want to
Speaker 2: have an argument because you can't argue with the youngsters nowadays.
Speaker 2: So why did I bring that up? Stein? I just
Speaker 2: brought it up because you brought up Zion and this.
Speaker 2: But really stin my personal opinion, my personal critique is
Speaker 2: he has to get better. However way he needs to
Speaker 2: get better, it's up to him. But he has to
Speaker 2: be able to play thirty five plus minutes and be
Speaker 2: able to do it consistently and be able to do
Speaker 2: it and be able to do it and play to
Speaker 2: his best. And in order to play to your best,
Speaker 2: you have to be in good physical shape. Now I
Speaker 2: will say this, good physical shape as far as your stamina.
Speaker 2: Maybe he can still have that same physique, Maybe he
Speaker 2: can still have that same body stature, Maybe he can
Speaker 2: still be the same way. I don't know most people
Speaker 2: that most people are saying he needs to lose weight.
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna go out there and say that. But
Speaker 2: he needs to be able to play thirty five minutes
Speaker 2: and do it and dominate. And so however way he
Speaker 2: needs to get to it, that's what needs to happen,
Speaker 2: or else there's gonna be more of this and staring
Speaker 2: with this n season tournament. This gave him a platform,
Speaker 2: just like it gave the Pacers a platform to see
Speaker 2: how special this team is. The Pelicans had that same opportunity,
Speaker 2: but it worked in the opposite for them. And you know,
Speaker 2: it can item make you or break you. Right now,
Speaker 2: I broke Zion, but he has a chance to pick
Speaker 2: up the pieces and get it back together. But he's
Speaker 2: going to have to do so because people are paying
Speaker 2: attention now. And that's one thing I like about this
Speaker 2: this season tournament.
Speaker 1: I look, it's not comfortable to talk about, and he is.
Speaker 1: His potential is so ridiculously high, and that's I think
Speaker 1: what disappoints people. They want, you know, they they want
Speaker 1: to see him play to his maximum ability or something
Speaker 1: close to it, because you know, we've seen peek Zion
Speaker 1: can be a destructive force. But I mean he's not
Speaker 1: rebounding either, you know, I mean it's he's he they need,
Speaker 1: they just need they need more from him to go somewhere.
Speaker 1: They've got a lot of interesting, good players on that
Speaker 1: team and and a lot of good, complimentary players, but
Speaker 1: you know, you need your star twosome to function well.
Speaker 1: And you know, this week, even in even in the quarters,
Speaker 1: when they beat Sacramento, you know, Zion had a very
Speaker 1: quiet game. So you know, when it's when it's fellow
Speaker 1: pros and you know, Charles Barkley, Shaquille O'Neil, who have
Speaker 1: been in that same position as Zion as face of
Speaker 1: the franchise, when they say it, I mean, there's no
Speaker 1: way people are going to tune it out. It's going
Speaker 1: to be discussed and it's going to be talked about,
Speaker 1: and you know, we'll see what kind of response now
Speaker 1: we get because I'm sure this in season tournament trip
Speaker 1: to Vegas was not a memorable and pleasant one for
Speaker 1: Zion and the Pelicans.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and and it speaks, it speaks volumes coming from
Speaker 2: Shaq and Chuck because those guys know that they had
Speaker 2: to get in better shape to be able to play
Speaker 2: their best, and so they're speaking from experience and somebody
Speaker 2: that's probably that's gone through what Zion is going through
Speaker 2: right now. So I still I like, again, you know,
Speaker 2: Chuck and sometimes Shack, but Chuck a lot of times
Speaker 2: gets a bad rap for being too hard on players.
Speaker 2: I really do think that it's been constructive criticism as
Speaker 2: far you know, they're speaking from a place of experience
Speaker 2: of going through what Zion is going through now, so
Speaker 2: hopefully Zion takes he and A and he's able to
Speaker 2: take his game to the next level. However way he
Speaker 2: needs to do it.
Speaker 1: All Right, before we go, let's get into something that
Speaker 1: It's a topic both you and I have been interested in.
Speaker 1: I actually saw you on NBA TV today asking DiAngelo
Speaker 1: Russell about this because there is the question, and we
Speaker 1: don't have clarity yet, what how will the team that
Speaker 1: wins the nd season tournament celebrate. On one hand, you've
Speaker 1: got the Pacers. They've won three ABA championships, but they've
Speaker 1: never won an NBA title. They went to the NBA
Speaker 1: Finals one famously in two thousand. They played the Shaq
Speaker 1: and Kobe Lakers lost that finals in six They you know,
Speaker 1: have won a division here and there. You know, they
Speaker 1: won the conference in two thousand. Obviously they were Eastern
Speaker 1: Conference champions. If you make the NBA finals, but the
Speaker 1: Pacers don't have a building full of banners. The feeling,
Speaker 1: I think is that if the Pacers win this thing
Speaker 1: on Saturday night, they will hang a banner. And it
Speaker 1: is it is not definitive. I actually spoke to Rick
Speaker 1: Carlisle today and asked him that very question. And he
Speaker 1: said that for me to ask him such a thing
Speaker 1: right before the championship game, he said, Stein, that is
Speaker 1: a karmically flawed question. I'm not going to answer it,
Speaker 1: but uh, you know, he left me with the strong
Speaker 1: impression that, yes, if the Pacers can win this thing,
Speaker 1: they're gonna make a big deal about it. Then on
Speaker 1: the flip side, you've got the Lakers. The Lakers do
Speaker 1: not hang banners when they win conference championships. They do
Speaker 1: not hang banners when they win the Pacific Division. They
Speaker 1: only hang banners when they win it all. They've got
Speaker 1: seventeen titles tied with Boston. And I discovered that we've
Speaker 1: both reported separately. We didn't realize that we were doing this,
Speaker 1: but I think both you and I have reported that.
Speaker 1: The official word we're getting is the Lakers have made
Speaker 1: no determination yet one way or the other what they're
Speaker 1: going to do. But I think the expectation is that
Speaker 1: an end season tournament championship is not enough for them,
Speaker 1: because even Lebron you saw him postgame with your colleague
Speaker 1: Ali LaForce, and Lebron played so great against the Pelicans.
Speaker 1: I mean, he was the best player on the court
Speaker 1: at almost thirty nine. But he told Ali he's not
Speaker 1: going to get too out of control happy because it's
Speaker 1: only December. So that's my long winded way of saying,
Speaker 1: what do you think happens if the Pacers win it
Speaker 1: all or the Lakers win the.
Speaker 2: Highest Pacers are putting up a banner for sure, you
Speaker 2: know what I think. This is my feeling, and this
Speaker 2: is I have no sourcing on it whatsoever. I haven't
Speaker 2: spoken to anybody on it, aside from getting the message
Speaker 2: from the Lakers that they haven't made a decision. But
Speaker 2: this is what I think. I think a team like
Speaker 2: the Lakers or Celtics might feel obligated to do so
Speaker 2: at some point because I think this is going to
Speaker 2: be something that gets bigger, right, I think this is
Speaker 2: going to be something that's going to continue and it's
Speaker 2: going to be a big thing. It has yet to
Speaker 2: register to me at stein because you know, I'm not
Speaker 2: into the the soccer culture and I don't understand you know,
Speaker 2: the different cups and tournaments, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: But if this becomes ingrained, you know, this is this
Speaker 2: is this tournament is going to speak to the younger
Speaker 2: generation coming up who are going to come up watching this.
Speaker 2: If this really is, becomes not equal but pretty close
Speaker 2: behind winning a Larry O'Brian Trophy. I can see the
Speaker 2: Lakers saying, you know what, this is gonna be here
Speaker 2: to stay, even though we don't feel the significance of
Speaker 2: it now. We might want to throw something up there,
Speaker 2: or maybe they can wait stein the Lakers. That's what
Speaker 2: I would do. If I'm the Lakers or the Celtics
Speaker 2: and I win the first or the second nd season tournament,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna make a banner, but I'm gonna just hold it,
Speaker 2: put in the closet, leave it the storage. Let's see
Speaker 2: how big this thing is. Then about a tenth year.
Speaker 2: If this thing is huge, go ahead and throw up
Speaker 2: that batterer from eight nine years ago. Ahead, go ahead.
Speaker 1: I'm in the other camp. Every team should hang a
Speaker 1: banner for this. And the reason is, you know, the
Speaker 1: league came up with this. Adam Silver has wanted this
Speaker 1: for ages for really two main reasons.
Speaker 2: Yo.
Speaker 1: There's the business reason, of course, the one that they
Speaker 1: don't like to admit, but the one we all understand
Speaker 1: that if this thing goes well, and by all accounts,
Speaker 1: people don't grade it as hard as I have, so
Speaker 1: I think the reviews have been more positive than negative.
Speaker 1: The league would love to sell the inn season tournament
Speaker 1: as a separate TV package to a media rights partner
Speaker 1: down the road. That's what it's hoping to do on
Speaker 1: the business side. But on the competitive side, Adam Silver,
Speaker 1: and this is the part he does take from soccer.
Speaker 1: He's always said, this is a league where there's one
Speaker 1: winner and twenty nine losers because unless you win the
Speaker 1: Larry O'Brien Trophy, you're a failure. And the thing he
Speaker 1: did really want to take from soccer is, let's create
Speaker 1: a second trophy opportunity that teams are excited to chase.
Speaker 1: Because there are teams in the league that when they
Speaker 1: win a division they hang a banner because they're not
Speaker 1: the Lakers and they're not the Celtics and they don't
Speaker 1: have seventeen championship banners. So to certain franchises, winning the
Speaker 1: division or winning the conference's that is banner worthy. And
Speaker 1: the you know, basically what I'm really looking forward to
Speaker 1: Saturday before the game, Adam Silver is going to have
Speaker 1: a press conference and I hope someone asked the question.
Speaker 1: I hope someone asks, what is the league's stance on banners,
Speaker 1: And even as I talk, as I say this out
Speaker 1: loud and start thinking about it, Adam will probably say
Speaker 1: something along the lines of we don't want to be
Speaker 1: in position of telling our teams what to do. But
Speaker 1: my gut instinct is the league office wants to see
Speaker 1: everyone whoever wins this thing hang a banner and treat
Speaker 1: it like a big deal. Because the league's goal here,
Speaker 1: and you know, you can't say they're there yet in
Speaker 1: year one, but the league's goal here is that this
Speaker 1: is the second most valuable prize a team can win.
Speaker 1: The league wants this to be bigger than a division
Speaker 1: title or even a conference title. That the league is
Speaker 1: hoping to establish this as the number two prize for
Speaker 1: teams in the NBA. So to me, if the Lakers
Speaker 1: won it and didn't hang a banner, that's a slap
Speaker 1: in the face to the league.
Speaker 2: Well remember look what you say, Stan, you said. The
Speaker 2: league is hoping this becomes the second most significant award
Speaker 2: during the regular season, hoping, hoping, hoping. What if it isn't,
Speaker 2: what if it doesn't make it to sustainability, So then
Speaker 2: the Lakers are or the Pacers, they're just they're stuck
Speaker 2: with an inn season tournament that doesn't in season tournament
Speaker 2: banner that doesn't exist anymore.
Speaker 1: I guess you know what it is. I just I
Speaker 1: can't see it going away now, Like I.
Speaker 2: Don't think so either. I don't think so either. I
Speaker 2: think I don't think so.
Speaker 1: Like again, I think I've been as critical of this
Speaker 1: thing as anyone. And and you know, all of my
Speaker 1: almost all of my criticisms are based on group play
Speaker 1: and counting these regular seas and games twice and the
Speaker 1: fact that the nd season tournament is not separate enough.
Speaker 1: But I think I'm in the minority. I think this
Speaker 1: has generated many more fans than foes in year one,
Speaker 1: and the fact that Lebron has taking it so seriously
Speaker 1: in year one has certainly helped it. So I I
Speaker 1: guess I'm just I'm kind of skipping steps here and
Speaker 1: operating under the premise that I think. I think it's here.
Speaker 1: I think it's here to stay.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I believe so too. I still will tell the
Speaker 2: Lakers make the banner, believe it in storage. Well, let's
Speaker 2: let's wait, let's wait to see what.
Speaker 1: Well, you know what's gonna happen. You're right, because again,
Speaker 1: now that you know someone is gonna ask Adam Silver
Speaker 1: and he's probably gonna say, we don't want to tell
Speaker 1: teams what to do. And if the league does not
Speaker 1: compel teams to hang a banner for this, maybe the
Speaker 1: Lakers won't. Maybe the Lakers will do exactly what you
Speaker 1: said and take a wait and see approach.
Speaker 2: Yeah, take a wait and see approach. STEI. Before we
Speaker 2: get out of here, STEI, have you ever and Producer
Speaker 2: Ryan feel free to chime in. We don't let producer
Speaker 2: Ryan chime in enough. He has a lot to say.
Speaker 1: He's putting out too many fires, airs, gaffs, controversies. The
Speaker 1: man is busy.
Speaker 2: Star. You know, it's what I experienced yesterday was the
Speaker 2: equivalent to me of experiencing Is it called the solar
Speaker 2: clips Is that what it's called? Where? Where? What the Earth?
Speaker 2: How does what the Earth rotates around the sun? Moon
Speaker 2: or sun? It blocks out the sun? Yeah, it blocks
Speaker 2: off the Sun and it's like you only see at
Speaker 2: that what time. I've never seen it before, but what
Speaker 2: I experienced last night is the equivalent equivalent of that. So,
Speaker 2: Producer Ryan and STEI, have you ever been in a
Speaker 2: high riser hotel like I am right now? I'm in
Speaker 2: a high Riser hotel, are you and you justly hear
Speaker 2: a loud thump at the window. You hear a loud thump, thump, thump, thump.
Speaker 2: Have y'all heard that never?
Speaker 1: I don't know where you're going with this.
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm gonna tell you so all the time,
Speaker 2: every time I'm in high Risers, I hear a loud
Speaker 2: thump at the window, bump, thump, like every now and then,
Speaker 2: like probably three or four times a day. So y'all
Speaker 2: need to pay attention. So those thumps are birds hitting
Speaker 2: the glass window because they don't see the glass window.
Speaker 2: And I always, for years, I'm forty two, I've never
Speaker 2: actually seen the bird hit the window. I finally saw
Speaker 2: the bird hit the window and drop all the way
Speaker 2: down to the road. I saw it finally, after all
Speaker 2: those thumps I heard all these years, I finally just
Speaker 2: happened to be looking out my window and I seen
Speaker 2: a bird going straight for the glass. It was like
Speaker 2: the glass like ten feet away from mop building. It
Speaker 2: was just going straight. I'm like, what this bird doing?
Speaker 2: Where's this bird going? It kept going fast, it didn't
Speaker 2: slow down and boom, and it just slid down the
Speaker 2: rest of the glass window.
Speaker 1: Onto, and that was your solar eclipse.
Speaker 2: That was my solar I finally saw it after years
Speaker 2: of hearing that. So y'all never heard a thump when
Speaker 2: you had a high where you had a high rise
Speaker 2: of hotel glass windows, You've never heard those thumps at
Speaker 2: the window?
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I had. I mean I just experienced similar
Speaker 1: during a stay at JW. Marriott, LA live right across
Speaker 1: the street from yes, the building formerly known as Staple Center.
Speaker 1: But I did not deem it podcast worthy.
Speaker 2: I did not.
Speaker 1: I didn't. I didn't know that. I didn't know that
Speaker 1: that was the story that would that would be good
Speaker 1: for the pod. And that's because you only heard it.
Speaker 2: You didn't see it. You didn't see it.
Speaker 1: Now you gotta see it true too. I did not.
Speaker 1: I did not see the bird.
Speaker 2: I am looking at this bird and it is speeding
Speaker 2: and not slowing down.
Speaker 1: Could you could you identify what kind of bird it was?
Speaker 2: It was? It was like a black crow, like sometime
Speaker 2: a black crow. It was a black bird, but it
Speaker 2: was speeding, it was not slowing down. I'm like, doesn't
Speaker 2: this see this building? This glass And I'm like, hold on,
Speaker 2: is this gonna be swat and just slid all the
Speaker 2: way down.
Speaker 1: Who knows, Maybe now we're gonna get some bird watching
Speaker 1: traffic on this pod instead of just NBA listeners.
Speaker 2: Hey, we're here for everybody. I just know that. I
Speaker 2: just know there are people out there that hear those thumps.
Speaker 2: And then there's some people like producer Ryme who didn't
Speaker 2: actually know what that thump was. That's what the thump was.
Speaker 2: It was birds that they think. They don't they don't
Speaker 2: see the window. They think it's they think it's a
Speaker 2: clear shot to get wherever they're trying to get until
Speaker 2: they get where they're at.
Speaker 1: Producer Producer Ryan doesn't get to go to any hotels
Speaker 1: because his full time job is keeping this pod glued
Speaker 1: together and troubleshooting all of our messes. So he yeah,
Speaker 1: we can't even remember the last time he was in
Speaker 1: a hotel.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he listens to us go splat, That's that's what
Speaker 2: he does.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then yeah, all right on that note, that
Speaker 1: is going to do it for this edition of This
Speaker 1: League Uncut. The next time we are with you, Chris
Speaker 1: Haynes will be back from Vegas with certainly more stories.
Speaker 1: A notebook full of stories from the NBA, and who
Speaker 1: knows what else he'll see an experience on the strip.
Speaker 2: I'm coming. I don't forget about that, but.
Speaker 1: At least he won't be in Vegas any longer by
Speaker 1: the next time we speak, and so my jealousy factor
Speaker 1: will have declined significantly. And yes, Tuesday Night Lakers at Dallas,
Speaker 1: Chris Haynes on the sidelines for TNT, wearing some fresh
Speaker 1: new gear for sure for the national TV audience, and
Speaker 1: I will be in the building critiquing his every move.
Speaker 1: It'll be our first time in the same place since July,
Speaker 1: almost basically five months since he and I were together.
Speaker 1: So definitely looking forward to that Lakers MAVs game and
Speaker 1: what sort of mayhem ensues. And we're working on a
Speaker 1: special guest next week as well. Don't want to jinx it,
Speaker 1: but I think we're gonna have a very high profile
Speaker 1: NBA newsmaker join us as well. So we got lots
Speaker 1: of good stuff on the way. Please remember, as always
Speaker 1: rate review, subscribe to this League uncut via Spotify or
Speaker 1: Apple Pods or wherever you get your pods, and Chris
Speaker 1: and I will be back with you again, Harry Larry soon.
Speaker 1: Enjoy the ist final everyone, and that'll do it for us.
Speaker 1: See you next time. This League Uncut is an iHeartRadio
Speaker 1: production Chris Haines and Mark Stein.